June 16, 2022 • 42 mins
This episode will revisit the speech actor Sacheen Littlefeather delivered on Marlon Brando's behalf to explore Native American representation in cinema and controversies about using the Oscars stage as a platform for activism.
Guests: Sacheen Littlefeather, activist/actress; Buffy Sainte-Marie, singer/songwriter
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Support for this podcast is made possible by Gordon and Dona Crawford, who believe that quality journalism makes Los Angeles a better place to live.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
this year. Obviously people are talking about the will smith
slap and they have been referring back to your speech.
Well, I have one thing to say about that.
I didn't do it.
(00:20):
Glad you made that clear. This is Sacheen little feather
whose appearance at the 1973 Academy Awards on behalf of
Marlon Brando recently went viral in reaction to will smith
slapping chris rock at the 2022 Academy Awards ceremony.
But there was a threat of violence that you faced
(00:42):
that evening
and I wonder if you're open to talking about that
backstage, behind me,
John Wayne
was very incensed, he attempted to assault me on stage.
He had to be restrained by six security men in
(01:05):
order to prevent him from doing exactly that
there is no footage of john Wayne, the Hollywood actor
famous for playing cowboys reacting to session speech. But several people,
including the Director of that evening's awards, have confirmed these
accounts
that night Marlon Brando was nominated for Best Actor for
(01:27):
his role as Don Corleone in The Godfather. He had
asked Sachin to attend the ceremony in his place and
if he won to refuse the award on his behalf
accepting the award for Marlon Brando in The Godfather
Before session went on stage that night, the producer of
(01:47):
the ceremony told her that she would be arrested if
she did not keep her speech to under a minute.
The standard speech time.
I knew I had to do everything in 60 seconds
or less. I saw the police officers waiting in the
wings to take me in handcuffs off the stage.
Here is the speech that made john Wayne so angry
(02:10):
that he needed to be restrained from charging the stage. Hello,
my name is Sacheen little feather. I'm Apache and I'm
president of the National Native American Affirmative Image committee. I'm
representing Marlon Brando this evening. He very regretfully cannot accept
this very generous award.
(02:32):
And the reasons for this being are the treatment of
american indians today by the film industry,
excuse me
and on television, in movie reruns
(02:55):
and also with recent happenings at wounded knee.
I beg at this time that I have not intruded
upon this evening and that we will in the future.
Our hearts and our understandings will meet with love and generosity.
Thank you On behalf of Marlon Brando.
(03:19):
I carried myself as a dignified indian woman would carry herself.
I spoke with courage with dignity with honor. I did
not use my fist. I did not use profanity and
I did not use a loud and egregious voice. I
spoke from my heart because the heart and the heartbeat
(03:42):
is the voice of all indigenous people everywhere. And that
is exactly what happened
In 60 seconds or less
in this week's episode. We are going to tell the
behind the scenes story of Sachin speech and break down
the political and cultural forces at play. That led to
(04:05):
that moment
And later in the episode, we'll hear from singer songwriter
and the first indigenous person to win an Oscar Buffy
Sainte Marie. She tells us about her reaction to Sachin
speech as well as what she believes the academy's role
should be in relation to social justice movements.
(04:35):
In 1973, Sacheen Little Feather was both an activist and
an actress. She says what inspired her to begin acting
in part was the fact that her father was deaf.
I couldn't communicate with him in sign language like my
mother did. So I had to communicate through
other ways and basically had to act out for him
(05:00):
the messages. So you you were performing out of a
kind of necessity. Family necessity. Yes, absolutely. And when I
was in grade school
I got to play several parts in several different plays
and enjoyed the experience. Of course there was a lot
of racially, you know, prejudice back then as well.
(05:23):
We were called the N word in grade school
and when I went to visit Mississippi Alabama and the
Southern states, I was made to drink out of the
black drinking faucet
and use the black bathrooms and I felt heard saw
(05:50):
and knew that there were great injustices going on
not only as an indian person
but with all people of color. Were you thinking that
acting could be a way that you could
make a difference in terms of these issues. I think
in terms of acting,
(06:12):
I felt that there should be
native people. Black people asian people, chicano people.
I felt that there should be an inclusion of everyone,
a rainbow of people that should be involved in creating
their own image.
(06:33):
I want to ask you about some of the ways
that you
you know, encountered images of indigenous people on screen. I mean,
did you have strong feelings about the western when you
were growing up? Did you immediately see this as a problem?
I think that everybody who saw Westerns who was native
(06:57):
wanted to be a cowboy.
I think that there is
a desire to be identifying with the winner. You know,
who wants to identify with the loser?
Well, I saw native people as being stereotyped. There was
(07:19):
a Hollywood indian, the movie indian and then the real indian,
there were two indians, one that was not real and
one that was real
and I knew the one that was real, that had
nothing to do with the screen. Indian with the Hollywood
indian
(07:40):
and under the domination of that stereotype. We couldn't get
jobs in the industry and represent ourselves as we really are.
There was job discrimination and the movie industry basically looked
like Clorox factory. I mean, it was so white, it
was ridiculous. What sorts of opportunities were there for you
(08:03):
when you were starting your acting career? Well, very few
except I got a few jobs with italian film crews
because in those days I was considered exotic and that
meant that you didn't get employment very often because you
(08:23):
were too exotic for mainstream. You heard that rather than
we won't hire you because you're a person of color,
no matter what your credentials were,
no matter how good you were. Period, especially in ads
(08:44):
and advertising, you didn't use a bar of soap, you
didn't use laundry detergent,
you didn't drink coca cola. We were just non existent
and no one ever questioned that.
I questioned it.
I questioned it when I refused the Academy Award for
Marlon Brando in 1973.
(09:08):
I want to talk a lot about what happened that night.
But I think part of the important context is your
work as an activist and your interest as an activist.
You had participated in the Alcatraz occupation
And you brought awareness to what was happening at wounded knee,
the occupation there. And it would be really helpful I
(09:28):
think to hear you talk about what that moment was
like in the early 1970s in terms of native struggle
and organizing
many native americans have parents who went to american indian
boarding schools, whether they were run by the government or
run by the churches because the churches were instrumental in
(09:52):
grabbing indian land from indians and keeping that land for themselves.
And this is a way
That making child napping legal was taking Children away at
the age of four and 5 from the parents
(10:15):
and keeping them in boarding schools
In the US there were over 400 boarding schools operating
from the late 1800s up until as recently as the
1960s with the express intention to assimilate indigenous Children by
removing them from their families,
keep the child but destroy everything about the indian, destroy
(10:38):
everything about the culture, destroy the language, destroy the native
american spiritual belief system and turn the native american into
a dominant society, person with dominant society values.
So in the late 60s, in the early 1970s
was there a particular way in which folks were coming
(11:02):
to consciousness that they were organizing in a way that
was especially important at that time.
