October 14, 2025 • 28 mins
This week, Simon and Andrew are joined by Paul Grace, author of Operation Hurricane: the story of Britain's first atomic test in Australia and the legacy that remains, the fascinating story behind Australia’s first nuclear weapons test.
Paul takes us on a captivating journey through the dramatic events of 1952, when the British detonated a nuclear bomb off the Montebello Islands on Western Australia’s north coast. Through meticulous research and a deep personal connection, Paul brings this complex slice of history vividly to life - uncovering both the human stories and the lasting legacy of those tests.
It’s a conversation that’s as warm and engaging as it is thought-provoking, with Paul’s passion and curiosity shining through every moment. A remarkable story, beautifully told, and a chat you won’t want to miss.
Paul recently appeared at the Totally Lit Festival in Fremantle, WA, for which Vision Australia Radio was a proud media partner.
Support Vision Australia Radio: https://www.visionaustralia.org/donate
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:17):
Hello and welcome to In Plain Sight, a program where
we highlight people who are making a positive impact in
the community and disability sector.
S2 (00:25):
Shining a light on those who would be otherwise hidden
in plain sight.
S1 (00:29):
And it's a pleasure to bring you these stories on
a weekly basis with you here on Vision Australia Radio. Hi.
S2 (00:35):
Welcome everybody, and welcome Andrew.
S1 (00:37):
Thank you, Simon, and welcome to you too.
S2 (00:39):
It's great to be here. I've really been enjoying the
last few shows that we've been putting together and have
had a bit of a literature theme all around, reading
and books. And this week we will be talking more
about books, and we'll let you know more about that
very shortly as this program goes to air. I wanted
(01:00):
to make a point that October 15th is International White
Cane Day, and it is a day where we acknowledge
and take note of all the great achievements that people
who are blind, are vision impaired or have low vision
are doing within the world, and how something as simple
as a white cane can bring so much independence and
(01:24):
so much to a person's life, and it has become
a symbol of independence and achievement. And also just a
symbol of a blind person is out and about in
the world and doing great things. So to all my
friends who are blind or vision impaired or have low vision,
whether or not you use a white cane or have
(01:46):
a dog guide or whatever method of mobility and assistance
that you use. Hello and welcome to you and I
wish you Happy White Cane Day, which is on October
15th and today I also wanted to make mention of
an event coming up on the 30th of October, something
(02:06):
that I'm really keen to support and I supported last year,
and it is a fundraising event for the Lost at
Sea blind sailing team, and the Fabulous Kylie. Fourth and
her team of sailors are heading off to Oman and
they are holding a big gala dinner at the Royal
(02:27):
Perth Yacht Club. And Andrew, do you have the details
of that event in front of you there, please?
S1 (02:32):
I do yes. So the events taking place, as you say,
at the Royal Perth Yacht Club on the 30th of
October and that's a Thursday. And the Royal Perth Yacht
Club is in Crawley, here in Perth. It's a fabulous,
delicious meal at the Royal Perth Yacht Club and you
can offer your support and encouragement by coming along to
that event. Um, you can book tickets through the Facebook
(02:56):
page of Lost at Sea, and there's a great pun
in the spelling of that. It's Lost at Sea blind
Sailing Team, so that's pretty fantastic. So join skipper Kylie
fourth and her team, Erin McLeod clue and Chiara, Jarcho
and Todd back for helping them get off to their.
(03:16):
The World Championships of Inclusion in Oman on the 30th
of November through to the 8th of December.
S2 (03:23):
But if you can't get along to that event, there
is a way you can help support by just donating
to this cause. Again, go on Facebook, look for the
Lost at Sea Facebook page and find out how to
donate to their cause there. So what have we got
coming up in today's programme, Andrew?
S1 (03:39):
Our guest this week is writer Paul Grace, whose 2023
book Operation Hurricane was shortlisted for the WA Premier's Book
Awards in 2024. Paul was a guest on the one
of the panels at the Totally Lit Writers Festival, and
you had a fascinating conversation with him about that book,
and it's a really interesting piece of WA history.
S2 (04:01):
And we will listen to that interview with Paul. Right now.
Our guest is Paul Grace, an author who was also
a presenter at the Totally Lit Festival just recently, and
we're going to talk to him about his book Operation
Hurricane and also his appearance at the Totally Lit Festival.
(04:23):
And I'd like to welcome Paul to the studio right now. Hi, Paul.
S3 (04:27):
Hi, Simon. Thanks for having me.
S2 (04:28):
It's a pleasure. I've had a quick look at your
book and I find it fascinating, a really interesting subject matter,
being West Australian as well. I was aware of this
happening in the far flung north west of Western Australia.
I'll just get you to give us a quick synopsis
of what your book is about.
S3 (04:47):
Sure. Operation hurricane was the first British nuclear test which
was conducted in the Montebello Islands in the north west
of WA, off off the Pilbara coast. And, uh, that
occurred on the 3rd of October, 1952. And it was
a major operation, um, that involved, uh, almost 5000 Commonwealth
(05:12):
service personnel from Britain and Australia and a big crew
of scientists as well. British scientists who were all involved
in the effort to develop nuclear weapons.
S2 (05:23):
And I read that you were inspired to start writing
this book because your grandfather, Ronald, was involved with this operation.
