Jim James

Jim James, the frontman of My Morning Jacket, has lived many lives over the band’s 27-year career. He started as a hopeful young musician, chasing the magic of his musical heroes—while secretly fearing he’d never measure up. Later, he spiraled into heavy drinking and self-doubt, teetering on the edge of leaving the band.

But today, Jim is in a much different place. Healthier, more grounded, and full of self-acceptance, thanks in part to a mix of traditional and psychedelic therapies he turned to during the pandemic.

This month, My Morning Jacket returns with Is, their tenth studio album—and their first made entirely with an outside producer, the legendary Brendan O’Brien.

On today’s episode, Leah Rose sits down with Jim to talk about the ayahuasca journey that helped him learn how to truly love himself. He also looks back on writing the band’s ambitious second album, At Dawn, and recalls the surreal moment he saw Bob Dylan disappear into the music while playing with him live.

You can hear a playlist of some of our favorite My Morning Jacket songs HERE.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:15):
Pushkin.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Jim James, the frontman from My Morning Jacket, has lived
many lives over the band's twenty seven year career. He
started as a hopeful young musician, chasing the magic of
his musical heroes while secretly fearing he'd never measure up. Later,
he spiraled into heavy drinking and self doubt, teetering on
the edge of leaving the band behind. But today Jim

(00:41):
is in a much different place, healthier, more grounded, and
full of self acceptance, thanks in part to a mix
of traditional and psychedelic therapies he turned to during the pandemic.
This month, My Morning Jacket returns with is their tenth
studio album, and they're first made entirely with an outside producer,
the legendary Brendan O'Brien. On today's episode, Lea Rose sits

(01:04):
down with Jim to talk about the ayahuasca journey that
helped him learn how.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
To truly love himself.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
He also looks back on the writing of the band's
second album At Dawn and recalls this surreal moment he
saw Bob Dylan disappear into the music while playing with
him live. This is broken record, real musicians, real conversations.

(01:31):
You can see a full video of this interview on
our YouTube page at YouTube dot com Slash Broken Record podcast.
Now here's Leah Rose's interview with Jim James.

Speaker 3 (01:41):
So, when you go in to start a new project,
like with the new album is, do you have a
vision in mind for what you want it to sound
like or what's the conceptual part for you?

Speaker 4 (01:55):
When you know, okay, this is the beginning of a
new project.

Speaker 1 (01:59):
Well, it's so different. Every album is so different. And
over the years, various gems over the time, have you
had had ideas or con or opinions or theories or
whatever about what they thought that the albums might be.
And it's so funny because it's like the universe always

(02:20):
makes the album what it's gonna be, you know, and
and lots of most of my life I didn't. I
didn't realize that until the last moment, you know, or
or somewhere in there. Because you know, you can start
with the concept let's make a heavy metal album, or
let's make a protest album, or let's make this kind
of album or that kind of album. But when you

(02:40):
get in the studio, things start working and not working,
and very quickly your heavy metal album turns into a
folk album or whatever, you know, just to use broad terms.
So I feel like this record more than ever. I
feel like I really just tried to let myself put
everything I have into the pot, and I put all

(03:02):
of my ideas, even things that were kind of mostly
finished or close to finish solo project ideas or one
ever and thirty second voice memos, and you know, things
we'd already recorded with My Morning Jacket that we're kind
of we weren't totally happy with, but we just kind
of put it all into the pot and I tried
to step back and let it, let it be what

(03:27):
it was going to be.

Speaker 3 (03:30):
I heard that you recently, and I don't know how
much this has to do with recording the new album,
the process, your creative process with the new album, but
you had an experience with ayahuasca that sort of maybe
brought some clarity to your life and your relationship with yourself.
Was that a recent experience and does that have anything

(03:52):
to do with this album?

Speaker 1 (03:54):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (03:54):
God, yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:55):
I mean I feel like I've been on a really,
really great journey in the last five years or so
I've been on it. I feel so excited and so
grateful that I found a therapist in the pan pandemic
that I really connected with and I really so I
started doing EMDR and parts work therapy with him, and

(04:18):
that EMDR is basically like, Uh, there's a lot of
different ways you can do it, but you're basically trying
to train your brain to put traumatic memories back where
they're supposed to be. And you can you can either
follow a light left to right, or you can tap
on yourself left to right, and basically it's like this

(04:40):
really interesting. Uh. And obviously if you google it or whatever,
you can read far more scientific explanations on this. But
you're basically, you work with your therapist to go to
a traumatic moment and and while you're processing that traumatic
moment in your mind, you're tapping or you're following a

(05:01):
light or whatever works best for you. And basically it's
like in my experience, because we all kind of I
think we all know the feeling of of trauma taking
us over when we don't want to be taken over.
You know, it kind of starts playing like a full
color HD movie and kind of taking over our lives.
And basically you're trying to put it back into your

(05:21):
memory box. Where it's just it's just another memory, like
the you know, it's like a black and white polaroid
compared to a full color HD movie with sound. And
so I found when I work through those things and
through different parts of myself, when I combine the parts,
work therapy with it, so with that it's like a
similar thing like you'll work with the twelve year old

(05:44):
version of yourself or the five year old version of yourself,
or wherever you've experienced these trauma and you process it,
and as you process it, something's happening in your mind
with the tapping where it's putting, it's kind of unpacking
the power of the trauma to make it more of

(06:04):
a normal memory, you know, where it doesn't have such
a hold on you. And I feel like that for
me has been extremely powerful. And I have coupled that
with different psychedelic therapies like ayahuasca and ketamine five EO
d MT different things, because I feel like I think
one thing that I try to be careful about when

(06:26):
talking with people about psychedelics in particular is not trying
to be like, go do ayahuasca and everything's going to
be great. You know, all your problems are gone, you know,
because I think that's the kind of common thing that
people think, Oh, if I go to ayahuasca, I think
you really got I think all those things are important
pieces of the puzzle, but I think you have to
be very careful where you go and who you do

(06:49):
it with, and be very guided, you know. I feel
like I've always wanted to do a lot of those things,
but I've always tried to wait until somebody that I
trust kind of brought it to me, you know, the
universe brings it to me, you know, And I feel like,
so I've been fortunate to have some of those experiences.
But yeah, ayahuasca was really, I mean, very varied experience,

