July 5, 2025 • 20 mins
What do young professionals in New York City actually think about money and capitalism? According to our guest Emily Sundberg, creator of the Feed Me newsletter, there is a foreboding sense that nobody is coming to save them. End times are coming. AI will take all the jobs. There's a limited time to "secure the bag." In this live episode, recorded in New York City in June, Emily talks about how this translates into consumption and investing decisions among today's youth, and how they see the world of politics.
Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlots
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Hello, odd lots listeners. You are listening to another special
episode of the podcast. It was recorded in New York
City on July twenty sixth. In this conversation, we talked
to Emily Sunberg of the feed Me newsletter. We are
talking about how gen Z sees the world, how they
think about capitalism, how they think about money, how they
think about investing, how they think about spending it, and
(00:40):
how they think about how nobody is coming to save them.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (00:44):
I don't think it's a secret at this point that
gen Z seems to love stock market investing and things
like that, trying to make money. So take a listen.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
First question, I've been on my mind the last couple
of days. You have a very like young plugged in
like sort of business capitalism audience. What percentage of your
readers do you think voted for u Zoran?
Speaker 5 (01:09):
A young man I think he was nineteen, a Yale student,
emailed me this morning and asked if I could put
that poll in my newsletter, and I didn't. It felt
a little late, but I should have. I'm guessing sixty
five percent. Cautiously like, yeah, can.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
You maybe describe your sort of average reader just for
people who might not be aware, like what population are
you plugged into here?
Speaker 5 (01:36):
So I don't know if any of you use substack,
but they don't give you these analytics. So all of
my data about my readership has been quite anecdotal from
just looking at people's profiles in the comment section and
seeing who shows up to my parties.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Do any of you read it? Like if I do?
Speaker 5 (01:52):
Okay, so some of you that's some of my audience.
I like to say that my readership is everyone from
bartenders to billionaires. But I would say, like, if you're
paying eighty dollars a year for a newsletter, then you're
probably making a decent amount of money, or you're at
least interested in making money. And I think it's a
mostly New York audience thirty to forty five ish, But
(02:15):
if you come to my parties you'll see who else
there is. But I would say, like people interested in
making money and somewhat interested in New York City business
and culture.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
So the first time, several tries to get you on
the podcast, but finally making it happen, and I wanted
to talk about like gen Z and capitalism, because I
feel like millennials and maybe Gen X, but Millennials in
particular like sort of had this love hate relationship, like
sort of apologized for wanting money, so ambivalent about it.
(02:46):
And I get the impression that the younger generation is
like much more comfortable with like.
Speaker 6 (02:51):
Yeah, we want to make a ton of money.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
So I'm like, yeah, so talk about if that's correct
this perception.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I think one thing that's very clear about gen Z
is that they've repeatedly been told nobody.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Is coming to save you.
Speaker 5 (03:06):
You're going to graduate into a job market that barely exists,
and if you get a job, you might not even
have a desk or an office to go into.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
A lot of.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
Them were home during COVID, and they're also seeing like
shootings and schools all the time, and they're seeing their
capital getting sworn like there it's nobody's coming to save them,
and it's sort of up to them to make the
most of this world while it's still in existence. And
you hear this sense of like get the bag while
(03:37):
the world is still here for.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
You to make some money out of it. What was
your question?
Speaker 6 (03:42):
No, that was basically it like that's kind of overwhelming.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Sentiment that I hear from these people. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I think it was like some survey and they asked
all the generations, like what do you need to have
a good life, and there's something like seventy thousand whatever,
and then gen Z was like five hundred thousand dollars
salary or something like that.
Speaker 5 (03:57):
Yeah, I mean you're even seeing like if you're a creator,
even at like Goldman Sachs, you're probably making more money
as like making day in the life tiktoks than you
are from your salary. And like there's this growing creator economy,
and your role model might be somebody who's like made
millions and millions of dollars a year from humiliating themselves online,
(04:18):
and like there's all these possibilities and tools from entering
the creator economy. Like I think Bloomberg published a story
last week that even just the market for creator marketing
is like thirty three billion dollars.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Now, it's massive.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
This idea that no one's coming to save you. We've
talked about this on an episode before, but it does
feel like that kind of translates into people making these
lottery ticket type bets. Right, So I'll buy into crypto
or I'll make a ridiculous options trade or something like
that and hope that I just get lucky and save myself.
Speaker 5 (04:51):
M hmm, yeah, I think like something with crypto. There's
this online sort of sportsmanship and camaraderie around it as well,
So there's like this fun competition and making the money,
and it's all very public as well. To me, like
you're seeing out how much your peers are making and winning,
and you're almost like seeing how much they're taking home
each week, which is stressful.