S3 (05:32):
That's right. I do have a personal connection to the test. Uh,
my grandfather, his name was Ron Grace. He was a
pilot in the RAAF. He'd served in World War II
and Korea. And in 1952, he was sent up to
Onslow on the WA coast to participate in Operation Hurricane. Uh,
(05:55):
he was a member of the number 86 Transport Wing, uh,
operating out of Richmond, New South Wales, usually, and a
detachment was sent to Onslow, uh to do several jobs
in connection with the nuclear test. Before the test, they
were flying security patrols around the Montebello Islands. And then
(06:17):
after the test, they had a very controversial job, controversial
in retrospect, called coastal monitoring. And what coastal monitoring meant
that was basically code for looking for fallout on the mainland.
The British government had promised that there wouldn't be any
fallout that would reach the mainland. And so, uh, my
(06:41):
grandfather and a few of his mates were sent up
in Dakotas, which are unpressurized aircraft, actually, to fly up
and down the coast between Onslow and Broome with, uh,
these huge contraptions, really strange contraptions, basically like giant Geiger
counters in the back of the aircraft, uh, looking for fallout. And, uh,
(07:02):
their initial flights were conducted at 500ft, which is very,
very low. That was the point of that was to
look for fallout at ground level, or as close as
they could safely fly to ground level. And then they
also flew, uh, higher altitude flights. Uh, and at 10,000ft,
to be precise, uh, my grandfather's plane, uh, contacted, uh,
(07:26):
radioactive cloud or what the scientists referred to as an
invisible concentration of radioactive particles over the coast. Uh, right.
Right above 80 Mile Beach between Port Hedland and Broome.
So although they contacted a radioactive cloud there, and that
cloud was subsequently tracked across the east coast near Townsville
(07:49):
and out over the Pacific Ocean as well. Uh, despite
that fact, the British scientists found that, uh, in their words,
no deposited activity reached the mainland. And that was a
very controversial finding that that basically, uh, when a royal
commission was finally held into the nuclear tests in the 1980s,
(08:09):
the commissioners found that that was that was basically a
sort of a political finding that was that they they
found what they were supposed to find, which was that
no fallout had reached the mainland.
S2 (08:21):
That's fantastic. Really fascinating. And I'm I'm really intrigued by
your family connection there. And it makes stories much more
relevant and impacting when we connect it to ourselves. And
we know that there's personal connections. I'd like to get
to know you a little bit as well. Paul, I
read that you were a broadcaster and a bookseller. So
(08:45):
tell us firstly, what does that mean, a bookseller? Do
you own your own bookshop or.
S3 (08:50):
I've worked in bookshops for, for many years. Um, my
first full time job out of university, where I studied
at Curtin and, um, have an English degree and my
first full time job was at Dymocks in High Street,
which I'm glad to say is still going strong. And
since then I've worked in several different bookstores, big and small. Um,
(09:13):
reference and technical and, uh, general. I've never owned my
own shop. Okay. Um, that would be, uh, the, the,
the next sort of step in proceedings for me, but
I've worked as a manager in many shops and, uh, yeah,
I have have a lot of experience in that area. And, uh,
I've done a lot of, uh, reading obviously in, in the, uh,
(09:37):
sort of area that I'm now writing in.
S2 (09:39):
So it's an interesting transition to be a reader to
a writer.
S3 (09:43):
Yes. That's right. I've always been, uh, a keen reader of,
of all sorts of genres, but probably a special interest
in military history because of my family history, not just
my grandfather who I've told you about, but, uh, my
other grandfather was also in the RAAF during World War two. II.
(10:03):
My father is, um, ex-army. He actually served in Vietnam and, uh,
stayed in the army for many years afterwards. And my
brother as well, he, uh, joined the Army out of
high school, and he served in East Timor and Afghanistan. Wow. So, yeah.
So I have this sort of although I haven't served myself,
(10:23):
I have this strong family connection, um, with the services.
And so I've always taken a special interest in trying
to understand the experience of, uh, people like my dad,
my brother and my two grandfathers, um, through military history
and writing the book for me was sort of my
(10:46):
way of contributing to to that family history and and
to and to Australia's military history to some extent.
S2 (10:55):
I have glanced your book. I purchased it from the
Apple Store because it was available as a a read,
and it was the first time I've ever done anything
like that. And for those who don't know, I'm vision
impaired so I can see the written word, but I
find it quite difficult to to read physically in that sense.
So I have my computer. It reads it out. I
(11:17):
was trying to find an audio book version. I couldn't
find one. So if anyone from Vision Australia library is listening, uh,
please add Paul's book to the list because it would
make a great audio book. And I know many of
our listeners are interested in history and historic factual books
of this nature. I think they would find it fascinating.
(11:39):
So the book is called Operation Hurricane.
S3 (11:43):
I'll second that, too. Um, thanks for saying that, Simon.
I would love for there to be an audio version
of the book. I've been sort of pushing for it
to happen, but it hasn't happened yet, so hopefully we
can make it happen.
S2 (11:53):
Now, getting back to your family there, your book, from
what I've read and seen, is quite technical because it's
a non-fiction book and it's a very thorough and detailed
historic review of those times. How did your family that
were in the mill have been in the military? Find
that book? How did they accept it? Obviously, your grandfather
(12:14):
wasn't around to read it, but yeah, your father and
your brother.