There was the american indian movement
and its followers
and they were the ones that were wounded knee. In
South Dakota. The american indian movement was a militant civil
(11:22):
rights group similar to the black panthers or militia that
was raising consciousness and fighting for indigenous issues. A month
before solutions appearance at the Academy Awards members of the
American Indian movement along with 200 oglala Lakota activists seized
control of the small town of wounded knee. South Dakota
taking citizens hostage
(11:44):
and demanded the U. S. Government make good on treaties
respecting indigenous land ownership.
The american indian movement wanted to bring attention to the
broken promises of the US government and the impoverished living conditions.
Indigenous peoples were forced to endure.
Here's russell means one of the leaders of the occupation
talking about those conditions from wounded knee at the time,
Speaker 2 (12:07):
we are suffering starvation, hunger, inadequate shelter, inadequate warmth in
climate type of weather,
Speaker 1 (12:15):
there was a great injustice there
the way that native american indian people were treated.
And so the american indian movement came there within hours
of the occupation police had surrounded the town
and as a result the FBI came in and there
(12:35):
was a media blackout at wounded knee. Federal officials were
blocking press from speaking to the indigenous activists as part
of their military tactic to squash the occupation. Now when
I came up on the podium to represent Marlon Brando,
I mentioned in my speech, wounded knee,
(13:17):
Let's talk about how you um arrived at that moment
of going on stage and giving this speech.
When did you meet Marlon Brando? How did how did
you connect with him and how did this plan develop
that you would stand in for him at the Academy Awards.
I lived in san Francisco not far from Francis ford
(13:41):
Coppola Francis ford Coppola is of course the director of
the Godfather trilogy. And I used to walk the hills
of san Francisco
which is quite a feat because they're very steep. But
that was my exercise and I used to walk by
Francis ford Coppola's house every day and he used to
(14:01):
sit out on his porch. I had read many articles
about Marlon Brando being interested in native american indian people
but I had wondered if Marlon Brando was very sincere
in his interest in native american indian people
or was he just studying up for a film role.
(14:28):
So I wrote a letter to him but I didn't
know where to send it.
And it was a very sincere letter and I knew
that Francis ford Coppola had directed him and The Godfather.
So I asked Francis ford Coppola when I was walking
(14:49):
by one day
as an attractive young woman,
I called out to him and I said hello and
I introduced myself and he asked me to come up
on his porch. And I did and I began a
conversation with him
and eventually I told him I had this letter from
Marlon Brando
(15:10):
and I said but I don't know where to send it.
So he helped me to send that letter.
I waited a year. I was working at the radio
station K. F. R. C. Finally one day a year
later at the radio station
I got this very mysterious call.
(15:32):
So they put the call through
and he said to me
in his voices that he had
oh I bet you don't know who this is.
And I said sure I do. And he said well
who is it?
And I said it's Marlon Brando.
(15:54):
And he he laughed and I said well you sure
beat indian time all the hell I told them
And he laughed again and we laughed
and we just talk like we're old friends
about everything that was native, if he was playing a
part of the native or if he was really interested
(16:16):
in native american indian people
and we had a great conversation
and from then on we just became phone buddies,
he used to call me at home and then I
would fly down and spend time with he and his
family as a house guest.
(16:36):
And uh, I just knew him as a human being.
I was interested in him
as a fellow activist and also as just a person period.
It sounds like you got to a place where you
did feel that he was sincere in the interest that
he was showing. Absolutely yes, I did. So when did
(16:58):
he start to talk to you about the plan? The
possibility that you would accept the Oscar on his behalf
if he were to win. And he was clearly a
frontrunner for winning the academy Award that year.
So he called me on a saturday
and the academy awards was the next day,
(17:21):
That's how fast it happened.
And he swore me to secrecy not to tell anybody
which I did not.
And I flew down to his house
and I asked him about my wardrobe because I really
didn't have anything to wear except for my pow wow dress,
(17:43):
a northern style buckskin dress
and moccasins and hair ties. So you could say basically
he chose my wardrobe for me because he did,
I didn't have any evening gown or evening where? And
I went down to his house and he was very
(18:03):
busy and his secretary typing up this acceptance speech should
he win.
And I was kept basically in the dark.
So it was really late in the day when his
secretary gave me this long speech to read like eight pages, right, eight, Yeah.
(18:29):
And so I I said to myself, wow, this is
pretty long, I don't think I could do this.
And when I got to the Academy Awards, Howard Koch,
who was the producer of the Academy Awards Show itself,
said to me,
If you read that speech or go over 60 seconds,
(18:55):
I'm going to have you arrested. That's when Sachin knew
that she would have to improvise and not read off
of the statement Marlon Brando and his secretary had written
and his name was called as best actor.
And so I knew what I had to do
(19:15):
and I was praying beforehand the whole time for the
strength and the courage
to do what I needed to do.
And my ancestors were with me,
50 million people were watching the broadcast that night.
(19:37):
The immediate reaction in the room was mixed as we noted,
john Wayne was furious and people reacted with a mixture
of booing and applause
According to Sachin, there were consequences. You have said that
after giving your speech that you were red listed
and could you talk about what you mean by that,
(19:57):
what that meant in terms of your career
in the industry, the FBI, I found out, went around
to studios, I have a friend who was with a
particular studio and she told me Sachin the FBI were
(20:17):
just here and they told us that if we would
ever hire you they would shut us down. Shut our
production down. So
there were lies that were printed about me in the press.
There were lies going around about me altogether. Said I
rented my buckskin dress that I was an indian. I
was a mexican actress that it was all a publicity
(20:41):
stunt etcetera etcetera etcetera. Nothing could be further from the truth.
But ultimately Sachin was not concerned about what Hollywood or
the government thought about her or her speech. People who
sent me notes of congratulations were Coretta scott King, the
(21:01):
widow of martin Luther king and also cesar Chavez also
my own people
and others
who counted in my life who I admired and I
knew that I had done the right thing irregardless of
what other people had said or did to me.
(21:23):
I knew I had done the right thing
coming up, legendary folk singer, songwriter Buffy Sainte Marie,
(21:51):
Buffy Sainte Marie was the first indigenous person to win
an Oscar.
The winner is Jack Cichy Buffy Sainte Marie,
She won for Best Original Song in 1983. She co
wrote up where we belong for the movie and officer
(22:12):
and a gentleman. It was performed by Joe Cocker and
Jennifer Warrants.
(22:32):
Thank you for me too,
marty Stuart Levin joe conquer jennifer warren's kurtz over my mom,
my little boy Cody
and most of all, my husband Jack nature gave me
the chance to be a part of opportunity. Gentlemen, thank
you very much.
