September 12, 2025 • 37 mins
Watch Carol and Tim LIVE every day on YouTube: http://bit.ly/3vTiACF.
The man accused of killing of conservative activist Charlie Kirk— identified as Tyler Robinson — was arrested on suspicion of murder and weapons offenses.
Robinson is being held in county jail in Utah without bail, according to court documents. He was arrested by law enforcement, after a family member alerted authorities that he had confessed, or at least implied involvement, in the killing, Utah Governor Spencer Cox said Friday.
No formal charges have been filed against Robinson, but authorities in Utah said they intend to file them early next week.
Kirk, 31, executive director of Turning Point USA and a close ally of President Donald Trump, was shot in the neck Sept. 10 as he spoke at an outdoor student event before a crowd of more than 3,000 at Utah Valley University in Orem, about 40 miles (64 kilometers) south of Salt Lake City. He was pronounced dead at a local hospital.
Today's show features:
- Bloomberg News Senior White House Correspondent Josh Wingrove on Charlie Kirk’s role in the US conservative movement and the US urging G-7 sanctions on Russian oil
- Axel Merk, President and Chief Investment Officer of Merk Investments on the gold market boom
- Bloomberg Tech Co-Host Ed Ludlow on takeaways from his interview with Tesla Board Chair Robyn Denholm
- Alan Lancz, Director of Research at LanczGlobal on stock picks and Friday's late-day market fade
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. This is Bloomberg Business
Weekdaily reporting from the magazine that helps global leaders stay
ahead with insight on the people, companies, and trends shaping
today's complex economy. Plus global business finance and tech news
(00:23):
as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast with
Carol Masser and Tim Stenebeck on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
The latest on the Charlie Kirk assassination. The suspect in
the killing identified as Tyler Robinson, twenty two, of Utah
after a tip from a family member led to his apprehension.
Joining us is Josh wing Grove. He's Bloomberg New Senior
White House correspondent. He joins us from the White House.
He's featured on a new episode of the Bloomberg Big
Take podcast discussing Charlie Kirk's impact on conservatism. It's called
(00:53):
The Big Take, How Charlie Kirk Changed Conservatism. Josh joins
us from the White House. Josh, we spoke earlier with
Miles Miller about the latest on the case and what
we heard at the press conference earlier. I want to
take a big step back and understand the life and
legacy of Charlie Kirk because no question, an outside sports
when it comes to republic and politics, friends and close
to so many in this current administration. What is the
(01:15):
political legacy that he leaves behind.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
Yeah, I mean, he was arguably the most influential conservative
of his generation, starting with Turning Point USA, which looked
to mobilize conservatives on campus. Of course, American conservatives have
long complained that they don't get a fair shake on
college campuses, and you know, the professors there are too liberal,
and so they saw that as sort of one front
of the struggle to sort of expand the conservative tent,
(01:41):
as you will, and Kirk really led the push on that.
He was also a very early supporter and advocate for
Donald Trump specifically and spoke at its convention regularly. All
this of course at a young age. It was thirty
one when he was shot and killed on Wednesday. So
this is just a very very intent influential figure. It's
hard to really put into words. You know, Trump, his son,
(02:04):
Vice President Vance. You know, everyone is putting on statements
and mourning him. Of course, Trump himself this morning was
the one who announced the arrest of or let it
be a slip that there have been an arrest in
the case in Utah, and so Kirk's influence is just
so big. There questions now as to where this goes,
of course, including more logistical ones about who will run
turning point, can it still be as effective without Charlie Kirk,
(02:28):
and more broad questions about you know, where we go
from here. President Trump indicating that he you know, worries
or is treating this as part of a larger left
wing effort. And we should note there's no evidence yet
from investigators that that is fully the case, in other words,
that this shooter was participating in some sort of network.
(02:49):
But President Trump thinks it is growing from you know,
left wing protests and advocacy. In particularly this morning, renewed
his threat to potentially pursue some sort of racketeering investigation
investigation against George Soros, not for this, but more broadly
for funding flesh wing protesters. So this has the chance
to sort of be the basis on which Trump tries
to do stuff. And that's what's got a lot of
(03:10):
Democrats concerned.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
Got it.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
We just feel so broken, Josh in a moment of tragedy,
and all I can think about is his friends, his family,
you know, a loss of life. And I understand there's
a lot of political discourse out there, and it just
makes me think, like, why can't we all get along?
Why can't we discuss the differences we have? You know?
What is though, also the responsibility perhaps of those who
(03:32):
know Charlie Kirk, of the president, perhaps of the Republican
Party of Conservatives and maybe saying, hey, like enough, you know,
there's been too many political targets and shootings and incidents
and political violence. What's the responsibility of all politicians to
step forward and say, like, we need to stop this,
and what's the likelihood that any of that happens?
Speaker 3 (03:54):
I mean, the Utah governor has been calling to take
down the temperature in his press conference this morning. He's
a Republican. There are calls from both parties to do
that lest this sort of spiral into other violent acts
or without that even just sort of further embitter the
partisan kind of environment that we're living in here in
the US. But others don't see that, and there are
(04:17):
conservative voices right now calling for you know, the way
to sort of honor Charlie Kirk's legacy is to push
back against the progressive and left wing groups that Kirk
enjoyed sparring with. And so that's really the crossroads that
we're at. I should note the President Trump himself is
not really among those calling to take down the temperature.
(04:37):
He has said he supports nonviolent action, but he also
called Charlie kirkha martyr, and as I said earlier, as
indicated that he plans to pursue sort of other measures
in the wake of this fatal shooting on Wednesday, that,
of course, is being treated by authorities as a political assassination.
And so it is a fraught time here, no doubt
about it. And you know, Kirk is so influential in
(04:59):
the concern of community, the many you're simply grieving, including
people in this building behind me who knew him personally.
You know, this is just a tragedy where they've lost
someone they know important to their movement, but also just
on a personal level. It's also true that, of course
some Democrats were not the biggest fans of Charlie Kirk
and or you know, those who are speaking to that
(05:20):
right now are being seized upon by conservatives who think
this is not the time to be litigating what he
said or what he didn't and so this is all
just has the potential to really continue to be pretty fraud.
Of course, we should know that Kirk leaves behind a
wife and two kids. Focus on them as well right now,
including from Press Secretary Caroline Levitt, who sent well wishes
to his widow today. So this is just a tragedy
(05:42):
on Wednesday. The hope of courses that it doesn't continue
because we've seen too many of these. Of course, you know,
shooting in Minnesota lawmakers. Earlier in Minnesota we had the
of course of the arson outside Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro's home.
We've had shootings in the past of lawmakers, including Steve Scalize,
a Republican, including Gabby Gifford's a Democrat. There have been
too many of these in America, I think is a
(06:04):
pretty widely held view right now. And the question is
what can be done sort of bring down the temperature
and not have these sort of spiral into god forbid,
more violent acts. That's not something we should, you know,
anyone wants to see happened. I should know that the President
Trump is emphasizing though the acts that have targeted Republicans,
not so much the ones that have targeted Democrats. So
(06:25):
he's feeding sort of his audience a different view, a
partial view of the overall landscape of political violence that
we're seeing in America over recent years.
Speaker 5 (06:33):
Yeah, as we know, violence doesn't distinguish between parties, and
we certainly have seen that play out. Josh, I just
want to layer something else on top of it, and
has come out in some of the reporting and pointing
to global forces kind of jumping on and seizing on
you this moment of tragedy and turbulence in American politics.
(06:53):
Is there anything to that.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
I think it's a little early to say yet, but
there certainly are concerns and reports and indications that essentially
bought armies or pouring gas on the fire, for lack
of a better phrase, And that is a concern that
predated the fatal shooting of Charlie Kirk. You know, to
what extent are through social media platforms, Americans being exposed
or manipulated by foreign actors. This is a long standing issue.
(07:20):
We just don't know yet how much it's playing here.