S3 (12:17):
Well, they've been really encouraging. Um, they're both, uh, big readers,
especially my dad. He might be might be the best
read person that I know. Um, especially in the, in
the area of military history. And they've been really encouraging and,
and were, um, uh, very, very, uh, warm in their
(12:39):
praise of when, when the book came out. It's interesting
that you touched on that, that level of technicality and
the level of research in the book. Because because you
really hit on what was the biggest challenge of of
writing the book. This is, you know, I'm not a
nuclear physicist, so I had a lot to learn when
(13:00):
it came to to researching this topic. And and not
just the the technicalities of how bombs work and and
how a military operation works, but also, um, I'm not
a trained historian, so I had to train myself up in, um,
in research techniques. And so it was it was very
(13:24):
difficult because we're, we're, we're lucky that there's a trove
of records available relating to the nuclear tests because of
the Royal commission that was held in the 1980s. So
there's thousands of pages of evidence in the form of um,
written statements by participants, uh, verbal testimony at the royal
(13:48):
commission and also declassified government documents, um, from Britain and Australia.
But the problem is so much of this stuff is contradictory.
People have probably experienced situations at work where the official
story might be very different from the real story of
what's happened. Uh, in a certain incident. And that's something that, uh,
(14:14):
that is very true with the nuclear tests. The other
difficulty is that because the Royal Commission was 30 years
after the events, a memories fade. And so you have many, uh,
people who were involved in the same operations, doing the
same jobs, but whose accounts often were quite contradictory, uh,
(14:39):
just because of that simple problem that it's 30 years
later and, and people are sort of struggling to remember
events that happened a lifetime ago.
S1 (14:48):
You're listening to In Plain Sight on Vision Australia Radio
with Simon Chong and me, Andrew Williams. Our guest this
week is writer Paul Grace, whose 2023 book Operation Hurricane
was shortlisted for the WA Premier's Book Awards Book of
the year 2024. Paul was a guest panellist during the
(15:09):
Totally Lit Writers Festival in Fremantle, here in Perth, and
now it's back to Simon and Paul.
S2 (15:17):
Now, in regards to the totally lit literature festival that
was held in Fremantle. You were on a panel which
the title of the panel, the whole day's discussion was
Quantum Words. And you were on a panel with Gillian O'Shaughnessy.
I'm curious to know we are reading this book in
the 21st century where everything is contentious, everything is questioned,
(15:40):
no one believes anything they read, and all this type
of paranoia that's going on. And you just talked about
it then where, um, officials say one thing and the
participants say another thing. How do you, as an author
addressed this type of activity, this behavior, this thought, these
(16:01):
thought patterns in the 21st century, in the world of
social media and so on. Is that part of what
you were discussing at The Talk?
S3 (16:08):
It's definitely a big problem. The whole issue of nuclear
weapons and even nuclear power, it's it's very controversial. Yes.
People have drastically different views. And what's interesting is that
I find sometimes it's it's almost impossible to say anything
(16:29):
without upsetting somebody on one end of the argument and
sometimes upsetting people on both ends of the argument. I've,
I really tried in the book to consciously to tread
a middle path. I wanted to be as fair as
possible to the British scientists who were involved. A lot
(16:53):
of people have portrayed them as sort of either bumbling
buffoons who didn't know what they were doing, or even
as mustache twirling villains who didn't care about what happened
to the Australian people or the Australian, um, environment at all.
(17:15):
And I didn't find either of those things to be true.
I found them to be, uh, very, very clever and
intelligent people. They weren't evil people. They were doing a
very difficult job as best as they could. And looking
back from our position now, we can see mistakes that
(17:39):
were made. Yes, we can see things that they missed.
And we can also question the wisdom of the whole endeavor.
You know.
S2 (17:46):
You do point that out in the book, and it's
the irony of war, how there are side benefits that
come from developing machineries and weapons and things that you
need in war that can be used in peacetime afterwards.
Whilst I was looking at your book, you were talking
about it just now. You mentioned a lot about how
(18:09):
Australia and the time was still in the grips of
being patriotic members of the British Empire. Yes. And you
sort of hinted that in your book about how Australia
was used not only for these nuclear tests because they could,
but it's a barren place. There's no one there. We
(18:29):
can drop a nuclear bomb. It'll be okay. You do
acknowledge that there has always been indigenous people in most
parts of this great nation, including the Montebello Islands, where
this took place. We do look back on history, sometimes
with harsh critique, but we can only look back in
the past with the lens from that era, not the
(18:53):
21st century era.
S3 (18:55):
Yeah, I think sometimes you have to almost look at
it both ways and try to hold a hold both
ideas in your mind at the same time. Uh, you're
absolutely right to say that a big part of the
mindset with, um, the British government and unfortunately, even the
Australian government at the time was that these were vast
(19:19):
swathes of empty territory, uh, where people, uh, where the
governments could, could do what they liked. It was an
extension of the terra nullius concept. The the idea that
this is empty land that was virtually uninhabited. And of course,
we know that's not true. The Montebellos, uh, they have
(19:42):
a fascinating history going back 30,000 years. They were actually
still part of the mainland because that was during the
last ice age. and sea levels were much lower then,
and the entire north west shelf was actually part of
the mainland, including what is now Barrow Island and the
(20:03):
Montebellos about 10,000 years ago. The ice caps start to melt,
sea levels rise, and gradually over time, over several thousand years,
sea levels rise to the point where they are now.
But before that, um, Aboriginal people from the northwest of
(20:24):
Australia did visit that area. And we have evidence of
Aboriginal habitation in caves on, uh, one particular island in
the montebellos called Campbell Island, where there's where there's three caves.