(22:53):
Buffy Sainte Marie. It's wonderful to see you always. Thanks
jackal and you two in 1983 you became the first
indigenous person to win an Oscar. Could you talk about
that experience? Did it really uh, strike you that you
were making history at that moment when your name was
called and you went up on stage. Oh no, I
(23:15):
never know. I never thought about that until recently when
people have been phrasing it like that. No,
yes. I was the first indigenous person to win an
Oscar and it was up where we belong from an
officer and a gentleman. I wrote the melody for them.
So when it came to be that we had been
nominated and we knew we were going to go to
(23:37):
the Oscar ceremony. Oh, I had this pink sparkly sequined dress.
I mean it was so wonderful but we didn't really
expect to win. And then we did. And it was just,
it was just astounding
the previous time an indigenous person was on the Academy
awards stage with Sacheen little feather. 10 years earlier, Buffy
(24:00):
had caught it on tv at the time. She didn't
know session personally. What was your reaction to her speech?
Of course I knew marlin And this was 1973 for
Pete's sakes, 1973 there was a war against indigenous people
in south Dakota wounded name was going on.
(24:21):
So what we had to deal with was a little
bit different from everybody else in that studio audience or
most of the people watching television. And I was very
proud of Sachin and I was totally surprised of course.
And he was proud of marlin too because let me
tell you how it is. Sometimes the american indian movement
or some of the group would invite a celebrity, you know,
(24:42):
someone of the level of jane fonda or Marlon brando
and they would show up all heart, you know, they
would really, really want to help and all.
But what do you think the dog on media is
going to do? They're not there to see our issue
and we wind up with a great big story about
our celebrity who was there to help the indians and
(25:03):
the issue isn't even portrayed accurately, which kind of was
the point.
So for Sachin to get up there in front of
the whole wide world and to represent marlin in that way,
I thought, I thought it was great. But you know,
there's a lot to say. We should probably give people
kind of a feeling about how it was in Hollywood
(25:26):
for indigenous people, you know? Yeah, yeah. Because that's the
first thing she said, she talks about the treatment of
the american indian, maybe you could help us to sort
of get a sense of the picture that she was describing.
Well, it's kind of weird. If you, if you look
at movie history, I guess probably the first thing that
you would come up with involving indigenous people would pay thomas. Edison,
(25:50):
I mean he made, he made one of the first
movies and you know, they were colorful things and interesting things.
So we started showing up and being portrayed by other
people in the movies right out of the gate
too Short. Edison films made in the late 18 hundreds,
Buffalo dance and Sue ghost dance featuring Sioux tribes members
(26:12):
are considered to be the first instances of indigenous peoples
caught on film
From Robert Flaherty's Nanook of the north in 1922 to
educational films from the mid-20th century. Indigenous communities have long
been of interest to documentarians, but the films were almost
never told from indigenous points of view.
(26:33):
The University of Arizona's American Indian Film Gallery includes nearly
500 documentaries. They featured narration that the project's archivists described
as condescending at best and racist and inaccurate at worst.
So Buffy was naturally skeptical of projects aimed to capture
indigenous history. But anyway, in 1967 or 68, I was
(26:59):
invited to take a role in the Virginia.
The Virginian was a television series set in late 1800s
Wyoming and I was offered a role in an episode.
But I said if you want me Buffy Sainte Marie
who got hit records and is known as an indigenous
person to show up in your movie. What I want
is real easy. All the indigenous parts are to be
(27:22):
played by indigenous people
and of course they said oh no that uh we've got,
I forget what the number was 32 extras or something
and we've got some leading parts to they can't all
the indians and I said well then I'm not gonna
do it because I know they can
so they were going to use makeup right to make
(27:43):
people look like indians. Huh? Yeah they said they said
don't worry about it. We've got Filipinos, we've got Italians,
we've got jews, we've got Koreans and besides that we've
got makeup artists that can turn a dog into a
cat And my reaction to that was you know it's
(28:03):
more important than just fooling white people.
We're giving you a gift here.
We had so much to bring to the table and
see Marlon had been in indian country. He knew that
he knew we weren't just one little two little three
little indians to be exploited when somebody needed something in
feathers to act like a villain or a victim he
(28:24):
knew so we appreciated marlin. So Sachin you know she
looked so beautiful. She was wearing her traditional clothes and
yet we're all quite you know any anybody that I've
ever talked to about that evening. You know we were
all totally surprised of course
but bravo to both of them, you know, they they
did something
(28:45):
and I was hoping that you could also talk about
some of your activism during that period, part of the
Alcatraz occupation for example, because that period
is so critical in terms of the american indian movement
and uh do you have some, you know, any reflections
on the legacy of that movement today? Well, Alcatraz was
(29:07):
very important at the time and I still think that
Alcatraz is important because Alcatraz was not done just by
a bunch of people who were ticked off because their
rights are being denied. It wasn't, there was a lot
more to it than that.
Um the history of Alcatraz itself, I mean Alcatraz should
have come to indigenous people, it should have come back
to us when they were finished using it for what
(29:29):
they were using it for at the time, Alcatraz sat
on public land. And so when the infamous Alcatraz prison
was shut down and a development plan for a casino
was announced, indigenous activists decided to occupy the island and
reclaim it.
Buffy never lived on the island, but she helped bring
clean drinking water to the occupiers.
(29:50):
We wanted to turn it into cultural centers and you know,
we had, we had done our homework, but I mean we,
I don't mean me particularly, but it was john Trudell
and a lot of other people who are in the
next world now who really did that work. But the
reason why it was important. Alcatraz was one of many,
many building complexes campuses that were created on indigenous land
(30:16):
with the blessing of indigenous people
with contracts and when they were no longer going to
be used for that specific purpose, they were supposed to
come back to us.
I mean I wound up ducking bullets. I'm running running
through the woods in Russian Wisconsin over this medical facility
(30:37):
built on MMA nominee land and it was supposed to
be returned to the people. I mean it was built
by the catholic church
with the agreement of the Menominee people and then it
was supposed to revert back to the tribe and the
local vigilantes were not having any of it. They wanted
it for themselves and they were shooting at us. So
(30:57):
there were things going on before and after Alcatraz, Although
I'm glad you bring it up.
What kind of bothers me a little bit is that
it's like every 25 years there's an Indian uprising and
we get our names in the paper and then everybody
forgets about us because you know, just the way of
the world in Canada indigenous people are quite prominently represented
(31:21):
in just about any field or profession you can think of.
I mean, you know, from, from, from television broadcasters and lawyers.
There's a huge, huge mix of professions and there are
a few people, you know in the academy, there are
a few indigenous, I'm not the only indigenous person in
the academy, there are other indigenous people, but it's tricky
(31:43):
right now, you know, with the academy because just our
way of voting, you vote in your own field, like
I only vote, I'm in the music branch,
but and I'm the only indigenous person in the music
branch
and you have to have two people in your branch
to nominate somebody.
