Praying for Healing (Guest: Sam Collier)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I didn't want to interview you.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
I get a lot of backlash, but listen, I gotta
be submitted to what God called me to do.

Speaker 3 (00:06):
Who is Sam Callyer?

Speaker 4 (00:08):
You know, I'm rediscovering that my life started in poverty.
My mother had five kids. At twenty one, Me and
my twin sister were the fourth and fifth.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Do you struggle with abandonment issues?

Speaker 4 (00:18):
The Lord did a supernatural work with my adoptive parents.

Speaker 1 (00:22):
They made adoption of fairy tale.

Speaker 4 (00:24):
We were going to preschool telling everybody we were adopted,
and they were going to their parents saying can we
be adopted? What I discover from that is that I
did not have an abandonment boom.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
I had an attachment.

Speaker 4 (00:35):
Everybody leaves me, I don't leave them, which means I'll
stay in something.

Speaker 1 (00:39):
Way too long. What led to your divorce?

Speaker 2 (00:43):
It wasn't like one lad with another one did a
counter suit and y'all made a joint decision to go
ahead of file.

Speaker 4 (00:47):
You know, it was a little more complicated than that.
For the sake of honoring her.

Speaker 1 (00:51):
There was a discussion and we landed on the joint filing.

Speaker 3 (00:54):
What is your hope when it comes to your ex wife?

Speaker 1 (00:57):
Hope about what I don't know. You tell me, I
want to give real answers. That's what I want.

Speaker 4 (01:02):
I remember having a lot of hope. The divorce is
so tumultuous that I forgot. I'm gonna just be honest.
And I have never said any of this publicly. There's
an obvious her right. I don't want to be the
butter of a joke, but I want her to be
everything God's called her to be because I remember when
I met her, I saw it in our life, and she's
the mother of my son. I want him to see
her amazing. I want him to see what I saw, and.

Speaker 1 (01:22):
I want to do the same.

Speaker 4 (01:22):
What does it mean to be Sam two point zero?
And I get it because you're held to a higher standard.
I've apologized to the public, and my commitment to the
public is to be better than I've ever been. But
if we are believers, there is no evidence in the
text of repentance, grace, restoration, rehabilitation upon accountability not being
true for pastors.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
And this is something that the Holy Spirit just dropped
in my heart. Can you pray right now for your
ex wife.

Speaker 1 (01:48):
I'm leaving the interview. I'm leaving it what's going on?
What's going on? The Dear Future WiFi podcast has global impact.

Speaker 4 (01:57):
From Texas, I have been on this joy of healing
and self discovery and this podcast has been a vital
part of my process.

Speaker 1 (02:06):
God's establishing through you a legacy, a display of freedom,
founding authentic spirituality.

Speaker 3 (02:13):
California.

Speaker 4 (02:14):
I learned so much as a single man through your
podcast and continue to learn so much as.

Speaker 1 (02:21):
Now a married man Nigeria. This is just therapy for me.

Speaker 4 (02:25):
You know, I've been healed, I've been strengthing in my
convictions on the sto to do single hoopta Amsterdam way
that you've shown us how it is possible for a
man to be as intentional as you are.

Speaker 3 (02:39):
New Jersey.

Speaker 1 (02:40):
I appreciate your vulnerability.

Speaker 2 (02:42):
I appreciate just being able to see that there is
life after divorce.

Speaker 3 (02:45):
To New York.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
I am a single woman, so these episodes really give
me hope and courage that God does have a husband
for me.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
Discover, uncover and recover love.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
I'm a terrissaar Whitfield and this is season ten of
the Dear Future Wifie podcasts. Welcome to a Dear Future
Wifie podcast. I'm your host laterras Ar Whickfield. Listen, are
you still shacking up with us? If you're still shacking
up with us, come on, can we get a commitment?
Hit that subscription button and subscribe. Make sure you're turning
on your notification bell so you'll be notified about upcoming episodes.

(03:18):
And let me just shout out the patriots right now.
Thank y'all for following this journey. Getting behind the scenes footage.
I'm Patreon. Make sure you click on the link in
the description and join the Patreon. While you're at it,
why don't you just go there and join the melon list.
We have an amazing book that's going to be coming out,
a Student of Love, and I want to make sure
that all of y'all get an opportunity to digest these

(03:42):
gems that are in this book. But I'll tell y'all
more about that as that time comes.

Speaker 3 (03:47):
Listen.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
This episode is pretty pretty dope.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
I met this king when I was in at the
Essence Festival a couple of months ago. He interviewed me
for his platform, and so I felt like it's just
made all the sense in the world to bring in
a differuture wifey podcast. So without further do Welcome to
a Differture wifey podcast. My homie Sam, call you how
you're going?

Speaker 1 (04:08):
Team? Can I shake your hands? Yeah? I just reached under.

Speaker 4 (04:10):
Man, I'm uh, I'm honored to be here. Why do
you say that, I'm honored because I'm from Atlanta, Georgia.

Speaker 1 (04:18):
And then I walked in and saw the legendary.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
Yellow cows in a room.

Speaker 4 (04:22):
All right, I mean it looks like you're in a
stadium when it's online, big like a stadium. And so
it's just been so many people have sat in this chair,
and as you know, my life over the last five
years has been just so many ups and downs. And
so when you find individuals who've been blessed, like you've

(04:43):
been blessed with this type of platform and they extend it,
it just means everything to me.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
So well, well, let me tell you something. One of
the hardest things to find is men to sit on
the yellow couch because a lot of men don't want
to operate in transparency. And so every time, like I've
tried to get certain on the podcast and be like, man,
I'm from telling all.

Speaker 1 (05:02):
My mind, you know what I mean? Like what no, Like, no,
we need spaces.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
I created this space for myself to share my flaws.
And I said, you know what, I couldn't be the
only person going through these issues and navigating these idio secrecies.
Why can't I provide a space starting out for myself
so that I can be transparent and vulnerable. And the
Bible says confess your false one to another so that
you may be healed.

Speaker 3 (05:27):
And so I'll create a platform for that.

Speaker 2 (05:29):
And then what happened that other people started joining the
podcast and they knew it was a safe space to
share their stories and their issues and hurts, habits and
hang ups. So got that from Celebrate Recovery because I've
been through CRR so and so it just became a
place for healing. It's nothing judgment zone. And so that's

(05:49):
what I want to do. I want to chop it
up with you and just talk all things love, relationship, marriage,
singleness and just a journey. So when I ask you,
if I were to ask you right now, who is
call you?

Speaker 1 (06:00):
What would you do? You know I'm rediscovering that. I'm
rediscovering that.

Speaker 3 (06:10):
That's fair.

Speaker 4 (06:12):
Well, you know me and you spoke a little bit
earlier about your adoption journey and the kids that you've adopted.
You know, my life started in poverty, and my mother
had five kids at twenty one, at twenty one, and
it was me and my twin sister were the fourth
and fifth. My dad was I predicted the drugs at

(06:36):
the time. He passed away from that addiction during COVID.
Never met him, It's okay. Spoke to him twice on
the phone and knew it was him every time, and
it was like his voice was like shooting through the
drugs and I could just hear it over the phone.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
He signed, I mean, he was a happy guy.

Speaker 4 (06:56):
And that was roughly around, you know, a kind of
twenty five. But my life started, and I'm supposed to
be a statistic because it started with my dad doing
that and my mother at the time, you know, they
kind of trace her steps back to her living in
a prostitution house. And so she's twenty one with five

(07:18):
kids on welfare, trying to figure out how to make
it and.

Speaker 1 (07:22):
What city is joab Bro, what city? What's she in? Augusta,
Augusta Georgian.

Speaker 4 (07:26):
Yeah, And so she sends us I kind of call
it the Moses story, send us up the river, and
hopes they would work out gave us up for adoption.
We got adopted, raising a Christian home on the streets
of Auburn Avenue in Atlanta.

Speaker 1 (07:41):
And so I'm rediscovering who I am.

Speaker 4 (07:44):
But I think the hope is that I would be
someone that would represent being able to rise out of
the ashes to become what God wants to do.

Speaker 3 (07:56):
What do you think is your purpose?

Speaker 1 (07:57):
Wait?

Speaker 4 (07:57):
Thing God put you on this earth? So you at
the gate like this, you cop on.

Speaker 2 (08:02):
The I'm just I'm just falling. I just want to
know who you are, who think you are? Has God
showed you? Because a lot of times we may be
operating in spaces and occupations job titles that we're doing,
but we know that that's not what we're supposed to do.

Speaker 3 (08:17):
It's just a means to an end.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
And even sometimes you have pastors that may be pastoring
because their father was a pastor and they inherit the church,
but they said.

Speaker 3 (08:26):
I never want to do that. I want to be
a rapper.

Speaker 2 (08:28):
Absolutely, So they're operating in a position that they weren't
really their heart was. Don't believe that that's what God
put them on this earth together, even fulfilling the quote
unquote will of God.

Speaker 1 (08:41):
About this master. So my question you is, what do
you think your purpose is?

Speaker 4 (08:44):
Yeah, you know, it maybe was about eight years when
I discovered who I was in terms of what God
had put on the inside of me. I talk all
the time about Jeremiah one to five. Before you were
formed in your mother's womb, I knew you and me.
What that has always meant is that before we were
even born, God puts something on the inside of all

(09:06):
of us that we are to live out.

Speaker 1 (09:08):
Dear future wife, it was in you right and it
was birth.

Speaker 4 (09:12):
And I think for me, with the Lord put in me,
was this desire and this gift to help others discover
what was put on the inside of them. And I
think that comes in many ways. You know, a lot
so many individuals have different ideas on what purpose is
and how you get there, whether it be occupation or
a title or so on and so forth. But I

(09:33):
think whatever your purpose is, it's something that transcends occupation, and.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
It is a It is a lifestyle.

Speaker 4 (09:42):
It is a gift set that you can work out
in many different ways. And so if I could do
one thing for the rest of my life, it would
be helping others discover who they are and helping them
craft a strategy and to mobilize whatever those gifts are
that it would come to life.

Speaker 2 (10:00):
You brought me into the conversation about dear future wifey.
Dear future wife he was birth in twenty seventeen, and
I've never shared this story, but it was in twenty
seventeen I wrote a letter to my future wifey after
coming out of this toxic relationship with this individual. It
was in relationship, was a situationship, and I remember crying

(10:21):
myself to sleep. I woke up the next morning and
as soon as I opened my eyes, tear starts streaming
down my face again.

