June 21, 2025 • 30 mins
After facing backlash for sharing the story of what happened the night Paul punched the door for the first time while filming Married At First Sight, Carina explores why people don't take domestic violence seriously. She is joined by Rhiannon Purcell, a mother-of-five and DV survivor and advocate, who shares her heartbreaking story of how little incidents can, and usually will, slowly escalate into the horror she endured which left her fighting for her life.
Sign Rhiannon's petition here: https://chng.it/6vNRckmtPY
1800RESPECT is available for free, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week to support people impacted by domestic, family or sexual violence.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Trigger warnings, so this episode will be hard to listen
to for some people. It will be emotional, and it
will heavily discuss domestic violence, abusive partners, and how so
many women become trapped in relationships which they feel they
cannot escape, and when they do try and escape, they
feel let down by the system. In the first episode
(00:20):
of this podcast, I shared the full story of what
happened the night Paul punched the door for the first time.
Over the last few months, it feels like everyone has
shared their opinions on that night, argued about what it
was or wasn't and who was to blame. But what
I've realized is nothing that I or any woman may
say or do ever warrants their partner responding with violence.
(00:44):
Everyone may think what happened that night was just a
storyline on a TV show, a scandal in the tabloids,
and a thing for people to debate on social media,
But to me, it's none of those things. It's something
that I was the victim of, and as I was
ready to talk about in my own words in a
way that I felt comfortable, the response was overwhelming, so
(01:07):
many comments blaming me, judging me, saying get over at Karina,
but then so many messages from women saying they've been
in the position I was that night, saying how for
them it started with a punch to a door or
smashing an object, and over time, as those outbursts became
more frequent, it ended up with them being bruised, covered
(01:29):
in blood in hospital and in some cases almost losing
their lives. What happened to me was one incident and
thankfully there was no escalation, but not everybody is as lucky.
And seeing so many people saying that was not domestic
violence and I should get over it is why domestic
violence is such a problem in Australia and not taken seriously.
(01:51):
That's why I wanted to do this episode and welcome
a very brave woman who has sadly lived that life
and experienced how little incidents do esculate into the horror.
She'd then endure it for fifteen years.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Hi, my honey, this is going to be really a
deep episode. The comments on your posts on episode one,
you know, people got really I mean the comments were crazy,
like basically telling you to get over what happened, the
whole DV situation, that you're just an attention Zeeker, you
(02:27):
know that it's not really domestic violence.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
So I don't know.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
I've been like reading a few why am.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I going to cry? I'm am I going to cry.
Smile with a Notion podcast is usually so bubbly, and
you know.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
It's really bubbly and all the time, and yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
But this is a really deep and serious conversation and
topic that we're touching. One that was the first time
I've properly spoken publicly about what happens.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
How do you feel after speaking about it?
Speaker 1 (03:04):
It's been tough reading a lot of the comments and
the public's views and opinions. There's a lot of negativity
and people saying, just get over it, that happens so
long ago, move on, that's not real domestic violence. You know,
it's tough. It's really tough to read those and see
(03:25):
how people can be so harsh and quick to judge.
So I think that's why today's conversation and episode is
really important for not only myself, for you and the public.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
So I read an article in the press and it
was about rhann and Purcell. She's a mother of five
from Sydney. She's a domestic violence survivor, advocate and she
wants changed in Australia. So throughout her life, Rhannon has
unfortunately had multiple partners who were violent, and she knows
how hard it can be to leave a relationship that
(04:05):
you know, has had domestic violence in it. On average,
it takes a woman seven times to finally leave a
violent partner for good. Why am I getting I'm just
really this is like hitting something in me.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
In her last relationship, Randon knew that she had to
escape when her partner assaulted one of her children, which
is yeah, that's pretty heavy.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
So did they have children together? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Yeah, So we actually have Rhannon here today. So like
when the comments say, you know, get over it. He
just punched the door. You know. Hopefully this conversation can
show people that, you know, this is the start of
domestic violence and how further it can go. So we're
bringing Rihanna now and she can share her story with everyone.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Rihannon, thank you so much for joining myself, Jacob and
for coming on the podcast and sharing your story. I
want this to be a safe space. You know, this
is a really oh I'm getting emotional. This is a
very touchy subject and a very very kind of even
(05:21):
get my words out with how serious what my experience
was to what actually happens in the real world and
how many women go through domestic violence. Again, I've said
it in my episode with Jacob that I'm not educated
enough on domestic violence and what I went through on
(05:43):
married at First Sight was just a snippet of what
most women who go through domestic violence experience. So again,
thank you so much for joining us and telling us
your story. I'm sure it's very personal in your relationship
with was it your ex partner or your ex partner
(06:06):
at fifteen years and you had four children with him?