Speaker 6 (05:12):
How much of the nobody is coming to save you.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Mentality is like AI dread like jobs as we know
them might not exist.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
I think a lot of it, Yeah, Moore.
Speaker 5 (05:23):
I mean back to this idea that say you graduate
from college last week on a one hundred degree day
and you don't have a job lined up yet, or
maybe you do have a job lined up, and you're
entering a very flat company where there's not like a
clear ladder for you to climb, and not only is
your timeline there, it probably feels somewhat flat, but the
end is like whether you're a copywriter or if you're
(05:47):
working in finance, there's like the end of it might
be a replacement with mass layoffs and AI coming in
to take that job.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
I'm going to ask a completely self interested question, but
does gen Z truly hate the millennial generation?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Is that a real thing?
Speaker 5 (06:03):
I'm not gen Z, so like, I'm not like the
speaker of the generation. I'm I guess maybe how I'm thirty,
So yeah, there's like but I never identified as gens.
I'm definitely identify more with millennials. I don't think they
truly hate millennials. I don't think that's the case. I
think that there's like a lot of parts about there's
like this tweetness to millennials that is like cringey, but
(06:28):
that's fair.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
I agree.
Speaker 6 (06:29):
Yeah, I'm really actually.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I've actually been thinking about this phenomenon of like really
flat companies for a while, so I thought it was
like really interesting that you said that, because.
Speaker 6 (06:40):
It really feels like and we actually did.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
An episode recently with the economist Ricardo Houseman where he
sort of talked about like companies their structure is just
they have a lot of different people who are like
the talent, but it doesn't feel like they're just sort
of normal jobs at a lot of companies for people
who are just sort of normal to get.
Speaker 5 (06:58):
Yeah, I worked at Meta for a few years and
there were like these Roman numerals next to your position,
and you knew how much everybody at the company was
making if they were like a three or five, And
when you moved from a four to a five, it
was like twenty thousand dollars more year, like not life changing,
like maybe you're taking an extra few ubers like a
year or something like that. And it felt very flat like.
(07:19):
And it's also hard to look at somebody who you're
working with who's two levels higher than you and necessarily
aspire to that, Like you're not going to stay an
extra two hours at night.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
It's not inspiring.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
So just going back to Momdani. So one of the
theories about why he's kind of resonating with the younger
crowd nowadays is this idea that Okay, they don't really
have a stake in capitalism necessarily, like they don't feel
like they're being rewarded by the capitalist system, and so
they're voting for change. Is that something you kind of
(07:52):
observe in your day to day interactions.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
Well, I work alone, so I'm not like observing many
interactions from people, but like online. I think the people
who gravitated towards him the strongest felt more religion like hope,
Like it was like this idea of hope and something different,
and it was like a salve after such a rough
beginning of the year with like Trump coming into the
(08:17):
White House. But yeah, I don't I think it was.
It felt more emotional and almost religious to me than like,
at least from what I've been observing, and and why
people attach themselves to that message so strongly.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
What about we're talking about, Okay, you have this desire
to get the bag, make a bunch of money and
like a lottery ticket metaphorically with crypto or whatever. How
does this mentality how would you say it changes consumption
patterns and like the impulse to just like save or
like how does it affect what people buy?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
That's a good question.
Speaker 5 (08:48):
I was talking to a friend the other day who
said that she was at her younger sister's graduation on
the West Coast and all of the young women were
wearing Gucci sandals, like all of them at this school.
It was in the Bay Area, and she's ten years
older than her sister, and she was like, this is
not something that I witnessed, and it's not like everyone
(09:08):
there is loaded to afford this this like specific sandal.
And I know that a lot of you might have
read that story in New York Magazine a few weeks
ago about the West Village and this sort of homogeneous
looking young person in New York City, and I'm realizing
that that's kind of a phenomenon across the whole country.
It's like everyone is wearing the same buying the same,
(09:30):
like fitting into this.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
And millennials back to that.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
It's like everybody wanted to do their own thing and
listen to their own music and have their own style
and have their own tumbler or whatever.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Like it was annoying.
Speaker 5 (09:41):
It was annoying, but it created like diversity of opinions
and the ability to have like small shows that sold
out and stuff and small brands that existed in small
stores that existed. But and I haven't fully baked out
the thought, but I started realizing it like a week ago,
like the West Village thing has quickly turned into like
if you live in them in a flyover state, or
(10:02):
you live in the West Village, you might be wearing
the same exact outfit and be just as obsessed with
like the macha thing whatever. So that's like definitely part
of the consumption conversation. It's like you're checking off boxes
of like small things that you're buying, whether it's at
Starbucks or Gucci, to like kind of form this perfect
(10:24):
life of what it means to be a twenty five
year old, And like, Okay, now I'm happy I figured
that out. Something else that I've been reading a lot about.