Speaker 1 (10:27):
I was like, God, what is going on?

Speaker 2 (10:29):
And I was talking to God about this particular woman,
and God said, I want you to write to your
future wifey. And I was like, well, I mean, what
do you mean? Like why are you gonna tell me
to write at six o'clock in the morning, you know?
And I began to write a letter to my future wifey.
And the reason why he told me to do that
is because what I wrote on that paper was not

(10:49):
what I was entertaining with the woman. And I posted
it on Facebook and people were commenting like, oh my
God's most beautiful letter I've ever read from.

Speaker 1 (10:59):
A man was just moving people. People was DM and me.

Speaker 2 (11:02):
People were talking about how healing just hearing me say that.
And she called me and was like, how dare you
write this letter and post that on Facebook? And I said,
what did you think about it? She said, well, why
does it matter what I think? If you cared about
what I thought, you would have sent it to me.
And I said, no, it was an open letter, and

(11:24):
I said and she and she got mad and hung
on the phone. And she called me back later and
she said, I said, why are you getting mad at
a letter that I wrote? And she was like, she
got silent again, And I said, if it was you
who I'm talking about, you wouldn't be upset. You were
to respond like the strangers who are hearing a letter
a man pour out his heart and they're being moved.

(11:47):
If that was you, you'd be like, oh my god,
this guy that I'm dating, You're so amazed. I just,
oh my god, I hear you now louder than I've
ever heard you before. But God said, she didn't have
the ears to hear what my heart was saying and
showing me in that moment in twenty seventeen. Who I
desired is not what I wrote in that paper. Well,

(12:08):
a juxtaposition between who I was entertaining and what I
wrote in that paper, those are two totally different people.
And so I sit here today excited because November twenty second,
I'll be getting married to the woman who I wrote
and explained on that piece of paper. And it took
that many years to heal so that I could see
her clearly. It took years for me to mature, overcome

(12:33):
my idio secrecies and my issues, my lack of integrity,
all that stuff. It took years to me to grow
to that moment so that when God introduced me to
this woman, I could manage her heart effectively.

Speaker 1 (12:45):
Wow. How long did it take?

Speaker 3 (12:46):
About eight years?

Speaker 1 (12:48):
It took. It took from twenty seventeen.

Speaker 2 (12:51):
I started the podcast in twenty twenty, so that's three years,
and then twenty five. Wow, So it took eight years.
And it was a lot of me facing myself in
the mirror. It was a lot of people that I
dated on the way that it didn't work out. And
I try to tell people all the time, which my

(13:11):
book speaks about, is that it will teach you how
to effectively date where you don't internalize relationships that don't
work out. If it didn't work out, it wasn't supposed
to work out. And so sometimes we get stuck in
a place that God said, no, this is just a moment.
And we build monuments in moments, and God is wanted
to say, Hey, this is just the moment. Don't build

(13:33):
a monument in it, and go ahead and grow from it.
And so my question to you is where were areas
of your life where you look back at it, and
especially when areas were love that you look back and go,
I see what God is trying to teach me, and
I've learned from this and through this. When you think
about that, do you go all way back to high school?

(13:53):
Do you go back to college? Where do you go
back to? Where does your mind automatically go back to?

Speaker 4 (14:01):
It absolutely jumps back to my marriage first, just because
it's on the top of my mind. It's every day,
it's thinking through it, it's navigating divorce and the challenges
of co parenting and so on and so forth. And
I'll give a lesson that I learned in therapy. It
was probably about two weeks before the divorce began and

(14:24):
I kind of went away. You know, everybody has their
reason for divorce, right. We had a joint filing, so
there was mine and then there was also her, and
so she has her reason and I have, you know,
my particular reason. And I think for me, especially thinking
about this as a pastor, going man, do I want
to do? I want to fight for this? Do I

(14:44):
want to go back? And do we want to long suffer?
What can we do to make this work?

Speaker 3 (14:48):
And how many years were married?

Speaker 4 (14:49):
We were married for eight years? Eight years. Matt got
married after two months, which this is what I'm getting
ready to jump into.

Speaker 1 (14:56):
And it okay too, Yes?

Speaker 3 (14:59):
Two months?

Speaker 2 (14:59):
Yeah, to hear that he got married in two months?
Good lord, he said, He said, said you had me
at Hello? He said, hello, will you marry me?

Speaker 1 (15:08):
Will you marry me? I was just and I said
this on the Christian Post.

Speaker 4 (15:12):
I'll say it again, but I don't think y'all are
going to take it and turn into a headline like
they did because the Christian Post.

Speaker 1 (15:18):
He asked me, He's like, well, why would you get
married after two months?

Speaker 4 (15:20):
He had just come out of a marriage, and now
y'all date a week after and now you're married too much?

Speaker 1 (15:25):
Why would you do that?

Speaker 4 (15:26):
And he was kind of coming at me, and I
tried to make a joke and I said, well, Beyonce
said drunk in love.

Speaker 1 (15:33):
And he made that the headline, the pastor is drunk.
And I said, Leonardo, he said the pastor was drinking.
That was the headline.

Speaker 4 (15:45):
I said, Leonod, you're supposed to be helping me figure,
but I was.

Speaker 1 (15:51):
I was drunk in love. But there was a.

Speaker 4 (15:54):
Big lesson that came out of that that I actually
looked back on my life and I see it all
over my relation.

Speaker 1 (16:00):
Let me that how long was she divorced before you
got married? She got divorced and then we got married
two months later.

Speaker 2 (16:11):
No huh, yes, so so not only did you marry
her two months after meeting her, she was only divorced
two months.

Speaker 4 (16:18):
Yes, which we're gonna get into my failures later.

Speaker 1 (16:24):
This is Kermit the frog and I'm sipping my butt.

Speaker 4 (16:27):
But one of them is you know, I would leave,
And this is I believe in headship, So the biblical
concept of headship, and listen, everybody has to make their
own decision, absolutely, But as the man in the relationship,
could I have done a better job of helping us.

Speaker 1 (16:44):
Wait, absolutely, could I have stopped this? Absolutely?

Speaker 4 (16:48):
Did I know? Was it a bad decision? Absolutely? Does
accountability need to be taken? Absolutely right? And so I
say that, But the lesson in that from me.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
Came.

Speaker 1 (17:03):
I mean, it was full circle.

Speaker 4 (17:04):
I went away and I'm gonna shout him out my therapist,
Jason Van Ruler. And there's a place in Nashville called
on Site, and on Site is it's a place where
most Christian celebrities go, and or celebrities that happened to
be Christian. You understand the difference. It's off the grid,

(17:26):
got to turn your phone off and you go. And
they specialize in what they call psycho drama, which we
will get into later, but you know about.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
Yeah, I was in it.

Speaker 2 (17:35):
I did a cycle drama when I got from my
high school for taking a gun to school.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Uh just told y.

Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, I was a little knucklehead when I was growing up. Listen, man,
it's supposed to be a safe space. You ain't supposed
to laugh at me, Sam, Sam, this is my childhood trauma. Okay,
I was a hug and a makon. But what were
you going to psycho drama. So I went to school.
I went to Skyline High School. My brother has shot
the mirror in the bathroom. He had he had bought
a gun and he shot the mirror out playing. So
he said, well, well, dad gets home, he's gonna make

(18:04):
me get rid of the gun. So he came up
with this brainiac idea for me to take it to
school and sell it. It was my sophomore year in
high school. I took the gun to school. I ended
up getting caught with it. I didn't have it wasn't loaded.
It was a thirty eight smith in western They caught
me at the school. They took me, didn't go to jail.
He had this Yeah, it was a thirty eight, big
old long that had the thing go down the side

(18:25):
of my pants and all that walking around like a
penguin through the same and so they took me to
this little holding area. They didn't take me at juvenile
but they had this little hold in the area, and
my dad came and picked me up and I was
sent to all turn to school. And so they came
up with this great idea to say, hey, let's grab
some of these kids, who was a school of fifty.
Let's get about eight of them and we'll do a

(18:46):
play which was called Real Life that later became a
published play, but it was a psycho drama. So they
had us reenact rewrote these stories about these young teenagers
that's in games and people that was making all these
bad decis and so that we could see what our
decisions look like, playing either the victim of the person
or playing the young man that keep fighting and end

(19:09):
up getting killed. So we were able to learn through
a cycle drama and it was it was probably who.

Speaker 4 (19:17):
They say, the body keeps the score absolutely and as
you move, it's wild how you move through the drama
and it starts to reveal where the trauma is and
then it heals. So I'm doing this and it's a
it's twenty eight hours of therapy with Jason van Ruler
three days straight. Now, we didn't go to on site.
He's one of their main therapists. And so he said,

(19:40):
you know, he gave me it was like eight grand
to go to on site. So he's like, look, if
you want to over twenty eight hours for twenty eight hours,
So it's yes, it was a three day experience, a
three day experience, yes, And he said look, if you
want to say, two thousand, come to my house in
South Dakota, and I'm going to teach you the same
stuff that I teach here. So I went to his
practice up in South d Him. I felt like I

(20:01):
was going to visit Kanye in Wyoming. And so I mean,
within the first thirty minutes he listens to my story.
Because my question when I went to him was what
do I need to do now? I run into a
brick wall. Things were exploding. After eight years, I said,
I need and I need to go back and get
inventory on how I got here, how I can get healthy,

(20:25):
how I can stay healthy, and how I can build
a life that God is pleased with in pursuing my
purpose and all of the above. And after thirty minutes,
he said, I want to I want to show you something.
We're talking about my lessons, my greatest lessons, and and
it's all throughout my love life.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
He said, I want to show you something. He put
out his whiteboard and he.

Speaker 4 (20:46):
Drew a circle, and he drew a circle in that,
and another circle in another circle like a what is
a Russian nesting doll, And in the middle it's a
little circle and he said This is called the vulnerability
will and he says in the middle, he pulled out
a key and I still had his key. He said,
I'm gonna give you this key. I want you to
keep this key for the rest of your life. This

(21:08):
key unlocks the center. In the center circle is your
greatest fears, your greatest desires, your greatest secrets. It's the
people that are in this circle. You trust them implicitly
with everything, he said. The circle outside of that, they're
close friends, but they don't get the center.

Speaker 1 (21:28):
But they're close.

Speaker 3 (21:28):
And he said.

