November 1, 2023 • 45 mins
What if you could unlock your dog's full potential and establish a stronger bond with your canine companion? We've got an episode that will make you rethink the traditional walks and fetch games. Join us as we share innovative outdoor activities for your dogs like sniffari and treasure hunt- experiences that stimulate their senses and give them the mental workout they need. Witness the remarkable transformation from our case studies where these activities have reshaped a dog's behavior.
Picture this: your dog agilely leaping and dashing, clearly enjoying every moment. We're talking about agility training and pair walks that not only keep your dog physically engaged but also help reactive dogs. Learn how to read your dog's body language, understand their motivations, and introduce them to other dogs. We also delve into the concept of regulation, sharing tips on how to teach your pup the important lesson of self-control. Plus, cautionary tales for those working with breed pups, a must-hear if you’re a breed owner.
Finally, we tackle the often-ignored topic of obsessive play behavior in dogs. Does your dog play obsessively, maybe even creating their own games out of sheer boredom? Hear about Belle and Myles, Remy, and other dogs who show different ways obsessive play can manifest. We share practical advice on addressing this issue like removing balls from the house or providing mental enrichment. So, ready to transform your dog's playtime into a healthy and enjoyable experience? Tune in and let’s embark on this journey together!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Everybody welcome to a podcast for dog people.
I'm John and I'm Jamie and weare your personal dog experts.
We're here to help you betterunderstand your dogs in the wide
spectrum of behaviors theyexhibit.
So join us on this journey tolearn everything.
Dog Everybody.
Welcome to another episode ofthe podcast for dog people by
Paulson University.
(00:20):
Today we're gonna be talkingabout outdoor activities in
mental stimulation and we'regonna recommend some things.
We're gonna recommend you don'tdo some things and yeah, it's a
really interesting topicbecause a lot of people think
that you can't go wrong Just you, just as much as you possibly
can.
But the the saying too much ofanything is a bad thing rings
(00:46):
true, especially for mentalstimulation and your dog's
personality.
Yeah, and physical activity isreally what I'm getting at, but
I know that you wanted to talkabout at least these two case
studies that you have from youknow, since we started working
with dogs.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Yes of clients whose dogs have essentially gone
insane and Well, let's, let's gothrough the options first,
right like the like, oursuggestions for the activities
outdoors, then we'll go into thedon'ts and then we'll lead to
why those don'ts led to thosecase studies.
I like, I think that's the wayI want to do this.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
I like it.
I'm trying to fix my my micmicrophone situation here.
Okay, I think we're good,alright, cool, alright.
So I just finished making apost for you.
I'm gonna be posting it rightafter this podcast.
You would give me a bunch ofthings, a bunch of your.
We're calling it your top seven.
Yes mental stimulation slashenrichment ideas.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Yes, so let's go through those.
So these are all things thatyou can do outdoors.
You can y'all also notice onthat post from anybody sees it
on Instagram.
There's a lot of these thingsyou can do inside as well, but
bringing it outside will elevatethe stimulation.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Right, you're bringing in new sense, new
sounds, new sites.
It's a totally differentexperience for them.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Yep, for sure.
So the first one is a sniffarisniffari big fan.
So I personally love this onebecause it's so frickin easy and
it really doesn't cost anything.
It doesn't really do anything alot of times.
And now this this is a thingthat we always have to talk
about on my sessions, right,because what I made a post a
(02:27):
while ago it went a little viral.
If your dog doesn't like towalk, don't make them walk,
right, like that's a big thing.
But another thing that tends topop up a lot is that when we
try to take our dogs for walks,we tend to think that we need to
run them, right, quote-unquotethat's, we need to run your dog.
Bs, no, not true.
Also, they want a sniff morethan they want to walk.
(02:49):
They can walk in the house,they can they walk all day when
they're not sleeping.
So really, for them, whenthey're outside, they're not
looking for that Mile walk.
That's not what's interestingto them.
What's interesting to them isbeing outside those sounds,
those smells, all that goodstuff and Stimulating their
brain in a non Exercise fashion,right there, exercising their
(03:12):
minds.
They would rather do that thantheir body.
Utilizing their senses exactlyand that's actually what comes
the brain okay.
So when you get out your friendand I have a lot of clients
that get very frustrated in thebeginning of their walk because
the dog Is literally goingapeshit and they're like by the
end of the walk they're fine,but in the beginning it's, it's
a hot mess and I always say letthem stimulate before you walk
(03:34):
for exercise.
This is something that you cando as a routine.
This is your new thing.
You come out the door whereveryour dog wants to sniff, left
right, straight back.
Wherever they want to go.
You are at their beck and callOkay, and a lot of you like well
, I want to be in control.
That's not necessary.
That's not the goal here.
The goal is to stimulate yourdog.
So lose the fight, you know.
(03:54):
Pick our battles and if yourdog wants to go a specific way
and smell, obviously Withinreason of not letting your dog
go on people's lawns, if you'regonna get yelled at, but you
know, if there's a bigger areanear your house or in your front
lawn, just let them sniff.
Let them do their thing.
Don't be talking to them, don'ttry and pull them closer to you
, just let them do their thing,as long as they're not, you know
, obviously, wrenching your armout of the socket.
(04:15):
You know, let them do theirthing.
This will actually allow themto get there.
I call getting your yai-yas outin the beginning of the walk.
So once you actually startwalking and you're on a routine,
they'll be able to function alot better.
They kind of got thatstimulation out.
They kind of, you know, workedtheir brains in a way where now
they can function.
Now they can be like oh, we'rewalking this way and I can focus
(04:36):
on mom or dad, versus before,when I kind of came out the door
and I was loony tunes.
So this is a really, reallygood method to kind of fix up
your walk and really get thatextra stimulation in there for
your dog, without doing reallyanything other than just
standing there and lookingpretty see the polar opposite of
us with the Balanced trainerslike to call a structured walk.
Yes which is probably the mostboring thing on the face of this
(04:56):
earth right, the walk reallyessentially is for the dog, it's
for the dog, but we make itthis like you need to listen to
me and it's like no, let them dotheir damn thing, right, like
let them have fun.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
This is the the two minutes.
If they get two walks a day,right yeah, and most people like
to do real quick, just get themout and get back inside two
minutes.
They get to go outside, letthem sniff a little, let them
live a little and risk yourlives and it's so simple.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
You really don't have to do much of anything other
than just stand there.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
And then, so that was sniffari is.
Number one and then move on tonumber two number two is the
treasure hunt.
The treasure hunt the treasurehunt.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Sorry, I'm a little nasally today.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
I see that got me sick, oh boy.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
So the treasure hunt we don't do, because our dogs
are not that smart.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
They're not smart, they're not.
They're not Athleticallyblessed.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
They don't care about this type of.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Oakley has an enlarged heart.
He's on Viagra just to keephimself alive.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
We don't know if she's like sticks and glue put
together.
She hobbles through the houseand Pudge is like no, I'm not
hungry.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
No.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
So the three of them don't benefit from most of these
.
They are just happy with theirnormal enrichment frozen toys
inside.
They're good to go.
But other dogs that are moreintelligent tend to be a little
bit more anxious and reactiveand stuff like that.
This is a really good optionfor them, where we're more so
using the brain versus againover exercising them.
You'll see a pattern here.
(06:20):
I am not pro over exercisebecause I actually find that it
overstimulates and over tiresour dogs that are Already
anxious and already a hot messin their brains, and it makes it
worse.
So you'll notice that a lot ofthese are more using our brain
activities versus using our bodyactivities.
So, like in our posts, it'll sayyou know, it may take your dog
(06:41):
a little bit of time to figurethis out, especially if you've
never done anything like thisbefore.
It's basically a hide and seekgame with treats and food.
I do not suggest throwing yourdog's kibble all over the yard.
There are some trainers outthere, even positive
reinforcement that suggests this.
If you have a concrete backyard, great, go for it.
Or patio, go for it.
(07:01):
But if it's the grass and theymiss kibble, then I get nervous
that they're missing part oftheir meal or they're giving up
because they can't find it, andthen we don't know that they're
getting underfed.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
And then you got raccoons in the ornament.
Yeah, we don't want that either.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
So I prefer, if you're going to like, toss the
food which is a great option on,like on a hard surface outside
that you can see where the foodis and you're aware of, like,
what they got and what theydidn't get.
Now the treasure hunt is morealong the lines of like, let me
take a scoop of kibble or apiece, a couple pieces of string
cheese and put them behind thischair or put them by this rock
(07:36):
that my dog can perfectly see,and like, hiding them in
specific places, maybe not underthings, because, again, if your
dog is really good at this andthey get there, you can get
there once they become a pro.
But in the beginning, like,keep it simple, right Couple of
places, and you stick to aphrase that they're gonna know
consistently, like find it Now.
Like Gatsby, my parents dog,when he wants to play with his
(07:58):
tennis ball, which we'll get toin a minute, if you say find it,
he starts to look for it.
He knows find it means findsomething right.
He might not even know what itis he's looking for, but he
starts using his nose and triesto find whatever it is that is
being hidden, right?
So, again, it might not beperfect.
In the beginning it might looklike a hot mess, but eventually,
once you kind of lead them toit, right, like find it, and
(08:20):
you're like find it, yes, get it, getting excited.
And then you kind of like leadthem over to where it is and
then, once they find it, you'relike, yes, you found it, and you
get all excited and maybe theyget a couple more treats for
finding it.
Then they're more encouraged todo this activity.
And then you get it to thepoint where, like we know some
clients that like literally haveto hide their dogs inside, go
hide everything outside and thenlet the door open and the dog's
like already ready to golooking for these treats and
(08:42):
it's like their most favoriteactivity.
This is also an inside rainyday win for a lot of dogs as
well, so this is a great option.
Anything to add on that one.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
I ran over my wire hold on.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
A little bit of a struggle bus today, oh no, okay,
come on, babe, get it together.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
I wrapped around my foot.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
All right Anything to add about the treasure hunt?
Speaker 1 (09:08):
No.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Okay, could have just said that, wasting my time.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
This is a crisis.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
The third one is hiking.
This is a really simple one.
Now again, a lot of these don'treally pertain to me in John's
life because I am not anoutdoorsy person.
I really I mean I'll do it, butit really does not interest me
like going for a hike.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Are we really the authority on outdoor activities
with your dog?
Speaker 2 (09:31):
You know, I think these are great options.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
No.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
So hiking right Now.
This is kind of similar to thatnumber one that we talked about
, the Snifari very similar.
But you can take it one stepfurther.
You go hiking.
I don't like dogs off leash.
We've made that perfectly clear.
I don't think it's everacceptable.
I don't think it's ever needed.
Okay, I prefer having a dog ona long line 50 yards or 50 feet
(09:56):
is my preference.
You can do 100, whatever worksfor you.
As long as there is somethingtethered to your dog.
I do not like retractablessuper dangerous.
So if you're gonna do this,it's gotta be a long line.
This will ensure that nobodygets hurt, at least not in a
really bad way.
