December 16, 2024 • 28 mins
Lizzie Eastham and Sam Rickard present Studio 1 - Vision Australia Radio’s weekly look at life from a low vision and blind point of view.
On this week’s show
“Born to Run”
With a new chapter of Achilles International opening in South Australia, Lizzie and Sam went down to see what it is all about, and we learned about Lizzie’s somewhat unorthodox running technique.
Studio 1 welcomes any input from our listeners. If you have any experience or thoughts about issues covered in this episode or believe there is something we should be talking about.
EMAIL: studio1@visionaustralia.org or leave comment on the station’s facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/VARadioNetwork
A special thank you to Kent Dredge Dennis Lorenzen from Blind Sports SA
You can learn more about Achilles, wherever you are, here: https://www.achillesaustralia.org.au/
Vision Australia gratefully acknowledges the support of the Community Broadcasting Foundation for Studio 1.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:05):
This is studio one on Vision Australia radio.
S2 (00:12):
Hello, I'm Sam.
S3 (00:14):
And I'm Lizzie, and this.
S2 (00:15):
Is Studio One, your weekly look at life from a
low vision and blind point of view. Here on Vision
Australia Radio.
S3 (00:20):
On this week's show, we are going running.
S2 (00:24):
South Australia is opening its own chapter of Achilles, a
group that trains and matches up guide runners to people
with a vision impairment who want to go running.
S3 (00:32):
Yes, and I even give it a go with.
S2 (00:34):
Some mixed results. As we always say at this point,
please do get in touch with the show. Whether you
have experience of any of the issues covered on this
week's episode of Studio One, or if you think there
is something we should be talking about. You never know.
Your story and insight may help somebody else who is
dealing with something similar.
S3 (00:50):
You can contact us via email at studio One at
Vision Australia. Org, that's studio number one at Vision australia.org.
Or perhaps you could drop us a note on our Facebook.
Just go to facebook.com slash VA Radio Network.
S4 (01:10):
Thank you, everyone, for coming today. Um, this is really
exciting for us because this is something that we've been
on our radar for a long time. I have a
number of jobs, and some of you may know me
in different, different roles, but, uh, blind sports. I work
a couple of days a week as a sports development officer. Um,
(01:30):
I'm also with some of, you know, uh, South Australian
runners Club, club coach. So therefore this is, you know,
just fits in really well there. And I do also
work at South Australian Sports Institute as, uh, well we
call physical preparation coaches, but in old terminology, strength and
conditioning coach. It's quite exciting because I it was probably 12,
(01:50):
18 months ago, I had reached out to Achilles to
see how we could get something happening. Got some ideas
and thoughts, but unfortunately then with everything else going on,
that fell to the wayside. But then I reached out
again when I was ready to get going again, and
then just then Castanea jumped on board, which was awesome
because now we started. So all of a sudden now
we're starting to get that little support network, um, starting
(02:12):
to be created. And it's not just me trying to
trying to keep the ball rolling, um, along. So so
that kind of brings us here, here where we are now.
So I organized the Pacers for the Adelaide Marathon as well.
So I'd love to see us see that expand into being,
you know, organizing guides or having people have interests who
want to run. And then we can have guides and
(02:33):
and for the record, I think the Achilles people are
aware of this. It's not just people who are blind
or low vision, it's people with other, uh, disabilities. There
may also need support to, to get around um, South
Australian Sports Institute. I've worked with people with cerebral palsy etc.
and there's always challenges in that as well. And the
(02:53):
excitement of being able to, to guide somebody, um, and
help them achieve their goal is definitely a really a
great thing to do. And, and I see it along
the same line as those who have ever done pacing
in an event. Same thing. The feedback and the thought
you get, oh great, you helped me achieve my goal
and all that is really rewarding. But I'm really not
(03:14):
the expert because I've got here next to me a
couple of guys who have got, what, 30 odd years,
40 years, we don't know. We're going to raise too
much money, will we? We will say more than 15
years beside me. So. So Sam's actually a Paralympian, uh,
represented Australia in Sydney, Sydney, Sydney and Athens. Was it Seoul? Seoul? Barcelona, Atlanta? Sydney.
(03:38):
There you go. Okay, so. So we've done a few. Yeah.
S2 (03:50):
Hello, Lizzy. How are we going today?
S3 (03:53):
It is warm, warm, warm. And I am going pretty good. Thanks.
And yourself?
S2 (03:58):
Um. Well, mixed. I might talk about that just a
second later. Now, full disclosure to our listeners yesterday. At
the time of recording, it was 40 degrees in Adelaide
and instead of curling up underneath the air conditioning, where
were we?
S3 (04:15):
Out at Victoria Park in the centre of Adelaide, taking
on a guide running course. And I have to say
I nearly passed out. It was pretty gruelling and we
didn't run that far. I mean, maybe we ran like
500m in total. But seriously, it was hot.
S2 (04:32):
Well, as for me, I'm drugged up.
S3 (04:35):
Drugged up. Oh well, please do explain.
S2 (04:37):
As you know, I lead a highly active life. Um,
I do all sorts of things here and there, and
I manage to do my back in.
S3 (04:46):
How did you do that?
S2 (04:48):
Well, you might think maybe it was at the gym,
or maybe it was out running. No, it was lifting
a laundry basket.
S3 (04:56):
Oh, well, that doesn't surprise me, Sam, because it's something
that a lot of people do.
S2 (05:00):
The thing is, a couple of days earlier, I was
shifting around the old style, my old style TVs, and
we were getting rid of those. Not a problem. I
just bent down the wrong way and all of a
sudden I am in agony. So yes, I am on
the what? What was we called mother's little helpers at
the moment. So yes, it's been an interesting week.
S5 (05:27):
Okay, so we are here on a nice hot morning
at Victoria Park, the former racecourse and what it, uh,
until recently the home of the Adelaide 500. Joining me
right here now is Dennis Lorenzen, who is a former
coach of South Australian blind Sports and a fairly good
athlete in your time yourself, weren't you?
S6 (05:48):
Oh yeah. Yes, I had a few in my youth
when I met some, some success, uh, doing athletics. Yeah.
S5 (05:56):
So what got you into all of this? I mean, you,
the first I got to know you was through, uh,
blind spots itself. So, um. What? um, you know, inspired
you to sort of jump over and coach people like myself?
