August 18, 2025 • 52 mins
Charles Hinckfuss, founder and creative director of MCM House, joins us to share the story of building one of Australia’s most distinctive furniture brands. In this chat, we get into the hustle behind MCM House — where the ideas come from, how you stay ahead of trends, the grind of running logistics and retail, and what it takes to keep a brand “cool” in a tough market. Charles talks about balancing creativity with business, the influence of global design and boutique hotels, and the lessons he’s picked up building a business that resonates with people. Enjoy!
Check out MCM's website here: https://www.mcmhouse.com/
You can subscribe to the Mentored newsletter here: https://mentored.com.au/newsletter-sign-up
Join the Facebook Group.
Follow Mark Bouris on Instagram, LinkedIn & YouTube.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So I think for us welcome, Thank you Mark, Welcome.
Now you're the founder and says creative director of mc
M house, I just kick it off. What's emc M
house do?
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Look, we are a furniture retailer at heart. You know,
I've founded it on the idea of having a furniture collection.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
That is decorative.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
You know, the intentions always when you start these things
is a dream and then building those things over a
period of time can be a lot more complex.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Working way through the nightmare.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
So you know, we've got our fifteen year anniversary coming
up and wow, you know it's a good milestone. But
you know you reflect even now of the people who
are involved and some of the stuff you do to
get to that point's pretty crazy.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Do you remember fifteen years ago when you first thought
of this? Maybe it was more than fifteen years ago
that you first thought of the idea of having mcm
house or yeahure.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
The journey was probably twenty years ago.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I came to Sydney, I was twenty three, wanting to
move from Melboyn bit of son. The idea of starting
a brand was just exciting, probably a little bit early
I thought.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
What was before that though? Like you just I'm going
to go to Sydney and start up a furnish brand.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Look, you know, I went to boarding school, and probably
at my school there's no real pathway for creative entrepreneurship.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
I mean, you know, when I look back on.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
It, if you pick a pathway after school, entrepreneur and
creativity isn't something you can learn.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
And I knew that. But the pathway was college UNI.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
So lucky enough, my mum was a pretty crazy restauranteur.
Dad was a business guy dentist, did a lot of
businesses on the side, So I was lucky enough.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Between the two of them, they were letting me just
probably go off the path, not.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Doing dentistry, engineering, or you know, any of the other
things that were sort of the norm back then, and
they let me go to Sydney to try and deal
in furniture.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Furniture Like how that sort of happened.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
My mom actually in London in the sixties, had a
brother here and her grandmother and they had a twink
that furniture like timber furniture, old antique furniture. After all
the modernism, you know, the super modern era, the people
wanted to get that old timber back into the house.
(02:29):
So she started sending containers back from London in the
seventies to Sydney to Geelong and they started a furniture
store in Geelong in the in the early eighties. So
from that, you know, there was always a passion dealing
in antiques and takes all.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Like more like when you're saying.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
Provincial you know, France, England regency furniture. Yeah, well not.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Shabby she I mean, you know it was period furniture
that had a sense of you know, history, I guess. So,
you know, decorative arts has always been a big thing
for me. You know, cool objects, but it doesn't have
to be you know, a bit of furniture. It could
be a broken sign, you know, something that's cool.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
What is that? What does that with people who have
that passion, like, well, what is the what is it?
What do you draw from it when you see something? Yeah,
a bit odd, but also it's sort of riggs of history.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
And yeah, my first store was a complete mixture of items.
You know, I had poor some penguins, you know, big camels,
and you know it was a real bizarre.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
You mean when you first came up here, yeah, and I.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Went for it. You know, and I had you know,
seventies leather sofas, and you know, it was a real
hub of eclectic energy.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
And this was before Instagram and website, so you could
have a cool store and I, you know, from day
one I had a big following. Guys would come over
from the bridge drive to the store and it was
a cool experiens Where was that in Harbor Street in Mossman,
just over there from the pub there was a little
garage and we knocked a hole and put a window
in and started that, you know, trading. And and because
(04:12):
we had cool objects, I often met really you know,
really cool characters equally eclectic. Yeah, no, guys with really
good big houses, but they're still eclectic. Yeah, And they
wanted something cool, and the cool factor then drew them
in and then from that there'd be a discussion, you know,
well I don't have a table, Charlie, can you make one?
(04:34):
So MCM was born out of me making stuff that
mixed well with the eclectic furniture.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
It was initials, you know, my mum's initials and mine
and then Charlie.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
But MCM, you know, it is a Roman numerals so strong,
so they always the idea was a trading house, you know,
like an international trading company, and so you know, there
was a plan to have a collection of furniture that
was born out of being eclectic and interesting. And those
things were often a good moderness table, a good so far.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
And a simple mirror. And then you filled your house
up with cool paintings, artworks, objects.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, sculptures, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, so you know, natural elements mixed with that, and
then you started to have a house that looked well lived,
interesting person, you know, and all that kind of stuff.
And then obviously you need to have stock. And then
it turns into a business.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Yeah, and was that something what would you do? You
travel there or like overseas and pick up by Yeah,
I mean you.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Know probably that that excitement to do that.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Initially, you know, you paid posit.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
You know, you got your design together, you go to
a factory and all of a sudden you're creating you know.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
A look and a feel. It's pretty exciting.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
But the journey now between there and fifteen years ago
is you know, it's a real process.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
You know, sometimes you can take five years to get
a product right.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Sometimes you nail it in three months and look furniture
is bulky. You know, I probably didn't pick the easiest
item and let alone delivering it around Australia. Yeah, it's
it's a journey and you know a lot of people
are involved.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
We'll get back to the logistics because that is an issue.
And then and also warehousing or store and then showrooms.
They're three pretty important parts of your business model. But
MCM today is not the eclectic dealers.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
No, and you know it is a challenge. You know
sometimes when I go into a store to you know,
to stretch that little bit of interest. We've really worked
on making sure the showrooms have a very dynamic appeal.
We've recently just done Melbourne High Street Armadale and that's
played into you know, I call it like a Dover
(06:51):
Street market type feel, you know, just deconstructed but luxury
and then having the basics that people can come in
and shop.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
But we explain that though. So you're you talk about
how the shop is decorated. Yeah, I mean, yeah, it
was deconstructed.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Rugged luxury. You praying the rugged luxury pretty well?
Speaker 2 (07:08):
What is it that you know, it's it's something that's
charming but still you know, warm and used.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Thank you yeah, and.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
You know it is probably you know what I like
in an object, you know, Yeah, you want that bit
of sense of you know, there's a bit of wrongness
about it. You know, there's something about something being a
bit off that makes it really great.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
But then you want to make sure that you've got
all basics done.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
But this is built, its new.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
Yeah, I mean it was the old.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
We picked up an old supermarket, left the roof raw,
did a really super gloss floor, got beautiful tiles from
Japan on the on the columns, nice awnings, good soft color,
but left things raw in between that.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
So you know, that's always been a thing.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
You know, what do you leave raw and then what
do you make clean in a retail environment to keep
it kind of interesting?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
And that those retail environments is that is that for
the purpose of retail customers or for the purpose of
let's call architectural interior architects or whatever they call.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Yeah, I mean, you know, I've always like you know,
contrasting elements and probably probably more from an artistic level
than a pure retail experience. You know, that idea of
a rough wall that's got a whole lot of natural
markings on it. You know, pan marks whatever mixed with
a nice linen. So from front I find very appealing.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Were the more an indulgence of personal indulgence? Do you
reckon folly?
Speaker 2 (08:38):
There's some good artists, you know, if you look at
periods of time where there's been great art. You know,
abstract you know, notion mixed with high end stuff is
something that you know, it is an appealing aesthetic.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
It can be confusing for stuff you is it like
you know, it gives it like a stuff I can
afford to do this or I mean, especially in terms
of the way people decorate their homes. They give if
they're trying to incorporate, well, a piece of art that's
sort of not in keeping with the rest of the
furniture might be all.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
That's probably where we've started on the journey. You know,
I've had it, you know, how do I make it
look cool? And also I didn't have what's cool? I
didn't have a budget as well. When you have a
don't have a budget, you work out how you can
get away with you making something cool?
Speaker 1 (09:23):
So is cool? What's cool?
Speaker 3 (09:27):
Is there an effortless cool notion? You know?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
And that's always you know, something to expY can you
make it look effortless, you know, and that's something that
I like, you know, how do you make something look
cool without it looking you know, too forced?
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's contrived.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Yeah, and that's probably you know, I always make sure
there's an element that m c M.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
You know, don't push it too far.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Bring in a cool painting when you can, right kind
of music, you know, right lighting, and it could be
something kind of unusual in the idea. So it's hard
to stay cool as you grow. You know that that's
been a challenge. But we've got a really good team
around and you know, I wrestle with it, you know,
because you need to have things that people need to use.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
Can't just have cool stuff. And you know, the business
is big.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Now it sounds like you're not you know, use other brands,
but you're not like Harvey Norman Furniture or Domain, which
is it's very and Jerry's doing a great job. Jerry
doing a great job. You too, Katie. But I remember
that there's is very sort of functional, practical, transactional. You
(10:39):
can get financed to buy whatever you're going to buy.
And you're going to buy the one of those chairs
that you know, you watch the footy with and you
push them out later on with functional functional, and and
it's and you know there's about volume and lots of turnover,
et cetera. But they carry a ship load of stock.
But you're in order you differentiate yourself. I think cool
(11:03):
maybe is about differentiating yourself because they're gross. Respect they're
definitely not cool. Those stores. I don't think for me cool.
What I'm mean by call is interesting. They're just basically
where I'm going to look for a specific thing. I
need an outdoor furniture that's been properly built, probably where
the proof won't fall apart when I buy it reasonable price,
(11:25):
because I'm going to put it somewhere like in my
farm or something, and I guess going to wreck it.
So I go for a particular reason. That's what I'm
going to look for one of those. If it's there,
I'll buy it. It's not that I don't buy it.
That's very practical. Whereas to me, cool is something that
is more, is more of more. It's more interesting for
me to walk around. I actually enjoy the experience. It's
(11:49):
an experience. So it might be the music as everything
is a package.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Yeah, I mean that that was the idea of my
before websites. I had to make the shot look interesting, Yeah,
because they had to. There was a shop window that
had to look.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
At your Instagram page.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
Yeah, that had to look good.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
So you know that I've been in the shop till
two at night sometimes rearranging stuff, you know, getting it
feel right. So you know, that's always been the idea
of what the store should feel like. Obviously, you know,
we need to grow the business and have stock.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
And do all the things that other retailers do.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
You've got to sell stuff, yeah, and you know we've
you know, we've got eight stores now around Australia. So
and we you know, we've got ambitions to continue to
grow that, you know, at that pace. So mixing that
and having a foundation to do that and stay cool
and you know and do really cool you know launches.
We've we're pretty you know, we're pretty adamant to make
sure our marketing you know, is pretty strong. You know,
(12:45):
I mean we probably spend more our marketing and our
branding and probably competitors do on the idea that we
are going to continue to grow and that's probably know
the sacrifice of some profit.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Yeah, you spending for your own sort of thing.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Yeah, and I'm but I love you. I love that
creative side of it.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
You know. We've got a new outdoor collection called Deloro,
you know, and the idea is that, you know, midnight
tom Ford ninety sort of feel. So you know, I
do like to add theater and an element of cinematatic
sort of theater.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Yeah, theater is important.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, speaking to.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Someone the other day, like Days of Thunder is probably
one of my favorite films. You can just watch it
without the noise on, you know, it's it's theater. Yeah,
and so you know that's what you want in a store.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
So the creative side of it's obviously is pretty important
to you. Yeah, just just on that that tom Ford piece.
So tom Ford's school cool.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
He's probably the marketing king, and but it's cool to
It's simple as well.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yeah, yeah, like he's the king of cool in some respeaks.
