September 19, 2025 • 34 mins
In this episode, we talk to Stephanie Lake.
The former dancer turned choreographer is the artistic director of Stephanie Lake Company, and also the resident choreographer for The Australian Ballet.
She’s the winner of many awards, including the Helpmann, and while her rise was stratospheric, it wasn’t always linear.
It was also somewhat delayed: Lake was a late bloomer in her chosen field, dancing in her teenage years only as a hobby.
Her life story starts in Canada, before taking a turn south to Tasmania, and now Melbourne.
Hosting this conversation – about a journey rich in resilience, creativity and balance – is Good Weekend senior writer Konrad Marshall.
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Episode Transcript
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S1 (00:07):
Hi, I'm Konrad Marshall and from the Sydney Morning Herald
and The Age. Welcome to Good Weekend Talks, a magazine
for your ears, featuring in-depth conversations with fascinating people from
sport and politics, science and culture, business and beyond. Every week,
you can download new episodes in which top journalists from
across our newsrooms talk to compelling people about the definitive
(00:28):
stories of the day. In this episode, we talk to
Stephanie Lake. The former dancer turned choreographer is the artistic
director of Stephanie Lake Company and also the resident choreographer
for the Australian Ballet. She's leading figure in Australian dance,
the winner of many awards including the Helpmann. And while
(00:50):
her rise was stratospheric, it wasn't always linear and in
some ways it came quite late. We're lucky to have
her in the studio today to talk through her life story,
which starts in Canada before taking a turn south to
Tasmania and now Melbourne, a journey rich in resilience, creativity
and balance. Welcome, Stephanie.
S2 (01:12):
Thank you so much. What an intro.
S1 (01:14):
Now, you lived in Canada until you were eight years old,
and I love the name of the place you're from.
I always have loved that name. Saskatoon, Saskatchewan.
S2 (01:22):
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. It sounds like a joke, but it's real.
Isn't that just the best? I was born in Saskatoon,
which is also in the same hospital as Joni Mitchell,
which I love as a small detail, but, um, I
lived in a tiny little village just outside of Saskatoon.
S1 (01:37):
What was life like there? I mean, freezing cold winters.
S2 (01:40):
It was very rural. It was it was brutally cold
in the winters. But I was a kid, so I
just thought it was fun. We were building snow forts
and playing with, you know, just just having a lot
of fun in the snow. But I think for adults,
it's just almost unbearable. It gets to -40 degrees, which
is an incomprehensible temperature. But but I loved it. It was.
(02:04):
It was just home. We we skied and skated and
played in the snow. Rugged up. It was good.
S1 (02:10):
I lived in North America for a while, kind of
right up there near Canada as well, and loved, uh,
loved that experience. But you have to make use of
the cold. You. Yes. If you're not going out there
and skating on a frozen pond or hitting a ski
mountain or something, um, you're just gonna get sad.
S2 (02:29):
It was. We spent a lot of time outside, ironically. And, um.
And the seasons are really marked. I remember really beautiful
autumn's fall there. Of course. Um, and spring is so
dramatic because it's been nothing but white for six months.
And then you see the little buds poking through the,
the slush and and the buds opening on the trees.
(02:50):
It's really dramatic and gorgeous, but it's an incredibly flat landscape.
Saskatchewan is is wheat belt prairies. Um, not a hill
in sight. So there are some classic photos from my, um,
childhood photo albums of of mum pushing a pram just
into kind of oblivion. Like literally a straight road to
(03:13):
the horizon. And she. Yeah, they would say, yeah, they'd
go for a walk and then you'd just, you'd just
walk in a straight line and turn around and walk
back along that straight line back home. Um, so very
different to the Tasmanian landscape, but, but really imprinted in
my memory, I think, in my DNA.
S1 (03:30):
What, uh, like the family, as you say, then moved
to Launceston. What prompted the move to Lonnie and what
was that culture shock?
S2 (03:38):
Well, mum was yeah, it was a big culture shock. Um,
mum's Scottish and dad's Canadian. They'd met in Ibiza in
the 70s and. And. Yeah, it was different to, to
to what it is now. I hear I've never been there, but, um,
it was kind of a hippie enclave at that time,
but they ended up back in Canada when they married
(03:59):
and they did ten years there, which is a pretty
good stint. But I don't think it was really sustainable
just because of the, the brutality of the, of the weather. And, um,
and so they decided to move elsewhere and, and kind
of poked a finger on the map and ended up
with Tasmania. Remarkable. Yeah. I mean, it blows my mind still,
(04:21):
I've got kids myself. And I just think, Good God,
what were you thinking? They had three kids. My mum, uh,
one of her sisters lived in Perth in WA, so
that was I think that helped them get the points
up for migration, you know? Um, I think there was
some intention of possibly ending up in Perth, but they
(04:42):
didn't like it. And so the little heart shaped island
at the bottom of the world was where we ended
up for. Okay. I know. Very full on.
S1 (04:51):
And what was the what was it like landing there?
a totally different landscape.
S2 (04:56):
Yeah. Yeah. Really? It was. It was a it was
a tough entry, to be honest. If I think back
on it, I was. Yeah, really homesick for Canada, for
our relatives, for, for everything that was familiar. Um, and
we kind of, you know, of course, they were just
so brave. They landed with no jobs. Um, dad did
(05:17):
some relief teaching in a high school. We ended up
in a in a really small town up in northwest
Tasmania because they needed teachers there. And I just remember being, ironically,
so freezing because in, in Canada, everything's so insulated. The
homes are totally set up for winters.
S1 (05:37):
You dress for it.
S2 (05:38):
You dress for it. Everyone has all the Parkers. You've
got the gear in north west Tasmania it was, oh
my God, I can still feel it. It was so
drafty and and I'd see the big condensation dripping down
the windows Inside, and we'd be huddled around this little
bar heater from Kmart just going, what has happened? Like,
(06:00):
how can we be so cold? Um, so yeah. And
it was, it was it was interesting. I had a really,
really thick Canadian accent. I got teased, of course, because
I was different and I was kind of, I don't know,
I was just a bit of a quirky kid. And, um,
so it was, it was it was tough in some ways,
but it ended up being great. Tasmania ended up being
(06:23):
a beautiful place to grow up, and it was also
my introduction to dance. So it kind of set me
on a path.
S1 (06:29):
You didn't really start dancing until your mid-teens and I understand,
didn't really do anything kind of resembling formal ballet until
about 19. Um, about a year ago on this podcast,
I interviewed Australian Ballet principal dancer Callum Linehan.
S2 (06:45):
I'm working with him at the moment. He's in my piece. Yes, he's.
S1 (06:48):
A lovely bloke. Yeah, but he sort of explained to
me how arduous it was training to be a dancer
as as a young kid, like once he was identified,
which was, I don't know, 11 or 12, like he
was quite young. Um, and I guess, are you glad
that you came to it a bit later and had
something resembling more of a normal childhood?
S2 (07:10):
Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Actually, I mean, there are pros and cons, right?
Because I had a lot of catching up to do.
So by the time I decided, okay, dance is what
I'm going to study, which was just such a hilarious notion,
now that I look back on it, because I was
I had very little experience. But, um, so there was
a huge amount of technical catching up to do. I
(07:32):
really had to do kind of boot camp to get
myself in into condition and to learn even the basics of,
of ballet technique, uh, let alone contemporary technique. But I
think the pro was very big and that was that.
