November 16, 2022 • 24 mins
Social enterprises exist so that nobody has to go it alone – so why should those enterprises have to go it alone?
In Victoria, they don’t. Social Enterprise Network Victoria (SENVIC) was founded by pioneers who knew space couldn’t develop unless everyone was working together: sharing advice, collaborating, and helping each other make the most impact possible.
SENVIC’s CEO, Nick Verginis, knows the value small businesses can offer not only their customers and employees, but to each other. His grandparents all ran small businesses after coming to Australia from Greece and relied on other small businesses to make it work.
In the social enterprise space, this is even more important. Nick shares how enterprises can multiply each other’s impact by working together, and details how a strong network of enterprises creates a greater range of opportunities for its community.
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Episode Transcript
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Craig Foster (00:03):
here's a tough fact of modern life. The market fails
some people. And if conventional business in the conventional market
doesn't work for certain people. Well, what does
these are exactly the kinds of questions, Nick Verginis grapples
with every day. He's got small business in his blood.
Each of his grandparents ran small businesses after coming to
(00:24):
Australia from Greece and they used those businesses to sponsor
other families coming to Australia. Now as the CEO of SENVIC,
he's applying the same philosophy on a much larger scale
and pushing for Australia to reconsider how we think about business.
I'm craig Foster and this is Getting it right. The
(00:45):
show about hiring, buying and working with purpose.
Nick Verginis (00:50):
My
name is Nick Verginis. I'm the CEO of Social Enterprise
Network Victoria. Or SENVIC and I I'm the inaugural CEO of SENVIC
we're relatively young, but in that role three years.
Craig Foster (01:05):
Thanks for joining us. Nick, lovely to talk to you
doing really important work. Could we just start please with
an understanding of SENVIC . It was established in 2018 and
what this network does.
Nick Verginis (01:16):
Yes. So SENVIC is a network of social enterprises. So
it started with nine pioneers of the sector who said,
we need to have a network that social enterprise needs
its own space together. Um, and since then we have
through securing some support for that idea. We've expanded to
(01:37):
over 800 members. Um, and that includes social enterprises, but
also
those organizations and government that want to see this sector
grow and thrive. And so what we focus on our
three things connect develop an influence. So it's about connection,
it's about developing the sector and growing it and scaling it.
And finally it's about influence. And I suppose the way
(01:59):
I see it is all roads lead to influence. We
want to see transformational change about how we understand business,
how we understand government.
And we see our our organizations as that way forward.
Craig Foster (02:12):
And it seems as though you're in the perfect position
at the right time because of your own family history.
If we go back a little bit long history of
small business dating way back to your grandparents. Tell us
about it.
Nick Verginis (02:24):
Yeah. Great. Um, yeah, I think social enterprise is a
new word for a very old idea. Um, and, and
even older than just my own history, I think when
I look to indigenous businesses and self determination, I think
our First Nations people have been practicing inclusive business regenerative
(02:45):
business one that's in sync with the environment and the
planet
that is the kind of economy we want to create.
And I think there's been many examples in our past,
but I suppose for myself, um, you know, I think
I'm a greek Australian and I think like most migrants and,
and people have sought refuge in Australia, they have looked
(03:06):
after each other first. So when they've started, you know,
whether it's the,
you know, the Greek milk bar or in my case
my family had a cafe. It was about bringing the
community together and employing each other, um, and helping to
sponsor other family to come over to this country. So,
you know, very much, I think the Australian story, particularly
(03:28):
the Melbourne story is that kind of cultural strength through
trade through business. And it's a funny thing in coming
to this role. It was really just looking back on
my own past and going, oh yeah,
I remember going to the greek clubs probably before I
could even walk being in, you know, the prom beside
the table where, you know, the local greek club would
(03:50):
have their Greek food and Greek culture celebrated and that
was like a weekly activity that you wouldn't have thought
it's a social enterprise, but it is that it's a,
it's a restaurant, it's a nightclub,
it's practicing culture and I think it's wonderful to see
the waves of migrants really that have done that in
this country and it's helped them preserve who they are,
(04:11):
but also get a foothold in a new land.
Craig Foster (04:14):
So why do you think with your own personal and
family experience that these types of forms of business take root,
particularly in migrant communities?
Nick Verginis (04:26):
I think it goes to it is, it is a
challenge in a new land language is a barrier. So, um,
you know, I think having your own community who can
perhaps be that um, that translator for you in the
new country, but also there's a lot of discrimination. So,
you know, I, I experienced that myself and, and you know,
(04:48):
I'm a second generation greek, Australian,
my father talks, you know, in sometimes quite bitterly about
those early days when he couldn't speak English in the
school yard. And it's the reality, I think of, you know, this, um,
I think it's just the reality of Australia. There are
(05:09):
homes where English is not the first language. And that
means that, you know, there are many, many Australians who
live in two worlds and one is that home where
they might speak a different language and then they go
out and they have to be accepted and find connection.
