July 22, 2025 • 21 mins
Terrible at budgeting? Been investing since you were a kid? Can't stop yourself spending your savings? Chances are those money habits formed a long, long time ago. Join Canna Campbell - a financial planner for 20 years - and Fear & Greed's Michael Thompson as they look at how we develop our feelings and habits about money - and how we make sure the habits we're shaping in the next generation are good ones.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to how do They have followed that? The podcast
that peeks into the financial lives of everyday Australian. So,
I'm Michael Thompson. I'm an author and the co host
of the podcast Fear and Greed business news. As always,
I'm with Canna Campbell, financial planner and founder of Sugar
Mumma TV, the financial literacy platform on YouTube and Instagram, threads,
TikTok and more. Hello Canna, Hello Canna. Today it sounds
(00:23):
like I was starting to win. Actually, don't get off
to a great start. Today's episode is another one that
came out of a previous episode when we're talking about
money habits, those kind of little things that we do
with our money, and where those habits have come from.
Because they don't just appear out of nowhere. They typically
(00:44):
have some kind of starting point, some origin story. Indeed,
I wanted to take a closer look today at how
we develop our feelings and our habits about money, whether
they all come, say, for instance, from your parents or
your family, your home environment when you are a child,
if they are formed in the household, how then do
(01:07):
we make sure that the examples that we're setting and
the habits that we are forming in our kids, for instance,
are good ones as well? And can you just end
up creating this cycle of good or bad habits that
goes through potentially through generations if you are okay with
this topic.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
I am kind of quite timely because I just finished
reading Happy Money by Ken Honda. Oh yes, which I
couldn't remember that the author's name when we I first
spoke about this idea or this concept.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
It's an interesting concept, isn't it. Do you think how
early do you think our attitudes about money and our
habits start to form? It is in childhood, wouldn't it be?
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Yes, even before we can count? Really, so we are
absorbing consciously and subconsciously all the time, you know, the energy,
the emotions around money, and the stress, secrecy, the scarcity,
but then also the generosity, the freedom, the choice, you know,
and the time. And from what I have read, it
(02:10):
suggests that around about age seven, most of us already
have formed a lot of our financial beliefs and they're
just starting to make and take shape seven that according
to the studies that I've read, Yeah, oh wow.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Do you think then in that case, if it's by seven,
do most of our financial behaviors come from watching our parents,
you would assume, yes.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
But not just your parents, so also people of impact.
So you know, you may have grown up with a
wealthy uncle or a neighbor that was, you know, squandalous
and constantly spending money. People you know stood out to
you and it's actually you got a term, it's called
(02:53):
financial socialization, where other people's financial behaviors are imprinted in you.
And this is often we've learned this like from obviously
observing them repetition overhearing conversations or perhaps a lack of
conversations where you know, things are just not spoken about,
and the choice of language where people have fears and
(03:16):
they've imposed their fears onto others habits like particularly around
maybe gambling or spending or saving, and obviously assumptions and
that was this can then cause money blocks for people,
which are a real thing. And luckily that's the real
thing that can actually can get a lot of help
out there. So it's not necessarily what they've heard and seen,
(03:40):
but also what they're seeing people do and haven't do
that really does help form these beliefs.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
When I started thinking about this episode, it made me
go back and think about kind of what I picked
up when I was a kid and some of those
money habits, and probably the main thing when I think
about it now, was an observation of the importance of
hard work, Like it was kind of like a work
(04:08):
ethic that I really very much picked up from my parents,
and as a result of that, an appreciation of the
value of money, that you have to work really hard
to earn money.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
In life, and you can't get lucky. Indeed, we're not
worthy of luck. If you get it, you're not worthy
of that because you've got it through luck.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yeah, it's about this idea of you earn, you earn
what you have been able to kind of accumulate, and
that because you've had to work hard for it, then
you need to make smart decisions about your money, and
which I think is a great way to kind of
set someone up for life because it's about the value
of money and the input that you actually need to
do in order to create that. And from there you
(04:49):
can kind of go, Okay, well, how do I take
that and how do I make smart money decisions about
investing and all of those kinds of things. But what
are some of these other money having then that people
do absorb in child childhood. I suppose it is about
what you mentioned, like with the squandalous uncle, and I
think about the risk of just spending all your money
and blowing it all.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
So there are the common ones, you know, I think
everyone can relate to, you know, hearing we can't afford that,
and that obviously creates an element of fear or you
know that scarcity mindset, the classic one you know your
parents have had. You know, you've got to work really
hard for every single dollar, which then also can sometimes
create burnout or that kind of adrenaline like side hustle mindset,
