May 13, 2025 • 25 mins
Have you ever wondered how to simply trust God? How to get out of a rut or spiritual desert? Pick your metaphor. I know I have, even recently! I have some good news for you! In this episode of the Kingdom & Culture Podcast, NY Times Best Selling Author, Speaker and Pastor, Dr. Mark Batterson hits on 3 key areas we can find encouragement for our hearts and minds: 1) In choosing a radical mindset shift and looking at faith through a fresh lens; 2) Through recognition of what God is doing in high school and college students/Gen Z and, 3) Practical parenting advice through something as simple as prayer. So if you've ever felt discouraged and overwhelmed with trying to live out your faith in Jesus, buckle up because Batterson is in the house.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Have you ever wondered how to simply trust God? Maybe
how to get out of your spiritual rut or desert?
I've been there recently and in today's episode of the
Kingdom and Culture podcast, Dr. Mark Patterson, a New York
Times bestselling author, also a pastor.
And a nationally renowned speaker is going to share with
(00:22):
us some key components on how to overcome the odds.
I don't know about you, but I, I want to overcome.
I don't want to sit back and be overcome, rather,
I want to be an overcomer. Like the Bible says
that we are more than conquerors in Christ. And so
Pastor Mark brings to the table today.
(00:44):
A practical and inspirational way for us to live our
lives on the daily in our culture with his lifelong
advice and what he's learned being a New York Times
bestselling author and speaker. So I hope you're ready and
buckle up because Patterson's in the house or rather on
(01:06):
the podcast, you know what I mean? Let's get ready.
I'm your host, Mike Whitford, and today we have a
friend of mine, pastor of mine, a guy that's honestly
(01:29):
spoken in my life for the past 26 years. And
so he's he's a special guy for me to have
on here. Um, and if you know who he is, uh, well,
I'm going to introduce him because we're about to find out. Uh,
his name is Mark Patterson. He, um, is a pastor
in Washington DC, has been pastoring out there since 1996.
(01:51):
Um, when I worked out there on Capitol Hill, he
was my pastor, and then I had a chance to
join him for a few years on Capitol Hill, uh,
being a campus pastor, part of National Community Church. That
is where he is the lead pastor, uh, National.cc.
So, um, moving things out there. And he's the author
of a few books, uh, The Circle Maker, which is
(02:11):
a New York Times bestselling book. Uh, one of my favorites,
in a pit with the Lion on a Snowy Day.
That's a mouthful, but one of the coolest book titles
I've ever heard, because it is totally accurate to, uh,
the storyline that uh Paschmart brings out. So you might
hear a little bit about that as we go along,
but
He, he's, uh, got 3 kids, married to his wonderful wife, Laura.
She's awesome, and just doing the work of God out
(02:33):
on the East Coast and wherever God leads him. So
without further ado, I wanna just, uh, say thanks for
being here, Pastor Mark. And, uh, I'm talking with my
hands here, hitting things, but, uh, thanks for, uh, being
part of things. So, anything else you wanna add, just
say hi.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Mike, good to be with you. And, uh, you know, I'm,
I'm in DC.
You're in LA and uh we're both believing for the
same thing that uh we want to see his kingdom come,
his will be done, and so we have had the
joy of pastoring National Community Church 29 years uh right
(03:10):
here in the nation's capital and, uh, seen some pretty
incredible miracles and, uh, just a joy to be on
with you and to have a conversation. Yeah,
Speaker 1 (03:21):
cool.
Well, and like you said, you've been out there for
29 years, uh, digging, honestly, wells of revival. Even before
revival was like a cool thing again, uh, you guys
were doing the work out in our nation's capital, like
you said.
Um, but speaking of revival, uh, when I was out
there back in January, I noticed, uh, a few of
your students at NCC because, I mean, that's what this
(03:44):
podcast is for. I hope students are listening, high school
and college and anybody else, um, but they're at their
winter escape, and God did some amazing things at that.
But one of the things that struck me is when
I was out there for your revival services in January, um,
I saw students flooding the altar each night.
I don't know. Could you tell us a little bit
about what, I mean, students out in the East Coast
(04:05):
are not much different than students on the West Coast.
They're students and they're just hungry for God. I don't know,
from your perspective as the lead pastor of NCC, what
do you see in God doing, not just in students,
but their families and the church at large and with
regards to just spiritual revival?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Yeah. Well, the reality is that like, most of us,
if we grew up going to church, we went, most
of us because our parents took us. But at, at
some point, you've got to find faith with your fingerprint
on it. It has to own you, you have to
own it.
And uh I'm telling you that, the younger you do that, uh,
(04:44):
the more opportunity there's gonna be for God to use
you and to bless you. And so, I, I'm thrilled
that we've got teenagers who are not seeking God's 2nd, 3rd,
or 10th.
They're seeking God first, and I, I think when you
begin to do that in your teen years, it lays
(05:05):
a foundation for whatever God wants to do. Um, I
might even get in our business just a little bit
and make an observation, Mike. I, I think a lot
of people, and I would have said this at 19,
at 19, I would have said I was following Jesus,
but the reality is I had invited Jesus to follow me.