And I think the workplace has been one of those
greatest struggles to find inclusion.
(05:30):
So that's why I think the idea of self determination
and looking after your own has been a great way
to help new communities establish here.
Craig Foster (05:39):
So, can you tell us about some of the best
examples that you've seen in your work as CEO of SENVIC?
Some of the communities that have particularly benefited from social enterprises.
Nick Verginis (05:51):
Yeah. Look, there's, there's countless, um, I think one of
the best ones that I love to talk about is
game traffic and contracting who operate in Central Victoria. When
you drive on the hume highway through central Victoria, you
might see some green pyramid signs and game is all
that's written on there and behind that organization that looks
(06:14):
just like any other corporate is actually a solution to
intergenerational poverty.
So in Shepperton, in Wangaratta, in central parts of Victoria where there's
high level of discrimination and disadvantage and large First Nations populations,
what you have, there is employment opportunities for people who
(06:36):
perhaps have never had their first chance.
So this is work in terms of traffic management, but
also landscaping event management. They do a variety of things.
And the profits from that company then go into wraparound
support to help at risk kids get through high school.
So you're not only employing people who perhaps have not
(06:57):
had a good chance using the profits from the success
of that business to help kids who perhaps wouldn't be
completing high school if they didn't have the counseling or
additional curriculum support to get them through and to stay
on the course.
Craig Foster (07:13):
What strikes me about that example is that it's in
contrast to what most people might think of a social
enterprise.. an inner city cafe or design business, for example,
are we seeing more social enterprises in regional areas?
Nick Verginis (07:26):
I think what's really fascinating about regional areas is it's again,
that idea of, I suppose
in regional areas where the market and government perhaps just
doesn't have the reach services, shops can close. Um, I
think in regional communities, social enterprises are shown actually creating
the greatest value because they can really harness social capital
(07:51):
to say, look a for profit business couldn't succeed in
that location.
But maybe what we could do is ban together and
open those doors again. So I think the Yackandandah general
store is a great example of a petrol station that
couldn't be maintained by a mainstream company but the local
said all we need petrol because that service is essential
(08:13):
to us and it's too far to the next major
town or petrol station.
And so they formed a cooperative to open that store
and to have some policies around employing local people for that.
So they created job opportunities, They reinvested
the profits from that business from the petrol station into
(08:34):
a general store and they made that general store have
all the products that that community needs. So it's a
fascinating way of um you know, realigning let's say a
for profit business which has its own trajectory and motivations
to one that's community oriented and listening. Um and it
just makes complete sense isn't it sort of listen to
(08:55):
your own market and create the kind of business that
they want.
Um and yeah, that that's a great example from regional victoria.
Craig Foster (09:07):
You've seen a new style of tourism emerging from regional
areas as well. Can you tell us a bit about
regenerative tourism,
Nick Verginis (09:14):
Regenerative tourism is certainly an idea whose time has come
in Victoria. It's very powerful because we know people are
flying less and they're visiting places within their five km,
but even now within, within the country
and what regenerative tourism is all about is not just
(09:36):
talking about sustainable or eco friendly, any of those kinds
of terms that we know get used in marketing pretty
easily regenerative tourism is moving beyond. Do no harm to
actually take your role as a tourist to make a
positive contribution to the, to the place that you're visiting.
(09:57):
There's a very traditional approach to tourism that you take
the first world and you impose it, you build the
resort in the third world. And we now, I think
there's a number of movements converging right now to say
we need, we're a bit more conscious of our footprint.
Um we're a bit more aware of the needs of
(10:19):
the areas that we visit. We certainly, I think more
sensitive to the beauty of nature.
You know, that's another great thing that's come out of
the pores that covid created was that real valuing of
nature and its surrounds. And so that's what regenerative travel
brings together that that sense of really respecting the strengths
(10:40):
of the people and the place that you're visiting.
Craig Foster (10:44):
Well, of course tourism is a hugely important industry and
factor in many regional communities. Quite a few of those
have been stricken by environmental disaster and the like. And
of course the recent pandemic and their local economy and
so on. How does this type of regenerative tourism business
(11:06):
rise to these challenges.
