August 11, 2025 • 14 mins
Australia will recognise a Palestinian state at the United Nations in September, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has announced.
Albanese claims the move will help advance a two-state solution and is “humanity’s best hope” for peace in the Middle East.
But as Israel intensifies its military campaign in Gaza once again, what difference does recognition really make?
Today, contributing editor of The New Daily, Amy Remeikis, on what the international community is trying to achieve – and whether it's too late.
If you enjoy 7am, the best way you can support us is by making a contribution at 7ampodcast.com.au/support.
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Guest: Contributing editor of The New Daily Amy Remeikis
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Today, I can confirm that at the eightieth Session of
the United Nations General Assembly in September, Australia will recognize
the state of Palestine.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Prime Minister Anthony Alberanesi has announced that from next month,
Australia will recognize a Palestinian state, alongside allies including the UK,
Canada and France. Albanzi claims that doing so would move
the Middle East back toward a two state solution.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
A two state solution is humanity's best hope to break
the cycle of violence in the Middle East and to
bring an end to the conflict, suffering and starvation in Gaza.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
But as Israel ramps up its military campaign in Gaza
once again, what difference does recognition really make? I'm Ruby
Jones and you're listening to seven AM today contributing editor
of the New Daalie Amy Ramikuz on what the international
community is trying to achieve and whether it's too late.
(01:11):
It's Tuesday, August twelfth. Amy, We've just heard the Prime
Minister Anthony Abernezi announce that Australia will recognize a Palestinian state.
So what does that actually mean in practical terms? It's
largely symbolic. It is not going to do anything to
(01:33):
end the military offensive that Israel is carrying out in Gaza.
It's not going to do anything to start the flow
of aid. It's not going to be able to stop
Israel or pressure.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Them into doing anything that Israel doesn't want to do,
particularly why the United States remains so strongly allied with
Israel in this campaign. What it will do, though, is
it does isolate Benjamin Ettanyahu within the international community. It
also sets up stronger diplomatic relations with the Palestinian Authority,
(02:02):
which is who every Western government is talking about when
they talk about recognizing Palestine. They're talking about the Palestinian Authority,
which is in the West Bank, and the Palestinian Authority
has already agreed to these preconditions to recognition.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
The Palestinian Authority has reaffirmed it recognizes Israel's right to
exist in peace and security. It has committed to demilitarize
and to hold general elections. It has pledged to abolish
the system of payments to the families of prisoners and martyrs,
and promised broader reform of governance, financial transparency in the
(02:42):
education system, including international oversight to guard against the incitement
of violence and hatred. These detailed and significant commitments have
been given even greater weight by the Arab leagues unprecedented
demand for Hamas to end it to rule in Gaza
and surrender its weapons to the Palestinian authority.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
So every Western country is already speaking as if the
Palestinian Authority is going to be the authority for all
of Palestine, including Gaza. So it strengthens those diplomatic relations.
It probably also will help the Palestinian authority rebuild to
a place where they do have authority because they will
have Western support in this.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
And we've had many times in the lead up to
this announcement the criticism that recognizing Palestine now ultimately rewards
the mus for their actions on October seven. So how
is the Australian government responding to that claim?
Speaker 3 (03:41):
What's your answer to that assertion?
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Har Mass don't support two states. A mass support one state.
In their words, from the River to the Sea, A
mass do not support recognizing the right of Israel to exist.