(07:15):
so many experiences. I mean we could talk shows and
shows and shows about just that, but there was that
was a very crucial piece in my healing journey of
I had an experience where I was holding myself in
my own arms, and I was this was twenty nineteen,
right before the pandemic, and I was I was Jim
in twenty nineteen, holding Jim in twenty nineteen, and it

(07:38):
was as real as this, Like it wasn't like some
some wild trippy hellucination. It was like as concretely real
as this, And I was holding myself, kind of patting
my hair back, looking into my own eyes, being like, Jim,
you're so mean to yourself, buddy, Like you gotta you
gotta be nicer to yourself. You gotta try and love
yourself more. You know, you're you're a nice guy. You're

(07:59):
trying your best. And I'm look, really, Jim, you really
mean it, you know. And it was like I was
able to see myself as another person, you know, And
I think that's a that's a distinction that really helped
me because it's easier for us to be nice to
people we love, you know, but then we're so mean
to ourselves. We rip ourselves to pieces. And I've spent

(08:20):
my entire life ripping myself to pieces, being so mean
to myself, trying to escape from myself, drinking myself to death,
you know, just running, running, running, And that was a
really important piece for me to see myself as somebody
that I need to treat with kindness, you know. Like
that was like a mind blower to me of like, God,
if I can't be nice to myself, if I can't

(08:43):
love myself, how can I hope to see the world
with clarity, you know, or you know, it just was
a really really big moment for me.

Speaker 4 (08:51):
Has it been able to stick?

Speaker 1 (08:54):
I really feel like it has. Yeah. I mean I
feel like with with the therapy I've been doing, you know,
it's like these experiences, I think, if you have someone
safe to process them with and you keep working with them,
I really do feel like they have begun to stick.
I mean, I feel like I've I've never felt more
peaceful or present in my life, you know, and I

(09:18):
just feel so grateful for that. I feel like that,
like you asked a minute ago, that was kind of
all of that has kind of combined to kind of
lead me to where I am when we're working on
this album and beyond, you know, to kind of be
able to not place my entire self worth in the
success or failure of my band, you know, because most

(09:39):
of my life I've done that, you know, most of
my life. I'm like, if I get the world to
love me, or I get this external validation, then maybe
finally I can love me. But you know, that's that's
a recipe that never works because you're just on the
roller coaster ride of one day the world loves you
and the next day of the world hates you or whatever,
and you're up and down, up and down, and yeah,

(09:59):
I keep trying to come back to like what can
I What can I do that nobody can ever take
away from me? You know, And that's love myself. You know,
that's something we can all do for our selves, especially
in the madness of the world, the chaos of the world.
I feel like if everybody started trying to really love themselves,

(10:19):
we would see that again to manifest and more healing
and more peace and more love for each other. You know.

Speaker 3 (10:26):
It takes a lot of work, though, like you were saying,
you had like a multi tiered approach to it, traditional
and non traditional.

Speaker 4 (10:34):
I don't know if enough people make that investment in themselves.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
Well, I think it's important that we talk about it
on things like this because I think, yeah, it's it's
it's something you do have to take the time to do.
But there's almost like this weird thing where our culture
tells us where we're selfish, if we work on ourselves
too much, or if we think about ourselves where and
there's this of course, there are ways to be selfish

(10:58):
and you know, narcissistic and ways that are kind of
taking the energy in a bad way. But I think
if we think about it kind of like that that
episode I had in Ayahuasca, where like, if we think
about ourselves as our own best friend or whatever, and
we treat ourselves as if we would treat our most beloved,
best friend or partner, you know, whoever in our life

(11:20):
that we love the most. Yeah, if we if we
started there, I mean, what what greater work is there
to do? You know? Then delay that foundation?

Speaker 4 (11:32):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (11:33):
Have friends or family or people who are you're really
close to have they noticed a difference in you?

Speaker 1 (11:40):
Yeah, they really have. And I feel like the band,
it's been a really really special thing because because for
years I was a terrible communicator, and I was so
depressed and uh just drinking and trying to run from
life and not being able to communicate how it's feeling,
and uh so there'd be a lot of bad energy

(12:00):
or a lot of unspoken energy, you know. And and
the band, you know, we almost didn't make it several
times throughout the years, you know. And I feel like,
luckily we've all been on a similar journey lately where
everybody is really trying to take good care of themselves
and do the work to like heal themselves, and you know,

(12:23):
and that's been this really beautiful, uh era of just
better communication. You know. It's like it's not like things
are always easier that no problems arise, but I think
when you instantly address the problem and talk about it
and clear the air, that like lets it all blow through.
And I think we've got we've been in this really

(12:44):
just I mean we kind we kind of all like
hug and talk about it all the time, like, look,
how lucky are we We're still you know, twenty five
years later, we're still playing music and we still love
each other and we're not like trying to kill each
other or like hiding from each other or like having
separate you know worlds or you know, it's just like
everyone has to so totally yeah, yeah, yeah, we're just

(13:07):
so you know, so great. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (13:10):
I mean that seems to be the move in as
you approach midlife, is to take sock in your health
and really try and be a better person.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
And it's really sad when you think about people who didn't.

Speaker 3 (13:21):
Make it this far, people who died early and they
didn't get to a point where they're like on a
self improvement kick.

Speaker 1 (13:27):
I know, well, God, I mean, midlife can go the
other way too, you know, you can hit the other
way if you haven't done that work and start springing
into other ways just like, yeah, got to be crazy
and yeah, well yeah, the classic midlife crisis kind of
stuff you know, that we hear about and that we
see out in the world. Unfortunately, a lot of people

(13:48):
that are in positions of power in our world right now,
we're watching them experience their midlife crisis and you know,
taking it out on everybody else. And because I mean
think about, like, God, if Kurt Cobain or you know,
Jimmy Hendrix or whoever people struggle with absolutely, Jim Morrison, whoever,
people who struggle with substance abuse, Joblin, whoever, think about

(14:11):
if they could have found a way out and found
a way to get past that, they could still be here.
You know, we could still be experiencing music from Marvin
Gay or you know they're talking all these people this
just like, I think we really need to think about
that for the future, you know, that that we can
hopefully get this word out that it's okay if you're depressed,

(14:35):
it's okay if you struggle with substance abuse, like talk
to somebody about it, like find a way there is
a way out, you know, and don't beat yourself up
or feel like you're all alone or your failure or whatever.
You know. I think we really need to address that.
A lot of this stuff, a lot of it comes
genetically or it comes through some pipeline.

