December 28, 2025 • 31 mins
This summer we're curating your playlist with some of our favourite episodes of BIZ - our podcast that gets your work life sorted!
Do you know we ALL should strive to be part personality hire?! Join Em Vernem as we learn about building rapport and ‘vibes’ at work from Biz career coaches Michelle Battersby and Soph Hirst.
You’ll learn the surprising science behind why workplace energy matters (yep there's actual research on this!); how to ‘learn’ one character trait that will make you more likeable; and how to bring your full self to work without crossing professional boundaries.
Plus we meet Sana from Canva whose job title literally includes the word "vibes" and learn how her department is revolutionising workplace culture.
This ep is perfect for anyone questioning their workplace identity, managers trying to build better teams, or anyone who just wants work to be that bit more fun!
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HOSTS: Michelle Battersby, Soph Hirst and Em Vernem
EXEC PRODUCER: Kimberly Braddish
AUDIO PRODUCER: Leah Porges
Mamamia acknowledges the Traditional Owners of the Land we have recorded this podcast on, the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation. We pay our respects to their Elders past and present, and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander cultures.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
You're listening to another MIA podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land. We
have recorded this podcast on the Gatagoul people of the
Eur Nation. We pay our respects to their elders past
and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and
Torres Strait Islander cultures.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Hello and Vernoon. Here and I am the host of BIZ,
a podcast that gets your work Live Sorted. And this
summer we are curating your playlist with unmissable episodes full
of hacks, tips and tricks from our top expert guests
and hosts. And if you're looking for more to listen to,
every Mama Mia podcast is curating your summer listening right
across our network. From pop culture to beauty to powerful interviews,
(01:04):
there is something for everyone. There is a link in
our show notes. Hello and welcome to BIZ your Work
Life Sorted. I'm m Vernon and today we're diving into
something that's probably made you fear for your life as
well as in treat you at the same time. It's
the concept of being a personality higher. So the personality
(01:27):
higher is someone who seems to make everything way more
fun that the person who somehow manages to have the
senior leaders wrapped around their little finger, and that the
person in the office that everyone wants to have afterwork
drinks with. So, whether you are that person, or you're
secretly wanted to be that person, or you know this person,
this episode is going to challenge how you think about
(01:49):
personality at work. Our career coaches are Michelle Battisbee who
founded Sunroom, and Sophurst, who runs her own coaching business,
Work Baby, and they're breaking down the real tension between
vibes and productivity.
Speaker 4 (02:03):
God, this is going to piss some people off, but
I'm gonna say it. Personality hires are arguably more important
than people that do actual work. Let me explain. Let
me explain.
Speaker 5 (02:13):
I explain.
Speaker 4 (02:14):
Anyone can do work. Anyone can be a good employee.
Anyone can go and then send an email.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
Anyone can do that.
Speaker 4 (02:21):
It takes a specific type of person to keep the
company culture fun and like funny and keep the office
like in good spirits. And that's where we come in.
That's where personality hires come in. Because I solely got
my corporate job from having a good personality.
Speaker 5 (02:38):
Okay, so you just heard from TikTok creator Daniel Bennett,
who's obviously the personality higher, and he has a very
interesting argument about the role this type of person plays
at work, and that's part of what we're going to
get into today. But first, what is a personality higher
and is it actually a good or a bad thing?
So right now I could genuinely go both ways on
(02:59):
this and I'm a little bit confused.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
So Michelle, can you break this down for us? What
is it?
Speaker 4 (03:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (03:04):
So, a personality high is someone who's typically hired for
their vibe, charisma, enthusiasm, social skills or their humor over
qualifications and technical abilities. So those skills that they do
have can still be amazing in the workplace. They can
(03:24):
make the workplace very positive and just a fun and
happy place to be. I do want to emphasize that
just because they're hired for those softer skills, let's say,
that doesn't mean that they're not competent. And I think
that sometimes the discourse on social media around personality hires
has meant that they don't really have real jobs, and
(03:47):
it's questioned what they actually do. But personality HighRes can
often be the people that go into leadership roles because
they are really good at communicating and they have great adaptability.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Interesting.
Speaker 5 (04:00):
I think there's so much in this because I originally
start when I saw that video, I remember thinking, oh, like,
I sort of want to be the personality higher.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
I remember people at work who were so.
Speaker 5 (04:11):
Funny in meetings and charismatic, and it's like they always
had the ear of the senior leaders.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
They just had this like gravita us almost.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
And I was like, I want to be the personality higher.
And then I started reading some of the comments, and
a lot of people were saying like, no, this is
the person in your university working group who is really
fun to hang out with but then never actually does
their part of the project. And I was like, oh, okay,
so it's actually bad, like these people aren't actually doing
the work.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
But I think it's just an interesting point that you
raise around.
Speaker 5 (04:39):
It's not that they're not competent, it's just that maybe
they're some of those skills in terms of like how
they communicate their presence at work. Maybe that's kind of
like elevating them to these more senior levels.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
I think there's a lot in it, though.
Speaker 6 (04:52):
And I think you make really good points because sometimes
a personality higher might have been hired and there is
a bit of a skills gap, but the hiring manager
believes that they can train that person up. There's growth,
there's potential there, and so I think for some personality hires,
there will be a bit of a steep learning curve
(05:14):
once they enter the workplace and they'll have to work
on that. And in today's world in particular, you're not
going to survive in the work place if you're not delivering.
So I think someone who is a personality higher who
then isn't actually contributing to the organization in their role
and reaching their KPIs, they're not going to survive. But
the same can be said for people at the complete
(05:36):
other end of the spectrum as well. Like if you've
got personality highs over on the left, and you've got
an ace, all star, technically brilliant person over on the right,
but maybe they've got a bit of a bad attitude sometimes,
maybe they have a bit of a negative demeanor. They
still reach their KPIs, but they're not actually that pleasant
(05:58):
to be around. I think that kind of employee could
also see their growth and career advancements be.
Speaker 5 (06:06):
Stifled because it's not just you as an individual delivering
your individual piece of work. It's actually like an organization
is a big collection of people, and it's actually part
of your job to help the whole collection of people
also be good at their job. It's not just about
your little piece. Okay, But you also went out on
your DMS Michelle, What did you get back from the
poll that you put up?
Speaker 6 (06:24):
Yeah, so one of my socials because I was just curious, like,
how many people actually consider themselves to be personality highers.
I mean that could be a completely different conversation, like
are their people out there that were hired because of
their personality as opposed to technical skills? Do they even know? Anyway?