Nick Verginis (11:10):
I think they are rising to the challenge first by
actually connecting and saying, we've got, we've got some shared
problems and some shared opportunities and through covid in victoria,
the Gippsland social enterprise collective emerged. So we we had
a model in SENVIC where we want local champions across
(11:32):
the state and across the city
and this year we've just um, you know, got all
the pieces in and got all the places together. But
Gippsland Social Enterprise Collective started about two years ago, early in
the pandemic. And they went really deeply into talking about
what is the, what is that region need? It was
also on the back of the black black Summer bushfires
(11:57):
and you know, I think when you look at Gippsland,
they're ahead of the curve because they've also had Latrobe
Valley kind of shift from a coal oriented economy and
then the bushfire. So they've just had crisis after crisis
and that kind of um, you know, that triggers some
real deep thinking about or what is the future and
(12:21):
what's emerged like a one shining light. And there are many,
but one is the Wayfarer cooperative.
This is an amazing platform that has only just finished
a pilot and I'll hope to expand soon. And essentially
what it is, it takes what we all know as
Airbnb a very convenient way to find accommodation and they
(12:44):
are turning that into a cooperative that benefits the community
you're visiting. So instead of $150 million dollars of profits
going overseas to a multinational.
What we're seeing is that money is a platform that
would make that money get reinvested in the community you're
in and the consumer even gets to nominate what type
of activities they wanted to go towards. So is it
(13:06):
about the people about the environment you get to indicate
your preferences and um, you know, it's just started, it's
going to take quite a bit of time to disrupt
Airbnb because it now seems that half the Mornington Peninsula
is on Airbnb,
um, you know, and that's what you have, you've got
these pockets of um holiday visitor economy that's there and waiting.
(13:29):
And at the moment it's just unfortunate that the platforms
are not benefiting the local community
and, and Wayfairer is just one aspect. The other bit
of it is actually engaging the community and what the
tourism experiences. So accommodation is one bit, but also in
the same way Airbnb and I'll admit, as a user
of Airbnb, it's nice to connect with the owners and
(13:51):
to hear something from them
and that can go a bit further with the local
community through Wayfairer, where they can suggest other things that
you might do while you're there. So the whole experience
of the visitor economy becomes one that is very much
about the community you're in. It's respectful and supporting the
environment as well and encouraging you to engage with the
(14:12):
natural beauty because that is our strength of this country.
And of course, also, it's the stories of First nations
and experiencing that culture.
So that kind of bringing together is really a powerhouse.
I think a powerhouse of an idea that we're confident
with say the commonwealth games and the you know, the
(14:34):
focus on tourism that will go with that for the
next few years. We're really hoping to take it from
Gippsland right across the state and hopefully across the country,
Craig Foster (14:42):
how important is measuring the impact that these social enterprises make?
Nick Verginis (14:47):
measuring impact is absolutely critical to us, You know, having
legitimacy and saying we're different. So what we want to
do is share ways of doing that as much as possible.
We're part of a project right now with Swinburne University
and Melbourne University and a number of other stakeholders to
build like an independent model that we can stand by
(15:11):
and really
um I suppose provide advice and frameworks for new enterprises
who are wanting to improve their impact story. But you
know this is all about confidence and credibility as well
and trust there, there's you know, the biggest risk I
think with things like the SDGs and that movement towards um
(15:33):
looking to do better is that we only look like
we're doing better rather than actually making an impact. So
the biggest risk to us is the social washing or
greenwashing
um that that you know, I think many of us
who are a bit cynical have have seen? So having
reliable evidence based impact is vital to keeping people's trust
(15:57):
and confidence that we're making a difference when they buy
from a social enterprise,
Craig Foster (16:02):
what is it that the victorian government, the state government
does in this regard. In relation to incentives, How is
it that you're saying to the marketplace? You know, we
want to see more of these social enterprises.
Nick Verginis (16:12):
Victorian government have been world leaders in this work. We
are immensely fortunate in Victoria that they've got that vision
and they understand that the market fails some people and
that the government needs to send some signals to correct that.
So supporting SENVC in its growth has been a really important part.
(16:35):
Um the programs that Jobs Victoria have done. So they
have created some wage subsidies to really encourage employment of
people who um so I suppose to address some of
the exacerbated disadvantages that we saw during Covid for example,
women over 45 years of age struggled to
(16:58):
get full time work, even good part time work as
well as First Nations people with disability. Those priority groups
are not helped by the market process operating as its own.
So the government created subsidies to create incentives there and
we saw that was a great program that which could continue.
(17:20):
But it did wrap up quite recently,
those signals. Plus Social Procurement Framework is really one of
those world leaders um and that's within the Victorian Social
Enterprise strategy? So the victorian government received a global award
this year in their contribution towards encouraging business to align
(17:42):
with the United Nations Sustainable Development Goals. So these SDGs
as they call them,
they are really the future with how the conversation will
go with, how do we make the planet safe and sustainable?
