Interview Highlight: Brooke Carter and Emma Hamilton - Australian Disability Network

As part of International Day of People with Disability (IDPwD), Brooke Carter and Emma Hamilton from the Australian Disability Network talk with Peter Greco about their Build Belonging Campaign. This is being launched under the scaffolding of the concept of Pragmatic Universal Design. Identified through Neuroinclusive Research, Pragmatic Universal Design is an actionable approach for Australian organisations to create more accessible and inclusive workplaces.

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Episode Transcript

S1 (00:13):
Let's talk about International Day for people with disabilities. December
3rd Important Day and the Australian Disability Network have been
doing some wonderful things that are leading up to the day.
Let's chat about it for a marketing em Hamilton, am
I going to catch up with you?

S2 (00:27):
Thanks, Peter. Thank you for this. Um, now, the theme
for this year's International Day of People with disability from
Australian Disability Network, I may add, because the actual body
does not release their theme till very late in the piece,
we go out with a theme that's focusing on workplaces,
inclusion and workplaces around the end of October every year. Now,

(00:47):
this year, we're calling it our Build Belonging campaign, but
it's actually been scaffolded by a an idea called Pragmatic
universal design, which many in the disability community will understand
or have heard of universal design as being, I suppose, the, um,
north star of universal design, whether it's for whatever products

(01:10):
or services or premises are created, but we also know
that that is not also always possible. For many, um,
organizations and workplaces. They are in buildings, they have systems
and processes and things often well set up. And while
they may realize that they do not meet universal design

(01:30):
or they may not be inclusive, um, this campaign, taking
the idea of pragmatic universal design, is about finding those
small steps that you can take that really build inclusion,
that don't require a lot of money, that don't require
a lot of setup. And it's not ignoring the ideals,

(01:51):
but it's just about starting where you are, learning as
you go. And then the other catchphrase is build belonging
one step at a time.

S1 (01:58):
Well, pragmatic is such an important word, isn't it? Because
if you make it too grandiose, if you like, then
that can kind of scare people off, I think. Well,
I don't know if we can manage that. So therefore
they kind of switch off or don't even try.

S2 (02:09):
Yes. We've heard from a lot of our members that, um,
they sometimes don't know where to start, and it can
be quite overwhelming. So what our team try to do
when we work with, um, our members who are organisations
across Australia, is to find out, I guess, where they
are at and where they want to go. And we
kind of map out ways they can get there. And

(02:30):
what we've done with this campaign is to make it
a broader sweep in terms of, I guess, public awareness,
not just with our members, is each week we have
a different theme aligned to best practice in workplaces, whether
that is workplace adjustments, whether that's dignified access. And we're
offering up, um, free resources and downloads each week, um,

(02:53):
for everybody.

S1 (02:54):
If I've been getting your emails and I'll take you
off there, I'm really learning so much from it. I mean,
it's kind of a lot of stuff is, of course,
but until it's kind of pointed out, then you don't
know about it or you don't know, you don't know
until it's pointed out. So that's great.

S2 (03:07):
Exactly. And Brooke has been working with many of our
members firsthand, so she can probably speak to how this
work actually translates into our membership as well.

S1 (03:19):
You know, Brooke, you're the relationships manager there. Tell us
a bit about how your role fits into all this
and what kind of reception have you had?

S3 (03:25):
Great question Peter. So my role, I guess, is to
really work with our members. So it's a lot of
listening to what they have been doing, listening to what
challenges that they are facing. Sometimes it's common across sectors.
A lot of it is sort of common but also

(03:46):
unique to different members as well. And looking at how
we can help them to build up resources and knowledge
in their organization. Um, you know, our mission is to
create a more disability confident Australia so that we do
have accessible workplaces. So I guess linking into the campaign, um,

(04:06):
members are absolutely loving the resources, but they're loving the
simplicity of particularly our top ten tips as as well.
And I think that this year's message of start where
you are and, you know, grow where you're going as
as well. Those messages really being able to connect back

(04:27):
to organizations as as well and look at what they
have in place, what they could be doing. And like
Emma said, it's it's not like it can be small
practical things as well. I think it's the important sort
of link and message to come back to members through
this campaign as well.

S1 (04:44):
I guess, with your members. And I did read somewhere
some something over 180 members or something like that. Have
I got that right?

S3 (04:50):
Around 450.

S1 (04:52):
I was divided by two. I must have. So I mean,
that's very impressive. And the point I was going to
make was obviously they all vary in so many ways
in terms of where they're based geographically, how many people
they're in contact with. And I guess the different disabilities
that they represent as well.

