November 28, 2024 • 44 mins
If you've watched Gladiator II or you just love Paul Mescal, Joseph Quinn or Pedro Pascal and need someone to make sense of your feelings, then this episode of The Spill is what you need.
These are unfiltered thoughts on Ridley Scott's epic action adventure, and from Paul Mescal and Denzel Washington's changing accents (and teeth) to the one question that infuriated the film’s creatives, nothing is off limits.
This is a safe place to talk about the best and worst moments from Gladiator II.
THE END BITS
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Listen to The Spill: A Brutally Honest Review Of Nobody Wants This, here.
Listen to The Spill: A Brutally Honest Review Of The Perfect Couple here.
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CREDITS
Hosts: Laura Brodnik & Em Vernem
Executive Producer: Kimberley Braddish
Audio Producer: Scott Stronach
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
So much.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
MoMA Maya acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
that this podcast is recorded on. Did you love the
episode we did on Paul Mescal about how he supposedly
runs away from his one night stance. That wasn't all
we talked about, but let's be real, it was the
most absurd part of it. We thought we'd share an
episode of mum MIA's daily celebrity podcast, This Spill, because
(00:36):
they did a brutally honest review of Paul's new movie
Gladiator two. It's not just Paul's movie, of course, there
are other big names in it too, like Pedro Pascal
and Denzil Washington, but it is being called Paul Mescal's
movie by all the young, cool people like us. You're
about to hear about all the best and worst moments
from Gladiator too, and also an acknowledgment of Russell Crow's
(00:59):
hurt feelings for not being included. Enjoy from MoMA Mia.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Welcome to the Spill, your daily pop culture fix. I'm
m Burnham and I'm Laura Brednick Hand. On today's show,
get your horses and carriages out because we're diving deep
back into the BC time. Also AD unclear, it's AD.
We're going back to the Roman Empire where Paul Mescal
(01:27):
killed everyone. We are going to be doing much anticipated,
brutally honest review of Gladiator too.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Yes, and we can watch us always in there if
you're not across our brilliant honest reviews, they are where
we let you the audience know they're coming. So you
know whichever movie or TV show that we're going to
be having a passionate debate about, and it's really just
a space for us to give out honest thoughts, behind
the scenes stories really go deep into the core of
this thing that has we have been obsessing over us
(01:56):
since we saw it. And obviously spoiler alert, we're going
to be talking about the ending. So we've given you.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
A full week, which we are very kind people, We'll
give you a week to watch it. But yeah, spoilers.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Yes, I mean Paul Meskal said he wanted people to
see this in cinemas and if you've disappointed Paul, I'm
just gonna say that's on you.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
You disappointed us.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So Gladiator two with what we're here today to discuss. So,
first of all, life to ask you a very important question.
You've seen Gladiator the original?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yes? But I saw the original after it was announced? Yes,
but you went did your home or I didn't know
where you went to the premiere? Many did not bes
a mess, Russell Crow because.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
As we were sitting in the premiere and Paul Mescale
had just come out on stage, and it was clapping
and the lights were about to go down, and that
is when a number of people around me leaned over
and whispered, what.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Is Gladiator the first one about? Right? You can't be
Australian and not know what Gladiator is.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Well, just in case some of our listeners are also
in that boat that they just have no idea where
the original movie is. No, no, your points did.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
I was in that boat until like a month ago.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I just thought that everyone was sitting in the cinema
about to watch this movie. And it's fair enough that
you hadn't watched the first one if that was your choice,
and that's the piece you'd made with what over God
that you subscribed to. However, it's a weird thing to
start worrying about it as the lights go down. So
just in case anyone else is in that boat. Gladiator
came out in the year two thousand.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
You've had twenty four years to watch it.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, time is it digging historical epic drama directed by
Ridley Scott. It was a huge success when it came
out in the year two thousand. It was actually the
second highest grossing film of the year. It received almost
universal critical and fam acclaim. Everyone was basically saying, this
is the best movie we've ever seen. It also went
(03:38):
on to win five Academy Awards, including the very coveted
Best Picture and also Best Actor for young Russell.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Crowe, Ah, Little Hotty and.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
The most Oscars I believe one of any movie that year.
So a real clean sweep across the board. So in
the original movie, Russell Crowe plays a Roman general called
Maximus who is betrayed.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I won't get into the backstory. It's you know, it'siler
last twenty four Yes, spoilers, classic guy staff betrayal, revenge.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
You know man is Megan Man killing other Mega men? Yeah,
men don't know how to work with their feelings. And
it said they go on epic quest to you know,
take down their enemy Barton. So Russell Crowe is you know,
Russell Crowe, Maximus, they're.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
All very entertain it's Russell and Paul.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Yeah, we're gonna be calling them Russell and Paul henceforth
instead of their character names. So Russell Crowe reduced to slavery,
becomes a gladiator and rises through the ranks of the arena,
and spoiler Rolert because it's very crucial to Gladiator two,
he dies at the end, which brings.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Us to he had a good run? Did I think
he did? I guess he died trying to like save
his feet for a purpose, something greater than him as
a man.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Any of us can ask for. I meant, I don't
want that to be me.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
No, I would never die for anyone.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
I wouldn't if anyone wouldn't die for you, wouldn't I
Kim our producer. I'm just saying that now.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
But speaking of Kim our producer, So you're saying this,
this is a recap of Gladiator one, because okay, you
do kind of have to have a sense of Gladiator
one before you watch Gladiator two. However, I was sitting
between our video producer Julian and our producer Kim. Both
have watched Gladiator, both had no idea what was going on.
The amount of questions I got from these two people
(05:16):
was insane.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
People asking me questions in the movie quite stresses me
out because I'm like, please hold questions to the end.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
First of all, no talking during the movie. You're interrupting
me watching men kill themselves.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Second of all, I hate it when like, I guess
this is different, because they could be like, is that
the guy from the first movie, and you can be like, no,
shut up.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
But it's more so when I want to see like
one hundred years old.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
There's so many movies I go to and listen to
a brand new story, and like a friend or whoever
I'm with from work will lean over and say, what's
happening here? I'm like, we have the same information. We're
watching the same movie.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
My mom does that all like opening credit. Yeah, She'll
be like, why are we at the beach? I'm like, Mom,
this is literally the first thing. I don't know why
they're gonna tell us. Okay, now we put that gripe
out there.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
We had to get that's just a love letter to
all of our friends and family not to talk to
us in the movies. So basically, Gladiator two takes place
many many years, like well over a decade after Gladiator one.
And we know this because the son of Maximum Lucius,
Lucius was a child in the first movie, and now
he's a grown up, buff, adult man in the form
(06:16):
of Paul Mescal looking very hot. It must be said
and will be said many times throughout this podcast.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
So that is the biggest spoiler in the entire film.
I think people knew that growing in, right, Yeah, I
knew it, But that's because, like we're Gladiator fans, there
are some people in the cinema, Kim, who were like,
what's going on? Who was that?
Speaker 1 (06:34):
So after Maximus was killed, Lucius was like spirited away
secretly by his mother Lucilla, played by Connie Nielsen, who
is reprising her role from the first movie as Maximus's lover.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Can we talk about some low brow rumors for a second.
Oh sure. I was watching an interview when they were
doing the press junket with Paul Mescal and Fred Hegenjer,
and the interviewer asked Paul if Russell Crowe had called
him and like given him some tips, and Paul straight
away was like, no, I haven't talked to Russell Crowe,
Like I haven't talked to him at all, and I
was like, knowing what we know about Russell Crowe, he's
(07:09):
an angry man. It has to be said. He would
agree with that. He would agree with that. I Oh,
I feel bad for Paul, But you know what, this
movie was great, and I just wish I just feel
like if Russell just gave him like a few like tips,
or like had like a few little cameo roles like
I think that could have just been like the perfect movie.
It was a great movie. I think that could have
(07:30):
made it perfect.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Can I tell you a rumor that I think an
unfounded and unfounded accusation it must be said around why
there might be bad blood between Paul Mescal and Russell Crowe,
a rumor that we are starting here on this very podcast.
I mean, the bad blood. This one's been around for
a while. I mean, when you have a blockbuster movie
like that, of course everyone starts saying afterwards, after one
of the oscars have made that much money, sequel, what
(07:52):
do we do next? And so Ridley Scott and the
team behind the first Gladiator movie were in talks for
a long time to try and get a sequel up
much sooner than twenty years but Russell Crowe well, allegedly
again massive. Allegedly, Russell Crowe had thought he could probably
come back because the biggest role of his career at
this point.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
How did he think he'd come back he died?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Well, apparently he favored a fantasy element in bringing Maximus
back to life. But the studio were the ones who
were like, no, it's not we can't bring you back
to life in any kind of way. And they were
the ones who were really pushing on having his son
take on the main storyline because they were like, that kid,
what happened to him? Surely he grows up to be
(08:33):
a little mini Russell Crowe when he cast a hot
young actor done.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Something like a faster situation. Do you know where he
appears in the stars and he's like Lucius looked to
the sky, I am always with to you and he's like, wait,
you're my dad. I thought you were just some idol.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
I liked It's funny because they kept having all these
almost like ghostly moments rut the scene where Maximus aka
Russell Crowe was meant to be there, like did you
see how like the wind swept some of the gradd
They tried.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
So hard to make it look like Russell was there,
and we knew he wasn't there. Well, that scene right
at the end where he's like stroking some flowers, like
a field of flowers, and he was stroking the gravel
where his father died. My god, I wonder whose hand
that was. I wonder how much I got paid.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
You know, to be Russell Crowe's hand. So that all happened. Okay,
back to the original movie. So yeah, it was a
little fun segue rap Russell Ckroe.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
He's still alive. But is his career? I don't know. No,
it's fine, it's fine, it's fine.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
I once bumped into Russell crow at a premiere and
because of whoy we're standing our faces smashed together and
our noses touched, and that's beautiful. And he looked angry
at me, but he looked angrier at all the people
around us who were there to support his movie. So okay,
just an angry man.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
So it starts off with Paul feeding some chickens, right,
He's like in his beautiful country home with his beautiful wife,
his hot hot were the most good looking people in
all of the land, probably in that entire century. Everyone
who looks at them, just can't stop staring because you
know what, they've got vineers, they've got great they've got
great skin, they're muscly, they're.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
They're both warriors too, two sexy warriors who fell in
love and got married.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I don't have a single nick on them until we'll
get there. We'll get to the next But they're living
in this place called Numidia. It's a place around Rome,
and it's during the time where the Romans wanted to
take over every village, town, country city around them because
they wanted to be the ultimate ultimate city. So I
think Numidia was the last one that Rome had to
(10:31):
take over. So Paul's like, got the boys together, we
got to get ready. We also find out that he's
somewhat a prominent figure in his hometown army. He gives
like a lot of speeches. He's like, what we do
we do together, and we do it to fight for Numidia.
