28 May 2025

On FOCAL POINT:

• Jennifer Parry leads Blind Citizens Australia Music Peer Group. Jennifer spoke about the group's preparation and having their works showcased at the 50th Anniversary Convention, from 13th June
• Danica Gates is the winner of the Joy Noble Medal - the highest honour for South Australia's Volunteer of the year.  Danica set up Beacon of Hope in Tumby Bay, a suicide prevention network with support from others who have had their lives effected by suicide.
• Neil Jarvis, the 2025 Recipient of the Tammy Axelsen's Life Time Achievement Award from the Round Table of information access for people with a print disability.
• Mark Pearce, CEO for Volunteering Australia with a wrap of the aims, objectives and achievements for National Volunteer Week.  

We were all saddened to hear of the passing of long-time volunteer and former producer of Focal Point Wendy McDougal.  

Resources: 

BCA Convention 2025: https://www.bca.org.au/bca-2025-convention-50th-anniversary-celebration/ 

Beacon of Hope: [e-mail]

Print Disability Round Table: http://www.printdisability.org

Volunteering Australia: http://www.volunteeringaustralia.org 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

S1 (00:14):
Good evening and welcome to Focal Point here on Business Radio,
radio 1190 7 a.m. and Adelaide online at Via radio
via Radio Digital in Adelaide and Darwin through the Community
Radio Plus app. Look for Vision Australia, Radio Adelaide, Peter
Greco on behalf of Phillip Napier and a big show
to Wendy McDougall listening in saying great to be here.

(00:35):
This program coming to you from Garner Land come to
you very shortly. We'll catch up with Jennifer Parry from
the Blind Citizens Music peer support group that's about to
perform at the convention. We'll find out about what they
will be doing and how they've been going. We'll then
catch up with Danica Gates, who's just won the Joy
Noble Medal for volunteer of the year award, working in

(00:58):
the area of suicide prevention. If the story impacts on you,
remember you can always call lifeline one three 1114 1311.
14 for lifeline. Then we'll be joined by the winner
of this year's Tammie Axelson Award from the roundtable for
Information Access. His initials might be Neal Jarvis. We'll catch

(01:21):
up with Neal very, very soon. And then Mark Pierce
will join us from Volunteering Australia. Wrapping up Volunteer Week,
if you're listening through 1190 7 a.m. in Adelaide at
8:00 for your listening pleasure. Lizzie and Sam are here
with Studio One just before we hear what's on Studio One.
Generally the last week of each month, we catch up
with co-founder and co-presenter of a Focal Point, Phil Vandepeer.

(01:44):
Phil not feeling the best at the moment, although I
think he's got his Henry Kissinger hat on and is
trying to repair the coalition. Or maybe he's with the
all the King's horses and all the King's men. Phil,
look after yourself. Hopefully, Phil back with us at the
end of June. Also last week this time we called
out for anyone that could help out. Designing a website,

(02:05):
constructing a website for Nathan Johnson, long distance runner and
motivational speaker, had a great response. Nathan is going through
some of those people who have contacted us, and hopefully
in the not too distant future, we'll be able to
let you know how all that went. Let's find out
what's on studio one. Tonight.

S2 (02:25):
We talk to two support workers who coincidentally have the
same name. The two meagan's talk about their backgrounds, what
got them involved, and where things are going from here.

S3 (02:34):
I also chat with Peter Spencer about how he supports
his clients in the realm of sport and recreation.

S2 (02:40):
So join us at eight for studio One.

S1 (02:44):
Blind to Australia's 50th convention gets ever closer. One of
the things that I'm really looking forward to is hearing
the BCA convention Music Peer Group. The lead of the
group is Jennifer Parry, and Jennifer joins us now. Jennifer,
always great to catch up. Thanks for your time. Welcome.

S4 (03:02):
Thanks, Peter. It's great to be on the show.

S1 (03:03):
It's about this group. Now, you've done some work before
in the past together, haven't you? Or there has been
a music group in the past before.

S4 (03:09):
Ah, yes. Well, this group of current ones has been
going since 2022 and I've been running it. There was
a co-host for a while and now on the main
facilitator of it. It's been going since then.

S1 (03:21):
Tell us about how it's all come about. Now, I
remember as a group playing before an online convention, is
this the same group or is it kind of had
a bit of a change in lineup?

S4 (03:30):
It's the same group as a whole. I mean, people
come and go, but most people I think are the same.
The online one. There was a song that was presented
as part of that. So that was pretty exciting. And
this one's a little bit more coming up.

S1 (03:42):
Now, because from memory, you kind of worked remotely to
each other for that one, didn't you?

S4 (03:47):
Yes. And we still do. We do collaborate together. Everything.
It's all done remotely.

S1 (03:53):
It has a turning out.

S4 (03:54):
It's going well. We've done quite a bit of material,
and it's great that we're going to have an opportunity
for us to showcase some of that work?

S1 (04:02):
Yeah. If you get asked back for take two, that's
got to be a positive thing.

S4 (04:06):
It certainly is. It's very positive. What's sure is.

S1 (04:10):
Just a bit about the group. And of course the
word peer is in your group. So I guess you're
kind of musically linked but also sort of in other
areas linked obviously with blindness and low vision.

S4 (04:20):
Yes. That's correct. And the best part about it is
that anyone from beginners who wants to know more about
music in a fun space, or people who have been
doing it for a while, are people that are into
the recording or production side of it, the audio production
and putting things together, applying all sorts of different instruments

(04:40):
or etc. can come along and join. And the work
that will be showcased at convention is a culmination of that. Father,
as I said earlier, the group itself has been running
for about three years now. It's been going pretty well
from strength to strength, and we encourage people to come
along and see what it's about and enjoy it. That's

(05:02):
the most important thing, as well as having that commonality
of doing it from a blind, low vision perspective.

S1 (05:08):
Yeah, of course the convention is going to be online,
but also in person, which is how it used to
be in the old days. That's great. It's getting back
to that. What about your performance? Would that be live
as in, will you all be together sort of in
the one place?

S4 (05:21):
Not on this occasion. Showcasing will be recordings which will
be presented through a sound system at the convention, but
I believe these will also be available post convention. The
songs that will be showcased on the BCA website. Post convention.

S1 (05:36):
All right. Well, that lots of people access to it
and who knows what it could lead to.

S4 (05:40):
Exactly. It's really exciting just to be asked and to
do it. And, um, I really hope people will enjoy it.

S1 (05:47):
Firth about the group, kind of who's in it? What instruments? Uh,
what's the make up of the group?

