December 8, 2024 • 39 mins
Etch sparkling was developed by Jason and Andy Quin.
With a background in the wine industry, it seemed a natural progression for Jason and Andy to move to the non-alcoholic space once Jason gave up drinking alcohol.
Jason and Andy’s story is one like so many Australians, alcohol started to take the reins, and they made the decision to live an alcohol free life. So, in true Aussie spirit, they decided to make an amazing array of sparkling non-alcoholic drinks that use Australian Native edibles that were shared with them by Uncle Lionel Lauch from Living Culture.
Their drinks are amazing and they were the only available option when I stopped drinking and was feeling my way through an alcohol free lifestyle.
They share their story on the podcast this week, it was such a pleasure to chat with them both and understand all they are trying to achieve.
You can find their amazing drinks at
www.etchsparking.com.au
Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/tendernessnurses
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Appogie Production. Hi, my name's beck Woodbine and welcome to
Tenderness for Nurses. I'm grateful for the person that I
have the opportunity to be.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
So I hit it and parked it for Nelly four years.
We always have free will, We always get to choose.
We are autonomous.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Hi. Everyone, thank you for tuning back in to Tenderness
for Nurses. Today I have Andy and Jason from ELG
Sparkling chatting with me about their journey to producing and
the development of H Sparkling, which is a beautiful sparkling
drink for people that want to make other choices other
than alcohol. And I actually tried it when I first
(00:51):
stopped drinking it was I put an order in for
you guys with you guys and gave it a whirl
because there was nothing else around at that time five
years ago. So thank you so much for taking the
time to come on board. How did it all start?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Thanks for having us back first of all, and thank
you for your order five years ago. That's very exciting. Well,
I guess we're still here because of those early orders,
So thanks, ye appreciate it. Thanks for having this on
this afternoon back five years ago. We started the ex
journey every time too his health and as you mentioned
(01:29):
five years ago, there was a whole lot of options
on the radar from an offering perspective in the Australian
market of an adult sophisticated drink that wasn't alcoholic, and
that's that's what we do.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
And so our goal is to change Australia's relationship with alcohol,
and that's what we're really trying to do and advocate
for native Australian plants, but I'll get to that a
bit later. But as you mentioned, as you say, that's
that's the offering that we're trying to provide for Australian consumers.
But there's a fair old backstory of that. So that's
(02:02):
I'm just giving you the little five seconds shot of
the big reason why for us is to change australia
relationship with alcohol and provide great tasting, non alcoholic adult rates.
But prior to that, we've both come from the wine
industry two decades twenty three years in the wine industry,
both as a wine maker, as management marketing sales. And
(02:27):
what happened in our story is that my relationship with
wine went from the love of my life who it
tried to kill me. And that's the truth behind all
the authenticity behind what we're doing now is the fact
that I haven't had a drink now for six years.
(02:49):
But that journey, I guess, and with our beverage experience
and with this awareness that hang on, we still love
socializing and some great things when we dine or when
we socialize. Let's use our skills to add value to
(03:11):
the community and due to Australians and offerings that are
out there. And that's a really long answer to how
we started, but also a little bit of a tease
into some of the snippets of re authenticity of why
we exist. We're not just a couple of wo have
come up with a money's idea. It's come out of
(03:33):
a real need that we personally observed, and we observed
that others in Australia could benefit from.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
And do you drink?
Speaker 3 (03:42):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
So I stopped drinking to support Jason. So I'm about
six and a half years. I don't really call myself sober,
but I'm six and a half years alcohol free. So
I stopped drinking before Jason to try and support him
in drinking less during you know, during those last days
(04:06):
of the heavy drinking. And yeah, I've just not I've
not picked up a drink.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
Since, you know, through my recovery. I guess I'm really
grateful that I didn't lose everything. Wasn't far from it,
Probably only one drink away. But you know they talk
about the yets in you know, haven't lost your job yet,
haven't lost your finances yet, haven't lost your family yet.
(04:31):
I might have only been one yet away. It wasn't
actually a choice I was. I was pretty crooked at
the end, and so it ended up being some of
your cohorts that helped me out at Frankston Emergency for
a couple of days. And it was at that point
that I was really sick. Then I was powerless and
over alcohol and the life was unmanageable. So it was
(04:53):
a a period in time and acute illness period of
time where I just had lost power and I was
struggling with life. I guess having these chats, it's an
interesting one about you know, we sometimes wear two hats.
We've certainly got this commercial lens of yet with two
business founders that are running a little family business. But
(05:18):
it's coming from a place of of realness and authenticity
to add to help people and have kept with a
genuine need and desire that we see around for care.
And I just as a beverage producers for so long,
just didn't really and I didn't pick that up. The
(05:42):
whole thing about caring for yourself and awareness that all
that sort of stuff didn't come out for me until
I know I had that forced maturing as a forty
five year old at that time.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Male.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Yeah, it's a tough journey to go on, and I
it is funny. I find it tough to look back.
Did you find that people fell away from your life
Jason and Andy that you weren't drinking anymore?
Speaker 2 (06:11):
I think removing alcohol from your life can shed some
people from your life that perhaps aren't there for the
right reasons. But I think the overwhelming majority stuck around.
And I think what was more interesting is that by
being vulnerable and sharing, Jason sharing his story and me
(06:35):
having great friends that I can share my story with,
we found that so many people felt more connected because
we were being vulnerable and authentic and yeah, it actually
like I know, Jason spoke to a table full of
people that he barely knew. It was a wine function,
I think, and shared his story and there was tears
(06:58):
around the table saying me too. You know all my
husbands was similar situation, or my wife or my auntie
or what you know, like every single person knew somebody
who had benefit to negatively by alcohol. And I think
that's why for me, this sharing our story is really
important because yeah, it's exposing that to other people and
(07:23):
letting people see that it's that it's okay because it's stigmatized.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
It takes this thing out of this or you know,
if there's perceived shame, which is one hurdle to get over,
isn't it absolutely impart to go how can I be
in Australian and not drink? Or I'm shamed for let
this thing get old of me, or I'm shamed of
myself and all of that negative self self talk is
a part of the transition.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Shame drives in silence, so it's by shining a light
and saying, well, this is what happened, and you know,
this is this is what it looks like, and it
takes that shames.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
And look at your life now, you know. And I
think that's where it's absolutely fantastic in that you can go. Yeah,
I went through a really shitty time. It was horrendous.
Got the help I needed. You know, I still have
to touch base and you know, look after myself and
show myself tenermous. But look where we are now. Yeah,
(08:24):
you know I'm doing a podcast and you were making
you know, X sparkling. It's remarkable. Do you guys find
that industry, that wine industry. A lot of people that
work in that space have an issue with alcohol.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Probably comes and say hospitality as well. I put in
the same budget whenever you've got probably some of those
intense work experiences and healthcare professionals. So if you've got
a lot of emotional and mental stuff happening in a
short period of time, yeah, sometimes you're looking for a
(08:59):
solution to just oh just let me rest. Now, in
the wind industry, in the hospitality that let me rest
solution is this self medication called boost.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Oh it's so glamorized, all that.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
Stuff and it's just so yeah. Look, it's just because
it's around you all the time.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
And the culture and the culture and the accessibility.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
So my rehab facility, right, this is when we're talking
about accessibility in Australia. My rehab was it was eight
k's away in Mornington and there's eleven liquor outlets between
yeah and there. But that is just ridiculous. So I
talking about accessibility, and I'm talking big box, big supermarket branded.
