July 13, 2022 • 45 mins
Eddie helps new father Malcolm Gladwell shop for a family car. They put a souped-up crossover, a Swedish luxury wagon, and... a minivan to the test to help him find the perfect balance of comfort, style, and safety.
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Speaker 1 (00:15):
Pushkin. Hey Eddie here, before we get started, I wanted
you to know that you can listen to Car Show
ad free by becoming a Pushkin Plus subscriber. You'll also
get access to detours, bonus episodes of Car Show where
we go for extended drives, play outtakes, and more fine
(00:37):
Pushkin Plus on the Car Show page, in Apple Podcasts,
or at Pushkin dot Fm. So all I have right
now is a twenty fourteen BMW X one. And now
most people would say that's perfectly sufficient. But I wouldn't
say that. You would, no, you would not say that.
(00:59):
I have tried it on a airport run for a
holiday with my you know, with my new plus one,
so three of us, and it was, you know, the
amount of I had totally underestimated the amount of stuff
that now, I mean, this is not in the last
(01:19):
ten years. The amount of stuff must have doubled that
you're required to carry with you. And the seats, car
seats are just ginormous. They're huge, Yeah, they're they're fortress
like we're just like so yeah, So I clearly what
I have right now is insufficient. That's me and Malcolm Gladwell,
a couple of months ago, talking shop, just like we
(01:41):
always seemed to do. Talking shop is actually how we met.
I still remember when I got that first call from
him a few years ago. I was sitting at my
desk in ann Arbor as editor in chief of Current Driver.
When my phone rang. I heard the dulcet tones. Malcolm
(02:02):
introduced himself as a reader, which I could hardly believe
because I was at that very moment breaking apart in
Oreo with my teeth. There was no way this mental,
giant red car magazine's. I was also prejudiced to believe
that all intellectuals hated driving and thought all cars were
yellow with a light on top. But this Canadian kid
(02:24):
impressed me. He was talking torqu curs and limited slip deferentials.
He said he was doing a show on unintended acceleration
for the first season of his podcast, Revisionist History. Did
we at carn Driver want to be featured on it?
We sure did. Altaman hits the brakes firmly, smoothly, easily,
(02:45):
we come to a halt. But now it was my
chance to return the favor. Malcolm needed my guidance. He
needed to know how do I effectively move around a
young family and all the stuff that comes with it.
Malcolm had just become a father and couldn't decide what
(03:06):
kind of car to get for his family. His small
first generation BMW X one SUV may have been perfect
ideal even for a bachelor. But if you're hauling kids
in their tackle, a glorified hot hatchback like the X
one isn't going to cut it. So I had to
(03:26):
parachute in there. And by parachute, I mean pack my
stuff into a minivan in Detroit and drive six hundred
miles east to meet Malcolm and Hudson, New York, home
to the Pushkin offices, and together we would go on
a quest to find Malcolm a car for the pastoral
life with a child, maybe even two. Eventually there's a
(03:47):
great pg arooric mine. He says. Having one kid is
like having a dog. Having two kids is like having
a zoo. That, yeah, everything's exponentially greater. You have to
have way more stuff. And yeah, if you're flying and
getting the whole family packed up to go on an airplane,
(04:07):
you need your car seat for the plan and for
the cab and all that, and you need your stroller
and there's just so much stuff. It's like packing a
small army. Here's my worry. My worries are as well.
I'm totally spoiled by I love this car to death,
my X one. Yeah, it has that beautiful creamy in
line six, and it has the hydraulic steering. It's got
(04:27):
like right old school. The steering on this car is
so beautiful. Every time I give into any other car,
regardless of the price, I don't think it steers as
well as my as my X one. So I'm resigned
to the fact I'm surrendering. So that's a hard thing
to give up for sure. But you know, designing which
(04:49):
way to go for a people mover, for a family car,
for you know, something that has a lot of space,
it's really sort of a deep psychological question. It is.
I'm now I'm a child of as well as I'm
sure all every member of my generation is. I'm a
child of the station wagon. Yeah, as I'm sure you were.
I was what was what we your family wagons, h
(05:11):
Ultomobile custom Cruiser. That was the biggie with the slide
out tailgate and the you know, the rear facing third
row where you could put the window down and inhale
the exhaust and you could, you know, make faces at
the serial killers behind you. It's so unsafe. And U
and my mom never got a minivan. Our car growing up,
(05:35):
our family wagon was up in the beginning was a
Pugo four O four. So yeah, I mean our moms
drove wagons, our parents drove wagons. But then the minivan
revolution came and sort of reordered the family car universe. Now,
in one fell swoop, the Chrysler minivan destroyed the station
wagon market, but then the station mark then the minivan
(05:59):
market itself got destroyed by the suv. And so that's
what we're going to look at today. We're going to
look at these three formats, like the evolution of the
family car from the station wagon to the minivan to
the suv. Which one is best for you? For me?
So we have what we have a representative of each class.
(06:20):
Yes we have a No, I'm not committing to these
particular cars. We're just trying to choose the class. That's right.
We're just towing into the frigid waters of automotive responsibility here.
It's a tough adjustment for a guy who has an
addiction to performance cars and the speeding tickets to prove it.
So I used a categorical approach, positioning his options not
(06:42):
as specific cars that might be too depressing, but in
the abstract the question is cautiously broad. Where on the
family car evolutionary ladder will our test subject, Malcolm Land
will he go retro and choose a wagon like his
parents did, or will he partake of the other options
(07:03):
in the marketplace, the minivan or the suv. We have
three vehicles for you to check out. Okay, okay. The
first is the Kia Carnival. Oh do you know what
that is? Yes, I do, I have. I have been
looking at them online really furtively or furtively. Well, I
(07:26):
like the idea that it doesn't it's a minivan that
doesn't look like a minivan, which is you know, but
it's all minivan. I mean, you're gonna see. I can't
wait for your experience with it or in your reaction.
The second is the wagon, the thing that a minivan killed.
The wagon that we have is a Volvo V ninety
(07:47):
cross Country. Ah, so this is the jacked up one. Yes, yeah,
they're all sort of jacked up. They all want to
be SUVs. Now they all have kind of exaggerated fenders,
higher ride heights. You know, it's interesting because the way
that the cargo area is packaged in wagons is usually
(08:08):
pretty good for getting kids stuff in there, because it's
it's longer, it's generally wider, and it's it's more horizontal
than vertical. And then we come to the suv. The
vehicle once used for rock crawling and mud bogging has
been brought to heal. The modern day suv is the
(08:29):
de facto family car for many, but the one we're
going to drive today blurs the line between family car
and granite bowl eyed. It's the Mercedes MG GL fifty three,
and it is very red, very fast, and very very expensive.
I'll give you my pre ranking of what I believe
(08:51):
a priori what I believe my preferences will be. The
one of the most dubious of is the overpowered suv.
It's mostly for kind of like symbolic sociological reasons. Perfect
I don't want to be the jackass in the AMG
the glamg. Right. I briefly had a Boxter, which was
(09:15):
the most beautiful drive I've ever had, and I got
rid of it because I was the jackass in the boxter.
I didn't want to go the jackass in the boxter.
I understand that, so I worry that jackass factor high. Also,
I've run a foul of the police so many times
up here, and the temptation to speed in this thing
is going to be, I'm guessing overwhelming. Second, I think
(09:39):
I'm quite drawn to Station Megan's. They have great symbolic
meaningful for me. I think they're immensely practical. I'm a
little dubious of these new fangled Volvos. I wouldn't mind
something that was just a proper psix orve eight in it.
And then I think I'm probably most enthusiastic about the
project of a minivan. Interesting because the sort of underlying
(10:04):
thing here is that we're going from the emotional to
the rational. We're going from it, you know, this crazy
steroidal Mercedes, it's all jacked up and it's got like,
you know, nightclub lighting and everything, and it's read through
the more rational station wagon, where the cargo package is
(10:25):
a little bit more sane and makes a little bit
more sense. It's lower to the ground, but it's still
fun to drive to the completely rational, which is the
one box minivan, not fun. I have no kind of
status anxiety about driving a minivan. Well, here's a really
interesting point, and Dan Neil from The Wall Street Journal
makes it all the time. He says, minivans are symbols
(10:48):
of virility. Sports cars are not minivans. Mean you've had kids,
you've reproduced? Yes, yes they do. So that's our baseline.