(05:33):
classic one. You know, money doesn't grow on trees, you know,
which these days is money doesn't come out of the
magical wall, and money doesn't come out of that special
little plastic card every time we tap or even our
phones as we knock things like if I try and
tell my kids I left my wallet at home, they say,
it's fine, just grab your phone.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Is your phone. It's a really hard thing to try
and teach kids about the value of money when you
don't actually see money anymore.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
It is And I think also the other thing, you know,
when I think about this, you know, we're living at
one of the most expensive times in history. So with
the cost of living crisis, So what are we saying
to our children? Like, what are we imprinting into our
own children about you know, as you know, I'm guilty
of saying things like this to myself. You know, we
can't afford that right now, or you know that's too expensive,
(06:22):
you know, because things simply are We don't mean to,
it's not intentional. But we're also going to be aware
of what we're saying, you know, to our children, so
that we give them the best level of I guess
awareness and self worth and self control to be able
to have healthy habits and not create similar money blocks
that maybe have been imprinted on us. So you know,
and these things will show up, like avoiding financial decisions,
(06:46):
over spending or over saving, you know, being so tight
with money because you're so scared of money, and then
obviously having huge guilt around money. So, which is an
interesting one because I think a lot of people have
been told, like you are, that you've got to work
hard to earn money. So what happens How do you
feel when money comes to you easily? Some people can
(07:08):
feel really uncomfortable with that.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
No, I think it almost I then appreciate how lucky
I am in that respect, which I think is actually
it does strike me as quite a positive thing. It
means that I appreciate the fact that, hey, I did
not have to do perhaps as much as I would
otherwise have had to do in order to earn that
sum of money. Therefore, this is a good thing. This
is a bonus, this is a benefit. Let's do something
(07:31):
wise with it. Which makes me sound very very clever.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
It does. But you know what, You're lucky to have
that mindset then, because some people would be really ashamed
or embarrassed or actually gotten lucky and blessing neither had
a hand out from a pairent or won the lottery.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
If I won lotto, there would be zero shame attached
to that. I've worked hard to enter that every single week,
so it's not easy to remember to put your entry
in every week.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Please tell me you don't want lottery tickets every week.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
No, only when it's over ten million dollars.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
You know, I recently discovered one of my own like
money message that was imprinted as a.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Childhood I was going to ask you whether you had
noted any from your own I.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Did, and it was really confronting. And I discovered this
pray reading this book and also doing this other program
which I recently completed around mindset, and I actually realized
I have a the way my I guess negative money
message comes out is actually an element of that attacks
self worth. But actually it almost like a form of
(08:34):
over investing, which comes from, you know, a fear and
a insecurity around stability and harmony within relationships. And when
I discovered it, it was really confronting, and I was
I was, but also at the same time it was
fascinating and insightful, So you know, it's definitely worth exploring
(08:55):
these you know, I guess, these definitions, these messages, these
things that have been imprinted in you as you go
down your financial journey, because you will definitely release a
lot of things in your life.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Well, actually that leads me into something that I would
be interested in. Can you unlearn then or kind of
rewire money habits that perhaps aren't serving you well as
an adult. Say you've carried over some insecurity around money
from childhood, How then can you change that as an
(09:26):
adult because that would be a hard habit to break.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Well, I'm an example, I'm working on this exact discovery myself,
and I guess the first step is obviously awareness. I've
now discovered it and I'm now able to sort of
break it down, understand where it comes from, but also
dissect it and pick apart and criticize it and go, well,
that doesn't make sense and that's actually factually incorrect, and
(09:50):
why do you want to think like that? Does that
serve you in a positive way? So I've then been
able to reframe it and you know, challenge it and
then flick the switch it on it, and she turned
it into a good thing that serves me in a
positive way. And what you know people suggest is using
is like affirmations and journaling and obviously financial education and
(10:10):
getting help. But you definitely can, I think, build new
neural pathways. It takes time, It takes obviously patients and
an element of I guess compassion, and you do need
to constantly be on top of it because you know,
just when you think you've cleared a money block or
in a negative habit that was imprinted, there's a new
one that's lying just beneath the surface, waiting for you.
(10:34):
But yes, I definitely do, and I think it's been
very liberating for me, speaking from a personal experience, to
discover what was behind all of this.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Can I ask, then, what are the assigns as an
adult perhaps that you might have inherited a negative money
mindset from childhood? Is it that kind of avoiding money decisions?