S4 (05:52):
Oh, we've got a mix of people of different ages
and from different states. So mainly actually at this point,
New South Wales and Victoria. It's just worked out that way.
You've got a couple of guitarists, a bass player. You've
got two people do lots of great production work that
do a lot of putting all the things together. We've

(06:12):
got people that do keyboard, we've got some singers and
others which I've probably just forgotten, and I'm sure they'll
tell me after. But it's a diverse range of skill
sets and perspectives that come together to do something really special.

S1 (06:27):
What about your background? Do you all come from different backgrounds?
I guess I'm thinking like in terms of you might
be classically trained or maybe self-taught or maybe a bit
of a hybrid as well, how does that all come together?

S4 (06:39):
There's definitely a bit of a mix. So some people
are from the country music background, others are contemporary music training.
Some people have been singing or doing music for a
long time, and others are a little bit later, but
there's a mix of different genres involved and people have
been doing training and Perspectives. I know one of them
has at least two. People have their own studio setups

(07:03):
to do things and others don't, and some people do
recording and share things using a phone, and others have
fully set up software and keyboard and studio interfaces and
mixes and so on. So it's a whole range of
different ways of doing things to get to a common
thing about making creative fun.

S1 (07:23):
Yeah, and I guess it's a great thing that, uh,
you know, I'm sort of assuming that all, if not all,
certainly most of the people involved have all got a
vision impairment or a blind. So I guess in terms of, um,
you know, the, the technical skills that are being used,
that kind of goes to show that, alright, even if
you're not a musician, you can do the kind of
technical side or if you're not necessarily good at technical,

(07:45):
you can do the music side of things. So there's
kind of something for everyone, which is a great message
to be putting out there.

S4 (07:51):
I think so. And even with, for instance, being able
to balance sound levels, really important job to make things
sound good or put, uh, nuances like reverb and things
like that, that can be extremely useful just to enrich
the sound in a piece or to have something purely raw.
And you make those decisions as you go along, and

(08:12):
that all takes skill and finesse.

S1 (08:14):
Jennifer, is it cover or a bit of original stuff?
How how is all that going?

S4 (08:19):
So at the moment we're doing we've been doing covers
and covers. Songs will be at convention. It will have
a flyover because of course the BCI convention is the
50th one. So we've catered to that. If it's a
flyover of being 50 years, 1975, and a few really

(08:39):
good pieces of it, and stay tuned for that.

S1 (08:42):
Okay, so you can't give us too much, which is
fair enough because we want it to be a surprise,
which is certainly the way to go. Now you're leading
this group just a bit about your role and how
you've taken it on and why you've taken it on.

S4 (08:54):
I definitely have a passion for music and have done
ever since. I can remember being little, whether it be
singing or playing an instrument. Yeah, I play flute, piano
and singing. Also did singing, songwriting. And when BCA were
putting things out for different groups and so on, and
music came up, I thought, this is something I'd be
really interested in. And they were looking for some people

(09:17):
to be in it, as well as someone to to
run it. And at one stage there was two of us,
Tim Haggis and I, running it. And at the moment
I'm sort of running it with support from BCA is required.
And it's just, um, really a combination of being able
to have a channel for creativity and to do the music,
enjoy that, and enjoy collaborating with people that are like minded,

(09:40):
that are just as passionate as I am about doing
that craft.

S1 (09:43):
Jennifer I mean, just a little bit tongue in cheek.
I mean, this a lot tongue in cheek, I should say.
Sometimes musicians get a bit of a reputation of being
prima donnas or kind of wanting the limelight or not
one to share. Have you had any issues with this group?
They all behave themselves. Have you had to put your
foot down on occasion?

S4 (10:00):
We actually worked really well. It's been very collaborative. That's
why I've been so fortunate and everyone enjoys it. And
if anything comes up in issues, we just work through
them like, um, different ideas etc. which is great because
it just means you learn even more from each other
than what you already are. And every, every time we meet,
there's something to learn and always something new.

S1 (10:22):
What's it like particularly doing it remotely? Because sometimes you
can have, um, lag or a bit of a delay,
you know, when you're trying to hook up through the internet.
Has that been much of an issue and how have
you overcome that?

S4 (10:35):
I have to say zoom has improved a lot. Um,
so the group meetings are usually a discussion format. Or
if we need to apply something, there'll be a screen
share and you'd play it over zoom platform. But in
terms of actually doing production or applying things, we usually
do that work outside of the meeting. So that reduces

(10:55):
complexity and less potential for lag. And you don't have
to switch from allowing background noise and not and all
that sort of thing. It just removes that whole complexity
around the meetings. It makes it a bit easier.

S1 (11:07):
And I guess this is touched on with zoom, but
I guess technology is so much better these days that,
you know, the quality is is really, really good.

S4 (11:14):
Yeah. Some of you have a the group has an
email list in for in between meetings, and we share
a lot of information through that as well, whether it
be recordings for something that we're doing, different ideas or
things coming up, etc..

S1 (11:26):
We talked about the fact that peer is kind of
in your name. What about kind of supporting each other
not just in music, but just, you know, maybe with
tips and tricks for, for daily life? I mean, the
sort of stuff that DCA and a lot of email
groups do specifically. But there's that kind of almost come
out by accident or just by incident, that the fact
that you might share different hacks or different things that

(11:47):
you handle, uh, you know, during your kind of everyday lives.

S4 (11:51):
It usually happens, incidentally, incidentally, as you said. And it's
that's a beautiful thing. There's always things that come up.
And I think that's what I meant by every time
you meet her, even in between meetings, there's always something
to learn from each other that comes up, whether it
be a life hack or a tip and trick or
somebody that knows about something that you didn't. That gets
passed on. And that's all about the sharing and caring.

(12:12):
That's what I call it. So it's that's the great
thing about collaborating with a group that goes well together.

S1 (12:17):
If it's just a bit more about your music background,
we know about you as an advocate. We've spoken to
you in the past about some of your wonderful advocacy work,
both with VCA, Narcan and other organizations. We've heard more
indirectly about your cricketing skills. What about your music? So
that started from a young age.

S4 (12:32):
Yes it did. The first real, real recollection of it
is I started singing along with a nursery rhyme when
I was about three. Uh, When You wish Upon a star, apparently.
And mum said, oh, gee, you can sing. And of
course mum is musical and she'd play piano as well.
So I learnt a lot from her, and that's really

(12:52):
when it started from. So after that, I realized this
was something I thought was fun and just delved into
it as much as I could. So I did piano
lessons at school and some flute for a while. Finished school.
I went away and did some other life things and
came back. And I've also done some music studies at TAFE,
music industry performance courses up until up to and including

(13:17):
an advanced diploma in IT. I've really enjoyed it and
that's helped me really sort of improved my skills and
give it a bit of structure. So being able to
do some songwriting and find somewhere that I can at
least put raw ideas down and record and equipment and
the technology has improved around that a lot too. So
that's helped me as well. And in finding and meeting

(13:39):
people to connect with that are wanting to do the
same thing, blind or low vision or not, that have
some sort of passion and wonderful ideas just like I do,
and it just keeps me moving forwards in that right
direction to where I would like to go.