That's those are your your pre existing biases. And you
think you're a minivan man, to come by be a
(11:09):
minivan man. Yeah. I'm Eddie Alterman, and this is Car Show,
my podcast about why we drive what we drive. On
today's season finale, we asked a question. When it's time
to trade in the fast car for a family car,
(11:32):
which do you choose? SUV, minivan or station wagon? Papa Bear,
Mama Bear or baby Bear. After the break, Malcolm and
I hit the road with a ship ton of baby
stuff in the backseat. So here we are Me and Malcolm,
(12:08):
two performance card guys evaluating family cars. Wintertime in Hudson,
New York is perhaps the perfect gran environment to prepare
for the coming fatherly depressions ahead. The dead trees and
the slick roads set in appropriately somber tone. Still, some
fun must be forgiven. Oh there it is, there, it is.
(12:31):
They are kind of rad looking. We give you the keys, Malcolm.
First up is the Mercedes mg GL fifty three list
price seventy seven thousand dollars, which sounds outlandish when you
say it out loud, But this thing is loaded to
the gunnals with leather, chrome and technology. Forget heated or
(12:56):
even cooled seats, the chairs, and this bends administer massages.
That's right, massages. Sounds over the top, and it is,
but it is also fairly representative of the new species
of European suv. I'll take a look. Probably enough room
for the stroller and all the baby well. The Mercedes
(13:23):
trunk is lavishly trimmed in something that feels like wombat fur.
There's a little chrome pull to access the spare tire
well and little chrome tie downs for the rear netting.
If you were to put a closet like this in
your house, it would easily cost seventy seven grand, given
the richness of the materials. But it's no walk in
(13:44):
closet in here. The cargo volume is compromised by the
forward raking rear window. The whole car is rakish. It
looks mean, it sits squat on huge twenty one inch wheels,
and every surface seems to glint like a gee. They're
definitely sacrificing practicality for that, you know, a certain eagerness,
(14:10):
esthetic eagerness forward rake, I don't, I don't, I don't.
I think they're thinking more about the horse powers than
they are about the number of children in the backseat.
I think. So yeah, there's no Eddie. There's nothing about this.
I couldn't even if I arrived at home with this
and I said to my partner, here's the here's our
family car. What is it? What's family about this car?
(14:31):
I don't know it. Actually, now that I'm looking at
with this red paint job and the black interior, it's
very kind of Marquis decide, you know it is not.
It's dark. I would worry about the values if any
child raised in this car, right, they're going to grow
up to be psychopaths. No, these are I think this
(14:54):
is what I was saying before. I object to these
overpowered They're just they're just jackass cars. You say that
now I haven't driven it. We shoved producer Sam and
Jacob in the back. They are not Baylor Linemen. It
was surprisingly tight back there. Well that's interesting. We don't
(15:15):
even have space for our we're maxed out at four yeah,
for in some microphones and that's it. It's pretty tightly coupled.
As I said, there's nothing family about this car. That's nice.
(15:39):
How do you like that from your one steering wheel,
you feel like it's hideous. You feel like Lewis Hamilton,
I feel I think it looks like it looks like
a video game control box. Yeah, I think we should
go full drive. Yeah, it so even this steering from
(16:00):
my like for my liking, it's too light, right, I
just don't. I'm just thinking to my little battered you know,
eight year old X one, and it's just so much
more of a pleasure to drive. Well, there's a connection there,
I mean to the road surface. You get some feel
(16:21):
coming through the steering wheel into your hands. It's really
really important. And I point out that we are that's
the prison. Oh that's where they're going to send me
one day when I get my next speeding tickets. So good,
It comes alive a little bit, right, comes alive. It
(16:44):
just wants to be a sports car, right, It doesn't
want to be a family car. And if I would
to drive this way with my daughter in the back,
I would, I would. It would be like a criminal act.
You know. I just think this card's a certain so
with fully optioned and creeping towards one hundred grand for
a car that it cannot be driven the way it
(17:05):
wants to be driven right for for I mean that's
the rational argument. I mean, isn't there something we're celebrating here?
I think it's only usable if you have a pre
adolescent son, and then that's the kind of person for
whom this car is ideal. Yeah, listen there, Yeah, I
(17:30):
mean it's crazy. And that's the six cylinder. Let's find
the massaging seats here? Does like to go fast? Yes,
it does. I do like the seats, Eddy, They're exceptional.
(17:52):
They are good, aren't they? These are some of the
best seats i've i've i've Saturday. Let's do the activated massage. Yeah,
give me a hold the sage, Kay, Paul sating we
have any last night. We don't want to go too
far deep into this man, You'll never know what you'll
find in the massage section. I will say this about
(18:15):
the tear finishes is actually this is beautiful right, you
have this cool carbon fiber we've here going across the
whole instrument panel. You have this kind of Super Bowl
style screen that goes from the digital gauges to the
control kind of message center. Yeah, you know it's it's
(18:39):
totally over the top. But you know, if you're paying
this much money, it is very bank faulty. I will
say doubt about it. It's crazy how well made it is.
I think that that's really where Mercedes beats everyone. But
there is much to be said about the Mercedes handling too.
For a big, heavy car, it sure likes to boogie.
(19:01):
You can do some serious donuts to end all donuts failing,
did you rans they probably get You're probably have four
kinds of doughnuts you could do in this car. You
could do a Crueler. You could do a Boston cream cream. Well, no,
wouldn't be a boss of You'd be like a Heidelberg. Right,
(19:22):
it's some kind of Bavarian nice right exactly. So what
we have here in the Mercedes AMG is something that's
excessive for kid duty. It's too nice. You don't want
apple sauce getting smeared on the leather. You don't want
goldfish dust ground into the carpets. As much as this
(19:43):
bends is a thing to covet, it is not the
rational choice. And I'm trying to appeal to Malcolm's higher
instincts here. My initial impression that it is a jackass
mobile is confirmed. It is. It has nothing to do
with children. You wouldn't put a child in it. The
child would would would the minute it got dirty. You'd
(20:03):
be horrified because it's so gorgeous. You're you would drive
away too fast. You're partner would be screaming at every
time you took a corner, like at an appropriate speed.
Just everything about it is like it's just wrong. And yeah,
I mean but I'm not even sure that compromise back
(20:25):
rear areas also bothering, not just not convinced. I and
fifth so much stuff in it. Well yeah, it's it's
really about the driver first rather than the kid in
the bank, right, yeah, not for the kind of parent
you want to be, Not for the kind of parent
I want to be. The Mercedes AMG G L E
(20:49):
fifty three failed to seduce Malcolm. He saw right through it.
Parenthood one high buck euro SUV zero. Next up is
our minivan and the newest entry to the segment, the
Kia Carnival. There are only five minivan models on sale
in the US right now, so this Kia Carnival is
(21:12):
a great representative of the current state of the minivan
circa twenty twenty two. All right, let's take a look. Okay,
is gorgeous. Now we're in Kya country, and it is gorgeous,
not only for a minivan, but by any measure. It's
(21:33):
just a very well resolved piece of industrial design. The
front grill is seductively concave. You want to reach out
and touch it. The overall boxingess is diminished by some
very careful surfacing. There's a huge L shaped spear of
textured metal flanking the rear glass. It has the effect
(21:53):
of making the Kia look long and low, more suv
than minivan. And that's just the outside. The inside is
where the real action is, because minivans are about the passengering,
not the driving. We started Malcolm off in the second row.
Oh we've got the captain's chairs. Okay, make yourself comfortable. Now.
(22:16):
It has been yours since I sat at a minivan,
and I must say that I the first delightful thing
is just how kind of airy and bright and the
greenhouse as you as you guys like to say, right, Yes,
I feel like in c I feel I have I
(22:36):
can surveil my kids in the backseat. Yes, And there's
an intercom system in this vehicle, so you can yell
at them and they can yell at you. Wait, there's
an there's an intercom system. So during the third row
I can keep them in line. Yeah, they can bark orders.
