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October 11, 2025 • 43 mins

Bloomberg Tech's Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow are live in LA for Bloomberg Screentime 2025, speaking with celebrities, entrepreneurs and leaders across the media, gaming and streaming landscape. NPR CEO Katherine Maher discusses the state of media under the Trump administration, Twitch CEO Dan Clancy and Scopely COO Eunice Lee weigh in on the gaming landscape, while streamer Imane Anys - aka “Pokimane” - dives into the business of streaming and building a following.

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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is live
from coast to coast with Carolline Hyde in New York
and Eva Low in sentences.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Go Welcome to a special edition of Bloomberg Tech Live
from Bloomberg screen Time in Los Angeles. Coming up this hour,
we're going to bring you conversations with some of the
biggest names in the entertainment industry.

Speaker 3 (00:36):
We'll we're speaking with top celebrities, ed the entrepreneurs, with
the leaders across this very much changing media landscape. And
we first go to the talk of the town here
at screen Time, of course, it was Jimmy Kimmel, the
late night show host, sat down on Bloomberg's Lucas Shaw
and explained how he thinks his comments about the conservative
activist Charlie Kirk were mischaracterized by the political right. Take

(00:59):
a listen.

Speaker 4 (01:01):
I didn't think there was a big problem, I you know,
I just saw it as distortion on the part of
some of the right wing media networks, and I.

Speaker 5 (01:11):
Was I aimed to correct it.

Speaker 4 (01:14):
I have problems like all the time, and it's kind
of funny because sometimes you think, oh, this is not
a problem, and then it turns into a big problem.
And then sometimes it goes the other way where you
think like, oh, oh, this is gonna be a problem
nobody really notices.

Speaker 6 (01:28):
And so at what point did you realize this was
a problem?

Speaker 4 (01:32):
I think when when they pulled the show off the air, Well,
that's unusual.

Speaker 5 (01:39):
Yeah, And what.

Speaker 6 (01:40):
Were the conversations that Data and Bob that led to that.

Speaker 4 (01:46):
I hate to disappoint you, but they were really good conversations.
I'm not a thinking I mean, like really good conversations
they are. These are people that I've known for a
long time and who I like very much much, and
who were you know, who wanted we all wanted this
to work out best. And I will tell you like

(02:06):
I mean, first of all, I ruined Dana's weekend. It
was just NonStop phone calls all weekend. But I don't
think what I don't think the result, which I think
turned out to be very positive, would have been as
positive if I hadn't talked to Dana as much as
I did, because it helped me think everything through and

(02:27):
it helped me just kind of understand where everyone was
coming from. I can sometimes be reactionary, I can sometimes
be aggressive, and I can sometimes be unpleasant, and I
think that it helped me. Really having those days to
think about it was helpful.

Speaker 6 (02:47):
I have a dumb question about this as someone who
is kind of reporting on it in real time, trying
to figure out what's happening. So the show goes up there,
you have all these conversations and when you made it
or when you made a decision put the show back
on the air, as my understanding at the time was,
it still wasn't exactly clear what you were going to say.
They still hadn't resolved the issues with the affiliates. So

(03:10):
what do you resolve in those conversations to know you're
going back if you haven't figured out a lot of
the things that come out of it.

Speaker 5 (03:17):
I think just the.

Speaker 4 (03:17):
Spirit of what I'm going to say rather than specifically
what I was going to say, And I think that's
something that we all agreed on, and I think that.

Speaker 5 (03:29):
Ultimately I wanted to kind of.

Speaker 4 (03:32):
Cover every base if I could, and sometimes you can
do that and sometimes you can't do that. And it
was something really that had to come from inside me.

Speaker 5 (03:44):
It had to be truthful.

Speaker 4 (03:45):
And I had to lay it all out there and
just be honest about what I was feeling and what
I'd experienced, and I think I did, and I think
that it probably went about as well as it could go.
I knew that it wasn't going to be perfect, and
there were always going to be people that didn't like
it and didn't accept it. But the important thing to

(04:08):
me was that I was able to explain what I
was saying, what I was trying to say.

Speaker 5 (04:17):
You felt like your.

Speaker 6 (04:17):
Initial comments had been mischaracterized.

Speaker 5 (04:20):
I didn't feel like it they were.

Speaker 4 (04:22):
It was intentionally and I think maliciously mischaracterized.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
Yeah, there was Jimmy Kimmel there with Bloombog screen time
host Lucas Shaw, who joins us now this morning. The
story around Jimmy Kimmel is one of the most read
on the Bloomberg terminal and the website, and it's being
shared across the industry. I think that's not that surprising, right, Lucas.
The headline is really straightforward. He thought that the show

(04:48):
was done, and in the course of what we just heard,
he explained everything that happened in the days that followed
being taken off air, confirming quite a lot of your reporting.
I just invite you to take it from there. And
the main takeaways from you from the conversation.

Speaker 6 (05:02):
Well, I guess I was a little surprised on respect
not shocked by how effusive his praise was for Disney,
just because in the moment, my sense from people around
him was that he was pretty pissed off at them,
right they had taken him off the air. You heard
him say, I didn't think I did anything that wrong.
My comments got sort of weaponized by right wing media,

(05:25):
and yet he's had nothing but positive things to say
about CEO Bob Bieger, about entertainment coachair Dana Walden. He
sort of somewhat endorsed Dana Walden to succeed Bob Byger,
which you know, I don't know that he or Dana
were expecting to happen last night, But this turn from
what could have been a really sad, ugly episode in

(05:46):
his career to something that has made him something of
a hero. And so I you know, this was I
guess a little bit of a victory lap for him, a.