So I went out on my story and I asked,
do you consider yourself a personality higher twenty eight percent
(06:46):
said outright yes, forty percent said partially, and thirty two
percent said no. So the majority of people believe that
their personality played some part. And then I did ask
them a question which was, if you answered yes or partially,
how does your personality show up at work? Which I
(07:06):
think we'll get into a bit later. And then I asked,
if you answered no, do you want to bring more
of your personality to the workplace, and forty six percent
of people said that they do want to bring their
personality the work to the workplace. Others said I like
to keep my personality a secret, and others said I
don't feel safe to bring my personality to work, which
(07:28):
I think is also, you know, something worthy of consideration.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
Oh man, this is so interesting. Okay, so half of
people actually want to have more personality at work. The
piece around feeling safe is really important too, so we'll
get into some of these. It does remind me of
a post it note that I had on my desk
at work and it just said don't be boring, and
that was sort of my reminder to myself, like, bring
your personality to work. Okay, so this episode is more
than just another career trend. It is about personality and
(07:55):
vibes and specifically how to make vibes at work so
you're happier and your job is easier. There is some
science behind why vibe is important, so you know, Also,
the workplace is really changing.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Whether you're a gen z just starting.
Speaker 5 (08:08):
Out, or you're a millennial manager managing a team, or
you're running a business, this episode's for you. Okay, Michelle,
I'm actually very interested to note.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Do you consider yourself to be a personality higher?
Speaker 6 (08:28):
Yes, I think I'm a personality higher. Can you be
a personality higher in your own company that you found?
Speaker 1 (08:35):
Why do you think you're a personality higher?
Speaker 6 (08:37):
Like, I've been given feedback along the way in my
career that's led me to think I'm I can deliver
technically in my area. But I also have been told
that I bring like a positive attitude. I'm enthusiastic. I
try to like lighten the mood in stressful situations and
like remind everyone that this isn't life saving work that
(08:59):
we're doing here.
Speaker 5 (09:00):
Interesting, So yeah, I think where and then part of
this episode is redefining what a personality higher actually is
and it doesn't mean.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
That you're not delivering in doing your job, all right.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
So I mean before starting this episode, I was a
bit conflicted because I sort of wanted to be a
personality higher, but I was also sort of judging them
as being a bit of a joke. So you might
be sitting there thinking the same thing, But there is
something deeper.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
So, Michelle, why.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
Is building rapport and vibes at work actually important?
Speaker 6 (09:27):
I'm still just stuck on what you said, because I
feel like you'd be part personality higher as well, do
you feel like you would be?
Speaker 5 (09:35):
I feel like I wasn't funny enough to be a
personality higher, so I was like, I'm not funny, and
I had a lot of self doubt around that. I
wanted to be the person in the room who was
like bringing it, you know. So I never felt like
I was a personality higher.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
But then I started thinking, well, I wasn't actually that
good at marketing, so was I a personality higher?
Speaker 5 (09:53):
And then I went down a shame spiral of imposter syndrome.
So I'm not going to talk about that anymore.
Speaker 6 (09:59):
You give fun vibes, though, like you bring fun energy
to working hard, which I also think is what you know,
bringing your personality to work can also look like maybe
that's also another way to think about it. Okay, So
why this is important? I think there are many advantages
to being a bit of a personality higher, the first
one being it's a very competitive hiring man market out
(10:21):
there at the moment in particular, so being likable and
showing how you aligned to a company's mission can really
put you ahead of other candidates. So I think it
can help get you in the door. It also can
help if you vibe with a hiring manager. You know,
when you leave an important meeting and you know, I
think that went well because we just clicked, We just gelled,
(10:43):
like maybe there was some banter, there was some back
and forth, maybe you connected on a personal level. I
think that's also a big part to how this can
be a bit of a superpower and why it's important
for people to develop. And a TikTok put this very
well where they were talking about Beer's riz and for
(11:03):
anyone listening, if you don't know what rizz. I didn't
know what riz was until about a year ago, which
I'm ashamed to say because I think I was still
too late. But charisma is riz to gen Z's. I
can't even define it in the right way, which shows
that I'm truly a millennial. But there was a TikTok
talking all about bizriz.
Speaker 7 (11:24):
The number one thing I think I got from two
years at Mackenzie that helps me land a director level
role at twenty three is literally this notion of developing bizriz.
Bizriz is essentially the skill to make senior people, whether
it's your clients or your leaders, to like you to
like working with you, to build a relationship and to
trust you with the work. Once you get someone to
like you, you essentially become an EPO baby. You get
(11:46):
advantaged opportunities and access to new projects, new jobs so much.
Speaker 6 (11:51):
And it really broke down how it helps you build
rapport and build relationships with senior managers. And this is
what I love about gen Z and their approach to
the workforce. It just feels a little bit more casual
and they're not really scared of hierarchy or traditional power
roles in the way I think some of the older
(12:14):
generations were. And this TikTok goes on to remind people
that your CEO or the head of your department is
someone's dad, someone's uncle, brother, sister, mother, auntie, and they're
going home and probably being paid out by the people
around the table with them, and they live lives and
have hobbies and have challenges. So being able to unearth
(12:36):
some of that and remind yourself of that is a
great way to also develop this in the workplace.
Speaker 7 (12:41):
These really senior leaders were literally somebody's dad or uncle,
and no matter how intimidating they seemed, sitting across from
you in the boardroom. Later that night, they would probably
sit across the dinner table from their gen z kid
who would literally be cringing at them for I don't know,
doing something kind of silly, and then you realize, I
don't know, like Mike, the CFO at this huge bank
(13:02):
is actually just your middle school friend Sam's dad who
would bring watermelon to the soccer practice. And that mindset
shift made it so much easier for me to be
confident and to be able to talk to them as
if they were also people, which obviously they are. No
matter how senior the man, at the end of the day,
they are still just someone's chuggy uncle, You'll.
Speaker 5 (13:20):
Be There's a healthy side to that in not putting
these senior leaders on this huge pedestal and just realizing, like, hey,
everyone's kind of human. So what about the fact Michelle though,
when it comes to stuff like building rapport and connecting
with people at work, that it is easier for some
people than it is for others. Like I know some
people and a lot of young people that I talk
to they really struggle with this. So is vibe something
(13:43):
you're just born with or is it something that you
can learn? Yeah?
Speaker 6 (13:46):
I love this question because I feel like both of
us have done some unlearning as we've researched this topic.
And my un learning was I did think it was
the kind of thing you were just born with, like
a bit of an X factor, those people that just
have those contagious personalities where they're always on, always happy,
always bubbly and positive. But there's an amazing TikTok from
(14:09):
Hannah gets Hired that taught me a lot, and she
shared a stat It was from a Princeton study, and
it showed that eighty two percent of how people perceive
you come down to one trait.
Speaker 8 (14:23):
You know, those people that are just so contagious to
be around. It feels like everybody likes them, They can
do no wrong. You can actually like hack your way
into being that person with just minor changes to the
way that you.
Speaker 7 (14:34):
Talk to other people.
Speaker 8 (14:35):
So this characteristic that Princeton research founds accounts for eighty
two percent of how other people perceive you is called charisma.
And what sets charisma apart from other personality traits is
that you're not born with it. It's actually something that
you can practice and grow and develop over time.