What kind of So the third row is really a
kid a kid row. It's a kid row and it's
not well, these are the kind of deluxe business class chairs. Yeah.
(23:01):
I handed Malcolm E laminated placard. It described how to
operate the business class style recliners in the Kia's second row,
this particular model, which is the top of the line Carnival.
It's really about the second row seat. And a funny
thing about the second row seat. It's kind of a
Korean cultural thing. That one next to you, that captain's chair.
(23:23):
That's where the chairman sits and he can stretch out.
And this is where the interpreter sits or the secretary sits,
so he or she has to sit all the way up.
But the front passenger seat sacrifices their foot room for
the chairman in that Yeah, exactly, Oh it's nice. Yeah
(23:44):
you can. I think recline this one too. The chairman's
chair has got a foot rest. I think both of
them do. And are you gonna take Are you gonna
take me for a driving? Let's do it? Yeah, but
you have to be reclined. Do you have to be
in the I would like to be called chairman Malcolm
for the duration of this draw because I'm in the
chairman seat. I put my daughter in the third room
(24:06):
and the car seat back there, sure, or the second
round next to you, she can monitor. I don't understand
the as a new parent, the obsession with monitoring the
child at all times. I mean if once they're strapped
in or in a crib. I understand if they're free ranging,
but like, why do I need to have round the
clock surveillance of this kid if they're already in what
(24:28):
is essentially a prison cell, which is what a crib is,
right as prisoners. Yeah, and we really have to keep
our eyes on our kids for some reason. I know
this massive nanny state. Okay, hold on, um, do I
want my daughter to be in a car that has
a chairman's chair, Like, what message am I sending her?
I think you're preparing her for the real world. That's
(24:50):
the reality of her life where she what is gonna be?
She always be at the bottom of the hierarchy, and
like there's always going to be a chairman lording over there.
I think she could be the chairman. She could be
the chairman. I'm telling my daughter you could. You two
can grow up to be a chairman. Can get used
to what it feels like. Yeah, I'm gonna make a
series of ill advised corporate decisions. Okay, we'll roll it up.
(25:20):
Tell you I want your professional perspective on. Remember how
I drove some six hundred miles from Detroit to Hudson
to meet Malcolm. I did it in this minivan. Ten
and a half hours in this thing. Plenty of time
for me to mentally catalog it's pros and cons. The
(25:41):
pros the comfort, the space, the calm, and the straightforward
nature of the infotainment system. The cons well, not many.
The one thing that I did notice on the highway
was getting blown around quite a bit. It was a
little a little bit like a spinnaker on the highway.
(26:04):
But that's because it just has a very broad broadside. Yeah,
so it acts sort of like a sock because you're
also cutting across the winds who have planes. That's right.
Little here in the Northeast, we don't have an issue.
That's true, those big open prairies. So I was but
(26:25):
you know, I felt very kind of in control the
whole time. There was a there were a couple of
moments where I felt like the steering was a little laggy,
that the body control, you know, wasn't that great. But
it's encouraging you to drive at a stately pace exactly.
You know, it was very happy at eighty miles an hour.
(26:46):
It's not the quietest thing, but it's pretty darn nice.
And look, Malcolm, it's got the super Bowl screen. It's
got the same thing as the Mercedes already does add
that big vast I do like them. How great the
U pits abilities? Yeah, it's good. And you know, the
(27:10):
engine's a little course, it's no Mercedes six cylinder, but
you know it's fine for what it is, and it
got out of its own way pretty quickly. You know,
when you're driving, you'll see it's it's it drives pretty
small it doesn't feel like a big honking minivan. There's
your friend. He's always sitting there. Although I would think
(27:33):
you're pretty uh, aren't you pretty caught proof in this car?
Such a great point, Such a great point. They do
not pull over minivans, yeah, you know, especially ones that
are sort of road colored and just blend into the background.
It's not an arrest me kind of car. It's like,
unlike every other car that I well, that's maybe the issue.
(27:55):
Maybe we have to get you into something that's a
little bit more low key, understated and cop invisible. The
thing is, you know, it's like, this isn't a fun
car to drive. This is a boring car. This is
a you know, it's comfortable, but it's boring. It's like
a government job, and it's a vehicle that a public
(28:17):
servant might be able to afford. Unlike the Mercedes, this Kia,
all optioned up, is about forty six thousand dollars. It's
a little more than half what the Mercedes costs. But
we're not comparing apples to oranges here. We're trying to
find a lifestyle. I'm actually kind of loving it, though
(28:38):
I'm reveling in the vastness of the interior. The seeing
is larger than the living room I had in my
first department in Army r Right. Look, I can look
back at you. I've got the passenger view. Most minivans
have video screens and the back of the front seat
headrest to keep the kids occupied with movies or shows,
(28:59):
you know, Talletubbies, Baby Shark, Reservoir Dogs. The Kia goes
one screen further the central screen and the keys dashboard
converts to a kiddie monitor and displays the goings on
in the rear. See that, that's kind of freaky. That
is great kids surveillance right there. Look at that. You
(29:20):
got that like the fish eye view of your kid.
You can see into their lab. Is a surveillance state
comes to the minivan. Chairman Malcolm emerged from the private
plane comfort of the rear seating area and took the wheel.
I don't know you were saying, it's I like the
I love the seating posits, the driving position. It's kind
(29:42):
of the lord of the matter. Yeah, it's I think
you if you drive drive it in a leisurely manner,
you'll never hear the engine to sort of the engine
harshness and right, you just keep it under under wraps.
That's the funny thing that the Glee goes you into
using all of its performance, whereas this sort of says,
(30:03):
you know, maybe maybe don't just says take your time
Anny the morning I drive the I like it. Yeah,
what is it about it? If you think I m
because all the Greenhouse is spectacular, you can see everything.
I like this sort of captain's chair driving position. I
(30:26):
like how it encourages me to drive in a modest,
unassuming manner. I don't know, I like it's kind of
insane practicality it is. It's like, that's the insanity of it.
It's it's weird in its own Like it's super committed
(30:47):
to just being a place where people are comfortable. Yeah. Yeah,
it's a living room on wheels. That's all it wants
to be. And I have no problem with that. It
knows what it wants to be. It's honest about it. Yeah,
it's fully committed to like being boring and kind of static.
I don't even know if it's it's boring. I felt like,
(31:08):
I you know, it encourages me to think of myself
as a kind of the male protector, you know, it's
so um, it's very grown up and at the advanced
age of fifteen, maybe it's time I got a grown
up automobile. I've never had one before. Yeah, it forces
you to think about yourself more differently. I mean, do
(31:30):
you fear more or v rile in it? I feel
like I could have seven or eight children this automobile.
In our running family car tally, the minivan scores a
needed point. So where now at parenthood? One minivan, one dead?
Even so, how does the station wagon fair? We'll find
(31:51):
out after the break. I'm Eddie Alterman, and this is
Car Show. The last car on our journey is the
station Wagon. I'm thinking maybe it'll be the sweet spot
(32:14):
we're looking for. Like our minivans segment, the station wagon
lineup is small. By my reckoning. There are only nine
wagons on sale in the US, and I'm counting the
Porsche's sport Arrismo models with their little hatches grafted onto
the backs of the taykon Ev and Panamyra sedans. So
the Vovo really does stand in for the market as
(32:36):
a whole. But I chose the Vovo because it is sensible, beautiful,
and not ostentatious. It is not a sports car replacement
like the Porsche's, but it sure isn't the refrigerator box
on wheels the Fovo wagons used to be. It comes
across as both seductive and responsible, the thinking person's utility vehicle,
(33:02):
but it does try to draft in the SUV's wake
a little bit like the vast majority of today's station wagons.