How do we have inclusive growth moving forward? And that
global movement is one that I think we'll see picked
up in business moving forward but to have victoria recognized
(18:06):
already as leading that it means that we do have
the right,
we have the North Star in place. And so now
it's about really activating the victorian social and Price strategy
and the Social Procurement Framework that's really the priority in
these next few years.
Craig Foster (18:25):
So exciting the concept of a social enterprise really essentially
should be every business on the planet. So you certainly
heading in the right direction. One of the biggest enablers
of doing social good through business is of course government,
you have these Social Procurement Framework for big businesses and
(18:46):
government contracts. Is that up to the task?
Nick Verginis (18:49):
Yeah, I think um it is, it's certainly the North Star.
So the Social Procurement Framework has given us what we
need and we've had it for a few years now
it's currently being reviewed and I and I think the
Framework is good, it's about the implementation and what we
do next.
It's there's very clear drive and calls from the community
(19:13):
to say it really needs to be beyond best endeavors
to buy from social enterprise, we know that in major
construction that lots of social enterprises provide their letters of support,
they seem to be part of the pitch that gets
secures the tender,
but then they get left off from the real benefits.
So putting some firmer commitments and requirements, probably some obligations
(19:37):
around buying from social enterprise would be really key in
those big contracts. Um, also expanding the reach of the framework.
It doesn't really have much of an impact with local
government who we know are really committed to buying local
and buying social.
So I think firming that up with the social procurement,
(19:59):
you know, that would be a vital part of the
next step and expanding beyond local government. I think where
taxpayers money is going into public organizations, there should be um,
you know, some, some targets about where social procurement spend
should reach and so following the money like that is
(20:19):
really important. Next step. And look, there's more send it
can do to, I think we can
help to grow the market where there is interest to
do social procurement
Craig Foster (20:31):
really love where you're going and the fact that you're
challenging the very concept of the corporate world and what
a business is and what it does and how it contributes.
Thank you for your time nick if I can give
you the last word, then speak to Australia, Speak to
other state governments speak to broader society and explain to
them in your role as CEO of SENVIC to why social
(20:52):
enterprises are so important to the future social fabric and
community resilience of Australia.
Nick Verginis (20:58):
So for the first two years of SENVIC , we've
actually been trying to work out
who we are, what we do and how we can
make a difference, you know, because partly were a network.
So we're a community trying to share intel and understanding
of how we do our jobs well. Um, and we're
also a peak body. So we're being a voice for
an alternative way that we can organize business and and
(21:21):
work together. And so we find ourselves in that gap
between business and charity is saying there's a different world
here and we're just trying to make sense of it.
So it took us a good two years to work
out what's our Theory of Change. And a lot of
that was informed by the Sustainable Development Goals and recognizing
(21:42):
that our members really focused on particular ones, like whether
it's inclusive growth in the economy, relieving poverty, um gender
inequality circular economy and having sustainable development,
they've all got their niche areas. Um, and that's important
(22:03):
because then they do it well. But for us as
a network, what do we do in a way we
are trying to create a community of all of those
people wanting to make positive impact to channel their voice
into a better world and um, you know, it's grasping
those that diversity and seeing that as a strength saying, well,
(22:23):
that's why we're not just a sector.
Um so Swinburne did a survey of the social enterprise sector
in Victoria and saw that we contribute $5.2 billion 60,000
people in Victoria. So we're just an invisible community, like
(22:46):
an invisible community that is using business for good
and holding that space and getting the attention of government
and capital and philanthropy and saying, you know, don't think
in just your traditional ways of supporting charities or supporting businesses,
think of social enterprise as this new new way forward.
(23:07):
And so even within ourselves, it took some time to
get that clear sense of identity.
So really what we want is that mindset to be
open to a different way of doing business, a different
way of doing charity work. Um and just seeing how
rather than a donation, which might go in and out
what social enterprise does is has sustainable solutions. And it
(23:32):
is complicated,
it's complex, we do complex work. But if you're going
to solve complex problems like poverty and homelessness and intergenerational disadvantage, marginalization,
you're going to have complex solutions. It just shows that
it's an idea whose time has come and there is
a community of people there with expertise that would love
(23:55):
to get more support.
Craig Foster (23:57):
Very important work, thank you for your time. Thanks Greg.
That's Nick Verginis CEO of Social Enterprise Network Victoria. And
if you'd like to find out more about the work
they're doing, you can visit SENVIC dot org dot au.