Is it building up debt and not knowing how to
keep on top of it. Is it not being able
to ever get yourself off ahead that you are just
living from week to week to week to week.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
It's all of those, you know, It's believing that I'm
never going to be good with money, feeling guilty for
spending money on yourself. You know, I know someone very
close that just feels physically sick when they go, and
shameful if they go and buy something really nice for themselves.
You know. Also, you know, there's a lot around the resistance,
you know, resisting learning about money, resisting getting started, resisting
(11:29):
actually going and getting advice. There's also, you know, an
element which I think a lot of us are guilty of,
and there's that self sabotage when you're just starting to
make progress with your finances and you just go, you know,
you've paid off one credit card and then you go
have a financial blowout, So it shows up in lots
of different ways, and you know, to ask your question together,
(11:50):
there are lots of different signs, but it also depends
on what is the actual incorrect message or habit or
attitude that's created it.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Okay, one more that kind of looks back, and then
we'll look to the future. How do you start to
understand what your kind of money story is. You mentioned
the journaling process and all of those kind of bits
and pieces that you're doing to help work through some
of those things that you have carried over from your youth, right,
but how do you actually start to understand what your challenges,
(12:23):
your own issues might be.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
So the first thing is obviously reflecting, and you've got
to do that in a safe space, you know, with
no distractions and be able to open up and go
dick because it's you know, we're going back. Depending on
how old you are, and depending on what your childhood
was like, you know, it could be quite a confronting
or a trigger for some people and then breaking down
(12:47):
like where did I hear that from? You know, how
did people around me handle certain financial situations or so
certain challenges and sit with the emotions that come up
for you with that and look at what you took
away from it, and then understanding that you actually have
the ability to change it. And this is why there
(13:08):
are so many great books out there that are designed
to help you, and you know it's a thirty dollars book.
Or I actually even know a financial planner. She's actually
retired financial plan who focuses purely on people's money blox
and I will happily pass on her details because she's
absolutely brilliant. But the thing with any of these things
(13:28):
and not a negative thing, necessarily you can take the
goodness from anything negative that happened to you and turn
it into a positive thing. So when I discovered my block,
I've actually, i think, come out of that a better
person and a more secure person in taking the goodness
out of it and the responsibility out of that particular block,
(13:50):
but also understanding about what else is needed to give
me what I was essentially trying to crave from that
money block in the first place. If that kind of
makes sense about making it a counseling session.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
For it does it doesn't, And I'm happy to do
a counseling session should you need it, But I'm completely unqualified.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
And it'd be most uncomfortable.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Wouldn't that be extraordinary?
Speaker 2 (14:11):
You like uncomfortable? I don't know what to do.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Okay, we're going to take a break. When we come back,
I want to then talk about the next generation. Right,
So this is kind of we've covered what we take
from our own childhood. How do we then make sure
that perhaps the messages that we are passing on to
our own kids, if you have them, and to the
next generation or to the people around us. It doesn't
(14:38):
have to be your kids, that those money messages are
good ones. We'll do that in a second. Can we
are talking all about money habits today, where they come from,
how you develop them, and then how you pass on
good money habits into the future to other generations, your kids, phaps,
(15:00):
young people around you as well. Let's start with parents, right,
what's the best way for parents to talk to their
kids about money, especially when things perhaps are tight, and
it might not even be talking directly to their children
about money. It's about the conversations perhaps that they have
between themselves that kids might overhear.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Oh, definitely, like it's funny, Tom and I will make
sure we might bitch and mode about how things expensive
things are. But we'll also when we're trying to get
through something, we also brainstorm and have positive, constructive conversations
with each other around the kids so they can hear
it that we're not just complaining about a situation where
you're trying to do something and help ourselves get through
(15:43):
that particular challenge. But I always say, come from a
place of empowerment and education, you know, being very honest
without oversharing, taking a very calm approach around talking about
money around your children. You know they're remembering that they're
absorbing everything and obviously taking it to con serration, you
know what is age appropriate and using you know, those
(16:04):
real life moments like at the supermarket with my eleven
year old son, paying bills at say the post office,
or you know, Tom and I are saying to the kids,
right we're sitting down, we're doing our budget. You guys
sit there and be quiet, and you know you can
sit and listen, but we need to do this because
this is important for you know, making sure that we
can pay all the bills on time. So show about
(16:26):
how you're handling things in a proactive way and being
positive but also being mindful that's incredibly empowering for children
and like take the pressure off. For example, my daughter
was asking for something from Surprise Surprise kmut and I
was trying to say, you know, I immediate reaction was no,
that's too expensive, we can't afford it. But as soon
(16:47):
as I said it and I heard I had the awareness,
I was like, why did I just say it like that?