(05:27):
And that's a whole different deal. Uh, most of us
have an inverted relationship with God. It's more about God
serving our purposes than us serving his, but I had
one of those all-in moments at 19. Uh, I was
at the University of Chicago on a full ride scholarship, and,
and I asked God a dangerous question. What do you
(05:48):
want me to do with my life? But Mike, the
only thing more dangerous than asking that question is not asking.
That question, and it was a moment for me where
I felt like God was calling me into full-time ministry.
I ended up giving up a full ride scholarship, transferring
to a Bible college about that and uh just started
(06:09):
pursuing God's plans and purposes for my life. And so
at some point you gotta make some defined.
decisions, you know, there, there are decades when nothing happens,
but there are days when decades happen, and, um, that
might be for some young people who are
Speaker 1 (06:26):
listening right now in your earthquake when you said that,
say that again, do that again,
Speaker 2 (06:31):
yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1 (06:32):
yeah, you know Pastor Mark, he's got these amazing, I
don't know, battersonisms where he just takes truth and just
condenses it into one little.
Laser. So say that again to the decades and the days.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah, there are decades when nothing happens, but there are
days when decades happen, and, and it usually, here's the
good news, you're one decision away from a totally different life. So,
but you have to make hard decisions, good decisions.
And uh sometimes it may seem like you're making a
decision not in your self-interest, but it's something that, that
(07:08):
you believe honors God, and God has a way of
honoring those decisions. And so, um, just a, a little
bit of a challenge there to make sure that uh
Man, I'll tell you what, I, I don't want anything
besides the good, pleasing and perfect will of God. That,
that's where I wanna live my life and, uh, and I,
(07:28):
I think that's what God has called each one of
us too.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
So I'm going to make an observation uh for those
that are maybe just hearing this on audio and any
on video, but behind you, you have a whole bunch
of books, most of which you have read, because you
pump out, you pump out a lot of books you write,
but you read even more. Uh, and you can talk
about that if you want to. But in light of that,
and what you just talked about taking steps of faith,
(07:54):
a book that was instrumental even in my taking a
step of faith from youth ministry into
Going and ministering with you in Washington DC in 2010
was in a pit with a lion on a snowy day.
That book just in the most positive way, rocked me
to have that courage, not basically to turn the table
on myself where, you know, nobody in their right mind
(08:15):
is going to tackle a lion on a sunny day,
let alone chase the lion into a pit on a
snowy day, which your, your book pulls out an actual
event in scripture, one of David's mighty men.
But in light of that, and, and I kind of
just gave the punch line there, but in light of
that and the circle maker and a book on prayer
and revival and all, what would you say for you
(08:37):
were the critical moments of what led you on your
faith journey from the age of 19 till now, and
just anything else you want to add in that context
and how
Students that are listening right now, what they can do
to take those steps of faith that seem impossible, but
like you said that that that critical one day of
decades happening right then and there as they take that
(08:59):
step of faith. I think you picked up what I
put down there.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Yeah, yep, yep, I think, uh, you know, the first
thing I would say is that faith is taking the
first step before God reveals the second step. So a
lot of us want the 25 year plan, or, or like,
we wish that the Lord's prayer was give us this.
Week, our weekly bread or give us this month or
(09:24):
monthly bread, uh, so that we don't have to depend
on God on a daily basis. But the reality is, uh,
the faith walk is a daily walk, you know, this
is the day that the Lord has made. I'll rejoice
and be glad in it. um, and, uh, every single
day you've got to make.
(09:44):
Uh, decisions to point your life, uh, towards the cross and,
and live out of that empty tomb. Um, so, I,
I think, uh, you know, as it relates to in
a pit with a lion on a snowy day. Most
of us, Mike, when we see a 500 pound lion,
(10:05):
We're running the other direction as far and as fast
as we can. We tend to run away from the
things that we're afraid of. But I, I think you,
you can't let fear dictate your decisions. You have to
let faith dictate your decisions. And so I, I would
challenge people to, uh, chase the lion to run after
(10:26):
those 500 pound dreams. Go after a dream that's destined
to fail without divine intervention and by definition.
A God-sized dream is gonna be beyond your ability, beyond
your resources, beyond your education. Uh, the good news is
God doesn't just call the qualified, he qualifies to call. And, uh,
(10:47):
and so really at the end of the day, it's
about
The fact that we're God's workmanship created in Christ Jesus
to do good works prepared for us in advance. So here,
here's the deal. God is setting you up all the
days of your life were ordained by Him.
But you just need the faith um to uh pick,
(11:09):
pick your metaphor to get out of the boat. Uh,
if you wanna walk on water, you gotta get out
of the boat or to step into the river. If
you want God to part the Jordan River, you gotta
take a step into it. So I think it's that
first step of faith, Mike, that is, is really the,
the critical piece, and I would say this the, the.
(11:30):
The earlier you do it, the younger you are that
you take those steps of faith. God has a way
of compounding that interest and uh it'll, it'll pay eternal dividends.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Amen. Um, you know, I, I think of, uh, you know,
the God, the God idea versus a good idea. You,
you said somewhere in one of your books, one good idea.
I don't know, blows a dozen goods, you say it.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
Yeah,
Speaker 1 (11:56):
I'd
Speaker 2 (11:56):
rather, I'd rather have one God idea than 1000 good ideas.