Thanks for listening to Getting it right. If you haven't
(24:20):
listened to the previous episodes, make sure you scroll back
through your podcast app and check them out. There's plenty
of inspiring stories about hiring, buying and working with purpose
that you don't want to miss and to make sure
you don't miss the upcoming episodes hit follow in your
podcast app while you're there.
Getting it right is a Jobsbank podcast produced by Deadset
(24:41):
Studios and hosted by Me Craig Foster.
here's a tough fact of modern life. The market fails
some people. And if conventional business in the conventional market
doesn't work for certain people. Well, what does
these are exactly the kinds of questions, Nick Verginis grapples
with every day. He's got small business in his blood.
Each of his grandparents ran small businesses after coming to
(00:24):
Australia from Greece and they used those businesses to sponsor
other families coming to Australia. Now as the CEO of SENVIC,
he's applying the same philosophy on a much larger scale
and pushing for Australia to reconsider how we think about business.
I'm craig Foster and this is Getting it right. The
(00:45):
show about hiring, buying and working with purpose.
Nick Verginis (00:50):
My
name is Nick Verginis. I'm the CEO of Social Enterprise
Network Victoria. Or SENVIC and I I'm the inaugural CEO of SENVIC
we're relatively young, but in that role three years.
Craig Foster (01:05):
Thanks for joining us. Nick, lovely to talk to you
doing really important work. Could we just start please with
an understanding of SENVIC . It was established in 2018 and
what this network does.
Nick Verginis (01:16):
Yes. So SENVIC is a network of social enterprises. So
it started with nine pioneers of the sector who said,
we need to have a network that social enterprise needs
its own space together. Um, and since then we have
through securing some support for that idea. We've expanded to
(01:37):
over 800 members. Um, and that includes social enterprises, but
also
those organizations and government that want to see this sector
grow and thrive. And so what we focus on our
three things connect develop an influence. So it's about connection,
it's about developing the sector and growing it and scaling it.
And finally it's about influence. And I suppose the way
(01:59):
I see it is all roads lead to influence. We
want to see transformational change about how we understand business,
how we understand government.
And we see our our organizations as that way forward.
Craig Foster (02:12):
And it seems as though you're in the perfect position
at the right time because of your own family history.
If we go back a little bit long history of
small business dating way back to your grandparents. Tell us
about it.
Nick Verginis (02:24):
Yeah. Great. Um, yeah, I think social enterprise is a
new word for a very old idea. Um, and, and
even older than just my own history, I think when
I look to indigenous businesses and self determination, I think
our First Nations people have been practicing inclusive business regenerative
(02:45):
business one that's in sync with the environment and the
planet
that is the kind of economy we want to create.
And I think there's been many examples in our past,
but I suppose for myself, um, you know, I think
I'm a greek Australian and I think like most migrants and,
and people have sought refuge in Australia, they have looked
(03:06):
after each other first. So when they've started, you know,
whether it's the,
you know, the Greek milk bar or in my case
my family had a cafe. It was about bringing the
community together and employing each other, um, and helping to
sponsor other family to come over to this country. So,
you know, very much, I think the Australian story, particularly
(03:28):
the Melbourne story is that kind of cultural strength through
trade through business. And it's a funny thing in coming
to this role. It was really just looking back on
my own past and going, oh yeah,
I remember going to the greek clubs probably before I
could even walk being in, you know, the prom beside
the table where, you know, the local greek club would
(03:50):
have their Greek food and Greek culture celebrated and that
was like a weekly activity that you wouldn't have thought
it's a social enterprise, but it is that it's a,
it's a restaurant, it's a nightclub,
it's practicing culture and I think it's wonderful to see
the waves of migrants really that have done that in
this country and it's helped them preserve who they are,
(04:11):
but also get a foothold in a new land.
Craig Foster (04:14):
So why do you think with your own personal and
family experience that these types of forms of business take root,
particularly in migrant communities?
Nick Verginis (04:26):
I think it goes to it is, it is a
challenge in a new land language is a barrier. So, um,
you know, I think having your own community who can
perhaps be that um, that translator for you in the
new country, but also there's a lot of discrimination. So,
you know, I, I experienced that myself and, and you know,
(04:48):
I'm a second generation greek, Australian,
my father talks, you know, in sometimes quite bitterly about
those early days when he couldn't speak English in the
school yard. And it's the reality, I think of, you know, this, um,
I think it's just the reality of Australia. There are
(05:09):
homes where English is not the first language. And that
means that, you know, there are many, many Australians who
live in two worlds and one is that home where
they might speak a different language and then they go
out and they have to be accepted and find connection.
And I think the workplace has been one of those
greatest struggles to find inclusion.