I have some young readers, and I do a lot
of surveys in my newsletter, which is awesome that my
readers are even willing to spend like fifteen minutes on
that because I wouldn't. There's a real sentiment of, like,
the world is burning, so why shouldn't we enjoy the
(10:45):
things that we can. And I don't know what the
savings accounts of these people look like or the credit
card bills look like, but I know that a lot
of these people are spending money that they do not have,
because I understand that the jobs that usually facilitate that
are a lot they're paying a lot more than what
these young people are making.
Speaker 4 (11:02):
And I imagine there's a sense that I'm never going
to make enough to buy a house or for sure, and.
Speaker 5 (11:07):
Then there's like the whole buy now, pay later conversation
which you can buy now, pay later, you're seamless, like
it's crazy. Yeah, So I think it's like you make
the money, you spend the money, and they're probably not
even thinking about what about my kids because that's the
dating apps don't even work.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
So I don't know where the kids come in.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Now, this is bleak, there's weak actually, you know, but
there's it's I'm enjoying this. So I lived for many
years of my life in Illinois. My dad was a
physics professor at a very small college, and really it
always strikes me like that he was totally fine moving
to a fairly small, large town in Illinois. When you
said flyover states, is there this aspiration that like you
(11:48):
have to get to one of the big cities that
like you have to get to like New York or
LA or San Francisci.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
I think as much as I don't think that's like
a new thing.
Speaker 5 (11:55):
I think it's like, well, we'll get to the West Village, like,
but I don't think that everybody there's like a new
grind to do that. I think that there's just as
many young people in New York living with four roommates
in a one bedroom with like weird home depot walls.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
Everywhere as there were when I was young.
Speaker 5 (12:14):
Where they're working, I mean, the three of us are
all like in the creator economy.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
I'm sure that there's a whole micro group of young
people doing the same trying to do the same thing we.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Are in the creator economy.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Just on the hey, there's a Mike.
Speaker 6 (12:33):
This is what else are we doing? We're creating?
Speaker 3 (12:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (12:37):
Did I disagree? No, Okay, we're creators.
Speaker 4 (12:41):
Just on the West Village girl thing and the idea
of homogeneity among fashion and consumerism. What do you think
is driving that? Is that like a lack of community
or I don't know, Like.
Speaker 5 (12:54):
That was one of the most shocking parts of the
story to me, Like I feel so silly. If there
was one person in this room with the same exact
outfit as me, I'd be like, ga, wait a second,
how what happened? Like I thought I was putting something together,
two white pieces of clothing, But it is it's really
weird to like, I don't know if you've ever been
in one of those workout classes, but it's like they
(13:16):
all have this set.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
It's I'm not sure what it is.
Speaker 5 (13:20):
I have to do some research, because it's an extreme
comfort with having the an identical life. And I think
part of it is probably like the Amazon storefront and
they're all following the same influencer who's promoting the same
product and everybody buys it immediately. There's this piece of
clothing I guess it was a dress from a Tory
(13:42):
birch a few weeks ago, and I posted it because
I saw like five people at the at different weddings
on the same weekend wearing it and it's a very
distinct like hot pink dress with mirrors all over it.
And I said, this is going to be the wedding
guest dress of the summer, like this is going to
be everywhere. And it sold out the next day, Like
people were not like then, I'm not going to buy it.
(14:02):
Everyone bought it, Like everybody clicked the link and then
bought it. Like there's this I think when you're all
following the same people and the same brands and having
the same excitement about the time people follow what time
like clothing drops come out at these brands too, Like
what time the sites get updated. There's a lot more
likelihood than that you're all going to buy the same thing.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Yeah, it's really weird, Like you'd think, Okay, people want
to be distinct. But I remember my wife and I
went out to a comedy show a couple months ago,
and everybody was dressed the same, and both of us
were like sort of flabbergasted.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
It was the same.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
It was just like sort of black, like a sort
of black shirt. I mean, you know, it's New York,
so people have always worn all black. But it was
really weird. There was no color in anyone's clothes in
the entire audience that night, and it was very strange.
How much do those Gucci sand goals cost.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Eight hundred?
