April 22, 2025 • 25 mins
Kerrie Duff, a Paralympian bronze medalist, joins us in the studio this week to discuss mentoring, leadership, and equality. Kerrie is a disability advocate who currently works for Team Lab and has her own consulting business.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:11):
Hi I'm Abby.
S2 (00:12):
I'm Simon, and welcome to. In Plain Sight program, where
we highlight people who are making a positive impact within
their community and the disability sector.
S1 (00:21):
Shining a light on those who might otherwise be hidden
in plain sight.
S2 (00:26):
And we share these stories on a weekly basis with
you here on Vision Australia Radio. Hi Abby, how are you?
S1 (00:38):
I'm fabulous. Simon, how are you?
S2 (00:40):
I'm pretty great too. Thanks for asking. It's good to
be here in the studio doing our fantastic show once again.
S1 (00:47):
And what's new with you, Simon?
S2 (00:48):
I had a fabulous weekend. The weekend just gone to
the recording date, and one of the nice things I
did was I went to see my friend and the
friend of the show, Ben Rowe, played some music at
a local community sports club and it was a fantastic day.
Ben is one of those people who I find somewhat
annoying because he's involved with everything. He's really talented, and
(01:12):
he's a musician and a sports person, and he works
for Blind Sports Western Australia. I'd also like to congratulate
and give an acknowledgment and shout out to our friend
Julie Carvalho, who we spoke to recently, and her colleague
in the cricket world, Nikki Muir, who got selected from
WA to be part of the Australian Women's blind cricket team.
(01:35):
And they're going to be participating in an upcoming tournament. Abby.
S1 (01:38):
Yeah they are. And it's historic because it is the
first time that international blind women's cricket has been played
in Australia. So it's being played at the Kuraby Knights
Cricket Club in Brisbane, and it'll be from the 20th
of April to the 25th of April. So a huge
congratulations to the 15 players that were selected.
S2 (02:01):
Especially shout out to our West Australian people. And that's
Australia versus Pakistan. I'm sure Vision Australia Radio across the
board will be following that, and some of our colleagues
on the station will be keeping track of that and
give you progressive reports as the tournament goes along. We
are talking about sport now, but our guest, who we
(02:21):
will be interviewing later on. Her name is Kerry Duff
and she was a Paralympian and we discovered talking with
Kerry that things like sport can really develop so many
other aspects of your life and give you extra confidence.
Now Kerry has a condition called spina bifida. What do
we know about spina bifida? Please, Abby.
S1 (02:43):
Well, did you know that spina bifida actually means split spine?
S2 (02:48):
No I didn't. That is a fascinating term.
S1 (02:51):
Neither did I. So it's because it's a birth defect
where the spinal cord and surrounding bones don't close completely
during pregnancy. And according to the Australian Institute of Health
and Welfare, Approximately 150 babies are born with spina bifida
each year in Australia, and there are about 5000 adults
(03:11):
living with the condition. Now there's also a spina bifida association,
and they advocate for research to improve the lives of
people living with spina bifida. They also provide one on
one information and guidance for families, individuals and providers. So
there are some good resources out there.
S2 (03:29):
There is. And one of the great things that we
learnt from talking with Kerri Duff is that she was
mentored as a young person, and then she found that
that was so rewarding. She wanted to give back to
the community and be a mentor herself in later life.
And she's still doing that now, and that's why she's
joined us on the radio today. And it was fabulous
(03:50):
to talk with her.
S1 (03:51):
Yeah. And we'll hear from Kerri now.
S2 (03:57):
And I'd like to welcome Kerri to the studio right now. Hello, Kerri.
S3 (04:01):
Hi, Simon. Thanks for having me.
S2 (04:03):
Now, Kerry, can you tell us you have spina bifida?
Is that.
S3 (04:06):
Correct? That's right. Yes. I was born with spina bifida.
S2 (04:09):
So for those who don't know, including myself, what is
spina bifida and how does that one acquire spina bifida?
S3 (04:16):
It's a neurological condition, and it's a condition that forms
when the baby is still forming in the mum's womb.
So often when I'm doing a presentation, I'll encourage people
who are or women who are from a child rearing
age to take folate if they're sexually active, because spina
bifida forms when there's not enough folate in the mother.
S1 (04:40):
Enough foliage.
S2 (04:41):
Folate.
S3 (04:42):
Folate.
S1 (04:42):
Folate.
S2 (04:43):
It's a grain or something.
S3 (04:45):
Folate. Folate is a vitamin B, and it's found in
green leafy vegetables. So you can also get supplements from
the chemist. And because everyone sort of takes a different amount,
everyone requires a different amount because you absorb it differently. Um,
it's worthwhile taking the supplements. Even if you're not thinking
of having a child. Because let's face it, kids sort
(05:07):
of just happen when you're not expecting them to happen.
S4 (05:10):
That's right.
S2 (05:11):
Now, is it my perception, or is there less spina
bifida in the community nowadays?
S3 (05:18):
There probably is less people born with spina bifida nowadays,
partly because it's with technological advances. It can be picked
up a lot more when people do pre-screening throughout their pregnancy,
and some people tend to decide to not go ahead
with the pregnancy. Oh, that's because yeah, I find it
a little bit sad. You can't tell the.
S2 (05:39):
Severity.
S3 (05:40):
The severity of the disability just from being in the womb.
But nowadays also it's also possible to operate on the child.