Speaker 6 (14:53):
And she goes on to explain that you can kind
of hack your way to being a bit more charismatic,
because charisma is made up of two things, those things
being warmth and competence, and apparently most people over index
on one or the other. So maybe you're really warm
and bubbly but you don't command that respect, or perhaps
(15:14):
you're really competent, but you're super blunt, straight shooting, and
you just come off like a bit of an asshole.
And what I also loved about this was the tips
she gives to then dial up warmth or competence are
really really simple, Like, these aren't groundbreaking things, and you
can literally just start doing this today. So if you
(15:35):
feel like you're the sort of person that needs to
dial up on the warmth, it's as simple as nodding
along when someone's talking, offering a smile, leaning in, Or
if you're this sort of person who feels like you
need to dial up competence, just speaking with a little
bit more confidence, maybe slowing it down or speeding it up,
whatever you think is more, you know the thing that
(15:55):
you're needing to work on, and speaking with down tones
as opposed to upward inflections. I think it was I
think I do the upward speaking, I put think I've
done it just then, but yeah, I found it fascinating.
Speaker 5 (16:08):
Yeah, I think it's really interesting that you do think
it's something that you're born with or you think it's
really hard, but maybe there's some small changes that we
can start to adopt.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
What else did you get from your DM's Michelle?
Speaker 6 (16:18):
Okay, So one of the other questions that I ask
in my DMS was how does your personality show up
in the workplace? So I think some of these examples
could be really good for just getting across how simple
it may be. I'd say I have the skills, but
vibe is executing regardless of it being in my skill set.
With enthusiasm, I improve the workplace culture, leading through tough
(16:42):
client conbos and supporting my team. Positivity, enthusiasm, and a
hunger to learn. I always share a smile. I boost
the spirits of others by encouraging them, and I organize
social events. Oh, this one's good. I'm really good at
reading the room, and I understand what makes people tick
and I craft comms accordingly. I always stay positive and
(17:06):
up for the challenge. I'm happy to try things even
if I'm not one hundred percent sure I've been told
my X factor is brightness and freshness in a very
corporate and traditional environment.
Speaker 5 (17:17):
Yeah, I think there's some really interesting stuff in that, Michelle,
because it's like, yes, you can have some of these
behaviors that make you come across as warm when you're
talking to people, but it's actually way more than that, right,
So a lot of the stuff I'm hearing coming through
is things like, you know, the ability to say positive
when stuff gets hard, or this like freshness that you're
bringing to work, thoughtfulness around how you're making other people feel,
(17:38):
the impact you're having on other people. So we wanted
to actually speak to a real life personality higher So
we've spoken to someone who works on an actual Vibes
team and yes, that is real because it says so on.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
LinkedIn that's coming up after this.
Speaker 6 (17:59):
So did you know there are companies with whole departments
dead headed to vibe. When I was at Bumble, we
had a role that was called Curator of Vibes. The
people that held that role genuinely were the vibe as people.
They kept things fresh, positive, bright. But I think it's
important to recognize that you don't need to have dedicated
(18:20):
roles or departments to have positive attitudes, personality, fun, camaraderie
existing in an organization. So so you've got up with
Sana from Camber, who's in the vibe team aka workplace Experiences.
Speaker 9 (18:38):
Firstly, I think every company should have a vibe team,
but until then, I think everybody can be their own
vibe team. Really, it can be pretty overwhelming the thought
of that, but I think it's important to just start small.
I think the most iconic vibe people I've known in
my life, and the most iconic personality highs if you will,
(19:01):
are the people who are genuine and come to work
and want to make genuine connections with people. So I
recommend start small. You know, creating a vibe doesn't mean
like planning huge events. It's about making people feel like
connected and getting to know people, ask real questions, celebrate
(19:23):
people's wins, and just bring your personality to work. I
think that's super key, Like authenticity. Really, just make work
feel like human, you know, and the vibe will just
naturally follow. Work is hard. Work can be a little
boring and monotonous, and I think bringing joy to your
(19:44):
co workers live in just a little freaky weird way
is the cherry on top of the day. I find
even when I'm being vibed, I feel like it puts
a little pep in my steps, and it makes me
want to do a better job, Like I feel more
enthusiastic essentially. So I think it's so important that everybody
(20:10):
is their own workplaces. Vibe team just makes life more
fun and interesting and weird.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
It's quite a privileged position that a company is in
to be able to high an entire ViBe's team.
Speaker 5 (20:22):
But the things that I spoke about with her are
relevant for anyone, whether you're an individual small business, So
you know, you can take these principles.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
First of all, I just want to say she is
such a vibe. So after the conversation, I was like
this pumping the air.
Speaker 5 (20:37):
And she is just like giving energy. She's giving vibe.
There's two really important things that came out of the conversation,
and the first is around this idea of the personality
higher is part of this anti fake movement that we're seeing,
and this is really a longing that we all have
to just be a bit more real at work. We're
(20:58):
just a bit over the fakeness, the like corporate speak
and the bullshit of it all. And you know, I
even think to some of the accounts that I love following.
One of them is the Aussie Corporate and the other
is Corporate Sween. And if you don't know these accounts
on TikTok and Instagram, we're going to put them in
the show notes. They are very funny and it's just
(21:18):
this like parody satire, taking the piss out of how
we all act at work.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
And they are brilliant.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
But I think you know, the reason we love these
meme accounts is we just have this craving to be
a bit more human and a bit more real. And
I think people think the personality higher is about being
the loudest, it's the most extroverted, it's the funniest, but
it's actually not. It's just about being the uest you,
and it's about not being scared to be your real
(21:44):
self and to just be a bit more genuine at work.
That really shifted my kind of perception and then the
other thing that really came through, So yes, bring yourself
to work and be real. But then also it's not
just about being the USU. It's about how you as
an individual is bringing out the best in the collective. Right,
So They have this thing in onboarding at Canvas. Part
(22:06):
of their onboarding is how to vibe, and they have
a line that says.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
When not the vibe, you're the vibe. Everyone has this
in them and we all contribute to the vibe. It's
about like, what are you.
Speaker 5 (22:17):
Doing to celebrate the uniqueness and awesomeness in everyone else
the work with. If you take the flip side of that,
it's like, what might you be doing that's actually dragging
other people down in the way that you're kind of
showing up and acting at work? And there's this expression
there's two types of people at work. There's drains and
there's radiators. And drains are the people that are like
(22:37):
taking the energy out of the room. And the radiators
the ones that like they're just like radiating warmth, reflecting
back the best and bringing out the best in other people.
You know, Drains take and radiators give. I think about
that so much in reflecting on my own work experiences,
Like when stuff got really hard, it was almost this
memurification of the experience we were all having that got
(22:59):
me through. So I think about the hardest projects where
like stuff just gets dark sometimes everyone's working so hard,
you're dealing with so many problems, and then someone will
like say something in a meeting and then everyone starts,
you know, repeating this little tagline, and then someone will
take the effort to go and put it on a
T shirt and like that's the stuff that actually gets
you through these shared experiences that are actually bringing us together.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
She did tell a story that I loved as well.
