June 3, 2025 • 30 mins
When contractions began during a Succession marathon with her mum, Lucinda Pikkat wasn't particularly concerned—her husband Simon was asleep at home an hour away, and surely there would be plenty of time to alert him.
In today's episode, Lucinda shares how her third daughter Saachi followed her older sisters remarkable pattern of arriving precisely at 38 weeks. As labor progressed quickly and phone calls went unanswered, Lucinda gave birth with her mother by her side, while her husband slept blissfully unaware, only discovering he had a new daughter when he woke up the next morning!
Lucinda reflects on the unexpected full-circle moment as her own mum stepped into the support role during her birth, creating a unique bond between three generations. She shares how she refined her approach to childbirth with each pregnancy, making her deliveries progressively more manageable, and describes the euphoric "warrior princess" high that accompanied each of her births.
Diary Of A Birth features mums telling their miraculous stories of bringing life into the world. If you'd like to share your birth story, we'd love to hear from you at podcast@mamamia.com.au or send us a voice note here.
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CREDITS:
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
You're listening to Amma Mia podcast. Mamma Mia acknowledges the
traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is
recorded on. We pay our respects to elders past, present
and emerging, and feel privileged to continue the sharing of
birth stories and knowledge that has been a fundamental part
of Indigenous culture. Hi. I'm Cassana Lukic and this is
(00:48):
Diary of a Birth. We love sharing all kinds of
birth stories here, but something I'm particularly passionate about is
sharing the positive stories as well as the traumatic. Birth
is hard. We all know that it's unexpected and sometimes scary,
but there are beautiful moments too. After two unmedicated and
(01:12):
complication free births, Today's mum felt confident going into her third.
Only this time she birth's so quickly her husband missed it.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
He just said, he looked at his phone and it
was multiple, like twenty miss calls, text messages from me,
my mom, everyone, and he goes, yeah, it's happened, like
he almost knew.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
But despite not having her husband there, she was delighted
to share the moment with her mother, an experience that
brought them even closer together. So let's meet today's mum.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Hi. My name's Lee Cinda, and this is the diary
of my birth with SARChI.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
So you've got three girls. You've got Poppy, Gigi, and Sachi.
And what interested me most about your story is how
you describe your berths as being relatively easy. So can
you just briefly tell me about your first two berths.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It's so funny because I say this to people and
my husband goes, were we in the same room? That
was not easy for you? He was screaming. I guess
it's like, retrospectively, looking back, it was joyful in a way.
I suppose I enjoyed it more than I thought. It
was still really hard, but I really enjoy giving birth.
(02:32):
And my mom's one of five, so maybe there's some
genetics at play. I've got free now and I've enjoyed
it so far. I could definitely keep going and having
five if I was lucky enough. But yeah, I have
enjoyed it.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
So you know, you mentioned that your mum felt like
she was a good berth, so were you're like, Okay,
this is genetic.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I was hoping it would be genetic, but at the
same time, I was like open to all options, Like
I love the sound of an epidural, like, I'm all
for advanced medicine, and you know that sounds amazing, Like
I really am all for that. So I honestly thought
I was going in to get an epidural for my
first and I thought it would be an opportunity to
be more present in the birth. I've heard all these stories,
(03:13):
so I'm like, this is great. But one thing I
wasn't aware of. I thought you sort of turned up
to the hospital and you get presented with your options,
like almost like a at a restaurant where the waiter
comes around and shares the dessert you know, trolley or
the champagne trolley. You can have this, this that, here's
your paodole endme, or there is the epidural option. But
(03:34):
there wasn't any of that. It was sort of up
to you as the patient to say what you wanted.
And I was really surprised by that. So I was waiting, thinking, man,
when's the midwife going to come back? I really want
this epi dural. It was starting to hurt. But by
the time I finally said, you know, I'm just going
to ask myself, she goes, no, it's way too late
for that. We're ready to push. So I was like,
what I need something, I need to pad it all.
(03:55):
I was just like, no, it won't, it won't kick him.
By the time you read, you've got a push and
it all just sort of happens. Where did you give
birth for Poppy in Woollongong private? So being in Barrel,
which is regional an hour and a half from Sydney.
There is a Barrel hospital here, but I just thought
making that trip to Woollongong. Honestly, it's because I paid
(04:18):
private health insurance for so bloody long. I just wanted
to make get my baby at my bark and go
to a private hospital.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Especially when you're paying for maternal private that really upset please.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I'm going to make the most of it. So we
went there, which was still a forty minute drive compared
to Sydney. So SARChI. I did wool and Gong with
the first two and then my last with Sachi. I thought,
you know what, I'll go to Sydney. That's where my GP,
the OB I really liked, was there. I just thought,
my last kid, maybe I'll do the trip to Sydney,
(04:50):
knowing I'd stay with my parents though, because I don't
think I could risk doing that hour and a half
drive in labor.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
Yeah. Okay, So you've had two beautiful births with Poppy
and Gig and then you fall pregnant with Sachi. What
are your pregnancies themselves?
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Like trimest one, Like, I don't know anyone who's had
a good trimester one really, like they're always pretty grim.
You do feel like you just constantly well, I did,
constantly exhausted, hungover, just off. So yeah, try mester ones
always like that. And then two and three is pretty good.
(05:25):
I think I just pushed through. Especially with the third.
You just have to get on with it with the
older kids, whereas I wish with Poffy and Gigi, I
took a bit more time to rest. There's nothing to prove,
you don't get you know, Brownie points, We don't, you know,
just relax. You're allowed to relax. But I feel like sometimes,
as women or all moms, you just it's not going
(05:48):
to prove something. But I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
It's that pressure to feel like you're doing a good job,
and then it's the guilt of oh god, I haven't
done a proper dinner tonight. So now I feel like
a bad mum or I have missed this or did
I forget Tuesday, or like, you know, all of those
things that we think about as moms and the amount
(06:12):
of pressure that we put on ourselves. So I completely
I understand exactly what you're talking about. But you had
really quick labors. You know, you had thirty nine weeks
for the first two, So what was your plan and
your partner's plan for baby number three?
Speaker 2 (06:29):
There was a part of me that thought, you know
what I want the future. All this time, the first
two have been completely natural, I'd like to experience a
different birth because as much as I say it was
positive and I enjoyed it, it was still at the
time horrific. It's a very hard thing. So I thought,
and I'm not necessarily present. I wasn't present. You know,
(06:51):
you become quite animalistic and you you know, you're screaming.