And when you were talking about that, it's funny. I
was only thinking about the other day. I was singing
him at the eighties Miami vice period and how they
change people's clothing. But it was sort of cool dudes
building a new form of fashion, which was like a
(14:05):
pretty amazing new form fashion. And I've never been a
cool person. Like what I remembers. I will follow what
I considered to be cool at the time, especially when
I was younger, not so much these days. But I
don't know how someone can create this stuff, like how
you can not only articulated, but actually conceive it in
(14:29):
the first place. As to what is cool? Are you
going back through the old movies and old stuff and yeah,
I mean, like inspiration's pretty pretty where do you find that?
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
I love film, you know, magazine from early age, my
mum had magazines, you know, And I grew up in
a really cool restaurant atmosphere. You know, go down there
and there be would be handwriting menus and filling up
the restaurant with cool furniture. And it was pre designer,
so the vibe was really important. So growing up that
environment where you know everything, you know, how the food
(15:03):
is put on the plate. Perfectionists not perfection It's probably
just care free, you know, carefree creativity, Yeah, but perfectionist
stems of being creative, Yeah, but.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Not in a pursuit that, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
It's it's you know, putting something together without it, you know,
being a plan.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
Yea, how do you do that?
Speaker 2 (15:22):
And adding that energy. But you know, on the flip
side of that, you know, you've got a hustle as
well to stay creative. Yeah, and so that's been a
balance because the hussle can sometimes take me completely away
from the creative side.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Oh really, Yeah, you know what it's like if I
spent my life hustling, but I don't do much creative
most of my stuff.
Speaker 3 (15:41):
The hustle's been fifty and creative being fifty right.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Well, for me, it's probably hustled more late ninety.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
And I'll probably if anyone asked me, I'd say ninety
like you, Yeah, it's been a hussle. You know, I
did everything from delivery to sales from day one, so
and I still do probably most of the big sales
on a commercial level.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Yeah, on a commercial So does your finish get made here?
What's the deal?
Speaker 3 (16:08):
We look? We at the moment, we do manufacturer overseas.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
You know, it started out here making one table down
in Brookvale and then from there. You know, obviously with
scale you need good supplies and good factories.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
And price, good price.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Yeah, I mean people, probably more important now is product
and price than it ever has been. And I you know,
I want to give good product a good price, you know,
I don't like the idea of overchat, you know, having
something that is expensive because you want to get it out.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
So where's your range? So where where would you fit
in the scale things sort of like mid range.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
There's there's luxury, and then there's premium and then for
your general generally Yeah, and look we we we tee
it between luxury and premium.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
There's premium more than luxury, which ones which luxury is
luxury that's the most expensive, and then your premium premium stuff.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
Yeah, and then affordable and then accessible.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Okay, yeah, okay, So and you fit between premium and luxury.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Yeah, I mean different objects you want to put into
different things. Transactional sofas are something that gets swapped over
in the house a lot, you know, And that's right.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Probably every three years, oh really three to five, depending
on what you're buying. Yeah, but that's probably an ocean
and I know a lot of big retailers that's the
tracking that they keep in mind.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
All right, so the life of it's over, let's call
it is three three, three to five really.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
But saying that I've got a friend that's still got
one from me from twelve years ago. Yeah, it's on
his front deck.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
So it all depends on the character of the person.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Yeah yeah, well mean people I move, we keep them forever,
just getting recovered. So so the design though, so just
to take me through this, So in terms of your stock,
do you go overseas and sort of say, well, they
give you a catalog and you say, I like that.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
That that so you know, we you know, we have
a we have a pretty you know, pretty in depth
planning process. Now we're designing for next year, you know,
next summer in twenty twenty six, twenty twenty seven. Oh
really twenty twenty seven summer yeap.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
So we've got our door launches next week twenty twenty six, right,
so you know you're about a year and a half
ahead now really yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
We're trying to make sure that we've got an in
stock product when we launch it, all the stocks in
the store come and experience it and you can get
it delivered. So it's a long way from when I had,
you know, a table go and get made myself.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
But that's how it works.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
And like you got a team sit sits down there
and draws it up on a yea. We got a team.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
We've got a buying team, so we've got a really
good network, you know, to make sure that we can grow,
you know, and look, I've got ambitions for it to
be you know, the number one furniture retailer for the
category that I'm in, Yeah, for your category, and so
I need to have the right team around.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
So I just want to get my head around there.
So you'll design or your team will you and the
team will design own this next next year's well the
year after. What do you call it? What are you
going to sell? And like where do you get you
where do they get their inspiration from? Like do you
(19:12):
sort of direct them? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (19:13):
I mean, look, I come up with a name for
a collection we've had Cabana wild Things was outdoor last
year from that movie Wild Things, which you probably remember
Matt Dylan, and the idea was like that, you know,
moody kind of Florida sunset fuel. So I'll come up
with a name and then we'll try and draw collection
from that, but still make sure that it's very usable
(19:36):
elements of color and design, and then you know, played
out from there.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
But you don't. You don't sort of say, well, what's
what's really hit the hit the straps or what.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Sort of Yeah, you've got a banger, it sells really well.
You know a rocket that's selling on the way up
to be a banger. You know, there is notions when
you know when a collection goes, it goes.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
How do you know this?
Speaker 3 (19:58):
How do you know that we've got data. I've got
a really good team seen when something hits, it hits.
And that's the exciting part about it because.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
But your people sort of looking in through the magazines,
looking at all the they have fashion shows. I mean,
sorry to have furniture shows like fashion fashion shows.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
Yeah, I mean you launch a collection, there is big
fares around the world. Launch it.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
So and look, I'm still trying to make it an
attainable access point, you know, so trying. Yeah, we're not
trying to design things that you know, so over the
top that you can't go and buy.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
That, because you can you can pay underground for a
Bloody's over these days if you really want to be
stupid my view, that's great.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
I've had a passion to continue to make it more accessible.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Yeah, accessible in terms of availability and price yeah, but without.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Really work on the experience, really work on the you know,
the idea that you can feel like you're in a
really cool place. And look, there's been some really great retailers,
you know throughout time they have done that.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
Well, yes, certainly, I'm still trying to get my head
around here. This work search I'll see, so your design
team will get inspiration from all these other places, not
not and not and not and including what other people
are doing. Just obviously you got to know what the
rest of the market is doing. Befo all of a
sudden everyone in the world loved wooden chairs. With wooden
(21:19):
you know you're going to have to do it.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
Trends are obvious.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
You know, the house has become more minimal, right, the
idea of filling up with a whole lot of antique furniture,
you know, it's way more We're way more in tune
with an environment that's very calming.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
Can we talk about that in for a second. So
what has been what do you see has been the
change in the way people like to furnish their home
Relatives to say twenty years ago.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
Look, there's twenty years ago.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
You probably have a mixture of some of you're given
some of you bought and something that you picked up
for free and something you know that you'd mix together.
So you know that evolution and look only a small
amount of people used to decorate. Decoration is huge now
really yeah, I mean look in America they're probably even
more ahead of us. But you know, people don't you
(22:08):
look how popular home shows are and you know the
block and everything like that. Everyone has a passion and
probably the biggest outset driver in Australia is your home.
So having a you know and probably selling your home,
that's when you make money. So having a passion to
make the home look good, feel good and build a
bit of value is I've.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
Seen the pick up. So the demographics a lot wider
than it ever was.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
So do you think Australians Because I remember buying a
house or probably with a house on it twenty years
ago and I remember going into the house and it
was a deceased estate and there's all this sixties furniture.
You know that that style of furniture you've seen the
sixties and you know there was even a stereo legs,
(22:53):
you know, sitting on four legs, timber legs, tim stereo
with the flip top. You know, it speaks attached as
cetera big big thing, a little bit of it, a
couples wide. Then there was the lounge lounge, single lounge
seats that sat around it, and of course it was
just the States. So I gave it all away, and
then I went and built a house. And I went
(23:14):
and many years later, twenties later, went built a house.
And I thought of himself, I wouldn't mind designing this
in the sixties, And I thought about all their furniture
just given away, and the stuff I board actually was
the same sort of furniture I had given away. But
do you think that people in Australia are as design
(23:35):
conscious as say other countries.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Look definitely it's it's accelerated. But look, the sixties was
a pretty wild time for design, Like people were really
pushing design harder than ever before.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
It disappeared in the eighties and nineties.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
I'd say, what do you put that down to.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
I've read a few different things.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
Obviously, whose government changing and you know, probably restrictions, but
you know that sixties period was probably the peak.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Creating we're talking about them of the world.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Charles just generally, you know, even the retailers Liberty and
you know those big retails in London that were crazy,
you know, and you know London in particular was a
huge design impact throughout the world. Italy has had different periods,
but yeah, it did stop for a period of time there.
I don't know, I don't whether we're wars or I'm
(24:31):
not sure exactly what happens in why different years come
and then we've obviously had a period of minimalism. Recently
it is starting to tear it back with a bit
of eclectic because people do want to identify something that's
kind of a bit unique.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
But minimalism has been pretty strong.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
What do you mean by minimalisms? Were talking about Scandinavian
style very.
Speaker 3 (24:51):
Much, you know, you know, simple, flaw simple so far,
very beige, beige, color beige, total total Asian with this
total anything, it's total brown and brown.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Tones tones of brown which could be and then.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Probably from that, you know, there will be impact. But
it's very easy to live in a tonal room. John
Pawson Ian Schrager, you know, the really cool designer An
Trager obviously, no, you know, probably the coolest creator of
interiors in the world from nightclubs to hotels. You know,
he's led that way of simplicity himself. Yeah, I mean
(25:30):
in his own environment.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
If you look at some of the hotels, you know,
the addition Hotel that that sort of led that minimalism,
and he did the Gramercy Park and so theater obviously
plays into an idea of lifestyle and minimalism have been strong.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
But do those sorts of hotels do they influence people?
People go to hotel perhaps and stay at Gramercy Park
or wherever, and they through in that hotel, and do
they want to them take that back to the home
they see.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
I honestly believe that boutique tell boutiquo old is probably
foresee interiors ten years.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
They're really good ones. Yeah, because they have all about experience.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
And if you look at probably some of the trends
from the best boutique hotels in the world, you'll see
a trend from about ten fifteen years later floating through.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
Wow. So in terms of what your research, your personal research,
if you go overseas, do you say to yourself, well,
I'm going to go and stay at the latest hotel
designed by blah blah blah.
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Yeah, I mean, look just t doesn't have to be
the latest.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
I mean, the first time I went to the Mercer
Hotel in New York, I was, you know, and that
was christ and Leagu one of his early hotels, and
he's probably one of the greatest interior designers, and that
was you know, I couldn't believe it. You know, in
that lobby there. Have you been to the lobby there?
It's a mixture of simplicity but luxury that you just
(26:56):
you know, that's.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
What you wanted to store.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Yeah, and that inspired me, you know, and I love
that idea of going into something like that and then
trying to take it into the norm.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Do you travel a place like the Four Seasons of Milan,
for example, Yeah, and you walk in there and you just, fuck,
this is cool because it is really like, yeah, believe.
Speaker 3 (27:16):
That's what I'm saying. Boutique hotels, you know their fantasy Land.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
As well as your Disneyland y.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Yeah, but even the experience, I mean, you know, there's
some really cool hotel experiences that maybe the interiors aren't
what I like, but that mood in Beverly Hills Hotels obviously,
you know, a classic.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
It's a been old school for me. There a little
bit now, and.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
But that you know, that old school mentality, you know,
with the bar underneath, and so it's different, but there's
obviously history in.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
That and you know it's someone so sad there, they'll
say so and so sad.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Yeah, I just you just know it's had that. But yeah,
that that that experience in boutique hotel. It's pretty rock
and roll.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
So you bring that stuff back, you and your team
you bring they might not go any where be these
as you can get look at all online, but they
bring that into your mix and then off the back
of that you you determine the theme, the theme for
the for the next release of any.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I mean, look, obviously, you know how much money you've
got to spend on a collection and time, you know,
restricts where you're going. We're on a bit of a
path for growth, so you know, there always is you know,
an idea in a direction that comes from you know, something.
