September 24, 2025 • 28 mins
Lizzie Eastham and Sam Rickard present Studio 1 - Vision Australia Radio’s weekly look at life from a low vision and blind point of view.
On this week’s show
“Technology: with Steve Monigatti”
Chaos strikes when Sam realises that he has not set up an interview with a famous Marathon runner, but with Vision Australia’s Access Technology Service Lead.
Steve talks about the ways to make home electronics more accessible, and the pros and cons of various phone and computer operating systems.
Meanwhile, Steven; Heidi and Shaun share their various trials and tribulations in a technical world that does not appear to be designed for Blind and Vision Impaired People.
Studio 1 welcomes any input from our listeners. If you have any experience or thoughts about issues covered in this episode or believe there is something we should be talking about.
You may also be interested in joining our choir of angels and telling your story.
EMAIL: studio1@visionaustralia.org or leave comment on the station’s Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/VARadioNetwork
A special thank you to Steve Monigatti. Additional thanks to Steven; Shaun and Heidi.
Sendibo Remote controls: https://sensibo.com/
This program was made possible with support from the Community Broadcasting Foundation. Find out more at https://cbf.org.au/
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:14):
This is Studio One with Sam Rickard and Lizzie Eastham
on Vision Australia Radio.
S2 (00:24):
With the lead up to the 25th anniversary of Sydney 2000.
It gives me great pleasure to be joined by the
one and only great marathon runner, Steve Moneghetti. G'day, Steve.
S3 (00:34):
Uh, Sam. Sorry. Sorry to disappoint, but, uh, you're the
first person who's asked today. But I'm not the marathon runner, unfortunately.
S2 (00:41):
What? Who? Why did not anybody tell me about this?
S4 (00:46):
Oh, look, mate, I am really sorry. Look, you know, Sam,
being honoured.
S2 (00:51):
I am shredding a week's worth of research. Oh, I'm Sam.
S4 (00:58):
And I'm Lizzie.
S2 (00:59):
And this is Studio One, your weekly look at life
from a low vision and blind point of view here
on Vision Australia Radio this week.
S4 (01:05):
Do you get the feeling that some pieces of technology
are just not for us?
S2 (01:09):
We catch up with Steve Moneghetti. Vision Australia's access technology
service development lead to point us in the right direction.
S4 (01:17):
As we always say at this point, please do get
in touch with the show. Whether you have any experience
of the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio One,
or if you think there's something we should be talking about.
You never know. Your story and insight may help someone
who's dealing with something similar.
S2 (01:32):
You can contact us via Email Studio one at org.
That's studio number one at Vision Australia.
S4 (01:38):
Org or of course, you can drop us a note
on our Facebook page by going to facebook.com Slash Radio Network.
S2 (01:46):
Hello, Lizzie. How are we going this fine day?
S4 (01:49):
Well, apart from someone trying to convince us to sell
our house, which we are renting so cannot do, but yeah,
we're pretty good. We're pretty good.
S2 (01:56):
That's a rather surrealist way of starting. Starting the day,
I suppose. Uh, yes. So it's been a rather, um, busy, uh,
few days as we've, uh, trying to get material together
for this week's show. But, I mean, what we are
looking at here is technology and just those bits of
technology that may not have us in mind, as it were. So, um,
(02:17):
we will be talking in effect to, uh, Steve Mangini,
who is the technical lead for Access Technology services, but
also something else that sort of crossed our desk, really.
And when you say technology, not for us. That is
self-service checkouts.
S4 (02:32):
Yeah, we have a problem with them too. And Steven
has expressed multiple times his dismay with the KFC and
Macca's touch screens. But there is a workaround in that
there are apps for both Macca's and KFC, and you
can use them to place your order for pickup before
(02:52):
you get there.
S2 (02:53):
Yeah, I'm sort of in two minds about that. I mean, okay,
maybe it's something telling us not to eat so much
junk food, but, you know, you do get some places
now also where you've got no choice but to go
to the, um, the self-service, I mean, target being one
of them. I'm quite happy to name the supermarket as well,
because target. Target is the one and only one that
I could sort of see where you've got no other
choice but to go there, and you've pretty much got
(03:14):
to flag somebody down to help you go through the checkout.
S4 (03:17):
Yeah, well, I mean, I wouldn't be going to target
alone as a totally blind person, just personally myself, just
because it's so hard to navigate and actually finding what
I want would be a nightmare. But, you know, if
you want to do that, then hats off to you.
And exactly. You should be given the freedom of choice
to speak to a person to assist you if that's
(03:39):
what you want to do.
S2 (03:40):
But that's enough about us. We asked a few other
people what they thought.
S5 (03:45):
I would say self-service checkouts in the supermarket. I would
say the self-service fast food outlets are you go to yourself,
you put in your order on a big screen.
S2 (03:58):
So is there anything particular about those systems that you
find particularly objectionable?
S5 (04:04):
Uh, with the supermarkets scanning the products is okay, but
when it comes to fruit and veg, making sure that
you've chosen the right one. My experience is you click
on fruit and veg and it comes up with all
the options, but remembering exactly what sort of apples you've chosen, um,
you know, and making sure that you choose the right
(04:24):
one from the selection. And the other problem I think
I've had is accidentally pressing the thing that says, do
you want to use bonus? Um, do you want to
use some flybuys points to pay for it? And accidentally pressing. Yes.
Or I meant to press no.
S2 (04:38):
Okay, so what about the fast food? Uh, what's annoying
about those?
S5 (04:41):
Just the interface. It's all. It's all white. I've one
in particular I'm thinking of. It's. It's all white. And
the the writing's not that big. And, I mean, there's
so many items on their menu. I mean, when you
know exactly what you want, it's not. It's not the
easiest to find exactly what you want. You sort of
got to go through all these other. Okay. Burgers, chicken burgers.
(05:06):
And then there's about 5 or 6 different types of
chicken burgers. And, uh, you know, the old cliche, do
you want fries with that? Do you want to change
it into a meal? Also, like, um, the experience. Well,
you and I both had recently. We wanted to get breakfast,
and it was just. It was just an ordeal. We
(05:27):
just felt it kept throwing us back to the beginning
all the time. And there's just no one around to
to sort of get assistance from Stephen.
S4 (05:36):
Firstly, I'll start off with you. Tell us the story
about the reverse cycle air conditioning that we have in
our home.
S6 (05:45):
Well, we got a ducted air conditioning heating system put in.
I told them it was for a blind couple and
they said, yeah, yeah, it's okay. My fault. I should
have asked him if I could see the screen. There
was no push buttons. There was no the screen itself.
It's just a flat screen. There's nothing to feel. It
doesn't make any noise when you turn it on and off.
(06:06):
So it's completely inaccessible for blind people. You can't access
anything in the menu. You can't turn the air conditioner
on full. Change the different settings.