S1 (13:57):
You use music.

S4 (13:58):
I use it sometimes, not all the time. Um, other
times I use learn by ear. The music has improved
a lot, as in being able to access it through
software and on electronic devices now. So that's made it
definitely a lot easier in some respects. And then other
things I learn by you as well. So I do

(14:21):
both tools get used.

S1 (14:23):
You find that you've got a good memory like you
remember things well, particularly when it comes to music.

S4 (14:27):
Oh yes, I do. And it's been essential to being
able to do it well. And I do karaoke as well.
That's the other thing I do quite on a regular basis,
just to keep me poised and on my toes, and
just being able to perform and keeping my memory and
brain active, learning new material all the time.

S1 (14:45):
There was a lot of evidence to show that that
kind of learning new stuff is really, really good sort
for the long term for your memory as well. So
it is working out good for you. Uh, I know
you can't tell us what you're doing for the 50th convention.
What's your go to when it comes to karaoke?

S4 (14:58):
Gosh, I do things from Bette Midler, Alicia Keys, Whitney Houston,
John Farnham, who was crowded House, uh, a bit of Adele,
even Etta James. So whatever takes my fancy. Really? I
think I'm pushing the envelope.

S1 (15:13):
You got a fairly eclectic music taste, which I guess, uh,
is probably a reflection of yourself anyway. The fact that you're,
you know, you're not sort of pigeonholed in one sort
of genre.

S4 (15:24):
No, I just I just like to learn what takes
the fancy and to stretch the brain. And often when
I'm at karaoke, I hear what other people do and
I think, oh my goodness, I could learn this. Or
that's prompted a thought about another song or something else
to do. So there's always inspiration and fresh ideas.

S1 (15:41):
Yeah, the convention is coming up from Friday the 13th,
so it's going to be a success because it's on
an auspicious day as far as the date of the
event coming up, and of course it'll be both online
and in person. We'll put some details up as to
how people can find out more, but you must be excited.
And I guess, you know, it'll be interesting to see
afterwards with people accessing the, the different, uh, tunes off, uh,

(16:04):
the website. So which ones turn out to be most
popular and maybe a bit of, uh, sort of friendly
rivalry for which ones, which ones do turn out to
be most popular?

S4 (16:13):
It will be interesting to see how people receive it all, but.

S1 (16:15):
Yeah.

S4 (16:16):
As presented and from the website. And of course we'll
make sure that people are notified once that's occurred. Um,
that will not be on the website until after convention. Okay.
Because of the mechanics of of how it'll work, I
don't know if any of the welcome function on the
Friday night is being streamed or not, because that's where
we're going to be presenting. That's on the Friday night. Yep. Um,

(16:38):
if not, it will definitely be available post convention and
we'll appropriately notify people once that occurs. So really looking
forward to that. And the fact that, as you say,
being hybrid this time, which has been six years between drinks,
so to speak. Really looking forward to it and just
reconnecting in person while still having the online option to

(16:59):
ensure full access for people as well.

S1 (17:01):
Great message. I know we've got someone on from BCA
next week to chat to us again, so we'll get
some more details regarding what's available and when and when
we chat next week. Jennifer, to you and the group.
Good luck. Break a leg. I think you can say
that to a music group. Can you? Well, I just did.

S4 (17:16):
You just did. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. It will be fine.

S1 (17:21):
It'll be more than fine. It'll be fun. So thank
you and good luck to everyone involved. And I should say,
a big shout out to Janine Sidhu, who tipped us
off about the group quite some time ago. So it's
been good to kind of follow it off, and now
it's good to have brought it on and look forward
to hearing it from June 13th. Thank you. That's the
Jennifer Parry there. Who's the lead as far as the
BCA convention music peer group goes. And that should be

(17:43):
a great event. We'll keep across all the details and
we'll talk more about the convention on the program next week.
But during National Volunteer Week, the Joy Nobel Medal was
presented to, I guess we could say, the volunteer of
the year here in South Australia. And this year goes
to Danica Gates, who's from beacon of Hope, Connecticut. Lovely

(18:03):
to meet you. And thank you for your time and congratulations.

S5 (18:05):
Thank you very much.

S1 (18:07):
Howard, why did beacon of Hope get started?

S5 (18:09):
So in 2016, my family lost our brother to suicide.
And we live in a small country community. And basically,
we really felt that there was a lot of a
lack of awareness in the community about how sort of
suicide impacted people. So after a period of, you know,

(18:31):
bereavement myself, and it was my sister as well, and
another group of people in our community sort of banded
together and said, look, we've got to start raising awareness
around this so that if number one, it happens again,
there's more support in the community. And number two, we
want to raise awareness to try and prevent it from
happening in the first place. So, um, yeah, that was
about 2017, 2018. That beacon of hope first started.

S1 (18:56):
It's a great name isn't it?

S5 (18:57):
Yes. Well, we named it after, um, because we live
in a, um, a rural seaside community. And it's related
to the, the history of, you know, the boats coming in. Oh, yeah.
Into the. Yeah, sure. So probably a lot of people
don't really understand that the concept around it was, you know,
that obviously we want to be a beacon for people who, um,

(19:19):
have lived experience or are in distress. We wanted to
be an alternative option to the, um, you know, the
emergency department. But recently, more recently, I've sort of thought
it's not just about being a beacon for people to
come to, but it's actually about helping people to find
the beacon within themselves as well. Yeah, I've been thinking
a lot about that in the last sort of week.

S1 (19:40):
It's a very powerful message, isn't it? Because I guess,
as you say, like a lot of it has to
come from within.

S5 (19:45):
Exactly. Um, it's about it's about knowing what your strengths
are and building on from your strengths and and not. Yeah.
Not focusing on things that you can improve, but sort
of using what you've got, which everybody has strengths. It's
just working out what they are, I think.

S1 (20:01):
And also a bit of, you know, it's okay to
speak about your weaknesses or, or if you think you've
got weaknesses, they're not necessarily weaknesses. Just I mean, maybe
things you can improve on.