So we know that it has this history. Uh, at
the time of the tests, the, the islands were uninhabited because, uh,
(20:47):
visitation ceased with the, with the rising of the sea levels. Uh, however,
it's quite possible that the Montebello tests, uh, have affected, uh,
Aboriginal people, uh, on the mainland as well, because it
happens that there are ultimately three nuclear tests conducted in Montebello.
S2 (21:09):
So the Montebello test was the the first one that
initiated the whole process.
S3 (21:15):
That's right.
S2 (21:15):
So can I ask before we go on? Had the
British been working on nuclear weapons for some time before
they decided to try and test this one?
S3 (21:25):
Yeah. They had. They'd been working on nuclear weapons, uh,
from very early in the war. In fact, uh, Britain's
wartime atom bomb program, which was called Tube Alloys, actually
predated the Manhattan Project. But it was much smaller and
it was eventually folded into it. And all the top
British scientists went to America to work on the bombs
(21:48):
that were ultimately dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. And then
after the war, um, for various reasons, uh, the the
Americans ceased cooperating with the Brits. They basically were pretty
happy with the situation of having a, a sort of
a nuclear monopoly. And so they stopped cooperating with the Brits.
(22:08):
But the British government still wanted their own nuclear weapons,
so they continued developing them on their own, which led
them to Australia to conduct, um, their first test in
the Montebello Islands.
S2 (22:22):
And the area that most Australians would be aware of
is Maralinga. Maralinga and made famous by one of Paul
Kelly's songs. Yes. And as Paul Kelly does, he he
can tell a story in three minutes that wake you
up to a whole history of events. But that's a
whole nother side issue.
S3 (22:42):
Yeah, very, very evocative and evocative. And the reason why, uh,
Maralinga became so infamous is because of the displacement and
the exposure of Aboriginal people from the lands around the
test sites, and the fact that the test site was
contaminated with a large amount of plutonium. One of the
(23:06):
most dangerous, um, uh, materials on planet Earth, which the
British failed to clean up. And so. So they became
particularly infamous, those tests. The Montebello tests have been slightly overshadowed, um, historically.
And that was one of the reasons why I wanted
to write this book. And as I was about to
(23:28):
say a minute ago, um, it's it's quite possible that
Aboriginal people on the mainland were, uh, impacted by the
Montebello tests as well, because with all three of the
Montebello tests, hurricane in 52 and the two mosaic tests
in 56, We know that contamination came back across the
(23:49):
mainland on all three occasions, and the Royal Commission found
that by far the most likely people to be impacted
by exposure to that fallout were Aboriginal people living traditional
or semi traditional lifestyles in the north west of WA.
S2 (24:07):
It's a fascinating topic, a really interesting one, and it's
a great book. I really enjoyed what I read of
it so far and we'll be continuing. It's relatively easy
to read, even though it is somewhat like a history textbook,
but it flows quite well. Um. Time is running away
from us now, Paul. Unfortunately. What other projects have you
(24:28):
got in store now? You've just promoting this first book
of yours?
S3 (24:32):
Well, um, as it happens, I've just returned from a
trip to the Montebello Islands, where I was visiting with, uh,
as part of a team of eight, uh, writers, photographers,
photographers and, um, descendants of nuclear veterans. And, uh, we
all were all going for different reasons, working on different projects.
(24:54):
And I'm personally, uh, developing a documentary adaptation of the book.
S2 (24:59):
Oh.
S3 (24:59):
Very good. So, uh, this trip was sort of the
first stage of developing that so very early stages of development. But, um, would.
S2 (25:09):
That be a feature length documentary?
S3 (25:11):
Remains to be seen. I'm quite hopeful that we might, uh, even, uh,
develop it into a series that incorporates the mainland tests, uh,
that you just brought up, because that's such an important
part of the story as well, obviously. So, um, fingers
crossed we might see something like perhaps a three part series, um,
(25:32):
on TV or on, uh, on a streaming service sometime soon.
S2 (25:36):
So just to remind people, the the book is called
Operation Hurricane. The author is Paul Grace, and he's been
in the studio to talk to us about that now,
and it's been a pleasure to talk with you, Paul,
and I really thank you for your time. Is there
anything else you'd like to leave us with before we
have to finish up today? Paul?
S3 (25:55):
No, thanks. Simon. Just thanks very much for having me.
It's been a pleasure to talk to you about the book, and, yeah,
hopefully we can get that audio version to happen. That
would be great.
S2 (26:04):
Just remind people, Paul, where they can get your book.
S3 (26:09):
Uh, the book is available in all good bookstores, as
they say. Uh, if your local bookstore doesn't have it
in stock, you can ask them to order it. And
it's also available online from all the usual online retailers
in both trade paperback and e-book version.
S2 (26:26):
I highly recommend checking out this book, folks. It's a
great read, and it's also good to know something about
our local, not just West Australian, but our Australian history,
our involvement with the nuclear testing in this case. In
this case, it was post war. But we all know
that post war leads to future war and is connected
(26:50):
to the previous wars. So, um, yeah, it was really
interesting and a really important topic, especially in this day
and age where we are talking about nuclear power and
nuclear weapons. And, uh, I really enjoyed having a look
at this book, and I hope you do too. And
thanks once again, Paul Grace.
S3 (27:06):
Thanks, Simon.
S2 (27:07):
That's all we got time for today. Thanks for joining
us here on Vision Australia Radio. Bye for now.