S7 (06:16):
Do you not even have an app? Like, is there
not even a QR code to download an app for
the thing?
S8 (06:23):
No, they never told us about one.
S9 (06:25):
Because if you still have the instruction.
S7 (06:27):
Book, you want to get one of your workers to
read through that and see if there's a QR code
that you can point your phone at and grab an app.
Hopefully that will be a workaround because the apps are usually,
pardon me, semi accessible, at least inasmuch as you can
turn the thing on and off.
S6 (06:44):
The Bluetooth operator. But what they meant was is the
unit in the ceiling Bluetooth to the control panel.
S4 (06:52):
Sean, you also have a story of inaccessible air conditioners.
S7 (06:56):
I do, but mine at least has physical buttons on it.
S8 (06:59):
Well, tell us about it.
S7 (07:00):
Well, it was in here when I moved in here,
so if anything goes wrong with it, the onus is
on me to get something done about it. That being said,
as I said, it's got physical buttons on it, so
I know which one turns it on and off because
it's got a bump on the button. or now which
one does the temperature? Because I had it read to
me and pointed out to me, changing the, you know,
(07:21):
from heat to cold. I haven't worked that out yet.
S4 (07:23):
One of the things for me that really drives me
mad is with the advent of all of these new
blind and low vision specific technology. I do have a
couple questions for the creators. Firstly, why are the voices
so obnoxiously loud? Not all of us that are blind
or low vision have hearing impairments.
S7 (07:42):
Why are the voices so obnoxiously synthesized?
S4 (07:45):
Well, that too, but also, there's no need to tell
me that the fryer temperature is high after I've just
spent 20 minutes using the air fryer.
S6 (07:53):
And the only way to stop that from going on
for the next 20 minutes is to turn it off
at the power point.
S4 (07:58):
Oh, so Lisa has a microwave that even if you
haven't put anything in it, as soon as you open
the door, it goes beware hot contents.
S9 (08:05):
Yeah, that's.
S7 (08:06):
Kind of a bit naff. Corey's got a ring doorbell
and I set it up for her. She can somewhat
use it on the phone, but what she does is
because we linked it to her lady a she can
tell it to talk to the front door and she
can find out who's there, because it's sort of an
intercom as well as a doorbell. It gives you an
alert when someone comes to the door. Anyhow, you mentioned
(08:27):
the other day when we was talking about the all
in one thing in the public dunnies you got to
get your hand just so to get the soap on there. Uh,
and then you got one for the water, and then
you got one for the hand dryer, and they're all
in the one place.
S6 (08:40):
Well, the other day, I spent five minutes trying to
get the soap to come out of the hand dispenser,
and I didn't realise that one of those automatic ones.
And you got to sort of wave your hand underneath it. Yeah.
And even that doesn't work half the time. Yeah. Modern technology. Right.
S4 (08:53):
Maybe they're all out of soap.
S7 (08:55):
Oh, well, that's also possible.
S6 (08:56):
Like when I used to go to the gym, when
I was trim and taut and I looked like Arnold Schwarzenegger.
S4 (09:01):
Well, pretend that was actually. Yeah, yeah. Well.
S6 (09:06):
Yeah. Well, I used to use this elliptical bike. What
do you call it? The one that you sit back on. Well,
this this screen has tiny little riding on it, and
you have to pedal at the same time as selecting
what program or whatever you got to do on the screen.
So with me, I have to have your nose up
against the screen to be able to see it. So
I'm sort of bending over in half. And if I
stop pedaling, the thing will stop. The program will stop
(09:28):
and I have to start all over again. But again,
it's all touch screen. It's all tiny little riding. You
can't enlarge or anything like that, so you have to
get somebody else to do that while you're pedaling. Otherwise
it will just stop. Yeah, similar sort of thing with
a treadmill. I remember back in the towns and school days,
we had an old treadmill there that had one dial
(09:49):
on it, and it turned right to go faster and
turn it left to go slower. That's how simple things
were back then.
S7 (09:56):
Yeah, we had a treadmill like that. It had a
start and stop button and a dial.
S4 (09:59):
Our treadmill is supposed to link up to the iFit.
It's a pro forma model, like you need site just
to be able to link it up to your phone.
The same was with my smart trainer when I had one,
and linking it up to my phone. I couldn't do
it by myself.
S7 (10:14):
Even even with that, you know, there should be some,
you know, form of accessibility, like where it talks enough
for you to be able to push a button or something.
A lot of companies still see accessibility as a feature
and not a requirement. True. We can try and legislate it,
but a lot of these companies focus on their bottom line,
(10:37):
and if it doesn't improve their bottom line, then they're
not going to do it. To write bigger companies like
Apple or Google or Microsoft where they can absorb all
of that, they'll do it because, you know, it's there's
something that they know that people need. But, you know,
smaller companies that can't afford that extra development when in
(10:58):
actual fact, it's just a matter of one tick box
somewhere in the IDE. They tend not to do anything
about it.
S4 (11:05):
What's the solution, do you think?
S7 (11:07):
I don't know, the going backwards is the right idea,
so make the apps more usable at least. Why not
do like they did with the ATMs back in the day,
where you could stick a pair of headphones in and
it would enable the accessibility functionality? There's still ATMs that
are accessible, even they have touch screens now. So that's
another thing that really needs some attention. Companies just need
(11:31):
to be made aware. And I'll tell you something for nothing.
You attract more flies with honey than with vinegar. If
you come at them all gung ho and oh, you
got to do this. Otherwise I'll go here, there and
everywhere and blah, blah blah. They're going to turn around
and tell you to go away.
S2 (11:45):
Yeah.
S6 (11:46):
In no uncertain terms. That means don't go to them
with a sort of like an idea, or.
S7 (11:52):
You explain to them in a calm, polite manner what's needed,
why it's needed, and see if they are willing to
come on board and provide that sort of functionality and
allow them the right of reply to explain why they
think they are unable or whether they think they can.
(12:13):
Because if you, as I said, if you come at
them with all guns blazing, they're just going to turn
their back on you and tell you to go someplace
else or go all the way away.
S2 (12:23):
Now we cross to our featured interview. Steve Mangini, Access
Technology service development lead for Vision Australia. G'day, Steve.
S3 (12:30):
Thanks, Sam. Thanks for having me along.
S2 (12:32):
I suppose tell us a little bit about yourself. Um,
what got you started in this gig in the first place?
When did you first get started with Vision Australia?
S3 (12:39):
Well, after the marathon career failed, of course. Um, I've
been at Vision Australia now for, uh, for 19 years, uh,
and most of that time in this access technology role.
So supporting clients to, uh, in that technology space, whether
that's uh, with, with phones, their computers, uh, smart speakers
and uh, and all the whole range of things. So
(13:00):
it's been a long while now coming up, 19 years.