What were the early warning signs of him being an abuser?
Speaker 3 (06:16):
For the first year of our relationship, we I don't
even think had like a single argument. And then yeah,
it just slowly, slowly happens. So you know, it'll be
with jealousy saying you know, you can't go here, you
(06:38):
can't go there, controlling what clothes you might wear. Then
it might be like, you know, breaking your phone or
not allowing you to have social media, or you know,
punching a wall or pushing you, and then it just
progresses over the years and at the time time you
(07:00):
don't really know that it's even happening.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Because it's a is it a fight or is it
a conversation? Is it just an argument with one another?
And then it turns into.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
Well it can be anything really, so like abuses usually
will slowly eat away your confidence, you know, make you
feel like you won't be able to find anyone else,
you're not good enough, things like that.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Were you ever told to just get over certain things
and that it's normal behavior or was he a deflector
was it more verbal or side of verbal? And then
it got more physical?
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Yeah, yeah, okay, and then yeah, in the end it
was just pretty much yeah, all types of abuse happening.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
You know, when Paul and I were getting into that
argument after our night out, and my point of view
of the argument was that I was apologizing for saying
what I said for then him to get reactive, and
what he wasn't happy about was I was trying to
(08:14):
explain my reasoning for that comment and under trying to
understand our boundaries. But he was making me feel like
it was my fault and that I shouldn't have said
that and I shouldn't have spoken about my past relationship
or brought that in. And a lot of people can
maybe agree with that, but you know where I was
(08:35):
coming from in that moment of time, was that but
you were so okay talking about swingers and being open
about your past sex life. But then when I bring
mine up, that's an issue, right, So and I then
felt guilty and then I was like, Okay, I'm in
the wrong. I'm so sorry, and I kept apologizing. Did
(08:56):
your ex partner make you feel like you were in
a position, in a vulnerable place where you had to
apologize and you were kind of feeling guilty trying to
be I guess yourself.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
I know exactly what you've described. I'd always go through. Yeah,
everything was just always my fault. His reaction was always
because of something I had done. So yeah, that's really
really common things. Yeah happened.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
You always felt like you were in the wrong.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
You were and I did find myself apologizing a lot
like you said you did.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, And I think for a lot of people out
there that experience, even just a minimal, like a minuscule
of abuse is like the biggest sign of what could
be if you stay in that relationship longer. Like, did
you notice any red flags or did you just at
(09:56):
the beginning, or were you just like in love in
lust and you loved the person so much because you
were so happy in that relationship, or did you know
that it was deep down in your gut that it
wasn't right for you and it was quite toxic behavior?
Speaker 3 (10:09):
As a child, I grew up witnessing domestic violence in
the home, right, So I do often wonder.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Like why did I stay? Or Yeah, But I don't know.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
I think possibly I saw like I'd never seen a
normal relationship, So I don't know whether I just thought
that was normal or that was love.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
But yeah, was there an incident that occurred where you
realized that wasn't normal behavior?
Speaker 4 (10:44):
When my son was.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Assaulted by his dad, I knew at that point that,
you know, I could kind of deal with myself getting hurt,
but when my kids, we're now the target, and that
was like I couldn't handle stuff like that.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
And then in the ABC newsiety called there's clear evidence
of you being physically abused.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Yeah, photos because he had my three year old twins
with him, and so we'd had an argument about him.
He'd said he was going to drop them off to me,
but he decided he wasn't going to and I had
to go and pick them up. So on the way there,
(11:33):
we had the argument. I was like threatened basically on
the phone, but I knew that I had to still
go and pick up my little girls. So I drove there,
even though I had a really terrible feeling that I
was going to be assaulted when I got there. And
(11:57):
when I got there, he came out of the house
and walked out with my little girls. And as he
walked outside, he turned the lights off.
Speaker 4 (12:10):
And straightway.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
You know, I knew that he obviously probably done that
for a reason because he knew he was about to
attack me. So my little girls got in the back. Yeah,
they were like three at the time, and.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
He sorry, he have some water if you need, Yeah,
take your time.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
Yeah, it's more just the fact that my kids had
to see that. That's what.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
I don't think any any woman should go through that.
And it's so fortunate that you were in that position
and that environment, and all you wanted was the safety
of your children and but also giving the father time
to see his kids. So you were again being an amazing,
nice human and a mother and this is what's happened
(13:10):
to you.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
So, yeah, he got in. My twins got in the
back seat of the car and he sat down in
the front passenger seat and just started saying, Oh, who
are you to talk to me like that, like obviously
(13:32):
really aggressively, and I was just like I'm sorry, I'm sorry,
like I'm sorry, and I had my phone in my hand,
and I don't know whether he thought I was recording
him or what, but he snatched the phone off me.