This is an opportunity to isolate Hamas that has been
forged by the very clear statements of the Palestinian Authority
(04:09):
on June ten and the very clear statements of the
Arab loke.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
At this point, Australia, like most of the Western world,
is talking about establishing relations with the Palestinian authority, which
is separate to Hamas, and they're still saying Hamas is
not going to be part of any further negotiations. I mean, realistically,
it is not for any Western government to say how
(04:33):
the Palestinians form government. It's for the Palestinians to decide
who forms their government, and then it is for the
countries to work out how they have those relations with
you know, that government down the track. We do it
with several nations that we don't have an exact agreement
on or we have ideological opposition to, and it will
(04:55):
be no different here. At this point. It's about, i suppose,
diplomatically trying to say, well, we're not going to negotiate
with terrorists, but it is international law that we cannot
install a government in Palestine. That is for the Palestinians
to do so. At the moment, I think we're talking
a big game, but the future is not ours to declare.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Nevertheless, though we have had the ab and easy say
that you know, as you've mentioned, there'll be no role
for Hamas in a Palestinian state, and that the plan
is for the Palestinian authority to be in charge. So
I just wanted to ask what state the Palestinian authority
is in and whether it's realistic that they would be
ready to govern.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
I think that's why the recognition from the Western countries
at this point is so important. There's so far to
go in this. I mean, the Palestinian authority will need
quite a bit of help in terms of the direction
that it chooses to go. There is going to be
borders that need to be decided on, There's going to
be you know, what role does Israel play in establishing
(06:00):
these two states? And there's also the question of what
is left of Gaza in terms of there actually being
a second state here, what is left of Palestine, what
is the right of return? All of these other questions
that have not yet been reckoned with. There are no
answers for from the Western community because at the moment,
the end goal is to try and pressure Israel into
(06:22):
stopping its military assault on Gaza. That right now is
the goal of all the Western countries that have decided
to finally recognize a Palestinian state. But in terms of
what it means for Palestinians. It's really difficult to say,
because it's not going to stop anything, and every country
(06:46):
that has decided to recognize Palestine now has to follow
through in concrete action to ensure that there is a
Palestine left to recognize.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Coming up, what recognizing Palestine means for Australia's relationship with
Israel and the United States.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
If there is a concern on Australia's part about international
law being violated here, I'm just wondering what further steps
might be taken here. Germany is going to block or
suspend arm sales to Israel that could be used in Gaza.
What about the armored steel and the F thirty five
components that Australia contributes.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
Would they be blocked?
Speaker 5 (07:30):
Oh, well, let's be clear, we don't supply weapons to Israel.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
The armed steel and the F thirty five components is
what I'm asking about.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
The Australian government has also been criticized for selling weapon
pats to Israel. So would recognition trigger any change or
any review of that arrangement.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
Well, it probably already should have under international law. And
if this ever gets to the Hague, which many believe
that it eventually will. Australia, like all nations in the
F thirty five supply chain, will have a case to answer.
The answer from the Isustralian government is that we're not
directly supplying weapons parts.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
Well, we're in F thirty five country and we have
been that for a couple of decades, and that is
a multilateral arrangement with supply chains that are organized by
Lockheed Martin in the United States and have multiple supplies
in respect of all of those supply chains. So really
that is a very different question, and we are a
(08:25):
part of that process.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
We're just supplying part non lethal parts that end up
in these lethal planes that then end up dropping bombs
on guars and civilians. It could instigate a review, but
again this is going to depend on how much pressure
is applied to Israel. And the big sticking point here
is the United States. The United States has shown no
(08:49):
sign that it will be recognizing Palestine, that it's going
to stop supplying arms to Israel, or indeed that it's
going to support any of this international push to try
to pressure Israel into complying with international law. So it
really is going to depend on how the United States
acts here, how much pressure is put on the United
(09:11):
States to start complying with its own international obligations, and
how willing Australia is going to be as being part
of that international pressure.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
And we know that Penny Will has already spoken to
Secretary of State Marco Rubio. So what do you think
that this move of recognizing a Palestinian state will mean
for our relationship with the US as it already caused tension.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
It has already caused tension, but I think that was
coming regardless of whether or not Australia took this step
now next week, last week, it didn't matter.
Speaker 6 (09:43):
On the Ruvio phone call, did you get any assurances
that our decision on this will not affect the rest
of the biolateral relationship with the US given the Trump
administration's opposition, You're not expecting any blowback on things like
trade or orcus or anything else.