S2 (05:47):
How has spina bifida affected you physically throughout your life,
and were those effects digressive? Would they become more as
you got older?
S3 (05:57):
When I was first born, my parents were told that
I would be in a wheelchair probably by the time
I was two. I'm now closer to 60 than I
am to 50. I can't tell you how old I am, um,
and I'm using a wheelchair. I've only been using a
wheelchair since probably I was about 50. Prior to that,
I walked on crutches and I used calipers. So the
(06:18):
spine having spina bifida did change throughout my life, and
it meant that I required different assistive technology to help
me get through the.
S1 (06:28):
What are calipers?
S3 (06:30):
Calipers are equipment that you have sort of on your
legs that.
S2 (06:35):
Support your legs.
S3 (06:37):
Calipers are supports that you use. Um, they mine are
called afos ankle foot orthosis. And they fit into your
shoes and they stop your knees. They stop your legs
from turning in so that you walk a bit straighter.
S4 (06:51):
Yeah. If you've.
S2 (06:52):
Ever saw the film Forrest Gump, that was a very
primitive version.
S1 (06:56):
Of that movie.
S3 (06:57):
So, um, with Forrest Gump, if you think about him,
he had two calipers on his legs. But when I
was actually, um, first learning to walk, I had a frame,
so I pushed that in front of me, but my
calipers were actually up to my waist and they were
joined at the knees. So I had to do a
little hop jump thing, jump sort of steps. And then
(07:18):
as time progressed, by the time I got to grade three, um,
I had calipers below my knees, but there was sort
of a progression to get to that.
S1 (07:26):
They were painful.
S3 (07:27):
They're not painful or. But they, they make they basically
they make the difference between being able to go to
a lot of different places and not being able to
have the stamina or the strength to do that, but
they do mean that you can't often get pretty feminine,
you know, nice looking shoes. You get these clodhopping horrible boots. Oh, well,
(07:51):
actually that that was probably pre 80s. Nowadays you can get,
you know, pretty nice wide shoes or.
S4 (07:59):
Yeah.
S3 (07:59):
Better fitting shoes.
S4 (08:01):
As.
S2 (08:02):
Kerry wear roughly the same age. And I remember as
a child seeing those images, especially for the fundraising events
and so on, for what we called here back those days,
the Spastic Welfare Association or the Crippled Children's Association and
things like that. And now I remember those pictures of
the poor little children. They were always young girls too,
(08:22):
mostly with the crutches and the callipers and all that
kind of business. It's the unfortunate way that those organisations
used to, um, portray people with a disability so they
could raise money and awareness and all that type of thing,
you know?
S3 (08:36):
Yeah, I can relate to that. Simon. When I went
to special school. I had three, I had two girlfriends.
And when we moved from one location and the school
was rebuilt closer to home, the three of us would
had our photos taken, and there was myself standing up
and another girl sitting in a wheelchair and someone else, um,
(08:56):
on sticks. But with those high up callipers like Forrest Gump.
And then 20 years later, after the school had been
built and we'd all left school and were doing other things,
they had our photo taken again. And at that stage
I was driving. So I got my photo taken, sitting
in the front seat of my car with my hand
on the hand controls, and it just showed you the
(09:18):
difference from earlier on having a picture of sweet little
innocent kids, but with disabilities to pull the heartstrings, to
showing a businesswoman who drives a car and is independent.
S2 (09:32):
So great.
S3 (09:33):
Society's changed a lot, which is really good.
S2 (09:35):
It has. Now, whilst you're in high school, you were
just talking about primary school there, but whilst you were
in high school you started your sporting life. Is that right?
S3 (09:44):
Yes. I started competitive sporting life in high school. I'd
swum during primary school, but not competitively.
S2 (09:51):
So mainly you're a swimmer or you were a swimmer.
Tell us a little bit about that, how that progressed
and how you reached the heights of Paralympian.
S3 (09:59):
I'd always enjoyed being at the pool or at the
beach and, you know, going for a swim. And I
took up swimming classes. Probably I would have been during
primary school. And then by the time I got to
high school, I joined a swimming squad. North Lodge Neptunes,
which was run by a past Olympian who was in
(10:23):
the water polo in 1950 something or other. Um, and yes,
I went, I went along to North Lodge swimming squad
from year ten onwards, and I would swim a couple
of times during the week and on the weekends, and
I'd get involved in the local competitions, but at that
(10:43):
stage I was swimming against younger kids. And then I
found sports and recreation for disabled children, and I became competitive,
getting involved in competitions with other kids with disabilities. And
it was a lot more equal because there you have classifications.
So it's based on functional ability. Kind of like NDIS is.
(11:05):
And so I would be swimming against someone who had
similar disability to me. Or they might have cerebral palsy
or another disability, but they have the same muscle tone
and ability.
S2 (11:15):
Yeah. When did you start doing serious competitive swimming?
S3 (11:19):
My first competition was in Adelaide with the first junior games.
That was in year ten and they were more games
where it was based on participating. But I'd run quite
a few of my swimming events, and I was selected,
along with three other Victorians, to be part of the
Australian team of 20 kids that went over to England,
(11:42):
and that was for the first invitational disabled Junior Games
held at Stoke Mandeville. And from there, when I came back,
I was invited to go to the the seniors because
by then I was like about 15. And from the
first nationals, I was chosen to go to the Far
Eastern South Pacific International Competition, which is equivalent to Commonwealth Games.