(32:05):
And so although we have directors and producers and actors
and actresses and we have people in, in, you know,
a lot of the professions, there are not two indigenous
people
in any profession
familiar enough with what the indigenous talent scene is in
(32:25):
film to be able to properly bring those people forward.
We have to discuss that it is a lot of
talented people, structural issue that you're pointing to, You might
have bigger numbers, but if people are isolated in their branches,
then what's the impact that they can have? Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, Right.
Do you think the Academy can or should have a
(32:48):
stronger presence in terms of
weighing in on social political issues, activists work?
Oh Gosh, that's that's so hard. You know, I try
very hard not to tell anybody else what to do.
And when it comes to a question like that, I
would I would certainly be willing to be part of
a discussion, but I do see many sides of many
(33:11):
questions I told you as a philosophy major. So I
can look, I can look at things from six or
10 points of view at the same time and have
fun with that.
I don't know the way I look at it. Jacqueline
is that there's a whole lot of good work left
to be done in the world, including in the movie industry.
And that's why we're here. Yeah. So I don't take
your your question about you know, whether the academy ought
(33:33):
to be doing more,
everybody ought to be doing more. Everybody's ripening and growing
and understanding and learning at the same time. So just
as for myself, I'm just gonna keep on producing good stuff.
And if somebody sees it great and if they don't
see it, not as great, but still great because I'm
a creative
the movie industry is one of the places that I've
(33:55):
been allowed to, you know, do My little dance is,
you know, scoring movies and being in things and encouraging
people and just being involved with the academy is it's
it's a great privilege and we can make good change
and we should and it shouldn't be a chore and
it shouldn't hurt. It shouldn't hurt. We can do this enjoy.
(34:17):
I mean, we're creative people and we certainly have the resources.
Yes, absolutely. Yes. I have 11 more question for you
take a little step back when you hear the term
indigenous representation Buffy, what does that mean to you?
I would have to say I would have to ask
(34:40):
for details.
I'm not exactly sure what you're going out but I'll
take a stab at it. But I've gotten out of
being a concert artist and you know, folk singer songwriter,
however you want to describe has been airplane tickets and
those airplane tickets not only have taken me to London
and paris and Hong kong and Sydney, you know, but
(35:00):
also to the indigenous corners of the world where Michael,
Jackson and Madonna would not want to go and
I would not even be invited to go. It's just
a different world. So the world of indigenous people, whether
you're talking about indigenous people like Maoris in new Zealand
or aboriginal people in Australia and all the different kinds
of people in africa. Whether you're talking about the Sami people,
(35:23):
the indigenous people of Scandinavia. I mean I've spent lots
of time with other indigenous people.
So when I hear the word indigenous, I don't just
think of Canadian indians or american indians. I don't, I
think about first, I know this is actual. When you
say the word indigenous first, my brain takes a trip
(35:45):
from the arctic circle all the way to to the
bottom of south America, all those different people, they're all indigenous.
And I've traveled enough in both the glamorous world of
show business but also a lot with indigenous people and
I know I know how it, I know how it
(36:06):
is and indigenous people in the world, what we have
in common is a lot of really, really good stuff.
Indigenous people had different systems. Indigenous people sometimes still but
not as much as we wish had languages that were
quite different from the concept of language is that most
(36:29):
people have.
I mean if you talk about spanish and italian and
Portuguese and french, you know they're all kind of related
and if you look at your hand, each one of
those is like a finger. But an indigenous language doesn't
come from that part of exercising the brain doesn't come
from there. It's like a thumb, it has a different function.
(36:49):
And people who are interested in this subject will tell
you that indigenous languages are sometimes exercising a different part
of the brain. Coming up with different ways of thinking
different ideas. And when you think of the things that
indigenous people, just indigenous people of the Americas have given
the rest of the world, you might say, oh they
look different or they have different music or different, oh
(37:10):
boy we can think differently. We have contributions that have
yet to be made to the world and people want
to start paying attention.
It's not only survival stuff, it's all kinds of other stuff,
artsy stuff stories, ways of telling stories. I spent some
time with an indigenous woman from Mexico who came from
a small rural group
(37:31):
discovered the spanish language and fell in love with it,
went to university and when she went home she had
the darndest time explaining to her friends what it was
that she did because in her language there's no metaphor.
So everything the only thing you talk about is what
is therefore there's no lying.
(37:52):
But she could not explain what poetry was.
And she became a poet. So now she's a poet
who writes in her own language
for the first time ever and in spanish. So indigenous
people all over the world are a page that most
of you have not turned yet. And it is exciting,
(38:14):
like a library is exciting. It's about everything and we're
about everything, including our stories and how we can portray them.
It's all good. You know, it's just all good. Yeah.
When you talk the way you're describing this incredible wealth
of cultural heritage and thinking, think about that. And then
you think about the tiny range of representations of indigenous
(38:38):
people on screen. I mean the gap is uh is staggering.
There just how limited the representations have been.
It's staggering. You know, And um, you know, there's one
way of looking at it would be to say poor
us were not represented. But the other way of looking
at it is poor. You you don't know what you're missing.
So that's always the way I've thought about it.
(39:02):
Well, thank you Buffy, thank you so much for these insights.
I always enjoy talking with you so much. Thank you
now that your big eyes are finally open,
(39:26):
how that you're wondering how must they feel
meaning them? That you've chased across America's movie screens.
No,
that you're wondering
how can it be real?
But the ones you've called
(39:48):
propaganda,
they starve in their splendor.
You've asked for my comment. I simply will render
my country.
(40:17):
The Academy Museum podcast is written and hosted by me
Jacqueline Stewart.
This episode was produced by antonia sarah ito. The Academy
Museum podcast team includes Kimberly stevens, victoria Alejandro and antonia
sarah ito. The show is a production of the Academy
Museum of Motion Pictures in collaboration with L. A Studios
(40:40):
mixing and original music by E scott kelly.
Our theme music was composed by Nicholas, Patel, Antonio Sarah
Edo and Leo G are the executive producers for Elia Studios.
Our podcast website Elliott dot com slash podcast is designed
by Andy Chitwood and the digital and marketing teams at
(41:02):
Elliot's Studios, the Academy Museum Marketing team created our branding
thanks to the team at the Academy Museum, including Sean
Anderson Peter Castro Stephanie sykes and Mat Younger
and to our Academy colleagues, randy Haber camp and Clare Lockhart.