But of course, yeah, it's a concern that this is
just another partisan issue that can be sort of seized
upon by America's enemies to inflame domestic political tensions.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Josh, A lot happening out of the nation's capital. We're
speaking with Josh Wingrove, he senior White House correspondent. I
want to talk a little bit about shifting gears, the
US urging G seven sanctions on Russian oil as President
Trump loses patients. I feel like the idea of losing
patients is something that we've heard with regard to Russia
quite a bit over the last few months. Josh, what's
(07:54):
the latest.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Yeah, the US is proposing that the G seven sort
of increased pressure on Russia, including by sanctioning China and
India for their purchases of Russian oil. Of course, the
US has taken steps towards India but not China itself,
and talking about some other measures that measures in terms
of trying to further monetize or even seize Russian assets
that are frozen. Of course, most of them are frozen
(08:18):
in Europe. In other words, the US can't get its
hands on it quite yet, so they're sort of trying
to tighten the screws on this at a time when
Europe is already considering its biggest sanctions package or more
recent as excuse me, sanctions package. I believe this would
be the nineteenth one. And so they're all kind of
deciding where to go from here. But of course the
Europeans are also juggling what they you know, what they
(08:38):
can count on from the US in terms of support
for Ukraine, support for NATO troop levels and all that
right now. So I think there are just so many
moving parts on this, but the US is at least
trying to get the G seven to to sort of
try to turn the temperature up. President Trump indicating this
morning in his interview with Fox News that he is
losing sort of you know, patients with President Putin a
(09:00):
little bit. But he had high hopes for that summit, remember,
you know, so that there were a lot of people clutching,
you know, the worried, I guess that it would backfire.
And we just haven't seen any movement since that summit.
And even behind me in this building, there's still photos
of President Putin and President Trump from that summit on
the walls of the White House. So he hasn't fully
exhausted patients yet. We haven't seen President Trump fully commit
(09:22):
to sort of you know, saying Oh, well, it doesn't
seem like Russia's interested in getting some sort of into
the fighting, so right now it remains in a murky area.
And if you're the Europeans, and in the case of
the G Seven also the Canadians and the Japanese, that
has to be part of your calculus right now. So
that's why there's so many movie pieces here as they
consider what they can do, or can't do, or don't
(09:42):
want to do to try to raise the pressure on Russia.
One final note that President Trump continues to advocate for
these secondary sanctions, in other words, sanctioning or tariffing, you know,
countries that do business with the countries that they're trying
to apply primary tariffs or restrictions to. That remains pretty
uncharted ground, pretty untested authority. That could be a tricky
(10:03):
one for the other countries to try to execute it,
even if they chose to try to go down that path.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Josh, appreciate you joining us on so much. Josh wingrove
Is Bloomberg new senior White House correspondent. Also make sure
to check out on the Bloomberg Terminal. A lot more
stories from our team in Washington, DC, including the President
sending the National Guard to Memphis in its next deployment.
Also for more on Charlie Kirk, check out the latest
episode of The Big Take podcast featuring josh Win Grove.
It covers the legacy of Charlie Kirk and how his
(10:29):
death is rippling through the political world. You're listening to
and watching Bloomberg BusinessWeek Daily.
Speaker 6 (10:35):
Stay with us.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
More from Bloomberg Business Week Daily coming up after this.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Catch
us live weekday afternoons from two to five eas during
Listen on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app,
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Speaker 5 (10:57):
Now, we want to get you some market news. There's
a lot going on in It's not just Gemini, which
is still up about thirty one percent in its first
day of trading, and we're going to talk about that
a little bit later on. We are also watching some
of what's going on in some of the different asset classes.
And I don't know if you've checked out gold recently, Tim,
but it has rallied by nearly forty percent this year.
It is making it one of the best performing commodities,
(11:19):
outpacing other market gauges, and that includes the S and
P five.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Hundred Central Bank buying geopolitical uncertainties inflows into ETFs, all
supporting the commodity. Our next guest is someone we've turned
to for years to talk gold and much more back
with us as Axel Merk, President and CIO of Merk Investments,
joining us from Menlo Park on the West Coast. He
manages the ASA Gold and Precious Medals Fund more than
one hundred percent so far this se here. The van
(11:43):
K mer GOLDIETF, with about two billion dollars in AUM meantime,
is up thirty eight percent year to date and invests
in the precious medal. Axel Carol mentioned how well the
fund has done and how well the commodity has done
in recent years. But let's look forward. What is the
outlook for the remainder of this? You're in your view
for gold.
Speaker 7 (12:01):
Great to be with you, and the fact that you're
covering gold, I suppose means it's got the attention of that.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
So is that the top is the top?
Speaker 6 (12:10):
What this means, if.
Speaker 7 (12:11):
Anything, is the most pessimistic thing I've heard about gold
in a long time. It took you so long to
get me on the air, right. But I mean, obviously
we've had a stunning run, right, and obviously we have
to keep in mind if something is this volatile on
the way up, there's always a risk on the downside correction.
(12:33):
That said, if that they are two key drivers. I
think one is in the US we have an easing
path at the FED, and if you take the European
Central Bank for example, as far as the eye can see,
rates are going to be steady, so we have a
more dabbish monitor policy. The other one is the broader
debasement trade. And of course is that correlation or causations
(12:57):
anybody's guess. If that is the case, that may have
legs that might last year, so to speak, right, the
dollar was always the cleanest shirt. One thing I'd like
to mention that maybe not the other guests are not mentioning,
is when when we talk about tariffs, it doesn't just
impact the trade and the flow of goods. It impacts
(13:19):
financial flows because that's the other side or of the
goods trade. And so I happen to believe that a
wrench has been thrown into the engine that we call
the exorbitant privilege, that it's more difficult to use the
US to finance things for higher returns abroad. Obviously this
is not a light switch or anything like that, but
(13:40):
a side effect. There's higher boring costs in the US,
and in the absence of physical discipline, it means more
pressure on the FED to low rates, and we've obviously
seen plenty of that, and so that's the dynamic that
has a lot of way to play out. And of
course the other context is that valuations are somewhat high,
and what do you in the equity marckets more broadly,
(14:00):
and what do you do to diversify. Now, I'm not
suggesting that the gold is very cheapyer, but gold historically
is one of the things that does well in an
easy environment, especially also that do as well if we
were to have a more severe correction the stock market,
and so an increasing number of people have been looking
for this sort of diversification.
Speaker 5 (14:18):
Well, what's interesting too, as we've seen gold take off
and you talk about throwing a rench into the US's
exorbitant privilege. I mean, I'm looking at the dollar, which
is the Dollar Index AXLE, which is down about ten
percent year date. Tim and I constantly are asking guests,
is the US and investible. You know, are the days
of the US dollar running supreme over? Although so much
(14:41):
is still done in dollars. Like I guess, we're just
trying to get an idea if this is a tipping
point where for the US dollar, especially too with the
kind of rise of digital and stable coins.
Speaker 7 (14:52):
Perhaps I don't think digital is stable. I mean the
stable coins are US dollar base. I actually think that's
supportive of the dollar of anything. If you look at
the breakdown in the G ten, the best performing currency
is the Swedish corona versus the dollar. And guess what
the Swedish economy is most as part of its GDP
exposed to to to defense spending and as you may be,
(15:16):
away of Europe is ramping up its defense spending. So
there are specific things right and and of course, as
a as a as a gold person, the debasement trait
kind of fits into our narrative. Whether that's really the
case is it remains to be seen. There is of
course more competition, and some people say that there is
(15:37):
no alternative, and while that may be true, my argument
is there does not need to be an alternative. What
I foresee is a greater fragmentation because if if you
think I go back to the exorbit of privilege. Part
of that is it's it's kind of a machinery. That's
that that provides liquidity for the for the world. And
(15:58):
if that begins to spiral somehow or is less effective
than it has been us efficient, it doesn't mean the
world's coming to an end, but it means that less
trade might be happening, more things might be happening locally. Ultimately,
that's of course healthy for emerging markets in particular if
they finance more things domestically. But we have some structural
(16:18):
transformations and the dollar might be weakening in that problem.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
He just got about twenty five seconds, Axel. So buy
gold by the commodity, by the bullion by minors, or
don't buy any of it at this point, Well, I
do both.
Speaker 7 (16:31):
I haven't sold any of them. Make the gold and
gold minor buyers are very different. The gold minus tend
to respeculative, especially go to the more genius and the
physical gold. It's the retf otherwise tends to be more
of a diversification play. There's a lot that hasn't happened
in the junior mining space. Very speculative, but some very
interesting opportunities.
Speaker 5 (16:50):
Yeah, all right, we promise we will catch up more often.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
Hey, hey, he was on in May. If you were
watching us in May, it's a little six Okay, so
it was a little while ago, but you.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
Know, we always appreciate Axel. Have a great weekend, Axel
Mark Present, Chief Investment Officer of American Investments.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
Stay with us.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
More from Bloomberg Business Week Daily coming up after this.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Listen live
each weekday starting at two pm Eastern on Applecarflay, and
Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also
listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station.
Just say Alexa, play Bloomberg eleven thirty. Only only he
(17:35):
can lead the company's next phase and his political engagement.