(09:49):
It was right down to little boutique. Yeah, but eleven
and yeah. The funniest well, it's not funny.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
I remember absolutely not thinking it was funny at the time,
but going into rehab to visit Jason, and he had it,
you know, window.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Looking out over the rooftops, but.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
The only thing you could see other than these rooftops
was the thirsty camel sign.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
I just thought, oh my god, that's terrible.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Can someone just, you know, somehow just cover that a
little bit up?
Speaker 3 (10:21):
You know? But that's life.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
And I think for me taking the blinkers off all
of a sudden, everywhere I go in particularly in those
early days, every bus shelter I saw had a ad.
Walking into the grocery store, there were there were ads
on the outside of the grocery store and the body
of wine here, and like it's just it's just everywhere,
as you say, it's glamorized.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
So for us, it's all about.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
You know, making sure we can have fun and celebrate
and do all of the things that we would always
have done, just without boozing our glass. So we can
still now have a beautiful, fancy drink. I feel like
we're standing around at a barbecue with it, you know,
a drink in a hand, but it just doesn't have
to include alcohol.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
So has the business in that last you know, six
years gone from or five years here to here? Have
you found? It's really because I feel that there's a shift,
and particularly the younger generation all over not drinking. Have
you found there's there's been huge support, I know, you
(11:28):
know sober in the country. Support you guys, Clean Slate
we do.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
We do farmers market everywhere on the weekend. When we
started five years ago, people would walk past and that
would be trying to be polite, but trying to be
but being a bit funny, a smarter and alcohol free.
What would you bother with a smile on their face,
But behind that there's this little sting.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Yeah, absolutely, and.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
We'd listened to it and you but now five years
down the track, we would get any more fault Well
when we very rarely get that, we now get thank you.
But that's the massive shift and the acceptance of and
(12:17):
the quality is improved. So in five years, the biggest
shift has been that the industry stepped up a bit
and instead of making adult drinks for sugar and chemicals
but just try and replicate something that they're not, the
industry has actually stepped up because it's now commercially viable
having successful businesses. We're having shells in supermarkets and in
(12:40):
big box liquor retailers that are dedicated to the space
and it's weeding out a lot of the poor quality products.
So therefore, if the products are good and they're desirable drink,
then what does it matter if it's got ethan only
it or not? If you just if you're not a personally,
if you're a normy but an adult dream if it's
(13:09):
like ours, it just should be greatness, aromatics, incredible structure
matches to food is Moorish and then that's what it
should be. So the industry has really stepped up to
the plate and that was when we see chain and
acceptance of adult beverages.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Because you guys, it's all Australian sauced and Australian ingredients
and flavors and fragrances and which I think is really fabulous.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
The story behind that, when I was getting well, our
local uncle Lionel, our local First Nations leader, down here
on the morning to niche there are some of my
favorite running tracks were in the bush down here in
the morning and pinsula and Lionel took me down these
and who was teaching me and we were eating the
whole way down. He was doing some healing with me,
(14:00):
which is just incredible. And that really just opened my
eyes to how this is incredible, these native Australian fruits
and herbs that I had no idea what the properties were.
And it was at a time when I just logged
that just logged it thought, how can I help amplify
this from a sustainable agricultural perspective, from an awareness perspective,
(14:24):
we need to know this stuff because it can be
a part of our diet. And that's where that was
the thought start of that, Well, what are we going
to do for the rest of our lives? We can't
make wine anymore? It was, well, how do we make
an adult drink that taste great? How do we amplify
native Australian fruits and herbs? And from uncle line introduce
(14:46):
us to people all over the country. And so we
now select native plants from Northern Territory, from Queenslan in
New South Wales, from South Australia and Victoria and tasm
and we make them into our drinks. And that's a
way to sort of say, hey, did you know quandong
originating from here, or finger lines or Davidson palms or whatever,
(15:10):
and there's just another interest. So we've pinched a lot
of our brand ethos and way of communications from the
wine industry really because there's stories. There's there's stories around hey,
this plant's connected to this country and this is the
benefits from you, and this is where it's harvested and
how it's harvested here it is.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
I think that's brilliant, especially when you hit that overseas market.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
It's similar to I guess where you'd say, you know,
here's a chardona from this region in front. We're trying
to do that with Australian ingredients. And one thing that
we're really specific in, like we were talking about alcohol
free drinks and how helpful they can be to people
when they're trying to cut back drinking. Like for us,
(16:00):
we have a lot of people who are just trying
to cut back and so having the wine and they'll
have a etch in a glass of wine, but I'm
sorry in a glass. But for us, it was really
important that we didn't want to replicate alcohol. So we're
trying to challenge that idea that adult drinks need to look, smell,
(16:21):
and taste like alcohol to be sophisticated and grown up.
And I think that's probably our main point of difference.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
There, because don't they say, and I have been too
afraid to drink wine or champagne because they were might
drink of choice, that the alcohol free wines, that there's
evidence now that you have the same visceral response even
though there's no ethanol in it, because of the taste
(16:52):
and the way it's poured and in the glass, that
you actually have a very similar response to if you
were drinking alcohol. So I have been very It's funny.
I can do the non alcoholic gin in a in
a mocktail, but there's just no way I would drink
or touch the non alcoholic wine or champagne. A it
(17:14):
tastes like crap. But b it it's that I don't
want to drink anything that's going to be at all
similar to what my issue was.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Well, you've got to put up boundaries, and it sounds
like you've got strong boundaries and that's it.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Yeah, yeah, And I'd rather drink something like itch or
a beautiful sparkling water with some lime in it or
something like that, then.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
Yeah, and that's okay.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Like that's where Itch came into it, because I used
to go to I remember the Christmas party of the
year Jason stopped drinking and everyone was standing around with
a wine glass in their hand or a can of
beer or something, and I had my soda water and
a little top of were container with fresh lime in it,
you know that, because I don't like sweet sugary drinks,
(18:01):
and so that's where the delicate aromatic flavors come from.
With eh, but yes, with you know, with drinking alcohol
free drinks. I know Jason can drink alcohol free beer
is okay, but we don't drink the wines for a
similar reason. And I think you just have to be
really careful and set your own boundaries because for some
(18:24):
people they say they're you know, they're amazing and really helpful,
and some people find them really helpful. In the early days,
but thems that don't need them after a while. For me,
it's it's sort of different in that because I watched
what wine did to my husband, I just am repulsed
(18:45):
by it now. So it's a difference. It's not a
case of me wanting to look like I'm having a
wine like I just think, why would I want to?
But yeah, everyone's got to have their own their own reasons.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
That's so interesting. You actually, when you go out to
a function that other people are drinking wine, how do
you feel.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
There's never any judgment on anybody else. I just think,
why would you want to put that in your body?
I just I look at it now and go, yeah,
I just have no desire. I mean I went out
with friends recently and they were all having spicy margaritas,
and they all had two or three or four or
(19:33):
five over the night. And you know, I say this
story that they were one hundred dollars poorer at the end.
