June 18, 2025 • 57 mins
On FOCAL POINT:
- John Machin is the winner of the David Blythe OAM award at Blind Citizens Australia 50th Anniversary Convention. John was on the first board of BCA.
- Rachel, from Marketing at Beyond Blindness, invited all to a number of events and activities, especially in the southern area of Adelaide.
- Dr Annmaree Watharow, and Moira Dunsmore, previewed some activities coming up for Deafblind Awareness week, and highlighted some of the challenges of people with a dual sensory impairment. One event is "A journey without sight or sound" this Friday 20th June, and a second event "Touch to Connect" Tuesday, 24th June,
- Sadam Ahmed, Technologist Extraordinaire, sharing some thoughts about the recent Apple's World Wide Developers Conference
Resources:
Blind Citizens Australia: http://www.bca.org.au
Beyond Blindness: http://www.beyondblindness.org.au
A Journey without Sight or Sound: https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/journey-without-sight-or-sound-sydney-deafblind-awareness-week-2025-tickets-1300120347959
Touch to Connect: https://www.visionaustralia.org/services/staying-connected/events/2025-06-23/touch-connect-celebrating-deafblind-awareness-week
Sadam Ahmed: http://www.sadamahmed.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:15):
Good evening and welcome to Focal Point here on Vision
Australia Radio number 90 7 a.m. Adelaide online at Via
radio via Radio Digital Adelaide and Darwin through the Community
Radio plus up with the Vision Australia Radio. Your favorite
podcast or streaming service will also find us Peter Greco
on behalf of Philip Napier, saying thank you so, so
(00:36):
much for making time to listen to us. This program
coming to you from Gardner Land come to you very,
very shortly. We'll catch up with this year's winner of
the David Blythe OAM Award, announced during the Bca's 50th
anniversary convention last weekend. The winners going to speak to
us very, very soon. We'll then catch up with Rachael
(00:56):
from Beyond Blindness. Lots of things happening there. And if
you live down south, maybe just turn the radio up
a little bit. Some interesting news coming your way. We'll
speak to doctor Anne-Marie Lutheran and also Moira Dunsmore, who
talks about Deafblind Awareness Week and some events that are
coming up and some work they're doing, some great work
(01:16):
they're doing in the area of deaf blindness and dual
sensory impairment for people who are of an older age.
And then there's Saddam. Ahmed will join us, technology expert.
He'll give us his review of the Apple event held
last week. If you're listening through 1190 7 a.m. in
Adelaide at 8:00 for your listening pleasure. Lizzie and Sam
(01:37):
are here with studio one. Let's find out right now
what songs.
S2 (01:41):
Studio one over the last year or so. We've received
quite a number of emails and quite a number of
long emails as well. So this week, to celebrate our
renewal for the next three years, we dive into the mailbag.
S3 (01:54):
Join us at 8:00 for Studio One.
S1 (01:57):
Since Australia had a very successful 50th anniversary convention. One
of the highlights was the announcement of the David Blythe
Poem Award, and this year it went to John Mason. John, welcome. Congratulations.
S4 (02:11):
Thank you very much, Peter. Glad to be on with you.
S1 (02:14):
How did you feel when you were told of this news?
S4 (02:17):
Oh, well, I was a bit surprised because I didn't
really think I deserved it, really. I didn't see myself
having done a lot of things. You know, they bind
citizens have a ward called the David Blight Award. Uh,
it is, uh, presented to a person who is considered
(02:39):
having done a lot for other blind people in their
lives and to help them in their way. I've done
a certain amount of that, I must admit, but I
hadn't done it with the idea of necessarily helping others.
I did it because I thought we were all enjoying ourselves,
and that's how it all came about.
S1 (02:57):
Well, congratulations. And it's very richly deserved. I've known you
and known of you for a long time. It's very
richly deserved. John, I guess it's a little bit special
because it's in the 50th anniversary year. That kind of
makes it a little bit more special.
S4 (03:11):
It certainly does. It's a very special award received at
a very special time. So I was very honored to
to be involved in it. I had been looking forward
to the 50th anniversary because we started up by inches
Australia some 50 years ago, and I thought, well, if
(03:33):
I can last 50 years, I'll be doing well. And
I and I made it.
S1 (03:40):
Congratulations all around. John, you were involved on the on
the very first committee, I believe.
S4 (03:45):
Oh, yeah. That's right. Do you want me to tell
you how it's done?
S1 (03:48):
Of course. Yes, please.
S4 (03:50):
It started off in 1974. I was working at a
film factory called Agfa, and there were a number of
other blind people working there. One of those was a
mate them mine. I had a blind chap named Serge Bankowski.
He passed away now, but at the time he was
working there, and he went up to Sydney one weekend
(04:12):
during 1974, and he happened to learn about a group
who was starting up a new national organization for the blind.
We already had one, of course, the Australian Federation of
Blind Citizens, which was an organization of, uh, unions and
(04:34):
other organizations of the blind. For example, the Blind Workers Union,
a trade union. The union in Western Australia and Sydney.
They were all members of that organization. But this group
came along thinking they would make an improvement on it.
And when Serge came back and told me what they
(04:58):
were going to do, we were a bit worried about it.
We had a look at some of their literature and
decided that that may be a bit of looking into,
because there's a bit there concerning. So we contacted one
of our main blind activists here in Melbourne, David Blight,
and we asked him, what did he think of it?
(05:19):
And he said, yes, indeed. It does need some looking into.
Well contact he Jeffrey Phillips Grayson who will be a
good value and will have a meeting and talk about it,
which we did. And then we decided we would call
a public meeting in early 1975. And it was agreed that, uh,
(05:45):
the five of us that was including myself should form
a committee to draw up a, uh, a policy or
constitution and bring it back to another meeting, which happened, uh,
a month or so later, and that was eventually approved
of as it was. And therefore we went ahead and
(06:06):
planned for the first convention, which took place on the
Queen's birthday weekend in Melbourne in June. I can't remember
the date right now, but we had a meeting for
1 or 2 days in Melbourne and that was then
followed up with some more of these every year or
(06:26):
every couple of years or so for, uh, all this time.
S1 (06:30):
And you visited most of the states with conventions, didn't you?
A lot of the states got a look in as
far as hosting conventions went.
S4 (06:37):
Yes. Well, once we got started, we had to, uh,
think about the public relation to interest other, uh, states
in what we were doing. And, uh, the main difference
in our organization was that we were going to make
it possible for every member to have voting rights Right
(06:58):
in the other organisation, the Australian Federation of Blind Citizens.
That was an organisation of organisation and the representatives for
those organisations had the right to do the voting. And
so it didn't give the individual person the right to
vote on matters that were of concern to them. So
(07:20):
when we started our organisation, which incidentally was called the
National Federation of Blind Citizens, but after a number of years,
we cut that down, the Blind Citizens Australia, and we
decided we would have individual voting. And so everybody has
(07:41):
the right to vote for their committee. And on issues
of concern.
S1 (07:46):
I guess in a way, if you put it in
a nutshell, John, it was about people who are blind
or low vision doing stuff for people who were blind
or have low vision like we were doing it for ourselves,
if I could put it that way.
S4 (07:58):
Oh that's right. Yes. Of course. I mean, people should
know about what bond people need and how they can
do with them and are showing themselves, not necessarily being
told by so-called people who are trying to, uh, to
follow various rules and things like that, which doesn't come
(08:20):
back to the individual. If a policy that by an
agency or an organization.
S1 (08:26):
And I guess when you look back on it, we're
talking about, you know, 1981 was the International Year for
people with disabilities. The Disability Discrimination Act came in in
the 1990s. I mean, you were way, way, way ahead
of your time.
S4 (08:41):
Well, I guess we were. That. Yeah. That's right. And, uh,
we've tried to stay ahead in various ways because we
don't want, uh, things coming along and affecting us without
us having the Opportunity to have a say and give
a voter approval, because otherwise things can get away with
(09:03):
it and we lose control.
S1 (09:06):
One of the impressive things have been some of the
people that have been in charge, either as Chairpeople or
as CEOs, are a very rich history, almost like a
who's who of the blindness community. He talked about people
like David Blythe and Bill jolly, Mary Anne Diamond, uh,
some really, uh, great names that have also gone on
(09:27):
to do other things as well.
S4 (09:29):
Oh my word. Yeah, they've been great representatives for blind people.
Very cool. And they know what they're talking about. My word. Uh,
another thing I might just mention to in mind some
of the things that have come from what we've done
as an organization. The biggest thing I think that we
(09:50):
did that affected people in Australia was audible traffic lights.
You know, there's like to go tick tick tick tick
tick and double crossing. Well, that came about because some
of us who were in the Federation were trying to
get assistance from people in technology to make a device
(10:14):
that could be fitted to virtually every road crossing in Australia. And, uh,
it seemed a big project that we'd probably never pull off.
But in fact, it did come up. We did get, uh,
a good response from the technical people who constructed and
(10:34):
modified what they were doing, and they made these traffic
lights that gave found audible sound to navigate across the road.
S1 (10:45):
It was helping people's safety and things like that. John.
You know, the general community become to depend on it
and kind of understand about that that can help a
person who's blind or low vision. So it's spreading so
well that the broader message of accessibility and inclusion.
S4 (11:03):
In daily reality we are concerned about is the blind pension,
which is given to blind people. At first we only
got a partial pension. That was many years ago now.
And then uh, we got an increase in that. And
finally we got a pension which enabled every blind person
(11:25):
to get the same rights.
S1 (11:27):
Well, those of us that have followed John will be
eternally grateful for the great work that you did. What
about yourself, John? What? What sort of things? You talked
about working in the film lab. What about some of
the other work? You've been pretty much involved with the
audio world as well, haven't you?
S4 (11:41):
Yeah, I guess when I first started out working, going
back to when I was only 20, I worked ten
years in the Royal Victorian Institute for the blind talking
book library. In the recording department, where we looked after
the recording that were made with audible books on them,
(12:04):
and we fed them out to the blind people through
the post. So I did that for ten years. Then,
as I mentioned, I was at AFA, it was 1984,
and then in about 1979, I had the opportunity to
go to the Queen Victoria Hospital in the City of Melbourne,
(12:26):
and we worked in the dark room. I was the
only blind person there. They had other people, radiographers and
that who were excited that I worked in the dark
room there for nine years. Then when the hospital moved
out to Clayton, which is that into an outer suburb,
we had to try and think of something that I
could do because they weren't going to continue their film
(12:49):
processing in the same way. So we went out to Clayton,
not sure that I was going to have a job,
but I did. Fortunately, they came up with a new
job for me and that was as patient transport officer.
That was a person who organized transport for patients coming
(13:12):
and going from the hospital. And I did that job
for 14 years. And, uh, I had a, a number
of volunteers that helped me because there was a lot
of paperwork involved with that. So I had about ten
volunteers and over ten years that we got through a
lot of bookings. The last couple of years, some 10,000
(13:34):
bookings a year. Wow. But that was what I did
for the last job I had. I retired in 2002.
S1 (13:42):
And you've kept an interesting technology.
S4 (13:44):
Yeah, I had hobbies, of course. First the amateur radio.
I kept my amateur radio license back in about 1980,
and I got a full license, and I had an
amateur radio station at my home with a large tower,
and I was able to talk to people and crossing
interstate and overseas, that was very good. And then I
(14:09):
had the idea of starting up a club for blind people,
which we called the Amateur Radio Group for the blind. And, uh,
that was one of the things I did to encourage
blind people to branch out and try new things and
have more opportunities. And then when computers came in, I
(14:31):
got interested in, uh, computing, and I learned a bit
about computers. And then I thought about starting up a
club or the computer users group, and, uh, that was, uh,
a small organization, but we were a branch of the
Blind Citizens Australia, and we, uh, we, we operated for
(14:53):
quite a number of years. Nowadays, that, uh, organization has
gained to another group, um, which is, uh, looking after
not only computers, but they're interested in technology for the
whole thing going on now for over 20 or 30 years,
I guess. I worked that.