S2 (13:03):
What sort of inspired you to start, um, in this particular, um,
line of career.
S3 (13:08):
I've been involved in, uh, in it previously, and, uh,
the opportunity came across at Vision Australia and I thought
it looked quite interesting. So at that stage, I didn't
know a lot about the technology, the specific technology that
people with low vision use. But, uh, came across into
the role and, um, yeah, I found it really rewarding.
(13:28):
It's been a fantastic, fantastic journey.
S2 (13:31):
So prior to doing what you're doing now, had you
had much involvement with the disability community, or did you
know anybody with a with a vision impairment?
S3 (13:38):
Yeah. No, I hadn't, uh, hadn't come across anyone with
a vision impairment previously. Yeah.
S4 (13:42):
Do you think that there's anything that you've learned over
the last 19 years that's really surprised you that you've gone,
oh my goodness, I. I wouldn't have even thought of that.
S3 (13:51):
I guess I'm just surprised at how at the ingenuity
of of clients and some clients and how they apply
different technology and to, to do whatever task that they want.
So it's quite amazing what I've seen, what I've seen
people do, you know, from being able to, uh, to
roast the chicken and, and smoke the chicken and things for,
(14:12):
for Christmas and and a smoked salmon and things like that.
And uh, some people do car repairs and things like that.
My former boss had no vision, and, uh, I'd ring
him up. If I had a problem with my car,
I'd ring him up and he'd be able to diagnose
it for me. Like, it's just, uh, the ingenuity and
the knowledge that some people with blindness and low vision
(14:33):
have is just, just incredible.
S2 (14:34):
Alright, so on to the subject of today's show. So, um,
in the course of your day, what would the sort
of questions be that would cross your desk? I mean,
have you encountered some similar issues as what we're talking
about here, where you just get the feeling that certain
items of technology just are not designed for us?
S3 (14:53):
There's always a workaround, I guess. Uh, uh, and that's
part of our role at Access Technology specialist at Vision Australia.
So and I guess many other service providers that Vision Australia,
it's about understanding what the person's goals are and what
they want to achieve is and then trying to work
out a workaround. So in most cases there is a workaround.
There are some things that are just not. But in
(15:14):
most cases there is. So I know we're talking about today,
one of the concerns people have is the accessibility of
their air conditioners and things like that. So, um, you know,
the solution is there's a there's a, an intermediary program
called a sensibo. And it, it connects to the, to
the air conditioner system. And it actually provides, um, you're
(15:36):
able to then to link the sensibo into your smart
home products. So your Alexa or your Google Home, and
you can control the air conditioner via voice. And also,
you know, it can also set it from, from away
from home. So you can actually on your way home,
you can set the heater on or the cooler on
and uh, and do that. So there are, you know,
(15:56):
many workarounds and ways around, uh, some of the problems that, uh,
and difficulties that some people have.
S2 (16:02):
I'm presuming, though, in that case, I mean, how does
the actual, um, uh, item install is it hardwired in
or is it would you have to have it professionally
put in, or is it something that goes in through
the Wi-Fi system or something like that.
S3 (16:14):
Yeah, just on the Wi-Fi system. So yes, it's about, um,
connecting to the remote control of your of your air conditioner.
And then, um, uh, then, as I said, it connects
up to your smart home speaker, so you can even
control it that way.
S2 (16:28):
So of course, we will include links to the, um,
what was it called again?
S3 (16:34):
Sensibo.
S2 (16:35):
Sensibo. So we'll include links to the product there in
our podcast notes. Of course. Um, I mean, it strikes
me as some things that, um, as technology's got more advanced,
the accessibility is actually gone down. And we'll stick with
air conditioning for a while because I'm old enough to
remember the old style boxes that used to jut outside
the window. And pretty much anybody could, um, use those.
(16:55):
You could get a vague idea because all knobs and buttons.
Now we've got touch pads and things like that which
are not tactile in the slightest.
S4 (17:03):
I had one of those recently up until it blew
itself up. Yeah.
S10 (17:07):
Aha.
S2 (17:08):
Have you got some examples that, uh, would, um, blow
the minds of our listeners as far as the ingenuity.
So things that are just completely out of the box.
S3 (17:16):
I guess one of the one of the latest things that, uh,
that interests me, um, uh, I had a, uh, one
of my colleagues again, um, has no vision, uh, was
out fishing, and he sent me a perfectly framed, uh,
video of him, uh, reeling in a fish the other day. So, um,
what he was able to do with his smart glasses,
wearing his, uh, the meta glasses and taking the video? Uh,
(17:38):
it was actually quite amazing. The, uh, the quality of
the video that came through.
S2 (17:42):
That actually brings us up to another subject. I mean,
because essentially what we're dealing with nowadays is you've got
two forms of technology. There's the technology that is slowly
evolving to be more adaptive. So we're talking like the
meta glasses and things like that, but are sold to
the general public as opposed to the specialist technology, which, well,
ultimately is more expensive, which is fine if you're on
(18:05):
an NDIS plan, but not everybody is on NDIS. So
maybe you can tell us a bit more about meta glasses,
for example, and what sort of uses can we put
to them? If you if you are out there and
you want to get some.
S3 (18:15):
Yeah. Well, the meter glass is, um, you know, one
of the big game changers and, and there'll be, um,
several products following very soon, so. Well, it's the metal
glasses at the moment. There are others in, in the pipeline,
you know, you can ask her to describe the scene
that's in front of you, and it will actually give
a description. It's using artificial intelligence AI to to do that.
(18:37):
And then you can ask it more questions. So you know,
what were the clouds like? Or for instance, if I
was to take a picture of myself at the moment,
I would say a man sitting at a keyboard, at
a desk with a screen, and then I could actually
ask her, what's what brand is the monitor? And it
will actually come back and give me the answer and
things like that. If I take go to a cafe,
for instance, I can ask, you know, I, I can
(18:58):
get the glasses to tell me what, what items have
got chicken in it or how much was the chicken parmigiana,
that sort of thing. But you can also do very
interesting things. I've got one client who, um, whose husband
has got mobility issues. So she's actually worked out that
through they can connect up through WhatsApp, and he can
be out in the car and watching and seeing the
(19:22):
video from the she's taking off her glasses. So she's
inside the supermarket. She can actually pick up the carton
of milk, show him the use by date, and he
can actually read it. Or, you know, whether it's a
low fat or skim milk or a full cream milk
and that sort of thing. So yeah, it's quite amazing
how some people are applying the use of the glasses.