So if you're gonna go hikingand you get your dog used to the
length, you don't wanna go likefrom using a six foot leash to
(10:19):
now randomly going hiking andnow you have a 100 foot leash.
Your dog's gonna be like what'shappening and they're gonna get
really confused when there'sfinally a tug at the end of that
100 foot leash.
So start small and then gohiking and be very alert, have
your treats on you and you'rejust kinda letting them do their
thing.
Again, you're not shucking themalong the entire time.
You're kinda watching forthings that they can get wrapped
(10:42):
up in.
You don't want them if they'resuper hyperactive and they're
running all over the placesprinting.
You wanna be very careful whenyou're using a long line because
, again, they're unaware whenthey're getting crazy how short
that leash is getting and whenthey're about to get that tug on
their neck and you don't wantanybody getting hurt.
So we always suggest a frontclip harness for this, because
you don't want anybody gettingclothes lined and then just
(11:02):
watch for like trees and thingsthat they can get tangled around
, so they don't again getclothes lined randomly and get
negatively reinforced when youreally didn't do anything.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
Positive punishment.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Yeah, positive punishment.
So, yes, keep walking.
And this is a little bit of astep up from the number one that
we went over this nefarie,because now there's new sense
they're not close to homebecause that can actually change
things for dogs.
When they know that they'reclose to home, they're in their
neighborhood, they may actdifferently and they may be more
stressed because they're morereactive or protective of their
(11:34):
home, or they'll be lessstressed because they know that
they have an out.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Yeah, or they could be distracted by certain
behavior patterns they have.
If there's barking dogs thatare always at that house on the
corner, they're gonna prime upfor it, they're gonna be
expecting it.
Whereas you go on a hike, youtry a new trail, it's a novel
and just as it's enriching foryou, it's enriching for them.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
It makes me think of Opie, one of our dogs.
We've talked about him numeroustimes on the podcast and on
social media, but Opie's a dogthat we've been working with for
years.
He was at the shelter and gotadopted now by our friends Linda
and Josh.
He hates walking at home likewill not leave the driveway.
He's actually doing better now.
In the last couple of monthshe's made a turn.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
How's he All?
Speaker 2 (12:13):
right, good, but when they first, I mean they've had
him what?
He's nine now, they've had himfor seven years and he would not
leave the house, like literallywould not cross the driveway
mark onto the sidewalk.
But Linda can get him in thecar and take him to a park and
he will walk fine.
So he does not like walking inthe neighborhood, it makes him
too nervous.
But out and about he'scompletely fine and actually
enjoys it.
So every dog's a little bitdifferent, kind of find what
(12:35):
works for your dog.
But I really you know thehiking for those really hyper
focused dogs that like to sniff.
This is great for you too,because you're not in your
neighborhood feeling like youneed to be very monotonous and
like keep moving, like this is atime for you to relax as well
and kind of enjoy the sceneryand just relax around you and
unplug a little bit.
So I like this option a lot.
Oh, and to work on your recallForgot that part, the golden
(12:59):
opportunity To work on yourrecall.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
This is a great opportunity, which you should
already have established, andsome level at least, that they
know the touch cue or whateverit is that you're gonna be using
.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yes, so we like the touch cue.
That's come.
You know, boop my palm withyour nose.
Most dogs really love it.
If your dog's a little skittish, this might be a little bit
more of a struggle for you.
But basically the idea is forthem to go and sniff and have a
good time and you get reallyexcited and say touch and then
come running, boop your hand,get that really high value treat
and then you set them rightback out to do exactly what they
(13:30):
were doing.
You are reinforcing that recall, but you're also saying the
recall doesn't mean that the funis ending, so this is actually
enjoyable for you.
Take a slight break, come get apiece of hot dog and go right
back to what you were doing.
They're like well, I love thatcue, that's great.
I love that recall and this islike that emergency command.
Obviously, if a dog runs out ofthe home and you say touch
(13:52):
versus get back here, they'regonna be more likely to come to
the touch because they like it.
Yes, so that is a really goodgolden opportunity to really
enforce that and drive your bondwith your dog.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
So number three was hiking.
Yes, number four.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
Number four is frozen enrichment.
This is, like I already said,that the number one was
obviously the sniffari, butpersonally, for our dogs, this
is our number one.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
This is what we do, based on their activity level.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Based on their personality and what they like.
I mean, my dogs are really notactive, they really aren't.
So this is a really big one forour family.
But let's say you have a veryactive family, you like to go to
wineries, you like to go out toeat and you like to bring your
dog.
Your dog's generally friendly,isn't super reactive, but they
tend to get a little bit bored.
When we go out to eat, we'rebasically expecting our dogs to
(14:41):
kind of just sit there and thiskind of like elevates it for
them, makes it a little bit morefun in general, where they
might actually behave better forus because they know that this
is coming Bringing frozen treats.
So John had suggested bringing acooler bag, like a small cooler
bag with frozen items.
So we do a lot of marabonescongs and our new favorite is
(15:01):
the Pupcicle that is on Amazon.
It's also on our product list.
It's a great option because youcan fill your own silicone ice
cube tray and bring that withyou.
We will.
We have like what?
Like five trays now that makeslike 20 little ice cubes at a
time.
I'll fill them all and then popthem out when they're ready.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
And put them in a little bag Like little balls.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Like ice balls, like whiskey balls, right yeah, like
a smaller whiskey ball, but likeit's.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
you can do I've talked about this so many times
you can do yoga, pumpkin puree,like anything that your dog
likes.
It'll freeze that into a balland that ball fits perfectly
inside of the Pupcicle.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
So you can bring a ton of those with you on your
outing and really all you haveto do is make sure you have ice
packs and you just bring thatone item, that one Pupcicle, and
you're good to go.
You just keep popping them inwhenever they need them.
So I love that and I think thatit's really great, especially
on those hot days.
We wanna keep our dogs calmwhen we're out and about.
But it's a win-win foreverybody really, because then
(15:58):
everybody gets to enjoythemselves.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
I like it.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Number five Number five is agility.
Can you actually read what youwrote, because it actually made
me laugh.
I think it's perfect.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
While I have the laziest dogs on the planet,
seriously they're pros.
Many dogs absolutely loveagility training.
The key is ensuring that yourdog enjoys it and that it
doesn't become a source ofstress or overstimulation.
Some dogs take to it likenaturals and really that depends
on their breed for the mostpart in their what kind of drive
that they have, just innately.
(16:29):
But sorry, having an issue withmy John's just now.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
He's mouth on chinning today.
Everybody just pay attention tome.
Oh, except for this part whereI'm reading Well, I didn't know
you were really having that hardat the time, but clearly the
key is ensuring that your dogenjoys it and that it doesn't
become a source of stress oroverstimulation.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Some dogs take to it like naturals and thrive, and
they're the ones who trulybenefit.
However, if your dog seemsuninterested, consider exploring
another outdoor activity.
If your dog loves it, go for it.
Remember to balance the timeand obsession to maintain a
healthy relationship.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
The obsession is what we're gonna talk about in a
little bit.
This is really important.
Actually, just thought ofanother case study too goose who
used to go agility training andthen we realized it was
actually stressing him out more.
So agility can be great for alot of dogs.
They feel a sense of pride whenthey do it.
You know it obviously usestheir brain and their exercise
(17:20):
muscles at the same time.
But really like what John said,you wanna make sure that your
dog actually likes this.
If your dog is avoiding this oris really getting frustrated or
struggling and really isn'tdoing what the practice is right
, like they're not enjoying it,cut it off.
This is something that it'slike they either like naturally
(17:41):
take to it or they don't.
It really shouldn't be one ofthose things that's taught very
similar to like therapy training.
Right, oakley's a therapy dogbecause he was born a therapy
dog.
I did not make him a therapydog, okay, even though Tishi by
nature is very similarlyfriendly and sweet and loving,
she has slight more anxiety orthe ability to leach people's
(18:04):
anxiety.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
She's a mess.
She could never be a therapydog.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
She's 13 now leave her alone.
But Oakley was, he is, so hewas like bread for this.
Like he literally like does notleach other people's anxiety.
So if someone's stressed and ispetting him, he is there for
them, versus like a dog who'slike, oh my God, they're anxious
.
No, I need to be anxious, right, Even though they're
acknowledging that anxiety andgiving them the love that they
need.
But very similar to the agilityhere, it needs to be something
(18:32):
that's natural for them andfeels really good.
It's not something that weprogram.
You can't, you just can't do it.
So I always urge people when Isay what do you think about
agility training?
And if I'm working with aclient I'm like, no, your dog is
not, this is not for them.
This will stress them out more.
This is diving into the anxietywe actually want to lead away
from.
But some dogs yes, fabulous,really good outlet could work
(18:55):
really well, especially if theylike other dogs.
But we were working with onedog, goose, who mom was taking
to agility.
He's an Aussie shepherd, it'sin his blood, but he's very dog
reactive.
He lives with two other dogs,but any other dog that he didn't
really know made him veryuncomfortable.
So he was very distracted bythe other dogs trying to learn
how to do the agility and it wasactually becoming a source of
(19:17):
stress for him.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
I think you jumped segments.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
You weren't supposed to talk about the bad stuff yet.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Well, no, I was just.
That's a small portion.
A small portion, just a littleon it yeah.
Number six is pair walks.
Okay, if you've been listeningto us for a while, you know this
, but if you are new to our show, we do not do face to face dog
meets ever.
It's not our thing, we don'tlike it, we don't think it's
setting our dogs up for success.
(19:44):
So pair walks is essentiallywhen you take two dogs, two or
more, and you're walking all inthe same direction and they are
not meeting each other orsniffing each other for a little
bit.
Okay, if there is a sniff, it'sgonna be like in our situation.
What we do with Oakley.
He's our big guy who is theneutral dog.
He literally doesn't care abouta damn thing, all he wants is
food.
(20:04):
He walks forward and thereactive dog that I'm trying to
get to understand that dogs areactually a good thing.
I will bring them immediatelyup to Oakley's butt for them to
sniff.
This allows them to understandwho Oakley is without him
turning around and looking atthem, all right.
So I'm manipulating thesituation, the pair walk because
I'm not with you and I can'tsee who's reactive and who's not
(20:26):
, who's having a good time,who's not.
I always suggest going for apair walk, so like ones on the
left, ones on the right, almostlike a street away, like
sidewalk to sidewalk.
That's kinda how you'repositioning yourselves and
you're just walking all in thesame direction.
They can look at each otherside to side, but we're not
letting them like pummel eachother and then going for the
butt sniff, the double buttsniff, where they're both going
(20:49):
to sniff the butt at the sametime.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
Never good.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
When that happens, your dog is unknowingly
extending their neck, whichthey're literally saying here's
my jugular right, yeah, think oflike a yin and yang symbol.
Yes, that's exactly what happens.
But when they do that, the body, the biologically, is going
back to times when they livedoutside and they were really,
you know, in more survival mode.
(21:12):
That's a no-no, you don'textend your neck, you don't show
that to another animal.
So they, even thoughfriendly-wise, they wanna go
meet that other dog, they areputting themselves in a
vulnerable state and sometimesthe body will kind of like shoot
adrenaline and make them think,oh, you're in fight or flight,
like protect yourself, eventhough nothing happened.