(12:05):
If you think of it in those sort of terms,
and they were actually held in Hong Kong. So I
had the experience of flying to Hong Kong, having a
track coach there who was working with the track athletes,
but he was also a biology teacher, so he was
testing me on my biology because I had exams when
I got back. So I was sort of combining schoolwork
(12:27):
and study with getting involved in sport.
S2 (12:29):
Yeah.
S3 (12:29):
Um, but yeah, going to Beijing was amazing because it
exposed me to a whole lot of people of all
different abilities.
S2 (12:35):
And what year was that going to Beijing?
S3 (12:37):
That was in 82.
S2 (12:38):
And tell us, what was the pinnacle of your swimming career?
S3 (12:43):
Ah, the pinnacle, no doubt, would be winning a bronze
in the 400m freestyle at the 1984 Paralympics. They were
also held in England, and there I did a personal
best time of 11 seconds. So when you talk about swimming,
normally people talk about 100th of a second. So, um,
(13:03):
to improve my time by that much was was pretty awesome.
And when I came back to Australia, I found that
a lot of people were saying, oh, are you going
to try for silver? Are you going to try for gold?
And I'm thinking, well, hang on, I've just done a
PB and I've represented Australia. What more do you want
me to do? So I had a rest for a
bit after that because I'd sort of felt like I'd reached,
(13:23):
you know, the heights of the highs I'd had. Telegram
from the Prime Minister and guys, and we had a
cocktail party. It was before the days of when you
had ticker tape parades and anything like that. So in
the newspaper there was only like a tiny little, like
two liner at the back of the paper saying what
our results were when we came back.
S1 (13:48):
You're currently listening to In Plain Sight on Vision Australia
Radio with Simon Chong and Abby Green. Rain. This week
we are speaking to Carryduff Paralympian, bronze medallist and disability
advocate who currently works for team GB.
S2 (14:10):
So I saw a quote from you, Kerry, that said
your swimming career and the success that you had in
your swimming career was a great launching pad and a
great place for you to start and give you the
confidence to be the successful person that you are. Do
you want to expand on that for us beat architects?
S3 (14:30):
Um, yeah. Basically through doing sport, I did increase my confidence.
I was exposed to a lot more people from various backgrounds,
and I was also fortunate to have a lot of
mentors and sort of like peer support during that time.
Prior to getting involved in sport, I was kind of
in a bit of a no man's land because it
was only like myself with a disability at school. So,
(14:51):
you know, no one else I could bounce ideas off.
So I was sort of like the different person, the
other person. But with the sport, I found that I
was in a position where I would go to schools
and talk about what I was going to do when
I went to a competition, and then when I came back,
I'd bring medals and I'd go back to the school
and have a chat in the assembly, or I'd speak
to a rotary group. So to do that and feel confident,
(15:14):
I had to join. I chose to join Toastmasters, which
improved my public speaking and got me to see how
you can sort of form a speech and, you know,
insert a little bit of humor into it and different
things like that. And also through being involved in sport,
I was then given a lot of other opportunities. Like recently,
(15:34):
I've been involved in putting together some training manuals for
sporting groups that are interested and keen to involve more
people with disabilities in their clubs. So we've put together
some manuals, um, with Paralympics Australia and Disabled Sports Australia,
and that's something that, you know, once upon a time
I never would have thought that I'd be involved in that.
S2 (15:58):
So you just mentioned the word mentor there. I like
to encourage people to seek out mentors and role models
and to demonstrate it, because it's such a great avenue
of building one's confidence and then to share that confidence
with others. Now, you like to now help mentor other
people in the different areas of your your work that
(16:20):
you've done over the years. Is that right, Kerry?
S3 (16:23):
Yes. Yeah. I guess throughout life I've, I've kind of
been at the I mean, there were people born with
spina bifida prior to me, but a lot of the
kids that were born prior to the 60s, they didn't
sort of flourish and succeed to the extent that kids
born after that had the opportunity to with, with medical
advances and society sort of becoming more welcoming and more inclusive. Slowly, slowly,
(16:48):
slowly over time. Um, so whilst I looked up to
1 or 2 people when I was growing up. As
I've got older, I've been involved in groups like the
Spina Bifida Association of Victoria, where I was born, and
then when I moved to WA. Um, SBA, WA and
(17:10):
through that been able to provide programs like summer camps
and leadership courses, where people have been able to sort
of get to meet other people with similar disabilities or
or people without without disabilities or people with differing disabilities. Um,
and just compare ideas and troubleshoot ways of negotiating life.
S2 (17:31):
So you participated in a leadership program yourself, didn't you, Kerry?
S3 (17:34):
I was involved in leaders for tomorrow.
S2 (17:36):
That here in.
S4 (17:36):
Perth.
S3 (17:37):
It is in Perth. Yeah, it's actually a national program
that went for three years, a few years back. And
it was facilitated through equal in WA. And through that
I had the opportunity to do some training in small business,
setting up small businesses and also in public speaking again,
and also getting involved in the Australian Institute of Company Directors.
(18:00):
I started to do some of the work in that,
which then means that when I come across other people
who are interested in starting up a business or wanting
to know how to go about writing a their life story,
you know, I've got a bit more of an idea
how to do that through the different contacts that I've
made over the years.
S2 (18:18):
So the different avenues of work that you've been involved
in have been around advocacy and helping other people within
the disability sector. And you have your own little business
called Kerry Duff Consulting. Tell us about Kerry Duff Consulting
and what that involves and how it works.