S6 (06:10):
Well, uh, my son was he was born blind and, uh,
so and ended up at the Townsend School for the
Blind at Hove. And there they had a wonderful phys
ed teacher in Jenny Flood. And also must have remember
Dennis Peck, who encouraged all her athletes and students to
to incorporate athletics as part of their exercise program. So
(06:34):
with our son being encouraged to do this, Jenny, uh,
was at, uh, quite good in the running aspects of things.
And through my, my background, uh, I was familiar with
the strength side of things. So I offered to, to
assist Jenny, uh, in coaching the kids. So, uh, and
then I was thinking, well, gosh, if I'm coaching your
(06:57):
own son, but only coaching others, you really need to qualify. So. And, uh,
through both the Australian Track and Field Coaches Association and
the Athletics Australia formerly. Get my qualifications, which I have.
I am an elite coach with the Australian track and
field coaches and a level three with the Australian Athletics Australia.
S7 (07:20):
So what are some of the achievements that your athletes
have had?
S6 (07:25):
Well, yes. Um, predominately this was in the North east 1990s. Uh,
got involved in the area about 91, 92, uh, and
right through to about 2002. Um, the, the team in
that period and prior, they won the house and a
number of times, which was the Australian competition for the
(07:46):
state in competing at the Blind Nationals. Uh, through that period, uh,
a personal achievement, which I liked, which incorporated all the
different aspects of blind sport, the Association of Blind Sporting Clubs. Uh, the, uh,
what was called the Blind Sporting Council at the time,
which was the fundraising body that we set up, we
(08:07):
were able to put all we fight. At least five
of South Australians went to the Sydney Olympics in the various.
There was a judo with, uh, Tony Clark. Uh, of course,
our success with Sonya Penny Bennett, the goalball Christian Stafford
in the swimming um and our ring in from Northern
(08:31):
Territory and Sam Rickard he was he was he was
residing in South Australia at the time, if I recall. Right.
Sam I was yes. Yeah. He so he was another one.
So we'll claim him as well. And there's someone else.
But I just, um. You caught me on the hop.
I can't quite remember. There is another one there somewhere,
I'm sure. But, um, so I take those. Another crowning
(08:51):
achievement which which I had a big part in was, um,
through through 1996. And one of our nationals, um, the
host state was meant to supply guide runners, And this
was in Sydney, and they dutifully did so. However, um,
because of the unfamiliarity with, uh, with the guide runners, uh,
(09:15):
the people who you train with and so on, these
were just people who were athletes themselves and participating and
helping out. There was a couple of incidents where one
one of our sprinters missed out by a fraction of
a second to qualifying for the for for a world championship.
I forget the exact one that he was going for,
but it had. He had his own guide runner. He
(09:37):
we felt confident that he would have achieved that qualification time.
And similarly, another middle distance runner who was so good
that he actually needed two guide runners because they ran
out of puff. Um, so in the in the change
between the two guide runners, he inadvertently stepped onto the
guide rail, which is the inside of the track, and
twisted an ankle and couldn't complete his his run. So
(10:00):
that precipitated, um, and by the initiative of uh, three people,
all visually impaired, and Tim Haggis, Michael Anderson, fellow who.
We don't see any more Paul Crestani. They had this
brainwave of forming a body that raised funds that would
support blind athletes. And so they they conjured up this idea.
(10:24):
They came forth and and told us the idea, and
we said, well, why not? That's a great idea. So
we formed a committee which consisted of mostly people who
were already on the athletics club board or management. And, um,
and we set to it to create a charity for
exactly that purpose. So that started in 1996. And now
(10:48):
after a couple of name changes, it's called the Blind
Sports Foundation and has been going ever since 1996 raising
money to support blind sport. So I take great pride
in having a strong hand in that in the initial instance.
So and it's a long winded answer, but I'm proud
of my involvement with Blind Sport and and along the way,
(11:10):
I've helped when I could. I stopped coaching in about
2002 to pursue other activities and put something back into
my industry that I was working, so, which I did.
And then I retired from work in 2013 and and
always kept touch with the boys, uh, uh, Tim Harris
and Michael and the like and Sam bump into each
(11:32):
other around the place. So, um, it's been a wonderful
relationship with the blind, blind athletes.
S5 (11:39):
So what are we doing out here, though, on this, uh,
hot day? I mean, what's, uh, the the reason why we've, uh,
ventured out on a on a on a Sunday morning?
S6 (11:49):
Yes. Well, this morning, we've been invited to, uh, extol
our expertise in guide running, uh, through in association with
a running club called the Achilles. This is a single
Achilles Australia who.
S8 (12:04):
You.
S6 (12:05):
Are trying to learn to and promoting handicapped people in,
in into participating in running activities. So they want to
learn how to do guide running. And that's what we're
going to be doing here today. And the beauty.
S5 (12:20):
Of it is we actually have a genuine blind person
with us today.
S7 (12:23):
So I am extremely enthusiast and I wanted to start
running for a while, so see what's all about. Oh, wonderful.
S6 (12:31):
You got that exactly right. And that's what their their goal,
their goal of their, uh, their club is I guess,
isn't it?
S7 (12:39):
It's funny you should say that because a friend of mine, um,
Steven Kemp's wife, recently did the New York Marathon, and
she reckons there were so many Achilles, um, athletes out
there guiding people and helping people out. So it's great
to see that there's such a presence not just in, like,
small running events, but also main stage. So the competition.
S1 (13:07):
This is studio One on Vision Australia Radio.
S5 (13:20):
So we are joined here by Hendrik from Blind Sport
SA and I have Justin Crawford.
S9 (13:29):
Justin Crawford from Achilles series. Adelaide. Yes.
S5 (13:31):
So, um, the goal of today really is to teach
people how to go and run people like ourselves. What
got you involved with this kind of thing?
S9 (13:42):
Um, it was really a background in running and walking
and being active. And I believe that, um, that mental
and physical being outside helps with the mental and physical wellbeing.
And I saw Achilles in Melbourne a few years ago
and went, that's an amazing idea. Bring something here to
help more people. And yeah, just sort of started got
in touch with Achilles in Sydney, which would have been
(14:04):
26 years went by. How bout really?