I had I had a lot of confidence creatively. I
(07:53):
had nothing to kind of undo, you know? I didn't
have to unpack a whole lot of the burdens of
of technique or structure. I was I was completely comfortable
improvising and creating. I thought of myself as a choreographer
from a really young age, because that that was the
kind of culture I'd grown up with, with dance. And
(08:14):
so there were lots. Yeah, there were lots of good
things about that late start. I think I always kind
of positioned myself as a bit of an outsider, actually,
because I'd started so late. And that's been a somewhat
of a defining characteristic, I think, actually, and has served
me well because I kind of I enter into every
situation thinking, okay, this isn't my world, but I'm going
(08:36):
to figure it out. Um, and so to find myself
as the resident choreographer of the Australian Ballet, you can
imagine how mind blowing that is for someone with my background.
And now, and actually, as of this year, I've just
been appointed artist in residence of the Dresden Ballet as
well in Germany. So thank you. So to have these
connections to these huge classical institutions is, yeah, really phenomenal
(09:01):
and exciting. And I don't take it for granted for
a moment, but I think that that early start, feeling
like I have to figure out these worlds is um, yeah,
has has set me up well.
S1 (09:14):
I love asking athletes when I interview them what it
is they love about what they do like physically, whether
it's the act of kind of playing football or hitting
a tennis ball, what is it? They love the joy
they get out of that performance. So reframing it for you,
I can't help but think of that scene in the
movie Billy Elliot, where the, uh, sort of snooty selection panel, like,
(09:38):
asks him how it feels, and he's like electricity.
S3 (09:43):
You know, when he dances.
S1 (09:44):
What did it feel like for you when you began dancing.
Like what? What did you love about it? What do
you love about it still?
S2 (09:51):
Uh, I, I love almost everything about it. I love
I love the the way it takes you out of
your brain and puts you in your body in such
a tangible way. I love I love feeling slightly out
of control and off balance. Um. I love a feeling
(10:14):
of discovery. Like you're experiencing a movement for the first
time and you don't know how it happened and how
to reproduce it. I really, really love dancing with other people,
and I do miss that a lot. You know, I'm
not performing anymore, but I get that thrill from choreographing
and being in the studio with the dancers and and
creating movement with them. But I can I can viscerally
(10:36):
remember that feeling of of being in such close contact
that that intimate trust of of working with other dancers
and having literally having their physical safety in your hands,
or throwing your weight into someone else's arms and having
them catch you, or to be lifted, taken off your
(10:56):
own feet, off off your own center of gravity. It's
kind of an ecstatic state, actually.
S1 (11:02):
You mentioned collaboration there, and that dovetails quite neatly into
my next question. You grew up in the Baha'i Faith.
I hope I pronounced that correctly. A religion with the
catch phrase unity in diversity, including this sort of emphasis
on group experience. I believe you even went on a
year of service after high school to Canada, Hungary and
(11:23):
Israel as part of a kind of dance troupe, um,
based on the faith? Yes. Do you practice? Do you
still believe?
S2 (11:31):
No, no, no, I'm a hardcore atheist now. I've, I've, I've.
That's in my past. But I was really devout. I
was a very devout Baha'i when I was growing up.
My I mentioned my, my parents met in Ibiza. They
were hippie searchers, spiritual searchers in the 70s. And, um,
and my dad discovered the Baha'i Faith, and we were
(11:51):
all raised in that, in that religion. And it was
a huge part of my identity when I was growing
up and in my teens. But no, no longer I
my religion is art and nature.
S1 (12:02):
You had a bit of a three year lull, I think,
between high school and dance school. I did. What did
you get up to there? Were you, uh, in search
mode or.
S2 (12:11):
Oh, yes, partly. I was, um, I was searching for
what to do with my life. Really. I was so lost, I, I,
I was a very high achieving student at school. I'd
done really well and kind of had felt like I
had lots of options in a way, but then was
kind of paralyzed by those options. It felt like, well,
(12:32):
I don't I don't love anything in particular. And I
really didn't know what to do. And I felt like
all my friends were so clear about what they were doing.
They were all off to uni and studying international relations
and doing, you know, impressive things and were so clear
about it. And I was just really adrift. Um, so
I spent a year working in a sandwich shop and
in the deli at Coles and just earning some money.
(12:55):
And my goal was always to go overseas and and
do this year of service. It was called um under
the Baha'i framework. So I was saving up for that.
I had some intention in that direction, but I was
really just kind of I had no idea what I
was going to study or what I was going to
do for a career. And then while I was away
(13:16):
in that big year of travel, I made the hilarious
decision to to do dance. And and up to that point,
it had been my favorite hobby. To be clear, it
was it was my favorite thing to do on the weekends.
And I'd joined a youth dance company, and that was
really exciting for me. But I had very little training
and and so it was a pretty audacious thing to
(13:38):
start saying that I wanted to do. So I came
back from that year of travel and then started to
talk to anyone I knew who was in the dance
field and ended up plonking myself on the on the
stone steps of tasdance, literally just waiting there for the
artistic directors to turn up. And then they came and
found this little waif just sitting on their on their step.
(14:02):
And I said, I'd love to do an apprenticeship with
your company. And they set that up for me. How amazing. Like,
I just think these little acts of kindness along the way.
So that year, after travel, I ended up doing a year,
almost a year of apprenticeship with Tasdance. And it was
intended that I would kind of just be hanging around
(14:22):
the edges and maybe doing a bit of class and
that kind of thing, but I ended up performing with
the company. I ended up touring with the company. I
ended up leading workshops. So the the directors of the
company were kind of bonkers, but the experience was really valuable.
And then that's what led to me auditioning for VCA
in Melbourne.
S1 (14:42):
It's amazing how those little acts of kindness, or those
moments of luck or just.
S2 (14:47):
Yeah, can.
S1 (14:48):
Change a life.
S2 (14:49):
Luck and luck and pluck. I would say yeah, because
I yeah, I'm kind of amazed at my young self
just turning up on that doorstep, actually. And there's been
a bit of that since then. I've, I've, it's been
luck and pluck all the way. But I got myself
along to that doorstep. But yes, they were very generous
(15:10):
in opening the door.
S1 (15:11):
Now, you only got into dance school at the VCA. Sorry.
The Victorian College of the Arts for our New South
Wales listeners. Yes, by the skin of your teeth. You've
described visiting Melbourne for the first time and finding it
to be filthy grey, flat and featureless.
S2 (15:26):
Oh my God, did I say that? That is a
horrible thing to say about my dear city. You also.
But that is true. That is. That was my first impression. Yes.
S1 (15:35):
You also kind of, uh. Once you were there, you
barely passed at times had to really fight to kind
of graduate. I believe you might have even failed ballet
as a subject. It sounds like an incredibly tough time,
not just academically, but personally.
S2 (15:52):
Yeah. It was. It was a mixed bag for sure.
My my first year of study was was really. Oh,
it was it was a really difficult one for me
because I'd come from this, this background. The dancing I'd
been doing in Tasmania was very free, very creative. We
were very empowered as young artists in this youth company,
(16:15):
Stompin and and so that was my background. And, and
I came in to VCA and I just found it.