S1 (15:12):
Out. You certainly laid the foundations for that, John. And,
I mean, technology can play such an important role in
the lives of people blind or low vision. So we
thank you and salute you for that, John. We're out
of time, which is a shame. But I gotta say,
you've also got a fantastic radio voice, which, uh, I'm
just a little bit jealous of. So congratulations on that, John. Again.
(15:36):
Well done. This year's winner of the David Blythe Award,
so richly deserved and in its 50th year. Uh, you
work with David right at the beginning, and now you've
got an award in David's name as well. So thank
you for speaking to us. We wish you well and
on behalf of anyone that's had anything to do with you,
thank you for all you've done and also those people
who've never met you. Thank you for all you've done
(15:57):
for all of us.
S4 (15:58):
Oh, that's very nice and I'm very pleased to hear
about that. So very good and nice to speak to you, Peter.
S1 (16:06):
That's the John Merchant there. This year's winner of the
David Blythe Award.
S5 (16:10):
One step beyond.
S1 (16:17):
Let's go down to the offices of Beyond Blindness and
find out what's happening. In short, the answer is plenty.
So for a man from marketing, we've got Rachel. Rachel.
Good to catch up again.
S6 (16:26):
Hi, Peter. Yeah, it's always good to talk to you.
S1 (16:29):
Now, we've been chatting over the last few months about
stuff you've been doing in country areas. We're now going
to head just a little south of Adelaide.
S6 (16:36):
Yeah, we've got a bit of an update with some
new programs that are happening with the South, just in
case you don't know. We recently employed a new member
engagement officer called Lachlan. So here's some fairly quickly hit
the ground running and put together new activities for the
southern members.
S1 (16:56):
Okay. Where do you want to start? Swish!
S6 (16:59):
Yep. He's in the process of organizing for swish, which
is blind table tennis. So he says we're excited to
introduce swish, a fun and fast paced table game designed
for people who are blind or visually impaired. And it's
a version of table tennis where the ball travels under
a raised net, and it makes a noise so that
(17:20):
the players can track it by sound. It's easy to
learn social in a great way to stay active. And
the swish table will be located at the southern office,
so that's really convenient for everyone who visits that office. And, uh,
they're planning to run the sessions on the second Thursday
(17:41):
of every month, but the starting date is still yet
to be confirmed. So whether you're new to the game
or you've played it before. Everyone's welcome to come and
give it a go.
S1 (17:51):
All right. We'll give details as to how people can
find out more shortly. It's certainly a game that's been
around for a long time, so I'm sure many would
have tried. And if you haven't been a good time
to see what it's like.
S6 (18:01):
Yeah, for sure. We have done a few sessions, I think,
in the, uh, Lefevre, which is down west. And um, yeah,
a lot of members really enjoyed that. So it's good
that members in other locations can, you know, have a
go to one.
S1 (18:17):
Of the great things about swish is doesn't matter what
the weather's like outside, you can always play because it's
played indoors and so is carpet bowls.
S6 (18:24):
Yeah. Um, this is another one that, um, lachlan's put together.
Carpet bowls is a fun social game, similar to lawn bowls,
but it's played indoors on a long strip of carpet.
It's perfect for all abilities, with smaller, lighter bowls and
a shorter playing area, making it ideal for those with
vision loss and um. The game encourages gentle movement, teamwork
(18:47):
and a bit of friendly competition. So we're currently working
on launching a regular group for the southern members. It's
still in the planning stages at the moment, but Lachlan's
taking expressions of interest for both members and volunteers.
S1 (19:01):
Terrific. Well, I have to say it's a sort of
game that anyone can play, and it doesn't matter if
it's not high intensity, because it's all about the social
interaction and the fun.
S6 (19:12):
Yeah. That's true. Yeah. And even, um, even gentle movement
is really good for the body as well. All types
of movement is, you know, doing stretches and, um, yeah,
gentle movements important to focus.
S1 (19:24):
Righteous people haven't played before. There will be people there
that have either played or can kind of coach you
or show you how the game is played. So don't
be a stranger by thinking I've never played before. I
don't know about it. You'll soon have someone to help
you and learn quickly from that.
S6 (19:38):
Yeah, definitely. We always have, um, our volunteers or, um,
staff members. There's always people around to help you. So
if it's your first time, you know, don't be shy because, um. Yeah,
you can always give it a go no matter what
sort of level you're at.
S1 (19:53):
Yeah. Talk about gentle movement. You've got a really good idea,
a sort of a gentle walking group rather than, uh,
something that's sort of super competitive or, um, you know,
ultra marathon ish. This is something a bit more, uh,
you know, a bit more, uh, evenly paced. That's a
great way to start a bit of exercise as well.
S6 (20:10):
Yeah. Um, we've got the gentle walking group, um, down south.
I'm sure a lot of our members are familiar with
the gentle walking group that we've organised from the Central
East office. So we've thought that there was a need
to have it down south. This group is designed for
members who enjoy getting outdoors for some light movement and
(20:33):
social connection, without the intensity of a longer or more
difficult walk. They'll be walking around 2 to 4km at
a relaxed pace, with plenty of time to chat, take
breaks and enjoy the fresh air together. And, um. The
South Group had their first gentle walk session on Thursday
the 5th of June, and they walked along the Christies
(20:55):
Beach foreshore and then afterwards had lunch at a local cafe.
S1 (20:59):
Sounds great. Yeah, that's going to continue. So once a month?
S6 (21:03):
Yes, it's going to be on the first Thursday of
every month. So the next ones will be on Thursday
the 3rd of July. And then following that it will
be Thursday the 7th of August and so on. So yeah,
hopefully it can continue.
S1 (21:18):
And for those that might want to go a little
bit quicker, there's something for you as well.
S6 (21:21):
If anyone thinks that the gentle walking group is a bit,
you know, too gentle for them and they want to
sort of push themselves to their limit. There's also the, um,
Southern Advanced Walking Group. So that group has been around
for a while. So, uh, that's on Tuesday the 24th
of June. This is where the advanced walkers, um, is
(21:42):
for members who enjoy a more challenging walk where they
head out on longer trails. Up to ten kilometres per walk.
And this has more varied terrain and it's a great
way to stay active and social.
S1 (21:56):
Alright, obviously Lachlan's doing a lot of work in that area,
putting all this together, so we'll give details as to
how people can get in touch with Lachlan before we
wrap up. But what about in terms of volunteers or
people to get involved, uh, who might not necessarily be
blind or have low vision?
S6 (22:11):
Yeah, we're always needing volunteers to put their hand up
for all of our activities, but especially because we're creating
these new activities, we would really like people who, um,
you know, do want to act as site guides or drivers,
particularly for the Swiss table tennis, carpet bowls and gentle
(22:31):
walking group that was just mentioned. So yeah, if that's
something that you're interested in or you have experience in
or you just want to, um, yeah, just come along
and help. Yeah. Please do contact Lachlan because we need
the members to come and, um, participate. But we also
need the volunteers to come and support the members to
(22:51):
be able to do these activities. So, yeah, if you
know anyone or you yourself might be listening. Yeah. Please
let us know.
S1 (22:59):
What's the sort of thing where, you know, if people
want to get involved. But transport might be a bit
of an issue. If you can provide us some transport,
then that might be 1 or 2 more members coming along,
which obviously gives them the opportunity to participate in these activities,
which has got to be a good thing as well.
S6 (23:15):
Yeah, for sure.
S1 (23:15):
They were talking about the southern group, but have you
also got something happening at Victor Harbour, which I guess
is a bit further south?
S6 (23:21):
Yeah. Uh, we do have the Victor Harbour talking books.
That's on the second Monday of each month. So. Yeah. Yeah.
If you are down there and, um, yeah, you are a,
a a reader, then um, yeah, come along to that and, um, yeah,
please do come along. I'll just go through all of
the other. Yeah, there's a southern social group. Uh, the
(23:45):
first Tuesday of the month. Gentle walking group, the craft group,
Blackwood coffee group, uh, talking books at Hallett Cove and
a monthly bus outing. The advanced walking group we just
talked about, as well as, uh, Marian Conversation Corner.
S1 (24:03):
And I guess there are different days, different times. So,
you know, you can always get involved with more than
one of the groups as well. You can have, you know,
2 or 3 activities you can connect up with, uh,
every month.
S6 (24:15):
Yeah, for sure. You can come to one. You can
come to all of them. Yeah. We try to um,
or Lachlan tries to, um, sort of space them out
so that they don't clash too much. So yeah, you're
welcome to come to as many as you like.
S1 (24:27):
Yeah. We're getting some pretty crazy weather at the moment
after a fairly long drought, a bit of rain and
sort of windy weather. Um, uh, out east, uh, people
can still play golf.
S6 (24:36):
Yeah. So in the central East, um, we're trying something
different with virtual Golf, which is at X Golf at
Windsor Gardens. Uh, this will allow for the activity to
carry on despite the weather, um, because it's indoors. So yeah, it's, um,
pretty timely and, um. Yeah. Good. Sort of, um, organizing
(24:58):
by Marion to do that. You know, as we're getting
into the rainy sort of season. It's good. Um, yeah.
No matter what the. You know, the show can go on. Um,
so the venue offers state of the art virtual golf simulators,
which measures and swings the shots and, um, analyzes the shots, um,
(25:19):
detailed stats and even tips on how to improve your technique.
It's all skill levels. So even if you're a beginner
or an expert, you can come along. Or maybe if
you're an expert in the, um, sort of regular outdoor golf,
but this might be a bit, you know, something, a
bit of a novelty for you to, um, yeah. Have
a try at the, um. yeah, sort of technology sort
(25:41):
of side of, of of things.
S1 (25:44):
Uh, that's why, uh, a lot of, uh, society is
moving into the technological area. So, so to Windsor Gardens,
you said.
S6 (25:50):
Yeah, that's a x-golf at Windsor Gardens. That's on Tuesday,
the 24th of June. That's at 1030 to 12. And
there is a cost of $15, but that includes the
game and soft drinks, the activity subject to a number of, um, participants.
So yeah, if it's something you'd like to come along to,
(26:10):
please do come along so that, um, we can get
a big enough group so it can go ahead and, um,
the regular golf we have that day, usually at Valley View,
will be canceled for the day. So you can, you know,
members are able to come along to this one.
S1 (26:25):
Well, no, uh, beyond Blindness has been great supporters of
golf for people blind or low vision for quite some time.
I know you've gone to some of the presentation evenings that, uh,
the blind golf, uh, people have had. So, uh, it's
kind of a continuing on that great association with that sport.
S6 (26:40):
Yeah. And I suppose it's a good introduction too. Yeah.
If you don't want to do outdoor golf, it's a
good sort of start. And yeah, you never know where
it might lead.
S1 (26:49):
Indeed. All right. So, uh, you've covered a lot of
territory there in more ways than one. Is that about it?
S6 (26:55):
Um, yeah. That's, um, pretty much it. I'll just, um,
let you know who to contact. So if you're interested
in anything down south, you can contact Lachlan. He's our
southern member engagement officer. Um, so he's at the Christies
beach office, and you can call him on 085566228 or 0438Â 051Â 223.
S1 (27:21):
Alright. And for people wanting to inquire about the golf,
that's kind of more Marion's area.
S6 (27:26):
Yeah. So that's Marion and she's at the Central East, uh,
Campbelltown office. And you can call her on 083676088 or
if you have any member inquiries or general volunteering inquiries,
that's our main office number. And you can yeah, speak
to our staff too.
S1 (27:46):
Alright. And also we'll check out your website and your
Facebook page as well. If people want to find out
a bit more or get in touch that way.
S6 (27:53):
Um, yeah. They can go to our Beyond Blindness or
we're on Facebook. You can search for, uh, Beyond Blindness
or just type us into Google and yeah, we'll come up.
S1 (28:05):
Alright. Or if you want to sign up for your
fabulous newsletters that you put together on a regular basis
to get all the information as well, that's another way
that people can keep in touch. Yeah. Rachel, you've done very,
very well. You've certainly earned your keep for this month.