They were all saying to me, oh, so sweet, I've
got you know, I've got this real sweet, sickly taste
in my mouth.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
Now.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
They couldn't drive home, so I had to drive them home.
And the next day they woke up feeling a crap
and I had a great night. I can't even remember
what I had. I think I had sparkling water, so
I was really hydrated that night.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
Yeah, probably woke up.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
Feeling a bit smike the next day. But yeah, there's
never I mean, there's never anyjudgment from me. What other
people do, I don't sort of that doesn't bother me
at all. But yeah, I just I have zero interest
in alcohol free wines.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Or I just want to get to a point and
I've just got a bail. On nights like that, I
can't be around people that are heavily intoxicated anymore. Yeah, no,
are you the same, Jason?
Speaker 3 (20:31):
I was just took the words out of my mouth.
That's one of my boundaries. As soon as the words
starts slurring or the stories are repeating, exit stage left.
No one remembers that you've gone anyway.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
No, they don't remember they Yeah, it was a great party.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
The values change as well, so you know, it's one
stage you probably really wanted to do the last to
leave because you're having sobolutely having the best time of
your life. But when you're not drinking, you may then
have more value on what you're going to do the
next day, and you know, you know that you can
have just as good a time until maybe nine or ten,
(21:09):
go home, have a solid app you know, nine hour
eight hour sleep, Yeah, wake up and actually make use
of the day.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Which is yea and the day is not wasted.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
One of the key things I've experienced is the development
of that genuine interest in other people that has come
from not drinking, and the fact that in the past
I'll probably be inebriating. You'd always be one upping the
stories and thinking of what you can do next or whatever,
Whereas now you can quite hacklelegious. You're listening to what
(21:42):
a person's saying, and you can ask intelligent questions and
you come out of it going wow, that was a
cool conversation. That was a good person, or I learned
something or I took a gold nugget out of there
or whatever that would never have happened because another line
and you forget what you were so I.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Couldn't agree more. That is so so true, and I
think I'm a far better person without drinking. I'm definitely kinder.
I just am a better person. I've get more done,
and I think, like I said before, when I spoke
with Chris from Clean Slate. I have found women in
particular my age, can be quite awful when they're inebriated.
(22:22):
It's nice not to be around that.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
So you guys have aligned yourself with some amazing not
for profits, Sober in the Country being one. How is
that going for you guys, Like, do you actively support
them with functions and supplying the drinks or is it
just that you want to support organizations that are, you know,
(22:45):
supporting people that are having issues with alcohol.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
With Sober in the Country, it's a little bit of
it's probably It's definitely not a commercial drive because I'm
a member of the group, as Jason Quinn not as
ch I mentioned talk about it, people talk about it
in the community, and because we're really clear on that
delineation here is when we're trying to be a commercial business,
(23:09):
that's a separate, completely separate thing. Our partnership with not
for profits as you've mentioned, clans like so in the Country,
it's around amplification of options and about the benefits of
just some lifestyle changes that if you are if you
were ill like where I was, there's there's routes to help.
(23:32):
If you're on the pathway if we can plant the
seed to go, Hey, just give some check in, don't
have one of the yets happened to you yet, just
make some changes. And that's why we really like to
work with people that like that, because we can we
(23:53):
can help amplify their stories and we can help facilitate
someone's change. We're feedback on the email this week saying
you've changed the shape of my husband in a funny
what way because he's changes his relationship with Boom. He's
lost people wait his exercise, and that for us is
(24:18):
worth so much more than a black numbered P and
L at the end of the month. Yeah, of course
that's what we do. What we do. Yes, we're trying
to run a business, but we're very clear on what's separate.
It's about advocacy and aunlification of the healthy way of being.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
And I think when we first launched it, they were
in bottles and I always say, itch is a message
in a bottle, So it's it's for me. Sober in
the country helps us to get our drinks into the
hands of people who actually need our drinks, not just one.
So for some people, I mean I've had numerous messages
which just likes that boat, just saying, you know, your
(25:02):
drinks have changed my life, which is an incredible statement
when you're talking about a drink company. And I just
think for us, it's not just about the drinks. It's
the fact that we're standing here saying this is our story,
this is what happened to us. You don't have to
get to this point, you know, check in with your
relationship with alcohol. And again for me, I'm fifty two
(25:24):
and I speak to people all the time who in
my age group who say, oh, I just can't drink
like I used to drink, or you know, I get
a headache now every time I drink, And there's actually
a reason for that. It's not just that you're you know,
you need to drink more to get practice. Your body
(25:45):
is actually processes are changing in your body. So, yeah,
being able to share these stories and yeah, talk to
people like you and your audience that hopefully can you know,
there'll be people who need to hear the message.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
And without a doubt, that's one of the things I'm
really support Fair Australia and they recently released a statement
on Instagram about how Facebook is looking at the algorithms
and targeting people that have alcohol and gambling issues and
then they specifically target those people and you've got the
(26:27):
ethics around that is so wrong, and I mean, how
do you stop that? And of course Fair are trying
to stop that through legislation. And you know the ads
and you know the stuff with Schoolies last year that
hard Solo came out and that was all done a
(26:49):
little bit, you know, in a naughty manner, but it
got through before Schoolies and then they pulled it. And
you know, we need people like you guys and organizations
like Fair and Sober in the country. Two, I think
really highlight what's going on out there, and it is
a problem in our country. You know, it is a
(27:11):
cultural thing and they're targeting the most vulnerable and things
have to change in that in that regard.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Sorry, I'm going to bug in there because I so
on my daily scroll I am constantly fed alcohol advertising.
And do you know how you can go in and
see why am I seeing this ad? And so I
will go in and say, don't show me this ad.
(27:39):
And you can actually put in their words to not
show me, and I've put in their numerous times don't
show me, whine and don't show me alcohol, but it
doesn't change.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
I'm constant getting it.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
And I mean the challenge we've got is we use
the word alcohol free. So the word alcohol is in there,
but it's I just think there needs to be some
changes in that because I'm constantly thinking about, well, what
if I was a vulnerable person and I was trying
to stop and this is just constantly being said to me.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Oh absolutely. And imagine gambling, the gambling ads and people
that have a real issue with gambled I mean, I mean,
I think the alcohol adds are bad, but I think
gambling is ten times worse.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
There's too much money commercially in alcohol. There's too much
excise tax being raped in by the government. Of every
unit of alcohol they get hot nearly half of it.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
Oh is it half?
Speaker 3 (28:33):
Well, depending on whether it's a wine, a beer, or
a spirit, I don't know. Is that the exact excise
numbers per per category? Yeah, excuse me this, but I
know from a wine perspective, there's twenty nine percent wine equalization.
That's plus the GST, so you're already up to thirty
one percent of that every unit of your bottle, picture,
forty percent of it's going off to tax, so.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
The government's not going to change anything because they're breaking
the money.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
And it's very similar to cigarettes, though when you think
about cigarettes twenty years ago, it would have been a
very similar thing attacks. But it's education and people speaking up,
and I think there is definitely a shift happening. The
younger generation are drinking less. They're having their green smoothies
and doing a yogurt instead of hungover, and I think
(29:19):
there is a shift. And I think the more you know,
social media is a great tool for sharing this information
as well all that we talk about the fact. I mean,
I don't want us to come across as prohibitioness because
if you can enjoy drinking, you know, in moderation, you
do you But we know that alcohols a type one carcinogen.
