November 16, 2021 • 41 mins
Sudden Impact’s producer Tim Byrd has entered the chat. He and lead singer Aaron Kane continue the story of the group, through record label mishaps, internal strife, and a changing music scene. Plus, a deeper dive into the ways our culture evolved during the Sudden Impact years.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
I don't know it was meant to happen. You know
what I'm saying, We weren't meant to have that success
at that time because I think that I think we
wouldn't have been able to hand it.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
That is Tim Bird. He wrote and produced music with
Sudden Impact, the lost boy band I'm trying to find.
He was so integral to their sound. Some people call
him the sixth member of Sudden Impact. I've gotten his
contact info from Aaron Kane, the lead singer of the group,
and I'm getting the Sudden Impact story from his perspective,
and right away I get a brand new piece of information.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
They start a group called Too Special first before they
became set an Impact.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Too Special, Yes what I'm saying, too number two to
oh yeah, okay, Too Special. This is a group who's
had a lot of ups and downs, a lot of
record labels and a lot of getting dropped from record labels,
and as you're about to find out, they've also had
a lot of names. In this episode, we'll hear more
of the Sudden Impact story from producer Tim Bird and
(01:01):
lead singer Aaron Kane. This is Waiting for Impact, a
Dave Holmes passion project when we left off in the
(01:27):
last episode, I was trying to get Noel Kane's contact
info from his brother Aaron finally did get it. I
have reached out and as of yet, I have not
heard anything back. But in the meantime, there's another name
to add to the list of names that this group
has had. Too Special became Sudden Impact, which became White Guys.
And not to spoil anything, but that list of names
(01:49):
is going to get longer. More on that later, but
for now, tell me how you came to work with
Sudden Impact.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah, we all went to high school together. Was that
I was in a group at the time. We were
performing original songs and one of the members of Sudden Impact, well,
they became such a bat, Todd White.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
He wanted to start a group like New Kids on
the Block.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It's nineteen eighty nine as this story begins. Bobby Brown's
Don't Be Cruel is the number one album of the year.
Mariah Carey is recording her debut album. The Rolling Stones
are out on their Steel Wheels Comeback Tour. Will Smith
beats JJ FADD and Cool Mo d to win the
first ever Best Rap Performance Grammy for Parents. Just Don't understand,
(02:32):
and he meets with Quincy Jones to develop NBC's The
Fresh Prince of bel Air. Tim Bird joins Too Special
as the group's unofficial producer, and here in the present
he confirms the wildest part of the story.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
So they're out in LA and they're calling us, Hey,
we just ranted the heavy d. Hey he's randed Stevie
wonder we thought they were lying. And then they had
their poster, the two Special poster, right yeah, And they
run into BIV.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
There's like Michael Bibbins.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
They say, uh, bib our poster and Biff told him
get that out of my face. Well, was something, you know,
curse first behind it. Get that out of my face.
I'm not signing that bleep. And he thought it was
you can swear feeling.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
He thought it was a poster of new Kids on
the Block, because remember there was a rivalry between New
Audition and New Kids on the Block, right Sead back
in this day, right. So Todd told him said, look, no,
we're a new group.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
We're stuck out here in LA.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
We have no way to get back home, but would
you please sign this poster?
Speaker 3 (03:29):
So he signed it. He said a new group. Huh,
all right, I'm.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Here's some money for a ticket, plane ticket. I'm gonna
send you out back to Virginia and wait for a
call for me in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
So, okay, Aaron told me that I didn't one percent
believe it. This is actually how it happened. He just
saw the picture.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Mm hmm, he just saw the pictures.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Do you do you think that that rivalry between New
Edition and New Kids on the Block had anything to
do with why he wanted to sign them.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yes, I think so.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
Nobody else believes it, but I think so. Okay, I
think it was like get back, Yeah, yeah, I mean,
and plus it's a lot of money because New Kids
on the Box they they made a billion dollars.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Off of merchandise Alon, right, right, So I think it
was that.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
Okay, So what happens next?
Speaker 1 (04:18):
What happens next? He calls us in a couple of weeks.
We didn't believe them even they came back from La
Yeah whatever, whatever. Me just working on songs and just
playing around, and Michael Bivens calls the house and we're talking.
He said, guys, I'm gonna sign you. Guys, I'm gonna
send the contracts. They'll be out there by FedEx. They
we all got the contracts, signed them as artists, signed
(04:39):
me as a producer, and changed their name to Sudden Impact.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Right, and why did he change that name?
Speaker 3 (04:47):
He liked the movie Clint Eastwood movie.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Okay, Sudden Impact was a big movie. It's the one
that gave the culture go ahead, make my day. I
was hoping for a better story there, but I will
take that one. So Sudden Impact all signed their contracts.
Tim Bird signs his and goes from being the unofficial
producer to the official producer, and they all plan to
get busy recording, but before they do, they get their
(05:10):
big break.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
And the rest is then they came back and ended
up in the Motown Philly video. Right, that was during
that same time they end up in the Motown Philly video.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
So by the time they were in the Motown Philly video,
had had you recorded anything officially for Michael Bibbins yet?
Speaker 1 (05:31):
We had just started Well, actually he hadn't heard it yet,
that's right, that's right. They didn't have They didn't have
a finished demo that we could send some because everything
was moving so fast.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
So they're in the video but they don't have a
song yet.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
No, not yet.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Sudden Impact has gotten a major leg up. The video
is on rotation on all the big music video networks.
People around the country are seeing it over and over
and they're waiting to hear music from Sudden Impact. The
pressure is on. How did that feel for all of
you getting that kind of boost? How did that feel?
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Oh? I felt I felt great?
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yeah, yeah, I felt like, this is my chance to
be Michael Jackson.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
But you know, be famous and all that. But what happens.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
I ended up leaving my group to focus solely on
Sudden Impact.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
What was your band called So Suave? So Suave is
an awesome name. But this is the point in the
story when the group that had been called Too Special
and later was called Sudden Impact is about to be
called something new.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
After Motown Philly video came out, That's when Bibb started
marketing and finding other art artists to come into the
fold of the East Coast Family. Right then and there,
when he formed the East Coast Family, he changed Sudden.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
Impact to the White Guys.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Now why because whenever he would do interviews or boys
and men would do interviews instead of asking questions about
Michael Bivens BBD or boys to men, they would say, Hey, whatever.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Happened to them? White guys? There's the video? Yeah and
so yeah, so big, change the name.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Change the name to white guys.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
It's spelt like wit gizzies though.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Yeah, yeah, I've seen them. I've seen them in the
video for one for all for one. Yes, where they
are it's w h yt g I z E.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
How did you and how did the guys feel about
changing your name? For another time?
Speaker 3 (07:28):
Didn't care. We were with Michael Bivens, So.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Let's talk about Michael Bivens. I would love to talk
to Michael Bivins, but so far he hasn't gotten back
to me. I've asked I vete Nicole Brown to put
in a good word for me, because they're still close friends,
and she has, but so far nothing. I've been thinking
about it a lot, and I wonder whether he's worried
that he is going to be the villain of the story.
And I wonder whether that worries a Vet now that
(07:52):
she's involved with the show. And if that's the case,
I would understand his concern and hers, wouldn't you. I mean,
what if somebody came up to you right now and said,
I just heard an amazing story about you. How would
you feel You'd be a little concerned for a minute,
wouldn't you? Then? What if that person told you I'm
making a ten episode podcast series about that story. I'm
(08:13):
talking to all kinds of people who know you in
conversations that you won't be able to hear until the
show comes out. I get it. That has got to
be a scary thing to hear. If it were happening
to me, I probably wouldn't want to be involved either.
But a couple things. One, I am not interested in
assassinating anyone's character, or making a chump out of anyone,
or ruining anyone's reputation unless their kid Rock because I
(08:36):
hate that guy. Interesting stories usually don't have clear cut villains.
And I'm not interested in telling a boring story or
an easy one. This is a complicated story where everyone
so far is just doing their best. And Two, no
matter how the biv ten project turned out, it started
in the first place because of a trait of Bivins
that I admire, one that I think is worth celebrating ambition.
(09:00):
The biv ten project wasn't what he hoped it would be,
but that doesn't mean it was a bad thing. It
wasn't the success that he envisioned, but that doesn't make
it a failure. And most importantly, though he couldn't deliver
to his artists the fame and fortune that he may
have implicitly or explicitly promised them, he didn't leave them
with nothing. Life doesn't work in binaries like that. The
(09:21):
people I've spoken to so far are mostly not rich
and mostly not famous, but they are all better off
for having known and worked with Michael Biffins, and they
know it. Even if their relationship is strained, they all
still respect and admire the guy. Tim Bird puts it, well,
what do you think Michael Bivins thinks of the whole
BIV ten experience?