Speaker 7 (17:38):
It's up to him.
Speaker 5 (17:39):
As just two of the many, many headlines out of
the Bloomberg Technology Team interview at Tesla board chair Robin
Denholm bottom line, Tesla's chair saying Elon Musk is the
man to continue to take Tesla to its next phase.
Speaker 8 (17:53):
The board's responsibility is to look at who the CEO
is for the next period of time, and we believe
that is the right CEO for Tesla over this transformative
period of time, and our view is he's a generational leader.
There aren't any other people out there like Elon who
can actually lead the company over this next decade or so,
(18:16):
and so once you decide who the leader should be,
you need to put in place the compensation package to
incent and motivate him to actually deliver natually.
Speaker 5 (18:28):
Knowledge would motivate me as well. That, of course, was
Tesla board chair Robin Denholm talking to B Tech.
Speaker 7 (18:33):
The b Tech.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
Dynamo dynamic duo of Ed Ludlow and Caroline hyde A
is co host of Bloomberg Technology every Monday through Friday
eleven am Wall Street Time on Bloomberg TV. He joins
us now from the Bloomberg News Bureau in San Francisco.
Tesla shares, by the way, folks, ralling up about six
and a half percent. The number two gainer in both
the S and P five hundred and now is TAK
one hundred today and well done, well done, well done.
(18:57):
You guys covered so much it was and it always
is so much to cover when it's involving Elon and Tesla.
What was a priority for you and Caroline and really
your team as you thought about your interview with Robin Denhol.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
Yeah, when the news broke a week ago that there
was a proposed pay package for Elon Musk, the headline
was the trillion dollar value of the total award, right,
But because of how the board had to communicate it
in the proxy, it's like a very dense, three hundred
plus page document that it's incumbent on shareholders to read
(19:32):
the specifics. Get lost a little bit, and for me,
you guys mentioned the politics angle. One of the few
things that was like very explicitly codified in the proxy
was that the board had got reassurances from Elon Musk
that he would wind down political activity. Now, actually, the
(19:52):
big takeaway from the interview was that they are actually
pretty relaxed about the idea that Musk might continue to
have in the political domain. You know, we pushed so
hard when you guys say political activity, and when I said, sorry,
that was too casual. When the board says political activity,
what do you even mean? We asked that, do you
(20:12):
mean Musk has told you he won't participate in a
political party, or he'll stop making donations behind specific candidates
or initiatives, and Denholm's response was really simple, is it's
up to Elon Musk what his political activity is. But
they are reassured enough that this package they will get
in return somebody that will be focused on Tesla.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
You know, it's an I appreciated how you pushed her
ed because if you think about Elon Musk's own political evolution,
I mean, he said in the spring of last year
that he wasn't going to donate to either political candidate.
This was when Joe Biden and Donald Trump were running
against each other. That all changed after Butler Pennsylvania in
the assassination attempt, and then you know, Elon went full
fledged and even served as part you know, in the
(20:55):
administration in the capacity of Prdoge. So we saw how
quickly he changed his mind in a very short period
of time. So I guess it can only be up
to him because he's the one who makes these decisions.
Speaker 6 (21:09):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
Well well the way that Robin Denholm put it, and
you know this wasn't on the record on camera interview,
and miss Denholm, I'm sure chose her words very carefully,
but she said that Musk's political activity or time in
government has concluded and he is now back focused on Tesla.
(21:30):
You know, the main thing that we got to it
was a long interview, right, but that again the details
like so important in what the board is requiring a
enon Musk, you know, these are not goals. The word
goal is not correct to say that Musk gets a
trillion dollars in the end if he hits goals, they're
mandatory requirements. And if he doesn't hit the operational and
(21:53):
financial goals. Denholm was very clear like he doesn't get
not the dollar value comp But remember at the heart
of this is that elon Musk's condition, it was a
negotiation and what he wanted was voting power, because Musk's
idea is that with greater voting power he will be
able to keep Tesla focused on a future that is
(22:16):
about artificial intelligence, not necessarily the legacy of Tesla, which
is selling electric vehicles to consumers.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
Well, speaking of power and voting power and just power generally,
I mean, there's been a lot of criticism I think
it's fair to say ed of the Tesla board and
who's in charge in you know, Robin Denholm. I mean,
I'm looking at the Bloomberg description Australian business executive former
Countan who's chair of Tesla, chosen by Elon in November
(22:45):
twenty eighteen to be chair, and prior to that she
is relatively unknown. I'm just curious about the board and
correct me because you know this company, but nothing's correct.
What do we need to know about the Tesla board
and what they say and what it really means to work?
(23:05):
Lan Kennon can't do.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
I regret not saying this out loud explicitly, even if
I did not then ask, you know, I should have
asked about it. But basically, the criticism from all kinds
of investors, the biggest institutionals on Wall Street to the
smallest retail investors is that it's a rubber stamp board
that just does what Elon Musk wants. There's something really
important to understand that it was a special committee that
(23:29):
negotiated meeting with Elon Musk ten times this compensation package,
so Musk had input into it. But the special committee
is made up of just two people, Robin Denholm and
then Kathleen Wilson Thompson, who also kind of shairs the
financial and comp committee on the Tesla board. A board
of two or a committee of two because Elon Musk
(23:51):
is on the board, so he recuses himself technically even
though he negotiates. And then his brother, Kimball Musk, is
on the board of Tesla, but he's brother, so he
recuses himself from negotiating the comp It actually was really
important to say that out loud. Now at the end
of the day, it's a shareholder right to vote on
(24:14):
this package. On November sixth and a lot of Denholm
was explaining and she really wanted to get this across.
This is a proposal, you have the right to vote
on it, so you need to understand what's in it,
even though there is some sort of you know, there
is skepticism about how solid that board is. Robin Denholm
lives in Australia for what it's worth, but I can
(24:35):
tell you from conversations in the company investors that I
know she's highly engaged, reads everything, knows everything that's going on.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Ed, Well, you've been on air with us. There's been
some breaking news that we'd love for you to react
to this about Apple Company that you follow very closely.
Mark German reporting that Apple's AI and search executive Robbie Walker,
Robbie Walker will leave the company, one of the iPhone
maker's most senior AI executives. This, according people with knowledge
of the matter, this follows a slew of folks who've
(25:04):
left in recent months, not just to go to meta
platforms for those huge pay packages. What's your immediate reaction to.
Speaker 4 (25:10):
This, Well, I'm just checking at the stock. You guys
have the ticker up, okay, so the shares haven't sort
of plummeted. What I know is limited about Robbie Walker.
He had been reporting to John g Andrea, which I'm
sure on this show you've discussed Mark's other reporting, which
was about who was in charge. So to a point,
(25:33):
John g Andrea had led the AI team, and a
lot of the departures that we've reported on in Aggregate
have left had been reporting.
Speaker 3 (25:43):
On to him.
Speaker 4 (25:43):
But you have to remember that Craig Federigi, who's like
the software chief, the software guru at Apple, he had
sort of taken command of the team. So I guess,
and I pull up the draft and I'm scrambling to
find it. But give me for that. But I think
that it's just a signal that these exits have continued
(26:04):
since that restructure.
Speaker 5 (26:05):
Is what I was going to say, no, you're you're
laying it out really well.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
And the news came out when when Ed was speaking
about Tesla. So yeah, yeah, OK, I'm believing.
Speaker 5 (26:15):
I guess his serial role. Walker became one of the
top Apple execs working on the new AI powered web
search system to compete with Perplexity and chat GBT. It's
scheduled to debut next year. So yeah, I kind of fluid.
Speaker 4 (26:28):
Huh Yeah, I mean, I'm doing this deliberately because it's relevant.
Speaker 5 (26:33):
You know.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Part of the Denholm conversation about why it has to
be Elon Musk that leads Tesla is that you have
right now this huge talent war. Apple is one of
the losers of it. Let's be honest. Based on the reporting,
Meta is paying over the nose to get people. And
Denholm's argument about Elon Musk is that he's a draw,
(26:55):
so the compensation doesn't really matter. People want to go
and work for him because he's seen as this great
engineering mind and he's so hands on, you know, in
the trenches. I believe he's been in. The building I
was in is three thousand Hanavi Street, which is like
the Global Engineering HQ, and Elon Musk was there this
week and getting involved in stuff that's the landscape right now.
(27:16):
So these stories are so interesting because for AI, you know,
the human capital, the human intelligence that's building out AI.