S3 (18:34):
I got involved in advocacy, basically because I wanted to
give back like I'd received so much. My parents had
been involved in starting up the Spinal Bifida Association in Victoria,
which then led to the Australian Spinal Bifida Hydrocephalus Association
starting up nationally. And over time, I've got involved in
executive positions, sort.
S2 (18:54):
Of being on the.
S3 (18:54):
Board. Yeah, I was on the board for Spina Bifida Foundation,
and I was the president of Aspa for a while.
And that sort of then led on to being involved
in the International Federation for Spina Bifida and Hydrocephalus and
having a board position in an overseas organization which was
seeking to have people with disabilities more involved in their
(19:16):
own lives, sort of being more proactive themselves rather than
having people doing things for them. So having parents have
all the say or the professionals have all the say,
empowering people to have the skills to speak up for themselves.
S2 (19:26):
You mentioned what motivated you because your parents instilled that
quality within you to want to give back to the community,
but I'm always curious. I was just talking about role
models and mentoring. What you would say to a young
person with a disability, a physical disability, to encourage them
to take up positions of leadership.
S3 (19:46):
I guess from my swimming days, I learned to set
goals and like incremental ones. So if you'd like to
be involved in a board. Work out what it is
that you need beforehand. So like when I was involved
with women with Disabilities Australia, we had leadership groups where
people could get together and learn the skills that you need.
(20:08):
You know, whether it's budgeting, whether it's different directorship type roles. So,
you know, find a mentor, don't don't be afraid to
go and ask somebody if you can meet with them or,
you know, chat with them over the phone. And often,
you know, people are often willing to assist you, but
they might not know how. So if I know, it's
really scary to take that first step, but by taking
(20:32):
that first step and celebrating that, you've actually taken that
first step. Because often we're really hard on ourselves. So
you've got to make sure that you celebrate the wins. Yes.
Make sure that, you know, you find someone that is
doing what it is that you would like to do,
and then ask them how they got there and then,
you know, work out what it is that you need
to do to do that.
S2 (20:51):
On a similar note to my previous question, what would
you say to the general public who haven't had much
to do with people with a physical disability or any
kind of disability, to encourage them to be a bit
more supportive and inclusive within our society and community?
S3 (21:07):
I guess one of my my first messages always is
assume nothing. Don't assume that you need to do something
for someone, or help someone, or that you know how
to do it. The best thing is to just ask somebody.
And my name is Kerry. It's not the girl in
the wheelchair. So see the person first. I'm a person
just the same as someone who who doesn't walk around
with sticks or walk around with a cane or push
(21:29):
a chair. I might walk a little bit funny when
I'm not in my chair. I sort of walk a
little bit like a penguin because I'm a bit bit wobbly,
but I still get from point A to point B.
If you see someone sort of struggling up a hill,
ask them before you push the chair because it might
put the person off centre and then, you know, they
might fall out of their chair if they're not prepared
for you to do that. As an example, If I'm
(21:51):
putting the shopping into the boot of my car, I'll
be standing out of my chair, hanging onto the boot
of the car, and I'll be reaching in and out.
And if somebody comes up and suddenly starts to help me,
that can really throw me off off center. And it's
the same as, like if you're a person without a
disability and someone just suddenly comes up and grabs you
by the arm, that's going to take you by surprise.
(22:11):
So even though we're all different, you can still try
and put yourself in the other person's position.
S2 (22:17):
That's right. It's it's a strange idea that people can think.
They can just come up and assist or touch or
help somebody because they have a disability or an impairment
or a blind or whatever it might be. What are
you actually doing work wise these days?
S3 (22:33):
I work for a company called Teamlab, and we do
team building for corporates, so it might be a business
or accountants, it might be a sporting group. So with Teamlab,
people might come to us while they're doing their strategic planning,
and they might want to have a fun component to that.
So we'll get them to go and do an urban challenge,
and or we'll get them to do something like painting Day,
(22:56):
or get them to put together torches that can be
used for people in developing countries. So the tasks that
we get the people to do, they have to work
together as a team. So everybody's got different abilities, different likes,
different dislikes. Um, so you have to work out how
to work together. My husband's also involved in it, and
he's also a wheelchair user, and we're the only two
(23:18):
people with visible disabilities in the group. So it's another
way of being an advocate for just living a regular
life and doing something. It's a paid job. Often people
think that because you have a disability, you're not going
to be in paid employment.
S2 (23:33):
No.
S3 (23:33):
That's right. And yes, I have been involved and I
still am involved in a lot of voluntary roles, but
I've also definitely had a lot of paid positions.
S2 (23:41):
So, Kerry, it's been fascinating to talk to you and
you've had such a full and well-rounded life. Like we said, grounding,
grounding from being a sports person when you're young to
right up until now, where you're supporting other organizations to
be more inclusive and to consider accessibility needs and so on.
So I want to congratulate you and thank you for
(24:02):
sharing your story with us today. Kerry. Look forward to
speaking to you again sometime. Thanks for joining us.
S3 (24:06):
Thanks very much, Simon. That's been great.
S1 (24:17):
That concludes in Plain Sight for this week. Join us,
Abbey Green and Simon Chung at the same time next
week on Vision Australia Radio VA radio digital and online
at VA Radio.com. You can also listen on demand by
searching for In Plain Sight wherever you get your podcasts,
or ask your smart device to play in Plain Sight
(24:39):
by Vision Australia Radio. Thanks for listening.