S5 (14:07):
Have you had much to do with the blindness and
vision care community process? No.
S9 (14:12):
Not really. Funnily enough, I went to a blind school,
a kindergarten, and I was first year. And you know
how many years ago that is like 35 years ago.
And I other than being involved in charities, I've been
a part of an impact 100, which is a charity
in SA for a while, and we've had a variety
of different people, but not not enough to I've got
a lot of learning to do and we've got to
work with people like you and hopefully learn some more.
S5 (14:35):
So you've been involved with Blind Sports SA for a while,
but I was there when you were first interviewed.
S4 (14:44):
So 14 years ago.
S5 (14:46):
So and again, I had you prior to being involved
with this had much to do with the disability community
in general.
S4 (14:53):
A little bit. I had in another role I do
a strength and conditioning role. I'd worked with a vision impaired,
as we now call them. Low vision is the new terminology.
So a person with low vision to do the Kokoda Trail.
So I helped train her up to build her strength
(15:14):
and she achieved it.
S5 (15:16):
So what gave you the idea to run? Um, because
this is the second one of these seminars. I mean,
what gave you the idea to actually start doing this
kind of thing? Um, well.
S4 (15:25):
It's something that we've been wanting to do for a while.
I mean, the challenges are me being a one man
band here in Adelaide that, uh, so many things everyone
else wants to do. So, as Lizzie would know, I've
done stuff at Beyond Blindness, and we've had people wanting
to do tandem riding and flying bowls and, and, uh,
(15:45):
lesser extent, me being participating, but with blind cricket, etc..
So a number of other sports. And so this is
one thing that's been on the radar. And then, then
we started it moving along, and I'd had a chat
to Achilles in Sydney probably 12, 18 months ago and
then unfortunately fell off the radar a little bit. And
then I reached out again. And there just so happened
(16:06):
that Justine had also reached out probably within a month
or two earlier. Um, and so then I said, fantastic,
because all of a sudden the one man band becomes
a many, many person band, I should say. And we
then we'll be able to get things moving along.
S5 (16:22):
Okay. So maybe in both explain what exactly is Achilles?
S9 (16:26):
Uh, so yeah, Achilles started years ago and they actually
started just trying to get, um, people with vision impaired.
S4 (16:33):
So low vision.
S9 (16:35):
People out in the community doing things from walking to
running and participating in events. I see. Um, and it
was literally someone in America that decided to start that
with a friend of his at the time, and it
seeks it's just expanded from there. And for me, it's
literally about the community inclusion and doing something that I love, like,
love and a lot of friends that love running and walking.
(16:56):
And for me, you know, other people do what we enjoy,
which also that mental aspect.
S4 (17:01):
And on the other side of that, I do some
coaching with South Australian Road Runners Club, so I'm part
of the organising committee for the Adelaide Marathon, for example.
There's a number of other events and I see it
as a great opportunity that we can get some people
with low vision actually having the opportunity to do half marathons, marathons, um,
(17:22):
and we have a support network which, which has been
always a challenge having that support network. And so we
will now have that in place to to move forward.
S5 (17:30):
And is this going to be part of a coaching
courses or anything like that as well. I mean, has
there been any moves as far as that goes?
S4 (17:38):
Not at this stage, but I'm quite open to to
us doing whatever we need to do to keep it moving. And,
and if we need to have some kind of official
accreditation or whatever from a coaching perspective, let's get it.
Let's let's get it involved and let's talk to Athletics
SA as well about, uh, getting it included in, in
(17:59):
their courses as well.
S5 (18:00):
So let's just get on with this thing then. Okay.
S4 (18:02):
No worries. Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Lizzie.
S2 (18:10):
You've never really been out and done a proper sort
of running session before, have you?
S3 (18:15):
Not since I was 17. I was a South Australian
cross country champion at the time. Can you actually believe that?
Probably not, but I was a bit of a runner
back in the day. I have not done any running
since then. The only running I've actually partaken in is
on the treadmill. So to actually get out with a
guide runner and go for a proper run was I
(18:38):
kind of likened it to trying to learn how to
ride a bike as an adult. If you've never ridden
a bike before. It was daunting and it was scary.
S2 (18:45):
And my god, you could actually tell you hadn't been
out running for a while as well. The conversation, and
I've not included this so much in the recordings that
we'll be going to. But was your running like a robot?
Why were you running like a robot?
S3 (19:04):
I don't know. You expect me to have an answer? Okay,
so one of the things I said yesterday was that
with a seeing eye dog, I'm used to having my
hand down straight all the time. Because when you've got
the harness, you can't keep your elbow bent at a
90 degree angle. You have to have it down by
your side. And obviously that's just what I do with
the other arm as well. And so I've never really
(19:26):
known how to engage my arms when I've gone walking
or running. So I guess I just naturally fell to
that sort of stance. And I understand that your arms
propel you forward, because once I actually learnt how to
do that, I did find that I was able to
pick up momentum a lot more quicker.
S2 (19:43):
And well, it felt a lot more natural as well,
didn't it?
S3 (19:47):
I can't say that I'm not just yet, but I'm
sure it will be once I've given it some more goes.
I've actually my guide partner and I have actually agreed
to train together starting next Monday. We're going out for
a run so wish us luck!
S9 (20:06):
I ran a half.
S7 (20:07):
Marathon this year, but I'm just coming back from having
bad knees. I would love to do like, my first
goal ever. Yeah, I want to do either one of
the five. I like the park. So we're just coming
up to see stairs now. Up or.
S4 (20:20):
Down? Okay, so this is what.
S5 (20:22):
I've been looking forward to seeing how Lizzie runs. Yep.
So go for that. See that path there?
S7 (20:29):
Yes.
S5 (20:30):
All right.
S10 (20:31):
All right. We're about to get back on the road.
I guess not. Oh. There's someone. Yeah. Should we try
to jog? We don't have to take a nice slow pace.
Here we go, Lizzie. Um. Sweet swing.
S5 (20:46):
Adam. Yeah.
S10 (20:47):
You're running like a robot. You must stop. There you go.
That's better. That's better. Here we go. Nice. Okay, we're
turning left, then. Right. I will turn over. And we were. Okay,
we got it. We got it.