Speaker 4 (21:28):
The circle outside of that colleagues people you know, he said,
And then it's the world. What you have to do,
he said, this key is only to be given the
people that have earned the center. But to get to
the center, you need to make them go from one
circle to the next, and then they graduate from that
to the next. So by the time they get to

(21:50):
the center, this key matters.

Speaker 1 (21:51):
He said.

Speaker 4 (21:51):
Here's what you keep doing with your life. You keep
handing people the key that you'd just met, and then
you wonder why they don't care about the center. Then
you wonder why, wait, this isn't You're not supposed to
be here. What you we don't vibe in this. And
he said, and this, and this is the issue. And

(22:13):
if you continue to do this, you're going to continue
to have toxic relationships.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
You're going to continue to not be with the right person.

Speaker 4 (22:19):
You're going to continue to invite people into the most
vulnerable parts of yourself and they're going to destroy you.
And he's not he wasn't just talking about romance. He said,
you do this with your friendships, you'll meet somebody. And
it's because your pastors had so many pastors like this.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
We talked about all the time. It's our job to
believe the best.

Speaker 4 (22:38):
But that's our gift, right, Like I just not just
I met you that sence, but it was gonna tear
out right, and I mean we hit it off immediately,
and my normal personality, let's go eat, let's do this.

Speaker 1 (22:50):
Here's my number, here's my social security you know, it's
just like.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
I tell you, if you want to give me your
credit card, just tell me, give me a credit card,
give me your bank account.

Speaker 3 (22:58):
Information will be good.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
Absolutely.

Speaker 4 (23:00):
And you know what I've had to learn, and what
I'm learning is that not everybody is the same. And
there are people out here that you know, for me.
I wouldn't dream of crossing anybody. I just you know,
I want to love people well, I want to believe

(23:22):
the best. I'm never thinking about plying or doing or stealing.
But there are people that have not developed certain things.

Speaker 3 (23:30):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (23:31):
And if you're walking around handing.

Speaker 4 (23:33):
The key to everybody, then eventually you're going to become
your greatest enemy.

Speaker 1 (23:38):
Let me ask you, do you start struggle with abandonment issues?

Speaker 4 (23:42):
M you know, I've never struggled with abandonment. But let
me tell you what I did discover that I struggle with.
Because when I weigh and let me pause on abandonment.
So for whatever reason, we'll talk about adoption for a second.

Speaker 1 (23:55):
Yep.

Speaker 4 (23:56):
For whatever reason, the Lord did a supernatural work in
the life of me and my sister with my adoptive parents.
Adoptive parents, they were Christian, but my dad he was
fifty when he adopted us. My mom was like ten
years younger. Get it, left, the christ got together. My
mom couldn't have kids. And then they, you know, they
came to and adopted us. Now we they black, so

(24:19):
we looked like them. So everybody then nobody knew adopted, Yes,
and they I don't it just had to be the
work of the Lord and the spirit that just had
my parents know they made adoption of fairy tale. So
when we were people asked me, when did you know
that you were adopted? I said from day one? I
don't remember, not knowing how I was adopted, and I

(24:39):
was like two two three four. But the but the story,
it was like a Disney story. We rescued you, you
your parents.

Speaker 2 (24:47):
We don't know the full story, but we know that
you can take How old you said you were two
three four?

Speaker 1 (24:52):
How old was you like four?

Speaker 3 (24:54):
He said, I was two three four.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
I don't remember. That's my point. I don't remember.

Speaker 4 (25:00):
But what I do remember is that we were going
to preschool telling everybody we were adopted, and and they
were going to their parents saying can we be adopted?

Speaker 1 (25:09):
It was just a like is this what we they adopted?

Speaker 3 (25:12):
We were like made adoption.

Speaker 1 (25:14):
We made it cool. And that's because of my parents.

Speaker 4 (25:16):
So for whatever reason, I personally, you know, I can't
speak from my sister later on in life, but I
personally never felt abandoned. My personality also lends itself Again,
I'm walking around handing people the key. My personality lends
itself to glass half full versus half empty. So and

(25:36):
this is a lot of things that you'll see in
children that are in foster characture and adopted.

Speaker 1 (25:40):
It depends where do you want to look.

Speaker 4 (25:43):
And for me, it was never about what I didn't have,
It was about what I did happen. So I always
felt rescued and accepted versus leaning into rejected and abandoned,
even though those things happen. And that's what I had
to come to. My part of therapy, and I'm gonna
get to what I did is yell. My part of
therapy was convincing myself to accept Hey, you know, no,

(26:04):
you were accepted, but there was also a period where.

Speaker 1 (26:08):
You were abandoned.

Speaker 4 (26:09):
And I had was like, okay, okay, amen, I will
accept this.

Speaker 1 (26:15):
What I did discover that I.

Speaker 4 (26:16):
Had was a small amount of trauma from the first
five months of my life. I got adopted at it
was it was two months, but it was it took
about yeah, I mean you understand, it went fou It
took three more months for us to come home, and
so my parents adopted us that that within that two months,
in those three months, and so for those three months,

(26:37):
we didn't have a mother, right, we didn't have a mother,
I didn't have a father. And when I was when
I went away for these three days, uh, Jason, he said,
let's let's go back and this story is gonna be crazy,
but I'm going to tell you.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
He said, Now, let's go back and look.

Speaker 4 (26:54):
Let's look at your adoption. He said, just we just
want to cover all. But the question is how did
you get here? How do you get healthy? How do
you stay healthy? Have you ever done trauma around this?
I said no, I've not done trauma work around this.
And so he said, all right, cool, here's I want
you to write down seven names on a piece of
seven pieces of paper. He said, these are people when

(27:15):
you think about the first twelve years of your life.
So you're talking about elementary school, preschool, maybe a little
bit of middle school. These are names that just stand out,
people that you said, don't ask yourself why you remember,
just write them down. And so I write down, you
know my mother, who my father? I write now, my
twin sister. I write down a random girl I had

(27:37):
a crush with that I just remembered. I don't remember why.
And I wrote down a mentor that I met when
I was twelve, wrote down my best friend at the
time and another person, and he said, okay, now here's
another paper. I want you to write down my biological parents.
So I write that down. He said, Now another paper
writes Sam. He said, now I want you to put
this were in a room and we can walk out

(27:58):
this door and into the room. So he puts Sam
in the middle of the room on the floor. Psychodrama.
He says, now I want you to take these papers.
We're gonna leave biological lass, and I want you to
put them as close to the paper as what they
represent to you when you think about what they were,
he said. And if it's really close, I want you

(28:20):
to put them on top of the paper. So I
take my mom and my dad, who adopts me. They
go on top of the paper. I take my twin sister.
She's like half of the paper, and that's no shade,
it's just my sister. I take my mentor. I put
him a little bit beyond the girl, a little bit
more best friend over here.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
He says, all right, he has me the biological parents.
He says, where do you want to put this? I
take it. I walk out of the room and he said,
where are you going away?

Speaker 4 (28:51):
And I said, they out here, and he said, okay,
I'm gonna come out there. So then he comes out there. Now,
this is this is just happening. I'm not thinking about it.
I'm I have there's no ill will. I'm just like,
but this is just when you talk. This is where
I wanted to put him. And he came out there
and he says, all right, put it on the ground.
So we put it on the ground and I'm standing

(29:12):
there and I'm looking at him. He's looking at me,
and he said, so we're outside. He said, so I
guess in there represents home and I said okay. He said,
all right, so they're out here. They didn't make they
didn't make it any who. I'm getting emotional talking about
I'm gonna go through it.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
And so.

Speaker 4 (29:33):
He says, what do you want to say to them?
And as soon as he says it, my whole chest
starts to collapse. I'm standing up, my knees are bucking,
and he said, are you okay? I'm like, He's like,
and he's like, all right, let's go back inside. So
he said, so he rushes me back inside. We sit
down on the couch and He's like, so, what was happening?

(29:55):
What was happening out there? And I started getting heavy
again in the chair. He said, okay, let me close
the door. He closes the door, it goes away. He
closed the door, and when it goes away.

Speaker 1 (30:06):
And he said, so you know this heaviness this in
your chest. I said yeah. He said, that's what that's
that's the drama. And and up to that point, you
thought you was fine.

Speaker 4 (30:18):
I thought I was fine because I didn't because the
typical is abandonment. So I never had people issues with
people leaving me. What I discovered. We went back out.
He said, let's go back outside, and we started interacting
with the papers and he started walking me through it,
and the pain started going away, and the heaviness started
going away.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
He was healing me in real time. He was he
and this is what he explained.

Speaker 4 (30:39):
What trauma treatment does is it begins, it reduces the wound,
it redefines it, and replaces it with replaces the lie
with the truth, because at some point there was a lie.
So we go in my subconscious and we're dealing with
the line and we're coming out, so we do all that.
What I discover from that is that I did not
have an abandonment womb, had an attachment woond, but it

(31:05):
was it was unique. Everybody leaves me, I don't leave them,
which means I'll stay in something way too long because
in my mind, leaving is wrong and it's in my
it was in my subconscious and you'll stay and you'll fight,

(31:25):
and you'll even when you know, even when you're pleading,
but if there's an inkling of the other person saying
but or please or could you I'm right or whatever,
because I'm not going to do to you what was
done to me.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
And so and so what I'm learning.

Speaker 4 (31:46):
Is how to protect myself, you know, and I don't
and I don't think I would have ever understood that
without without this work. But it's been some train wrecks
because I'm a loving guy. I'm a pastor. I believe
the best.

Speaker 1 (32:04):
You know you can. You can tell I'm smiling. I'm happy.
I got my red shoes on, and this is who
I am.

Speaker 2 (32:11):
I asked him what color was he wearing? Black and white?
I like to coordinate with my with my people. He
gonna popped out some red shoes. Now you did, and
say red, black and white. Try to be different, said.

Speaker 4 (32:24):
Ebony, Should I wear the like the fancy shoes? She said,
where the joins? Some somebody wear that on them, some
red shoes. I'm like, man, but we still coordinated.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
Look we did we did it, but she threw it
on some red shoes. I said, that was not what
you tell me that all. And so after eight years
you said, you you eight years of marriage? Then what
led to your divorce?

Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yeah? Who filed? It was a joint finally, so both y'all.

Speaker 2 (32:53):
Came to the decision and said it wasn't like one
lad with another one did a counter suit.