So confronting having to just follow this, this very codified techniques.
I felt restricted, I felt restrained. I really disliked having
to look at myself in the mirror all day, every day.
(16:35):
I found it very, uh. I really questioned it. I
felt like it was a very narcissistic pursuit. Like, why
am I doing this? How what what good is this
doing in the world? Especially because there was such a
focus on just training and technique, which of course now
I understand is is an a completely essential foundation to
being a dancer. You have to learn your trade, you
(16:59):
have to put in your 10,000 hours. And I really
bucked against that. I really I was, I was a bit, yeah,
rebellious and unhappy, at least for that first year. And
then I really had a turning point after at the
end of first year, where I'd made a very clear
decision that I was going to either just shut up
and stop my whining and get on with it or quit.
(17:19):
It's one or the other. So I'm either going to
be the best in the class and and go hard,
or go and do something else. Stop whining about it.
I made the choice to stay and and I did.
I did exceptionally well in most things, not ballet. Ballet
wasn't a great fit for me, but but I did
(17:40):
really well in everything else. And I met colleagues, my
my peers and and people who ended up being really
important collaborators in my life, dear, dear friends and and
started choreographing work and putting it, putting it out in public.
So it was. Yeah, it was the best possible training
(18:01):
for me, for all the good and bad things about it.
S1 (18:04):
And then of course, sort of exiting school, you got
kind of swept up in contemporary dance, including Lucy Guerin's
chunky move, Philip Adams Ballet Lab yourself, putting on kind
of scrappy shows with a collective performing at fringe festivals.
And it sounds like by 25 you were really performing
at a very high level, and then 26 you were
(18:27):
pregnant with your first daughter two years later. Another daughter? Yes. Those,
I imagine, were prime years for your dance career. Do
you mourn the loss of those years at all in
your vocation?
S2 (18:42):
I was literally just before coming here. I was holding
my daughter so tightly. She's 21 now that that darling
daughter had who I had when I was 26. And
just saying, I just love you so, so much. Never
move out. So, um, and of course I don't mean that,
but I kind of do. But, um, no, of course not. Um,
(19:03):
my daughters are everything to me. But it was. Yeah,
it was a it was it was interesting timing. Absolutely.
I because I'd started uni a bit late, I graduated
a bit late. And so everything was happening a little
bit late and I'd, I'd been on this, as you said,
just this amazing trajectory where dreams were coming true. Boom, boom, boom.
(19:24):
I was working with Gideon Obarzanek, I was working with
Lucy Guerin, I was working with Phillip Adams, like all
the kind of the superstars that I looked up to
when I was studying and thought in some distant universe,
I Universe. I might be in in a studio with them,
and I ended up working with all of them and
getting to tour the world and do things that I
couldn't have, really have dreamed of. And yeah, there was
(19:46):
there was an amazing momentum happening. And then and then
I was pregnant with my daughter and and life changed dramatically.
I basically stopped dancing altogether for about. Yeah, it was
probably 3 or 4 years where and right, as you say,
like right in a.
S1 (20:05):
Right in the sweet.
S2 (20:05):
Spot, right in the sweet spot. And and the dancer's
life span, the career, um, years are very short, really.
I mean, most dancers retire in quotation marks around 30
to 35, so. So I was very cognizant of the
fact that. Huh. Okay. My life's taken a turn. This
(20:26):
is this is interesting. I thought I felt like maybe
I was on the precipice of perhaps moving to Europe
or New York and and trying my luck in in
some bigger, bigger ponds. Um, and then, um, I ended
up having a family. So yeah, it was it was
a big rupture at the time. And I did really mourn.
I grieved dance and choreography because I, I felt like
(20:50):
I needed to come to terms with the fact that
it was over. Mhm. And that was, that was quite
hard to face, but it was not over. It turns
out very much not. There was a very incremental, gradual
return to dance that has ended up with me now
here with two grown daughters and this astonishing career. So
(21:14):
I it's I still pinch myself. It's unexpected.
S1 (21:19):
How did you feel about the switch from, um, dance
at a choreographer? I always wonder how that goes for
people in other endeavors, whether it's sort of, you know,
player to coach or even, uh, writer to editor, you know.
S2 (21:32):
True true, true. Yeah. Well, it's, um, it's it's different
for everyone. For me, dancing and choreographing were never separate.
I was always I've been choreographing as long as I've
been dancing. And you could probably argue that I've been
choreographing longer than I've been dancing, because I was bossing
(21:54):
my sisters around and getting them to be in dances.
And when I was very little and I, I can
I have memories of making up dances at home when
I was very small, so there wasn't ever a time
where I felt like I had to make a decision
and leave dance in order to become a choreographer, because
I was working in a more a kind of fluid
(22:16):
way between lots of choreographers and lots of of companies. Um,
there was downtime where I was able to always be,
I would always use that time to be making shows.
So I realized not so long ago that It. Next
year will be the. It'll be 30 years since my
first public, um, dance that I'd choreographed where there were
(22:40):
ticket buyers. So, uh, so I'm quite proud of that.
That's that's a that's a decent stint. Uh, so, yeah,
there was never really a decision to become a choreographer.
It was more like a decision to focus on choreography. So, uh,
when I was about when I was in my early 40s,
I decided to to hang up my hang up my
(23:03):
dance shoes. Actually, it had been quite a few years
before that that I decided to hang up my dance shoes.
But then I broke my arm in the middle of
the opening night of that show that I'd. I'd made
this decision that it was going to be my last
show as a performer. And and then I literally yeah,
my I was in hospital getting a cast on and
(23:23):
I thought, uh, this isn't how I go out. No way.
This isn't the last one. And then I ended up
doing many more years after that because I got the
bug again, and I ended up doing about three more.
Lucy Guerin shows after that. But yeah, at that point
I was already touring my own works internationally and things
were really taking off for me as a freelance choreographer.
S1 (23:43):
Your partner, Robin Fox, is a sound and light artist
and composer who has collaborated on many works with you.
What's that like working together?
S2 (23:54):
Yeah, it's so awesome.
S1 (23:55):
Not fraud at.
S2 (23:56):
All. No. Love it. It's the best, best, best. Yeah. Yeah,
we we've got a good groove going on. We've we
collaborate a lot with virtually every work I've made since
I've met him has been together with the odd exception.
So that's a pretty good track record. We've been together
15 years now, and, um, and almost instantaneously, uh, we
(24:22):
started working together. But it happened in this really organic way.
Like he was, he'd just come in to watch a
bit of something that I was working on with two dancers.
I was working on a duet at the time and
and I was just in the studio going, I'm just
clicking out this count because I didn't have anything. I just,
I just needed the meter for the dancers. And he said,
(24:44):
do you want me to I can do I can
kind of whip something up for you if you want.
Would that be better? So you don't have to do that?
And I was like, okay, yeah, sure. Go for it. Fine.
And he ended up making this great track that just
had such, you know, it was literally just like a
techno pulse. But I just it was the texture of
it and it was, it was so simple but clean
and gorgeous. Um, and that was literally the beginning of
(25:05):
our collaboration. And now we've made some huge shows together
in the last few years, particularly with just getting more
and more ambitious with what we're doing and, and have
started to work overseas. And, um, yeah, it's been it's
been really wonderful. But he's this is just a small
part of his many faceted, um, life. He's literally opening
(25:25):
the mess, which is the Melbourne electronic sound studio in
Fed Square. This living museum of electronic music instruments. So yeah,
he's he's a busy boy, but we work together very well.