S5 (21:04):
Again. So Achilles has done its job.
S2 (21:06):
Already, and it hasn't even really officially formed. You've actually
found found somebody to go out running with?
S3 (21:12):
Yeah, we swapped numbers. We were texting. And we have
these goals that we are training towards, like park runs
and maybe a 10-K at the end of the year.
But you know, if it happens, it happens. If it doesn't,
I'll just be glad to get out and do some running.
S5 (21:31):
So our little finding the experience.
S4 (21:33):
So is it a friendship what you were expecting or. Um,
it's weird. Doing it myself.
S11 (21:38):
Is like.
S5 (21:40):
Anything you sort of notice when you have the blindfold
on with when you're actually running, but tend to lean? Oh,
I was.
S11 (21:47):
I was leaning into him. So if you put tension on,
a plug, will sound better. Just joking about a dog
or a horse, you know, you give a little, suddenly you're. Yeah. Whereas,
I mean, I was moving, whereas the guy I was with,
I was building on it. He wasn't moving at all.
I took to make him move remember always that, you know.
So different strokes. Did you notice how Camille's slightest divot
(22:11):
in the.
S5 (22:11):
Ground all of a sudden becomes like.
S11 (22:13):
A.
S5 (22:14):
Major fall?
S11 (22:15):
That's the one thing that does scare me.
S3 (22:19):
I think I've learned that it is so important to
trust the person that you're running with to call out everything,
just as it is. With tandem riding, there is a
certain amount of communication that goes into any team sport
where the athlete is being guided by a sighted individual
and just learning about the different forms of communication and
(22:42):
what has to go into it to make the run
successful and safe again. It's quite daunting. It's quite scary,
but I'm really looking forward to getting into it.
S2 (22:50):
Well, that was a conversation I'd had with one of
the other runners because. So Lizzie was the only actually, um,
blind person there, apart from myself and not being me,
not being able to run, I wasn't really much of
a help as far as that goes. And one of
the ladies was saying she was actually rather distracted with
a lot of things that was going on around, and
she was hearing bugs going past and being very cautious
(23:12):
about that. And my comment was, you've got to block
those out. That's the problem. The other things in the area,
the bugs going past, the other people on the on
the track or whatever. That's the problem of the guide
runner who is effectively your set of eyes.
S3 (23:28):
Yes. And again, this is the same with the tandem.
You know, when you're on the road and there's cars
coming past and you're going between cars and trucks at
the lights, you sort of effectively need to just forget
that that's happening and just pretend that it's not. And,
you know, just try to go with the flow. Because
if you start worrying and you start trying to preemptively,
(23:49):
you know, guess what the other person's maneuver is going
to be or whatever, you're going to create an unsafe situation.
So yeah, it's a little bit of like meditation in
a way. You sort of just got to zone out,
get into your Zen place, you know.
S2 (24:01):
Now some of the terrain was a little bit rough.
How was that when you were going along? I love.
S3 (24:05):
Gravel. I actually said this yesterday. I really love walking
on gravel. I've done a lot of hikes in the past,
and gravel is one of my favorite terrain to run
on because you can hear your footsteps on the gravel,
you can hear the other person's footsteps on the gravel.
If there are bikes coming past you or other people,
you can hear them further off. I don't like concrete
(24:28):
as much as I like gravel, which is funny enough,
but apart from that I didn't mind it so much.
It was good. It was really good.
S2 (24:33):
Believe it or not, concrete is the worst substance to
run on. It comes down to resistance. If you are
running on a surface like bitumen or concrete, it is
actually worse for your legs, whereas gravel or grass is
the best. Um, they are the best surfaces to run
on because it has a little bit of give to
it as well.
S3 (24:53):
I can totally imagine that. Like the shock absorption, you know,
when you pound your feet on concrete, it's this the
impact goes straight into your knees and legs, but with
the gravel and grass here, I can quite imagine how
that would help you.
S2 (25:06):
So, have we got a convert here? I mean, am
I going to see you out at morning training instead
of on the bicycle?
S3 (25:13):
Yeah, I think so. I mean, I'm not going to
give up tandem cycling, that's for sure. I thoroughly enjoy it.
I however, I am focusing on one specific discipline that
being track cycling. So I won't need to dedicate as
much time on the road. So I am actually planning on. Yeah,
doing a bit more running and getting more engaged with
(25:34):
the running community, doing some park runs and maybe some
short five k 10-K races if possible. But I'm super keen.
S2 (25:41):
So as the old man here is opting out, you're
opting in.
S4 (25:47):
So thank you for coming out this morning. And, uh,
giving you a time and effort to just probably a
couple of things. I get various queries from people. They'll
contact me and say, you know, I want to do
a parkrun, I want to do a half marathon, I
want to do a marathon or whatever. In the past,
it's been really difficult because the chicken before the egg scenario.
I find the person, but then I go, well, hang on.
I've got no one to to to guide you, so
(26:10):
this would be great. We'll now have a bit of
a data base. And as I've said to some people,
even if you get matched up with somebody, don't feel
obligated to run with them because, uh, Sam, Dennis and
I are very aware that there are some people out
there with low vision who think the world owes them everything,
and you don't need to feel guilty. Um, if you say, look,
(26:32):
you've got you've got to be with I think we've
talked a lot about this. You've got to feel comfortable
with who you're running, and if you're not feeling comfortable,
it's going to be a chore and you're eventually going
to say, look, I don't want to. I just don't
want to get in my car and drive down to
take that person for a run, so that's fine. It
would be just reaching back to Justine or myself and
just saying, look, this isn't working. And then we're just.
(26:54):
And then probably just saying we reached out to me
and I'd, I'd, I'd said, Sam around and he'll have
a chat to the vision. Okay. We'll get him sorted.
S2 (27:06):
Well, that's a wrap for this week. A special thank
you to Kent, to Dennis and Justine.
S3 (27:11):
And a big thank you to all of you for listening.
S2 (27:14):
We'll be back next week on Christmas Day with the
first of our holiday specials, where we look at the
start of this year.
S3 (27:21):
But between now and then, please do get in touch
with the show. Whether you have experience of any of
the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio One,
or if you think there's something we should be talking about.
You never know. Your story and insight may help someone
who's dealing with something similar.