Speaker 3 (05:53):
Victory lap, which then you get to the nittigritty of numbers,
because that's what BlueBag does and you're trying to present
him that. Ultimately, yes, he record bump in terms of numbers,
but the numbers haven't been great for late night television
full stop. How did he navigate what he thinks is
the revenue positive or negatives right now for him?

Speaker 6 (06:10):
Well, twofold one, he was like, look, there was a
lot of reporting about how much his peer, Stephen Colbert's
show was losing. He thinks that that's wrong. He knows
how much money these shows cost to make. You know
generally how much they bring in. I think he said
last night it cost about one hundred and twenty million
dollars to do one of these shows. But he also said, look,
if they were losing money, they'd go off there. Stephen

(06:32):
Colbert show is going off the air. We don't know
the future of Kimmel's show. His contract is up next year.
I think most people assume that he'll be around for
a little bit longer. They don't want to At a minimum,
they're not going to fire him in the same way
that CBS did Coldert. But obviously the big challenge for
late night is that there's just so much more consumption
happening online and you can't monetize it in the same way.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
Found that's so interesting, Like his insight into how the
industry works, budgets, talent costs, losses or not losses, because
that's kind of the point of the rest of the day.

Speaker 5 (07:02):
We have many very.

Speaker 2 (07:03):
High profile speakers across entertainment and media generally, but just
for you, what is your next big focus after last night?

Speaker 6 (07:11):
My first interview is David Allison, who I think is,
other than Kim Well, probably the biggest interview of the conference,
just because he hasn't done a big interview since taking
over Paramounts Guidance. He seems to be in the news
every other day. He bought Barry Weiss's The Free Press.
He may or may not be trying to buy Warner
Brothers Discovery. We'll talk about both those things with him.

Speaker 3 (07:31):
And you've got Warner Brothers Discovery at the table as well.
That's gonna be fascinating considering the conversation you have with
Greg Peters ocosio Netflix about how ultimately he's not after M.

Speaker 7 (07:40):
And A WBD, That's gonna be a fascinating conversation.

Speaker 6 (07:43):
Yeah, the code chairs of their movie studio, I'm sure
that they will avoid talking about any big corporate matters
and kind of refer that to their leadership. But look,
they will be great to talk about the movie business with.
They have been on a real hot streak with Sinners,
with Minecraft, many other hits over the summer, Weapons and
then the new Ppa movie which probably isn't a commercial

(08:03):
hit but looks like an Oscar front runner.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
All right, Bloombe's Lucas. Sure, who's leading our coverage here
at Bloomberg screen time in Los Angeles? Thank you very much.
But actually here on Bloomberg Tech carry so much more.

Speaker 3 (08:14):
Coming up, we're going to be speaking with Catherine Meyer,
NPR CEO. Look, public media faces threats, particularly under the
Trump administration. Right now, what is the future of funding
sick with us?

Speaker 7 (08:23):
This is a BlueBag tech.

Speaker 8 (08:38):
See, that's what happens when people get activated.

Speaker 5 (08:41):
People got activated.

Speaker 8 (08:42):
And demanded that Jimmy Kimmel come back on the air.
And I think that there was a great victory. So
sometimes you know, when you're struggling and you're going through
all these changes because of the madness in DC, it's
important to realize when you do win, when you have
a victory, and I think Jimmy Kimmel being back on
the air was a victory for all.

Speaker 3 (09:01):
Of us Los Angeles mayor there Karen Bass reacting to
Jimmy Kimmel's return, of course, to the air after a
brief suspension of what he described as a mischaracterization of
his comments about Charlie Kirk. Meanwhile, look, public broadcasting as
a whole is facing new challenges. Outlets PBS, NPR, for example,

(09:23):
seeing their share in federal funding cut by Congress over
the summer, and raisest questions about the future. The viability
at the center of the debate is MPR CEO Katmah,
who we're pleased to say not only has just been
is joining us, having already been called before the Oversight
Committee earlier this year. Kevin, how how do you navigate
this time? How are you seeing the ability for MPR

(09:44):
to thrive and drive forward?

Speaker 9 (09:46):
Well, there's certainly no roadmap for this moment in time.
I think this represents a step change for all public broadcasting.
It's not just here in the United States. We recognize
that public broadcasters around the world are under and increasing
scrutiny and pressure. The good new for us is that
we have a viable model because we've built audiences over
the fifty years we've been in existence. We have forty

(10:06):
six million listeners a week, and so as we look
to the future, we're looking at all, right, this is
a change. It doesn't change our public service mandate, It
doesn't change our mission and our obligation to the American public.
It just probably will change how we have.

Speaker 6 (10:18):
To do our work.

Speaker 3 (10:20):
When you say how you do your work, does it
ultimately mean that you have to think about the resources
that you put to work there? Can you be as
expansive in the coverage that you have in for so
many years.

Speaker 5 (10:29):
It's a good question.