Speaker 3 (32:58):
It was like we both had a conversation.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
You sat down and said this marriage is no longer
serving the both of us, and y'all made a joint
decision to go ahead of file.

Speaker 1 (33:07):
You know.

Speaker 4 (33:07):
It was a little more complicated than that, you know,
And for the sake of honoring her, I will say
that I'll leave it at There was a discussion and
about what the journey had been over the last eight years,
and I was just blame it.

Speaker 1 (33:26):
On the attorneys, and we landed on the joint filing.

Speaker 4 (33:30):
And I feel I feel that that accurately represents what
our story has been, and what the discussions about divorce
over the years have been.

Speaker 1 (33:41):
And so it was, Yes, it was a joint filing.

Speaker 2 (33:45):
What is your hope? What is your hope when it
comes to your ex wife? What is what is that?
Do you have any hope to say that I'm gonna
put words in about Do you have any hope?

Speaker 1 (34:00):
What hope about? What? I don't know? You tell me, Wow,
I'm only I want to give real answers. That's what
I want, And I mean hope whatever that means.

Speaker 2 (34:16):
That's why I said I want to give language to it,
because my mind can go different ways. Uh, I'll share
this with you. When I filed for divorce, I told
my wife, Well, I told God. I said, God, I
know this is the right thing to do. And there's
nobody I could literally tell and say God wants me
to file for divorce.

Speaker 3 (34:33):
No one will understand.

Speaker 2 (34:34):
That went through our pre the marriage counselors that we had,
our pre mariital counselors. That was the same people husband, wife,
a couple. And I said, listen, I gotta filed for divorce.
This this this this marriage ain't working period and and
and I'll be honest, the marriage counselors told me, do

(34:54):
you realize you're doing the productions at doctor Tony Evans church?
They hire you to produce a Christmas and the these
productions every year. Doctor Evans believes firmly in marriage. What
do you think is going to look like if you
and I won't even remember the church that was hire
me to do that. What would it look like? How
you think he's going to feel if you filed for divorce?
He's really teen family. I said, I'm be honest with you.

(35:17):
Don't care what doctor Evans says. I don't care if
Bishop Tdjason, the Pope came and sat down with me,
all three of them and told me to stay in
this marriage. It's not that I have a rebellious heart.
I know that this marriage, it is the right thing
for me to do. To file for this divorce. This
was ten years in the main. It was me going
through celebrate recovery, as you heard me say. It was
me joining the thousand men of prayer, consecrating myself, going

(35:39):
to retreats, all this stuff, and I said, this marriage
isn't working. I never give the details of what I'll
always say is that I throw myself on the bus
and say, this is what I did. I cheated on
my wife in the past. And I said, but at
this point, I said, this marriage is no longer working.
So I went and filed for divorce. I said, but
if I'm right God, I said, if I'm right by this,

(36:03):
you'll teach me how to divorce my wife with grace
as well as we'll be able to be cordial in
the future. Man, when I tell you, even after my divorce,
I remember one day God told me get up and
go mow her yard. I said, what I'm gonna look like.
I'm like a crazy person out there mowing the yard
at a place. He said, go do it. I'm teaching

(36:25):
you serving to you. Didn't you didn't steward her heart
properly while you were married. I want her to see
a change restored delivered.

Speaker 1 (36:32):
Man. I said, what that gout to do with mowing
the yard.

Speaker 2 (36:34):
I mean, I'll have no accountability to her seeing me
as a changed person. He said, go do it. I
went out there and cut the yard. About two weeks later,
I even tell her that.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
She called me.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
She said, it's strange it that you just don't haven't
cut my yard because I don't know nobody else else
asking the neighbors if they get the yard cutting. The
person decided to cut the yard and no one was like,
I don't know, I will know my line. My line
care God did not mow your yard. She said, so
you're the last person that you bowed my yard.

Speaker 3 (37:02):
I said yeah.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
She said why did you do that?

Speaker 2 (37:04):
I said, God told me too, and she was like,
that was really nice to you, and I said, hey,
that's at least I can do. I had a quick
conversation that was done. A couple of years later, this
woman that I had was dealing with towards the tail
end of our marriage. I ended up sharing with her

(37:25):
the stuff that I had been going through with that girl.
And she said, I just can't believe that you'll ever
put up with a woman that treated you like that.
I said, I know, that's what I went through. And
then she was just like h had a cool little conversation.
She was like, don't entertain women like this or whatever.
Years later, this woman was my realator who closed on

(37:47):
my house for my future wifey the house that I
bought preparing for my future wife, and she was the realator.

Speaker 3 (37:54):
God had me again call her.

Speaker 1 (37:56):
I said, man, I don't want to do this. I
called her.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
She had just wrecked her car and didn't know where
the money was going to come from. She said, I
was looking for God to open up a door for
some finance to come through.

Speaker 3 (38:06):
I said, I already found the house. I found it.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
Are you go to do?

Speaker 2 (38:09):
Just put your name on it and you go get
this commission of about twenty something thousand dollars.

Speaker 3 (38:13):
She said, thank you Jesus did that.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
We were sitting in the title company and they said,
y'all both got the same last name. She said, are
y'all like brothers and sisters? Are like, what what is that?

Speaker 3 (38:26):
And they said, I said that's my ex.

Speaker 2 (38:29):
Wife, And they like, I would have never been able to,
you know, suspect that y'all get along so well.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
That was literally in twenty twenty three.

Speaker 2 (38:38):
August of twenty twenty three my divorce was final, and
December to twenty ninth or twenty fifteen, so we're talking
about eight years. And when I tell you that number
eight stands for new beginnings. When I tell you, God
was able to restore just the friendship, just to be
able for us to coexist in the same space, and

(38:59):
it was never no issues. But it was always like that,
even going through my divorce. It wasn't no big, sloppy whatever.
But I knew that I was making a decision to
divorce a woman who thought that forever would be spent
with me. So I had to understand how she had
to reconcile that in her mind. But I recognized that
I always say my marriage was the curse victory. It
wasn't bearing fruit in season, and so I said, this

(39:21):
just doesn't work. But I watched God restore everything that
I broke in her. So when I say the hope,
it's just that. My heart posture was. You take vows
with people, you walk down the aisle with them. In
two months, you look at this woman and say, this
is a woman I'm supposed to marry. You get married,

(39:42):
You take vows believing you're doing the right thing. Relationships
and marriages is extremely complicated. I don't ever expect you
to expose your wife and issues that she's that she.

Speaker 3 (39:53):
Might have done in the marriage or whatnot.

Speaker 2 (39:55):
But because I believe that marriage is still protected, So
you go through this marriage, y'all, go through whatever you
I'll go through. Then you make the decision y'all both
say let's let's let's file for the vorce. Y'all file
for the vorice, y'all fight and doing all the other stuff,
and it's done, and y'all have kids now. And so
the reality is that we're so used to these broken homes.
When I asked, you, do you have hope? What is

(40:17):
your hope as it comes to your ex wife?

Speaker 1 (40:21):
What is that? I have a lot to say. Okay,
so you can just be patient. I have because I
just I was just cooking. So I'm gonna let you go. No, no, But.

Speaker 4 (40:32):
The first thing I want to say is you are
putting me on your back and carrying me through this interview. Oh,
and I appreciate it for god your glory. I had
I one of the reasons I had to pause was
because I remember having a lot of hope at one

(40:54):
point and and or, but the divorces so tumultuous publicly
and privately.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
That I forgot. I'm gonna just be honest, I forgot.

Speaker 4 (41:08):
So when you asked me, I had to go back.
I'm like, what did I do? What did I used
to believe? How did I? And I found my way there?
But I need to set it up okay, And I
have never said any of this publicly, but I believe
the Lord wants me to say this, and I'm upset
at you for it. I'm gonna I'm gonna real honest

(41:29):
with you. I'm gonna have a conversation with you. I'm
very upset at you for this. But let me tell
you this before you say that. That's why I bear
my own scars. I don't sit in front of people
acting like I'm perfect. I had to learn I made mistakes.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
Everybody always hears me say I mismanaged the heart of
a woman. That is the worst thing that I ever did.
I took vows, but didn't hold those vows sacred. I
cheated on this woman, not once, but multiple times. So
I know that in my flawed mindset, my flawed my
I said this broken boy kept sitting in the front
seat of my marriage driving the car, and I recognized

(42:05):
after going through therapy, after getting healed, after being said free,
after being delivered, I've been able to sit and face
myself in the mirror and say that little N word
is what I want to say. That little dude right there,
he has no more place in my life. And I
said I'm going to show up as a mighty man
of valor making sound decisions, and when God blesses me
to take vows with another woman, I'm going to honor

(42:28):
it until I take my last.

Speaker 4 (42:29):
Really absolutely, so fight me later. I'm gonna fight you.
The foundation of what I want to say is this vulnerability.
Will there's a decision made from me. She obviously was involved,

(42:51):
she didn't have to marry me, but I take responsibility
for us eloping, okay, and that's a mistake. That two
month decision turns into eight years of chaos, two hundred

(43:11):
and forty therapy sessions, long suffering mountains of trauma. I'm
having psychotic breaks, all types of things, just me, me, me,
trying to deal with.

Speaker 1 (43:33):
The heaviness. Somebody called me the other day. I saw
you do an interview, and.

Speaker 4 (43:37):
I appreciate how you're navigating you elite pastor you at
this so there's certain things you're not in, certain things.
But when you said it was hard, I just cried
because I could feel you in that. Out of that,
I make decisions, big mistakes that are not God honoring.

(43:58):
Ruslan asked me, was it saying yes? And I make
those mistakes not as an excuse, but a reason. That's
the coping mechanism. I chose to deal with the dysfunction
in the chaos. And it's not hard to understand that

(44:19):
one marriage into a two month into a too month,
into you don't know each other, you're figuring things out.
It's not hard to see why that could be one
of the craziest things you've ever been a part of.

Speaker 1 (44:33):
And there was one moment.

Speaker 4 (44:37):
Every year every I mean, I should have left two
years or I should have not let me not even
say I should have left.

Speaker 1 (44:42):
We should have dissolved two years in Why did you
change the word?

Speaker 4 (44:47):
Because I think it more accurately represents what it should
have been. We should have both made the decision to dissolve,
because I believe we both were aware, not believe, I
know we were both aware of the dysfunction. And I

(45:12):
can't speak for her, and I would never speak for her,
But what I would say is.