(05:30):
So that's why I think the idea of self determination
and looking after your own has been a great way
to help new communities establish here.
Craig Foster (05:39):
So, can you tell us about some of the best
examples that you've seen in your work as CEO of SENVIC?
Some of the communities that have particularly benefited from social enterprises.
Nick Verginis (05:51):
Yeah. Look, there's, there's countless, um, I think one of
the best ones that I love to talk about is
game traffic and contracting who operate in Central Victoria. When
you drive on the hume highway through central Victoria, you
might see some green pyramid signs and game is all
that's written on there and behind that organization that looks
(06:14):
just like any other corporate is actually a solution to
intergenerational poverty.
So in Shepperton, in Wangaratta, in central parts of Victoria where there's
high level of discrimination and disadvantage and large First Nations populations,
what you have, there is employment opportunities for people who
(06:36):
perhaps have never had their first chance.
So this is work in terms of traffic management, but
also landscaping event management. They do a variety of things.
And the profits from that company then go into wraparound
support to help at risk kids get through high school.
So you're not only employing people who perhaps have not
(06:57):
had a good chance using the profits from the success
of that business to help kids who perhaps wouldn't be
completing high school if they didn't have the counseling or
additional curriculum support to get them through and to stay
on the course.
Craig Foster (07:13):
What strikes me about that example is that it's in
contrast to what most people might think of a social
enterprise.. an inner city cafe or design business, for example,
are we seeing more social enterprises in regional areas?
Nick Verginis (07:26):
I think what's really fascinating about regional areas is it's again,
that idea of, I suppose
in regional areas where the market and government perhaps just
doesn't have the reach services, shops can close. Um, I
think in regional communities, social enterprises are shown actually creating
the greatest value because they can really harness social capital
(07:51):
to say, look a for profit business couldn't succeed in
that location.
But maybe what we could do is ban together and
open those doors again. So I think the Yackandandah general
store is a great example of a petrol station that
couldn't be maintained by a mainstream company but the local
said all we need petrol because that service is essential
(08:13):
to us and it's too far to the next major
town or petrol station.
And so they formed a cooperative to open that store
and to have some policies around employing local people for that.
So they created job opportunities, They reinvested
the profits from that business from the petrol station into
(08:34):
a general store and they made that general store have
all the products that that community needs. So it's a
fascinating way of um you know, realigning let's say a
for profit business which has its own trajectory and motivations
to one that's community oriented and listening. Um and it
just makes complete sense isn't it sort of listen to
(08:55):
your own market and create the kind of business that
they want.
Um and yeah, that that's a great example from regional victoria.
Craig Foster (09:07):
You've seen a new style of tourism emerging from regional
areas as well. Can you tell us a bit about
regenerative tourism,
Nick Verginis (09:14):
Regenerative tourism is certainly an idea whose time has come
in Victoria. It's very powerful because we know people are
flying less and they're visiting places within their five km,
but even now within, within the country
and what regenerative tourism is all about is not just
(09:36):
talking about sustainable or eco friendly, any of those kinds
of terms that we know get used in marketing pretty
easily regenerative tourism is moving beyond. Do no harm to
actually take your role as a tourist to make a
positive contribution to the, to the place that you're visiting.
(09:57):
There's a very traditional approach to tourism that you take
the first world and you impose it, you build the
resort in the third world. And we now, I think
there's a number of movements converging right now to say
we need, we're a bit more conscious of our footprint.
Um we're a bit more aware of the needs of
(10:19):
the areas that we visit. We certainly, I think more
sensitive to the beauty of nature.
You know, that's another great thing that's come out of
the pores that covid created was that real valuing of
nature and its surrounds. And so that's what regenerative travel
brings together that that sense of really respecting the strengths
(10:40):
of the people and the place that you're visiting.
Craig Foster (10:44):
Well, of course tourism is a hugely important industry and
factor in many regional communities. Quite a few of those
have been stricken by environmental disaster and the like. And
of course the recent pandemic and their local economy and
so on. How does this type of regenerative tourism business
(11:06):
rise to these challenges.
Nick Verginis (11:10):
I think they are rising to the challenge first by
actually connecting and saying, we've got, we've got some shared
problems and some shared opportunities and through covid in victoria,
the Gippsland social enterprise collective emerged. So we we had
a model in SENVIC where we want local champions across
(11:32):
the state and across the city
and this year we've just um, you know, got all
the pieces in and got all the places together. But
Gippsland Social Enterprise Collective started about two years ago, early in
the pandemic. And they went really deeply into talking about
what is the, what is that region need? It was
also on the back of the black black Summer bushfires
(11:57):
and you know, I think when you look at Gippsland,
they're ahead of the curve because they've also had Latrobe
Valley kind of shift from a coal oriented economy and
then the bushfire. So they've just had crisis after crisis
and that kind of um, you know, that triggers some
real deep thinking about or what is the future and
(12:21):
what's emerged like a one shining light. And there are many,
but one is the Wayfarer cooperative.