Speaker 3 (28:30):
That is inspiring sous.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
The latest theme.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
We're doing, Cabana coming out with Doloro is the big
one right.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Now, so just to me through that.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
So Doloro is about that you know, intergalactic sort of
outdoor living that could be probably a bit modern, but
still you know, feeling like you maybe were outdoor living
on Mars. You know that futuristic as in futuristic, Yeah,
I mean outdoor furniture is tech related because it's got
to be strong to withstand elements. So the idea of
(28:58):
a furniture collection that could on Mars, for me, it
was pretty good.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Is this collection timber or metal?
Speaker 3 (29:04):
A lot of aluminium? A little bit of timber.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
Aluminium for me, probably the best element for Australia.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Because it doesn't rust and mold. Yeah, so you know,
playing into that, Yeah, it doesn't, but it can get
pitted if it's near the sea though that's a drumalt
salt pitch.
Speaker 3 (29:19):
You can deal with pitted probably more than mold molden issue.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Yeah. Yeah, so so it's and what about the fabrics.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Look again, probably more tonal at the moment, but we
do have an evergreen, we've got a terra cotta.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
But it's got to.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Be resilient, can't can't fade well yeah, I mean kind
of patterns are there because it too.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
But do you have to and do you leave this
stuff outside or you have to bring I.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
Mean, look, I like everything that can stay outside.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Yeah, because the pain in the arts have to move
stuff in and out, so we're looking at strong colors
or barrel like that, or.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
You know, we did actually try and put in some
strong colors in when we're shooting it.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
You just know, you know what I mean, Leave that
for later.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
But yeah, continuing to probably total is the challenge because
you know, you don't want to give anyone a reason
to say there's an opinion left or right. Yeah, yeah,
you know, and usually there's two people in this decision,
so yeah, and you don't really have control over both
of them.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
And our door furniture we're talking about stuffer in the
pool for example.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Yeah, modular systems, sun loungers, you know, yeah, yeah, everything. Yeah,
I mean I think it's sixty four pieces in the collection,
so that's pretty big.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
So like as an umbrellas the whole thing. Yeah, yeah,
and we'll have a come and look there, because I'm
always trying to get my little resort, you know.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
The big things to make sure we can fill the
whole house.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
Yeah, but this is an outdoor collection, yep. The lawyer,
the lawyer, Delao Deloro, Sorry, this is your outdoor collection.
How did you get inspiration for that again.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Again, that idea that you know, you could have furniture
that could survive, you know, on another planet.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
And basically straining conditions. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
Yeah, Trailie is probably the most brutal. Yeah, during the world.
You know, look at the rain we've got now, unbelievable
and it was stunning in.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
Melbourne yesterday and cold and probably Queensland's probably humid.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yeah. Yeah, So because you have to build something, you
go or produce stuff and go either one of those
places everywhere. Yeah, and that when they cand released.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
In stores this week and then campaigns in.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Three weeks campaign and so what how do you run
a campaign like that? So where do you run a
campaign like that?
Speaker 2 (31:24):
I mean digital is a big part. We've got a
database and then you know, we played out from there, so.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
We would have bet obviously instagrams, Perfume, Instagram, but like
you know, you've got everything going on.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
But yeah, I mean obviously you know social media and
you probably have a similar idea of you know how
powerful that can be. Again, when product's great, you know,
product and price probably the key things. But getting that
message out it's pretty critical. An organic reach we've found
is the best.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
So that's off your database when a.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Story is forwarded or gets you views without it being
forced out.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Not through an influencer, but through twenty your customers.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah, or just a story on it.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
I'm not influencers obviously play a part in the industry,
but to get the right mixing, the right timing is
always a bit of a challenge.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
But when you say organic that, what do you mean
by There might.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Be a story on a store that we've done.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
That isn't directly a general interest storytypeicing.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Yeah, or something we've done or you know, there was
an article from years ago that we still have a
house that we did up in Palm Beach from Country
Road wasn't even our brand and it's still high on
the ratings. So it is funny organic, organic readership and
organic following is.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
You know, and you don't promote excuse me, there's no
stuff you promote. Yeah, I mean people find it, but
I'm my head of marketing, probably gonna tell anything wrong.
So but in terms of social media, like into the
building your brand MCN brand.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
It's been the biggest, biggest thing. I mean again, theater
plays a big part in it.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
So what do you do? What are some of the
little tricks you pull.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Look, photo photo shoots are big for us, you know,
making sure that there's a vibe and that's the key,
you know, vibe, you know, and then obviously on that
is stock price and where your stores are.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Yeah, but that's access and affordability. But like you know,
you you're you're a creaty person. But it's easy for
you to say the vibe. I wouldn't add a creative vibe.
Like if you said to me, I Mark, you know,
you know, a fifty percent owner of MCM, because you know,
I paid a whole lot of money becoming your partner,
which is not trueman, let's say it was. And you said, mate,
(33:33):
what you are now in charge of building the vibe?
I would know where to start for our social but
you'd probably be pretty good at point. Someone would yea,
but what do you mean by vibe? So in terms
of socials, yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
The vibe is you know, what leads the theme and
the feeling of it. I mean, you do a spire,
you know, I mean we might have a we might
have a setting in the shoot that you know is
so big and so luxurious. It's an inspirational aspirational so
aspirational marketing is pretty cool to get to that point
where you can do that and give people, you know,
(34:07):
an idea of what it despires to have that I don't.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
But if you were you probably not the case. But
in terms of something you're being aspirational, do you get
someone like George Clooney to not George Clooney in particular,
but personality that look, I do they make it aspirational
to they can, but you know, I'm not big on
a personality being as part of what a product is.
I have done a really cool shoots, probably not so
(34:33):
much personality, but a type of character. My first shoot,
I had a close friend of mine. He was an
ex lawyer, became a flower farmer that you know, very chic,
cool guy, and I had him in a photo in
the white sofa with his cool dog and it's still
probably my favorite photo.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
You know, cool pair of persons and that idea of
you know, ragness, sheik, luxurious and lifestyle. You know, that's
a vibe. Not so much personality, but type of character.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
So when you when you look at your vibe, do
you try to match it to your customer base or
do you try to get the customer base to be
attracted to your vibe.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Probably we play into the collection a little bit more now,
but I've always kept a strong idea of what I like,
you know, in terms of a photo on a shoot,
and so yeah, it's you know, but it is a
balancing act what you can do with you know, budgets,
you know, I mean logistics what you're talking about now,
you know the cost of getting truckload of furniture to
(35:31):
a house at Flinders.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
It's pretty big Flinders in Victoria. Yeah, yeah, that's like
on the coast, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (35:36):
Yeah, that's where we just shot the outdoor.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
You just you just delivered some stuff to someone we
didn't know.
Speaker 3 (35:41):
We did a shoot in Flinders, right.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
Right, right right. Someone gave you their house or whatever
it is to you.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
We pay for it.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
Yeah, yeah, obviously not gave it to you, You rented or
something like that, and you do the shooting that place
because because the vibe at Flint is and what we
talk about ocean.
Speaker 3 (35:54):
Yeah, really cool architectual house on the ocean.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
Yeah, pretty pretty clean line joint, very cool. Yeah yeah,
and then you could.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
Just yeah it's a perfect setting.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah. Theater, yeah, totally only me. I love theater. I
love it. I can't produce it, but I love theater
when I see it. So if I was, excuse me,
if you were to today list out and I'll presume
to do this. The profiles or profile your database, that's
(36:23):
your customer base. Can you do you know who you're
Is it like something between forty and eighty or is it?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (36:29):
I mean, look do you know?
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Actually enough there's you know, we have got some dart
of it breaks it down and.
Speaker 3 (36:34):
So we do know that.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
You know, I was in the shop every day for
ten years, seven days, so I knew my customers and
the mix you know in Sydney's probably slightly different to Melbourne,
really slightly different.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
But you know it's probably a demographic thing.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
But if you break it down, you know, we know
twenty to thirty what they're probably spending forty to fifty
sixty plus.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
In terms of money. Yep, what and when we do that,
when you say you know what this beending, so you
know what the capacity is. But does that then determined
do you then build to suit that price? Now?
Speaker 3 (37:09):
Look you don't.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
I mean you can probably get yourself in a bit
of a tangle, but you're probably more aware of where
that market is. And look, we are trying to grow
the brand, so we need to have more customs.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
I guess where's the juicy bit in terms of demographic
it changes.
Speaker 2 (37:24):
You know as you grow. In the end, you know
you want to have a pretty consistent transaction value and
you know, funny enough that it probably is one or
two items. It's not a whole house, but you know
that's the inspiration to continue to have a range that
you know you can do a larger purchase.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
So when you say it's one or tour them, maybe
see three of them. You're talking about maybe a dining
table so for in a rug and or a coffee
that arm ship, yeah, table chairs and then there. So
there you're more most regularly turned over items.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
As a snapshot.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
And is that because it's funny when you said the
average life of a sover, let's call it is three
to five years. I know the average life a home
loan in my homeland business is four and a half years.
So people basically they don't pay the loan off for
four and a half years. But what they do is
they sell the house and they're buy another one that
might gread down grade, get divorced with the case of
b so that when they move, they're looking for new
(38:19):
furniture because the house that they move from or departments
they move from maybe smaller, maybe bigger, shit doesn't fit.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
Yeah, and look, that's probably why price is pretty critical now,
because you want to make sure that it's not a
life decision that they're making it.
Speaker 3 (38:34):
Look, the interesting part.
Speaker 2 (38:35):
On that on the back of that, you know, we're
doing a lot of work in the build to rent market.
You know, we're putting furniture in apartments that people are
just going to go and live in, you know, and
that's an interesting notion, you know. And then the affordability
of even developers to fill up an apartment of furniture.
It's probably cheaper than the cost of a truck going
(38:58):
in and out over three years, so you know, and
the impact on the building, so.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
You know, they buy it from you, or they rent
it from you, uh, the owners of the bill to me.
Speaker 3 (39:10):
Or purchase for the buill to rent.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
So you know, I mean the probably cost of furniture
is you know, probably the least expensive part of that process,
but the biggest impact.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
No, just seeing myself, if I'm the fund that owns
owns the whole building. Then I want to rent it out.
I just seen him, as I have said, of me
out laying capital for that. If I could just rent
it from you and with agreement that you turn over
every three years, you know, that might be that might be.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
I mean, look, there's different ways, you know what I mean,
who gets paid at what time? So you know, but
in the end, it's a it's a we do you know,
a really good commercial offering for that market. So the
transaction is you know, is suitable for it?
Speaker 1 (39:53):
So it's you, it's your biggest market, retail or wholesale retail, retail, Yeah,
for sure.
Speaker 3 (39:57):
The hustle in me has brought out the commercial.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, but is that is the commercial.
Speaker 3 (40:04):
So it's not something that we go to the market with,
but it's something that I do very well.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
So if you go to one of these build build
to rent buildings apart buildings, and there might be on
fifty apartments in there, do you decorate everyone that's exactly
the same? But has it worked?
Speaker 3 (40:17):
I mean, look, you might have two color schemes.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Yeah, but yeah, you want consistency, and you know, we've
done some really good ones with some really good partners.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
So yeah, that that'd be good for you though, because
you know you can make a super bulk order. You
know exactly you've got to you know, you want twenty
lounge or fifty lounges, fifty coffee tables, fifty drugs, fifty
blah blah blah. Yeah, it's an easy one for you
to sort.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Yeah, and look, you need to make sure that it's
you know, that it all works well and that it's
all going to stay in there and you know, survived.