Thanks also to the team at Elliot's Studios, including Taylor
(41:26):
Kaufman severe brah Kristen Hayford, Kristin Mueller Andy Orosco Michael
Cosentino and Leo G
Academy Museum Digital engagement platforms including this podcast are sponsored
by Bloomberg philanthropies,
support for this podcast is made possible by Gordon and
(41:49):
Donna Crawford who believe that quality Journalism makes los Angeles
a better place to live
this program is made possible in part by the Corporation
for Public Broadcasting, a private corporation funded by the american People.
this year. Obviously people are talking about the will smith
slap and they have been referring back to your speech.
Well, I have one thing to say about that.
I didn't do it.
(00:20):
Glad you made that clear. This is Sacheen little feather
whose appearance at the 1973 Academy Awards on behalf of
Marlon Brando recently went viral in reaction to will smith
slapping chris rock at the 2022 Academy Awards ceremony.
But there was a threat of violence that you faced
(00:42):
that evening
and I wonder if you're open to talking about that
backstage, behind me,
John Wayne
was very incensed, he attempted to assault me on stage.
He had to be restrained by six security men in
(01:05):
order to prevent him from doing exactly that
there is no footage of john Wayne, the Hollywood actor
famous for playing cowboys reacting to session speech. But several people,
including the Director of that evening's awards, have confirmed these
accounts
that night Marlon Brando was nominated for Best Actor for
(01:27):
his role as Don Corleone in The Godfather. He had
asked Sachin to attend the ceremony in his place and
if he won to refuse the award on his behalf
accepting the award for Marlon Brando in The Godfather
Before session went on stage that night, the producer of
(01:47):
the ceremony told her that she would be arrested if
she did not keep her speech to under a minute.
The standard speech time.
I knew I had to do everything in 60 seconds
or less. I saw the police officers waiting in the
wings to take me in handcuffs off the stage.
Here is the speech that made john Wayne so angry
(02:10):
that he needed to be restrained from charging the stage. Hello,
my name is Sacheen little feather. I'm Apache and I'm
president of the National Native American Affirmative Image committee. I'm
representing Marlon Brando this evening. He very regretfully cannot accept
this very generous award.
(02:32):
And the reasons for this being are the treatment of
american indians today by the film industry,
excuse me
and on television, in movie reruns
(02:55):
and also with recent happenings at wounded knee.
I beg at this time that I have not intruded
upon this evening and that we will in the future.
Our hearts and our understandings will meet with love and generosity.
Thank you On behalf of Marlon Brando.
(03:19):
I carried myself as a dignified indian woman would carry herself.
I spoke with courage with dignity with honor. I did
not use my fist. I did not use profanity and
I did not use a loud and egregious voice. I
spoke from my heart because the heart and the heartbeat
(03:42):
is the voice of all indigenous people everywhere. And that
is exactly what happened
In 60 seconds or less
in this week's episode. We are going to tell the
behind the scenes story of Sachin speech and break down
the political and cultural forces at play. That led to
(04:05):
that moment
And later in the episode, we'll hear from singer songwriter
and the first indigenous person to win an Oscar Buffy
Sainte Marie. She tells us about her reaction to Sachin
speech as well as what she believes the academy's role
should be in relation to social justice movements.
(04:35):
In 1973, Sacheen Little Feather was both an activist and
an actress. She says what inspired her to begin acting
in part was the fact that her father was deaf.
I couldn't communicate with him in sign language like my
mother did. So I had to communicate through
other ways and basically had to act out for him
(05:00):
the messages. So you you were performing out of a
kind of necessity. Family necessity. Yes, absolutely. And when I
was in grade school
I got to play several parts in several different plays
and enjoyed the experience. Of course there was a lot
of racially, you know, prejudice back then as well.
(05:23):
We were called the N word in grade school
and when I went to visit Mississippi Alabama and the
Southern states, I was made to drink out of the
black drinking faucet
and use the black bathrooms and I felt heard saw
(05:50):
and knew that there were great injustices going on
not only as an indian person
but with all people of color. Were you thinking that
acting could be a way that you could
make a difference in terms of these issues. I think
in terms of acting,
(06:12):
I felt that there should be
native people. Black people asian people, chicano people.
I felt that there should be an inclusion of everyone,
a rainbow of people that should be involved in creating
their own image.
(06:33):
I want to ask you about some of the ways
that you
you know, encountered images of indigenous people on screen. I mean,
did you have strong feelings about the western when you
were growing up? Did you immediately see this as a problem?
I think that everybody who saw Westerns who was native
(06:57):
wanted to be a cowboy.
I think that there is
a desire to be identifying with the winner. You know,
who wants to identify with the loser?
Well, I saw native people as being stereotyped. There was
(07:19):
a Hollywood indian, the movie indian and then the real indian,
there were two indians, one that was not real and
one that was real
and I knew the one that was real, that had
nothing to do with the screen. Indian with the Hollywood
indian
(07:40):
and under the domination of that stereotype. We couldn't get
jobs in the industry and represent ourselves as we really are.
There was job discrimination and the movie industry basically looked
like Clorox factory. I mean, it was so white, it
was ridiculous. What sorts of opportunities were there for you
(08:03):
when you were starting your acting career? Well, very few
except I got a few jobs with italian film crews
because in those days I was considered exotic and that
meant that you didn't get employment very often because you
(08:23):
were too exotic for mainstream. You heard that rather than
we won't hire you because you're a person of color,
no matter what your credentials were,
no matter how good you were. Period, especially in ads
(08:44):
and advertising, you didn't use a bar of soap, you
didn't use laundry detergent,
you didn't drink coca cola. We were just non existent
and no one ever questioned that.
I questioned it.
I questioned it when I refused the Academy Award for
Marlon Brando in 1973.
(09:08):
I want to talk a lot about what happened that night.
But I think part of the important context is your
work as an activist and your interest as an activist.
You had participated in the Alcatraz occupation
And you brought awareness to what was happening at wounded knee,
the occupation there. And it would be really helpful I
(09:28):
think to hear you talk about what that moment was
like in the early 1970s in terms of native struggle
and organizing
many native americans have parents who went to american indian
boarding schools, whether they were run by the government or
run by the churches because the churches were instrumental in
(09:52):
grabbing indian land from indians and keeping that land for themselves.
And this is a way
That making child napping legal was taking Children away at
the age of four and 5 from the parents
(10:15):
and keeping them in boarding schools
In the US there were over 400 boarding schools operating
from the late 1800s up until as recently as the
1960s with the express intention to assimilate indigenous Children by
removing them from their families,
keep the child but destroy everything about the indian, destroy
(10:38):
everything about the culture, destroy the language, destroy the native
american spiritual belief system and turn the native american into
a dominant society, person with dominant society values.
So in the late 60s, in the early 1970s
was there a particular way in which folks were coming
(11:02):
to consciousness that they were organizing in a way that
was especially important at that time.