Speaker 3 (14:56):
You know.

Speaker 1 (14:56):
It's not like people ask to be depressed or to
be genetically disposition towards alcoholism or drug abuse or whatever,
you know. So I think the more we can talk
about it, and the more we can try to get
people the help they need, the more we can see
the future people now live to still create, you know, totally. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:14):
And I don't know what your relationship is like with
your parents or if they're living or what, but has
this change in you has it changed your relationship with
your parents or with family members?

Speaker 1 (15:28):
Oh? God, absolutely yeah. My parents are amazing. They're still alive,
and we're really close and we spend a lot of
time together. And I mean, I think every family, you know, dynamic,
is complex and has its difficulties and stuff like that.
But one thing I recognize the more that I try
to find peace with myself is that everybody's on their

(15:50):
own journey, and a lot of the times the best
thing we can do for somebody is just be there
to listen to them and not think that we can
keep solving their problems. You know that we have all
the answers. And you know, I think I think that's
one thing that I've struggled with. On another people have
struggle with is when you watch somebody that you love

(16:13):
suffer whatever, and you keep wanting to help them. You know,
you're like, oh my god, if only you just won't
you just do this? Won't you just do that? Yeah?
And I think a lot of times people don't need
to hear that, you know. It's like people people just
need you to be there for them and listen to them,
and yeah, speak your peace and and you know, put
out put some things on the table that could help them.

(16:34):
But then I think sometimes we need to step back
and say. That's one thing I just kept coming to
again and again, was like, well, like, whoa man, how
can I offer anybody advice if I'm constantly at war
with myself? You know, like where am I? Where am
I offering advice from? If my whole world is in chaos?

Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (16:53):
You know, and so I think that's like the uh,
the thing I've tried to come back to with my
family and friends. It's just like, how can I be
there to to support them and listen to them.

Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, and you said something about Era about my morning
Jacket having ERA earlier, and I was reading on Reddit
and it seems like a lot of your fans think
of the band in distinct eras. And I saw somebody
mention that they thought a distinct era was post COVID.
So it's sort of interesting that that lines up with

(17:25):
that experience for you. And I was wondering for you,
you've been in it. It might just be hard to
think of it objectively. But do you think of the
band as like distinct eras that line up maybe with
albums or decades or how do you think of it?

Speaker 1 (17:43):
Oh? Yeah, definitely. It's so funny because we've been thinking
about this a lot, because I look back because we
constantly have to do things like learn an old song
that we're going to play or something that we haven't
played in ten years or more. So I'm constantly looking
back on all these old gyms that have gone through
all of these albums. Because each album is like a

(18:04):
time machine for me, you know, And it's like and
if I have to go back to it and hear it,
and I like hear that old Gem and I'm like, wow, man,
Like that Gem was so lost in being Jim, so
completely consumed by this experience of being Jim and being

(18:25):
gobbled up by this depression or this fear or whatever,
that he was so consumed in it. But at the
same time, like I always know that he was trying
the best he could, and that kind of really gives
me this piece as I look back across everything and
the sense of like I'm so proud of everything that

(18:48):
I've ever done. I still show up to do the work,
but I accept that, like a lot of the things
are gonna happen, They're not really in my control. Whereas
as I look back in this time machine and all
the old Gems, all these old Gems were so locked
into their ego of Jim, and so there's so much
resistance and so much depression and anger and fighting and

(19:11):
the universe still was going to do what it was
going to do, but I couldn't see that, and I
was fighting it and just like so consumed in this
whole thing, so Yeah, it's so interesting when I look back,
because there's so much fun in there, and so much
joy too, and hilarity and experience and love and brotherhood

(19:32):
with the guys in the band and you know, everybody
I've ever collaborated with, and all all of this. But
there was so much fear there too, and so much
depression that I feel like I look back on all
those different eras of Jim and I really try to
be compassionate towards him or whatever, because it's I have
to embody him all the time, you know, anytime I

(19:54):
sing one of those songs to embody this old version
of Jim, you know. And it used to be when
I was still depressed and I was still being eaten alive.
As the latest version of Jim that's having to go
back and do all these older gym soles are cool.
Oh my god, I can't tired good. I can't take it.
But now the more peaceful I've become, it's become really

(20:17):
fun and more easy for me to go be twenty
two year old Gym or twenty five year old Jen
or nearly suicidal thirty year old Gym or whatever it is.
And I can see it all with more compassion, and
we can have more fun as a band, you know,
we can do wilder setlists and do every single song
we've ever recorded or whatever, Whereas before my depression limited

(20:39):
my range of what I could do because I just
couldn't do a lot of things.

Speaker 3 (20:43):
Oh wow, Do you ever have the experience where, similar
to the therapy that you were talking about, how you're
trying to sort of rewire or change the impact of
a traumatic memory. Do you ever sing an old song
and try and do the same thing with the old
song to where you're trying to rewire the experience of it.

Speaker 1 (21:04):
Definitely. Yeah, It's so crazy, because, yeah, when I feel
like when I was still being eaten alive by my
alcoholism or my depression, like maybe twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen,
something like that. In that period, when I was trying
to go back and do some of the old songs,
it was so dark, so difficult, you know. But now

(21:25):
when I go back and try to do some of
those darker songs, there is this really beautiful rewiring or
something where it's like it's like geez, like what a
gift that I'm able to like go back and revisit
this energy and almost like it ye, heal it, you know,
like somehow manifest the energy still and create it because
there's a lot of like wailing and screaming and like waw,

(21:49):
you know, like a lot of energy that old Jim
had to get out or whatever that now when I
get it out, it's like this beautiful yeah changing of
the energy or releasing of the energy. And there's this
gratitude there where like whoa, Like how lucky am I
that I can still do this? Yeah? And that people
still want to show up and see it. You know,

(22:11):
it's like it becomes this beautiful celebration of like if
there were people that identified with the way that that
Jim was feeling, or you know, people that are dealing
with their own depression or their own energy, like perhaps
and hopefully we can all rewire together, you know, we
can all manifest this new energy together, and yeah, it's

(22:31):
really really healing.

Speaker 3 (22:33):
When you revisit those old songs or any songs that
you've written, do you ever have the experience of like, damn,
like this is actually really good and kind of like
patch yourself on the back, Like do you give yourself
props over or is it always just like do you
go to the negative.