Speaker 9 (10:29):
It's something we're trying to figure out. NPR received traditionally
about one percent of our budget directly from the federal government,
but we have just one percent. But we have a
network of around two hundred and fifty member stations which
received as much as seventy percent in rural parts of
the country, and so we're waiting to see what some
of the fallout will be for those stations. We have projections.
We're concerned about this, and we're looking at how we

(10:52):
can buttress some of their work by cutting fees to
them and thinking about how to make a dollar stretch
a little bit further to continue to serve local community Cavin.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
I think there would be a lot of value in
you explaining the business model.

Speaker 5 (11:04):
It is amazing.

Speaker 2 (11:05):
Well, the reason I ask actually is in preparation for today,
I suddenly stopped and looked at mprs following on social
platforms for example. It's very very big. Yes, you know,
how do I consume some MPR content like on YouTube
for example, But that isn't necessarily a big, big income generator.
View is that? Is that right?

Speaker 10 (11:25):
Right?

Speaker 5 (11:25):
So?

Speaker 9 (11:25):
I think people think of us as radio because that's
our origin, but in fact, fifty percent of our listening
comes from digital platforms. It comes through podcasts, it comes
through YouTube, it actually comes through reading online. And you
can see in our numbers that our demographics are actually
very well distributed. We've been accused of being too liberal,
but what I can tell you is that when we
look at the audience data as to who comes to us,

(11:46):
it's actually a very represent representative distribution of the American public.
So fifty percent of what we're doing is for digital audiences,
and fifty percent of what we're doing is for radio audiences.
On the radio side, we have these roughly two hundred
for fifty members across the country. They serve ninety nine
point seven percent of the American public, So in some
ways we are one of the largest national networks. And

(12:07):
we have three thousand local journalists around the country who
then serve back into the network with stories that they're
filing for their local communities and for their states.

Speaker 3 (12:16):
How does it make them feel when they're deemed to
be too liberal.

Speaker 2 (12:21):
And how not good?

Speaker 5 (12:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 9 (12:22):
Really not good. I mean, we have reporters who are
covering tribal areas who are primarily focused on the issues
of Native American communities. We have reporters in rural Alaska
who are focusing on the issues that their communities face,
some of the issues around for example, fishing and access
to access to the sorry the National Wildlife Preserve and

(12:43):
what does that mean for economic opportunity for Alaskans. They're
having nuanced conversations that represent the full spectrum of the
American debate on any of these issues, and so to
be called liberal or to be demeaned in that way
is really a misrepresentation of the work that they do.

Speaker 7 (12:58):
Nuanced is a great word, maed more of it.

Speaker 9 (13:01):
Well, we try to make sure that we're hearing from
all sides of the story. In every story, and that
means that we are representing sure, of course communities in
California that perhaps have one point of view, but also
communities in Indiana that have a different point of view.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
You know, we talked about this as a team, and
one of our producers, Oreie Thomas, brought up the idea
that there is like the NPR strategy, and then there's
what the local stations are doing on the politics side
of things. You know, how are the local stations reacting,
for example, if a lot of their listener base did
vote for President Trump, you know, with what's going on,

(13:33):
how are you factoring that in? But also, like in
the business model, do you end up sort of also
competing at the MPR level with the local station level
because you're trying to pursue different subscribers things like that.

Speaker 9 (13:47):
Well, those are sort of two very different questions. I mean,
we aim to serve the entire spectrum of American conversation, right, So,
we had the White House Press Secretary on just last
week speaking directly to the American public about the administrations
thinking on the current government shutdown. We invite members of
both parties on all the time. We invite independent voices
on all the time. This is important to us, but

(14:08):
it's not just our politics coverage. It's also coverage of
American life all of the cultural aspects that make up
our differences as well. And that is one of the
flexibilities of local reporting is it means that our station
in Utah can run stories about the local reaction to
the Charlie Kirk assassination as well as contributing to our
national coverage, so that Americans all across the country can

(14:28):
hear from those perspects.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
What is the feedback from American from the American listeners
about everything that's happened, Well.

Speaker 9 (14:34):
I mean on the news, of course. I think what
we hear very consistently is that this is a concerning time.
People dislike the amount of polarization. We do hear that
our coverage and the way that we approach things tends
to bring people closer to an understanding of their fellow
Americans because we really do focus on finding the personal story.
We'd like to say that everything that happens in America
happens somewhere, and so we're always trying to find this

(14:56):
somewhere that that is happening, whether it's the implications of
tearfs or you know the conversation that's happening around For example,
Jimmy Kimmel, who you were just recently referencing.

Speaker 3 (15:05):
Listeners are so loyal you turn to them for funding.
Have you seen big billionaires, big donors wanting.

Speaker 7 (15:12):
To step up into this moment.

Speaker 9 (15:14):
We have seen a outpouring of support, absolutely so. New
Hampshire Public Radio for example, raised a million dollars in
response to the defunding efforts and over the course of
a short period of weeks. We really appreciative of this,
but that won't fill the gap for these rural communities
that are already sizzy economically strapped. There's a reason they
have been federally funded. We know that for sorry, we

(15:36):
know that twenty percent of Americans live without local news.
There's a reason for that. The market cognitions don't allow it,
and that's where public media has filled in the gap.
So that still remains a challenge.

Speaker 10 (15:47):
We have seen a.

Speaker 9 (15:48):
Lot of support, of course, across the board for public radio.
I think there were three million people who wrote into
Congress to support the to support us at the time
of defunding.

Speaker 7 (15:57):
But it won't be enough.