Speaker 3 (09:40):
I don't know. Good questions.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
I don't speculate, though, but I don't know. I think
he thought it was a success, and yeah, think about it,
he was the first puppy. What puppy ended up doing?
BIV did it first. Yeah, so I don't know what.
I don't know if those things behind the scenes that
went on that we weren't privy to, but I'm pretty
sure he should be He should be pat hisself from
(10:03):
the back.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
Back to the saga of Sudden Impact. Who I guess
we should now start calling White Guys. What was the
sound of White.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Guys, Salman? White Guys?
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Was?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
I would say it was pop?
Speaker 1 (10:27):
It wasn't as poppy as in Sync or just that.
And you know a little more soul to it, Okay,
you know a little more so a little more like uh,
a soulful group, like closely like what boys.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Thement was doing. Gotcha, Yeah, that's exactly they had. We
evolved over the years.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Though, and they had the time to evolve to catch
us up. Michael Bivens signed a group called Two Special
to his three artist production deal at Motown, then change
their name to Sudden Impact because he liked the Cline
Eastwood movie. Then signed Sudden Impact to Capitol Records, then
put Sudden Impact in Boys to Men's debut video, then
pulled them off Capitol Records to sign them to his
own label, biv ten Records, a division of Motown, then
(11:06):
changed their name again to White Guys. There's a lot
of activity going on around this project, and once again,
Michael Bivens still has not heard a single song. What
then happens with white guys. Do you end up in
the studio at all?
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Well, we started, we had built our own studio at
Todd's house, so we were always recorded at home, so
every day we would have songs. And at that time
there was something going on between I think Boys.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
To Men and Michael Bivens. Not sure.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Let's dig into that a little bit. Boys to Men's
debut album, Coolly High Harmony, was executive produced by Michael Bivens,
and it was a big success. It sold nine million copies.
It had hits like Motown Philly and It's So Hard
to Say Goodbye to Yesterday, which would play at high
school graduation parties for years to come. Boys to Men
were on their way. In nineteen ninety two, they went
(11:57):
into the studio with Babyface, one of the most successful
R and B songwriters and producers of all time. They
recorded a song for the soundtrack of the Eddie Murphy
halle Berry romantic comedy Boomerang. That song was called End
of the Road. It was a smash. It went to
(12:22):
number one and stayed there for thirteen weeks, tying the
record set by Whitney Houston's I Will Always Love You.
Boys to Men really leveled up with End of the Road.
Their second album had the single I'll Make Love to You,
which broke Whitney Houston and Boys to Men's own record
by staying at number one for fourteen weeks. That album
sold twenty million copies. And I don't know why this is,
(12:46):
and it's not really pertinent to the sudden impact story,
and maybe it's part of what he doesn't want to
talk about anymore. But Michael Bivens isn't listed in the
credits for that second Boys to Men album anywhere.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Because this round about the time when there's second Boys
and Men's second album came out and sold like twenty
something million copies, and so things started slowing up. I
really don't understand. I can't really speak on why things
started slowing up when we knowsed it, but we still
kept working. We would call Michael and I'm asking, when's
the next time you gonna call chet send us out
(13:18):
to la or put us in the studio, And sometimes
we would get a call and sometimes not. He would
say that I'm working on something for y'all right now.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
Then we finally got in touch with them.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
He said, look, I'm gonna let you all go from
your contracts, blah blah. So we're getting more seasoned with
writing songs and producing songs, so every day we would
build our studio.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Listen to what he does there. Tim Bird is talking
about being let go from BIV ten Records, a massive disappointment,
and he just glides right past it. A three year
journey of high hopes, major labels, big expectations of pop
stardom gets dashed in a single phone call, and Tim
doesn't dwell on it for a second in his memory.
The guys just get right back to work. That is
(14:00):
called resilience, and that resilience is going to serve them
well in this next chapter.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
And so I think it was like a year or
two later, or this was in ninety five when everything
just went crazy.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
So it's nineteen ninety five. Hoody in the Blowfish's Cracked
Rear View is the number one album of the year.
Mariah Carey sells twenty million copies of her album Daydream.
The Rolling Stones are on their Voodoo Lounge comeback tour.
Coolio wins Best Rap Performance for Gangster's Paradise, while Will
Smith finishes the entire run of Fresh Prince of bel
(14:32):
Air and moves on to Independence Day. I'm going to
bring Aaron Kane back into the mix now and let
the two of them tell you what happened next. And
as a heads up, he's going to name some new
jack swing artists from the nineties who if you don't
know them, you will want to look them up.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
So now here we are in Newport News, sitting there
and don't have no deal. Don't have no deal. We're
I mean, we're constantly working on demos, and so we
know that Teddy Riley is in Virginia Beach. Teddy Riley
(15:08):
had the Future Studios in Virginia Beach where Michael Jackson
recorded dangerous albums.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
Guys is popping, Guys.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
Is doing their stuff there, Black Streets down there, Black
Street is doing crazy stuff.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Guy and Black Street. If you are hearing those names
for the first time right now, look him up. Listen
to Let's Chill or Before I Let You Go or
Groove Me. You can thank me later. Teddy Riley is
a member of both of those groups and he's their
producer and he is really having a moment as he
heard Michael Jackson is working with him. That is the
ultimate seal of approval. At the time, white guys are
(15:49):
looking for a label, for a manager, for anything, so
they do what's worked before. They put themselves in front
of a very important person and they ask.
Speaker 5 (15:57):
I think maybe Tim A todb went up there.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
They they contacted somebody going into the Future Studios and
it ends up being a guy named Leon Silver's the Third.
I don't know if you remember a group from the
Silvers back in the seventies.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Yeah as Wyle, right, yes, yeah yeah. Are they Hotline?
Yes Hot Yeah? Okay, yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:27):
Well Leon is like Leon Silver's the Third. He is
a great producer, great songwriter. He actually did Janet Jackson's
first album. Well at the time, he was at Future
Studios working with Teddy Riley on some stuff. He actually
(16:48):
did before I Let You Go by Black Street, Before
You Go.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
Can I Get Good Nun? He he did that.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I love these musical interludes.
Speaker 4 (17:06):
That's one of my favorite songs of all time. I
love that song, Dave Hollister saying that. But anyway, so
I think the story is is that Tim walked into
Future Studios one time and ran into Leon and had
(17:28):
a conversation with him, maybe gave him a demo tape
or whatever. He heard some of our stuff and he
was like, guys, why don't you guys come by my
house and start recording with me. Now, at the time,
I'm twenty one, twenty two. I don't know who the
(17:49):
hell Leon Silvers is, you know, I don't know who yet.
He's just some old guy. Would dreads to me, and
I say old. He was probably his forties at the time.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
And like any good old guy in his forties, Leon
Silver's the third ran a tight ship.
Speaker 5 (18:07):
We go to his house every day. We would get up.
Speaker 4 (18:11):
He was an early bird, and we would get up
at like six seven o'clock in the morning, be at
his house in the morning at eight o'clock in the morning,
and record at his house on reel to reel. He
had real to reel. That's what we were recording.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
That's standard old guy behavior. The guys write four more
songs and record demos for them, and because they're not
on a label anymore, not getting a stipend or weekend
trips to Disney World, they're having to figure out how
to feed themselves. How are you earning money during all
of this?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
I got a regular job. Yeah, Aaron and them Aaron them.
They got jobs. Everybody got jobs. And then whenever we
would finish work, we will always go to the studio.
So it was like work, work, work, work. We would
stay in the studio. So even if I had to
be at work at nine o'clock in the morning, stand
a studio till six o'clock in the morning and still
at least get an our sleep to go to work.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
What was work at that time?