And everyone's like, fuck yeah. I'd be like pissing myself
because I'd be so scared. I don't have time to
(10:52):
listen to this. I'm like, can we all just watch
what's happening? These ships are coming so fast. They've got
like I don't know. They probably had some motors back there.
They were going very fast, really fast. And also like,
I don't know how they got their aim so good,
Like with all the bombs and the like catapults, Like
how could they aim so well when they do the
training soldiers. Yeah, but they'd had no telescopes. I was
(11:14):
just very stressful. So when I saw the ships, I
was like, Ah, this is dumb. You think you can
fight this massive land of people while you're coming on
your little rickety boat. And you were wrong. I was
wrong because you know what, Then I saw Pedro Pascal,
and I was like, no one's safe here. The minute
I see Pedro Pascal, he did one of those things
where like he sees his soldiers fighting and trying to
(11:34):
get up a ladder and he's like, oh, I have
to do it myself, and he just like pushes everyone
away and he's like, I'll get up there. He gets
up there, he kills some prominent people are my prominent.
I mean Paul's.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Wife, Paul's hot wife. That was actually a very sad moment.
A lot of moments in this movie are very cheesy
and silly, especially it has to be a lot of
the deaths because some of them as the movie goes along,
some of them get a bit comical.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
We'll get to it shucks.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
But Paul Muscal's wife I thought was quite sad because
they make eye contact.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
Everyone around them is dying.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
And then that arrow just like pierces her heart and
she looks so shocked, and then she just falls into
the water. And then they have almost like a dream
sequence where you see, you know the legend that you
get when you pass away, you get rowed across the
river sticks by the ferryman, and that's what Paul was
seeing as his wife got onto the faeryom was rowed away,
which means she died.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Because he got knocked out as well, so he was
having that dream. And then he wakes up on the
beach like the soldiers pulled him on to shore, and
he sees his wife's body floating in the ocean, and
he goes to run towards her. I don't know how
he got there so fast, because I thought it was
a riptid because he was going back and forth. But
he gets there eventually, and then he does like this
big sob and.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
Then we I thought it was he can see that
he wants to bury her, but he knows the soldiers
are coming to take him, so he does that really
beautiful thing where he just tries to pull as much
as the arrow out of her heart and then pushes
her ount to the ocean because it's obviously He's like,
I can't do anything, but I don't want my wife's
body floating with an arrow sticking out of it, So
all I can do is pull it out and just
push her, and he keeps the arrow.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Yeah, the arrow is like a little motif of a
reminder of his wife throughout the entire film. Oh yeah,
I was quite much.
Speaker 4 (13:05):
Yeah, it is an art choosing gladiators, they're usually prisoners
of war.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
I claim this city for the glory of Rome.
Speaker 4 (13:25):
You have something in you wait, never let it go.
It will carry you to quatness.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Okay, So that was like probably the saddest part. Oh
there was a few sad parts, but that was like
the big sad one where we're like, oh shit, this
is real. We then find out that Pedro Pascal is
the general of the Roman Army. He doesn't seem to
crash hot about his job. It just seems like something
he's got to do. He's trying to quite quit pay
the bills. He's trying to quite quit not conquer any
(13:59):
more countries, but no one will let him. He did
something really interesting where when he claims the land, he
seems so not disinterested but ashamed almost, And that's I
think where we get the first clear said Pedro Pascal
might sort of be a different character than what we
think he is.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Yeah, because he set it through the eyes of poor Mescal.
He is seen to be like this vicious killer, and
I guess you know, he was leading the army that
killed his wife and his friends. But what we see
about acacious Pedro Pascal's character is that he is a
soldier and a general who thrives off defending Rome and defending.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
They have the best character development in the entire film. Yeah,
he really because you see him in this impossible situation.
And then now he's because no one's actually attacking Rome
because they hold all the armies in land and all
that sort of stuff. Now, the two emperors geta played
by Joseph Quinn and Emperor karro Kella played by a
good friend Fred, basically just thirsty for more power and
(14:54):
more land. A young men who don't know anything different.
They've had everything handed to them on a silver pladdle, literally,
and now they're only getting their only form of entertainment
because they don't have TVs back there. They'd hate the spill.
They'd have no idea what we're talking about. Yeah, the
only form of entertainment they have is to watch men
kill each other, and they are thriving off.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
It and sending a Casius out to all these different
places to conquer, where he's like, I just want to
be at home with my wife. Let's talk about the
Empress for a second, because they were very well done
and as.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Scary they were because they.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Have that thing, like we were saying when we did
our little review of this on a previous episode, is
that they have that thing is that they're entertaining to watch.
But they're also like I have like a deep hatred
for them, and I think that's very hard because to
hate a character, you also have to see them as
like fully formed people. And I really could just see
these two spoiled, awful men who were just being brought
up with immense power and privilege, no idea what to
(15:46):
do with it, and instead they weren't even that power hungry.
They were to extent, but they actually cared more about
entertainment and being really sadistic.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
And they wanted people to take them seriously. It reminded
me so much of Jeoffrey and Game of Throne had
that same character one hundred percent. And I think we
talked about in the last episode in such a dangerous
villain because they don't kill out of hatred, they kill
out of joy. Yeah, one hundred percent. They're just completely unhinged,
like no one is safe, Like anytime they feel like
(16:14):
someone's betrayed them, or they think someone's making fun of them,
or they think someone's on their side, just immediately killed.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
So Ridley Scott described the characters as damaged goods from birth,
and this is the wildest thing I've ever heard. So
Apparently Joseph Quinn, who plays guitar, said that he was
being really careful not to soil Joaquin Phoenix's performance in
the original movie, who was the villain, and so he
didn't look to him. Instead, he took inspiration from Philip
(16:40):
Simoor Hoffman's villain in Mission Impossible three one of your favors,
I'm sure, and also Gary Oldman's character from the Fifth Element.
But Ridley Scott has said that the two evil Emperors
are actually based well, one of their inspirations, I feel like.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
You're gonna drop a troop bomb right now, are based
on the cartoon Beavis and butt Head. No you can't
take me, but you cannot take my bumbhole. I am
the Great Corn And once you hear it, oh my god,
you can't unsee it. He watched Bea.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
So it ran from nineteen ninety three to twenty eleven,
like it went for so long, and it was basically
about these like really dumb teenagers and all the crazy,
ridiculous antiques.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
They get, but you love them.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
It was like the epitome of like dumb humor. Yeah,
oh my god, and how they each other up and everything. Literally,
this whole epic dramatic story is based on Beavis and
butt Head.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
And it was, yeah, their whole thing, and they're like obsession,
Like I think my favorite scene in the whole movie
was them calling in Paul to watch him fight. Yes,
So what we just skipped over was like all the
strong men from Pedro Pascal from the place that he
just kind of violently murdered all the survivors and the
(17:55):
strong men were taken prisoner back to Rome to be
sold as gladiators. The person who controls the gladiators and
owns them as Denzel Washington, very sexy men. Yes, everyone
is really sexy in this movie and have great tea.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Even there being evil, campy, ridiculous, Like Denzel Washington was like,
it's so funny because everyone feels a bit like they're
in a different movie, but it all kind of works,
so it actually.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
It feels like they're in a different movie because they
all kept their accents. Yeah, everyone kept their own accents.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
Everyone's like, we're all in Rome, but we all apparently
grew up in different places and we will not address it.
Paul Mescale feels like he's in a limited drama series.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Yeah, what's going on? And I do well.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Apparently Ridley Scott cast him after he watched Normal People
because he was looking for a comfort show. I love
that Ridley Scott watched that show before you did. He's
like became a Normal People fan before you because you.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Haven't called Normal People a comfort show.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Deeply.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Yeah, I was like, oh my god, Ridley, please, I
can give you much better. You're clearly not on something.
You're a woman struggling Forella.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
And he was like, oh, that man's interesting. There was
many people up for the role. One of them was
Austin Butler, and I'm just glad that didn't happen because
he's such a method actor. He would have tried to
like fight actual gladiators and he would be killed.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Find him in the zoo just trying to slay.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
All the other monkeys have like taken him out because like,
I think you could take Austin Butler.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
Yeah, it can't be a method actor. I'm glad it
was Paul. Also, we forget that they filmed this really
early on, yeah, because I forgot that, like he did
all of the other stuff that's come out, like after
some and things like after Gladiator. Yeah. And it's crazy
how he probably filmed all of this with like no
press because straight after normal people. It was during COVID,
so no one really knew him. He had time to
(19:29):
put his Instagram on private, he did all of this stuff.
He only has like two hundred thousand followers, and then
like imagine making a movie where no one really cares
about and then suddenly everyone suddenly cares and the premiere
is just ten times bigger than I don't imagine.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
It's the sequel too, of the biggest movies in the world.
It's funny because Ridley it's like, oh yeah, I jumped
on the zoom with Paul and gave him the role
after he saw him with normal people. And I'm just
imagine how that conversation went. Is like Ridley Scott saying, so,
do you want to be in Gladiator too? And Paul
going yeah, all right then and look it worked out.
And then Pedro Pascal, I think he's in Gladiator. He's
in the Gladiator that the film. Pascal's like, shut up,
(20:04):
I'm the Gladiator. He's in the movie that the Gladiator
team want us think we're seeing, which is a very
pristie drama, but very you know, based on history and
character development all those things. And then Denzel Washington isn't
a Ryan Murphy TV show camp, crazy over the top,
having the time of his life playing a villain, And
somehow all these men it just works.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
It just works, and somehow Denzel Washington is still best.
Probably he's probably like now taking as a joke and
is trying like maybe I'll just try to like chill,
chill with this one. You're still Denzel watching.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
There's such an opulent like kind of flair to his
character Macretus, we should say, although we just call him
Denzel as he goes through, because you can see.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
That he plays like a queer icon.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
He's plotting, and he's dangerous, and he's moving all the
pieces around, and.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
He's the one who he thought was safe and then
we realize he's not safe and he's actually insane.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
And he'll shake your hand, pour your drink, and then
kill you. That kind of a villain because so many times,
just before he takes someone out does something, he's so
soothing and he's so calm, and he'll give you a
kiss on the cheek and he patting your head and
next mente he'll stab you through the heart or have
your brother slit your throat, or turn you out of
your home, like there's no stopping there.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
So true. And also because Denzel Washington plays such like wholesome,
like the good guy, like he's the main good but
he's got a lot of villains. Over he had a
lot of villains, but he's always like the guy that
everyone just wants to be. Like. He's a good action hero.
He's so good.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
He's a good, quiet dramatic actor, which is why it's
interesting that he chose to like he's one of those
actors where he can just like be very like very
still in a scene, but he can still carry the
drama of it, and you see the camera just like
finds him wherever he is. He doesn't amag saying he
makes everyone lean. Then yeah, he makes everyone leaning to him.