So I thought, you know, it might be quite nice
just holding my husband's hand for this one. But then
the other side of me thought, you know, i've I've
done it before, I can do it again. And there
is something really empowering about birthing in general. So I
was like, I can do this, and I thought, I'm
(07:12):
going to go in and try my best to do
it natural again, but no, you know the options there
and she was in the right position and everything was
okay and set to have a natural birth, so I
thought I'd give it a crack.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Yeah, So when did you head up to Sydney then?
Speaker 2 (07:27):
So it was actually thirty eight weeks both poffee and cheese.
You came bang on thirty eight weeks, and I thought,
I went to Sydney at thirty eight weeks, but to
stay with my parents, which was nice. I said to
my husband, you stay in Barrel treated as a holiday.
You can have two weeks by yourself without the other
two kids. I can be in Sydney with my mum
and dad to help with the kids. It's just a
(07:48):
nice break before number three comes into the world. And
just because the other two came at thirty eight weeks
didn't necessarily mean this one would. So I said, look,
there's no point you coming up just yet because with
you know, work and whatnot. You just stay until I
give you the call and you just jump straight in
the car. And so it was thirty eight weeks. Admittedly
I did do acupuncture, what else did I do the
(08:12):
RAS relief tea. I was wanting it to move along,
because I quite liked the idea of them all being
born at thirty eight weeks. But also, you're over it,
aren't You're so over it at that she just want
them out.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Yeah, the curb walking, the you're like, is this the
only way we're going to get this baby out? Can
somebody please just get this kid out?
Speaker 3 (08:32):
I get it.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
My mom's like, you should just enjoy these two weeks,
don't rush it, just relax. You've got me here to
help you. But I don't know, there's something about just
wanting to get her out.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
I know you're uncomfortable, you full, Their heads have dropped.
Your yea helvis feels full. You get a pee fifty
times a night, It's like it's a lot. So I
get that. But the craziest part of your whole story
is your husband's in bowel and then you start to
feel a little niggle.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah. So I thought it was getting to the end
of the evening. It was like eight pm on the
thirty eight week mark, and I thought, look, she's not
coming today. There goes my thirty eight weeks for all
of them. And I was watching Succession with my mum
and I could just sort of start feeling some sort
of twag and I'm like, oh, what's going on? And
I was rolling around. My mom's like are you okay?
(09:24):
I was like, I'm sure, I'm okay. It's just maybe
some movement. And then we're watching another episode and it
was about nine o'clock and I thought, you know what,
I'm gonna go just have a shell, wash my hair
and put a faked hat on. My mom's like, what
is your problem? But anyways, I thought, look, I'm just
gonna get prepared in case. And as the night went on,
I could just feel maybe this is it. Yeah, this
(09:47):
is it, and yeah, I just got sort of ready.
And then at about midnight I called the hospital. You know,
you've just got to let them know because hey, you're
expecting me in two weeks, but just letting you know
it could happen tonight. This is a bit of a
random thing. But my mom she takes her blood pressure
for her own sort of medication. She's like, let me
(10:08):
just take your blood pressure just to see where it's at.
And I told the hospital that and they're like, wow,
that's really high. I can't remember what it was. They're like,
you've actually you better come in now. And I came
in and a couple of hours later she was warm.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Once you had felt those niggles, did you call your husband?
Speaker 2 (10:26):
No? Because I didn't. It wasn't enough, Like it was
very low. I was moving about, I was putting my
town on. It felt. Yeah, it wasn't. I honestly didn't
think it was going to come back. She wasn't gonna
come that night. I thought, here tomorrow thing and I'd
labor potentially through the night. It wasn't enough just yet.
I thought maybe my like waters would break. But yeah,
(10:48):
in hindsight, I probably should have.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
So when did Simon get a phone call?
Speaker 2 (10:52):
So around the midnight when I knew I was gonna
have to go in, but he wasn't answering, so I
was like, okay, Well he thought, you know, you can
put your phone on sleep mode, I do not disturb.
You can have exceptions, he thought. He changed it around.
So this phone calls started coming through around midnight when
I realized, okay, couok, this is it, and then yeah,
basically every hour and then he woke up at six
(11:14):
point thirty and just jumped in the car and came
to Sydney. But yeah, it was just that's just how
quickly it comes, like it can go from just little ooh,
that's interesting. She might be getting ready to come to
woom we're on. Yeah, And they were all like that,
even with Gigi. I was lying in the hospital waiting
(11:35):
and we were I was on my phone, we were
ordering some Uber Eats it was sushi, and then by
the time he put the order in, she came and
then the Uber came like it just come. It was in.
So that active labor was about twenty five minutes.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
So wow, Okay, so you're calling your husband. Are you
panicked at this point? Are you're You're like, you know what,
He's asleep. He's clearly not going to get this. I'm
just going to go to the hospital with mum.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
If it was my first, i'd be panicked. I'd be
really on edge. Because it was the third. There, I
guess there was a part of me I was like,
my mum's here, that's really special. Like I always knew
she'd be there in the hospital with me if he
wasn't there, So I wasn't panicked and I just knew
what had happened. I was sort of laughing about it
because it was just, you know, to miss the birth
(12:21):
and he hates blood. He was forced to cut the
umbilical cord by our ob with the first Like I
was like, it's just funny how it's worked out for him,
And yeah, I wasn't too panicked at all.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, you seem like a very chilled person. I want
to hear more about the going to the hospital. Your
mom's driving you to the hospital. You're still feeling these contractions.
Are they starting to intensify?
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, so it is, yeah, and I have the contraction
app so I was sort of seeing if they were contractions,
if there was any inconsistency rhythm to them. So like
nine ish about midnight, I called the hospital and then
we went in at about two. So in all this time,
I guess you could call that laboring. My waters hadn't
(13:07):
broken though, but I could feel things were happening. And
then when I went in two o'clock, basically when I arrived,
my waters broke, which was a really good just it
worked out well with timing. And then we hung around.
It was my mum and I and that's when it
really I was still okay, like it's not sort of
I'm not bent over and howling just yet, like I'm
(13:29):
still okay and managing it. It wasn't until just that
end in active waybor it really ramps up for me
and I'm I'm on all fours, I'm running to the bathroom,
you know, being sick. And that's sort of when it
just picks up in that last little bit for me,
where it's just it's lucky. It's pretty chill up until
that last bit, it's just it's on.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Did you sort of get a check when you got
into the hospital after your order broke?
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Yeah, so she checked to make sure, yep, confirm my
waters have broken. And then I had the option if
I wanted to stay in the hospital or go home
and labor more at home. But just based on my
experience with the other two coming so quickly, they said
just stay in the hospital. You've got your mum here.