S3 (05:08):
Yeah. Correct. We've got members that are big, large organizations
that you would walk into and interact with every day,
just in, in everyday life that anyone would interact with
to medium to small organizations. Some have big diversity teams
and lots of resources and other organizations. It can be

(05:29):
down to 1 or 2 people being their diversity and
inclusion team and having to drive their initiatives. And I
guess that's where we really come in of matching the
organization and their needs and being able to use these
amazing resources that our wonderful marketing team has created for
us as well, to be able to, I guess, have

(05:50):
an impact within all of these organizations as well.

S1 (05:53):
But look, let's look at some of the kind of
themes each week that you've had. Uh, where do you
want to start? We started with, uh, you know, being, uh,
neuro inclusive.

S2 (06:02):
Yes. Neuro inclusion has become a really key thing for
our members. They're really keen on understanding how they can
make their workplaces more neuro inclusive. And so we have
got some more research coming out very soon. But ahead
of that, we shared our top ten tips for creating
a neuro inclusive workplace. We had also a look at

(06:23):
what some of our members have been doing with spotlight,
for example, the Inclusive Banking Initiative. So a new inclusive
banking initiative that Commbank have done. So we kind of
look trying to present ideas and then look at some
real world examples. At the same time. If you want
to hear what any of the top tips are from
your inclusive workplaces, they're things like offer workplace adjustments throughout

(06:46):
the work cycle. Now that actually, I would say is
a fundamental to every aspect of work, but this is
just tying this into what's important in neuro inclusive workplaces.
Streamline processes. Make sure you can offer that there's an
inclusive social culture with social connections without pressure. I'm just
looking at some of the other themes there. Things like

(07:07):
sensory spaces. Consider a quiet zone in your workplace, that
kind of thing.

S1 (07:12):
I've been doing this program for a while, and those
sort of sensory spaces, those relaxed sessions that are entertainment venues,
I mean, they're kind of, well, I was going to
say commonplace in the sense that, I mean, they're much
more common than they were. I mean, you know, it
seems kind of almost all of a sudden that, you know,
organizations have become aware of this and, you know, kind
of got on board.

S2 (07:31):
Yes. And I think I think that's with greater awareness.
I think a lot of, a lot of, um, people
are more aware of being your own clothes, uh, neuro inclusive.
And I think that comes often from, um, I'm sure
people know someone who is neurodivergent and they're wanting to
see how they can, um, support friends or family. And
then that expands out to workplaces and public spaces as well.

S1 (07:55):
Do you want to touch a bit on inclusive recruitment?
That was one of the other themes that was coming
through the last few weeks.

S4 (08:01):
I think with.

S3 (08:01):
Inclusive recruitment, it's as as Emma already said, you know,
a key component that sort of comes through with, with
everything is, again, workplace adjustments. Um, but some of the
other tips that we do have is where we're starting
to wanting to see it more and more and more is, um,
you know, having interview questions available in advance as well.

(08:22):
You know, having a couple of, uh, contact methods as, as,
as well to support those that, you know, some people
might want to contact by email. Some people want to
might contact by phone number as, as well. So they're
really I guess then they're, they're small things that are
with greater awareness. Um, like with the social spaces are

(08:43):
coming through, um, you know, making sure that job boards
are accessible as well for using assistive technology, um, as
well to make sure that, you know, everybody can participate
in that recruitment process.

S1 (08:56):
Because one of the things that's kind of happening is,
you know, technology is moving so quickly and in a
sense it can be a great assister to getting people
included in workplaces. But but also, you know, if it's
not used properly or if people aren't aware of what
things it can do, then that gets missed out on.

S3 (09:14):
Yeah. And I think it's understanding the, you know, why
why is this important? Why is it important to have, um,
these things in place and understanding what impact it'll have to,
to someone's experience as well. Emma mentioned before, you know,
asking along the journey as well is a big thing of,
of recruitment. Um, as, as well. And the impact and

(09:37):
the positive experience that, that can give to someone. But
I definitely agree with you. Technology is moving fast, but
it just means that, you know, we need to do
take a bit more time and actually make sure things
are accessible as well, and that it includes everyone.

S1 (09:52):
And how did you come up with some of these tips? Um,
like how they kind of formulated.