But I mean do we know that? I know that,
(29:42):
But is that a public you know? I feel like
that's something that not everyone knows.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
Now.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
People don't know that. I just think it's good for
your health because they've been told that red wine is
good for your health. It's all the antioxidants.
Speaker 3 (29:54):
Information.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
We could make educated choices about what we want to
do with them. But I think when we're not being
given the information or you know, and perhaps in some
cases you wouldn't want to hear it, so you're not
going to hear it even if it's there.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
But I just think it can be.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
Shared more, and you know, social media is a break.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
Tool for that.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
I absolutely agree with you, and I think social media
can be used for so much good and not target
so many vulnerable people because you are vulnerable when you're
in that state. You don't care what it takes to
get a drink. You just want that ethanol in your system.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
More home delivery services have popped up, particularly after COVID
solution to get delivery home. There was an unfortunate death
in Sydney where I think that people media where a
gentleman as he was an addictive person and just kept
and he was founded, and I think that it's just
a shocking scenario that occur.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
I just found it hard during COVID that the wine,
you know, the bottle, is that sort of thing we're
deemed as a necessary business and if you think about it,
we probably all would have literally had a meltdown if
they hadn't been able to buy alcohol, because you know,
that would have just stopped and everyone would have lost
their shit, but it's pretty sad that it's seemed as
(31:16):
an essential service.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yeah, and that shows you again much the government had
something to lose if they would, you know, and you're
rightly right in saying that there would have been a
lot of very angry people there are and probably a
lot of really sick people who would absolutely touring as well.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
So yeah, yeah, without without a doubt, I think they.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Considered all that probably, But I just feel so grateful
that Jason had got sober brightic COVID because I really
feel people during that time, when you know, you are isolated,
and that's something that you often do when you're in
that state, is isolate yourself, and I think people being
(32:02):
stuck at home. We have so many people say that
they stopped drinking during that time. And for us, we
started our business in November twenty.
Speaker 3 (32:12):
Nineteen and this happened he very much and it.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Was really interesting for us watching the initial lockdowns, everyone
was drinking, but that second lockdown, for us in Victoria,
a lot of people stopped drinking and that's when we
started to get a lot of interest because they were saying, well,
hang on, you know, we're starting at lunchtime now. And
you know, we need to put a pullback. And I
(32:38):
think that's where the rise of the alcohol free drinks
space really took off.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
It's interesting when you have a platform, the number of
people that reach out to you. I am constantly asked
about how I stopped drinking, what I did, how it's
changed my life? Is it for the better? Was it
really hard? Like it's really interesting the number of people
that do approach me and reach out to me just
wanting to know how I did it, because there are
(33:05):
a lot of people out there, I think that are
really struggling.
Speaker 3 (33:08):
How did you do it?
Speaker 1 (33:09):
That I knew I had a problem. I went saw
a GP who brushed me off and made me feel
like fool. I knew a psychiatrist, well, I knew his wife,
and I reached out to her and said would he
feel comfortable in seeing me? And at this stage, I
was at a tipping point where I was going to
get really bad, and I went and saw him. He
(33:31):
put me on Campero for six months. But from the
day he put me on it, I just decided I
wasn't going to drink again, and I haven't. So you know,
whether I had alcohol use disorder or not or I mean,
I certainly was behaving as someone that was starting to
get very out of control. I don't know, I don't
know how I was just able to stop, but I did,
(33:53):
and I just made my mind up. And I haven't
had a drink since then and won't because life is
so much better without it.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
I think those words like olcoholic can be a really
derogatory word.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
I hate it, yeah, and I.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Think I mean I used to use it not a
positive but in a neutral word way, but so many
people say I'm not an alcoholic, and I think I
think it's considered quite a stigmatized word. Yes, so I
think the alcohol used disorder and the fact that there's
so many different levels of alcohols disorder. Absolutely, And also,
(34:36):
like the gray area, drinking is also something that resonates
with a lot of people you might not consider yourself,
like for me, I remember doing a lot of googling
in these days, going, well, I knew there was the
man on the park bench, you know that was brown
paper bag, but my husband doesn't look like that, So
why is he so sick? And why can't he stop drinking?
Speaker 3 (34:59):
What's he? Then?
Speaker 2 (35:00):
And you know, I remember googling what does an alcoholic
look like? Or you know, how do you know if
one's an alcoholic? And I think, I mean that's one
thing in itself is that if you questioning whether you've
got a.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Problem with alcohol, you got a problem. You've probably got
a problem with alcohol.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Because people who don't have a problem with alcohol don't google.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
That's it exactly.
Speaker 3 (35:25):
See.
Speaker 1 (35:25):
I don't like the term sober either. I have a
and it's just me. I just have an issue with it.
I'm just a non drinker. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Well I say alcohol free because I think being free
is liberating and so yeah, I'm free of alcohol.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
Because to me, sober has a connotation around being an alcoholic.
And I really have an issue with the term alcoholic
because you know, I didn't miss a day of work,
and you know, I just managed my drinking hard and
fast so I could go to bed and then but
(36:02):
it got to the stage earth honestly, I was, Yeah,
I was going down a very dark hole.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
I think this fear of the word alcoholic. I hear
so many people say I'm not an alcoholic.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
You know, I wasn't an alcoholic, but I had to
stop drinking and I just think, yeah, just take the
power out of that word, like it just you know, you.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
Have a problem. You may have had an issue with alcohol.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Whether you're an alcoholic or not, it doesn't matter, you
know that the point is that you're that you're trying
to get well and to get off. You don't have
to put yourself into a box and say, well, gosh,
am I an alcoholic or am I? I think it's
just alcohol is not serving me. And I do not
know anybody who has stopped drinking who wishes they were
(36:50):
back in that state.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
You so mind you.
Speaker 1 (36:55):
I must say, I have used the term alcoholic when
people have hustled me and hassled me to have a
drink like you've been out, and they goingnah, come on,
you're right, you know you're fine. And I actually have
turned around and said, listen mate, I'm an alkie, so
you know you need to back off. That stops the
conversation pretty quick. They go, oh god, sorry, yeah, it's like,
(37:18):
you know, just back off, It's okay, I don't want
to drink. They just can't let it go. But guys,
thank you so much for coming in and chatting with me.
And I really appreciate the fact that you're both so
open about your journey because having been there myself, you
know it has its moments. And I'm just delighted that
you've got such an amazing product, and you know that
(37:40):
you're out there helping communities and sober in the country
and people that really are quite vulnerable and need assistance.
So it's wonderful that you're applying a drink that makes
us all feel dare I say it normal? So I
love it.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Well. I guess you should put a plug in for
sober in the country. If you're out in the regions,
get in touch with the crew. Wonderful website resource that
has support services, reading material and then contact information as well.