There was the american indian movement
and its followers
and they were the ones that were wounded knee. In
South Dakota. The american indian movement was a militant civil
(11:22):
rights group similar to the black panthers or militia that
was raising consciousness and fighting for indigenous issues. A month
before solutions appearance at the Academy Awards members of the
American Indian movement along with 200 oglala Lakota activists seized
control of the small town of wounded knee. South Dakota
taking citizens hostage
(11:44):
and demanded the U. S. Government make good on treaties
respecting indigenous land ownership.
The american indian movement wanted to bring attention to the
broken promises of the US government and the impoverished living conditions.
Indigenous peoples were forced to endure.
Here's russell means one of the leaders of the occupation
talking about those conditions from wounded knee at the time,
Speaker 2 (12:07):
we are suffering starvation, hunger, inadequate shelter, inadequate warmth in
climate type of weather,
Speaker 1 (12:15):
there was a great injustice there
the way that native american indian people were treated.
And so the american indian movement came there within hours
of the occupation police had surrounded the town
and as a result the FBI came in and there
(12:35):
was a media blackout at wounded knee. Federal officials were
blocking press from speaking to the indigenous activists as part
of their military tactic to squash the occupation. Now when
I came up on the podium to represent Marlon Brando,
I mentioned in my speech, wounded knee,
(13:17):
Let's talk about how you um arrived at that moment
of going on stage and giving this speech.
When did you meet Marlon Brando? How did how did
you connect with him and how did this plan develop
that you would stand in for him at the Academy Awards.
I lived in san Francisco not far from Francis ford
(13:41):
Coppola Francis ford Coppola is of course the director of
the Godfather trilogy. And I used to walk the hills
of san Francisco
which is quite a feat because they're very steep. But
that was my exercise and I used to walk by
Francis ford Coppola's house every day and he used to
(14:01):
sit out on his porch. I had read many articles
about Marlon Brando being interested in native american indian people
but I had wondered if Marlon Brando was very sincere
in his interest in native american indian people
or was he just studying up for a film role.
(14:28):
So I wrote a letter to him but I didn't
know where to send it.
And it was a very sincere letter and I knew
that Francis ford Coppola had directed him and The Godfather.
So I asked Francis ford Coppola when I was walking
(14:49):
by one day
as an attractive young woman,
I called out to him and I said hello and
I introduced myself and he asked me to come up
on his porch. And I did and I began a
conversation with him
and eventually I told him I had this letter from
Marlon Brando
(15:10):
and I said but I don't know where to send it.
So he helped me to send that letter.
I waited a year. I was working at the radio
station K. F. R. C. Finally one day a year
later at the radio station
I got this very mysterious call.
(15:32):
So they put the call through
and he said to me
in his voices that he had
oh I bet you don't know who this is.
And I said sure I do. And he said well
who is it?
And I said it's Marlon Brando.
(15:54):
And he he laughed and I said well you sure
beat indian time all the hell I told them
And he laughed again and we laughed
and we just talk like we're old friends
about everything that was native, if he was playing a
part of the native or if he was really interested
(16:16):
in native american indian people
and we had a great conversation
and from then on we just became phone buddies,
he used to call me at home and then I
would fly down and spend time with he and his
family as a house guest.
(16:36):
And uh, I just knew him as a human being.
I was interested in him
as a fellow activist and also as just a person period.
It sounds like you got to a place where you
did feel that he was sincere in the interest that
he was showing. Absolutely yes, I did. So when did
(16:58):
he start to talk to you about the plan? The
possibility that you would accept the Oscar on his behalf
if he were to win. And he was clearly a
frontrunner for winning the academy Award that year.
So he called me on a saturday
and the academy awards was the next day,
(17:21):
That's how fast it happened.
And he swore me to secrecy not to tell anybody
which I did not.
And I flew down to his house
and I asked him about my wardrobe because I really
didn't have anything to wear except for my pow wow dress,
(17:43):
a northern style buckskin dress
and moccasins and hair ties. So you could say basically
he chose my wardrobe for me because he did,
I didn't have any evening gown or evening where? And
I went down to his house and he was very
(18:03):
busy and his secretary typing up this acceptance speech should
he win.
And I was kept basically in the dark.
So it was really late in the day when his
secretary gave me this long speech to read like eight pages, right, eight, Yeah.
(18:29):
And so I I said to myself, wow, this is
pretty long, I don't think I could do this.
And when I got to the Academy Awards, Howard Koch,
who was the producer of the Academy Awards Show itself,
said to me,
If you read that speech or go over 60 seconds,
(18:55):
I'm going to have you arrested. That's when Sachin knew
that she would have to improvise and not read off
of the statement Marlon Brando and his secretary had written
and his name was called as best actor.
And so I knew what I had to do
(19:15):
and I was praying beforehand the whole time for the
strength and the courage
to do what I needed to do.
And my ancestors were with me,
50 million people were watching the broadcast that night.
(19:37):
The immediate reaction in the room was mixed as we noted,
john Wayne was furious and people reacted with a mixture
of booing and applause
According to Sachin, there were consequences. You have said that
after giving your speech that you were red listed
and could you talk about what you mean by that,
(19:57):
what that meant in terms of your career
in the industry, the FBI, I found out, went around
to studios, I have a friend who was with a
particular studio and she told me Sachin the FBI were
(20:17):
just here and they told us that if we would
ever hire you they would shut us down. Shut our
production down. So
there were lies that were printed about me in the press.
There were lies going around about me altogether. Said I
rented my buckskin dress that I was an indian. I
was a mexican actress that it was all a publicity
(20:41):
stunt etcetera etcetera etcetera. Nothing could be further from the truth.
But ultimately Sachin was not concerned about what Hollywood or
the government thought about her or her speech. People who
sent me notes of congratulations were Coretta scott King, the
(21:01):
widow of martin Luther king and also cesar Chavez also
my own people
and others
who counted in my life who I admired and I
knew that I had done the right thing irregardless of
what other people had said or did to me.
(21:23):
I knew I had done the right thing
coming up, legendary folk singer, songwriter Buffy Sainte Marie,
(21:51):
Buffy Sainte Marie was the first indigenous person to win
an Oscar.
The winner is Jack Cichy Buffy Sainte Marie,
She won for Best Original Song in 1983. She co
wrote up where we belong for the movie and officer
(22:12):
and a gentleman. It was performed by Joe Cocker and
Jennifer Warrants.
(22:32):
Thank you for me too,
marty Stuart Levin joe conquer jennifer warren's kurtz over my mom,
my little boy Cody
and most of all, my husband Jack nature gave me
the chance to be a part of opportunity. Gentlemen, thank
you very much.
(22:53):
Buffy Sainte Marie. It's wonderful to see you always. Thanks
jackal and you two in 1983 you became the first
indigenous person to win an Oscar. Could you talk about
that experience? Did it really uh, strike you that you
were making history at that moment when your name was
called and you went up on stage. Oh no, I
(23:15):
never know. I never thought about that until recently when
people have been phrasing it like that. No,
yes. I was the first indigenous person to win an
Oscar and it was up where we belong from an
officer and a gentleman. I wrote the melody for them.