So we're well done on that. And, uh, welcome to Lochlann,
who's obviously recently joined. We hope we have a long
(28:25):
and happy stay, and I'm sure he'll get on very
well with the members and volunteers as time rolls on. Rachel,
we'll catch up again next month.
S6 (28:33):
Thank you. Yeah. Thanks, Peter.
S1 (28:34):
Rachel. There from Beyond Blindness, doing wonderful work in the community.
And if you'd like to get involved, you've got all
the details. And as always, if you miss them, you
can always consult our show notes. Or you can always
give us a call here at the radio station. You're
listening to.
S7 (28:48):
Focal Point on Vision Australia Radio, on.
S1 (28:51):
VA radio, digital.
S7 (28:52):
And online at VA radio.
S1 (28:55):
Hope you're enjoying the program. Well, coming up next week
is Deafblind Awareness Week, celebrating the life and memory of
Helen Keller. Let's chat a bit about it with, uh,
Doctor Anne Murray, with who we've spoken to before. And, Marie,
welcome and thank you for your time.
S8 (29:12):
Happy to be here. We're looking forward to Deafblind Awareness Week.
And it kicks off on this Friday with um, next, uh,
Macquarie Uni, um, are having an event where people can
book in and go and experience some things about what
(29:34):
it's like from a day to day life about what
it's like to be deafblind, the challenges and the complexities
of that. And it will involve it's been run. It's
been organised by deaf blind people, run by deaf blind people,
presented by deaf blind people. And you are shepherded around
all the different stations by deaf blind people. So it's
(29:56):
a true community participation awareness raising event. And that's on
this Friday. And there are two sessions from 10 to 12,
I think, and from 2 to 4, I think. And
I think Peter will have the link that he can
give the listeners. And I think that that's the really
(30:19):
important thing, because I think there were two, I guess,
two prongs to Deafblind Awareness week. One is awareness, like
getting the general community to understand the complexities and the
challenges and also the joy and the capabilities of people
who have both sight and hearing loss. Then secondly, it's about, okay,
(30:43):
what are the specific things that we need the community to,
you know, get up and start doing a better job at.
And so the second prong is really around the challenges
of profoundly negative health care experiences. And that's the second event,
which is next Tuesday afternoon at 1:00 is a webinar
(31:06):
hosted by Deafblind Information Services. And this is where we're
talking about the healthcare experiences kind of across the board.
So from all health and social care kind of encounters
from birth, I suppose, to the end of life, from
hospital experiences to the optometrist to the audiologist, to the GP,
(31:32):
to the specialist, to the social worker, and it's about how,
you know, the danger that comes from poor communication experiences,
because these lead to really poor health and wellbeing outcomes.
So my own research has been centred around, I guess,
(31:54):
hospital experiences and how 0% got a an accessible to
them consent form. 6% understood what was going on. You know, 17%
felt that they were not treated as a human being.
And you know, and as well they were just numerous
stories of abuse. I mean, more than a third experience,
(32:16):
a form of abuse, neglect, forcible restraint or some other
exertion of power in the hospital system. So the awareness
week is about the, the, the raising, the awareness, but
also really pushing back and challenging Changing the prevailing negative
experiences and that people with any sensory impairment can be
(32:40):
subjected to. So that's the next week coming up in
a in a in a in a nutshell.
S1 (32:46):
Terrific. Well, we'll certainly put links up on our show
notes for those two events in particular Maura, you and
Anne Marie. And your team, if you like, have been
doing a fair bit of work as far as the
dual sensory impairment and particularly for older people.
S9 (33:01):
That's right. Peter. Um, so Anne Marie and I have
been collaborating for a number of years now. Actually, we've
probably got our three year anniversary coming up. Um, there's
a couple of projects on the go, um, that are
one centered in Indonesia, actually, but the other is looking
at older people and their carers, particularly because what a
(33:25):
lot of the research, including Anne-marie's and mine have shown
is the degree of social isolation and the lack of
environmental capacity for older people with GSI and the impacts
that that has on their carers as well. And I
suppose I just want to echo what Anne-Marie was saying,
(33:45):
that the Deafblind Awareness Week is, is about raising awareness
and about celebrating people who live with dual sensory impairment.
But what we did actually find for older people specifically,
is that they lack an identity and they lack an
understanding of what was going on for them, as did
their carers. So the current project is really looking at
(34:09):
how we better integrate carer networks and support networks for
older people with DSI and their carers. So if we
have any over the age of 65 years person living
with combined vision and hearing loss, we would love to
hear from you because we're really looking at trying to
(34:30):
create a number of workshops that help you understand and
communicate and help and share your story with your colleagues,
your friends, your social networks.
S1 (34:41):
One would think more. This is the sort of stuff
that might have happened before, but I guess, you know,
like a lot of good ideas, it's a bit like,
why didn't someone think of it before now? But I
guess you have. So we make the most of it.
S9 (34:54):
Yeah. I think it's, um, particularly older people with dual
sensory impairment. It's very much a hidden disability. Hearing loss particularly,
can be quite stigmatised. So people often don't admit that
they've got, um, hearing loss. It's also quite insidious. So
they tend not to recognise that their hearing loss is
(35:17):
being impaired. And it's a combination of vision and hearing
that really lead to difficulties with function, with our environment
and the social isolation. But it's not well recognised in
primary health care. It's not recognised well in the hospital setting.
I'm a registered nurse as well, so it's really something
(35:40):
that is a big concern for the growing older population.
We're going to see many more people over the age
of 75 and 80 living with dual sensory impairment, and
we don't have the right assessment tools or strategies or
support mechanisms in place, really to support them to live
(36:00):
at home successfully. And I think that also, you know,
is the same for residential aged care facilities, for instance,
where support and assessment tools are really very much in
their infancy here. So yeah, it's a huge problem.
S1 (36:18):
Marie, would you like to comment a bit further on that?
Because I mean that because it's not just hidden, but
it's also isolating, which I guess is hidden in another
sort of way.
S8 (36:27):
Ah, yeah. Um, yes. Peter, um, exactly what Moira's been saying.
I think one of the things that really made Moira
and I join forces and also with, with we wanted
to translate what we were seeing in the research into
actually practical benefit for the community. And as Moira was saying,
particularly for older people, because you're at the end of
(36:48):
your life and sensory impairment can really profoundly isolate you.
And the research says quite, quite strongly, this is associated, um,
with really, really poor health and wellbeing. It is associated
with increased risk of cognitive decline and dementia. And these
are all associated with higher costs. And it's also an
(37:10):
awful way to spend the end of your life.
S9 (37:13):
Um, absolutely.
S8 (37:14):
Connected from society and being more unwell than you need
to be and not supported. So this is why we're
sort of very much aware of this monstrous sized gap
in the way things are at the moment where we've
got this, this triple invisibility operating, where we don't have
(37:35):
a recognition at government level of dual sensory impairment and
deaf blindness as a distinct disability on its own. So
we don't even have good data because the data is
about deaf people. The data is about blind people. But
put the two together. Then the invisibility of the professionals
and practitioners and policy makers that they're not aware. Therefore
(37:56):
they're not diagnosing, they're not recognising, they're not. 80% of
the people in, in one of our studies from last
year were not given a referral or information when they
were diagnosed with dual sensory impairment. 80%. And then the
last bit we had is Moira's already alluded to the
third degree of invisibility centred around the individuals and families themselves.
(38:20):
That I don't see too good or hear too well
is what people say. They don't say I have got
a particular identity and diagnosis. So you see this as
being really critical, for we need the funding theory to
get out of bed and start funding some activities in
this regard. And, um, we need to sort of work
(38:42):
on this multi-pronged approach. And as Moira said, it's very
important not to leave the carers and families out in
the cold. It needs to have a dedicated service that
centres around expert people and expert services that understand that vision. Loss,
with a hearing loss on top of that is complicated
(39:02):
and it can be challenging. But but a good life
is still possible, and you can still be capable if
you help properly and more.
S1 (39:10):
That's the point I was going to make. I mean,
you talk about kind of the last few years of
your life, but theoretically people are living longer and longer.
So we are talking about a lot of time, a
lot of years potentially.
S9 (39:23):
Absolutely. Often, um, the participants we tend to have in
our studies are those who are over 75, 80. But
you're absolutely right. This can actually start, um, 65 and above, um,
where people are involved with my aged care. But for,
for other groups of the population, it can start as
(39:43):
young as 50. So there is a long life still
to lead with quite significant impacts, often from vision and
hearing loss. And that impact really, um, is also focused
on the carer as well. That can be husband, spouse, daughter,
you know, the family that are managing this sort of
(40:06):
social isolation, social fatigue that is going on. So it
sort of starts from the interpersonal relationships and the isolation
from external sources. And that has real ramifications for the
carer and the family too. So some of the workshops
and some of the implementation work that we are doing
(40:28):
centers around older people using the residual hearing and vision loss,
understanding their environment and knowing how to sort of talk
about dual sensory impairment with their GP or with their
nurse practitioner, so that they can start beginning to join
up the dots and find services and supports for older
(40:50):
people with DSI in the community.
S1 (40:52):
Laura and Amira, we have barely scratched the surface, but
thank you again for your passion and for your input.
And that interview just about you is coming up. We'll
we'll mark a time, I promise. But thank you both
for speaking to us and for all the very best
for the events, particularly around the Deafblind Awareness Week.
S9 (41:10):
Thank you Peter, thanks for the opportunity.
S1 (41:12):
Again, that's Laura Dunsmore and also doctor Anne-Marie Witherow talking
about Deafblind Awareness Week and dual sensory impairment. All that
information that Amber in particular spoke about will be up
on our show notes. And as always, if you haven't
got access to those. Give us a call at the
radio station and we will pass them on to you. Well,
(41:35):
Apple have just had one of their major events of
the year. Let's find out what our Salim Ahmed thinks
about it. Saddam, always great to catch up. Thanks for
your time.
S10 (41:42):
Thanks, Peter. Thanks for having me. For the umpteenth time,
I think I should have a share of your superannuation.
S1 (41:47):
Okay, well, if I was on one, you would. But
I'm not saying you still can.
S10 (41:51):
Yeah, exactly. I'll take it on regardless.
S1 (41:55):
I said underwhelming seems to be kind of the hashtag
from the Apple event.
S10 (42:00):
Yes, yes. You know, I've been I've been following Apple
now probably for the last 14 years. So I was
about 18 when I got my first Mac again, 2010, uh,
when I got my first iPhone as well. And it
seems to me and, you know, look, we'll give them
kudos where kudos is due. And I give credit always
(42:21):
give credit where credit's due. Drew. They were the first
to bring, you know, a touch screen device, make it
accessible otherwise would be in the old stone ages. But
but it really seems to be especially for power users.
And going back to my my blog post is that
things were better quality control wise 14 years ago. Now,
that sounds very sort of strange to say, but for
(42:41):
people who've been watching it and using it, power users,
you know, you could get work done productively. I remember
doing a 10,000 word essay back in 2010 with the Mac,
just just voiceover built in. And so whilst I give
them kudos, it seems to me that they they are
releasing good stuff like they've got accessibility, uh, labels now
where with iOS 26 where apps can, can, can say
(43:04):
whether they're friendly or not. That's a huge step. You know,
we've had door detection. We've had, um, you know, AI labeling, uh,
AI features there with VoiceOver. There's the Braille screen input,
which a lot of my colleagues are a fan of,
but just quality control and unfortunately, has slipped, which is
very unfortunate at this time. And that's sort of why
(43:26):
I want to say, look, we're giving kudos where kudos
is due. But sometimes you just want to get things
done and not just, you know, overwhelmed by the shiny stuff.
And I think that if they say release software by annually,
be able to fix things, like for example, in Safari
you get Safari busy, for example, or a busy web
page will make VoiceOver freeze that kind of stuff.
S1 (43:47):
Well, that's fairly unhelpful.
S10 (43:49):
It is. It is. You know, when you when you're
in a web page or you have to, you know,
submit an application, I my premise would be, you know,
we pay the same amount. I actually had a spreadsheet
that I spent over $40,000 in the last 14 years with,
with Apple hardware, which is a high number now. You know,
I like it and I teach it. And, you know,
I've got that money back. I've got my return investment back.