Speaker 1 (22:51):
But historically I've always gone to the negative. I've always
been like, I'm not good enough. I'll never be as
good as Bob Dylan or you know, I'll never sing
as good as Nina Simone or whatever the comparisons are.
But now that I'm in this new paradigm, and I
hope I don't sound like like I've done all the
work and solved it all and I'm like totally, you know,

(23:12):
figured it all out anything, because I have and I'm
still in this journey. But one thing I do recognize
is I am able to love all those old gems
more and give them a pat on the back and
like and really just love a song for what it is,
you know, and and not be comparing it with fucking
Bob Dylan or whatever. You know what I mean. It's
like there's just always been this ruthless voice comparing myself

(23:35):
to all of my heroes. And I think once we
all realize that, like, that's that's all illusion. You know
that there is no comparison, there is no better or worse,
there is no you know, it's all different shades of
everything than I have. I really have been able to
just like just enjoy a song for what for what
it is, you know, like for the well the thing

(23:56):
it provides at that moment, and uh and also just
experience in that in that moment and then it's gone.
You know, I'm not worried about it. I'm not like, oh,
Jez Louiss, you did I sing that well enough? Or
are those lyrics good enough? Whatever? It's like just like experience.

Speaker 3 (24:10):
I just feel like you're such a good performer. I
just hope that you realize that. And you're such a
great songwriter. You're so good to what you do.

Speaker 4 (24:17):
I just like want to like thank you, be like, dude,
you will take on yourself.

Speaker 1 (24:24):
Well now now I feel like I finally am able
to love to love myself and just accept it, you know,
and and really enjoy it in the moment. And uh.
But I think the world is tough because the world
kind of forces us to compare ourselves to our heroes
or to our contemporaries, and especially like the more digital
the world's gotten and the more numerically based it's all gotten.

(24:45):
There's stats for everything, you know. Every YouTube video has
a play count, every Instagram post has a like count.
And I think when you're trapped in that comparative frame
of mind and you're like, oh, Vandixa's eighty three million
views on their YouTube, we will only have you know. Yeah,
It's just like that whole uh mentality is just so

(25:09):
fucked up, you know. And I think that's like part
of our jobs too, is like trying to get each
other out of that comparison mind frame and just into
this idea that we've all got something to share and
it's gonna be what it's gonna be, and you can't
look at it in this statistical way that unfortunately our

(25:33):
current digital paradise has trapped us into the statistical world.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
That's wild. We'll be back with more from Jim James
and Lea Rose after the break.

Speaker 1 (25:48):
So.

Speaker 4 (25:48):
I saw that at Don is turning twenty.

Speaker 3 (25:51):
Five this year, and I was curious, how if you're
able to contrast the recording of at Don where you
were when you were like, you're like twenty one twenty
two when you recorded that.

Speaker 4 (26:06):
It's crazy, I think, so is like, how was the
process different?

Speaker 1 (26:14):
Oh God, I mean everything was different. You know, life
was so different.

Speaker 3 (26:19):
What were you like, where were you at? What do
you remember from that period of your life.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
That was funny. That was an interesting period in my
life that I called the heroic Gym period in my
therapy conversations, is that I do my parts work because
that was the first time in my life after the
Tennessee Fire came out that anybody ever liked anything I'd
ever done period, you know. So it's like there's the
sense of like, whoa, people actually liked my music, and

(26:44):
I fell in love for the first time, and I
lost my virginity, and I like was having this like
really beautiful moment in time where like all these things
that I never thought would happen were happening, and there's
this sense of just joy and creation, and you know,
we were just like running around wild and you know,

(27:05):
we were kind of like our own little version of
the Wrong Stones in France or whatever.

Speaker 3 (27:10):
You know.

Speaker 1 (27:11):
We were like, you know, making our wild XL on
Main Street World out there in Shelbyville, and it was
so fun and beautiful and uh and free, you know,
and there was this sense of but there's always the
sense we always had the sense because nobody had ever
liked anything that we did, we still thought every at

(27:32):
every turn, we were going to get canned you know,
so we're like, all right, like, let's make this thing
as long as we can, because this is our probably
our last shot.

Speaker 3 (27:38):
You know.

Speaker 1 (27:38):
I think at Dawn and the Tancy Fire and it
still moves. I think all those records are like as
long as the CD can be, which is seventy four minutes.
You know, like we're like, let's use literally every second
of this fucking CD. You know, we're still thinking of
CD terms back then. But it's so beautiful because after that,
but most of my life after that, I was trapped

(28:00):
in severe depression and severe you know still whatever. Still
had a lot of fun and a lot of beauty whatever.
But it's interesting that you choose that record because I
feel like, is we've kind of come into this new
golden age of like this this peaceful golden age of
like it's different from that because that was like that

(28:21):
was a beginner's mind still and youth and first and
new and all that stuff, and and but it's beautiful
because we've kind of invented this this new new, this
new beginner's mind in the experience where it's like, what
else can we do that keeps this new for us

(28:41):
and keeps this fresh for us, And one of those
things was finally being able to release control and bring
in somebody like Brendan O'Brien to work on this record
with us. That was something we'd never done before, was
like bring in a coach, you know, because we always
either did it ourselves, or we did it with contemporaries
or equals or you know, people that are kind of

(29:02):
on the same level as us. And that's a beautiful
way to work too, but we're just like always like
what can we do that's different? And I think all
of this kind of healing that we're talking about, I
was able to like let go of so much and
be like, I really think we could benefit from a coach,
you know, somebody who's who's not our equal, He's not

(29:23):
on our level. He's like a step or two above.
He's done this hundreds times more than we have. You know,
he's twenty years older than that. You know, just all
these things and really like connecting with Brendan and getting
to see his viewpoint was such a revelation for me
and for us that I feel like made this whole thing,

(29:46):
this whole experience, just this beautiful new beginner's minding, you know,
it is really really special.

Speaker 3 (29:53):
Why did you pick Brendan? Did have anything to do
with his past work? He's you know, produced most pro
jam albums, engineered Blood Sugar, Sex, Magic for the Chili Peppers,
worked with Stone type of pilots, just a ton a
ton of artists. Did it have anything to do with
with his work or his sound specifically or was it

(30:14):
more his personality?