I just imagine I've got to yell for everything. Imagine
(21:46):
people leading. But in this you didn't just see. He
came in and he was like, I can see other
people around me maybe going smaller and quieter, and I'm
gonna go big and I'm gonna stay big for the
whole movie.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
He comes across firstly as someone you feel like you
can trust, Like he almost is like a mentor to Lucius,
to like Paul mescal where he wants Paul to be
like his best fighter. Yeah, and he's like, what do
you want? And Paul's like the entire and then dells
and Washington's like too much, But then he does it.
He gives it, and he's like, here's your army. I've
(22:18):
done my job. What are you going to do for
me now?
Speaker 1 (22:20):
And then he's like I want the head of General Acacius.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
And then yeah, and then Paul had to go and
be like, actually, this is not what I want. It's like, well,
too late, So.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
I've drawn you away from your favorite part of the movie,
which I have to circle back to. So that's that's
where all our players sit at this part. And then
they have the first task where they have to even
just see if all these slaves who they've brought in,
who was going to be strong enough to even be
up for auction as a gladiator. And that's where some
creatures come in.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Oh my god. Okay, so I got really confused in
this scene because the first gladiator scene where the gladiators
are fighting, you think they're going to fight each other,
but then like there's herd of monkeys just come out
of nowhere ready to attack them. And I was looking
at these monkeys and I was like, my monkeys like
(23:04):
this back then, what do you mean? They were like
they were insane monkeys. They were like dinosaur monkeys.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
They I'm not completely that surely is not what they
look like back then. I mean, potentially, I don't know
how much monkeys have changed over time. I guess they have,
Like the thing is where would they have gotten shots?
So I'm jumping her head, I'm jumping ahead.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
Going back to the monkeys. So it's hard because they
they were smart monkeys as well. Yeah, like they knew
they kill a man, and they knew they had to
kill a man in the first place. If I was
just a monkey there, I'd be like, oh what am
I doing? How have they thought? The monkeys from fighting
each other?
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Because each month an individual fighter I had a game.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
They were sitting with Denzel Washington and are watching it
was giving them a fight.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
They were weirdly like CGI monkeys, but in a weird way,
like could that have been real? Apparently they actually did.
Used to put many different animals in those arenas. Soles
exist back.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
Like, yes, Emily monkeys, he been around for a long time.
But those kind of monkeys were crazy. The CGI monkeys,
I think they knew they looked insane. They look like
monkeys from like Planet of the Apes, if Planet of
a took place in like.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
Twenty thirty four. Yeah, they was an alien element to
the monkeys.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
You're right.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
And even though they were throwing those darts at them
through the different cracks in the coliseum to make them angrier.
They still I guess we're very targeted. But then also
poor Mescal has a very kind of throw down moment
with the monkey that he's fighting.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
He first tried to protect his friend, who tragically died. Yeah,
he just but he was ready to die. He was like,
it's my time. And then yeah, poor Mescal, I don't know,
pulled out some chain.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
You're forgetting the moment where he bit the monkey's arm
and the monkeys screamed that was.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
I And they didn't have raby shots back then, so
that was a gambling itself.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
I just remember going, ew what, I'm like, it's literally
germs the least off his problem is. But imagine putting
your mouth on a monkey. I was like Poorman Scale,
I would never And.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
The monkey then like kind of respected him for a
little bit, Like there was a hot second with a
monkey looked at him and he was like, I cannot
believe he just did that to me. But honestly, reprospect,
he's like, he fights sturdy and I'm loving it. Somewhere
in the universe there is an old script where poor
Mescal and the monkey form an alliance and then we
have Planet of the Apes. This is actually the prequel
(25:19):
prequel series, the Apes.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Even though they've made lots of those, no one talks
about it.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
No one's going to talk about it except us, okay.
And then they had a few more animals, so there
were a lot of fight scenes, all like one step
bigger than the last ones. We had monkeys. Then we
had the rhinos scene.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Yeah, which iize, I do believe they had back then
in the cool fights.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
And we talked about how it's okay to use a
rhino because back then they weren't extinct and they didn't
know what's going to happen to rhinos now in twenty
twenty four, So they were like, it's fine to use
I own you.
Speaker 4 (25:48):
Now, but whose head could I give you to satisfy
your fury?
Speaker 2 (25:54):
The General will do.
Speaker 4 (25:56):
Rome has taken everything from me, but I will have
my vengeance.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
It's clinic of meeting for you in the next life.
I don't know why you are so really freed in
this one. It will clear my path to the throng.
You will be my instrument.
Speaker 4 (26:17):
I will never be your instrument in this life for
the next.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
We then had the ship scene. Yes, And now this
brings me to my favorite part. Of my notes I've
made under a subheading called Ridley Scott and the Sharks
the Internet. No, so, really, Scott does not like when
people question his movies in any way. He particularly doesn't
like when people question the historical accuracy of his movies.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
He's protective of his art. So when he released Napoleon,
remember did Napoleon movie? It kind of didn't didn't really
take off.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Yeah, with Yking and Phoenix, there was a scene that
turned out to be quite controversial movie. He does love
a water scene. He also loves a cannon scene. So
in the scene he has Napoleon fire cannons at the Pyramids,
and people got very upset about it and saying it
wasn't historically accurate. How dare you he wouldn't have done that.
They didn't have those type of cannons back then. Like,
people got very intense.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Anything Napoleon beckted the Pyramids.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
That was like, did Poline actually do that? You're like
tarnishing his name? And then really Scott didn't into the
times and they asked him like big backlash to the
cannon scene, do you want to speak on that? And
he said, excuse me, mate, were you there? No, we'll
shut the fuck up. And anytime anyone has asked me
about the cannons, he's like, were you fucking there?
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Were you fucking there?
Speaker 4 (27:32):
No?
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
And look he makes it because you know what, we
weren't there, and also neither were you. But he's just
saying we should all like leaves making scenes. No, unless
you're making your alternative cannon scene, leave them alone. So
they see in the movie they flood the Colosseum with
water and they have two different ships coming.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
So I thought the water would just sink through the ground.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Well apparently they actually did that. Yes, I went, Brad,
I went to the Colisseum this year, that's right.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
And as I walked around, I was trying to just
listen to the history from the guy because it was
amazing and.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
I was just going through a drought.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
As I was doing the tour of the Colosseum in Rome,
I was trying to listen to the guide. I was
also trying to look for the cat that was there
that apparently it like attacks people, but if you scratch
it's tummy, it rolls over. So that was really taking
up a lot of my time. But I also I
was thinking about poor mescal and Pedro Pascal because I
knew this movie was coming out and so I was
trying to store all the thoughts in my mind. And
the guy was saying that they did used to fill
the Colisseum with water. They did used to bring boats in,
(28:27):
and they did used to have a gladiators with different
people fight like a stage naval battle, either constructed in
a body of water, natural or man made, or in
a building. And so there is some evidence that they
did fill the Colosseum.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
That's pretty cool, I mean tragic, but cool. I don't
want to see one be killed for fun.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
But apparently when this movie came out, because as we
were watching, even though I had that in my head
that they had filled the Colosseum with water, as we
were watching this scene in Gladiator too, I was like, guys,
you've literally jumped the shark. And not just because there
are sharks on screen, but like it just seems so
silly of the way they were doing it, with like
the sharks swirling around them, and then the boats were
(29:03):
on fire, and then different like gladiators kept getting knocked
off the boat, and then the sharks were like viciously
like them. Yeah, which we know unless they were like
I don't know, but like that's not sharks. It's not
real shark behavior. I don't get the sharks in there.
How did they find so many sharks?
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Y're all like big size sharks family, so many sharks.
Where were the baby sharks? I guess they have the
sharks before putting them, maybe because maybe that's why they
ate the men so quickly. The sharks eat themselves.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Because like sharks don't just see any kind of human
being and being like I'm just going to instantly, like
revenolessly attack that person.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Like there's different sharks like eating people. I was listening
to an episode of The Quickie and they had a
shark and they asked him where their sharks in the
callers there. No, They asked him like about like shark
attacks on people, and they said that shark attacks happen
out of accident, not because the shark wants to eat
the person. Apparently, people for sharks kind of like how
we smell perfume, Like it smells good, so they kind
(29:58):
of taste it and they're like, no, but I can't
actually eat that stuff for me, so doesn't make sense
to me. Well really Scott would beg to differ because
I would not tell Scott if you're listening, sharks, I
love to see ga sharks. I think it's completely believable.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Well, during the press too, someone did ask him from
Collider and they said the sharks weren't there in real life,
and Ridley Scott said, you're dead wrong. The Colosseum did
flood with water and there were sea battles. Dude, if
you can build a colosseum, you can flood it with
fucking water, are you kidding? And to get a couple
of sharks in a net from the sea, are you kidding?
Of course they can, Yeah, you're idiot. I love.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
How we just had a conversation about how to get
the sharks in and he's just like, what do you
mean they got a net? No further question.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
So Ridley Scott says it's historically accurate, So we're gonna
say it's historically accurate, even though it was very funny
to watch.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
So I also want to talk about Colie Nielsen's role,
the role that she reprised Lucilla, who played Maximus's lover
and then Paul Mescal's mum in this new movie. I mean,
what a woman. I found her role quite interesting. It
feels like her role was the one that kind of
pieced everything together because she had like a few dramatic scenes,
(31:12):
but it also felt weirdly rushed, Like I felt like
her scenes in particular were very rushed, especially between the
second and third act. Then it's just very confusing because
if you took out all the fighting and all the
like bleeding and the staring and the politics and stuff,
and you just focused on, like the heartfelt storyline between
(31:34):
Paul finding out who he really is and like his
mom and his dad and mourning his wife, it feels
quite disjointed. So the part where she goes visits him
for the first time and kind of he figures out
while she's there that he is her son, like she
is his birth mother. He yells at her, He's.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Like, well, of course, because he feels like, just to
defend Paul mescal for a moment, he feels like he
was sent away and then forgotten about. And he's looking
at this woman and you can kind of feel like
he knew straightaway that was his mum, but he was
kind of repressing it. And then he's looking at this
woman who he sees living this life of luxury with
the people that killed his wife, and he's pretty much like,
you forgot about me and you left me out there
(32:16):
to die, and now I want nothing to do with you.
And I understand marry the general.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Yeah, he killed my wife. Yeah, it's actually quite a
good setup. It's good. And he yells, he's like, get
out of my room. And then she tries to say something.
He's like, gout and then they don't talk again. And
then the next time they talk, I'm like, oh, no,
he's going to yell at her again. He's gonna yell.
They haven't talked since that first yelling situation. Immediately forgive him.
He's like, Okay, well he's got a lot going on.