That's more dedicated to people out in the bush. And
I guess to read the city based people, it would
be Chris and it's clean slate.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
And if you want to try and change the dialogue
around alcohol, then get on board with Fair Australia because
they're often after people to write in or share their
stories things like that, So I think Fair needs a
fair bit of support as well. So there are some
great organizations out there that are really trying to change
(38:41):
the landscape around alcohol. Yeah, and you guys are one
of them.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
And just one last word on edge is that each
stands for every time choose health. And I think you know,
when you're in that state where you're trying to drink less,
it's opening the fridge and sy know canavech there and going,
what's my choice the bottle of wine or the can
of beage, And you know that's that little message that
(39:06):
hopefully helps somebody.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
I think that's wonderful
Appogie Production. Hi, my name's beck Woodbine and welcome to
Tenderness for Nurses. I'm grateful for the person that I
have the opportunity to be.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
So I hit it and parked it for Nelly four years.
We always have free will, We always get to choose.
We are autonomous.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Hi. Everyone, thank you for tuning back in to Tenderness
for Nurses. Today I have Andy and Jason from ELG
Sparkling chatting with me about their journey to producing and
the development of H Sparkling, which is a beautiful sparkling
drink for people that want to make other choices other
than alcohol. And I actually tried it when I first
(00:51):
stopped drinking it was I put an order in for
you guys with you guys and gave it a whirl
because there was nothing else around at that time five
years ago. So thank you so much for taking the
time to come on board. How did it all start?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Thanks for having us back first of all, and thank
you for your order five years ago. That's very exciting. Well,
I guess we're still here because of those early orders,
So thanks, ye appreciate it. Thanks for having this on
this afternoon back five years ago. We started the ex
journey every time too his health and as you mentioned
(01:29):
five years ago, there was a whole lot of options
on the radar from an offering perspective in the Australian
market of an adult sophisticated drink that wasn't alcoholic, and
that's that's what we do.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
And so our goal is to change Australia's relationship with alcohol,
and that's what we're really trying to do and advocate
for native Australian plants, but I'll get to that a
bit later. But as you mentioned, as you say, that's
that's the offering that we're trying to provide for Australian consumers.
But there's a fair old backstory of that. So that's
(02:02):
I'm just giving you the little five seconds shot of
the big reason why for us is to change australia
relationship with alcohol and provide great tasting, non alcoholic adult rates.
But prior to that, we've both come from the wine
industry two decades twenty three years in the wine industry,
both as a wine maker, as management marketing sales. And
(02:27):
what happened in our story is that my relationship with
wine went from the love of my life who it
tried to kill me. And that's the truth behind all
the authenticity behind what we're doing now is the fact
that I haven't had a drink now for six years.
(02:49):
But that journey, I guess, and with our beverage experience
and with this awareness that hang on, we still love
socializing and some great things when we dine or when
we socialize. Let's use our skills to add value to
(03:11):
the community and due to Australians and offerings that are
out there. And that's a really long answer to how
we started, but also a little bit of a tease
into some of the snippets of re authenticity of why
we exist. We're not just a couple of wo have
come up with a money's idea. It's come out of
(03:33):
a real need that we personally observed, and we observed
that others in Australia could benefit from.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
And do you drink?
Speaker 3 (03:42):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
So I stopped drinking to support Jason. So I'm about
six and a half years. I don't really call myself sober,
but I'm six and a half years alcohol free. So
I stopped drinking before Jason to try and support him
in drinking less during you know, during those last days
(04:06):
of the heavy drinking. And yeah, I've just not I've
not picked up a drink.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
Since, you know, through my recovery. I guess I'm really
grateful that I didn't lose everything. Wasn't far from it,
Probably only one drink away. But you know they talk
about the yets in you know, haven't lost your job yet,
haven't lost your finances yet, haven't lost your family yet.
(04:31):
I might have only been one yet away. It wasn't
actually a choice I was. I was pretty crooked at
the end, and so it ended up being some of
your cohorts that helped me out at Frankston Emergency for
a couple of days. And it was at that point
that I was really sick. Then I was powerless and
over alcohol and the life was unmanageable. So it was
(04:53):
a a period in time and acute illness period of
time where I just had lost power and I was
struggling with life. I guess having these chats, it's an
interesting one about you know, we sometimes wear two hats.
We've certainly got this commercial lens of yet with two
business founders that are running a little family business. But
(05:18):
it's coming from a place of of realness and authenticity
to add to help people and have kept with a
genuine need and desire that we see around for care.
And I just as a beverage producers for so long,
just didn't really and I didn't pick that up. The
(05:42):
whole thing about caring for yourself and awareness that all
that sort of stuff didn't come out for me until
I know I had that forced maturing as a forty
five year old at that time.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Male.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Yeah, it's a tough journey to go on, and I
it is funny. I find it tough to look back.
Did you find that people fell away from your life
Jason and Andy that you weren't drinking anymore?
Speaker 2 (06:11):
I think removing alcohol from your life can shed some
people from your life that perhaps aren't there for the
right reasons. But I think the overwhelming majority stuck around.
And I think what was more interesting is that by
being vulnerable and sharing, Jason sharing his story and me
(06:35):
having great friends that I can share my story with,
we found that so many people felt more connected because
we were being vulnerable and authentic and yeah, it actually
like I know, Jason spoke to a table full of
people that he barely knew. It was a wine function,
I think, and shared his story and there was tears
(06:58):
around the table saying me too. You know all my
husbands was similar situation, or my wife or my auntie
or what you know, like every single person knew somebody
who had benefit to negatively by alcohol. And I think
that's why for me, this sharing our story is really
important because yeah, it's exposing that to other people and
(07:23):
letting people see that it's that it's okay because it's stigmatized.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
It takes this thing out of this or you know,
if there's perceived shame, which is one hurdle to get over,
isn't it absolutely impart to go how can I be
in Australian and not drink? Or I'm shamed for let
this thing get old of me, or I'm shamed of
myself and all of that negative self self talk is
a part of the transition.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Shame drives in silence, so it's by shining a light
and saying, well, this is what happened, and you know,
this is this is what it looks like, and it
takes that shames.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
And look at your life now, you know. And I
think that's where it's absolutely fantastic in that you can go. Yeah,
I went through a really shitty time. It was horrendous.
Got the help I needed. You know, I still have
to touch base and you know, look after myself and
show myself tenermous. But look where we are now. Yeah,
(08:24):
you know I'm doing a podcast and you were making
you know, X sparkling. It's remarkable. Do you guys find
that industry, that wine industry. A lot of people that
work in that space have an issue with alcohol.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Probably comes and say hospitality as well. I put in
the same budget whenever you've got probably some of those
intense work experiences and healthcare professionals. So if you've got
a lot of emotional and mental stuff happening in a
short period of time, yeah, sometimes you're looking for a
(08:59):
solution to just oh just let me rest. Now, in
the wind industry, in the hospitality that let me rest
solution is this self medication called boost.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Oh it's so glamorized, all that.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
Stuff and it's just so yeah. Look, it's just because
it's around you all the time.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
And the culture and the culture and the accessibility.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
So my rehab facility, right, this is when we're talking
about accessibility in Australia. My rehab was it was eight
k's away in Mornington and there's eleven liquor outlets between
yeah and there. But that is just ridiculous. So I
talking about accessibility, and I'm talking big box, big supermarket branded.