There it is. Good my good ideas are good, but
they don't change the course of history. Uh, God ideas
are what changes the game, and it's not always easy
to discern between.
a good idea and a God idea or even a
(12:16):
bad idea sometimes no one bats 1000 but at the
end of the day, I, I wanna make sure I'm
living a spirit-led life.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
Yeah. Better to have tried and failed than to never
have tried at all. Like really briefly, because you're the
dad of 3 kids, uh, one is, I think.
Late twenties, fresh college graduate slash married slash had a baby,
and now you're a grandpa, praise the Lord. And you
got your last one Joiah, he's, he's in college at
(12:47):
that college age. So you've raised teenagers, uh, you're a
parent and now a grandparent. What would, how would you
encourage
encourage parents right now. I don't know what things we're
talking about, just, just a word of encouragement for parents
that maybe they were like, what is my child listen
to and they're listening to this podcast and like, oh,
this is good. And what would you say parents? And
or to teenagers that are listening, college students that are listening,
that may help them understanding their parents better. I'm just
(13:10):
gonna throw that out there. Hopefully that was a softball
lob and you can hit it.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Yeah, well, the 1st, 1st thing I would say is
that there are no perfect parents, and there are no
perfect kids either. The, the truth is, um, you know,
I know, unbelievable, Mike, um, but I, I, I think.
I would say this prayer, I think can turn parents
into prophets who shape the destiny of their kids. And
(13:37):
so I, I, I wanna make sure I'm praying for
my kids. And by the way, the mistakes that we
make as parents are also double as some of the
greatest opportunities because how are kids gonna learn how to
say sorry if it's.
It's not modeled for them by their parents. And so there,
there's something about just the humility as a parent that, hey,
(14:01):
I don't have this figured out and, and the truth
is you never stop parenting. So even with three kids
in their twenties, we're, we're still trying to figure out
how to parent our, our kids. So, um, you know, everybody.
Everybody is born into somebody else's story and so we're
born into a family of origin and it's, it's not perfect, um,
(14:27):
you know, some, some are pretty Christ-centered, God-honoring, Bible believing, and,
and that's wonderful. But at the end of the day, um,
God has children, not grandchildren, so all of us need
to make that decision.
Uh, to as many as have received him, then he
gave the power to become children of God. So all
(14:49):
I can do is make sure that, that I'm doing
my best to love my family, to be a good husband,
a good father, and, uh, the good news is where
we fall short, there's a heavenly Father who compensates for
our shortcomings. And so I, I'm grateful for
that.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
And you have a book, Praying Circles Around Your Children, right?
That's one of your, uh, uh, circle maker. Yeah, sure,
sure do,
yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Yep, and I, and I think, um, just in, in
very simple form. I've prayed Luke 252 thousands of times
for my kids. May you grow in wisdom and stature
and in favor with God and with man. And so
it's just about the consistency of praying, loving, servant.
And, and I'll say one more thing for me, success, uh,
(15:37):
doesn't have anything to do with books I write or
the church I get the joy of pastoring. Success is
when those who know me best respect me most. I,
I'm not gonna be a perfect person, but
I at least want to be the same person in
public as I am in private, and uh I wanna,
I wanna live with a certain authenticity that uh my
(16:00):
kids and my wife um know that uh
as imperfect as I am, it's authentic, and, uh, I'm
doing my best to, to live according to the convictions
that God's given
me.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Amen. Well, I can attest to having known you for
26 years, um, having been in your house multiple times,
thanks for that, by the way, that was cool. I
always love cleaning your house. Teach me how to play cornhole, um,
that's mentorship right there. Uh, on the West Coast, I
dominate when I play you though, I, I I.
I still, I still get beat. But that's it. Yeah. Um,
(16:36):
it's legit. I wanna, you know, for students or parents,
whoever's listening, I just want to say, uh, Pastor Mark
Batterson is somebody you can trust. Uh, none of us
are perfect, but somebody you can trust in terms of
his writings, his, his pastoring and, and his leadership in
the church. And, uh, thankful for that, Pastor Mark. Um,
one more thing, or, uh, well, maybe 1.5 more things here. Um.
(16:57):
So you just wrote a book, uh, which I'm still, uh,
getting into, but a Million Little Miracles. And, um, right,
I got that title right. Yeah, you got it. Uh,
and it's just your, it's your latest book, and I,
I wanted to point it out because of the fact
of what it hits on. I think going back to
that idea of revival, which I talked to Ross John.
And a couple of episodes ago, and he, he's like
(17:19):
on the streets leading like revivals, um, with students. I
love what he's doing. And, and so this book kind
of hits on that, that, that miracles are among us
every day, but also in small ways, but also big ones.
So can you just touch on that a little bit
how you see that playing out and
Um, yeah, uh, yeah,
Speaker 2 (17:37):
let's have a little bit of fun with that. Go
for it. You know, I, I, I've met people who say, I,
I've never experienced a miracle. Uh, with all due respect,
you have never not, in fact, you are one. I mean,
come on, right now we're on a planet that's spinning
at 1000 miles an hour, speeding through space at 67,000 MPH,
(17:59):
and so even on a day you didn't get much done,
you did travel 1.6 million miles through space.
Uh, you know, and, and Mike, I don't know anybody
Speaker 1 (18:08):
that, no, he just came up with that, guys, by
the way, he just has that up
here.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Mike, I don't know anybody who at the end of
the day says, Lord, thanks for keeping us in orbit.