This is an amazing platform that has only just finished
a pilot and I'll hope to expand soon. And essentially
what it is, it takes what we all know as
Airbnb a very convenient way to find accommodation and they
(12:44):
are turning that into a cooperative that benefits the community
you're visiting. So instead of $150 million dollars of profits
going overseas to a multinational.
What we're seeing is that money is a platform that
would make that money get reinvested in the community you're
in and the consumer even gets to nominate what type
of activities they wanted to go towards. So is it
(13:06):
about the people about the environment you get to indicate
your preferences and um, you know, it's just started, it's
going to take quite a bit of time to disrupt
Airbnb because it now seems that half the Mornington Peninsula
is on Airbnb,
um, you know, and that's what you have, you've got
these pockets of um holiday visitor economy that's there and waiting.
(13:29):
And at the moment it's just unfortunate that the platforms
are not benefiting the local community
and, and Wayfairer is just one aspect. The other bit
of it is actually engaging the community and what the
tourism experiences. So accommodation is one bit, but also in
the same way Airbnb and I'll admit, as a user
of Airbnb, it's nice to connect with the owners and
(13:51):
to hear something from them
and that can go a bit further with the local
community through Wayfairer, where they can suggest other things that
you might do while you're there. So the whole experience
of the visitor economy becomes one that is very much
about the community you're in. It's respectful and supporting the
environment as well and encouraging you to engage with the
(14:12):
natural beauty because that is our strength of this country.
And of course, also, it's the stories of First nations
and experiencing that culture.
So that kind of bringing together is really a powerhouse.
I think a powerhouse of an idea that we're confident
with say the commonwealth games and the you know, the
(14:34):
focus on tourism that will go with that for the
next few years. We're really hoping to take it from
Gippsland right across the state and hopefully across the country,
Craig Foster (14:42):
how important is measuring the impact that these social enterprises make?
Nick Verginis (14:47):
measuring impact is absolutely critical to us, You know, having
legitimacy and saying we're different. So what we want to
do is share ways of doing that as much as possible.
We're part of a project right now with Swinburne University
and Melbourne University and a number of other stakeholders to
build like an independent model that we can stand by
(15:11):
and really
um I suppose provide advice and frameworks for new enterprises
who are wanting to improve their impact story. But you
know this is all about confidence and credibility as well
and trust there, there's you know, the biggest risk I
think with things like the SDGs and that movement towards um
(15:33):
looking to do better is that we only look like
we're doing better rather than actually making an impact. So
the biggest risk to us is the social washing or
greenwashing
um that that you know, I think many of us
who are a bit cynical have have seen? So having
reliable evidence based impact is vital to keeping people's trust
(15:57):
and confidence that we're making a difference when they buy
from a social enterprise,
Craig Foster (16:02):
what is it that the victorian government, the state government
does in this regard. In relation to incentives, How is
it that you're saying to the marketplace? You know, we
want to see more of these social enterprises.
Nick Verginis (16:12):
Victorian government have been world leaders in this work. We
are immensely fortunate in Victoria that they've got that vision
and they understand that the market fails some people and
that the government needs to send some signals to correct that.
So supporting SENVC in its growth has been a really important part.
(16:35):
Um the programs that Jobs Victoria have done. So they
have created some wage subsidies to really encourage employment of
people who um so I suppose to address some of
the exacerbated disadvantages that we saw during Covid for example,
women over 45 years of age struggled to
(16:58):
get full time work, even good part time work as
well as First Nations people with disability. Those priority groups
are not helped by the market process operating as its own.
So the government created subsidies to create incentives there and
we saw that was a great program that which could continue.
(17:20):
But it did wrap up quite recently,
those signals. Plus Social Procurement Framework is really one of
those world leaders um and that's within the Victorian Social
Enterprise strategy? So the victorian government received a global award
this year in their contribution towards encouraging business to align
(17:42):
with the United Nations Sustainable Development Goals. So these SDGs
as they call them,
they are really the future with how the conversation will
go with, how do we make the planet safe and sustainable?
How do we have inclusive growth moving forward? And that
global movement is one that I think we'll see picked
up in business moving forward but to have victoria recognized
(18:06):
already as leading that it means that we do have
the right,
we have the North Star in place. And so now
it's about really activating the victorian social and Price strategy
and the Social Procurement Framework that's really the priority in
these next few years.