Speaker 5 (14:51):
I don't know, man, I don't wear I don't have, okay,
but like a lot of money for a pair of
shoes and then for everyone to feel comfort. I mean
we see it all the time with bags and stuff,
but it is sort of funny when it's an entire wardrobe.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
You talk about the burken what.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Part I don't talk about, just talk about it. Do
people still buy burkins like as an investment? I don't know.
Speaker 5 (15:15):
Bethany Frankel said she's made like a ton of money
on flipping her burcands.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
But god, flip is crazy. Yeah, she's a flipper. She did.
She's bought some new houses too.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
One of the things that I always like reading in
your newsletter is like you're always talking about new brands
that are launching, new restaurants, et cetera. There's been we
talk about volatility in the market, all this uncertainty due
to trade and whatever else. Do you feel any slow
down it all in sort of new entrepreneurial endeavors on
account of all this uncertainty that's going on. Or is
(15:44):
it just like people just powering through.
Speaker 5 (15:46):
It a slow down of new economic endeavors like from young.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
People, yeah, or just like like new business launches. Has
that slowed down at all in your view with all
the economic question marks?
Speaker 3 (16:00):
No, I think people are doing it differently though.
Speaker 5 (16:02):
I don't think people are as excited to take on
like venture capital, and they're more likely to like bootstrap
or attach themselves to a friend and like try something
and have it fail and sort of quietly brush it
aside and be like I didn't start that weird vodka.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
Company that it's like that.
Speaker 5 (16:16):
Don't do that anymore, you know, where I think like
I can speak to the girl boss very well, like
the girl boss of of my When I was like
coming up in my twenties, was like taking these huge
checks from whatever fore runner, a general catalyst or whatever.
I never really thought about the implications. And then I
think young people have sort of learned what that means
at the end, which means people are gonna want some
(16:38):
return and often they don't get it.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
So I know you were talking in your newsletter. I
think it was just this week about another article in
New York mag which was about the Hamptons and the
sort of like existential stress. I guess that rich people
in the Hamptons feel about their lifestyle and they feel
competitive with one another, and I think you said that
people were kind of like batting that away and saying
(17:02):
that's not so much of a thing. But then on
the other hand, you also wrote about weddings and how
much everyone is spending on weddings nowadays, how expensive it
is to be a guest. I guess my question is, like,
what pockets of the culture, whether it's New York or beyond,
are are the most consumerist or wealth obsessed for you
right now?
Speaker 5 (17:20):
Women, The thing is, it's all happening, all the cameras
are always on. So like, let's take weddings, for example,
Hampton's are a different story. It's like a different There's
so many different facets going on there with the weddings.
It's like it used to be about the bride and
now it's about every individual at the wedding and the
(17:42):
photo that they're getting and where the photo is going
to end up after. I'm speaking from the point of
view of a New York woman who's like, I don't
know if this is the case for everyone. But something
else that I identified this morning with my husband that I
think is that I think that the definition of friend
who qualifies for wedding is sort of like expanding as well.
(18:03):
So there's this weird gift culture going on where if
I invite you, then I have to invite you, and
I'm expecting that you're going to invite me to yours.
And I also think that there's something happening with like
dms and group texts where people are getting closer faster
and like that also events the wedding guest lists.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Yeah, this resonates someone in want I think that someone
in a group chat recently now they're getting married, and
I was like, what the heck, why didn't I get
an invite?
Speaker 6 (18:30):
We're in a group chat together, so I could see
like that stress totally.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
I was talking to somebody before my wedding, which was
two months ago, about my wedding and they were like,
so am I invited?
Speaker 3 (18:40):
And I was like, no, I'm just telling you something
about my life right now. But there's also an etiquette epidemic. Wait,
what does that mean?
Speaker 6 (18:47):
What does that mean?
Speaker 5 (18:48):
An epidemic like people not holding the door for you,
people posting photos of your wedding before you do, like
things like that.
Speaker 6 (18:57):
I think we're at time. That was so good. There
was really I love your newsletter, I love.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Finally getting a chance to chat, and I think we
at some point we should do another longer episode just
on like the group chat at Connor.
Speaker 6 (19:08):
There are so many facets. Thank you so much, Emily,
thank you.
Speaker 4 (19:26):
This has been another episode at the Audlots podcast. I'm
Tracy Alloway. You can follow me at Tracy Alloway and.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
I'm Jill Wisenthal. You can follow me at the Stalwart.
Follow our producers Carmen Rodriguez at Carmen armand Dash Oll
Bennett at dashbot and Kilbrooks at Kilbrooks. For more Oddlots content,
go to Bloomberg dot com slash odd Lots, where we
have a daily newsletter and all of our episodes and
you can chat about these topics twenty four to seven
in our discord discord dot gg slash odlocks.