S5 (20:10):
Well, I was I've always been an extremely emotional person. And, um,
you know, through my whole life I've sort of been told,
you know, you're too emotional and you're too dramatic and
you're a sook and, you know, all those kinds of things.
And I actually, you know, in my older teenage years
and sort of as an adult, I actually sort of
numbed my emotions a bit so that I wasn't so

(20:31):
much for people. And it's really since my brother passed
away that I've sort of really let myself feel the
emotions because you can't get through things if you don't
feel them. So I think vulnerability is a strength. Personally,
you know, it's much easier if you have open and honest,
vulnerable conversations. If you're if you're. Yeah, I think there's
a lot of stigma around that, especially with men about

(20:54):
being vulnerable. And yeah, I think it's really important that
we start, you know, really sort of checking ourselves on
that sort of thinking.

S1 (21:00):
Yeah, probably better to be vulnerable to make out nothing's
wrong and soldier on.

S5 (21:04):
Exactly. And I think sometimes, you know, you start talking
about things and it just, just the conversation and feeling
like you've been heard helps a lot of the time.
Not I'm not going to say every time, but I
think more compassionate conversations, more understanding. And the thing with
suicide is that people experience ideology probably more than than

(21:25):
some people realise. I think the number is 1 in 20.
People will experience ideology and there's a lot of fear
around it because obviously, yeah, there's a lot of stigma
and a lot of shame that's, you know, historically. But yeah,
if we talk more compassionately about it and sort of
have a bit more of an understanding that a lot
of people do experience it. Uh, we might. Yeah, I

(21:48):
just think the open conversations and and and not judging
and then not stigmatizing and shaming people because they experience it.

S1 (21:56):
I don't know how long you've been in Tumby Bay,
but is it the sort of thing where, you know,
particularly those remote or rural rural areas have got have
got their own, uh, you know, differences to say, you know,
someone in the city.

S5 (22:08):
I was born in Tumby Bay. I moved to Adelaide
and did a teaching degree. And then I've come back. Oh, look,
I think we all know that living in rural communities,
you know, there's definitely differences to Metro. One of the
things is, you know, they can be really close knit
and really supportive communities. But there's also the side of,
you know, I guess people being quite judgemental. Um, if

(22:30):
something happens, it's like you're living in a fishbowl. Everybody
knows everything. Everybody has an opinion about others. Um, and
I think, I think if you live in a, if
you've lived in a country town, you know. The other
thing is, in rural communities, we don't have as many resources. Yeah.
There's probably. Well, there is more isolation. So there's a
lot of things happening. That sort of one of my focuses, too,

(22:54):
is that we need more people to actually stand up and, um,
I guess want to do something because suicide prevention is
actually a whole of community responsibility. There's a whole of
government approach in South Australia currently for preventing suicide, because
it is such a prolific issue and so many lives
are lost. And then the ripple effect of the lives

(23:15):
that are lost is is really great.

S1 (23:17):
It's a great way to put it. The ripple effect.
I think it's something like, you know, 9 or 10
people a day, which is which is staggering, isn't it?
I mean, that that is so confronting Australia. Yeah. That's
so confronting, isn't it?

S5 (23:29):
And I live on the Eyre Peninsula. And the statistic
for Eyre Peninsula is ten lives a year. And, you know,
the Eyre Peninsula is just like a big community. Immunity.
And it's not. It's not that that only the lives
that are lost, though. You know, it's obviously the people
that are impacted afterwards. But there's also the stuff that
happens beforehand. You know, people experiencing mental health distress, people

(23:49):
experiencing ideology, people who have made attempts like it's it's
such a huge thing. It's much bigger than I think
people realise sometimes.

S1 (23:59):
When you're kind of used to the country setting to
your benefit. In a sense, that kind of I was
reading somewhere about like the, the setting of walking into
your meetings is is kind of nice because of the,
the salt and sea air, that sort of, uh, sort
of country feel about it.

S5 (24:14):
Oh, there's definitely advantages. I mean, it's a beautiful place
and there's obviously beautiful people in in the community. I
think a lot of it comes down to sort of
the culture of country communities is that we do things
the way we always have, and we are quite change adverse.
And I also think as humans, we sort of we

(24:36):
automatically are judgmental, which I know people take as me
saying like is a bad thing, that they're that they're judgmental.
But it's actually innate in us to sort of filter
things out and, you know, look at them through our biases,
I guess. So just being aware of that, that you
even have biases and sort of going, oh, you know,

(24:56):
that's a bit, you know, why do I think that?
Or I think that is one way we can actually improve. Well,
rural communities but also South Australia.

S1 (25:05):
As you said, you're a teacher by profession. What about
the way you conduct yourself as a teacher now compared
to before your brother took his life? Is that is
that any different, do you think? Is your approach different
to say that the kids in your class.

S5 (25:18):
Oh, look, when my brother passed away, it completely changed
absolutely everything about me. Like, it really just basically, um, just,
you know, I had I ended up having completely new foundations.
I have always been fairly, um, caring, but I definitely,
You know, sometimes when you're a teacher, what you're doing

(25:39):
is you're trying to actually manage the lessons and, and,
you know, get the kids to do, do what, you know,
the curriculum. And, um, I definitely used to be much
more authoritarian, but now I definitely yeah. Like, I, I
consider every child to be, you know, individual and, you know,
you don't know what's happening in their lives. And sometimes,

(26:00):
you know, sometimes if you're having behaviors with students, usually
it's because something is actually going on in their life.
It's not just because they're acting out, you know. So yes,
I definitely it definitely changed my, my teaching. And, you know,
it does all the time. The more I learn, the
more I sort of, um, I guess, um, more understanding.

S1 (26:21):
The beacon of hope. You have monthly meetings?

S5 (26:23):
Yeah, we have a meeting on the first Monday of
every month. And our look, our beacon of Hope network,
is not huge like it's we live in a community
of 2000 ish. It's it's not just I guess the
awards are not just about beacon of hope. It's actually
about all the other advocacy that I was involved in.
And I wasn't born with leadership skills, but I was

(26:45):
born with a very sort of loud voice. Nothing wrong.

S6 (26:49):
With that, nothing wrong with that.

S5 (26:51):
I've always been an advocate and I have always stuck
up for, you know, things, stuck up for myself and
stuck up for like, if I see, you know, people
being treated unfairly or being sort of, um, outcast. I've
always stuck up, um, so and, you know, sometimes that trait, uh,

(27:13):
doesn't gel with other people. If you're standing up for
things and you're standing up quite passionately, but, you know,
the people that I've met along the way through through
suicide prevention and gone through two conferences and, you know,
having conversations with people who have been through it, like it,
they respect and are really proud, um, and really support

(27:34):
me speaking up because, you know, we need people to
do it.