The Volvo V ninety cross Country has been ruggedized, a
little jacked up like an SUV with plastic fender cladding
and all wheel drive. Still, its sleekness and subtle curvaciousness
(33:22):
cannot be denied. It has glossy brown paint and big
silvery wheels. Everything flows from one contour to another, both
outside and inside. It's more calming than crunchy, more design
within reach than our EI, and it is our last
vehicle under consideration. I feel like this vehicle matches your
(33:47):
esthetic sensibility well. The interior is lovely. It would be
destroyed by a child in you one week. The seats
are swaddled in soft brown leather with white stitching. A
band of open poor walnut wraps around the dash and
(34:08):
down the center console. A thin spear of brushed aluminum
follows it high Scandinavian sophistication. The ride on this car
is quite nice. It's like soaking off the bumps, long wheelbase,
you know, pretty stable ride, it feels planted. I've always
(34:32):
felt these things drove a little big. They felt like
they're a little bit bigger than they are. I don't
sure your take is on that. It doesn't quite have
the grandeur of the of the Kia Carnival. My initial
thought is, if I'm gonna go family haller, I should
(34:54):
go all in. This seems to be a tweeter. I mean,
the lack of the third seed. So I can't have
two children have this car? No, no, so right away,
I mean, like, so, why don't I just get an
Why don't I just get a nice sit in? Pretty
much does this offer me? I mean, I have my
(35:15):
Catalax T five f right man, he loves that thing. Anyway.
We stop briefly to examine the cargo hold in the
Volvo and found it surprisingly small. Yeah, I don't, I mean,
I don't. I don't have a problem with this car,
but I don't understand. I don't see how it It
does not solve the question I'm trying to answer right,
(35:38):
doesn't answer my question. My question is how do I
effectively move around a young family and all the stuff
that comes with it. This is a beautiful automobile. That
doesn't resolve that it for me, this is a style statement. Yeah,
think about the Volvos that you know, you grew up wherever,
(35:58):
and compare them to this. How would you characterize that? Well,
the ones I grew up with had that pleasing obvious liddy.
They were tanks in the best sense of the word. Um.
I mean, if we drove them today we would think
they were ludicrously underpower, but they didn't seem that way
(36:19):
at the time. They were very They were self consciously utilitarian.
They were about Swedish socialism. This is a capitalist card, right,
It's like this is about the transformation of Sweden as
much as anything, though this V ninety wagon seems impossibly
Swedish inside and out. Volvo is now a Chinese own
(36:40):
brand Geelie out of Hanzo bought Volvo from Ford back
in twenty ten. This is a Chinese But I mean
it would only even been you know, this is Sweden
of the seventies, is the most kind of ostentatiously egalitarian
society on Earth, So there was not an ounce of
frippery in any of those old follows. This thing is like,
(37:05):
I feel like they've been like one of those exquisite
modernist hotels. Yeah, this is sort of the son of
that bla the st edsel Ford to the Henry Ford.
This is the you know, this is the kid who
grew up rich and has really exquisite taste. And it's
a little more loose. No, there's no question. It's the
(37:27):
handsomest of the three interiors that we've seen, right, Like,
who would buy this? This is for a couple with
no kids, who loves the ski, who you know, has
you know, really exquisite taste. He's a retired eant specialist
(37:48):
from Boston who now lives in Great Barrington and Western Massachusetts.
She is a curator in an art gallery and they
have one grown daughter who works for Goldman. They don't
really talk to her. And I think they take this
car from their home in Beacon Hill, Act to Great
(38:08):
Barrington every weekend. The Berkshires. Yeah, and they go to
not the Canyon Ranch, that's too sort of No, they
go to like that, you know, the Lennox what's it
called the does a classical music festival. Right, they go
to UM. I think that's what this car's for, and
they try to do some antiquing, but are frustrated with
(38:29):
the size and shape of the cargo area. No, Eddie,
they're not they're going. They're not taking the piece home.
Someone's delivering it. You don't. They don't even know that
it was possible to take to pick it up yourself.
How basic of me? Yeah, yeah, they're so. I don't
think I think the I think the cargo area here
(38:52):
is uh is symbolic. I mean it's good, but it's
you don't actually you're not hauling firewood in the back
of this car. It's vestigial, right, It's like one of
those prehensible tails. It's just there to signify something. Favorite
quote ever S J. Popel, father of Ron Popel, who
(39:13):
is the man who invented the pocket fisherman. Someone once
explained to him that the pocket fisherman, which is a
fishing rod that you could put in your pocket, didn't
actually work, and he said, it's not for using, it's forgiving.
I feel like that describes a lot about this car.
(39:37):
It's a pocket fisherman on wheels. It's a pocket Fisherman.
So we've driven all three. One's too overpowered, one's too
mock functional, but one's just right. Looks like we have
(40:03):
our verdict. As someone who's obsessed with cars, I think
you know that your choice of a car is a
You're making a statement about yourself, the way that the
music you listen to in the seventies and eighties was
a statement about who you were. It isn't anymore, weirdly,
but it was back then. So I'm very self conscious
about my car choices. It's why I've gotten rid of
(40:23):
cars that I loved, because I didn't like what they
said about me. I don't. I'm not a Devolvo is
first is for someone whose kids have grown and gone
yeah and who's retired. Neither those are true of me.
And the Mercedes is I am not a hedge, fun
guy with the weekend house. That's what that is. That's
(40:44):
what the car is, right right. It's a jackass car.
It's it's just just it makes a statement. I mean,
it's a beautiful automobile, but it's just not the Glee.
And I think this is true of all performance SUVs.
There's something inherently dishonest about it. You don't make a
performance car ride that high or have that much weight.
You know, a performance car should be something else. And likewise,
(41:09):
wagon that doesn't have a really useful cargo hold, what's
the point? Get us an out? Like you were saying. Yeah,
I'm reminded driving the Murk in my out of favorite magazine,
car magazine. I well, car magazine. They used to have
those little capsule reviews of each car sold and written
(41:30):
in the back. I've always remembered the one they had
for them, the really big Rolls Royce, which was out
of my way, a little man, and the Murk is
very out of my way, little man. It's like it's
really you know it. I feel like it's out of
step with the with the particuar or maybe or maybe
(41:53):
perfectly in step with the moment we're in right now
as a society, and as it's all I want to
run as far as as fast as I can from it.
It's sort of what Jay Gatsby would drive now, So
I can't. I can't do that one. I really, I
don't know if I've ever driven a minivan before, really,
no one will looking my first ever minivan drive, and
(42:14):
I'm this is a great moment. This was an important,
important moment for me. What I didn't understand is although
they're big, they drive small. Yeah. So yeah, it was
that was the revelation, is there these things are I
feel I can park it? I mean maybe it's just
again a perception, but I feel I can park it anywhere.
But the minivan is that's that's who I am right now.
(42:35):
And I love that you're honest about it. The minivan
is honest. It's not trying to be something it's not.
It's trying to be a great family holler. It's trying
to be a box on wheels, a utilitarian solution instead
of cosplay. It made me want to drive all the
other mini van's out there, and I'm gonna try my luck. Well, yeah,
(42:57):
I think now we feel like we're pointed in the
right direction and we can find the right minivan. Yeah,
it's the right kind of vehicle at the right time
in this new father's life. Not to mention the right place.
We're in upstate New York. We are not in Bavaria.
We do not have ananto bon, we do not have
(43:18):
compliant police officers, and we're not stowing all of our
kids stuff at the chalet. Right right, We're taking it
with us. We're in America, We're driving minivans. Car Show
(43:41):
is written and hosted by me Eddie Alterman. It's produced
by Sam Dingman, Jacob Smith, and Amy Gaines. Our editor
is Jan Guera. Original music and mastering by Benaliday. Our
executive producer is Mia Lobell. Our show art was designed
by Sean Karney and airbrushed by Greg la Fever. Our
(44:05):
patron saints are Lee, Tom Malad and Justine Lange. Special
thanks to Heather Faine, John Schnars, Carrie Brody, Carl Migliori,
Christina Sullivan, Jason Gambrel, Eric Sandler, Maggie Taylor, Morgan Rattner,
Nicole Morano, Mary Beth Smith, Jordan McMillan, Isabella Narvaez, Maya Kanik,
(44:32):
Daniella Lakhan, Jake Flanagan, and extra special thanks to Malcolm
Gladwell and el Hefe Jacob Weisberg. Car Show is a
production of Pushkin Industries. If you love this show in
others from Pushkin Industries, consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin
Plus is a podcast subscription that offers bonus content and
(44:54):
uninterrupted listening for just four ninety nine a month. Look
for Pushkin Plus on Apple podcast subscriptions. To find more
Pushkin podcasts, Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or
wherever you listen. Podcast m
Pushkin. Hey Eddie here, before we get started, I wanted
you to know that you can listen to Car Show
ad free by becoming a Pushkin Plus subscriber. You'll also
get access to detours, bonus episodes of Car Show where
we go for extended drives, play outtakes, and more fine
(00:37):
Pushkin Plus on the Car Show page, in Apple Podcasts,
or at Pushkin dot Fm. So all I have right
now is a twenty fourteen BMW X one. And now
most people would say that's perfectly sufficient. But I wouldn't
say that. You would, no, you would not say that.