Hi I'm Abby.
S2 (00:12):
I'm Simon, and welcome to. In Plain Sight program, where
we highlight people who are making a positive impact within
their community and the disability sector.
S1 (00:21):
Shining a light on those who might otherwise be hidden
in plain sight.
S2 (00:26):
And we share these stories on a weekly basis with
you here on Vision Australia Radio. Hi Abby, how are you?
S1 (00:38):
I'm fabulous. Simon, how are you?
S2 (00:40):
I'm pretty great too. Thanks for asking. It's good to
be here in the studio doing our fantastic show once again.
S1 (00:47):
And what's new with you, Simon?
S2 (00:48):
I had a fabulous weekend. The weekend just gone to
the recording date, and one of the nice things I
did was I went to see my friend and the
friend of the show, Ben Rowe, played some music at
a local community sports club and it was a fantastic day.
Ben is one of those people who I find somewhat
annoying because he's involved with everything. He's really talented, and
(01:12):
he's a musician and a sports person, and he works
for Blind Sports Western Australia. I'd also like to congratulate
and give an acknowledgment and shout out to our friend
Julie Carvalho, who we spoke to recently, and her colleague
in the cricket world, Nikki Muir, who got selected from
WA to be part of the Australian Women's blind cricket team.
(01:35):
And they're going to be participating in an upcoming tournament. Abby.
S1 (01:38):
Yeah they are. And it's historic because it is the
first time that international blind women's cricket has been played
in Australia. So it's being played at the Kuraby Knights
Cricket Club in Brisbane, and it'll be from the 20th
of April to the 25th of April. So a huge
congratulations to the 15 players that were selected.
S2 (02:01):
Especially shout out to our West Australian people. And that's
Australia versus Pakistan. I'm sure Vision Australia Radio across the
board will be following that, and some of our colleagues
on the station will be keeping track of that and
give you progressive reports as the tournament goes along. We
are talking about sport now, but our guest, who we
(02:21):
will be interviewing later on. Her name is Kerry Duff
and she was a Paralympian and we discovered talking with
Kerry that things like sport can really develop so many
other aspects of your life and give you extra confidence.
Now Kerry has a condition called spina bifida. What do
we know about spina bifida? Please, Abby.
S1 (02:43):
Well, did you know that spina bifida actually means split spine?
S2 (02:48):
No I didn't. That is a fascinating term.
S1 (02:51):
Neither did I. So it's because it's a birth defect
where the spinal cord and surrounding bones don't close completely
during pregnancy. And according to the Australian Institute of Health
and Welfare, Approximately 150 babies are born with spina bifida
each year in Australia, and there are about 5000 adults
(03:11):
living with the condition. Now there's also a spina bifida association,
and they advocate for research to improve the lives of
people living with spina bifida. They also provide one on
one information and guidance for families, individuals and providers. So
there are some good resources out there.
S2 (03:29):
There is. And one of the great things that we
learnt from talking with Kerri Duff is that she was
mentored as a young person, and then she found that
that was so rewarding. She wanted to give back to
the community and be a mentor herself in later life.
And she's still doing that now, and that's why she's
joined us on the radio today. And it was fabulous
(03:50):
to talk with her.
S1 (03:51):
Yeah. And we'll hear from Kerri now.
S2 (03:57):
And I'd like to welcome Kerri to the studio right now. Hello, Kerri.
S3 (04:01):
Hi, Simon. Thanks for having me.
S2 (04:03):
Now, Kerry, can you tell us you have spina bifida?
Is that.
S3 (04:06):
Correct? That's right. Yes. I was born with spina bifida.
S2 (04:09):
So for those who don't know, including myself, what is
spina bifida and how does that one acquire spina bifida?
S3 (04:16):
It's a neurological condition, and it's a condition that forms
when the baby is still forming in the mum's womb.
So often when I'm doing a presentation, I'll encourage people
who are or women who are from a child rearing
age to take folate if they're sexually active, because spina
bifida forms when there's not enough folate in the mother.
S1 (04:40):
Enough foliage.
S2 (04:41):
Folate.
S3 (04:42):
Folate.
S1 (04:42):
Folate.
S2 (04:43):
It's a grain or something.
S3 (04:45):
Folate. Folate is a vitamin B, and it's found in
green leafy vegetables. So you can also get supplements from
the chemist. And because everyone sort of takes a different amount,
everyone requires a different amount because you absorb it differently. Um,
it's worthwhile taking the supplements. Even if you're not thinking
of having a child. Because let's face it, kids sort
(05:07):
of just happen when you're not expecting them to happen.
S4 (05:10):
That's right.
S2 (05:11):
Now, is it my perception, or is there less spina
bifida in the community nowadays?
S3 (05:18):
There probably is less people born with spina bifida nowadays,
partly because it's with technological advances. It can be picked
up a lot more when people do pre-screening throughout their pregnancy,
and some people tend to decide to not go ahead
with the pregnancy. Oh, that's because yeah, I find it
a little bit sad. You can't tell the.
S2 (05:39):
Severity.
S3 (05:40):
The severity of the disability just from being in the womb.
But nowadays also it's also possible to operate on the child.
S2 (05:47):
How has spina bifida affected you physically throughout your life,
and were those effects digressive? Would they become more as
you got older?