Speaker 3 (19:07):
It was? What was that time? It was sprint.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Tim is working at a Sprint store. And meanwhile Boys
to Men are blowing up. As I told you, End
of the Road goes to number one and stays there
for thirteen weeks. I'll Make Love to You, from their
second album, stays at number one for fourteen weeks until
it gets replaced by On Bendney, another Boys to Men's song,
Boys to Men Are Dominating, and Tommy Montola, the CEO
(19:32):
of Columbia Records and husband of Mariah Carey, makes Boys
to Men the same kind of deal Motown once gave
to Michael Bivens.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
Tommy Bettola said, listen, guys, if you guys do a
song with Mariah, I'll give you your own label deal. Right,
So they did the song you Know Went to the Moon.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
The song Boys to Men do with Mariah Carey is
called One Sweet Day. It goes to number one and
stays there for sixteen weeks. They have now broken their
own record for longest running number one single twice, and
(20:13):
this third record stands until Old Town Road breaks it
nearly twenty five years later.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
So they got their own label deal off of that
song called Stone Creek Records Sudden Impact.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Who I should be calling white guys right now? And
I keep trying, but I guess my body doesn't want
to have a pre existing relationship with Boys to Men
having been in their debut video. So once again they
go on a road trip to try to get some attention,
but this time they have songs.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
It was Aaron Nole and Todd went to Richmond, Virginia
to see Boys the Men and Jodasy perform do that concert,
and they ran into Mike McCarey, the one who left
Boys the Men, the one with the back problems, the
bass voice.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
They ran into him at the arena.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
And we had the demos at that We had all
of our songs on tape, and they were really good
because we were halfway working with Teddy Riley too a
little bit indirectly, yep, indirectly, And so Mike McCarey heard
the songs, He's like, we're about to start our own
label called Stone Creek. Won't you guys come sign with us?
(21:19):
And that's how we got the Stone Creek.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
So now here we are in another label situation, and
Stone Creek is a part of Sony Records. So now
Boys of Men moves us up to Philly. That's how
I'm in the spot where I'm at now in Jersey.
In ninety seven, they move us up to Philadelphia, put
(21:43):
us up in this amazing apartment complex in Germantown, Philadelphia.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Big apartment.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
It was like the apartment was sort of like you
and the TV showed different strokes. Yeah, yeah, the house
but without the stairs. But that's how big it was. Yeah,
we all, all six of us, stayed there for two
years and we banged out songs. Because Boys Men ended
up buying Will Smith's old studio in Gladwin, Pennsylvania.
Speaker 5 (22:12):
So they signed us, and they signed another artist. His
name is Uncle Sam. Oh no, if you know who
Uncle Sam is.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
We're fresh my memory. That sounds sort of familiar.
Speaker 5 (22:24):
I Don't Never Want to See You?
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yes, Uncle Sam's I Don't Ever Want to See You
Again went to number six on the Billboard charts. And
I love it when Aaron Kine sings to me. So
the guys are on their third label. They're finally getting
to work on an album in a world where R
and B vocal groups are selling crazy amounts of CDs.
They start to work even harder. And this is the
mid nineties by now, so I have to ask, is
(22:51):
there choreography?
Speaker 4 (22:52):
It's funny that you say that, because that was a
problem for us.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Really.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
Everybody wanted us to be dancers and be dancers like
new kids on the block and new addition, and we
just weren't into the dance. And man, we just like
that wasn't something that we were passionate about. You know,
like we didn't want to dance. We just wanted to
(23:22):
record songs, sing songs and come out and sing to
the latens like that. That's what we wanted to do.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
Some dancing was expected, it was.
Speaker 4 (23:35):
It was at that time, and everybody was like, come on, guys,
you guys got to dance.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
With Stone Creek Records, the guys get a new start
a new attitude and a new name.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
Another name change. Yes, this is crazy Yanye from Boys
to Men.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
He liked the way they look, and plus he was
a fan of the movie The Outsiders, and he said,
you know what we should call you, Guys to Outsiders, said,
I just got finished watching the movie the other day,
he said, Plus, some of y'all looked like one of
the characters and the Alzheizers Ciders. So we're going to
give each one of y'all the same nickname, pony Boy all.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
This that young. Yeah, that was a great idea.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
So Too Special became Sudden Impact, which became White Guys,
which became the Outsiders. It's hard enough to get any
kind of momentum going in the music industry without your
name changing every five minutes. But the guys keep pushing forward.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
So anyway, so we're recording at Sony and Boys of
Men ends up putting out Uncle Sam first. So here
we get bumped again and Dave, are songs.
Speaker 5 (24:43):
That we were recording there.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
We had actually some songs with boys and men singing,
some backgrounds with us, and I mean the songs that
we were doing there were just beautiful, beautiful songs and
they choose to put out I don't never want to
see you again. Uncle Sam put his album out. They
put Uncle Sam's album out, and guess what happens after that?
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Oh, you actually want me to guess?
Speaker 3 (25:11):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Did they drop you?
Speaker 5 (25:13):
The label goes under?
Speaker 4 (25:15):
Oh god, Tommy Battola ends up dropping Stone Creek after
the Uncle Sam album comes out.
Speaker 5 (25:25):
So here we are again.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
Now we've just been through all of this and here
we are again with no record deal again.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
So how can that be? He's the boys de Man
m Riah Carey have the longest running number one of
all time up to that time, right right, huge, So
they've got they've done, end of the road. They've done.
I mean, they're they're huge. They get offered a label deal,
they signed two people. Was it just Tommy Mottola saying
(25:58):
like I gave you what I said I was gonna
ge you and now I don't want to pay attention
to this anymore or what happened?
Speaker 4 (26:03):
I think I think it was something internal that that
we really don't know about. I think it's something internal
between Poison Men and Tommy Mattola.
Speaker 5 (26:15):
That's what I think.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
I couldn't believe the phone call when we got the
phone call that the label is folding, and now you
guys got to go back to Virginia again. I mean,
we were just devastating Stone Creek.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
The whole label just straight up folds. The guys are
back to square one yet again. But at least this
time they've made some proper recordings. What happened to the
music that was recorded for Stone Creek?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
We still got it, Yeah, yeah, we still got it.
It's kind of dated though, but yeah, we still got it.
I remember, because remember, you gotta understand this one thing.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
A lot of people don't remember.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Sun Impact was supposed to be the next new kids
on the block.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
So with all these.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Deals we were going through in between, that left it
all open for back Street Boys and and Sync you know,
to come through. So we weren't trying to be like them.
We were trying to be a little more edgy. I'll say,
like a comparison between Jodasy and Boys to Men, you
know what I mean, a little more edgy.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
So at least they still have their music from back then.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
Kind of the songs are on four Match that I
really can't transfer because I don't have the machines for
them anymore, which really sucks.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Yeah, so they're just sitting there in a hard drive.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Yeah, not even a hard drive will tape, Oh my god.
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Them studio tapes, you know, like even whenever people are
doing radio, the little small little tapes that you put
in Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah a a's or whatever
you used to call it.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah, there's almost nothing you can do with that.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
Anymore now unless that I can hold it up to
the light and see if I can see the music notes.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
But other than that, yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
So the frustration of that never coming out. Did that
Did you see that wearing on on them? On yourself?
Speaker 1 (28:02):
No?
Speaker 3 (28:02):
I think I don't think.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
I know.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
I didn't feel that way. I was just too determined.
I knew a couple of the guys were determined. I
think that I say Alan and Todd, who were like
the closest, they were also determined. Aaron and No they
were determined, but they were just they just wanted to
move on for something else. But they still was determined
to do music. But it was frustrating. We did a
(28:27):
lot of songs with boys, the men, went to a
lot of parties, and then in nineteen ninety seven it
all stop.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
So Sudden Impact got signed at the time of New
Kids on the Block. They kept writing and recording demos
through the years when a boy band was pop music
poison and then parted ways at the exact moment boy
bands became big again with the right label. With any
consistent label or name, they could have had their moment.
The timing was just always exactly off. So what does
(28:56):
that feel like?
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Like a letdown? I said, we're going to find something else,
you know, and went home.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
And that's when we started having that being upset at
each other because everybody wanted to control everything because we
had gotten better with recording writing songs. So what I
want to write too? I want to write too. And
the majority of the writing was me and me and Todd.
We were like Leonard and McCartney. We were throwing them
(29:24):
out and so we started writing, and then everybody would
get frustrated because one didn't want to come to the
studio anymore, or somebody girlfriend they had to go see them,
or just had to focus.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
Was starting to wane a little bit.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
And I think what happened Aaron Aaron and Know they
wanted to do darker songs than what we were doing,
you know, sort of like a jobasy and this, that
and the other. So one time we had a meeting
and Aaron and Knows said we're going to start our
own band.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Yeah, No Love Loss.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
The Cane Brothers split off to start another vocal group
with their friend Donnie Evans, which they called DNA for
Donnie Noel Aaron the Outsiders fill the open positions with
two new guys, Jimmy Marble and Jason Dowdy. And he
won't be surprised by what happens next.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
We found two more members to add to the group
and then called them Outsiders for Life.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Yes, that is right. So just to review, two Special
became Sudden Impact became White Guys became the Outsiders became
Outsiders for Life. And it is a Z instead of
an S at the end of Outsiders, and the four
is a number four. It's an eye in life, though
it's not a why they exercised some restraint. It's two
thousand by now. Insincts No Strings Attached is the number
(30:43):
one album of the year. Mariah Carey is filming Glitter.