And to go back to where we started, I guess,
(19:43):
is the use of Alexa and Google Home and the
smart home speakers, because these days you can get your
smart lights and all your smart devices, and you can
control them all by voice. And, uh, and that is, um,
quite groundbreaking, you know? So not only does it mean
you can control it by voice and know what you're doing, but,
(20:04):
you know, things like you can turn your washing machine
on at 10 a.m. in the morning when you've got
use of the solar power and things like that, and
you may not even be home to do it. You
can actually using your smart devices connected up to your
smart home. Then it's it's possible to do a lot
of things. So you can turn on your lights on
and off. You can broadcast if you've got 3 or
(20:25):
4 smart homes, you can broadcast a message to tell
everyone to come out for dinner and and those sorts
of things. So what you can do in that smart
home space is, uh, is really quite amazing as well.
You know, controlling your TV, playing your radio stations, all
that sort of thing. The smart home speakers are capable
of doing all that.
S2 (20:43):
So we've gone high tech, but not everything is connected
to Wi-Fi. There are some, well, older things, I guess.
S3 (20:51):
Sam and Lizzie. What? Uh, the suggestion there would be
that if if someone's got a, um, something they can't
do and they need to be able to do it,
that's where they could contact the Vision Australia office. And
either whether it's in the space of an orientation mobility
specialist and occupational therapist or access technology specialist, they could
come out and investigate what some potential solutions are and
(21:13):
work with the person to develop the right solution for them.
S2 (21:16):
So where does your job start and where does your
job finish? As far as all of that goes? I mean, um,
if we've got a problem with something that is slightly
outside your wheelhouse, you're able to refer people. And of course, um,
they're able to refer to you.
S3 (21:29):
That's right. So we work in, uh, across disciplinary and
transdisciplinary approach. So if it's not us, that's, uh, as
big when I say us as an access technology specialist,
but he may be one of the OTS that might
be able to provide some, some better knowledge than we'd
refer the refer the person on to the OT or
(21:49):
the ONM or the other person, the other service provider
that could provide some support in that space.
S2 (21:54):
All right. Moving on to gadgets. I just want to
know if there's anything that's come across your desk that
is just plain cool that you'd like to share with us.
S3 (22:02):
I know we've already mentioned the meta glasses, but I think, um,
I think the glasses and the various technology that's coming
with them and where they'll go in the next 12
months is probably the most groundbreaking space that we've been
in for a while. Smartphones changed everything that we did, uh,
back ten, 12 years ago. And I've got the got
(22:24):
the sense that, you know, the meta glasses and what
they're capable of are going to be, um, almost as prolific,
I think, uh, moving forward for, uh, for people who
are blind or have low vision.
S2 (22:35):
Talking of smartphones, so the most common sort of acquired
wisdom is that, uh, yes, the iPhone is way more
user friendly for blind people. Where would you stand on that?
S3 (22:45):
The answer to that is partially. It depends. So for
our low vision, for someone with low vision, then the
Android have ability to do some more work around, uh,
setting up different home screens, some large button options and
things and other visual enhancements. So the Android phones are
very good in that space, working with visual enhancements and
(23:07):
things like that. Uh, in terms of blindness, there is
the voiceover screen reader for the iPhones and talkback on
the Android. Most people, most users will find VoiceOver to
be more consistent, and the apps supported by the Apple
Store more consistent and better across the range of apps. However,
there will be talkback users who will who will argue
(23:29):
the opposite that Talkback is equally as capable. So I
think the general sense is that the iPhone, in that
in that VoiceOver screen reader is slightly better. But, um,
Android isn't far behind.
S2 (23:39):
What about, um, um, other pieces of information technology, for example,
a mac versus windows?
S3 (23:46):
Yeah. So again, it's a horses for courses type type setup.
Windows has become very good. Uh, windows magnifier and rate
has improved um and Nvda. So they're all free applications
that you can put on the computers. And, um, it's
actually very good. A lot of that same basic accessibility
is also available on the Mac in terms of the
(24:07):
visual enhancements, speech on demand. And there's also the VoiceOver
screen reader for Mac. So it's really just depends what
what you've grown up with, what you're used to, what
what system you're used to. Uh, in the workplace, most
workplace is a windows. So it tends to be windows focused. But, uh,
the Macs is certainly, um, it will just depend what,
(24:29):
what system the clients using because the there is, uh,
screen readers and visual enhancements available in both systems, both platforms.
S2 (24:36):
And uh, there are also third party software programs that, uh,
if you have the spare money you can actually use
as well.
S3 (24:42):
Yeah, not so much for the Apple in terms of
accessibility when we're when you're talking windows and Zoomtext and, um, supernova,
those sorts of programs, jaws that are paid options, uh,
that they are windows specific. There's not so many of
those sort of options. Well, in fact, there's no none
of those sort of options available on the Mac, uh,
(25:04):
things like Dragon. And that will still work. So for
people that want to dictate that, certainly Dragon is available
in both platforms. So just again, it just depends, um,
where the person starts with. And we'll provide the support
and some training in, uh, depending on whichever platform the
client is using.
S2 (25:21):
So talking of adaptive software, I mean, in my day
it used to be Jaws. If you need a screen
reader and zoom text if you need screen magnification, I'm
sure there must be more out there. And I mean,
are they still the big two or are they, uh,
more suitable applications out there nowadays?
S3 (25:37):
Well, again, Jaws and Zoomtext are not cheap. Uh, and, uh,
you need a reasonable, reasonable amount of funding, uh, or
a good funding budget to, uh, to pay for Jaws
and Zoomtext for some people, for a lot of people
who only need lower levels of magnification. There's windows magnifier, um,
and and is on on an apple on a mac. There's, uh,
(25:57):
there's zoom and magnify has a series of visual enhancements
available so you can change your pointer size and your
background colors and things like that. So the accessibility features
available now, um, in a standard windows installation, uh, with magnifier.
And the other accessibility features is are really quite good
(26:19):
and for a lot of clients, um, it's all they need.
It's only, uh, people that, uh, require greater levels of
magnification or some slightly more sophisticated, uh, solutions that we
would go to either Zoomtext supernova is another one in
spectrum or, um, an any screen reader such as, uh,
Nvda which is free and and jaws.
S2 (26:41):
No worries. Okay. Steve Menghetti, thank you for joining us. And, uh, um.
Keep cruising.
S3 (26:46):
Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Lizzie. Thanks for your time.
S2 (26:48):
He's got to run.
S3 (26:49):
Indeed.
S2 (26:51):
That is a wrap for this week. A big thank
you to Steve Minghetti. Also to Stephen, Heidi and Sean
for giving us their opinions.
S4 (26:59):
And of course, a big thanks to you for listening.
That's including our listeners on the Reading Radio Network.
S2 (27:06):
What have we got next week?
S4 (27:07):
We are looking into how to get fit, especially if
you've never delved into the world of health and fitness.
We look at some of the accessible apps and resources
that are available, and we also shine a light on
things that still need some work.