The dog was just doing exactlywhat they were doing sniffing
(21:33):
the butt.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
You know, friendly, but A lot of people don't see
how or why that escalates.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
I know cause it's so quick.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Cause the motivating factor to get that close to the
other dog to begin with was toget the sniff, and once the
sniff was in, there's no othermotivating factor to be that
close, and that's for, you know,specific dogs that will do this
.
So, without the motivatingfactor, now they're like oh crap
, I'm right here, they're rightthere, my neck's right there.
I need to do something quick.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Like, the thing that I wanted to do is already done,
right, so now, now I'm just in acrowd, yeah well, we see the
same exact thing.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
When people will put a treat on their knee and have a
dog that doesn't like thatperson, come over and take the
treat off their knee.
Speaker 2 (22:14):
So they're motivated for the food.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
Right, once the food's gone, once they take the
treat.
You're now face to face withthis dog who does not want to be
near you.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
And this dog's like oh, now it has to make a choice.
Do I back up or do I bite?
Speaker 1 (22:28):
And I can count I think I'm still on one hand how
many times I know of somebodythat got bit in that situation
in a shelter setting, but still,I mean that's stupid.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Stupid.
Seems like a good idea at thetime, but then when it plays out
, it's really not so.
We prefer pair walks.
We like when dogs get to comeout of their cars.
Right, let's say you're meetingat a park.
You can't tell your dog hey,we're gonna go meet your dog
friend at the park, don't be ajerk.
Right, calm yourself down.
They can't say, oh, I'm gonnago see my friend.
And calm themselves down in thepark where they know what to
(22:59):
expect.
Right, they can't self-regulateon something that they haven't
even seen or understood yet,right?
So once they get out of the car, they're now going from, like,
usually a zero state to probablyclose to a tent of excitement
or fear right, either one andthey need to come down from that
.
So if we get them out of thecar and immediately meet our
friend, we're asking for aproblem, right?
We're asking for crazy, loonytune behavior.
(23:20):
So in reality, we wanna givethem a few minutes to say, yes,
you're at the park, there'sother dogs and people here, your
friend is here, let'sself-regulate before we make a
mistake, right?
And they can say, oh, my friendis here, okay, okay, gotta
shake it off, shake it off,shake it off, okay, get back to
normal, right.
Then they can behaveappropriately because they're in
a normal place of thinkingright, they're regulated.
So give them a few minutes andthen you can slowly get them
(23:42):
together on your walk.
On your walk, and then they cankind of be like oh, my friend
is here, okay, get a littlesniff and then go sniff right,
go sniff the ground right.
They kind of like disengagefrom the situation.
That's proper socialization andwe wanna show our dogs
especially if your dog is superfriendly, that you don't need to
play 24-7.
That doesn't have to be theonly form of socialization.
(24:03):
You can go for a nice walk withyour friend and not be
pummeling each other 24-7.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Teaching regulation.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Yes, it's really important and playing to style,
right, my crazy puppies thatcome here for training.
They'll meet Oakley and Oakleygets to teach them I don't play,
I'll be your friend, but Idon't play, it's not my thing.
And some of them will get alittle offended.
They get a little, you know,they get a little lack of a
better phrase but hurt, andthey've gotta overcome that
(24:29):
frustration and be like oh okay,he still likes me, but he
doesn't wanna play with me,right?
And that's a really.
That's not a skill that comesover time, that's taught, right.
So if your dog is only-.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
That's not a skill they're born with.
That's something that theylearn over time.
Yes, they have to learn.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
We have to put them in situations to learn it.
But also like, for example, Ihad a dog here the other day
trying to play with Oakley.
He gave a slight growl becauseshe was jumping all over his
head.
She sat ears back, just kind ofstared at him right, and he
just gave her a kiss on themouth to be like I still like
you, and it totally helped her,Like it made her understand that
he wasn't mad at her, right, hewas just saying I don't really
(25:11):
like that.
And it was really good for herto learn because she has a
sister at home that is verysubmissive and doesn't give
corrections, so she needed a dogthat was gonna tell her please
stop doing that, right.
So it was a really goodopportunity for her and these
are the things that will help.
So we were doing a pair walkand she was kind of pummeling
him a little bit and he said Idon't like that.
And she was able to actuallywalk and sniff and disengage
(25:33):
from Oakley, which was like sogreat.
She's only like 10 months old,so it's fabulous.
So, yes, we prefer those pairwalks where they can build
confidence and sniff withanother friend and play randomly
and then go back to walking.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
And then, lastly, number seven.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
Water games.
This is not always feasible,but if it is, go for it.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Especially this time of year.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yeah, right, not the best number two.
That's why it's number sevenright now, but if it was summer
I'd probably put it as numbertwo.
Water games right.
If you have a pool, great.
If there's a lake by you orbeach.
One of our dog walkers, ryan,likes to take one of our dog
walking clients to the beachover in Asbury, and I mean, this
dog loves it, even though it'schilly for us.
He has no problem because he'sa dog.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
And sprinklers.
Sprinklers are great.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Splash pads if you're obviously your dog is not
destructive and won't bite it.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
They're cheap enough.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Another one is the watering hose.
You can spray it and kind oflike drag it around, almost like
a laser pointer for cats.
But again going back to andthis is gonna lead us into this
bigger conversation of thingsyou don't wanna do you need to
watch for obsessive behavior.
This should not be somethingthat you are doing hours on ends
.
It can literally make dogscrazy and obsessive.
(26:45):
So, yes, that is an option, butyou just wanna make sure that
the dog's personality is goodfor it.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
Anything to add on that one?
Speaker 1 (26:56):
I don't think so, Other than like don't push it,
because there's a lot of dogsthat don't like water.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
Yep, don't push it, don't force them.
We always talk about Gatsby onthe show, but Gatsby absolutely
loves the water and it's greatfor him.
Now that he's getting older wehave not really been throwing
the ball into the water becausehe's getting old.
But him swimming actually it'sexercise, but it's also keeping
his joints really fresh.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
It's a low impact exercise.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Yeah, without a ton of pressure on the body.
So that's been great for him,keeping him moving when he's
what he's nine now.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Just turned 10?
I feel like he's double digitsnow I think he just turned 10.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
No, he was two when we met.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
He had just turned three no.
I don't know, he's either nineor 10.
I feel like he's an older endof that.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
But yeah.
So water games are anothergreat option, so let's lead into
those-.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Cautionary tales.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Cautionary tales.
Okay, this is a big one andthis is something that no pun
intended.
This is something that I talkabout a lot.
All right, deal with a lot ofdogs who are those working
breeds.
Right, you're Aussie shepherds,you're regular shepherds,
border collies, dogs that havereally intense prey, drive,
(28:13):
hurting capabilities, thingslike that, these this is when
you wanna be very touch and gowith these options.
Okay.
Anything that engages the mindand physicality at the same time
can be dangerous.
Okay, for one we'll talk about,we're gonna change her name.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
What do we wanna call her?
Speaker 1 (28:38):
Belle.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Belle, Belle works.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
Belle works.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
That's a place, that's a mall near us.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
It's a Jersey Moll.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
So Belle was a client years ago, probably from when
we first started out.
Had her as a puppy.
I trained her.
They started having issues.
Tom also wanted to be a trainer, but it it didn't.
Basically what had happened wasshe was trying to make Belle
(29:08):
work for absolutely everythingOkay, for affection, for play,
for food, for all of herresources.
Basically, belle had to give toreceive.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
And this was done under the misunderstanding that
because of her breed, becauseshe was a working dog breed, she
needed to be worked 24 seven.
She needed to earn her pay 24seven.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
And that she would enjoy this which she did not.
No, she did not Very quickly, Iwould say around six to eight
months.
She was becoming very reluctantto do basic tasks.
She like wouldn't go in hercrate anymore unless there was
food.
She would not play fetch unlessthere were treats involved.
(29:55):
She would not drop the balluntil you gave her food.
Mom was trading.
She was guarding mom's clothing.
She was biting people.
She bit the son, she bit thedad for walking into the bedroom
.
She basically went crazy.
She basically was like sooverworked and so overtired from
(30:17):
all the having to work foreverything.
I don't even think she knewwhat normal life really looked
like anymore.
So, oh, and the plank, she wasone that did the hose, the
watering hose, and it wasobsessive.
She wouldn't stop, she couldn'tbreak from it, she wouldn't go
to the bathroom, all she wouldwanna do is play with the hose.
(30:37):
And then she was biting thehose and it was just hot mess,
couldn't even get her outsidewithout removing the hose from
the backyard.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Everything was like.
Even the slightest game wasturned into like the Super Bowl,
Like it was.
Everything became high stakes.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Yep, and she couldn't live a normal life Like there
was no.
Just you get home from work andyou take care of your dog and
you go back to normal Likeeverything was a process with
her, and it was like pullingteeth 24 seven.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
And it was basically narrowed down to the agility
work that she was doing.
Right, it got to the point theydidn't have a big yard at all.
This woman had like a wholeagility thing set up in the yard
and it seemed to be more forher than it was for the dog.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
Yeah it was.
And she was like, well, no, Idon't wanna stop doing that.
When I told her it wasbasically making her crazy, what
oh Salem's trying to get in thedoor?
Oh, Tishy's tail, oh my God,she's still put that up.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Tishy's tail is stuck under the door.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
She's literally obsessed with me.
I think that she actuallythinks that she came out of me.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Hello, Miss.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Hi Tishy.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Go lay down.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
All right, good girl lay down.
So even though I had toldBelle's mom that this was in
turn making her crazy, she wasnot open to stopping those
behaviors.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
She doubled down on the agility work, yeah, and
things got worse.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
She forced her more.
She was like no, she needs tolisten to me, this is what she
needs.
But we have to listen to ourdogs.
If they're telling us theydon't want something, they're
not lying to us.
They have no reason to lie.
They're not just doing it toannoy you.
They're not doing it becausethey're trying to gain control
(32:22):
over you.
Most of the time, dogs willtell us exactly what they need
and what they want and what theydon't want.
Speaker 1 (32:28):
Yeah, this dog was being overworked.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Yeah, she was exhausted.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
I know it was a long time ago.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
It was a long time ago.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
But I believe the outcome was we just agreed to
disagree and stopped workingtogether, right?
Speaker 2 (32:39):
I don't think she kept the dog.
I don't think she kept Belle.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
She got.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
A different she got the same breed and she got a boy
.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
And then did the same thing, but I guess he was able
to handle it.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
I think, if I remember correctly, she came
back for training and I told herthat the situation was oh,
that's right.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
She did like a year and a half later and she was and
.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
I was like I'm not doing this again.
Yeah, because you were a sourceof stress for me and I can't
had to protect my piece a littlebit.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
Yeah, hard to do, so that was.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Belle, that was Belle .
Speaker 1 (33:09):
And then, who else was I thinking of?
Speaker 2 (33:12):
I was thinking of another one.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
There's Gatsby with the ball.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Gatsby with the ball is a big one, okay.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Which is what we just did a reel about.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Yes, we just did a reel about fetch and how it can
affect our dogs negatively.