So when it came to be that we had been
nominated and we knew we were going to go to
(23:37):
the Oscar ceremony. Oh, I had this pink sparkly sequined dress.
I mean it was so wonderful but we didn't really
expect to win. And then we did. And it was just,
it was just astounding
the previous time an indigenous person was on the Academy
awards stage with Sacheen little feather. 10 years earlier, Buffy
(24:00):
had caught it on tv at the time. She didn't
know session personally. What was your reaction to her speech?
Of course I knew marlin And this was 1973 for
Pete's sakes, 1973 there was a war against indigenous people
in south Dakota wounded name was going on.
(24:21):
So what we had to deal with was a little
bit different from everybody else in that studio audience or
most of the people watching television. And I was very
proud of Sachin and I was totally surprised of course.
And he was proud of marlin too because let me
tell you how it is. Sometimes the american indian movement
or some of the group would invite a celebrity, you know,
(24:42):
someone of the level of jane fonda or Marlon brando
and they would show up all heart, you know, they
would really, really want to help and all.
But what do you think the dog on media is
going to do? They're not there to see our issue
and we wind up with a great big story about
our celebrity who was there to help the indians and
(25:03):
the issue isn't even portrayed accurately, which kind of was
the point.
So for Sachin to get up there in front of
the whole wide world and to represent marlin in that way,
I thought, I thought it was great. But you know,
there's a lot to say. We should probably give people
kind of a feeling about how it was in Hollywood
(25:26):
for indigenous people, you know? Yeah, yeah. Because that's the
first thing she said, she talks about the treatment of
the american indian, maybe you could help us to sort
of get a sense of the picture that she was describing.
Well, it's kind of weird. If you, if you look
at movie history, I guess probably the first thing that
you would come up with involving indigenous people would pay thomas. Edison,
(25:50):
I mean he made, he made one of the first
movies and you know, they were colorful things and interesting things.
So we started showing up and being portrayed by other
people in the movies right out of the gate
too Short. Edison films made in the late 18 hundreds,
Buffalo dance and Sue ghost dance featuring Sioux tribes members
(26:12):
are considered to be the first instances of indigenous peoples
caught on film
From Robert Flaherty's Nanook of the north in 1922 to
educational films from the mid-20th century. Indigenous communities have long
been of interest to documentarians, but the films were almost
never told from indigenous points of view.
(26:33):
The University of Arizona's American Indian Film Gallery includes nearly
500 documentaries. They featured narration that the project's archivists described
as condescending at best and racist and inaccurate at worst.
So Buffy was naturally skeptical of projects aimed to capture
indigenous history. But anyway, in 1967 or 68, I was
(26:59):
invited to take a role in the Virginia.
The Virginian was a television series set in late 1800s
Wyoming and I was offered a role in an episode.
But I said if you want me Buffy Sainte Marie
who got hit records and is known as an indigenous
person to show up in your movie. What I want
is real easy. All the indigenous parts are to be
(27:22):
played by indigenous people
and of course they said oh no that uh we've got,
I forget what the number was 32 extras or something
and we've got some leading parts to they can't all
the indians and I said well then I'm not gonna
do it because I know they can
so they were going to use makeup right to make
(27:43):
people look like indians. Huh? Yeah they said they said
don't worry about it. We've got Filipinos, we've got Italians,
we've got jews, we've got Koreans and besides that we've
got makeup artists that can turn a dog into a
cat And my reaction to that was you know it's
(28:03):
more important than just fooling white people.
We're giving you a gift here.
We had so much to bring to the table and
see Marlon had been in indian country. He knew that
he knew we weren't just one little two little three
little indians to be exploited when somebody needed something in
feathers to act like a villain or a victim he
(28:24):
knew so we appreciated marlin. So Sachin you know she
looked so beautiful. She was wearing her traditional clothes and
yet we're all quite you know any anybody that I've
ever talked to about that evening. You know we were
all totally surprised of course
but bravo to both of them, you know, they they
did something
(28:45):
and I was hoping that you could also talk about
some of your activism during that period, part of the
Alcatraz occupation for example, because that period
is so critical in terms of the american indian movement
and uh do you have some, you know, any reflections
on the legacy of that movement today? Well, Alcatraz was
(29:07):
very important at the time and I still think that
Alcatraz is important because Alcatraz was not done just by
a bunch of people who were ticked off because their
rights are being denied. It wasn't, there was a lot
more to it than that.
Um the history of Alcatraz itself, I mean Alcatraz should
have come to indigenous people, it should have come back
to us when they were finished using it for what
(29:29):
they were using it for at the time, Alcatraz sat
on public land. And so when the infamous Alcatraz prison
was shut down and a development plan for a casino
was announced, indigenous activists decided to occupy the island and
reclaim it.
Buffy never lived on the island, but she helped bring
clean drinking water to the occupiers.
(29:50):
We wanted to turn it into cultural centers and you know,
we had, we had done our homework, but I mean we,
I don't mean me particularly, but it was john Trudell
and a lot of other people who are in the
next world now who really did that work. But the
reason why it was important. Alcatraz was one of many,
many building complexes campuses that were created on indigenous land
(30:16):
with the blessing of indigenous people
with contracts and when they were no longer going to
be used for that specific purpose, they were supposed to
come back to us.
I mean I wound up ducking bullets. I'm running running
through the woods in Russian Wisconsin over this medical facility
(30:37):
built on MMA nominee land and it was supposed to
be returned to the people. I mean it was built
by the catholic church
with the agreement of the Menominee people and then it
was supposed to revert back to the tribe and the
local vigilantes were not having any of it. They wanted
it for themselves and they were shooting at us. So
(30:57):
there were things going on before and after Alcatraz, Although
I'm glad you bring it up.
What kind of bothers me a little bit is that
it's like every 25 years there's an Indian uprising and
we get our names in the paper and then everybody
forgets about us because you know, just the way of
the world in Canada indigenous people are quite prominently represented
(31:21):
in just about any field or profession you can think of.
I mean, you know, from, from, from television broadcasters and lawyers.
There's a huge, huge mix of professions and there are
a few people, you know in the academy, there are
a few indigenous, I'm not the only indigenous person in
the academy, there are other indigenous people, but it's tricky
(31:43):
right now, you know, with the academy because just our
way of voting, you vote in your own field, like
I only vote, I'm in the music branch,
but and I'm the only indigenous person in the music
branch
and you have to have two people in your branch
to nominate somebody.
(32:05):
And so although we have directors and producers and actors
and actresses and we have people in, in, you know,
a lot of the professions, there are not two indigenous
people
in any profession
familiar enough with what the indigenous talent scene is in
(32:25):
film to be able to properly bring those people forward.