(44:10):
But can I you know, I expect the same quality
software control that, you know, Brianna or um, Amber will get,
you know, when they're not using VoiceOver. So we have
to really say, look, this is why I give my
clients the option. And a lot of people use the
Mac for music, for creation, for coding. But to give
(44:30):
an objective opinion, you know, we pay a lot of money.
And of course, with the socioeconomic community we're in, you know,
even more because, you know, people jobs are hard to
come by. And so therefore, you know, we should be
holding Apple to a standard of even higher quality because
they are an assistive technology provider. That's just like other
people in the business. And, you know, Apple exists to
(44:51):
sell themselves. You know, they're not they're not a charity.
So therefore we should be asking the harder question and saying, look,
you know, by all means talk about these things during
Global Awareness Day, but please just fix what you've got.
And back then when you know the late Steve was
in charge, I may he rest in peace. Things were
tightly controlled and stability was a big one. And I
(45:13):
know from snow leopard to leopard to lion, you know,
those were the good old days. And funnily enough, the
Mac is a very it's what put them on the map.
It came out 41 years ago in 1984. So that's
a product where, you know, they're neglecting. And I've said,
you know, I've said Apple 2000 pieces of feedback during
my time of, uh, of, you know, of using as a,
(45:33):
as a consumer and maybe they responded to like 5%
of the feedback actually fix the issues. So no one's
taking away, no one will ever take away what Apple's done.
You know, they'll always be in the in the halls
of fame for for for accessibility. That's that's a given.
But you know people like NFB you know who are
the state um, you know consumer for for the US.
It just seems like yeah, it's sort of just too
(45:55):
much accolade, not enough uncomfortable truths, which is fair enough.
S1 (45:59):
There seems to be maybe haven't picked up with AI
as much as they could have. Do you feel?
S10 (46:03):
Absolutely. You know Apple. That's a great example. Apple intelligence
was the big marquee feature last time at WWDC. You know,
we were promised that we'd be able to do things like,
you know, ask Siri, uh, contextually aware questions like, where
is my boarding pass? And it would go in there,
bring up the boarding pass and tell you it was
from Lauren for, you know, at 10 a.m. meeting Lauren
(46:23):
in Brisbane, for example. That's not here. You know, they
marketed it as such. I saw YouTube videos. We all did.
Where Lauren was, was, was, you know, telling information, um,
things like, you know, set up dinner reservations with Brianna
for 10 p.m. and it would do that and send
the reservation off to Brianna. So we don't have that.
And we didn't get it right through the whole iOS
(46:43):
18 cycle. So we didn't get 18.1 18, 0.1, 18.2.
And never, ever should they have promised something they couldn't deliver.
That was an absolute farce, because what it's done is,
you know, people have bought the iPhone 16. I didn't
buy it, luckily enough. But people, you know, droves did
and they were buying, you know, what was promised, say,
(47:06):
last June. Now we're June, now 20, 20, 25. Still,
we still haven't got it.
S1 (47:12):
Well, what about what about the feedback then? And I
guess the, the response to that. Do you think there's
a lot of room for improvement there?
S10 (47:20):
I think it is, yes. I absolutely know, for example,
you know, it'll it'll get things wrong. I often get,
for example, when I use the writing tools, I do
a lot of writing on my phone. If it's not,
you know, particularly drafting things, I have about 2000 notes
in my folder and it'll often say, no, can't get
that right. Or, you know, writing tools don't work here. So,
(47:40):
for example, what Gemini can do. For example, today I
was working on a coding project with my nephew. But,
you know, asking Gemini, how can I do that? And
it seems to actually pull back the information. For example,
I said, how can I make a coding project for,
you know, for making Lego because he's five years old
and it actually came back with the steps to make
to make the app step by step, as in, you know,
(48:02):
you use this code there. And not only not only
bring back the steps, but put the code in the
right places for me, because coding is a very precise
area where a left parent or a hyphen can make
a big difference, or a piece of a block of code.
So working with him, you know, he's visual. So he
could actually see that it's put the code in the
right place so that when you put it through a
simulator or, you know, we put it onto your PC,
(48:22):
it then will run the emulator, as in it'll run
in an environment that's not not Google Play. So stuff
like that is Google has always been ahead in AI,
even in the early days where the revolution started and
Apple's not. I think it's an embarrassment. They're not where
they are should be now. But also what I find
very frustrating, as we all do, is that we were
(48:45):
promised we would get these things, which is a public
relations nightmare, and I think everyone cited disabled. Whatever, whatever
you are, whatever color you are, that is a big,
big faux pas. And I really feel that, you know,
being a long time Apple user as a consumer, um,
at one stage a shareholder, that that wouldn't have happened
under Steve. You know, he wasn't perfect. And I you know,
(49:05):
I hate to bring back people that are, you know,
passed away, but something like that. He was a perfectionist.
And so it's fair enough. You know, software is not perfect.
We go through a phase and we go through betas and,
you know, tons of something, but just don't promise things
you can't deliver. It's a very unfortunate set of ears.
S1 (49:20):
I was going to ask you, did last week give
you any confidence? But I guess given what you've said
over the last 12 months and last week, it's almost
a bit irrelevant in terms of, uh, you've got to deliver.
S10 (49:28):
That's right. And, you know, look, I as I said
in my blog post, you know, we're not the honeymoon
is over. You know, it's, um, as I said, particularly
for seasoned users, uh, who have been watching for 14
years is a is a good, you know, a lot
of qualitative and quantitative data. I've definitely given them, you know,
about 33 I was 18 then, you know, Keen and
Green and um, look, I'll always, you know, advocate in
(49:50):
my own company for, you know, for, for the best
for our clients. And I always give the option for
the Mac, for the, for our clients and say, listen,
this is this is the strength I take a very objective.
I take it I take a non opinionated view, um,
in my own company and a lot of people, you know,
they use the Mac and have done, you know, one
one is a DJ and one is a music producer.
But as a consumer and for me, particularly for me,
(50:12):
you know, I do a lot of my shortest blog
post is 1100 words. I'm invoicing every day. We need
to advocate for tools that will get us into into work,
you know? And people say, well, you know, you can
run windows on your Mac, that's fine. But you know,
Susan over there, my neighbor, she doesn't have to run
windows on my Mac. Do you know, do you know,
to to get work done. And so when every dollar counts,
(50:33):
you know, I'm a say 160 per hour. That's six hours.
That's 969, 60. Every every dollar counts. So for example,
you know, at least with the with the other operating systems,
if one thing doesn't work, we have other options. You know,
you have other like Nvda or whatever. So so I
think the problem we have here with VoiceOver is okay. Sure, sure.
You know, there are there are good things there with
(50:53):
the Mac. It's accessible. You pay you pay the same price.
But if things don't work, then you're at Apple's mercy
to fix something. And so that that's where the, the
you know, where the rubber hits the road is. If
you're in a professional like myself and a lot of
people are, you know, own business, you know, you sell makeup,
whatever you are, you need to, you know, the client
doesn't care that your voice doesn't work. So you can't
(51:13):
really say right to accessibility at Apple.com because we do.
And just the nature of the DNA of the company.
You will never hear back.
S1 (51:21):
Sometimes I guess if people are thinking like you, they're
going to vote with their feet or vote with their wallet.
And so they may be either jolted into doing something
or maybe they do become a bit of a yesterday's hero.
S10 (51:32):
Of course. And you know, and look, everyone's different. Every single, um,
Saddam is different too. So, you know, it's it's, um,
it's it's. There you go. And I never say, you know,
this and that, but, you know, for me, Apple's really
lost their shine. And I'll be keeping my hardware, of course,
because I have a $40,000, $40,000. But in terms of
upgrading hardware, um, I'm very happy just to be a
(51:54):
software individual now and just upgrade what I have. And
I've got quite a fleet here to, to upgrade. And
so when, when the time comes because, you know, for example, 25%
of our, of our clients have switched to another to
Google for Android and they just get things done, you know, so,
you know, and they're in high value. You know, they're
in big, big firms. You know, they're they it's 9
to 5 corporate types, you know fortune 500 companies. So
(52:16):
for me that that was really saying a lot where
they just get on with it and look a global
awareness day. Apple should be commended. And I never will
take the Apple from away from what they've done. But 25%
of my own numbers with my own Excel spreadsheet, that's
a high number.
S1 (52:30):
Yeah. Well, you know, you've got to also look forward.
I mean, it's nice to have had the accolades in
the past, but, you know, your next job is the
next one that that that's the big one, not the
last one.
S10 (52:40):
That's right. And as I said, you know, um, you know,
the way that the iPhone came into existence was by,
you know, preying on the misfortunes of Nokia, for example.
So Nokia was huge back in the day to give
that analogy. And they didn't see it coming. But you see, um,
you know, I read an article where one of the
executives said the iPhone may not be around for ten
(53:01):
years time. And if if that is the way I is,
I is going. So I think they know that. But
you know, see if if people are upgrading, they've got
you whether you agree or not, because you still pay
for services, but in terms of actually quality innovation and
just and just software, you know, it's we're not asking
for the moon. I have faith that, you know, possibly
(53:21):
things will get better. We don't know. You know, no
one no one knows the company. It's, you know, more
secret than than Fort Knox. But I think. Really? Yeah. Consumers. Um,
because everyone's money is, you know, Bob's money as good
as as good as, uh, Rachel's money. So, so just
just I was really caution, you know, Apple's a very
(53:41):
good company at, you know, with the distortion field. The
reality distortion field. So, you know, 14 years in my case,
people have been watching it maybe in the in the 90s,
even before I was born, you know, before I was embryo.
So there you go. So they, you know, it is
a place where, you know, you will just get swept away. But. Yeah, um,
it's funny how, you know, Android is just move on
and Google, you know, 2012, it was it was the opposite.
(54:05):
You know, you didn't you didn't recommend Android device for productivity. Yeah.
You were like, you know, don't don't use KitKat. You know,
it's not good for you. It's not healthy. You know,
don't don't have a gingerbread. You get diabetes. But, you know,
it's funny how the tide has swung really dramatically.
S1 (54:18):
All right, let's see where it goes next time. Sam,
how can we find you? How can we get in touch?
S10 (54:22):
Thank you very much for the opportunity. So people can
just go to this website triple W, and it's a redirect.
It'll just go to the same place. Uh, that's the
best place to find me. I've got all my blog
posts you can read about my thoughts on Apple, uh,
which is the latest blog post there I've got on education.
I've got one on Windows 11 now. So again triple w.com.
(54:46):
They can also check out Apple Pay as well. And
Google Pay. That's the best place. That's where I do
my best work.
S1 (54:51):
Adam.
S10 (54:51):
Thank you so much Peter. All the best to you. Cheers.
S1 (54:53):
Always great to catch up with Sam. Harsh, but probably
very fair. And if you got some thoughts you can
always get in touch with us. Great chat there with Adam.
What about the Trump phone? Are you in the market
for a Trump phone? You got your hand up? No.
Hands down. Okay. I ought to describe show of the week.
It's coming up this Sunday evening. 830 SBS Viceland. Bermuda
(55:16):
Triangle A search party goes out looking for the yacht
The Revenant, which went missing in 1958 with five crew
members on board. Was it a storm, or was it
indeed the Bermuda Triangle and its magnetic anomaly? Maybe all
will be revealed. We'll find out more. And you know
(55:36):
what it's got. Audio description this Sunday evening, 830 SBS Viceland.
Bermuda Triangle check it out if your game. Some birthdays
before we go. Feel better for having a birthday? We'll
catch up with Phil on the program next week. He
had a birthday this week. So Phil, happy birthday to you.
Hope you've recovered by the time next week's program comes around.
(55:58):
Speak about Vision Australia Radio Pam Green had a birthday.
Happy birthday to you Pam. Hope you're enjoying your time.
Also wish you a very happy birthday to the very
talented Rhea Andriani. Wonderful writer creative artist Rhea. Happy birthday
to you. Don Ashworth having a birthday involved with some
wonderful AI research and Chad Paris, the white Tiger having
(56:21):
a birthday all the way from Western Australia. That wonderful
elite sprinter at the Paralympic Games. Happy birthday to you, Chad. Paris.