Speaker 1 (45:18):
I know that it was not something.

Speaker 4 (45:24):
That she dreamed of and definitely not something that I
dreamed of, right, So we both should have come together
and made that decision. I have since taken accountability, and
I want to say this, and I'm doing my best
to navigate everything with love and respect, with all of
the things. The son watching this one day, all of
these things. Absolutely, and so just give me grace, audience,

(45:48):
give me grace. But there has been a question about accountability.
Are you taking account Are you really taking account You
didn't give us this and you didn't And I want
to say this as I you know, doctor A. R.
Bernard is my covering and I believe in confessing your
sins one to another. And I love what when I
was talking to my publicist is you know, we just

(46:09):
we were talking about this idea of being accountable where
it matters most, being accountable to those that are overseeing you,
that are holding that know your ends and your house.
They know every last gritty detail of everything. And I
came to them on my knees going this and they
already knew it. So we just want to see if

(46:30):
you was gonna lie about it. Yeah, they already knew.
And then there was this belief. We believe you're a
humble man. We believe that you're repenting. We believe that
you're taking accountability at the highest level. Pauls and doctor
Rabernard came out of the Nation of Islam so there
is no weak accountability.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
There is no we're not lying, We're not gonna we're
gonna call a spade a space.

Speaker 4 (46:53):
And if you're not repentant, and if we're not ready
to go in this direction, he would say it this way,
I'm wiping my hands up here.

Speaker 1 (46:59):
That's how he talked. It's nation of it strong, and
that he's a believer. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (47:03):
But and I asked him one time, what did you
bring up from the nation? He said, everything you thought,
everything you think. That discipline that hard, you know, And
this is it's been amazing for me to be with
CCC and to be under a leader like doctor A. R. Bernard,
because the principles of the nation around rehabilitating black men,
it's something that has that is prevalent in them. While
everybody else is running in every direction, they're running towards

(47:26):
going if the Lord says, God is not done there
it is. If you are accountable, if you are humble,
if you are honest. Okay, I wanted to say that
while we were here because I don't want your comments going.

Speaker 1 (47:39):
He ain't he covering up?

Speaker 4 (47:41):
No, no, no, this is where we are so immense accountability.

Speaker 1 (47:47):
There was a moment and this is what I've never
shared publicly. There was a moment.

Speaker 4 (47:55):
And this is true now, whether really where there was
a massive realization, I'm not your person and you're not
my and we know after when you get married up
two months if you're honest, I don't like you, you

(48:16):
don't like me. We know this with public figures doing
the best we can, trying to save face. I don't
leave anybody.

Speaker 1 (48:26):
And so.

Speaker 4 (48:29):
I remember saying something there that I'll say here again,
and if she watches this, I.

Speaker 1 (48:34):
Hope she hears it.

Speaker 4 (48:37):
She's beautiful, she's talented, she's annoying, and God, when I
met her, she was beautiful, talented, annoyed, and that hadn't changed.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
And there's a purpose on her life.

Speaker 4 (48:54):
I felt a sense of responsibility for helping. Again, we talk,
but what is my purpose? I believe my purpose is
to help other people discover theirs. So for me, I've
taken I took so much gratitude and so much honor
being able to help Steward with the lord that placed

(49:14):
on her life. If anybody, if you've ever seen her speak,
you ever seen a preach, if you've ever seen that
girl is amazing.

Speaker 1 (49:20):
That's what you're gonna say, because she's powerful and.

Speaker 4 (49:23):
She's annoyed, and I want and this is what I
in that moment, in the realization, I want you to
find your person so that you can be everything that
God has called you to be.

Speaker 1 (49:34):
I don't want and and there's and there's an obvious hurt.
I talked to.

Speaker 4 (49:39):
Doctor Bernard about this. There's an obvious herd right we
we we. I mean, we're gonna talk about meeting my
biological fact. But kid, you know twins, adoptees, they respond,
they respond differently when they meet your biological family. Some
people embrace them, some people push them away. It's the
same story. It's just where you want to look. We
her and I we've processed the divorce completely different, right,

(50:01):
And there's obviously immense hurt on her on her end,
I have not chosen the process it that way.

Speaker 1 (50:07):
Partially a part of it is my personality.

Speaker 4 (50:12):
I don't want anything that the man and I'm gonna
I'll say it this way, that the marriage produced in
her to remain pain hurt, and I was a part
of that, and I don't want that to continue to
plague her. I want her to be free. I want
her to be happy. I want her to be everything because,
and this is my opinion, she's at her best when

(50:33):
she is that. And so my hope is, and I
hate you for this, I hate it. My hope is
that I would look up one day and she would
be happy and that she's ever been. That she would
be in a marriage if she wants to do that again,

(50:53):
or a relationship with a man that can fully support
her the way she needs to be supported, that fits
her skill set and her gift set in such a
unique way that it compounds. And she's doing stadiums, and
she's writing books and she's touring. I don't want to
be the butt of a joke, I'll say that, but

(51:15):
I want her to be everything God's called her to
be because I remember when I met her. I saw
it all her life and it's still there, absolutely, And
she's the mother of my son. So I want him
to see her fly. I want him to see her amazing.
I want him to see what I saw, and I
want to do the same. You know, I this is

(51:37):
me and doctor Barnard, this is the dream. It's like Sam,
what is what does it mean to be Sam? Two
point zero? And who is that everything that you're saying
about I left the boy in the front seat, and
who you're becoming now, and what dear, I was thinking
about this year. I know we didn't talk about it,
but I was in my hotel praying for you, and
I was thinking. I said, man, look at what the
Lord has done in his life as a result of

(51:59):
him being transparent, honest and vulnerable, accountable, making so many
mistakes as you stated before, and God blessed your ministry,
and I just got excited about that because that's what
I want, and that is sorry you got to be preaching.
That is the gospel. It's the idea that if we
are repentant, if we are accountable, that God's grace is sufficient.

(52:24):
He takes the light in us moving forward, in us
getting up again, and in us being rehabilitated. And I
think the thing we have to be if I put
my pastor hat on for one second, I think the
thing that we have to be okay with is that
same grace, that same repentance, that same restoration that we
want and believe in for the lay person.

Speaker 1 (52:45):
Can be true for the leader. Absolutely, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (52:48):
At some point, and this is what I've experienced on
and you know it's you thank God for the pain,
because there's lessons in the pain.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
But I've experienced more than ever this season.

Speaker 4 (52:58):
We feel great about the Christians being rehabilitated. We have
a very difficult time with a leader, and I get
it because you're held to a higher standard. So there
is this belief that you were supposed to walk this way,
you were supposed to do this. We were looking up
to you. The dissolving of your marriage hurt so many people.

(53:19):
And I've said this in one interview and I say
it here, and I apologize. I've apologized to the public
because the public trust you, they trusted me, They've given
me a platform, and my commitment to the public is
to be better than I've ever been. And because it
did hurt. But if we are believers, we have to

(53:41):
There is no evidence in the text, and I wanted to,
I want I knew ill maybe make this statement today,
So I did all research on it all last night.
I said, let me make sure, I'm let me look
through that. There is no evidence in the text of repentance, grace, restoration,
rehabilitation upon accountability not being true for pastors or for leaders.

Speaker 1 (53:59):
There's no evidence.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
You've seen it allut the Bible with kings. So my
question to you is this not even a question. This
is something that the Holy Spirit just dropped in my heart.
Can you pray right now for your ex wife.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
I'm leaving the interview. I'm leaving it. What's going on?
What's going on?

Speaker 2 (54:22):
Listen?

Speaker 1 (54:23):
Putting in the notes. And it's because I used to
be a pastor.

Speaker 2 (54:30):
Well, I'm a licensed minister, and yes I preach and
I do all that. I'll be preaching at my church
on September twenty first.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
Put your prophetic gift away now.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
So let me tell you why I sound.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
It's because I'm hearing something in the spirit ram just
the heart, and I see how the devil has been
running so rapid and just I'll take you out of
the equation. Just Christian marriages period, including my own. See,
people can look at and be like, how could you
be a Christian in cheat? I was a Christian and cheated?

(55:04):
How can King David be a David in the Bible?
How can David be called a man after God's own
heart but then take another man's wife, put that man
on the front line, getting him killed. But God calls
him a man after my own heart. See, the problem
is is that we in this world have a tendency

(55:25):
to play God and don't realize that God knows the
trauma of these individuals.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
He knows the thorn in their flesh.

Speaker 2 (55:35):
As Paul talks about the thorn in my flesh, he says,
the things I know to do, but I still don't
do anyway. So God knows all that. It doesn't give
a pass to our mistakes. But that's the grace of
God to be like, there is no perfect man. That's
why Jesus had to come. And so pity to us
as believers who believe that just because you have a

(55:55):
title of a pastor, just because you're a prophet, just
because you're a EVANGELI is, just because you're a teacher,
just because you're a Christian, that you are without sin
and you will no longer make mistakes and you won't
hurt somebody, you won't do the unthinkable to somebody. What
you said earlier was having a repented heart. And so
what I'm saying to you is this is that the

(56:17):
devil has been running so rapid because the statistics for
divorce with Christians are the same as people in the world.
But we as believers, especially those who have because I
believe that once you go through divorce, you carry an
anointing for divorce. You carry anointing to be able to say,
you know what, I went through that. So now God

(56:38):
has given me power and dominion and authority if we
choose to pick up that authority to begin the war
against that spirit that has been infiltrating this world. And
so what I decide to do, I said, you know what, Yes,
I create this whole platform. Why it's and still hope
in everybody else to believe in love again if they're singles,
to make sure that we understand that therapy is very
necessary in order to overcome our problems. And then let's

(57:01):
come against the spirit of divorce. That's come against the
spirit of division with single people where you see on
social media single men going against single women and everybody's
arguing saying we don't need each other when actually we do.
So It's like when I'm hearing you speak about your
ex wife, the beauty of it is this now you're

(57:21):
speaking with hope. You said, I hope for her to
have a better life even outside of me. At the beginning,
when I ask you that you struggle with trying to
put words to it. You was like, what because all
you can see is the pain. All you saw is
the confusion. That's all the devil wanted you to see.
But the minute the Holy Spirit begin to show up,
you started seeing something greater. Your heart went to go

(57:43):
back to the beginning of when you met her. You said,
I saw it then, and God's word did not lie
whether she achieved that in my life, which is which
was the goal that you wanted to have.