S2 (27:24):
But between now and then, please do get in touch
with the show. Whether you have experience of any of
the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio One,
or if you think there's something we should be talking about.
You never know. Your story and insight may help somebody
else who is dealing with something similar.
S4 (27:38):
You can contact us via email at studio. Org. That's
studio number one at Vision Australia. Or of course, you
can drop us a note on Facebook or Instagram by
searching for VA Radio Network.
S2 (27:54):
Bye for now.
S1 (27:55):
Studio one was produced in the Adelaide studios of Vision
Australia Radio. This show was made possible with the help
of the Community Broadcasting Foundation. Find out more at.
This is Studio One with Sam Rickard and Lizzie Eastham
on Vision Australia Radio.
S2 (00:24):
With the lead up to the 25th anniversary of Sydney 2000.
It gives me great pleasure to be joined by the
one and only great marathon runner, Steve Moneghetti. G'day, Steve.
S3 (00:34):
Uh, Sam. Sorry. Sorry to disappoint, but, uh, you're the
first person who's asked today. But I'm not the marathon runner, unfortunately.
S2 (00:41):
What? Who? Why did not anybody tell me about this?
S4 (00:46):
Oh, look, mate, I am really sorry. Look, you know, Sam,
being honoured.
S2 (00:51):
I am shredding a week's worth of research. Oh, I'm Sam.
S4 (00:58):
And I'm Lizzie.
S2 (00:59):
And this is Studio One, your weekly look at life
from a low vision and blind point of view here
on Vision Australia Radio this week.
S4 (01:05):
Do you get the feeling that some pieces of technology
are just not for us?
S2 (01:09):
We catch up with Steve Moneghetti. Vision Australia's access technology
service development lead to point us in the right direction.
S4 (01:17):
As we always say at this point, please do get
in touch with the show. Whether you have any experience
of the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio One,
or if you think there's something we should be talking about.
You never know. Your story and insight may help someone
who's dealing with something similar.
S2 (01:32):
You can contact us via Email Studio one at org.
That's studio number one at Vision Australia.
S4 (01:38):
Org or of course, you can drop us a note
on our Facebook page by going to facebook.com Slash Radio Network.
S2 (01:46):
Hello, Lizzie. How are we going this fine day?
S4 (01:49):
Well, apart from someone trying to convince us to sell
our house, which we are renting so cannot do, but yeah,
we're pretty good. We're pretty good.
S2 (01:56):
That's a rather surrealist way of starting. Starting the day,
I suppose. Uh, yes. So it's been a rather, um, busy, uh,
few days as we've, uh, trying to get material together
for this week's show. But, I mean, what we are
looking at here is technology and just those bits of
technology that may not have us in mind, as it were. So, um,
(02:17):
we will be talking in effect to, uh, Steve Mangini,
who is the technical lead for Access Technology services, but
also something else that sort of crossed our desk, really.
And when you say technology, not for us. That is
self-service checkouts.
S4 (02:32):
Yeah, we have a problem with them too. And Steven
has expressed multiple times his dismay with the KFC and
Macca's touch screens. But there is a workaround in that
there are apps for both Macca's and KFC, and you
can use them to place your order for pickup before
(02:52):
you get there.
S2 (02:53):
Yeah, I'm sort of in two minds about that. I mean, okay,
maybe it's something telling us not to eat so much
junk food, but, you know, you do get some places
now also where you've got no choice but to go
to the, um, the self-service, I mean, target being one
of them. I'm quite happy to name the supermarket as well,
because target. Target is the one and only one that
I could sort of see where you've got no other
choice but to go there, and you've pretty much got
(03:14):
to flag somebody down to help you go through the checkout.
S4 (03:17):
Yeah, well, I mean, I wouldn't be going to target
alone as a totally blind person, just personally myself, just
because it's so hard to navigate and actually finding what
I want would be a nightmare. But, you know, if
you want to do that, then hats off to you.
And exactly. You should be given the freedom of choice
to speak to a person to assist you if that's
(03:39):
what you want to do.
S2 (03:40):
But that's enough about us. We asked a few other
people what they thought.
S5 (03:45):
I would say self-service checkouts in the supermarket. I would
say the self-service fast food outlets are you go to yourself,
you put in your order on a big screen.
S2 (03:58):
So is there anything particular about those systems that you
find particularly objectionable?
S5 (04:04):
Uh, with the supermarkets scanning the products is okay, but
when it comes to fruit and veg, making sure that
you've chosen the right one. My experience is you click
on fruit and veg and it comes up with all
the options, but remembering exactly what sort of apples you've chosen, um,
you know, and making sure that you choose the right
(04:24):
one from the selection. And the other problem I think
I've had is accidentally pressing the thing that says, do
you want to use bonus? Um, do you want to
use some flybuys points to pay for it? And accidentally pressing. Yes.
Or I meant to press no.
S2 (04:38):
Okay, so what about the fast food? Uh, what's annoying
about those?
S5 (04:41):
Just the interface. It's all. It's all white. I've one
in particular I'm thinking of. It's. It's all white. And
the the writing's not that big. And, I mean, there's
so many items on their menu. I mean, when you
know exactly what you want, it's not. It's not the
easiest to find exactly what you want. You sort of
got to go through all these other. Okay. Burgers, chicken burgers.
(05:06):
And then there's about 5 or 6 different types of
chicken burgers. And, uh, you know, the old cliche, do
you want fries with that? Do you want to change
it into a meal? Also, like, um, the experience. Well,
you and I both had recently. We wanted to get breakfast,
and it was just. It was just an ordeal. We
(05:27):
just felt it kept throwing us back to the beginning
all the time. And there's just no one around to
to sort of get assistance from Stephen.
S4 (05:36):
Firstly, I'll start off with you. Tell us the story
about the reverse cycle air conditioning that we have in
our home.
S6 (05:45):
Well, we got a ducted air conditioning heating system put in.
I told them it was for a blind couple and
they said, yeah, yeah, it's okay. My fault. I should
have asked him if I could see the screen. There
was no push buttons. There was no the screen itself.
It's just a flat screen. There's nothing to feel. It
doesn't make any noise when you turn it on and off.
(06:06):
So it's completely inaccessible for blind people. You can't access
anything in the menu. You can't turn the air conditioner
on full. Change the different settings.
S7 (06:16):
Do you not even have an app? Like, is there
not even a QR code to download an app for
the thing?
S8 (06:23):
No, they never told us about one.
S9 (06:25):
Because if you still have the instruction.
S7 (06:27):
Book, you want to get one of your workers to
read through that and see if there's a QR code
that you can point your phone at and grab an app.
Hopefully that will be a workaround because the apps are usually,
pardon me, semi accessible, at least inasmuch as you can
turn the thing on and off.
S6 (06:44):
The Bluetooth operator. But what they meant was is the
unit in the ceiling Bluetooth to the control panel.
