March 18, 2024 • 20 mins
This week, we’re all about becoming more resilient.
Pushing on towards our goals is great, but, as we all know, life can have a way of messing with even the best laid plans. Whether it’s failing an exam you worked hard for, having to drop out of athletic training due to an injury, or just generally feeling down on your luck, we’ve all experienced loss or failure in some form or another.
So this week, we sit down with entrepreneur Josh Wintersgill to dig into the topic of resilience. From tips for facing up to failure to an honest look at coping when we’re feeling low, we’re chatting strategies to keep us all going when the going gets tough.
This is On Your Marks. Because you’ll never know until you try.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Student 1 (00:01):
There's going to be definitely ups and downs, and at
times, I just wanted to burn all my books and
just stop the whole thing.
Student 2 (00:07):
It's very disappointing, especially when you hear about the failures.
Student 3 (00:11):
Sometimes you just need a good cry to let it
out. And then brush yourself off, stand back up and
keep going.
Krutika Adatia (00:18):
Hello, I'm Krutika Adatia and I'm a chartered accountant. I now support
accountancy students through their training. And as an educator, I'm
regularly up close and personal with some of the common
issues people face while studying for and sitting their accountancy exams.
So in this series for the ACCA, I'm chatting to
experts about strategies we can all use when facing some
(00:41):
of life's challenges. This week we're looking at keeping going
when the going gets tough. That's right. We're talking resilience.
How do we pick ourselves back up after a loss?
Why is it important to not let failure get us down?
And what strategies can help us all keep pushing forward?
This is On Your Marks. Because you'll never know until
(01:03):
you try. Getting going again after things haven't gone your way,
whether that's a failed exam or a disastrous first date,
can feel really difficult. I remember when I was in
my early 20s, I started learning how to drive. And
after failing my driving test, not once, not twice, and
I won't tell you how many times, my confidence was
rock bottom. It really got me down. Practically, it was
(01:25):
really frustrating, but also emotionally. Up until this point, I
had passed every exam I'd ever sat. I did manage
to persevere and eventually pass, but keeping myself going back
again and again was the real challenge. So to talk
about not giving up, today I've got Josh Wintersgill with me.
He's an entrepreneur, Great Britain's Young Entrepreneur of the Year
(01:45):
in 2019 in fact, and founder of able Move and
creator of the easyTravelseat. As a young entrepreneur, he's faced
his fair share of new business setbacks. So Josh, I'm
going to open with what I think is quite a
big question. Do you think you are resilient and what does being resilient mean
to you?
Josh Wintersgill (02:02):
Yes, is the answer. I'm definitely resilient. I think growing
up with a neuromuscular condition has taught me lots of
things in life, and one of the key things that
I always refer people to was a statement from my
nan growing up as a child, which was, " Put can't
in your pocket and pull out try." And it's a
mantra that stuck with me for my entire life. So
(02:23):
whenever I get into difficult situations, I always remind myself
that if there's something I can't do, I can. I've just
got to put can't in my pocket and pull out try.
Krutika Adatia (02:32):
I really love that saying. Can you tell us a
little bit more about your business, Able Move?
Josh Wintersgill (02:36):
Yeah. So Able Move was founded in 2018 off of
the back of some bad experiences traveling by air as
a wheelchair user. Growing up as a child, I could
kind of walk on and off an aircraft and as
I got older, I got heavier, less mobile, and it
got to the point where I was required to be
physically carried by my family from my wheelchair onto an
aircraft and then into the seat. And it got to the
(02:57):
point where my family could no longer do that, and
I was then relying on airport staff to actually physically
lift me from my chair into this tiny little chair
to then take me onto an aircraft and into an
aircraft seat. And that whole experience was rather traumatic. And
back in 2018, I was reading a wonderful book called
Start with Why by Simon Sinek. So any students that
(03:19):
haven't read it, I highly recommend reading it. And it
got me really thinking about why I was doing certain
things at that point in my life, both from a
personal point of view, but also from a professional point
of view. I realized that I couldn't necessarily answer my
why that clearly and easily, and that's when I started reflecting
on life and travel. And that's when I realized perhaps
(03:39):
maybe I can go down a different road and start
looking at improving the way other people with physical disabilities
access air travel. And that kind of sparked off the
whole idea of creating a sling that could be used
for people in wheelchairs to be lifted on and off
an aircraft.
Krutika Adatia (03:54):
I love that. I'm actually a big fan of Simon
Sinek myself. So you've spoken to us a little bit
about your purpose being driven by the challenges that you
faced with mobility. And I guess as a business owner,
you probably face challenges in everyday operations, everyday decisions you
make. So can you tell us a little bit about
some of what those setbacks might be?