We just don't pray that way, but we, we already
trust God for the big things. I think now we
gotta trust Him for the little things. And so I,
I would also note that about 37 sextilian biochemical reactions
happening in the human body at any given moment. I didn't.
(18:35):
Flip a switch this morning. Um, heart will pump 100,000
times today, pump 6 quarts of blood through 60,000 miles
of veins, arteries, and capillaries, 30 trillion red blood cells,
each with 260 million hemoglobin that deliver oxygen to the cells,
and you don't even have to change the batteries. You,
your body will recycle 330 billion cells today. You're 1%
(19:00):
different today than you were yesterday. And Mike, to all
of that, I would say if that
That's not miraculous. I don't know what is. And so
I believe in the miracles that defy the laws of
physics that defy a doctor's diagnosis. I've experienced those miracles.
Can you talk a little
Speaker 1 (19:19):
bit about that one, your big one, yeah, I don't know, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2 (19:22):
yeah, because you were there, um, yep, yeah, um, I,
I had severe asthma for 40 years, and, uh, July 2nd, 2016,
I prayed a bold prayer. We were in a series
called Mountains Move.
And I, I knelt next to the altar. Look at that. And, uh, and,
and I just said, Lord, I know you can heal. I've,
(19:45):
I've asked you hundreds of times, but I'm gonna ask again.
Would you heal these lungs? Uh, Mike, there were 40
days and 40 years that I didn't take multiple puffs
of a rescue inhaler. Uh, ICU unit, um, probably added
up 3 months over my lifetime. Uh, I was code
blue at 13. I thought I was taking my last breath.
(20:07):
Uh, never went anywhere without an inhaler, played basketball with
an inhaler in my sock, slept with an inhaler under
my pillow, but I'm here to tell you today that
I have not touched an inhaler from July 2, 2016
to today. Actually went out and ran the Chicago marathon
to celebrate that miracle. And so I believe in, in
(20:32):
a God who can heal.
But I also wanna say in the same breath, pun intended,
that every single breath is a miracle in him we
live and move and have our being. So, this is
really a book about recapturing uh the miracle that we
call life.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
So good. Past Mark, there's so many more things we
can talk about, but I think I'd be remiss if
I didn't ask you in light of your, like you're
posted there in the nation's capital. There's a whole bunch
of things going on there all the time.
Especially right now, I'm not gonna get into it. And
yet here you are pastoring faithfully, gradually and letting God
doing things suddenly, which I've seen both and out there.
(21:13):
Uh, I don't know if you could just maybe offer
a word of encouragement to students, uh, people listening, uh,
people throughout the nation. I'm praying that this podcast will
reach obviously everybody everywhere, um, but that, yeah, if you
could just speak one final word of encouragement, wrap it
up in a bow and then maybe pray a prayer
blessing on this season that you sense we are all
(21:37):
in together.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Yeah, absolutely. Well, uh, you know, we both share a
love for Washington DC Heymen. Love that. And,
Speaker 1 (21:50):
and I, I today, where am I now,
Speaker 2 (21:51):
yeah, there you go. Look at that. Resent, um.
Yeah, Lord, raise up Daniel's and Deborahs, Esther and Nehemiah's, uh, people,
people that have the courage to enter public service, and
so I'm very much, uh, of the school of thought
like we, we need people who are.
(22:12):
Courageous enough to uh throw their hat in the ring
and uh we need as many people of, of faith, um,
in this arena as possible. Having said that, I do
want to say this, there's a hill higher than Capitol Hill,
and it's a hill called Calvary. Uh, it, it, it's, um.
(22:33):
That, that is where our sin was forgiven. Come on,
the cursive.
Of sin was broken and uh my sin is nailed
to that cross. So that that's where we pin our
hopes and administrations come and go. We've pastored long enough
here that we've seen 7 presidential election cycles and guess what,
(22:56):
every 4 years it's gonna happen. Administrations come and go,
but the kingdom is forever. And so we're, we're aiming.
At his kingdom. Let your kingdom come. Your will be
done on earth as it is in heaven. And so Lord,
right now I pray for everyone listening that God, you
would plant hope in our hearts, that, that we would
(23:20):
operate out of faith, hope, and love, that God, you
would help us stand in the gap as peacemakers, grace givers,
truth tellers, tone setters. Lord, help us be.
The hands and feet of Jesus and, uh, and Lord,
at the end of the day, we'll cast our crowns
(23:40):
before your throne. Uh, all we want is to live
for the applause of nail scarred hands, and so we
bless you today. And Lord, I pray that you would
reveal yourself in a new way, in a more powerful
way to each person listening in Jesus' name. Amen.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
I hope you are as encouraged as I am.
To go chase some lions and to overcome your fears
with faith like Pastor Mark shared with us, all while
seeking to be a part of God's plan and movement
forward in your generation so that we can see His
kingdom advance in whatever we do. Whether you become a
New York Times bestselling author like Pastor Mark, or you
(24:20):
simply day to day follow Jesus faithfully, I hope you'll
take to heart what Pastor Mark shared. And as a reminder,
if you want to read any of his books, you
can go to Mark Batterson.com.
Uh, and just a little snippets of my favorites. My, my,
my most favorite of his books are In a Pit
with a Lion on a Snowy Day. That title's crazy
long but so cool. Trust me, you want to read it.