S1 (27:12):
That concludes in Plain Sight for this week. Join us
at the same time next week on Vision Australia Radio, radio,
radio digital and online at Radio.com. You can also listen
on demand by searching for In Plain Sight by Vision
Australia Radio. Wherever you get your podcasts, or ask your
smart device to play in Plain Sight by Vision Australia Radio.
(27:36):
Thanks for listening.
S4 (27:37):
Thank you.
Hello and welcome to In Plain Sight, a program where
we highlight people who are making a positive impact in
the community and disability sector.
S2 (00:25):
Shining a light on those who would be otherwise hidden
in plain sight.
S1 (00:29):
And it's a pleasure to bring you these stories on
a weekly basis with you here on Vision Australia Radio. Hi.
S2 (00:35):
Welcome everybody, and welcome Andrew.
S1 (00:37):
Thank you, Simon, and welcome to you too.
S2 (00:39):
It's great to be here. I've really been enjoying the
last few shows that we've been putting together and have
had a bit of a literature theme all around, reading
and books. And this week we will be talking more
about books, and we'll let you know more about that
very shortly as this program goes to air. I wanted
(01:00):
to make a point that October 15th is International White
Cane Day, and it is a day where we acknowledge
and take note of all the great achievements that people
who are blind, are vision impaired or have low vision
are doing within the world, and how something as simple
as a white cane can bring so much independence and
(01:24):
so much to a person's life, and it has become
a symbol of independence and achievement. And also just a
symbol of a blind person is out and about in
the world and doing great things. So to all my
friends who are blind or vision impaired or have low vision,
whether or not you use a white cane or have
(01:46):
a dog guide or whatever method of mobility and assistance
that you use. Hello and welcome to you and I
wish you Happy White Cane Day, which is on October
15th and today I also wanted to make mention of
an event coming up on the 30th of October, something
(02:06):
that I'm really keen to support and I supported last year,
and it is a fundraising event for the Lost at
Sea blind sailing team, and the Fabulous Kylie. Fourth and
her team of sailors are heading off to Oman and
they are holding a big gala dinner at the Royal
(02:27):
Perth Yacht Club. And Andrew, do you have the details
of that event in front of you there, please?
S1 (02:32):
I do yes. So the events taking place, as you say,
at the Royal Perth Yacht Club on the 30th of
October and that's a Thursday. And the Royal Perth Yacht
Club is in Crawley, here in Perth. It's a fabulous,
delicious meal at the Royal Perth Yacht Club and you
can offer your support and encouragement by coming along to
that event. Um, you can book tickets through the Facebook
(02:56):
page of Lost at Sea, and there's a great pun
in the spelling of that. It's Lost at Sea blind
Sailing Team, so that's pretty fantastic. So join skipper Kylie
fourth and her team, Erin McLeod clue and Chiara, Jarcho
and Todd back for helping them get off to their.
(03:16):
The World Championships of Inclusion in Oman on the 30th
of November through to the 8th of December.
S2 (03:23):
But if you can't get along to that event, there
is a way you can help support by just donating
to this cause. Again, go on Facebook, look for the
Lost at Sea Facebook page and find out how to
donate to their cause there. So what have we got
coming up in today's programme, Andrew?
S1 (03:39):
Our guest this week is writer Paul Grace, whose 2023
book Operation Hurricane was shortlisted for the WA Premier's Book
Awards in 2024. Paul was a guest on the one
of the panels at the Totally Lit Writers Festival, and
you had a fascinating conversation with him about that book,
and it's a really interesting piece of WA history.
S2 (04:01):
And we will listen to that interview with Paul. Right now.
Our guest is Paul Grace, an author who was also
a presenter at the Totally Lit Festival just recently, and
we're going to talk to him about his book Operation
Hurricane and also his appearance at the Totally Lit Festival.
(04:23):
And I'd like to welcome Paul to the studio right now. Hi, Paul.
S3 (04:27):
Hi, Simon. Thanks for having me.
S2 (04:28):
It's a pleasure. I've had a quick look at your
book and I find it fascinating, a really interesting subject matter,
being West Australian as well. I was aware of this
happening in the far flung north west of Western Australia.
I'll just get you to give us a quick synopsis
of what your book is about.
S3 (04:47):
Sure. Operation hurricane was the first British nuclear test which
was conducted in the Montebello Islands in the north west
of WA, off off the Pilbara coast. And, uh, that
occurred on the 3rd of October, 1952. And it was
a major operation, um, that involved, uh, almost 5000 Commonwealth
(05:12):
service personnel from Britain and Australia and a big crew
of scientists as well. British scientists who were all involved
in the effort to develop nuclear weapons.
S2 (05:23):
And I read that you were inspired to start writing
this book because your grandfather, Ronald, was involved with this operation.
S3 (05:32):
That's right. I do have a personal connection to the test. Uh,
my grandfather, his name was Ron Grace. He was a
pilot in the RAAF. He'd served in World War II
and Korea. And in 1952, he was sent up to
Onslow on the WA coast to participate in Operation Hurricane. Uh,
(05:55):
he was a member of the number 86 Transport Wing, uh,
operating out of Richmond, New South Wales, usually, and a
detachment was sent to Onslow, uh to do several jobs
in connection with the nuclear test. Before the test, they
were flying security patrols around the Montebello Islands. And then
(06:17):
after the test, they had a very controversial job, controversial
in retrospect, called coastal monitoring. And what coastal monitoring meant
that was basically code for looking for fallout on the mainland.