And at that point I was like, oh my god,
(13:52):
I need to get out of this car, like he's
going to attack me. So I went to get out
of the car, like open the door, and I turned
my head and then that's when I felt like a
blow to my head. Yeah, I continued to get out
of the car, and he also got out of the
car and started chasing me. So I'm screaming. At this point,
(14:18):
my little girls are screaming. They've gotten out of the
car and they're just standing on the side of the
road watching. Yeah, their dad like chase their mum while
she's screaming.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
And Yeah, he.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Pushed me to the ground and was kicking me hollow
I was on the ground and yeah, I actually thought
like I might die. So his family actually came running
out and helped pull him off me, and then I
(15:03):
saw a car coming driving down towards me, and then
when the car pulled over, it was actually one of
his family members in the car. She said like jump in,
jump in, and took me away from him, because I
think she was even worried that, like, you know, what
he might do. So I'm down the street around the corner,
(15:29):
kind of hiding from him. He was on parole at
the time, so obviously knew that, you know, he was
going to be in a lot of trouble. So he,
from what I understand, took like he left and so, yeah,
(15:54):
I'm around the corner. I don't he'd taken my phone
and smashed it on the road, so I didn't have
my phone. I used the family member's phone to call.
I think I called my sister Rosie or Taylor. I
knew the number off by heart, and I let them
know what had happened. But then I was like, oh
(16:16):
my god, like my twins. They're back at the at
the house, so I was like, please.
Speaker 4 (16:22):
Just take me back.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
So I went back and they were obviously they're really distraught,
and I had the family trying to get me to
go inside and clean up my face. And get all sorted,
and I just thought to myself, like why, Like I
(16:44):
felt like they were trying to like cover up or.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
You know, under the road.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Yeah, so I refuse.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
I was like, no, that's fine, I'm going home, like,
and I got my girls in the car, I got
back in the cars how to driving. And yeah, at
the time, I didn't realize like how bad my injuries were.
But I think it's just all the adrenaline and everything
(17:12):
at the time, you know, you don't kind of realize.
But as I was driving, I could feel like warm,
something warm and wet dripping down and yeah, I ended
up like I looked down and I was just all
covered in blood.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
Yeah, and I had like a four centimeter laceration on
the side of my head that I needed staple back together.
And yeah, as I was I drove home, I think
it was about a twenty minute drive with just like
blood dripping down.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:50):
So I end up in hospital and then yeah, so I.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Questioned and say, where how did this?
Speaker 4 (17:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (17:57):
Yeah, so I got home. All my family had kind
of rushed to my house by that stage, and I, yeah,
it was in shock, like I I could barely talk. Yeah,
just was really traumatized. My kids were like, oh my gosh,
(18:21):
because my other two kids weren't there at the time.
But imagine like me getting out of the car and
just yeah, I literally looked like I was like in
a horror movie or something. So all the kids were
just like crying, and you know, they didn't know if
I was going to die. Yeah, it was really really.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
That glimpse for your children is so detrimental for their future,
which is just so unfortunate situation and everything that you
went through. Why did he get let out of jail?
Did the police not think key, like the domestic unit
did not think that.
Speaker 4 (19:03):
He was He was given.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
A nine month prison sentence, where he had to serve
a minimum of four months. Yeah. I feel like the
sentence that was given for the assault was just not enough,
like absolutely disgusting long enough.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
And yet he was able to see your children. Yeah,
does he have any form of custody to have? No, Okay,
but you can see them, but he can't see you.
Is that what the AVO is all about?
Speaker 4 (19:37):
Pretty much? Yes?
Speaker 3 (19:39):
So I the magistrate keeps removing the children from the
av oh every time it goes before the court, so
they'll leave me on their but they'll remove the kids.
But yeah, obviously, because there was violence comitted in front
(20:00):
of children. I had community services involved and they they
didn't want him. They don't want him to have contact
with the kids unless he's done like men's behavior change
courses or domestic valance courses.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Or whatever like rehabilitation, community service. Ye did he do
any of that, So he's breaching that as well.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
Well, it wasn't court ordered, it was just their opinion.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
He then started a petition called Protect Women and Children
Demand for Stronger Domestic Violence Laws and Penalties or because
he was, you know, not proceeding with the av o,
or you feel that the government need to implement stronger
penalties for these situations so you feel safe as a
(20:58):
woman and your children. You don't want any contact with him,
you don't want him to be around. So how so
is that why you started the petition?