Speaker 4 (19:53):
And if you enjoy odd Lots, if you like it
when we do these live recordings, then please leave us
a positive review on your favorite podcas cast platform. Thanks
for listening.
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Hello, odd lots listeners. You are listening to another special
episode of the podcast. It was recorded in New York
City on July twenty sixth. In this conversation, we talked
to Emily Sunberg of the feed Me newsletter. We are
talking about how gen Z sees the world, how they
think about capitalism, how they think about money, how they
think about investing, how they think about spending it, and
(00:40):
how they think about how nobody is coming to save them.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (00:44):
I don't think it's a secret at this point that
gen Z seems to love stock market investing and things
like that, trying to make money. So take a listen.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
First question, I've been on my mind the last couple
of days. You have a very like young plugged in
like sort of business capitalism audience. What percentage of your
readers do you think voted for u Zoran?
Speaker 5 (01:09):
A young man I think he was nineteen, a Yale student,
emailed me this morning and asked if I could put
that poll in my newsletter, and I didn't. It felt
a little late, but I should have. I'm guessing sixty
five percent. Cautiously like, yeah, can.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
You maybe describe your sort of average reader just for
people who might not be aware, like what population are
you plugged into here?
Speaker 5 (01:36):
So I don't know if any of you use substack,
but they don't give you these analytics. So all of
my data about my readership has been quite anecdotal from
just looking at people's profiles in the comment section and
seeing who shows up to my parties.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Do any of you read it? Like if I do?
Speaker 5 (01:52):
Okay, so some of you that's some of my audience.
I like to say that my readership is everyone from
bartenders to billionaires. But I would say, like, if you're
paying eighty dollars a year for a newsletter, then you're
probably making a decent amount of money, or you're at
least interested in making money. And I think it's a
mostly New York audience thirty to forty five ish, But
(02:15):
if you come to my parties you'll see who else
there is. But I would say, like people interested in
making money and somewhat interested in New York City business
and culture.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
So the first time, several tries to get you on
the podcast, but finally making it happen, and I wanted
to talk about like gen Z and capitalism, because I
feel like millennials and maybe Gen X, but Millennials in
particular like sort of had this love hate relationship, like
sort of apologized for wanting money, so ambivalent about it.
(02:46):
And I get the impression that the younger generation is
like much more comfortable with like.
Speaker 6 (02:51):
Yeah, we want to make a ton of money.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
So I'm like, yeah, so talk about if that's correct
this perception.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I think one thing that's very clear about gen Z
is that they've repeatedly been told nobody.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Is coming to save you.
Speaker 5 (03:06):
You're going to graduate into a job market that barely exists,
and if you get a job, you might not even
have a desk or an office to go into.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
A lot of.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
Them were home during COVID, and they're also seeing like
shootings and schools all the time, and they're seeing their
capital getting sworn like there it's nobody's coming to save them,
and it's sort of up to them to make the
most of this world while it's still in existence. And
you hear this sense of like get the bag while
(03:37):
the world is still here for.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
You to make some money out of it. What was
your question?
Speaker 6 (03:42):
No, that was basically it like that's kind of overwhelming.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Sentiment that I hear from these people. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I think it was like some survey and they asked
all the generations, like what do you need to have
a good life, and there's something like seventy thousand whatever,
and then gen Z was like five hundred thousand dollars
salary or something like that.
Speaker 5 (03:57):
Yeah, I mean you're even seeing like if you're a creator,
even at like Goldman Sachs, you're probably making more money
as like making day in the life tiktoks than you
are from your salary. And like there's this growing creator economy,
and your role model might be somebody who's like made
millions and millions of dollars a year from humiliating themselves online,
(04:18):
and like there's all these possibilities and tools from entering
the creator economy. Like I think Bloomberg published a story
last week that even just the market for creator marketing
is like thirty three billion dollars.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Now, it's massive.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
This idea that no one's coming to save you. We've
talked about this on an episode before, but it does
feel like that kind of translates into people making these
lottery ticket type bets. Right, So I'll buy into crypto
or I'll make a ridiculous options trade or something like
that and hope that I just get lucky and save myself.
Speaker 5 (04:51):
M hmm, yeah, I think like something with crypto. There's
this online sort of sportsmanship and camaraderie around it as well,
So there's like this fun competition and making the money,
and it's all very public as well. To me, like
you're seeing out how much your peers are making and winning,
and you're almost like seeing how much they're taking home
each week, which is stressful.
Speaker 6 (05:12):
How much of the nobody is coming to save you.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Mentality is like AI dread like jobs as we know
them might not exist.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
I think a lot of it, Yeah, Moore.