Okay, let me read an Instagrammessage that came yesterday,
literally right after we postedthis, because it was perfect.
Let me find it.
Okay, here it is.
She wrote this as a comment ora message through the reel that
(33:44):
we just put up.
This video really resonateswith me.
Our lab was displaying multipleobsessive and anxious behaviors
that we thought were just highenergy drive behaviors.
We finally started him on anSSRI and deployed some other
management strategies and itmade a huge difference in his
and our happiness.
So when you see obsessivebehavior over fetch or any type
(34:09):
of a game physical game ofthrowing or something like that,
I think trying to think of anyother games that would be
similar to this, like Frisbee,that's more like fetch, but we
really see it in a lot of thetennis balls.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
I mean, you've seen it seems to almost always be
tennis balls.
Speaker 2 (34:26):
You've seen the dogs on social media where they throw
a ton, hundreds of tennis ballsand dogs freaking out right.
There is healthy love of fetchand tennis balls.
That's fine, but there arequite a few dogs who are OCD
about fetch, where Gatsby wasreally, and I had to tell my
parents.
I said listen, this is notaiding him, this is.
(34:48):
It's almost like a sickness,where he would go outside and
wanna play 24 seven.
So he'd stand by the door, hewould bark and they're like oh,
does he have to go to thebathroom?
No, he would go outside, he'dgrab his ball and he would stand
at the door and if you did notcome out and play with him, he
would bark until you did.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
And he wouldn't look at you.
He'd bark at the ball.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
Yep, he'd be barking, he'd be staring at the ball.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
No matter what you did, he would never make eye
contact with you.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
He'd just be Wagging his tail.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
Panting and staring at the ball, and if you didn't
touch it he'd pick it up andthen like drop it at you, like
resetting, but he would alwaysstare at the ball.
Could not look away from theball.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
To the point where we would have parties like our
family would come over in thesummer and playing in the pool
and people would be standingeating food, drinking and he
would have a ball sitting attheir feet and do that, what you
just described over and, overand over again, where the person
didn't even realize that Kathywas there.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
Yeah, and he would hurt people.
Remember when he hurt my legBecause he but he ran into you,
he just ran, not even looking,trying to initiate someone to
throw the ball.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Somebody else threw the ball and he ran, yeah,
backwards and hit right intoJohn.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
So yeah, very obsessive, not healthy for him.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
No, it was not healthy for him.
He has a very he is a dog thatwhen we first adopted him, when
he came into the home, he camefrom a home that really wasn't
giving him enough attention.
He was kind of neglected, notin an abusive way, just
neglected not a lot of love, nota lot of time.
He got to a point where he wasactually creating games for
himself to kind of fill thatvoid and he was trying to catch
(36:12):
shadows or like mirror.
What would you call it mirrorreflections.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
Yeah, or like the reflection of light glare off of
a wine glass.
Speaker 2 (36:21):
On the floor, he would catch it like it was a
game and we, you know, back thenI was just a new trainer and I
really did a lot of my research.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Shadow chasing.
Speaker 2 (36:29):
It's very much so stems from insecurity and not
getting needs met.
So and Fetch just kind of fitright into that category for him
, and you know, for a long timewe were like, oh my God, he's so
good at the game and it's likeno, it's more of a sickness,
like he is really good, right,he's really, you know, agile and
whatever, but we had to reallytailor it back.
So I had my parents remove allthe balls from outside except
for one and it would be more ofthis thing where we were doing a
(36:51):
lot of other managementtechniques with him but also
kind of ignoring that behavioronce his needs were met, making
sure that he did have everythinghe needed like enrichment and
love and all that good stuff.
So he was understanding thathis need to want to play that
was more of his anxiety than itwas a love and I think that's.
Does your dog love it or is itan anxious, ocd behavior?
(37:12):
So something I really wantpeople to keep an eye out if
your dog does this, it's more oflike a tactic to distract from
the anxiety or the over, youknow, overstimulation in the
brain.
Another case study I workedwith more recently and I like
this one because it's a littlebit-.
Speaker 1 (37:30):
Ladybug.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
You're so distracting today.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Sorry.
And then I got tissue in frontof me sunbathing.
Now she's literally in the sun.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
John, stay focused.
John, my God.
John's very melancholy today.
I don't know if it's becauseHalloween's over, he's just in a
weird spot.
Speaker 1 (37:45):
All right all right, wrap this one up.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
No, I'm still talking .
No, the other case study.
I like to compare these twowith Belle and this one, because
Belle was just a one dog family, whereas this dog I'm gonna
call him Myles and his brother'sname is gonna be Remy.
All right, so Myles and Remy isa two dog household, so this,
(38:11):
actually this obsessive play,was affecting their relationship
.
Okay, so this is a blendedfamily.
Mom and dad were a little bitolder.
They both had separate kids,kind of brought everybody in the
same house.
Remy was the dad's dog, orreally the dad's son dog, son's
dog.
He was a little bit older,probably around eight, kind of
(38:32):
blah, like wasn't super active,like to just hang out, get
attention, like couch potato dog, like just chill, right.
Then Myles, who was a boldcarrier of eight months old,
came.
Now they had him.
Since he was a puppy, I wannasay two months old, they got him
.
So they grew up together, right, the puppy grew eight months
old.
That's when they contacted meGuarding, attacking each other,
(38:55):
hot mess, right.
So once we got into it and Ireally dug deep, I'm like I'm
literally watching them on myvirtual and Myles is in the
background with all these ballsAnnoying Remy to no end, but it
becoming obsessive, like ifsomeone would throw the ball, he
would jump on the couch with itand hit into Remy and then Remy
would go after him becauseMyles had gone after Remy so
(39:18):
many times in situations likethis that he was on the defense.
So it was really affectingtheir relationship and they were
moving the balls outside.
They said listen, we'd we childit?
I said you can move the ballsoutside, but I really want you
to cut down the amount of timethat you're playing.
Okay, they did that.
It didn't really fix anything.
We eliminated the ballsaltogether.
Myles is like a different dog.
(39:39):
He can relax, he can take a nap, he can accept normal affection
without having to get up andlike, walk away and go do
something else before comingback and accept it again.
The ball situation, theconstant need for fetch for
hours on end at night, to thepoint where mom couldn't even
cook dinner because he was likeunder her feet was just creating
so much stress and tension inthe home that once we eliminated
(40:02):
it and we gave him more mentalenrichment so frozen bones,
frozen congs, things like that,more proactive affection right,
we're giving it to him when heisn't asking for it.
We're giving it to him beforehe needs it.
It was a huge game changer, sohe needed that to be eliminated
completely.
That was not helping himwhatsoever, or their
relationship.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
It's crazy how common it is.
It's extremely common.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
It just seems like super obscure, but but, just
like the one on Instagram said,like they thought it was just
the behaviors of that specificbreed, right?
So you just go with it.
You read all the books.
You're like, oh, it's normal,but it's not, it doesn't need to
be.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
Right, it's neurotic.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
It's neurotic, it is.
It's more in the brain thananything else.
So we have to actually set themup for success and give them
better things to do so they cangive us more, more I don't even
know what to say better behavior, so to speak.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
More desirable behavior yes yes, and them being
happy and stress-free?
Yeah, or at least low stress.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
So before eliminating the balls for miles, I was
getting probably three texts aweek.
I haven't heard from them likea month and a half.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
That's good.
Yeah, no news is good news.
No news is good news, right?
Speaker 2 (41:10):
So yes, we're on our way.
So those are two well,technically three goose as well.
I can talk about goose becausehe's still one of our really
good boys, not that the otherones don't but I know that his
mom doesn't mind us using hisname, but agility did not work
for him.
He was very stressed out.
So if she does agility, it's inthe backyard with his siblings
and he's fine with that.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
Yeah, all right.
Well, we covered some outdoormental simulation, slash
enrichment ideas.
We covered what not to do, whatto look for, really, which was
the goal of this week.
I think that we accomplishedthat, yeah, yeah.
One thing I wanted to add withthe hiking and, I guess,
anything outdoors, yes, makesure you're prepared for any
(41:51):
emergency.
Mm-hmm.
Get yourself a advanced petfirst aid and CPR certification.
About three and a half hoursonline and you can become
certified.
Get your certification in themail right through us.
Allow me the pleasure of beingable to teach you about your dog
, their anatomy and physiology,and what you should do when
(42:12):
things go south, because everynow and then we all have a rainy
day.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
I mean, how many times, even in our family alone,
have, like our extended family,called you in a panic?
Yeah, it's like once a monthand we're like, okay, you got to
do XYZ and we're so lucky tohave you in the family that you
know all of these things,because it's not common
knowledge and it's not somethingthat you can easily just look
up on Google to fix Like.
These are things that you needto know in your brain and
(42:35):
understand how the body works.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
Yeah, and John you got to be quick.
I mean just emergencies.
You got to be quick yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Time is of the essence, right?
What is it Money?
Speaker 1 (42:44):
is oh, you're going to do this.
Yeah, time is money, money ispizza, pizza is power, yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
Parks and Rec.
I'm going to say, if you knowwhat that's from, if you know
what that's from DMS but yeah,so John, put together this whole
entire course to really helpfamilies, be super knowledgeable
and then you could be the onegetting the calls once a month
from your friends and familythat can help.
You, too, could field calls forzero compensation.
Speaker 1 (43:09):
But yeah, paulsonuniversitycom forward,
slash petfirstaid.
Or just go topaulsonuniversitycom and
navigate in the menus to theadvanced petfirstaid CPR course
and sign up today.
All right, I think that's allwe got for this week.
Yep, what is next week's topic?
Do you remember, do you?
Speaker 2 (43:26):
have it written down?
No, it's in my book.
Speaker 1 (43:28):
I know it's.
We're doing this thing where weare addressing like particular.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Topics every week Topics with questions.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (43:36):
And we're calling them buckets.
So for the week we have abucket of content that will
address a specific topic.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
This helps us stay consistent, but I also think it
really helps people in generalfind knowledge that they need.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
So next week is puppies, puppy question week.
Speaker 2 (43:53):
Just puppy, everything.
Speaker 1 (43:54):
Leash walking, hardware, teething, whatever you
can think of.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
Body training, we're gonna be covering puppies, so we
should probably do two podcastsof that cause.
I feel like that could be areally long conversation.
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yeah, probably Like a part one, part two Maybe.
If you guys are out therelistening, I see the downloads
in it.
You're listening, Like tweet usor something.
Yeah, talk to us that paw somepodcast on ex, formerly Twitter.
That's what everybody's sayingnow.
Speaker 2 (44:22):
Ex formerly Twitter.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
Yeah, twitter changed his name to ex.
You didn't know that.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
I don't pay attention to this stuff.
I can't.
It's too stupid.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
Okay, we're also on threads, but threads was kind of
a flop, but I still get.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
You weren't really excited about that.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
I wasn't really excited.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
You were like there's this new thing called threads
and you try to explain to me andmy brain went south real quick.