Last thing you want to do is have to be
swopping furniture out yeah, within that three years.
Speaker 3 (40:48):
So yeah, no, it's it's look, it's a good market.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
But again, you know, go in retail for me as
a passion, you know, and that's something that I'm focusing
more on now than before.
Speaker 1 (40:59):
So did you see eight stores?
Speaker 3 (41:01):
Eight stores were up in Brisbane tomorrow. We're are stores
now Melbourne, Sydney. We've got two bel Gwala and Paddington.
We've got an outlet in Alexandria Byron. Where's one Barron
in the habitat?
Speaker 1 (41:17):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah that was.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
Actually the second story. If it did.
Speaker 2 (41:22):
Really cool going up there Brandon, He said, come into
a store. And there was that perfect period of time
where people were.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
Moving there to live. And again that was a drink
COVID just.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
Before just before COVID, and.
Speaker 3 (41:36):
Then obviously it was you know, it was like heaven
up there during COVID. Did you get up there over them?
Speaker 1 (41:41):
But I to get there, I had to get I
actually ended up again and have to get the vaccine
because I couldn't get on the plane. But my address
is Byron's my actual on my license. So I was
able to travel because I was basically traveling from home
at home. But in the end you couldn't could leave
you unless unless you drive.
Speaker 3 (41:59):
It was the capital city of Australia.
Speaker 1 (42:00):
Probably it's changed a bit now. Yeah, so everybody's pulled
back a bit, but went mental up there. Crazy pricing prices,
et cetera. So you're your habitat, Okay, that's a great
that's a great little development habitat thing. It's perfect for
your stuff.
Speaker 3 (42:13):
It was great.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Look it was it was only three on it square
meters when I started.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
That's second one. So but it was a good footprint.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Again, logistics, you know, that's probably been the thing I
look at after the idea, you know, getting a truck
to go because he's got to go to Brisbane and
then another track down to Byron.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
Was that just for long haul purposes?
Speaker 2 (42:35):
You know, you can't have a guy driving eight hours
and then doing a job you're not legally allowed to, right,
so you know you probably have second set of drivers.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
So there's all those complications.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
So the logistics, so maybe you just quickly map out
before we close off this. We've talked about, you know,
all the inspirational stuff and design and concepts and you
know what's cool and aspiration, all that sort of emotional stuff,
but just a bit.
Speaker 3 (43:03):
It's the biggest toll of me is all that hard stuff.
Speaker 1 (43:05):
Yeah, I was going to say, let's talk about what
you call the hustle. Let's just we've got logistics, delivery,
logistics in other words, the last mile stuff. You've got
all your first mode of your your online stores, so
you go to there's a bit, then there's the maintenance
delivery not delivery, the product yourself, you know, designing and
(43:29):
producing it. So maybe you can break it up into
a couple of baskets for me. So how does a
business like your business, how do what's its rhythm look
like in terms of execution of the.
Speaker 2 (43:44):
Try not to fill my head too much because it's
a it's a it's a full ecosystem activity, you know,
you know, and any one time there's probably a couple
of thousand people from manufacturing, through to through to phone
that could be operating. And you know we're not we're
you know, we're not huge, but we're big enough. So
you know, it is an ecosystem, you know. And that's
(44:05):
from you know, materials getting to the factory, getting built,
getting onto a container, avoiding a typhoon, getting into the dock,
avoiding any dock issues, getting to the fact, you know,
getting the warehouse, getting the customer to pick up phone
and book in a delivery, making sure it's not raining
(44:25):
when they deliver, make sure the apartment can actually fit
the item. Else making sure the drill works, got the batteries,
make sure they can flip over the table or put
it up.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
So it's a it's a big process.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
And you've got a massive team doing that too. Big, Yeah, yeah,
because that's sort of a lot of man management or
woman Menagually.
Speaker 2 (44:49):
It could be one item could have you know, ten,
twelve or twenty touch points. Yeah, yeah, the skills to
probably get that down and the probably the best retailer
Nick Carley, probably the quickest and the at doing that.
So that's you know, that's that's probably an aspirational in
terms of how you operate as a business, as an
operational so you know, and that's probably you can see
(45:09):
share price in his turn so instead.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Of but when do you finish that? The child's so
into all that stuff or is that look?
Speaker 2 (45:16):
You know, and I aim to be able to do
something like that. You know, your order and you know,
we carry you three four million bucks worth of stock now,
so I do want to have stock that people can get.
Speaker 3 (45:25):
And then there's also made to order.
Speaker 2 (45:27):
But you have to challenge because again I started it
out in the back of it you and then to
build that you know, one generation.
Speaker 1 (45:34):
It's a bit of a bit of a because he's
a couple of generations this guy.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
Probably every furniture retailer has got a generational sort of
story to an ad. So yeah, I'm playing a bit
to catch up.
Speaker 3 (45:46):
But you know that's fun. Yeah, it's good, that's good.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
I would have loved to probably a family member that
you know what I mean, got a bit of pain
along the way.
Speaker 1 (45:54):
But your mum sort of copped a little bit, but
she caught pain.
Speaker 3 (45:56):
She did.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
She was actually my first ever wholesale when I got
the brand going. So funny she she's she's been pretty
pretty dynamic.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
Did you get a good deal from her?
Speaker 2 (46:07):
Yeah, Well she knew that I needed to get an
order to get my own Fantage collection, so she opened
up a little store in Geelong.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Wow when she was sixty I think sixty five.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
There's a cool photo so yeah, and she probably got
a bit of pain doing that.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
So dealing with the sun, yeah, still does. And so
you've got a stores.
Speaker 2 (46:26):
But what more we've got the marked out you know,
twelve to fifteen is probably you know a.
Speaker 3 (46:31):
Good sweet spot.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Finding the row win twenty twenty seven, Wow, that's two years.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
Yeah, so I've going to call on a Newcastle opening up,
which is going to.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
Be a lot a lot of money up in Newcastle
of people looking for Yeah, we're it's.
Speaker 2 (46:44):
Going to be going like a surf gallery, big internal courtyard.
Speaker 3 (46:49):
So you know, we're trying to do retail.
Speaker 2 (46:53):
Experiences in spots that you know people love to be
in Melbourne, Hotred Armadah, we did that Paddington's going to
have a big reno. We've got fifteen year anniversary coming up,
so you know that that's the next exciting part to
do cool stores in you know, in cool locations.
Speaker 1 (47:10):
That new building cross Roafue and Paddington, that's pretty wild.
It looks good.
Speaker 3 (47:14):
Yeah, no parking though the people live there. No, that's
going to be a hotel.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
This hotel is it? So that's actually pretty good for
you in terms of traffic.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
And yeah, Paddington's always had a little bit of an
up and down period, but it is the main street
when everyone goes yeah, and you know, it's you know,
it's cool to have someone doing something, I know.
Speaker 3 (47:35):
And then next door of Varna, they're going to have
a big development going from there.
Speaker 1 (47:38):
Yeah. The Varna's the old movie theater.
Speaker 2 (47:40):
And then so that's getting turned I think that's getting
turned into a big development soon as.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
Well well, like a commercial residential hotel.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
Yeah, it's commercial.
Speaker 1 (47:49):
Yeah. So that's interesting because that old site there on
the corner of Oxford Street and whatever it is Flin
does I think it is. They've done an amazing job,
but they've been trying to be talking about thirty years.
I think it's just no sort of scaffolding has been
taken down.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
They ran in, they found they had some heritage issues
in the ground. Oh wow, sole for two years to
find artifacts as something happened.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
I heard.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
So they've had an issue there. But it's finished now,
not yet. It looks like it nearly looks great. Boutique
hotels Sydney starving for them.
Speaker 2 (48:22):
Yeah, but it's you know, I mean look at that
two year you know, hold up, you know, it's a
hard thing to do it in Sydney.
Speaker 1 (48:29):
So it's also very expensive and hard to make money,
very very expensive.
Speaker 2 (48:32):
So I mean, yeah, but yeah, I know Capella is
probably one in the city. Yeah, I mean that's raised
the bar for Australia. But that was pretty deep pockets.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
Do you ever get a chance to quote on those
sorts of compellers.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
And yeah, look I do have a hospitality arm care
workshop and we do so we've done.
Speaker 1 (48:52):
Some pretty cool specializing in hospitality.
Speaker 2 (48:54):
Any kind of commercial offering. So and we've done a
lot of projects along that. Again that's born out the hustle.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
Yeah, that's you though. You have to yes, you're your
your development manager, you know.
Speaker 2 (49:05):
I've got a team over say he's like about thirty
people that just work on that. We've got a couple.
You know, I got a job in Miami. You got
a job in Germany. So we've had jobs all around
the world and that's fueled a little bit of excitement.
Speaker 1 (49:17):
It's funny that I was talking to one of the
past Bayley family and they've Mikey or Pete, No, Chris, Chris.
And Chris is telling me that they opened up a
hotel that's outside his division. He's more on the retail
side for a jewelry, but he said, I've opened a
hotel a year or two ago in New York.
Speaker 3 (49:32):
Yeah. Yeah, Now I remember talking to the boys about that.
Speaker 1 (49:34):
Anyons is bad, like boys for New.
Speaker 3 (49:37):
York's great city for hotels.
Speaker 1 (49:39):
Yeah, but in terms of furniture, you're talking about that
sort of experience, the vibe New York's place for me
that andedly Milan is definitely the vibe, that type of thing. Like,
as I said, I couldn't create something in a million years,
but if I see something, I can tell if I know,
if I like something, you know, get the whole feeling
I walk.
Speaker 3 (49:57):
In the Wow it changes.
Speaker 1 (49:59):
Yeah, yeah, you know what. Literally it's the.
Speaker 2 (50:02):
One thing that changes me, you know when I'm stale
and you know what, and that's unfortunately Sidney, you know,
we're probably you know, because it's it's so expensive here
to do cool things and that you know, it has
changed for that notion.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
I mean, Justin's probably pushing you know, more than anything.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
But you know, and even I know, you know when
he does a big project, it's expensive. Yeah, I worked
on Mimis with him and you know that that was
a big undertaking.
Speaker 1 (50:26):
Yeah, also expensive joint get his money back. Well, well, Charles,
I was really great talking to me, to be honest,
like I'm I'm a furniture lover home furniture that is,
I love you furniture. I know what I love as
I couldn't create it. I've always had a great deal
of admiration for people who can conceptualize these things and
(50:50):
then turn it into the product. And as you say,
you know, build the vibe. I can feel the vibe.
I couldn't build the vibe. My life depended on it.
So it's a great opportunity standing and talk to you.
We'll sit her and talk to you about what looks
seems to me like to me, you're in a young bloke.
But it seems like to me a never ending passion
to you, like it's it's irrepressible.
Speaker 3 (51:10):
Yeah, I mean, look, it's you know, it's it's you
love it.
Speaker 2 (51:14):
Yeah, and once you start, like again, I've had a
shop open every day, you know, it's actually been twenty years.
I've had a shop every day fifteen years MCM. So unfortunately,
once you open the doors, you've always.
Speaker 3 (51:26):
Got a customer. Yeah, so you know, and that's that's
the journey.
Speaker 1 (51:29):
Yeah, but that's that interaction is probably not only the journey,
but it's probably one of the most satisfying parts of
it all. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (51:35):
And look, you know, looking back on it from you know,
fifteen twenty.
Speaker 3 (51:39):
Years is I've crossed the paths and everything.
Speaker 2 (51:42):
And my dad actually really you know, that was one
of the things that he loved, the interaction that I
had with you know, pretty amazing people on the journey.