S1 (25:38):
You formed your own company, as I mentioned before, back
in 2014. I'm always full of admiration for people who
do that, who kind of back themselves to go out
and build something new, because it sounds so bloody terrifying
to me. Um, what was that like, hanging your own shingle?
S2 (25:56):
Oh, look, I'm glad I was as naive as I
was at the time, because if I'd known what was involved,
I never would have done it. Mhm. Um. It's madness.
And you're right. It is. It is terrifying. It's best
not to think about it and just think of it
as a very small step. So I was lucky that
I had, uh, I was working with a producer at
the time who just kind of almost quite casually said,
(26:19):
I think it'd be good for you just to, you know,
formalize it and call it a company. And, um, we
can look after the paperwork for you with that. But
it will just help with, you know, just just giving
it a bit more gravitas. I was like, oh, sure, sure.
Like it really was quite. It felt very simple. Um,
it just seemed like almost like an administrative thing at
the time. Yeah. And I think that that was actually
(26:41):
really fortunate, because I don't know if I would have
had the guts to do it if it hadn't have
been proposed so lightly. To be fair, I have always
had a dream of having a company, of making bigger works,
and particularly of of having some kind of framework that
could support an emerging choreographers, other artists, something much bigger
(27:02):
than myself. And I'm inspired by people that have done that.
But but I probably thought that that was more in
the future. Not not at the point that it did happen. Um,
but there was there was good momentum happening at that time, 2013, 2014.
That's when I was starting to get invited to tour
my work internationally. I was getting commissions from other companies.
It was really taking off. And and so it did
(27:23):
seem like a good time, but. But also I remember
distinctly in 20 around 2012, 2013, wondering if it was
time to to wind it up because at the same time,
things weren't there were kind of a few disappointments. Things
weren't really happening. I didn't feel like, yeah, I didn't
(27:44):
feel like there was really a reason to keep going
that maybe I needed to, to listen and and just, um,
gracefully step, step aside. And I felt really sad about that.
I really remember that feeling of going, no, I think
it is time to wind it up. Um, so to
go from that to then starting the company and, and
(28:08):
just taking that chance and going, okay, all right, let's,
let's do it, see what happens. And then to be
here ten, 11 years later, um, with something I could
barely have dreamt of is is really astonishing.
S1 (28:22):
And of course, last year, as I mentioned earlier, you
were appointed resident choreographer for the Australian Ballet. That must
have felt like some kind of vindication after this very
zigzaggy career.
S2 (28:33):
Oh my goodness, I can't tell you. It was absolutely gobsmacking.
So David, the amazing David Hallberg, who's the artistic director
of the Australian Ballet.
S1 (28:44):
I think we've had him on the podcast.
S2 (28:45):
I'm sure you have.
S1 (28:46):
Lovely American.
S2 (28:47):
Fellow. Amazing, amazing person. He, um. Yeah, he was supportive
of my work. He'd commissioned me to make a short
work for the company. We talked about making something bigger
in the future. And then he'd called me in for
a meeting. He wanted to. He just sent me a
casual text and said, could we, um. Do you have
time for a meeting sometime this week? And I actually
(29:10):
felt I just had this instinct that something was wrong.
And so I put it off. I was like, ah, um,
I'm pretty busy this week. Um, how's next week? And
I don't know why, but I just kind of I
just wanted to put it off because I thought that
there was some issue. I actually thought that he was
going to tell me that, no, that the Major Commission
(29:30):
had fallen through, that actually they'd had a change of
heart and they'd decided to pull that one. And so
I delayed that meeting and and I even asked, oh,
is there something we can do over the phone? And
he said, no, we really need to meet face to
face for this one. And I thought, oh shit, it's
really bad. It's really bad. And then I went into
his office, braced for bad news, and he could have
(29:51):
knocked me over with a feather when he said, we'd
like to invite you to be the resident choreographer of
the Australian Ballet. I just honestly could. It was one
of the most surprising and happiest moments of my life.
It was, um, yeah. And it's been it's just been
a dream.
S1 (30:10):
You've got a new and intimate work debuting next week,
seven days, as part of the triple bill prism at
the Regent Theatre in Melbourne from September 20th 5th to
October 4th, and then at the Sydney Opera House from
November 7 to 15. You're also jumping into a perhaps
unfamiliar role as a festival organizer of sorts, working on
(30:32):
dance X, bringing together 14 dance companies for an October
event at the Arts Centre Melbourne. How do you go
with something like The Ladder? Something logical kind of switching
into your left brain?
S2 (30:47):
Oh well, I wouldn't call myself a festival organiser on that.
I won't give myself that credit. I am a mere
helper on that amazing project. Dance X is something that
the Australian Ballet launched two years ago, I think, and
this is the second iteration, and I'm. I'm merely helping
with the programming and logistics and but that was a
(31:10):
large part of the appeal of taking the role as
resident choreographer was not only the chance to work with
the company and And make works on those incredible ballet dancers.
But all of the other stuff that was surrounding it,
which was being part of the curatorial process, mentoring emerging
choreographers through the company, being part of of programming discussions
(31:35):
in projects such as dance. So absolutely love all of that.
And I've been I've been kind of I've been doing
that since a really young age. Like I mentioned, I
had a we had a collective at VCA called trike
and we put on our own shows and I've been
doing it's been that kind of spirit of community and,
and collaboration since the beginning. So this is very much
(31:57):
in my wheelhouse and something that I feel very passionate about. Um,
I enjoy it as much as choreography.
S1 (32:04):
I read a profile of you last year, and it
described a morning of rehearsal ahead of a production called
Circle Electric, and the scene pioneered in this story was
of you kind of giving these questions to the dancers. dances,
this whole list of questions that they had to go
away and consider. I want to put one of them
to you. It was a direction. You called on each
(32:25):
of them to list three things you've felt. Today I'm
mindful that it's only noon right now, but would you
favor us with three things that you've felt today?
S2 (32:37):
Oh, gosh. Okay. I've felt deeply tired. I've felt, um.
I felt, as I said before, this intense, burning love
for my my daughter. For some reason, she was buttering
my toast and putting honey on it, and I just
felt massive appreciation for my family. Um, and I feel
(32:59):
nervousness because I think today I'm going to meet one
of my heroes, William Forsythe, who's part of this triple
bill in Prism. And he's been one of my biggest
choreographic inspirations. And I think I'm going to run into
him at the studio today. So this is a big
day for me.
S1 (33:14):
Fantastic. Well, we'd better let you get on with that guy.
Thank you so much for coming in and having a chat.
S2 (33:20):
Such a pleasure. Thank you.
S1 (33:25):
That was choreographer Stephanie Lake on the latest good weekend talks.