Speaker 9 (15:58):
To fill one hundred and twenty million dollar gap relative
to the defending of your.

Speaker 7 (16:01):
Own background is so fascinating.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
Having been for a stint with the Web Summit, making huge,
big events and for a tech community, you're on the
chair of the Signal Foundation, You're also been at Wikipedia.
I'm interested as to how in this moment of belt tightening,
your technological savvy comes into all of it.

Speaker 9 (16:20):
Well, I actually think that technology is an enormous advantage
for the complex structure that you have. You asked me
about the business model earlier, and I think it's a
great lead into this.

Speaker 7 (16:29):
Right, there is a.

Speaker 9 (16:29):
Way in which we could be in competition all of
these local stations seeking to now transform their work for
a national audience. Technology actually offers us the place to
bring all of that aggregate reporting together. And so if
somebody is running a really great story here in LA
about a local band that is about to go on tour,
and I reference that because music is a big part

(16:50):
of what we do at NPR, we now have the
ability to serve that to any audience member anywhere across
the country who might be interested in what that.

Speaker 2 (16:57):
Band is about to do.

Speaker 9 (16:58):
Right, we wouldn't have been able to do that in
a previous era, but the ability of digital platforms, the
affordances for us to serve audiences seamlessly. They don't think
of us as our local station versus our local station.
They think of us as one public media experience, and
that's really what we're leaning into.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
So, Sweden, what are you going to do differently are
in this environment? What are you going to change to
bring in more money that you need?

Speaker 9 (17:20):
Well, certainly investing pretty heavily in the fundraising piece. I mean,
I don't think that that's dissimilar from what we've seen
in nonprofit news as a whole. We've seen tremendous success
in the nonprofit news sector in building subscriptions and building memberships.
That's an opportunity for us, and in fact, we've been
doing it for a long time. We have millions and
millions of loyal donors across the country. It's time to
bring in the next generation. You mentioned I come from Wikipedia.

(17:41):
We have a little experience in this right, So that's
one piece of it. I also think that it's an
opportunity for us to think about how we're doing our
news gathering and news production more effectively. And so we
have all these journalists across the country. What does it
mean to do the national editorial planning where we're really
thinking about how to elevate these conversations that are happening
around the country into the national story. And then of

(18:02):
course we have this great international and national reporting that
we mean to now weave.

Speaker 2 (18:05):
Into the next Cafreine mayor MPR CEO, thank you very
much for being with us here at Bloomberg's screen Time. Meanwhile,
Warner Music Group is said to be in close agreement
with Netflix to create a slate of movies and documentaries
based on the record labels catalog of artists and songs.
That's according to sources. Here's what Warner Music Group CEO
Robert Kilhle said about a potential deal.

Speaker 11 (18:28):
I cannot confirm anything, but but the you know, if
you step back and think about this, it makes a lot.
You know, our company has tremendous catalog, Prince Madonna, Fleetwood,
Mac and it's just it just goes on and on
and on. The stories that we have are incredible and

(18:51):
they haven't really been topped.

Speaker 5 (18:53):
It more like Marvel for music.

Speaker 11 (18:56):
I said, that's that's that's where we are and it
will be unlocked and so it makes a lot of
sense for us to partner with a company that can
bring it to life all around the world. And it's
exciting both for acts who are no longer with us,
but we make their estates happy and satisfied, but also

(19:18):
for acts who are with us, who then can actually
help bring young audiences to the streaming platforms.

Speaker 3 (19:25):
Robert kinsil One, a music group CEO.

Speaker 12 (19:27):
Then I think it's it's hard for any brand that
has a deep, you know, consumer sense of what are
you doing for me? Right, and then you're like, well,
I'm going to do this as well, and you have
it takes a while to really build up that.

Speaker 5 (19:44):
Sense of what's happening.

Speaker 12 (19:45):
But it's not it's not that dissimilar to let's say
we were launched, you know, in a new country, like
you know, you went to Japan, right, So when we
started in Japan, two percent of the Japanese population it
ever heard of Netflix, So nobody knew what wo But
you can nobody even know your name much let's be
able to tell you what we were doing. And we're
doing pay TV service in a country that doesn't really
have a great PayTV you know, operation we're doing over

(20:07):
the internet in a way that was totally new, and
so you've got to every day build a little bit
of like what are we doing, who we are, what
are we you know, how are we here to serve you?
So that ten year journey, let's say, you know, just
at the tenth anniversary in Japan. You know, tremendous progress
over ten years, but it took us a long time.
And I think, you know, the gaming situation is not
dissimilar to that.

Speaker 6 (20:27):
How much is it an impediment that for the most
part now you can only play it on on your phone?

Speaker 12 (20:33):
Well, I would say, you know, the phone is what's
great about it is it's a well developed gaming ecosystem,
right so you know, folks notifying games there. But it's
also a highly competitive gaming ecosystem, so it's developed. This
gives you both that upside and the downside. But what's
exciting is that now we are moving beyond the phone

(20:53):
to the TV. So I mentioned like one of the
big gaming areas we're going after. One of the big
gaming areas we're going after now is you know, so
gaming experiences. It will show up on your TV. So
we are now announcing we're announced here actually that we're
going to have these social party games, a pack of
social party games that you can play on your TV
with your phone as the controller. And it's things like

(21:14):
you know, recognizable games like Boggle. You got Pictionary, We've
got a Lego party game, We've got Tetris, We've got
like a Mafia style Who've done it? This is this
is me and our CTO Elizabeth playing Boggle here, which
is it's we're two very competitive people, so it got
it got pretty ugly.