(00:59):
I have tried it on a airport run for a
holiday with my you know, with my new plus one,
so three of us, and it was, you know, the
amount of I had totally underestimated the amount of stuff
that now, I mean, this is not in the last
(01:19):
ten years. The amount of stuff must have doubled that
you're required to carry with you. And the seats, car
seats are just ginormous. They're huge, Yeah, they're they're fortress
like we're just like so yeah, So I clearly what
I have right now is insufficient. That's me and Malcolm Gladwell,
a couple of months ago, talking shop, just like we
(01:41):
always seemed to do. Talking shop is actually how we met.
I still remember when I got that first call from
him a few years ago. I was sitting at my
desk in ann Arbor as editor in chief of Current Driver.
When my phone rang. I heard the dulcet tones. Malcolm
(02:02):
introduced himself as a reader, which I could hardly believe
because I was at that very moment breaking apart in
Oreo with my teeth. There was no way this mental,
giant red car magazine's. I was also prejudiced to believe
that all intellectuals hated driving and thought all cars were
yellow with a light on top. But this Canadian kid
(02:24):
impressed me. He was talking torqu curs and limited slip deferentials.
He said he was doing a show on unintended acceleration
for the first season of his podcast, Revisionist History. Did
we at carn Driver want to be featured on it?
We sure did. Altaman hits the brakes firmly, smoothly, easily,
(02:45):
we come to a halt. But now it was my
chance to return the favor. Malcolm needed my guidance. He
needed to know how do I effectively move around a
young family and all the stuff that comes with it.
Malcolm had just become a father and couldn't decide what
(03:06):
kind of car to get for his family. His small
first generation BMW X one SUV may have been perfect
ideal even for a bachelor. But if you're hauling kids
in their tackle, a glorified hot hatchback like the X
one isn't going to cut it. So I had to
(03:26):
parachute in there. And by parachute, I mean pack my
stuff into a minivan in Detroit and drive six hundred
miles east to meet Malcolm and Hudson, New York, home
to the Pushkin offices, and together we would go on
a quest to find Malcolm a car for the pastoral
life with a child, maybe even two. Eventually there's a
(03:47):
great pg arooric mine. He says. Having one kid is
like having a dog. Having two kids is like having
a zoo. That, yeah, everything's exponentially greater. You have to
have way more stuff. And yeah, if you're flying and
getting the whole family packed up to go on an airplane,
(04:07):
you need your car seat for the plan and for
the cab and all that, and you need your stroller
and there's just so much stuff. It's like packing a
small army. Here's my worry. My worries are as well.
I'm totally spoiled by I love this car to death,
my X one. Yeah, it has that beautiful creamy in
line six, and it has the hydraulic steering. It's got
(04:27):
like right old school. The steering on this car is
so beautiful. Every time I give into any other car,
regardless of the price, I don't think it steers as
well as my as my X one. So I'm resigned
to the fact I'm surrendering. So that's a hard thing
to give up for sure. But you know, designing which
(04:49):
way to go for a people mover, for a family car,
for you know, something that has a lot of space,
it's really sort of a deep psychological question. It is.
I'm now I'm a child of as well as I'm
sure all every member of my generation is. I'm a
child of the station wagon. Yeah, as I'm sure you were.
I was what was what we your family wagons, h
(05:11):
Ultomobile custom Cruiser. That was the biggie with the slide
out tailgate and the you know, the rear facing third
row where you could put the window down and inhale
the exhaust and you could, you know, make faces at
the serial killers behind you. It's so unsafe. And U
and my mom never got a minivan. Our car growing up,
(05:35):
our family wagon was up in the beginning was a
Pugo four O four. So yeah, I mean our moms
drove wagons, our parents drove wagons. But then the minivan
revolution came and sort of reordered the family car universe. Now,
in one fell swoop, the Chrysler minivan destroyed the station
wagon market, but then the station mark then the minivan
(05:59):
market itself got destroyed by the suv. And so that's
what we're going to look at today. We're going to
look at these three formats, like the evolution of the
family car from the station wagon to the minivan to
the suv. Which one is best for you? For me?
So we have what we have a representative of each class.
(06:20):
Yes we have a No, I'm not committing to these
particular cars. We're just trying to choose the class. That's right.
We're just towing into the frigid waters of automotive responsibility here.
It's a tough adjustment for a guy who has an
addiction to performance cars and the speeding tickets to prove it.
So I used a categorical approach, positioning his options not
(06:42):
as specific cars that might be too depressing, but in
the abstract the question is cautiously broad. Where on the
family car evolutionary ladder will our test subject, Malcolm Land
will he go retro and choose a wagon like his
parents did, or will he partake of the other options
(07:03):
in the marketplace, the minivan or the suv. We have
three vehicles for you to check out. Okay, okay. The
first is the Kia Carnival. Oh do you know what
that is? Yes, I do, I have. I have been
looking at them online really furtively or furtively. Well, I
(07:26):
like the idea that it doesn't it's a minivan that
doesn't look like a minivan, which is you know, but
it's all minivan. I mean, you're gonna see. I can't
wait for your experience with it or in your reaction.
The second is the wagon, the thing that a minivan killed.
The wagon that we have is a Volvo V ninety
(07:47):
cross Country. Ah, so this is the jacked up one. Yes, yeah,
they're all sort of jacked up. They all want to
be SUVs. Now they all have kind of exaggerated fenders,
higher ride heights. You know, it's interesting because the way
that the cargo area is packaged in wagons is usually
(08:08):
pretty good for getting kids stuff in there, because it's
it's longer, it's generally wider, and it's it's more horizontal
than vertical. And then we come to the suv. The
vehicle once used for rock crawling and mud bogging has
been brought to heal. The modern day suv is the
(08:29):
de facto family car for many, but the one we're
going to drive today blurs the line between family car
and granite bowl eyed. It's the Mercedes MG GL fifty three,
and it is very red, very fast, and very very expensive.
I'll give you my pre ranking of what I believe
(08:51):
a priori what I believe my preferences will be. The
one of the most dubious of is the overpowered suv.
It's mostly for kind of like symbolic sociological reasons. Perfect
I don't want to be the jackass in the AMG
the glamg. Right. I briefly had a Boxter, which was
(09:15):
the most beautiful drive I've ever had, and I got
rid of it because I was the jackass in the boxter.
I didn't want to go the jackass in the boxter.
I understand that, so I worry that jackass factor high. Also,
I've run a foul of the police so many times
up here, and the temptation to speed in this thing
is going to be, I'm guessing overwhelming. Second, I think
(09:39):
I'm quite drawn to Station Megan's. They have great symbolic
meaningful for me. I think they're immensely practical. I'm a
little dubious of these new fangled Volvos. I wouldn't mind
something that was just a proper psix orve eight in it.
And then I think I'm probably most enthusiastic about the
project of a minivan. Interesting because the sort of underlying
(10:04):
thing here is that we're going from the emotional to
the rational. We're going from it, you know, this crazy
steroidal Mercedes, it's all jacked up and it's got like,
you know, nightclub lighting and everything, and it's read through
the more rational station wagon, where the cargo package is
(10:25):
a little bit more sane and makes a little bit
more sense. It's lower to the ground, but it's still
fun to drive to the completely rational, which is the
one box minivan, not fun. I have no kind of
status anxiety about driving a minivan. Well, here's a really
interesting point, and Dan Neil from The Wall Street Journal
makes it all the time. He says, minivans are symbols
(10:48):
of virility. Sports cars are not minivans. Mean you've had kids,
you've reproduced? Yes, yes they do. So that's our baseline.