The Rolling Stones are playing smaller venues on their No
Security Comeback Tour. Eminem wins Best Rap Performance for My
Name Is, and Will Smith recovers from the failure of
the movie Wild Wild West with the album Willennium Outsider's
four Life recorded an album in two thousand for Blackground Records,
(31:05):
a Leah's label. It was never released. Aaron's new project,
DNA didn't get too much traction either, and his brother
Noel and his old friends in such an impact or
whatever you're calling them in your head right now all
went home to Virginia.
Speaker 4 (31:18):
So from there, everybody else went back to Virginia. I
didn't go back to Virginia because I met a girl
here in South Jersey, and when that whole thing happened,
I actually met her at a Boys of Man concert.
Speaker 5 (31:32):
That's funny perfect.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Aaron stayed behind with his new girlfriend, who would become
his wife, and he started a solo career under his
own name on another new label, Invigorator Records. Flash forward
to two thousand and six. The number one album of
the year is the soundtrack to the Disney Channel original
movie High School Musical Mariah Carey is Back with the
Emancipation of Mimi. The Rolling Stones are in the middle
(31:55):
of there a Bigger Bang Comeback Tour. Kanye West wins
Best Rap Perform Moments for gold Digger, Will Smith does
The Pursuit of Happiness, gets nominated for an Oscar and
in his old NBC Monday night time slot, a new
show debuts. It's called Heroes. It stars Hayden Pantier, who,
when we started this story back in nineteen eighty nine
(32:15):
was not born yet. Aaron Kane releases a solo single
called got a Love.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
My song called Gota Love went to number seven.
Speaker 5 (32:31):
On the R and B charts in two thousand and five, so.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
Maybe made some significant amount of money, you know, with that.
We sold three hundred thousand copies of that independently, so
you know, that was very lucrative for us, and you know,
got to buy house and buy stuff. And so after that,
(32:58):
I did an album with them, Let That Out, did
pretty good, and then that.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Label folded Geez because the two of them had always
had a good relationship. Aaron and Tim reunited.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
Me and him have been working on independent artists.
Speaker 5 (33:22):
We do TV and film now.
Speaker 4 (33:25):
Like I have a bunch of artists myself that I
deal with.
Speaker 5 (33:29):
I still put out my own albums.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
I just put out two new albums in the last
six months. One called Confused and another one called Love
Receipts that me and Tim produced all ourselves.
Speaker 5 (33:46):
And we do TV and film.
Speaker 4 (33:47):
We do stuff for independent artists, working on stuff for
Casey from Jobsee.
Speaker 5 (33:54):
I just did a song with his niece.
Speaker 4 (33:58):
I love letting out albums because I truly am an artist.
Speaker 5 (34:05):
At heart, you know what I mean, Like that's where.
Speaker 4 (34:08):
I came from from when I was seventeen eight years
eighteen years.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
Old, Like that's what I did.
Speaker 4 (34:15):
And what I love about doing music is that you
start with a blank canvas and you start with silence,
and at the end of the song you end up
with organized sounds and organized vocals and emotions, and and
(34:37):
then after you get done producing the song and mixing
down the song, it's like, wow, look what I have.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
Look what I have, creative created.
Speaker 5 (34:50):
Life, you know.
Speaker 4 (34:53):
Yeah, it's just it's just a great feeling, you know,
after you get done.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Right. But it's been you know, the path was a
winding one to this point, and there were a lot
of a lot of moments that just didn't didn't pan
out well.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Of course, I would have loved to be a multi
platinum selling group, you know, I mean, I mean, that's
That's why when you're a little kid, you get in
to this industry because that's what you want, you know.
(35:34):
But I'm truly blessed that I've been blessed with a
talent that I can, like, I'll be seventy years old
producing the track.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
You know, despite everything, Aaron Kane is in it for
the long haul and Tim Byrd feels the same way.
Are you happy that you took the ride?
Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yes, very happy. I'm happy for the age talk about
you said the.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Ride right, just the whole whole thing.
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Yeah, it was experienced. It allowed me to grow, you know,
That's why I love it. I enjoy it and and
actually prepares you for downtime whenever nothing's going on. You
don't stress out. You don't want to feel like you're
a nobody or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
But as I love it.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, how do you think the rest of the guys
felt about it? You said you don't want to feel
like a nobody? Do you do you think that they
ever felt that.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Way during those down times that we had.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Yeah, No, I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (36:34):
None of us did. We were just determined. We didn't.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
I don't think we had time to even think about
being depressed. We were just like, Noah, let's go, let's go,
let's go.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
You know you mentioned earlier that there that you you're
not concerned about fame anymore. Is there? Do you remember
a moment where you were like, that's I'm finished with
that pursuit now.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Yeah, early on, I think round about when I was with.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
And being around that time period, and you get to
watch how other people respond to whatever success or lack thereof,
and you don't. I started to say, I said, I
don't want to be like that person. I believe that
we got it back in those days, I think we
would have been broke.
Speaker 2 (37:15):
Now, talk me through what that looks like to you.
What you mean like the scenario in which Sudden Impact
had released a huge record.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
Oh yeah, they released a huge record.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
Be great for that time period, but remember music started
changing too.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
How are we going to keep up with the change?
Speaker 1 (37:31):
And when you're in front of the crowd, it's hard
for you to make that transition with music changes. We
were underneath the radar. Even though they were into videos,
they were still under the radar, so they had the
ability to grow when music was changing.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
What's the guy's relationship with each other now? The five
of them, the original five.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Okay, the original five.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Ok Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
I talked to Aaron. Me and Aaron talk almost daily,
so I keep in touch with him. I just talked
to his brother no on Saturday, so I told him, Yeah,
I told him about the podcast.
Speaker 3 (38:04):
He said, I really don't know what to say. I said,
they want to ask you about Sun Impact.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
You know more of the ends than I do. I
just recorded you guys. Yeah, So I talked to him.
He's interested in trying to do it. Todd, who started
the group, Me and him, like I said, we were
like the Lenna McCartney of the group. And he's still
a great songwriter. And he's been doing country lately, great crunch.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he's doing great with that.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
Dave, who's also in the group, we haven't seen him
in years, no now.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
I think he wanted to get away from that whole
thing because he was kind of the quiet one anyway.
Alan Healey, which is Todd's best friend. Alan Heely, he
now owns a couple of computer repair stories.
Speaker 3 (38:51):
He doesn't do music anymore. He still listens, but he
doesn't do music anymore.
Speaker 2 (38:55):
But aside from Dave, everybody still keeps in contact. Yeah,
so I'm waiting on a reply from Noel Caine, and
Tim says he's going to put in a good word
for me with Todd White, who, if all goes well,
will put me in touch with Alan Healy. So from
the original lineup of Sudden Impact, that just leaves Dave,
a man I know only as Dave. No one I've
(39:18):
spoken to so far has his contact info. But now
I have four more full names of Sudden Impact members,
a few more names of Sudden Impact to the group,
so I can investigate a little more extensively. So I do,
and I find a lineup for Outsiders for Life. Todd
White is in there, Alan Healy is in there, plus
the new guys Jason Dowdy and Jimmy Marble, and the
(39:39):
fifth member of two specials Sudden Impact White guys, the
Outsiders Outsiders for Life. His name is Dave Smith. This
is going to be harder than I thought. Next time,
I'm going to search the world for a Dave Smith,
and I will talk to someone who tasted success in
the nineteen nineties and then ran in a brand new direction.
(40:01):
His story. In the next episode of Waiting for Impact,
a Dave Holmes Passion Project. This has been an Exactly
Right production written by me Dave Holmes, produced by Hannah
Kyle Crichton, recorded, mixed and sound designed by Andrew Epen.
(40:23):
Additional engineering and assembly by Annalise Nelson. Music by Ben Wise,
artwork by Garrett Ross Executive produced by Karen Kilgareff, Georgia
hart Starr and Danielle Kramer. Follow the show on Instagram, Facebook,
and Twitter at exactly right and follow me at Dave Holmes.
(40:44):
For more information, go to Exactlyrightmedia dot com binge the
show add free on Stitcher Premium for a free month.