We're here as well. It was really early hours of
the morning. They said, we'll give eu ob a call.
It like five five thirty. He also missed the berth
(14:16):
as well. It just sort of happened.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
Can we get a refund for that?
Speaker 2 (14:22):
I would say, what are we paying for? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:26):
What were you dilated at when you got into the hospital.
Do you remember four or five?
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Okay, it was enough, but not enough for them to
be alarmed or sort of be all lies on me.
At this point. They just said, you know, shout out
if you really need me. But it's even at that
four or five. You know, it's different for everyone. It's
just I'm not necessarily I'm contracting, and those contractions hurt,
but in between, I'm still pretty okay. I think I
(14:52):
was like on my phone in between, even at four
or five, and then yeah, on all fours again for
the contraction, and then back again on my phone. So
I just it's not too bad until it hits that
eight centimeters dilated for me, where it just yeah or
hell breaks loose. Just the way that you describe it
sounds like your body is made to birth, and that's incredible.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Coming up.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
It feels almost euphoric, like you feel like warrior princess.
It's just sort of done this huge thing.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
So you get to your eight centimeters and nine ten,
you're in this transition phase. It's really hurting. Your mom's
there with you, the husband's asleep having a lovely rest.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
The o be's asleep.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Fummer, the OB's asleep, and the midwife says, okay, we're
ready to push.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
I actually am. I don't know if you got this,
but I vomited with all three of mine as well.
That's a sign for me that I'm going to go
into labor. So I was there, I was contracting and
I was sort of on all fours and I was
asking for the gas and they gave me it, but
it was like A turned so low, like Mom, can
you crank that up? I need more. But there was
(16:10):
a big contraction where I said I just need to
go to the bathroom. I'm going to be sick. And
I went to the bathroom and then I just sort
of collapsed and I was like, yeah, I need a push.
This is it. So I was over in the bathroom
at this point and they're like, do you want to
give birth down there? I was like, I was trying
to get a mat out for me to give birth
by the toilet. I was like, no, I can make
(16:31):
it back up onto the bed. So I crawled back
onto the bed and laid down. All my burths have
been just in that position where I am on my
back up. My mum was holding my hand and they
just said, this is it. You need to push, and
they raced in and it was there. And I don't know,
if it's just your body, you do actually get used
(16:53):
to it. But I do find the first Poppy was
the hardest by far in terms of that ring of
fire and that feeling of pushing. But with Gigi and
then Sartchi and they've bull been the same size, it
does get easier. So I guess if it's your body
used to just stretching out to that size. But yeah,
she came out. My mum cut the and bilical cord.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
How many how many pushes?
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Three?
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Three pushes and she was out. Yeah, she comes out,
she's aunt straight onto your chest. Yeah, you've got your
mom with you, and your mom must have been so thrilled.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
To be with you and me too. It was really special.
She was bowling her eyes out and yeah, it was
really sweet. I did, actually, I should say, with the
pushes with Poppy, and it was all just by first,
and it was so crazy, and I just wanted to
push and I was really like grunting pushing, and I
actually tore I think with it one or two degree tear.
(17:51):
And then I learned that by Gigi and then SARChI.
It's just those little pilate pushes and pumps that you
should do instead of those big grunts like I just
thought the bigger, the better to get this child out
of me. So I was really pushing. But by SARChI,
I'd learn it was just like to get them out
(18:11):
without tearing, and that happened.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Yeah, do you know, I think that's such a big thing.
Is like the I've spoken about this before, the learning
how to push, and something challenging with an epidural is
depending on how strong it is, sometimes you cannot feel
how you're pushing. So it is really important to learn
that because your body knows when to kind of ease
(18:36):
the baby out, I guess. But yeah, it's amazing that
through subsequent pregnancies you kind of learned, all right, this
is going to be a better way to push.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
It's almost opposite to what the midwife is saying, like
big push, now, big push, and that sort of to
me means just all your force into it. But yeah,
it's just yeah, that learning to do the push, but
more from internally pushing. So yeah, that was yeah, three
or four pushes and then she was out.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
She was out she was on your chest, and you
and your mum went some time together and your mom
cut the cord.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Yeah. Yeah, and then we facetimed in my husband zooming
up the highway to Sydney.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
Okay, wait wait, I got to I gotta get this
be right. So he finally wakes up. He wakes up
at six. When was SARChI born?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Five fifteen?
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Okay? So he wakes up to what.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
He just said. He looked at his phone and it
was multiple, like twenty miss calls, text messages from me,
my mom, everyone, and he goes, yeah, it's happened, like
he almost knew, and then just called me straight away.
And then I put it on FaceTime and introduced her
and he chose her name SARChI, so he was like, hi, SARChI,
like knew straight away. It wasn't who's this or what's
(19:51):
the sex and he just jumped straight from the car
and came to Sydney.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
I'm just imagining him waking up and looking at his
phone and going, oh, okay, so I've just missed. Yeah,
how does he feel about missing Sachi's birth? Is almost like, well,
I've had two, so I know what it's like.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
Yeah, and here's the time where if he sees the
slightest bit of blood he fades like he really can't
stand blood. And the first he didn't want to go
anywhere near that end with my first pregnance or second.
But the ob was like, you need to come on,
cut the cord. Cut the cord. Oh no, sorry, he
needed to pull the head out. He pulled poffy out.
He goes, no, no, no, I can't do that this,
(20:30):
come on, put your gloves on. In his fiddling about
and I was like, just hurry up, someone get this
kid out of me. So he was almost traumatized by that.
So he looked. I think maybe there's a part of
him that regrets not being there, but I think he
was pretty happy in bed and happy to meet above
when all the mess was cleaned up. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
You know, it's like the nineteen fifties are all waiting
in the room smoking their cigars, drinking. There is my
baby here. Yeah. Like it was a.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
Bit where I was like, you know, it's actually kind
of you had wanted my mom to be there to
cut the cord, So even if he was there, I'd
be like, mom, you do it.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Was your mom there for all three of your berths.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
No, no, no, it was always just Simon.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
That's a beautiful special moment for you and your mom
to share.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Yeah, so it was really special.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
And tell me about Simon meeting Sachi for the first
time when he finally gets to Sydney.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Yeah, he sort of just waltzed on in with some
coffees for.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
All of us.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
And sat down and yeah, Gabric cuddle did their Chester
chest skin on skin. He hates all the blood and stuff,
so he cleaned her up straight away, you know, all
the white stuff you meant to keep on her a
bit because let's get rid of this. But no, he
was You could just you know, when they're just almost
shock like his pupils were so big, like it was
all sort of you can tell her he was running
(21:51):
on adrenaline just as much as I was. And yeah,
it was nice. So he had some good bonding time
and just made sure it was, yeah, an extra long
bonding session of the Chester Chest. So he had some
time alone. I think we left him in the room
for a bit so he could have that moment with Sashi.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
You did mention a little bit about the oxytocin high,
the high that you feel after giving birth. And I've
heard this from a few other women who've given birth
vaginally without medication. Can you tell me about that high
that you feel.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Yeah, it feels almost euphoric. Especially it's just this overwhelming,
like you feel like a warrior princess. It's just sort
of done, this huge thing and the rush, and I
guess and it lasts almost like forty eight hours, just
this high of like I guess, maybe pride and happiness
(22:48):
that you've got this beautiful child, but it's more about
your You just feel so proud is a good word
for it. Maybe it's just yeah, it's incredible. But then
I guess with any up comes the down and they
talk about the is it the three day baby blues? Oh?