(32:42):
He's trying to save Rome. He's like, oh, he's trying
to enemy. Get out of my room. So she like
they suddenly make up randomly, and she gives him Maximus's
ring that she's been wearing, and he was like, I
will wear this ring next to my wife's ring.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
That's actually meant to be a really beautiful moment. And
I just feel like you haven't taken it in here.
It's so every time I see you recently, you'll just
say that randomly, Oh.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
This ring next to my wife's. He's trying to be
nice about it. Thank you, mom, I forgive you to
give you mom.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
Because because Paul Beskil doesn't have a lot of lines,
he doesn't have a lot.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
I think that's a except for that one poem yes,
which is like the one line that he says that
everyone remembers.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
That's a creative choice and it does kind of work.
He's meant to be, you know, he's always watching and
reacting and when they ask him to speak, he's like
he's like no, they're like speaking English. He's like yeah,
sure whatever.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
He doesn't have a lot of dialogue in the film,
but I think that kind of works to his character.
It does a lot of breathing and a lot of
brooding and a lot of just like what strength.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
And on ah and then everyone's like yeah, I guess
sure what he said with both of those.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
But a lot of it is just like close ups
of his face and his body, like reacting to things
and taking things in. And I think that's interesting choice,
Like you can convey a lot without dialogue. Sometimes in
these movies they can be too much dialogue. If you
get into historical drama, and there's a lot of exposition,
a lot of explaining, a lot of men walking around
and brooding.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Is he educated because they like so. You see a
scene where like he's a young boy and then they
come to find him and then he gets sent away
by himself on a horse.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Yeah, and the different community, but he still was like
educated while he was like living in Rome with his family.
He does speak well, Okay, weird thing for us to
be debating, but I think that's maybe just how they've
kind of done his character. It's interesting because with Gladiator too,
like I just think like if it wasn't done properly,
it just would have been the most boring movie. And
I think the original scripts around it very much center
(34:33):
on like the politics and the internal power struggles. And
I'm like, when I went to this movie, I'm like,
if this is going to be a bunch of white
men standing around in rooms monologuing about their importance, I'm
out of here. I've had a long day, there's a
long line to get in here.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
I'm out.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
But the movie caters to I think what people want
from a movie in terms of like action packed, a
very fast, fast paced and the stakes are very It's
kind of like the stakes are out there of like
this is a really bad guy and this is the
good guy, and that's it. Everyone's stay in their lane.
But it kind of does work because it's a it's
a cadence of storyline that we really recognize.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
The characters are still developing in their lane to an extent.
It's almost like if you had taken out to the
Vicious Killing. This is a kid's movie about an orphan.
This is Disney movie about an orphan taken away from
his parents, coming back and fighting the bad guys and
saving everyone, Like if he took out the killer monkeys
and the killer sharks and the static and the sadistic
emperors and the fact that one of them is dying
(35:28):
from syphilis.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
This is a kid's movie. It's very good versus bad,
but adults need that sometimes too.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
Yeah, it was just such a good watch. Like I definitely,
as you said, wouldn't watch it because I do feel
like Gladiator one was more of a drama, like there
was so much it was more intense in that way
where the plot line felt like there was so much
at stake, whereas like with Gladiator two, because it's kind
of like the same storyline as Gladiator one. You kind
(35:55):
of know what's at steak already, so you can just
like enjoy.
Speaker 1 (35:57):
It just feels like more like an action, popcorn summer
kind of movie. Okay, do you want to get into ending,
which is actually quite sad because you think a lot
of people are gonna you think like they're gonna do this.
They go into you know, get out of here, and
then death after death after death.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
I got quite confused. What were you confused by? I
was confused right at the end when he was giving
that speech and there were thousands of people, and I
was like, oh, I hope the guys at the back
can hear him and they don't just start killing people
because there's no way they can hear him. They're so
far bad, Like how do they all know that we're
not fighting? Like, I don't think that message has been
passed on accurately.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Okay, So in armies they have like systems in back
in the olden days, and they have like walkie talkers
or you think of how to like pass that along,
like you have a person who's in charge of like
each section.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Pass it on, pass it on. Stop you're feeling you're
getting a message going kill and you're like, wait, kill,
just because one guy forgot to say stop killing. Okay.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
But before that, we have Denzel Washington rising to the
power of emperor because.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
Quickly he tricks Overnight.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
That was an intense scene. How he tricks the brothers,
He tricks the little Emperor. This is how we can describe.
He tricks the little Emperor, whose brain is at all
by syphilis, which is very sad for him, tricks him
into killing his brother because Denzel's thinking like the younger one,
the little one is easier to control out of these
two crazy emperors. And then Denzel wrangles it so that
the little Emperor, who's the one who's ruling now I guess,
(37:21):
names his monkey first, which everyone was a bit stressed about,
which is fair enough, it was there for long, and
then named Denzel. And then when Denzel stabbed him through
the ear him yeah, that's a bad way to go. Yeah,
I don't want to go that way, leaving him to
be in power. But then they're having the big three
down fight, and then we have the death of Acacius,
which I actually thought was really sad, but I thought
(37:43):
that it was very satisfying to have that big throwdown
fight between Pedro and Paul, because the whole movie had
been building to that, and see Pedro trying to say, acacius,
I need to call them the character names, being like no,
like we're fighting for the same thing, and being like,
I won't kill you. And then I think the big
emotional turning point for Paul Mescal was him also putting
down his sword because the only thing I'd been getting
(38:04):
up in the morning and getting him through this was
killing that man, this man who was in front of him,
and then he had to make the choice to put
his sword down.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
And then but they killed him anyway, and then Paul went,
look what you do. Do you like this? You're the
killing of your general. I'm like, all right, I feel
like Paul's in the room, that's right.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
I think they were trying because one of the most
infamous scenes from the original Gladiator, and the one that
people still repeat to this day, is are you not entertained?
And so I think they were trying to make that happen.
But which she said that how good would that be?
Might have been two on the note he was understanding ovation.
But you know what I thought was the real kind
of just the one of the ugly kills is when
(38:45):
Lucilla Connie Nielsen, his character is tied out on the
thing in the.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Middle, like she was the last living person for him. Yes,
like the last person who like probably had love for him.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Yeah, he lost his wife, he lost all of his friends,
he lost his mentor, and that was like just when
he got to Rome, and then.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
He was losing after me. The credits is still it's love.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
It's peoful opening scene. And then he's lost a lot
of people that he'd made friends with since he got there.
He's lost Acacius, who was like a new friend, Danizel
he thought he was going to be there, trained betrayed,
and then he's only got Connie Nilsen left. And the
way she dies with Denzel Washington acting, I'm just going
(39:30):
to say, like a little spoiled brat, like he's losing
the war and he could just run, he could leave,
he could find his army.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
He wanted to take everything from Paul mescal and she's like,
this is not your movie movie, Denzel Washington, and.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
Then Denzel Washington, the man, the actor takes the bowl
and arrow and shoots her through the heart in the
same way that Paul Paul Mescal lost his wife in
the opening scenes the film with an arrow through the heart.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
I'm surprised he's not traumatized by I think he is traumatized,
is what we see throughout the film.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
And then it's really on I think is a cinematic
way to describe it in terms of.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
The battle kicking horse chase.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Yes, but then we have what everyone has been b for,
which is the epic threw down between Denzel and Paul
in the river.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
You know what, it reminded me of what Black Panther.
Oh yeah, bit of a and men fighting in water
is dangerous game because like when there's drowning involved, that
takes it to a whole new life.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
Stabbing through the water, stabbing you can't see who's moving
where or who's doing what.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
They would be very intense people just rises. Yes, man,
he did look like a became victorious, and then he
had to stand between the Roman army and the other army,
which I'm getting the other Roman army, the friendly Roman
army and the other Roman army and say, look, guys,
it's been a Dan. Well, let's just put the swords down,
(40:49):
like we're all fighting for the same thing. Sometimes it's men.
We need to like let out our emotions in a different,
more healthier way. I feel like, if we just talked
about it and didn't kill each other, this could be
a really beautiful friendship. I really want a version of
the movie where he says that, and then the guys
at the back are like, what.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
Telling or not someone tell us? And we're killing great
and then they kill poor Mescal. Unfortunate with that for me,
goddamn it. And after that you want to have this
real victorious moment of like, they won, the good guys won,
but there are no winners in war. A series Animalphs
taught me that there are no winners in more. It's
all really ugly. And so then we have these scenes
of poor Mescal looking absolutely fucking devastated and broken because
(41:27):
he's staying in that arena and he was like, that's
where my dad died, that's where my mom died. Still there,
that's where Acacius died and my wife also dead.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Pulls out the little arrow and then he does that
touchy dirt thing that he loves, and yes, because he's remembering,
he's trying to feel like tied to his father and
how he died in that moment and how he's standing there.
Speaker 1 (41:45):
And this is because Paul Mescal is a good actor.
You see in his eyes that his character is thinking,
I am alive, but I am dead inside. And even
though everyone is celebrating around me, there is no celebration
for Paul.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Mescal until Gladiator three.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
Do you know? They're talking about that, and it's going
to follow in his next like through this next part
where he's been given this big power that he doesn't want.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
But you know, them all the emperor now and he's like, no,
we talked about this, boys, there's no empress.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
And he's like, you're the emperor and they're like, it's
either you or the monkey because the monkey is officially
taken in charge, and so one of you is going
to have to step up. But you know, one of
the reasons that people really want Gladiator three besides the
fact that we all really loved Gladiator two and we
want to see we want to see what other animals
they can put in them at Colosseum. We want to
see more death and blood.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
Is it because they want to rub it into Russell
Crowe more Russell Cross at home. No, He's like, how
about come back? And it goes now.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
He's like, if you could have bloodthirsty, mechanical sharks and
alien monkeys, you can have Russell Crowe back.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
I'm saying, my mafussa pitch is pretty good. It's prett good.
We should send that to them. No, they want to
see Paul Mescal have a love story. Ah boring. I
want to see por Maskell kill more men. Yeah, I
just think give the guy a minute. Wid Yeah. I
think it's because people just want killing and they want sex.
They just want normal people what they want.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Daisy Ridley appears, Daisy, so Daisy egger Jones appears.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
Well, that's why they cast Joseph Quinn because he Quinn's dead.
So Paul's like, well, who's.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
Gonna be Oh my god, Daisy ed goad Jones can
appear as the sister of the emperors, and even though
women can't have power at that time, it's going to
be her evil husband, who.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
Like Hell's the evil husband and him and Daisy get
together and then they make normal people too. In Rome,
it's like Emily in Paris. In Rome, normal people do.