If you enjoyed this episode, please remember to subscribe, rate
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in for more compelling conversations. Coming soon! We chat with
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brought to you by The Sydney Morning Herald and The
(33:45):
Age proud newsrooms powered by subscriptions to support independent journalism. Search,
subscribe Sydney Morning Herald or The Age? This episode of
Good Weekend Talks is produced by Konrad Marshall, with technical
assistance from Cormac Lally and editing by our executive producer
Tami Mills. Tom McKendrick is head of audio and Melissa
(34:06):
Stevens is the editor of Good Weekend.
Hi, I'm Konrad Marshall and from the Sydney Morning Herald
and The Age. Welcome to Good Weekend Talks, a magazine
for your ears, featuring in-depth conversations with fascinating people from
sport and politics, science and culture, business and beyond. Every week,
you can download new episodes in which top journalists from
across our newsrooms talk to compelling people about the definitive
(00:28):
stories of the day. In this episode, we talk to
Stephanie Lake. The former dancer turned choreographer is the artistic
director of Stephanie Lake Company and also the resident choreographer
for the Australian Ballet. She's leading figure in Australian dance,
the winner of many awards including the Helpmann. And while
(00:50):
her rise was stratospheric, it wasn't always linear and in
some ways it came quite late. We're lucky to have
her in the studio today to talk through her life story,
which starts in Canada before taking a turn south to
Tasmania and now Melbourne, a journey rich in resilience, creativity
and balance. Welcome, Stephanie.
S2 (01:12):
Thank you so much. What an intro.
S1 (01:14):
Now, you lived in Canada until you were eight years old,
and I love the name of the place you're from.
I always have loved that name. Saskatoon, Saskatchewan.
S2 (01:22):
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. It sounds like a joke, but it's real.
Isn't that just the best? I was born in Saskatoon,
which is also in the same hospital as Joni Mitchell,
which I love as a small detail, but, um, I
lived in a tiny little village just outside of Saskatoon.
S1 (01:37):
What was life like there? I mean, freezing cold winters.
S2 (01:40):
It was very rural. It was it was brutally cold
in the winters. But I was a kid, so I
just thought it was fun. We were building snow forts
and playing with, you know, just just having a lot
of fun in the snow. But I think for adults,
it's just almost unbearable. It gets to -40 degrees, which
is an incomprehensible temperature. But but I loved it. It was.
(02:04):
It was just home. We we skied and skated and
played in the snow. Rugged up. It was good.
S1 (02:10):
I lived in North America for a while, kind of
right up there near Canada as well, and loved, uh,
loved that experience. But you have to make use of
the cold. You. Yes. If you're not going out there
and skating on a frozen pond or hitting a ski
mountain or something, um, you're just gonna get sad.
S2 (02:29):
It was. We spent a lot of time outside, ironically. And, um.
And the seasons are really marked. I remember really beautiful
autumn's fall there. Of course. Um, and spring is so
dramatic because it's been nothing but white for six months.
And then you see the little buds poking through the,
the slush and and the buds opening on the trees.
(02:50):
It's really dramatic and gorgeous, but it's an incredibly flat landscape.
Saskatchewan is is wheat belt prairies. Um, not a hill
in sight. So there are some classic photos from my, um,
childhood photo albums of of mum pushing a pram just
into kind of oblivion. Like literally a straight road to
(03:13):
the horizon. And she. Yeah, they would say, yeah, they'd
go for a walk and then you'd just, you'd just
walk in a straight line and turn around and walk
back along that straight line back home. Um, so very
different to the Tasmanian landscape, but, but really imprinted in
my memory, I think, in my DNA.
S1 (03:30):
What, uh, like the family, as you say, then moved
to Launceston. What prompted the move to Lonnie and what
was that culture shock?
S2 (03:38):
Well, mum was yeah, it was a big culture shock. Um,
mum's Scottish and dad's Canadian. They'd met in Ibiza in
the 70s and. And. Yeah, it was different to, to
to what it is now. I hear I've never been there, but, um,
it was kind of a hippie enclave at that time,
but they ended up back in Canada when they married
(03:59):
and they did ten years there, which is a pretty
good stint. But I don't think it was really sustainable
just because of the, the brutality of the, of the weather. And, um,
and so they decided to move elsewhere and, and kind
of poked a finger on the map and ended up
with Tasmania. Remarkable. Yeah. I mean, it blows my mind still,
(04:21):
I've got kids myself. And I just think, Good God,
what were you thinking? They had three kids. My mum, uh,
one of her sisters lived in Perth in WA, so
that was I think that helped them get the points
up for migration, you know? Um, I think there was
some intention of possibly ending up in Perth, but they
(04:42):
didn't like it. And so the little heart shaped island
at the bottom of the world was where we ended
up for. Okay. I know. Very full on.
S1 (04:51):
And what was the what was it like landing there?
a totally different landscape.
S2 (04:56):
Yeah. Yeah. Really? It was. It was a it was
a tough entry, to be honest. If I think back
on it, I was. Yeah, really homesick for Canada, for
our relatives, for, for everything that was familiar. Um, and
we kind of, you know, of course, they were just
so brave. They landed with no jobs. Um, dad did
(05:17):
some relief teaching in a high school. We ended up
in a in a really small town up in northwest
Tasmania because they needed teachers there. And I just remember being, ironically,
so freezing because in, in Canada, everything's so insulated. The
homes are totally set up for winters.
S1 (05:37):
You dress for it.
S2 (05:38):
You dress for it. Everyone has all the Parkers. You've
got the gear in north west Tasmania it was, oh
my God, I can still feel it. It was so
drafty and and I'd see the big condensation dripping down
the windows Inside, and we'd be huddled around this little
bar heater from Kmart just going, what has happened? Like,
(06:00):
how can we be so cold? Um, so yeah. And
it was, it was it was interesting. I had a really,
really thick Canadian accent. I got teased, of course, because
I was different and I was kind of, I don't know,
I was just a bit of a quirky kid. And, um,
so it was, it was it was tough in some ways,
but it ended up being great. Tasmania ended up being
(06:23):
a beautiful place to grow up, and it was also
my introduction to dance. So it kind of set me
on a path.
S1 (06:29):
You didn't really start dancing until your mid-teens and I understand,
didn't really do anything kind of resembling formal ballet until
about 19. Um, about a year ago on this podcast,
I interviewed Australian Ballet principal dancer Callum Linehan.
S2 (06:45):
I'm working with him at the moment. He's in my piece. Yes, he's.
S1 (06:48):
A lovely bloke. Yeah, but he sort of explained to
me how arduous it was training to be a dancer
as as a young kid, like once he was identified,
which was, I don't know, 11 or 12, like he
was quite young. Um, and I guess, are you glad
that you came to it a bit later and had
something resembling more of a normal childhood?
S2 (07:10):
Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Actually, I mean, there are pros and cons, right?
Because I had a lot of catching up to do.
So by the time I decided, okay, dance is what
I'm going to study, which was just such a hilarious notion,
now that I look back on it, because I was
I had very little experience. But, um, so there was
a huge amount of technical catching up to do. I
(07:32):
really had to do kind of boot camp to get
myself in into condition and to learn even the basics of,
of ballet technique, uh, let alone contemporary technique. But I
think the pro was very big and that was that.