Speaker 1 (30:16):
Well? Yes, and no, I really love Evil Empire that
raised against the Machine record when he did that record,
and I took different meetings with lots of people. And
it's interesting because a lot of more experienced, bigger name
producers or whatever often come with bigger egos, and there's

(30:38):
this whole thing that they bring in that can be
really hard to deal with, where they want to tell
you how many Grammys they've won and how many records
they've made with Elton John, you know, all this kind
of toxic energy that we're always like whatever man you know,
like and Brendan. The great thing about Brendan is like
he never put any of that on us, and it
was never about him inflating his legend or his ego.

(31:01):
You know, It's almost like all that he cared about
was the music. You know. And he was a very
nice guy, a very funny guy. But he wasn't interested
in becoming best friends. He wasn't interested in being our
spiritual guru. You know. All he was interested in was
the song. You know, it is the song the right Keith,
Is it the right tempo? Do the lyrics connect? You know?

(31:22):
And he always would have this great sense of being
critical but always offering a solution or always offering something
that would help. And to me that it was just
like I had never really worked with somebody who whose
mind worked that quickly, wow, and who never was there

(31:43):
about their agenda, you know. And he was always open
to what we had to say too. He would never
like cancel out what we had to say, be like
all right, all right, let's check that out, or you know.
But it was so funny playing them songs because he's
playing one song and he's like, I was like, I
don't know, man, And then he's playing the next song
and he's like he's like, oh, that's pretty great. Okay,
all right, we're gonna have to get rid of something
else because this is pretty good. And it was just

(32:05):
really inspiring, and I started writing more and more songs
and as we said, started the record or whatever. And
because we send him like over one hundred songs what
and very quickly he whittles it down to twenty you know,
his favorite twenty you know, and he's just like and
we're talking about it. He's like, he's like, oh yeah, man,
He's like, I'll just get in there, and he's like
pretty quickly, I'm like, nope, nope.

Speaker 4 (32:25):
Did you recognize the pattern of what he likes and
what he doesn't like?

Speaker 1 (32:29):
No, It's really interesting because I mean, I feel like
he he chose songs that we wouldn't have chosen as
a band, that were more like solo projects I was
working on, and then other songs that I wrote, even
after he'd gone through those first hundred or so. It
was really amazing just to see like what he liked
and what he didn't, and that was I was just

(32:49):
really trying to surrender to that process. So I felt like, Okay,
the universe is gonna speak to me through Brendan and
I'm gonna just flow with it and see what happens.
But it's really cool because there were some songs like
Squid inc Is a good example of a song song
Brenda did not like squid ink at first, and he's like,
is it gone on? No, man, But the guys really
liked and they really wanted to do it, and Brandon

(33:11):
was really respectful of that. He's like, I don't know
about Screwed, Inc. But the guys like it. Let's keep
it in there. Let's see what happens, you know, because
I feel like he kind of understands that that universe
thing too, because we could go try it and it
just falls flat and doesn't work, or we try it
and everybody loves it and it's great. And I think
that whole thing was really really interesting because it was
this cool combination of like everybody's input, but everybody kind

(33:37):
of really removing their egos. And I feel like Brendon's
good at just channeling the universe as it comes through
and really just being like he himself. I forget how
I put it, but he's like, he's like, I think
I'm just hearing things, and I think that's how people
want to hear them.

Speaker 4 (33:51):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
He's like, it's just so interesting. It was just really refreshing.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
As someone if you can, if it's possible to make
yourself sort of just like a fan of the band.
Listening to this album as a completed project, is it
different than passed out?

Speaker 4 (34:09):
Like, how would you say it's different?

Speaker 1 (34:12):
I think they're all different. I mean, I think that's
one thing we really consciously try to do is make
every album different and go to a different place, work
with a different person. We're always in a different frame
of mine, you know, different life things have always happened.
I think that's one thing. Probably anybody could look at
my morning jacket and say whether they liked the band
or not, that we're kind of always trying different things.

(34:33):
We're trying different styles, We're trying try and do this
and trying that. And I really think this album's same
thing because I feel like there's a lot of different flavors.
There's a lot of different styles. Yeah, And it was
just really interesting because, you know, over one hundred demos
or whatever, we chose twenty and then we narrowed it
down to fifteen, and then a couple didn't work at all,
you know, and you don't know why, a couple of

(34:53):
our favorite songs, you know, and we're just sitting there
scratching our head, and you know, Brandon and I were
trying to see if we could do anything to save them,
and a certain point you're like, okay, well those two
didn't work. You know, let's see what did work, you know.
And that was really cool thing too with Brennan, where
I feel like he was like, sometimes we going are
going to make record somebody, and we have fifteen songs

(35:16):
and ten of them don't work, and you're sitting there
with five songs and you're like, all right, man, I'll
see you in six months, go write some more songs. Yeah,
And so I think he would have been honest with
us too if he felt like we were at that point.

Speaker 3 (35:27):
You know, did you ask him about that Rage album
that you like, did he tell you, like any stories
or anything about what, you know, other bands he's worked
with or whatever.

Speaker 1 (35:38):
We did talk some about things, but that was the meant.
I mean, it's just like he'll share stories that he
never shares them in this heroic ego way, you know,
cause a lot of people they are like into their legend, yeah,
and they're like sharing stories about I was Midnight and

(35:58):
Elton n I were gooding high in the back of
his rolling Royce. Yeah, and people are really into their
own legend. You know. It was really cool because Brennan,
like Brenna, would share little stories here or there if
there was like a something we're working on, He's like,
oh fuck, yeah, yeah, hell, you know, one time this
or that or this is that. But there's something that
just really really appealed to us about his lack of inflating.

(36:20):
He's you know, he's almost reluctant to share our stories.

Speaker 3 (36:24):
You know that.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
It was really really that that part he really did
seem humble and uh really but also very self assured
in a really beautiful way, like a beautiful confidence where
he's always ready to speak, speak his mind and he's
always going to tell you if he thinks he's something
and good or whatever, And uh, that was really really refreshing.

Speaker 4 (36:41):
That sounds like a good coach. You said you wanted
a coach.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
It really, it really was.

Speaker 3 (36:46):
Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. One thing I was thinking about
my morning jacket. I saw that you guys have been
called like the best live band of your generation.

Speaker 4 (36:56):
And one thing that seems unique.