Speaker 1 (43:33):
In Rome, it's all happening anyway, thank you for listening
to our very unhinged, brutally honest review of Gladiator two.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
Hope you like the movie.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
The movie because we really enjoyed it. We owed you
all to see it. And yeah, look, any day where
we're seeing a mustly poor moss girl and his perfect teeth,
even though historically and accurate, run across the screen, is
a good day.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
Thank you so much for listening to this episode of
the spill. We do so many really honest reviews. We're
gonna link a bunch of them in the show. Note
make sure you watch them first because we do talk
about spoilers and get in deep. But we will be
back here on your podcast feed at three pm on Monday.
Bye byell It, Love It.
So much.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
MoMA Maya acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
that this podcast is recorded on. Did you love the
episode we did on Paul Mescal about how he supposedly
runs away from his one night stance. That wasn't all
we talked about, but let's be real, it was the
most absurd part of it. We thought we'd share an
episode of mum MIA's daily celebrity podcast, This Spill, because
(00:36):
they did a brutally honest review of Paul's new movie
Gladiator two. It's not just Paul's movie, of course, there
are other big names in it too, like Pedro Pascal
and Denzil Washington, but it is being called Paul Mescal's
movie by all the young, cool people like us. You're
about to hear about all the best and worst moments
from Gladiator too, and also an acknowledgment of Russell Crow's
(00:59):
hurt feelings for not being included. Enjoy from MoMA Mia.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Welcome to the Spill, your daily pop culture fix. I'm
m Burnham and I'm Laura Brednick Hand. On today's show,
get your horses and carriages out because we're diving deep
back into the BC time. Also AD unclear, it's AD.
We're going back to the Roman Empire where Paul Mescal
(01:27):
killed everyone. We are going to be doing much anticipated,
brutally honest review of Gladiator too.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Yes, and we can watch us always in there if
you're not across our brilliant honest reviews, they are where
we let you the audience know they're coming. So you
know whichever movie or TV show that we're going to
be having a passionate debate about, and it's really just
a space for us to give out honest thoughts, behind
the scenes stories really go deep into the core of
this thing that has we have been obsessing over us
(01:56):
since we saw it. And obviously spoiler alert, we're going
to be talking about the ending. So we've given you.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
A full week, which we are very kind people, We'll
give you a week to watch it. But yeah, spoilers.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Yes, I mean Paul Meskal said he wanted people to
see this in cinemas and if you've disappointed Paul, I'm
just gonna say that's on you.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
You disappointed us.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So Gladiator two with what we're here today to discuss. So,
first of all, life to ask you a very important question.
You've seen Gladiator the original?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yes? But I saw the original after it was announced? Yes,
but you went did your home or I didn't know
where you went to the premiere? Many did not bes
a mess, Russell Crow because.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
As we were sitting in the premiere and Paul Mescale
had just come out on stage, and it was clapping
and the lights were about to go down, and that
is when a number of people around me leaned over
and whispered, what.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Is Gladiator the first one about? Right? You can't be
Australian and not know what Gladiator is.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Well, just in case some of our listeners are also
in that boat that they just have no idea where
the original movie is. No, no, your points did.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
I was in that boat until like a month ago.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I just thought that everyone was sitting in the cinema
about to watch this movie. And it's fair enough that
you hadn't watched the first one if that was your choice,
and that's the piece you'd made with what over God
that you subscribed to. However, it's a weird thing to
start worrying about it as the lights go down. So
just in case anyone else is in that boat. Gladiator
came out in the year two thousand.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
You've had twenty four years to watch it.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, time is it digging historical epic drama directed by
Ridley Scott. It was a huge success when it came
out in the year two thousand. It was actually the
second highest grossing film of the year. It received almost
universal critical and fam acclaim. Everyone was basically saying, this
is the best movie we've ever seen. It also went
(03:38):
on to win five Academy Awards, including the very coveted
Best Picture and also Best Actor for young Russell.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Crowe, Ah, Little Hotty and.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
The most Oscars I believe one of any movie that year.
So a real clean sweep across the board. So in
the original movie, Russell Crowe plays a Roman general called
Maximus who is betrayed.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I won't get into the backstory. It's you know, it'siler
last twenty four Yes, spoilers, classic guy staff betrayal, revenge.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
You know man is Megan Man killing other Mega men? Yeah,
men don't know how to work with their feelings. And
it said they go on epic quest to you know,
take down their enemy Barton. So Russell Crowe is you know,
Russell Crowe, Maximus, they're.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
All very entertain it's Russell and Paul.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Yeah, we're gonna be calling them Russell and Paul henceforth
instead of their character names. So Russell Crowe reduced to slavery,
becomes a gladiator and rises through the ranks of the arena,
and spoiler Rolert because it's very crucial to Gladiator two,
he dies at the end, which brings.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Us to he had a good run? Did I think
he did? I guess he died trying to like save
his feet for a purpose, something greater than him as
a man.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Any of us can ask for. I meant, I don't
want that to be me.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
No, I would never die for anyone.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
I wouldn't if anyone wouldn't die for you, wouldn't I
Kim our producer. I'm just saying that now.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
But speaking of Kim our producer, So you're saying this,
this is a recap of Gladiator one, because okay, you
do kind of have to have a sense of Gladiator
one before you watch Gladiator two. However, I was sitting
between our video producer Julian and our producer Kim. Both
have watched Gladiator, both had no idea what was going on.
The amount of questions I got from these two people
(05:16):
was insane.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
People asking me questions in the movie quite stresses me
out because I'm like, please hold questions to the end.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
First of all, no talking during the movie. You're interrupting
me watching men kill themselves.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Second of all, I hate it when like, I guess
this is different, because they could be like, is that
the guy from the first movie, and you can be like, no,
shut up.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
But it's more so when I want to see like
one hundred years old.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
There's so many movies I go to and listen to
a brand new story, and like a friend or whoever
I'm with from work will lean over and say, what's
happening here? I'm like, we have the same information. We're
watching the same movie.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
My mom does that all like opening credit. Yeah, She'll
be like, why are we at the beach? I'm like, Mom,
this is literally the first thing. I don't know why
they're gonna tell us. Okay, now we put that gripe
out there.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
We had to get that's just a love letter to
all of our friends and family not to talk to
us in the movies. So basically, Gladiator two takes place
many many years, like well over a decade after Gladiator one.
And we know this because the son of Maximum Lucius,
Lucius was a child in the first movie, and now
he's a grown up, buff, adult man in the form
(06:16):
of Paul Mescal looking very hot. It must be said
and will be said many times throughout this podcast.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
So that is the biggest spoiler in the entire film.
I think people knew that growing in, right, Yeah, I
knew it, But that's because, like we're Gladiator fans, there
are some people in the cinema, Kim, who were like,
what's going on? Who was that?
Speaker 1 (06:34):
So after Maximus was killed, Lucius was like spirited away
secretly by his mother Lucilla, played by Connie Nielsen, who
is reprising her role from the first movie as Maximus's lover.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Can we talk about some low brow rumors for a second.
Oh sure. I was watching an interview when they were
doing the press junket with Paul Mescal and Fred Hegenjer,
and the interviewer asked Paul if Russell Crowe had called
him and like given him some tips, and Paul straight
away was like, no, I haven't talked to Russell Crowe,
Like I haven't talked to him at all, and I
was like, knowing what we know about Russell Crowe, he's
(07:09):
an angry man. It has to be said. He would
agree with that. He would agree with that. I Oh,
I feel bad for Paul, But you know what, this
movie was great, and I just wish I just feel
like if Russell just gave him like a few like tips,
or like had like a few little cameo roles like
I think that could have just been like the perfect movie.
It was a great movie. I think that could have
(07:30):
made it perfect.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Can I tell you a rumor that I think an
unfounded and unfounded accusation it must be said around why
there might be bad blood between Paul Mescal and Russell Crowe,
a rumor that we are starting here on this very podcast.
I mean, the bad blood. This one's been around for
a while. I mean, when you have a blockbuster movie
like that, of course everyone starts saying afterwards, after one
of the oscars have made that much money, sequel, what
(07:52):
do we do next? And so Ridley Scott and the
team behind the first Gladiator movie were in talks for
a long time to try and get a sequel up
much sooner than twenty years but Russell Crowe well, allegedly
again massive. Allegedly, Russell Crowe had thought he could probably
come back because the biggest role of his career at
this point.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
How did he think he'd come back he died?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Well, apparently he favored a fantasy element in bringing Maximus
back to life. But the studio were the ones who
were like, no, it's not we can't bring you back
to life in any kind of way. And they were
the ones who were really pushing on having his son
take on the main storyline because they were like, that kid,
what happened to him? Surely he grows up to be
(08:33):
a little mini Russell Crowe when he cast a hot
young actor done.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Something like a faster situation. Do you know where he
appears in the stars and he's like Lucius looked to
the sky, I am always with to you and he's like, wait,
you're my dad. I thought you were just some idol.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
I liked It's funny because they kept having all these
almost like ghostly moments rut the scene where Maximus aka
Russell Crowe was meant to be there, like did you
see how like the wind swept some of the gradd
They tried.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
So hard to make it look like Russell was there,
and we knew he wasn't there. Well, that scene right
at the end where he's like stroking some flowers, like
a field of flowers, and he was stroking the gravel
where his father died. My god, I wonder whose hand
that was. I wonder how much I got paid.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
You know, to be Russell Crowe's hand. So that all happened. Okay,
back to the original movie. So yeah, it was a
little fun segue rap Russell Ckroe.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
He's still alive. But is his career? I don't know. No,
it's fine, it's fine, it's fine.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
I once bumped into Russell crow at a premiere and
because of whoy we're standing our faces smashed together and
our noses touched, and that's beautiful. And he looked angry
at me, but he looked angrier at all the people
around us who were there to support his movie. So okay,
just an angry man.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
So it starts off with Paul feeding some chickens, right,
He's like in his beautiful country home with his beautiful wife,
his hot hot were the most good looking people in
all of the land, probably in that entire century. Everyone
who looks at them, just can't stop staring because you
know what, they've got vineers, they've got great they've got
great skin, they're muscly, they're.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
They're both warriors too, two sexy warriors who fell in
love and got married.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I don't have a single nick on them until we'll
get there. We'll get to the next But they're living
in this place called Numidia. It's a place around Rome,
and it's during the time where the Romans wanted to
take over every village, town, country city around them because
they wanted to be the ultimate ultimate city. So I
think Numidia was the last one that Rome had to
(10:31):
take over. So Paul's like, got the boys together, we
got to get ready. We also find out that he's
somewhat a prominent figure in his hometown army. He gives
like a lot of speeches. He's like, what we do
we do together, and we do it to fight for Numidia.
And everyone's like, fuck yeah. I'd be like pissing myself
because I'd be so scared. I don't have time to
(10:52):
listen to this. I'm like, can we all just watch
what's happening? These ships are coming so fast. They've got
like I don't know. They probably had some motors back there.