Speaker 1 (23:03):
God? Those that's the one thing I worn first time.
Mom's about I said, day five, you were going to
feel a dip, Yes, you were going to be really sad.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Yes. And I felt those big time as well. So
I might have felt the high initially a lot of
the intensity, but then I also felt the lows. I
just remember being in like a breastfeeding class and I
was just doing anything to try and distract myself from crying.
And I know what am I doing, and I was
just trying to like online shop or just something to
distract myself, and anything was making me cry. And that
(23:35):
is I warned mums about the baby blues and also
the engagement of the boobs, like I don't think anyone
warns you about how he engage your boos, cat, And yeah,
you're so uncomfortable. You've got the blues and you feel
low and sad and you're like, what have I done
with my life? Yeah, but it all settles down and yeah,
(23:58):
it all sort of eats itself out, but yeah, ephoric high.
It's incredible, and I think it's just it. It's the
hardest thing I've ever ever done, and I think a
lot of women it's the hardest thing they ever go through.
So maybe that's where that pride comes from, Like you
can actually do something like that.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
I mean, I obviously have had very different experiences to you,
but I definitely do deal feel and I think every
woman should, no matter the way that they give birth.
Is that immense feeling of pride and amazement at what
our bodies can do. The first thing I said when
(24:36):
my first baby came out was I've been waiting for
you for so long, and it's that like.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Love, you know, and the amount of times I was saying,
I can't do this, I can't do this. I can't
do this. You can. You can, the midwives, you can.
You almost say I can't do this. So I think
it's the finally, like you, you do do it, and
we do do it, And here's the baby that you
have been waiting for in all your life, you know,
(25:04):
even that nine months, you've been growing this thing and
feeling the kicks, and I can't just seeing their face
and you've been visualizing, visualizing and imagining for the past
nine months or you know, your life what they would
look like, and then you see their little swished up face,
even though that's nothing what they'll eventually look like. But yeah,
(25:24):
it's pretty spectacular. Yeah, it's like I do anything for
that feeling. Although this after Gigi, the first thing I
said is I'm never doing this again.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
Okay, So now that such he's nine months, has that
feeling of I'm never doing this again gone away.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
I would love another one. I'm so ready to go now,
like I would love And you know, you sort of
get that feeling where you're looking at baby names, you
thinking little things I'm there, ready to go. My husband
was set on two and we compromised at three. So
I'm sort of aut that challenging spot where I would
(26:01):
really love another one, but he was so set on two.
I just don't want to have, like we've got such
a beautiful, healthy relationship and with our three healthy kids,
adding another child into the mix where he was so
adamant not too. I don't want that to disrupt our
unit and union at the moment. So we just we've
(26:22):
got to figure that out.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
You know what you've got, You've got some time and
you can always like go back and thinking about it
and talk about it and stuff like that. But thank
you for sharing such a positive and beautiful story with us.
Absolute pleasure to talk to you, and thank you for
sharing your story.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
I wanted to ask our resident obstrician and gynecologist, doctor
Browmin Devine, if there is a genetic component to being
a good Bertha.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
In terms of being a good bertha, you know, people
you say, oh, she's got childbearing hips. That used to
be something that people said when I was growing up,
she's got good child bearing hips, And it was often
the way someone was possibly quite covacous on the outside,
so they you know, had a curvacious pair of hips
or something like that, which doesn't really have any impact
on whether someone's going to be able to have an
(27:14):
easy birth or not. Definitely, when you talk about genetics,
there are a lot of factors that come into play
whether someone's going to have a straightforward labor or a
complicated labor. But there is a reasonable input from someone's
bone structure and the size and the shape of the
inlet of their pelvis and the outlet of their pelvis.
And we've always sort of said in obstetrics that women
(27:36):
who are smaller or shorter don't have so much height
and have little feet, so foot size four or four
and a half five. We often look at people's feet
and think, all, goodness, I wonder how you're going to
go in labor because people with little small feet often
have smaller pelvies as well, and certainly that can be
something that runs in families. Again, when I started my training,
(27:58):
we used to do this silly business where we'd get
cat scans of people's pelvis and measure the inside diameters
of their pelvis and then try and make assumptions about
whether that would mean they're going to be able to
have a vaginal birth or not, and all that just
showed us that it wasn't a very particularly accurate way
of determining people's birth outcomes at all. So it's all
(28:19):
gone by the way. But it's absolutely true that some
people have quick and relatively straightforward labors and others have
really long, slow, difficult, frankly mean and nasty labors, And
it's got very little to do at the end of
the day on how motivated you are or how much
you want to birds vaginally. There's a whole bunch of factors,
(28:40):
the size and shape of your pelvis being one, but
also the size and shape of your bubb's head and
how the head's positioned in relation to your pelvis, and
whether the placenta's going to cope with the whole of
labor and get the bub through without having a bit
of a hissy fit halfway through the labor and decide
it doesn't want to work anymore. So there's lots and
(29:01):
lots of reasons why a birth would go in one
direction or another. But certainly if a person comes in
and said, look, you know, I've got a family history,
all the women in my family birth really easily. There
is something about that you think good.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
And can doctor Devine explain what the highest that some
women experience after birth.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
It's very complex, obviously it's not just one thing. But
I think most people are aware that oxytocin, which is
the hormone that is released in labor to allow your
uterus to contract, is also known as the cuddle hormone,
so it's also released in the post orgasmic state to
make people sort of feel very smoochy and happy and
close and cuddly. So that's an interesting sort of correlation there. Also,
(29:49):
I mean, there must be a range of neurotransmitters that
are buzzing around in your brain after going through something
like a labor which is really, you know, a phenomenally
intense and really hard work time for your body and
your psyche and your hormonal system and everything. So that
(30:10):
must release a number of neurotransmitters that can bring that
sort of dopamine and things that bring that real sort
of high.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
Diary of a Birth was hosted by me Cassemie Lukich
with expert input from Dr Bromwin Define. We also want
to hear from you if you like this episode, please
share and subscribe. A five star rating goes a long
way in ensuring we continue to share all of your stories.