We have to discuss that it is a lot of
talented people, structural issue that you're pointing to, You might
have bigger numbers, but if people are isolated in their branches,
then what's the impact that they can have? Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, Right.
Do you think the Academy can or should have a
(32:48):
stronger presence in terms of
weighing in on social political issues, activists work?
Oh Gosh, that's that's so hard. You know, I try
very hard not to tell anybody else what to do.
And when it comes to a question like that, I
would I would certainly be willing to be part of
a discussion, but I do see many sides of many
(33:11):
questions I told you as a philosophy major. So I
can look, I can look at things from six or
10 points of view at the same time and have
fun with that.
I don't know the way I look at it. Jacqueline
is that there's a whole lot of good work left
to be done in the world, including in the movie industry.
And that's why we're here. Yeah. So I don't take
your your question about you know, whether the academy ought
(33:33):
to be doing more,
everybody ought to be doing more. Everybody's ripening and growing
and understanding and learning at the same time. So just
as for myself, I'm just gonna keep on producing good stuff.
And if somebody sees it great and if they don't
see it, not as great, but still great because I'm
a creative
the movie industry is one of the places that I've
(33:55):
been allowed to, you know, do My little dance is,
you know, scoring movies and being in things and encouraging
people and just being involved with the academy is it's
it's a great privilege and we can make good change
and we should and it shouldn't be a chore and
it shouldn't hurt. It shouldn't hurt. We can do this enjoy.
(34:17):
I mean, we're creative people and we certainly have the resources.
Yes, absolutely. Yes. I have 11 more question for you
take a little step back when you hear the term
indigenous representation Buffy, what does that mean to you?
I would have to say I would have to ask
(34:40):
for details.
I'm not exactly sure what you're going out but I'll
take a stab at it. But I've gotten out of
being a concert artist and you know, folk singer songwriter,
however you want to describe has been airplane tickets and
those airplane tickets not only have taken me to London
and paris and Hong kong and Sydney, you know, but
(35:00):
also to the indigenous corners of the world where Michael,
Jackson and Madonna would not want to go and
I would not even be invited to go. It's just
a different world. So the world of indigenous people, whether
you're talking about indigenous people like Maoris in new Zealand
or aboriginal people in Australia and all the different kinds
of people in africa. Whether you're talking about the Sami people,
(35:23):
the indigenous people of Scandinavia. I mean I've spent lots
of time with other indigenous people.
So when I hear the word indigenous, I don't just
think of Canadian indians or american indians. I don't, I
think about first, I know this is actual. When you
say the word indigenous first, my brain takes a trip
(35:45):
from the arctic circle all the way to to the
bottom of south America, all those different people, they're all indigenous.
And I've traveled enough in both the glamorous world of
show business but also a lot with indigenous people and
I know I know how it, I know how it
(36:06):
is and indigenous people in the world, what we have
in common is a lot of really, really good stuff.
Indigenous people had different systems. Indigenous people sometimes still but
not as much as we wish had languages that were
quite different from the concept of language is that most
(36:29):
people have.
I mean if you talk about spanish and italian and
Portuguese and french, you know they're all kind of related
and if you look at your hand, each one of
those is like a finger. But an indigenous language doesn't
come from that part of exercising the brain doesn't come
from there. It's like a thumb, it has a different function.
(36:49):
And people who are interested in this subject will tell
you that indigenous languages are sometimes exercising a different part
of the brain. Coming up with different ways of thinking
different ideas. And when you think of the things that
indigenous people, just indigenous people of the Americas have given
the rest of the world, you might say, oh they
look different or they have different music or different, oh
(37:10):
boy we can think differently. We have contributions that have
yet to be made to the world and people want
to start paying attention.
It's not only survival stuff, it's all kinds of other stuff,
artsy stuff stories, ways of telling stories. I spent some
time with an indigenous woman from Mexico who came from
a small rural group
(37:31):
discovered the spanish language and fell in love with it,
went to university and when she went home she had
the darndest time explaining to her friends what it was
that she did because in her language there's no metaphor.
So everything the only thing you talk about is what
is therefore there's no lying.
(37:52):
But she could not explain what poetry was.
And she became a poet. So now she's a poet
who writes in her own language
for the first time ever and in spanish. So indigenous
people all over the world are a page that most
of you have not turned yet. And it is exciting,
(38:14):
like a library is exciting. It's about everything and we're
about everything, including our stories and how we can portray them.
It's all good. You know, it's just all good. Yeah.
When you talk the way you're describing this incredible wealth
of cultural heritage and thinking, think about that. And then
you think about the tiny range of representations of indigenous
(38:38):
people on screen. I mean the gap is uh is staggering.
There just how limited the representations have been.
It's staggering. You know, And um, you know, there's one
way of looking at it would be to say poor
us were not represented. But the other way of looking
at it is poor. You you don't know what you're missing.
So that's always the way I've thought about it.
(39:02):
Well, thank you Buffy, thank you so much for these insights.
I always enjoy talking with you so much. Thank you
now that your big eyes are finally open,
(39:26):
how that you're wondering how must they feel
meaning them? That you've chased across America's movie screens.
No,
that you're wondering
how can it be real?
But the ones you've called
(39:48):
propaganda,
they starve in their splendor.
You've asked for my comment. I simply will render
my country.
(40:17):
The Academy Museum podcast is written and hosted by me
Jacqueline Stewart.
This episode was produced by antonia sarah ito. The Academy
Museum podcast team includes Kimberly stevens, victoria Alejandro and antonia
sarah ito. The show is a production of the Academy
Museum of Motion Pictures in collaboration with L. A Studios
(40:40):
mixing and original music by E scott kelly.
Our theme music was composed by Nicholas, Patel, Antonio Sarah
Edo and Leo G are the executive producers for Elia Studios.
Our podcast website Elliott dot com slash podcast is designed
by Andy Chitwood and the digital and marketing teams at
(41:02):
Elliot's Studios, the Academy Museum Marketing team created our branding
thanks to the team at the Academy Museum, including Sean
Anderson Peter Castro Stephanie sykes and Mat Younger
and to our Academy colleagues, randy Haber camp and Clare Lockhart.
Thanks also to the team at Elliot's Studios, including Taylor
(41:26):
Kaufman severe brah Kristen Hayford, Kristin Mueller Andy Orosco Michael
Cosentino and Leo G
Academy Museum Digital engagement platforms including this podcast are sponsored
by Bloomberg philanthropies,
support for this podcast is made possible by Gordon and
(41:49):
Donna Crawford who believe that quality Journalism makes los Angeles
a better place to live
this program is made possible in part by the Corporation
for Public Broadcasting, a private corporation funded by the american People.
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