Speaker 1 (44:40):
I'm glad I spent all that time explaining it to you.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
It happens a lot.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
But, yeah, reach out to us, let's have a conversation
.
Ask us your questions so wecould address them on the
podcast.
Tell us what you want to hearabout and please follow us on
Instagram at possum university.
If you enjoyed the show andyou're listening on a podcast
platform that has ratings and aSpotify and Apple podcast, your
ratings please give us fivestars so other dog owners can
find us and also share thepodcast for dog people with your
(45:06):
friends and family.
And that's all we have for thisweek, until next week.
Speaker 2 (45:10):
Class dismissed MUSIC .
Everybody welcome to a podcast for dog people.
I'm John and I'm Jamie and weare your personal dog experts.
We're here to help you betterunderstand your dogs in the wide
spectrum of behaviors theyexhibit.
So join us on this journey tolearn everything.
Dog Everybody.
Welcome to another episode ofthe podcast for dog people by
Paulson University.
(00:20):
Today we're gonna be talkingabout outdoor activities in
mental stimulation and we'regonna recommend some things.
We're gonna recommend you don'tdo some things and yeah, it's a
really interesting topicbecause a lot of people think
that you can't go wrong Just you, just as much as you possibly
can.
But the the saying too much ofanything is a bad thing rings
(00:46):
true, especially for mentalstimulation and your dog's
personality.
Yeah, and physical activity isreally what I'm getting at, but
I know that you wanted to talkabout at least these two case
studies that you have from youknow, since we started working
with dogs.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Yes of clients whose dogs have essentially gone
insane and Well, let's, let's gothrough the options first,
right like the like, oursuggestions for the activities
outdoors, then we'll go into thedon'ts and then we'll lead to
why those don'ts led to thosecase studies.
I like, I think that's the wayI want to do this.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
I like it.
I'm trying to fix my my micmicrophone situation here.
Okay, I think we're good,alright, cool, alright.
So I just finished making apost for you.
I'm gonna be posting it rightafter this podcast.
You would give me a bunch ofthings, a bunch of your.
We're calling it your top seven.
Yes mental stimulation slashenrichment ideas.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Yes, so let's go through those.
So these are all things thatyou can do outdoors.
You can y'all also notice onthat post from anybody sees it
on Instagram.
There's a lot of these thingsyou can do inside as well, but
bringing it outside will elevatethe stimulation.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Right, you're bringing in new sense, new
sounds, new sites.
It's a totally differentexperience for them.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Yep, for sure.
So the first one is a sniffarisniffari big fan.
So I personally love this onebecause it's so frickin easy and
it really doesn't cost anything.
It doesn't really do anything alot of times.
And now this this is a thingthat we always have to talk
about on my sessions, right,because what I made a post a
(02:27):
while ago it went a little viral.
If your dog doesn't like towalk, don't make them walk,
right, like that's a big thing.
But another thing that tends topop up a lot is that when we
try to take our dogs for walks,we tend to think that we need to
run them, right, quote-unquotethat's, we need to run your dog.
Bs, no, not true.
Also, they want a sniff morethan they want to walk.
(02:49):
They can walk in the house,they can they walk all day when
they're not sleeping.
So really, for them, whenthey're outside, they're not
looking for that Mile walk.
That's not what's interestingto them.
What's interesting to them isbeing outside those sounds,
those smells, all that goodstuff and Stimulating their
brain in a non Exercise fashion,right there, exercising their
(03:12):
minds.
They would rather do that thantheir body.
Utilizing their senses exactlyand that's actually what comes
the brain okay.
So when you get out your friendand I have a lot of clients
that get very frustrated in thebeginning of their walk because
the dog Is literally goingapeshit and they're like by the
end of the walk they're fine,but in the beginning it's, it's
a hot mess and I always say letthem stimulate before you walk
(03:34):
for exercise.
This is something that you cando as a routine.
This is your new thing.
You come out the door whereveryour dog wants to sniff, left
right, straight back.
Wherever they want to go.
You are at their beck and callOkay, and a lot of you like well
, I want to be in control.
That's not necessary.
That's not the goal here.
The goal is to stimulate yourdog.
So lose the fight, you know.
(03:54):
Pick our battles and if yourdog wants to go a specific way
and smell, obviously Withinreason of not letting your dog
go on people's lawns, if you'regonna get yelled at, but you
know, if there's a bigger areanear your house or in your front
lawn, just let them sniff.
Let them do their thing.
Don't be talking to them, don'ttry and pull them closer to you
, just let them do their thing,as long as they're not, you know
, obviously, wrenching your armout of the socket.
(04:15):
You know, let them do theirthing.
This will actually allow themto get there.
I call getting your yai-yas outin the beginning of the walk.
So once you actually startwalking and you're on a routine,
they'll be able to function alot better.
They kind of got thatstimulation out.
They kind of, you know, workedtheir brains in a way where now
they can function.
Now they can be like oh, we'rewalking this way and I can focus
(04:36):
on mom or dad, versus before,when I kind of came out the door
and I was loony tunes.
So this is a really, reallygood method to kind of fix up
your walk and really get thatextra stimulation in there for
your dog, without doing reallyanything other than just
standing there and lookingpretty see the polar opposite of
us with the Balanced trainerslike to call a structured walk.
Yes which is probably the mostboring thing on the face of this
(04:56):
earth right, the walk reallyessentially is for the dog, it's
for the dog, but we make itthis like you need to listen to
me and it's like no, let them dotheir damn thing, right, like
let them have fun.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
This is the the two minutes.
If they get two walks a day,right yeah, and most people like
to do real quick, just get themout and get back inside two
minutes.
They get to go outside, letthem sniff a little, let them
live a little and risk yourlives and it's so simple.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
You really don't have to do much of anything other
than just stand there.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
And then, so that was sniffari is.
Number one and then move on tonumber two number two is the
treasure hunt.
The treasure hunt the treasurehunt.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Sorry, I'm a little nasally today.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
I see that got me sick, oh boy.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
So the treasure hunt we don't do, because our dogs
are not that smart.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
They're not smart, they're not.
They're not Athleticallyblessed.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
They don't care about this type of.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Oakley has an enlarged heart.
He's on Viagra just to keephimself alive.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
We don't know if she's like sticks and glue put
together.
She hobbles through the houseand Pudge is like no, I'm not
hungry.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
No.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
So the three of them don't benefit from most of these
.
They are just happy with theirnormal enrichment frozen toys
inside.
They're good to go.
But other dogs that are moreintelligent tend to be a little
bit more anxious and reactiveand stuff like that.
This is a really good optionfor them, where we're more so
using the brain versus againover exercising them.
You'll see a pattern here.
(06:20):
I am not pro over exercisebecause I actually find that it
overstimulates and over tiresour dogs that are Already
anxious and already a hot messin their brains, and it makes it
worse.
So you'll notice that a lot ofthese are more using our brain
activities versus using our bodyactivities.
So, like in our posts, it'll sayyou know, it may take your dog
(06:41):
a little bit of time to figurethis out, especially if you've
never done anything like thisbefore.
It's basically a hide and seekgame with treats and food.
I do not suggest throwing yourdog's kibble all over the yard.
There are some trainers outthere, even positive
reinforcement that suggests this.
If you have a concrete backyard, great, go for it.
Or patio, go for it.
(07:01):
But if it's the grass and theymiss kibble, then I get nervous
that they're missing part oftheir meal or they're giving up
because they can't find it, andthen we don't know that they're
getting underfed.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
And then you got raccoons in the ornament.
Yeah, we don't want that either.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
So I prefer, if you're going to like, toss the
food which is a great option on,like on a hard surface outside
that you can see where the foodis and you're aware of, like,
what they got and what theydidn't get.
Now the treasure hunt is morealong the lines of like, let me
take a scoop of kibble or apiece, a couple pieces of string
cheese and put them behind thischair or put them by this rock
(07:36):
that my dog can perfectly see,and like, hiding them in
specific places, maybe not underthings, because, again, if your
dog is really good at this andthey get there, you can get
there once they become a pro.
But in the beginning, like,keep it simple, right Couple of
places, and you stick to aphrase that they're gonna know
consistently, like find it Now.
Like Gatsby, my parents dog,when he wants to play with his
(07:58):
tennis ball, which we'll get toin a minute, if you say find it,
he starts to look for it.
He knows find it means findsomething right.
He might not even know what itis he's looking for, but he
starts using his nose and triesto find whatever it is that is
being hidden, right?
So, again, it might not beperfect.
In the beginning it might looklike a hot mess, but eventually,
once you kind of lead them toit, right, like find it, and
(08:20):
you're like find it, yes, get it, getting excited.
And then you kind of like leadthem over to where it is and
then, once they find it, you'relike, yes, you found it, and you
get all excited and maybe theyget a couple more treats for
finding it.
Then they're more encouraged todo this activity.
And then you get it to thepoint where, like we know some
clients that like literally haveto hide their dogs inside, go
hide everything outside and thenlet the door open and the dog's
like already ready to golooking for these treats and
(08:42):
it's like their most favoriteactivity.
This is also an inside rainyday win for a lot of dogs as
well, so this is a great option.
Anything to add on that one.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
I ran over my wire hold on.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
A little bit of a struggle bus today, oh no, okay,
come on, babe, get it together.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
I wrapped around my foot.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
All right Anything to add about the treasure hunt?
Speaker 1 (09:08):
No.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Okay, could have just said that, wasting my time.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
This is a crisis.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
The third one is hiking.
This is a really simple one.
Now again, a lot of these don'treally pertain to me in John's
life because I am not anoutdoorsy person.
I really I mean I'll do it, butit really does not interest me
like going for a hike.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Are we really the authority on outdoor activities
with your dog?
Speaker 2 (09:31):
You know, I think these are great options.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
No.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
So hiking right Now.
This is kind of similar to thatnumber one that we talked about
, the Snifari very similar.
But you can take it one stepfurther.
You go hiking.
I don't like dogs off leash.
We've made that perfectly clear.
I don't think it's everacceptable.
I don't think it's ever needed.
Okay, I prefer having a dog ona long line 50 yards or 50 feet
(09:56):
is my preference.
You can do 100, whatever worksfor you.
As long as there is somethingtethered to your dog.
I do not like retractablessuper dangerous.
So if you're gonna do this,it's gotta be a long line.
This will ensure that nobodygets hurt, at least not in a
really bad way.
So if you're gonna go hikingand you get your dog used to the
length, you don't wanna go likefrom using a six foot leash to
(10:19):
now randomly going hiking andnow you have a 100 foot leash.
Your dog's gonna be like what'shappening and they're gonna get
really confused when there'sfinally a tug at the end of that
100 foot leash.
So start small and then gohiking and be very alert, have
your treats on you and you'rejust kinda letting them do their
thing.
Again, you're not shucking themalong the entire time.
You're kinda watching forthings that they can get wrapped
(10:42):
up in.
You don't want them if they'resuper hyperactive and they're
running all over the placesprinting.
You wanna be very careful whenyou're using a long line because
, again, they're unaware whenthey're getting crazy how short
that leash is getting and whenthey're about to get that tug on
their neck and you don't wantanybody getting hurt.