S3 (05:57):
When I was first born, my parents were told that
I would be in a wheelchair probably by the time
I was two. I'm now closer to 60 than I
am to 50. I can't tell you how old I am, um,
and I'm using a wheelchair. I've only been using a
wheelchair since probably I was about 50. Prior to that,
I walked on crutches and I used calipers. So the
(06:18):
spine having spina bifida did change throughout my life, and
it meant that I required different assistive technology to help
me get through the.
S1 (06:28):
What are calipers?
S3 (06:30):
Calipers are equipment that you have sort of on your
legs that.
S2 (06:35):
Support your legs.
S3 (06:37):
Calipers are supports that you use. Um, they mine are
called afos ankle foot orthosis. And they fit into your
shoes and they stop your knees. They stop your legs
from turning in so that you walk a bit straighter.
S4 (06:51):
Yeah. If you've.
S2 (06:52):
Ever saw the film Forrest Gump, that was a very
primitive version.
S1 (06:56):
Of that movie.
S3 (06:57):
So, um, with Forrest Gump, if you think about him,
he had two calipers on his legs. But when I
was actually, um, first learning to walk, I had a frame,
so I pushed that in front of me, but my
calipers were actually up to my waist and they were
joined at the knees. So I had to do a
little hop jump thing, jump sort of steps. And then
(07:18):
as time progressed, by the time I got to grade three, um,
I had calipers below my knees, but there was sort
of a progression to get to that.
S1 (07:26):
They were painful.
S3 (07:27):
They're not painful or. But they, they make they basically
they make the difference between being able to go to
a lot of different places and not being able to
have the stamina or the strength to do that, but
they do mean that you can't often get pretty feminine,
you know, nice looking shoes. You get these clodhopping horrible boots. Oh, well,
(07:51):
actually that that was probably pre 80s. Nowadays you can get,
you know, pretty nice wide shoes or.
S4 (07:59):
Yeah.
S3 (07:59):
Better fitting shoes.
S4 (08:01):
As.
S2 (08:02):
Kerry wear roughly the same age. And I remember as
a child seeing those images, especially for the fundraising events
and so on, for what we called here back those days,
the Spastic Welfare Association or the Crippled Children's Association and
things like that. And now I remember those pictures of
the poor little children. They were always young girls too,
(08:22):
mostly with the crutches and the callipers and all that
kind of business. It's the unfortunate way that those organisations
used to, um, portray people with a disability so they
could raise money and awareness and all that type of thing,
you know?
S3 (08:36):
Yeah, I can relate to that. Simon. When I went
to special school. I had three, I had two girlfriends.
And when we moved from one location and the school
was rebuilt closer to home, the three of us would
had our photos taken, and there was myself standing up
and another girl sitting in a wheelchair and someone else, um,
(08:56):
on sticks. But with those high up callipers like Forrest Gump.
And then 20 years later, after the school had been
built and we'd all left school and were doing other things,
they had our photo taken again. And at that stage
I was driving. So I got my photo taken, sitting
in the front seat of my car with my hand
on the hand controls, and it just showed you the
(09:18):
difference from earlier on having a picture of sweet little
innocent kids, but with disabilities to pull the heartstrings, to
showing a businesswoman who drives a car and is independent.
S2 (09:32):
So great.
S3 (09:33):
Society's changed a lot, which is really good.
S2 (09:35):
It has. Now, whilst you're in high school, you were
just talking about primary school there, but whilst you were
in high school you started your sporting life. Is that right?
S3 (09:44):
Yes. I started competitive sporting life in high school. I'd
swum during primary school, but not competitively.
S2 (09:51):
So mainly you're a swimmer or you were a swimmer.
Tell us a little bit about that, how that progressed
and how you reached the heights of Paralympian.
S3 (09:59):
I'd always enjoyed being at the pool or at the
beach and, you know, going for a swim. And I
took up swimming classes. Probably I would have been during
primary school. And then by the time I got to
high school, I joined a swimming squad. North Lodge Neptunes,
which was run by a past Olympian who was in
(10:23):
the water polo in 1950 something or other. Um, and yes,
I went, I went along to North Lodge swimming squad
from year ten onwards, and I would swim a couple
of times during the week and on the weekends, and
I'd get involved in the local competitions, but at that
(10:43):
stage I was swimming against younger kids. And then I
found sports and recreation for disabled children, and I became competitive,
getting involved in competitions with other kids with disabilities. And
it was a lot more equal because there you have classifications.
So it's based on functional ability. Kind of like NDIS is.
(11:05):
And so I would be swimming against someone who had
similar disability to me. Or they might have cerebral palsy
or another disability, but they have the same muscle tone
and ability.
S2 (11:15):
Yeah. When did you start doing serious competitive swimming?
S3 (11:19):
My first competition was in Adelaide with the first junior games.
That was in year ten and they were more games
where it was based on participating. But I'd run quite
a few of my swimming events, and I was selected,
along with three other Victorians, to be part of the
Australian team of 20 kids that went over to England,
(11:42):
and that was for the first invitational disabled Junior Games
held at Stoke Mandeville. And from there, when I came back,
I was invited to go to the the seniors because
by then I was like about 15. And from the
first nationals, I was chosen to go to the Far
Eastern South Pacific International Competition, which is equivalent to Commonwealth Games.