That is a battleground, right, and that's all like I'm
reflecting on.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
Yeah, all right, great stuff. As always, Thank you, Thank you,
ed La Low breaking news are talking about breaking news
in real time as well as folding it into an
incredible interview that he and Caroline Hyde of the Bloomberg
Tech Team had with the chair of Tesla's board, Eda Low,
As we said, co host of Bloomberg Tech. Joining us
from our San Francisco bureau.
Speaker 6 (27:50):
Stay with us.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
More from Bloomberg Business Week Daily coming up after this.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Catch
us live weekday afternoons from two to five eastering. Listen
on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business Up,
or watch us live on YouTube.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
Roam.
Speaker 5 (28:14):
How about you let me drive?
Speaker 2 (28:15):
Oh no, no, no no, this is not a toy, please.
Speaker 4 (28:20):
Honey, please, how do the gravels listen?
Speaker 7 (28:23):
I want to drive. It's a good question. Good time.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
This is the drive to the clothes cons the musing
well down on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 5 (28:39):
All right, everybody, we've got just about eighteen nineteen minutes
to go until we wrap up the trade on this Friday,
wrapping up the Friday session and also the week overall.
Gotta say very clear what I love about the Bloomberg
is I always have these charts up of the S
and P down and the Nasdaq one hundred.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
That's it, looking what's going on.
Speaker 5 (28:55):
You've got the S and P at its lows of
the session, so a straight leg down. We're down only
eight points, but the point is we're definitely off our
best levels of the session, and we've seen this movement
in like the last twenty thirty minutes. So makes me
wonder a little bit of what's going on. Maybe people
ahead of the FED meeting next week closing out positions.
I'm not quite sure. Downjown's industrial average, it is down
(29:17):
two hundred and eighty three points, down six tens of
a percent, and NASDEK one hundred still in positive territory
of about one third of one percent, but it too
has rolled over off its best level of the session.
So I'm taking a look at our markets live blog
to see what is going on. Yeah, maybe it's just investors.
It's been a bullish week for investors. We've seen several
(29:41):
records and I'm just taking a look at where the
S and P five hundred is for the week. Overall,
we're still up about one and a half percent. So
do you just kind of, for lack of a better phrase,
take some money off the table heading into the weekend.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
And up twelve percent for the year. Let's see what
Alan Lance has to say about this. He's president of
the ria Allen b. Lands In Associates and director of
research at the research firm Lance Global. He joins us
once again from Toledo, Ohio. Been a while since we
last had you on the program. Allen, how are you.
Speaker 6 (30:08):
We're doing well?
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Are you too, We're doing well. It's good to talk
to you again. I wanted to just get your idea
about where we are in this market cycle, given I
think a lot has happened, especially since April so called
Liberation Day and the way that investors have essentially shrugged
off the threat or implementation of tariffs.
Speaker 9 (30:29):
Yeah, it's been an incredible rebound and I agree with
what investors are doing as far as the close here,
and that's taken a little bit of profits. When you
look at a company like Oracle, that's one of our
core positions.
Speaker 6 (30:40):
But I'd be much.
Speaker 9 (30:41):
More inclined to take partial profits there and redeploy them
into areas that haven't moved mitigate risk rather than chasing.
I think we're about in the sixth inning. I know
you have a lot of people on and they're talking
first second inning, but really, when you look at the
valuations here and now the IPO market's certain heat, we
still have the ways to go.
Speaker 6 (31:01):
We're not at the end of this, but we're, you know,
more than halfway through.
Speaker 9 (31:05):
So so those people loading up and chasing the AI plays,
I think, uh, you know, uh, you got to be
numble enough to get out in time, that's for sure.
Speaker 5 (31:16):
Well, investors look like they're getting out ahead of the weekend.
I think it's kind of notable. And I'm sure you've
got your screens up and you're looking at the trade.
Is it just good week, bullush week? And maybe you
just take a little bit of a breather ahead of
next week's FED meeting or what.
Speaker 9 (31:31):
Yeah, I think you got some positives and and they're
getting discounted, Carol, So you get a situation where you know,
it looks like interest rates will go down.
Speaker 6 (31:39):
You know, the IPO markets heating up. Uh, you know,
good news with with you know, some of.
Speaker 9 (31:44):
The tech stocks and uhs as far as even the
uh you know TAM you know situations as far as
with the video and what have you. So I think
it's it's a situation where why not take some money
off the table.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
UH.
Speaker 9 (31:58):
The interesting thing, there's still some good by out there.
You know, some you know leaders that haven't moved early
part of the summer. We're buying Johnson Johnson and Pepsi.
They have moved now with their other companies that have
good dividends that I still think are attractive. So this
is not like a two thousand and seven we talked
and said, you know, get out and everything's overvalued. But
(32:18):
it is something where I think you got to be
a little precarious as far as in chasing.
Speaker 2 (32:23):
You said last year you started taking profits in in
video that was that when it was out one hundred
and forty dollars. You said you then redeployed some of
those profits into companies like Snowflake or Mango dB. Do
you regret selling in video last year at one not
at all.
Speaker 9 (32:41):
You know, if you look at Snowflake, it's done better
in the past year than than NA Video. And you know,
Mango DV at the end of the year was down
and it's up, you know, so again I think, you know,
investors look at it like, oh, you know in videos hired,
you know, one seventies now instead of one forty. But
really it's been an underperformer compared to you know, the industry,
(33:05):
which is hard to believe. Even Oracle it's up you know,
forty some percent over the last five years. The industry's
up eighteen eighteen is great, But if you're in the
right areas, you can do you know, much more. So
I think that diversification is important, tim and investors shouldn't
just be in one or two or seven stocks, you know.
I think it's going to broaden out, and that's what
(33:25):
you have in the latter innings and that's what we're seeing.
Speaker 6 (33:28):
So yeah, you know, we're actually doing more of that.
Speaker 5 (33:31):
Well, if I'm doing play by play with the markets
right now, we've now bounced kind of off our worst
levels of the session on the S and PN down
and we've seen investors come back. Blacky trade weird I
don't know. Am I just too laser focused on the
tick by tick today?
Speaker 7 (33:47):
I don't know.
Speaker 6 (33:49):
Yeah, that's short term. I wouldn't worry about that.
Speaker 9 (33:51):
I think the long term trends is, you know, it's
going to be you know, the critical you know area.
As far as that goes, and there's good you know investments,
it still can be you know, purchase, which which you
know I'm appreciative of. If everything's overvalued, then it gets
really hard.
Speaker 6 (34:06):
So so to.
Speaker 9 (34:07):
Takes some money off the table, even in video, I
think we'll go higher, you know, but take some money
off the table and buy things that haven't moved yet,
that have lesser risk, better risk reward, I think is
prudent strategy right now.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
I want to talk a little bit about risks that
you see out there and when you think it's time to,
if at all, move to cash or you know, it's
a question. I don't ask lightly because that's a drastic
move for investors, and you know, people are always saying,
do not time the market. I'm not giving financial advice here,
but I'm just wondering how you're thinking about risk right now,
because there are a lot of folks out there. You say,
(34:42):
valuations are very high.
Speaker 9 (34:44):
Yeah, they are high in certain areas, and that's why
you know, we are starting to take profits and you
know again partial profits in Oracle and and companies have
done well like in video. But I also think that
there are areas you can still buy so you don't
have to be and cash like in two thousand and
seven and late nineteen ninety nine we're saying get in
(35:05):
cash and be defensive. Now I think you could be
defensive but still have companies that have dividends and are
trading it historic lows really valuation wise in it. That's
what makes us divergence, you know, interesting where you can
get out and take some good profits or partial profits
and redeploy the money and things that have yeah, lesser
risk and better reward, like you know, as far as
(35:29):
snow Frock had a year ago.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Alan, sorry to jump in, but we've got like we've
got a million questions left and only like a minute left.
I just want to talk MP Materials because we had
Jim Litinski on the show. We've spent a lot of
time talking about that company. It was on your radar
before it was on a lot of people's radar. You
spoke with us about buying it. What's the status there?
Speaker 6 (35:45):
We would hold it again, not chase it. You know,
we're buying it. You know, in the mid twenties it
went down to ten. We're just buying more. Just long
term play, you know, two good pieces of news.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
You know.
Speaker 9 (35:57):
Earlier this summer we increased our target to eighty to
ninety dollars, so we did take some profits. But again
I think it's a good long term play. Again, another
one of those high flowers that we would in chase.
But you know, hopefully we can find some like MP
materials from you know, six months ago that will do well,
even though I don't think you'll see.
Speaker 5 (36:17):
Those kind of games twenty seconds really quick. You're comfortable
with the government taking a stake, Yeah, I think on this.