(24:43):
Second one is Circle Maker. It's about prayer and revival.
And then the third one is Win the Day. It's
about leadership and overcoming the odds, and last but not least,
book called Please sorry thanks. Nothing profound, just words we
should say every day to one another.
So again, thanks for joining us on the Kingdom and
Culture podcast, we will see you next time.
Have you ever wondered how to simply trust God? Maybe
how to get out of your spiritual rut or desert?
I've been there recently and in today's episode of the
Kingdom and Culture podcast, Dr. Mark Patterson, a New York
Times bestselling author, also a pastor.
And a nationally renowned speaker is going to share with
(00:22):
us some key components on how to overcome the odds.
I don't know about you, but I, I want to overcome.
I don't want to sit back and be overcome, rather,
I want to be an overcomer. Like the Bible says
that we are more than conquerors in Christ. And so
Pastor Mark brings to the table today.
(00:44):
A practical and inspirational way for us to live our
lives on the daily in our culture with his lifelong
advice and what he's learned being a New York Times
bestselling author and speaker. So I hope you're ready and
buckle up because Patterson's in the house or rather on
(01:06):
the podcast, you know what I mean? Let's get ready.
I'm your host, Mike Whitford, and today we have a
friend of mine, pastor of mine, a guy that's honestly
(01:29):
spoken in my life for the past 26 years. And
so he's he's a special guy for me to have
on here. Um, and if you know who he is, uh, well,
I'm going to introduce him because we're about to find out. Uh,
his name is Mark Patterson. He, um, is a pastor
in Washington DC, has been pastoring out there since 1996.
(01:51):
Um, when I worked out there on Capitol Hill, he
was my pastor, and then I had a chance to
join him for a few years on Capitol Hill, uh,
being a campus pastor, part of National Community Church. That
is where he is the lead pastor, uh, National.cc.
So, um, moving things out there. And he's the author
of a few books, uh, The Circle Maker, which is
(02:11):
a New York Times bestselling book. Uh, one of my favorites,
in a pit with the Lion on a Snowy Day.
That's a mouthful, but one of the coolest book titles
I've ever heard, because it is totally accurate to, uh,
the storyline that uh Paschmart brings out. So you might
hear a little bit about that as we go along,
but
He, he's, uh, got 3 kids, married to his wonderful wife, Laura.
She's awesome, and just doing the work of God out
(02:33):
on the East Coast and wherever God leads him. So
without further ado, I wanna just, uh, say thanks for
being here, Pastor Mark. And, uh, I'm talking with my
hands here, hitting things, but, uh, thanks for, uh, being
part of things. So, anything else you wanna add, just
say hi.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Mike, good to be with you. And, uh, you know, I'm,
I'm in DC.
You're in LA and uh we're both believing for the
same thing that uh we want to see his kingdom come,
his will be done, and so we have had the
joy of pastoring National Community Church 29 years uh right
(03:10):
here in the nation's capital and, uh, seen some pretty
incredible miracles and, uh, just a joy to be on
with you and to have a conversation. Yeah,
Speaker 1 (03:21):
cool.
Well, and like you said, you've been out there for
29 years, uh, digging, honestly, wells of revival. Even before
revival was like a cool thing again, uh, you guys
were doing the work out in our nation's capital, like
you said.
Um, but speaking of revival, uh, when I was out
there back in January, I noticed, uh, a few of
your students at NCC because, I mean, that's what this
(03:44):
podcast is for. I hope students are listening, high school
and college and anybody else, um, but they're at their
winter escape, and God did some amazing things at that.
But one of the things that struck me is when
I was out there for your revival services in January, um,
I saw students flooding the altar each night.
I don't know. Could you tell us a little bit
about what, I mean, students out in the East Coast
(04:05):
are not much different than students on the West Coast.
They're students and they're just hungry for God. I don't know,
from your perspective as the lead pastor of NCC, what
do you see in God doing, not just in students,
but their families and the church at large and with
regards to just spiritual revival?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Yeah. Well, the reality is that like, most of us,
if we grew up going to church, we went, most
of us because our parents took us. But at, at
some point, you've got to find faith with your fingerprint
on it. It has to own you, you have to
own it.
And uh I'm telling you that, the younger you do that, uh,
(04:44):
the more opportunity there's gonna be for God to use
you and to bless you. And so, I, I'm thrilled
that we've got teenagers who are not seeking God's 2nd, 3rd,
or 10th.
They're seeking God first, and I, I think when you
begin to do that in your teen years, it lays
(05:05):
a foundation for whatever God wants to do. Um, I
might even get in our business just a little bit
and make an observation, Mike. I, I think a lot
of people, and I would have said this at 19,
at 19, I would have said I was following Jesus,
but the reality is I had invited Jesus to follow me.
(05:27):
And that's a whole different deal. Uh, most of us
have an inverted relationship with God. It's more about God
serving our purposes than us serving his, but I had
one of those all-in moments at 19. Uh, I was
at the University of Chicago on a full ride scholarship, and,
and I asked God a dangerous question. What do you
(05:48):
want me to do with my life? But Mike, the
only thing more dangerous than asking that question is not asking.
That question, and it was a moment for me where
I felt like God was calling me into full-time ministry.