Speaker 1 (51:49):
Yeah. Well, Charles sinkhas from MCM house in eight stores
around Australia and soon to be a lot more. Thanks
for much coming on the mentor. I appreciate me. It
was great.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (52:00):
Mark. You welcome
So I think for us welcome, Thank you Mark, Welcome.
Now you're the founder and says creative director of mc
M house, I just kick it off. What's emc M
house do?
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Look, we are a furniture retailer at heart. You know,
I've founded it on the idea of having a furniture collection.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
That is decorative.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
You know, the intentions always when you start these things
is a dream and then building those things over a
period of time can be a lot more complex.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Working way through the nightmare.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
So you know, we've got our fifteen year anniversary coming
up and wow, you know it's a good milestone. But
you know you reflect even now of the people who
are involved and some of the stuff you do to
get to that point's pretty crazy.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Do you remember fifteen years ago when you first thought
of this? Maybe it was more than fifteen years ago
that you first thought of the idea of having mcm
house or yeahure.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
The journey was probably twenty years ago.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I came to Sydney, I was twenty three, wanting to
move from Melboyn bit of son. The idea of starting
a brand was just exciting, probably a little bit early
I thought.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
What was before that though? Like you just I'm going
to go to Sydney and start up a furnish brand.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Look, you know, I went to boarding school, and probably
at my school there's no real pathway for creative entrepreneurship.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
I mean, you know, when I look back on.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
It, if you pick a pathway after school, entrepreneur and
creativity isn't something you can learn.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
And I knew that. But the pathway was college UNI.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
So lucky enough, my mum was a pretty crazy restauranteur.
Dad was a business guy dentist, did a lot of
businesses on the side, So I was lucky enough.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Between the two of them, they were letting me just
probably go off the path, not.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Doing dentistry, engineering, or you know, any of the other
things that were sort of the norm back then, and
they let me go to Sydney to try and deal
in furniture.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Furniture Like how that sort of happened.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
My mom actually in London in the sixties, had a
brother here and her grandmother and they had a twink
that furniture like timber furniture, old antique furniture. After all
the modernism, you know, the super modern era, the people
wanted to get that old timber back into the house.
(02:29):
So she started sending containers back from London in the
seventies to Sydney to Geelong and they started a furniture
store in Geelong in the in the early eighties. So
from that, you know, there was always a passion dealing
in antiques and takes all.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Like more like when you're saying.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
Provincial you know, France, England regency furniture. Yeah, well not.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Shabby she I mean, you know it was period furniture
that had a sense of you know, history, I guess. So,
you know, decorative arts has always been a big thing
for me. You know, cool objects, but it doesn't have
to be you know, a bit of furniture. It could
be a broken sign, you know, something that's cool.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
What is that? What does that with people who have
that passion, like, well, what is the what is it?
What do you draw from it when you see something? Yeah,
a bit odd, but also it's sort of riggs of history.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
And yeah, my first store was a complete mixture of items.
You know, I had poor some penguins, you know, big camels,
and you know it was a real bizarre.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
You mean when you first came up here, yeah, and I.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Went for it. You know, and I had you know,
seventies leather sofas, and you know, it was a real
hub of eclectic energy.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
And this was before Instagram and website, so you could
have a cool store and I, you know, from day
one I had a big following. Guys would come over
from the bridge drive to the store and it was
a cool experiens Where was that in Harbor Street in Mossman,
just over there from the pub there was a little
garage and we knocked a hole and put a window
in and started that, you know, trading. And and because
(04:12):
we had cool objects, I often met really you know,
really cool characters equally eclectic. Yeah, no, guys with really
good big houses, but they're still eclectic. Yeah, And they
wanted something cool, and the cool factor then drew them
in and then from that there'd be a discussion, you know,
well I don't have a table, Charlie, can you make one?
(04:34):
So MCM was born out of me making stuff that
mixed well with the eclectic furniture.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
It was initials, you know, my mum's initials and mine
and then Charlie.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
But MCM, you know, it is a Roman numerals so strong,
so they always the idea was a trading house, you know,
like an international trading company, and so you know, there
was a plan to have a collection of furniture that
was born out of being eclectic and interesting. And those
things were often a good moderness table, a good so far.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
And a simple mirror. And then you filled your house
up with cool paintings, artworks, objects.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, sculptures, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, so you know, natural elements mixed with that, and
then you started to have a house that looked well lived,
interesting person, you know, and all that kind of stuff.
And then obviously you need to have stock. And then
it turns into a business.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Yeah, and was that something what would you do? You
travel there or like overseas and pick up by Yeah,
I mean you.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Know probably that that excitement to do that.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Initially, you know, you paid posit.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
You know, you got your design together, you go to
a factory and all of a sudden you're creating you know.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
A look and a feel. It's pretty exciting.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
But the journey now between there and fifteen years ago
is you know, it's a real process.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
You know, sometimes you can take five years to get
a product right.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Sometimes you nail it in three months and look furniture
is bulky. You know, I probably didn't pick the easiest
item and let alone delivering it around Australia. Yeah, it's
it's a journey and you know a lot of people
are involved.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
We'll get back to the logistics because that is an issue.
And then and also warehousing or store and then showrooms.
They're three pretty important parts of your business model. But
MCM today is not the eclectic dealers.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
No, and you know it is a challenge. You know
sometimes when I go into a store to you know,
to stretch that little bit of interest. We've really worked
on making sure the showrooms have a very dynamic appeal.
We've recently just done Melbourne High Street Armadale and that's
played into you know, I call it like a Dover
(06:51):
Street market type feel, you know, just deconstructed but luxury
and then having the basics that people can come in
and shop.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
But we explain that though. So you're you talk about
how the shop is decorated. Yeah, I mean, yeah, it
was deconstructed.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Rugged luxury. You praying the rugged luxury pretty well?
Speaker 2 (07:08):
What is it that you know, it's it's something that's
charming but still you know, warm and used.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Thank you yeah, and.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
You know it is probably you know what I like
in an object, you know, Yeah, you want that bit
of sense of you know, there's a bit of wrongness
about it. You know, there's something about something being a
bit off that makes it really great.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
But then you want to make sure that you've got
all basics done.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
But this is built, its new.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
Yeah, I mean it was the old.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
We picked up an old supermarket, left the roof raw,
did a really super gloss floor, got beautiful tiles from
Japan on the on the columns, nice awnings, good soft color,
but left things raw in between that.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
So you know, that's always been a thing.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
You know, what do you leave raw and then what
do you make clean in a retail environment to keep
it kind of interesting?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
And that those retail environments is that is that for
the purpose of retail customers or for the purpose of
let's call architectural interior architects or whatever they call.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Yeah, I mean, you know, I've always like you know,
contrasting elements and probably probably more from an artistic level
than a pure retail experience. You know, that idea of
a rough wall that's got a whole lot of natural
markings on it. You know, pan marks whatever mixed with
a nice linen. So from front I find very appealing.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Were the more an indulgence of personal indulgence? Do you
reckon folly?
Speaker 2 (08:38):
There's some good artists, you know, if you look at
periods of time where there's been great art. You know,
abstract you know, notion mixed with high end stuff is
something that you know, it is an appealing aesthetic.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
It can be confusing for stuff you is it like
you know, it gives it like a stuff I can
afford to do this or I mean, especially in terms
of the way people decorate their homes. They give if
they're trying to incorporate, well, a piece of art that's
sort of not in keeping with the rest of the
furniture might be all.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
That's probably where we've started on the journey. You know,
I've had it, you know, how do I make it
look cool? And also I didn't have what's cool? I
didn't have a budget as well. When you have a
don't have a budget, you work out how you can
get away with you making something cool?
Speaker 1 (09:23):
So is cool? What's cool?
Speaker 3 (09:27):
Is there an effortless cool notion? You know?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
And that's always you know, something to expY can you
make it look effortless, you know, and that's something that
I like, you know, how do you make something look
cool without it looking you know, too forced?
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's contrived.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Yeah, and that's probably you know, I always make sure
there's an element that m c M.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
You know, don't push it too far.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Bring in a cool painting when you can, right kind
of music, you know, right lighting, and it could be
something kind of unusual in the idea. So it's hard
to stay cool as you grow. You know that that's
been a challenge. But we've got a really good team
around and you know, I wrestle with it, you know,
because you need to have things that people need to use.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
Can't just have cool stuff. And you know, the business
is big.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Now it sounds like you're not you know, use other brands,
but you're not like Harvey Norman Furniture or Domain, which
is it's very and Jerry's doing a great job. Jerry
doing a great job. You too, Katie. But I remember
that there's is very sort of functional, practical, transactional. You
(10:39):
can get financed to buy whatever you're going to buy.
And you're going to buy the one of those chairs
that you know, you watch the footy with and you
push them out later on with functional functional, and and
it's and you know there's about volume and lots of turnover,
et cetera. But they carry a ship load of stock.
But you're in order you differentiate yourself. I think cool
(11:03):
maybe is about differentiating yourself because they're gross. Respect they're
definitely not cool. Those stores. I don't think for me cool.
What I'm mean by call is interesting. They're just basically
where I'm going to look for a specific thing. I
need an outdoor furniture that's been properly built, probably where
the proof won't fall apart when I buy it reasonable price,
(11:25):
because I'm going to put it somewhere like in my
farm or something, and I guess going to wreck it.
So I go for a particular reason. That's what I'm
going to look for one of those. If it's there,
I'll buy it. It's not that I don't buy it.
That's very practical. Whereas to me, cool is something that
is more, is more of more. It's more interesting for
me to walk around. I actually enjoy the experience. It's
(11:49):
an experience. So it might be the music as everything
is a package.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Yeah, I mean that that was the idea of my
before websites. I had to make the shot look interesting, Yeah,
because they had to. There was a shop window that
had to look.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
At your Instagram page.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
Yeah, that had to look good.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
So you know that I've been in the shop till
two at night sometimes rearranging stuff, you know, getting it
feel right. So you know, that's always been the idea
of what the store should feel like. Obviously, you know,
we need to grow the business and have stock.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
And do all the things that other retailers do.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
You've got to sell stuff, yeah, and you know we've
you know, we've got eight stores now around Australia. So
and we you know, we've got ambitions to continue to
grow that, you know, at that pace. So mixing that
and having a foundation to do that and stay cool
and you know and do really cool you know launches.
We've we're pretty you know, we're pretty adamant to make
sure our marketing you know, is pretty strong. You know,
(12:45):
I mean we probably spend more our marketing and our
branding and probably competitors do on the idea that we
are going to continue to grow and that's probably know
the sacrifice of some profit.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Yeah, you spending for your own sort of thing.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Yeah, and I'm but I love you. I love that
creative side of it.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
You know. We've got a new outdoor collection called Deloro,
you know, and the idea is that, you know, midnight
tom Ford ninety sort of feel. So you know, I
do like to add theater and an element of cinematatic
sort of theater.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Yeah, theater is important.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, speaking to.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Someone the other day, like Days of Thunder is probably
one of my favorite films. You can just watch it
without the noise on, you know, it's it's theater. Yeah,
and so you know that's what you want in a store.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
So the creative side of it's obviously is pretty important
to you. Yeah, just just on that that tom Ford piece.
So tom Ford's school cool.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
He's probably the marketing king, and but it's cool to
It's simple as well.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yeah, yeah, like he's the king of cool in some respeaks.
And when you were talking about that, it's funny. I
was only thinking about the other day. I was singing
him at the eighties Miami vice period and how they
change people's clothing. But it was sort of cool dudes
building a new form of fashion, which was like a
(14:05):
pretty amazing new form fashion. And I've never been a
cool person. Like what I remembers. I will follow what
I considered to be cool at the time, especially when
I was younger, not so much these days. But I
don't know how someone can create this stuff, like how
you can not only articulated, but actually conceive it in
(14:29):
the first place. As to what is cool? Are you
going back through the old movies and old stuff and yeah,
I mean, like inspiration's pretty pretty where do you find that?