S4 (06:52):
Sean, you also have a story of inaccessible air conditioners.
S7 (06:56):
I do, but mine at least has physical buttons on it.
S8 (06:59):
Well, tell us about it.
S7 (07:00):
Well, it was in here when I moved in here,
so if anything goes wrong with it, the onus is
on me to get something done about it. That being said,
as I said, it's got physical buttons on it, so
I know which one turns it on and off because
it's got a bump on the button. or now which
one does the temperature? Because I had it read to
me and pointed out to me, changing the, you know,
(07:21):
from heat to cold. I haven't worked that out yet.
S4 (07:23):
One of the things for me that really drives me
mad is with the advent of all of these new
blind and low vision specific technology. I do have a
couple questions for the creators. Firstly, why are the voices
so obnoxiously loud? Not all of us that are blind
or low vision have hearing impairments.
S7 (07:42):
Why are the voices so obnoxiously synthesized?
S4 (07:45):
Well, that too, but also, there's no need to tell
me that the fryer temperature is high after I've just
spent 20 minutes using the air fryer.
S6 (07:53):
And the only way to stop that from going on
for the next 20 minutes is to turn it off
at the power point.
S4 (07:58):
Oh, so Lisa has a microwave that even if you
haven't put anything in it, as soon as you open
the door, it goes beware hot contents.
S9 (08:05):
Yeah, that's.
S7 (08:06):
Kind of a bit naff. Corey's got a ring doorbell
and I set it up for her. She can somewhat
use it on the phone, but what she does is
because we linked it to her lady a she can
tell it to talk to the front door and she
can find out who's there, because it's sort of an
intercom as well as a doorbell. It gives you an
alert when someone comes to the door. Anyhow, you mentioned
(08:27):
the other day when we was talking about the all
in one thing in the public dunnies you got to
get your hand just so to get the soap on there. Uh,
and then you got one for the water, and then
you got one for the hand dryer, and they're all
in the one place.
S6 (08:40):
Well, the other day, I spent five minutes trying to
get the soap to come out of the hand dispenser,
and I didn't realise that one of those automatic ones.
And you got to sort of wave your hand underneath it. Yeah.
And even that doesn't work half the time. Yeah. Modern technology. Right.
S4 (08:53):
Maybe they're all out of soap.
S7 (08:55):
Oh, well, that's also possible.
S6 (08:56):
Like when I used to go to the gym, when
I was trim and taut and I looked like Arnold Schwarzenegger.
S4 (09:01):
Well, pretend that was actually. Yeah, yeah. Well.
S6 (09:06):
Yeah. Well, I used to use this elliptical bike. What
do you call it? The one that you sit back on. Well,
this this screen has tiny little riding on it, and
you have to pedal at the same time as selecting
what program or whatever you got to do on the screen.
So with me, I have to have your nose up
against the screen to be able to see it. So
I'm sort of bending over in half. And if I
stop pedaling, the thing will stop. The program will stop
(09:28):
and I have to start all over again. But again,
it's all touch screen. It's all tiny little riding. You
can't enlarge or anything like that, so you have to
get somebody else to do that while you're pedaling. Otherwise
it will just stop. Yeah, similar sort of thing with
a treadmill. I remember back in the towns and school days,
we had an old treadmill there that had one dial
(09:49):
on it, and it turned right to go faster and
turn it left to go slower. That's how simple things
were back then.
S7 (09:56):
Yeah, we had a treadmill like that. It had a
start and stop button and a dial.
S4 (09:59):
Our treadmill is supposed to link up to the iFit.
It's a pro forma model, like you need site just
to be able to link it up to your phone.
The same was with my smart trainer when I had one,
and linking it up to my phone. I couldn't do
it by myself.
S7 (10:14):
Even even with that, you know, there should be some,
you know, form of accessibility, like where it talks enough
for you to be able to push a button or something.
A lot of companies still see accessibility as a feature
and not a requirement. True. We can try and legislate it,
but a lot of these companies focus on their bottom line,
(10:37):
and if it doesn't improve their bottom line, then they're
not going to do it. To write bigger companies like
Apple or Google or Microsoft where they can absorb all
of that, they'll do it because, you know, it's there's
something that they know that people need. But, you know,
smaller companies that can't afford that extra development when in
(10:58):
actual fact, it's just a matter of one tick box
somewhere in the IDE. They tend not to do anything
about it.
S4 (11:05):
What's the solution, do you think?
S7 (11:07):
I don't know, the going backwards is the right idea,
so make the apps more usable at least. Why not
do like they did with the ATMs back in the day,
where you could stick a pair of headphones in and
it would enable the accessibility functionality? There's still ATMs that
are accessible, even they have touch screens now. So that's
another thing that really needs some attention. Companies just need
(11:31):
to be made aware. And I'll tell you something for nothing.
You attract more flies with honey than with vinegar. If
you come at them all gung ho and oh, you
got to do this. Otherwise I'll go here, there and
everywhere and blah, blah blah. They're going to turn around
and tell you to go away.
S2 (11:45):
Yeah.
S6 (11:46):
In no uncertain terms. That means don't go to them
with a sort of like an idea, or.
S7 (11:52):
You explain to them in a calm, polite manner what's needed,
why it's needed, and see if they are willing to
come on board and provide that sort of functionality and
allow them the right of reply to explain why they
think they are unable or whether they think they can.
(12:13):
Because if you, as I said, if you come at
them with all guns blazing, they're just going to turn
their back on you and tell you to go someplace
else or go all the way away.
S2 (12:23):
Now we cross to our featured interview. Steve Mangini, Access
Technology service development lead for Vision Australia. G'day, Steve.
S3 (12:30):
Thanks, Sam. Thanks for having me along.
S2 (12:32):
I suppose tell us a little bit about yourself. Um,
what got you started in this gig in the first place?
When did you first get started with Vision Australia?
S3 (12:39):
Well, after the marathon career failed, of course. Um, I've
been at Vision Australia now for, uh, for 19 years, uh,
and most of that time in this access technology role.
So supporting clients to, uh, in that technology space, whether
that's uh, with, with phones, their computers, uh, smart speakers
and uh, and all the whole range of things. So
(13:00):
it's been a long while now coming up, 19 years.
S2 (13:03):
What sort of inspired you to start, um, in this particular, um,
line of career.
S3 (13:08):
I've been involved in, uh, in it previously, and, uh,
the opportunity came across at Vision Australia and I thought
it looked quite interesting. So at that stage, I didn't
know a lot about the technology, the specific technology that
people with low vision use. But, uh, came across into
the role and, um, yeah, I found it really rewarding.
(13:28):
It's been a fantastic, fantastic journey.
S2 (13:31):
So prior to doing what you're doing now, had you
had much involvement with the disability community, or did you
know anybody with a with a vision impairment?