S1 (27:37):
What about something like this in terms of, I guess,
just raising awareness and the value of volunteers in a
more general sense? Do you think something like this is
good for for that volunteer movement, if I can call
it that?

S5 (27:49):
Absolutely. I'm only one representative of a suicide prevention group. Um,
and there's 35 to 40. I'm not exactly sure of
the number of, um, of suicide prevention networks in South Australia.
And we're only a few years most of us have
had lived experience of, um, grief or, or lived experiences
of ideology, experiences of caring for someone. So. Yeah. Look, I,

(28:14):
I guess it's a good way to highlight the people
that are working in this space and they're working from pain. And,
you know, every time they go out and volunteer, it is,
you know, it is actually like it is coming from
having a lived experience and having to get through the
lived experience. I'm wanting to help other people, and there's
lots of examples of that in different areas of the

(28:35):
community around suicide prevention, as one example. I mean, I
see in my own community, there's so many amazing volunteers
that have been working for or volunteering and being involved
in the community for, um, you know, their whole lives.
So my grandfather actually was a really involved in volunteering. He, um,
was involved in Lions and Progress Association Landcare, and he

(29:02):
spent a fair, you know, he was he really was
quite a prolific volunteer. Uh, and he was also quite
philanthropic in the early days, too. So, yeah, I sort
of I've been thinking in the last few days just,
you know, and also my brother that passed away, he
was very, um, involved in the SES. So, yeah, I'm
definitely inspired by them. I mean, I'd never volunteered before

(29:24):
he passed away.

S1 (29:25):
Well, it sounds like you've inherited, uh, particularly your grandfather's
genes in that area. Danica, we're out of time. But
it's been really great talking to you. It's not an
easy thing to talk about. We really appreciate it. Just
with the few minutes we've had with you, you're certainly
a very worthy recipient of the Joy Nobel Medal. Thank
you for spending some time with us, and we wish
you well in the future. And thank for speaking so

(29:46):
openly and personally about, uh, a little bit of your life.

S5 (29:49):
No worries. Thank you very much.

S1 (29:50):
That's the delegates who this year won the, uh, Joy
Nobel Medal for the volunteer of the year here in
South Australia, all the way from Tumby Bay, setting up
beacon of Hope. You're listening to Focal.

S7 (30:03):
Point on beating Australia Radio 1190 7 a.m. via radio,
digital and online at Radio.com.

S1 (30:12):
This year's Lifetime Achievement Award has just been announced and
it's great to welcome the winner new jobs to the program. Neil,
welcome and congratulations.

S8 (30:21):
Thank you very much, Peter. It's great to be talking
to you again.

S1 (30:24):
And I've got a gift that, uh, it's a very
special thing for you to win something like this because
you you tell me. Well, work with me for quite
some time.

S8 (30:32):
Yes, we we, we worked together for quite a while,
and it's a real honor, Peter. It really is. I
was shocked and, um, I am very humbled. I'm still
a bit shell shocked, if I'm honest. But I'm really,
really humbled. Not least because it's sharing the award with
people who've gone before who were, you know, I know

(30:52):
were worthy recipients when I was president of Round Table,
I think I made the award to about six different people,
all of whom I think were far more worthy than me.
But also, yeah, the the really critical thing is the
fact that it links my name with Tammy's Forever, which
is so such a lovely thing.

S1 (31:13):
Oh that's fantastic. And Vicky being very modest there with you,
a number of the winners, and actually you're all very
worthy recipients. And it's a great point. You make like, uh,
you know, to look back on those that have wanted
to think your name is up with them. I mean,
I guess that makes it very special.

S8 (31:27):
It does, it does. The whole point of the Lifetime
Achievement Award when it was first set up, was to
was to honour people who had contributed. So to get
to that point, in the view of the committee. You
must have done something right. But, um, yeah. To to
be linked with luminaries in the field of assistive tech
and access tech is it's just an accessible information. It's

(31:51):
just very, very special. Yeah, it really is.

S1 (31:53):
It all comes together a number of years. And I
know we've talked about different things and we we've spoken,
but we haven't really known much about you because you
live in New Zealand or you New Zealand for quite
some time, but you've got the most delightful English accent.

S8 (32:07):
I grew up in England. In fact, I left England
when I was, um, just before I was 40. So, yeah, my, my, um,
my accent kind of is, is set in stone now.
Can't easily change. But I came to New Zealand in
2004 with my late wife Lisette. And, um, she was, um,

(32:27):
a Kiwi advocate for Braille and braille music and, um.
All of those things. And yeah, she sadly passed away
in 2016 whilst whilst I was president of Round Table.
And that was one of the points that I wanted
to make when they gave me the award on Monday night.
Was that the support I'd got from the Round Table

(32:48):
community at that time? I can't say how invaluable that was.

S1 (32:51):
Oh, that's a wonderful thing to say, and we've chatted
to a number of members over the years, people like
Sonali and Clare and Fearon, they are all very genuine people,
which is I mean, I guess you're connected by lots
of things, but being good, nice people is another factor.

S8 (33:07):
It's a cliche. You often hear that people say that
such and such an organisation is like a family, but honestly,
it is. And you know, we, Sonali and I were,
were sat chatting the other day, reminiscing about all the
things that we'd got up to, um, when we were, uh,
both on the Round Table committee. And it is very

(33:27):
much we look after each other because it's hard work.
It's it's wonderful work. We are very fortunate to be
able to do it, and I wouldn't swap it for anything.
But it is hard work. It takes up your time
and to have people around you who who understand that
and who understand you, you can't put a price on that, Peter.

(33:48):
It's just so important.

S1 (33:49):
It's an interesting concept, isn't it, because you move around
the states, the different states, which is a great thing. So,
you know, people can't afford to go or people don't
are unable to travel. You know, you get a chance
to at least every now and again experience in your
in your city.

S8 (34:03):
That's right. That's right. I think one of the, one
of the really important values of Round Table is that
it has to be close to the people who who
make it up. So it doesn't matter if those people
are those involved in production of, um, accessible information or
those involved in in consuming it. It doesn't matter who
you are, but you have every bit as much right

(34:26):
to be part of the Round Table community as anybody
else does. And that means that we don't restrict ourselves
just to the big cities, which is or the capitals,
which is important to do that as well. But we
do make sure we, we, we visit other states where
people are working just as hard and need need to
have the opportunity to network with their with their peers

(34:47):
as well.

S1 (34:48):
I hope I get in trouble here, but I think
we can break the news that next year is going
to be in Adelaide.