I ended up giving up a full ride scholarship, transferring
to a Bible college about that and uh just started
(06:09):
pursuing God's plans and purposes for my life. And so
at some point you gotta make some defined.
decisions, you know, there, there are decades when nothing happens,
but there are days when decades happen, and, um, that
might be for some young people who are
Speaker 1 (06:26):
listening right now in your earthquake when you said that,
say that again, do that again,
Speaker 2 (06:31):
yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1 (06:32):
yeah, you know Pastor Mark, he's got these amazing, I
don't know, battersonisms where he just takes truth and just
condenses it into one little.
Laser. So say that again to the decades and the days.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah, there are decades when nothing happens, but there are
days when decades happen, and, and it usually, here's the
good news, you're one decision away from a totally different life. So,
but you have to make hard decisions, good decisions.
And uh sometimes it may seem like you're making a
decision not in your self-interest, but it's something that, that
(07:08):
you believe honors God, and God has a way of
honoring those decisions. And so, um, just a, a little
bit of a challenge there to make sure that uh
Man, I'll tell you what, I, I don't want anything
besides the good, pleasing and perfect will of God. That,
that's where I wanna live my life and, uh, and I,
(07:28):
I think that's what God has called each one of
us too.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
So I'm going to make an observation uh for those
that are maybe just hearing this on audio and any
on video, but behind you, you have a whole bunch
of books, most of which you have read, because you
pump out, you pump out a lot of books you write,
but you read even more. Uh, and you can talk
about that if you want to. But in light of that,
and what you just talked about taking steps of faith,
(07:54):
a book that was instrumental even in my taking a
step of faith from youth ministry into
Going and ministering with you in Washington DC in 2010
was in a pit with a lion on a snowy day.
That book just in the most positive way, rocked me
to have that courage, not basically to turn the table
on myself where, you know, nobody in their right mind
(08:15):
is going to tackle a lion on a sunny day,
let alone chase the lion into a pit on a
snowy day, which your, your book pulls out an actual
event in scripture, one of David's mighty men.
But in light of that, and, and I kind of
just gave the punch line there, but in light of
that and the circle maker and a book on prayer
and revival and all, what would you say for you
(08:37):
were the critical moments of what led you on your
faith journey from the age of 19 till now, and
just anything else you want to add in that context
and how
Students that are listening right now, what they can do
to take those steps of faith that seem impossible, but
like you said that that that critical one day of
decades happening right then and there as they take that
(08:59):
step of faith. I think you picked up what I
put down there.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Yeah, yep, yep, I think, uh, you know, the first
thing I would say is that faith is taking the
first step before God reveals the second step. So a
lot of us want the 25 year plan, or, or like,
we wish that the Lord's prayer was give us this.
Week, our weekly bread or give us this month or
(09:24):
monthly bread, uh, so that we don't have to depend
on God on a daily basis. But the reality is, uh,
the faith walk is a daily walk, you know, this
is the day that the Lord has made. I'll rejoice
and be glad in it. um, and, uh, every single
day you've got to make.
(09:44):
Uh, decisions to point your life, uh, towards the cross and,
and live out of that empty tomb. Um, so, I,
I think, uh, you know, as it relates to in
a pit with a lion on a snowy day. Most
of us, Mike, when we see a 500 pound lion,
(10:05):
We're running the other direction as far and as fast
as we can. We tend to run away from the
things that we're afraid of. But I, I think you,
you can't let fear dictate your decisions. You have to
let faith dictate your decisions. And so I, I would
challenge people to, uh, chase the lion to run after
(10:26):
those 500 pound dreams. Go after a dream that's destined
to fail without divine intervention and by definition.
A God-sized dream is gonna be beyond your ability, beyond
your resources, beyond your education. Uh, the good news is
God doesn't just call the qualified, he qualifies to call. And, uh,
(10:47):
and so really at the end of the day, it's
about
The fact that we're God's workmanship created in Christ Jesus
to do good works prepared for us in advance. So here,
here's the deal. God is setting you up all the
days of your life were ordained by Him.
But you just need the faith um to uh pick,
(11:09):
pick your metaphor to get out of the boat. Uh,
if you wanna walk on water, you gotta get out
of the boat or to step into the river. If
you want God to part the Jordan River, you gotta
take a step into it. So I think it's that
first step of faith, Mike, that is, is really the,
the critical piece, and I would say this the, the.
(11:30):
The earlier you do it, the younger you are that
you take those steps of faith. God has a way
of compounding that interest and uh it'll, it'll pay eternal dividends.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Amen. Um, you know, I, I think of, uh, you know,
the God, the God idea versus a good idea. You,
you said somewhere in one of your books, one good idea.
I don't know, blows a dozen goods, you say it.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
Yeah,
Speaker 1 (11:56):
I'd
Speaker 2 (11:56):
rather, I'd rather have one God idea than 1000 good ideas.
There it is. Good my good ideas are good, but
they don't change the course of history. Uh, God ideas
are what changes the game, and it's not always easy
to discern between.
a good idea and a God idea or even a
(12:16):
bad idea sometimes no one bats 1000 but at the
end of the day, I, I wanna make sure I'm
living a spirit-led life.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
Yeah. Better to have tried and failed than to never
have tried at all. Like really briefly, because you're the
dad of 3 kids, uh, one is, I think.