Speaker 3 (36:59):
About you guys and super cool is that you can
put out a studio album and then you sort of
can remix all the songs live on stage, so it
almost gives the songs a different like more than one life,
and that seems like it's it's really it could be
really fun for you guys to keep things kind of
like fresh and keep evolving them.

Speaker 1 (37:21):
Yeah, it really is. It's so cool and it's always
funy when people say things like best, when people use
those kind of words, it's like, it so funny. It's
like it's all it's all so subjective, you know what
I mean, it's all such an illusion that but yeah,
that's the beautiful thing is when you think of a song,
a recording of a song, it's just like a seed.

(37:42):
I mean, think about anything that grows. You know, you
plan a seed and a tree grows, and it looks
this way one day, but then it looks different the
next day. It looks different ten years from now, and
it looks and I feel like that's kind of how
every song is, is that it looks different every day
and depending on how you play it or depending on
where it goes. Some songs really lend themselves to exploding

(38:03):
and improvising and you know, and other songs don't you know,
the songs are like all right, here we are, it's
three minutes long, and this is it yeah, but even
those songs, they still they'll be faster or slower, or
they'll you'll be angry one day, you know it sounds different.
You'll be really happy one day it sounds different. But yeah,
it's so so interesting.

Speaker 3 (38:22):
Yeah, I was thinking about that without in the Open
the song, and just wondering how that was gonna develop live,
And if when you're recording songs, do you think about
how it will develop live or are you.

Speaker 4 (38:36):
Just concentrating on the studio version.

Speaker 1 (38:40):
We do talk about that a lot and dream about
it and like, oh man, this is gonna be fun
to do live. You know, we say that a lot,
but uh, you also have to kind of let go
and let it be what it wants to be. And
some things like out in the Open's a good example
of a song that changed a lot. I mean, that
was just kind of a ukulele idea I had that
everybody liked, but they didn't know what would happen with it.

(39:03):
Everybody liked the riff a lot, and I had a melody.
I had, like the vocal melody, but I didn't have
any lyrics or anything. And Brendan really liked that riff
a lot and really like he was like, Okay, let's
just take this riff and let's think about it. Let's
you know, the ukulele turns into electric guitar and the
band comes in and it gets more exciting, and you know,
it like expands, and that his excitement got me excited,

(39:26):
so like I like started, you know, like working on
it thinking about it that way, and I'm sure live
it'll it'll grow even more. You know. It's like that's
just such a such a cool thing, such a such
a fun process. How it all unfolds?

Speaker 3 (39:42):
Did my morning jacket go through like a Hamburg Beatles
moment where you all just played together live, like night
after night our you know, like big chunks of time
to really get good. Like, how did how did you
guys get good initially?

Speaker 1 (39:59):
That's a good question. I don't know. I mean, I
think we just played so much. You know, I think
when you play that much, I think any band would
probably agree with that. That just the more you play,
the more it all becomes like second nature to you,
you know what I mean, You're just kind of locked
into each other. So when you start playing, I mean,
now when we play, we've been playing together in this

(40:24):
version of mine where jacket for twenty years. Over twenty
years now, you know, that's a lot of accumulated time,
and not only time on stage, but just time together
as people, you know, and you kind of know each
other more and more and more and more and more.
And you think of, yeah, like the Beatles in that
those Hamburg days or whatever, all that time they played
together and all those experiences really prepared them for when

(40:47):
they were together in the studio and faced with the
pressure of the world or whatever, they were ready to
do it because they had spent the time and done
the work.

Speaker 3 (40:56):
Do you consider your relationship with the band as the
most important relationship in your life.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
No, I don't really look at anything that way, because
it all flows and changes in every days different and
so I try to look at whoever's in my life
that day as the most important person in my life,
you know, whoever I'm encountering in that moment, because it's
really I think that's one thing we forget is everything
else is gone, you know, like right now it's just

(41:24):
you and me and there's nothing else happening right now.
The band isn't here, my parents aren't here, you know,
nobody's here right now, And I try to keep thinking
about that, because when you're on tour, you really have
to think about that in this interesting way because if
I'm trapped somewhere, it doesn't matter where I want to be.
I'm right there, you know, and it's like and I

(41:46):
can spend time wishing I was somewhere else, or I
can face reality and try and enjoy it, you know.
And I love how Michael Singer talks about He's wrote
The Untethered Soul and has a podcast that I really enjoy,
and he talks about reality and he's like, you want
to hear the definition of reality. Reality is that which

(42:07):
has already happened. It's like and you can't if you
wish you could change it. You know, you might not
like it, but it is, you know. That was another
one of the reasons I want to name the record
is it is like it is, you know, it's like
and I think that's something we all need to think
about if we want to change the world. If we're
not happy about the way the world is, it's okay

(42:29):
to feel upset about it. It's okay to wish it
was different and one way. But if you face it
directly as it is and say this is reality right now?
What am I going to do about it? How am
I going to need it? You know? How am I
going to show up for myself and for reality as
it is? And I think that's like some kind of

(42:51):
doorway to a better future. It's almost like you can't
think about the future. You've got to like really think
about what can I do in this present moment, starting close,
you know, starting with myself and the people around me,
and how can I make that better? And I just
keep trying to think about that. That's really been helping me.

Speaker 2 (43:15):
One last break and we're back with Lea Rose and
Jim James.

Speaker 4 (43:22):
What have you been listening to lately?

Speaker 1 (43:25):
I feel like whenever anybody asks me that, my mind
goes blank, goes completely blank. I feel like I have
my regular diet.

Speaker 4 (43:35):
Yeah, what's your diet?

Speaker 1 (43:37):
My steady diet is My Sweet Lord by George Harrison.
I feel like I listened to that song kind of
on repeat all the time, like over and over and
over and over again. There's this band Magdalena Bay. Have
you heard them. They've got this song Image that I
really like. Oh. There's an artist Lacey Guthrie. They've got
this song called here she comes that. I really like.

(43:59):
I mean, I feel like Kendrick Lamar is always blowing
my mind. I mean, I feel like we're kind of
like living in his era in a lot of ways.
I feel like there's this this thing that he's doing
that's speaking to so many people. I really like that
dough Chi record, Like, I feel like the vibe that
that's coming from that is really powerful. Yeah. God, I

(44:20):
mean there's just like that's the thing. It's like the
problem and the benefit of the digital age or whatever.
There's there's so much great, so much great music, but
it's almost like this title wave. Yes, yeah, you're trying
trying to hold on to any of it, you know,
it's all there's just like so much for sure.