Josh Wintersgill (04:14):
Gosh, there's loads. I mean, I remember when it was starting out,
it was kind of like, " My God, where do I
go for help? Where do I start?" And I remember
my lodgers that I was living with at the time,
they bought me a small handbook on starting out a
small business, and it got me thinking about all of
the things that I kind of think about in life
or what are the things that I value and started
writing them on paper. And then started tying that into
(04:35):
a business plan and a marketing strategy. And I'd managed
to find a template by The Prince's Trust on starting
out a business as an entrepreneur. And I remember reaching
out to Business West in the southwest of the UK
and they provided lots of support on intellectual property, sales,
financing, investment, IP, and it was a really great place
(04:58):
to start. That kind of got me on the right
tracks, but then I soon realized I didn't really have
much money to get a business going. I had at
the time maybe like 7 or £ 8, 000 in my
bank account. And a lot of that got swallowed up
on trying to put a patent in place, and IP
attorneys are actually very expensive, so my money got swallowed
up really quickly. And I was then thinking about, now
(05:20):
I need to try and get some investment, and all
of these things start going through your head and you
have to control your thought process and eat the elephant
in small chunks as it were. But I was very
lucky through some networking, I got told about an awards
program called the UK Disabled Entrepreneurs Award, which was founded
by Sir Stelios, the founder of EasyJet. And in partnership
(05:40):
with Leonard Cheshire, they every year run a UK Disabled
Entrepreneurs Awards program where individuals put forward their businesses in
hope that Stelios and the team at Leonard Cheshire had
taken an interest in it and they give out cash
grants to those business owners. And fortunately for me, I
got £ 30,000 that year that I could then use to
start my business. And this is a pun I suppose,
(06:03):
but I did land on my feet through those awards
and I got very lucky in the fact that because Sir
Stelios owned an airline and here I am with a
product that's benefiting passengers to access his airline, he took
quite an interest in that as well from a business
perspective. And he decided to actually invest £ 70,000 into my
company along with the £ 30,000 grant. So here I am
(06:24):
at the age of 25 with 100 grand, and I'm
like, I've now got the money to do everything that
I need to do. And I just got really lucky.
And I think the harder you work and the more
doors you knock, the luckier you seem to get. I
actually started manufacturing in 2019.
Krutika Adatia (06:41):
Wow, that sounds incredible. And congratulations on that journey and
getting that grant as well. That must've been an incredible feeling.
Josh Wintersgill (06:52):
It was. I remember coming out of ... I'll never forget. I came out of Sir Stelios' office and my
dad was outside and we just basically high- fived as
soon as we got out to the end of the
road. And I remember Stelios standing there and just watching me
and my dad walk off, and I think he was
pleased as punch really. And as were we.
Krutika Adatia (07:07):
You mentioned earlier that you had, was it 7, 000, £8,000? And at that
point you were trying to think, " Right, where am I
going to get the funds from?" I can only imagine
that when you are thinking about starting up your own business, there's
probably going to be moments where you just feel like
you want to give up. I mean, did you have
any of those moments? And what made you feel that
(07:27):
you could continue going? Talk to us a little bit about that.
Josh Wintersgill (07:30):
Yeah, I think at the beginning it was very much
adrenaline based. It all happened very, very quickly within the
space of about 12 to 18 months. And I think
the profile of the awards and the weight that that
carried got recognition in other areas. But actually the real
challenge for me started probably sort of towards the end
(07:51):
of 2019. So within the first, I think 8 or
9 months, I'd burnt nearly 50 or 60 grand in cash. I
was putting money into staff to kind of get sales
going and business development. I was committing money to stock,
and all I was doing was seeing ... You see 100
grand in your bank and you're like, " Holy crap, that's
a lot of money." You've never seen money like that
(08:12):
in your life. You never expect to have that sort
of money just sat in a bank. So to see
it going down and down and down and down, I
mean, I was up having sleepless nights thinking, " What am
I going to do? Oh my God, this is not
working. I'm selling, but I'm not selling enough. What can
I do more of?" And it was kind of like
you were kind of doubting yourself all the time. Is
this product actually any good? And I was just freaking
out. And then all of a sudden, sales started to
(08:34):
pick up sort of backend of 2019. We only did £
25,000 of revenue in the first year and with a
loss of nearly 50, 60K. That doesn't even touch the sides.
So basically COVID then came in 2020. So as sales
started picking up towards the backend of 2019, I thought, "
(08:55):
Bloody hell, 2020 is going to be a good year."
And then lo and behold, bang, the travel industry stops,
no sales coming through for six or seven months, and
somehow to this day, the company is still going.
Krutika Adatia (09:06):
And can I just take you back to that moment
when you mentioned that you had all this money leaving
your account? Can you take us back to the sort
of emotions you were feeling and what was the conversation
happening in your head to try and get you out of
the mind frame to keep persevering, to keep going?