The British government had promised that there wouldn't be any
fallout that would reach the mainland. And so, uh, my
(06:41):
grandfather and a few of his mates were sent up
in Dakotas, which are unpressurized aircraft, actually, to fly up
and down the coast between Onslow and Broome with, uh,
these huge contraptions, really strange contraptions, basically like giant Geiger
counters in the back of the aircraft, uh, looking for fallout. And, uh,
(07:02):
their initial flights were conducted at 500ft, which is very,
very low. That was the point of that was to
look for fallout at ground level, or as close as
they could safely fly to ground level. And then they
also flew, uh, higher altitude flights. Uh, and at 10,000ft,
to be precise, uh, my grandfather's plane, uh, contacted, uh,
(07:26):
radioactive cloud or what the scientists referred to as an
invisible concentration of radioactive particles over the coast. Uh, right.
Right above 80 Mile Beach between Port Hedland and Broome.
So although they contacted a radioactive cloud there, and that
cloud was subsequently tracked across the east coast near Townsville
(07:49):
and out over the Pacific Ocean as well. Uh, despite
that fact, the British scientists found that, uh, in their words,
no deposited activity reached the mainland. And that was a
very controversial finding that that basically, uh, when a royal
commission was finally held into the nuclear tests in the 1980s,
(08:09):
the commissioners found that that was that was basically a
sort of a political finding that was that they they
found what they were supposed to find, which was that
no fallout had reached the mainland.
S2 (08:21):
That's fantastic. Really fascinating. And I'm I'm really intrigued by
your family connection there. And it makes stories much more
relevant and impacting when we connect it to ourselves. And
we know that there's personal connections. I'd like to get
to know you a little bit as well. Paul, I
read that you were a broadcaster and a bookseller. So
(08:45):
tell us firstly, what does that mean, a bookseller? Do
you own your own bookshop or.
S3 (08:50):
I've worked in bookshops for, for many years. Um, my
first full time job out of university, where I studied
at Curtin and, um, have an English degree and my
first full time job was at Dymocks in High Street,
which I'm glad to say is still going strong. And
since then I've worked in several different bookstores, big and small. Um,
(09:13):
reference and technical and, uh, general. I've never owned my
own shop. Okay. Um, that would be, uh, the, the,
the next sort of step in proceedings for me, but
I've worked as a manager in many shops and, uh, yeah,
I have have a lot of experience in that area. And, uh,
I've done a lot of, uh, reading obviously in, in the, uh,
(09:37):
sort of area that I'm now writing in.
S2 (09:39):
So it's an interesting transition to be a reader to
a writer.
S3 (09:43):
Yes. That's right. I've always been, uh, a keen reader of,
of all sorts of genres, but probably a special interest
in military history because of my family history, not just
my grandfather who I've told you about, but, uh, my
other grandfather was also in the RAAF during World War two. II.
(10:03):
My father is, um, ex-army. He actually served in Vietnam and, uh,
stayed in the army for many years afterwards. And my
brother as well, he, uh, joined the Army out of
high school, and he served in East Timor and Afghanistan. Wow. So, yeah.
So I have this sort of although I haven't served myself,
(10:23):
I have this strong family connection, um, with the services.
And so I've always taken a special interest in trying
to understand the experience of, uh, people like my dad,
my brother and my two grandfathers, um, through military history
and writing the book for me was sort of my
(10:46):
way of contributing to to that family history and and
to and to Australia's military history to some extent.
S2 (10:55):
I have glanced your book. I purchased it from the
Apple Store because it was available as a a read,
and it was the first time I've ever done anything
like that. And for those who don't know, I'm vision
impaired so I can see the written word, but I
find it quite difficult to to read physically in that sense.
So I have my computer. It reads it out. I
(11:17):
was trying to find an audio book version. I couldn't
find one. So if anyone from Vision Australia library is listening, uh,
please add Paul's book to the list because it would
make a great audio book. And I know many of
our listeners are interested in history and historic factual books
of this nature. I think they would find it fascinating.
(11:39):
So the book is called Operation Hurricane.
S3 (11:43):
I'll second that, too. Um, thanks for saying that, Simon.
I would love for there to be an audio version
of the book. I've been sort of pushing for it
to happen, but it hasn't happened yet, so hopefully we
can make it happen.
S2 (11:53):
Now, getting back to your family there, your book, from
what I've read and seen, is quite technical because it's
a non-fiction book and it's a very thorough and detailed
historic review of those times. How did your family that
were in the mill have been in the military? Find
that book? How did they accept it? Obviously, your grandfather
(12:14):
wasn't around to read it, but yeah, your father and
your brother.
S3 (12:17):
Well, they've been really encouraging. Um, they're both, uh, big readers,
especially my dad. He might be might be the best
read person that I know. Um, especially in the, in
the area of military history. And they've been really encouraging and,
and were, um, uh, very, very, uh, warm in their
(12:39):
praise of when, when the book came out. It's interesting
that you touched on that, that level of technicality and
the level of research in the book. Because because you
really hit on what was the biggest challenge of of
writing the book. This is, you know, I'm not a
nuclear physicist, so I had a lot to learn when
(13:00):
it came to to researching this topic. And and not
just the the technicalities of how bombs work and and
how a military operation works, but also, um, I'm not
a trained historian, so I had to train myself up in, um,
in research techniques. And so it was it was very
(13:24):
difficult because we're, we're, we're lucky that there's a trove
of records available relating to the nuclear tests because of
the Royal commission that was held in the 1980s. So
there's thousands of pages of evidence in the form of um,
written statements by participants, uh, verbal testimony at the royal
(13:48):
commission and also declassified government documents, um, from Britain and Australia.