That's those are your your pre existing biases. And you
think you're a minivan man, to come by be a
(11:09):
minivan man. Yeah. I'm Eddie Alterman, and this is Car Show,
my podcast about why we drive what we drive. On
today's season finale, we asked a question. When it's time
to trade in the fast car for a family car,
(11:32):
which do you choose? SUV, minivan or station wagon? Papa Bear,
Mama Bear or baby Bear. After the break, Malcolm and
I hit the road with a ship ton of baby
stuff in the backseat. So here we are Me and Malcolm,
(12:08):
two performance card guys evaluating family cars. Wintertime in Hudson,
New York is perhaps the perfect gran environment to prepare
for the coming fatherly depressions ahead. The dead trees and
the slick roads set in appropriately somber tone. Still, some
fun must be forgiven. Oh there it is, there, it is.
(12:31):
They are kind of rad looking. We give you the keys, Malcolm.
First up is the Mercedes mg GL fifty three list
price seventy seven thousand dollars, which sounds outlandish when you
say it out loud, But this thing is loaded to
the gunnals with leather, chrome and technology. Forget heated or
(12:56):
even cooled seats, the chairs, and this bends administer massages.
That's right, massages. Sounds over the top, and it is,
but it is also fairly representative of the new species
of European suv. I'll take a look. Probably enough room
for the stroller and all the baby well. The Mercedes
(13:23):
trunk is lavishly trimmed in something that feels like wombat fur.
There's a little chrome pull to access the spare tire
well and little chrome tie downs for the rear netting.
If you were to put a closet like this in
your house, it would easily cost seventy seven grand, given
the richness of the materials. But it's no walk in
(13:44):
closet in here. The cargo volume is compromised by the
forward raking rear window. The whole car is rakish. It
looks mean, it sits squat on huge twenty one inch wheels,
and every surface seems to glint like a gee. They're
definitely sacrificing practicality for that, you know, a certain eagerness,
(14:10):
esthetic eagerness forward rake, I don't, I don't, I don't.
I think they're thinking more about the horse powers than
they are about the number of children in the backseat.
I think. So yeah, there's no Eddie. There's nothing about this.
I couldn't even if I arrived at home with this
and I said to my partner, here's the here's our
family car. What is it? What's family about this car?
(14:31):
I don't know it. Actually, now that I'm looking at
with this red paint job and the black interior, it's
very kind of Marquis decide, you know it is not.
It's dark. I would worry about the values if any
child raised in this car, right, they're going to grow
up to be psychopaths. No, these are I think this
(14:54):
is what I was saying before. I object to these
overpowered They're just they're just jackass cars. You say that
now I haven't driven it. We shoved producer Sam and
Jacob in the back. They are not Baylor Linemen. It
was surprisingly tight back there. Well that's interesting. We don't
(15:15):
even have space for our we're maxed out at four yeah,
for in some microphones and that's it. It's pretty tightly coupled.
As I said, there's nothing family about this car. That's nice.
(15:39):
How do you like that from your one steering wheel,
you feel like it's hideous. You feel like Lewis Hamilton,
I feel I think it looks like it looks like
a video game control box. Yeah, I think we should
go full drive. Yeah, it so even this steering from
(16:00):
my like for my liking, it's too light, right, I
just don't. I'm just thinking to my little battered you know,
eight year old X one, and it's just so much
more of a pleasure to drive. Well, there's a connection there,
I mean to the road surface. You get some feel
(16:21):
coming through the steering wheel into your hands. It's really
really important. And I point out that we are that's
the prison. Oh that's where they're going to send me
one day when I get my next speeding tickets. So good,
It comes alive a little bit, right, comes alive. It
(16:44):
just wants to be a sports car, right, It doesn't
want to be a family car. And if I would
to drive this way with my daughter in the back,
I would, I would. It would be like a criminal act.
You know. I just think this card's a certain so
with fully optioned and creeping towards one hundred grand for
a car that it cannot be driven the way it
(17:05):
wants to be driven right for for I mean that's
the rational argument. I mean, isn't there something we're celebrating here?
I think it's only usable if you have a pre
adolescent son, and then that's the kind of person for
whom this car is ideal. Yeah, listen there, Yeah, I
(17:30):
mean it's crazy. And that's the six cylinder. Let's find
the massaging seats here? Does like to go fast? Yes,
it does. I do like the seats, Eddy, They're exceptional.
(17:52):
They are good, aren't they? These are some of the
best seats i've i've i've Saturday. Let's do the activated massage. Yeah,
give me a hold the sage, Kay, Paul sating we
have any last night. We don't want to go too
far deep into this man, You'll never know what you'll
find in the massage section. I will say this about
(18:15):
the tear finishes is actually this is beautiful right, you
have this cool carbon fiber we've here going across the
whole instrument panel. You have this kind of Super Bowl
style screen that goes from the digital gauges to the
control kind of message center. Yeah, you know it's it's
(18:39):
totally over the top. But you know, if you're paying
this much money, it is very bank faulty. I will
say doubt about it. It's crazy how well made it is.
I think that that's really where Mercedes beats everyone. But
there is much to be said about the Mercedes handling too.
For a big, heavy car, it sure likes to boogie.
(19:01):
You can do some serious donuts to end all donuts failing,
did you rans they probably get You're probably have four
kinds of doughnuts you could do in this car. You
could do a Crueler. You could do a Boston cream cream. Well, no,
wouldn't be a boss of You'd be like a Heidelberg. Right,
(19:22):
it's some kind of Bavarian nice right exactly. So what
we have here in the Mercedes AMG is something that's
excessive for kid duty. It's too nice. You don't want
apple sauce getting smeared on the leather. You don't want
goldfish dust ground into the carpets. As much as this
(19:43):
bends is a thing to covet, it is not the
rational choice. And I'm trying to appeal to Malcolm's higher
instincts here. My initial impression that it is a jackass
mobile is confirmed. It is. It has nothing to do
with children. You wouldn't put a child in it. The
child would would would the minute it got dirty. You'd
(20:03):
be horrified because it's so gorgeous. You're you would drive
away too fast. You're partner would be screaming at every
time you took a corner, like at an appropriate speed.
Just everything about it is like it's just wrong. And yeah,
I mean but I'm not even sure that compromise back
(20:25):
rear areas also bothering, not just not convinced. I and
fifth so much stuff in it. Well yeah, it's it's
really about the driver first rather than the kid in
the bank, right, yeah, not for the kind of parent
you want to be, Not for the kind of parent
I want to be. The Mercedes AMG G L E
(20:49):
fifty three failed to seduce Malcolm. He saw right through it.
Parenthood one high buck euro SUV zero. Next up is
our minivan and the newest entry to the segment, the
Kia Carnival. There are only five minivan models on sale
in the US right now, so this Kia Carnival is
(21:12):
a great representative of the current state of the minivan
circa twenty twenty two. All right, let's take a look. Okay,
is gorgeous. Now we're in Kya country, and it is gorgeous,
not only for a minivan, but by any measure. It's
(21:33):
just a very well resolved piece of industrial design. The
front grill is seductively concave. You want to reach out
and touch it. The overall boxingess is diminished by some
very careful surfacing. There's a huge L shaped spear of
textured metal flanking the rear glass. It has the effect
(21:53):
of making the Kia look long and low, more suv
than minivan. And that's just the outside. The inside is
where the real action is, because minivans are about the passengering,
not the driving. We started Malcolm off in the second row.
Oh we've got the captain's chairs. Okay, make yourself comfortable. Now.
(22:16):
It has been yours since I sat at a minivan,
and I must say that I the first delightful thing
is just how kind of airy and bright and the
greenhouse as you as you guys like to say, right, Yes,
I feel like in c I feel I have I
(22:36):
can surveil my kids in the backseat. Yes, And there's
an intercom system in this vehicle, so you can yell
at them and they can yell at you. Wait, there's
an there's an intercom system. So during the third row
I can keep them in line. Yeah, they can bark orders.
What kind of So the third row is really a
kid a kid row. It's a kid row and it's
not well, these are the kind of deluxe business class chairs. Yeah.