Josh Wintersgill (09:21):
Yeah, it was really weird because I remember kind of
having conversations with a couple of people that I employed saying, "
Look, if we carry on at this rate, I'm not
going to be able to keep you around and I'm going to have
to let you go." And I'd only had them like,
what? Four to six months? And it was kind of
really scary. So in some respects, I probably hit the
ground a bit too soon with people and not focused
(09:42):
enough on the core product and trying to push it
myself. So I then had to start going, okay, well
clearly the projections of sales that I was expecting isn't
coming in and having to make those difficult decisions and
have conversations with people to say, " Look, I'm really sorry,
but I'm not on the projection that I thought we
were going to be on. And unfortunately, we're going to
have to let you go" kind of thing. So they're
(10:04):
just difficult conversations. And I think when you are 26, 27
and you've not been faced with those challenges before, and
it's not like I have a HR department to go
to and ask for support, you've just kind of got
to bite the bullet and do it. So there was a lot
of learning at the same time.
Krutika Adatia (10:19):
Earlier you mentioned that what motivates you is circling back
to your why, thinking about what is the purpose of
what you're doing, but really just if I was to
ask you what motivates you when you feel like things
aren't going your way?
Josh Wintersgill (10:32):
It is very much the why. It's reminding yourself of
the value that the product is aiming to achieve or
what you want your business to do for people. And
constantly reminding yourself if you believe in that and you
believe that it's having a positive impact on people's lives,
on those times where you're having your low days. And
bearing in mind, these low days, they don't just hang
(10:52):
around for a day, they can be over a sustained
period of time that it's so important that you remind
yourself of the why you are doing it and the
values and the impact. And if you just keep plugging
away day in and day out, eventually you'll come out
of that kind of divot or that hole that you are in.
It's hard. It's a hard slog and there's no easy
answer to it. Everyone will get to that point and
(11:14):
everyone will have to keep pushing through. I don't know
anyone that's ever had it plain sailing, to be fair.
Krutika Adatia (11:19):
Yeah, I think everyone always faces some sort of challenges,
and it's how you deal with those challenges and come
through it. So how do you know when it's the
right moment to keep pushing and keep going forward to
take a chance? When do you know it's the right
time to not?
Josh Wintersgill (11:35):
I always remind myself or try to remind myself, and
it's really hard to stick to it, but always go
with your instinct. Your gut generally leads you in the
right direction. I sometimes have a little bit of paranoia
creep in on stuff that I do, but I do
try and stick to that instinct. So to give you
an example, when COVID hit, I realized that one product
(11:59):
isn't just going to make a success of this company.
I'm going to need to add new products and I'm
going to need to change the way I sell it
and also what it does and how can I offer
something slightly different. And then I got thinking about some
of the other challenges that I had with getting in and out of a
swimming pool and my wheelchair cushion getting really wet. And
(12:19):
I remember one year my nan went down to a
market in Tenerife and she got ... This is top secret,
nobody knows this. But she got a blanket down at
the market for about four euros, and it was absolutely
huge. And she got a pair of scissors and she
cut it out into the shape of my wheelchair and
put it over my chair, and it stopped my wheelchair
cushion from getting wet. Anyway, I didn't think anything of
(12:41):
it until when COVID hit and I had all this
time to reflect on certain things. And I thought, well,
why don't I introduce a new product? Why don't we
create a waterproof wheelchair towel that will stop water from
getting through the wheelchair so when somebody gets out the
bath or the shower or the swimming pool, they can
have this product? And we created it and it's our
bestselling product now. So again, that was stemmed from just
(13:06):
going with my instinct and trying to use the bits
of cash that I had to get something to market
quite quickly and know that it was going to make
a difference for people.
Krutika Adatia (13:16):
That's great. And that's fabulous that you sought out opportunities
during COVID, which would've been a really tough time for
so many businesses.
Josh Wintersgill (13:24):
I just think you get presented with different challenges and
you can either face them and get on with it
or you can choose to ignore it. But if you
choose to ignore them, they generally come back round and
bite you. So yeah.
Krutika Adatia (13:36):
That's great. I love the attitude and the approach that you
have, Josh. And so would you say that your attitude
in business has actually been shaped by also your personal experiences?
Josh Wintersgill (13:47):
100%. It all stems back to my childhood really, and
how I was raised and that perspective and outlook on
life to always make sure that you don't give up.
I mean, don't get me wrong. There are times when
you do need to go, " Enough is enough and I'm
going to stop maybe investing money in this because something
isn't working or I'm going to stop this activity that
(14:07):
I'm doing because I'm just really not enjoying it." There
is something quite smart about saying enough is enough and
calling it a day. It's difficult because when you are
really passionate about something, it just kind of keeps you
going. But yeah, I think everything for me does stem
back from that kind of aspect of being resilient as
a child through the need to not give up with
(14:28):
my condition. Because if I stop exercising and I stop
doing things, that means that I will deteriorate in terms
of physical ability. So when you know that you're going
to deteriorate, if you don't exercise, you kind of have
to exercise. And growing up as a kid, I didn't
(14:48):
really enjoy exercise, but what my nan did was that
she made it fun. So we'd sing songs, we'd catch
a ball, and it would be like there would be
some sort of competitiveness to it as well. And all
of a sudden I was doing exercise without even realized that
I was doing exercise. So it's just tricks on the
mind, but it worked.