Speaker 6 (21:33):
Who I'm not going to say that means he lost?

Speaker 5 (21:38):
Oh does it why she watched a video? My friend?
You triggered my competitors.

Speaker 12 (21:45):
But this is again, this is you know, so it's
your phone, which is an incredible device, and there's all
sorts of things that you're going to be able to
do on your phone that you can't do on a
normal controller like touch screen. And this is us basically
picking our words on that, and it's you know, it's
dead simple to use, it's intuitive. And then this is
us on the earliest days of how we actually can

(22:06):
use that. And if we you know, basically are going
to like unleash this with a bunch of creators and
they're going to go figure out stuff that we didn't
even imagine that they can do with that interactivity.

Speaker 2 (22:20):
That was Netflix co CEO Greg Peter's key conversations coming
up gaming with Twitch CEO Dan Clancy, Unice Lee of
Scope Lee. One of the top streamers out there is
Poke Maine. So much more from Los Angeles and Bloomberg
screen Time. This is Bloomberg Tech. Welcome back to a

(22:48):
special edition of Bloomberg Tech. We live from Bloomberg screen
Time in Los Angeles. Amazon streaming platform Twitch. It's growing
online stars by the minute. It's averaging more than one
hundred and five million monthly visitors globally. And here to
discuss the current state but also the future state of
the live streaming business model is Twitch CEO Dan Clancy.

Speaker 10 (23:10):
Thank you for having me. It's great to be here.

Speaker 2 (23:11):
So Twitch is such an interesting thing, an entity. There
are loads of people out there that aren't familiar with it,
and actually I thought the most sensible place to start
is like, can you just explain what Twitch is, how
it works.

Speaker 10 (23:23):
Hopefully for those so simple space.

Speaker 13 (23:25):
So Twitch is a live streaming platform where people go live. Okay,
and so if you say it's a live version of
YouTube or something like that. But the thing that really
makes Twitch unique in the kind of need that it
meets in people is as human beings, we are all
yearning for community. And what happens on Twitch is people
go live and they basically share their lives. They let

(23:46):
people into their living room, they go out in the.

Speaker 10 (23:49):
World, and they explore, they gain.

Speaker 13 (23:51):
And then what they do is very authentically engage with
those people that are watching. And since people spend a
fair amount of time watching these people, community forms between
the folks that are watching, and I think that is
really the magic of Twitch and which distinguishes Twitch from
many other platforms that have live streaming. The phrase I
use is we're community centric live streaming because people find

(24:13):
a place where they belong.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
So the simple origin was like people would be playing
video games in simple terms, and they would be filming
and streaming themselves playing this game, sometimes with others. But
it's kind of evolved into a much broader set of
content irl or just chatting. Is the things that you
know I'm following on the platform. Is there a still
a heavy proportion of activity that's gaming related or is

(24:37):
it now much more diverse?

Speaker 13 (24:38):
Well, it's very diverse, and the interesting story is even
before Twitch, Twitch started as justin TV, and in justin
TV it was life casting, so in fact it wasn't
about gaming, okay, and then Twitch life life casting is
what they called it back then, where you were just
casting your life, and then Twitch pivoted and focused on
gaming and that's when it really took off. And now

(25:00):
it's kind of come full circle because while gaming is
still a big part of Twitch and will always be
a big part of Twitch, more and more creators are
out there just doing all sorts of things you said, IRL,
which is in real life, which means you go out
on the streets, you go climbing a mountain.

Speaker 2 (25:15):
I've watched you stream from a water slide in a doughnut. Yes,
content that irl, that's ir.

Speaker 10 (25:22):
It's in real life.

Speaker 3 (25:24):
DJ Cancy, I think, is who you're streaming as I'm
interested though, like it does such a great job on
the show reminding us of the sheer scale in the
power of numbers of gaming. When we think about big
movie hits, it pales into comparison of the amount of
money earned by James versus video games. And what amazes
me is how much the content creators are winning in
terms of content. They are getting one hundred million dollar

(25:46):
contracts to jump from you to kick or from Kick
to you or to YouTube more than Lebron James is earning.
Can you go to actually who your competition therefore is,
and how you fight for that content in this moment.

Speaker 13 (25:59):
Yeah, the way I look at it astually, we're fairly
unique in this space, and I don't focus on the
competition because as a live streaming platform at our scale,
they're smaller ones.

Speaker 10 (26:08):
But you know, really, when we think of the social.

Speaker 13 (26:10):
Media space, you have YouTube, you have TikTok, you have Instagram,
but Twitch is really the only one that solely focuses
on this community centric live streaming experience. And the way
I describe it sometimes is we actually are a long
form platform and that people sit there and watch for
one hour two hours. So in that sense, we're like
Prime Video and Netflix, but we're social, so we're sort

(26:31):
of right in the middle of what I'll call the
streaming platforms and the social media platforms. We're really a
long form social media platform.

Speaker 3 (26:38):
They're also, dare I say, right in the middle of
the culture wars.

Speaker 7 (26:41):
And I'm just really.

Speaker 3 (26:42):
Interested as to how you navigate that in leadership when
people are bringing them into their homes in a more
intimate setting and feel that they can share anything that
they feel, but that then can blow up in many
different ways.