Speaker 6 (36:24):
It's very important.
Speaker 9 (36:25):
I disagree with the intel and with the airspace and
what have you, but on this I think it is
critical and it really helped with the company.
Speaker 6 (36:34):
On the map.
Speaker 5 (36:35):
As we mentioned, this stock has been on a tear.
It is more than three hundred percent yre today. Ellen
Lance have a great weekend. President of Allen B. Lance
and Associates joining us from Toledo, Ohio.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily podcast, available on Apple, Spotify,
and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live weekday
afternoons from two to five pm Eastern on Bloomberg dot com,
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(37:06):
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Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. This is Bloomberg Business
Weekdaily reporting from the magazine that helps global leaders stay
ahead with insight on the people, companies, and trends shaping
today's complex economy. Plus global business finance and tech news
(00:23):
as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast with
Carol Masser and Tim Stenebeck on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
The latest on the Charlie Kirk assassination. The suspect in
the killing identified as Tyler Robinson, twenty two, of Utah
after a tip from a family member led to his apprehension.
Joining us is Josh wing Grove. He's Bloomberg New Senior
White House correspondent. He joins us from the White House.
He's featured on a new episode of the Bloomberg Big
Take podcast discussing Charlie Kirk's impact on conservatism. It's called
(00:53):
The Big Take, How Charlie Kirk Changed Conservatism. Josh joins
us from the White House. Josh, we spoke earlier with
Miles Miller about the latest on the case and what
we heard at the press conference earlier. I want to
take a big step back and understand the life and
legacy of Charlie Kirk because no question, an outside sports
when it comes to republic and politics, friends and close
to so many in this current administration. What is the
(01:15):
political legacy that he leaves behind.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
Yeah, I mean, he was arguably the most influential conservative
of his generation, starting with Turning Point USA, which looked
to mobilize conservatives on campus. Of course, American conservatives have
long complained that they don't get a fair shake on
college campuses, and you know, the professors there are too liberal,
and so they saw that as sort of one front
of the struggle to sort of expand the conservative tent,
(01:41):
as you will, and Kirk really led the push on that.
He was also a very early supporter and advocate for
Donald Trump specifically and spoke at its convention regularly. All
this of course at a young age. It was thirty
one when he was shot and killed on Wednesday. So
this is just a very very intent influential figure. It's
hard to really put into words. You know, Trump, his son,
(02:04):
Vice President Vance. You know, everyone is putting on statements
and mourning him. Of course, Trump himself this morning was
the one who announced the arrest of or let it
be a slip that there have been an arrest in
the case in Utah, and so Kirk's influence is just
so big. There questions now as to where this goes,
of course, including more logistical ones about who will run
turning point, can it still be as effective without Charlie Kirk,
(02:28):
and more broad questions about you know, where we go
from here. President Trump indicating that he you know, worries
or is treating this as part of a larger left
wing effort. And we should note there's no evidence yet
from investigators that that is fully the case, in other words,
that this shooter was participating in some sort of network.
(02:49):
But President Trump thinks it is growing from you know,
left wing protests and advocacy. In particularly this morning, renewed
his threat to potentially pursue some sort of racketeering investigation
investigation against George Soros, not for this, but more broadly
for funding flesh wing protesters. So this has the chance
to sort of be the basis on which Trump tries
to do stuff. And that's what's got a lot of
(03:10):
Democrats concerned.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
Got it.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
We just feel so broken, Josh in a moment of tragedy,
and all I can think about is his friends, his family,
you know, a loss of life. And I understand there's
a lot of political discourse out there, and it just
makes me think, like, why can't we all get along?
Why can't we discuss the differences we have? You know?
What is though, also the responsibility perhaps of those who
(03:32):
know Charlie Kirk, of the president, perhaps of the Republican
Party of Conservatives and maybe saying, hey, like enough, you know,
there's been too many political targets and shootings and incidents
and political violence. What's the responsibility of all politicians to
step forward and say, like, we need to stop this,
and what's the likelihood that any of that happens?
Speaker 3 (03:54):
I mean, the Utah governor has been calling to take
down the temperature in his press conference this morning. He's
a Republican. There are calls from both parties to do
that lest this sort of spiral into other violent acts
or without that even just sort of further embitter the
partisan kind of environment that we're living in here in
the US. But others don't see that, and there are
(04:17):
conservative voices right now calling for you know, the way
to sort of honor Charlie Kirk's legacy is to push
back against the progressive and left wing groups that Kirk
enjoyed sparring with. And so that's really the crossroads that
we're at. I should note the President Trump himself is
not really among those calling to take down the temperature.
(04:37):
He has said he supports nonviolent action, but he also
called Charlie kirkha martyr, and as I said earlier, as
indicated that he plans to pursue sort of other measures
in the wake of this fatal shooting on Wednesday, that,
of course, is being treated by authorities as a political assassination.
And so it is a fraught time here, no doubt
about it. And you know, Kirk is so influential in
(04:59):
the concern of community, the many you're simply grieving, including
people in this building behind me who knew him personally.
You know, this is just a tragedy where they've lost
someone they know important to their movement, but also just
on a personal level. It's also true that, of course
some Democrats were not the biggest fans of Charlie Kirk
and or you know, those who are speaking to that
(05:20):
right now are being seized upon by conservatives who think
this is not the time to be litigating what he
said or what he didn't and so this is all
just has the potential to really continue to be pretty fraud.
Of course, we should know that Kirk leaves behind a
wife and two kids. Focus on them as well right now,
including from Press Secretary Caroline Levitt, who sent well wishes
to his widow today. So this is just a tragedy
(05:42):
on Wednesday. The hope of courses that it doesn't continue
because we've seen too many of these. Of course, you know,
shooting in Minnesota lawmakers. Earlier in Minnesota we had the
of course of the arson outside Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro's home.
We've had shootings in the past of lawmakers, including Steve Scalize,
a Republican, including Gabby Gifford's a Democrat. There have been
too many of these in America, I think is a
(06:04):
pretty widely held view right now. And the question is
what can be done sort of bring down the temperature
and not have these sort of spiral into god forbid,
more violent acts. That's not something we should, you know,
anyone wants to see happened. I should know that the President
Trump is emphasizing though the acts that have targeted Republicans,
not so much the ones that have targeted Democrats. So
(06:25):
he's feeding sort of his audience a different view, a
partial view of the overall landscape of political violence that
we're seeing in America over recent years.
Speaker 5 (06:33):
Yeah, as we know, violence doesn't distinguish between parties, and
we certainly have seen that play out. Josh, I just
want to layer something else on top of it, and
has come out in some of the reporting and pointing
to global forces kind of jumping on and seizing on
you this moment of tragedy and turbulence in American politics.
(06:53):
Is there anything to that.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
I think it's a little early to say yet, but
there certainly are concerns and reports and indications that essentially
bought armies or pouring gas on the fire, for lack
of a better phrase, And that is a concern that
predated the fatal shooting of Charlie Kirk. You know, to
what extent are through social media platforms, Americans being exposed
or manipulated by foreign actors. This is a long standing issue.
(07:20):
We just don't know yet how much it's playing here.
But of course, yeah, it's a concern that this is
just another partisan issue that can be sort of seized
upon by America's enemies to inflame domestic political tensions.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Josh, A lot happening out of the nation's capital. We're
speaking with Josh Wingrove, he senior White House correspondent. I
want to talk a little bit about shifting gears, the
US urging G seven sanctions on Russian oil as President
Trump loses patients. I feel like the idea of losing
patients is something that we've heard with regard to Russia
quite a bit over the last few months. Josh, what's
(07:54):
the latest.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Yeah, the US is proposing that the G seven sort
of increased pressure on Russia, including by sanctioning China and
India for their purchases of Russian oil. Of course, the
US has taken steps towards India but not China itself,
and talking about some other measures that measures in terms
of trying to further monetize or even seize Russian assets
that are frozen. Of course, most of them are frozen
(08:18):
in Europe. In other words, the US can't get its
hands on it quite yet, so they're sort of trying
to tighten the screws on this at a time when
Europe is already considering its biggest sanctions package or more
recent as excuse me, sanctions package. I believe this would
be the nineteenth one. And so they're all kind of
deciding where to go from here. But of course the
Europeans are also juggling what they you know, what they
(08:38):
can count on from the US in terms of support
for Ukraine, support for NATO troop levels and all that
right now. So I think there are just so many
moving parts on this, but the US is at least
trying to get the G seven to to sort of
try to turn the temperature up. President Trump indicating this
morning in his interview with Fox News that he is
losing sort of you know, patients with President Putin a
(09:00):
little bit. But he had high hopes for that summit, remember,
you know, so that there were a lot of people clutching,
you know, the worried, I guess that it would backfire.