(09:49):
It was right down to little boutique. Yeah, but eleven
and yeah. The funniest well, it's not funny.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
I remember absolutely not thinking it was funny at the time,
but going into rehab to visit Jason, and he had it,
you know, window.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Looking out over the rooftops, but.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
The only thing you could see other than these rooftops
was the thirsty camel sign.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
I just thought, oh my god, that's terrible.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Can someone just, you know, somehow just cover that a
little bit up?
Speaker 3 (10:21):
You know? But that's life.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
And I think for me taking the blinkers off all
of a sudden, everywhere I go in particularly in those
early days, every bus shelter I saw had a ad.
Walking into the grocery store, there were there were ads
on the outside of the grocery store and the body
of wine here, and like it's just it's just everywhere,
as you say, it's glamorized.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
So for us, it's all about.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
You know, making sure we can have fun and celebrate
and do all of the things that we would always
have done, just without boozing our glass. So we can
still now have a beautiful, fancy drink. I feel like
we're standing around at a barbecue with it, you know,
a drink in a hand, but it just doesn't have
to include alcohol.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
So has the business in that last you know, six
years gone from or five years here to here? Have
you found? It's really because I feel that there's a shift,
and particularly the younger generation all over not drinking. Have
you found there's there's been huge support, I know, you
(11:28):
know sober in the country. Support you guys, Clean Slate
we do.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
We do farmers market everywhere on the weekend. When we
started five years ago, people would walk past and that
would be trying to be polite, but trying to be
but being a bit funny, a smarter and alcohol free.
What would you bother with a smile on their face,
But behind that there's this little sting.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Yeah, absolutely, and.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
We'd listened to it and you but now five years
down the track, we would get any more fault Well
when we very rarely get that, we now get thank you.
But that's the massive shift and the acceptance of and
(12:17):
the quality is improved. So in five years, the biggest
shift has been that the industry stepped up a bit
and instead of making adult drinks for sugar and chemicals
but just try and replicate something that they're not, the
industry has actually stepped up because it's now commercially viable
having successful businesses. We're having shells in supermarkets and in
(12:40):
big box liquor retailers that are dedicated to the space
and it's weeding out a lot of the poor quality products.
So therefore, if the products are good and they're desirable drink,
then what does it matter if it's got ethan only
it or not? If you just if you're not a personally,
if you're a normy but an adult dream if it's
(13:09):
like ours, it just should be greatness, aromatics, incredible structure
matches to food is Moorish and then that's what it
should be. So the industry has really stepped up to
the plate and that was when we see chain and
acceptance of adult beverages.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Because you guys, it's all Australian sauced and Australian ingredients
and flavors and fragrances and which I think is really fabulous.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
The story behind that, when I was getting well, our
local uncle Lionel, our local First Nations leader, down here
on the morning to niche there are some of my
favorite running tracks were in the bush down here in
the morning and pinsula and Lionel took me down these
and who was teaching me and we were eating the
whole way down. He was doing some healing with me,
(14:00):
which is just incredible. And that really just opened my
eyes to how this is incredible, these native Australian fruits
and herbs that I had no idea what the properties were.
And it was at a time when I just logged
that just logged it thought, how can I help amplify
this from a sustainable agricultural perspective, from an awareness perspective,
(14:24):
we need to know this stuff because it can be
a part of our diet. And that's where that was
the thought start of that, Well, what are we going
to do for the rest of our lives? We can't
make wine anymore? It was, well, how do we make
an adult drink that taste great? How do we amplify
native Australian fruits and herbs? And from uncle line introduce
(14:46):
us to people all over the country. And so we
now select native plants from Northern Territory, from Queenslan in
New South Wales, from South Australia and Victoria and tasm
and we make them into our drinks. And that's a
way to sort of say, hey, did you know quandong
originating from here, or finger lines or Davidson palms or whatever,
(15:10):
and there's just another interest. So we've pinched a lot
of our brand ethos and way of communications from the
wine industry really because there's stories. There's there's stories around hey,
this plant's connected to this country and this is the
benefits from you, and this is where it's harvested and
how it's harvested here it is.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
I think that's brilliant, especially when you hit that overseas market.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
It's similar to I guess where you'd say, you know,
here's a chardona from this region in front. We're trying
to do that with Australian ingredients. And one thing that
we're really specific in, like we were talking about alcohol
free drinks and how helpful they can be to people
when they're trying to cut back drinking. Like for us,
(16:00):
we have a lot of people who are just trying
to cut back and so having the wine and they'll
have a etch in a glass of wine, but I'm
sorry in a glass. But for us, it was really
important that we didn't want to replicate alcohol. So we're
trying to challenge that idea that adult drinks need to look, smell,
(16:21):
and taste like alcohol to be sophisticated and grown up.
And I think that's probably our main point of difference.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
There, because don't they say, and I have been too
afraid to drink wine or champagne because they were might
drink of choice, that the alcohol free wines, that there's
evidence now that you have the same visceral response even
though there's no ethanol in it, because of the taste
(16:52):
and the way it's poured and in the glass, that
you actually have a very similar response to if you
were drinking alcohol. So I have been very It's funny.
I can do the non alcoholic gin in a in
a mocktail, but there's just no way I would drink
or touch the non alcoholic wine or champagne. A it
(17:14):
tastes like crap. But b it it's that I don't
want to drink anything that's going to be at all
similar to what my issue was.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Well, you've got to put up boundaries, and it sounds
like you've got strong boundaries and that's it.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Yeah, yeah, And I'd rather drink something like itch or
a beautiful sparkling water with some lime in it or
something like that, then.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
Yeah, and that's okay.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Like that's where Itch came into it, because I used
to go to I remember the Christmas party of the
year Jason stopped drinking and everyone was standing around with
a wine glass in their hand or a can of
beer or something, and I had my soda water and
a little top of were container with fresh lime in it,
you know that, because I don't like sweet sugary drinks,
(18:01):
and so that's where the delicate aromatic flavors come from.
With eh, but yes, with you know, with drinking alcohol
free drinks. I know Jason can drink alcohol free beer
is okay, but we don't drink the wines for a
similar reason. And I think you just have to be
really careful and set your own boundaries because for some
(18:24):
people they say they're you know, they're amazing and really helpful,
and some people find them really helpful. In the early days,
but thems that don't need them after a while. For me,
it's it's sort of different in that because I watched
what wine did to my husband, I just am repulsed
(18:45):
by it now. So it's a difference. It's not a
case of me wanting to look like I'm having a
wine like I just think, why would I want to?
But yeah, everyone's got to have their own their own reasons.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
That's so interesting. You actually, when you go out to
a function that other people are drinking wine, how do
you feel.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
There's never any judgment on anybody else. I just think,
why would you want to put that in your body?
I just I look at it now and go, yeah,
I just have no desire. I mean I went out
with friends recently and they were all having spicy margaritas,
and they all had two or three or four or
(19:33):
five over the night. And you know, I say this
story that they were one hundred dollars poorer at the end.
They were all saying to me, oh, so sweet, I've
got you know, I've got this real sweet, sickly taste
in my mouth.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
Now.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
They couldn't drive home, so I had to drive them home.