I said to her, actually, hang on, I'm going to
explain that again right now. That doesn't actually fit within
our budget because we're saving for a holiday right now,
and if it means we by that means we can't
have this. And I went back and started again so
she could. I almost like pressed Alina what I said,
(17:07):
and I made good again by saying it in a
more empowering way and including her part as part of it.
And you know, the more I've included my children, I've
and you know, comes in ways, it's not always perfect,
but when I include them, they they tend to ask
for less. You know, my kids constantly want you buy
them one thing and they want something else, you know,
(17:27):
And when I include them more of the journey and
what we're trying to work on and how we're trying
to help ourselves. And I think there's a big thing
your kids seeing you help yourself is essential. It's done
a full circle to the point where like my three
year old often to give me some money. You know,
she had a little little pocket of coins that she
I don't know, she probably stole it from me, to
be honest, but she said, here, I'll give you money,
(17:49):
your mama. Like it was like it was very It
was so sweet that she's stealing or that she's there's
a conscience there. But you know, when you start to
include them, and that's why I say, like you're empowering them,
you're educating them, you know, explaining that we need to
be respectful with money. It's you know, not infinite right now,
(18:10):
and you know we're helping ourselves and taking responsibility. And yeah,
so that one of.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
The hardest things to do is to walk through Kmart
or big w with kids, right It's just it's torture.
And so I was in there the other day and
the kids wanted something and I just said to them, yep,
that's great, I said, but have you got enough in
your in your pocket money? Have you saved enough pocket
money in order to do this? I'm like, well, no,
I got this all right. Well, once you've saved enough,
(18:38):
if you still want it, we can come back and
buy it once you've once you've saved it, I haven't
mentioned it again, funny, And so I think that that
was just like the impulse thing, and I was just
trying to go okay, well number one couldn't afford to
buy it outright anyway, but maybe just that delayed gratification
would actually work, and tying it back to Okay, you
(18:59):
can do this if that's what you want, but you
are going to have to kind of put your money
towards it. It's just it's experimentation, seeing what works what doesn't.
And I'm hoping we're not doing permanent damage along the way.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Oh, I know the pressure. That's why I say, like,
you can make good again. You can go back and say,
you know how I said that we can afford it.
Can I explain that to you again, because I really
want you to understand what I'm trying to do right now,
or what I'm trying to do for the family, or
what you know, what our goals or what our dreams
are like kids love to be included, you know, And
that's the whole, the richness of a connection and in
(19:33):
the unity of a family.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Okay, then all right, if a parent is really that,
we are running out of time. So one last question.
If a parent, for instance, or an adult, let's just
say an adult does want to improve their own money
habits right and to stop being a better role model
to their kids, to the young people around them, perhaps
where is the best place to start.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
I think pocket money is a great place to start,
you know, showing children, you know. I think it's the
barefoot investor has the three jars analogy where it saves
spend and give I like that a lot. But I
also would recommend strongly that there is an invest jar,
so you do four jars and give them an opportunity
(20:18):
to come up with their own goals and their own
deadlines and make it a really fun experience for them.
And I was talking to her friend the other day
actually literally about pocket money, and her daughter's very young,
and I said, don't use coins, go and get from Spotlight.
You can buy them for two or three dollars, and
they are these big gems, and she could put the
(20:38):
gems in the jars. And I know for my daughter Tiger,
who's three. She loves she has some real coins, so
she's obviously stolen from me, but she has our little
pocket of gems and she thinks that that's money.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
I would want that.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
They're really pretty. Actually, that's like stars and circles and
love hearts and really colorful.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
No, no, no, I just want to straight up kind of
big old rubies or something like that. Absolutely, I think
that's where I'm going. And I would bury it all
in the backyard and leave it there for someone to
find it about two hundred years. Wouldn't that be disappointing
when they realized it was actually a glass from Spotlight? Okay, look,
if anyone wants more information, where do they find you? Canna?
Speaker 2 (21:18):
The best place is always to contact me on Instagram
at sugar Mama.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
TV perfect and you can hear me every day with
Sean Aylmer on Fear and Greed. Thank you very much
for listening to how do they afford that? Remember hit
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Thank you very much for your company join us again
next week.