(23:01):
I handed Malcolm E laminated placard. It described how to
operate the business class style recliners in the Kia's second row,
this particular model, which is the top of the line Carnival.
It's really about the second row seat. And a funny
thing about the second row seat. It's kind of a
Korean cultural thing. That one next to you, that captain's chair.
(23:23):
That's where the chairman sits and he can stretch out.
And this is where the interpreter sits or the secretary sits,
so he or she has to sit all the way up.
But the front passenger seat sacrifices their foot room for
the chairman in that Yeah, exactly, Oh it's nice. Yeah
(23:44):
you can. I think recline this one too. The chairman's
chair has got a foot rest. I think both of
them do. And are you gonna take Are you gonna
take me for a driving? Let's do it? Yeah, but
you have to be reclined. Do you have to be
in the I would like to be called chairman Malcolm
for the duration of this draw because I'm in the
chairman seat. I put my daughter in the third room
(24:06):
and the car seat back there, sure, or the second
round next to you, she can monitor. I don't understand
the as a new parent, the obsession with monitoring the
child at all times. I mean if once they're strapped
in or in a crib. I understand if they're free ranging,
but like, why do I need to have round the
clock surveillance of this kid if they're already in what
(24:28):
is essentially a prison cell, which is what a crib is,
right as prisoners. Yeah, and we really have to keep
our eyes on our kids for some reason. I know
this massive nanny state. Okay, hold on, um, do I
want my daughter to be in a car that has
a chairman's chair, Like, what message am I sending her?
I think you're preparing her for the real world. That's
(24:50):
the reality of her life where she what is gonna be?
She always be at the bottom of the hierarchy, and
like there's always going to be a chairman lording over there.
I think she could be the chairman. She could be
the chairman. I'm telling my daughter you could. You two
can grow up to be a chairman. Can get used
to what it feels like. Yeah, I'm gonna make a
series of ill advised corporate decisions. Okay, we'll roll it up.
(25:20):
Tell you I want your professional perspective on. Remember how
I drove some six hundred miles from Detroit to Hudson
to meet Malcolm. I did it in this minivan. Ten
and a half hours in this thing. Plenty of time
for me to mentally catalog it's pros and cons. The
(25:41):
pros the comfort, the space, the calm, and the straightforward
nature of the infotainment system. The cons well, not many.
The one thing that I did notice on the highway
was getting blown around quite a bit. It was a
little a little bit like a spinnaker on the highway.
(26:04):
But that's because it just has a very broad broadside. Yeah,
so it acts sort of like a sock because you're
also cutting across the winds who have planes. That's right.
Little here in the Northeast, we don't have an issue.
That's true, those big open prairies. So I was but
(26:25):
you know, I felt very kind of in control the
whole time. There was a there were a couple of
moments where I felt like the steering was a little laggy,
that the body control, you know, wasn't that great. But
it's encouraging you to drive at a stately pace exactly.
You know, it was very happy at eighty miles an hour.
(26:46):
It's not the quietest thing, but it's pretty darn nice.
And look, Malcolm, it's got the super Bowl screen. It's
got the same thing as the Mercedes already does add
that big vast I do like them. How great the
U pits abilities? Yeah, it's good. And you know, the
(27:10):
engine's a little course, it's no Mercedes six cylinder, but
you know it's fine for what it is, and it
got out of its own way pretty quickly. You know,
when you're driving, you'll see it's it's it drives pretty
small it doesn't feel like a big honking minivan. There's
your friend. He's always sitting there. Although I would think
(27:33):
you're pretty uh, aren't you pretty caught proof in this car?
Such a great point, Such a great point. They do
not pull over minivans, yeah, you know, especially ones that
are sort of road colored and just blend into the background.
It's not an arrest me kind of car. It's like,
unlike every other car that I well, that's maybe the issue.
(27:55):
Maybe we have to get you into something that's a
little bit more low key, understated and cop invisible. The
thing is, you know, it's like, this isn't a fun
car to drive. This is a boring car. This is
a you know, it's comfortable, but it's boring. It's like
a government job, and it's a vehicle that a public
(28:17):
servant might be able to afford. Unlike the Mercedes, this Kia,
all optioned up, is about forty six thousand dollars. It's
a little more than half what the Mercedes costs. But
we're not comparing apples to oranges here. We're trying to
find a lifestyle. I'm actually kind of loving it, though
(28:38):
I'm reveling in the vastness of the interior. The seeing
is larger than the living room I had in my
first department in Army r Right. Look, I can look
back at you. I've got the passenger view. Most minivans
have video screens and the back of the front seat
headrest to keep the kids occupied with movies or shows,
(28:59):
you know, Talletubbies, Baby Shark, Reservoir Dogs. The Kia goes
one screen further the central screen and the keys dashboard
converts to a kiddie monitor and displays the goings on
in the rear. See that, that's kind of freaky. That
is great kids surveillance right there. Look at that. You
(29:20):
got that like the fish eye view of your kid.
You can see into their lab. Is a surveillance state
comes to the minivan. Chairman Malcolm emerged from the private
plane comfort of the rear seating area and took the wheel.
I don't know you were saying, it's I like the
I love the seating posits, the driving position. It's kind
(29:42):
of the lord of the matter. Yeah, it's I think
you if you drive drive it in a leisurely manner,
you'll never hear the engine to sort of the engine
harshness and right, you just keep it under under wraps.
That's the funny thing that the Glee goes you into
using all of its performance, whereas this sort of says,
(30:03):
you know, maybe maybe don't just says take your time
Anny the morning I drive the I like it. Yeah,
what is it about it? If you think I m
because all the Greenhouse is spectacular, you can see everything.
I like this sort of captain's chair driving position. I
(30:26):
like how it encourages me to drive in a modest,
unassuming manner. I don't know, I like it's kind of
insane practicality it is. It's like, that's the insanity of it.
It's it's weird in its own Like it's super committed
(30:47):
to just being a place where people are comfortable. Yeah. Yeah,
it's a living room on wheels. That's all it wants
to be. And I have no problem with that. It
knows what it wants to be. It's honest about it. Yeah,
it's fully committed to like being boring and kind of static.
I don't even know if it's it's boring. I felt like,
(31:08):
I you know, it encourages me to think of myself
as a kind of the male protector, you know, it's
so um, it's very grown up and at the advanced
age of fifteen, maybe it's time I got a grown
up automobile. I've never had one before. Yeah, it forces
you to think about yourself more differently. I mean, do
(31:30):
you fear more or v rile in it? I feel
like I could have seven or eight children this automobile.
In our running family car tally, the minivan scores a
needed point. So where now at parenthood? One minivan, one dead?
Even so, how does the station wagon fair? We'll find
(31:51):
out after the break. I'm Eddie Alterman, and this is
Car Show. The last car on our journey is the
station Wagon. I'm thinking maybe it'll be the sweet spot
(32:14):
we're looking for. Like our minivans segment, the station wagon
lineup is small. By my reckoning. There are only nine
wagons on sale in the US, and I'm counting the
Porsche's sport Arrismo models with their little hatches grafted onto
the backs of the taykon Ev and Panamyra sedans. So
the Vovo really does stand in for the market as
(32:36):
a whole. But I chose the Vovo because it is sensible, beautiful,
and not ostentatious. It is not a sports car replacement
like the Porsche's, but it sure isn't the refrigerator box
on wheels the Fovo wagons used to be. It comes
across as both seductive and responsible, the thinking person's utility vehicle,
(33:02):
but it does try to draft in the SUV's wake
a little bit like the vast majority of today's station wagons.