And the next day they woke up feeling a crap
and I had a great night. I can't even remember
what I had. I think I had sparkling water, so
I was really hydrated that night.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
Yeah, probably woke up.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
Feeling a bit smike the next day. But yeah, there's
never I mean, there's never anyjudgment from me. What other
people do, I don't sort of that doesn't bother me
at all. But yeah, I just I have zero interest
in alcohol free wines.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Or I just want to get to a point and
I've just got a bail. On nights like that, I
can't be around people that are heavily intoxicated anymore. Yeah, no,
are you the same, Jason?
Speaker 3 (20:31):
I was just took the words out of my mouth.
That's one of my boundaries. As soon as the words
starts slurring or the stories are repeating, exit stage left.
No one remembers that you've gone anyway.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
No, they don't remember they Yeah, it was a great party.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
The values change as well, so you know, it's one
stage you probably really wanted to do the last to
leave because you're having sobolutely having the best time of
your life. But when you're not drinking, you may then
have more value on what you're going to do the
next day, and you know, you know that you can
have just as good a time until maybe nine or ten,
(21:09):
go home, have a solid app you know, nine hour
eight hour sleep, Yeah, wake up and actually make use
of the day.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Which is yea and the day is not wasted.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
One of the key things I've experienced is the development
of that genuine interest in other people that has come
from not drinking, and the fact that in the past
I'll probably be inebriating. You'd always be one upping the
stories and thinking of what you can do next or whatever,
Whereas now you can quite hacklelegious. You're listening to what
(21:42):
a person's saying, and you can ask intelligent questions and
you come out of it going wow, that was a
cool conversation. That was a good person, or I learned
something or I took a gold nugget out of there
or whatever that would never have happened because another line
and you forget what you were so I.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Couldn't agree more. That is so so true, and I
think I'm a far better person without drinking. I'm definitely kinder.
I just am a better person. I've get more done,
and I think, like I said before, when I spoke
with Chris from Clean Slate. I have found women in
particular my age, can be quite awful when they're inebriated.
(22:22):
It's nice not to be around that.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
So you guys have aligned yourself with some amazing not
for profits, Sober in the Country being one. How is
that going for you guys, Like, do you actively support
them with functions and supplying the drinks or is it
just that you want to support organizations that are, you know,
(22:45):
supporting people that are having issues with alcohol.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
With Sober in the Country, it's a little bit of
it's probably It's definitely not a commercial drive because I'm
a member of the group, as Jason Quinn not as
ch I mentioned talk about it, people talk about it
in the community, and because we're really clear on that
delineation here is when we're trying to be a commercial business,
(23:09):
that's a separate, completely separate thing. Our partnership with not
for profits as you've mentioned, clans like so in the Country,
it's around amplification of options and about the benefits of
just some lifestyle changes that if you are if you
were ill like where I was, there's there's routes to help.
(23:32):
If you're on the pathway if we can plant the
seed to go, Hey, just give some check in, don't
have one of the yets happened to you yet, just
make some changes. And that's why we really like to
work with people that like that, because we can we
(23:53):
can help amplify their stories and we can help facilitate
someone's change. We're feedback on the email this week saying
you've changed the shape of my husband in a funny
what way because he's changes his relationship with Boom. He's
lost people wait his exercise, and that for us is
(24:18):
worth so much more than a black numbered P and
L at the end of the month. Yeah, of course
that's what we do. What we do. Yes, we're trying
to run a business, but we're very clear on what's separate.
It's about advocacy and aunlification of the healthy way of being.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
And I think when we first launched it, they were
in bottles and I always say, itch is a message
in a bottle, So it's it's for me. Sober in
the country helps us to get our drinks into the
hands of people who actually need our drinks, not just one.
So for some people, I mean I've had numerous messages
which just likes that boat, just saying, you know, your
(25:02):
drinks have changed my life, which is an incredible statement
when you're talking about a drink company. And I just
think for us, it's not just about the drinks. It's
the fact that we're standing here saying this is our story,
this is what happened to us. You don't have to
get to this point, you know, check in with your
relationship with alcohol. And again for me, I'm fifty two
(25:24):
and I speak to people all the time who in
my age group who say, oh, I just can't drink
like I used to drink, or you know, I get
a headache now every time I drink, And there's actually
a reason for that. It's not just that you're you know,
you need to drink more to get practice. Your body
(25:45):
is actually processes are changing in your body. So, yeah,
being able to share these stories and yeah, talk to
people like you and your audience that hopefully can you know,
there'll be people who need to hear the message.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
And without a doubt, that's one of the things I'm
really support Fair Australia and they recently released a statement
on Instagram about how Facebook is looking at the algorithms
and targeting people that have alcohol and gambling issues and
then they specifically target those people and you've got the
(26:27):
ethics around that is so wrong, and I mean, how
do you stop that? And of course Fair are trying
to stop that through legislation. And you know the ads
and you know the stuff with Schoolies last year that
hard Solo came out and that was all done a
(26:49):
little bit, you know, in a naughty manner, but it
got through before Schoolies and then they pulled it. And
you know, we need people like you guys and organizations
like Fair and Sober in the country. Two, I think
really highlight what's going on out there, and it is
a problem in our country. You know, it is a
(27:11):
cultural thing and they're targeting the most vulnerable and things
have to change in that in that regard.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Sorry, I'm going to bug in there because I so
on my daily scroll I am constantly fed alcohol advertising.
And do you know how you can go in and
see why am I seeing this ad? And so I
will go in and say, don't show me this ad.
(27:39):
And you can actually put in their words to not
show me, and I've put in their numerous times don't
show me, whine and don't show me alcohol, but it
doesn't change.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
I'm constant getting it.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
And I mean the challenge we've got is we use
the word alcohol free. So the word alcohol is in there,
but it's I just think there needs to be some
changes in that because I'm constantly thinking about, well, what
if I was a vulnerable person and I was trying
to stop and this is just constantly being said to me.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Oh absolutely. And imagine gambling, the gambling ads and people
that have a real issue with gambled I mean, I mean,
I think the alcohol adds are bad, but I think
gambling is ten times worse.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
There's too much money commercially in alcohol. There's too much
excise tax being raped in by the government. Of every
unit of alcohol they get hot nearly half of it.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
Oh is it half?
Speaker 3 (28:33):
Well, depending on whether it's a wine, a beer, or
a spirit, I don't know. Is that the exact excise
numbers per per category? Yeah, excuse me this, but I
know from a wine perspective, there's twenty nine percent wine equalization.
That's plus the GST, so you're already up to thirty
one percent of that every unit of your bottle, picture,
forty percent of it's going off to tax, so.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
The government's not going to change anything because they're breaking
the money.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
And it's very similar to cigarettes, though when you think
about cigarettes twenty years ago, it would have been a
very similar thing attacks. But it's education and people speaking up,
and I think there is definitely a shift happening. The
younger generation are drinking less. They're having their green smoothies
and doing a yogurt instead of hungover, and I think
(29:19):
there is a shift. And I think the more you know,
social media is a great tool for sharing this information
as well all that we talk about the fact. I mean,
I don't want us to come across as prohibitioness because
if you can enjoy drinking, you know, in moderation, you
do you But we know that alcohols a type one carcinogen.
But I mean do we know that? I know that,
(29:42):
But is that a public you know? I feel like
that's something that not everyone knows.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
Now.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
People don't know that. I just think it's good for
your health because they've been told that red wine is
good for your health. It's all the antioxidants.