But the problem is so much of this stuff is contradictory.
People have probably experienced situations at work where the official
story might be very different from the real story of
what's happened. Uh, in a certain incident. And that's something that, uh,
(14:14):
that is very true with the nuclear tests. The other
difficulty is that because the Royal Commission was 30 years
after the events, a memories fade. And so you have many, uh,
people who were involved in the same operations, doing the
same jobs, but whose accounts often were quite contradictory, uh,
(14:39):
just because of that simple problem that it's 30 years
later and, and people are sort of struggling to remember
events that happened a lifetime ago.
S1 (14:48):
You're listening to In Plain Sight on Vision Australia Radio
with Simon Chong and me, Andrew Williams. Our guest this
week is writer Paul Grace, whose 2023 book Operation Hurricane
was shortlisted for the WA Premier's Book Awards Book of
the year 2024. Paul was a guest panellist during the
(15:09):
Totally Lit Writers Festival in Fremantle, here in Perth, and
now it's back to Simon and Paul.
S2 (15:17):
Now, in regards to the totally lit literature festival that
was held in Fremantle. You were on a panel which
the title of the panel, the whole day's discussion was
Quantum Words. And you were on a panel with Gillian O'Shaughnessy.
I'm curious to know we are reading this book in
the 21st century where everything is contentious, everything is questioned,
(15:40):
no one believes anything they read, and all this type
of paranoia that's going on. And you just talked about
it then where, um, officials say one thing and the
participants say another thing. How do you, as an author
addressed this type of activity, this behavior, this thought, these
(16:01):
thought patterns in the 21st century, in the world of
social media and so on. Is that part of what
you were discussing at The Talk?
S3 (16:08):
It's definitely a big problem. The whole issue of nuclear
weapons and even nuclear power, it's it's very controversial. Yes.
People have drastically different views. And what's interesting is that
I find sometimes it's it's almost impossible to say anything
(16:29):
without upsetting somebody on one end of the argument and
sometimes upsetting people on both ends of the argument. I've,
I really tried in the book to consciously to tread
a middle path. I wanted to be as fair as
possible to the British scientists who were involved. A lot
(16:53):
of people have portrayed them as sort of either bumbling
buffoons who didn't know what they were doing, or even
as mustache twirling villains who didn't care about what happened
to the Australian people or the Australian, um, environment at all.
(17:15):
And I didn't find either of those things to be true.
I found them to be, uh, very, very clever and
intelligent people. They weren't evil people. They were doing a
very difficult job as best as they could. And looking
back from our position now, we can see mistakes that
(17:39):
were made. Yes, we can see things that they missed.
And we can also question the wisdom of the whole endeavor.
You know.
S2 (17:46):
You do point that out in the book, and it's
the irony of war, how there are side benefits that
come from developing machineries and weapons and things that you
need in war that can be used in peacetime afterwards.
Whilst I was looking at your book, you were talking
about it just now. You mentioned a lot about how
(18:09):
Australia and the time was still in the grips of
being patriotic members of the British Empire. Yes. And you
sort of hinted that in your book about how Australia
was used not only for these nuclear tests because they could,
but it's a barren place. There's no one there. We
(18:29):
can drop a nuclear bomb. It'll be okay. You do
acknowledge that there has always been indigenous people in most
parts of this great nation, including the Montebello Islands, where
this took place. We do look back on history, sometimes
with harsh critique, but we can only look back in
the past with the lens from that era, not the
(18:53):
21st century era.
S3 (18:55):
Yeah, I think sometimes you have to almost look at
it both ways and try to hold a hold both
ideas in your mind at the same time. Uh, you're
absolutely right to say that a big part of the
mindset with, um, the British government and unfortunately, even the
Australian government at the time was that these were vast
(19:19):
swathes of empty territory, uh, where people, uh, where the
governments could, could do what they liked. It was an
extension of the terra nullius concept. The the idea that
this is empty land that was virtually uninhabited. And of course,
we know that's not true. The Montebellos, uh, they have
(19:42):
a fascinating history going back 30,000 years. They were actually
still part of the mainland because that was during the
last ice age. and sea levels were much lower then,
and the entire north west shelf was actually part of
the mainland, including what is now Barrow Island and the
(20:03):
Montebellos about 10,000 years ago. The ice caps start to melt,
sea levels rise, and gradually over time, over several thousand years,
sea levels rise to the point where they are now.
But before that, um, Aboriginal people from the northwest of
(20:24):
Australia did visit that area. And we have evidence of
Aboriginal habitation in caves on, uh, one particular island in
the montebellos called Campbell Island, where there's where there's three caves.
So we know that it has this history. Uh, at
the time of the tests, the, the islands were uninhabited because, uh,
(20:47):
visitation ceased with the, with the rising of the sea levels. Uh, however,
it's quite possible that the Montebello tests, uh, have affected, uh,
Aboriginal people, uh, on the mainland as well, because it
happens that there are ultimately three nuclear tests conducted in Montebello.
S2 (21:09):
So the Montebello test was the the first one that
initiated the whole process.