This episode was produced by Ella Maitland and myself Cassemie Lukic,
(30:45):
with audio production by Tina Mattalov,
You're listening to Amma Mia podcast. Mamma Mia acknowledges the
traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is
recorded on. We pay our respects to elders past, present
and emerging, and feel privileged to continue the sharing of
birth stories and knowledge that has been a fundamental part
of Indigenous culture. Hi. I'm Cassana Lukic and this is
(00:48):
Diary of a Birth. We love sharing all kinds of
birth stories here, but something I'm particularly passionate about is
sharing the positive stories as well as the traumatic. Birth
is hard. We all know that it's unexpected and sometimes scary,
but there are beautiful moments too. After two unmedicated and
(01:12):
complication free births, Today's mum felt confident going into her third.
Only this time she birth's so quickly her husband missed it.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
He just said, he looked at his phone and it
was multiple, like twenty miss calls, text messages from me,
my mom, everyone, and he goes, yeah, it's happened, like
he almost knew.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
But despite not having her husband there, she was delighted
to share the moment with her mother, an experience that
brought them even closer together. So let's meet today's mum.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Hi. My name's Lee Cinda, and this is the diary
of my birth with SARChI.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
So you've got three girls. You've got Poppy, Gigi, and Sachi.
And what interested me most about your story is how
you describe your berths as being relatively easy. So can
you just briefly tell me about your first two berths.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It's so funny because I say this to people and
my husband goes, were we in the same room? That
was not easy for you? He was screaming. I guess
it's like, retrospectively, looking back, it was joyful in a way.
I suppose I enjoyed it more than I thought. It
was still really hard, but I really enjoy giving birth.
(02:32):
And my mom's one of five, so maybe there's some
genetics at play. I've got free now and I've enjoyed
it so far. I could definitely keep going and having
five if I was lucky enough. But yeah, I have
enjoyed it.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
So you know, you mentioned that your mum felt like
she was a good berth, so were you're like, Okay,
this is genetic.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I was hoping it would be genetic, but at the
same time, I was like open to all options, Like
I love the sound of an epidural, like, I'm all
for advanced medicine, and you know that sounds amazing, Like
I really am all for that. So I honestly thought
I was going in to get an epidural for my
first and I thought it would be an opportunity to
be more present in the birth. I've heard all these stories,
(03:13):
so I'm like, this is great. But one thing I
wasn't aware of. I thought you sort of turned up
to the hospital and you get presented with your options,
like almost like a at a restaurant where the waiter
comes around and shares the dessert you know, trolley or
the champagne trolley. You can have this, this that, here's
your paodole endme, or there is the epidural option. But
(03:34):
there wasn't any of that. It was sort of up
to you as the patient to say what you wanted.
And I was really surprised by that. So I was waiting, thinking, man,
when's the midwife going to come back? I really want
this epi dural. It was starting to hurt. But by
the time I finally said, you know, I'm just going
to ask myself, she goes, no, it's way too late
for that. We're ready to push. So I was like,
what I need something, I need to pad it all.
(03:55):
I was just like, no, it won't, it won't kick him.
By the time you read, you've got a push and
it all just sort of happens. Where did you give
birth for Poppy in Woollongong private? So being in Barrel,
which is regional an hour and a half from Sydney.
There is a Barrel hospital here, but I just thought
making that trip to Woollongong. Honestly, it's because I paid
(04:18):
private health insurance for so bloody long. I just wanted
to make get my baby at my bark and go
to a private hospital.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Especially when you're paying for maternal private that really upset please.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I'm going to make the most of it. So we
went there, which was still a forty minute drive compared
to Sydney. So SARChI. I did wool and Gong with
the first two and then my last with Sachi. I thought,
you know what, I'll go to Sydney. That's where my GP,
the OB I really liked, was there. I just thought,
my last kid, maybe I'll do the trip to Sydney,
(04:50):
knowing I'd stay with my parents though, because I don't
think I could risk doing that hour and a half
drive in labor.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
Yeah. Okay, So you've had two beautiful births with Poppy
and Gig and then you fall pregnant with Sachi. What
are your pregnancies themselves?
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Like trimest one, Like, I don't know anyone who's had
a good trimester one really, like they're always pretty grim.
You do feel like you just constantly well, I did,
constantly exhausted, hungover, just off. So yeah, try mester ones
always like that. And then two and three is pretty good.
(05:25):
I think I just pushed through. Especially with the third.
You just have to get on with it with the
older kids, whereas I wish with Poffy and Gigi, I
took a bit more time to rest. There's nothing to prove,
you don't get you know, Brownie points, We don't, you know,
just relax. You're allowed to relax. But I feel like sometimes,
as women or all moms, you just it's not going
(05:48):
to prove something. But I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
It's that pressure to feel like you're doing a good job,
and then it's the guilt of oh god, I haven't
done a proper dinner tonight. So now I feel like
a bad mum or I have missed this or did
I forget Tuesday, or like, you know, all of those
things that we think about as moms and the amount
(06:12):
of pressure that we put on ourselves. So I completely
I understand exactly what you're talking about. But you had
really quick labors. You know, you had thirty nine weeks
for the first two, So what was your plan and
your partner's plan for baby number three?
Speaker 2 (06:29):
There was a part of me that thought, you know
what I want the future. All this time, the first
two have been completely natural, I'd like to experience a
different birth because as much as I say it was
positive and I enjoyed it, it was still at the
time horrific. It's a very hard thing. So I thought,
and I'm not necessarily present. I wasn't present. You know,
(06:51):
you become quite animalistic and you you know, you're screaming.
So I thought, you know, it might be quite nice
just holding my husband's hand for this one. But then
the other side of me thought, you know, i've I've
done it before, I can do it again. And there
is something really empowering about birthing in general. So I
was like, I can do this, and I thought, I'm
(07:12):
going to go in and try my best to do
it natural again, but no, you know the options there
and she was in the right position and everything was
okay and set to have a natural birth, so I
thought I'd give it a crack.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Yeah, So when did you head up to Sydney then?
Speaker 2 (07:27):
So it was actually thirty eight weeks both poffee and cheese.