Welcome to how do They have followed that? The podcast
that peeks into the financial lives of everyday Australian. So,
I'm Michael Thompson. I'm an author and the co host
of the podcast Fear and Greed business news. As always,
I'm with Canna Campbell, financial planner and founder of Sugar
Mumma TV, the financial literacy platform on YouTube and Instagram, threads,
TikTok and more. Hello Canna, Hello Canna. Today it sounds
(00:23):
like I was starting to win. Actually, don't get off
to a great start. Today's episode is another one that
came out of a previous episode when we're talking about
money habits, those kind of little things that we do
with our money, and where those habits have come from.
Because they don't just appear out of nowhere. They typically
(00:44):
have some kind of starting point, some origin story. Indeed,
I wanted to take a closer look today at how
we develop our feelings and our habits about money, whether
they all come, say, for instance, from your parents or
your family, your home environment when you are a child,
if they are formed in the household, how then do
(01:07):
we make sure that the examples that we're setting and
the habits that we are forming in our kids, for instance,
are good ones as well? And can you just end
up creating this cycle of good or bad habits that
goes through potentially through generations if you are okay with
this topic.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
I am kind of quite timely because I just finished
reading Happy Money by Ken Honda. Oh yes, which I
couldn't remember that the author's name when we I first
spoke about this idea or this concept.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
It's an interesting concept, isn't it. Do you think how
early do you think our attitudes about money and our
habits start to form? It is in childhood, wouldn't it be?
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Yes, even before we can count? Really, so we are
absorbing consciously and subconsciously all the time, you know, the energy,
the emotions around money, and the stress, secrecy, the scarcity,
but then also the generosity, the freedom, the choice, you know,
and the time. And from what I have read, it
(02:10):
suggests that around about age seven, most of us already
have formed a lot of our financial beliefs and they're
just starting to make and take shape seven that according
to the studies that I've read, Yeah, oh wow.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Do you think then in that case, if it's by seven,
do most of our financial behaviors come from watching our parents,
you would assume, yes.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
But not just your parents, so also people of impact.
So you know, you may have grown up with a
wealthy uncle or a neighbor that was, you know, squandalous
and constantly spending money. People you know stood out to
you and it's actually you got a term, it's called
(02:53):
financial socialization, where other people's financial behaviors are imprinted in you.
And this is often we've learned this like from obviously
observing them repetition overhearing conversations or perhaps a lack of
conversations where you know, things are just not spoken about,
and the choice of language where people have fears and
(03:16):
they've imposed their fears onto others habits like particularly around
maybe gambling or spending or saving, and obviously assumptions and
that was this can then cause money blocks for people,
which are a real thing. And luckily that's the real
thing that can actually can get a lot of help
out there. So it's not necessarily what they've heard and seen,
(03:40):
but also what they're seeing people do and haven't do
that really does help form these beliefs.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
When I started thinking about this episode, it made me
go back and think about kind of what I picked
up when I was a kid and some of those
money habits, and probably the main thing when I think
about it now, was an observation of the importance of
hard work, Like it was kind of like a work
(04:08):
ethic that I really very much picked up from my parents,
and as a result of that, an appreciation of the
value of money, that you have to work really hard
to earn money.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
In life, and you can't get lucky. Indeed, we're not
worthy of luck. If you get it, you're not worthy
of that because you've got it through luck.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yeah, it's about this idea of you earn, you earn
what you have been able to kind of accumulate, and
that because you've had to work hard for it, then
you need to make smart decisions about your money, and
which I think is a great way to kind of
set someone up for life because it's about the value
of money and the input that you actually need to
do in order to create that. And from there you
(04:49):
can kind of go, Okay, well, how do I take
that and how do I make smart money decisions about
investing and all of those kinds of things. But what
are some of these other money having then that people
do absorb in child childhood. I suppose it is about
what you mentioned, like with the squandalous uncle, and I
think about the risk of just spending all your money
and blowing it all.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
So there are the common ones, you know, I think
everyone can relate to, you know, hearing we can't afford that,
and that obviously creates an element of fear or you
know that scarcity mindset, the classic one you know your
parents have had. You know, you've got to work really
hard for every single dollar, which then also can sometimes
create burnout or that kind of adrenaline like side hustle mindset,
(05:33):
classic one. You know, money doesn't grow on trees, you know,
which these days is money doesn't come out of the
magical wall, and money doesn't come out of that special
little plastic card every time we tap or even our