Krutika Adatia (15:07):
Well, your nan sounds like an incredible person, by the
way, Josh.
Josh Wintersgill (15:10):
She's a good egg. Yeah.
Krutika Adatia (15:12):
Brilliant. I just want to ask you one more question
actually. You mentioned that your resilience comes from your childhood.
I'm just thinking, is resilience something that you are born
with? Can it be cultivated?
Josh Wintersgill (15:22):
I think it's something that people learn. You'll have certain
things that happen in your life where everything could be all hunky-
dory, and then all of a sudden, you lose a
family member, you lose a partner, a marriage ends, you
have kids, you go in a different direction in life
and you go, "Oh my God, what am I doing here?" And
it's kind of like everyone gets to a stage in
their life where they have to go through something that's
(15:42):
difficult and that will naturally shape you as a person.
And I think it's how you then deal with that
afterwards that really then defines whether or not you're actually
resilient or not. And I just think it's hard for
some people because some people don't necessarily have a good
support network around them. So it's then even harder. If
you've got no one to lean on, it's where do
(16:03):
I turn to? Where do I go next? So I'm
not saying it's easy by any stretch, and I think
that you learn through experience, life experiences, I'd say.
Krutika Adatia (16:10):
And what about other areas of your life? Have you
had to deal with resilience there?
Josh Wintersgill (16:14):
Yeah, I mean, outside of kind of the business world,
I've done various things, but one of the things I'm
trying to do at the moment is become a Paralympian
in air rifle. So I am on the Great British
Pathway program at the moment, and shooting is one of
those sports where it's very isolating. It's you and a rifle
and you spend a lot of time in your own
head. So if you've got a busy, hectic life going
(16:37):
on outside, it's really difficult to stop that coming into
your head when you're looking down a rifle, trying to
shoot and stay still and as calm as possible. And
I picked up the sport probably back in 2000 and
I want to say 17, and I've gone through various
stages. So going back to this, having a plan and
having values and goals, I said to myself, " If I'm
(17:00):
going to start out on this journey to do shooting,
I want to get to the top." And that has
always been my focus. And so in my spare time,
I spend a lot of time training, traveling away from
home. And it can be very debilitating at times when
you're in cold ranges, you've got a lot going on
in your head, you don't want to be there, but
(17:21):
you know that you are capable of getting there and
you're good enough. And there's always a conflicting battle in
your head of, " Oh, I really should just stop doing
this, but I enjoy it. I know I can get
there." And then there's the financial issues of plowing loads
of money into going to training because it's not cheap,
and the cost of equipment is very expensive. And then
(17:42):
when you're on the range, you're thinking, " Oh, I've got
to do this for the business. I've got these other
opportunities." And you've got loads of things on in your head.
And so it sometimes can be very, very hard to
channel all of that. But that I did get to
a stage in my life a couple of years ago
where I wasn't living in my own place. I was
living with my nan, the business was really struggling, I
(18:04):
had lost a very good relationship or what I thought
was at the time, and it got me reflecting on
a lot. And I just wanted to stop shooting. I wanted
to stop the business. I was kind of struggling a
little bit with my mental health, well, quite a lot
actually. I was actually diagnosed with depression through COVID, which
I didn't realize, and it was a really tough time. So
all of these elements of not necessarily living independently, struggling
(18:28):
with the business, questioning whether or not I should keep
shooting, it was all very overwhelming. But it kind of
all ties back into this why piece of why am
I doing the shooting? Why did I set the business
up? I know I'm capable of being so much more.
And I think it's having that self- belief that you
are capable. And I suppose when we were talking about
(18:48):
these periods of long- term challenges or these long- term
downsides, it's just making sure that you keep turning up
for yourself every day. And it can be hard, but
if you do it, hopefully you get to the other
side. And I'd like to think I'm now at that
other side and hopefully based on what I'm seeing from
a financial point of view of the business and from
(19:09):
my scores and everything in training as well, I'm on
that upward trajectory now, which is quite exciting.
Krutika Adatia (19:14):
Thank you so much, Josh. And before we wrap up,
just want to end with three strategies that you can
give our listeners about becoming more resilient.
Josh Wintersgill (19:22):
Okay. Put can't in your pocket and pull out try
is one of them. Always make sure that you have
a plan because a plan is better than no plan.
And then I would say just make sure that you
go with your instinct and that whatever you choose to
do is something that you enjoy doing because if it
isn't, it's going to be a very, very uphill battle for you.