That's it for the program. Sam, Richard, thanks so much
for your help. Pam. Greg, thanks so much for yours.
Thanks to the team for helping us put the program together.
This program has come to you from Ghana land on
behalf of Philip Napier. This is Peter Greco saying, be
(56:44):
kind to yourselves, be thoughtful and look out for others.
All being well. Focal point back at the same time
next week on Vision Australia Radio and the Reading Radio Network.
This is focal.
S7 (56:57):
Point.
Good evening and welcome to Focal Point here on Vision
Australia Radio number 90 7 a.m. Adelaide online at Via
radio via Radio Digital Adelaide and Darwin through the Community
Radio plus up with the Vision Australia Radio. Your favorite
podcast or streaming service will also find us Peter Greco
on behalf of Philip Napier, saying thank you so, so
(00:36):
much for making time to listen to us. This program
coming to you from Gardner Land come to you very,
very shortly. We'll catch up with this year's winner of
the David Blythe OAM Award, announced during the Bca's 50th
anniversary convention last weekend. The winners going to speak to
us very, very soon. We'll then catch up with Rachael
(00:56):
from Beyond Blindness. Lots of things happening there. And if
you live down south, maybe just turn the radio up
a little bit. Some interesting news coming your way. We'll
speak to doctor Anne-Marie Lutheran and also Moira Dunsmore, who
talks about Deafblind Awareness Week and some events that are
coming up and some work they're doing, some great work
(01:16):
they're doing in the area of deaf blindness and dual
sensory impairment for people who are of an older age.
And then there's Saddam. Ahmed will join us, technology expert.
He'll give us his review of the Apple event held
last week. If you're listening through 1190 7 a.m. in
Adelaide at 8:00 for your listening pleasure. Lizzie and Sam
(01:37):
are here with studio one. Let's find out right now
what songs.
S2 (01:41):
Studio one over the last year or so. We've received
quite a number of emails and quite a number of
long emails as well. So this week, to celebrate our
renewal for the next three years, we dive into the mailbag.
S3 (01:54):
Join us at 8:00 for Studio One.
S1 (01:57):
Since Australia had a very successful 50th anniversary convention. One
of the highlights was the announcement of the David Blythe
Poem Award, and this year it went to John Mason. John, welcome. Congratulations.
S4 (02:11):
Thank you very much, Peter. Glad to be on with you.
S1 (02:14):
How did you feel when you were told of this news?
S4 (02:17):
Oh, well, I was a bit surprised because I didn't
really think I deserved it, really. I didn't see myself
having done a lot of things. You know, they bind
citizens have a ward called the David Blight Award. Uh,
it is, uh, presented to a person who is considered
(02:39):
having done a lot for other blind people in their
lives and to help them in their way. I've done
a certain amount of that, I must admit, but I
hadn't done it with the idea of necessarily helping others.
I did it because I thought we were all enjoying ourselves,
and that's how it all came about.
S1 (02:57):
Well, congratulations. And it's very richly deserved. I've known you
and known of you for a long time. It's very
richly deserved. John, I guess it's a little bit special
because it's in the 50th anniversary year. That kind of
makes it a little bit more special.
S4 (03:11):
It certainly does. It's a very special award received at
a very special time. So I was very honored to
to be involved in it. I had been looking forward
to the 50th anniversary because we started up by inches
Australia some 50 years ago, and I thought, well, if
(03:33):
I can last 50 years, I'll be doing well. And
I and I made it.
S1 (03:40):
Congratulations all around. John, you were involved on the on
the very first committee, I believe.
S4 (03:45):
Oh, yeah. That's right. Do you want me to tell
you how it's done?
S1 (03:48):
Of course. Yes, please.
S4 (03:50):
It started off in 1974. I was working at a
film factory called Agfa, and there were a number of
other blind people working there. One of those was a
mate them mine. I had a blind chap named Serge Bankowski.
He passed away now, but at the time he was
working there, and he went up to Sydney one weekend
(04:12):
during 1974, and he happened to learn about a group
who was starting up a new national organization for the blind.
We already had one, of course, the Australian Federation of
Blind Citizens, which was an organization of, uh, unions and
(04:34):
other organizations of the blind. For example, the Blind Workers Union,
a trade union. The union in Western Australia and Sydney.
They were all members of that organization. But this group
came along thinking they would make an improvement on it.
And when Serge came back and told me what they
(04:58):
were going to do, we were a bit worried about it.
We had a look at some of their literature and
decided that that may be a bit of looking into,
because there's a bit there concerning. So we contacted one
of our main blind activists here in Melbourne, David Blight,
and we asked him, what did he think of it?
(05:19):
And he said, yes, indeed. It does need some looking into.
Well contact he Jeffrey Phillips Grayson who will be a
good value and will have a meeting and talk about it,
which we did. And then we decided we would call
a public meeting in early 1975. And it was agreed that, uh,
(05:45):
the five of us that was including myself should form
a committee to draw up a, uh, a policy or
constitution and bring it back to another meeting, which happened, uh,
a month or so later, and that was eventually approved
of as it was. And therefore we went ahead and
(06:06):
planned for the first convention, which took place on the
Queen's birthday weekend in Melbourne in June. I can't remember
the date right now, but we had a meeting for
1 or 2 days in Melbourne and that was then
followed up with some more of these every year or
(06:26):
every couple of years or so for, uh, all this time.
S1 (06:30):
And you visited most of the states with conventions, didn't you?
A lot of the states got a look in as
far as hosting conventions went.
S4 (06:37):
Yes. Well, once we got started, we had to, uh,
think about the public relation to interest other, uh, states
in what we were doing. And, uh, the main difference
in our organization was that we were going to make
it possible for every member to have voting rights Right
(06:58):
in the other organisation, the Australian Federation of Blind Citizens.
That was an organisation of organisation and the representatives for
those organisations had the right to do the voting. And
so it didn't give the individual person the right to
vote on matters that were of concern to them. So
(07:20):
when we started our organisation, which incidentally was called the
National Federation of Blind Citizens, but after a number of years,
we cut that down, the Blind Citizens Australia, and we
decided we would have individual voting. And so everybody has
(07:41):
the right to vote for their committee. And on issues
of concern.
S1 (07:46):
I guess in a way, if you put it in
a nutshell, John, it was about people who are blind
or low vision doing stuff for people who were blind
or have low vision like we were doing it for ourselves,
if I could put it that way.
S4 (07:58):
Oh that's right. Yes. Of course. I mean, people should
know about what bond people need and how they can
do with them and are showing themselves, not necessarily being
told by so-called people who are trying to, uh, to
follow various rules and things like that, which doesn't come
(08:20):
back to the individual. If a policy that by an
agency or an organization.
S1 (08:26):
And I guess when you look back on it, we're
talking about, you know, 1981 was the International Year for
people with disabilities. The Disability Discrimination Act came in in
the 1990s. I mean, you were way, way, way ahead
of your time.
S4 (08:41):
Well, I guess we were. That. Yeah. That's right. And, uh,
we've tried to stay ahead in various ways because we
don't want, uh, things coming along and affecting us without
us having the Opportunity to have a say and give
a voter approval, because otherwise things can get away with
(09:03):
it and we lose control.
S1 (09:06):
One of the impressive things have been some of the
people that have been in charge, either as Chairpeople or
as CEOs, are a very rich history, almost like a
who's who of the blindness community. He talked about people
like David Blythe and Bill jolly, Mary Anne Diamond, uh,
some really, uh, great names that have also gone on
(09:27):
to do other things as well.
S4 (09:29):
Oh my word. Yeah, they've been great representatives for blind people.
Very cool. And they know what they're talking about. My word. Uh,
another thing I might just mention to in mind some
of the things that have come from what we've done
as an organization. The biggest thing I think that we
(09:50):
did that affected people in Australia was audible traffic lights.
You know, there's like to go tick tick tick tick
tick and double crossing. Well, that came about because some
of us who were in the Federation were trying to
get assistance from people in technology to make a device
(10:14):
that could be fitted to virtually every road crossing in Australia. And, uh,
it seemed a big project that we'd probably never pull off.
But in fact, it did come up. We did get, uh,
a good response from the technical people who constructed and
(10:34):
modified what they were doing, and they made these traffic
lights that gave found audible sound to navigate across the road.
S1 (10:45):
It was helping people's safety and things like that. John.
You know, the general community become to depend on it
and kind of understand about that that can help a
person who's blind or low vision. So it's spreading so
well that the broader message of accessibility and inclusion.
S4 (11:03):
In daily reality we are concerned about is the blind pension,
which is given to blind people. At first we only
got a partial pension. That was many years ago now.
And then uh, we got an increase in that. And
finally we got a pension which enabled every blind person
(11:25):
to get the same rights.
S1 (11:27):
Well, those of us that have followed John will be
eternally grateful for the great work that you did. What
about yourself, John? What? What sort of things? You talked
about working in the film lab. What about some of
the other work? You've been pretty much involved with the
audio world as well, haven't you?
S4 (11:41):
Yeah, I guess when I first started out working, going
back to when I was only 20, I worked ten
years in the Royal Victorian Institute for the blind talking
book library. In the recording department, where we looked after
the recording that were made with audible books on them,
(12:04):
and we fed them out to the blind people through
the post. So I did that for ten years. Then,
as I mentioned, I was at AFA, it was 1984,
and then in about 1979, I had the opportunity to
go to the Queen Victoria Hospital in the City of Melbourne,
(12:26):
and we worked in the dark room. I was the
only blind person there. They had other people, radiographers and
that who were excited that I worked in the dark
room there for nine years. Then when the hospital moved
out to Clayton, which is that into an outer suburb,
we had to try and think of something that I
could do because they weren't going to continue their film
(12:49):
processing in the same way. So we went out to Clayton,
not sure that I was going to have a job,
but I did. Fortunately, they came up with a new
job for me and that was as patient transport officer.
That was a person who organized transport for patients coming
(13:12):
and going from the hospital. And I did that job
for 14 years. And, uh, I had a, a number
of volunteers that helped me because there was a lot
of paperwork involved with that. So I had about ten
volunteers and over ten years that we got through a
lot of bookings. The last couple of years, some 10,000
(13:34):
bookings a year. Wow. But that was what I did
for the last job I had. I retired in 2002.
S1 (13:42):
And you've kept an interesting technology.
S4 (13:44):
Yeah, I had hobbies, of course. First the amateur radio.
I kept my amateur radio license back in about 1980,
and I got a full license, and I had an
amateur radio station at my home with a large tower,
and I was able to talk to people and crossing
interstate and overseas, that was very good. And then I
(14:09):
had the idea of starting up a club for blind people,
which we called the Amateur Radio Group for the blind. And, uh,
that was one of the things I did to encourage
blind people to branch out and try new things and
have more opportunities. And then when computers came in, I
(14:31):
got interested in, uh, computing, and I learned a bit
about computers. And then I thought about starting up a
club or the computer users group, and, uh, that was, uh,
a small organization, but we were a branch of the
Blind Citizens Australia, and we, uh, we, we operated for
(14:53):
quite a number of years. Nowadays, that, uh, organization has
gained to another group, um, which is, uh, looking after
not only computers, but they're interested in technology for the
whole thing going on now for over 20 or 30 years,
I guess. I worked that.
S1 (15:12):
Out. You certainly laid the foundations for that, John. And,
I mean, technology can play such an important role in
the lives of people blind or low vision. So we
thank you and salute you for that, John. We're out
of time, which is a shame. But I gotta say,
you've also got a fantastic radio voice, which, uh, I'm
just a little bit jealous of. So congratulations on that, John. Again.
(15:36):
Well done. This year's winner of the David Blythe Award,
so richly deserved and in its 50th year. Uh, you
work with David right at the beginning, and now you've
got an award in David's name as well. So thank
you for speaking to us. We wish you well and
on behalf of anyone that's had anything to do with you,
thank you for all you've done and also those people
who've never met you. Thank you for all you've done
(15:57):
for all of us.