Speaker 7 (09:59):
We speak first and we make our sovereign decisions. But
you will see from the reader. I think that the
State Department have issued since the call. We spoke about
a range of batterms, including the Indo Pacific. Insecurity in
the Indo Pacific.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
It was interesting that the readout that the White House
provided of that phone call, there was only a couple
of lines and it essentially just said that it would
discuss the Middle East as well as the strategic partnerships
that Australia has throughout the Pacific. And I think that
that is the line that Penny Wong is trying to
speak to is that we're going to disagree on this,
but our allyship is still quite tight when it comes
(10:35):
to our region. We're just going to disagree over how
to handle the Middle East.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
And Benjamin Netanya who has said that recognition by Australia
would be shameful, and these comments come off the back
of Israel's Foreign minister calling Albneazi a liar for saying
that aid was being restricted from coming into Gaza. So
how is the Australian government attempting to navigate its relationship
with Israel in this moment.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
I think that there's been a lot of work that
the Australian government has put in to keep Israel's government
in the loop of where Australia is thinking on this.
There has been a lot of diplomatic pressure applied, and
of course we've also seen the Australian government seek to
soothe Israel at different times by saying we are addressing
(11:23):
anti Semitism in Australia, we are reacting to that. What
we are standing for is international law and this has
all very much been couched in these diplomatic terms that
Australia is upholding international law obligations and humanitarian law obligations.
Australia didn't really start really strengthening its language until we
(11:43):
saw the United Kingdom and Canada and parts of the
U start to really toughen up their stance against Israel.
And that started when the images of the Stage five
malnutrition started coming through from Palestinian journalists, when they started
showing the real effects of a deliberate starvation campaign on
(12:05):
a civilian population. And that's when we saw the international
community really start to step up. So Australia has been
able to toughen its language, but of course I think
we also need to recognize the Australian people and the
protesters and that giant display in Sydney not so long ago.
(12:25):
It's no surprise that the Australian government has been pressured
into moving perhaps faster than they anticipated, and it's because
of the groundswell of support from Australian people who said.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Enough, why and me, thank you so much for via Tan.
Speaker 8 (12:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Also in the news today, a journalist described as one
of Al Jazeera's most recognizable faces reporting from Gaza has
been killed alongside four colleagues in an Israeli air strike.
Anas Al Sharif, who was twenty eight, was among a
group of Al Jazeera's staff who died in a strike
on a tent near Schifa Hospital in Gaza City on Sunday.
(13:25):
According to Gaza officials and Al Jazeera, and electric car
drivers could be hit with a road tax, with federal
MP Tanya Plibersek framing it a sensible move as more
people switch to evs. The comments come ahead of the
federal government's Productivity roundtable next week. I'm Ruby Jones. This
(13:46):
is seven am. See you tomorrow.
Today, I can confirm that at the eightieth Session of
the United Nations General Assembly in September, Australia will recognize
the state of Palestine.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Prime Minister Anthony Alberanesi has announced that from next month,
Australia will recognize a Palestinian state, alongside allies including the UK,
Canada and France. Albanzi claims that doing so would move
the Middle East back toward a two state solution.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
A two state solution is humanity's best hope to break
the cycle of violence in the Middle East and to
bring an end to the conflict, suffering and starvation in Gaza.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
But as Israel ramps up its military campaign in Gaza
once again, what difference does recognition really make? I'm Ruby
Jones and you're listening to seven AM today contributing editor
of the New Daalie Amy Ramikuz on what the international
community is trying to achieve and whether it's too late.
(01:11):
It's Tuesday, August twelfth. Amy, We've just heard the Prime
Minister Anthony Abernezi announce that Australia will recognize a Palestinian state.
So what does that actually mean in practical terms? It's
largely symbolic. It is not going to do anything to
(01:33):
end the military offensive that Israel is carrying out in Gaza.
It's not going to do anything to start the flow
of aid. It's not going to be able to stop
Israel or pressure.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Them into doing anything that Israel doesn't want to do,
particularly why the United States remains so strongly allied with
Israel in this campaign. What it will do, though, is
it does isolate Benjamin Ettanyahu within the international community. It
also sets up stronger diplomatic relations with the Palestinian Authority,
(02:02):
which is who every Western government is talking about when
they talk about recognizing Palestine. They're talking about the Palestinian Authority,
which is in the West Bank, and the Palestinian Authority
has already agreed to these preconditions to recognition.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
The Palestinian Authority has reaffirmed it recognizes Israel's right to
exist in peace and security. It has committed to demilitarize
and to hold general elections. It has pledged to abolish
the system of payments to the families of prisoners and martyrs,
and promised broader reform of governance, financial transparency in the
(02:42):
education system, including international oversight to guard against the incitement
of violence and hatred. These detailed and significant commitments have
been given even greater weight by the Arab leagues unprecedented
demand for Hamas to end it to rule in Gaza
and surrender its weapons to the Palestinian authority.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
So every Western country is already speaking as if the
Palestinian Authority is going to be the authority for all
of Palestine, including Gaza. So it strengthens those diplomatic relations.