Krutika Adatia (19:41):
Brilliant. Thank you so much. That's it from this episode
of On Your Marks. Thank you Josh for talking with
me today. For more information about ACCA exams, you can
go to www. accaglobal.com/ exams. See you next time. I'm Krutika
Adatia and this is On Your Marks.
There's going to be definitely ups and downs, and at
times, I just wanted to burn all my books and
just stop the whole thing.
Student 2 (00:07):
It's very disappointing, especially when you hear about the failures.
Student 3 (00:11):
Sometimes you just need a good cry to let it
out. And then brush yourself off, stand back up and
keep going.
Krutika Adatia (00:18):
Hello, I'm Krutika Adatia and I'm a chartered accountant. I now support
accountancy students through their training. And as an educator, I'm
regularly up close and personal with some of the common
issues people face while studying for and sitting their accountancy exams.
So in this series for the ACCA, I'm chatting to
experts about strategies we can all use when facing some
(00:41):
of life's challenges. This week we're looking at keeping going
when the going gets tough. That's right. We're talking resilience.
How do we pick ourselves back up after a loss?
Why is it important to not let failure get us down?
And what strategies can help us all keep pushing forward?
This is On Your Marks. Because you'll never know until
(01:03):
you try. Getting going again after things haven't gone your way,
whether that's a failed exam or a disastrous first date,
can feel really difficult. I remember when I was in
my early 20s, I started learning how to drive. And
after failing my driving test, not once, not twice, and
I won't tell you how many times, my confidence was
rock bottom. It really got me down. Practically, it was
(01:25):
really frustrating, but also emotionally. Up until this point, I
had passed every exam I'd ever sat. I did manage
to persevere and eventually pass, but keeping myself going back
again and again was the real challenge. So to talk
about not giving up, today I've got Josh Wintersgill with me.
He's an entrepreneur, Great Britain's Young Entrepreneur of the Year
(01:45):
in 2019 in fact, and founder of able Move and
creator of the easyTravelseat. As a young entrepreneur, he's faced
his fair share of new business setbacks. So Josh, I'm
going to open with what I think is quite a
big question. Do you think you are resilient and what does being resilient mean
to you?
Josh Wintersgill (02:02):
Yes, is the answer. I'm definitely resilient. I think growing
up with a neuromuscular condition has taught me lots of
things in life, and one of the key things that
I always refer people to was a statement from my
nan growing up as a child, which was, " Put can't
in your pocket and pull out try." And it's a
mantra that stuck with me for my entire life. So
(02:23):
whenever I get into difficult situations, I always remind myself
that if there's something I can't do, I can. I've just
got to put can't in my pocket and pull out try.
Krutika Adatia (02:32):
I really love that saying. Can you tell us a
little bit more about your business, Able Move?
Josh Wintersgill (02:36):
Yeah. So Able Move was founded in 2018 off of
the back of some bad experiences traveling by air as
a wheelchair user. Growing up as a child, I could
kind of walk on and off an aircraft and as
I got older, I got heavier, less mobile, and it
got to the point where I was required to be
physically carried by my family from my wheelchair onto an
aircraft and then into the seat. And it got to the
(02:57):
point where my family could no longer do that, and
I was then relying on airport staff to actually physically
lift me from my chair into this tiny little chair
to then take me onto an aircraft and into an
aircraft seat. And that whole experience was rather traumatic. And
back in 2018, I was reading a wonderful book called
Start with Why by Simon Sinek. So any students that
(03:19):
haven't read it, I highly recommend reading it. And it
got me really thinking about why I was doing certain
things at that point in my life, both from a
personal point of view, but also from a professional point
of view. I realized that I couldn't necessarily answer my
why that clearly and easily, and that's when I started reflecting
on life and travel. And that's when I realized perhaps
(03:39):
maybe I can go down a different road and start
looking at improving the way other people with physical disabilities
access air travel. And that kind of sparked off the
whole idea of creating a sling that could be used
for people in wheelchairs to be lifted on and off
an aircraft.
Krutika Adatia (03:54):
I love that. I'm actually a big fan of Simon
Sinek myself. So you've spoken to us a little bit
about your purpose being driven by the challenges that you
faced with mobility. And I guess as a business owner,
you probably face challenges in everyday operations, everyday decisions you
make. So can you tell us a little bit about
some of what those setbacks might be?