Speaker 3 (21:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (21:10):
I just feel like, do you think the government's failed.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
Yeah, definitely as a human and as a woman, they've
failed me and my kids, and also thousands and thousands
of women all over Australia. Like, since my story has
been out in the media and I've started the petition,
I've had so many women message me with their stories
(21:40):
and yeah, letting me know the failures of the police
and the courts in their situation as well. So it's
not an isolated thing. It's like just everywhere like so many,
there's thousands of women. So yeah, I just feel like
(22:02):
there's a whole failure in the system, like just it
needs a whole overhaul. So that's what my petition is about.
It's about harsher penalties when there's kids involved, I feel
(22:25):
like kids need to be protected on the AVO things
like that.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
It's probably a form of you feeling ignored and that
your situation isn't serious, and you know there's not only
yourself involved, but your children are involved. This petition. More
and more people are signing it, More and more women
are signing it. I think you were saying, how many
have we have you hit ten thousand.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
I think we're almost at ten thousand.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Wow, it's amazing to see what the power of social
media can do.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
Yeah, many women have a platform where they can share
their story, and yeah, I was lucky that I have
my sister Rosie, who has a few followers online. Yeah,
when I've shared things, they've sometimes got attention. But yeah,
(23:21):
a lot of women they don't.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Have that inaccessibility to resources when they're in a household
where domestic violence is occurring and they can't just run
away or get out.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
They don't have.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Family to go to, they don't have friends to go to.
What's really interesting once my story my experience came out,
I've had so many women speak to me about their
experience and what they went through and really applauded me
for seeing the early science and really ending that relationship
before it gets too deep. I wanted to ask you,
(23:58):
were you ever able to stay with family or stay
with friends when you were going through that situation of
domestic violence with your ex partner and you having children?
Where did you go? Did you just get kicked to
the curb or did you feel like, you know, you
weren't feeling safe, you weren't feeling protected by anyone, You're
(24:20):
let alone your ex partner. So where did you go?
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Or the night that I was.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
Attack that we spoke about, Yeah, obviously police were involved
and whatever else.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Did you call a help line or anything?
Speaker 4 (24:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
So the police, you know, promised that my kids and
I would be safe, gave me, you know, the numbers
to call one a hundred respect.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
All that sort of stuff.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
I phoned one a hundred respect and let them know
the situation that we couldn't go home because at the
time he wasn't arrested straight away, so there was like
a few weeks where the police couldn't find him.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
So danger.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
Yeah, like my kids and I literally couldn't go home
because we didn't know where he was. I didn't know
you know, what he was thinking in his head, did
he want to kill me or whatever. So yeah, I
called one eight hundred respect and thought, you know, there'd
(25:34):
be all this support there for me, and yeah, literally
there was like nothing, Like I didn't get any callbacks
from anyone. My kids and I had to sleep you
know at families places which you know all my family
(25:59):
have like two bad droom apartments and things. So yeah,
adding five kind of myself and my four little ones
into tiny little places. So yeah, no callbacks, no support, nothing.
So that was another thing at the time I thought of,
(26:23):
you know, women that don't have family or friends.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
It's probably why they choose to just stay.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
Well like environment, they end up going back, yeah back.
So yeah, I was thankful that, you know, I had
my family there to help, but I just couldn't help.
But think about the women that don't because yeah, literally
there was no support, the support that's promised. Yeah, I
didn't get that. And I've heard that that happens a lot.
(26:54):
It's not just I'm not just like an isolated Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
I remember with my experience when the show came to
air and that episode came out, you know, the domestic
violence department in Mascot in Sydney reached out to me
and I had to go in and have, you know,
(27:22):
give my statement and explain my side. And obviously the
police got all the footage of what happened in our situation,
and really they they had to just brush brush it,
brushed through it because it had been flagged when it
came to air. But would they have questioned me if
(27:46):
I was a normal person going through this in an
everyday life. Maybe not. You have to be applauded for
coming out and being vulnerable and telling your story and
trying to get word out there, so things like what
happened to you don't continue happening to other women and families.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
So before I came on today, yeah, I went and
looked online at you know when you spoke about what happened,
and I looked at the comments and was really shocked
and disgusted by so many people, you know, excusing what
(28:32):
you went through and saying, you know, no, that's that's
not DV. What are you talking about? Oh that's you.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Get over a second?
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Yeah, Like I was literally like, what the hell my situation?
Like what you went through? That that is like the
start was domestic violence and can literally lead to you
know what what I went through?
Speaker 4 (28:59):
What's so many women go through.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
It's honestly been an honor to have you sit here
and have that conversation and open up about your story
because I can see it how triggered you are, and
you know, you said you have anxiety and your hands
are sweaty, and you know you're getting those flashbacks. So
I really do find you so admirable and so strong
(29:22):
to explain your story and really just I think both
of our goal is to also for me to get
more educated on domestic violence, but our goal would be
to try and help other women around us, whether that's
charitable work or signing your petition, which everyone can go
(29:44):
and sign. It's online. We will put the link in
the podcast description because we really need the government to
take this more seriously and the courts need.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
To Yeah, there needs to be so many changes.