Head to Stitcher Premier dot com slash impact and enter
promo code Impact when you select a monthly plan, Subscribe
and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or
wherever you get your podcasts,
I don't know it was meant to happen. You know
what I'm saying, We weren't meant to have that success
at that time because I think that I think we
wouldn't have been able to hand it.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
That is Tim Bird. He wrote and produced music with
Sudden Impact, the lost boy band I'm trying to find.
He was so integral to their sound. Some people call
him the sixth member of Sudden Impact. I've gotten his
contact info from Aaron Kane, the lead singer of the group,
and I'm getting the Sudden Impact story from his perspective,
and right away I get a brand new piece of information.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
They start a group called Too Special first before they
became set an Impact.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Too Special, Yes what I'm saying, too number two to
oh yeah, okay, Too Special. This is a group who's
had a lot of ups and downs, a lot of
record labels and a lot of getting dropped from record labels,
and as you're about to find out, they've also had
a lot of names. In this episode, we'll hear more
of the Sudden Impact story from producer Tim Bird and
(01:01):
lead singer Aaron Kane. This is Waiting for Impact, a
Dave Holmes passion project when we left off in the
(01:27):
last episode, I was trying to get Noel Kane's contact
info from his brother Aaron finally did get it. I
have reached out and as of yet, I have not
heard anything back. But in the meantime, there's another name
to add to the list of names that this group
has had. Too Special became Sudden Impact, which became White Guys.
And not to spoil anything, but that list of names
(01:49):
is going to get longer. More on that later, but
for now, tell me how you came to work with
Sudden Impact.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah, we all went to high school together. Was that
I was in a group at the time. We were
performing original songs and one of the members of Sudden Impact, well,
they became such a bat, Todd White.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
He wanted to start a group like New Kids on
the Block.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It's nineteen eighty nine as this story begins. Bobby Brown's
Don't Be Cruel is the number one album of the year.
Mariah Carey is recording her debut album. The Rolling Stones
are out on their Steel Wheels Comeback Tour. Will Smith
beats JJ FADD and Cool Mo d to win the
first ever Best Rap Performance Grammy for Parents. Just Don't understand,
(02:32):
and he meets with Quincy Jones to develop NBC's The
Fresh Prince of bel Air. Tim Bird joins Too Special
as the group's unofficial producer, and here in the present
he confirms the wildest part of the story.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
So they're out in LA and they're calling us, Hey,
we just ranted the heavy d. Hey he's randed Stevie
wonder we thought they were lying. And then they had
their poster, the two Special poster, right yeah, And they
run into BIV.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
There's like Michael Bibbins.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
They say, uh, bib our poster and Biff told him
get that out of my face. Well, was something, you know,
curse first behind it. Get that out of my face.
I'm not signing that bleep. And he thought it was
you can swear feeling.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
He thought it was a poster of new Kids on
the Block, because remember there was a rivalry between New
Audition and New Kids on the Block, right Sead back
in this day, right. So Todd told him said, look, no,
we're a new group.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
We're stuck out here in LA.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
We have no way to get back home, but would
you please sign this poster?
Speaker 3 (03:29):
So he signed it. He said a new group. Huh,
all right, I'm.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Here's some money for a ticket, plane ticket. I'm gonna
send you out back to Virginia and wait for a
call for me in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
So, okay, Aaron told me that I didn't one percent
believe it. This is actually how it happened. He just
saw the picture.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Mm hmm, he just saw the pictures.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Do you do you think that that rivalry between New
Edition and New Kids on the Block had anything to
do with why he wanted to sign them.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yes, I think so.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
Nobody else believes it, but I think so. Okay, I
think it was like get back, Yeah, yeah, I mean,
and plus it's a lot of money because New Kids
on the Box they they made a billion dollars.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Off of merchandise Alon, right, right, So I think it
was that.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
Okay, So what happens next?
Speaker 1 (04:18):
What happens next? He calls us in a couple of weeks.
We didn't believe them even they came back from La
Yeah whatever, whatever. Me just working on songs and just
playing around, and Michael Bivens calls the house and we're talking.
He said, guys, I'm gonna sign you. Guys, I'm gonna
send the contracts. They'll be out there by FedEx. They
we all got the contracts, signed them as artists, signed
(04:39):
me as a producer, and changed their name to Sudden Impact.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Right, and why did he change that name?
Speaker 3 (04:47):
He liked the movie Clint Eastwood movie.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Okay, Sudden Impact was a big movie. It's the one
that gave the culture go ahead, make my day. I
was hoping for a better story there, but I will
take that one. So Sudden Impact all signed their contracts.
Tim Bird signs his and goes from being the unofficial
producer to the official producer, and they all plan to
get busy recording, but before they do, they get their
(05:10):
big break.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
And the rest is then they came back and ended
up in the Motown Philly video. Right, that was during
that same time they end up in the Motown Philly video.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
So by the time they were in the Motown Philly video,
had had you recorded anything officially for Michael Bibbins yet?
Speaker 1 (05:31):
We had just started Well, actually he hadn't heard it yet,
that's right, that's right. They didn't have They didn't have
a finished demo that we could send some because everything
was moving so fast.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
So they're in the video but they don't have a
song yet.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
No, not yet.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Sudden Impact has gotten a major leg up. The video
is on rotation on all the big music video networks.
People around the country are seeing it over and over
and they're waiting to hear music from Sudden Impact. The
pressure is on. How did that feel for all of
you getting that kind of boost? How did that feel?
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Oh? I felt I felt great?
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yeah, yeah, I felt like, this is my chance to
be Michael Jackson.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
But you know, be famous and all that. But what happens.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
I ended up leaving my group to focus solely on
Sudden Impact.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
What was your band called So Suave? So Suave is
an awesome name. But this is the point in the
story when the group that had been called Too Special
and later was called Sudden Impact is about to be
called something new.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
After Motown Philly video came out, That's when Bibb started
marketing and finding other art artists to come into the
fold of the East Coast Family. Right then and there,
when he formed the East Coast Family, he changed Sudden.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
Impact to the White Guys.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Now why because whenever he would do interviews or boys
and men would do interviews instead of asking questions about
Michael Bivens BBD or boys to men, they would say, Hey, whatever.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Happened to them? White guys? There's the video? Yeah and
so yeah, so big, change the name.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Change the name to white guys.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
It's spelt like wit gizzies though.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Yeah, yeah, I've seen them. I've seen them in the
video for one for all for one. Yes, where they
are it's w h yt g I z E.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
How did you and how did the guys feel about
changing your name? For another time?
Speaker 3 (07:28):
Didn't care. We were with Michael Bivens, So.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Let's talk about Michael Bivens. I would love to talk
to Michael Bivins, but so far he hasn't gotten back
to me. I've asked I vete Nicole Brown to put
in a good word for me, because they're still close friends,
and she has, but so far nothing. I've been thinking
about it a lot, and I wonder whether he's worried
that he is going to be the villain of the story.
And I wonder whether that worries a Vet now that
(07:52):
she's involved with the show. And if that's the case,
I would understand his concern and hers, wouldn't you. I mean,
what if somebody came up to you right now and said,
I just heard an amazing story about you. How would
you feel You'd be a little concerned for a minute,
wouldn't you? Then? What if that person told you I'm
making a ten episode podcast series about that story. I'm
(08:13):
talking to all kinds of people who know you in
conversations that you won't be able to hear until the
show comes out. I get it. That has got to
be a scary thing to hear. If it were happening
to me, I probably wouldn't want to be involved either.
But a couple things. One, I am not interested in
assassinating anyone's character, or making a chump out of anyone,
or ruining anyone's reputation unless their kid Rock because I
(08:36):
hate that guy. Interesting stories usually don't have clear cut villains.
And I'm not interested in telling a boring story or
an easy one. This is a complicated story where everyone
so far is just doing their best. And Two, no
matter how the biv ten project turned out, it started
in the first place because of a trait of Bivins
that I admire, one that I think is worth celebrating ambition.
(09:00):
The biv ten project wasn't what he hoped it would be,
but that doesn't mean it was a bad thing. It
wasn't the success that he envisioned, but that doesn't make
it a failure. And most importantly, though he couldn't deliver
to his artists the fame and fortune that he may
have implicitly or explicitly promised them, he didn't leave them
with nothing. Life doesn't work in binaries like that. The
(09:21):
people I've spoken to so far are mostly not rich
and mostly not famous, but they are all better off
for having known and worked with Michael Biffins, and they
know it. Even if their relationship is strained, they all
still respect and admire the guy. Tim Bird puts it, well,
what do you think Michael Bivins thinks of the whole
BIV ten experience?