You came bang on thirty eight weeks, and I thought,
I went to Sydney at thirty eight weeks, but to
stay with my parents, which was nice. I said to
my husband, you stay in Barrel treated as a holiday.
You can have two weeks by yourself without the other
two kids. I can be in Sydney with my mum
and dad to help with the kids. It's just a
(07:48):
nice break before number three comes into the world. And
just because the other two came at thirty eight weeks
didn't necessarily mean this one would. So I said, look,
there's no point you coming up just yet because with
you know, work and whatnot. You just stay until I
give you the call and you just jump straight in
the car. And so it was thirty eight weeks. Admittedly
I did do acupuncture, what else did I do the
(08:12):
RAS relief tea. I was wanting it to move along,
because I quite liked the idea of them all being
born at thirty eight weeks. But also, you're over it,
aren't You're so over it at that she just want
them out.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Yeah, the curb walking, the you're like, is this the
only way we're going to get this baby out? Can
somebody please just get this kid out?
Speaker 3 (08:32):
I get it.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
My mom's like, you should just enjoy these two weeks,
don't rush it, just relax. You've got me here to
help you. But I don't know, there's something about just
wanting to get her out.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
I know you're uncomfortable, you full, Their heads have dropped.
Your yea helvis feels full. You get a pee fifty
times a night, It's like it's a lot. So I
get that. But the craziest part of your whole story
is your husband's in bowel and then you start to
feel a little niggle.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah. So I thought it was getting to the end
of the evening. It was like eight pm on the
thirty eight week mark, and I thought, look, she's not
coming today. There goes my thirty eight weeks for all
of them. And I was watching Succession with my mum
and I could just sort of start feeling some sort
of twag and I'm like, oh, what's going on? And
I was rolling around. My mom's like are you okay?
(09:24):
I was like, I'm sure, I'm okay. It's just maybe
some movement. And then we're watching another episode and it
was about nine o'clock and I thought, you know what,
I'm gonna go just have a shell, wash my hair
and put a faked hat on. My mom's like, what
is your problem? But anyways, I thought, look, I'm just
gonna get prepared in case. And as the night went on,
I could just feel maybe this is it. Yeah, this
(09:47):
is it, and yeah, I just got sort of ready.
And then at about midnight I called the hospital. You know,
you've just got to let them know because hey, you're
expecting me in two weeks, but just letting you know
it could happen tonight. This is a bit of a
random thing. But my mom she takes her blood pressure
for her own sort of medication. She's like, let me
(10:08):
just take your blood pressure just to see where it's at.
And I told the hospital that and they're like, wow,
that's really high. I can't remember what it was. They're like,
you've actually you better come in now. And I came
in and a couple of hours later she was warm.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Once you had felt those niggles, did you call your husband?
Speaker 2 (10:26):
No? Because I didn't. It wasn't enough, Like it was
very low. I was moving about, I was putting my
town on. It felt. Yeah, it wasn't. I honestly didn't
think it was going to come back. She wasn't gonna
come that night. I thought, here tomorrow thing and I'd
labor potentially through the night. It wasn't enough just yet.
I thought maybe my like waters would break. But yeah,
(10:48):
in hindsight, I probably should have.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
So when did Simon get a phone call?
Speaker 2 (10:52):
So around the midnight when I knew I was gonna
have to go in, but he wasn't answering, so I
was like, okay, Well he thought, you know, you can
put your phone on sleep mode, I do not disturb.
You can have exceptions, he thought. He changed it around.
So this phone calls started coming through around midnight when
I realized, okay, couok, this is it, and then yeah,
basically every hour and then he woke up at six
(11:14):
point thirty and just jumped in the car and came
to Sydney. But yeah, it was just that's just how
quickly it comes, like it can go from just little ooh,
that's interesting. She might be getting ready to come to
woom we're on. Yeah, And they were all like that,
even with Gigi. I was lying in the hospital waiting
(11:35):
and we were I was on my phone, we were
ordering some Uber Eats it was sushi, and then by
the time he put the order in, she came and
then the Uber came like it just come. It was in.
So that active labor was about twenty five minutes.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
So wow, Okay, so you're calling your husband. Are you
panicked at this point? Are you're You're like, you know what,
He's asleep. He's clearly not going to get this. I'm
just going to go to the hospital with mum.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
If it was my first, i'd be panicked. I'd be
really on edge. Because it was the third. There, I
guess there was a part of me I was like,
my mum's here, that's really special. Like I always knew
she'd be there in the hospital with me if he
wasn't there, So I wasn't panicked and I just knew
what had happened. I was sort of laughing about it
because it was just, you know, to miss the birth
(12:21):
and he hates blood. He was forced to cut the
umbilical cord by our ob with the first Like I
was like, it's just funny how it's worked out for him,
And yeah, I wasn't too panicked at all.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, you seem like a very chilled person. I want
to hear more about the going to the hospital. Your
mom's driving you to the hospital. You're still feeling these contractions.
Are they starting to intensify?
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, so it is, yeah, and I have the contraction
app so I was sort of seeing if they were contractions,
if there was any inconsistency rhythm to them. So like
nine ish about midnight, I called the hospital and then
we went in at about two. So in all this time,
I guess you could call that laboring. My waters hadn't
(13:07):
broken though, but I could feel things were happening. And
then when I went in two o'clock, basically when I arrived,
my waters broke, which was a really good just it
worked out well with timing. And then we hung around.
It was my mum and I and that's when it
really I was still okay, like it's not sort of
I'm not bent over and howling just yet, like I'm
(13:29):
still okay and managing it. It wasn't until just that
end in active waybor it really ramps up for me
and I'm I'm on all fours, I'm running to the bathroom,
you know, being sick. And that's sort of when it
just picks up in that last little bit for me,
where it's just it's lucky. It's pretty chill up until
that last bit, it's just it's on.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Did you sort of get a check when you got
into the hospital after your order broke?
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Yeah, so she checked to make sure, yep, confirm my
waters have broken. And then I had the option if
I wanted to stay in the hospital or go home
and labor more at home. But just based on my
experience with the other two coming so quickly, they said
just stay in the hospital. You've got your mum here.
We're here as well. It was really early hours of
the morning. They said, we'll give eu ob a call.
It like five five thirty. He also missed the berth
(14:16):
as well. It just sort of happened.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
Can we get a refund for that?
Speaker 2 (14:22):
I would say, what are we paying for? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:26):
What were you dilated at when you got into the hospital.
Do you remember four or five?
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Okay, it was enough, but not enough for them to
be alarmed or sort of be all lies on me.