It probably also will help the Palestinian authority rebuild to
a place where they do have authority because they will
have Western support in this.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
And we've had many times in the lead up to
this announcement the criticism that recognizing Palestine now ultimately rewards
the mus for their actions on October seven. So how
is the Australian government responding to that claim?
Speaker 3 (03:41):
What's your answer to that assertion?
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Har Mass don't support two states. A mass support one state.
In their words, from the River to the Sea, A
mass do not support recognizing the right of Israel to exist.
This is an opportunity to isolate Hamas that has been
forged by the very clear statements of the Palestinian Authority
(04:09):
on June ten and the very clear statements of the
Arab loke.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
At this point, Australia, like most of the Western world,
is talking about establishing relations with the Palestinian authority, which
is separate to Hamas, and they're still saying Hamas is
not going to be part of any further negotiations. I mean, realistically,
it is not for any Western government to say how
(04:33):
the Palestinians form government. It's for the Palestinians to decide
who forms their government, and then it is for the
countries to work out how they have those relations with
you know, that government down the track. We do it
with several nations that we don't have an exact agreement
on or we have ideological opposition to, and it will
(04:55):
be no different here. At this point. It's about, i suppose,
diplomatically trying to say, well, we're not going to negotiate
with terrorists, but it is international law that we cannot
install a government in Palestine. That is for the Palestinians
to do so. At the moment, I think we're talking
a big game, but the future is not ours to declare.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Nevertheless, though we have had the ab and easy say
that you know, as you've mentioned, there'll be no role
for Hamas in a Palestinian state, and that the plan
is for the Palestinian authority to be in charge. So
I just wanted to ask what state the Palestinian authority
is in and whether it's realistic that they would be
ready to govern.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
I think that's why the recognition from the Western countries
at this point is so important. There's so far to
go in this. I mean, the Palestinian authority will need
quite a bit of help in terms of the direction
that it chooses to go. There is going to be
borders that need to be decided on, There's going to
be you know, what role does Israel play in establishing
(06:00):
these two states? And there's also the question of what
is left of Gaza in terms of there actually being
a second state here, what is left of Palestine, what
is the right of return? All of these other questions
that have not yet been reckoned with. There are no
answers for from the Western community because at the moment,
the end goal is to try and pressure Israel into
(06:22):
stopping its military assault on Gaza. That right now is
the goal of all the Western countries that have decided
to finally recognize a Palestinian state. But in terms of
what it means for Palestinians. It's really difficult to say,
because it's not going to stop anything, and every country
(06:46):
that has decided to recognize Palestine now has to follow
through in concrete action to ensure that there is a
Palestine left to recognize.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Coming up, what recognizing Palestine means for Australia's relationship with
Israel and the United States.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
If there is a concern on Australia's part about international
law being violated here, I'm just wondering what further steps
might be taken here. Germany is going to block or
suspend arm sales to Israel that could be used in Gaza.
What about the armored steel and the F thirty five
components that Australia contributes.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
Would they be blocked?
Speaker 5 (07:30):
Oh, well, let's be clear, we don't supply weapons to Israel.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
The armed steel and the F thirty five components is
what I'm asking about.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
The Australian government has also been criticized for selling weapon
pats to Israel. So would recognition trigger any change or
any review of that arrangement.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
Well, it probably already should have under international law. And
if this ever gets to the Hague, which many believe
that it eventually will. Australia, like all nations in the
F thirty five supply chain, will have a case to answer.