Speaker 5 (23:23):
Which is, you know, back to that point around, it's
not just about being the most extroverted and the funniest.
Shush said, there's a software engineer who's like very quiet,
and you would not call him a personality higher on
the surface, but he actually has like little in jokes
with like one hundred different people. So he is going
out of his way to build these little micro connections
with everyone he works with, and he is loved. And
(23:46):
I honestly worked with so many people like that in
my workplaces. So it's not just about being the loudest.
It's about how you're making other people feel. And we
should all be contributing to work being a funner and
more real place.
Speaker 6 (23:58):
So you might be sitting there thinking what does this
actually mean for me? How can I actually do this
at work, So let's talk about some practical actions.
Speaker 5 (24:07):
So I was thinking, there's sort of like two parts
of this, right, there's you know, you yourself, be interesting
and don't be scared to be your self at work,
and then there's also be interested in other people. So
let's talk about the first one. So when I was
chatting to Sanna from the Vibe team, cameber. She kept saying,
just like, you know, celebrate your freak. We're all freaks.
It's okay to be different. For me, that really is like,
don't be scared to kind of bring your interests and
(24:29):
your stories to work and to be yourself. One interesting
thing I think it's just worth calling out is something
I hear a lot from managers, particularly managers of gen
Z is they're saying, yes, we love the authentic self,
and please bring your authentic self to work. But there
also is a level of professionalism where it's like, don't
(24:51):
treat the workplace like it's your sharehouse. So I do
just want to flag that and say it's not like
we're saying turn up at work and act exactly how
you do with your mates at home. But I do
think it's about like, celebrate your interest don't be afraid
to kind of talk about what you do outside of
work that's interesting and unique about you. The other one
that I think I probably have more tips on is
(25:11):
around how you can kind of put effort into building
connection with other people. So Sin, I really spoke about
this idea of starting small. It's not about going and
organizing some massive social event. It's actually first just taking
an interest in other people. And I would love to
hear some of your tips on this too, Michelle. One
thing that I really love to do was when I
was doing things at work that made me feel uncomfortable
(25:33):
or were a little bit hard. So say, for example,
you presenting in a team meeting, or you know, you
send out that big rap email to a really big
list of people. I would just recognize how that made
me feel, and then when I saw other people also
doing those things, I would actually put the effort into
actually telling them if you thought they did a good job.
So like say someone presents in a team meeting, so
often it will be like that was really good in
(25:53):
our head, and we don't actually go and tell them,
so like take the time to send this Slack message
or have a chat with them after and say like,
I really like this thing that you just did it,
or you know, that was a great rap email.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
That you just sent out.
Speaker 5 (26:03):
Another little tip is just like being interested in people's lives,
so you know, if someone's like, I've got this really
big client presentation coming up in a month and I'm like,
I'm really worried about I'm really working towards it. I
like putting people's little milestones in my calendar just to
remind myself to check in and ask them like, hey,
how did that go. I know that sounds a bit
like over the top, but just do it for the
special people.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
That you want to build a connection with.
Speaker 6 (26:23):
I've never actually done this, but I just saw this
online from a founder that I really admire, Maggie Sellers,
who will also put her account in the show notes.
But she just gave some tips actually around how to
build rapport, and I thought it was a good one.
If you're having meetings with important people, after you finish
the meeting, send yourself an email with the things that
(26:47):
you discussed with them that really stood out, especially if
they're about their personal life, and then make the subject
of the email their name. And then when you see
them next search in your inbox by their name. Remember
the things that you discussed the last time you were
with them, if it was a month ago, three months ago,
and then bring those things up in the next meeting,
and it just demonstrates that you actually were listening and
(27:10):
cared and you enjoyed what they were talking about.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Ah, that's so smart. I've never heard that before. That
would be so amazing. If you're someone who has works with.
Speaker 5 (27:18):
A lot of clients and kind of exit on a
partners as well, that's a don't miss an opportunity to
mean things at work.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
So start a game of thesamplement.
Speaker 5 (27:25):
You know. Again, it's just like back to those small things.
Someone in their team was preparing for a marathon and
they all recorded just like a funny little video of
everyone running on a treadmill and saying congratulations to this person.
I mean, there's so many examples. I think creative agencies are.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
So good at this.
Speaker 5 (27:39):
So it'd actually love to hear from some of the
people listening about things that you guys have done. The
last point I make is this ability to sometimes laugh
at work, and to be able to laugh at yourself
and to laugh at other people when they're funny. Just like,
bring some lightness to work, because it is really hard,
and we spend a lot of time at work. It's
really hard, it can be very serious. But let's sort
(28:02):
of where we can try to bring some of that
lightness and freshness to it. So we know the hardest
part of this is often the inspiration and the examples.
So Michelle and I had an idea. We're going to
be building the biz Vibes Library. This is going to
be a free resource that is going to help to
inspire you and make your lives easier.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
If you trying to bring more vibes to.
Speaker 5 (28:22):
Work, we want you to send us your dms to
this Instagram account and tell us your examples that you've
seen at work. So this is either examples that you've
done yourself or things you've seen other people do to
help bring vibes and personality to work.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
And we're going to send out this ViBe's library in
our newsletter.
Speaker 5 (28:42):
If you're not subscribed to that, the link is in
the show notes, so make sure you're signed up.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Michelle, kick us off with one of your own examples.
Speaker 6 (28:49):
Sorry to toot my own horn, but at Sunroom, one
of the things we did and we have always had
a small company is we would get each member of
our team to do a presentation on their life and
it was always the most wholesome, sweetest eye opening thing
where each member of our team, over like a lunch
(29:10):
period each week, would run us through a PowerPoint like
where they grew up, their families, jobs, hobbies, where they've traveled,
and it was such a nice way to genuinely get
to know people, especially in today's world where there's so
much working from home. Some people might work from home
one hundred percent of the time and so you're not
getting those like coffee catchups or water cooler chats. So
(29:34):
I always loved this and people just surprised us. And
it was this rolling activity that we would do. It
was called like a life story presentation.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
So I thought we could finish up.
Speaker 5 (29:44):
Michelle on a message that they got from Sana, the
vibe expert at Canava, So I sort of asked her,
you know, what would you like people to take away
from this episode, and with so much brightness in her voice,
she said, you know, we've all got it.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
In us to change this. Life is hard.
Speaker 5 (30:00):
Work doesn't need to be so bad for the person
who's sitting there who hates their job.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
I want to inspire you. I want you to know,
you know.
Speaker 5 (30:07):
Hey, I am a freak and that's a good thing,
and you know I can bring that to work. And
she said to me, I want to empower everyone to
be the personality.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Higher and I just thought it was so beautiful. Love
that so much.
Speaker 3 (30:23):
The biggest takeaway from today's episode is that being a
personality higher isn't about being fake or shrinking responsibility, thank god,
It's about combining authentic personality with real contribution. As we've learned,
if all you bring other vibes, you won't last long
in today's workplace. If you want more tips on bringing
personality to work while maintaining productivity, make sure you check
(30:46):
out our biz newsletter this week because we'll be sharing
our Vibes Library. It's a collection of real examples from
real workplaces that showcase exactly how to strike that perfect balance.