Speaker 1 (30:00):
Thank you so much for sitting with me and telling
me your story.
Speaker 4 (30:05):
Thank you for having me. Of course, thanks
Trigger warnings, so this episode will be hard to listen
to for some people. It will be emotional, and it
will heavily discuss domestic violence, abusive partners, and how so
many women become trapped in relationships which they feel they
cannot escape, and when they do try and escape, they
feel let down by the system. In the first episode
(00:20):
of this podcast, I shared the full story of what
happened the night Paul punched the door for the first time.
Over the last few months, it feels like everyone has
shared their opinions on that night, argued about what it
was or wasn't and who was to blame. But what
I've realized is nothing that I or any woman may
say or do ever warrants their partner responding with violence.
(00:44):
Everyone may think what happened that night was just a
storyline on a TV show, a scandal in the tabloids,
and a thing for people to debate on social media,
But to me, it's none of those things. It's something
that I was the victim of, and as I was
ready to talk about in my own words in a
way that I felt comfortable, the response was overwhelming, so
(01:07):
many comments blaming me, judging me, saying get over at Karina,
but then so many messages from women saying they've been
in the position I was that night, saying how for
them it started with a punch to a door or
smashing an object, and over time, as those outbursts became
more frequent, it ended up with them being bruised, covered
(01:29):
in blood in hospital and in some cases almost losing
their lives. What happened to me was one incident and
thankfully there was no escalation, but not everybody is as lucky.
And seeing so many people saying that was not domestic
violence and I should get over it is why domestic
violence is such a problem in Australia and not taken seriously.
(01:51):
That's why I wanted to do this episode and welcome
a very brave woman who has sadly lived that life
and experienced how little incidents do esculate into the horror.
She'd then endure it for fifteen years.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Hi, my honey, this is going to be really a
deep episode. The comments on your posts on episode one,
you know, people got really I mean the comments were crazy,
like basically telling you to get over what happened, the
whole DV situation, that you're just an attention Zeeker, you
(02:27):
know that it's not really domestic violence.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
So I don't know.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
I've been like reading a few why am.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I going to cry? I'm am I going to cry.
Smile with a Notion podcast is usually so bubbly, and
you know.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
It's really bubbly and all the time, and yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
But this is a really deep and serious conversation and
topic that we're touching. One that was the first time
I've properly spoken publicly about what happens.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
How do you feel after speaking about it?
Speaker 1 (03:04):
It's been tough reading a lot of the comments and
the public's views and opinions. There's a lot of negativity
and people saying, just get over it, that happens so
long ago, move on, that's not real domestic violence. You know,
it's tough. It's really tough to read those and see
(03:25):
how people can be so harsh and quick to judge.
So I think that's why today's conversation and episode is
really important for not only myself, for you and the public.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
So I read an article in the press and it
was about rhann and Purcell. She's a mother of five
from Sydney. She's a domestic violence survivor, advocate and she
wants changed in Australia. So throughout her life, Rhannon has
unfortunately had multiple partners who were violent, and she knows
how hard it can be to leave a relationship that
(04:05):
you know, has had domestic violence in it. On average,
it takes a woman seven times to finally leave a
violent partner for good. Why am I getting I'm just
really this is like hitting something in me.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
In her last relationship, Randon knew that she had to
escape when her partner assaulted one of her children, which
is yeah, that's pretty heavy.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
So did they have children together? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Yeah, So we actually have Rhannon here today. So like
when the comments say, you know, get over it. He
just punched the door. You know. Hopefully this conversation can
show people that, you know, this is the start of
domestic violence and how further it can go. So we're
bringing Rihanna now and she can share her story with everyone.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Rihannon, thank you so much for joining myself, Jacob and
for coming on the podcast and sharing your story. I
want this to be a safe space. You know, this
is a really oh I'm getting emotional. This is a
very touchy subject and a very very kind of even
(05:21):
get my words out with how serious what my experience
was to what actually happens in the real world and
how many women go through domestic violence. Again, I've said
it in my episode with Jacob that I'm not educated
enough on domestic violence and what I went through on
(05:43):
married at First Sight was just a snippet of what
most women who go through domestic violence experience. So again,
thank you so much for joining us and telling us
your story. I'm sure it's very personal in your relationship
with was it your ex partner or your ex partner
(06:06):
at fifteen years and you had four children with him?
What were the early warning signs of him being an abuser?