They were going very fast, really fast. And also like,
I don't know how they got their aim so good,
Like with all the bombs and the like catapults, Like
how could they aim so well when they do the
training soldiers. Yeah, but they'd had no telescopes. I was
(11:14):
just very stressful. So when I saw the ships, I
was like, Ah, this is dumb. You think you can
fight this massive land of people while you're coming on
your little rickety boat. And you were wrong. I was
wrong because you know what, Then I saw Pedro Pascal,
and I was like, no one's safe here. The minute
I see Pedro Pascal, he did one of those things
where like he sees his soldiers fighting and trying to
(11:34):
get up a ladder and he's like, oh, I have
to do it myself, and he just like pushes everyone
away and he's like, I'll get up there. He gets
up there, he kills some prominent people are my prominent.
I mean Paul's.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Wife, Paul's hot wife. That was actually a very sad moment.
A lot of moments in this movie are very cheesy
and silly, especially it has to be a lot of
the deaths because some of them as the movie goes along,
some of them get a bit comical.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
We'll get to it shucks.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
But Paul Muscal's wife I thought was quite sad because
they make eye contact.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
Everyone around them is dying.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
And then that arrow just like pierces her heart and
she looks so shocked, and then she just falls into
the water. And then they have almost like a dream
sequence where you see, you know the legend that you
get when you pass away, you get rowed across the
river sticks by the ferryman, and that's what Paul was
seeing as his wife got onto the faeryom was rowed away,
which means she died.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Because he got knocked out as well, so he was
having that dream. And then he wakes up on the
beach like the soldiers pulled him on to shore, and
he sees his wife's body floating in the ocean, and
he goes to run towards her. I don't know how
he got there so fast, because I thought it was
a riptid because he was going back and forth. But
he gets there eventually, and then he does like this
big sob and.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
Then we I thought it was he can see that
he wants to bury her, but he knows the soldiers
are coming to take him, so he does that really
beautiful thing where he just tries to pull as much
as the arrow out of her heart and then pushes
her ount to the ocean because it's obviously He's like,
I can't do anything, but I don't want my wife's
body floating with an arrow sticking out of it, So
all I can do is pull it out and just
push her, and he keeps the arrow.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Yeah, the arrow is like a little motif of a
reminder of his wife throughout the entire film. Oh yeah,
I was quite much.
Speaker 4 (13:05):
Yeah, it is an art choosing gladiators, they're usually prisoners
of war.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
I claim this city for the glory of Rome.
Speaker 4 (13:25):
You have something in you wait, never let it go.
It will carry you to quatness.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Okay, So that was like probably the saddest part. Oh
there was a few sad parts, but that was like
the big sad one where we're like, oh shit, this
is real. We then find out that Pedro Pascal is
the general of the Roman Army. He doesn't seem to
crash hot about his job. It just seems like something
he's got to do. He's trying to quite quit pay
the bills. He's trying to quite quit not conquer any
(13:59):
more countries, but no one will let him. He did
something really interesting where when he claims the land, he
seems so not disinterested but ashamed almost, And that's I
think where we get the first clear said Pedro Pascal
might sort of be a different character than what we
think he is.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Yeah, because he set it through the eyes of poor Mescal.
He is seen to be like this vicious killer, and
I guess you know, he was leading the army that
killed his wife and his friends. But what we see
about acacious Pedro Pascal's character is that he is a
soldier and a general who thrives off defending Rome and defending.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
They have the best character development in the entire film. Yeah,
he really because you see him in this impossible situation.
And then now he's because no one's actually attacking Rome
because they hold all the armies in land and all
that sort of stuff. Now, the two emperors geta played
by Joseph Quinn and Emperor karro Kella played by a
good friend Fred, basically just thirsty for more power and
(14:54):
more land. A young men who don't know anything different.
They've had everything handed to them on a silver pladdle, literally,
and now they're only getting their only form of entertainment
because they don't have TVs back there. They'd hate the spill.
They'd have no idea what we're talking about. Yeah, the
only form of entertainment they have is to watch men
kill each other, and they are thriving off.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
It and sending a Casius out to all these different
places to conquer, where he's like, I just want to
be at home with my wife. Let's talk about the
Empress for a second, because they were very well done
and as.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Scary they were because they.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Have that thing, like we were saying when we did
our little review of this on a previous episode, is
that they have that thing is that they're entertaining to watch.
But they're also like I have like a deep hatred
for them, and I think that's very hard because to
hate a character, you also have to see them as
like fully formed people. And I really could just see
these two spoiled, awful men who were just being brought
up with immense power and privilege, no idea what to
(15:46):
do with it, and instead they weren't even that power hungry.
They were to extent, but they actually cared more about
entertainment and being really sadistic.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
And they wanted people to take them seriously. It reminded
me so much of Jeoffrey and Game of Throne had
that same character one hundred percent. And I think we
talked about in the last episode in such a dangerous
villain because they don't kill out of hatred, they kill
out of joy. Yeah, one hundred percent. They're just completely unhinged,
like no one is safe, Like anytime they feel like
(16:14):
someone's betrayed them, or they think someone's making fun of them,
or they think someone's on their side, just immediately killed.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
So Ridley Scott described the characters as damaged goods from birth,
and this is the wildest thing I've ever heard. So
Apparently Joseph Quinn, who plays guitar, said that he was
being really careful not to soil Joaquin Phoenix's performance in
the original movie, who was the villain, and so he
didn't look to him. Instead, he took inspiration from Philip
(16:40):
Simoor Hoffman's villain in Mission Impossible three one of your favors,
I'm sure, and also Gary Oldman's character from the Fifth Element.
But Ridley Scott has said that the two evil Emperors
are actually based well, one of their inspirations, I feel like.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
You're gonna drop a troop bomb right now, are based
on the cartoon Beavis and butt Head. No you can't
take me, but you cannot take my bumbhole. I am
the Great Corn And once you hear it, oh my god,
you can't unsee it. He watched Bea.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
So it ran from nineteen ninety three to twenty eleven,
like it went for so long, and it was basically
about these like really dumb teenagers and all the crazy,
ridiculous antiques.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
They get, but you love them.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
It was like the epitome of like dumb humor. Yeah,
oh my god, and how they each other up and everything. Literally,
this whole epic dramatic story is based on Beavis and
butt Head.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
And it was, yeah, their whole thing, and they're like obsession,
Like I think my favorite scene in the whole movie
was them calling in Paul to watch him fight. Yes,
So what we just skipped over was like all the
strong men from Pedro Pascal from the place that he
just kind of violently murdered all the survivors and the
(17:55):
strong men were taken prisoner back to Rome to be
sold as gladiators. The person who controls the gladiators and
owns them as Denzel Washington, very sexy men. Yes, everyone
is really sexy in this movie and have great tea.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Even there being evil, campy, ridiculous, Like Denzel Washington was like,
it's so funny because everyone feels a bit like they're
in a different movie, but it all kind of works,
so it actually.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
It feels like they're in a different movie because they
all kept their accents. Yeah, everyone kept their own accents.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
Everyone's like, we're all in Rome, but we all apparently
grew up in different places and we will not address it.
Paul Mescale feels like he's in a limited drama series.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Yeah, what's going on? And I do well.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Apparently Ridley Scott cast him after he watched Normal People
because he was looking for a comfort show. I love
that Ridley Scott watched that show before you did. He's
like became a Normal People fan before you because you.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Haven't called Normal People a comfort show.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Deeply.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Yeah, I was like, oh my god, Ridley, please, I
can give you much better. You're clearly not on something.
You're a woman struggling Forella.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
And he was like, oh, that man's interesting. There was
many people up for the role. One of them was
Austin Butler, and I'm just glad that didn't happen because
he's such a method actor. He would have tried to
like fight actual gladiators and he would be killed.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Find him in the zoo just trying to slay.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
All the other monkeys have like taken him out because like,
I think you could take Austin Butler.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
Yeah, it can't be a method actor. I'm glad it
was Paul. Also, we forget that they filmed this really
early on, yeah, because I forgot that, like he did
all of the other stuff that's come out, like after
some and things like after Gladiator. Yeah. And it's crazy
how he probably filmed all of this with like no
press because straight after normal people. It was during COVID,
so no one really knew him. He had time to
(19:29):
put his Instagram on private, he did all of this stuff.
He only has like two hundred thousand followers, and then
like imagine making a movie where no one really cares
about and then suddenly everyone suddenly cares and the premiere
is just ten times bigger than I don't imagine.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
It's the sequel too, of the biggest movies in the world.
It's funny because Ridley it's like, oh yeah, I jumped
on the zoom with Paul and gave him the role
after he saw him with normal people. And I'm just
imagine how that conversation went. Is like Ridley Scott saying, so,
do you want to be in Gladiator too? And Paul
going yeah, all right then and look it worked out.
And then Pedro Pascal, I think he's in Gladiator. He's
in the Gladiator that the film. Pascal's like, shut up,
(20:04):
I'm the Gladiator. He's in the movie that the Gladiator
team want us think we're seeing, which is a very
pristie drama, but very you know, based on history and
character development all those things. And then Denzel Washington isn't
a Ryan Murphy TV show camp, crazy over the top,
having the time of his life playing a villain, And
somehow all these men it just works.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
It just works, and somehow Denzel Washington is still best.
Probably he's probably like now taking as a joke and
is trying like maybe I'll just try to like chill,
chill with this one. You're still Denzel watching.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
There's such an opulent like kind of flair to his
character Macretus, we should say, although we just call him
Denzel as he goes through, because you can see.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
That he plays like a queer icon.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
He's plotting, and he's dangerous, and he's moving all the
pieces around, and.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
He's the one who he thought was safe and then
we realize he's not safe and he's actually insane.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
And he'll shake your hand, pour your drink, and then
kill you. That kind of a villain because so many times,
just before he takes someone out does something, he's so
soothing and he's so calm, and he'll give you a
kiss on the cheek and he patting your head and
next mente he'll stab you through the heart or have
your brother slit your throat, or turn you out of
your home, like there's no stopping there.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
So true. And also because Denzel Washington plays such like wholesome,
like the good guy, like he's the main good but
he's got a lot of villains. Over he had a
lot of villains, but he's always like the guy that
everyone just wants to be. Like. He's a good action hero.
He's so good.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
He's a good, quiet dramatic actor, which is why it's
interesting that he chose to like he's one of those
actors where he can just like be very like very
still in a scene, but he can still carry the
drama of it, and you see the camera just like
finds him wherever he is. He doesn't amag saying he
makes everyone lean. Then yeah, he makes everyone leaning to him.
I just imagine I've got to yell for everything. Imagine
(21:46):
people leading. But in this you didn't just see. He
came in and he was like, I can see other
people around me maybe going smaller and quieter, and I'm
gonna go big and I'm gonna stay big for the
whole movie.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
He comes across firstly as someone you feel like you
can trust, Like he almost is like a mentor to Lucius,
to like Paul mescal where he wants Paul to be
like his best fighter. Yeah, and he's like, what do
you want? And Paul's like the entire and then dells
and Washington's like too much, But then he does it.