S4 (15:58):
Oh, that's very nice and I'm very pleased to hear
about that. So very good and nice to speak to you, Peter.
S1 (16:06):
That's the John Merchant there. This year's winner of the
David Blythe Award.
S5 (16:10):
One step beyond.
S1 (16:17):
Let's go down to the offices of Beyond Blindness and
find out what's happening. In short, the answer is plenty.
So for a man from marketing, we've got Rachel. Rachel.
Good to catch up again.
S6 (16:26):
Hi, Peter. Yeah, it's always good to talk to you.
S1 (16:29):
Now, we've been chatting over the last few months about
stuff you've been doing in country areas. We're now going
to head just a little south of Adelaide.
S6 (16:36):
Yeah, we've got a bit of an update with some
new programs that are happening with the South, just in
case you don't know. We recently employed a new member
engagement officer called Lachlan. So here's some fairly quickly hit
the ground running and put together new activities for the
southern members.
S1 (16:56):
Okay. Where do you want to start? Swish!
S6 (16:59):
Yep. He's in the process of organizing for swish, which
is blind table tennis. So he says we're excited to
introduce swish, a fun and fast paced table game designed
for people who are blind or visually impaired. And it's
a version of table tennis where the ball travels under
a raised net, and it makes a noise so that
(17:20):
the players can track it by sound. It's easy to
learn social in a great way to stay active. And
the swish table will be located at the southern office,
so that's really convenient for everyone who visits that office. And, uh,
they're planning to run the sessions on the second Thursday
(17:41):
of every month, but the starting date is still yet
to be confirmed. So whether you're new to the game
or you've played it before. Everyone's welcome to come and
give it a go.
S1 (17:51):
All right. We'll give details as to how people can
find out more shortly. It's certainly a game that's been
around for a long time, so I'm sure many would
have tried. And if you haven't been a good time
to see what it's like.
S6 (18:01):
Yeah, for sure. We have done a few sessions, I think,
in the, uh, Lefevre, which is down west. And um, yeah,
a lot of members really enjoyed that. So it's good
that members in other locations can, you know, have a
go to one.
S1 (18:17):
Of the great things about swish is doesn't matter what
the weather's like outside, you can always play because it's
played indoors and so is carpet bowls.
S6 (18:24):
Yeah. Um, this is another one that, um, lachlan's put together.
Carpet bowls is a fun social game, similar to lawn bowls,
but it's played indoors on a long strip of carpet.
It's perfect for all abilities, with smaller, lighter bowls and
a shorter playing area, making it ideal for those with
vision loss and um. The game encourages gentle movement, teamwork
(18:47):
and a bit of friendly competition. So we're currently working
on launching a regular group for the southern members. It's
still in the planning stages at the moment, but Lachlan's
taking expressions of interest for both members and volunteers.
S1 (19:01):
Terrific. Well, I have to say it's a sort of
game that anyone can play, and it doesn't matter if
it's not high intensity, because it's all about the social
interaction and the fun.
S6 (19:12):
Yeah. That's true. Yeah. And even, um, even gentle movement
is really good for the body as well. All types
of movement is, you know, doing stretches and, um, yeah,
gentle movements important to focus.
S1 (19:24):
Righteous people haven't played before. There will be people there
that have either played or can kind of coach you
or show you how the game is played. So don't
be a stranger by thinking I've never played before. I
don't know about it. You'll soon have someone to help
you and learn quickly from that.
S6 (19:38):
Yeah, definitely. We always have, um, our volunteers or, um,
staff members. There's always people around to help you. So
if it's your first time, you know, don't be shy because, um. Yeah,
you can always give it a go no matter what
sort of level you're at.
S1 (19:53):
Yeah. Talk about gentle movement. You've got a really good idea,
a sort of a gentle walking group rather than, uh,
something that's sort of super competitive or, um, you know,
ultra marathon ish. This is something a bit more, uh,
you know, a bit more, uh, evenly paced. That's a
great way to start a bit of exercise as well.
S6 (20:10):
Yeah. Um, we've got the gentle walking group, um, down south.
I'm sure a lot of our members are familiar with
the gentle walking group that we've organised from the Central
East office. So we've thought that there was a need
to have it down south. This group is designed for
members who enjoy getting outdoors for some light movement and
(20:33):
social connection, without the intensity of a longer or more
difficult walk. They'll be walking around 2 to 4km at
a relaxed pace, with plenty of time to chat, take
breaks and enjoy the fresh air together. And, um. The
South Group had their first gentle walk session on Thursday
the 5th of June, and they walked along the Christies
(20:55):
Beach foreshore and then afterwards had lunch at a local cafe.
S1 (20:59):
Sounds great. Yeah, that's going to continue. So once a month?
S6 (21:03):
Yes, it's going to be on the first Thursday of
every month. So the next ones will be on Thursday
the 3rd of July. And then following that it will
be Thursday the 7th of August and so on. So yeah,
hopefully it can continue.
S1 (21:18):
And for those that might want to go a little
bit quicker, there's something for you as well.
S6 (21:21):
If anyone thinks that the gentle walking group is a bit,
you know, too gentle for them and they want to
sort of push themselves to their limit. There's also the, um,
Southern Advanced Walking Group. So that group has been around
for a while. So, uh, that's on Tuesday the 24th
of June. This is where the advanced walkers, um, is
(21:42):
for members who enjoy a more challenging walk where they
head out on longer trails. Up to ten kilometres per walk.
And this has more varied terrain and it's a great
way to stay active and social.
S1 (21:56):
Alright, obviously Lachlan's doing a lot of work in that area,
putting all this together, so we'll give details as to
how people can get in touch with Lachlan before we
wrap up. But what about in terms of volunteers or
people to get involved, uh, who might not necessarily be
blind or have low vision?
S6 (22:11):
Yeah, we're always needing volunteers to put their hand up
for all of our activities, but especially because we're creating
these new activities, we would really like people who, um,
you know, do want to act as site guides or drivers,
particularly for the Swiss table tennis, carpet bowls and gentle
(22:31):
walking group that was just mentioned. So yeah, if that's
something that you're interested in or you have experience in
or you just want to, um, yeah, just come along
and help. Yeah. Please do contact Lachlan because we need
the members to come and, um, participate. But we also
need the volunteers to come and support the members to
(22:51):
be able to do these activities. So, yeah, if you
know anyone or you yourself might be listening. Yeah. Please
let us know.
S1 (22:59):
What's the sort of thing where, you know, if people
want to get involved. But transport might be a bit
of an issue. If you can provide us some transport,
then that might be 1 or 2 more members coming along,
which obviously gives them the opportunity to participate in these activities,
which has got to be a good thing as well.
S6 (23:15):
Yeah, for sure.
S1 (23:15):
They were talking about the southern group, but have you
also got something happening at Victor Harbour, which I guess
is a bit further south?
S6 (23:21):
Yeah. Uh, we do have the Victor Harbour talking books.
That's on the second Monday of each month. So. Yeah. Yeah.
If you are down there and, um, yeah, you are a,
a a reader, then um, yeah, come along to that and, um, yeah,
please do come along. I'll just go through all of
the other. Yeah, there's a southern social group. Uh, the
(23:45):
first Tuesday of the month. Gentle walking group, the craft group,
Blackwood coffee group, uh, talking books at Hallett Cove and
a monthly bus outing. The advanced walking group we just
talked about, as well as, uh, Marian Conversation Corner.
S1 (24:03):
And I guess there are different days, different times. So,
you know, you can always get involved with more than
one of the groups as well. You can have, you know,
2 or 3 activities you can connect up with, uh,
every month.
S6 (24:15):
Yeah, for sure. You can come to one. You can
come to all of them. Yeah. We try to um,
or Lachlan tries to, um, sort of space them out
so that they don't clash too much. So yeah, you're
welcome to come to as many as you like.
S1 (24:27):
Yeah. We're getting some pretty crazy weather at the moment
after a fairly long drought, a bit of rain and
sort of windy weather. Um, uh, out east, uh, people
can still play golf.
S6 (24:36):
Yeah. So in the central East, um, we're trying something
different with virtual Golf, which is at X Golf at
Windsor Gardens. Uh, this will allow for the activity to
carry on despite the weather, um, because it's indoors. So yeah, it's, um,
pretty timely and, um. Yeah. Good. Sort of, um, organizing
(24:58):
by Marion to do that. You know, as we're getting
into the rainy sort of season. It's good. Um, yeah.
No matter what the. You know, the show can go on. Um,
so the venue offers state of the art virtual golf simulators,
which measures and swings the shots and, um, analyzes the shots, um,
(25:19):
detailed stats and even tips on how to improve your technique.
It's all skill levels. So even if you're a beginner
or an expert, you can come along. Or maybe if
you're an expert in the, um, sort of regular outdoor golf,
but this might be a bit, you know, something, a
bit of a novelty for you to, um, yeah. Have
a try at the, um. yeah, sort of technology sort
(25:41):
of side of, of of things.
S1 (25:44):
Uh, that's why, uh, a lot of, uh, society is
moving into the technological area. So, so to Windsor Gardens,
you said.
S6 (25:50):
Yeah, that's a x-golf at Windsor Gardens. That's on Tuesday,
the 24th of June. That's at 1030 to 12. And
there is a cost of $15, but that includes the
game and soft drinks, the activity subject to a number of, um, participants.
So yeah, if it's something you'd like to come along to,
(26:10):
please do come along so that, um, we can get
a big enough group so it can go ahead and, um,
the regular golf we have that day, usually at Valley View,
will be canceled for the day. So you can, you know,
members are able to come along to this one.
S1 (26:25):
Well, no, uh, beyond Blindness has been great supporters of
golf for people blind or low vision for quite some time.
I know you've gone to some of the presentation evenings that, uh,
the blind golf, uh, people have had. So, uh, it's
kind of a continuing on that great association with that sport.
S6 (26:40):
Yeah. And I suppose it's a good introduction too. Yeah.
If you don't want to do outdoor golf, it's a
good sort of start. And yeah, you never know where
it might lead.
S1 (26:49):
Indeed. All right. So, uh, you've covered a lot of
territory there in more ways than one. Is that about it?
S6 (26:55):
Um, yeah. That's, um, pretty much it. I'll just, um,
let you know who to contact. So if you're interested
in anything down south, you can contact Lachlan. He's our
southern member engagement officer. Um, so he's at the Christies
beach office, and you can call him on 085566228 or 0438Â 051Â 223.
S1 (27:21):
Alright. And for people wanting to inquire about the golf,
that's kind of more Marion's area.
S6 (27:26):
Yeah. So that's Marion and she's at the Central East, uh,
Campbelltown office. And you can call her on 083676088 or
if you have any member inquiries or general volunteering inquiries,
that's our main office number. And you can yeah, speak
to our staff too.
S1 (27:46):
Alright. And also we'll check out your website and your
Facebook page as well. If people want to find out
a bit more or get in touch that way.
S6 (27:53):
Um, yeah. They can go to our Beyond Blindness or
we're on Facebook. You can search for, uh, Beyond Blindness
or just type us into Google and yeah, we'll come up.
S1 (28:05):
Alright. Or if you want to sign up for your
fabulous newsletters that you put together on a regular basis
to get all the information as well, that's another way
that people can keep in touch. Yeah. Rachel, you've done very,
very well. You've certainly earned your keep for this month.
So we're well done on that. And, uh, welcome to Lochlann,
who's obviously recently joined. We hope we have a long
(28:25):
and happy stay, and I'm sure he'll get on very
well with the members and volunteers as time rolls on. Rachel,
we'll catch up again next month.
S6 (28:33):
Thank you. Yeah. Thanks, Peter.
S1 (28:34):
Rachel. There from Beyond Blindness, doing wonderful work in the community.
And if you'd like to get involved, you've got all
the details. And as always, if you miss them, you
can always consult our show notes. Or you can always
give us a call here at the radio station. You're
listening to.
S7 (28:48):
Focal Point on Vision Australia Radio, on.
S1 (28:51):
VA radio, digital.