Josh Wintersgill (04:14):
Gosh, there's loads. I mean, I remember when it was starting out,
it was kind of like, " My God, where do I
go for help? Where do I start?" And I remember
my lodgers that I was living with at the time,
they bought me a small handbook on starting out a
small business, and it got me thinking about all of
the things that I kind of think about in life
or what are the things that I value and started
writing them on paper. And then started tying that into
(04:35):
a business plan and a marketing strategy. And I'd managed
to find a template by The Prince's Trust on starting
out a business as an entrepreneur. And I remember reaching
out to Business West in the southwest of the UK
and they provided lots of support on intellectual property, sales,
financing, investment, IP, and it was a really great place
(04:58):
to start. That kind of got me on the right
tracks, but then I soon realized I didn't really have
much money to get a business going. I had at
the time maybe like 7 or £ 8, 000 in my
bank account. And a lot of that got swallowed up
on trying to put a patent in place, and IP
attorneys are actually very expensive, so my money got swallowed
up really quickly. And I was then thinking about, now
(05:20):
I need to try and get some investment, and all
of these things start going through your head and you
have to control your thought process and eat the elephant
in small chunks as it were. But I was very
lucky through some networking, I got told about an awards
program called the UK Disabled Entrepreneurs Award, which was founded
by Sir Stelios, the founder of EasyJet. And in partnership
(05:40):
with Leonard Cheshire, they every year run a UK Disabled
Entrepreneurs Awards program where individuals put forward their businesses in
hope that Stelios and the team at Leonard Cheshire had
taken an interest in it and they give out cash
grants to those business owners. And fortunately for me, I
got £ 30,000 that year that I could then use to
start my business. And this is a pun I suppose,
(06:03):
but I did land on my feet through those awards
and I got very lucky in the fact that because Sir
Stelios owned an airline and here I am with a
product that's benefiting passengers to access his airline, he took
quite an interest in that as well from a business
perspective. And he decided to actually invest £ 70,000 into my
company along with the £ 30,000 grant. So here I am
(06:24):
at the age of 25 with 100 grand, and I'm
like, I've now got the money to do everything that
I need to do. And I just got really lucky.
And I think the harder you work and the more
doors you knock, the luckier you seem to get. I
actually started manufacturing in 2019.
Krutika Adatia (06:41):
Wow, that sounds incredible. And congratulations on that journey and
getting that grant as well. That must've been an incredible feeling.
Josh Wintersgill (06:52):
It was. I remember coming out of ... I'll never forget. I came out of Sir Stelios' office and my
dad was outside and we just basically high- fived as
soon as we got out to the end of the
road. And I remember Stelios standing there and just watching me
and my dad walk off, and I think he was
pleased as punch really. And as were we.
Krutika Adatia (07:07):
You mentioned earlier that you had, was it 7, 000, £8,000? And at that
point you were trying to think, " Right, where am I
going to get the funds from?" I can only imagine
that when you are thinking about starting up your own business, there's
probably going to be moments where you just feel like
you want to give up. I mean, did you have
any of those moments? And what made you feel that
(07:27):
you could continue going? Talk to us a little bit about that.
Josh Wintersgill (07:30):
Yeah, I think at the beginning it was very much
adrenaline based. It all happened very, very quickly within the
space of about 12 to 18 months. And I think
the profile of the awards and the weight that that
carried got recognition in other areas. But actually the real
challenge for me started probably sort of towards the end
(07:51):
of 2019. So within the first, I think 8 or
9 months, I'd burnt nearly 50 or 60 grand in cash. I
was putting money into staff to kind of get sales
going and business development. I was committing money to stock,
and all I was doing was seeing ... You see 100
grand in your bank and you're like, " Holy crap, that's
a lot of money." You've never seen money like that
(08:12):
in your life. You never expect to have that sort
of money just sat in a bank. So to see
it going down and down and down and down, I
mean, I was up having sleepless nights thinking, " What am
I going to do? Oh my God, this is not
working. I'm selling, but I'm not selling enough. What can
I do more of?" And it was kind of like
you were kind of doubting yourself all the time. Is
this product actually any good? And I was just freaking
out. And then all of a sudden, sales started to
(08:34):
pick up sort of backend of 2019. We only did £
25,000 of revenue in the first year and with a
loss of nearly 50, 60K. That doesn't even touch the sides.
So basically COVID then came in 2020. So as sales
started picking up towards the backend of 2019, I thought, "
(08:55):
Bloody hell, 2020 is going to be a good year."
And then lo and behold, bang, the travel industry stops,
no sales coming through for six or seven months, and
somehow to this day, the company is still going.
Krutika Adatia (09:06):
And can I just take you back to that moment
when you mentioned that you had all this money leaving
your account? Can you take us back to the sort
of emotions you were feeling and what was the conversation
happening in your head to try and get you out of
the mind frame to keep persevering, to keep going?