Speaker 3 (09:40):
I don't know. Good questions.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
I don't speculate, though, but I don't know. I think
he thought it was a success, and yeah, think about it,
he was the first puppy. What puppy ended up doing?
BIV did it first. Yeah, so I don't know what.
I don't know if those things behind the scenes that
went on that we weren't privy to, but I'm pretty
sure he should be He should be pat hisself from
(10:03):
the back.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
Back to the saga of Sudden Impact. Who I guess
we should now start calling White Guys. What was the
sound of White.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Guys, Salman? White Guys?
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Was?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
I would say it was pop?
Speaker 1 (10:27):
It wasn't as poppy as in Sync or just that.
And you know a little more soul to it, Okay,
you know a little more so a little more like uh,
a soulful group, like closely like what boys.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Thement was doing. Gotcha, Yeah, that's exactly they had. We
evolved over the years.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Though, and they had the time to evolve to catch
us up. Michael Bivens signed a group called Two Special
to his three artist production deal at Motown, then change
their name to Sudden Impact because he liked the Cline
Eastwood movie. Then signed Sudden Impact to Capitol Records, then
put Sudden Impact in Boys to Men's debut video, then
pulled them off Capitol Records to sign them to his
own label, biv ten Records, a division of Motown, then
(11:06):
changed their name again to White Guys. There's a lot
of activity going on around this project, and once again,
Michael Bivens still has not heard a single song. What
then happens with white guys. Do you end up in
the studio at all?
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Well, we started, we had built our own studio at
Todd's house, so we were always recorded at home, so
every day we would have songs. And at that time
there was something going on between I think Boys.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
To Men and Michael Bivens. Not sure.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Let's dig into that a little bit. Boys to Men's
debut album, Coolly High Harmony, was executive produced by Michael Bivens,
and it was a big success. It sold nine million copies.
It had hits like Motown Philly and It's So Hard
to Say Goodbye to Yesterday, which would play at high
school graduation parties for years to come. Boys to Men
were on their way. In nineteen ninety two, they went
(11:57):
into the studio with Babyface, one of the most successful
R and B songwriters and producers of all time. They
recorded a song for the soundtrack of the Eddie Murphy
halle Berry romantic comedy Boomerang. That song was called End
of the Road. It was a smash. It went to
(12:22):
number one and stayed there for thirteen weeks, tying the
record set by Whitney Houston's I Will Always Love You.
Boys to Men really leveled up with End of the Road.
Their second album had the single I'll Make Love to You,
which broke Whitney Houston and Boys to Men's own record
by staying at number one for fourteen weeks. That album
sold twenty million copies. And I don't know why this is,
(12:46):
and it's not really pertinent to the sudden impact story,
and maybe it's part of what he doesn't want to
talk about anymore. But Michael Bivens isn't listed in the
credits for that second Boys to Men album anywhere.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Because this round about the time when there's second Boys
and Men's second album came out and sold like twenty
something million copies, and so things started slowing up. I
really don't understand. I can't really speak on why things
started slowing up when we knowsed it, but we still
kept working. We would call Michael and I'm asking, when's
the next time you gonna call chet send us out
(13:18):
to la or put us in the studio, And sometimes
we would get a call and sometimes not. He would
say that I'm working on something for y'all right now.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
Then we finally got in touch with them.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
He said, look, I'm gonna let you all go from
your contracts, blah blah. So we're getting more seasoned with
writing songs and producing songs, so every day we would
build our studio.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Listen to what he does there. Tim Bird is talking
about being let go from BIV ten Records, a massive disappointment,
and he just glides right past it. A three year
journey of high hopes, major labels, big expectations of pop
stardom gets dashed in a single phone call, and Tim
doesn't dwell on it for a second in his memory.
The guys just get right back to work. That is
(14:00):
called resilience, and that resilience is going to serve them
well in this next chapter.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
And so I think it was like a year or
two later, or this was in ninety five when everything
just went crazy.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
So it's nineteen ninety five. Hoody in the Blowfish's Cracked
Rear View is the number one album of the year.
Mariah Carey sells twenty million copies of her album Daydream.
The Rolling Stones are on their Voodoo Lounge comeback tour.
Coolio wins Best Rap Performance for Gangster's Paradise, while Will
Smith finishes the entire run of Fresh Prince of bel
(14:32):
Air and moves on to Independence Day. I'm going to
bring Aaron Kane back into the mix now and let
the two of them tell you what happened next. And
as a heads up, he's going to name some new
jack swing artists from the nineties who if you don't
know them, you will want to look them up.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
So now here we are in Newport News, sitting there
and don't have no deal. Don't have no deal. We're
I mean, we're constantly working on demos, and so we
know that Teddy Riley is in Virginia Beach. Teddy Riley
(15:08):
had the Future Studios in Virginia Beach where Michael Jackson
recorded dangerous albums.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
Guys is popping, Guys.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
Is doing their stuff there, Black Streets down there, Black
Street is doing crazy stuff.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Guy and Black Street. If you are hearing those names
for the first time right now, look him up. Listen
to Let's Chill or Before I Let You Go or
Groove Me. You can thank me later. Teddy Riley is
a member of both of those groups and he's their
producer and he is really having a moment as he
heard Michael Jackson is working with him. That is the
ultimate seal of approval. At the time, white guys are
(15:49):
looking for a label, for a manager, for anything, so
they do what's worked before. They put themselves in front
of a very important person and they ask.
Speaker 5 (15:57):
I think maybe Tim A todb went up there.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
They they contacted somebody going into the Future Studios and
it ends up being a guy named Leon Silver's the Third.
I don't know if you remember a group from the
Silvers back in the seventies.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Yeah as Wyle, right, yes, yeah yeah. Are they Hotline?
Yes Hot Yeah? Okay, yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:27):
Well Leon is like Leon Silver's the Third. He is
a great producer, great songwriter. He actually did Janet Jackson's
first album. Well at the time, he was at Future
Studios working with Teddy Riley on some stuff. He actually
(16:48):
did before I Let You Go by Black Street, Before
You Go.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
Can I Get Good Nun? He he did that.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I love these musical interludes.
Speaker 4 (17:06):
That's one of my favorite songs of all time. I
love that song, Dave Hollister saying that. But anyway, so
I think the story is is that Tim walked into
Future Studios one time and ran into Leon and had
(17:28):
a conversation with him, maybe gave him a demo tape
or whatever. He heard some of our stuff and he
was like, guys, why don't you guys come by my
house and start recording with me. Now, at the time,
I'm twenty one, twenty two. I don't know who the
(17:49):
hell Leon Silvers is, you know, I don't know who yet.
He's just some old guy. Would dreads to me, and
I say old. He was probably his forties at the time.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
And like any good old guy in his forties, Leon
Silver's the third ran a tight ship.
Speaker 5 (18:07):
We go to his house every day. We would get up.
Speaker 4 (18:11):
He was an early bird, and we would get up
at like six seven o'clock in the morning, be at
his house in the morning at eight o'clock in the morning,
and record at his house on reel to reel. He
had real to reel. That's what we were recording.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
That's standard old guy behavior. The guys write four more
songs and record demos for them, and because they're not
on a label anymore, not getting a stipend or weekend
trips to Disney World, they're having to figure out how
to feed themselves. How are you earning money during all
of this?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
I got a regular job. Yeah, Aaron and them Aaron them.
They got jobs. Everybody got jobs. And then whenever we
would finish work, we will always go to the studio.
So it was like work, work, work, work. We would
stay in the studio. So even if I had to
be at work at nine o'clock in the morning, stand
a studio till six o'clock in the morning and still
at least get an our sleep to go to work.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
What was work at that time?