S8 (34:52):
It is indeed. Yes, it is indeed. And that's also
quite poignant because Adelaide was the last time we were
in Adelaide was 2015. So ten years ago now. And
that was Tammy's last conference. So there are so many
things that kind of always bring it home to you.
But yes, that was a really successful conference. We had

(35:12):
a fabulous time. Tammy loved it. She had such a
a good conference. Um, but sadly she passed away a
month later. So it was, it was really soon afterwards.
And um, so Adelaide has a very special place in
all our hearts just for that. And it's a great city,
as you well know.

S1 (35:32):
Okay, I remember that. That terrible news. Yeah. It was
such a shock. I knew you talked about access to information.
I mean, these days there's so much more information available.
Of course, one of the feathers in your cap is
riding the Marrakesh Express. If I can omit a few metaphors,
that's that.

S8 (35:49):
Ages both of us, Peter.

S1 (35:52):
That's not why I mentioned it.

S8 (35:55):
Yeah, I believe that the Marrakesh treaty and what came
as a result of that, which was the easier sharing
of copyrighted content around the world, is one of the
most important things that's happened in my lifetime for blind
and low vision people, because we all know how hard
it has been throughout most of our lives to get
access to material on the same basis that our sighted

(36:18):
peers can get. But Marrakesh doesn't solve all our problems,
but it goes a long way to solving ones that
shouldn't have been there in the first place. And, um,
you know, I used to tell a story when I was, um,
doing this work for the Blind Foundation in New Zealand and,
and and on the international stage, we had a situation where, um,

(36:39):
a book like the Harry Potter series was recorded by the, uh,
the folks in the UK by the Rnib and produced
in Braille by them. The same thing happened in the
States with with their local agencies. The same thing happened
in Australia and, and in New Zealand and probably elsewhere
as well. So there were there was at least half
a dozen different versions of Harry Potter that were recorded.

(37:00):
And this was at a time when we couldn't get
access to 90% of of content that was published. That's just,
you know, a silly way to, to work. And, um,
the Marrakesh treaty gave us a way to circumvent that,
because the reason that always happened in the past was
because of copyright laws that were never meant to get
in our way, but they did.

S1 (37:21):
If I was to use an English term there that
was so daft, wasn't it?

S8 (37:24):
Was daft. It was absolutely daft. Oh, right. That's right.

S1 (37:28):
And of course, resources are so scarce that when you're
spitting it out, when you don't need to be doing that, it's,
you know, it's crazy.

S8 (37:34):
Well that's right, we were we were duplicating triple, quadruple
whatever the phrase is when we didn't have access to
any more than 10% to start with. So if you
set out to plan an inefficient and ineffective way of
producing accessible information, that would have been the way that
you would have gone. But, um, yeah, Marrakesh is making

(37:55):
that much easier. It's there are still, uh, things to resolve.
It's not we're not in a perfect world yet, but
we are much further down the track than we were
before Marrakesh, I think.

S1 (38:05):
And of course, braille displays and the braille displays has
been a big thing over the last 20 years or so.

S8 (38:10):
Yes. It has. And one of the things that I
was most proud to be part of was the efforts
to make affordable braille displays, because, as we know, braille
displays are life changing for those of us that have them,
and those of us that can use them, they really
do make such a difference in our lives. But traditionally,
the cost of a Braille display has been prohibitive. It's

(38:33):
been in the thousands and thousands of dollars. And that's
not a reflection or a comment on the people that
produce braille displays. Because this technology is expensive, it's hard
to manufacture. It's requires a lot of mechanical precision. So
it is understandable that it's always been very, very expensive.
But that doesn't help the person who isn't on a,

(38:56):
on a, on a decent income but needs access to Braille.
So yeah, one of the things that I was really
proud to be a part of was the Transforming Braille group,
which worked with Orbit Technology at the time to to
bring down the prices of Braille. And the aim was
just to say, look, we know that many braille displays
cost what they cost for very good reasons. And that's

(39:17):
not going to change, but at least give people an
affordable Alternative. You know, not everyone drives a Rolls-Royce car,
do they? But, you know people. Most people will settle
for a lower cost option if they if they can.
And we felt the same should be true for Braille.
Braille should be democratized and given to the people who
need it. And that has started to happen too.

S1 (39:38):
Finally, going to Rolls-Royce. If I can afford the chauffeur.
If I can afford the chauffeur.

S8 (39:42):
Yeah. You imagine a Rolls-Royce driverless car. That'll be interesting.

S1 (39:46):
Oh, I hope we live long enough to see me too.

S8 (39:49):
Me too.

S1 (39:49):
Maybe in a round table in the. In the future
we'll be chatting about that.

S8 (39:52):
That would be wonderful. I've got my name down, Mark.

S1 (39:54):
Just behind yours. The other great thing about the Refreshable
Braille displays, of course, is then you can connect it
to your your smart phone or your computer because they've
come such a long way as well.

S8 (40:05):
Yes. Yes, I think, um, we um, one of the
presentations that round table, uh, yesterday that Sonali did actually
was to look back just over the past decade of achievements,
because when you're in the middle of doing this work
all the time, it's easy to forget how far you've come. Yeah,
it really is. But if you look back, you know,
there's over the history of Round Table. And even before that,

(40:28):
round Table has been around for 40 odd years now,
44 years. But, um, and a lot has changed. A
lot has happened in that time. We are in such
a different place, but we have different problems now. But
one of the things that, that it's always good to
remember is just how far and how quickly we have
moved on. And as you say, the access to smartphones,

(40:49):
which means we literally have a computer in our pocket
that's more powerful than anything that ever went to the moon.
And we can we can use that to do so
many different things. We can read anything now. We can
find our way around with maps and with GPS equipment.
We can get guidance using the video capabilities. We can

(41:09):
access information about images that we never thought we would
get access to. All that in a device that you
can hold in one hand. And and as you say,
if you want to, you can connect that to a
Braille display. So if you need Braille to use your
smartphone and remember, many people do. Lots of people can
make do with with the speech on smartphone. That's fine.
But many of us are probably Braille first anyway. We

(41:32):
prefer Braille first, and then there's always those people who
are deaf blind who don't have the access to speech
in the same way.

S1 (41:38):
Yeah, right. Right now, great to catch up with you
at a time now, but we'll certainly keep in touch.
And also the other news from the conference is that, uh,
Agata montoya is now the president, which is great news.
We had spoke to her after a few weeks ago
to promote it. So she takes over from Sonali, and
we've actually got Sonali penciled in for a bit of

(41:58):
a wrap up and a bit back in the next
few weeks.

S8 (42:01):
Fantastic. Sonali has done a phenomenal job as president and
she's really left roundtable in a in a great place.
And Agata I know will continue that tradition and will
be a great president as well. So I look forward
to hearing what you what you chat with Sonali about.