Craig Foster (18:25):
So exciting the concept of a social enterprise really essentially
should be every business on the planet. So you certainly
heading in the right direction. One of the biggest enablers
of doing social good through business is of course government,
you have these Social Procurement Framework for big businesses and
(18:46):
government contracts. Is that up to the task?
Nick Verginis (18:49):
Yeah, I think um it is, it's certainly the North Star.
So the Social Procurement Framework has given us what we
need and we've had it for a few years now
it's currently being reviewed and I and I think the
Framework is good, it's about the implementation and what we
do next.
It's there's very clear drive and calls from the community
(19:13):
to say it really needs to be beyond best endeavors
to buy from social enterprise, we know that in major
construction that lots of social enterprises provide their letters of support,
they seem to be part of the pitch that gets
secures the tender,
but then they get left off from the real benefits.
So putting some firmer commitments and requirements, probably some obligations
(19:37):
around buying from social enterprise would be really key in
those big contracts. Um, also expanding the reach of the framework.
It doesn't really have much of an impact with local
government who we know are really committed to buying local
and buying social.
So I think firming that up with the social procurement,
(19:59):
you know, that would be a vital part of the
next step and expanding beyond local government. I think where
taxpayers money is going into public organizations, there should be um,
you know, some, some targets about where social procurement spend
should reach and so following the money like that is
(20:19):
really important. Next step. And look, there's more send it
can do to, I think we can
help to grow the market where there is interest to
do social procurement
Craig Foster (20:31):
really love where you're going and the fact that you're
challenging the very concept of the corporate world and what
a business is and what it does and how it contributes.
Thank you for your time nick if I can give
you the last word, then speak to Australia, Speak to
other state governments speak to broader society and explain to
them in your role as CEO of SENVIC to why social
(20:52):
enterprises are so important to the future social fabric and
community resilience of Australia.
Nick Verginis (20:58):
So for the first two years of SENVIC , we've
actually been trying to work out
who we are, what we do and how we can
make a difference, you know, because partly were a network.
So we're a community trying to share intel and understanding
of how we do our jobs well. Um, and we're
also a peak body. So we're being a voice for
an alternative way that we can organize business and and
(21:21):
work together. And so we find ourselves in that gap
between business and charity is saying there's a different world
here and we're just trying to make sense of it.
So it took us a good two years to work
out what's our Theory of Change. And a lot of
that was informed by the Sustainable Development Goals and recognizing
(21:42):
that our members really focused on particular ones, like whether
it's inclusive growth in the economy, relieving poverty, um gender
inequality circular economy and having sustainable development,
they've all got their niche areas. Um, and that's important
(22:03):
because then they do it well. But for us as
a network, what do we do in a way we
are trying to create a community of all of those
people wanting to make positive impact to channel their voice
into a better world and um, you know, it's grasping
those that diversity and seeing that as a strength saying, well,
(22:23):
that's why we're not just a sector.
Um so Swinburne did a survey of the social enterprise sector
in Victoria and saw that we contribute $5.2 billion 60,000
people in Victoria. So we're just an invisible community, like
(22:46):
an invisible community that is using business for good
and holding that space and getting the attention of government
and capital and philanthropy and saying, you know, don't think
in just your traditional ways of supporting charities or supporting businesses,
think of social enterprise as this new new way forward.
(23:07):
And so even within ourselves, it took some time to
get that clear sense of identity.
So really what we want is that mindset to be
open to a different way of doing business, a different
way of doing charity work. Um and just seeing how
rather than a donation, which might go in and out
what social enterprise does is has sustainable solutions. And it
(23:32):
is complicated,
it's complex, we do complex work. But if you're going
to solve complex problems like poverty and homelessness and intergenerational disadvantage, marginalization,
you're going to have complex solutions. It just shows that
it's an idea whose time has come and there is
a community of people there with expertise that would love
(23:55):
to get more support.
Craig Foster (23:57):
Very important work, thank you for your time. Thanks Greg.
That's Nick Verginis CEO of Social Enterprise Network Victoria. And
if you'd like to find out more about the work
they're doing, you can visit SENVIC dot org dot au.
Thanks for listening to Getting it right. If you haven't
(24:20):
listened to the previous episodes, make sure you scroll back
through your podcast app and check them out. There's plenty
of inspiring stories about hiring, buying and working with purpose
that you don't want to miss and to make sure
you don't miss the upcoming episodes hit follow in your
podcast app while you're there.
Getting it right is a Jobsbank podcast produced by Deadset
(24:41):
Studios and hosted by Me Craig Foster.
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