S2 (27:36):
You can email us at studio One at Vision Australia.
Org that's studio number one at Vision Australia.
S3 (27:41):
Org or perhaps you can search for us on social media,
whether that be Facebook or Instagram. Just look for VA
Radio Network. We want to hear from you.
S2 (27:51):
Good bye for now.
S1 (27:53):
Vision Australia Radio gratefully acknowledges the support of the Community
Broadcasting Foundation for Studio One.
This is studio one on Vision Australia radio.
S2 (00:12):
Hello, I'm Sam.
S3 (00:14):
And I'm Lizzie, and this.
S2 (00:15):
Is Studio One, your weekly look at life from a
low vision and blind point of view. Here on Vision
Australia Radio.
S3 (00:20):
On this week's show, we are going running.
S2 (00:24):
South Australia is opening its own chapter of Achilles, a
group that trains and matches up guide runners to people
with a vision impairment who want to go running.
S3 (00:32):
Yes, and I even give it a go with.
S2 (00:34):
Some mixed results. As we always say at this point,
please do get in touch with the show. Whether you
have experience of any of the issues covered on this
week's episode of Studio One, or if you think there
is something we should be talking about. You never know.
Your story and insight may help somebody else who is
dealing with something similar.
S3 (00:50):
You can contact us via email at studio One at
Vision Australia. Org, that's studio number one at Vision australia.org.
Or perhaps you could drop us a note on our Facebook.
Just go to facebook.com slash VA Radio Network.
S4 (01:10):
Thank you, everyone, for coming today. Um, this is really
exciting for us because this is something that we've been
on our radar for a long time. I have a
number of jobs, and some of you may know me
in different, different roles, but, uh, blind sports. I work
a couple of days a week as a sports development officer. Um,
(01:30):
I'm also with some of, you know, uh, South Australian
runners Club, club coach. So therefore this is, you know,
just fits in really well there. And I do also
work at South Australian Sports Institute as, uh, well we
call physical preparation coaches, but in old terminology, strength and
conditioning coach. It's quite exciting because I it was probably 12,
(01:50):
18 months ago, I had reached out to Achilles to
see how we could get something happening. Got some ideas
and thoughts, but unfortunately then with everything else going on,
that fell to the wayside. But then I reached out
again when I was ready to get going again, and
then just then Castanea jumped on board, which was awesome
because now we started. So all of a sudden now
we're starting to get that little support network, um, starting
(02:12):
to be created. And it's not just me trying to
trying to keep the ball rolling, um, along. So so
that kind of brings us here, here where we are now.
So I organized the Pacers for the Adelaide Marathon as well.
So I'd love to see us see that expand into being,
you know, organizing guides or having people have interests who
want to run. And then we can have guides and
(02:33):
and for the record, I think the Achilles people are
aware of this. It's not just people who are blind
or low vision, it's people with other, uh, disabilities. There
may also need support to, to get around um, South
Australian Sports Institute. I've worked with people with cerebral palsy etc.
and there's always challenges in that as well. And the
(02:53):
excitement of being able to, to guide somebody, um, and
help them achieve their goal is definitely a really a
great thing to do. And, and I see it along
the same line as those who have ever done pacing
in an event. Same thing. The feedback and the thought
you get, oh great, you helped me achieve my goal
and all that is really rewarding. But I'm really not
(03:14):
the expert because I've got here next to me a
couple of guys who have got, what, 30 odd years,
40 years, we don't know. We're going to raise too
much money, will we? We will say more than 15
years beside me. So. So Sam's actually a Paralympian, uh,
represented Australia in Sydney, Sydney, Sydney and Athens. Was it Seoul? Seoul? Barcelona, Atlanta? Sydney.
(03:38):
There you go. Okay, so. So we've done a few. Yeah.
S2 (03:50):
Hello, Lizzy. How are we going today?
S3 (03:53):
It is warm, warm, warm. And I am going pretty good. Thanks.
And yourself?
S2 (03:58):
Um. Well, mixed. I might talk about that just a
second later. Now, full disclosure to our listeners yesterday. At
the time of recording, it was 40 degrees in Adelaide
and instead of curling up underneath the air conditioning, where
were we?
S3 (04:15):
Out at Victoria Park in the centre of Adelaide, taking
on a guide running course. And I have to say
I nearly passed out. It was pretty gruelling and we
didn't run that far. I mean, maybe we ran like
500m in total. But seriously, it was hot.
S2 (04:32):
Well, as for me, I'm drugged up.
S3 (04:35):
Drugged up. Oh well, please do explain.
S2 (04:37):
As you know, I lead a highly active life. Um,
I do all sorts of things here and there, and
I manage to do my back in.
S3 (04:46):
How did you do that?
S2 (04:48):
Well, you might think maybe it was at the gym,
or maybe it was out running. No, it was lifting
a laundry basket.
S3 (04:56):
Oh, well, that doesn't surprise me, Sam, because it's something
that a lot of people do.
S2 (05:00):
The thing is, a couple of days earlier, I was
shifting around the old style, my old style TVs, and
we were getting rid of those. Not a problem. I
just bent down the wrong way and all of a
sudden I am in agony. So yes, I am on
the what? What was we called mother's little helpers at
the moment. So yes, it's been an interesting week.
S5 (05:27):
Okay, so we are here on a nice hot morning
at Victoria Park, the former racecourse and what it, uh,
until recently the home of the Adelaide 500. Joining me
right here now is Dennis Lorenzen, who is a former
coach of South Australian blind Sports and a fairly good
athlete in your time yourself, weren't you?
S6 (05:48):
Oh yeah. Yes, I had a few in my youth
when I met some, some success, uh, doing athletics. Yeah.
S5 (05:56):
So what got you into all of this? I mean, you,
the first I got to know you was through, uh,
blind spots itself. So, um. What? um, you know, inspired
you to sort of jump over and coach people like myself?
S6 (06:10):
Well, uh, my son was he was born blind and, uh,
so and ended up at the Townsend School for the
Blind at Hove. And there they had a wonderful phys
ed teacher in Jenny Flood. And also must have remember
Dennis Peck, who encouraged all her athletes and students to
to incorporate athletics as part of their exercise program. So
(06:34):
with our son being encouraged to do this, Jenny, uh,
was at, uh, quite good in the running aspects of things.