phones as we knock things like if I try and
tell my kids I left my wallet at home, they say,
it's fine, just grab your phone.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Is your phone. It's a really hard thing to try
and teach kids about the value of money when you
don't actually see money anymore.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
It is And I think also the other thing, you know,
when I think about this, you know, we're living at
one of the most expensive times in history. So with
the cost of living crisis, So what are we saying
to our children? Like, what are we imprinting into our
own children about you know, as you know, I'm guilty
of saying things like this to myself. You know, we
can't afford that right now, or you know that's too expensive,
(06:22):
you know, because things simply are We don't mean to,
it's not intentional. But we're also going to be aware
of what we're saying, you know, to our children, so
that we give them the best level of I guess
awareness and self worth and self control to be able
to have healthy habits and not create similar money blocks
that maybe have been imprinted on us. So you know,
and these things will show up, like avoiding financial decisions,
(06:46):
over spending or over saving, you know, being so tight
with money because you're so scared of money, and then
obviously having huge guilt around money. So, which is an
interesting one because I think a lot of people have
been told, like you are, that you've got to work
hard to earn money. So what happens How do you
feel when money comes to you easily? Some people can
(07:08):
feel really uncomfortable with that.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
No, I think it almost I then appreciate how lucky
I am in that respect, which I think is actually
it does strike me as quite a positive thing. It
means that I appreciate the fact that, hey, I did
not have to do perhaps as much as I would
otherwise have had to do in order to earn that
sum of money. Therefore, this is a good thing. This
is a bonus, this is a benefit. Let's do something
(07:31):
wise with it. Which makes me sound very very clever.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
It does. But you know what, You're lucky to have
that mindset then, because some people would be really ashamed
or embarrassed or actually gotten lucky and blessing neither had
a hand out from a pairent or won the lottery.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
If I won lotto, there would be zero shame attached
to that. I've worked hard to enter that every single week,
so it's not easy to remember to put your entry
in every week.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Please tell me you don't want lottery tickets every week.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
No, only when it's over ten million dollars.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
You know, I recently discovered one of my own like
money message that was imprinted as a.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Childhood I was going to ask you whether you had
noted any from your own I.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Did, and it was really confronting. And I discovered this
pray reading this book and also doing this other program
which I recently completed around mindset, and I actually realized
I have a the way my I guess negative money
message comes out is actually an element of that attacks
self worth. But actually it almost like a form of
(08:34):
over investing, which comes from, you know, a fear and
a insecurity around stability and harmony within relationships. And when
I discovered it, it was really confronting, and I was
I was, but also at the same time it was
fascinating and insightful, So you know, it's definitely worth exploring
(08:55):
these you know, I guess, these definitions, these messages, these
things that have been imprinted in you as you go
down your financial journey, because you will definitely release a
lot of things in your life.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Well, actually that leads me into something that I would
be interested in. Can you unlearn then or kind of
rewire money habits that perhaps aren't serving you well as
an adult. Say you've carried over some insecurity around money
from childhood, How then can you change that as an
(09:26):
adult because that would be a hard habit to break.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Well, I'm an example, I'm working on this exact discovery myself,
and I guess the first step is obviously awareness. I've
now discovered it and I'm now able to sort of
break it down, understand where it comes from, but also
dissect it and pick apart and criticize it and go, well,
that doesn't make sense and that's actually factually incorrect, and
(09:50):
why do you want to think like that? Does that
serve you in a positive way? So I've then been
able to reframe it and you know, challenge it and
then flick the switch it on it, and she turned
it into a good thing that serves me in a
positive way. And what you know people suggest is using
is like affirmations and journaling and obviously financial education and
(10:10):
getting help. But you definitely can, I think, build new
neural pathways. It takes time, It takes obviously patients and
an element of I guess compassion, and you do need
to constantly be on top of it because you know,
just when you think you've cleared a money block or
in a negative habit that was imprinted, there's a new
one that's lying just beneath the surface, waiting for you.
(10:34):
But yes, I definitely do, and I think it's been
very liberating for me, speaking from a personal experience, to
discover what was behind all of this.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Can I ask, then, what are the assigns as an
adult perhaps that you might have inherited a negative money
mindset from childhood? Is it that kind of avoiding money decisions?