So we always suggest a frontclip harness for this, because
you don't want anybody gettingclothes lined and then just
(11:02):
watch for like trees and thingsthat they can get tangled around
, so they don't again getclothes lined randomly and get
negatively reinforced when youreally didn't do anything.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
Positive punishment.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Yeah, positive punishment.
So, yes, keep walking.
And this is a little bit of astep up from the number one that
we went over this nefarie,because now there's new sense
they're not close to homebecause that can actually change
things for dogs.
When they know that they'reclose to home, they're in their
neighborhood, they may actdifferently and they may be more
stressed because they're morereactive or protective of their
(11:34):
home, or they'll be lessstressed because they know that
they have an out.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Yeah, or they could be distracted by certain
behavior patterns they have.
If there's barking dogs thatare always at that house on the
corner, they're gonna prime upfor it, they're gonna be
expecting it.
Whereas you go on a hike, youtry a new trail, it's a novel
and just as it's enriching foryou, it's enriching for them.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
It makes me think of Opie, one of our dogs.
We've talked about him numeroustimes on the podcast and on
social media, but Opie's a dogthat we've been working with for
years.
He was at the shelter and gotadopted now by our friends Linda
and Josh.
He hates walking at home likewill not leave the driveway.
He's actually doing better now.
In the last couple of monthshe's made a turn.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
How's he All?
Speaker 2 (12:13):
right, good, but when they first, I mean they've had
him what?
He's nine now, they've had himfor seven years and he would not
leave the house, like literallywould not cross the driveway
mark onto the sidewalk.
But Linda can get him in thecar and take him to a park and
he will walk fine.
So he does not like walking inthe neighborhood, it makes him
too nervous.
But out and about he'scompletely fine and actually
enjoys it.
So every dog's a little bitdifferent, kind of find what
(12:35):
works for your dog.
But I really you know thehiking for those really hyper
focused dogs that like to sniff.
This is great for you too,because you're not in your
neighborhood feeling like youneed to be very monotonous and
like keep moving, like this is atime for you to relax as well
and kind of enjoy the sceneryand just relax around you and
unplug a little bit.
So I like this option a lot.
Oh, and to work on your recallForgot that part, the golden
(12:59):
opportunity To work on yourrecall.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
This is a great opportunity, which you should
already have established, andsome level at least, that they
know the touch cue or whateverit is that you're gonna be using
.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yes, so we like the touch cue.
That's come.
You know, boop my palm withyour nose.
Most dogs really love it.
If your dog's a little skittish, this might be a little bit
more of a struggle for you.
But basically the idea is forthem to go and sniff and have a
good time and you get reallyexcited and say touch and then
come running, boop your hand,get that really high value treat
and then you set them rightback out to do exactly what they
(13:30):
were doing.
You are reinforcing that recall, but you're also saying the
recall doesn't mean that the funis ending, so this is actually
enjoyable for you.
Take a slight break, come get apiece of hot dog and go right
back to what you were doing.
They're like well, I love thatcue, that's great.
I love that recall and this islike that emergency command.
Obviously, if a dog runs out ofthe home and you say touch
(13:52):
versus get back here, they'regonna be more likely to come to
the touch because they like it.
Yes, so that is a really goodgolden opportunity to really
enforce that and drive your bondwith your dog.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
So number three was hiking.
Yes, number four.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
Number four is frozen enrichment.
This is, like I already said,that the number one was
obviously the sniffari, butpersonally, for our dogs, this
is our number one.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
This is what we do, based on their activity level.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Based on their personality and what they like.
I mean, my dogs are really notactive, they really aren't.
So this is a really big one forour family.
But let's say you have a veryactive family, you like to go to
wineries, you like to go out toeat and you like to bring your
dog.
Your dog's generally friendly,isn't super reactive, but they
tend to get a little bit bored.
When we go out to eat, we'rebasically expecting our dogs to
(14:41):
kind of just sit there and thiskind of like elevates it for
them, makes it a little bit morefun in general, where they
might actually behave better forus because they know that this
is coming Bringing frozen treats.
So John had suggested bringing acooler bag, like a small cooler
bag with frozen items.
So we do a lot of marabonescongs and our new favorite is
(15:01):
the Pupcicle that is on Amazon.
It's also on our product list.
It's a great option because youcan fill your own silicone ice
cube tray and bring that withyou.
We will.
We have like what?
Like five trays now that makeslike 20 little ice cubes at a
time.
I'll fill them all and then popthem out when they're ready.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
And put them in a little bag Like little balls.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Like ice balls, like whiskey balls, right yeah, like
a smaller whiskey ball, but likeit's.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
you can do I've talked about this so many times
you can do yoga, pumpkin puree,like anything that your dog
likes.
It'll freeze that into a balland that ball fits perfectly
inside of the Pupcicle.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
So you can bring a ton of those with you on your
outing and really all you haveto do is make sure you have ice
packs and you just bring thatone item, that one Pupcicle, and
you're good to go.
You just keep popping them inwhenever they need them.
So I love that and I think thatit's really great, especially
on those hot days.
We wanna keep our dogs calmwhen we're out and about.
But it's a win-win foreverybody really, because then
(15:58):
everybody gets to enjoythemselves.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
I like it.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Number five Number five is agility.
Can you actually read what youwrote, because it actually made
me laugh.
I think it's perfect.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
While I have the laziest dogs on the planet,
seriously they're pros.
Many dogs absolutely loveagility training.
The key is ensuring that yourdog enjoys it and that it
doesn't become a source ofstress or overstimulation.
Some dogs take to it likenaturals and really that depends
on their breed for the mostpart in their what kind of drive
that they have, just innately.
(16:29):
But sorry, having an issue withmy John's just now.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
He's mouth on chinning today.
Everybody just pay attention tome.
Oh, except for this part whereI'm reading Well, I didn't know
you were really having that hardat the time, but clearly the
key is ensuring that your dogenjoys it and that it doesn't
become a source of stress oroverstimulation.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Some dogs take to it like naturals and thrive, and
they're the ones who trulybenefit.
However, if your dog seemsuninterested, consider exploring
another outdoor activity.
If your dog loves it, go for it.
Remember to balance the timeand obsession to maintain a
healthy relationship.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
The obsession is what we're gonna talk about in a
little bit.
This is really important.
Actually, just thought ofanother case study too goose who
used to go agility training andthen we realized it was
actually stressing him out more.
So agility can be great for alot of dogs.
They feel a sense of pride whenthey do it.
You know it obviously usestheir brain and their exercise
(17:20):
muscles at the same time.
But really like what John said,you wanna make sure that your
dog actually likes this.
If your dog is avoiding this oris really getting frustrated or
struggling and really isn'tdoing what the practice is right
, like they're not enjoying it,cut it off.
This is something that it'slike they either like naturally
(17:41):
take to it or they don't.
It really shouldn't be one ofthose things that's taught very
similar to like therapy training.
Right, oakley's a therapy dogbecause he was born a therapy
dog.
I did not make him a therapydog, okay, even though Tishi by
nature is very similarlyfriendly and sweet and loving,
she has slight more anxiety orthe ability to leach people's
(18:04):
anxiety.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
She's a mess.
She could never be a therapydog.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
She's 13 now leave her alone.
But Oakley was, he is, so hewas like bread for this.
Like he literally like does notleach other people's anxiety.
So if someone's stressed and ispetting him, he is there for
them, versus like a dog who'slike, oh my God, they're anxious
.
No, I need to be anxious, right, Even though they're
acknowledging that anxiety andgiving them the love that they
need.
But very similar to the agilityhere, it needs to be something
(18:32):
that's natural for them andfeels really good.
It's not something that weprogram.
You can't, you just can't do it.
So I always urge people when Isay what do you think about
agility training?
And if I'm working with aclient I'm like, no, your dog is
not, this is not for them.
This will stress them out more.
This is diving into the anxietywe actually want to lead away
from.
But some dogs yes, fabulous,really good outlet could work
(18:55):
really well, especially if theylike other dogs.
But we were working with onedog, goose, who mom was taking
to agility.
He's an Aussie shepherd, it'sin his blood, but he's very dog
reactive.
He lives with two other dogs,but any other dog that he didn't
really know made him veryuncomfortable.
So he was very distracted bythe other dogs trying to learn
how to do the agility and it wasactually becoming a source of
(19:17):
stress for him.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
I think you jumped segments.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
You weren't supposed to talk about the bad stuff yet.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Well, no, I was just.
That's a small portion.
A small portion, just a littleon it yeah.
Number six is pair walks.
Okay, if you've been listeningto us for a while, you know this
, but if you are new to our show, we do not do face to face dog
meets ever.
It's not our thing, we don'tlike it, we don't think it's
setting our dogs up for success.
(19:44):
So pair walks is essentiallywhen you take two dogs, two or
more, and you're walking all inthe same direction and they are
not meeting each other orsniffing each other for a little
bit.
Okay, if there is a sniff, it'sgonna be like in our situation.
What we do with Oakley.
He's our big guy who is theneutral dog.
He literally doesn't care abouta damn thing, all he wants is
food.
(20:04):
He walks forward and thereactive dog that I'm trying to
get to understand that dogs areactually a good thing.
I will bring them immediatelyup to Oakley's butt for them to
sniff.
This allows them to understandwho Oakley is without him
turning around and looking atthem, all right.
So I'm manipulating thesituation, the pair walk because
I'm not with you and I can'tsee who's reactive and who's not
(20:26):
, who's having a good time,who's not.
I always suggest going for apair walk, so like ones on the
left, ones on the right, almostlike a street away, like
sidewalk to sidewalk.
That's kinda how you'repositioning yourselves and
you're just walking all in thesame direction.
They can look at each otherside to side, but we're not
letting them like pummel eachother and then going for the
butt sniff, the double buttsniff, where they're both going
(20:49):
to sniff the butt at the sametime.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
Never good.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
When that happens, your dog is unknowingly
extending their neck, whichthey're literally saying here's
my jugular right, yeah, think oflike a yin and yang symbol.
Yes, that's exactly what happens.
But when they do that, the body, the biologically, is going
back to times when they livedoutside and they were really,
you know, in more survival mode.
(21:12):
That's a no-no, you don'textend your neck, you don't show
that to another animal.
So they, even thoughfriendly-wise, they wanna go
meet that other dog, they areputting themselves in a
vulnerable state and sometimesthe body will kind of like shoot
adrenaline and make them think,oh, you're in fight or flight,
like protect yourself, eventhough nothing happened.
The dog was just doing exactlywhat they were doing sniffing
(21:33):
the butt.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
You know, friendly, but A lot of people don't see
how or why that escalates.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
I know cause it's so quick.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Cause the motivating factor to get that close to the
other dog to begin with was toget the sniff, and once the
sniff was in, there's no othermotivating factor to be that
close, and that's for, you know,specific dogs that will do this
.
So, without the motivatingfactor, now they're like oh crap
, I'm right here, they're rightthere, my neck's right there.