S1 (42:17):
That's a great tribute isn't it, When you say the
tsunami is lifted in a great place, I mean, that's
the best legacy anyone can leave. Is.

S8 (42:23):
Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. And she really has done that. She's
been a real credit to the organization.

S1 (42:28):
Well, Neil, you're not going anywhere. But you've got this
lifetime achievement award under your belt. So again congratulations. Thank you.
Thank you very much. I know you've been really busy.
So to extra time after conference is great. So thank
you and wish you well.

S8 (42:41):
I really appreciate you giving me the time to talk. Thanks, Peter.
And and have a great day.

S1 (42:46):
Do Java Sarah. This year's winner of the Kenny Atkinson
Lifetime Achievement Award. Just concluded National Volunteer Week, I think
a very successful national volunteer week. Let's find out from
Volunteering Australia, go right to the top and speak to
their CEO, Mark Pearce. Mark, great to catch up with you.
Thanks for your time.

S9 (43:05):
It's great to be with you.

S1 (43:06):
Has been a good week. Do you think?

S9 (43:08):
I think it has. National Volunteer Week is always fun week. Um,
I mean, we we tend to to wade our way
through both opportunity and, uh, and a whole lot of distraction.
But National Volunteer Week gives us the opportunity to step
back and reflect upon those things which are really important,
not the least of which is the enthusiasm and the

(43:29):
contribution and the engagement of volunteers and how they see
tomorrow and all of the tomorrows to come. And of course,
the theme for National Volunteer Week this this week is
Connecting Communities. And I think for me, there's nothing more
profound than that, that, um, opportunity to get in there

(43:49):
to think about how we want our communities to look
and not just communities from a geographical perspective, but the
communities of interest, the communities of passion where we see
problems and where we see ways of moving forward. It's
about finding those people who have a passion and a
commitment and time available, and connecting them in to the

(44:11):
communities that make sense for them. So yes, it's been
a wonderful week. I'd be happy for National Volunteer Week
to be every week.

S1 (44:19):
No. Fair enough. And of course, many volunteers do volunteer
every week. So I kind of it is, isn't it?

S9 (44:25):
It's very true. Yeah. Look, I think, um, when we
think about the, um, the landscape of volunteering in this country, uh,
around about 6 million people volunteer their time through organizations
and into community, and many millions more do so outside
of organizations, but with a profound effect on community itself.

S1 (44:45):
On this radio station. A lot of community stations around Australia,
they rely heavily on volunteers, which is great. But, you know,
for example, the programs that I do, Mark, I speak
to people that are involved with different sports or recreation
or leisure activities, uh, even advocacy groups, social justice, a
lot of those do a lot of their work through
unpaid ways.

S9 (45:05):
Yes, that's that's right. And I think one of the
things we need to be cognizant of and, uh, certainly
I bang on with federal government on a, on a
regular basis about the fact that we can talk about
workforce and we can talk about employment, and that has
a very particular meaning. But the country is run both
by paid and unpaid workers. Volunteers are a huge part

(45:28):
of our national workforce. And of course, there's nuance and
there are differences in the way that we approach that
contribution and that engagement. But it's very important to understand
that Australia grinds to a very rapid halt without the
engagement and the contribution of volunteers. They're an essential part
of Australia's workforce.

S1 (45:48):
You said 6 million people. You probably can't put a
price on it, can you?

S9 (45:51):
You really can't. And in fact, I mean, that's a
great point you make because we've looked at lots of
different ways of coming up with a value for volunteering. And,
you know, from a Treasury perspective, that's that's good. Um,
we like to put numbers on, on everything. But inevitably
those numbers tell a story, but not the entire story.

(46:13):
And we certainly find that putting a number on on
the the contribution of volunteers, you know, enumerating the value
to the economy takes something away because it's more than dollars,
it's more than productivity. It's about passion and it's about
our optimism for tomorrow.

S1 (46:30):
You talked about connecting communities being the theme for this
particular year. Of course, loneliness is such a dreadful incident
that happens too often and can have all sorts of
consequences as well. So part of connecting communities may be
minimizing or lessening the the burden, if I could put
it that way of loneliness.

S9 (46:49):
It's very true. Loneliness is one of those insidious epidemics,
I suppose, within our community. And volunteering has something really
important to say about loneliness. And your point is really
well made. When we think about loneliness, we think about disconnection.
And there are lots of other parts to that, that puzzle,

(47:09):
but finding ways to connect people in with others around
finding meaning in people's lives or providing them with that
connection to meaning. And there's a term which, um, one
of the the people at Volunteering Australia, Sarah Wilson, she's
doing a PhD presently, and her thesis is on this

(47:31):
term mattering, and it speaks profoundly to loneliness. It's about
where we see ourselves within community, but how we connect
into community and where we see our contribution. Volunteering provides
people that opportunity to say, yeah, look, I can find
ways of connecting, I can find ways of engaging, and
I can find ways of reducing that awful incidence of

(47:54):
loneliness by making my time available and getting connected with
other people from a volunteer's perspective. But of course, volunteers
themselves are engaged in a whole lot of services which
are there to reduce the effect, that awful effect of
loneliness on community. And they do that each and every day.

S1 (48:12):
A lot of the focus of the stuff that we
do on this radio network, Mark, is around vision impairment, blindness, disability.
And yes, you know, I'm sure that people who are
or who live with a disability are probably, well, well
represented as far as participation the volunteer workforce goes compared
to the conventional workforce, if I can put it that way.

S9 (48:32):
Yeah, it's a really good point. Um, one of the
things that we speak about, and certainly we've spoken of
in National Volunteer Week this year, is in that that
theme of connecting communities is the importance and the ability
of volunteering to, uh, accentuate to, to facilitate inclusion, to
look towards diversity in all of its forms and find

(48:55):
pathways for, for inclusion volunteering. Does it really, really well,
that's not to say it's perfect. And there are many
things that we can do to improve it. Uh, you know,
I can think off the top of my head about
probably 5 to 10 things that that we don't do
really well in volunteering, but they're probably of a lesser
concern than the things that we do really well. That's

(49:16):
not to say that we look towards improvement. We certainly do.
But gee, volunteering is is a powerful way of ensuring
that those people who live with disability, who feel disconnected,
have pathways to to be involved.

S1 (49:32):
What about people with disabilities? Of course, people that might
have English as a second language. Indeed, our first Australians,
I guess if they could all kind of be included
under that volunteering umbrella, that the community's got to be
benefiting from that very much.

S9 (49:44):
So we certainly see in terms of the data that
we both generate and, and we operate on with, with
contribution from academic institutions and other is that people who
move to this country, uh, will oftentimes utilize the pathway
of volunteering to improve language, uh, to create a better

(50:05):
understanding of English in, in, in our sense, um, and
it's it's a powerful way of getting connected with a
new community.