The answer from the Isustralian government is that we're not
directly supplying weapons parts.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
Well, we're in F thirty five country and we have
been that for a couple of decades, and that is
a multilateral arrangement with supply chains that are organized by
Lockheed Martin in the United States and have multiple supplies
in respect of all of those supply chains. So really
that is a very different question, and we are a
(08:25):
part of that process.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
We're just supplying part non lethal parts that end up
in these lethal planes that then end up dropping bombs
on guars and civilians. It could instigate a review, but
again this is going to depend on how much pressure
is applied to Israel. And the big sticking point here
is the United States. The United States has shown no
(08:49):
sign that it will be recognizing Palestine, that it's going
to stop supplying arms to Israel, or indeed that it's
going to support any of this international push to try
to pressure Israel into complying with international law. So it
really is going to depend on how the United States
acts here, how much pressure is put on the United
(09:11):
States to start complying with its own international obligations, and
how willing Australia is going to be as being part
of that international pressure.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
And we know that Penny Will has already spoken to
Secretary of State Marco Rubio. So what do you think
that this move of recognizing a Palestinian state will mean
for our relationship with the US as it already caused tension.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
It has already caused tension, but I think that was
coming regardless of whether or not Australia took this step
now next week, last week, it didn't matter.
Speaker 6 (09:43):
On the Ruvio phone call, did you get any assurances
that our decision on this will not affect the rest
of the biolateral relationship with the US given the Trump
administration's opposition, You're not expecting any blowback on things like
trade or orcus or anything else.
Speaker 7 (09:59):
We speak first and we make our sovereign decisions. But
you will see from the reader. I think that the
State Department have issued since the call. We spoke about
a range of batterms, including the Indo Pacific. Insecurity in
the Indo Pacific.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
It was interesting that the readout that the White House
provided of that phone call, there was only a couple
of lines and it essentially just said that it would
discuss the Middle East as well as the strategic partnerships
that Australia has throughout the Pacific. And I think that
that is the line that Penny Wong is trying to
speak to is that we're going to disagree on this,
but our allyship is still quite tight when it comes
(10:35):
to our region. We're just going to disagree over how
to handle the Middle East.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
And Benjamin Netanya who has said that recognition by Australia
would be shameful, and these comments come off the back
of Israel's Foreign minister calling Albneazi a liar for saying
that aid was being restricted from coming into Gaza. So
how is the Australian government attempting to navigate its relationship
with Israel in this moment.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
I think that there's been a lot of work that
the Australian government has put in to keep Israel's government
in the loop of where Australia is thinking on this.
There has been a lot of diplomatic pressure applied, and
of course we've also seen the Australian government seek to
soothe Israel at different times by saying we are addressing
(11:23):
anti Semitism in Australia, we are reacting to that. What
we are standing for is international law and this has
all very much been couched in these diplomatic terms that
Australia is upholding international law obligations and humanitarian law obligations.
Australia didn't really start really strengthening its language until we
(11:43):
saw the United Kingdom and Canada and parts of the
U start to really toughen up their stance against Israel.
And that started when the images of the Stage five
malnutrition started coming through from Palestinian journalists, when they started
showing the real effects of a deliberate starvation campaign on
(12:05):
a civilian population. And that's when we saw the international
community really start to step up. So Australia has been
able to toughen its language, but of course I think
we also need to recognize the Australian people and the
protesters and that giant display in Sydney not so long ago.
(12:25):
It's no surprise that the Australian government has been pressured
into moving perhaps faster than they anticipated, and it's because
of the groundswell of support from Australian people who said.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Enough, why and me, thank you so much for via Tan.
Speaker 8 (12:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Also in the news today, a journalist described as one
of Al Jazeera's most recognizable faces reporting from Gaza has
been killed alongside four colleagues in an Israeli air strike.
Anas Al Sharif, who was twenty eight, was among a
group of Al Jazeera's staff who died in a strike
on a tent near Schifa Hospital in Gaza City on Sunday.
(13:25):
According to Gaza officials and Al Jazeera, and electric car
drivers could be hit with a road tax, with federal
MP Tanya Plibersek framing it a sensible move as more
people switch to evs. The comments come ahead of the
federal government's Productivity roundtable next week. I'm Ruby Jones. This
(13:46):
is seven am. See you tomorrow.
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