Josh Wintersgill (09:21):
Yeah, it was really weird because I remember kind of
having conversations with a couple of people that I employed saying, "
Look, if we carry on at this rate, I'm not
going to be able to keep you around and I'm going to have
to let you go." And I'd only had them like,
what? Four to six months? And it was kind of
really scary. So in some respects, I probably hit the
ground a bit too soon with people and not focused
(09:42):
enough on the core product and trying to push it
myself. So I then had to start going, okay, well
clearly the projections of sales that I was expecting isn't
coming in and having to make those difficult decisions and
have conversations with people to say, " Look, I'm really sorry,
but I'm not on the projection that I thought we
were going to be on. And unfortunately, we're going to
have to let you go" kind of thing. So they're
(10:04):
just difficult conversations. And I think when you are 26, 27
and you've not been faced with those challenges before, and
it's not like I have a HR department to go
to and ask for support, you've just kind of got
to bite the bullet and do it. So there was a lot
of learning at the same time.
Krutika Adatia (10:19):
Earlier you mentioned that what motivates you is circling back
to your why, thinking about what is the purpose of
what you're doing, but really just if I was to
ask you what motivates you when you feel like things
aren't going your way?
Josh Wintersgill (10:32):
It is very much the why. It's reminding yourself of
the value that the product is aiming to achieve or
what you want your business to do for people. And
constantly reminding yourself if you believe in that and you
believe that it's having a positive impact on people's lives,
on those times where you're having your low days. And
bearing in mind, these low days, they don't just hang
(10:52):
around for a day, they can be over a sustained
period of time that it's so important that you remind
yourself of the why you are doing it and the
values and the impact. And if you just keep plugging
away day in and day out, eventually you'll come out
of that kind of divot or that hole that you are in.
It's hard. It's a hard slog and there's no easy
answer to it. Everyone will get to that point and
(11:14):
everyone will have to keep pushing through. I don't know
anyone that's ever had it plain sailing, to be fair.
Krutika Adatia (11:19):
Yeah, I think everyone always faces some sort of challenges,
and it's how you deal with those challenges and come
through it. So how do you know when it's the
right moment to keep pushing and keep going forward to
take a chance? When do you know it's the right
time to not?
Josh Wintersgill (11:35):
I always remind myself or try to remind myself, and
it's really hard to stick to it, but always go
with your instinct. Your gut generally leads you in the
right direction. I sometimes have a little bit of paranoia
creep in on stuff that I do, but I do
try and stick to that instinct. So to give you
an example, when COVID hit, I realized that one product
(11:59):
isn't just going to make a success of this company.
I'm going to need to add new products and I'm
going to need to change the way I sell it
and also what it does and how can I offer
something slightly different. And then I got thinking about some
of the other challenges that I had with getting in and out of a
swimming pool and my wheelchair cushion getting really wet. And
(12:19):
I remember one year my nan went down to a
market in Tenerife and she got ... This is top secret,
nobody knows this. But she got a blanket down at
the market for about four euros, and it was absolutely
huge. And she got a pair of scissors and she
cut it out into the shape of my wheelchair and
put it over my chair, and it stopped my wheelchair
cushion from getting wet. Anyway, I didn't think anything of
(12:41):
it until when COVID hit and I had all this
time to reflect on certain things. And I thought, well,
why don't I introduce a new product? Why don't we
create a waterproof wheelchair towel that will stop water from
getting through the wheelchair so when somebody gets out the
bath or the shower or the swimming pool, they can
have this product? And we created it and it's our
bestselling product now. So again, that was stemmed from just
(13:06):
going with my instinct and trying to use the bits
of cash that I had to get something to market
quite quickly and know that it was going to make
a difference for people.
Krutika Adatia (13:16):
That's great. And that's fabulous that you sought out opportunities
during COVID, which would've been a really tough time for
so many businesses.
Josh Wintersgill (13:24):
I just think you get presented with different challenges and
you can either face them and get on with it
or you can choose to ignore it. But if you
choose to ignore them, they generally come back round and
bite you. So yeah.
Krutika Adatia (13:36):
That's great. I love the attitude and the approach that you
have, Josh. And so would you say that your attitude
in business has actually been shaped by also your personal experiences?
Josh Wintersgill (13:47):
100%. It all stems back to my childhood really, and
how I was raised and that perspective and outlook on
life to always make sure that you don't give up.
I mean, don't get me wrong. There are times when
you do need to go, " Enough is enough and I'm
going to stop maybe investing money in this because something
isn't working or I'm going to stop this activity that
(14:07):
I'm doing because I'm just really not enjoying it." There
is something quite smart about saying enough is enough and
calling it a day. It's difficult because when you are
really passionate about something, it just kind of keeps you
going. But yeah, I think everything for me does stem
back from that kind of aspect of being resilient as
a child through the need to not give up with
(14:28):
my condition. Because if I stop exercising and I stop
doing things, that means that I will deteriorate in terms
of physical ability. So when you know that you're going
to deteriorate, if you don't exercise, you kind of have
to exercise. And growing up as a kid, I didn't
(14:48):
really enjoy exercise, but what my nan did was that
she made it fun. So we'd sing songs, we'd catch
a ball, and it would be like there would be
some sort of competitiveness to it as well. And all
of a sudden I was doing exercise without even realized that
I was doing exercise. So it's just tricks on the
mind, but it worked.