Late twenties, fresh college graduate slash married slash had a baby,
and now you're a grandpa, praise the Lord. And you
got your last one Joiah, he's, he's in college at
(12:47):
that college age. So you've raised teenagers, uh, you're a
parent and now a grandparent. What would, how would you
encourage
encourage parents right now. I don't know what things we're
talking about, just, just a word of encouragement for parents
that maybe they were like, what is my child listen
to and they're listening to this podcast and like, oh,
this is good. And what would you say parents? And
or to teenagers that are listening, college students that are listening,
that may help them understanding their parents better. I'm just
(13:10):
gonna throw that out there. Hopefully that was a softball
lob and you can hit it.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Yeah, well, the 1st, 1st thing I would say is
that there are no perfect parents, and there are no
perfect kids either. The, the truth is, um, you know,
I know, unbelievable, Mike, um, but I, I, I think.
I would say this prayer, I think can turn parents
into prophets who shape the destiny of their kids. And
(13:37):
so I, I, I wanna make sure I'm praying for
my kids. And by the way, the mistakes that we
make as parents are also double as some of the
greatest opportunities because how are kids gonna learn how to
say sorry if it's.
It's not modeled for them by their parents. And so there,
there's something about just the humility as a parent that, hey,
(14:01):
I don't have this figured out and, and the truth
is you never stop parenting. So even with three kids
in their twenties, we're, we're still trying to figure out
how to parent our, our kids. So, um, you know, everybody.
Everybody is born into somebody else's story and so we're
born into a family of origin and it's, it's not perfect, um,
(14:27):
you know, some, some are pretty Christ-centered, God-honoring, Bible believing, and,
and that's wonderful. But at the end of the day, um,
God has children, not grandchildren, so all of us need
to make that decision.
Uh, to as many as have received him, then he
gave the power to become children of God. So all
(14:49):
I can do is make sure that, that I'm doing
my best to love my family, to be a good husband,
a good father, and, uh, the good news is where
we fall short, there's a heavenly Father who compensates for
our shortcomings. And so I, I'm grateful for
that.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
And you have a book, Praying Circles Around Your Children, right?
That's one of your, uh, uh, circle maker. Yeah, sure,
sure do,
yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Yep, and I, and I think, um, just in, in
very simple form. I've prayed Luke 252 thousands of times
for my kids. May you grow in wisdom and stature
and in favor with God and with man. And so
it's just about the consistency of praying, loving, servant.
And, and I'll say one more thing for me, success, uh,
(15:37):
doesn't have anything to do with books I write or
the church I get the joy of pastoring. Success is
when those who know me best respect me most. I,
I'm not gonna be a perfect person, but
I at least want to be the same person in
public as I am in private, and uh I wanna,
I wanna live with a certain authenticity that uh my
(16:00):
kids and my wife um know that uh
as imperfect as I am, it's authentic, and, uh, I'm
doing my best to, to live according to the convictions
that God's given
me.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Amen. Well, I can attest to having known you for
26 years, um, having been in your house multiple times,
thanks for that, by the way, that was cool. I
always love cleaning your house. Teach me how to play cornhole, um,
that's mentorship right there. Uh, on the West Coast, I
dominate when I play you though, I, I I.
I still, I still get beat. But that's it. Yeah. Um,
(16:36):
it's legit. I wanna, you know, for students or parents,
whoever's listening, I just want to say, uh, Pastor Mark
Batterson is somebody you can trust. Uh, none of us
are perfect, but somebody you can trust in terms of
his writings, his, his pastoring and, and his leadership in
the church. And, uh, thankful for that, Pastor Mark. Um,
one more thing, or, uh, well, maybe 1.5 more things here. Um.
(16:57):
So you just wrote a book, uh, which I'm still, uh,
getting into, but a Million Little Miracles. And, um, right,
I got that title right. Yeah, you got it. Uh,
and it's just your, it's your latest book, and I,
I wanted to point it out because of the fact
of what it hits on. I think going back to
that idea of revival, which I talked to Ross John.
And a couple of episodes ago, and he, he's like
(17:19):
on the streets leading like revivals, um, with students. I
love what he's doing. And, and so this book kind
of hits on that, that, that miracles are among us
every day, but also in small ways, but also big ones.
So can you just touch on that a little bit
how you see that playing out and
Um, yeah, uh, yeah,
Speaker 2 (17:37):
let's have a little bit of fun with that. Go
for it. You know, I, I, I've met people who say, I,
I've never experienced a miracle. Uh, with all due respect,
you have never not, in fact, you are one. I mean,
come on, right now we're on a planet that's spinning
at 1000 miles an hour, speeding through space at 67,000 MPH,
(17:59):
and so even on a day you didn't get much done,
you did travel 1.6 million miles through space.
Uh, you know, and, and Mike, I don't know anybody
Speaker 1 (18:08):
that, no, he just came up with that, guys, by
the way, he just has that up
here.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Mike, I don't know anybody who at the end of
the day says, Lord, thanks for keeping us in orbit.
We just don't pray that way, but we, we already
trust God for the big things. I think now we
gotta trust Him for the little things. And so I,
I would also note that about 37 sextilian biochemical reactions
happening in the human body at any given moment. I didn't.