S2 (09:56):
Well at Australian Disability Network, we have a huge team
of experts like I refer to a lot of our
team members at ICN. It's about 36 of us as
subject matter experts. So we created these tips based on
existing resources, what we knew. But we actually worked with
our team and especially worked with our team of with

(10:17):
lived experience as well. So that's one of our big mantras,
is to always co-design. So they were created with our team,
with lived experience, and with that lens of the workplace,
as well as that kind of pragmatic universal design lens.

S1 (10:31):
Look, what about kind of making these things stick, if
you like, or sort of an after sales angle to it?
I mean, this is great leading up to the day.
The day happens, sort of, you know, December 4th onwards.
So how do we kind of keep the keep the
momentum going?

S3 (10:45):
I think the day is you've made a great point.
The day is a great day to start conversations. But
the important thing is to keep them going. And it's
why we've developed, you know, these resources. We've tried to
make them easy to follow as well. We've tried to
make them clear. And we do a lot, a lot
of different work throughout the year as well. There's different

(11:07):
ways that people can showcase what they're doing throughout the year.
But I think the biggest thing is to continue the
momentum is just to continue the conversations. Um, asking people
and and learning about what their needs are and how
we can make things accessible. And we touched on sort of,
you know, we use our colleagues that have lived experience
of being able to co-design and incorporate or create innovation,

(11:32):
hopefully keep the momentum going so that it's not just
a one day conversation.

S1 (11:37):
And I know it's kind of easy to kind of
always fall back on, you know, what about the government
doing something about it? Uh, do you have much contact
with sort of governments at all levels and, and the
role that they can play?

S2 (11:48):
That's a really great question, Peter. I think we have
a lot of government departments, federal and state level across
the country are actually our members. So within those workplaces,
they are trying to do what they can in the space.
But we have completed a couple of projects in the
last year that were funded by the government. And we've
also got not Austin, but Australia's also got the and

(12:13):
I think they've just changed their name. Brook, do you
remember what it is? Um, the centre for Inclusive Employment has.

S1 (12:20):
Oh yeah. About that on Sunday. Yeah, that was great. Yeah.
We spoke to Doctor Jenny Crosby. She's a very impressive person.

S2 (12:27):
Yes. So, um, we're we are watching and supporting, um,
that work as much as we can. And hopefully that
will drive a lot more inclusion and a lot more
discussion and awareness about the benefits of employing people with disability.

S1 (12:43):
Brook, I often say, you know, like those of us
that live with a disability, we kind of feel like
we're living in a bit of an echo chamber, and
we kind of think, well, of course everyone must know
about this, because that's kind of how I live my life.
But I guess we've also got to be a bit more, uh,
broad thinking or or kind of think outside the square
that not everyone is kind of aware of it because
of their life circumstances. That's kind of no one's fault,

(13:05):
but you can't be expected to know what you don't know.

S3 (13:08):
Yeah, absolutely. Peter, I can certainly empathize with you there
and hear where you're coming from there as well. But
I guess, you know, it's really important that we don't
assume and make assumptions. Um, and that way we can
create awareness and education and really make a difference as well.

S1 (13:27):
Terrific. Now, if people want to find out more, uh,
how can we do that? December 30th, a week or
so away. But if I, I guess it's the message
that is relevant all year round, as we've kind of
touched on, what's the best way for people to get
in touch or to find out, as I said before,
and I'm not just saying because I'm speaking to you guys,
but these resources, these, uh, this information that's been coming
down on a regular basis throughout the last few weeks

(13:48):
has been really fascinating and and just great reading. But
but also you kind of feel like you're learning all
the time here.

S2 (13:54):
Peter, that's great to hear. I love that people are
actually reading and clicking on the links of the, um,
edms signing up, subscribing to our monthly newsletter is a
great thing to do. Visiting our website and following us
on LinkedIn or Instagram. And we aren't just posting and
sharing things that we're doing, but we're also sharing the
work of other Australian organizations and, um, just spreading the

(14:18):
word all year round.

S1 (14:20):
We'll put those details up with our show notes so
people can go there. And as always, if they can't
access those for whatever reason or don't have the access
to the internet, they can always call us at the
radio station and we'll pass on those details. Emma Hamilton,
manager for marketing at Austin, thank you so much for
speaking to us. And Brooke Carter, the relationships manager. Thanks
for your time. To Brooke.

S5 (14:41):
Thank you Peter.

S2 (14:41):
Thanks, Peter. You have a good evening.

S1 (14:43):
And Hamilton and Brooke Carter there from the Australian Disability Network.
All those details up with our show notes.