And don't forget to follow us on Instagram at biz
by Mama Mia. We post so much on there and
we'd love to hear your thoughts on personality highs and
workplace culture. Please comment or send us a DM. Thank
(31:09):
you so much for listening. I will See you on
Thursday for Biz Inbox, so we answer your biggest workplace
and career dilemmas. See ya two
You're listening to another MIA podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land. We
have recorded this podcast on the Gatagoul people of the
Eur Nation. We pay our respects to their elders past
and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and
Torres Strait Islander cultures.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Hello and Vernoon. Here and I am the host of BIZ,
a podcast that gets your work Live Sorted. And this
summer we are curating your playlist with unmissable episodes full
of hacks, tips and tricks from our top expert guests
and hosts. And if you're looking for more to listen to,
every Mama Mia podcast is curating your summer listening right
across our network. From pop culture to beauty to powerful interviews,
(01:04):
there is something for everyone. There is a link in
our show notes. Hello and welcome to BIZ your Work
Life Sorted. I'm m Vernon and today we're diving into
something that's probably made you fear for your life as
well as in treat you at the same time. It's
the concept of being a personality higher. So the personality
(01:27):
higher is someone who seems to make everything way more
fun that the person who somehow manages to have the
senior leaders wrapped around their little finger, and that the
person in the office that everyone wants to have afterwork
drinks with. So, whether you are that person, or you're
secretly wanted to be that person, or you know this person,
this episode is going to challenge how you think about
(01:49):
personality at work. Our career coaches are Michelle Battisbee who
founded Sunroom, and Sophurst, who runs her own coaching business,
Work Baby, and they're breaking down the real tension between
vibes and productivity.
Speaker 4 (02:03):
God, this is going to piss some people off, but
I'm gonna say it. Personality hires are arguably more important
than people that do actual work. Let me explain. Let
me explain.
Speaker 5 (02:13):
I explain.
Speaker 4 (02:14):
Anyone can do work. Anyone can be a good employee.
Anyone can go and then send an email.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
Anyone can do that.
Speaker 4 (02:21):
It takes a specific type of person to keep the
company culture fun and like funny and keep the office
like in good spirits. And that's where we come in.
That's where personality hires come in. Because I solely got
my corporate job from having a good personality.
Speaker 5 (02:38):
Okay, so you just heard from TikTok creator Daniel Bennett,
who's obviously the personality higher, and he has a very
interesting argument about the role this type of person plays
at work, and that's part of what we're going to
get into today. But first, what is a personality higher
and is it actually a good or a bad thing?
So right now I could genuinely go both ways on
(02:59):
this and I'm a little bit confused.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
So Michelle, can you break this down for us? What
is it?
Speaker 4 (03:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (03:04):
So, a personality high is someone who's typically hired for
their vibe, charisma, enthusiasm, social skills or their humor over
qualifications and technical abilities. So those skills that they do
have can still be amazing in the workplace. They can
(03:24):
make the workplace very positive and just a fun and
happy place to be. I do want to emphasize that
just because they're hired for those softer skills, let's say,
that doesn't mean that they're not competent. And I think
that sometimes the discourse on social media around personality hires
has meant that they don't really have real jobs, and
(03:47):
it's questioned what they actually do. But personality HighRes can
often be the people that go into leadership roles because
they are really good at communicating and they have great adaptability.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Interesting.
Speaker 5 (04:00):
I think there's so much in this because I originally
start when I saw that video, I remember thinking, oh, like,
I sort of want to be the personality higher.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
I remember people at work who were so.
Speaker 5 (04:11):
Funny in meetings and charismatic, and it's like they always
had the ear of the senior leaders.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
They just had this like gravita us almost.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
And I was like, I want to be the personality higher.
And then I started reading some of the comments, and
a lot of people were saying like, no, this is
the person in your university working group who is really
fun to hang out with but then never actually does
their part of the project. And I was like, oh, okay,
so it's actually bad, like these people aren't actually doing
the work.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
But I think it's just an interesting point that you
raise around.
Speaker 5 (04:39):
It's not that they're not competent, it's just that maybe
they're some of those skills in terms of like how
they communicate their presence at work. Maybe that's kind of
like elevating them to these more senior levels.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
I think there's a lot in it, though.
Speaker 6 (04:52):
And I think you make really good points because sometimes
a personality higher might have been hired and there is
a bit of a skills gap, but the hiring manager
believes that they can train that person up. There's growth,
there's potential there, and so I think for some personality hires,
there will be a bit of a steep learning curve
(05:14):
once they enter the workplace and they'll have to work
on that. And in today's world in particular, you're not
going to survive in the work place if you're not delivering.
So I think someone who is a personality higher who
then isn't actually contributing to the organization in their role
and reaching their KPIs, they're not going to survive. But
the same can be said for people at the complete
(05:36):
other end of the spectrum as well. Like if you've
got personality highs over on the left, and you've got
an ace, all star, technically brilliant person over on the right,
but maybe they've got a bit of a bad attitude sometimes,
maybe they have a bit of a negative demeanor. They
still reach their KPIs, but they're not actually that pleasant
(05:58):
to be around. I think that kind of employee could
also see their growth and career advancements be.
Speaker 5 (06:06):
Stifled because it's not just you as an individual delivering
your individual piece of work. It's actually like an organization
is a big collection of people, and it's actually part
of your job to help the whole collection of people
also be good at their job. It's not just about
your little piece. Okay, But you also went out on
your DMS Michelle, What did you get back from the
poll that you put up?
Speaker 6 (06:24):
Yeah, so one of my socials because I was just curious, like,
how many people actually consider themselves to be personality highers.
I mean that could be a completely different conversation, like
are their people out there that were hired because of
their personality as opposed to technical skills? Do they even know? Anyway?
So I went out on my story and I asked,
do you consider yourself a personality higher twenty eight percent
(06:46):
said outright yes, forty percent said partially, and thirty two
percent said no. So the majority of people believe that
their personality played some part. And then I did ask
them a question which was, if you answered yes or partially,
how does your personality show up at work? Which I
(07:06):
think we'll get into a bit later. And then I asked,
if you answered no, do you want to bring more
of your personality to the workplace, and forty six percent
of people said that they do want to bring their
personality the work to the workplace. Others said I like
to keep my personality a secret, and others said I
don't feel safe to bring my personality to work, which
(07:28):
I think is also, you know, something worthy of consideration.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
Oh man, this is so interesting. Okay, so half of
people actually want to have more personality at work. The
piece around feeling safe is really important too, so we'll
get into some of these. It does remind me of
a post it note that I had on my desk
at work and it just said don't be boring, and
that was sort of my reminder to myself, like, bring
your personality to work. Okay, so this episode is more
than just another career trend. It is about personality and
(07:55):
vibes and specifically how to make vibes at work so
you're happier and your job is easier. There is some
science behind why vibe is important, so you know, Also,
the workplace is really changing.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Whether you're a gen z just starting.