Speaker 3 (19:07):
It was? What was that time? It was sprint.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Tim is working at a Sprint store. And meanwhile Boys
to Men are blowing up. As I told you, End
of the Road goes to number one and stays there
for thirteen weeks. I'll Make Love to You, from their
second album, stays at number one for fourteen weeks until
it gets replaced by On Bendney, another Boys to Men's song,
Boys to Men Are Dominating, and Tommy Montola, the CEO
(19:32):
of Columbia Records and husband of Mariah Carey, makes Boys
to Men the same kind of deal Motown once gave
to Michael Bivens.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
Tommy Bettola said, listen, guys, if you guys do a
song with Mariah, I'll give you your own label deal. Right,
So they did the song you Know Went to the Moon.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
The song Boys to Men do with Mariah Carey is
called One Sweet Day. It goes to number one and
stays there for sixteen weeks. They have now broken their
own record for longest running number one single twice, and
(20:13):
this third record stands until Old Town Road breaks it
nearly twenty five years later.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
So they got their own label deal off of that
song called Stone Creek Records Sudden Impact.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Who I should be calling white guys right now? And
I keep trying, but I guess my body doesn't want
to have a pre existing relationship with Boys to Men
having been in their debut video. So once again they
go on a road trip to try to get some attention,
but this time they have songs.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
It was Aaron Nole and Todd went to Richmond, Virginia
to see Boys the Men and Jodasy perform do that concert,
and they ran into Mike McCarey, the one who left
Boys the Men, the one with the back problems, the
bass voice.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
They ran into him at the arena.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
And we had the demos at that We had all
of our songs on tape, and they were really good
because we were halfway working with Teddy Riley too a
little bit indirectly, yep, indirectly, And so Mike McCarey heard
the songs, He's like, we're about to start our own
label called Stone Creek. Won't you guys come sign with us?
(21:19):
And that's how we got the Stone Creek.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
So now here we are in another label situation, and
Stone Creek is a part of Sony Records. So now
Boys of Men moves us up to Philly. That's how
I'm in the spot where I'm at now in Jersey.
In ninety seven, they move us up to Philadelphia, put
(21:43):
us up in this amazing apartment complex in Germantown, Philadelphia.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Big apartment.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
It was like the apartment was sort of like you
and the TV showed different strokes. Yeah, yeah, the house
but without the stairs. But that's how big it was. Yeah,
we all, all six of us, stayed there for two
years and we banged out songs. Because Boys Men ended
up buying Will Smith's old studio in Gladwin, Pennsylvania.
Speaker 5 (22:12):
So they signed us, and they signed another artist. His
name is Uncle Sam. Oh no, if you know who
Uncle Sam is.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
We're fresh my memory. That sounds sort of familiar.
Speaker 5 (22:24):
I Don't Never Want to See You?
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yes, Uncle Sam's I Don't Ever Want to See You
Again went to number six on the Billboard charts. And
I love it when Aaron Kine sings to me. So
the guys are on their third label. They're finally getting
to work on an album in a world where R
and B vocal groups are selling crazy amounts of CDs.
They start to work even harder. And this is the
mid nineties by now, so I have to ask, is
(22:51):
there choreography?
Speaker 4 (22:52):
It's funny that you say that, because that was a
problem for us.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Really.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
Everybody wanted us to be dancers and be dancers like
new kids on the block and new addition, and we
just weren't into the dance. And man, we just like
that wasn't something that we were passionate about. You know,
like we didn't want to dance. We just wanted to
(23:22):
record songs, sing songs and come out and sing to
the latens like that. That's what we wanted to do.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
Some dancing was expected, it was.
Speaker 4 (23:35):
It was at that time, and everybody was like, come on, guys,
you guys got to dance.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
With Stone Creek Records, the guys get a new start
a new attitude and a new name.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
Another name change. Yes, this is crazy Yanye from Boys
to Men.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
He liked the way they look, and plus he was
a fan of the movie The Outsiders, and he said,
you know what we should call you, Guys to Outsiders, said,
I just got finished watching the movie the other day,
he said, Plus, some of y'all looked like one of
the characters and the Alzheizers Ciders. So we're going to
give each one of y'all the same nickname, pony Boy all.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
This that young. Yeah, that was a great idea.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
So Too Special became Sudden Impact, which became White Guys,
which became the Outsiders. It's hard enough to get any
kind of momentum going in the music industry without your
name changing every five minutes. But the guys keep pushing forward.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
So anyway, so we're recording at Sony and Boys of
Men ends up putting out Uncle Sam first. So here
we get bumped again and Dave, are songs.
Speaker 5 (24:43):
That we were recording there.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
We had actually some songs with boys and men singing,
some backgrounds with us, and I mean the songs that
we were doing there were just beautiful, beautiful songs and
they choose to put out I don't never want to
see you again. Uncle Sam put his album out. They
put Uncle Sam's album out, and guess what happens after that?
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Oh, you actually want me to guess?
Speaker 3 (25:11):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Did they drop you?
Speaker 5 (25:13):
The label goes under?
Speaker 4 (25:15):
Oh god, Tommy Battola ends up dropping Stone Creek after
the Uncle Sam album comes out.
Speaker 5 (25:25):
So here we are again.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
Now we've just been through all of this and here
we are again with no record deal again.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
So how can that be? He's the boys de Man
m Riah Carey have the longest running number one of
all time up to that time, right right, huge, So
they've got they've done, end of the road. They've done.
I mean, they're they're huge. They get offered a label deal,
they signed two people. Was it just Tommy Mottola saying
(25:58):
like I gave you what I said I was gonna
ge you and now I don't want to pay attention
to this anymore or what happened?
Speaker 4 (26:03):
I think I think it was something internal that that
we really don't know about. I think it's something internal
between Poison Men and Tommy Mattola.
Speaker 5 (26:15):
That's what I think.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
I couldn't believe the phone call when we got the
phone call that the label is folding, and now you
guys got to go back to Virginia again. I mean,
we were just devastating Stone Creek.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
The whole label just straight up folds. The guys are
back to square one yet again. But at least this
time they've made some proper recordings. What happened to the
music that was recorded for Stone Creek?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
We still got it, Yeah, yeah, we still got it.
It's kind of dated though, but yeah, we still got it.
I remember, because remember, you gotta understand this one thing.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
A lot of people don't remember.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Sun Impact was supposed to be the next new kids
on the block.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
So with all these.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Deals we were going through in between, that left it
all open for back Street Boys and and Sync you know,
to come through. So we weren't trying to be like them.
We were trying to be a little more edgy. I'll say,
like a comparison between Jodasy and Boys to Men, you
know what I mean, a little more edgy.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
So at least they still have their music from back then.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
Kind of the songs are on four Match that I
really can't transfer because I don't have the machines for
them anymore, which really sucks.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Yeah, so they're just sitting there in a hard drive.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Yeah, not even a hard drive will tape, Oh my god.
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Them studio tapes, you know, like even whenever people are
doing radio, the little small little tapes that you put
in Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah a a's or whatever
you used to call it.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah, there's almost nothing you can do with that.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
Anymore now unless that I can hold it up to
the light and see if I can see the music notes.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
But other than that, yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
So the frustration of that never coming out. Did that
Did you see that wearing on on them? On yourself?
Speaker 1 (28:02):
No?
Speaker 3 (28:02):
I think I don't think.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
I know.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
I didn't feel that way. I was just too determined.
I knew a couple of the guys were determined. I
think that I say Alan and Todd, who were like
the closest, they were also determined. Aaron and No they
were determined, but they were just they just wanted to
move on for something else. But they still was determined
to do music. But it was frustrating. We did a
(28:27):
lot of songs with boys, the men, went to a
lot of parties, and then in nineteen ninety seven it
all stop.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
So Sudden Impact got signed at the time of New
Kids on the Block. They kept writing and recording demos
through the years when a boy band was pop music
poison and then parted ways at the exact moment boy
bands became big again with the right label. With any
consistent label or name, they could have had their moment.
The timing was just always exactly off. So what does
(28:56):
that feel like?
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Like a letdown? I said, we're going to find something else,
you know, and went home.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
And that's when we started having that being upset at
each other because everybody wanted to control everything because we
had gotten better with recording writing songs. So what I
want to write too? I want to write too. And
the majority of the writing was me and me and Todd.
We were like Leonard and McCartney. We were throwing them
(29:24):
out and so we started writing, and then everybody would
get frustrated because one didn't want to come to the
studio anymore, or somebody girlfriend they had to go see them,
or just had to focus.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
Was starting to wane a little bit.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
And I think what happened Aaron Aaron and Know they
wanted to do darker songs than what we were doing,
you know, sort of like a jobasy and this, that
and the other. So one time we had a meeting
and Aaron and Knows said we're going to start our
own band.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Yeah, No Love Loss.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
The Cane Brothers split off to start another vocal group
with their friend Donnie Evans, which they called DNA for
Donnie Noel Aaron the Outsiders fill the open positions with
two new guys, Jimmy Marble and Jason Dowdy. And he
won't be surprised by what happens next.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
We found two more members to add to the group
and then called them Outsiders for Life.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Yes, that is right. So just to review, two Special
became Sudden Impact became White Guys became the Outsiders became
Outsiders for Life. And it is a Z instead of
an S at the end of Outsiders, and the four
is a number four. It's an eye in life, though
it's not a why they exercised some restraint. It's two
thousand by now. Insincts No Strings Attached is the number
(30:43):
one album of the year. Mariah Carey is filming Glitter.