S3 (13:38):
Yeah. No, I hadn't, uh, hadn't come across anyone with
a vision impairment previously. Yeah.
S4 (13:42):
Do you think that there's anything that you've learned over
the last 19 years that's really surprised you that you've gone,
oh my goodness, I. I wouldn't have even thought of that.
S3 (13:51):
I guess I'm just surprised at how at the ingenuity
of of clients and some clients and how they apply
different technology and to, to do whatever task that they want.
So it's quite amazing what I've seen, what I've seen
people do, you know, from being able to, uh, to
roast the chicken and, and smoke the chicken and things for,
(14:12):
for Christmas and and a smoked salmon and things like that.
And uh, some people do car repairs and things like that.
My former boss had no vision, and, uh, I'd ring
him up. If I had a problem with my car,
I'd ring him up and he'd be able to diagnose
it for me. Like, it's just, uh, the ingenuity and
the knowledge that some people with blindness and low vision
(14:33):
have is just, just incredible.
S2 (14:34):
Alright, so on to the subject of today's show. So, um,
in the course of your day, what would the sort
of questions be that would cross your desk? I mean,
have you encountered some similar issues as what we're talking
about here, where you just get the feeling that certain
items of technology just are not designed for us?
S3 (14:53):
There's always a workaround, I guess. Uh, uh, and that's
part of our role at Access Technology specialist at Vision Australia.
So and I guess many other service providers that Vision Australia,
it's about understanding what the person's goals are and what
they want to achieve is and then trying to work
out a workaround. So in most cases there is a workaround.
There are some things that are just not. But in
(15:14):
most cases there is. So I know we're talking about today,
one of the concerns people have is the accessibility of
their air conditioners and things like that. So, um, you know,
the solution is there's a there's a, an intermediary program
called a sensibo. And it, it connects to the, to
the air conditioner system. And it actually provides, um, you're
(15:36):
able to then to link the sensibo into your smart
home products. So your Alexa or your Google Home, and
you can control the air conditioner via voice. And also,
you know, it can also set it from, from away
from home. So you can actually on your way home,
you can set the heater on or the cooler on
and uh, and do that. So there are, you know,
(15:56):
many workarounds and ways around, uh, some of the problems that, uh,
and difficulties that some people have.
S2 (16:02):
I'm presuming, though, in that case, I mean, how does
the actual, um, uh, item install is it hardwired in
or is it would you have to have it professionally
put in, or is it something that goes in through
the Wi-Fi system or something like that.
S3 (16:14):
Yeah, just on the Wi-Fi system. So yes, it's about, um,
connecting to the remote control of your of your air conditioner.
And then, um, uh, then, as I said, it connects
up to your smart home speaker, so you can even
control it that way.
S2 (16:28):
So of course, we will include links to the, um,
what was it called again?
S3 (16:34):
Sensibo.
S2 (16:35):
Sensibo. So we'll include links to the product there in
our podcast notes. Of course. Um, I mean, it strikes
me as some things that, um, as technology's got more advanced,
the accessibility is actually gone down. And we'll stick with
air conditioning for a while because I'm old enough to
remember the old style boxes that used to jut outside
the window. And pretty much anybody could, um, use those.
(16:55):
You could get a vague idea because all knobs and buttons.
Now we've got touch pads and things like that which
are not tactile in the slightest.
S4 (17:03):
I had one of those recently up until it blew
itself up. Yeah.
S10 (17:07):
Aha.
S2 (17:08):
Have you got some examples that, uh, would, um, blow
the minds of our listeners as far as the ingenuity.
So things that are just completely out of the box.
S3 (17:16):
I guess one of the one of the latest things that, uh,
that interests me, um, uh, I had a, uh, one
of my colleagues again, um, has no vision, uh, was
out fishing, and he sent me a perfectly framed, uh,
video of him, uh, reeling in a fish the other day. So, um,
what he was able to do with his smart glasses,
wearing his, uh, the meta glasses and taking the video? Uh,
(17:38):
it was actually quite amazing. The, uh, the quality of
the video that came through.
S2 (17:42):
That actually brings us up to another subject. I mean,
because essentially what we're dealing with nowadays is you've got
two forms of technology. There's the technology that is slowly
evolving to be more adaptive. So we're talking like the
meta glasses and things like that, but are sold to
the general public as opposed to the specialist technology, which, well,
ultimately is more expensive, which is fine if you're on
(18:05):
an NDIS plan, but not everybody is on NDIS. So
maybe you can tell us a bit more about meta glasses,
for example, and what sort of uses can we put
to them? If you if you are out there and
you want to get some.
S3 (18:15):
Yeah. Well, the meter glass is, um, you know, one
of the big game changers and, and there'll be, um,
several products following very soon, so. Well, it's the metal
glasses at the moment. There are others in, in the pipeline,
you know, you can ask her to describe the scene
that's in front of you, and it will actually give
a description. It's using artificial intelligence AI to to do that.
(18:37):
And then you can ask it more questions. So you know,
what were the clouds like? Or for instance, if I
was to take a picture of myself at the moment,
I would say a man sitting at a keyboard, at
a desk with a screen, and then I could actually
ask her, what's what brand is the monitor? And it
will actually come back and give me the answer and
things like that. If I take go to a cafe,
for instance, I can ask, you know, I, I can
(18:58):
get the glasses to tell me what, what items have
got chicken in it or how much was the chicken parmigiana,
that sort of thing. But you can also do very
interesting things. I've got one client who, um, whose husband
has got mobility issues. So she's actually worked out that
through they can connect up through WhatsApp, and he can
be out in the car and watching and seeing the
(19:22):
video from the she's taking off her glasses. So she's
inside the supermarket. She can actually pick up the carton
of milk, show him the use by date, and he
can actually read it. Or, you know, whether it's a
low fat or skim milk or a full cream milk
and that sort of thing. So yeah, it's quite amazing
how some people are applying the use of the glasses.
And to go back to where we started, I guess,
(19:43):
is the use of Alexa and Google Home and the
smart home speakers, because these days you can get your
smart lights and all your smart devices, and you can
control them all by voice. And, uh, and that is, um,
quite groundbreaking, you know? So not only does it mean
you can control it by voice and know what you're doing, but,
(20:04):
you know, things like you can turn your washing machine
on at 10 a.m. in the morning when you've got
use of the solar power and things like that, and
you may not even be home to do it. You
can actually using your smart devices connected up to your
smart home. Then it's it's possible to do a lot
of things. So you can turn on your lights on
and off. You can broadcast if you've got 3 or
(20:25):
4 smart homes, you can broadcast a message to tell
everyone to come out for dinner and and those sorts
of things. So what you can do in that smart
home space is, uh, is really quite amazing as well.