Is it building up debt and not knowing how to
keep on top of it. Is it not being able
to ever get yourself off ahead that you are just
living from week to week to week to week.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
It's all of those, you know, It's believing that I'm
never going to be good with money, feeling guilty for
spending money on yourself. You know, I know someone very
close that just feels physically sick when they go, and
shameful if they go and buy something really nice for themselves.
You know. Also, you know, there's a lot around the resistance,
you know, resisting learning about money, resisting getting started, resisting
(11:29):
actually going and getting advice. There's also, you know, an
element which I think a lot of us are guilty of,
and there's that self sabotage when you're just starting to
make progress with your finances and you just go, you know,
you've paid off one credit card and then you go
have a financial blowout, So it shows up in lots
of different ways, and you know, to ask your question together,
(11:50):
there are lots of different signs, but it also depends
on what is the actual incorrect message or habit or
attitude that's created it.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Okay, one more that kind of looks back, and then
we'll look to the future. How do you start to
understand what your kind of money story is. You mentioned
the journaling process and all of those kind of bits
and pieces that you're doing to help work through some
of those things that you have carried over from your youth, right,
but how do you actually start to understand what your challenges,
(12:23):
your own issues might be.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
So the first thing is obviously reflecting, and you've got
to do that in a safe space, you know, with
no distractions and be able to open up and go
dick because it's you know, we're going back. Depending on
how old you are, and depending on what your childhood
was like, you know, it could be quite a confronting
or a trigger for some people and then breaking down
(12:47):
like where did I hear that from? You know, how
did people around me handle certain financial situations or so
certain challenges and sit with the emotions that come up
for you with that and look at what you took
away from it, and then understanding that you actually have
the ability to change it. And this is why there
(13:08):
are so many great books out there that are designed
to help you, and you know it's a thirty dollars book.
Or I actually even know a financial planner. She's actually
retired financial plan who focuses purely on people's money blox
and I will happily pass on her details because she's
absolutely brilliant. But the thing with any of these things
(13:28):
and not a negative thing, necessarily you can take the
goodness from anything negative that happened to you and turn
it into a positive thing. So when I discovered my block,
I've actually, i think, come out of that a better
person and a more secure person in taking the goodness
out of it and the responsibility out of that particular block,
(13:50):
but also understanding about what else is needed to give
me what I was essentially trying to crave from that
money block in the first place. If that kind of
makes sense about making it a counseling session.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
For it does it doesn't, And I'm happy to do
a counseling session should you need it, But I'm completely unqualified.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
And it'd be most uncomfortable.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Wouldn't that be extraordinary?
Speaker 2 (14:11):
You like uncomfortable? I don't know what to do.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Okay, we're going to take a break. When we come back,
I want to then talk about the next generation. Right,
So this is kind of we've covered what we take
from our own childhood. How do we then make sure
that perhaps the messages that we are passing on to
our own kids, if you have them, and to the
next generation or to the people around us. It doesn't
(14:38):
have to be your kids, that those money messages are
good ones. We'll do that in a second. Can we
are talking all about money habits today, where they come from,
how you develop them, and then how you pass on
good money habits into the future to other generations, your kids, phaps,
(15:00):
young people around you as well. Let's start with parents, right,
what's the best way for parents to talk to their
kids about money, especially when things perhaps are tight, and
it might not even be talking directly to their children
about money. It's about the conversations perhaps that they have
between themselves that kids might overhear.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Oh, definitely, like it's funny, Tom and I will make
sure we might bitch and mode about how things expensive
things are. But we'll also when we're trying to get
through something, we also brainstorm and have positive, constructive conversations
with each other around the kids so they can hear
it that we're not just complaining about a situation where
you're trying to do something and help ourselves get through
(15:43):
that particular challenge. But I always say, come from a
place of empowerment and education, you know, being very honest
without oversharing, taking a very calm approach around talking about
money around your children. You know they're remembering that they're
absorbing everything and obviously taking it to con serration, you
know what is age appropriate and using you know, those
(16:04):
real life moments like at the supermarket with my eleven
year old son, paying bills at say the post office,
or you know, Tom and I are saying to the kids,
right we're sitting down, we're doing our budget. You guys
sit there and be quiet, and you know you can
sit and listen, but we need to do this because
this is important for you know, making sure that we
can pay all the bills on time. So show about
(16:26):
how you're handling things in a proactive way and being
positive but also being mindful that's incredibly empowering for children
and like take the pressure off. For example, my daughter
was asking for something from Surprise Surprise kmut and I
was trying to say, you know, I immediate reaction was no,
that's too expensive, we can't afford it. But as soon
(16:47):
as I said it and I heard I had the awareness,
I was like, why did I just say it like that?