Speaker 13 (26:54):
Yeah, so, first of all, it's very important that we
take it very seriously in terms of having a set
of guidelines and what's appropriate on Twitch and what's not,
And so we spend a lot of time thinking about
that and letting our creators do what they need to
do to protect themselves.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
And you kick them off too if they take them
off if.

Speaker 13 (27:09):
They're not adhering to them. That's really important for our platform.
But really what it is is that's just one of
the things you have to deal with if you want
to get that authenticity because this key difference between Twitch
and many other short form platforms. If you're just making
a short clip, you can put on a mask. When
you're live streaming, you can't put on a mask. And

(27:29):
one thing that's been leading a lot of celebrities, entertainers, athletes,
influence all sorts of people now to live streaming is
they want that authentic, honest connection with their fans and
turn those fans into community.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
Done to interrupt team, Let's bring up the Gavin Newsom
session then and just play a little bit of it
if we can. There's some sound associated with it, Dan,
But in very simple terms, Gavin Newsome went on the
twitchcsion and not providing due process, went on the Twitch platform.
My understanding is that you know he was engaging with
one of his children's favorite content creators, that that's the

(28:05):
governor of California using Twitch to communicate. Just explain how
you feel about that.

Speaker 13 (28:11):
Yeah, the way I think of it, what he's doing
is he's he's just authentically interacting with you know, those
people that may have an interest in him, right, And
I do that myself. I stream and have a great
time doing it, And when you do it, you realize
there's like there's something really special about having that impact
on people and having that feedback, that visceral feeling of

(28:34):
you know when I when I stream, I'll play the
piano and sing and they'll say, oh, I love that song,
and it really kind of makes It's very different than
just looking at metrics like you do on other social media.

Speaker 2 (28:44):
You've been really clear there are guidelines for the content creators,
there are guidelines for the viewers in how they interact,
but Twitch is one of a number of platforms that
is caught up in a wider discussion about people that
want to talk politics or even in the context of radickzation.
Just give us your sort of blanket policy and approach

(29:04):
to managing that environment on the Twitch platform, please, because
DC is paying attention not just to Twitch. I get that,
but it is important well.

Speaker 13 (29:13):
This show, I'd say, like, first of all, our policy
is you know, you could freely express your views. It's
how you say it that's important that you should not
be attacking and hate and harassment is not allowed on
our platform, and we're very clear about that.

Speaker 10 (29:27):
But we understand that people are going to.

Speaker 2 (29:29):
Get super quick who adjudicates that.

Speaker 13 (29:32):
We have both automated techniques and we have a large
group of people that work whenever something's reported to then
analyze it and see if it did hearst our community guidelines,
and then if there's a violation, we take an enforcement action.

Speaker 3 (29:45):
What's so great as you two are going to be
on stage together a little bit later, Twitch CEO Dan Clancy,
we so thank you for your time with us on
the show as well. Now coming up, we're going to
be speaking with scopely Coo UNEs Lee about the growth
and competition in the mobile gaming industry tech. In the

(30:16):
realm of mobile gaming, there are a few key players
increasingly dominating the space. One of those is Scopefully. It's
the publisher behind Marvel Strikeforce, yat see with Buddies Pokemon,
my kid's favorite. Scope Ly Chief operating officer Unis League
joins us.

Speaker 7 (30:31):
Now and we see.

Speaker 3 (30:34):
That ip and it stands out so much units. But
competition is really building. How do you see that as
a really helping you focus on the business, scale the business,
but also drive off those competitors.

Speaker 14 (30:47):
Sure, I mean it's always great to have competition because
it only fuels that drive to innovate and to you know,
exceed expectations. For us, we welcome all of it. I
think scope Ly and forarticular, is always focused on a
community first approach, and so the games that we're building,
we think about how are we creating these highly social

(31:08):
engaging experiences. And I think that's what sets us apart
ultimately because we always start from that core premise.

Speaker 3 (31:14):
I'm that highly social engagement drives revenue. I'm assume mean
just talk us through the business model.

Speaker 14 (31:18):
Sure, I mean it's pretty astounding. Last year, we achieved
over ten billion dollars in lifetime revenue.

Speaker 6 (31:25):
We're really excited about that.

Speaker 14 (31:27):
We have five hundred million plus daily active users touching
our games in the last twelve months. There's just amazing
things happening, and we're so excited about adding Pokemon Go
to our stable or amazing portfolio of games. They continue
to grow and reach new players every day, and so yeah,
it's pretty amazing.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
Unis terribloembog screen time. There's been a lot of industry news.
I wondered if we could run through some of it.
So like last night, Netflix to me basically demoed a
technology that casts a mobile game from your phone to
your TV screen. As a hardcore gamer in many different
domains and formats, wasn't blown away by that? What do

(32:09):
you make of that concept and idea. I mean, it's
a mobile game cast to the television.

Speaker 14 (32:14):
I'm also a hardcore gamer, so I feel you. I
think at the end of the day, we're trying to
create again, highly social, engaging experiences and for our scope,
Lee it's about trying to be on the different mediums
where our players want to be, and even bringing our
community together in real life as we have with the
Go Fest, which is for Pokemon Go community. So I

(32:37):
think for us, we're just look, we're going to always
keep an eye on where people are playing, how they
want to engage with our content, and try to serve
that up to our community.