Speaker 3 (06:16):
For the first year of our relationship, we I don't
even think had like a single argument. And then yeah,
it just slowly, slowly happens. So you know, it'll be
with jealousy saying you know, you can't go here, you
(06:38):
can't go there, controlling what clothes you might wear. Then
it might be like, you know, breaking your phone or
not allowing you to have social media, or you know,
punching a wall or pushing you, and then it just
progresses over the years and at the time time you
(07:00):
don't really know that it's even happening.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Because it's a is it a fight or is it
a conversation? Is it just an argument with one another?
And then it turns into.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
Well it can be anything really, so like abuses usually
will slowly eat away your confidence, you know, make you
feel like you won't be able to find anyone else,
you're not good enough, things like that.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Were you ever told to just get over certain things
and that it's normal behavior or was he a deflector
was it more verbal or side of verbal? And then
it got more physical?
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Yeah, yeah, okay, and then yeah, in the end it
was just pretty much yeah, all types of abuse happening.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
You know, when Paul and I were getting into that
argument after our night out, and my point of view
of the argument was that I was apologizing for saying
what I said for then him to get reactive, and
what he wasn't happy about was I was trying to
(08:14):
explain my reasoning for that comment and under trying to
understand our boundaries. But he was making me feel like
it was my fault and that I shouldn't have said
that and I shouldn't have spoken about my past relationship
or brought that in. And a lot of people can
maybe agree with that, but you know where I was
(08:35):
coming from in that moment of time, was that but
you were so okay talking about swingers and being open
about your past sex life. But then when I bring
mine up, that's an issue, right, So and I then
felt guilty and then I was like, Okay, I'm in
the wrong. I'm so sorry, and I kept apologizing. Did
(08:56):
your ex partner make you feel like you were in
a position, in a vulnerable place where you had to
apologize and you were kind of feeling guilty trying to
be I guess yourself.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
I know exactly what you've described. I'd always go through. Yeah,
everything was just always my fault. His reaction was always
because of something I had done. So yeah, that's really
really common things. Yeah happened.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
You always felt like you were in the wrong.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
You were and I did find myself apologizing a lot
like you said you did.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, And I think for a lot of people out
there that experience, even just a minimal, like a minuscule
of abuse is like the biggest sign of what could
be if you stay in that relationship longer. Like, did
you notice any red flags or did you just at
(09:56):
the beginning, or were you just like in love in
lust and you loved the person so much because you
were so happy in that relationship, or did you know
that it was deep down in your gut that it
wasn't right for you and it was quite toxic behavior?
Speaker 3 (10:09):
As a child, I grew up witnessing domestic violence in
the home, right, So I do often wonder.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Like why did I stay? Or Yeah, But I don't know.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
I think possibly I saw like I'd never seen a
normal relationship, So I don't know whether I just thought
that was normal or that was love.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
But yeah, was there an incident that occurred where you
realized that wasn't normal behavior?
Speaker 4 (10:44):
When my son was.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Assaulted by his dad, I knew at that point that,
you know, I could kind of deal with myself getting hurt,
but when my kids, we're now the target, and that
was like I couldn't handle stuff like that.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
And then in the ABC newsiety called there's clear evidence
of you being physically abused.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Yeah, photos because he had my three year old twins
with him, and so we'd had an argument about him.
He'd said he was going to drop them off to me,
but he decided he wasn't going to and I had
to go and pick them up. So on the way there,
(11:33):
we had the argument. I was like threatened basically on
the phone, but I knew that I had to still
go and pick up my little girls. So I drove there,
even though I had a really terrible feeling that I
was going to be assaulted when I got there. And
(11:57):
when I got there, he came out of the house
and walked out with my little girls. And as he
walked outside, he turned the lights off.
Speaker 4 (12:10):
And straightway.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
You know, I knew that he obviously probably done that
for a reason because he knew he was about to
attack me. So my little girls got in the back. Yeah,
they were like three at the time, and.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
He sorry, he have some water if you need, Yeah,
take your time.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
Yeah, it's more just the fact that my kids had
to see that. That's what.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
I don't think any any woman should go through that.
And it's so fortunate that you were in that position
and that environment, and all you wanted was the safety
of your children and but also giving the father time
to see his kids. So you were again being an amazing,
nice human and a mother and this is what's happened
(13:10):
to you.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
So, yeah, he got in. My twins got in the
back seat of the car and he sat down in
the front passenger seat and just started saying, Oh, who
are you to talk to me like that, like obviously
(13:32):
really aggressively, and I was just like I'm sorry, I'm sorry,
like I'm sorry, and I had my phone in my hand,
and I don't know whether he thought I was recording
him or what, but he snatched the phone off me.