Speaker 5 (05:23):
I mean back to this idea that say you graduate
from college last week on a one hundred degree day
and you don't have a job lined up yet, or
maybe you do have a job lined up, and you're
entering a very flat company where there's not like a
clear ladder for you to climb, and not only is
your timeline there, it probably feels somewhat flat, but the
end is like whether you're a copywriter or if you're
(05:47):
working in finance, there's like the end of it might
be a replacement with mass layoffs and AI coming in
to take that job.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
I'm going to ask a completely self interested question, but
does gen Z truly hate the millennial generation?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Is that a real thing?
Speaker 5 (06:03):
I'm not gen Z, so like, I'm not like the
speaker of the generation. I'm I guess maybe how I'm thirty,
So yeah, there's like but I never identified as gens.
I'm definitely identify more with millennials. I don't think they
truly hate millennials. I don't think that's the case. I
think that there's like a lot of parts about there's
like this tweetness to millennials that is like cringey, but
(06:28):
that's fair.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
I agree.
Speaker 6 (06:29):
Yeah, I'm really actually.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I've actually been thinking about this phenomenon of like really
flat companies for a while, so I thought it was
like really interesting that you said that, because.
Speaker 6 (06:40):
It really feels like and we actually did.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
An episode recently with the economist Ricardo Houseman where he
sort of talked about like companies their structure is just
they have a lot of different people who are like
the talent, but it doesn't feel like they're just sort
of normal jobs at a lot of companies for people
who are just sort of normal to get.
Speaker 5 (06:58):
Yeah, I worked at Meta for a few years and
there were like these Roman numerals next to your position,
and you knew how much everybody at the company was
making if they were like a three or five, And
when you moved from a four to a five, it
was like twenty thousand dollars more year, like not life changing,
like maybe you're taking an extra few ubers like a
year or something like that. And it felt very flat like.
(07:19):
And it's also hard to look at somebody who you're
working with who's two levels higher than you and necessarily
aspire to that, Like you're not going to stay an
extra two hours at night.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
It's not inspiring.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
So just going back to Momdani. So one of the
theories about why he's kind of resonating with the younger
crowd nowadays is this idea that Okay, they don't really
have a stake in capitalism necessarily, like they don't feel
like they're being rewarded by the capitalist system, and so
they're voting for change. Is that something you kind of
(07:52):
observe in your day to day interactions.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
Well, I work alone, so I'm not like observing many
interactions from people, but like online. I think the people
who gravitated towards him the strongest felt more religion like hope,
Like it was like this idea of hope and something different,
and it was like a salve after such a rough
beginning of the year with like Trump coming into the
(08:17):
White House. But yeah, I don't I think it was.
It felt more emotional and almost religious to me than like,
at least from what I've been observing, and and why
people attach themselves to that message so strongly.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
What about we're talking about, Okay, you have this desire
to get the bag, make a bunch of money and
like a lottery ticket metaphorically with crypto or whatever. How
does this mentality how would you say it changes consumption
patterns and like the impulse to just like save or
like how does it affect what people buy?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
That's a good question.
Speaker 5 (08:48):
I was talking to a friend the other day who
said that she was at her younger sister's graduation on
the West Coast and all of the young women were
wearing Gucci sandals, like all of them at this school.
It was in the Bay Area, and she's ten years
older than her sister, and she was like, this is
not something that I witnessed, and it's not like everyone
(09:08):
there is loaded to afford this this like specific sandal.
And I know that a lot of you might have
read that story in New York Magazine a few weeks
ago about the West Village and this sort of homogeneous
looking young person in New York City, and I'm realizing
that that's kind of a phenomenon across the whole country.
It's like everyone is wearing the same buying the same,
(09:30):
like fitting into this.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
And millennials back to that.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
It's like everybody wanted to do their own thing and
listen to their own music and have their own style
and have their own tumbler or whatever.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Like it was annoying.
Speaker 5 (09:41):
It was annoying, but it created like diversity of opinions
and the ability to have like small shows that sold
out and stuff and small brands that existed in small
stores that existed. But and I haven't fully baked out
the thought, but I started realizing it like a week ago,
like the West Village thing has quickly turned into like
if you live in them in a flyover state, or
(10:02):
you live in the West Village, you might be wearing
the same exact outfit and be just as obsessed with
like the macha thing whatever. So that's like definitely part
of the consumption conversation. It's like you're checking off boxes
of like small things that you're buying, whether it's at
Starbucks or Gucci, to like kind of form this perfect
(10:24):
life of what it means to be a twenty five
year old, And like, Okay, now I'm happy I figured
that out. Something else that I've been reading a lot about.