And through my, my background, uh, I was familiar with
the strength side of things. So I offered to, to
assist Jenny, uh, in coaching the kids. So, uh, and
then I was thinking, well, gosh, if I'm coaching your
(06:57):
own son, but only coaching others, you really need to qualify. So. And, uh,
through both the Australian Track and Field Coaches Association and
the Athletics Australia formerly. Get my qualifications, which I have.
I am an elite coach with the Australian track and
field coaches and a level three with the Australian Athletics Australia.
S7 (07:20):
So what are some of the achievements that your athletes
have had?
S6 (07:25):
Well, yes. Um, predominately this was in the North east 1990s. Uh,
got involved in the area about 91, 92, uh, and
right through to about 2002. Um, the, the team in
that period and prior, they won the house and a
number of times, which was the Australian competition for the
(07:46):
state in competing at the Blind Nationals. Uh, through that period, uh,
a personal achievement, which I liked, which incorporated all the
different aspects of blind sport, the Association of Blind Sporting Clubs. Uh, the, uh,
what was called the Blind Sporting Council at the time,
which was the fundraising body that we set up, we
(08:07):
were able to put all we fight. At least five
of South Australians went to the Sydney Olympics in the various.
There was a judo with, uh, Tony Clark. Uh, of course,
our success with Sonya Penny Bennett, the goalball Christian Stafford
in the swimming um and our ring in from Northern
(08:31):
Territory and Sam Rickard he was he was he was
residing in South Australia at the time, if I recall. Right.
Sam I was yes. Yeah. He so he was another one.
So we'll claim him as well. And there's someone else.
But I just, um. You caught me on the hop.
I can't quite remember. There is another one there somewhere,
I'm sure. But, um, so I take those. Another crowning
(08:51):
achievement which which I had a big part in was, um,
through through 1996. And one of our nationals, um, the
host state was meant to supply guide runners, And this
was in Sydney, and they dutifully did so. However, um,
because of the unfamiliarity with, uh, with the guide runners, uh,
(09:15):
the people who you train with and so on, these
were just people who were athletes themselves and participating and
helping out. There was a couple of incidents where one
one of our sprinters missed out by a fraction of
a second to qualifying for the for for a world championship.
I forget the exact one that he was going for,
but it had. He had his own guide runner. He
(09:37):
we felt confident that he would have achieved that qualification time.
And similarly, another middle distance runner who was so good
that he actually needed two guide runners because they ran
out of puff. Um, so in the in the change
between the two guide runners, he inadvertently stepped onto the
guide rail, which is the inside of the track, and
twisted an ankle and couldn't complete his his run. So
(10:00):
that precipitated, um, and by the initiative of uh, three people,
all visually impaired, and Tim Haggis, Michael Anderson, fellow who.
We don't see any more Paul Crestani. They had this
brainwave of forming a body that raised funds that would
support blind athletes. And so they they conjured up this idea.
(10:24):
They came forth and and told us the idea, and
we said, well, why not? That's a great idea. So
we formed a committee which consisted of mostly people who
were already on the athletics club board or management. And, um,
and we set to it to create a charity for
exactly that purpose. So that started in 1996. And now
(10:48):
after a couple of name changes, it's called the Blind
Sports Foundation and has been going ever since 1996 raising
money to support blind sport. So I take great pride
in having a strong hand in that in the initial instance.
So and it's a long winded answer, but I'm proud
of my involvement with Blind Sport and and along the way,
(11:10):
I've helped when I could. I stopped coaching in about
2002 to pursue other activities and put something back into
my industry that I was working, so, which I did.
And then I retired from work in 2013 and and
always kept touch with the boys, uh, uh, Tim Harris
and Michael and the like and Sam bump into each
(11:32):
other around the place. So, um, it's been a wonderful
relationship with the blind, blind athletes.
S5 (11:39):
So what are we doing out here, though, on this, uh,
hot day? I mean, what's, uh, the the reason why we've, uh,
ventured out on a on a on a Sunday morning?
S6 (11:49):
Yes. Well, this morning, we've been invited to, uh, extol
our expertise in guide running, uh, through in association with
a running club called the Achilles. This is a single
Achilles Australia who.
S8 (12:04):
You.
S6 (12:05):
Are trying to learn to and promoting handicapped people in,
in into participating in running activities. So they want to
learn how to do guide running. And that's what we're
going to be doing here today. And the beauty.
S5 (12:20):
Of it is we actually have a genuine blind person
with us today.
S7 (12:23):
So I am extremely enthusiast and I wanted to start
running for a while, so see what's all about. Oh, wonderful.
S6 (12:31):
You got that exactly right. And that's what their their goal,
their goal of their, uh, their club is I guess,
isn't it?
S7 (12:39):
It's funny you should say that because a friend of mine, um,
Steven Kemp's wife, recently did the New York Marathon, and
she reckons there were so many Achilles, um, athletes out
there guiding people and helping people out. So it's great
to see that there's such a presence not just in, like,
small running events, but also main stage. So the competition.
S1 (13:07):
This is studio One on Vision Australia Radio.
S5 (13:20):
So we are joined here by Hendrik from Blind Sport
SA and I have Justin Crawford.
S9 (13:29):
Justin Crawford from Achilles series. Adelaide. Yes.
S5 (13:31):
So, um, the goal of today really is to teach
people how to go and run people like ourselves. What
got you involved with this kind of thing?
S9 (13:42):
Um, it was really a background in running and walking
and being active. And I believe that, um, that mental
and physical being outside helps with the mental and physical wellbeing.
And I saw Achilles in Melbourne a few years ago
and went, that's an amazing idea. Bring something here to
help more people. And yeah, just sort of started got
in touch with Achilles in Sydney, which would have been
(14:04):
26 years went by. How bout really?
S5 (14:07):
Have you had much to do with the blindness and
vision care community process? No.
S9 (14:12):
Not really. Funnily enough, I went to a blind school,
a kindergarten, and I was first year. And you know
how many years ago that is like 35 years ago.
And I other than being involved in charities, I've been
a part of an impact 100, which is a charity
in SA for a while, and we've had a variety
of different people, but not not enough to I've got
a lot of learning to do and we've got to
work with people like you and hopefully learn some more.