At this point. They just said, you know, shout out
if you really need me. But it's even at that
four or five. You know, it's different for everyone. It's
just I'm not necessarily I'm contracting, and those contractions hurt,
but in between, I'm still pretty okay. I think I
(14:52):
was like on my phone in between, even at four
or five, and then yeah, on all fours again for
the contraction, and then back again on my phone. So
I just it's not too bad until it hits that
eight centimeters dilated for me, where it just yeah or
hell breaks loose. Just the way that you describe it
sounds like your body is made to birth, and that's incredible.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Coming up.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
It feels almost euphoric, like you feel like warrior princess.
It's just sort of done this huge thing.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
So you get to your eight centimeters and nine ten,
you're in this transition phase. It's really hurting. Your mom's
there with you, the husband's asleep having a lovely rest.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
The o be's asleep.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Fummer, the OB's asleep, and the midwife says, okay, we're
ready to push.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
I actually am. I don't know if you got this,
but I vomited with all three of mine as well.
That's a sign for me that I'm going to go
into labor. So I was there, I was contracting and
I was sort of on all fours and I was
asking for the gas and they gave me it, but
it was like A turned so low, like Mom, can
you crank that up? I need more. But there was
(16:10):
a big contraction where I said I just need to
go to the bathroom. I'm going to be sick. And
I went to the bathroom and then I just sort
of collapsed and I was like, yeah, I need a push.
This is it. So I was over in the bathroom
at this point and they're like, do you want to
give birth down there? I was like, I was trying
to get a mat out for me to give birth
by the toilet. I was like, no, I can make
(16:31):
it back up onto the bed. So I crawled back
onto the bed and laid down. All my burths have
been just in that position where I am on my
back up. My mum was holding my hand and they
just said, this is it. You need to push, and
they raced in and it was there. And I don't know,
if it's just your body, you do actually get used
(16:53):
to it. But I do find the first Poppy was
the hardest by far in terms of that ring of
fire and that feeling of pushing. But with Gigi and
then Sartchi and they've bull been the same size, it
does get easier. So I guess if it's your body
used to just stretching out to that size. But yeah,
she came out. My mum cut the and bilical cord.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
How many how many pushes?
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Three?
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Three pushes and she was out. Yeah, she comes out,
she's aunt straight onto your chest. Yeah, you've got your
mom with you, and your mom must have been so thrilled.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
To be with you and me too. It was really special.
She was bowling her eyes out and yeah, it was
really sweet. I did, actually, I should say, with the
pushes with Poppy, and it was all just by first,
and it was so crazy, and I just wanted to
push and I was really like grunting pushing, and I
actually tore I think with it one or two degree tear.
(17:51):
And then I learned that by Gigi and then SARChI.
It's just those little pilate pushes and pumps that you
should do instead of those big grunts like I just
thought the bigger, the better to get this child out
of me. So I was really pushing. But by SARChI,
I'd learn it was just like to get them out
(18:11):
without tearing, and that happened.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Yeah, do you know, I think that's such a big thing.
Is like the I've spoken about this before, the learning
how to push, and something challenging with an epidural is
depending on how strong it is, sometimes you cannot feel
how you're pushing. So it is really important to learn
that because your body knows when to kind of ease
(18:36):
the baby out, I guess. But yeah, it's amazing that
through subsequent pregnancies you kind of learned, all right, this
is going to be a better way to push.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
It's almost opposite to what the midwife is saying, like
big push, now, big push, and that sort of to
me means just all your force into it. But yeah,
it's just yeah, that learning to do the push, but
more from internally pushing. So yeah, that was yeah, three
or four pushes and then she was out.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
She was out she was on your chest, and you
and your mum went some time together and your mom
cut the cord.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Yeah. Yeah, and then we facetimed in my husband zooming
up the highway to Sydney.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
Okay, wait wait, I got to I gotta get this
be right. So he finally wakes up. He wakes up
at six. When was SARChI born?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Five fifteen?
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Okay? So he wakes up to what.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
He just said. He looked at his phone and it
was multiple, like twenty miss calls, text messages from me,
my mom, everyone, and he goes, yeah, it's happened, like
he almost knew, and then just called me straight away.
And then I put it on FaceTime and introduced her
and he chose her name SARChI, so he was like, hi, SARChI,
like knew straight away. It wasn't who's this or what's
(19:51):
the sex and he just jumped straight from the car
and came to Sydney.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
I'm just imagining him waking up and looking at his
phone and going, oh, okay, so I've just missed. Yeah,
how does he feel about missing Sachi's birth? Is almost like, well,
I've had two, so I know what it's like.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
Yeah, and here's the time where if he sees the
slightest bit of blood he fades like he really can't
stand blood. And the first he didn't want to go
anywhere near that end with my first pregnance or second.
But the ob was like, you need to come on,
cut the cord. Cut the cord. Oh no, sorry, he
needed to pull the head out. He pulled poffy out.
He goes, no, no, no, I can't do that this,
(20:30):
come on, put your gloves on. In his fiddling about
and I was like, just hurry up, someone get this
kid out of me. So he was almost traumatized by that.
So he looked. I think maybe there's a part of
him that regrets not being there, but I think he
was pretty happy in bed and happy to meet above
when all the mess was cleaned up. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
You know, it's like the nineteen fifties are all waiting
in the room smoking their cigars, drinking. There is my
baby here. Yeah. Like it was a.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
Bit where I was like, you know, it's actually kind
of you had wanted my mom to be there to
cut the cord, So even if he was there, I'd
be like, mom, you do it.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Was your mom there for all three of your berths.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
No, no, no, it was always just Simon.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
That's a beautiful special moment for you and your mom
to share.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Yeah, so it was really special.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
And tell me about Simon meeting Sachi for the first
time when he finally gets to Sydney.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Yeah, he sort of just waltzed on in with some
coffees for.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
All of us.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
And sat down and yeah, Gabric cuddle did their Chester
chest skin on skin. He hates all the blood and stuff,
so he cleaned her up straight away, you know, all
the white stuff you meant to keep on her a
bit because let's get rid of this. But no, he
was You could just you know, when they're just almost
shock like his pupils were so big, like it was
all sort of you can tell her he was running
(21:51):
on adrenaline just as much as I was. And yeah,
it was nice. So he had some good bonding time
and just made sure it was, yeah, an extra long
bonding session of the Chester Chest. So he had some
time alone. I think we left him in the room
for a bit so he could have that moment with Sashi.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
You did mention a little bit about the oxytocin high,
the high that you feel after giving birth. And I've
heard this from a few other women who've given birth
vaginally without medication. Can you tell me about that high
that you feel.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Yeah, it feels almost euphoric. Especially it's just this overwhelming,
like you feel like a warrior princess. It's just sort
of done, this huge thing and the rush, and I
guess and it lasts almost like forty eight hours, just
this high of like I guess, maybe pride and happiness
(22:48):
that you've got this beautiful child, but it's more about
your You just feel so proud is a good word
for it. Maybe it's just yeah, it's incredible. But then
I guess with any up comes the down and they
talk about the is it the three day baby blues? Oh?