S3 (21:15):
That's right.
S2 (21:15):
So can I ask before we go on? Had the
British been working on nuclear weapons for some time before
they decided to try and test this one?
S3 (21:25):
Yeah. They had. They'd been working on nuclear weapons, uh,
from very early in the war. In fact, uh, Britain's
wartime atom bomb program, which was called Tube Alloys, actually
predated the Manhattan Project. But it was much smaller and
it was eventually folded into it. And all the top
British scientists went to America to work on the bombs
(21:48):
that were ultimately dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. And then
after the war, um, for various reasons, uh, the the
Americans ceased cooperating with the Brits. They basically were pretty
happy with the situation of having a, a sort of
a nuclear monopoly. And so they stopped cooperating with the Brits.
(22:08):
But the British government still wanted their own nuclear weapons,
so they continued developing them on their own, which led
them to Australia to conduct, um, their first test in
the Montebello Islands.
S2 (22:22):
And the area that most Australians would be aware of
is Maralinga. Maralinga and made famous by one of Paul
Kelly's songs. Yes. And as Paul Kelly does, he he
can tell a story in three minutes that wake you
up to a whole history of events. But that's a
whole nother side issue.
S3 (22:42):
Yeah, very, very evocative and evocative. And the reason why, uh,
Maralinga became so infamous is because of the displacement and
the exposure of Aboriginal people from the lands around the
test sites, and the fact that the test site was
contaminated with a large amount of plutonium. One of the
(23:06):
most dangerous, um, uh, materials on planet Earth, which the
British failed to clean up. And so. So they became
particularly infamous, those tests. The Montebello tests have been slightly overshadowed, um, historically.
And that was one of the reasons why I wanted
to write this book. And as I was about to
(23:28):
say a minute ago, um, it's it's quite possible that
Aboriginal people on the mainland were, uh, impacted by the
Montebello tests as well, because with all three of the
Montebello tests, hurricane in 52 and the two mosaic tests
in 56, We know that contamination came back across the
(23:49):
mainland on all three occasions, and the Royal Commission found
that by far the most likely people to be impacted
by exposure to that fallout were Aboriginal people living traditional
or semi traditional lifestyles in the north west of WA.
S2 (24:07):
It's a fascinating topic, a really interesting one, and it's
a great book. I really enjoyed what I read of
it so far and we'll be continuing. It's relatively easy
to read, even though it is somewhat like a history textbook,
but it flows quite well. Um. Time is running away
from us now, Paul. Unfortunately. What other projects have you
(24:28):
got in store now? You've just promoting this first book
of yours?
S3 (24:32):
Well, um, as it happens, I've just returned from a
trip to the Montebello Islands, where I was visiting with, uh,
as part of a team of eight, uh, writers, photographers,
photographers and, um, descendants of nuclear veterans. And, uh, we
all were all going for different reasons, working on different projects.
(24:54):
And I'm personally, uh, developing a documentary adaptation of the book.
S2 (24:59):
Oh.
S3 (24:59):
Very good. So, uh, this trip was sort of the
first stage of developing that so very early stages of development. But, um, would.
S2 (25:09):
That be a feature length documentary?
S3 (25:11):
Remains to be seen. I'm quite hopeful that we might, uh, even, uh,
develop it into a series that incorporates the mainland tests, uh,
that you just brought up, because that's such an important
part of the story as well, obviously. So, um, fingers
crossed we might see something like perhaps a three part series, um,
(25:32):
on TV or on, uh, on a streaming service sometime soon.
S2 (25:36):
So just to remind people, the the book is called
Operation Hurricane. The author is Paul Grace, and he's been
in the studio to talk to us about that now,
and it's been a pleasure to talk with you, Paul,
and I really thank you for your time. Is there
anything else you'd like to leave us with before we
have to finish up today? Paul?
S3 (25:55):
No, thanks. Simon. Just thanks very much for having me.
It's been a pleasure to talk to you about the book, and, yeah,
hopefully we can get that audio version to happen. That
would be great.
S2 (26:04):
Just remind people, Paul, where they can get your book.
S3 (26:09):
Uh, the book is available in all good bookstores, as
they say. Uh, if your local bookstore doesn't have it
in stock, you can ask them to order it. And
it's also available online from all the usual online retailers
in both trade paperback and e-book version.
S2 (26:26):
I highly recommend checking out this book, folks. It's a
great read, and it's also good to know something about
our local, not just West Australian, but our Australian history,
our involvement with the nuclear testing in this case. In
this case, it was post war. But we all know
that post war leads to future war and is connected
(26:50):
to the previous wars. So, um, yeah, it was really
interesting and a really important topic, especially in this day
and age where we are talking about nuclear power and
nuclear weapons. And, uh, I really enjoyed having a look
at this book, and I hope you do too. And
thanks once again, Paul Grace.
S3 (27:06):
Thanks, Simon.
S2 (27:07):
That's all we got time for today. Thanks for joining
us here on Vision Australia Radio. Bye for now.
S1 (27:12):
That concludes in Plain Sight for this week. Join us
at the same time next week on Vision Australia Radio, radio,
radio digital and online at Radio.com. You can also listen
on demand by searching for In Plain Sight by Vision
Australia Radio. Wherever you get your podcasts, or ask your
smart device to play in Plain Sight by Vision Australia Radio.
(27:36):
Thanks for listening.
S4 (27:37):
Thank you.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.