And at that point I was like, oh my god,
(13:52):
I need to get out of this car, like he's
going to attack me. So I went to get out
of the car, like open the door, and I turned
my head and then that's when I felt like a
blow to my head. Yeah, I continued to get out
of the car, and he also got out of the
car and started chasing me. So I'm screaming. At this point,
(14:18):
my little girls are screaming. They've gotten out of the
car and they're just standing on the side of the
road watching. Yeah, their dad like chase their mum while
she's screaming.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
And Yeah, he.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Pushed me to the ground and was kicking me hollow
I was on the ground and yeah, I actually thought
like I might die. So his family actually came running
out and helped pull him off me, and then I
(15:03):
saw a car coming driving down towards me, and then
when the car pulled over, it was actually one of
his family members in the car. She said like jump in,
jump in, and took me away from him, because I
think she was even worried that, like, you know, what
he might do. So I'm down the street around the corner,
(15:29):
kind of hiding from him. He was on parole at
the time, so obviously knew that, you know, he was
going to be in a lot of trouble. So he,
from what I understand, took like he left and so, yeah,
(15:54):
I'm around the corner. I don't he'd taken my phone
and smashed it on the road, so I didn't have
my phone. I used the family member's phone to call.
I think I called my sister Rosie or Taylor. I
knew the number off by heart, and I let them
know what had happened. But then I was like, oh
(16:16):
my god, like my twins. They're back at the at
the house, so I was like, please.
Speaker 4 (16:22):
Just take me back.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
So I went back and they were obviously they're really distraught,
and I had the family trying to get me to
go inside and clean up my face. And get all sorted,
and I just thought to myself, like why, Like I
(16:44):
felt like they were trying to like cover up or.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
You know, under the road.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Yeah, so I refuse.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
I was like, no, that's fine, I'm going home, like,
and I got my girls in the car, I got
back in the cars how to driving. And yeah, at
the time, I didn't realize like how bad my injuries were.
But I think it's just all the adrenaline and everything
(17:12):
at the time, you know, you don't kind of realize.
But as I was driving, I could feel like warm,
something warm and wet dripping down and yeah, I ended
up like I looked down and I was just all
covered in blood.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
Yeah, and I had like a four centimeter laceration on
the side of my head that I needed staple back together.
And yeah, as I was I drove home, I think
it was about a twenty minute drive with just like
blood dripping down.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:50):
So I end up in hospital and then yeah, so I.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Questioned and say, where how did this?
Speaker 4 (17:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (17:57):
Yeah, so I got home. All my family had kind
of rushed to my house by that stage, and I, yeah,
it was in shock, like I I could barely talk. Yeah,
just was really traumatized. My kids were like, oh my gosh,
(18:21):
because my other two kids weren't there at the time.
But imagine like me getting out of the car and
just yeah, I literally looked like I was like in
a horror movie or something. So all the kids were
just like crying, and you know, they didn't know if
I was going to die. Yeah, it was really really.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
That glimpse for your children is so detrimental for their future,
which is just so unfortunate situation and everything that you
went through. Why did he get let out of jail?
Did the police not think key, like the domestic unit
did not think that.
Speaker 4 (19:03):
He was He was given.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
A nine month prison sentence, where he had to serve
a minimum of four months. Yeah. I feel like the
sentence that was given for the assault was just not enough,
like absolutely disgusting long enough.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
And yet he was able to see your children. Yeah,
does he have any form of custody to have? No, Okay,
but you can see them, but he can't see you.
Is that what the AVO is all about?
Speaker 4 (19:37):
Pretty much? Yes?
Speaker 3 (19:39):
So I the magistrate keeps removing the children from the
av oh every time it goes before the court, so
they'll leave me on their but they'll remove the kids.
But yeah, obviously, because there was violence comitted in front
(20:00):
of children. I had community services involved and they they
didn't want him. They don't want him to have contact
with the kids unless he's done like men's behavior change
courses or domestic valance courses.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Or whatever like rehabilitation, community service. Ye did he do
any of that, So he's breaching that as well.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
Well, it wasn't court ordered, it was just their opinion.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
He then started a petition called Protect Women and Children
Demand for Stronger Domestic Violence Laws and Penalties or because
he was, you know, not proceeding with the av o,
or you feel that the government need to implement stronger
penalties for these situations so you feel safe as a
(20:58):
woman and your children. You don't want any contact with him,
you don't want him to be around. So how so
is that why you started the petition?
Speaker 3 (21:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (21:10):
I just feel like, do you think the government's failed.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
Yeah, definitely as a human and as a woman, they've
failed me and my kids, and also thousands and thousands
of women all over Australia. Like, since my story has
been out in the media and I've started the petition,
I've had so many women message me with their stories
(21:40):
and yeah, letting me know the failures of the police
and the courts in their situation as well. So it's
not an isolated thing. It's like just everywhere like so many,
there's thousands of women. So yeah, I just feel like
(22:02):
there's a whole failure in the system, like just it
needs a whole overhaul. So that's what my petition is about.