(18:35):
Flip a switch this morning. Um, heart will pump 100,000
times today, pump 6 quarts of blood through 60,000 miles
of veins, arteries, and capillaries, 30 trillion red blood cells,
each with 260 million hemoglobin that deliver oxygen to the cells,
and you don't even have to change the batteries. You,
your body will recycle 330 billion cells today. You're 1%
(19:00):
different today than you were yesterday. And Mike, to all
of that, I would say if that
That's not miraculous. I don't know what is. And so
I believe in the miracles that defy the laws of
physics that defy a doctor's diagnosis. I've experienced those miracles.
Can you talk a little
Speaker 1 (19:19):
bit about that one, your big one, yeah, I don't know, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2 (19:22):
yeah, because you were there, um, yep, yeah, um, I,
I had severe asthma for 40 years, and, uh, July 2nd, 2016,
I prayed a bold prayer. We were in a series
called Mountains Move.
And I, I knelt next to the altar. Look at that. And, uh, and,
and I just said, Lord, I know you can heal. I've,
(19:45):
I've asked you hundreds of times, but I'm gonna ask again.
Would you heal these lungs? Uh, Mike, there were 40
days and 40 years that I didn't take multiple puffs
of a rescue inhaler. Uh, ICU unit, um, probably added
up 3 months over my lifetime. Uh, I was code
blue at 13. I thought I was taking my last breath.
(20:07):
Uh, never went anywhere without an inhaler, played basketball with
an inhaler in my sock, slept with an inhaler under
my pillow, but I'm here to tell you today that
I have not touched an inhaler from July 2, 2016
to today. Actually went out and ran the Chicago marathon
to celebrate that miracle. And so I believe in, in
(20:32):
a God who can heal.
But I also wanna say in the same breath, pun intended,
that every single breath is a miracle in him we
live and move and have our being. So, this is
really a book about recapturing uh the miracle that we
call life.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
So good. Past Mark, there's so many more things we
can talk about, but I think I'd be remiss if
I didn't ask you in light of your, like you're
posted there in the nation's capital. There's a whole bunch
of things going on there all the time.
Especially right now, I'm not gonna get into it. And
yet here you are pastoring faithfully, gradually and letting God
doing things suddenly, which I've seen both and out there.
(21:13):
Uh, I don't know if you could just maybe offer
a word of encouragement to students, uh, people listening, uh,
people throughout the nation. I'm praying that this podcast will
reach obviously everybody everywhere, um, but that, yeah, if you
could just speak one final word of encouragement, wrap it
up in a bow and then maybe pray a prayer
blessing on this season that you sense we are all
(21:37):
in together.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Yeah, absolutely. Well, uh, you know, we both share a
love for Washington DC Heymen. Love that. And,
Speaker 1 (21:50):
and I, I today, where am I now,
Speaker 2 (21:51):
yeah, there you go. Look at that. Resent, um.
Yeah, Lord, raise up Daniel's and Deborahs, Esther and Nehemiah's, uh, people,
people that have the courage to enter public service, and
so I'm very much, uh, of the school of thought
like we, we need people who are.
(22:12):
Courageous enough to uh throw their hat in the ring
and uh we need as many people of, of faith, um,
in this arena as possible. Having said that, I do
want to say this, there's a hill higher than Capitol Hill,
and it's a hill called Calvary. Uh, it, it, it's, um.
(22:33):
That, that is where our sin was forgiven. Come on,
the cursive.
Of sin was broken and uh my sin is nailed
to that cross. So that that's where we pin our
hopes and administrations come and go. We've pastored long enough
here that we've seen 7 presidential election cycles and guess what,
(22:56):
every 4 years it's gonna happen. Administrations come and go,
but the kingdom is forever. And so we're, we're aiming.
At his kingdom. Let your kingdom come. Your will be
done on earth as it is in heaven. And so Lord,
right now I pray for everyone listening that God, you
would plant hope in our hearts, that, that we would
(23:20):
operate out of faith, hope, and love, that God, you
would help us stand in the gap as peacemakers, grace givers,
truth tellers, tone setters. Lord, help us be.
The hands and feet of Jesus and, uh, and Lord,
at the end of the day, we'll cast our crowns
(23:40):
before your throne. Uh, all we want is to live
for the applause of nail scarred hands, and so we
bless you today. And Lord, I pray that you would
reveal yourself in a new way, in a more powerful
way to each person listening in Jesus' name. Amen.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
I hope you are as encouraged as I am.
To go chase some lions and to overcome your fears
with faith like Pastor Mark shared with us, all while
seeking to be a part of God's plan and movement
forward in your generation so that we can see His
kingdom advance in whatever we do. Whether you become a
New York Times bestselling author like Pastor Mark, or you
(24:20):
simply day to day follow Jesus faithfully, I hope you'll
take to heart what Pastor Mark shared. And as a reminder,
if you want to read any of his books, you
can go to Mark Batterson.com.
Uh, and just a little snippets of my favorites. My, my,
my most favorite of his books are In a Pit
with a Lion on a Snowy Day. That title's crazy
long but so cool. Trust me, you want to read it.
(24:43):
Second one is Circle Maker. It's about prayer and revival.
And then the third one is Win the Day. It's
about leadership and overcoming the odds, and last but not least,
book called Please sorry thanks. Nothing profound, just words we
should say every day to one another.
So again, thanks for joining us on the Kingdom and
Culture podcast, we will see you next time.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.