Speaker 3 (57:55):
But now that's not the case.

Speaker 2 (57:57):
But you didn't say her calling ends just because you
said we're divorced. The reality is that the calling that
God has over her life and the stories that she
gets to share to be able to say I came
through these. This is the decision that we made. And
when y'all can start speaking about each other from a
heart posture of love and knowing that we share a

(58:17):
child together, that's all I want. I understand that people
make bad decisions, they get divorced all the time, but
I want you. I want to challenge you, as a
man of God, to speak against the spirit that is
plaguing your ex wife's mind that's allowing this division to
take place, as well as within yourself. We're going to
come against all this so that your son can see

(58:41):
a healthy mother, that your son can see a healthy father,
and see these two individuals coexist and co parent together
and be able to say I love them.

Speaker 1 (58:50):
I don't have to choose size. Both of them are great. God.

Speaker 4 (59:06):
When when you ordaining this show, we knew it was you,
but you did not tell me that this moment.

Speaker 1 (59:17):
What happened.

Speaker 4 (59:18):
And so I asked now in Jesus' name, for you
to cover Tony. Yes God, and I pray that that
she would be everything that you've called for her to be. Yes, Lord,

(59:39):
that her gifts would flourish, That you would expand her territory,
that you would put her on stages that she needs
to be on, so that somebody that needs what you've
placed in her before the foundations of the year.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
Will receive it.

Speaker 4 (01:00:05):
That strongholds would be broken, that women who have gone
through hard times and are really trying to figure out
how to rise again, that they would find truth in
her mouth for the sake of them being free. Yes God, God,
I pray against any hurt, harm, danger, trauma that was

(01:00:26):
caused in her by way of the marriage and even
by way of myself. I pray that she would be
healed and she would behold God. Yes, God, And I
pray for her future husband, if you have ordained this
for her life, that she would have the man that

(01:00:50):
she that she that she wants and that she needs,
and that we've talked about so many times, one that
serves her at the love that she needs to be served,
one that compliments her gift in the annoying and the
grace and the mantle that is on her life for
women around the world, not just only women, but for

(01:01:10):
also men.

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
God.

Speaker 4 (01:01:12):
I've seen the great exploits that you've done through her.
I've seen the people that have been delivered. I've seen
the prophetic words that have come out of her mouth
to individuals in a situation that needed.

Speaker 1 (01:01:24):
To be free. And I pray that she would be that.
And I pray for her relationship with.

Speaker 4 (01:01:31):
Sammy, Yes, that he would even begin to heal things
that she has asked to be healed God, as she
parents him, and that she loves him and as he
loves her. There's nothing like the relationship between a mother

(01:01:51):
and a son. And I just pray that we would
come to see that one day God. Also, lastly, pray
for a peaceful relationship between her and that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:04):
What the divorce court said would be true, that in
two to three years.

Speaker 4 (01:02:10):
Things will be different, in four years things would be different,
in five years things would be different, and that we
would be able to cope in an incredible way, have
conversations like maybe we never thought we'd have again, and
even champion the call of God on both of our lives. Yeah,
and I pray for litists that you would punish him

(01:02:31):
in just a little bit of a way for doing
this to me in front of the world in Jesus name.

Speaker 3 (01:02:37):
Amen, Amen, Amen, Amen, Amen.

Speaker 2 (01:02:43):
I want to lift up other people that are going
through divorces and people that are divorced. If you are
going through a divorce right now, if you have gone
through a divorce, I speak right now, that the Lord
begins to heal what hasn't been healed yet.

Speaker 3 (01:03:00):
If you've been.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
Carrying the mismanagement of your heart and you feel like
God the Bible says, vengeance's mindset the Lord, and some
of you are sitting back saying God allowed this to
happen to me, and He hasn't taken vengeance on said person,
whether it's your ex wife or your ex husband, and
you're looking at God to vindicate you. The first point

(01:03:25):
of vindication is when you free yourself from carrying the
weight of betrayal.

Speaker 3 (01:03:31):
Let it go, release it in the name of Jesus.

Speaker 2 (01:03:35):
Get free right now, no longer carry the burden of that.
It's a famous philosopher says that holding on to unforgiveness
is like drinking poison and inspecting the other person to die.
Release that in the name of Jesus. There is greater later.
God has a greater expectancy for you. You have to

(01:03:58):
believe it. You have to and lean out on your
own understanding. But in all your ways, acknowledge Christ and
allow him to direct your path. Even through this journey
of healing. God will direct you. He'll give you a word,
He'll give you a release. This episode is a release.
It's a divine assignment to position you, to reposition you

(01:04:20):
to your purpose. So God, we thank you, we glorify you,
we honor you, because there's nobody but you that could
take a broken young man named Latis and create a
platform to bring healing to millions.

Speaker 3 (01:04:36):
And I thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:04:38):
I always will submit and surrender this platform to you.

Speaker 1 (01:04:42):
You know, I had no idea what I.

Speaker 3 (01:04:45):
Want to talk to Sam about.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
But because he has a surrendered heart, you allow this
moment to take place, a moment that has never ever
taken place on the Dear Future WiFi podcast before, and
I can see it now. Testimonies break through deliverance. Men
are going to be calling their ex wives, and ex
wives are going to be calling their ex husbands and
saying I'm sorry, giving them the I'm sorry that they've

(01:05:09):
been waiting for for five, ten, fifteen, twenty years. I
speak that right now in the name of Jesus, for
a release that people get sorries forgive me. I apologize
things that they have never heard, and they've been waiting
on it, and they've been waiting on it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
Just to prove that you are God.

Speaker 2 (01:05:28):
They said, God, if you are God, if you can
put if you can make Pharaoh release the Israelites, certainly
you can make this man call me and say I'm sorry.
Certain you can make this woman call me and say
I apologize for I did you. Certainly you can, Jesus, Certainly,
because there's nothing too impossible for you God. So I
ask right now in the name of Jesus for a

(01:05:49):
supernatural release, for people to begin to release and bring
healing to each other like never before. God, we thank
you in advance for the time desimonious and Jesus name,
we pray amen.

Speaker 1 (01:06:05):
Mm hmm. Is it done? No? I ain't done. Who
I need a break? We ain't done. I need a break.
Thank you Jesus.

Speaker 3 (01:06:16):
So, Sam, how do you feel about this?

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
Who are terrorists? I am?

Speaker 4 (01:06:25):
You know, I'm a I'll be more a little more honest.
It's I think, I said a few weeks ago, I said,
you know, I think I'm I think I've spoken about
this enough. I don't know if I want to go
on anymore. And I and I actually debated. I was like, now,

(01:06:47):
dear future wife, is huge. Are you sure we're done?
And the Lord of the Lord told me no, I'm
I'm ordaining this. And he revealed to me that you
were going to carry me through this. He told me that,
but he did not reveal that the Lord was that

(01:07:09):
he was going to use you in this way.

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
And that's without saying too much. I just I think
in the depths of my heart, I was searching for
a way to do this and.

Speaker 4 (01:07:25):
Could not find it, and so I believe the Lord
used you as a midwife and helping to birth this.
And I'm still angry.

Speaker 2 (01:07:37):
You should be, And let me tell you this. I'm grateful.
Let me tell you this. Let me tell you what
I'm grateful. I'll be transparent. I didn't want to interview you.
I didn't want to interview you because I said, when
I get a pastor who and people feel like they've
done wrong in the marriage without even knowing all the details,
I get a lot of backlash. And so I said,

(01:08:01):
I mean, I get back last all day for that,
and I'd be like, why are y'all blaming me for
somebody else's decision? This is I got to create a
safe space for folks. And so then I was like,
but listen, I gotta be submitted to what God called
me to do.

Speaker 3 (01:08:14):
I can't allow public.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
Opinion to change the calling and the mantle over my podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:08:19):
But if I was honest with you, I was like, man,
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
And then on top of that, you did you did
my one of my close friends, Willie Moore Junior podcast,
and I was like, man, he just did that, right,
come do it? I just I said, that's really a
big out. He just did the other podcast. Yeah, you
know we're good or whatever. That's the reason why I
called you personally, and I said, I want to have
a conversation with you to see what can be unique
in this yehold, and I still didn't have an understanding.

(01:08:46):
I'm saying, all right, we just gonna talk. You said
we were just gonna talk. We talked. We said we're
going to talk about the things that you wish you
known before you got married. We didn't talk about none
of that. And I was like, oh, that'd be a
good thing. Yeah, we could talk about that.

Speaker 1 (01:08:59):
I'm not ready married.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
Yeah, I said that'd be great. I just got married.
I'm getting married in November. I need to know this.
I just did an episode with doctor Gary Chapman two
or three episodes ago that I released called the Things
I wish I'd known before I got married. I said
that'd be perfect, and God said, no, y'all gonna talk
about what I want to talk about.

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
I had no idea how this is going to be.

Speaker 2 (01:09:19):
And so the power in this level of surrender, because
we're both at a level of surrender, is that you
didn't want to have another conversation about it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:29):
We both were looking for an hour, looking for an out.

Speaker 2 (01:09:31):
I'm like, well, I don't want to do this, and
God said, why If I can't use you, then you
serve no purpose. See, people don't understand that if God
gets his purpose manifested in the earth by using people.
But if I am the gatekeeper to help you overcome
what you said your horse's hour was, I want a

(01:09:52):
space to do X y Z. I'm just looking for
that space, and I go ain't gonna be here. Then
God said, see, you didn't listen to me and then
listen to them. You start listening to all these other people.
And I always want to be in the heart posture
where I listen to him and not them. Jesus that
I listened to him and not them Jesus. And I'm
telling you, I'm telling you. I called my publicist, I said, Candice,

(01:10:16):
I said, man, should I do this? I don't want
to go back like, I ain't going to be talking
about no hell song I even talk about none of
That's what. I don't care about all that stuff. I
want to be happy. I'm about to get married. I
just want to talk about your elevation. Yes, I just
want to be talking about love and all that stuff.
I don't want That guy said, don't forget the mission.
Don't forget the mission. I've used this podcast to heal you,

(01:10:38):
to get you in the heart posture where you can
actually say vows and mean it. Jesus, don't you ever
put the public ahead of the promise. And the promise
I have for you is to continue creating this platform
to bring healing to men and women across the globe.

Speaker 3 (01:10:55):
So that's where me. I'm keeping it one thousand with you, and.