S1 (50:12):
And we're learning about their cultures while we're or they're
volunteering with us or we're volunteering with them.

S9 (50:17):
It's very important.

S1 (50:19):
And, Mark, I guess, you know, often people say, you know,
never waste the crisis. And you talked about connecting communities.
I mean, I think Covid and the the isolation, the lockdowns, etc.
in a sense, they've seen such a long time ago,
but that kind of maybe has revalued our importance on
on connection.

S9 (50:36):
Absolutely. One of the things that we saw from Covid
and Covid was a point in time where we were,
as you say, you never waste a crisis. But Covid
gave us an opportunity to reassess things in a macro sense. Um,
and then to try and break those down into individual experience.
And the first thing we saw, we did some research
with the Australian National University post Covid. The first thing

(51:00):
we saw was that for those people who had to
stop volunteering and couldn't re-enter for an extended period because
of lockdowns, The mental health outcomes were worse than those
who were able to continue, noting, of course, that two
in every three volunteers had to stop volunteering altogether during
the lockdowns around Covid. The second thing it said that

(51:20):
we we found was that people, I suppose, for the
first time in a long time, rediscovered their communities because
inevitably we were locked down. We couldn't go far. We
had to stay within suburb boundaries, and the communities in
which we live became that much more important, both for
support as well as for connection and a sense of belonging.

(51:43):
And those two things, not that they were the only
two things, but those two things are for me and
for us, really powerful indicators of just how important in
the first instance community is. And secondly, connecting back into community.

S1 (51:57):
And this we're experiencing right now, particularly in some places
in the northern New South Wales, the SES, you know,
they do such a wonderful job all year round. And
Australia being the country it is with floods and bushfires and,
you know, occasionally even at the same time, the the
great role that those people do is we can't put
a price on it. I think, uh, last Wednesday, I
think it might have been there was a wear orange

(52:19):
for the SES. That was such a powerful message as well.

S9 (52:23):
It really is wear orange Wednesday. Well, um, as as
it's known, um, is a great opportunity for us again
to step back and think about a particular group of
volunteers who, in the most literal sense, oftentimes put their
lives on the line, um, to protect community, to reduce suffering,
to help out when times are at their worst. I

(52:45):
volunteer for the SES in Queensland. I put on my
orange and I get out there and and do the thing.
And I'm always heartened to see the, I suppose, selflessness,
but also the, the, um, optimism that SES volunteers bring
to that role to say there is something we can do.

(53:06):
And when nature brings about difficult times, floods and fires
and a whole lot of other things, there are a
group of people together with others who get out there
and say, you know what? We can make a difference.
We can reduce suffering. We can make someone's day a
little brighter or assist them in being able to get
out of a dire situation. And that is a privilege

(53:28):
to be able to do.

S1 (53:29):
And that work, you know, is highlighted when we're in
the middle of the emergency. But, you know, when the
newspapers and the television stations have wrapped up and gone home,
their work continues.

S9 (53:39):
Oh, look, I'm really pleased you mentioned that because, yes,
the clean up takes a long, long time. I spend
time on committees with the National Emergency Management Agency, and
one of the things that we are always reminded of
is that the response is quick, but the recovery is long.

(54:00):
And sometimes from these these really significant events, for example,
the one that is being experienced in New South Wales.
It takes years to recover and as you say, the
news cycle moves on quickly. But the recovery effort and
the contribution of people like volunteers, uh, goes on for
years after.

S1 (54:16):
And of course, the impact on the individual's part of
mental health and just their state of mind. Uh, again,
you can't kind of quantify that unless you kind of
live through it. You probably don't really understand it. We
can kind of have empathy, but not necessarily, you know, really,
really understand it.

S9 (54:31):
Yeah, it's a good point. One of the things that
we speak of frequently with, um, volunteer managers, volunteer coordinators
for organizations that engage volunteers, is to say that your
volunteer management programs need to be first class. We spend
when in corporate Australia, in corporate organisations, uh, internationally, an

(54:52):
enormous amount of money is appropriately spent on human resource management,
but far too frequently it forgets about volunteers as being
a part of that, that human resource, uh, Cycle, and
we encourage organizations that involve volunteers to say, you need
to apply the same thinking, commitment and sincerity to your

(55:13):
volunteer workforce as you do to your paid workforce. That
means real dollars. It means the allocation of people. It
means appropriately supporting and training and maintaining. It means being
aware of the inevitable costs, human, emotional as well as
financial that volunteers bear and to ensure that workforces are integrated, noting,

(55:36):
of course, the nuance that that, uh, that applies to volunteering.
It's not paid employment. And people volunteer for reasons different
to paid employment. Um, but, you know, when when difficult
times come, and especially in emergency services, the volunteers will
suffer in the same way as paid emergency service personnel.

(56:00):
And it's important we not only recognize it but support
that as well.

S1 (56:04):
Thanks for spending some time with us today.

S9 (56:05):
Absolutely. My pleasure.

S1 (56:06):
That's the mark. The mark is the CEO of Volunteering Australia.
So a big thank you and a big well done
to all the volunteers. And long may you continue to
do what you do. How would you describe show of
the week is coming up this Sunday evening 730 SBS
Main Channel, London 2000 Years of History. This examines the

(56:28):
great fire that went through London in September 1666, 600
years after the Battle of Hastings. And also it profiles
the rebuild after that particular time. So that's audio described
this Sunday evening. 730 SBS Main Channel. It is rated
PG London. 2000 years of history. Birthdays before we go.

(56:52):
Happy birthday to Stefan Nero, the champion. Blind cricket having
a birthday. Happy birthday to you Stefan. Also Tanya Harrison
over there in New Zealand, a regular listener say Tanya,
a very big happy birthday to you. Hope things are
going well. Of course. We spoke to Neil Jarvis from
New Zealand earlier and Tanya moss having a birthday. What
a tremendous time Sonia had, along with Tanya mudra at

(57:13):
the 2000 Paralympic Games with the tandem cycling. So happy
birthday to you, Sonia moss. Oh, that's it for the programme.
Sam Rickard, thanks so much for your help. Pam Green,
thanks so much for yours. Reminding you that listening is
available on your favorite podcast platform. We'd love you to
spread the word about the programme on behalf of Philip Napier.

(57:34):
And a big cheerio to Wendy McDougall listening in. This
is Peter Greco saying be kind to yourselves, be thoughtful
and look out for others all being well. Focal point
back at the same time next week on Vision Australia
Radio and the Reading Radio Network. This is focal point.