I had I had a lot of confidence creatively. I
(07:53):
had nothing to kind of undo, you know? I didn't
have to unpack a whole lot of the burdens of
of technique or structure. I was I was completely comfortable
improvising and creating. I thought of myself as a choreographer
from a really young age, because that that was the
kind of culture I'd grown up with, with dance. And
(08:14):
so there were lots. Yeah, there were lots of good
things about that late start. I think I always kind
of positioned myself as a bit of an outsider, actually,
because I'd started so late. And that's been a somewhat
of a defining characteristic, I think, actually, and has served
me well because I kind of I enter into every
situation thinking, okay, this isn't my world, but I'm going
(08:36):
to figure it out. Um, and so to find myself
as the resident choreographer of the Australian Ballet, you can
imagine how mind blowing that is for someone with my background.
And now, and actually, as of this year, I've just
been appointed artist in residence of the Dresden Ballet as
well in Germany. So thank you. So to have these
connections to these huge classical institutions is, yeah, really phenomenal
(09:01):
and exciting. And I don't take it for granted for
a moment, but I think that that early start, feeling
like I have to figure out these worlds is um, yeah,
has has set me up well.
S1 (09:14):
I love asking athletes when I interview them what it
is they love about what they do like physically, whether
it's the act of kind of playing football or hitting
a tennis ball, what is it? They love the joy
they get out of that performance. So reframing it for you,
I can't help but think of that scene in the
movie Billy Elliot, where the, uh, sort of snooty selection panel, like,
(09:38):
asks him how it feels, and he's like electricity.
S3 (09:43):
You know, when he dances.
S1 (09:44):
What did it feel like for you when you began dancing.
Like what? What did you love about it? What do
you love about it still?
S2 (09:51):
Uh, I, I love almost everything about it. I love
I love the the way it takes you out of
your brain and puts you in your body in such
a tangible way. I love I love feeling slightly out
of control and off balance. Um. I love a feeling
(10:14):
of discovery. Like you're experiencing a movement for the first
time and you don't know how it happened and how
to reproduce it. I really, really love dancing with other people,
and I do miss that a lot. You know, I'm
not performing anymore, but I get that thrill from choreographing
and being in the studio with the dancers and and
creating movement with them. But I can I can viscerally
(10:36):
remember that feeling of of being in such close contact
that that intimate trust of of working with other dancers
and having literally having their physical safety in your hands,
or throwing your weight into someone else's arms and having
them catch you, or to be lifted, taken off your
(10:56):
own feet, off off your own center of gravity. It's
kind of an ecstatic state, actually.
S1 (11:02):
You mentioned collaboration there, and that dovetails quite neatly into
my next question. You grew up in the Baha'i Faith.
I hope I pronounced that correctly. A religion with the
catch phrase unity in diversity, including this sort of emphasis
on group experience. I believe you even went on a
year of service after high school to Canada, Hungary and
(11:23):
Israel as part of a kind of dance troupe, um,
based on the faith? Yes. Do you practice? Do you
still believe?
S2 (11:31):
No, no, no, I'm a hardcore atheist now. I've, I've, I've.
That's in my past. But I was really devout. I
was a very devout Baha'i when I was growing up.
My I mentioned my, my parents met in Ibiza. They
were hippie searchers, spiritual searchers in the 70s. And, um,
and my dad discovered the Baha'i Faith, and we were
(11:51):
all raised in that, in that religion. And it was
a huge part of my identity when I was growing
up and in my teens. But no, no longer I
my religion is art and nature.
S1 (12:02):
You had a bit of a three year lull, I think,
between high school and dance school. I did. What did
you get up to there? Were you, uh, in search
mode or.
S2 (12:11):
Oh, yes, partly. I was, um, I was searching for
what to do with my life. Really. I was so lost, I, I,
I was a very high achieving student at school. I'd
done really well and kind of had felt like I
had lots of options in a way, but then was
kind of paralyzed by those options. It felt like, well,
(12:32):
I don't I don't love anything in particular. And I
really didn't know what to do. And I felt like
all my friends were so clear about what they were doing.
They were all off to uni and studying international relations
and doing, you know, impressive things and were so clear
about it. And I was just really adrift. Um, so
I spent a year working in a sandwich shop and
in the deli at Coles and just earning some money.
(12:55):
And my goal was always to go overseas and and
do this year of service. It was called um under
the Baha'i framework. So I was saving up for that.
I had some intention in that direction, but I was
really just kind of I had no idea what I
was going to study or what I was going to
do for a career. And then while I was away
(13:16):
in that big year of travel, I made the hilarious
decision to to do dance. And and up to that point,
it had been my favorite hobby. To be clear, it
was it was my favorite thing to do on the weekends.
And I'd joined a youth dance company, and that was
really exciting for me. But I had very little training
and and so it was a pretty audacious thing to
(13:38):
start saying that I wanted to do. So I came
back from that year of travel and then started to
talk to anyone I knew who was in the dance
field and ended up plonking myself on the on the
stone steps of tasdance, literally just waiting there for the
artistic directors to turn up. And then they came and
found this little waif just sitting on their on their step.
(14:02):
And I said, I'd love to do an apprenticeship with
your company. And they set that up for me. How amazing. Like,
I just think these little acts of kindness along the way.
So that year, after travel, I ended up doing a year,
almost a year of apprenticeship with Tasdance. And it was
intended that I would kind of just be hanging around
(14:22):
the edges and maybe doing a bit of class and
that kind of thing, but I ended up performing with
the company. I ended up touring with the company. I
ended up leading workshops. So the the directors of the
company were kind of bonkers, but the experience was really valuable.
And then that's what led to me auditioning for VCA
in Melbourne.
S1 (14:42):
It's amazing how those little acts of kindness, or those
moments of luck or just.
S2 (14:47):
Yeah, can.
S1 (14:48):
Change a life.
S2 (14:49):
Luck and luck and pluck. I would say yeah, because
I yeah, I'm kind of amazed at my young self
just turning up on that doorstep, actually. And there's been
a bit of that since then. I've, I've, it's been
luck and pluck all the way. But I got myself
along to that doorstep. But yes, they were very generous
(15:10):
in opening the door.
S1 (15:11):
Now, you only got into dance school at the VCA. Sorry.
The Victorian College of the Arts for our New South
Wales listeners. Yes, by the skin of your teeth. You've
described visiting Melbourne for the first time and finding it
to be filthy grey, flat and featureless.
S2 (15:26):
Oh my God, did I say that? That is a
horrible thing to say about my dear city. You also.
But that is true. That is. That was my first impression. Yes.
S1 (15:35):
You also kind of, uh. Once you were there, you
barely passed at times had to really fight to kind
of graduate. I believe you might have even failed ballet
as a subject. It sounds like an incredibly tough time,
not just academically, but personally.
S2 (15:52):
Yeah. It was. It was a mixed bag for sure.
My my first year of study was was really. Oh,
it was it was a really difficult one for me
because I'd come from this, this background. The dancing I'd
been doing in Tasmania was very free, very creative. We
were very empowered as young artists in this youth company,
(16:15):
Stompin and and so that was my background. And, and
I came in to VCA and I just found it.
So confronting having to just follow this, this very codified techniques.
I felt restricted, I felt restrained. I really disliked having
to look at myself in the mirror all day, every day.