I have some young readers, and I do a lot
of surveys in my newsletter, which is awesome that my
readers are even willing to spend like fifteen minutes on
that because I wouldn't. There's a real sentiment of, like,
the world is burning, so why shouldn't we enjoy the
(10:45):
things that we can. And I don't know what the
savings accounts of these people look like or the credit
card bills look like, but I know that a lot
of these people are spending money that they do not have,
because I understand that the jobs that usually facilitate that
are a lot they're paying a lot more than what
these young people are making.
Speaker 4 (11:02):
And I imagine there's a sense that I'm never going
to make enough to buy a house or for sure, and.
Speaker 5 (11:07):
Then there's like the whole buy now, pay later conversation
which you can buy now, pay later, you're seamless, like
it's crazy. Yeah, So I think it's like you make
the money, you spend the money, and they're probably not
even thinking about what about my kids because that's the
dating apps don't even work.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
So I don't know where the kids come in.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Now, this is bleak, there's weak actually, you know, but
there's it's I'm enjoying this. So I lived for many
years of my life in Illinois. My dad was a
physics professor at a very small college, and really it
always strikes me like that he was totally fine moving
to a fairly small, large town in Illinois. When you
said flyover states, is there this aspiration that like you
(11:48):
have to get to one of the big cities that
like you have to get to like New York or
LA or San Francisci.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
I think as much as I don't think that's like
a new thing.
Speaker 5 (11:55):
I think it's like, well, we'll get to the West Village, like,
but I don't think that everybody there's like a new
grind to do that. I think that there's just as
many young people in New York living with four roommates
in a one bedroom with like weird home depot walls.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
Everywhere as there were when I was young.
Speaker 5 (12:14):
Where they're working, I mean, the three of us are
all like in the creator economy.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
I'm sure that there's a whole micro group of young
people doing the same trying to do the same thing we.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Are in the creator economy.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Just on the hey, there's a Mike.
Speaker 6 (12:33):
This is what else are we doing? We're creating?
Speaker 3 (12:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (12:37):
Did I disagree? No, Okay, we're creators.
Speaker 4 (12:41):
Just on the West Village girl thing and the idea
of homogeneity among fashion and consumerism. What do you think
is driving that? Is that like a lack of community
or I don't know, Like.
Speaker 5 (12:54):
That was one of the most shocking parts of the
story to me, Like I feel so silly. If there
was one person in this room with the same exact
outfit as me, I'd be like, ga, wait a second,
how what happened? Like I thought I was putting something together,
two white pieces of clothing, But it is it's really
weird to like, I don't know if you've ever been
in one of those workout classes, but it's like they
(13:16):
all have this set.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
It's I'm not sure what it is.
Speaker 5 (13:20):
I have to do some research, because it's an extreme
comfort with having the an identical life. And I think
part of it is probably like the Amazon storefront and
they're all following the same influencer who's promoting the same
product and everybody buys it immediately. There's this piece of
clothing I guess it was a dress from a Tory
(13:42):
birch a few weeks ago, and I posted it because
I saw like five people at the at different weddings
on the same weekend wearing it and it's a very
distinct like hot pink dress with mirrors all over it.
And I said, this is going to be the wedding
guest dress of the summer, like this is going to
be everywhere. And it sold out the next day, Like
people were not like then, I'm not going to buy it.
(14:02):
Everyone bought it, Like everybody clicked the link and then
bought it. Like there's this I think when you're all
following the same people and the same brands and having
the same excitement about the time people follow what time
like clothing drops come out at these brands too, Like
what time the sites get updated. There's a lot more
likelihood than that you're all going to buy the same thing.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Yeah, it's really weird, Like you'd think, Okay, people want
to be distinct. But I remember my wife and I
went out to a comedy show a couple months ago,
and everybody was dressed the same, and both of us
were like sort of flabbergasted.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
It was the same.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
It was just like sort of black, like a sort
of black shirt. I mean, you know, it's New York,
so people have always worn all black. But it was
really weird. There was no color in anyone's clothes in
the entire audience that night, and it was very strange.
How much do those Gucci sand goals cost.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Eight hundred?
Speaker 5 (14:51):
I don't know, man, I don't wear I don't have, okay,
but like a lot of money for a pair of
shoes and then for everyone to feel comfort. I mean
we see it all the time with bags and stuff,
but it is sort of funny when it's an entire wardrobe.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
You talk about the burken what.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Part I don't talk about, just talk about it. Do
people still buy burkins like as an investment? I don't know.