And we just haven't seen any movement since that summit.
And even behind me in this building, there's still photos
of President Putin and President Trump from that summit on
the walls of the White House. So he hasn't fully
exhausted patients yet. We haven't seen President Trump fully commit
(09:22):
to sort of you know, saying Oh, well, it doesn't
seem like Russia's interested in getting some sort of into
the fighting, so right now it remains in a murky area.
And if you're the Europeans, and in the case of
the G Seven also the Canadians and the Japanese, that
has to be part of your calculus right now. So
that's why there's so many movie pieces here as they
consider what they can do, or can't do, or don't
(09:42):
want to do to try to raise the pressure on Russia.
One final note that President Trump continues to advocate for
these secondary sanctions, in other words, sanctioning or tariffing, you know,
countries that do business with the countries that they're trying
to apply primary tariffs or restrictions to. That remains pretty
uncharted ground, pretty untested authority. That could be a tricky
(10:03):
one for the other countries to try to execute it,
even if they chose to try to go down that path.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Josh, appreciate you joining us on so much. Josh wingrove
Is Bloomberg new senior White House correspondent. Also make sure
to check out on the Bloomberg Terminal. A lot more
stories from our team in Washington, DC, including the President
sending the National Guard to Memphis in its next deployment.
Also for more on Charlie Kirk, check out the latest
episode of The Big Take podcast featuring josh Win Grove.
It covers the legacy of Charlie Kirk and how his
(10:29):
death is rippling through the political world. You're listening to
and watching Bloomberg BusinessWeek Daily.
Speaker 6 (10:35):
Stay with us.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
More from Bloomberg Business Week Daily coming up after this.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Catch
us live weekday afternoons from two to five eas during
Listen on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app,
or watch us Live on YouTube.
Speaker 5 (10:57):
Now, we want to get you some market news. There's
a lot going on in It's not just Gemini, which
is still up about thirty one percent in its first
day of trading, and we're going to talk about that
a little bit later on. We are also watching some
of what's going on in some of the different asset classes.
And I don't know if you've checked out gold recently, Tim,
but it has rallied by nearly forty percent this year.
It is making it one of the best performing commodities,
(11:19):
outpacing other market gauges, and that includes the S and
P five.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Hundred Central Bank buying geopolitical uncertainties inflows into ETFs, all
supporting the commodity. Our next guest is someone we've turned
to for years to talk gold and much more back
with us as Axel Merk, President and CIO of Merk Investments,
joining us from Menlo Park on the West Coast. He
manages the ASA Gold and Precious Medals Fund more than
one hundred percent so far this se here. The van
(11:43):
K mer GOLDIETF, with about two billion dollars in AUM meantime,
is up thirty eight percent year to date and invests
in the precious medal. Axel Carol mentioned how well the
fund has done and how well the commodity has done
in recent years. But let's look forward. What is the
outlook for the remainder of this? You're in your view
for gold.
Speaker 7 (12:01):
Great to be with you, and the fact that you're
covering gold, I suppose means it's got the attention of that.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
So is that the top is the top?
Speaker 6 (12:10):
What this means, if.
Speaker 7 (12:11):
Anything, is the most pessimistic thing I've heard about gold
in a long time. It took you so long to
get me on the air, right. But I mean, obviously
we've had a stunning run, right, and obviously we have
to keep in mind if something is this volatile on
the way up, there's always a risk on the downside correction.
(12:33):
That said, if that they are two key drivers. I
think one is in the US we have an easing
path at the FED, and if you take the European
Central Bank for example, as far as the eye can see,
rates are going to be steady, so we have a
more dabbish monitor policy. The other one is the broader
debasement trade. And of course is that correlation or causations
(12:57):
anybody's guess. If that is the case, that may have
legs that might last year, so to speak, right, the
dollar was always the cleanest shirt. One thing I'd like
to mention that maybe not the other guests are not mentioning,
is when when we talk about tariffs, it doesn't just
impact the trade and the flow of goods. It impacts
(13:19):
financial flows because that's the other side or of the
goods trade. And so I happen to believe that a
wrench has been thrown into the engine that we call
the exorbitant privilege, that it's more difficult to use the
US to finance things for higher returns abroad. Obviously this
is not a light switch or anything like that, but
(13:40):
a side effect. There's higher boring costs in the US,
and in the absence of physical discipline, it means more
pressure on the FED to low rates, and we've obviously
seen plenty of that, and so that's the dynamic that
has a lot of way to play out. And of
course the other context is that valuations are somewhat high,
and what do you in the equity marckets more broadly,
(14:00):
and what do you do to diversify. Now, I'm not
suggesting that the gold is very cheapyer, but gold historically
is one of the things that does well in an
easy environment, especially also that do as well if we
were to have a more severe correction the stock market,
and so an increasing number of people have been looking
for this sort of diversification.
Speaker 5 (14:18):
Well, what's interesting too, as we've seen gold take off
and you talk about throwing a rench into the US's
exorbitant privilege. I mean, I'm looking at the dollar, which
is the Dollar Index AXLE, which is down about ten
percent year date. Tim and I constantly are asking guests,
is the US and investible. You know, are the days
of the US dollar running supreme over? Although so much
(14:41):
is still done in dollars. Like I guess, we're just
trying to get an idea if this is a tipping
point where for the US dollar, especially too with the
kind of rise of digital and stable coins.
Speaker 7 (14:52):
Perhaps I don't think digital is stable. I mean the
stable coins are US dollar base. I actually think that's
supportive of the dollar of anything. If you look at
the breakdown in the G ten, the best performing currency
is the Swedish corona versus the dollar. And guess what
the Swedish economy is most as part of its GDP
exposed to to to defense spending and as you may be,
(15:16):
away of Europe is ramping up its defense spending. So
there are specific things right and and of course, as
a as a as a gold person, the debasement trait
kind of fits into our narrative. Whether that's really the
case is it remains to be seen. There is of
course more competition, and some people say that there is
(15:37):
no alternative, and while that may be true, my argument
is there does not need to be an alternative. What
I foresee is a greater fragmentation because if if you
think I go back to the exorbit of privilege. Part
of that is it's it's kind of a machinery. That's
that that provides liquidity for the for the world. And
(15:58):
if that begins to spiral somehow or is less effective
than it has been us efficient, it doesn't mean the
world's coming to an end, but it means that less
trade might be happening, more things might be happening locally. Ultimately,
that's of course healthy for emerging markets in particular if
they finance more things domestically. But we have some structural
(16:18):
transformations and the dollar might be weakening in that problem.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
He just got about twenty five seconds, Axel. So buy
gold by the commodity, by the bullion by minors, or
don't buy any of it at this point, Well, I
do both.
Speaker 7 (16:31):
I haven't sold any of them. Make the gold and
gold minor buyers are very different. The gold minus tend
to respeculative, especially go to the more genius and the
physical gold. It's the retf otherwise tends to be more
of a diversification play. There's a lot that hasn't happened
in the junior mining space. Very speculative, but some very
interesting opportunities.
Speaker 5 (16:50):
Yeah, all right, we promise we will catch up more often.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
Hey, hey, he was on in May. If you were
watching us in May, it's a little six Okay, so
it was a little while ago, but you.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
Know, we always appreciate Axel. Have a great weekend, Axel
Mark Present, Chief Investment Officer of American Investments.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
Stay with us.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
More from Bloomberg Business Week Daily coming up after this.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Listen live
each weekday starting at two pm Eastern on Applecarflay, and
Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also
listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station.
Just say Alexa, play Bloomberg eleven thirty. Only only he
(17:35):
can lead the company's next phase and his political engagement.
Speaker 7 (17:38):
It's up to him.
Speaker 5 (17:39):
As just two of the many, many headlines out of
the Bloomberg Technology Team interview at Tesla board chair Robin
Denholm bottom line, Tesla's chair saying Elon Musk is the
man to continue to take Tesla to its next phase.
Speaker 8 (17:53):
The board's responsibility is to look at who the CEO
is for the next period of time, and we believe
that is the right CEO for Tesla over this transformative
period of time, and our view is he's a generational leader.
There aren't any other people out there like Elon who
can actually lead the company over this next decade or so,
(18:16):
and so once you decide who the leader should be,
you need to put in place the compensation package to
incent and motivate him to actually deliver natually.