Speaker 1 (01:11:00):
It resonates with me on a lot of levels. I am.

Speaker 4 (01:11:03):
You know, you go through things I went through on
a global stage, and the biggest thing you experienced is
every people leaving, absolutely leaders, people, supporters, platforms, steals and
so when a ar Bernard who is him, takes me on,

(01:11:25):
covers me and backs me and gives me another shot.
I had a profit say to me before that they
didn't even know I was with him, and they said
to me, God sent somebody into your life to save
your ministry, to save your impact, to save your reputation.
I was like, and they didn't even know. And I

(01:11:47):
remember asking him he was. I had him on my
show and I said, I just got to be honest.
I want to know why you did this, because because
you don't like you got everything to lou like it's
your is. He's seventy two largest church in New York City,
all this influence, like why would you people are running

(01:12:10):
for me? Why would you run towards? And he said, Sam,
you know I the Lord told me to do this.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
Period.

Speaker 3 (01:12:18):
God said it that, he said I.

Speaker 4 (01:12:21):
So he said if you, if you or if anybody
else hasn't it, take it up with him.

Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:12:28):
And that's what happened today. Yep. So the soul listen,
you keep trying to fight me, take it up with him.
Go fight.

Speaker 2 (01:12:38):
And the last time I checked, your arms are too
short the box with got who short?

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):
So king? How can we support you? Got anything going on?

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
How can we support you? You have a podcast? Drop
your podcast? What's the name of your podcast?

Speaker 4 (01:12:56):
Called The Narrative with Sam Collier on American Urban Radio Network.
We got I don't know when you put yours out,
but I'm gonna put mine out before yours coming out
Wednesday next days Wednesday, I'm put yours out before then.

Speaker 1 (01:13:09):
When you make this statement, I was on his people
can know it's true we've been behind on that essence schedule,
but I'm definitely dropping it. I'm gonna drop it this week.

Speaker 4 (01:13:19):
So listen follow you'll see the terraces this week telling
us he don't know when he get married, and then
a week later he announced it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:29):
It was crazy.

Speaker 4 (01:13:31):
So go and see that and just Sam Collier, you know,
and come see us at Christian Culture Center Atlanta in
the city.

Speaker 2 (01:13:39):
So I love what a Arbernard said to you about
just God said it, and especially when you get to
that age, you don'na be caring what people say. He
just you know, you talk to like older people, they
be like, they be like, what were we talking about? Like,
they don't be caring. God tell them something, they feel something,
they gonna go do it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:56):
And that is what it is.

Speaker 2 (01:13:58):
But let me ask you this before we wrap, But
what did that mean.

Speaker 4 (01:14:02):
To you to get a second chance in ministry. I
have a complicated answer to that because at the height
of it all, really at the end of it all,
I wanted to leave. I said, I was angry with
the church, not just my church, with the church. I

(01:14:25):
was angry about it. I felt like because you said
something early and I hope. I'm not being too long
with it on this, but you said something earlier that
was powerful, and I skipped over because I knew we
had a lot more to do. But I want to
go back because I feel like the Lord wanted me
to say it. You got a divorce under Tony Evans,

(01:14:48):
and everybody was like, why would you do that? But
you had enough strength to do it. And I think
that's a problem. And let me tell you why. This
is when we talk about the next you know, when
there were conversations about divorce throughout my marriage, it's no
and I'm not talking about just with my ex. I'm

(01:15:09):
talking about with mentors and leaders and people that understood
what was happening before it got worse and before it
did this. But the number one thing I kept hearing,
and this is one of the things I want to
dedicate some of my life to going forward, was well,
can you just make it work if y'all could? And
I'm like, okay. And what it said to me was

(01:15:32):
you cared more about the image of me, that's it,
and my ex then you did us.

Speaker 3 (01:15:39):
That's facts.

Speaker 1 (01:15:41):
And so for me, I was very upset at this.

Speaker 4 (01:15:44):
I had arrived at a conclusion that the system of
Christianity not the church. The system of the church, the
structure of the church not the church. The church is
the body of believers. The structure around it is man made.
God's Church is perfect the way he designed it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:03):
It's amazing.

Speaker 4 (01:16:04):
But the man made structure is the structure that produces.
I mean, I know y'all ain't really, but can y'all
just figure this out because of what we need it
to be. Absolutely we don't want messing it. And we
create our own monsters, then we destroy them when they explode.
And so for me, I was done with the church.

(01:16:24):
I'm like, I don't why would I be a part
of that. I'm at a point, you know, when your
livelihood is connected to your morality, when your livelihood is
connected to your profession, or I'm sorry, you'll perceive whatever.
I'm at a point when I'm at the dollar menu
at Wendy's try to figure out how much pay for
my son.

Speaker 1 (01:16:44):
I'm like, why would I?

Speaker 4 (01:16:45):
This is crazy, Like this has implications that are beyond
the reputation, and this is I got a son to
take care of and how I pay for him is
with the ministry. But now the ministry has produced this
and all of it, and and your crush and people
are leaving.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
How am I going to take care of him? And
so I never wanted to do that.

Speaker 4 (01:17:03):
I was like, never, it's not even about me, even
though I don't agree with that, but I'll never put
him in that situation again.

Speaker 1 (01:17:10):
So I was out and then the Lord didn't let
me leave. It was just so many I heard the
audible voice of God.

Speaker 4 (01:17:16):
This is for the people that say, you get a divorce,
you shouldn't be pastoring no more.

Speaker 1 (01:17:20):
Well take it up with him, because I told him no.

Speaker 4 (01:17:24):
I had people on my right side, a lot of
them were white, saying you need to get out of
ministry that forever you're disqualified. I got people on my
left side, a lot of them were black, saying, don't
you ever what are you doing? Get back in the
pool that God has not done with your life and
you have so much. And so I said, well, if
they don't want me, I'm out because I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:17:43):
Need to do this.

Speaker 4 (01:17:44):
I can go do something else and subject myself to
a system that is healthy.

Speaker 3 (01:17:48):
Yep.

Speaker 4 (01:17:50):
I surrendered to the Lord, and he gave me a
second chance at it, and for me what it said
to me was a few things David said. I was
young and now I'm old, and I've never seen a righteous,
forsaken noise see baking bread.

Speaker 1 (01:18:08):
I did.

Speaker 4 (01:18:10):
A deep study this morning and last night on redemption.
That's what doctor Bernard and myself and my team, it's like,
this is what that has to be the message going forward,
and not just not a cliche redemption because you went
through this and we're trying to clean your image up,
not that a Christian principle that we have to get

(01:18:34):
redemption back in the culture. The world is more redemptive
than the church, and and that's a problem. And so
for me, I just it made me love God more,
trusting more, even in my pain and in my not
wanting to do to rock with the institution of church.

(01:18:54):
I love my members, I love being a part of
Christian Cultural Center.

Speaker 1 (01:18:58):
I love preaching. I love church. I love doing church.

Speaker 4 (01:19:01):
But the system I don't care for because I think
it's broken and I think we keep seeing leaders fall
because of it.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
Because we're going to be in every Humans are imperfect.

Speaker 4 (01:19:12):
You when you get ordained as a leader or a
pastor or an elder or whatever, you ain't you don't
become Jesus at all, and can we get us go?
And if you black, you coming in with trauma, you
can't introduce.

Speaker 1 (01:19:26):
Me to a maybe find a handful of black peop
They don't.

Speaker 4 (01:19:30):
Get no trauma. It's America, it's racism. We come in
with trauma. So that trauma is going to show up
at some point, and it's going and it's usually gonna
be when you at least expect it.

Speaker 1 (01:19:40):
You're gonna be on top of the world.

Speaker 4 (01:19:42):
So what happens then when the trauma catches up that
may have been self induced, but it may have been
you were born into it. You came from this and
you do it, and now it catches up to you
when you're on the platform, when you married and you
got this and you're leading these people and God elevated
you and the people trusted you.

Speaker 1 (01:19:58):
Am I supposed to do? Now? Is it done?

Speaker 4 (01:20:00):
Do we malfunction in real time and then it's over?
Or is there a system that can be created like
we see in the Nation of Islam. I'm a Christian,
I have a theological I don't agree with Islam.

Speaker 3 (01:20:16):
Yeah, I know you're Tommy talk about the structure.

Speaker 1 (01:20:18):
Is there something that can be created that allows.

Speaker 2 (01:20:21):
Men to get healed. And that's the thing about it.
And so yeah, that's what I respect. And shoot, we
all got trauma, no matter what our races, are, ethnicities,
our background, nationalities, we all have trauma. But I know
what the specific type of trauma you're talking about that's
indicative to how we came into the United States and

(01:20:42):
how we have to unpack that. But listen, man, this
was great. I believe we made the Lord proud. This
was an amazing, amazing episode. And again, thank you, thank
you for your surrender. And that's the reason why A. R.
Bernard said, God said it, and because he knew that

(01:21:04):
this moment would take place. And if you were no
longer in ministry, you wouldn't have a need to sit
here talk do nothing. You like, I ain't gonna be
in no type of faith based audience.

Speaker 1 (01:21:12):
I'm gone. And then the number one Sin's the thing.

Speaker 2 (01:21:15):
We got to look at it like this, either God
wins by you continue to carry out the good news,
or the devil winds by making you quit.

Speaker 3 (01:21:25):
It's that simple. It's that simple.

Speaker 2 (01:21:28):
Because who God calls he qualifies, and he don't say
I called you, but you messed up too much. I
changed my mind. I don't know what I thought when
I called you. He never looks at us like that
and be like I called you this, I changed my
I didn't see that. I didn't see that an equation.
I didn't see you doing that. I'm done with you, Sam,
You're done too much. There's no place in the Bible

(01:21:49):
where somebody did too much and God gave up to
him and they were doing some crazy stuff. And I
talk about that about the Pause and stuff that were,
you know, killing Christians, killing Christians, physically taking your life,
and then God uses him and changes his name from
Saul to Paul and use him to do great exploits.
You would think that somebody that was killing let me

(01:22:11):
tell you something. We're talking about, Grace. If somebody was
just started killing my kids, I'm not gonna say, oh, well,
come on over here. I'm gonna go ahead and use
you for I'm gonna hire you from a company like it.

Speaker 1 (01:22:21):
Just don't.

Speaker 3 (01:22:22):
My brain don't work like that.