Krutika Adatia (15:07):
Well, your nan sounds like an incredible person, by the
way, Josh.
Josh Wintersgill (15:10):
She's a good egg. Yeah.
Krutika Adatia (15:12):
Brilliant. I just want to ask you one more question
actually. You mentioned that your resilience comes from your childhood.
I'm just thinking, is resilience something that you are born
with? Can it be cultivated?
Josh Wintersgill (15:22):
I think it's something that people learn. You'll have certain
things that happen in your life where everything could be all hunky-
dory, and then all of a sudden, you lose a
family member, you lose a partner, a marriage ends, you
have kids, you go in a different direction in life
and you go, "Oh my God, what am I doing here?" And
it's kind of like everyone gets to a stage in
their life where they have to go through something that's
(15:42):
difficult and that will naturally shape you as a person.
And I think it's how you then deal with that
afterwards that really then defines whether or not you're actually
resilient or not. And I just think it's hard for
some people because some people don't necessarily have a good
support network around them. So it's then even harder. If
you've got no one to lean on, it's where do
(16:03):
I turn to? Where do I go next? So I'm
not saying it's easy by any stretch, and I think
that you learn through experience, life experiences, I'd say.
Krutika Adatia (16:10):
And what about other areas of your life? Have you
had to deal with resilience there?
Josh Wintersgill (16:14):
Yeah, I mean, outside of kind of the business world,
I've done various things, but one of the things I'm
trying to do at the moment is become a Paralympian
in air rifle. So I am on the Great British
Pathway program at the moment, and shooting is one of
those sports where it's very isolating. It's you and a rifle
and you spend a lot of time in your own
head. So if you've got a busy, hectic life going
(16:37):
on outside, it's really difficult to stop that coming into
your head when you're looking down a rifle, trying to
shoot and stay still and as calm as possible. And
I picked up the sport probably back in 2000 and
I want to say 17, and I've gone through various
stages. So going back to this, having a plan and
having values and goals, I said to myself, " If I'm
(17:00):
going to start out on this journey to do shooting,
I want to get to the top." And that has
always been my focus. And so in my spare time,
I spend a lot of time training, traveling away from
home. And it can be very debilitating at times when
you're in cold ranges, you've got a lot going on
in your head, you don't want to be there, but
(17:21):
you know that you are capable of getting there and
you're good enough. And there's always a conflicting battle in
your head of, " Oh, I really should just stop doing
this, but I enjoy it. I know I can get
there." And then there's the financial issues of plowing loads
of money into going to training because it's not cheap,
and the cost of equipment is very expensive. And then
(17:42):
when you're on the range, you're thinking, " Oh, I've got
to do this for the business. I've got these other
opportunities." And you've got loads of things on in your head.
And so it sometimes can be very, very hard to
channel all of that. But that I did get to
a stage in my life a couple of years ago
where I wasn't living in my own place. I was
living with my nan, the business was really struggling, I
(18:04):
had lost a very good relationship or what I thought
was at the time, and it got me reflecting on
a lot. And I just wanted to stop shooting. I wanted
to stop the business. I was kind of struggling a
little bit with my mental health, well, quite a lot
actually. I was actually diagnosed with depression through COVID, which
I didn't realize, and it was a really tough time. So
all of these elements of not necessarily living independently, struggling
(18:28):
with the business, questioning whether or not I should keep
shooting, it was all very overwhelming. But it kind of
all ties back into this why piece of why am
I doing the shooting? Why did I set the business
up? I know I'm capable of being so much more.
And I think it's having that self- belief that you
are capable. And I suppose when we were talking about
(18:48):
these periods of long- term challenges or these long- term
downsides, it's just making sure that you keep turning up
for yourself every day. And it can be hard, but
if you do it, hopefully you get to the other
side. And I'd like to think I'm now at that
other side and hopefully based on what I'm seeing from
a financial point of view of the business and from
(19:09):
my scores and everything in training as well, I'm on
that upward trajectory now, which is quite exciting.
Krutika Adatia (19:14):
Thank you so much, Josh. And before we wrap up,
just want to end with three strategies that you can
give our listeners about becoming more resilient.
Josh Wintersgill (19:22):
Okay. Put can't in your pocket and pull out try
is one of them. Always make sure that you have
a plan because a plan is better than no plan.
And then I would say just make sure that you
go with your instinct and that whatever you choose to
do is something that you enjoy doing because if it
isn't, it's going to be a very, very uphill battle for you.
Krutika Adatia (19:41):
Brilliant. Thank you so much. That's it from this episode
of On Your Marks. Thank you Josh for talking with
me today. For more information about ACCA exams, you can
go to www. accaglobal.com/ exams. See you next time. I'm Krutika
Adatia and this is On Your Marks.
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