S7 (28:52):
And online at VA radio.
S1 (28:55):
Hope you're enjoying the program. Well, coming up next week
is Deafblind Awareness Week, celebrating the life and memory of
Helen Keller. Let's chat a bit about it with, uh,
Doctor Anne Murray, with who we've spoken to before. And, Marie,
welcome and thank you for your time.
S8 (29:12):
Happy to be here. We're looking forward to Deafblind Awareness Week.
And it kicks off on this Friday with um, next, uh,
Macquarie Uni, um, are having an event where people can
book in and go and experience some things about what
(29:34):
it's like from a day to day life about what
it's like to be deafblind, the challenges and the complexities
of that. And it will involve it's been run. It's
been organised by deaf blind people, run by deaf blind people,
presented by deaf blind people. And you are shepherded around
all the different stations by deaf blind people. So it's
(29:56):
a true community participation awareness raising event. And that's on
this Friday. And there are two sessions from 10 to 12,
I think, and from 2 to 4, I think. And
I think Peter will have the link that he can
give the listeners. And I think that that's the really
(30:19):
important thing, because I think there were two, I guess,
two prongs to Deafblind Awareness week. One is awareness, like
getting the general community to understand the complexities and the
challenges and also the joy and the capabilities of people
who have both sight and hearing loss. Then secondly, it's about, okay,
(30:43):
what are the specific things that we need the community to,
you know, get up and start doing a better job at.
And so the second prong is really around the challenges
of profoundly negative health care experiences. And that's the second event,
which is next Tuesday afternoon at 1:00 is a webinar
(31:06):
hosted by Deafblind Information Services. And this is where we're
talking about the healthcare experiences kind of across the board.
So from all health and social care kind of encounters
from birth, I suppose, to the end of life, from
hospital experiences to the optometrist to the audiologist, to the GP,
(31:32):
to the specialist, to the social worker, and it's about how,
you know, the danger that comes from poor communication experiences,
because these lead to really poor health and wellbeing outcomes.
So my own research has been centred around, I guess,
(31:54):
hospital experiences and how 0% got a an accessible to
them consent form. 6% understood what was going on. You know, 17%
felt that they were not treated as a human being.
And you know, and as well they were just numerous
stories of abuse. I mean, more than a third experience,
(32:16):
a form of abuse, neglect, forcible restraint or some other
exertion of power in the hospital system. So the awareness
week is about the, the, the raising, the awareness, but
also really pushing back and challenging Changing the prevailing negative
experiences and that people with any sensory impairment can be
(32:40):
subjected to. So that's the next week coming up in
a in a in a in a nutshell.
S1 (32:46):
Terrific. Well, we'll certainly put links up on our show
notes for those two events in particular Maura, you and
Anne Marie. And your team, if you like, have been
doing a fair bit of work as far as the
dual sensory impairment and particularly for older people.
S9 (33:01):
That's right. Peter. Um, so Anne Marie and I have
been collaborating for a number of years now. Actually, we've
probably got our three year anniversary coming up. Um, there's
a couple of projects on the go, um, that are
one centered in Indonesia, actually, but the other is looking
at older people and their carers, particularly because what a
(33:25):
lot of the research, including Anne-marie's and mine have shown
is the degree of social isolation and the lack of
environmental capacity for older people with GSI and the impacts
that that has on their carers as well. And I
suppose I just want to echo what Anne-Marie was saying,
(33:45):
that the Deafblind Awareness Week is, is about raising awareness
and about celebrating people who live with dual sensory impairment.
But what we did actually find for older people specifically,
is that they lack an identity and they lack an
understanding of what was going on for them, as did
their carers. So the current project is really looking at
(34:09):
how we better integrate carer networks and support networks for
older people with DSI and their carers. So if we
have any over the age of 65 years person living
with combined vision and hearing loss, we would love to
hear from you because we're really looking at trying to
(34:30):
create a number of workshops that help you understand and
communicate and help and share your story with your colleagues,
your friends, your social networks.
S1 (34:41):
One would think more. This is the sort of stuff
that might have happened before, but I guess, you know,
like a lot of good ideas, it's a bit like,
why didn't someone think of it before now? But I
guess you have. So we make the most of it.
S9 (34:54):
Yeah. I think it's, um, particularly older people with dual
sensory impairment. It's very much a hidden disability. Hearing loss particularly,
can be quite stigmatised. So people often don't admit that
they've got, um, hearing loss. It's also quite insidious. So
they tend not to recognise that their hearing loss is
(35:17):
being impaired. And it's a combination of vision and hearing
that really lead to difficulties with function, with our environment
and the social isolation. But it's not well recognised in
primary health care. It's not recognised well in the hospital setting.
I'm a registered nurse as well, so it's really something
(35:40):
that is a big concern for the growing older population.
We're going to see many more people over the age
of 75 and 80 living with dual sensory impairment, and
we don't have the right assessment tools or strategies or
support mechanisms in place, really to support them to live
(36:00):
at home successfully. And I think that also, you know,
is the same for residential aged care facilities, for instance,
where support and assessment tools are really very much in
their infancy here. So yeah, it's a huge problem.
S1 (36:18):
Marie, would you like to comment a bit further on that?
Because I mean that because it's not just hidden, but
it's also isolating, which I guess is hidden in another
sort of way.
S8 (36:27):
Ah, yeah. Um, yes. Peter, um, exactly what Moira's been saying.
I think one of the things that really made Moira
and I join forces and also with, with we wanted
to translate what we were seeing in the research into
actually practical benefit for the community. And as Moira was saying,
particularly for older people, because you're at the end of
(36:48):
your life and sensory impairment can really profoundly isolate you.
And the research says quite, quite strongly, this is associated, um,
with really, really poor health and wellbeing. It is associated
with increased risk of cognitive decline and dementia. And these
are all associated with higher costs. And it's also an
(37:10):
awful way to spend the end of your life.
S9 (37:13):
Um, absolutely.
S8 (37:14):
Connected from society and being more unwell than you need
to be and not supported. So this is why we're
sort of very much aware of this monstrous sized gap
in the way things are at the moment where we've
got this, this triple invisibility operating, where we don't have
(37:35):
a recognition at government level of dual sensory impairment and
deaf blindness as a distinct disability on its own. So
we don't even have good data because the data is
about deaf people. The data is about blind people. But
put the two together. Then the invisibility of the professionals
and practitioners and policy makers that they're not aware. Therefore
(37:56):
they're not diagnosing, they're not recognising, they're not. 80% of
the people in, in one of our studies from last
year were not given a referral or information when they
were diagnosed with dual sensory impairment. 80%. And then the
last bit we had is Moira's already alluded to the
third degree of invisibility centred around the individuals and families themselves.
(38:20):
That I don't see too good or hear too well
is what people say. They don't say I have got
a particular identity and diagnosis. So you see this as
being really critical, for we need the funding theory to
get out of bed and start funding some activities in
this regard. And, um, we need to sort of work
(38:42):
on this multi-pronged approach. And as Moira said, it's very
important not to leave the carers and families out in
the cold. It needs to have a dedicated service that
centres around expert people and expert services that understand that vision. Loss,
with a hearing loss on top of that is complicated
(39:02):
and it can be challenging. But but a good life
is still possible, and you can still be capable if
you help properly and more.
S1 (39:10):
That's the point I was going to make. I mean,
you talk about kind of the last few years of
your life, but theoretically people are living longer and longer.
So we are talking about a lot of time, a
lot of years potentially.
S9 (39:23):
Absolutely. Often, um, the participants we tend to have in
our studies are those who are over 75, 80. But
you're absolutely right. This can actually start, um, 65 and above, um,
where people are involved with my aged care. But for,
for other groups of the population, it can start as
(39:43):
young as 50. So there is a long life still
to lead with quite significant impacts, often from vision and
hearing loss. And that impact really, um, is also focused
on the carer as well. That can be husband, spouse, daughter,
you know, the family that are managing this sort of
(40:06):
social isolation, social fatigue that is going on. So it
sort of starts from the interpersonal relationships and the isolation
from external sources. And that has real ramifications for the
carer and the family too. So some of the workshops
and some of the implementation work that we are doing
(40:28):
centers around older people using the residual hearing and vision loss,
understanding their environment and knowing how to sort of talk
about dual sensory impairment with their GP or with their
nurse practitioner, so that they can start beginning to join
up the dots and find services and supports for older
(40:50):
people with DSI in the community.
S1 (40:52):
Laura and Amira, we have barely scratched the surface, but
thank you again for your passion and for your input.
And that interview just about you is coming up. We'll
we'll mark a time, I promise. But thank you both
for speaking to us and for all the very best
for the events, particularly around the Deafblind Awareness Week.
S9 (41:10):
Thank you Peter, thanks for the opportunity.
S1 (41:12):
Again, that's Laura Dunsmore and also doctor Anne-Marie Witherow talking
about Deafblind Awareness Week and dual sensory impairment. All that
information that Amber in particular spoke about will be up
on our show notes. And as always, if you haven't
got access to those. Give us a call at the
radio station and we will pass them on to you. Well,
(41:35):
Apple have just had one of their major events of
the year. Let's find out what our Salim Ahmed thinks
about it. Saddam, always great to catch up. Thanks for
your time.
S10 (41:42):
Thanks, Peter. Thanks for having me. For the umpteenth time,
I think I should have a share of your superannuation.
S1 (41:47):
Okay, well, if I was on one, you would. But
I'm not saying you still can.
S10 (41:51):
Yeah, exactly. I'll take it on regardless.
S1 (41:55):
I said underwhelming seems to be kind of the hashtag
from the Apple event.
S10 (42:00):
Yes, yes. You know, I've been I've been following Apple
now probably for the last 14 years. So I was
about 18 when I got my first Mac again, 2010, uh,
when I got my first iPhone as well. And it
seems to me and, you know, look, we'll give them
kudos where kudos is due. And I give credit always
(42:21):
give credit where credit's due. Drew. They were the first
to bring, you know, a touch screen device, make it
accessible otherwise would be in the old stone ages. But
but it really seems to be especially for power users.
And going back to my my blog post is that
things were better quality control wise 14 years ago. Now,
that sounds very sort of strange to say, but for
(42:41):
people who've been watching it and using it, power users,
you know, you could get work done productively. I remember
doing a 10,000 word essay back in 2010 with the Mac,
just just voiceover built in. And so whilst I give
them kudos, it seems to me that they they are
releasing good stuff like they've got accessibility, uh, labels now
where with iOS 26 where apps can, can, can say
(43:04):
whether they're friendly or not. That's a huge step. You know,
we've had door detection. We've had, um, you know, AI labeling, uh,
AI features there with VoiceOver. There's the Braille screen input,
which a lot of my colleagues are a fan of,
but just quality control and unfortunately, has slipped, which is
very unfortunate at this time. And that's sort of why
(43:26):
I want to say, look, we're giving kudos where kudos
is due. But sometimes you just want to get things
done and not just, you know, overwhelmed by the shiny stuff.
And I think that if they say release software by annually,
be able to fix things, like for example, in Safari
you get Safari busy, for example, or a busy web
page will make VoiceOver freeze that kind of stuff.
S1 (43:47):
Well, that's fairly unhelpful.
S10 (43:49):
It is. It is. You know, when you when you're
in a web page or you have to, you know,
submit an application, I my premise would be, you know,
we pay the same amount. I actually had a spreadsheet
that I spent over $40,000 in the last 14 years with,
with Apple hardware, which is a high number now. You know,
I like it and I teach it. And, you know,
I've got that money back. I've got my return investment back.
(44:10):
But can I you know, I expect the same quality
software control that, you know, Brianna or um, Amber will get,
you know, when they're not using VoiceOver. So we have
to really say, look, this is why I give my
clients the option. And a lot of people use the
Mac for music, for creation, for coding. But to give
(44:30):
an objective opinion, you know, we pay a lot of money.
And of course, with the socioeconomic community we're in, you know,
even more because, you know, people jobs are hard to
come by. And so therefore, you know, we should be
holding Apple to a standard of even higher quality because
they are an assistive technology provider. That's just like other
people in the business. And, you know, Apple exists to
(44:51):
sell themselves. You know, they're not they're not a charity.