The Volvo V ninety cross Country has been ruggedized, a
little jacked up like an SUV with plastic fender cladding
and all wheel drive. Still, its sleekness and subtle curvaciousness
(33:22):
cannot be denied. It has glossy brown paint and big
silvery wheels. Everything flows from one contour to another, both
outside and inside. It's more calming than crunchy, more design
within reach than our EI, and it is our last
vehicle under consideration. I feel like this vehicle matches your
(33:47):
esthetic sensibility well. The interior is lovely. It would be
destroyed by a child in you one week. The seats
are swaddled in soft brown leather with white stitching. A
band of open poor walnut wraps around the dash and
(34:08):
down the center console. A thin spear of brushed aluminum
follows it high Scandinavian sophistication. The ride on this car
is quite nice. It's like soaking off the bumps, long wheelbase,
you know, pretty stable ride, it feels planted. I've always
(34:32):
felt these things drove a little big. They felt like
they're a little bit bigger than they are. I don't
sure your take is on that. It doesn't quite have
the grandeur of the of the Kia Carnival. My initial
thought is, if I'm gonna go family haller, I should
(34:54):
go all in. This seems to be a tweeter. I mean,
the lack of the third seed. So I can't have
two children have this car? No, no, so right away,
I mean, like, so, why don't I just get an
Why don't I just get a nice sit in? Pretty
much does this offer me? I mean, I have my
(35:15):
Catalax T five f right man, he loves that thing. Anyway.
We stop briefly to examine the cargo hold in the
Volvo and found it surprisingly small. Yeah, I don't, I mean,
I don't. I don't have a problem with this car,
but I don't understand. I don't see how it It
does not solve the question I'm trying to answer right,
(35:38):
doesn't answer my question. My question is how do I
effectively move around a young family and all the stuff
that comes with it. This is a beautiful automobile. That
doesn't resolve that it for me, this is a style statement. Yeah,
think about the Volvos that you know, you grew up wherever,
(35:58):
and compare them to this. How would you characterize that? Well,
the ones I grew up with had that pleasing obvious liddy.
They were tanks in the best sense of the word. Um.
I mean, if we drove them today we would think
they were ludicrously underpower, but they didn't seem that way
(36:19):
at the time. They were very They were self consciously utilitarian.
They were about Swedish socialism. This is a capitalist card, right,
It's like this is about the transformation of Sweden as
much as anything, though this V ninety wagon seems impossibly
Swedish inside and out. Volvo is now a Chinese own
(36:40):
brand Geelie out of Hanzo bought Volvo from Ford back
in twenty ten. This is a Chinese But I mean
it would only even been you know, this is Sweden
of the seventies, is the most kind of ostentatiously egalitarian
society on Earth, So there was not an ounce of
frippery in any of those old follows. This thing is like,
(37:05):
I feel like they've been like one of those exquisite
modernist hotels. Yeah, this is sort of the son of
that bla the st edsel Ford to the Henry Ford.
This is the you know, this is the kid who
grew up rich and has really exquisite taste. And it's
a little more loose. No, there's no question. It's the
(37:27):
handsomest of the three interiors that we've seen, right, Like,
who would buy this? This is for a couple with
no kids, who loves the ski, who you know, has
you know, really exquisite taste. He's a retired eant specialist
(37:48):
from Boston who now lives in Great Barrington and Western Massachusetts.
She is a curator in an art gallery and they
have one grown daughter who works for Goldman. They don't
really talk to her. And I think they take this
car from their home in Beacon Hill, Act to Great
(38:08):
Barrington every weekend. The Berkshires. Yeah, and they go to
not the Canyon Ranch, that's too sort of No, they
go to like that, you know, the Lennox what's it
called the does a classical music festival. Right, they go
to UM. I think that's what this car's for, and
they try to do some antiquing, but are frustrated with
(38:29):
the size and shape of the cargo area. No, Eddie,
they're not they're going. They're not taking the piece home.
Someone's delivering it. You don't. They don't even know that
it was possible to take to pick it up yourself.
How basic of me? Yeah, yeah, they're so. I don't
think I think the I think the cargo area here
(38:52):
is uh is symbolic. I mean it's good, but it's
you don't actually you're not hauling firewood in the back
of this car. It's vestigial, right, It's like one of
those prehensible tails. It's just there to signify something. Favorite
quote ever S J. Popel, father of Ron Popel, who
(39:13):
is the man who invented the pocket fisherman. Someone once
explained to him that the pocket fisherman, which is a
fishing rod that you could put in your pocket, didn't
actually work, and he said, it's not for using, it's forgiving.
I feel like that describes a lot about this car.
(39:37):
It's a pocket fisherman on wheels. It's a pocket Fisherman.
So we've driven all three. One's too overpowered, one's too
mock functional, but one's just right. Looks like we have
(40:03):
our verdict. As someone who's obsessed with cars, I think
you know that your choice of a car is a
You're making a statement about yourself, the way that the
music you listen to in the seventies and eighties was
a statement about who you were. It isn't anymore, weirdly,
but it was back then. So I'm very self conscious
about my car choices. It's why I've gotten rid of
(40:23):
cars that I loved, because I didn't like what they
said about me. I don't. I'm not a Devolvo is
first is for someone whose kids have grown and gone
yeah and who's retired. Neither those are true of me.
And the Mercedes is I am not a hedge, fun
guy with the weekend house. That's what that is. That's
(40:44):
what the car is, right right. It's a jackass car.
It's it's just just it makes a statement. I mean,
it's a beautiful automobile, but it's just not the Glee.
And I think this is true of all performance SUVs.
There's something inherently dishonest about it. You don't make a
performance car ride that high or have that much weight.
You know, a performance car should be something else. And likewise,
(41:09):
wagon that doesn't have a really useful cargo hold, what's
the point? Get us an out? Like you were saying. Yeah,
I'm reminded driving the Murk in my out of favorite magazine,
car magazine. I well, car magazine. They used to have
those little capsule reviews of each car sold and written
(41:30):
in the back. I've always remembered the one they had
for them, the really big Rolls Royce, which was out
of my way, a little man, and the Murk is
very out of my way, little man. It's like it's
really you know it. I feel like it's out of
step with the with the particuar or maybe or maybe
(41:53):
perfectly in step with the moment we're in right now
as a society, and as it's all I want to
run as far as as fast as I can from it.
It's sort of what Jay Gatsby would drive now, So
I can't. I can't do that one. I really, I
don't know if I've ever driven a minivan before, really,
no one will looking my first ever minivan drive, and
(42:14):
I'm this is a great moment. This was an important,
important moment for me. What I didn't understand is although
they're big, they drive small. Yeah. So yeah, it was
that was the revelation, is there these things are I
feel I can park it? I mean maybe it's just
again a perception, but I feel I can park it anywhere.
But the minivan is that's that's who I am right now.
(42:35):
And I love that you're honest about it. The minivan
is honest. It's not trying to be something it's not.
It's trying to be a great family holler. It's trying
to be a box on wheels, a utilitarian solution instead
of cosplay. It made me want to drive all the
other mini van's out there, and I'm gonna try my luck. Well, yeah,
(42:57):
I think now we feel like we're pointed in the
right direction and we can find the right minivan. Yeah,
it's the right kind of vehicle at the right time
in this new father's life. Not to mention the right place.
We're in upstate New York. We are not in Bavaria.
We do not have ananto bon, we do not have
(43:18):
compliant police officers, and we're not stowing all of our
kids stuff at the chalet. Right right, We're taking it
with us. We're in America, We're driving minivans. Car Show
(43:41):
is written and hosted by me Eddie Alterman. It's produced
by Sam Dingman, Jacob Smith, and Amy Gaines. Our editor
is Jan Guera. Original music and mastering by Benaliday. Our
executive producer is Mia Lobell. Our show art was designed
by Sean Karney and airbrushed by Greg la Fever. Our
(44:05):
patron saints are Lee, Tom Malad and Justine Lange. Special
thanks to Heather Faine, John Schnars, Carrie Brody, Carl Migliori,
Christina Sullivan, Jason Gambrel, Eric Sandler, Maggie Taylor, Morgan Rattner,
Nicole Morano, Mary Beth Smith, Jordan McMillan, Isabella Narvaez, Maya Kanik,
(44:32):
Daniella Lakhan, Jake Flanagan, and extra special thanks to Malcolm
Gladwell and el Hefe Jacob Weisberg. Car Show is a
production of Pushkin Industries. If you love this show in
others from Pushkin Industries, consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin
Plus is a podcast subscription that offers bonus content and
(44:54):
uninterrupted listening for just four ninety nine a month. Look
for Pushkin Plus on Apple podcast subscriptions. To find more
Pushkin podcasts, Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or
wherever you listen. Podcast m
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