S5 (14:35):
So you've been involved with Blind Sports SA for a while,
but I was there when you were first interviewed.
S4 (14:44):
So 14 years ago.
S5 (14:46):
So and again, I had you prior to being involved
with this had much to do with the disability community
in general.
S4 (14:53):
A little bit. I had in another role I do
a strength and conditioning role. I'd worked with a vision impaired,
as we now call them. Low vision is the new terminology.
So a person with low vision to do the Kokoda Trail.
So I helped train her up to build her strength
(15:14):
and she achieved it.
S5 (15:16):
So what gave you the idea to run? Um, because
this is the second one of these seminars. I mean,
what gave you the idea to actually start doing this
kind of thing? Um, well.
S4 (15:25):
It's something that we've been wanting to do for a while.
I mean, the challenges are me being a one man
band here in Adelaide that, uh, so many things everyone
else wants to do. So, as Lizzie would know, I've
done stuff at Beyond Blindness, and we've had people wanting
to do tandem riding and flying bowls and, and, uh,
(15:45):
lesser extent, me being participating, but with blind cricket, etc..
So a number of other sports. And so this is
one thing that's been on the radar. And then, then
we started it moving along, and I'd had a chat
to Achilles in Sydney probably 12, 18 months ago and
then unfortunately fell off the radar a little bit. And
then I reached out again. And there just so happened
(16:06):
that Justine had also reached out probably within a month
or two earlier. Um, and so then I said, fantastic,
because all of a sudden the one man band becomes
a many, many person band, I should say. And we
then we'll be able to get things moving along.
S5 (16:22):
Okay. So maybe in both explain what exactly is Achilles?
S9 (16:26):
Uh, so yeah, Achilles started years ago and they actually
started just trying to get, um, people with vision impaired.
S4 (16:33):
So low vision.
S9 (16:35):
People out in the community doing things from walking to
running and participating in events. I see. Um, and it
was literally someone in America that decided to start that
with a friend of his at the time, and it
seeks it's just expanded from there. And for me, it's
literally about the community inclusion and doing something that I love, like,
love and a lot of friends that love running and walking.
(16:56):
And for me, you know, other people do what we enjoy,
which also that mental aspect.
S4 (17:01):
And on the other side of that, I do some
coaching with South Australian Road Runners Club, so I'm part
of the organising committee for the Adelaide Marathon, for example.
There's a number of other events and I see it
as a great opportunity that we can get some people
with low vision actually having the opportunity to do half marathons, marathons, um,
(17:22):
and we have a support network which, which has been
always a challenge having that support network. And so we
will now have that in place to to move forward.
S5 (17:30):
And is this going to be part of a coaching
courses or anything like that as well. I mean, has
there been any moves as far as that goes?
S4 (17:38):
Not at this stage, but I'm quite open to to
us doing whatever we need to do to keep it moving. And,
and if we need to have some kind of official
accreditation or whatever from a coaching perspective, let's get it.
Let's let's get it involved and let's talk to Athletics
SA as well about, uh, getting it included in, in
(17:59):
their courses as well.
S5 (18:00):
So let's just get on with this thing then. Okay.
S4 (18:02):
No worries. Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Lizzie.
S2 (18:10):
You've never really been out and done a proper sort
of running session before, have you?
S3 (18:15):
Not since I was 17. I was a South Australian
cross country champion at the time. Can you actually believe that?
Probably not, but I was a bit of a runner
back in the day. I have not done any running
since then. The only running I've actually partaken in is
on the treadmill. So to actually get out with a
guide runner and go for a proper run was I
(18:38):
kind of likened it to trying to learn how to
ride a bike as an adult. If you've never ridden
a bike before. It was daunting and it was scary.
S2 (18:45):
And my god, you could actually tell you hadn't been
out running for a while as well. The conversation, and
I've not included this so much in the recordings that
we'll be going to. But was your running like a robot?
Why were you running like a robot?
S3 (19:04):
I don't know. You expect me to have an answer? Okay,
so one of the things I said yesterday was that
with a seeing eye dog, I'm used to having my
hand down straight all the time. Because when you've got
the harness, you can't keep your elbow bent at a
90 degree angle. You have to have it down by
your side. And obviously that's just what I do with
the other arm as well. And so I've never really
(19:26):
known how to engage my arms when I've gone walking
or running. So I guess I just naturally fell to
that sort of stance. And I understand that your arms
propel you forward, because once I actually learnt how to
do that, I did find that I was able to
pick up momentum a lot more quicker.
S2 (19:43):
And well, it felt a lot more natural as well,
didn't it?
S3 (19:47):
I can't say that I'm not just yet, but I'm
sure it will be once I've given it some more goes.
I've actually my guide partner and I have actually agreed
to train together starting next Monday. We're going out for
a run so wish us luck!
S9 (20:06):
I ran a half.
S7 (20:07):
Marathon this year, but I'm just coming back from having
bad knees. I would love to do like, my first
goal ever. Yeah, I want to do either one of
the five. I like the park. So we're just coming
up to see stairs now. Up or.
S4 (20:20):
Down? Okay, so this is what.
S5 (20:22):
I've been looking forward to seeing how Lizzie runs. Yep.
So go for that. See that path there?
S7 (20:29):
Yes.
S5 (20:30):
All right.
S10 (20:31):
All right. We're about to get back on the road.
I guess not. Oh. There's someone. Yeah. Should we try
to jog? We don't have to take a nice slow pace.
Here we go, Lizzie. Um. Sweet swing.
S5 (20:46):
Adam. Yeah.
S10 (20:47):
You're running like a robot. You must stop. There you go.
That's better. That's better. Here we go. Nice. Okay, we're
turning left, then. Right. I will turn over. And we were. Okay,
we got it. We got it.
S5 (21:04):
Again. So Achilles has done its job.
S2 (21:06):
Already, and it hasn't even really officially formed. You've actually
found found somebody to go out running with?
S3 (21:12):
Yeah, we swapped numbers. We were texting. And we have
these goals that we are training towards, like park runs
and maybe a 10-K at the end of the year.
But you know, if it happens, it happens. If it doesn't,
I'll just be glad to get out and do some running.
S5 (21:31):
So our little finding the experience.