It's about harsher penalties when there's kids involved, I feel
(22:25):
like kids need to be protected on the AVO things
like that.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
It's probably a form of you feeling ignored and that
your situation isn't serious, and you know there's not only
yourself involved, but your children are involved. This petition. More
and more people are signing it, More and more women
are signing it. I think you were saying, how many
have we have you hit ten thousand.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
I think we're almost at ten thousand.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Wow, it's amazing to see what the power of social
media can do.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
Yeah, many women have a platform where they can share
their story, and yeah, I was lucky that I have
my sister Rosie, who has a few followers online. Yeah,
when I've shared things, they've sometimes got attention. But yeah,
(23:21):
a lot of women they don't.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Have that inaccessibility to resources when they're in a household
where domestic violence is occurring and they can't just run
away or get out.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
They don't have.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Family to go to, they don't have friends to go to.
What's really interesting once my story my experience came out,
I've had so many women speak to me about their
experience and what they went through and really applauded me
for seeing the early science and really ending that relationship
before it gets too deep. I wanted to ask you,
(23:58):
were you ever able to stay with family or stay
with friends when you were going through that situation of
domestic violence with your ex partner and you having children?
Where did you go? Did you just get kicked to
the curb or did you feel like, you know, you
weren't feeling safe, you weren't feeling protected by anyone, You're
(24:20):
let alone your ex partner. So where did you go?
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Or the night that I was.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
Attack that we spoke about, Yeah, obviously police were involved
and whatever else.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Did you call a help line or anything?
Speaker 4 (24:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
So the police, you know, promised that my kids and
I would be safe, gave me, you know, the numbers
to call one a hundred respect.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
All that sort of stuff.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
I phoned one a hundred respect and let them know
the situation that we couldn't go home because at the
time he wasn't arrested straight away, so there was like
a few weeks where the police couldn't find him.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
So danger.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
Yeah, like my kids and I literally couldn't go home
because we didn't know where he was. I didn't know
you know, what he was thinking in his head, did
he want to kill me or whatever. So yeah, I
called one eight hundred respect and thought, you know, there'd
(25:34):
be all this support there for me, and yeah, literally
there was like nothing, Like I didn't get any callbacks
from anyone. My kids and I had to sleep you
know at families places which you know all my family
(25:59):
have like two bad droom apartments and things. So yeah,
adding five kind of myself and my four little ones
into tiny little places. So yeah, no callbacks, no support, nothing.
So that was another thing at the time I thought of,
(26:23):
you know, women that don't have family or friends.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
It's probably why they choose to just stay.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
Well like environment, they end up going back, yeah back.
So yeah, I was thankful that, you know, I had
my family there to help, but I just couldn't help.
But think about the women that don't because yeah, literally
there was no support, the support that's promised. Yeah, I
didn't get that. And I've heard that that happens a lot.
(26:54):
It's not just I'm not just like an isolated Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
I remember with my experience when the show came to
air and that episode came out, you know, the domestic
violence department in Mascot in Sydney reached out to me
and I had to go in and have, you know,
(27:22):
give my statement and explain my side. And obviously the
police got all the footage of what happened in our situation,
and really they they had to just brush brush it,
brushed through it because it had been flagged when it
came to air. But would they have questioned me if
(27:46):
I was a normal person going through this in an
everyday life. Maybe not. You have to be applauded for
coming out and being vulnerable and telling your story and
trying to get word out there, so things like what
happened to you don't continue happening to other women and families.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
So before I came on today, yeah, I went and
looked online at you know when you spoke about what happened,
and I looked at the comments and was really shocked
and disgusted by so many people, you know, excusing what
(28:32):
you went through and saying, you know, no, that's that's
not DV. What are you talking about? Oh that's you.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Get over a second?
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Yeah, Like I was literally like, what the hell my situation?
Like what you went through? That that is like the
start was domestic violence and can literally lead to you
know what what I went through?
Speaker 4 (28:59):
What's so many women go through.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
It's honestly been an honor to have you sit here
and have that conversation and open up about your story
because I can see it how triggered you are, and
you know, you said you have anxiety and your hands
are sweaty, and you know you're getting those flashbacks. So
I really do find you so admirable and so strong
(29:22):
to explain your story and really just I think both
of our goal is to also for me to get
more educated on domestic violence, but our goal would be
to try and help other women around us, whether that's
charitable work or signing your petition, which everyone can go
(29:44):
and sign. It's online. We will put the link in
the podcast description because we really need the government to
take this more seriously and the courts need.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
To Yeah, there needs to be so many changes.
Speaker 1 (30:00):
Thank you so much for sitting with me and telling
me your story.
Speaker 4 (30:05):
Thank you for having me. Of course, thanks
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