Speaker 5 (18:28):
Knowledge would motivate me as well. That, of course, was
Tesla board chair Robin Denholm talking to B Tech.
Speaker 7 (18:33):
The b Tech.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
Dynamo dynamic duo of Ed Ludlow and Caroline hyde A
is co host of Bloomberg Technology every Monday through Friday
eleven am Wall Street Time on Bloomberg TV. He joins
us now from the Bloomberg News Bureau in San Francisco.
Tesla shares, by the way, folks, ralling up about six
and a half percent. The number two gainer in both
the S and P five hundred and now is TAK
one hundred today and well done, well done, well done.
(18:57):
You guys covered so much it was and it always
is so much to cover when it's involving Elon and Tesla.
What was a priority for you and Caroline and really
your team as you thought about your interview with Robin Denhol.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
Yeah, when the news broke a week ago that there
was a proposed pay package for Elon Musk, the headline
was the trillion dollar value of the total award, right,
But because of how the board had to communicate it
in the proxy, it's like a very dense, three hundred
plus page document that it's incumbent on shareholders to read
(19:32):
the specifics. Get lost a little bit, and for me,
you guys mentioned the politics angle. One of the few
things that was like very explicitly codified in the proxy
was that the board had got reassurances from Elon Musk
that he would wind down political activity. Now, actually, the
(19:52):
big takeaway from the interview was that they are actually
pretty relaxed about the idea that Musk might continue to
have in the political domain. You know, we pushed so
hard when you guys say political activity, and when I said, sorry,
that was too casual. When the board says political activity,
what do you even mean? We asked that, do you
(20:12):
mean Musk has told you he won't participate in a
political party, or he'll stop making donations behind specific candidates
or initiatives, and Denholm's response was really simple, is it's
up to Elon Musk what his political activity is. But
they are reassured enough that this package they will get
in return somebody that will be focused on Tesla.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
You know, it's an I appreciated how you pushed her
ed because if you think about Elon Musk's own political evolution,
I mean, he said in the spring of last year
that he wasn't going to donate to either political candidate.
This was when Joe Biden and Donald Trump were running
against each other. That all changed after Butler Pennsylvania in
the assassination attempt, and then you know, Elon went full
fledged and even served as part you know, in the
(20:55):
administration in the capacity of Prdoge. So we saw how
quickly he changed his mind in a very short period
of time. So I guess it can only be up
to him because he's the one who makes these decisions.
Speaker 6 (21:09):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
Well well the way that Robin Denholm put it, and
you know this wasn't on the record on camera interview,
and miss Denholm, I'm sure chose her words very carefully,
but she said that Musk's political activity or time in
government has concluded and he is now back focused on Tesla.
(21:30):
You know, the main thing that we got to it
was a long interview, right, but that again the details
like so important in what the board is requiring a
enon Musk, you know, these are not goals. The word
goal is not correct to say that Musk gets a
trillion dollars in the end if he hits goals, they're
mandatory requirements. And if he doesn't hit the operational and
(21:53):
financial goals. Denholm was very clear like he doesn't get
not the dollar value comp But remember at the heart
of this is that elon Musk's condition, it was a
negotiation and what he wanted was voting power, because Musk's
idea is that with greater voting power he will be
able to keep Tesla focused on a future that is
(22:16):
about artificial intelligence, not necessarily the legacy of Tesla, which
is selling electric vehicles to consumers.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
Well, speaking of power and voting power and just power generally,
I mean, there's been a lot of criticism I think
it's fair to say ed of the Tesla board and
who's in charge in you know, Robin Denholm. I mean,
I'm looking at the Bloomberg description Australian business executive former
Countan who's chair of Tesla, chosen by Elon in November
(22:45):
twenty eighteen to be chair, and prior to that she
is relatively unknown. I'm just curious about the board and
correct me because you know this company, but nothing's correct.
What do we need to know about the Tesla board
and what they say and what it really means to work?
(23:05):
Lan Kennon can't do.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
I regret not saying this out loud explicitly, even if
I did not then ask, you know, I should have
asked about it. But basically, the criticism from all kinds
of investors, the biggest institutionals on Wall Street to the
smallest retail investors is that it's a rubber stamp board
that just does what Elon Musk wants. There's something really
important to understand that it was a special committee that
(23:29):
negotiated meeting with Elon Musk ten times this compensation package,
so Musk had input into it. But the special committee
is made up of just two people, Robin Denholm and
then Kathleen Wilson Thompson, who also kind of shairs the
financial and comp committee on the Tesla board. A board
of two or a committee of two because Elon Musk
(23:51):
is on the board, so he recuses himself technically even
though he negotiates. And then his brother, Kimball Musk, is
on the board of Tesla, but he's brother, so he
recuses himself from negotiating the comp It actually was really
important to say that out loud. Now at the end
of the day, it's a shareholder right to vote on
(24:14):
this package. On November sixth and a lot of Denholm
was explaining and she really wanted to get this across.
This is a proposal, you have the right to vote
on it, so you need to understand what's in it,
even though there is some sort of you know, there
is skepticism about how solid that board is. Robin Denholm
lives in Australia for what it's worth, but I can
(24:35):
tell you from conversations in the company investors that I
know she's highly engaged, reads everything, knows everything that's going on.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Ed, Well, you've been on air with us. There's been
some breaking news that we'd love for you to react
to this about Apple Company that you follow very closely.
Mark German reporting that Apple's AI and search executive Robbie Walker,
Robbie Walker will leave the company, one of the iPhone
maker's most senior AI executives. This, according people with knowledge
of the matter, this follows a slew of folks who've
(25:04):
left in recent months, not just to go to meta
platforms for those huge pay packages. What's your immediate reaction to.
Speaker 4 (25:10):
This, Well, I'm just checking at the stock. You guys
have the ticker up, okay, so the shares haven't sort
of plummeted. What I know is limited about Robbie Walker.
He had been reporting to John g Andrea, which I'm
sure on this show you've discussed Mark's other reporting, which
was about who was in charge. So to a point,
(25:33):
John g Andrea had led the AI team, and a
lot of the departures that we've reported on in Aggregate
have left had been reporting.
Speaker 3 (25:43):
On to him.
Speaker 4 (25:43):
But you have to remember that Craig Federigi, who's like
the software chief, the software guru at Apple, he had
sort of taken command of the team. So I guess,
and I pull up the draft and I'm scrambling to
find it. But give me for that. But I think
that it's just a signal that these exits have continued
(26:04):
since that restructure.
Speaker 5 (26:05):
Is what I was going to say, no, you're you're
laying it out really well.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
And the news came out when when Ed was speaking
about Tesla. So yeah, yeah, OK, I'm believing.
Speaker 5 (26:15):
I guess his serial role. Walker became one of the
top Apple execs working on the new AI powered web
search system to compete with Perplexity and chat GBT. It's
scheduled to debut next year. So yeah, I kind of fluid.
Speaker 4 (26:28):
Huh Yeah, I mean, I'm doing this deliberately because it's relevant.
Speaker 5 (26:33):
You know.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Part of the Denholm conversation about why it has to
be Elon Musk that leads Tesla is that you have
right now this huge talent war. Apple is one of
the losers of it. Let's be honest. Based on the reporting,
Meta is paying over the nose to get people. And
Denholm's argument about Elon Musk is that he's a draw,
(26:55):
so the compensation doesn't really matter. People want to go
and work for him because he's seen as this great
engineering mind and he's so hands on, you know, in
the trenches. I believe he's been in. The building I
was in is three thousand Hanavi Street, which is like
the Global Engineering HQ, and Elon Musk was there this
week and getting involved in stuff that's the landscape right now.
(27:16):
So these stories are so interesting because for AI, you know,
the human capital, the human intelligence that's building out AI.
That is a battleground, right, and that's all like I'm
reflecting on.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
Yeah, all right, great stuff. As always, Thank you, Thank you,
ed La Low breaking news are talking about breaking news
in real time as well as folding it into an
incredible interview that he and Caroline Hyde of the Bloomberg
Tech Team had with the chair of Tesla's board, Eda Low,
As we said, co host of Bloomberg Tech. Joining us
from our San Francisco bureau.
Speaker 6 (27:50):
Stay with us.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
More from Bloomberg Business Week Daily coming up after this.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Catch
us live weekday afternoons from two to five eastering. Listen
on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business Up,
or watch us live on YouTube.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
Roam.
Speaker 5 (28:14):
How about you let me drive?
Speaker 2 (28:15):
Oh no, no, no no, this is not a toy, please.