Speaker 3 (44:38):
And I saw that you were in the the Bob
Dylan the the.

Speaker 1 (44:43):
Movie were not I'm not there.

Speaker 4 (44:44):
I'm not there. Yeah, what was that experience?

Speaker 1 (44:47):
Like it was wild? It was so beautiful. I think
originally they said Hank Williams the Third was supposed to
do that part or whatever. Yeah, for some reason he
couldn't do it. And Randall Poster, who's one of the
greatest music supervisors of all time, who's done like all
the Wes Anderson films and so many amazing films. He
was the music supervisor and uh I was living in

(45:10):
New York at the time, and he called me up
and he's like, Hey, do you want to sing this
this Bob Dylan song going to Alcapolca. I was like,
that's one of my favorite Dylan songs. I love the
Basement tapes and I love that that era of Dylan.
So we popped over to this studio and Colexico had
already recorded the music and I sang the track and

(45:34):
it all worked out, and then we flew out to
Montreal to film the scene. I was like painting. I
had to paint my face to kind of be like
the Rolling Thunder era Dylan, but I wasn't. I wasn't
like supposed to be him or anything. I'm just supposed
to be this band leader that looks like him or

(45:55):
reminds you of him from that era or whatever. And
it was so funny because I took the white face paint.
The makeup lady came and gave me the face paint,
and they're like, and I knew that era of Dylan
or whatever. She's like, so I'll let you put the
paint on or whatever, you know, and I like was
so nervous and so terrified. I wanted to do a
really great job to put all this light paint all

(46:16):
over my face, like so much. There's like, you know,
probably like two inches of paint sticking on my face.
And she comes back in and she's like, geez man,
She's like, you don't have to do that much. She's like,
let's get because if he would have done it, he
probably just would have you know, put it on pretty
quick or whatever. And I was it was just such
a funny moment of like that thing, you know, that
over perfectionist thing kind of coming in and biting you

(46:37):
in the ass, right, so funny. So like today she
helped me, like, you know, we took some of it
off or whatever, and it was amazing. It was just
such a cool part to be a part of it.

Speaker 4 (46:45):
That's so cool. What a cool experience, especially for someone
who loves stealing.

Speaker 1 (46:49):
Oh man, it was unbelievable.

Speaker 4 (46:51):
Have you ever met him?

Speaker 1 (46:53):
Yeah, I mean not really met him because he but
we I got to sing with him a couple of
times when we went on tour with him on the
Americana Brama tour we did when it was I don't know,
ten years ago or something, and that was really fascinating
because it was us and Will Coo and Dylan and
they had sold us on the idea of the tour

(47:15):
that he wanted to play with everybody a lot. They're like,
Dylan really wants to play with all the bands, and
like we pictured ourselves sitting around the campfire at midnight,
like let's learn all of desire or whatever, you know,
all these like and of course we get to the tour.
We don't see him, we don't hear from him, we
don't meet him. You know, you you never even see
him in catering or anything.

Speaker 3 (47:33):
You know.

Speaker 1 (47:34):
His bus pulls up, he gets off the bus, plays
this show, gets on the bus leaves. You know. That's
and but then one night his bass player comes up
to me and he's like, he's like, I think Bob
wants you. Was sitting to night and he gives me
a CD of this Reverend Gary Davis song that I
I didn't know, and uh, Jeff from Wilco and I

(47:54):
were like, go in the backstage and we've got our
guitars and we're like, you know, we've got like whatever.
A couple hours until we're supposed to sit him, sit
him with him, and you know, yeah, we're both like
terrified and we're trying to learn the song. And in
the bass player Tony he's like, he's like, let's do
this in the key of D and I don't really
know keys or anything. So we're like, okay, if we'd
like learn it, and I swear like five minutes before

(48:16):
we're supposed to go on, the guitar tech comes back
and he's like, I think Dylan wants to do it
and be flat. So we're like, okay, do you to
be flat? What is that? You know, we're like trying
to figure out and I don't know the song well
at all or whatever, you know, and then we's like
go out, you know. I mean he was really nice
on stage, you know, he welcomed us on stage or whatever,
and we you know, stumbled our way through the song,

(48:38):
and uh, we did. We did a couple of Revengdary
Davis songs, and then we did the Weight by the
band like four or five times, and every night he
would change the key of that, so it was like
constantly going up and down. You know. It's like it
was so wild. But it was so crazy because you
never got to like spend any time with him or anything,

(48:58):
like we didn't have a conversation or anything. But when
we were playing with him on stage, one of the
most unbelievable things I've ever seen, like like looking over
it him and he is gone. I mean he's completely lost,
Like his eyes were somewhere, you know, like tapped into

(49:21):
something that really was. I think that like we're all
part of this you know, for lack of a better word,
cosmic ocean or consciousness or whatever that I really believe
we're all tied into and we're all just little nodes
off the same a wall of electricity, or we're little
waves off the same ocean or whatever. And occasionally a

(49:43):
person comes along that somehow their energy speaks to everybody,
you know, in this different way, you know, like Dylan does,
you know, and there's just this thing like being two
feet away from him, you know, looking at him, when
I was like I saw that wow thing or whatever.

(50:05):
I guess that must be his connection to the thing,
you know, because it was like really was no one
was there in his body. You know, It's like he
was in that place that I think we all know
that place musicians know it is the place when they're
lost in great music, you know, and they're they're lost

(50:27):
in the moment. And I think the place most of
it us know at best is like in love, you know,
making love or that at that part of life where you're, yeah,
you are gone, you know, you've you've forgotten all about
this human experience and you are lost in the energy
of love and God. And uh, that was one of
the coolest things I've ever gotten to see is stand

(50:49):
so close to uh, a hero like that and see
that force was just it was unbelievable.

Speaker 4 (50:58):
That's incredible.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (51:00):
Have you played with anybody else and had that experience?