(12:05):
If you think of it in those sort of terms,
and they were actually held in Hong Kong. So I
had the experience of flying to Hong Kong, having a
track coach there who was working with the track athletes,
but he was also a biology teacher, so he was
testing me on my biology because I had exams when
I got back. So I was sort of combining schoolwork
(12:27):
and study with getting involved in sport.
S2 (12:29):
Yeah.
S3 (12:29):
Um, but yeah, going to Beijing was amazing because it
exposed me to a whole lot of people of all
different abilities.
S2 (12:35):
And what year was that going to Beijing?
S3 (12:37):
That was in 82.
S2 (12:38):
And tell us, what was the pinnacle of your swimming career?
S3 (12:43):
Ah, the pinnacle, no doubt, would be winning a bronze
in the 400m freestyle at the 1984 Paralympics. They were
also held in England, and there I did a personal
best time of 11 seconds. So when you talk about swimming,
normally people talk about 100th of a second. So, um,
(13:03):
to improve my time by that much was was pretty awesome.
And when I came back to Australia, I found that
a lot of people were saying, oh, are you going
to try for silver? Are you going to try for gold?
And I'm thinking, well, hang on, I've just done a
PB and I've represented Australia. What more do you want
me to do? So I had a rest for a
bit after that because I'd sort of felt like I'd reached,
(13:23):
you know, the heights of the highs I'd had. Telegram
from the Prime Minister and guys, and we had a
cocktail party. It was before the days of when you
had ticker tape parades and anything like that. So in
the newspaper there was only like a tiny little, like
two liner at the back of the paper saying what
our results were when we came back.
S1 (13:48):
You're currently listening to In Plain Sight on Vision Australia
Radio with Simon Chong and Abby Green. Rain. This week
we are speaking to Carryduff Paralympian, bronze medallist and disability
advocate who currently works for team GB.
S2 (14:10):
So I saw a quote from you, Kerry, that said
your swimming career and the success that you had in
your swimming career was a great launching pad and a
great place for you to start and give you the
confidence to be the successful person that you are. Do
you want to expand on that for us beat architects?
S3 (14:30):
Um, yeah. Basically through doing sport, I did increase my confidence.
I was exposed to a lot more people from various backgrounds,
and I was also fortunate to have a lot of
mentors and sort of like peer support during that time.
Prior to getting involved in sport, I was kind of
in a bit of a no man's land because it
was only like myself with a disability at school. So,
(14:51):
you know, no one else I could bounce ideas off.
So I was sort of like the different person, the
other person. But with the sport, I found that I
was in a position where I would go to schools
and talk about what I was going to do when
I went to a competition, and then when I came back,
I'd bring medals and I'd go back to the school
and have a chat in the assembly, or I'd speak
to a rotary group. So to do that and feel confident,
(15:14):
I had to join. I chose to join Toastmasters, which
improved my public speaking and got me to see how
you can sort of form a speech and, you know,
insert a little bit of humor into it and different
things like that. And also through being involved in sport,
I was then given a lot of other opportunities. Like recently,
(15:34):
I've been involved in putting together some training manuals for
sporting groups that are interested and keen to involve more
people with disabilities in their clubs. So we've put together
some manuals, um, with Paralympics Australia and Disabled Sports Australia,
and that's something that, you know, once upon a time
I never would have thought that I'd be involved in that.
S2 (15:58):
So you just mentioned the word mentor there. I like
to encourage people to seek out mentors and role models
and to demonstrate it, because it's such a great avenue
of building one's confidence and then to share that confidence
with others. Now, you like to now help mentor other
people in the different areas of your your work that
(16:20):
you've done over the years. Is that right, Kerry?
S3 (16:23):
Yes. Yeah. I guess throughout life I've, I've kind of
been at the I mean, there were people born with
spina bifida prior to me, but a lot of the
kids that were born prior to the 60s, they didn't
sort of flourish and succeed to the extent that kids
born after that had the opportunity to with, with medical
advances and society sort of becoming more welcoming and more inclusive. Slowly, slowly,
(16:48):
slowly over time. Um, so whilst I looked up to
1 or 2 people when I was growing up. As
I've got older, I've been involved in groups like the
Spina Bifida Association of Victoria, where I was born, and
then when I moved to WA. Um, SBA, WA and
(17:10):
through that been able to provide programs like summer camps
and leadership courses, where people have been able to sort
of get to meet other people with similar disabilities or
or people without without disabilities or people with differing disabilities. Um,
and just compare ideas and troubleshoot ways of negotiating life.
S2 (17:31):
So you participated in a leadership program yourself, didn't you, Kerry?
S3 (17:34):
I was involved in leaders for tomorrow.
S2 (17:36):
That here in.
S4 (17:36):
Perth.
S3 (17:37):
It is in Perth. Yeah, it's actually a national program
that went for three years, a few years back. And
it was facilitated through equal in WA. And through that
I had the opportunity to do some training in small business,
setting up small businesses and also in public speaking again,
and also getting involved in the Australian Institute of Company Directors.
(18:00):
I started to do some of the work in that,
which then means that when I come across other people
who are interested in starting up a business or wanting
to know how to go about writing a their life story,
you know, I've got a bit more of an idea
how to do that through the different contacts that I've
made over the years.
S2 (18:18):
So the different avenues of work that you've been involved
in have been around advocacy and helping other people within
the disability sector. And you have your own little business
called Kerry Duff Consulting. Tell us about Kerry Duff Consulting
and what that involves and how it works.