He gives it, and he's like, here's your army. I've
(22:18):
done my job. What are you going to do for
me now?
Speaker 1 (22:20):
And then he's like I want the head of General Acacius.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
And then yeah, and then Paul had to go and
be like, actually, this is not what I want. It's like, well,
too late, So.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
I've drawn you away from your favorite part of the movie,
which I have to circle back to. So that's that's
where all our players sit at this part. And then
they have the first task where they have to even
just see if all these slaves who they've brought in,
who was going to be strong enough to even be
up for auction as a gladiator. And that's where some
creatures come in.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Oh my god. Okay, so I got really confused in
this scene because the first gladiator scene where the gladiators
are fighting, you think they're going to fight each other,
but then like there's herd of monkeys just come out
of nowhere ready to attack them. And I was looking
at these monkeys and I was like, my monkeys like
(23:04):
this back then, what do you mean? They were like
they were insane monkeys. They were like dinosaur monkeys.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
They I'm not completely that surely is not what they
look like back then. I mean, potentially, I don't know
how much monkeys have changed over time. I guess they have,
Like the thing is where would they have gotten shots?
So I'm jumping her head, I'm jumping ahead.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
Going back to the monkeys. So it's hard because they
they were smart monkeys as well. Yeah, like they knew
they kill a man, and they knew they had to
kill a man in the first place. If I was
just a monkey there, I'd be like, oh what am
I doing? How have they thought? The monkeys from fighting
each other?
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Because each month an individual fighter I had a game.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
They were sitting with Denzel Washington and are watching it
was giving them a fight.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
They were weirdly like CGI monkeys, but in a weird way,
like could that have been real? Apparently they actually did.
Used to put many different animals in those arenas. Soles
exist back.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
Like, yes, Emily monkeys, he been around for a long time.
But those kind of monkeys were crazy. The CGI monkeys,
I think they knew they looked insane. They look like
monkeys from like Planet of the Apes, if Planet of
a took place in like.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
Twenty thirty four. Yeah, they was an alien element to
the monkeys.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
You're right.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
And even though they were throwing those darts at them
through the different cracks in the coliseum to make them angrier.
They still I guess we're very targeted. But then also
poor Mescal has a very kind of throw down moment
with the monkey that he's fighting.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
He first tried to protect his friend, who tragically died. Yeah,
he just but he was ready to die. He was like,
it's my time. And then yeah, poor Mescal, I don't know,
pulled out some chain.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
You're forgetting the moment where he bit the monkey's arm
and the monkeys screamed that was.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
I And they didn't have raby shots back then, so
that was a gambling itself.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
I just remember going, ew what, I'm like, it's literally
germs the least off his problem is. But imagine putting
your mouth on a monkey. I was like Poorman Scale,
I would never And.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
The monkey then like kind of respected him for a
little bit, Like there was a hot second with a
monkey looked at him and he was like, I cannot
believe he just did that to me. But honestly, reprospect,
he's like, he fights sturdy and I'm loving it. Somewhere
in the universe there is an old script where poor
Mescal and the monkey form an alliance and then we
have Planet of the Apes. This is actually the prequel
(25:19):
prequel series, the Apes.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Even though they've made lots of those, no one talks
about it.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
No one's going to talk about it except us, okay.
And then they had a few more animals, so there
were a lot of fight scenes, all like one step
bigger than the last ones. We had monkeys. Then we
had the rhinos scene.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Yeah, which iize, I do believe they had back then
in the cool fights.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
And we talked about how it's okay to use a
rhino because back then they weren't extinct and they didn't
know what's going to happen to rhinos now in twenty
twenty four, So they were like, it's fine to use
I own you.
Speaker 4 (25:48):
Now, but whose head could I give you to satisfy
your fury?
Speaker 2 (25:54):
The General will do.
Speaker 4 (25:56):
Rome has taken everything from me, but I will have
my vengeance.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
It's clinic of meeting for you in the next life.
I don't know why you are so really freed in
this one. It will clear my path to the throng.
You will be my instrument.
Speaker 4 (26:17):
I will never be your instrument in this life for
the next.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
We then had the ship scene. Yes, And now this
brings me to my favorite part. Of my notes I've
made under a subheading called Ridley Scott and the Sharks
the Internet. No, so, really, Scott does not like when
people question his movies in any way. He particularly doesn't
like when people question the historical accuracy of his movies.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
He's protective of his art. So when he released Napoleon,
remember did Napoleon movie? It kind of didn't didn't really
take off.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Yeah, with Yking and Phoenix, there was a scene that
turned out to be quite controversial movie. He does love
a water scene. He also loves a cannon scene. So
in the scene he has Napoleon fire cannons at the Pyramids,
and people got very upset about it and saying it
wasn't historically accurate. How dare you he wouldn't have done that.
They didn't have those type of cannons back then. Like,
people got very intense.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Anything Napoleon beckted the Pyramids.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
That was like, did Poline actually do that? You're like
tarnishing his name? And then really Scott didn't into the
times and they asked him like big backlash to the
cannon scene, do you want to speak on that? And
he said, excuse me, mate, were you there? No, we'll
shut the fuck up. And anytime anyone has asked me
about the cannons, he's like, were you fucking there?
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Were you fucking there?
Speaker 4 (27:32):
No?
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
And look he makes it because you know what, we
weren't there, and also neither were you. But he's just
saying we should all like leaves making scenes. No, unless
you're making your alternative cannon scene, leave them alone. So
they see in the movie they flood the Colosseum with
water and they have two different ships coming.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
So I thought the water would just sink through the ground.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Well apparently they actually did that. Yes, I went, Brad,
I went to the Colisseum this year, that's right.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
And as I walked around, I was trying to just
listen to the history from the guy because it was
amazing and.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
I was just going through a drought.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
As I was doing the tour of the Colosseum in Rome,
I was trying to listen to the guide. I was
also trying to look for the cat that was there
that apparently it like attacks people, but if you scratch
it's tummy, it rolls over. So that was really taking
up a lot of my time. But I also I
was thinking about poor mescal and Pedro Pascal because I
knew this movie was coming out and so I was
trying to store all the thoughts in my mind. And
the guy was saying that they did used to fill
the Colisseum with water. They did used to bring boats in,
(28:27):
and they did used to have a gladiators with different
people fight like a stage naval battle, either constructed in
a body of water, natural or man made, or in
a building. And so there is some evidence that they
did fill the Colosseum.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
That's pretty cool, I mean tragic, but cool. I don't
want to see one be killed for fun.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
But apparently when this movie came out, because as we
were watching, even though I had that in my head
that they had filled the Colosseum with water, as we
were watching this scene in Gladiator too, I was like, guys,
you've literally jumped the shark. And not just because there
are sharks on screen, but like it just seems so
silly of the way they were doing it, with like
the sharks swirling around them, and then the boats were
(29:03):
on fire, and then different like gladiators kept getting knocked
off the boat, and then the sharks were like viciously
like them. Yeah, which we know unless they were like
I don't know, but like that's not sharks. It's not
real shark behavior. I don't get the sharks in there.
How did they find so many sharks?
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Y're all like big size sharks family, so many sharks.
Where were the baby sharks? I guess they have the
sharks before putting them, maybe because maybe that's why they
ate the men so quickly. The sharks eat themselves.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Because like sharks don't just see any kind of human
being and being like I'm just going to instantly, like
revenolessly attack that person.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Like there's different sharks like eating people. I was listening
to an episode of The Quickie and they had a
shark and they asked him where their sharks in the
callers there. No, They asked him like about like shark
attacks on people, and they said that shark attacks happen
out of accident, not because the shark wants to eat
the person. Apparently, people for sharks kind of like how
we smell perfume, Like it smells good, so they kind
(29:58):
of taste it and they're like, no, but I can't
actually eat that stuff for me, so doesn't make sense
to me. Well really Scott would beg to differ because
I would not tell Scott if you're listening, sharks, I
love to see ga sharks. I think it's completely believable.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Well, during the press too, someone did ask him from
Collider and they said the sharks weren't there in real life,
and Ridley Scott said, you're dead wrong. The Colosseum did
flood with water and there were sea battles. Dude, if
you can build a colosseum, you can flood it with
fucking water, are you kidding? And to get a couple
of sharks in a net from the sea, are you kidding?
Of course they can, Yeah, you're idiot. I love.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
How we just had a conversation about how to get
the sharks in and he's just like, what do you
mean they got a net? No further question.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
So Ridley Scott says it's historically accurate, So we're gonna
say it's historically accurate, even though it was very funny
to watch.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
So I also want to talk about Colie Nielsen's role,
the role that she reprised Lucilla, who played Maximus's lover
and then Paul Mescal's mum in this new movie. I mean,
what a woman. I found her role quite interesting. It
feels like her role was the one that kind of
pieced everything together because she had like a few dramatic scenes,
(31:12):
but it also felt weirdly rushed, Like I felt like
her scenes in particular were very rushed, especially between the
second and third act. Then it's just very confusing because
if you took out all the fighting and all the
like bleeding and the staring and the politics and stuff,
and you just focused on, like the heartfelt storyline between
(31:34):
Paul finding out who he really is and like his
mom and his dad and mourning his wife, it feels
quite disjointed. So the part where she goes visits him
for the first time and kind of he figures out
while she's there that he is her son, like she
is his birth mother. He yells at her, He's.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Like, well, of course, because he feels like, just to
defend Paul mescal for a moment, he feels like he
was sent away and then forgotten about. And he's looking
at this woman and you can kind of feel like
he knew straightaway that was his mum, but he was
kind of repressing it. And then he's looking at this
woman who he sees living this life of luxury with
the people that killed his wife, and he's pretty much like,
you forgot about me and you left me out there
(32:16):
to die, and now I want nothing to do with you.
And I understand marry the general.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Yeah, he killed my wife. Yeah, it's actually quite a
good setup. It's good. And he yells, he's like, get
out of my room. And then she tries to say something.
He's like, gout and then they don't talk again. And
then the next time they talk, I'm like, oh, no,
he's going to yell at her again. He's gonna yell.
They haven't talked since that first yelling situation. Immediately forgive him.
He's like, Okay, well he's got a lot going on.
(32:42):
He's trying to save Rome. He's like, oh, he's trying
to enemy. Get out of my room. So she like
they suddenly make up randomly, and she gives him Maximus's
ring that she's been wearing, and he was like, I
will wear this ring next to my wife's ring.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
That's actually meant to be a really beautiful moment. And
I just feel like you haven't taken it in here.