I said to her, actually, hang on, I'm going to
explain that again right now. That doesn't actually fit within
our budget because we're saving for a holiday right now,
and if it means we by that means we can't
have this. And I went back and started again so
she could. I almost like pressed Alina what I said,
(17:07):
and I made good again by saying it in a
more empowering way and including her part as part of it.
And you know, the more I've included my children, I've
and you know, comes in ways, it's not always perfect,
but when I include them, they they tend to ask
for less. You know, my kids constantly want you buy
them one thing and they want something else, you know,
(17:27):
And when I include them more of the journey and
what we're trying to work on and how we're trying
to help ourselves. And I think there's a big thing
your kids seeing you help yourself is essential. It's done
a full circle to the point where like my three
year old often to give me some money. You know,
she had a little little pocket of coins that she
I don't know, she probably stole it from me, to
be honest, but she said, here, I'll give you money,
(17:49):
your mama. Like it was like it was very It
was so sweet that she's stealing or that she's there's
a conscience there. But you know, when you start to
include them, and that's why I say, like you're empowering them,
you're educating them, you know, explaining that we need to
be respectful with money. It's you know, not infinite right now,
(18:10):
and you know we're helping ourselves and taking responsibility. And yeah,
so that one of.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
The hardest things to do is to walk through Kmart
or big w with kids, right It's just it's torture.
And so I was in there the other day and
the kids wanted something and I just said to them, yep,
that's great, I said, but have you got enough in
your in your pocket money? Have you saved enough pocket
money in order to do this? I'm like, well, no,
I got this all right. Well, once you've saved enough,
(18:38):
if you still want it, we can come back and
buy it once you've once you've saved it, I haven't
mentioned it again, funny, And so I think that that
was just like the impulse thing, and I was just
trying to go okay, well number one couldn't afford to
buy it outright anyway, but maybe just that delayed gratification
would actually work, and tying it back to Okay, you
(18:59):
can do this if that's what you want, but you
are going to have to kind of put your money
towards it. It's just it's experimentation, seeing what works what doesn't.
And I'm hoping we're not doing permanent damage along the way.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Oh, I know the pressure. That's why I say, like,
you can make good again. You can go back and say,
you know how I said that we can afford it.
Can I explain that to you again, because I really
want you to understand what I'm trying to do right now,
or what I'm trying to do for the family, or
what you know, what our goals or what our dreams
are like kids love to be included, you know, And
that's the whole, the richness of a connection and in
(19:33):
the unity of a family.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Okay, then all right, if a parent is really that,
we are running out of time. So one last question.
If a parent, for instance, or an adult, let's just
say an adult does want to improve their own money
habits right and to stop being a better role model
to their kids, to the young people around them, perhaps
where is the best place to start.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
I think pocket money is a great place to start,
you know, showing children, you know. I think it's the
barefoot investor has the three jars analogy where it saves
spend and give I like that a lot. But I
also would recommend strongly that there is an invest jar,
so you do four jars and give them an opportunity
(20:18):
to come up with their own goals and their own
deadlines and make it a really fun experience for them.
And I was talking to her friend the other day
actually literally about pocket money, and her daughter's very young,
and I said, don't use coins, go and get from Spotlight.
You can buy them for two or three dollars, and
they are these big gems, and she could put the
(20:38):
gems in the jars. And I know for my daughter Tiger,
who's three. She loves she has some real coins, so
she's obviously stolen from me, but she has our little
pocket of gems and she thinks that that's money.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
I would want that.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
They're really pretty. Actually, that's like stars and circles and
love hearts and really colorful.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
No, no, no, I just want to straight up kind of
big old rubies or something like that. Absolutely, I think
that's where I'm going. And I would bury it all
in the backyard and leave it there for someone to
find it about two hundred years. Wouldn't that be disappointing
when they realized it was actually a glass from Spotlight? Okay, look,
if anyone wants more information, where do they find you? Canna?
Speaker 2 (21:18):
The best place is always to contact me on Instagram
at sugar Mama.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
TV perfect and you can hear me every day with
Sean Aylmer on Fear and Greed. Thank you very much
for listening to how do they afford that? Remember hit
follow on the podcast and the best thing that you
can do is tell somebody else send them the link
to this exact episode if you think that they might
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Thank you very much for your company join us again
next week.
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