S3 (18:34):
I got involved in advocacy, basically because I wanted to
give back like I'd received so much. My parents had
been involved in starting up the Spinal Bifida Association in Victoria,
which then led to the Australian Spinal Bifida Hydrocephalus Association
starting up nationally. And over time, I've got involved in
executive positions, sort.
S2 (18:54):
Of being on the.
S3 (18:54):
Board. Yeah, I was on the board for Spina Bifida Foundation,
and I was the president of Aspa for a while.
And that sort of then led on to being involved
in the International Federation for Spina Bifida and Hydrocephalus and
having a board position in an overseas organization which was
seeking to have people with disabilities more involved in their
(19:16):
own lives, sort of being more proactive themselves rather than
having people doing things for them. So having parents have
all the say or the professionals have all the say,
empowering people to have the skills to speak up for themselves.
S2 (19:26):
You mentioned what motivated you because your parents instilled that
quality within you to want to give back to the community,
but I'm always curious. I was just talking about role
models and mentoring. What you would say to a young
person with a disability, a physical disability, to encourage them
to take up positions of leadership.
S3 (19:46):
I guess from my swimming days, I learned to set
goals and like incremental ones. So if you'd like to
be involved in a board. Work out what it is
that you need beforehand. So like when I was involved
with women with Disabilities Australia, we had leadership groups where
people could get together and learn the skills that you need.
(20:08):
You know, whether it's budgeting, whether it's different directorship type roles. So,
you know, find a mentor, don't don't be afraid to
go and ask somebody if you can meet with them or,
you know, chat with them over the phone. And often,
you know, people are often willing to assist you, but
they might not know how. So if I know, it's
really scary to take that first step, but by taking
(20:32):
that first step and celebrating that, you've actually taken that
first step. Because often we're really hard on ourselves. So
you've got to make sure that you celebrate the wins. Yes.
Make sure that, you know, you find someone that is
doing what it is that you would like to do,
and then ask them how they got there and then,
you know, work out what it is that you need
to do to do that.
S2 (20:51):
On a similar note to my previous question, what would
you say to the general public who haven't had much
to do with people with a physical disability or any
kind of disability, to encourage them to be a bit
more supportive and inclusive within our society and community?
S3 (21:07):
I guess one of my my first messages always is
assume nothing. Don't assume that you need to do something
for someone, or help someone, or that you know how
to do it. The best thing is to just ask somebody.
And my name is Kerry. It's not the girl in
the wheelchair. So see the person first. I'm a person
just the same as someone who who doesn't walk around
with sticks or walk around with a cane or push
(21:29):
a chair. I might walk a little bit funny when
I'm not in my chair. I sort of walk a
little bit like a penguin because I'm a bit bit wobbly,
but I still get from point A to point B.
If you see someone sort of struggling up a hill,
ask them before you push the chair because it might
put the person off centre and then, you know, they
might fall out of their chair if they're not prepared
for you to do that. As an example, If I'm
(21:51):
putting the shopping into the boot of my car, I'll
be standing out of my chair, hanging onto the boot
of the car, and I'll be reaching in and out.
And if somebody comes up and suddenly starts to help me,
that can really throw me off off center. And it's
the same as, like if you're a person without a
disability and someone just suddenly comes up and grabs you
by the arm, that's going to take you by surprise.
(22:11):
So even though we're all different, you can still try
and put yourself in the other person's position.
S2 (22:17):
That's right. It's it's a strange idea that people can think.
They can just come up and assist or touch or
help somebody because they have a disability or an impairment
or a blind or whatever it might be. What are
you actually doing work wise these days?
S3 (22:33):
I work for a company called Teamlab, and we do
team building for corporates, so it might be a business
or accountants, it might be a sporting group. So with Teamlab,
people might come to us while they're doing their strategic planning,
and they might want to have a fun component to that.
So we'll get them to go and do an urban challenge,
and or we'll get them to do something like painting Day,
(22:56):
or get them to put together torches that can be
used for people in developing countries. So the tasks that
we get the people to do, they have to work
together as a team. So everybody's got different abilities, different likes,
different dislikes. Um, so you have to work out how
to work together. My husband's also involved in it, and
he's also a wheelchair user, and we're the only two
(23:18):
people with visible disabilities in the group. So it's another
way of being an advocate for just living a regular
life and doing something. It's a paid job. Often people
think that because you have a disability, you're not going
to be in paid employment.
S2 (23:33):
No.
S3 (23:33):
That's right. And yes, I have been involved and I
still am involved in a lot of voluntary roles, but
I've also definitely had a lot of paid positions.
S2 (23:41):
So, Kerry, it's been fascinating to talk to you and
you've had such a full and well-rounded life. Like we said, grounding,
grounding from being a sports person when you're young to
right up until now, where you're supporting other organizations to
be more inclusive and to consider accessibility needs and so on.
So I want to congratulate you and thank you for
(24:02):
sharing your story with us today. Kerry. Look forward to
speaking to you again sometime. Thanks for joining us.
S3 (24:06):
Thanks very much, Simon. That's been great.
S1 (24:17):
That concludes in Plain Sight for this week. Join us,
Abbey Green and Simon Chung at the same time next
week on Vision Australia Radio VA radio digital and online
at VA Radio.com. You can also listen on demand by
searching for In Plain Sight wherever you get your podcasts,
or ask your smart device to play in Plain Sight
(24:39):
by Vision Australia Radio. Thanks for listening.
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