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
I love film, you know, magazine from early age, my
mum had magazines, you know, And I grew up in
a really cool restaurant atmosphere. You know, go down there
and there be would be handwriting menus and filling up
the restaurant with cool furniture. And it was pre designer,
so the vibe was really important. So growing up that
environment where you know everything, you know, how the food
(15:03):
is put on the plate. Perfectionists not perfection It's probably
just care free, you know, carefree creativity, Yeah, but perfectionist
stems of being creative, Yeah, but.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Not in a pursuit that, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
It's it's you know, putting something together without it, you know,
being a plan.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
Yea, how do you do that?
Speaker 2 (15:22):
And adding that energy. But you know, on the flip
side of that, you know, you've got a hustle as
well to stay creative. Yeah, and so that's been a
balance because the hussle can sometimes take me completely away
from the creative side.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Oh really, Yeah, you know what it's like if I
spent my life hustling, but I don't do much creative
most of my stuff.
Speaker 3 (15:41):
The hustle's been fifty and creative being fifty right.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Well, for me, it's probably hustled more late ninety.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
And I'll probably if anyone asked me, I'd say ninety
like you, Yeah, it's been a hussle. You know, I
did everything from delivery to sales from day one, so
and I still do probably most of the big sales
on a commercial level.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Yeah, on a commercial So does your finish get made here?
What's the deal?
Speaker 3 (16:08):
We look? We at the moment, we do manufacturer overseas.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
You know, it started out here making one table down
in Brookvale and then from there. You know, obviously with
scale you need good supplies and good factories.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
And price, good price.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Yeah, I mean people, probably more important now is product
and price than it ever has been. And I you know,
I want to give good product a good price, you know,
I don't like the idea of overchat, you know, having
something that is expensive because you want to get it out.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
So where's your range? So where where would you fit
in the scale things sort of like mid range.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
There's there's luxury, and then there's premium and then for
your general generally Yeah, and look we we we tee
it between luxury and premium.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
There's premium more than luxury, which ones which luxury is
luxury that's the most expensive, and then your premium premium stuff.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
Yeah, and then affordable and then accessible.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Okay, yeah, okay, So and you fit between premium and luxury.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Yeah, I mean different objects you want to put into
different things. Transactional sofas are something that gets swapped over
in the house a lot, you know, And that's right.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Probably every three years, oh really three to five, depending
on what you're buying. Yeah, but that's probably an ocean
and I know a lot of big retailers that's the
tracking that they keep in mind.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
All right, so the life of it's over, let's call
it is three three, three to five really.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
But saying that I've got a friend that's still got
one from me from twelve years ago. Yeah, it's on
his front deck.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
So it all depends on the character of the person.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Yeah yeah, well mean people I move, we keep them forever,
just getting recovered. So so the design though, so just
to take me through this, So in terms of your stock,
do you go overseas and sort of say, well, they
give you a catalog and you say, I like that.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
That that so you know, we you know, we have
a we have a pretty you know, pretty in depth
planning process. Now we're designing for next year, you know,
next summer in twenty twenty six, twenty twenty seven. Oh
really twenty twenty seven summer yeap.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
So we've got our door launches next week twenty twenty six, right,
so you know you're about a year and a half
ahead now really yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
We're trying to make sure that we've got an in
stock product when we launch it, all the stocks in
the store come and experience it and you can get
it delivered. So it's a long way from when I had,
you know, a table go and get made myself.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
But that's how it works.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
And like you got a team sit sits down there
and draws it up on a yea. We got a team.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
We've got a buying team, so we've got a really
good network, you know, to make sure that we can grow,
you know, and look, I've got ambitions for it to
be you know, the number one furniture retailer for the
category that I'm in, Yeah, for your category, and so
I need to have the right team around.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
So I just want to get my head around there.
So you'll design or your team will you and the
team will design own this next next year's well the
year after. What do you call it? What are you
going to sell? And like where do you get you
where do they get their inspiration from? Like do you
(19:12):
sort of direct them? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (19:13):
I mean, look, I come up with a name for
a collection we've had Cabana wild Things was outdoor last
year from that movie Wild Things, which you probably remember
Matt Dylan, and the idea was like that, you know,
moody kind of Florida sunset fuel. So I'll come up
with a name and then we'll try and draw collection
from that, but still make sure that it's very usable
(19:36):
elements of color and design, and then you know, played
out from there.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
But you don't. You don't sort of say, well, what's
what's really hit the hit the straps or what.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Sort of Yeah, you've got a banger, it sells really well.
You know a rocket that's selling on the way up
to be a banger. You know, there is notions when
you know when a collection goes, it goes.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
How do you know this?
Speaker 3 (19:58):
How do you know that we've got data. I've got
a really good team seen when something hits, it hits.
And that's the exciting part about it because.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
But your people sort of looking in through the magazines,
looking at all the they have fashion shows. I mean,
sorry to have furniture shows like fashion fashion shows.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
Yeah, I mean you launch a collection, there is big
fares around the world. Launch it.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
So and look, I'm still trying to make it an
attainable access point, you know, so trying. Yeah, we're not
trying to design things that you know, so over the
top that you can't go and buy.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
That, because you can you can pay underground for a
Bloody's over these days if you really want to be
stupid my view, that's great.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
I've had a passion to continue to make it more accessible.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Yeah, accessible in terms of availability and price yeah, but without.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Really work on the experience, really work on the you know,
the idea that you can feel like you're in a
really cool place. And look, there's been some really great retailers,
you know throughout time they have done that.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
Well, yes, certainly, I'm still trying to get my head
around here. This work search I'll see, so your design
team will get inspiration from all these other places, not
not and not and not and including what other people
are doing. Just obviously you got to know what the
rest of the market is doing. Befo all of a
sudden everyone in the world loved wooden chairs. With wooden
(21:19):
you know you're going to have to do it.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
Trends are obvious.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
You know, the house has become more minimal, right, the
idea of filling up with a whole lot of antique furniture,
you know, it's way more We're way more in tune
with an environment that's very calming.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
Can we talk about that in for a second. So
what has been what do you see has been the
change in the way people like to furnish their home
Relatives to say twenty years ago.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
Look, there's twenty years ago.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
You probably have a mixture of some of you're given
some of you bought and something that you picked up
for free and something you know that you'd mix together.
So you know that evolution and look only a small
amount of people used to decorate. Decoration is huge now
really yeah, I mean look in America they're probably even
more ahead of us. But you know, people don't you
(22:08):
look how popular home shows are and you know the
block and everything like that. Everyone has a passion and
probably the biggest outset driver in Australia is your home.
So having a you know and probably selling your home,
that's when you make money. So having a passion to
make the home look good, feel good and build a
bit of value is I've.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
Seen the pick up. So the demographics a lot wider
than it ever was.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
So do you think Australians Because I remember buying a
house or probably with a house on it twenty years
ago and I remember going into the house and it
was a deceased estate and there's all this sixties furniture.
You know that that style of furniture you've seen the
sixties and you know there was even a stereo legs,
(22:53):
you know, sitting on four legs, timber legs, tim stereo
with the flip top. You know, it speaks attached as
cetera big big thing, a little bit of it, a
couples wide. Then there was the lounge lounge, single lounge
seats that sat around it, and of course it was
just the States. So I gave it all away, and
then I went and built a house. And I went
(23:14):
and many years later, twenties later, went built a house.
And I thought of himself, I wouldn't mind designing this
in the sixties, And I thought about all their furniture
just given away, and the stuff I board actually was
the same sort of furniture I had given away. But
do you think that people in Australia are as design
(23:35):
conscious as say other countries.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Look definitely it's it's accelerated. But look, the sixties was
a pretty wild time for design, Like people were really
pushing design harder than ever before.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
It disappeared in the eighties and nineties.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
I'd say, what do you put that down to.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
I've read a few different things.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
Obviously, whose government changing and you know, probably restrictions, but
you know that sixties period was probably the peak.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Creating we're talking about them of the world.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Charles just generally, you know, even the retailers Liberty and
you know those big retails in London that were crazy,
you know, and you know London in particular was a
huge design impact throughout the world. Italy has had different periods,
but yeah, it did stop for a period of time there.
I don't know, I don't whether we're wars or I'm
(24:31):
not sure exactly what happens in why different years come
and then we've obviously had a period of minimalism. Recently
it is starting to tear it back with a bit
of eclectic because people do want to identify something that's
kind of a bit unique.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
But minimalism has been pretty strong.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
What do you mean by minimalisms? Were talking about Scandinavian
style very.
Speaker 3 (24:51):
Much, you know, you know, simple, flaw simple so far,
very beige, beige, color beige, total total Asian with this
total anything, it's total brown and brown.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Tones tones of brown which could be and then.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Probably from that, you know, there will be impact. But
it's very easy to live in a tonal room. John
Pawson Ian Schrager, you know, the really cool designer An
Trager obviously, no, you know, probably the coolest creator of
interiors in the world from nightclubs to hotels. You know,
he's led that way of simplicity himself. Yeah, I mean
(25:30):
in his own environment.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
If you look at some of the hotels, you know,
the addition Hotel that that sort of led that minimalism,
and he did the Gramercy Park and so theater obviously
plays into an idea of lifestyle and minimalism have been strong.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
But do those sorts of hotels do they influence people?
People go to hotel perhaps and stay at Gramercy Park
or wherever, and they through in that hotel, and do
they want to them take that back to the home
they see.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
I honestly believe that boutique tell boutiquo old is probably
foresee interiors ten years.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
They're really good ones. Yeah, because they have all about experience.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
And if you look at probably some of the trends
from the best boutique hotels in the world, you'll see
a trend from about ten fifteen years later floating through.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
Wow. So in terms of what your research, your personal research,
if you go overseas, do you say to yourself, well,
I'm going to go and stay at the latest hotel
designed by blah blah blah.
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Yeah, I mean, look just t doesn't have to be
the latest.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
I mean, the first time I went to the Mercer
Hotel in New York, I was, you know, and that
was christ and Leagu one of his early hotels, and
he's probably one of the greatest interior designers, and that
was you know, I couldn't believe it. You know, in
that lobby there. Have you been to the lobby there?
It's a mixture of simplicity but luxury that you just
(26:56):
you know, that's.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
What you wanted to store.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Yeah, and that inspired me, you know, and I love
that idea of going into something like that and then
trying to take it into the norm.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Do you travel a place like the Four Seasons of Milan,
for example, Yeah, and you walk in there and you just, fuck,
this is cool because it is really like, yeah, believe.
Speaker 3 (27:16):
That's what I'm saying. Boutique hotels, you know their fantasy Land.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
As well as your Disneyland y.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Yeah, but even the experience, I mean, you know, there's
some really cool hotel experiences that maybe the interiors aren't
what I like, but that mood in Beverly Hills Hotels obviously,
you know, a classic.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
It's a been old school for me. There a little
bit now, and.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
But that you know, that old school mentality, you know,
with the bar underneath, and so it's different, but there's
obviously history in.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
That and you know it's someone so sad there, they'll
say so and so sad.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Yeah, I just you just know it's had that. But yeah,
that that that experience in boutique hotel. It's pretty rock
and roll.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
So you bring that stuff back, you and your team
you bring they might not go any where be these
as you can get look at all online, but they
bring that into your mix and then off the back
of that you you determine the theme, the theme for
the for the next release of any.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I mean, look, obviously, you know how much money you've
got to spend on a collection and time, you know,
restricts where you're going. We're on a bit of a
path for growth, so you know, there always is you know,
an idea in a direction that comes from you know, something.