Speaker 3 (29:54):
Information.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
We could make educated choices about what we want to
do with them. But I think when we're not being
given the information or you know, and perhaps in some
cases you wouldn't want to hear it, so you're not
going to hear it even if it's there.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
But I just think it can be.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
Shared more, and you know, social media is a break.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
Tool for that.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
I absolutely agree with you, and I think social media
can be used for so much good and not target
so many vulnerable people because you are vulnerable when you're
in that state. You don't care what it takes to
get a drink. You just want that ethanol in your system.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
More home delivery services have popped up, particularly after COVID
solution to get delivery home. There was an unfortunate death
in Sydney where I think that people media where a
gentleman as he was an addictive person and just kept
and he was founded, and I think that it's just
a shocking scenario that occur.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
I just found it hard during COVID that the wine,
you know, the bottle, is that sort of thing we're
deemed as a necessary business and if you think about it,
we probably all would have literally had a meltdown if
they hadn't been able to buy alcohol, because you know,
that would have just stopped and everyone would have lost
their shit, but it's pretty sad that it's seemed as
(31:16):
an essential service.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yeah, and that shows you again much the government had
something to lose if they would, you know, and you're
rightly right in saying that there would have been a
lot of very angry people there are and probably a
lot of really sick people who would absolutely touring as well.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
So yeah, yeah, without without a doubt, I think they.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Considered all that probably, But I just feel so grateful
that Jason had got sober brightic COVID because I really
feel people during that time, when you know, you are isolated,
and that's something that you often do when you're in
that state, is isolate yourself, and I think people being
(32:02):
stuck at home. We have so many people say that
they stopped drinking during that time. And for us, we
started our business in November twenty.
Speaker 3 (32:12):
Nineteen and this happened he very much and it.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Was really interesting for us watching the initial lockdowns, everyone
was drinking, but that second lockdown, for us in Victoria,
a lot of people stopped drinking and that's when we
started to get a lot of interest because they were saying, well,
hang on, you know, we're starting at lunchtime now. And
you know, we need to put a pullback. And I
(32:38):
think that's where the rise of the alcohol free drinks
space really took off.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
It's interesting when you have a platform, the number of
people that reach out to you. I am constantly asked
about how I stopped drinking, what I did, how it's
changed my life? Is it for the better? Was it
really hard? Like it's really interesting the number of people
that do approach me and reach out to me just
wanting to know how I did it, because there are
(33:05):
a lot of people out there, I think that are
really struggling.
Speaker 3 (33:08):
How did you do it?
Speaker 1 (33:09):
That I knew I had a problem. I went saw
a GP who brushed me off and made me feel
like fool. I knew a psychiatrist, well, I knew his wife,
and I reached out to her and said would he
feel comfortable in seeing me? And at this stage, I
was at a tipping point where I was going to
get really bad, and I went and saw him. He
(33:31):
put me on Campero for six months. But from the
day he put me on it, I just decided I
wasn't going to drink again, and I haven't. So you know,
whether I had alcohol use disorder or not or I mean,
I certainly was behaving as someone that was starting to
get very out of control. I don't know, I don't
know how I was just able to stop, but I did,
(33:53):
and I just made my mind up. And I haven't
had a drink since then and won't because life is
so much better without it.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
I think those words like olcoholic can be a really
derogatory word.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
I hate it, yeah, and I.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Think I mean I used to use it not a
positive but in a neutral word way, but so many
people say I'm not an alcoholic, and I think I
think it's considered quite a stigmatized word. Yes, so I
think the alcohol used disorder and the fact that there's
so many different levels of alcohols disorder. Absolutely, And also,
(34:36):
like the gray area, drinking is also something that resonates
with a lot of people you might not consider yourself,
like for me, I remember doing a lot of googling
in these days, going, well, I knew there was the
man on the park bench, you know that was brown
paper bag, but my husband doesn't look like that, So
why is he so sick? And why can't he stop drinking?
Speaker 3 (34:59):
What's he? Then?
Speaker 2 (35:00):
And you know, I remember googling what does an alcoholic
look like? Or you know, how do you know if
one's an alcoholic? And I think, I mean that's one
thing in itself is that if you questioning whether you've
got a.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Problem with alcohol, you got a problem. You've probably got
a problem with alcohol.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Because people who don't have a problem with alcohol don't google.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
That's it exactly.
Speaker 3 (35:25):
See.
Speaker 1 (35:25):
I don't like the term sober either. I have a
and it's just me. I just have an issue with it.
I'm just a non drinker. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Well I say alcohol free because I think being free
is liberating and so yeah, I'm free of alcohol.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
Because to me, sober has a connotation around being an alcoholic.
And I really have an issue with the term alcoholic
because you know, I didn't miss a day of work,
and you know, I just managed my drinking hard and
fast so I could go to bed and then but
(36:02):
it got to the stage earth honestly, I was, Yeah,
I was going down a very dark hole.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
I think this fear of the word alcoholic. I hear
so many people say I'm not an alcoholic.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
You know, I wasn't an alcoholic, but I had to
stop drinking and I just think, yeah, just take the
power out of that word, like it just you know, you.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
Have a problem. You may have had an issue with alcohol.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Whether you're an alcoholic or not, it doesn't matter, you
know that the point is that you're that you're trying
to get well and to get off. You don't have
to put yourself into a box and say, well, gosh,
am I an alcoholic or am I? I think it's
just alcohol is not serving me. And I do not
know anybody who has stopped drinking who wishes they were
(36:50):
back in that state.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
You so mind you.
Speaker 1 (36:55):
I must say, I have used the term alcoholic when
people have hustled me and hassled me to have a
drink like you've been out, and they goingnah, come on,
you're right, you know you're fine. And I actually have
turned around and said, listen mate, I'm an alkie, so
you know you need to back off. That stops the
conversation pretty quick. They go, oh god, sorry, yeah, it's like,
(37:18):
you know, just back off, It's okay, I don't want
to drink. They just can't let it go. But guys,
thank you so much for coming in and chatting with me.
And I really appreciate the fact that you're both so
open about your journey because having been there myself, you
know it has its moments. And I'm just delighted that
you've got such an amazing product, and you know that
(37:40):
you're out there helping communities and sober in the country
and people that really are quite vulnerable and need assistance.
So it's wonderful that you're applying a drink that makes
us all feel dare I say it normal? So I
love it.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Well. I guess you should put a plug in for
sober in the country. If you're out in the regions,
get in touch with the crew. Wonderful website resource that
has support services, reading material and then contact information as well.
That's more dedicated to people out in the bush. And
I guess to read the city based people, it would
be Chris and it's clean slate.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
And if you want to try and change the dialogue
around alcohol, then get on board with Fair Australia because
they're often after people to write in or share their
stories things like that, So I think Fair needs a
fair bit of support as well. So there are some
great organizations out there that are really trying to change
(38:41):
the landscape around alcohol. Yeah, and you guys are one
of them.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
And just one last word on edge is that each
stands for every time choose health. And I think you know,
when you're in that state where you're trying to drink less,
it's opening the fridge and sy know canavech there and going,
what's my choice the bottle of wine or the can
of beage, And you know that's that little message that
(39:06):
hopefully helps somebody.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
I think that's wonderful
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