So therefore we should be asking the harder question and saying, look,
you know, by all means talk about these things during
Global Awareness Day, but please just fix what you've got.
And back then when you know the late Steve was
in charge, I may he rest in peace. Things were
tightly controlled and stability was a big one. And I
(45:13):
know from snow leopard to leopard to lion, you know,
those were the good old days. And funnily enough, the
Mac is a very it's what put them on the map.
It came out 41 years ago in 1984. So that's
a product where, you know, they're neglecting. And I've said,
you know, I've said Apple 2000 pieces of feedback during
my time of, uh, of, you know, of using as a,
(45:33):
as a consumer and maybe they responded to like 5%
of the feedback actually fix the issues. So no one's
taking away, no one will ever take away what Apple's done.
You know, they'll always be in the in the halls
of fame for for for accessibility. That's that's a given.
But you know people like NFB you know who are
the state um, you know consumer for for the US.
It just seems like yeah, it's sort of just too
(45:55):
much accolade, not enough uncomfortable truths, which is fair enough.
S1 (45:59):
There seems to be maybe haven't picked up with AI
as much as they could have. Do you feel?
S10 (46:03):
Absolutely. You know Apple. That's a great example. Apple intelligence
was the big marquee feature last time at WWDC. You know,
we were promised that we'd be able to do things like,
you know, ask Siri, uh, contextually aware questions like, where
is my boarding pass? And it would go in there,
bring up the boarding pass and tell you it was
from Lauren for, you know, at 10 a.m. meeting Lauren
(46:23):
in Brisbane, for example. That's not here. You know, they
marketed it as such. I saw YouTube videos. We all did.
Where Lauren was, was, was, you know, telling information, um,
things like, you know, set up dinner reservations with Brianna
for 10 p.m. and it would do that and send
the reservation off to Brianna. So we don't have that.
And we didn't get it right through the whole iOS
(46:43):
18 cycle. So we didn't get 18.1 18, 0.1, 18.2.
And never, ever should they have promised something they couldn't deliver.
That was an absolute farce, because what it's done is,
you know, people have bought the iPhone 16. I didn't
buy it, luckily enough. But people, you know, droves did
and they were buying, you know, what was promised, say,
(47:06):
last June. Now we're June, now 20, 20, 25. Still,
we still haven't got it.
S1 (47:12):
Well, what about what about the feedback then? And I
guess the, the response to that. Do you think there's
a lot of room for improvement there?
S10 (47:20):
I think it is, yes. I absolutely know, for example,
you know, it'll it'll get things wrong. I often get,
for example, when I use the writing tools, I do
a lot of writing on my phone. If it's not,
you know, particularly drafting things, I have about 2000 notes
in my folder and it'll often say, no, can't get
that right. Or, you know, writing tools don't work here. So,
(47:40):
for example, what Gemini can do. For example, today I
was working on a coding project with my nephew. But,
you know, asking Gemini, how can I do that? And
it seems to actually pull back the information. For example,
I said, how can I make a coding project for,
you know, for making Lego because he's five years old
and it actually came back with the steps to make
to make the app step by step, as in, you know,
(48:02):
you use this code there. And not only not only
bring back the steps, but put the code in the
right places for me, because coding is a very precise
area where a left parent or a hyphen can make
a big difference, or a piece of a block of code.
So working with him, you know, he's visual. So he
could actually see that it's put the code in the
right place so that when you put it through a
simulator or, you know, we put it onto your PC,
(48:22):
it then will run the emulator, as in it'll run
in an environment that's not not Google Play. So stuff
like that is Google has always been ahead in AI,
even in the early days where the revolution started and
Apple's not. I think it's an embarrassment. They're not where
they are should be now. But also what I find
very frustrating, as we all do, is that we were
(48:45):
promised we would get these things, which is a public
relations nightmare, and I think everyone cited disabled. Whatever, whatever
you are, whatever color you are, that is a big,
big faux pas. And I really feel that, you know,
being a long time Apple user as a consumer, um,
at one stage a shareholder, that that wouldn't have happened
under Steve. You know, he wasn't perfect. And I you know,
(49:05):
I hate to bring back people that are, you know,
passed away, but something like that. He was a perfectionist.
And so it's fair enough. You know, software is not perfect.
We go through a phase and we go through betas and,
you know, tons of something, but just don't promise things
you can't deliver. It's a very unfortunate set of ears.
S1 (49:20):
I was going to ask you, did last week give
you any confidence? But I guess given what you've said
over the last 12 months and last week, it's almost
a bit irrelevant in terms of, uh, you've got to deliver.
S10 (49:28):
That's right. And, you know, look, I as I said
in my blog post, you know, we're not the honeymoon
is over. You know, it's, um, as I said, particularly
for seasoned users, uh, who have been watching for 14
years is a is a good, you know, a lot
of qualitative and quantitative data. I've definitely given them, you know,
about 33 I was 18 then, you know, Keen and
Green and um, look, I'll always, you know, advocate in
(49:50):
my own company for, you know, for, for the best
for our clients. And I always give the option for
the Mac, for the, for our clients and say, listen,
this is this is the strength I take a very objective.
I take it I take a non opinionated view, um,
in my own company and a lot of people, you know,
they use the Mac and have done, you know, one
one is a DJ and one is a music producer.
But as a consumer and for me, particularly for me,
(50:12):
you know, I do a lot of my shortest blog
post is 1100 words. I'm invoicing every day. We need
to advocate for tools that will get us into into work,
you know? And people say, well, you know, you can
run windows on your Mac, that's fine. But you know,
Susan over there, my neighbor, she doesn't have to run
windows on my Mac. Do you know, do you know,
to to get work done. And so when every dollar counts,
(50:33):
you know, I'm a say 160 per hour. That's six hours.
That's 969, 60. Every every dollar counts. So for example,
you know, at least with the with the other operating systems,
if one thing doesn't work, we have other options. You know,
you have other like Nvda or whatever. So so I
think the problem we have here with VoiceOver is okay. Sure, sure.
You know, there are there are good things there with
(50:53):
the Mac. It's accessible. You pay you pay the same price.
But if things don't work, then you're at Apple's mercy
to fix something. And so that that's where the, the
you know, where the rubber hits the road is. If
you're in a professional like myself and a lot of
people are, you know, own business, you know, you sell makeup,
whatever you are, you need to, you know, the client
doesn't care that your voice doesn't work. So you can't
(51:13):
really say right to accessibility at Apple.com because we do.
And just the nature of the DNA of the company.
You will never hear back.
S1 (51:21):
Sometimes I guess if people are thinking like you, they're
going to vote with their feet or vote with their wallet.
And so they may be either jolted into doing something
or maybe they do become a bit of a yesterday's hero.
S10 (51:32):
Of course. And you know, and look, everyone's different. Every single, um,
Saddam is different too. So, you know, it's it's, um,
it's it's. There you go. And I never say, you know,
this and that, but, you know, for me, Apple's really
lost their shine. And I'll be keeping my hardware, of course,
because I have a $40,000, $40,000. But in terms of
upgrading hardware, um, I'm very happy just to be a
(51:54):
software individual now and just upgrade what I have. And
I've got quite a fleet here to, to upgrade. And
so when, when the time comes because, you know, for example, 25%
of our, of our clients have switched to another to
Google for Android and they just get things done, you know, so,
you know, and they're in high value. You know, they're
in big, big firms. You know, they're they it's 9
to 5 corporate types, you know fortune 500 companies. So
(52:16):
for me that that was really saying a lot where
they just get on with it and look a global
awareness day. Apple should be commended. And I never will
take the Apple from away from what they've done. But 25%
of my own numbers with my own Excel spreadsheet, that's
a high number.
S1 (52:30):
Yeah. Well, you know, you've got to also look forward.
I mean, it's nice to have had the accolades in
the past, but, you know, your next job is the
next one that that that's the big one, not the
last one.
S10 (52:40):
That's right. And as I said, you know, um, you know,
the way that the iPhone came into existence was by,
you know, preying on the misfortunes of Nokia, for example.
So Nokia was huge back in the day to give
that analogy. And they didn't see it coming. But you see, um,
you know, I read an article where one of the
executives said the iPhone may not be around for ten
(53:01):
years time. And if if that is the way I is,
I is going. So I think they know that. But
you know, see if if people are upgrading, they've got
you whether you agree or not, because you still pay
for services, but in terms of actually quality innovation and
just and just software, you know, it's we're not asking
for the moon. I have faith that, you know, possibly
(53:21):
things will get better. We don't know. You know, no
one no one knows the company. It's, you know, more
secret than than Fort Knox. But I think. Really? Yeah. Consumers. Um,
because everyone's money is, you know, Bob's money as good
as as good as, uh, Rachel's money. So, so just
just I was really caution, you know, Apple's a very
(53:41):
good company at, you know, with the distortion field. The
reality distortion field. So, you know, 14 years in my case,
people have been watching it maybe in the in the 90s,
even before I was born, you know, before I was embryo.
So there you go. So they, you know, it is
a place where, you know, you will just get swept away. But. Yeah, um,
it's funny how, you know, Android is just move on
and Google, you know, 2012, it was it was the opposite.
(54:05):
You know, you didn't you didn't recommend Android device for productivity. Yeah.
You were like, you know, don't don't use KitKat. You know,
it's not good for you. It's not healthy. You know,
don't don't have a gingerbread. You get diabetes. But, you know,
it's funny how the tide has swung really dramatically.
S1 (54:18):
All right, let's see where it goes next time. Sam,
how can we find you? How can we get in touch?
S10 (54:22):
Thank you very much for the opportunity. So people can
just go to this website triple W, and it's a redirect.
It'll just go to the same place. Uh, that's the
best place to find me. I've got all my blog
posts you can read about my thoughts on Apple, uh,
which is the latest blog post there I've got on education.
I've got one on Windows 11 now. So again triple w.com.
(54:46):
They can also check out Apple Pay as well. And
Google Pay. That's the best place. That's where I do
my best work.
S1 (54:51):
Adam.
S10 (54:51):
Thank you so much Peter. All the best to you. Cheers.
S1 (54:53):
Always great to catch up with Sam. Harsh, but probably
very fair. And if you got some thoughts you can
always get in touch with us. Great chat there with Adam.
What about the Trump phone? Are you in the market
for a Trump phone? You got your hand up? No.
Hands down. Okay. I ought to describe show of the week.
It's coming up this Sunday evening. 830 SBS Viceland. Bermuda
(55:16):
Triangle A search party goes out looking for the yacht
The Revenant, which went missing in 1958 with five crew
members on board. Was it a storm, or was it
indeed the Bermuda Triangle and its magnetic anomaly? Maybe all
will be revealed. We'll find out more. And you know
(55:36):
what it's got. Audio description this Sunday evening, 830 SBS Viceland.
Bermuda Triangle check it out if your game. Some birthdays
before we go. Feel better for having a birthday? We'll
catch up with Phil on the program next week. He
had a birthday this week. So Phil, happy birthday to you.
Hope you've recovered by the time next week's program comes around.
(55:58):
Speak about Vision Australia Radio Pam Green had a birthday.
Happy birthday to you Pam. Hope you're enjoying your time.
Also wish you a very happy birthday to the very
talented Rhea Andriani. Wonderful writer creative artist Rhea. Happy birthday
to you. Don Ashworth having a birthday involved with some
wonderful AI research and Chad Paris, the white Tiger having
(56:21):
a birthday all the way from Western Australia. That wonderful
elite sprinter at the Paralympic Games. Happy birthday to you, Chad. Paris.
That's it for the program. Sam, Richard, thanks so much
for your help. Pam. Greg, thanks so much for yours.
Thanks to the team for helping us put the program together.
This program has come to you from Ghana land on
behalf of Philip Napier. This is Peter Greco saying, be
(56:44):
kind to yourselves, be thoughtful and look out for others.
All being well. Focal point back at the same time
next week on Vision Australia Radio and the Reading Radio Network.
This is focal.
S7 (56:57):
Point.
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