Speaker 1 (51:05):
Oh my god. Yeah, We've been so lucky. It's so
fortunate to like share the stage with so many unbelievable artists.
You know, it's just like it it is, uh, I
just yeah, or even seeing people like I got to
see Edda James before she passed away, you know, and

(51:25):
the energy you know, coming off of her, you know,
just like really you felt like the place was going
to be ripped apart. You know, it's like the the
walls are gonna be ripped off the place, you know,
the energy is so insanely for us. Or seeing Jonny
Mitchell at the Hollywood Bowl last year, you know, just

(51:46):
in the audience, you know, like not I'm like and
I've always really loved and respected Jonny Mitchell, but it's
never fully been my thing. It's never fully spoken to
me fully deeply, because a lot of it, honestly just
feels kind of over my head. It's very complex and
very layered, and a lot of times I really so
much respect and so much beauty. But seeing her, the

(52:11):
unbelievable energy coming out of her, of like she's seen
it all and lived to tell the tale now and
you're seeing her in person all almost like she's she's
all of the energy of everything that's ever happened in
the history of mankind or whatever is like coming out

(52:31):
of her as she sits on her throne. And it's
like I kept getting this vision of her as like
the power of like Marlon Brando and the Godfather or wherever,
you know. But it's like, but like ten thousand Marlon Brandos,
you know, just like the power coming off her just
like I mean, like I couldn't believe it, you know,
It's just like that's one really inspiring thing too that

(52:52):
we talk about a lot as a band is like
you see these people that really show you the age
doesn't matter the way we think it does, and age
is relative, you know, and nobody can help the help
complications they may have, or if you have bad health
or something happens to you, you know, obviously nobody can change
or help that. But beyond that, seeing the Rolling Stones,

(53:17):
I've seen them four or five times in the last
few years, just unbelievable, you know, like they're not over
the hill, old guys. You know, they're the greatest rock
and roll band of all time and they're still alive. Yeah,
and they're still blowing your mind, you know. Or you
see Neil Young saying that still blowing your mind, you know,

(53:38):
like still and that kind of stuff is just so inspiring.
I've talked with the Specimen in the day. It's like
we're all the first to see rock and roll grow old.
Like this is all so new, Yeah, you know, it's
all so new, and there's so many people like Jimmy
Hendricks or whatever who died, or John Lennon who died

(54:00):
or whatever. But then there's still so many people like
Paul McCartney or like I still have gotten to hear
Keith Richards ripped my mind in half with Gode. You
know when he hits some big you know, it's just like.

Speaker 3 (54:15):
Just so lucky, so lucky to witness that unbelievably lucky.

Speaker 4 (54:20):
Yeah. How are you feeling about touring these days?

Speaker 1 (54:25):
It's so funny And we were talking about this the
other day because we have never felt better about playing
shows like the band as a unit, as like a
like everything feels so beautiful and so unbelievable, and we've
never felt better about like the music and the brotherhood
and the harmony and the experience with everybody coming to

(54:47):
the shows and the circle that's created by the audience
and us, and the whole thing is it has never
been more beautiful. And simultaneously, I feel like the more
sober I've gotten in peaceful I've gotten, the harder the
travels become. So it's been like this this crazy, uh
back and forth thing of like oh my god, like
I cannot sleep on the bus anymore, you know things

(55:09):
like that where you're.

Speaker 4 (55:09):
Like, is it because you have back back stuff?

Speaker 2 (55:12):
Right?

Speaker 1 (55:13):
Well, yeah, I mean a litany of that kind of stuff.
It's just it's just interesting that. Uh. I think everybody
recognizes that kind of thing in the in their own
life where it's like nothing is ever one thing, you know,
it's like always both had you know. I love this
new I feel like this phrase. I don't know when
it was born, but I feel like it's really come

(55:35):
to more and more light in the past five years
five years or so, this both hand things. And I
think about that and it's like touring is this huge
both and you know, it's like I've never loved playing
shows more and I've never not enjoyed traveling more, you know.
All the same time, it's like the travel is just
so difficult for me. But it's like, but it's part

(55:55):
of the what I mean, what can you do until
they get the teleporter and then it we gotta do it.

Speaker 3 (56:01):
We got to do How do you get yourself in
the mood for a show if you can't do like
a couple of shots or whatever, it is, like, how
do you get into them the mind frame?

Speaker 1 (56:10):
Well, I've never drank before shows. I always drank after shows,
but I've never drank before shows because I'm really like,
my dad really gave me a really good work ethic.
I feel like in a really like sense of you know,
like gott gotta show up for work and you gotta
be ready to work, you know. But well, I've got
a whole list of things I do. I mean, I've

(56:31):
really got like a whole vocal warm up thing I do,
and a whole meditation thing, and just like a quiet
thing and an exercise thing and a music thing. And
you know, it's like this series of like simultaneously getting
relaxed and getting excited, you know, and like getting your
voice warmed up so much energy and then we have

(56:52):
a we always do a huddle, you know, and get
our band energy going. And and I I asked Alice
Coltrane a long time ago if we could use a
piece of her music to as our walk on music,
to kind of bless the stage. So there's this really
cool piece I cut together of a couple of her

(57:13):
instrumental portions that I feel like, is this really cool
like thing that kind of comes out and like clears
the energy of the stage before we come on. So yeah,
just things like that. I try to pray. I try
to really pray to the energy of the day and
whatever forces might be there that just then it is

(57:34):
what it is, and I can accept that, you know that.
I hope it's a great experience for the audience, and
I hope that it's a great experience for us, And
I hope that I imagine the whole venue surrounded in like
a golden light, and like try to imagine all of
us surrounded in like some kind of protective, healing light.
But then simultaneously, like, please help me accept whatever doesn't

(57:59):
go right, Yeah, because that's going to happen too, you know,
like because that's so so much out of your control
when you step on the stage, you know, it's like
and that's part of it, I think, is trying to
accept that.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
Well, Jim, thank you so much for talking, Thanks for
being so open. Thanks, Yeah, congrats on the new album.

Speaker 1 (58:16):
Thanks so much, thanks for having me.

Speaker 2 (58:20):
In episode description, you'll find a link to a playlist
of our favorite mind Morning Jacket and Jim James tracks
and again. To see the video version of this episode,
visit YouTube dot com slash Broken Record Podcast, and be
sure to follow us on Instagram at the Broken Record Pod.
You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record. Broken
Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose with marketing

(58:42):
help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our engineer is
Ben Tolliday. Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries.
If you love this show and others from Pushkin, consider
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(59:05):
and if you like this show, please remember to share, rate,
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back any beats.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
I'm justin Richmond.