Speaker 2 (32:46):
The industry has seen seismic shifts in the last two years.
I think that's a completely fair statement. You have some
financial relationship with Saudi through various investments that they've made.
The biggest, most recent use is the take private of
Electronic Arts. My question is very simple. Have you had

(33:08):
discussions about cooperating with EA? You know, you are very
strong in mobile gaming. EA is not so strong in
mobile gaming.

Speaker 10 (33:17):
We are.

Speaker 14 (33:17):
We have so much respect for what EA has been
able to do and the amazing you know, brands and
ips that they've built, so we have we come from
that place first. Right now, we're not in specific discussions,
but post deal, if those opportunities arrive, we're definitely open
to discussions for sure.

Speaker 3 (33:34):
And we think about ultimately where you've come from the
fact that you were busy over an activision with Call
of Duty.

Speaker 7 (33:39):
You are someone who calls yourself a hardcore gamer.

Speaker 3 (33:43):
Where do you think the balance shifts in terms of
mobile versus console. How do you see that continuing to evolve?

Speaker 14 (33:48):
Honestly, I think our community, our players want to access
our content in different ways and it's not this huge
battle so much. But again, as I mentioned earlier, it's
about serving our community where they want to engage with
our content, where they want to play, and I think
there's a place for all of it. We are also
we have several things which you can't talk about but
in development that are a cross platform and across platforms

(34:11):
you may not expect from scopeing.

Speaker 3 (34:13):
Okay, keep us tuned on that respect, but we can
go global with you because you're a woman who is international,
very core. You've been in London, you studied in Asia,
and I'm thinking about how things change from global aera
to global air. Pokemon go inherently for us a very
Japanese bit of IP that has become a typical global phenomenal.

Speaker 14 (34:31):
Yes, absolutely, I mean for us again, it's there's a
whole wide world to appeal to. And what the beauty
of games is that it brings these folks together across
the globe. It transcends geographies, cultures, and that's super exciting
for us and that's that social connection part that we
want to continue to promote and continue to see.

Speaker 2 (34:50):
So we're talking about this thing right, the mobile right,
and gaming is one thing I can do on my
mobile phone. Do you guys consider your rivals to be TikTok?

Speaker 5 (35:01):
Literally?

Speaker 2 (35:01):
This is Bloomberg screen time? You know, how do you
assess a marketplace where the competition for eyeballs isn't necessarily
in the time spent on gaming?

Speaker 6 (35:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 14 (35:10):
I mean I think the gaming space itself is so
fast moving and evolves very quickly. So wherever eyeball's intention
is again, wherever our players are fans because they're looking
at IP through various mediums, so being conscious of that
it's not just through the game, there's different ways of
the IP coming to life, so us staying on top

(35:32):
of that is super important at scopely, again, how do
we connect with the community where they want to? Mobiles
one of the most tactile and easiest ways to do so,
but it's something that is always on our minds.

Speaker 2 (35:44):
Roadblocks. C dem Zuki told us very recently that sometimes
on a Friday night their servers melt because of all
the condensed activity in the mobile gaming domain. Do you
ever come across like flash moments like that where the
world is just playing at the same time.

Speaker 14 (35:57):
I mean, we have so many people engaging daily, hourly
with our products because of their deep love of these ips.
Star Trek Fleet Command is a great example. Yes, seventy
five percent of our players of that game, they are
touching it every single day, every single day, and in
meaningful amounts of time.

Speaker 7 (36:17):
I mean, I know it's for your business.

Speaker 14 (36:18):
I think for Star Trek fans, it's like amazing to
be able to be in that universe, and those are
hardcore fans that that IP attracts real loyalty, and so
our ability to do that, you know, for that community
is pretty special.

Speaker 2 (36:32):
How many years has it been I've done like that
on television? Unis Chief Opera I have remember I did
do it once. Well, let's leave it. Unisslee, chief operating
Officer at SCOPEIA. It's great to have you on bluebo Tech.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 5 (36:55):
So.

Speaker 2 (36:56):
Hollywood's typically focused on the people in front of the camera,
but today increasingly we're talking about streamers, people like imin
anis more commonly known as poke Main. She's one of
the most popular streamers on Twitch, with nearly ten million
dedicated followers and another twenty million across other platforms. We're
talking YouTube x, Facebook, Insta and delighted to say that

(37:18):
Pokey joins us. Now we've been talking in recent weeks.
It's great to finally have you on Bloomberg Tech. Like guys, now,
bear with me on this one, but let's just start
by asking what is your day job? How would you
describe what it is that you.

Speaker 15 (37:32):
Do in technical terms? I'm a content creator. How I
might want to describe it is just I love sharing
my life online. I love to entertain people. I love
to make people happy about it.

Speaker 2 (37:44):
I'd say it started with video games on Twitch, like
quite a long time ago. You've got a long history
with Twitch, I sure do. Twenty thirteen, twenty thirteen and like,
and that's something we share in common. You know some
of the titles in particular, but we just had Dan
Fancy on the program earlier. For you in particular, it
is expanded to IRL and just chatting. Is there a

(38:08):
moment where that happened? It moved beyond video games?