Speaker 5 (15:15):
Bethany Frankel said she's made like a ton of money
on flipping her burcands.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
But god, flip is crazy. Yeah, she's a flipper. She did.
She's bought some new houses too.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
One of the things that I always like reading in
your newsletter is like you're always talking about new brands
that are launching, new restaurants, et cetera. There's been we
talk about volatility in the market, all this uncertainty due
to trade and whatever else. Do you feel any slow
down it all in sort of new entrepreneurial endeavors on
account of all this uncertainty that's going on. Or is
(15:44):
it just like people just powering through.
Speaker 5 (15:46):
It a slow down of new economic endeavors like from young.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
People, yeah, or just like like new business launches. Has
that slowed down at all in your view with all
the economic question marks?
Speaker 3 (16:00):
No, I think people are doing it differently though.
Speaker 5 (16:02):
I don't think people are as excited to take on
like venture capital, and they're more likely to like bootstrap
or attach themselves to a friend and like try something
and have it fail and sort of quietly brush it
aside and be like I didn't start that weird vodka.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
Company that it's like that.
Speaker 5 (16:16):
Don't do that anymore, you know, where I think like
I can speak to the girl boss very well, like
the girl boss of of my When I was like
coming up in my twenties, was like taking these huge
checks from whatever fore runner, a general catalyst or whatever.
I never really thought about the implications. And then I
think young people have sort of learned what that means
at the end, which means people are gonna want some
(16:38):
return and often they don't get it.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
So I know you were talking in your newsletter. I
think it was just this week about another article in
New York mag which was about the Hamptons and the
sort of like existential stress. I guess that rich people
in the Hamptons feel about their lifestyle and they feel
competitive with one another, and I think you said that
people were kind of like batting that away and saying
(17:02):
that's not so much of a thing. But then on
the other hand, you also wrote about weddings and how
much everyone is spending on weddings nowadays, how expensive it
is to be a guest. I guess my question is, like,
what pockets of the culture, whether it's New York or beyond,
are are the most consumerist or wealth obsessed for you
right now?
Speaker 5 (17:20):
Women, The thing is, it's all happening, all the cameras
are always on. So like, let's take weddings, for example,
Hampton's are a different story. It's like a different There's
so many different facets going on there with the weddings.
It's like it used to be about the bride and
now it's about every individual at the wedding and the
(17:42):
photo that they're getting and where the photo is going
to end up after. I'm speaking from the point of
view of a New York woman who's like, I don't
know if this is the case for everyone. But something
else that I identified this morning with my husband that I
think is that I think that the definition of friend
who qualifies for wedding is sort of like expanding as well.
(18:03):
So there's this weird gift culture going on where if
I invite you, then I have to invite you, and
I'm expecting that you're going to invite me to yours.
And I also think that there's something happening with like
dms and group texts where people are getting closer faster
and like that also events the wedding guest lists.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Yeah, this resonates someone in want I think that someone
in a group chat recently now they're getting married, and
I was like, what the heck, why didn't I get
an invite?
Speaker 6 (18:30):
We're in a group chat together, so I could see
like that stress totally.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
I was talking to somebody before my wedding, which was
two months ago, about my wedding and they were like,
so am I invited?
Speaker 3 (18:40):
And I was like, no, I'm just telling you something
about my life right now. But there's also an etiquette epidemic. Wait,
what does that mean?
Speaker 6 (18:47):
What does that mean?
Speaker 5 (18:48):
An epidemic like people not holding the door for you,
people posting photos of your wedding before you do, like
things like that.
Speaker 6 (18:57):
I think we're at time. That was so good. There
was really I love your newsletter, I love.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Finally getting a chance to chat, and I think we
at some point we should do another longer episode just
on like the group chat at Connor.
Speaker 6 (19:08):
There are so many facets. Thank you so much, Emily,
thank you.
Speaker 4 (19:26):
This has been another episode at the Audlots podcast. I'm
Tracy Alloway. You can follow me at Tracy Alloway and.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
I'm Jill Wisenthal. You can follow me at the Stalwart.
Follow our producers Carmen Rodriguez at Carmen armand Dash Oll
Bennett at dashbot and Kilbrooks at Kilbrooks. For more Oddlots content,
go to Bloomberg dot com slash odd Lots, where we
have a daily newsletter and all of our episodes and
you can chat about these topics twenty four to seven
in our discord discord dot gg slash odlocks.
Speaker 4 (19:53):
And if you enjoy odd Lots, if you like it
when we do these live recordings, then please leave us
a positive review on your favorite podcas cast platform. Thanks
for listening.
Hosts And Creators
Joe Weisenthal
Tracy Alloway
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.