Speaker 3 (28:30):
That is inspiring sous.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
The latest theme.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
We're doing, Cabana coming out with Doloro is the big
one right.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Now, so just to me through that.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
So Doloro is about that you know, intergalactic sort of
outdoor living that could be probably a bit modern, but
still you know, feeling like you maybe were outdoor living
on Mars. You know that futuristic as in futuristic, Yeah,
I mean outdoor furniture is tech related because it's got
to be strong to withstand elements. So the idea of
(28:58):
a furniture collection that could on Mars, for me, it
was pretty good.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Is this collection timber or metal?
Speaker 3 (29:04):
A lot of aluminium? A little bit of timber.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
Aluminium for me, probably the best element for Australia.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Because it doesn't rust and mold. Yeah, so you know,
playing into that, Yeah, it doesn't, but it can get
pitted if it's near the sea though that's a drumalt
salt pitch.
Speaker 3 (29:19):
You can deal with pitted probably more than mold molden issue.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Yeah. Yeah, so so it's and what about the fabrics.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Look again, probably more tonal at the moment, but we
do have an evergreen, we've got a terra cotta.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
But it's got to.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Be resilient, can't can't fade well yeah, I mean kind
of patterns are there because it too.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
But do you have to and do you leave this
stuff outside or you have to bring I.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
Mean, look, I like everything that can stay outside.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Yeah, because the pain in the arts have to move
stuff in and out, so we're looking at strong colors
or barrel like that, or.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
You know, we did actually try and put in some
strong colors in when we're shooting it.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
You just know, you know what I mean, Leave that
for later.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
But yeah, continuing to probably total is the challenge because
you know, you don't want to give anyone a reason
to say there's an opinion left or right. Yeah, yeah,
you know, and usually there's two people in this decision,
so yeah, and you don't really have control over both
of them.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
And our door furniture we're talking about stuffer in the
pool for example.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Yeah, modular systems, sun loungers, you know, yeah, yeah, everything. Yeah,
I mean I think it's sixty four pieces in the collection,
so that's pretty big.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
So like as an umbrellas the whole thing. Yeah, yeah,
and we'll have a come and look there, because I'm
always trying to get my little resort, you know.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
The big things to make sure we can fill the
whole house.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
Yeah, but this is an outdoor collection, yep. The lawyer,
the lawyer, Delao Deloro, Sorry, this is your outdoor collection.
How did you get inspiration for that again.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Again, that idea that you know, you could have furniture
that could survive, you know, on another planet.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
And basically straining conditions. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
Yeah, Trailie is probably the most brutal. Yeah, during the world.
You know, look at the rain we've got now, unbelievable
and it was stunning in.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
Melbourne yesterday and cold and probably Queensland's probably humid.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yeah. Yeah, So because you have to build something, you
go or produce stuff and go either one of those
places everywhere. Yeah, and that when they cand released.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
In stores this week and then campaigns in.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Three weeks campaign and so what how do you run
a campaign like that? So where do you run a
campaign like that?
Speaker 2 (31:24):
I mean digital is a big part. We've got a
database and then you know, we played out from there, so.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
We would have bet obviously instagrams, Perfume, Instagram, but like
you know, you've got everything going on.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
But yeah, I mean obviously you know social media and
you probably have a similar idea of you know how
powerful that can be. Again, when product's great, you know,
product and price probably the key things. But getting that
message out it's pretty critical. An organic reach we've found
is the best.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
So that's off your database when a.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Story is forwarded or gets you views without it being
forced out.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Not through an influencer, but through twenty your customers.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah, or just a story on it.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
I'm not influencers obviously play a part in the industry,
but to get the right mixing, the right timing is
always a bit of a challenge.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
But when you say organic that, what do you mean
by There might.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Be a story on a store that we've done.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
That isn't directly a general interest storytypeicing.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Yeah, or something we've done or you know, there was
an article from years ago that we still have a
house that we did up in Palm Beach from Country
Road wasn't even our brand and it's still high on
the ratings. So it is funny organic, organic readership and
organic following is.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
You know, and you don't promote excuse me, there's no
stuff you promote. Yeah, I mean people find it, but
I'm my head of marketing, probably gonna tell anything wrong.
So but in terms of social media, like into the
building your brand MCN brand.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
It's been the biggest, biggest thing. I mean again, theater
plays a big part in it.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
So what do you do? What are some of the
little tricks you pull.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Look, photo photo shoots are big for us, you know,
making sure that there's a vibe and that's the key,
you know, vibe, you know, and then obviously on that
is stock price and where your stores are.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Yeah, but that's access and affordability. But like you know,
you you're you're a creaty person. But it's easy for
you to say the vibe. I wouldn't add a creative vibe.
Like if you said to me, I Mark, you know,
you know, a fifty percent owner of MCM, because you know,
I paid a whole lot of money becoming your partner,
which is not trueman, let's say it was. And you said, mate,
(33:33):
what you are now in charge of building the vibe?
I would know where to start for our social but
you'd probably be pretty good at point. Someone would yea,
but what do you mean by vibe? So in terms
of socials, yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
The vibe is you know, what leads the theme and
the feeling of it. I mean, you do a spire,
you know, I mean we might have a we might
have a setting in the shoot that you know is
so big and so luxurious. It's an inspirational aspirational so
aspirational marketing is pretty cool to get to that point
where you can do that and give people, you know,
(34:07):
an idea of what it despires to have that I don't.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
But if you were you probably not the case. But
in terms of something you're being aspirational, do you get
someone like George Clooney to not George Clooney in particular,
but personality that look, I do they make it aspirational
to they can, but you know, I'm not big on
a personality being as part of what a product is.
I have done a really cool shoots, probably not so
(34:33):
much personality, but a type of character. My first shoot,
I had a close friend of mine. He was an
ex lawyer, became a flower farmer that you know, very chic,
cool guy, and I had him in a photo in
the white sofa with his cool dog and it's still
probably my favorite photo.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
You know, cool pair of persons and that idea of
you know, ragness, sheik, luxurious and lifestyle. You know, that's
a vibe. Not so much personality, but type of character.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
So when you when you look at your vibe, do
you try to match it to your customer base or
do you try to get the customer base to be
attracted to your vibe.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Probably we play into the collection a little bit more now,
but I've always kept a strong idea of what I like,
you know, in terms of a photo on a shoot,
and so yeah, it's you know, but it is a
balancing act what you can do with you know, budgets,
you know, I mean logistics what you're talking about now,
you know the cost of getting truckload of furniture to
(35:31):
a house at Flinders.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
It's pretty big Flinders in Victoria. Yeah, yeah, that's like
on the coast, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (35:36):
Yeah, that's where we just shot the outdoor.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
You just you just delivered some stuff to someone we
didn't know.
Speaker 3 (35:41):
We did a shoot in Flinders, right.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
Right, right right. Someone gave you their house or whatever
it is to you.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
We pay for it.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
Yeah, yeah, obviously not gave it to you, You rented or
something like that, and you do the shooting that place
because because the vibe at Flint is and what we
talk about ocean.
Speaker 3 (35:54):
Yeah, really cool architectual house on the ocean.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
Yeah, pretty pretty clean line joint, very cool. Yeah yeah,
and then you could.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
Just yeah it's a perfect setting.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah. Theater, yeah, totally only me. I love theater. I
love it. I can't produce it, but I love theater
when I see it. So if I was, excuse me,
if you were to today list out and I'll presume
to do this. The profiles or profile your database, that's
(36:23):
your customer base. Can you do you know who you're
Is it like something between forty and eighty or is it?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (36:29):
I mean, look do you know?
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Actually enough there's you know, we have got some dart
of it breaks it down and.
Speaker 3 (36:34):
So we do know that.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
You know, I was in the shop every day for
ten years, seven days, so I knew my customers and
the mix you know in Sydney's probably slightly different to Melbourne,
really slightly different.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
But you know it's probably a demographic thing.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
But if you break it down, you know, we know
twenty to thirty what they're probably spending forty to fifty
sixty plus.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
In terms of money. Yep, what and when we do that,
when you say you know what this beending, so you
know what the capacity is. But does that then determined
do you then build to suit that price? Now?
Speaker 3 (37:09):
Look you don't.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
I mean you can probably get yourself in a bit
of a tangle, but you're probably more aware of where
that market is. And look, we are trying to grow
the brand, so we need to have more customs.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
I guess where's the juicy bit in terms of demographic
it changes.
Speaker 2 (37:24):
You know as you grow. In the end, you know
you want to have a pretty consistent transaction value and
you know, funny enough that it probably is one or
two items. It's not a whole house, but you know
that's the inspiration to continue to have a range that
you know you can do a larger purchase.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
So when you say it's one or tour them, maybe
see three of them. You're talking about maybe a dining
table so for in a rug and or a coffee
that arm ship, yeah, table chairs and then there. So
there you're more most regularly turned over items.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
As a snapshot.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
And is that because it's funny when you said the
average life of a sover, let's call it is three
to five years. I know the average life a home
loan in my homeland business is four and a half years.
So people basically they don't pay the loan off for
four and a half years. But what they do is
they sell the house and they're buy another one that
might gread down grade, get divorced with the case of
b so that when they move, they're looking for new
(38:19):
furniture because the house that they move from or departments
they move from maybe smaller, maybe bigger, shit doesn't fit.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
Yeah, and look, that's probably why price is pretty critical now,
because you want to make sure that it's not a
life decision that they're making it.
Speaker 3 (38:34):
Look, the interesting part.
Speaker 2 (38:35):
On that on the back of that, you know, we're
doing a lot of work in the build to rent market.
You know, we're putting furniture in apartments that people are
just going to go and live in, you know, and
that's an interesting notion, you know. And then the affordability
of even developers to fill up an apartment of furniture.
It's probably cheaper than the cost of a truck going
(38:58):
in and out over three years, so you know, and
the impact on the building, so.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
You know, they buy it from you, or they rent
it from you, uh, the owners of the bill to me.
Speaker 3 (39:10):
Or purchase for the buill to rent.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
So you know, I mean the probably cost of furniture
is you know, probably the least expensive part of that process,
but the biggest impact.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
No, just seeing myself, if I'm the fund that owns
owns the whole building. Then I want to rent it out.
I just seen him, as I have said, of me
out laying capital for that. If I could just rent
it from you and with agreement that you turn over
every three years, you know, that might be that might be.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
I mean, look, there's different ways, you know what I mean,
who gets paid at what time? So you know, but
in the end, it's a it's a we do you know,
a really good commercial offering for that market. So the
transaction is you know, is suitable for it?
Speaker 1 (39:53):
So it's you, it's your biggest market, retail or wholesale retail, retail, Yeah,
for sure.
Speaker 3 (39:57):
The hustle in me has brought out the commercial.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, but is that is the commercial.
Speaker 3 (40:04):
So it's not something that we go to the market with,
but it's something that I do very well.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
So if you go to one of these build build
to rent buildings apart buildings, and there might be on
fifty apartments in there, do you decorate everyone that's exactly
the same? But has it worked?
Speaker 3 (40:17):
I mean, look, you might have two color schemes.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Yeah, but yeah, you want consistency, and you know, we've
done some really good ones with some really good partners.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
So yeah, that that'd be good for you though, because
you know you can make a super bulk order. You
know exactly you've got to you know, you want twenty
lounge or fifty lounges, fifty coffee tables, fifty drugs, fifty
blah blah blah. Yeah, it's an easy one for you
to sort.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Yeah, and look, you need to make sure that it's
you know, that it all works well and that it's
all going to stay in there and you know, survived.
Last thing you want to do is have to be
swopping furniture out yeah, within that three years.
Speaker 3 (40:48):
So yeah, no, it's it's look, it's a good market.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
But again, you know, go in retail for me as
a passion, you know, and that's something that I'm focusing
more on now than before.
Speaker 1 (40:59):
So did you see eight stores?