I need to do something quick.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Like, the thing that I wanted to do is already done,
right, so now, now I'm just in acrowd, yeah well, we see the
same exact thing.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
When people will put a treat on their knee and have a
dog that doesn't like thatperson, come over and take the
treat off their knee.
Speaker 2 (22:14):
So they're motivated for the food.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
Right, once the food's gone, once they take the
treat.
You're now face to face withthis dog who does not want to be
near you.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
And this dog's like oh, now it has to make a choice.
Do I back up or do I bite?
Speaker 1 (22:28):
And I can count I think I'm still on one hand how
many times I know of somebodythat got bit in that situation
in a shelter setting, but still,I mean that's stupid.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Stupid.
Seems like a good idea at thetime, but then when it plays out
, it's really not so.
We prefer pair walks.
We like when dogs get to comeout of their cars.
Right, let's say you're meetingat a park.
You can't tell your dog hey,we're gonna go meet your dog
friend at the park, don't be ajerk.
Right, calm yourself down.
They can't say, oh, I'm gonnago see my friend.
And calm themselves down in thepark where they know what to
(22:59):
expect.
Right, they can't self-regulateon something that they haven't
even seen or understood yet,right?
So once they get out of the car, they're now going from, like,
usually a zero state to probablyclose to a tent of excitement
or fear right, either one andthey need to come down from that
.
So if we get them out of thecar and immediately meet our
friend, we're asking for aproblem, right?
We're asking for crazy, loonytune behavior.
(23:20):
So in reality, we wanna givethem a few minutes to say, yes,
you're at the park, there'sother dogs and people here, your
friend is here, let'sself-regulate before we make a
mistake, right?
And they can say, oh, my friendis here, okay, okay, gotta
shake it off, shake it off,shake it off, okay, get back to
normal, right.
Then they can behaveappropriately because they're in
a normal place of thinkingright, they're regulated.
So give them a few minutes andthen you can slowly get them
(23:42):
together on your walk.
On your walk, and then they cankind of be like oh, my friend
is here, okay, get a littlesniff and then go sniff right,
go sniff the ground right.
They kind of like disengagefrom the situation.
That's proper socialization andwe wanna show our dogs
especially if your dog is superfriendly, that you don't need to
play 24-7.
That doesn't have to be theonly form of socialization.
(24:03):
You can go for a nice walk withyour friend and not be
pummeling each other 24-7.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Teaching regulation.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Yes, it's really important and playing to style,
right, my crazy puppies thatcome here for training.
They'll meet Oakley and Oakleygets to teach them I don't play,
I'll be your friend, but Idon't play, it's not my thing.
And some of them will get alittle offended.
They get a little, you know,they get a little lack of a
better phrase but hurt, andthey've gotta overcome that
(24:29):
frustration and be like oh okay,he still likes me, but he
doesn't wanna play with me,right?
And that's a really.
That's not a skill that comesover time, that's taught, right.
So if your dog is only-.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
That's not a skill they're born with.
That's something that theylearn over time.
Yes, they have to learn.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
We have to put them in situations to learn it.
But also like, for example, Ihad a dog here the other day
trying to play with Oakley.
He gave a slight growl becauseshe was jumping all over his
head.
She sat ears back, just kind ofstared at him right, and he
just gave her a kiss on themouth to be like I still like
you, and it totally helped her,Like it made her understand that
he wasn't mad at her, right, hewas just saying I don't really
(25:11):
like that.
And it was really good for herto learn because she has a
sister at home that is verysubmissive and doesn't give
corrections, so she needed a dogthat was gonna tell her please
stop doing that, right.
So it was a really goodopportunity for her and these
are the things that will help.
So we were doing a pair walkand she was kind of pummeling
him a little bit and he said Idon't like that.
And she was able to actuallywalk and sniff and disengage
(25:33):
from Oakley, which was like sogreat.
She's only like 10 months old,so it's fabulous.
So, yes, we prefer those pairwalks where they can build
confidence and sniff withanother friend and play randomly
and then go back to walking.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
And then, lastly, number seven.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
Water games.
This is not always feasible,but if it is, go for it.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Especially this time of year.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yeah, right, not the best number two.
That's why it's number sevenright now, but if it was summer
I'd probably put it as numbertwo.
Water games right.
If you have a pool, great.
If there's a lake by you orbeach.
One of our dog walkers, ryan,likes to take one of our dog
walking clients to the beachover in Asbury, and I mean, this
dog loves it, even though it'schilly for us.
He has no problem because he'sa dog.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
And sprinklers.
Sprinklers are great.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Splash pads if you're obviously your dog is not
destructive and won't bite it.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
They're cheap enough.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Another one is the watering hose.
You can spray it and kind oflike drag it around, almost like
a laser pointer for cats.
But again going back to andthis is gonna lead us into this
bigger conversation of thingsyou don't wanna do you need to
watch for obsessive behavior.
This should not be somethingthat you are doing hours on ends
.
It can literally make dogscrazy and obsessive.
(26:45):
So, yes, that is an option, butyou just wanna make sure that
the dog's personality is goodfor it.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
Anything to add on that one?
Speaker 1 (26:56):
I don't think so, Other than like don't push it,
because there's a lot of dogsthat don't like water.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
Yep, don't push it, don't force them.
We always talk about Gatsby onthe show, but Gatsby absolutely
loves the water and it's greatfor him.
Now that he's getting older wehave not really been throwing
the ball into the water becausehe's getting old.
But him swimming actually it'sexercise, but it's also keeping
his joints really fresh.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
It's a low impact exercise.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Yeah, without a ton of pressure on the body.
So that's been great for him,keeping him moving when he's
what he's nine now.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Just turned 10?
I feel like he's double digitsnow I think he just turned 10.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
No, he was two when we met.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
He had just turned three no.
I don't know, he's either nineor 10.
I feel like he's an older endof that.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
But yeah.
So water games are anothergreat option, so let's lead into
those-.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Cautionary tales.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Cautionary tales.
Okay, this is a big one andthis is something that no pun
intended.
This is something that I talkabout a lot.
All right, deal with a lot ofdogs who are those working
breeds.
Right, you're Aussie shepherds,you're regular shepherds,
border collies, dogs that havereally intense prey, drive,
(28:13):
hurting capabilities, thingslike that, these this is when
you wanna be very touch and gowith these options.
Okay.
Anything that engages the mindand physicality at the same time
can be dangerous.
Okay, for one we'll talk about,we're gonna change her name.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
What do we wanna call her?
Speaker 1 (28:38):
Belle.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Belle, Belle works.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
Belle works.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
That's a place, that's a mall near us.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
It's a Jersey Moll.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
So Belle was a client years ago, probably from when
we first started out.
Had her as a puppy.
I trained her.
They started having issues.
Tom also wanted to be a trainer, but it it didn't.
Basically what had happened wasshe was trying to make Belle
(29:08):
work for absolutely everythingOkay, for affection, for play,
for food, for all of herresources.
Basically, belle had to give toreceive.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
And this was done under the misunderstanding that
because of her breed, becauseshe was a working dog breed, she
needed to be worked 24 seven.
She needed to earn her pay 24seven.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
And that she would enjoy this which she did not.
No, she did not Very quickly, Iwould say around six to eight
months.
She was becoming very reluctantto do basic tasks.
She like wouldn't go in hercrate anymore unless there was
food.
She would not play fetch unlessthere were treats involved.
(29:55):
She would not drop the balluntil you gave her food.
Mom was trading.
She was guarding mom's clothing.
She was biting people.
She bit the son, she bit thedad for walking into the bedroom
.
She basically went crazy.
She basically was like sooverworked and so overtired from
(30:17):
all the having to work foreverything.
I don't even think she knewwhat normal life really looked
like anymore.
So, oh, and the plank, she wasone that did the hose, the
watering hose, and it wasobsessive.
She wouldn't stop, she couldn'tbreak from it, she wouldn't go
to the bathroom, all she wouldwanna do is play with the hose.
(30:37):
And then she was biting thehose and it was just hot mess,
couldn't even get her outsidewithout removing the hose from
the backyard.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Everything was like.
Even the slightest game wasturned into like the Super Bowl,
Like it was.
Everything became high stakes.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Yep, and she couldn't live a normal life Like there
was no.
Just you get home from work andyou take care of your dog and
you go back to normal Likeeverything was a process with
her, and it was like pullingteeth 24 seven.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
And it was basically narrowed down to the agility
work that she was doing.
Right, it got to the point theydidn't have a big yard at all.
This woman had like a wholeagility thing set up in the yard
and it seemed to be more forher than it was for the dog.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
Yeah it was.
And she was like, well, no, Idon't wanna stop doing that.
When I told her it wasbasically making her crazy, what
oh Salem's trying to get in thedoor?
Oh, Tishy's tail, oh my God,she's still put that up.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Tishy's tail is stuck under the door.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
She's literally obsessed with me.
I think that she actuallythinks that she came out of me.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Hello, Miss.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Hi Tishy.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Go lay down.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
All right, good girl lay down.
So even though I had toldBelle's mom that this was in
turn making her crazy, she wasnot open to stopping those
behaviors.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
She doubled down on the agility work, yeah, and
things got worse.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
She forced her more.
She was like no, she needs tolisten to me, this is what she
needs.
But we have to listen to ourdogs.
If they're telling us theydon't want something, they're
not lying to us.
They have no reason to lie.
They're not just doing it toannoy you.
They're not doing it becausethey're trying to gain control
(32:22):
over you.
Most of the time, dogs willtell us exactly what they need
and what they want and what theydon't want.
Speaker 1 (32:28):
Yeah, this dog was being overworked.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Yeah, she was exhausted.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
I know it was a long time ago.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
It was a long time ago.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
But I believe the outcome was we just agreed to
disagree and stopped workingtogether, right?
Speaker 2 (32:39):
I don't think she kept the dog.
I don't think she kept Belle.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
She got.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
A different she got the same breed and she got a boy
.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
And then did the same thing, but I guess he was able
to handle it.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
I think, if I remember correctly, she came
back for training and I told herthat the situation was oh,
that's right.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
She did like a year and a half later and she was and
.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
I was like I'm not doing this again.
Yeah, because you were a sourceof stress for me and I can't
had to protect my piece a littlebit.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
Yeah, hard to do, so that was.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Belle, that was Belle .
Speaker 1 (33:09):
And then, who else was I thinking of?
Speaker 2 (33:12):
I was thinking of another one.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
There's Gatsby with the ball.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Gatsby with the ball is a big one, okay.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Which is what we just did a reel about.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Yes, we just did a reel about fetch and how it can
affect our dogs negatively.
Okay, let me read an Instagrammessage that came yesterday,
literally right after we postedthis, because it was perfect.
Let me find it.
Okay, here it is.
She wrote this as a comment ora message through the reel that
(33:44):
we just put up.
This video really resonateswith me.
Our lab was displaying multipleobsessive and anxious behaviors
that we thought were just highenergy drive behaviors.
We finally started him on anSSRI and deployed some other
management strategies and itmade a huge difference in his
and our happiness.