(16:35):
I found it very, uh. I really questioned it. I
felt like it was a very narcissistic pursuit. Like, why
am I doing this? How what what good is this
doing in the world? Especially because there was such a
focus on just training and technique, which of course now
I understand is is an a completely essential foundation to
being a dancer. You have to learn your trade, you
(16:59):
have to put in your 10,000 hours. And I really
bucked against that. I really I was, I was a bit, yeah,
rebellious and unhappy, at least for that first year. And
then I really had a turning point after at the
end of first year, where I'd made a very clear
decision that I was going to either just shut up
and stop my whining and get on with it or quit.
(17:19):
It's one or the other. So I'm either going to
be the best in the class and and go hard,
or go and do something else. Stop whining about it.
I made the choice to stay and and I did.
I did exceptionally well in most things, not ballet. Ballet
wasn't a great fit for me, but but I did
(17:40):
really well in everything else. And I met colleagues, my
my peers and and people who ended up being really
important collaborators in my life, dear, dear friends and and
started choreographing work and putting it, putting it out in public.
So it was. Yeah, it was the best possible training
(18:01):
for me, for all the good and bad things about it.
S1 (18:04):
And then of course, sort of exiting school, you got
kind of swept up in contemporary dance, including Lucy Guerin's
chunky move, Philip Adams Ballet Lab yourself, putting on kind
of scrappy shows with a collective performing at fringe festivals.
And it sounds like by 25 you were really performing
at a very high level, and then 26 you were
(18:27):
pregnant with your first daughter two years later. Another daughter? Yes. Those,
I imagine, were prime years for your dance career. Do
you mourn the loss of those years at all in
your vocation?
S2 (18:42):
I was literally just before coming here. I was holding
my daughter so tightly. She's 21 now that that darling
daughter had who I had when I was 26. And
just saying, I just love you so, so much. Never
move out. So, um, and of course I don't mean that,
but I kind of do. But, um, no, of course not. Um,
(19:03):
my daughters are everything to me. But it was. Yeah,
it was a it was it was interesting timing. Absolutely.
I because I'd started uni a bit late, I graduated
a bit late. And so everything was happening a little
bit late and I'd, I'd been on this, as you said,
just this amazing trajectory where dreams were coming true. Boom, boom, boom.
(19:24):
I was working with Gideon Obarzanek, I was working with
Lucy Guerin, I was working with Phillip Adams, like all
the kind of the superstars that I looked up to
when I was studying and thought in some distant universe,
I Universe. I might be in in a studio with them,
and I ended up working with all of them and
getting to tour the world and do things that I
couldn't have, really have dreamed of. And yeah, there was
(19:46):
there was an amazing momentum happening. And then and then
I was pregnant with my daughter and and life changed dramatically.
I basically stopped dancing altogether for about. Yeah, it was
probably 3 or 4 years where and right, as you say,
like right in a.
S1 (20:05):
Right in the sweet.
S2 (20:05):
Spot, right in the sweet spot. And and the dancer's
life span, the career, um, years are very short, really.
I mean, most dancers retire in quotation marks around 30
to 35, so. So I was very cognizant of the
fact that. Huh. Okay. My life's taken a turn. This
(20:26):
is this is interesting. I thought I felt like maybe
I was on the precipice of perhaps moving to Europe
or New York and and trying my luck in in
some bigger, bigger ponds. Um, and then, um, I ended
up having a family. So yeah, it was it was
a big rupture at the time. And I did really mourn.
I grieved dance and choreography because I, I felt like
(20:50):
I needed to come to terms with the fact that
it was over. Mhm. And that was, that was quite
hard to face, but it was not over. It turns
out very much not. There was a very incremental, gradual
return to dance that has ended up with me now
here with two grown daughters and this astonishing career. So
(21:14):
I it's I still pinch myself. It's unexpected.
S1 (21:19):
How did you feel about the switch from, um, dance
at a choreographer? I always wonder how that goes for
people in other endeavors, whether it's sort of, you know,
player to coach or even, uh, writer to editor, you know.
S2 (21:32):
True true, true. Yeah. Well, it's, um, it's it's different
for everyone. For me, dancing and choreographing were never separate.
I was always I've been choreographing as long as I've
been dancing. And you could probably argue that I've been
choreographing longer than I've been dancing, because I was bossing
(21:54):
my sisters around and getting them to be in dances.
And when I was very little and I, I can
I have memories of making up dances at home when
I was very small, so there wasn't ever a time
where I felt like I had to make a decision
and leave dance in order to become a choreographer, because
I was working in a more a kind of fluid
(22:16):
way between lots of choreographers and lots of of companies. Um,
there was downtime where I was able to always be,
I would always use that time to be making shows.
So I realized not so long ago that It. Next
year will be the. It'll be 30 years since my
first public, um, dance that I'd choreographed where there were
(22:40):
ticket buyers. So, uh, so I'm quite proud of that.
That's that's a that's a decent stint. Uh, so, yeah,
there was never really a decision to become a choreographer.
It was more like a decision to focus on choreography. So, uh,
when I was about when I was in my early 40s,
I decided to to hang up my hang up my
(23:03):
dance shoes. Actually, it had been quite a few years
before that that I decided to hang up my dance shoes.
But then I broke my arm in the middle of
the opening night of that show that I'd. I'd made
this decision that it was going to be my last
show as a performer. And and then I literally yeah,
my I was in hospital getting a cast on and
(23:23):
I thought, uh, this isn't how I go out. No way.
This isn't the last one. And then I ended up
doing many more years after that because I got the
bug again, and I ended up doing about three more.
Lucy Guerin shows after that. But yeah, at that point
I was already touring my own works internationally and things
were really taking off for me as a freelance choreographer.
S1 (23:43):
Your partner, Robin Fox, is a sound and light artist
and composer who has collaborated on many works with you.
What's that like working together?
S2 (23:54):
Yeah, it's so awesome.
S1 (23:55):
Not fraud at.
S2 (23:56):
All. No. Love it. It's the best, best, best. Yeah. Yeah,
we we've got a good groove going on. We've we
collaborate a lot with virtually every work I've made since
I've met him has been together with the odd exception.
So that's a pretty good track record. We've been together
15 years now, and, um, and almost instantaneously, uh, we
(24:22):
started working together. But it happened in this really organic way.
Like he was, he'd just come in to watch a
bit of something that I was working on with two dancers.
I was working on a duet at the time and
and I was just in the studio going, I'm just
clicking out this count because I didn't have anything. I just,
I just needed the meter for the dancers. And he said,
(24:44):
do you want me to I can do I can
kind of whip something up for you if you want.
Would that be better? So you don't have to do that?
And I was like, okay, yeah, sure. Go for it. Fine.
And he ended up making this great track that just
had such, you know, it was literally just like a
techno pulse. But I just it was the texture of
it and it was, it was so simple but clean
and gorgeous. Um, and that was literally the beginning of
(25:05):
our collaboration. And now we've made some huge shows together
in the last few years, particularly with just getting more
and more ambitious with what we're doing and, and have
started to work overseas. And, um, yeah, it's been it's
been really wonderful. But he's this is just a small
part of his many faceted, um, life. He's literally opening
(25:25):
the mess, which is the Melbourne electronic sound studio in
Fed Square. This living museum of electronic music instruments. So yeah,
he's he's a busy boy, but we work together very well.