Speaker 3 (41:01):
Eight stores were up in Brisbane tomorrow. We're are stores
now Melbourne, Sydney. We've got two bel Gwala and Paddington.
We've got an outlet in Alexandria Byron. Where's one Barron
in the habitat?
Speaker 1 (41:17):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah that was.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
Actually the second story. If it did.
Speaker 2 (41:22):
Really cool going up there Brandon, He said, come into
a store. And there was that perfect period of time
where people were.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
Moving there to live. And again that was a drink
COVID just.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
Before just before COVID, and.
Speaker 3 (41:36):
Then obviously it was you know, it was like heaven
up there during COVID. Did you get up there over them?
Speaker 1 (41:41):
But I to get there, I had to get I
actually ended up again and have to get the vaccine
because I couldn't get on the plane. But my address
is Byron's my actual on my license. So I was
able to travel because I was basically traveling from home
at home. But in the end you couldn't could leave
you unless unless you drive.
Speaker 3 (41:59):
It was the capital city of Australia.
Speaker 1 (42:00):
Probably it's changed a bit now. Yeah, so everybody's pulled
back a bit, but went mental up there. Crazy pricing prices,
et cetera. So you're your habitat, Okay, that's a great
that's a great little development habitat thing. It's perfect for
your stuff.
Speaker 3 (42:13):
It was great.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Look it was it was only three on it square
meters when I started.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
That's second one. So but it was a good footprint.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Again, logistics, you know, that's probably been the thing I
look at after the idea, you know, getting a truck
to go because he's got to go to Brisbane and
then another track down to Byron.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
Was that just for long haul purposes?
Speaker 2 (42:35):
You know, you can't have a guy driving eight hours
and then doing a job you're not legally allowed to, right,
so you know you probably have second set of drivers.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
So there's all those complications.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
So the logistics, so maybe you just quickly map out
before we close off this. We've talked about, you know,
all the inspirational stuff and design and concepts and you
know what's cool and aspiration, all that sort of emotional stuff,
but just a bit.
Speaker 3 (43:03):
It's the biggest toll of me is all that hard stuff.
Speaker 1 (43:05):
Yeah, I was going to say, let's talk about what
you call the hustle. Let's just we've got logistics, delivery,
logistics in other words, the last mile stuff. You've got
all your first mode of your your online stores, so
you go to there's a bit, then there's the maintenance
delivery not delivery, the product yourself, you know, designing and
(43:29):
producing it. So maybe you can break it up into
a couple of baskets for me. So how does a
business like your business, how do what's its rhythm look
like in terms of execution of the.
Speaker 2 (43:44):
Try not to fill my head too much because it's
a it's a it's a full ecosystem activity, you know,
you know, and any one time there's probably a couple
of thousand people from manufacturing, through to through to phone
that could be operating. And you know we're not we're
you know, we're not huge, but we're big enough. So
you know, it is an ecosystem, you know. And that's
(44:05):
from you know, materials getting to the factory, getting built,
getting onto a container, avoiding a typhoon, getting into the dock,
avoiding any dock issues, getting to the fact, you know,
getting the warehouse, getting the customer to pick up phone
and book in a delivery, making sure it's not raining
(44:25):
when they deliver, make sure the apartment can actually fit
the item. Else making sure the drill works, got the batteries,
make sure they can flip over the table or put
it up.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
So it's a it's a big process.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
And you've got a massive team doing that too. Big, Yeah, yeah,
because that's sort of a lot of man management or
woman Menagually.
Speaker 2 (44:49):
It could be one item could have you know, ten,
twelve or twenty touch points. Yeah, yeah, the skills to
probably get that down and the probably the best retailer
Nick Carley, probably the quickest and the at doing that.
So that's you know, that's that's probably an aspirational in
terms of how you operate as a business, as an
operational so you know, and that's probably you can see
(45:09):
share price in his turn so instead.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Of but when do you finish that? The child's so
into all that stuff or is that look?
Speaker 2 (45:16):
You know, and I aim to be able to do
something like that. You know, your order and you know,
we carry you three four million bucks worth of stock now,
so I do want to have stock that people can get.
Speaker 3 (45:25):
And then there's also made to order.
Speaker 2 (45:27):
But you have to challenge because again I started it
out in the back of it you and then to
build that you know, one generation.
Speaker 1 (45:34):
It's a bit of a bit of a because he's
a couple of generations this guy.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
Probably every furniture retailer has got a generational sort of
story to an ad. So yeah, I'm playing a bit
to catch up.
Speaker 3 (45:46):
But you know that's fun. Yeah, it's good, that's good.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
I would have loved to probably a family member that
you know what I mean, got a bit of pain
along the way.
Speaker 1 (45:54):
But your mum sort of copped a little bit, but
she caught pain.
Speaker 3 (45:56):
She did.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
She was actually my first ever wholesale when I got
the brand going. So funny she she's she's been pretty
pretty dynamic.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
Did you get a good deal from her?
Speaker 2 (46:07):
Yeah, Well she knew that I needed to get an
order to get my own Fantage collection, so she opened
up a little store in Geelong.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Wow when she was sixty I think sixty five.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
There's a cool photo so yeah, and she probably got
a bit of pain doing that.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
So dealing with the sun, yeah, still does. And so
you've got a stores.
Speaker 2 (46:26):
But what more we've got the marked out you know,
twelve to fifteen is probably you know a.
Speaker 3 (46:31):
Good sweet spot.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Finding the row win twenty twenty seven, Wow, that's two years.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
Yeah, so I've going to call on a Newcastle opening up,
which is going to.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
Be a lot a lot of money up in Newcastle
of people looking for Yeah, we're it's.
Speaker 2 (46:44):
Going to be going like a surf gallery, big internal courtyard.
Speaker 3 (46:49):
So you know, we're trying to do retail.
Speaker 2 (46:53):
Experiences in spots that you know people love to be
in Melbourne, Hotred Armadah, we did that Paddington's going to
have a big reno. We've got fifteen year anniversary coming up,
so you know that that's the next exciting part to
do cool stores in you know, in cool locations.
Speaker 1 (47:10):
That new building cross Roafue and Paddington, that's pretty wild.
It looks good.
Speaker 3 (47:14):
Yeah, no parking though the people live there. No, that's
going to be a hotel.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
This hotel is it? So that's actually pretty good for
you in terms of traffic.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
And yeah, Paddington's always had a little bit of an
up and down period, but it is the main street
when everyone goes yeah, and you know, it's you know,
it's cool to have someone doing something, I know.
Speaker 3 (47:35):
And then next door of Varna, they're going to have
a big development going from there.
Speaker 1 (47:38):
Yeah. The Varna's the old movie theater.
Speaker 2 (47:40):
And then so that's getting turned I think that's getting
turned into a big development soon as.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
Well well, like a commercial residential hotel.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
Yeah, it's commercial.
Speaker 1 (47:49):
Yeah. So that's interesting because that old site there on
the corner of Oxford Street and whatever it is Flin
does I think it is. They've done an amazing job,
but they've been trying to be talking about thirty years.
I think it's just no sort of scaffolding has been
taken down.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
They ran in, they found they had some heritage issues
in the ground. Oh wow, sole for two years to
find artifacts as something happened.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
I heard.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
So they've had an issue there. But it's finished now,
not yet. It looks like it nearly looks great. Boutique
hotels Sydney starving for them.
Speaker 2 (48:22):
Yeah, but it's you know, I mean look at that
two year you know, hold up, you know, it's a
hard thing to do it in Sydney.
Speaker 1 (48:29):
So it's also very expensive and hard to make money,
very very expensive.
Speaker 2 (48:32):
So I mean, yeah, but yeah, I know Capella is
probably one in the city. Yeah, I mean that's raised
the bar for Australia. But that was pretty deep pockets.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
Do you ever get a chance to quote on those
sorts of compellers.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
And yeah, look I do have a hospitality arm care
workshop and we do so we've done.
Speaker 1 (48:52):
Some pretty cool specializing in hospitality.
Speaker 2 (48:54):
Any kind of commercial offering. So and we've done a
lot of projects along that. Again that's born out the hustle.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
Yeah, that's you though. You have to yes, you're your
your development manager, you know.
Speaker 2 (49:05):
I've got a team over say he's like about thirty
people that just work on that. We've got a couple.
You know, I got a job in Miami. You got
a job in Germany. So we've had jobs all around
the world and that's fueled a little bit of excitement.
Speaker 1 (49:17):
It's funny that I was talking to one of the
past Bayley family and they've Mikey or Pete, No, Chris, Chris.
And Chris is telling me that they opened up a
hotel that's outside his division. He's more on the retail
side for a jewelry, but he said, I've opened a
hotel a year or two ago in New York.
Speaker 3 (49:32):
Yeah. Yeah, Now I remember talking to the boys about that.
Speaker 1 (49:34):
Anyons is bad, like boys for New.
Speaker 3 (49:37):
York's great city for hotels.
Speaker 1 (49:39):
Yeah, but in terms of furniture, you're talking about that
sort of experience, the vibe New York's place for me
that andedly Milan is definitely the vibe, that type of thing. Like,
as I said, I couldn't create something in a million years,
but if I see something, I can tell if I know,
if I like something, you know, get the whole feeling
I walk.
Speaker 3 (49:57):
In the Wow it changes.
Speaker 1 (49:59):
Yeah, yeah, you know what. Literally it's the.
Speaker 2 (50:02):
One thing that changes me, you know when I'm stale
and you know what, and that's unfortunately Sidney, you know,
we're probably you know, because it's it's so expensive here
to do cool things and that you know, it has
changed for that notion.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
I mean, Justin's probably pushing you know, more than anything.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
But you know, and even I know, you know when
he does a big project, it's expensive. Yeah, I worked
on Mimis with him and you know that that was
a big undertaking.
Speaker 1 (50:26):
Yeah, also expensive joint get his money back. Well, well, Charles,
I was really great talking to me, to be honest,
like I'm I'm a furniture lover home furniture that is,
I love you furniture. I know what I love as
I couldn't create it. I've always had a great deal
of admiration for people who can conceptualize these things and
(50:50):
then turn it into the product. And as you say,
you know, build the vibe. I can feel the vibe.
I couldn't build the vibe. My life depended on it.
So it's a great opportunity standing and talk to you.
We'll sit her and talk to you about what looks
seems to me like to me, you're in a young bloke.
But it seems like to me a never ending passion
to you, like it's it's irrepressible.
Speaker 3 (51:10):
Yeah, I mean, look, it's you know, it's it's you
love it.
Speaker 2 (51:14):
Yeah, and once you start, like again, I've had a
shop open every day, you know, it's actually been twenty years.
I've had a shop every day fifteen years MCM. So unfortunately,
once you open the doors, you've always.
Speaker 3 (51:26):
Got a customer. Yeah, so you know, and that's that's
the journey.
Speaker 1 (51:29):
Yeah, but that's that interaction is probably not only the journey,
but it's probably one of the most satisfying parts of
it all. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (51:35):
And look, you know, looking back on it from you know,
fifteen twenty.
Speaker 3 (51:39):
Years is I've crossed the paths and everything.
Speaker 2 (51:42):
And my dad actually really you know, that was one
of the things that he loved, the interaction that I
had with you know, pretty amazing people on the journey.
Speaker 1 (51:49):
Yeah. Well, Charles sinkhas from MCM house in eight stores
around Australia and soon to be a lot more. Thanks
for much coming on the mentor. I appreciate me. It
was great.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (52:00):
Mark. You welcome
Popular Podcasts
NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal
Gregg Rosenthal and a rotating crew of elite NFL Media co-hosts, including Patrick Claybon, Colleen Wolfe, Steve Wyche, Nick Shook and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic get you caught up daily on all the NFL news and analysis you need to be smarter and funnier than your friends.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com