Speaker 1 (23:03):
God? Those that's the one thing I worn first time.
Mom's about I said, day five, you were going to
feel a dip, Yes, you were going to be really sad.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Yes. And I felt those big time as well. So
I might have felt the high initially a lot of
the intensity, but then I also felt the lows. I
just remember being in like a breastfeeding class and I
was just doing anything to try and distract myself from crying.
And I know what am I doing, and I was
just trying to like online shop or just something to
distract myself, and anything was making me cry. And that
(23:35):
is I warned mums about the baby blues and also
the engagement of the boobs, like I don't think anyone
warns you about how he engage your boos, cat, And yeah,
you're so uncomfortable. You've got the blues and you feel
low and sad and you're like, what have I done
with my life? Yeah, but it all settles down and yeah,
(23:58):
it all sort of eats itself out, but yeah, ephoric high.
It's incredible, and I think it's just it. It's the
hardest thing I've ever ever done, and I think a
lot of women it's the hardest thing they ever go through.
So maybe that's where that pride comes from, Like you
can actually do something like that.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
I mean, I obviously have had very different experiences to you,
but I definitely do deal feel and I think every
woman should, no matter the way that they give birth.
Is that immense feeling of pride and amazement at what
our bodies can do. The first thing I said when
(24:36):
my first baby came out was I've been waiting for
you for so long, and it's that like.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Love, you know, and the amount of times I was saying,
I can't do this, I can't do this. I can't
do this. You can. You can, the midwives, you can.
You almost say I can't do this. So I think
it's the finally, like you, you do do it, and
we do do it, And here's the baby that you
have been waiting for in all your life, you know,
(25:04):
even that nine months, you've been growing this thing and
feeling the kicks, and I can't just seeing their face
and you've been visualizing, visualizing and imagining for the past
nine months or you know, your life what they would
look like, and then you see their little swished up face,
even though that's nothing what they'll eventually look like. But yeah,
(25:24):
it's pretty spectacular. Yeah, it's like I do anything for
that feeling. Although this after Gigi, the first thing I
said is I'm never doing this again.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
Okay, So now that such he's nine months, has that
feeling of I'm never doing this again gone away.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
I would love another one. I'm so ready to go now,
like I would love And you know, you sort of
get that feeling where you're looking at baby names, you
thinking little things I'm there, ready to go. My husband
was set on two and we compromised at three. So
I'm sort of aut that challenging spot where I would
(26:01):
really love another one, but he was so set on two.
I just don't want to have, like we've got such
a beautiful, healthy relationship and with our three healthy kids,
adding another child into the mix where he was so
adamant not too. I don't want that to disrupt our
unit and union at the moment. So we just we've
(26:22):
got to figure that out.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
You know what you've got, You've got some time and
you can always like go back and thinking about it
and talk about it and stuff like that. But thank
you for sharing such a positive and beautiful story with us.
Absolute pleasure to talk to you, and thank you for
sharing your story.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
I wanted to ask our resident obstrician and gynecologist, doctor
Browmin Devine, if there is a genetic component to being
a good Bertha.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
In terms of being a good bertha, you know, people
you say, oh, she's got childbearing hips. That used to
be something that people said when I was growing up,
she's got good child bearing hips, And it was often
the way someone was possibly quite covacous on the outside,
so they you know, had a curvacious pair of hips
or something like that, which doesn't really have any impact
on whether someone's going to be able to have an
(27:14):
easy birth or not. Definitely, when you talk about genetics,
there are a lot of factors that come into play
whether someone's going to have a straightforward labor or a
complicated labor. But there is a reasonable input from someone's
bone structure and the size and the shape of the
inlet of their pelvis and the outlet of their pelvis.
And we've always sort of said in obstetrics that women
(27:36):
who are smaller or shorter don't have so much height
and have little feet, so foot size four or four
and a half five. We often look at people's feet
and think, all, goodness, I wonder how you're going to
go in labor because people with little small feet often
have smaller pelvies as well, and certainly that can be
something that runs in families. Again, when I started my training,
(27:58):
we used to do this silly business where we'd get
cat scans of people's pelvis and measure the inside diameters
of their pelvis and then try and make assumptions about
whether that would mean they're going to be able to
have a vaginal birth or not, and all that just
showed us that it wasn't a very particularly accurate way
of determining people's birth outcomes at all. So it's all
(28:19):
gone by the way. But it's absolutely true that some
people have quick and relatively straightforward labors and others have
really long, slow, difficult, frankly mean and nasty labors, And
it's got very little to do at the end of
the day on how motivated you are or how much
you want to birds vaginally. There's a whole bunch of factors,
(28:40):
the size and shape of your pelvis being one, but
also the size and shape of your bubb's head and
how the head's positioned in relation to your pelvis, and
whether the placenta's going to cope with the whole of
labor and get the bub through without having a bit
of a hissy fit halfway through the labor and decide
it doesn't want to work anymore. So there's lots and
(29:01):
lots of reasons why a birth would go in one
direction or another. But certainly if a person comes in
and said, look, you know, I've got a family history,
all the women in my family birth really easily. There
is something about that you think good.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
And can doctor Devine explain what the highest that some
women experience after birth.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
It's very complex, obviously it's not just one thing. But
I think most people are aware that oxytocin, which is
the hormone that is released in labor to allow your
uterus to contract, is also known as the cuddle hormone,
so it's also released in the post orgasmic state to
make people sort of feel very smoochy and happy and
close and cuddly. So that's an interesting sort of correlation there. Also,
(29:49):
I mean, there must be a range of neurotransmitters that
are buzzing around in your brain after going through something
like a labor which is really, you know, a phenomenally
intense and really hard work time for your body and
your psyche and your hormonal system and everything. So that
(30:10):
must release a number of neurotransmitters that can bring that
sort of dopamine and things that bring that real sort
of high.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
Diary of a Birth was hosted by me Cassemie Lukich
with expert input from Dr Bromwin Define. We also want
to hear from you if you like this episode, please
share and subscribe. A five star rating goes a long
way in ensuring we continue to share all of your stories.
This episode was produced by Ella Maitland and myself Cassemie Lukic,
(30:45):
with audio production by Tina Mattalov,
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