Speaker 5 (08:08):
Out, or you're a millennial manager managing a team, or
you're running a business, this episode's for you. Okay, Michelle,
I'm actually very interested to note.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Do you consider yourself to be a personality higher?
Speaker 6 (08:28):
Yes, I think I'm a personality higher. Can you be
a personality higher in your own company that you found?
Speaker 1 (08:35):
Why do you think you're a personality higher?
Speaker 6 (08:37):
Like, I've been given feedback along the way in my
career that's led me to think I'm I can deliver
technically in my area. But I also have been told
that I bring like a positive attitude. I'm enthusiastic. I
try to like lighten the mood in stressful situations and
like remind everyone that this isn't life saving work that
(08:59):
we're doing here.
Speaker 5 (09:00):
Interesting, So yeah, I think where and then part of
this episode is redefining what a personality higher actually is
and it doesn't mean.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
That you're not delivering in doing your job, all right.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
So I mean before starting this episode, I was a
bit conflicted because I sort of wanted to be a
personality higher, but I was also sort of judging them
as being a bit of a joke. So you might
be sitting there thinking the same thing, But there is
something deeper.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
So, Michelle, why.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
Is building rapport and vibes at work actually important?
Speaker 6 (09:27):
I'm still just stuck on what you said, because I
feel like you'd be part personality higher as well, do
you feel like you would be?
Speaker 5 (09:35):
I feel like I wasn't funny enough to be a
personality higher, so I was like, I'm not funny, and
I had a lot of self doubt around that. I
wanted to be the person in the room who was
like bringing it, you know. So I never felt like
I was a personality higher.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
But then I started thinking, well, I wasn't actually that
good at marketing, so was I a personality higher?
Speaker 5 (09:53):
And then I went down a shame spiral of imposter syndrome.
So I'm not going to talk about that anymore.
Speaker 6 (09:59):
You give fun vibes, though, like you bring fun energy
to working hard, which I also think is what you know,
bringing your personality to work can also look like maybe
that's also another way to think about it. Okay, So
why this is important? I think there are many advantages
to being a bit of a personality higher, the first
one being it's a very competitive hiring man market out
(10:21):
there at the moment in particular, so being likable and
showing how you aligned to a company's mission can really
put you ahead of other candidates. So I think it
can help get you in the door. It also can
help if you vibe with a hiring manager. You know,
when you leave an important meeting and you know, I
think that went well because we just clicked, We just gelled,
(10:43):
like maybe there was some banter, there was some back
and forth, maybe you connected on a personal level. I
think that's also a big part to how this can
be a bit of a superpower and why it's important
for people to develop. And a TikTok put this very
well where they were talking about Beer's riz and for
(11:03):
anyone listening, if you don't know what rizz. I didn't
know what riz was until about a year ago, which
I'm ashamed to say because I think I was still
too late. But charisma is riz to gen Z's. I
can't even define it in the right way, which shows
that I'm truly a millennial. But there was a TikTok
talking all about bizriz.
Speaker 7 (11:24):
The number one thing I think I got from two
years at Mackenzie that helps me land a director level
role at twenty three is literally this notion of developing bizriz.
Bizriz is essentially the skill to make senior people, whether
it's your clients or your leaders, to like you to
like working with you, to build a relationship and to
trust you with the work. Once you get someone to
like you, you essentially become an EPO baby. You get
(11:46):
advantaged opportunities and access to new projects, new jobs so much.
Speaker 6 (11:51):
And it really broke down how it helps you build
rapport and build relationships with senior managers. And this is
what I love about gen Z and their approach to
the workforce. It just feels a little bit more casual
and they're not really scared of hierarchy or traditional power
roles in the way I think some of the older
(12:14):
generations were. And this TikTok goes on to remind people
that your CEO or the head of your department is
someone's dad, someone's uncle, brother, sister, mother, auntie, and they're
going home and probably being paid out by the people
around the table with them, and they live lives and
have hobbies and have challenges. So being able to unearth
(12:36):
some of that and remind yourself of that is a
great way to also develop this in the workplace.
Speaker 7 (12:41):
These really senior leaders were literally somebody's dad or uncle,
and no matter how intimidating they seemed, sitting across from
you in the boardroom. Later that night, they would probably
sit across the dinner table from their gen z kid
who would literally be cringing at them for I don't know,
doing something kind of silly, and then you realize, I
don't know, like Mike, the CFO at this huge bank
(13:02):
is actually just your middle school friend Sam's dad who
would bring watermelon to the soccer practice. And that mindset
shift made it so much easier for me to be
confident and to be able to talk to them as
if they were also people, which obviously they are. No
matter how senior the man, at the end of the day,
they are still just someone's chuggy uncle, You'll.
Speaker 5 (13:20):
Be There's a healthy side to that in not putting
these senior leaders on this huge pedestal and just realizing, like, hey,
everyone's kind of human. So what about the fact Michelle though,
when it comes to stuff like building rapport and connecting
with people at work, that it is easier for some
people than it is for others. Like I know some
people and a lot of young people that I talk
to they really struggle with this. So is vibe something
(13:43):
you're just born with or is it something that you
can learn? Yeah?
Speaker 6 (13:46):
I love this question because I feel like both of
us have done some unlearning as we've researched this topic.
And my un learning was I did think it was
the kind of thing you were just born with, like
a bit of an X factor, those people that just
have those contagious personalities where they're always on, always happy,
always bubbly and positive. But there's an amazing TikTok from
(14:09):
Hannah gets Hired that taught me a lot, and she
shared a stat It was from a Princeton study, and
it showed that eighty two percent of how people perceive
you come down to one trait.
Speaker 8 (14:23):
You know, those people that are just so contagious to
be around. It feels like everybody likes them, They can
do no wrong. You can actually like hack your way
into being that person with just minor changes to the
way that you.
Speaker 7 (14:34):
Talk to other people.
Speaker 8 (14:35):
So this characteristic that Princeton research founds accounts for eighty
two percent of how other people perceive you is called charisma.
And what sets charisma apart from other personality traits is
that you're not born with it. It's actually something that
you can practice and grow and develop over time.
Speaker 6 (14:53):
And she goes on to explain that you can kind
of hack your way to being a bit more charismatic,
because charisma is made up of two things, those things
being warmth and competence, and apparently most people over index
on one or the other. So maybe you're really warm
and bubbly but you don't command that respect, or perhaps
(15:14):
you're really competent, but you're super blunt, straight shooting, and
you just come off like a bit of an asshole.