Speaker 15 (38:12):
I would say, interestingly enough, when I first started streaming,
you weren't even allowed to stream IRL or just chatting.
It was just games, right, anything else you might get
banned for a few days. And so as the platform
started not only allowing but supporting different types of content,
I of course only wanted to try out those different things.
And I also love how it allowed me to showcase

(38:33):
different parts of my life. Now instead of traveling and
feeling like, oh, I can't do my job, I can't game,
I can't speak to my community, I could travel and
stream myself in those different countries. So as both the
platform changed and what the audiences like and enjoy changed,
I followed in and I was able to explore so
many different types of content.

Speaker 3 (38:52):
And then we've seen you go to crew, We've seen
you go to around the world. But what's so interesting, Pokey,
is that your demographic must have broadened from League of
Legends out to now wanting to see horse ride, talking
about some of your health stories. How can you break
down the demographics and who it is in your community?

Speaker 15 (39:07):
Absolutely? What I find the most interesting is that it
entirely depends on the piece of content and the platform.
So on Twitch, of course, the platform itself is maybe
majority men, sometimes younger depending on the game or what
you're streaming.

Speaker 7 (39:20):
But on TikTok.

Speaker 15 (39:21):
A lot of my videos are like majority female. I
do get readies with me, makeup halls, all sorts of
different things, and I really adore that because it allows
me to really tap into and share all the different
facets of my hobbies and what I.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
Like to do.

Speaker 3 (39:35):
And you do share your community of friends, they appear
with you. There's also the perhaps your brother who doesn't
appear so much on screen, and you're here in LA.
There are safety concerns, whether it's in real life or
whether it's online as well.

Speaker 7 (39:46):
How do you think about that navigating?

Speaker 15 (39:48):
Oh my, it really depends on the exact safety concern
and what aspect it brings. So there's online safety and
there's also in person safety. So what you said earlier
about I L streaming, I typically don't IRL stream in
LA unless I have security with me, otherwise I feel
a little bit better streaming IRL in other countries. When

(40:09):
it comes to moderation online, oh, it's been a trial
and and error kind of situation learning how to moderate
my platforms, how to feel safe online, how to make
sure my community feel safe.

Speaker 7 (40:20):
So it's really a lot.

Speaker 6 (40:22):
Of different things.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
Hochy is part of the IRL and just chatting content.
Sometimes you have discussed things that are more political or
societal issues. How do you choose those that you want
to weigh in on? And then the safety piece you
just explained how you factor that in.

Speaker 15 (40:39):
I would say my priority for starters is of course
speaking to my direct experiences and how I know those
things affect others. For example, the safety issues that I
face online, I'm not the only one, and it's not
just creators. Any woman, any girl, frankly, any person online
can be victim to those same safety issues. So I

(41:00):
love to be a spokesperson for the things that I
have direct experience and knowledge in. And then secondly for
me political topics, what I really feel passionate speaking out
about is simply just human rights, respecting other people what
their rights should be in regards to the things that
they can say, that they can experience, that they can share.
I feel like that's what I.

Speaker 7 (41:20):
Feel comfortable talking about.

Speaker 15 (41:22):
And so aside from that, Luckily, the safety aspects that
I have in place right now allow me to feel
comfortable discussing anything.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
Hook you've made a career of this, would you please
explain to our Bloomberg Tech audience you know how it
works how you make money with respect if you're able to,
Like you've also set up a talent agency for content creators.
You know how big a piece is that for you?
Is it different Twitch versus Instagram, for.

Speaker 15 (41:46):
Example, so your streams of income do differ greatly depending
on the platform. I would say the unique thing about
Twitch is that there's a subscription model, which means, as
opposed to YouTube, where you can subscribe to someone for
free and your essential just following them, like you follow
someone on Instagram. For Twitch, when you subscribe, you're sending
them five dollars every month. It's a monthly subscription that

(42:08):
also generates income. But for me, the large, large, large
majority of my career income has come just from sponsorships
and contracts, and then probably the second largest piece has
come from business ventures, and then the third largest piece
might be subscriptions.

Speaker 7 (42:24):
So I'd say that's the unique.

Speaker 15 (42:25):
Piece that most people don't know about Twitch, but for
ig in most other platforms, it's primarily ads and sponsors.

Speaker 3 (42:32):
We could talk to you for so much longer, and
I'm very pleased that it's going to.

Speaker 7 (42:35):
Be on stage with you.

Speaker 3 (42:37):
Imman Ais also known as Poke main with so pleased
that she joined the show, and what a show it
has been, because that.

Speaker 7 (42:44):
Does it for this edition of Newbag Tech. But the
story doesn't stop. There are so many people going to
be on stage. I've got the Foster sisters, You've got a.

Speaker 2 (42:50):
Great Pokey and Dan from Clancy, Like I want to
understand the content creator economy so much more because as
we just heard, it's so different. And then tomorrow, well
not miss this. We're going all in on defense technology.
We will speak with the leaders of Anderill, Palenteer and
many other leaders in defense tech from Andreil's head quarters
right here in California. You don't want to miss it.

(43:11):
There is a lot to recap from the last hour.
Check out the pod loads of you are listening to.
It's super grateful for the feedback we've had. Listen on Apple, Spotify,
iHeart and the Bloomberg platforms. Caro take us out.

Speaker 3 (43:22):
I mean, what an amazing array we can do right
here in Los Angeles and the world a content creation
to the world of defense tech.

Speaker 7 (43:28):
There's a lot to be had.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Yeah, this is Los Angeles and Bloombog screen time. This
is Bloomberg Tech
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