The Rolling Stones are playing smaller venues on their No
Security Comeback Tour. Eminem wins Best Rap Performance for My
Name Is, and Will Smith recovers from the failure of
the movie Wild Wild West with the album Willennium Outsider's
four Life recorded an album in two thousand for Blackground Records,
(31:05):
a Leah's label. It was never released. Aaron's new project,
DNA didn't get too much traction either, and his brother
Noel and his old friends in such an impact or
whatever you're calling them in your head right now all
went home to Virginia.
Speaker 4 (31:18):
So from there, everybody else went back to Virginia. I
didn't go back to Virginia because I met a girl
here in South Jersey, and when that whole thing happened,
I actually met her at a Boys of Man concert.
Speaker 5 (31:32):
That's funny perfect.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Aaron stayed behind with his new girlfriend, who would become
his wife, and he started a solo career under his
own name on another new label, Invigorator Records. Flash forward
to two thousand and six. The number one album of
the year is the soundtrack to the Disney Channel original
movie High School Musical Mariah Carey is Back with the
Emancipation of Mimi. The Rolling Stones are in the middle
(31:55):
of there a Bigger Bang Comeback Tour. Kanye West wins
Best Rap Perform Moments for gold Digger, Will Smith does
The Pursuit of Happiness, gets nominated for an Oscar and
in his old NBC Monday night time slot, a new
show debuts. It's called Heroes. It stars Hayden Pantier, who,
when we started this story back in nineteen eighty nine
(32:15):
was not born yet. Aaron Kane releases a solo single
called got a Love.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
My song called Gota Love went to number seven.
Speaker 5 (32:31):
On the R and B charts in two thousand and five, so.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
Maybe made some significant amount of money, you know, with that.
We sold three hundred thousand copies of that independently, so
you know, that was very lucrative for us, and you know,
got to buy house and buy stuff. And so after that,
(32:58):
I did an album with them, Let That Out, did
pretty good, and then that.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Label folded Geez because the two of them had always
had a good relationship. Aaron and Tim reunited.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
Me and him have been working on independent artists.
Speaker 5 (33:22):
We do TV and film now.
Speaker 4 (33:25):
Like I have a bunch of artists myself that I
deal with.
Speaker 5 (33:29):
I still put out my own albums.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
I just put out two new albums in the last
six months. One called Confused and another one called Love
Receipts that me and Tim produced all ourselves.
Speaker 5 (33:46):
And we do TV and film.
Speaker 4 (33:47):
We do stuff for independent artists, working on stuff for
Casey from Jobsee.
Speaker 5 (33:54):
I just did a song with his niece.
Speaker 4 (33:58):
I love letting out albums because I truly am an artist.
Speaker 5 (34:05):
At heart, you know what I mean, Like that's where.
Speaker 4 (34:08):
I came from from when I was seventeen eight years
eighteen years.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
Old, Like that's what I did.
Speaker 4 (34:15):
And what I love about doing music is that you
start with a blank canvas and you start with silence,
and at the end of the song you end up
with organized sounds and organized vocals and emotions, and and
(34:37):
then after you get done producing the song and mixing
down the song, it's like, wow, look what I have.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
Look what I have, creative created.
Speaker 5 (34:50):
Life, you know.
Speaker 4 (34:53):
Yeah, it's just it's just a great feeling, you know,
after you get done.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Right. But it's been you know, the path was a
winding one to this point, and there were a lot
of a lot of moments that just didn't didn't pan
out well.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Of course, I would have loved to be a multi
platinum selling group, you know, I mean, I mean, that's
That's why when you're a little kid, you get in
to this industry because that's what you want, you know.
(35:34):
But I'm truly blessed that I've been blessed with a
talent that I can, like, I'll be seventy years old
producing the track.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
You know, despite everything, Aaron Kane is in it for
the long haul and Tim Byrd feels the same way.
Are you happy that you took the ride?
Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yes, very happy. I'm happy for the age talk about
you said the.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Ride right, just the whole whole thing.
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Yeah, it was experienced. It allowed me to grow, you know,
That's why I love it. I enjoy it and and
actually prepares you for downtime whenever nothing's going on. You
don't stress out. You don't want to feel like you're
a nobody or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
But as I love it.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, how do you think the rest of the guys
felt about it? You said you don't want to feel
like a nobody? Do you do you think that they
ever felt that.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Way during those down times that we had.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Yeah, No, I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (36:34):
None of us did. We were just determined. We didn't.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
I don't think we had time to even think about
being depressed. We were just like, Noah, let's go, let's go,
let's go.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
You know you mentioned earlier that there that you you're
not concerned about fame anymore. Is there? Do you remember
a moment where you were like, that's I'm finished with
that pursuit now.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Yeah, early on, I think round about when I was with.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
And being around that time period, and you get to
watch how other people respond to whatever success or lack thereof,
and you don't. I started to say, I said, I
don't want to be like that person. I believe that
we got it back in those days, I think we
would have been broke.
Speaker 2 (37:15):
Now, talk me through what that looks like to you.
What you mean like the scenario in which Sudden Impact
had released a huge record.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
Oh yeah, they released a huge record.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
Be great for that time period, but remember music started
changing too.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
How are we going to keep up with the change?
Speaker 1 (37:31):
And when you're in front of the crowd, it's hard
for you to make that transition with music changes. We
were underneath the radar. Even though they were into videos,
they were still under the radar, so they had the
ability to grow when music was changing.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
What's the guy's relationship with each other now? The five
of them, the original five.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Okay, the original five.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Ok Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
I talked to Aaron. Me and Aaron talk almost daily,
so I keep in touch with him. I just talked
to his brother no on Saturday, so I told him, Yeah,
I told him about the podcast.
Speaker 3 (38:04):
He said, I really don't know what to say. I said,
they want to ask you about Sun Impact.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
You know more of the ends than I do. I
just recorded you guys. Yeah, So I talked to him.
He's interested in trying to do it. Todd, who started
the group, Me and him, like I said, we were
like the Lenna McCartney of the group. And he's still
a great songwriter. And he's been doing country lately, great crunch.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he's doing great with that.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
Dave, who's also in the group, we haven't seen him
in years, no now.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
I think he wanted to get away from that whole
thing because he was kind of the quiet one anyway.
Alan Healey, which is Todd's best friend. Alan Heely, he
now owns a couple of computer repair stories.
Speaker 3 (38:51):
He doesn't do music anymore. He still listens, but he
doesn't do music anymore.
Speaker 2 (38:55):
But aside from Dave, everybody still keeps in contact. Yeah,
so I'm waiting on a reply from Noel Caine, and
Tim says he's going to put in a good word
for me with Todd White, who, if all goes well,
will put me in touch with Alan Healy. So from
the original lineup of Sudden Impact, that just leaves Dave,
a man I know only as Dave. No one I've
(39:18):
spoken to so far has his contact info. But now
I have four more full names of Sudden Impact members,
a few more names of Sudden Impact to the group,
so I can investigate a little more extensively. So I do,
and I find a lineup for Outsiders for Life. Todd
White is in there, Alan Healy is in there, plus
the new guys Jason Dowdy and Jimmy Marble, and the
(39:39):
fifth member of two specials Sudden Impact White guys, the
Outsiders Outsiders for Life. His name is Dave Smith. This
is going to be harder than I thought. Next time,
I'm going to search the world for a Dave Smith,
and I will talk to someone who tasted success in
the nineteen nineties and then ran in a brand new direction.
(40:01):
His story. In the next episode of Waiting for Impact,
a Dave Holmes Passion Project. This has been an Exactly
Right production written by me Dave Holmes, produced by Hannah
Kyle Crichton, recorded, mixed and sound designed by Andrew Epen.
(40:23):
Additional engineering and assembly by Annalise Nelson. Music by Ben Wise,
artwork by Garrett Ross Executive produced by Karen Kilgareff, Georgia
hart Starr and Danielle Kramer. Follow the show on Instagram, Facebook,
and Twitter at exactly right and follow me at Dave Holmes.
(40:44):
For more information, go to Exactlyrightmedia dot com binge the
show add free on Stitcher Premium for a free month.
Head to Stitcher Premier dot com slash impact and enter
promo code Impact when you select a monthly plan, Subscribe
and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or
wherever you get your podcasts,
Host
Dave Holmes
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