And what I also loved about this was the tips
she gives to then dial up warmth or competence are
really really simple, Like, these aren't groundbreaking things, and you
can literally just start doing this today. So if you
(15:35):
feel like you're the sort of person that needs to
dial up on the warmth, it's as simple as nodding
along when someone's talking, offering a smile, leaning in, Or
if you're this sort of person who feels like you
need to dial up competence, just speaking with a little
bit more confidence, maybe slowing it down or speeding it up,
whatever you think is more, you know the thing that
(15:55):
you're needing to work on, and speaking with down tones
as opposed to upward inflections. I think it was I
think I do the upward speaking, I put think I've
done it just then, but yeah, I found it fascinating.
Speaker 5 (16:08):
Yeah, I think it's really interesting that you do think
it's something that you're born with or you think it's
really hard, but maybe there's some small changes that we
can start to adopt.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
What else did you get from your DM's Michelle?
Speaker 6 (16:18):
Okay, So one of the other questions that I ask
in my DMS was how does your personality show up
in the workplace? So I think some of these examples
could be really good for just getting across how simple
it may be. I'd say I have the skills, but
vibe is executing regardless of it being in my skill set.
With enthusiasm, I improve the workplace culture, leading through tough
(16:42):
client conbos and supporting my team. Positivity, enthusiasm, and a
hunger to learn. I always share a smile. I boost
the spirits of others by encouraging them, and I organize
social events. Oh, this one's good. I'm really good at
reading the room, and I understand what makes people tick
and I craft comms accordingly. I always stay positive and
(17:06):
up for the challenge. I'm happy to try things even
if I'm not one hundred percent sure I've been told
my X factor is brightness and freshness in a very
corporate and traditional environment.
Speaker 5 (17:17):
Yeah, I think there's some really interesting stuff in that, Michelle,
because it's like, yes, you can have some of these
behaviors that make you come across as warm when you're
talking to people, but it's actually way more than that, right,
So a lot of the stuff I'm hearing coming through
is things like, you know, the ability to say positive
when stuff gets hard, or this like freshness that you're
bringing to work, thoughtfulness around how you're making other people feel,
(17:38):
the impact you're having on other people. So we wanted
to actually speak to a real life personality higher So
we've spoken to someone who works on an actual Vibes
team and yes, that is real because it says so on.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
LinkedIn that's coming up after this.
Speaker 6 (17:59):
So did you know there are companies with whole departments
dead headed to vibe. When I was at Bumble, we
had a role that was called Curator of Vibes. The
people that held that role genuinely were the vibe as people.
They kept things fresh, positive, bright. But I think it's
important to recognize that you don't need to have dedicated
(18:20):
roles or departments to have positive attitudes, personality, fun, camaraderie
existing in an organization. So so you've got up with
Sana from Camber, who's in the vibe team aka workplace Experiences.
Speaker 9 (18:38):
Firstly, I think every company should have a vibe team,
but until then, I think everybody can be their own
vibe team. Really, it can be pretty overwhelming the thought
of that, but I think it's important to just start small.
I think the most iconic vibe people I've known in
my life, and the most iconic personality highs if you will,
(19:01):
are the people who are genuine and come to work
and want to make genuine connections with people. So I
recommend start small. You know, creating a vibe doesn't mean
like planning huge events. It's about making people feel like
connected and getting to know people, ask real questions, celebrate
(19:23):
people's wins, and just bring your personality to work. I
think that's super key, Like authenticity. Really, just make work
feel like human, you know, and the vibe will just
naturally follow. Work is hard. Work can be a little
boring and monotonous, and I think bringing joy to your
(19:44):
co workers live in just a little freaky weird way
is the cherry on top of the day. I find
even when I'm being vibed, I feel like it puts
a little pep in my steps, and it makes me
want to do a better job, Like I feel more
enthusiastic essentially. So I think it's so important that everybody
(20:10):
is their own workplaces. Vibe team just makes life more
fun and interesting and weird.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
It's quite a privileged position that a company is in
to be able to high an entire ViBe's team.
Speaker 5 (20:22):
But the things that I spoke about with her are
relevant for anyone, whether you're an individual small business, So
you know, you can take these principles.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
First of all, I just want to say she is
such a vibe. So after the conversation, I was like
this pumping the air.
Speaker 5 (20:37):
And she is just like giving energy. She's giving vibe.
There's two really important things that came out of the conversation,
and the first is around this idea of the personality
higher is part of this anti fake movement that we're seeing,
and this is really a longing that we all have
to just be a bit more real at work. We're
(20:58):
just a bit over the fakeness, the like corporate speak
and the bullshit of it all. And you know, I
even think to some of the accounts that I love following.
One of them is the Aussie Corporate and the other
is Corporate Sween. And if you don't know these accounts
on TikTok and Instagram, we're going to put them in
the show notes. They are very funny and it's just
(21:18):
this like parody satire, taking the piss out of how
we all act at work.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
And they are brilliant.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
But I think you know, the reason we love these
meme accounts is we just have this craving to be
a bit more human and a bit more real. And
I think people think the personality higher is about being
the loudest, it's the most extroverted, it's the funniest, but
it's actually not. It's just about being the uest you,
and it's about not being scared to be your real
(21:44):
self and to just be a bit more genuine at work.
That really shifted my kind of perception and then the
other thing that really came through, So yes, bring yourself
to work and be real. But then also it's not
just about being the USU. It's about how you as
an individual is bringing out the best in the collective. Right,
So They have this thing in onboarding at Canvas. Part
(22:06):
of their onboarding is how to vibe, and they have
a line that says.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
When not the vibe, you're the vibe. Everyone has this
in them and we all contribute to the vibe. It's
about like, what are you.
Speaker 5 (22:17):
Doing to celebrate the uniqueness and awesomeness in everyone else
the work with. If you take the flip side of that,
it's like, what might you be doing that's actually dragging
other people down in the way that you're kind of
showing up and acting at work? And there's this expression
there's two types of people at work. There's drains and
there's radiators. And drains are the people that are like
(22:37):
taking the energy out of the room. And the radiators
the ones that like they're just like radiating warmth, reflecting
back the best and bringing out the best in other people.
You know, Drains take and radiators give. I think about
that so much in reflecting on my own work experiences,
Like when stuff got really hard, it was almost this
memurification of the experience we were all having that got
(22:59):
me through. So I think about the hardest projects where
like stuff just gets dark sometimes everyone's working so hard,
you're dealing with so many problems, and then someone will
like say something in a meeting and then everyone starts,
you know, repeating this little tagline, and then someone will
take the effort to go and put it on a
T shirt and like that's the stuff that actually gets
you through these shared experiences that are actually bringing us together.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
She did tell a story that I loved as well.
Speaker 5 (23:23):
Which is, you know, back to that point around, it's
not just about being the most extroverted and the funniest.
Shush said, there's a software engineer who's like very quiet,
and you would not call him a personality higher on
the surface, but he actually has like little in jokes
with like one hundred different people. So he is going
out of his way to build these little micro connections
with everyone he works with, and he is loved. And
(23:46):
I honestly worked with so many people like that in
my workplaces. So it's not just about being the loudest.
It's about how you're making other people feel. And we
should all be contributing to work being a funner and
more real place.