So when you see obsessivebehavior over fetch or any type
(34:09):
of a game physical game ofthrowing or something like that,
I think trying to think of anyother games that would be
similar to this, like Frisbee,that's more like fetch, but we
really see it in a lot of thetennis balls.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
I mean, you've seen it seems to almost always be
tennis balls.
Speaker 2 (34:26):
You've seen the dogs on social media where they throw
a ton, hundreds of tennis ballsand dogs freaking out right.
There is healthy love of fetchand tennis balls.
That's fine, but there arequite a few dogs who are OCD
about fetch, where Gatsby wasreally, and I had to tell my
parents.
I said listen, this is notaiding him, this is.
(34:48):
It's almost like a sickness,where he would go outside and
wanna play 24 seven.
So he'd stand by the door, hewould bark and they're like oh,
does he have to go to thebathroom?
No, he would go outside, he'dgrab his ball and he would stand
at the door and if you did notcome out and play with him, he
would bark until you did.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
And he wouldn't look at you.
He'd bark at the ball.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
Yep, he'd be barking, he'd be staring at the ball.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
No matter what you did, he would never make eye
contact with you.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
He'd just be Wagging his tail.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
Panting and staring at the ball, and if you didn't
touch it he'd pick it up andthen like drop it at you, like
resetting, but he would alwaysstare at the ball.
Could not look away from theball.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
To the point where we would have parties like our
family would come over in thesummer and playing in the pool
and people would be standingeating food, drinking and he
would have a ball sitting attheir feet and do that, what you
just described over and, overand over again, where the person
didn't even realize that Kathywas there.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
Yeah, and he would hurt people.
Remember when he hurt my legBecause he but he ran into you,
he just ran, not even looking,trying to initiate someone to
throw the ball.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Somebody else threw the ball and he ran, yeah,
backwards and hit right intoJohn.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
So yeah, very obsessive, not healthy for him.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
No, it was not healthy for him.
He has a very he is a dog thatwhen we first adopted him, when
he came into the home, he camefrom a home that really wasn't
giving him enough attention.
He was kind of neglected, notin an abusive way, just
neglected not a lot of love, nota lot of time.
He got to a point where he wasactually creating games for
himself to kind of fill thatvoid and he was trying to catch
(36:12):
shadows or like mirror.
What would you call it mirrorreflections.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
Yeah, or like the reflection of light glare off of
a wine glass.
Speaker 2 (36:21):
On the floor, he would catch it like it was a
game and we, you know, back thenI was just a new trainer and I
really did a lot of my research.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Shadow chasing.
Speaker 2 (36:29):
It's very much so stems from insecurity and not
getting needs met.
So and Fetch just kind of fitright into that category for him
, and you know, for a long timewe were like, oh my God, he's so
good at the game and it's likeno, it's more of a sickness,
like he is really good, right,he's really, you know, agile and
whatever, but we had to reallytailor it back.
So I had my parents remove allthe balls from outside except
for one and it would be more ofthis thing where we were doing a
(36:51):
lot of other managementtechniques with him but also
kind of ignoring that behavioronce his needs were met, making
sure that he did have everythinghe needed like enrichment and
love and all that good stuff.
So he was understanding thathis need to want to play that
was more of his anxiety than itwas a love and I think that's.
Does your dog love it or is itan anxious, ocd behavior?
(37:12):
So something I really wantpeople to keep an eye out if
your dog does this, it's more oflike a tactic to distract from
the anxiety or the over, youknow, overstimulation in the
brain.
Another case study I workedwith more recently and I like
this one because it's a littlebit-.
Speaker 1 (37:30):
Ladybug.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
You're so distracting today.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Sorry.
And then I got tissue in frontof me sunbathing.
Now she's literally in the sun.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
John, stay focused.
John, my God.
John's very melancholy today.
I don't know if it's becauseHalloween's over, he's just in a
weird spot.
Speaker 1 (37:45):
All right all right, wrap this one up.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
No, I'm still talking .
No, the other case study.
I like to compare these twowith Belle and this one, because
Belle was just a one dog family, whereas this dog I'm gonna
call him Myles and his brother'sname is gonna be Remy.
All right, so Myles and Remy isa two dog household, so this,
(38:11):
actually this obsessive play,was affecting their relationship
.
Okay, so this is a blendedfamily.
Mom and dad were a little bitolder.
They both had separate kids,kind of brought everybody in the
same house.
Remy was the dad's dog, orreally the dad's son dog, son's
dog.
He was a little bit older,probably around eight, kind of
(38:32):
blah, like wasn't super active,like to just hang out, get
attention, like couch potato dog, like just chill, right.
Then Myles, who was a boldcarrier of eight months old,
came.
Now they had him.
Since he was a puppy, I wannasay two months old, they got him
.
So they grew up together, right, the puppy grew eight months
old.
That's when they contacted meGuarding, attacking each other,
(38:55):
hot mess, right.
So once we got into it and Ireally dug deep, I'm like I'm
literally watching them on myvirtual and Myles is in the
background with all these ballsAnnoying Remy to no end, but it
becoming obsessive, like ifsomeone would throw the ball, he
would jump on the couch with itand hit into Remy and then Remy
would go after him becauseMyles had gone after Remy so
(39:18):
many times in situations likethis that he was on the defense.
So it was really affectingtheir relationship and they were
moving the balls outside.
They said listen, we'd we childit?
I said you can move the ballsoutside, but I really want you
to cut down the amount of timethat you're playing.
Okay, they did that.
It didn't really fix anything.
We eliminated the ballsaltogether.
Myles is like a different dog.
(39:39):
He can relax, he can take a nap, he can accept normal affection
without having to get up andlike, walk away and go do
something else before comingback and accept it again.
The ball situation, theconstant need for fetch for
hours on end at night, to thepoint where mom couldn't even
cook dinner because he was likeunder her feet was just creating
so much stress and tension inthe home that once we eliminated
(40:02):
it and we gave him more mentalenrichment so frozen bones,
frozen congs, things like that,more proactive affection right,
we're giving it to him when heisn't asking for it.
We're giving it to him beforehe needs it.
It was a huge game changer, sohe needed that to be eliminated
completely.
That was not helping himwhatsoever, or their
relationship.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
It's crazy how common it is.
It's extremely common.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
It just seems like super obscure, but but, just
like the one on Instagram said,like they thought it was just
the behaviors of that specificbreed, right?
So you just go with it.
You read all the books.
You're like, oh, it's normal,but it's not, it doesn't need to
be.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
Right, it's neurotic.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
It's neurotic, it is.
It's more in the brain thananything else.
So we have to actually set themup for success and give them
better things to do so they cangive us more, more I don't even
know what to say better behavior, so to speak.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
More desirable behavior yes yes, and them being
happy and stress-free?
Yeah, or at least low stress.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
So before eliminating the balls for miles, I was
getting probably three texts aweek.
I haven't heard from them likea month and a half.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
That's good.
Yeah, no news is good news.
No news is good news, right?
Speaker 2 (41:10):
So yes, we're on our way.
So those are two well,technically three goose as well.
I can talk about goose becausehe's still one of our really
good boys, not that the otherones don't but I know that his
mom doesn't mind us using hisname, but agility did not work
for him.
He was very stressed out.
So if she does agility, it's inthe backyard with his siblings
and he's fine with that.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
Yeah, all right.
Well, we covered some outdoormental simulation, slash
enrichment ideas.
We covered what not to do, whatto look for, really, which was
the goal of this week.
I think that we accomplishedthat, yeah, yeah.
One thing I wanted to add withthe hiking and, I guess,
anything outdoors, yes, makesure you're prepared for any
(41:51):
emergency.
Mm-hmm.
Get yourself a advanced petfirst aid and CPR certification.
About three and a half hoursonline and you can become
certified.
Get your certification in themail right through us.
Allow me the pleasure of beingable to teach you about your dog
, their anatomy and physiology,and what you should do when
(42:12):
things go south, because everynow and then we all have a rainy
day.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
I mean, how many times, even in our family alone,
have, like our extended family,called you in a panic?
Yeah, it's like once a monthand we're like, okay, you got to
do XYZ and we're so lucky tohave you in the family that you
know all of these things,because it's not common
knowledge and it's not somethingthat you can easily just look
up on Google to fix Like.
These are things that you needto know in your brain and
(42:35):
understand how the body works.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
Yeah, and John you got to be quick.
I mean just emergencies.
You got to be quick yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Time is of the essence, right?
What is it Money?
Speaker 1 (42:44):
is oh, you're going to do this.
Yeah, time is money, money ispizza, pizza is power, yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
Parks and Rec.
I'm going to say, if you knowwhat that's from, if you know
what that's from DMS but yeah,so John, put together this whole
entire course to really helpfamilies, be super knowledgeable
and then you could be the onegetting the calls once a month
from your friends and familythat can help.
You, too, could field calls forzero compensation.
Speaker 1 (43:09):
But yeah, paulsonuniversitycom forward,
slash petfirstaid.
Or just go topaulsonuniversitycom and
navigate in the menus to theadvanced petfirstaid CPR course
and sign up today.
All right, I think that's allwe got for this week.
Yep, what is next week's topic?
Do you remember, do you?
Speaker 2 (43:26):
have it written down?
No, it's in my book.
Speaker 1 (43:28):
I know it's.
We're doing this thing where weare addressing like particular.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Topics every week Topics with questions.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (43:36):
And we're calling them buckets.
So for the week we have abucket of content that will
address a specific topic.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
This helps us stay consistent, but I also think it
really helps people in generalfind knowledge that they need.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
So next week is puppies, puppy question week.
Speaker 2 (43:53):
Just puppy, everything.
Speaker 1 (43:54):
Leash walking, hardware, teething, whatever you
can think of.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
Body training, we're gonna be covering puppies, so we
should probably do two podcastsof that cause.
I feel like that could be areally long conversation.
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yeah, probably Like a part one, part two Maybe.
If you guys are out therelistening, I see the downloads
in it.
You're listening, Like tweet usor something.
Yeah, talk to us that paw somepodcast on ex, formerly Twitter.
That's what everybody's sayingnow.
Speaker 2 (44:22):
Ex formerly Twitter.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
Yeah, twitter changed his name to ex.
You didn't know that.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
I don't pay attention to this stuff.
I can't.
It's too stupid.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
Okay, we're also on threads, but threads was kind of
a flop, but I still get.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
You weren't really excited about that.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
I wasn't really excited.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
You were like there's this new thing called threads
and you try to explain to me andmy brain went south real quick.
Speaker 1 (44:40):
I'm glad I spent all that time explaining it to you.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
It happens a lot.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
But, yeah, reach out to us, let's have a conversation
.
Ask us your questions so wecould address them on the
podcast.
Tell us what you want to hearabout and please follow us on
Instagram at possum university.
If you enjoyed the show andyou're listening on a podcast
platform that has ratings and aSpotify and Apple podcast, your
ratings please give us fivestars so other dog owners can
find us and also share thepodcast for dog people with your
(45:06):
friends and family.
And that's all we have for thisweek, until next week.
Speaker 2 (45:10):
Class dismissed MUSIC .
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