You know, controlling your TV, playing your radio stations, all
that sort of thing. The smart home speakers are capable
of doing all that.
S2 (20:43):
So we've gone high tech, but not everything is connected
to Wi-Fi. There are some, well, older things, I guess.
S3 (20:51):
Sam and Lizzie. What? Uh, the suggestion there would be
that if if someone's got a, um, something they can't
do and they need to be able to do it,
that's where they could contact the Vision Australia office. And
either whether it's in the space of an orientation mobility
specialist and occupational therapist or access technology specialist, they could
come out and investigate what some potential solutions are and
(21:13):
work with the person to develop the right solution for them.
S2 (21:16):
So where does your job start and where does your
job finish? As far as all of that goes? I mean, um,
if we've got a problem with something that is slightly
outside your wheelhouse, you're able to refer people. And of course, um,
they're able to refer to you.
S3 (21:29):
That's right. So we work in, uh, across disciplinary and
transdisciplinary approach. So if it's not us, that's, uh, as
big when I say us as an access technology specialist,
but he may be one of the OTS that might
be able to provide some, some better knowledge than we'd
refer the refer the person on to the OT or
(21:49):
the ONM or the other person, the other service provider
that could provide some support in that space.
S2 (21:54):
All right. Moving on to gadgets. I just want to
know if there's anything that's come across your desk that
is just plain cool that you'd like to share with us.
S3 (22:02):
I know we've already mentioned the meta glasses, but I think, um,
I think the glasses and the various technology that's coming
with them and where they'll go in the next 12
months is probably the most groundbreaking space that we've been
in for a while. Smartphones changed everything that we did, uh,
back ten, 12 years ago. And I've got the got
(22:24):
the sense that, you know, the meta glasses and what
they're capable of are going to be, um, almost as prolific,
I think, uh, moving forward for, uh, for people who
are blind or have low vision.
S2 (22:35):
Talking of smartphones, so the most common sort of acquired
wisdom is that, uh, yes, the iPhone is way more
user friendly for blind people. Where would you stand on that?
S3 (22:45):
The answer to that is partially. It depends. So for
our low vision, for someone with low vision, then the
Android have ability to do some more work around, uh,
setting up different home screens, some large button options and
things and other visual enhancements. So the Android phones are
very good in that space, working with visual enhancements and
(23:07):
things like that. Uh, in terms of blindness, there is
the voiceover screen reader for the iPhones and talkback on
the Android. Most people, most users will find VoiceOver to
be more consistent, and the apps supported by the Apple
Store more consistent and better across the range of apps. However,
there will be talkback users who will who will argue
(23:29):
the opposite that Talkback is equally as capable. So I
think the general sense is that the iPhone, in that
in that VoiceOver screen reader is slightly better. But, um,
Android isn't far behind.
S2 (23:39):
What about, um, um, other pieces of information technology, for example,
a mac versus windows?
S3 (23:46):
Yeah. So again, it's a horses for courses type type setup.
Windows has become very good. Uh, windows magnifier and rate
has improved um and Nvda. So they're all free applications
that you can put on the computers. And, um, it's
actually very good. A lot of that same basic accessibility
is also available on the Mac in terms of the
(24:07):
visual enhancements, speech on demand. And there's also the VoiceOver
screen reader for Mac. So it's really just depends what
what you've grown up with, what you're used to, what
what system you're used to. Uh, in the workplace, most
workplace is a windows. So it tends to be windows focused. But, uh,
the Macs is certainly, um, it will just depend what,
(24:29):
what system the clients using because the there is, uh,
screen readers and visual enhancements available in both systems, both platforms.
S2 (24:36):
And uh, there are also third party software programs that, uh,
if you have the spare money you can actually use
as well.
S3 (24:42):
Yeah, not so much for the Apple in terms of
accessibility when we're when you're talking windows and Zoomtext and, um, supernova,
those sorts of programs, jaws that are paid options, uh,
that they are windows specific. There's not so many of
those sort of options. Well, in fact, there's no none
of those sort of options available on the Mac, uh,
(25:04):
things like Dragon. And that will still work. So for
people that want to dictate that, certainly Dragon is available
in both platforms. So just again, it just depends, um,
where the person starts with. And we'll provide the support
and some training in, uh, depending on whichever platform the
client is using.
S2 (25:21):
So talking of adaptive software, I mean, in my day
it used to be Jaws. If you need a screen
reader and zoom text if you need screen magnification, I'm
sure there must be more out there. And I mean,
are they still the big two or are they, uh,
more suitable applications out there nowadays?
S3 (25:37):
Well, again, Jaws and Zoomtext are not cheap. Uh, and, uh,
you need a reasonable, reasonable amount of funding, uh, or
a good funding budget to, uh, to pay for Jaws
and Zoomtext for some people, for a lot of people
who only need lower levels of magnification. There's windows magnifier, um,
and and is on on an apple on a mac. There's, uh,
(25:57):
there's zoom and magnify has a series of visual enhancements
available so you can change your pointer size and your
background colors and things like that. So the accessibility features
available now, um, in a standard windows installation, uh, with magnifier.
And the other accessibility features is are really quite good
(26:19):
and for a lot of clients, um, it's all they need.
It's only, uh, people that, uh, require greater levels of
magnification or some slightly more sophisticated, uh, solutions that we
would go to either Zoomtext supernova is another one in
spectrum or, um, an any screen reader such as, uh,
Nvda which is free and and jaws.
S2 (26:41):
No worries. Okay. Steve Menghetti, thank you for joining us. And, uh, um.
Keep cruising.
S3 (26:46):
Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Lizzie. Thanks for your time.
S2 (26:48):
He's got to run.
S3 (26:49):
Indeed.
S2 (26:51):
That is a wrap for this week. A big thank
you to Steve Minghetti. Also to Stephen, Heidi and Sean
for giving us their opinions.
S4 (26:59):
And of course, a big thanks to you for listening.
That's including our listeners on the Reading Radio Network.
S2 (27:06):
What have we got next week?
S4 (27:07):
We are looking into how to get fit, especially if
you've never delved into the world of health and fitness.
We look at some of the accessible apps and resources
that are available, and we also shine a light on
things that still need some work.
S2 (27:24):
But between now and then, please do get in touch
with the show. Whether you have experience of any of
the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio One,
or if you think there's something we should be talking about.
You never know. Your story and insight may help somebody
else who is dealing with something similar.
S4 (27:38):
You can contact us via email at studio. Org. That's
studio number one at Vision Australia. Or of course, you
can drop us a note on Facebook or Instagram by
searching for VA Radio Network.
S2 (27:54):
Bye for now.
S1 (27:55):
Studio one was produced in the Adelaide studios of Vision
Australia Radio. This show was made possible with the help
of the Community Broadcasting Foundation. Find out more at.
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