S1 (25:38):
You formed your own company, as I mentioned before, back
in 2014. I'm always full of admiration for people who
do that, who kind of back themselves to go out
and build something new, because it sounds so bloody terrifying
to me. Um, what was that like, hanging your own shingle?
S2 (25:56):
Oh, look, I'm glad I was as naive as I
was at the time, because if I'd known what was involved,
I never would have done it. Mhm. Um. It's madness.
And you're right. It is. It is terrifying. It's best
not to think about it and just think of it
as a very small step. So I was lucky that
I had, uh, I was working with a producer at
the time who just kind of almost quite casually said,
(26:19):
I think it'd be good for you just to, you know,
formalize it and call it a company. And, um, we
can look after the paperwork for you with that. But
it will just help with, you know, just just giving
it a bit more gravitas. I was like, oh, sure, sure.
Like it really was quite. It felt very simple. Um,
it just seemed like almost like an administrative thing at
the time. Yeah. And I think that that was actually
(26:41):
really fortunate, because I don't know if I would have
had the guts to do it if it hadn't have
been proposed so lightly. To be fair, I have always
had a dream of having a company, of making bigger works,
and particularly of of having some kind of framework that
could support an emerging choreographers, other artists, something much bigger
(27:02):
than myself. And I'm inspired by people that have done that.
But but I probably thought that that was more in
the future. Not not at the point that it did happen. Um,
but there was there was good momentum happening at that time, 2013, 2014.
That's when I was starting to get invited to tour
my work internationally. I was getting commissions from other companies.
It was really taking off. And and so it did
(27:23):
seem like a good time, but. But also I remember
distinctly in 20 around 2012, 2013, wondering if it was
time to to wind it up because at the same time,
things weren't there were kind of a few disappointments. Things
weren't really happening. I didn't feel like, yeah, I didn't
(27:44):
feel like there was really a reason to keep going
that maybe I needed to, to listen and and just, um,
gracefully step, step aside. And I felt really sad about that.
I really remember that feeling of going, no, I think
it is time to wind it up. Um, so to
go from that to then starting the company and, and
(28:08):
just taking that chance and going, okay, all right, let's,
let's do it, see what happens. And then to be
here ten, 11 years later, um, with something I could
barely have dreamt of is is really astonishing.
S1 (28:22):
And of course, last year, as I mentioned earlier, you
were appointed resident choreographer for the Australian Ballet. That must
have felt like some kind of vindication after this very
zigzaggy career.
S2 (28:33):
Oh my goodness, I can't tell you. It was absolutely gobsmacking.
So David, the amazing David Hallberg, who's the artistic director
of the Australian Ballet.
S1 (28:44):
I think we've had him on the podcast.
S2 (28:45):
I'm sure you have.
S1 (28:46):
Lovely American.
S2 (28:47):
Fellow. Amazing, amazing person. He, um. Yeah, he was supportive
of my work. He'd commissioned me to make a short
work for the company. We talked about making something bigger
in the future. And then he'd called me in for
a meeting. He wanted to. He just sent me a
casual text and said, could we, um. Do you have
time for a meeting sometime this week? And I actually
(29:10):
felt I just had this instinct that something was wrong.
And so I put it off. I was like, ah, um,
I'm pretty busy this week. Um, how's next week? And
I don't know why, but I just kind of I
just wanted to put it off because I thought that
there was some issue. I actually thought that he was
going to tell me that, no, that the Major Commission
(29:30):
had fallen through, that actually they'd had a change of
heart and they'd decided to pull that one. And so
I delayed that meeting and and I even asked, oh,
is there something we can do over the phone? And
he said, no, we really need to meet face to
face for this one. And I thought, oh shit, it's
really bad. It's really bad. And then I went into
his office, braced for bad news, and he could have
(29:51):
knocked me over with a feather when he said, we'd
like to invite you to be the resident choreographer of
the Australian Ballet. I just honestly could. It was one
of the most surprising and happiest moments of my life.
It was, um, yeah. And it's been it's just been
a dream.
S1 (30:10):
You've got a new and intimate work debuting next week,
seven days, as part of the triple bill prism at
the Regent Theatre in Melbourne from September 20th 5th to
October 4th, and then at the Sydney Opera House from
November 7 to 15. You're also jumping into a perhaps
unfamiliar role as a festival organizer of sorts, working on
(30:32):
dance X, bringing together 14 dance companies for an October
event at the Arts Centre Melbourne. How do you go
with something like The Ladder? Something logical kind of switching
into your left brain?
S2 (30:47):
Oh well, I wouldn't call myself a festival organiser on that.
I won't give myself that credit. I am a mere
helper on that amazing project. Dance X is something that
the Australian Ballet launched two years ago, I think, and
this is the second iteration, and I'm. I'm merely helping
with the programming and logistics and but that was a
(31:10):
large part of the appeal of taking the role as
resident choreographer was not only the chance to work with
the company and And make works on those incredible ballet dancers.
But all of the other stuff that was surrounding it,
which was being part of the curatorial process, mentoring emerging
choreographers through the company, being part of of programming discussions
(31:35):
in projects such as dance. So absolutely love all of that.
And I've been I've been kind of I've been doing
that since a really young age. Like I mentioned, I
had a we had a collective at VCA called trike
and we put on our own shows and I've been
doing it's been that kind of spirit of community and,
and collaboration since the beginning. So this is very much
(31:57):
in my wheelhouse and something that I feel very passionate about. Um,
I enjoy it as much as choreography.
S1 (32:04):
I read a profile of you last year, and it
described a morning of rehearsal ahead of a production called
Circle Electric, and the scene pioneered in this story was
of you kind of giving these questions to the dancers. dances,
this whole list of questions that they had to go
away and consider. I want to put one of them
to you. It was a direction. You called on each
(32:25):
of them to list three things you've felt. Today I'm
mindful that it's only noon right now, but would you
favor us with three things that you've felt today?
S2 (32:37):
Oh, gosh. Okay. I've felt deeply tired. I've felt, um.
I felt, as I said before, this intense, burning love
for my my daughter. For some reason, she was buttering
my toast and putting honey on it, and I just
felt massive appreciation for my family. Um, and I feel
(32:59):
nervousness because I think today I'm going to meet one
of my heroes, William Forsythe, who's part of this triple
bill in Prism. And he's been one of my biggest
choreographic inspirations. And I think I'm going to run into
him at the studio today. So this is a big
day for me.
S1 (33:14):
Fantastic. Well, we'd better let you get on with that guy.
Thank you so much for coming in and having a chat.
S2 (33:20):
Such a pleasure. Thank you.
S1 (33:25):
That was choreographer Stephanie Lake on the latest good weekend talks.
If you enjoyed this episode, please remember to subscribe, rate
and comment wherever you get your podcasts and keep tuning
in for more compelling conversations. Coming soon! We chat with
TV and food personality Melissa Leong. Good Weekend Talks is
brought to you by The Sydney Morning Herald and The
(33:45):
Age proud newsrooms powered by subscriptions to support independent journalism. Search,
subscribe Sydney Morning Herald or The Age? This episode of
Good Weekend Talks is produced by Konrad Marshall, with technical
assistance from Cormac Lally and editing by our executive producer
Tami Mills. Tom McKendrick is head of audio and Melissa
(34:06):
Stevens is the editor of Good Weekend.
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