S4 (21:33):
So is it a friendship what you were expecting or. Um,
it's weird. Doing it myself.
S11 (21:38):
Is like.
S5 (21:40):
Anything you sort of notice when you have the blindfold
on with when you're actually running, but tend to lean? Oh,
I was.
S11 (21:47):
I was leaning into him. So if you put tension on,
a plug, will sound better. Just joking about a dog
or a horse, you know, you give a little, suddenly you're. Yeah. Whereas,
I mean, I was moving, whereas the guy I was with,
I was building on it. He wasn't moving at all.
I took to make him move remember always that, you know.
So different strokes. Did you notice how Camille's slightest divot
(22:11):
in the.
S5 (22:11):
Ground all of a sudden becomes like.
S11 (22:13):
A.
S5 (22:14):
Major fall?
S11 (22:15):
That's the one thing that does scare me.
S3 (22:19):
I think I've learned that it is so important to
trust the person that you're running with to call out everything,
just as it is. With tandem riding, there is a
certain amount of communication that goes into any team sport
where the athlete is being guided by a sighted individual
and just learning about the different forms of communication and
(22:42):
what has to go into it to make the run
successful and safe again. It's quite daunting. It's quite scary,
but I'm really looking forward to getting into it.
S2 (22:50):
Well, that was a conversation I'd had with one of
the other runners because. So Lizzie was the only actually, um,
blind person there, apart from myself and not being me,
not being able to run, I wasn't really much of
a help as far as that goes. And one of
the ladies was saying she was actually rather distracted with
a lot of things that was going on around, and
she was hearing bugs going past and being very cautious
(23:12):
about that. And my comment was, you've got to block
those out. That's the problem. The other things in the area,
the bugs going past, the other people on the on
the track or whatever. That's the problem of the guide
runner who is effectively your set of eyes.
S3 (23:28):
Yes. And again, this is the same with the tandem.
You know, when you're on the road and there's cars
coming past and you're going between cars and trucks at
the lights, you sort of effectively need to just forget
that that's happening and just pretend that it's not. And,
you know, just try to go with the flow. Because
if you start worrying and you start trying to preemptively,
(23:49):
you know, guess what the other person's maneuver is going
to be or whatever, you're going to create an unsafe situation.
So yeah, it's a little bit of like meditation in
a way. You sort of just got to zone out,
get into your Zen place, you know.
S2 (24:01):
Now some of the terrain was a little bit rough.
How was that when you were going along? I love.
S3 (24:05):
Gravel. I actually said this yesterday. I really love walking
on gravel. I've done a lot of hikes in the past,
and gravel is one of my favorite terrain to run
on because you can hear your footsteps on the gravel,
you can hear the other person's footsteps on the gravel.
If there are bikes coming past you or other people,
you can hear them further off. I don't like concrete
(24:28):
as much as I like gravel, which is funny enough,
but apart from that I didn't mind it so much.
It was good. It was really good.
S2 (24:33):
Believe it or not, concrete is the worst substance to
run on. It comes down to resistance. If you are
running on a surface like bitumen or concrete, it is
actually worse for your legs, whereas gravel or grass is
the best. Um, they are the best surfaces to run
on because it has a little bit of give to
it as well.
S3 (24:53):
I can totally imagine that. Like the shock absorption, you know,
when you pound your feet on concrete, it's this the
impact goes straight into your knees and legs, but with
the gravel and grass here, I can quite imagine how
that would help you.
S2 (25:06):
So, have we got a convert here? I mean, am
I going to see you out at morning training instead
of on the bicycle?
S3 (25:13):
Yeah, I think so. I mean, I'm not going to
give up tandem cycling, that's for sure. I thoroughly enjoy it.
I however, I am focusing on one specific discipline that
being track cycling. So I won't need to dedicate as
much time on the road. So I am actually planning on. Yeah,
doing a bit more running and getting more engaged with
(25:34):
the running community, doing some park runs and maybe some
short five k 10-K races if possible. But I'm super keen.
S2 (25:41):
So as the old man here is opting out, you're
opting in.
S4 (25:47):
So thank you for coming out this morning. And, uh,
giving you a time and effort to just probably a
couple of things. I get various queries from people. They'll
contact me and say, you know, I want to do
a parkrun, I want to do a half marathon, I
want to do a marathon or whatever. In the past,
it's been really difficult because the chicken before the egg scenario.
I find the person, but then I go, well, hang on.
I've got no one to to to guide you, so
(26:10):
this would be great. We'll now have a bit of
a data base. And as I've said to some people,
even if you get matched up with somebody, don't feel
obligated to run with them because, uh, Sam, Dennis and
I are very aware that there are some people out
there with low vision who think the world owes them everything,
and you don't need to feel guilty. Um, if you say, look,
(26:32):
you've got you've got to be with I think we've
talked a lot about this. You've got to feel comfortable
with who you're running, and if you're not feeling comfortable,
it's going to be a chore and you're eventually going
to say, look, I don't want to. I just don't
want to get in my car and drive down to
take that person for a run, so that's fine. It
would be just reaching back to Justine or myself and
just saying, look, this isn't working. And then we're just.
(26:54):
And then probably just saying we reached out to me
and I'd, I'd, I'd said, Sam around and he'll have
a chat to the vision. Okay. We'll get him sorted.
S2 (27:06):
Well, that's a wrap for this week. A special thank
you to Kent, to Dennis and Justine.
S3 (27:11):
And a big thank you to all of you for listening.
S2 (27:14):
We'll be back next week on Christmas Day with the
first of our holiday specials, where we look at the
start of this year.
S3 (27:21):
But between now and then, please do get in touch
with the show. Whether you have experience of any of
the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio One,
or if you think there's something we should be talking about.
You never know. Your story and insight may help someone
who's dealing with something similar.
S2 (27:36):
You can email us at studio One at Vision Australia.
Org that's studio number one at Vision Australia.
S3 (27:41):
Org or perhaps you can search for us on social media,
whether that be Facebook or Instagram. Just look for VA
Radio Network. We want to hear from you.
S2 (27:51):
Good bye for now.
S1 (27:53):
Vision Australia Radio gratefully acknowledges the support of the Community
Broadcasting Foundation for Studio One.
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