Speaker 6 (23:58):
So you might be sitting there thinking what does this
actually mean for me? How can I actually do this
at work, So let's talk about some practical actions.
Speaker 5 (24:07):
So I was thinking, there's sort of like two parts
of this, right, there's you know, you yourself, be interesting
and don't be scared to be your self at work,
and then there's also be interested in other people. So
let's talk about the first one. So when I was
chatting to Sanna from the Vibe team, cameber. She kept saying,
just like, you know, celebrate your freak. We're all freaks.
It's okay to be different. For me, that really is like,
don't be scared to kind of bring your interests and
(24:29):
your stories to work and to be yourself. One interesting
thing I think it's just worth calling out is something
I hear a lot from managers, particularly managers of gen
Z is they're saying, yes, we love the authentic self,
and please bring your authentic self to work. But there
also is a level of professionalism where it's like, don't
(24:51):
treat the workplace like it's your sharehouse. So I do
just want to flag that and say it's not like
we're saying turn up at work and act exactly how
you do with your mates at home. But I do
think it's about like, celebrate your interest don't be afraid
to kind of talk about what you do outside of
work that's interesting and unique about you. The other one
that I think I probably have more tips on is
(25:11):
around how you can kind of put effort into building
connection with other people. So Sin, I really spoke about
this idea of starting small. It's not about going and
organizing some massive social event. It's actually first just taking
an interest in other people. And I would love to
hear some of your tips on this too, Michelle. One
thing that I really love to do was when I
was doing things at work that made me feel uncomfortable
(25:33):
or were a little bit hard. So say, for example,
you presenting in a team meeting, or you know, you
send out that big rap email to a really big
list of people. I would just recognize how that made
me feel, and then when I saw other people also
doing those things, I would actually put the effort into
actually telling them if you thought they did a good job.
So like say someone presents in a team meeting, so
often it will be like that was really good in
(25:53):
our head, and we don't actually go and tell them,
so like take the time to send this Slack message
or have a chat with them after and say like,
I really like this thing that you just did it,
or you know, that was a great rap email.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
That you just sent out.
Speaker 5 (26:03):
Another little tip is just like being interested in people's lives,
so you know, if someone's like, I've got this really
big client presentation coming up in a month and I'm like,
I'm really worried about I'm really working towards it. I
like putting people's little milestones in my calendar just to
remind myself to check in and ask them like, hey,
how did that go. I know that sounds a bit
like over the top, but just do it for the
special people.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
That you want to build a connection with.
Speaker 6 (26:23):
I've never actually done this, but I just saw this
online from a founder that I really admire, Maggie Sellers,
who will also put her account in the show notes.
But she just gave some tips actually around how to
build rapport, and I thought it was a good one.
If you're having meetings with important people, after you finish
the meeting, send yourself an email with the things that
(26:47):
you discussed with them that really stood out, especially if
they're about their personal life, and then make the subject
of the email their name. And then when you see
them next search in your inbox by their name. Remember
the things that you discussed the last time you were
with them, if it was a month ago, three months ago,
and then bring those things up in the next meeting,
and it just demonstrates that you actually were listening and
(27:10):
cared and you enjoyed what they were talking about.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Ah, that's so smart. I've never heard that before. That
would be so amazing. If you're someone who has works with.
Speaker 5 (27:18):
A lot of clients and kind of exit on a
partners as well, that's a don't miss an opportunity to
mean things at work.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
So start a game of thesamplement.
Speaker 5 (27:25):
You know. Again, it's just like back to those small things.
Someone in their team was preparing for a marathon and
they all recorded just like a funny little video of
everyone running on a treadmill and saying congratulations to this person.
I mean, there's so many examples. I think creative agencies are.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
So good at this.
Speaker 5 (27:39):
So it'd actually love to hear from some of the
people listening about things that you guys have done. The
last point I make is this ability to sometimes laugh
at work, and to be able to laugh at yourself
and to laugh at other people when they're funny. Just like,
bring some lightness to work, because it is really hard,
and we spend a lot of time at work. It's
really hard, it can be very serious. But let's sort
(28:02):
of where we can try to bring some of that
lightness and freshness to it. So we know the hardest
part of this is often the inspiration and the examples.
So Michelle and I had an idea. We're going to
be building the biz Vibes Library. This is going to
be a free resource that is going to help to
inspire you and make your lives easier.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
If you trying to bring more vibes to.
Speaker 5 (28:22):
Work, we want you to send us your dms to
this Instagram account and tell us your examples that you've
seen at work. So this is either examples that you've
done yourself or things you've seen other people do to
help bring vibes and personality to work.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
And we're going to send out this ViBe's library in
our newsletter.
Speaker 5 (28:42):
If you're not subscribed to that, the link is in
the show notes, so make sure you're signed up.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Michelle, kick us off with one of your own examples.
Speaker 6 (28:49):
Sorry to toot my own horn, but at Sunroom, one
of the things we did and we have always had
a small company is we would get each member of
our team to do a presentation on their life and
it was always the most wholesome, sweetest eye opening thing
where each member of our team, over like a lunch
(29:10):
period each week, would run us through a PowerPoint like
where they grew up, their families, jobs, hobbies, where they've traveled,
and it was such a nice way to genuinely get
to know people, especially in today's world where there's so
much working from home. Some people might work from home
one hundred percent of the time and so you're not
getting those like coffee catchups or water cooler chats. So
(29:34):
I always loved this and people just surprised us. And
it was this rolling activity that we would do. It
was called like a life story presentation.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
So I thought we could finish up.
Speaker 5 (29:44):
Michelle on a message that they got from Sana, the
vibe expert at Canava, So I sort of asked her,
you know, what would you like people to take away
from this episode, and with so much brightness in her voice,
she said, you know, we've all got it.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
In us to change this. Life is hard.
Speaker 5 (30:00):
Work doesn't need to be so bad for the person
who's sitting there who hates their job.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
I want to inspire you. I want you to know,
you know.
Speaker 5 (30:07):
Hey, I am a freak and that's a good thing,
and you know I can bring that to work. And
she said to me, I want to empower everyone to
be the personality.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Higher and I just thought it was so beautiful. Love
that so much.
Speaker 3 (30:23):
The biggest takeaway from today's episode is that being a
personality higher isn't about being fake or shrinking responsibility, thank god,
It's about combining authentic personality with real contribution. As we've learned,
if all you bring other vibes, you won't last long
in today's workplace. If you want more tips on bringing
personality to work while maintaining productivity, make sure you check
(30:46):
out our biz newsletter this week because we'll be sharing
our Vibes Library. It's a collection of real examples from
real workplaces that showcase exactly how to strike that perfect balance.
And don't forget to follow us on Instagram at biz
by Mama Mia. We post so much on there and
we'd love to hear your thoughts on personality highs and
workplace culture. Please comment or send us a DM. Thank
(31:09):
you so much for listening. I will See you on
Thursday for Biz Inbox, so we answer your biggest workplace
and career dilemmas. See ya two
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