Speaker 4 (28:20):
Honey, please, how do the gravels listen?
Speaker 7 (28:23):
I want to drive. It's a good question. Good time.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
This is the drive to the clothes cons the musing
well down on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 5 (28:39):
All right, everybody, we've got just about eighteen nineteen minutes
to go until we wrap up the trade on this Friday,
wrapping up the Friday session and also the week overall.
Gotta say very clear what I love about the Bloomberg
is I always have these charts up of the S
and P down and the Nasdaq one hundred.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
That's it, looking what's going on.
Speaker 5 (28:55):
You've got the S and P at its lows of
the session, so a straight leg down. We're down only
eight points, but the point is we're definitely off our
best levels of the session, and we've seen this movement
in like the last twenty thirty minutes. So makes me
wonder a little bit of what's going on. Maybe people
ahead of the FED meeting next week closing out positions.
I'm not quite sure. Downjown's industrial average, it is down
(29:17):
two hundred and eighty three points, down six tens of
a percent, and NASDEK one hundred still in positive territory
of about one third of one percent, but it too
has rolled over off its best level of the session.
So I'm taking a look at our markets live blog
to see what is going on. Yeah, maybe it's just investors.
It's been a bullish week for investors. We've seen several
(29:41):
records and I'm just taking a look at where the
S and P five hundred is for the week. Overall,
we're still up about one and a half percent. So
do you just kind of, for lack of a better phrase,
take some money off the table heading into the weekend.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
And up twelve percent for the year. Let's see what
Alan Lance has to say about this. He's president of
the ria Allen b. Lands In Associates and director of
research at the research firm Lance Global. He joins us
once again from Toledo, Ohio. Been a while since we
last had you on the program. Allen, how are you.
Speaker 6 (30:08):
We're doing well?
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Are you too, We're doing well. It's good to talk
to you again. I wanted to just get your idea
about where we are in this market cycle, given I
think a lot has happened, especially since April so called
Liberation Day and the way that investors have essentially shrugged
off the threat or implementation of tariffs.
Speaker 9 (30:29):
Yeah, it's been an incredible rebound and I agree with
what investors are doing as far as the close here,
and that's taken a little bit of profits. When you
look at a company like Oracle, that's one of our
core positions.
Speaker 6 (30:40):
But I'd be much.
Speaker 9 (30:41):
More inclined to take partial profits there and redeploy them
into areas that haven't moved mitigate risk rather than chasing.
I think we're about in the sixth inning. I know
you have a lot of people on and they're talking
first second inning, but really, when you look at the
valuations here and now the IPO market's certain heat, we
still have the ways to go.
Speaker 6 (31:01):
We're not at the end of this, but we're, you know,
more than halfway through.
Speaker 9 (31:05):
So so those people loading up and chasing the AI plays,
I think, uh, you know, uh, you got to be
numble enough to get out in time, that's for sure.
Speaker 5 (31:16):
Well, investors look like they're getting out ahead of the weekend.
I think it's kind of notable. And I'm sure you've
got your screens up and you're looking at the trade.
Is it just good week, bullush week? And maybe you
just take a little bit of a breather ahead of
next week's FED meeting or what.
Speaker 9 (31:31):
Yeah, I think you got some positives and and they're
getting discounted, Carol, So you get a situation where you know,
it looks like interest rates will go down.
Speaker 6 (31:39):
You know, the IPO markets heating up. Uh, you know,
good news with with you know, some of.
Speaker 9 (31:44):
The tech stocks and uhs as far as even the
uh you know TAM you know situations as far as
with the video and what have you. So I think
it's it's a situation where why not take some money
off the table.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
UH.
Speaker 9 (31:58):
The interesting thing, there's still some good by out there.
You know, some you know leaders that haven't moved early
part of the summer. We're buying Johnson Johnson and Pepsi.
They have moved now with their other companies that have
good dividends that I still think are attractive. So this
is not like a two thousand and seven we talked
and said, you know, get out and everything's overvalued. But
(32:18):
it is something where I think you got to be
a little precarious as far as in chasing.
Speaker 2 (32:23):
You said last year you started taking profits in in
video that was that when it was out one hundred
and forty dollars. You said you then redeployed some of
those profits into companies like Snowflake or Mango dB. Do
you regret selling in video last year at one not
at all.
Speaker 9 (32:41):
You know, if you look at Snowflake, it's done better
in the past year than than NA Video. And you know,
Mango DV at the end of the year was down
and it's up, you know, so again I think, you know,
investors look at it like, oh, you know in videos hired,
you know, one seventies now instead of one forty. But
really it's been an underperformer compared to you know, the industry,
(33:05):
which is hard to believe. Even Oracle it's up you know,
forty some percent over the last five years. The industry's
up eighteen eighteen is great, But if you're in the
right areas, you can do you know, much more. So
I think that diversification is important, tim and investors shouldn't
just be in one or two or seven stocks, you know.
I think it's going to broaden out, and that's what
(33:25):
you have in the latter innings and that's what we're seeing.
Speaker 6 (33:28):
So yeah, you know, we're actually doing more of that.
Speaker 5 (33:31):
Well, if I'm doing play by play with the markets
right now, we've now bounced kind of off our worst
levels of the session on the S and PN down
and we've seen investors come back. Blacky trade weird I
don't know. Am I just too laser focused on the
tick by tick today?
Speaker 7 (33:47):
I don't know.
Speaker 6 (33:49):
Yeah, that's short term. I wouldn't worry about that.
Speaker 9 (33:51):
I think the long term trends is, you know, it's
going to be you know, the critical you know area.
As far as that goes, and there's good you know investments,
it still can be you know, purchase, which which you
know I'm appreciative of. If everything's overvalued, then it gets
really hard.
Speaker 6 (34:06):
So so to.
Speaker 9 (34:07):
Takes some money off the table, even in video, I
think we'll go higher, you know, but take some money
off the table and buy things that haven't moved yet,
that have lesser risk, better risk reward, I think is
prudent strategy right now.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
I want to talk a little bit about risks that
you see out there and when you think it's time to,
if at all, move to cash or you know, it's
a question. I don't ask lightly because that's a drastic
move for investors, and you know, people are always saying,
do not time the market. I'm not giving financial advice here,
but I'm just wondering how you're thinking about risk right now,
because there are a lot of folks out there. You say,
(34:42):
valuations are very high.
Speaker 9 (34:44):
Yeah, they are high in certain areas, and that's why
you know, we are starting to take profits and you
know again partial profits in Oracle and and companies have
done well like in video. But I also think that
there are areas you can still buy so you don't
have to be and cash like in two thousand and
seven and late nineteen ninety nine we're saying get in
(35:05):
cash and be defensive. Now I think you could be
defensive but still have companies that have dividends and are
trading it historic lows really valuation wise in it. That's
what makes us divergence, you know, interesting where you can
get out and take some good profits or partial profits
and redeploy the money and things that have yeah, lesser
risk and better reward, like you know, as far as
(35:29):
snow Frock had a year ago.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Alan, sorry to jump in, but we've got like we've
got a million questions left and only like a minute left.
I just want to talk MP Materials because we had
Jim Litinski on the show. We've spent a lot of
time talking about that company. It was on your radar
before it was on a lot of people's radar. You
spoke with us about buying it. What's the status there?
Speaker 6 (35:45):
We would hold it again, not chase it. You know,
we're buying it. You know, in the mid twenties it
went down to ten. We're just buying more. Just long
term play, you know, two good pieces of news.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
You know.
Speaker 9 (35:57):
Earlier this summer we increased our target to eighty to
ninety dollars, so we did take some profits. But again
I think it's a good long term play. Again, another
one of those high flowers that we would in chase.
But you know, hopefully we can find some like MP
materials from you know, six months ago that will do well,
even though I don't think you'll see.
Speaker 5 (36:17):
Those kind of games twenty seconds really quick. You're comfortable
with the government taking a stake, Yeah, I think on this.
Speaker 6 (36:24):
It's very important.
Speaker 9 (36:25):
I disagree with the intel and with the airspace and
what have you, but on this I think it is
critical and it really helped with the company.
Speaker 6 (36:34):
On the map.
Speaker 5 (36:35):
As we mentioned, this stock has been on a tear.
It is more than three hundred percent yre today. Ellen
Lance have a great weekend. President of Allen B. Lance
and Associates joining us from Toledo, Ohio.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily podcast, available on Apple, Spotify,
and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live weekday
afternoons from two to five pm Eastern on Bloomberg dot com,
the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business App.
You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube
(37:06):
and always on the Bloomberg terminal
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