It's so every time I see you recently, you'll just
say that randomly, Oh.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
This ring next to my wife's. He's trying to be
nice about it. Thank you, mom, I forgive you to
give you mom.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
Because because Paul Beskil doesn't have a lot of lines,
he doesn't have a lot.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
I think that's a except for that one poem yes,
which is like the one line that he says that
everyone remembers.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
That's a creative choice and it does kind of work.
He's meant to be, you know, he's always watching and
reacting and when they ask him to speak, he's like
he's like no, they're like speaking English. He's like yeah,
sure whatever.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
He doesn't have a lot of dialogue in the film,
but I think that kind of works to his character.
It does a lot of breathing and a lot of
brooding and a lot of just like what strength.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
And on ah and then everyone's like yeah, I guess
sure what he said with both of those.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
But a lot of it is just like close ups
of his face and his body, like reacting to things
and taking things in. And I think that's interesting choice,
Like you can convey a lot without dialogue. Sometimes in
these movies they can be too much dialogue. If you
get into historical drama, and there's a lot of exposition,
a lot of explaining, a lot of men walking around
and brooding.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Is he educated because they like so. You see a
scene where like he's a young boy and then they
come to find him and then he gets sent away
by himself on a horse.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Yeah, and the different community, but he still was like
educated while he was like living in Rome with his family.
He does speak well, Okay, weird thing for us to
be debating, but I think that's maybe just how they've
kind of done his character. It's interesting because with Gladiator too,
like I just think like if it wasn't done properly,
it just would have been the most boring movie. And
I think the original scripts around it very much center
(34:33):
on like the politics and the internal power struggles. And
I'm like, when I went to this movie, I'm like,
if this is going to be a bunch of white
men standing around in rooms monologuing about their importance, I'm
out of here. I've had a long day, there's a
long line to get in here.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
I'm out.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
But the movie caters to I think what people want
from a movie in terms of like action packed, a
very fast, fast paced and the stakes are very It's
kind of like the stakes are out there of like
this is a really bad guy and this is the
good guy, and that's it. Everyone's stay in their lane.
But it kind of does work because it's a it's
a cadence of storyline that we really recognize.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
The characters are still developing in their lane to an extent.
It's almost like if you had taken out to the
Vicious Killing. This is a kid's movie about an orphan.
This is Disney movie about an orphan taken away from
his parents, coming back and fighting the bad guys and
saving everyone, Like if he took out the killer monkeys
and the killer sharks and the static and the sadistic
emperors and the fact that one of them is dying
(35:28):
from syphilis.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
This is a kid's movie. It's very good versus bad,
but adults need that sometimes too.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
Yeah, it was just such a good watch. Like I definitely,
as you said, wouldn't watch it because I do feel
like Gladiator one was more of a drama, like there
was so much it was more intense in that way
where the plot line felt like there was so much
at stake, whereas like with Gladiator two, because it's kind
of like the same storyline as Gladiator one. You kind
(35:55):
of know what's at steak already, so you can just
like enjoy.
Speaker 1 (35:57):
It just feels like more like an action, popcorn summer
kind of movie. Okay, do you want to get into ending,
which is actually quite sad because you think a lot
of people are gonna you think like they're gonna do this.
They go into you know, get out of here, and
then death after death after death.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
I got quite confused. What were you confused by? I
was confused right at the end when he was giving
that speech and there were thousands of people, and I
was like, oh, I hope the guys at the back
can hear him and they don't just start killing people
because there's no way they can hear him. They're so
far bad, Like how do they all know that we're
not fighting? Like, I don't think that message has been
passed on accurately.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Okay, So in armies they have like systems in back
in the olden days, and they have like walkie talkers
or you think of how to like pass that along,
like you have a person who's in charge of like
each section.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Pass it on, pass it on. Stop you're feeling you're
getting a message going kill and you're like, wait, kill,
just because one guy forgot to say stop killing. Okay.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
But before that, we have Denzel Washington rising to the
power of emperor because.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
Quickly he tricks Overnight.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
That was an intense scene. How he tricks the brothers,
He tricks the little Emperor. This is how we can describe.
He tricks the little Emperor, whose brain is at all
by syphilis, which is very sad for him, tricks him
into killing his brother because Denzel's thinking like the younger one,
the little one is easier to control out of these
two crazy emperors. And then Denzel wrangles it so that
the little Emperor, who's the one who's ruling now I guess,
(37:21):
names his monkey first, which everyone was a bit stressed about,
which is fair enough, it was there for long, and
then named Denzel. And then when Denzel stabbed him through
the ear him yeah, that's a bad way to go. Yeah,
I don't want to go that way, leaving him to
be in power. But then they're having the big three
down fight, and then we have the death of Acacius,
which I actually thought was really sad, but I thought
(37:43):
that it was very satisfying to have that big throwdown
fight between Pedro and Paul, because the whole movie had
been building to that, and see Pedro trying to say, acacius,
I need to call them the character names, being like no,
like we're fighting for the same thing, and being like,
I won't kill you. And then I think the big
emotional turning point for Paul Mescal was him also putting
down his sword because the only thing I'd been getting
(38:04):
up in the morning and getting him through this was
killing that man, this man who was in front of him,
and then he had to make the choice to put
his sword down.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
And then but they killed him anyway, and then Paul went,
look what you do. Do you like this? You're the
killing of your general. I'm like, all right, I feel
like Paul's in the room, that's right.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
I think they were trying because one of the most
infamous scenes from the original Gladiator, and the one that
people still repeat to this day, is are you not entertained?
And so I think they were trying to make that happen.
But which she said that how good would that be?
Might have been two on the note he was understanding ovation.
But you know what I thought was the real kind
of just the one of the ugly kills is when
(38:45):
Lucilla Connie Nielsen, his character is tied out on the
thing in the.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Middle, like she was the last living person for him. Yes,
like the last person who like probably had love for him.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Yeah, he lost his wife, he lost all of his friends,
he lost his mentor, and that was like just when
he got to Rome, and then.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
He was losing after me. The credits is still it's love.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
It's peoful opening scene. And then he's lost a lot
of people that he'd made friends with since he got there.
He's lost Acacius, who was like a new friend, Danizel
he thought he was going to be there, trained betrayed,
and then he's only got Connie Nilsen left. And the
way she dies with Denzel Washington acting, I'm just going
(39:30):
to say, like a little spoiled brat, like he's losing
the war and he could just run, he could leave,
he could find his army.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
He wanted to take everything from Paul mescal and she's like,
this is not your movie movie, Denzel Washington, and.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
Then Denzel Washington, the man, the actor takes the bowl
and arrow and shoots her through the heart in the
same way that Paul Paul Mescal lost his wife in
the opening scenes the film with an arrow through the heart.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
I'm surprised he's not traumatized by I think he is traumatized,
is what we see throughout the film.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
And then it's really on I think is a cinematic
way to describe it in terms of.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
The battle kicking horse chase.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Yes, but then we have what everyone has been b for,
which is the epic threw down between Denzel and Paul
in the river.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
You know what, it reminded me of what Black Panther.
Oh yeah, bit of a and men fighting in water
is dangerous game because like when there's drowning involved, that
takes it to a whole new life.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
Stabbing through the water, stabbing you can't see who's moving
where or who's doing what.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
They would be very intense people just rises. Yes, man,
he did look like a became victorious, and then he
had to stand between the Roman army and the other army,
which I'm getting the other Roman army, the friendly Roman
army and the other Roman army and say, look, guys,
it's been a Dan. Well, let's just put the swords down,
(40:49):
like we're all fighting for the same thing. Sometimes it's men.
We need to like let out our emotions in a different,
more healthier way. I feel like, if we just talked
about it and didn't kill each other, this could be
a really beautiful friendship. I really want a version of
the movie where he says that, and then the guys
at the back are like, what.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
Telling or not someone tell us? And we're killing great
and then they kill poor Mescal. Unfortunate with that for me,
goddamn it. And after that you want to have this
real victorious moment of like, they won, the good guys won,
but there are no winners in war. A series Animalphs
taught me that there are no winners in more. It's
all really ugly. And so then we have these scenes
of poor Mescal looking absolutely fucking devastated and broken because
(41:27):
he's staying in that arena and he was like, that's
where my dad died, that's where my mom died. Still there,
that's where Acacius died and my wife also dead.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Pulls out the little arrow and then he does that
touchy dirt thing that he loves, and yes, because he's remembering,
he's trying to feel like tied to his father and
how he died in that moment and how he's standing there.
Speaker 1 (41:45):
And this is because Paul Mescal is a good actor.
You see in his eyes that his character is thinking,
I am alive, but I am dead inside. And even
though everyone is celebrating around me, there is no celebration
for Paul.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Mescal until Gladiator three.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
Do you know? They're talking about that, and it's going
to follow in his next like through this next part
where he's been given this big power that he doesn't want.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
But you know, them all the emperor now and he's like, no,
we talked about this, boys, there's no empress.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
And he's like, you're the emperor and they're like, it's
either you or the monkey because the monkey is officially
taken in charge, and so one of you is going
to have to step up. But you know, one of
the reasons that people really want Gladiator three besides the
fact that we all really loved Gladiator two and we
want to see we want to see what other animals
they can put in them at Colosseum. We want to
see more death and blood.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
Is it because they want to rub it into Russell
Crowe more Russell Cross at home. No, He's like, how
about come back? And it goes now.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
He's like, if you could have bloodthirsty, mechanical sharks and
alien monkeys, you can have Russell Crowe back.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
I'm saying, my mafussa pitch is pretty good. It's prett good.
We should send that to them. No, they want to
see Paul Mescal have a love story. Ah boring. I
want to see por Maskell kill more men. Yeah, I
just think give the guy a minute. Wid Yeah. I
think it's because people just want killing and they want sex.
They just want normal people what they want.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Daisy Ridley appears, Daisy, so Daisy egger Jones appears.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
Well, that's why they cast Joseph Quinn because he Quinn's dead.
So Paul's like, well, who's.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
Gonna be Oh my god, Daisy ed goad Jones can
appear as the sister of the emperors, and even though
women can't have power at that time, it's going to
be her evil husband, who.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
Like Hell's the evil husband and him and Daisy get
together and then they make normal people too. In Rome,
it's like Emily in Paris. In Rome, normal people do.
Speaker 1 (43:33):
In Rome, it's all happening anyway, thank you for listening
to our very unhinged, brutally honest review of Gladiator two.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
Hope you like the movie.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
The movie because we really enjoyed it. We owed you
all to see it. And yeah, look, any day where
we're seeing a mustly poor moss girl and his perfect teeth,
even though historically and accurate, run across the screen, is
a good day.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
Thank you so much for listening to this episode of
the spill. We do so many really honest reviews. We're
gonna link a bunch of them in the show. Note
make sure you watch them first because we do talk
about spoilers and get in deep. But we will be
back here on your podcast feed at three pm on Monday.
Bye byell It, Love It.
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