Speaker 2 (01:22:23):
But that's the reason why I said, as believers, as humans,
our thought processes over people is already flawed because the
reality is, the more you get removed from the offense
that you cause, the more people no longer see you
as the offense that you did. But that's what grace
looks like. And God allows this level of grace.

Speaker 1 (01:22:44):
See.

Speaker 2 (01:22:45):
The only reason why people even know that I cheated
on my ex wife because I keep bringing it up.

Speaker 3 (01:22:51):
I keep bringing up my ex wife never said anything.

Speaker 2 (01:22:54):
Publicly, keep saying I keep saying that, don't nobody else's
ex wife saying that she ain't never made a Facebook
post about it, she ain't never said nothing. I'm the
one running around saying this. And when God told me
to say it for the first time, I said, now,
why would I do that? Because God knew it was
other people that I wanted people to be able to
look at this flawed human Because I grew up in

(01:23:17):
the church, my whole life got filled with the evidence
of speaking in tongues at twelve years old. So I
grew up in church my whole life, but I never
ever ever heard people talk about their faults. So I
was sitting there like, gosh, I am I only one
struggling with this and I only want this, And God said,
whyon't you be what you wanted to see? Be what
you want to see? I gave you this platform, stewarted,
well share about that. And I said, now, why would

(01:23:39):
I do that? That was five years old. I've been
divorceding five years at that time. Why would I want
to bring this up? God says, because it's other people
that need to be set free. And I said, they
don't need to be set free on my account. And
I to be throwing myself on the back. I'm telling you.
ILL said, well, why would I out the sid I'm
getting Listen. I only had five hundred subscribers at the time.
I said, these women are going to be so triggered,
they're gonna say another cheater, I hate him, and they're

(01:24:01):
gonna unsuscribe. Only had five hundred people. Now I got
six hundred and thirty thousand subscribers because I was operating
in truth, transparency, vulnerability, and deliverance Jesus. And then God said,
I can reward that.

Speaker 1 (01:24:13):
Jesus.

Speaker 2 (01:24:13):
I can't reward. God can't heal what you won't reveal.
I can't do nothing with that. But the men you
expose yourself is the first thing that Jesus Christ did
when he came from the grave. He revealed his scars.
Because the scars showed where you came from. When we
walk around and act like we're all in our glorified body,
then people be like, well, I can't I can't.

Speaker 3 (01:24:30):
Relate to that.

Speaker 2 (01:24:31):
He's too glorified, he's too perfect. Our glorified bodies only
come when we come, when we go to heaven. So
now I got to walk around with my flawed self
and say, here's my scars. This is where I was bleeding,
this is where I made mistakes, this is where I
had to overcome.

Speaker 3 (01:24:44):
These are my scars.

Speaker 2 (01:24:45):
So then people go, all right, teach me this Jesus
that allows you to be transparent. Willie Moore Junr said this,
this is so beautiful. Willy Moore Junr came and did
my podcast. We're gonna wrap up, but Willimore Junr did
the podcast. When I did, I was at New Bird Church.
I did the podcast live, and I didn't know much
about him on a personal level, but I just loved
how he would articulate itself in his Falseter care story

(01:25:06):
and all that coming out of being adopted and stuff,
and I said, I want him on the podcast. So
he was on the podcast. After the podcast, he said,
he called me. He said I was wondering what manner
of man is this that could sit up here and
share his mistakes and false He was going through his divorce.
So I didn't realize that somebody that I admired so
much on social media now was admiring the level of

(01:25:29):
transparency that I had. And I went through Celebrate Recovery
and it made and he was like, how do you
operate like this? I said, I went this program called
Celebrate Recovery. He went and enrolled and Celebrate Recovery like
a couple of weeks later changed his entire life. But
it came from me being open and vulnerable and honest
to say, I'm not perfect, and I'm trying to be better.

(01:25:53):
I'm trying. I'm trying my best to honor God. I'm
trying to honor vows that I take. I'm trying my
best to get healed from certain things. And so that's
what the process has been on the Dear Future WIFEI podcast.
And so now I'm a delivered man. I'm a redeemed man.
I'm a man that's gonna walk in honor. I'm a
man that teaches my kids how to watch and walk

(01:26:13):
and honor, how to be disciplined, how to honor their
honor God with their bodies, practicing abstinence and ben virgins
until they get married. That's the type of stuff that
was never taught to me.

Speaker 3 (01:26:23):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:26:24):
My daddy never told me, hey, listen, you might want
to wait till you get married to have sex.

Speaker 1 (01:26:28):
Never.

Speaker 2 (01:26:28):
I had a child when I was eighteen years old,
before I graduated high school.

Speaker 3 (01:26:32):
So it's like my senior year in high school.

Speaker 2 (01:26:35):
Two weeks before I walked across the stage, I was
sitting up here having a two week old baby, you
know what I'm saying. And now just became a grandfather
two weeks ago with my daughter. She's married and I
have a beautiful granddaughter named Claire Elizabeth Cosmey and so,
but that came from that broken boy that said I

(01:26:56):
made these mistakes. Let me teach my daughter the right way.
Let me stewart my daughter's heart well. And so, like
I said, I can talk to you all day that
I love chopping it up with other brethren.

Speaker 1 (01:27:08):
I'll say this again, thank you for your surrender.

Speaker 2 (01:27:11):
Thank you for not giving up on your calling because
God needed you. Because there are souls linked to your yes.
There are souls linked to your yes. And I'm gonna
tell you this right now. Prophetically, you haven't seen nothing yet.
You've done some things in the past that was cute.
That's what God is saying. That was cute. It pales

(01:27:33):
in comparison to what God is going to do. Your
latelier ladder will be greater than your former And I'm
telling you that right now in the name of Jesus.
I want you to receive that from the crown of
your head to the souls of your feet, that God
is about to release a whole nother level of anointing
in your life that you have yet to experience. Because

(01:27:53):
what happened right now and what happened this episode, there
was a release that happened. Even in the pain of
your past marriage, there's a freedom. There's an elevation that
you spoke into her life, and God is going to
do the same thing for you.

Speaker 1 (01:28:05):
He's going to elevate you on another level.

Speaker 2 (01:28:08):
You're gonna look back on this episode and say, God,
I thank you. I thank you for not giving up
on me. And the other thing is I thank you
for not giving up on yourself. So I thank you,
Man of God. I thank you, Man of God, walking
everything that God called you to walk in in Jesus name. Hey,
thank y'all so much for tuning in to the Dear
Future WIFEI podcast. Listen, there's going to be a link

(01:28:29):
to the book Student of Love. I'm gonna go ahead
and drop that now. Think I'm sposted to wait till
the end of September, but we're gonna put the I'm
gonna tell my pups and company, we just need to get.

Speaker 3 (01:28:37):
All that together now.

Speaker 2 (01:28:38):
But it's gonna be a link in the description for
Student of Love because there's some principles that I learned
in this journey I bled in this book, and there
are principles and journeys that are going to set you
free and position your heart to be a greater lover
for the people that God allows you to love. I'm
telling you from a romantic standpoint, from familiar standpoints with

(01:29:02):
your family with just mankind. Student of Love is an amazing,
powerful book that's going to teach you how to have
a heart posture of a student and learn love daily.
Y'all give that to give it up for my homie Sam.
Call you y'all, Love you a man, Love you King,
Thank you. Stay tuned to the end for a letter
to my future wife.

Speaker 1 (01:29:20):
Writing these love letters.

Speaker 2 (01:29:23):
You, Ladarian thrust it suddenly into child protective services.

Speaker 1 (01:29:32):
In twenty fifteen, my nephew black a.

Speaker 2 (01:29:36):
Boy, the likelihood have been adopted outside of kinship slim
to none? Rmione, sixteen years old, black a boy with
five years in the foster care system before I even
knew his name. The likelihood have ever been adopted?

Speaker 1 (01:29:53):
Yep, you guessed it. Slim to none.

Speaker 2 (01:29:56):
While Ladarian and Ourmione were trying to survive and barely
an overpopulated and underfunded Falseter care system, I was living
my own life, doing well professionally, having been a single
father with a daughter who at that point was doing
well in college. It was my time to live my
life right wrong. I felt unsettled, tireless, agitated. There are

(01:30:19):
just too many of our black children stuck in ambiguity
and in the limbo of the Falter care system. In
twenty seventeen, I legally adopted my nephew Ladarian. Fast forward
to twenty nineteen. I had no ties to this other
young king, but I felt God instructed me to adopt them.
Also in an Babe starting over with parenting should have

(01:30:40):
been enough. Right, Working with various foster care and adoption
agencies to help bring awareness to the countless young Black
Kings and the Falster care system should have decreased my agitation.

Speaker 1 (01:30:49):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:30:50):
Joining the board of directors of Advantage of Adoption and
organization that helps find permanent adoptive homes for children in
false care should have led to some type of resolve.

Speaker 3 (01:30:59):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:31:00):
No, not at all. None of it felt like I
had done enough. I now realized that every one of
those experiences was land the fundamental foundation for my life's mission.
Kingdom Royal. Kingdom Royal would be a luxury, state of
the art home for foster boys. Our first location will

(01:31:21):
be in the Dallas Fortwork Metroplex. We will utilize the
whole person approach that instills identity, empowers them to advocate
for themselves, and enlightens them regarding new perspectives and limitless
options that they thought were impossible.

Speaker 1 (01:31:37):
Though.

Speaker 2 (01:31:37):
The young Kings will attend the local public schools that
are in proximity to Kingdom Royal. Our at home curriculum
will broaden their worldview through participating in the arts, attending
various cultural events, learning about and engaging in multifaceted discussions
about current events and even relevant historical contexts, introducing them
to gardening and landscaping, and even caring for our animal

(01:32:00):
on our form and on site stables. We just launched
our startup capital campaign with the goal of raising two
point eight million dollars. Now why two point eight million dollars? Well,
In twenty seventeen, I created a web series in which
I performed random acts of kindness for targeting the homeless community.
One of the most notable successes was that one of
the videos went viral, garnering twenty eight million views. However,

(01:32:25):
one of my biggest regrets is that I didn't raise
a single dollar to help in implementing a more sustainable
plan for the homeless community. So, throughout the years, with
much remorse, I reflect and on not maximizing that moment.

Speaker 1 (01:32:39):
I knew if at that.

Speaker 2 (01:32:40):
Time just ten percent of the viewers donated one dollar,
we would have raised at least two point eight million
dollars That could have really established long term support for
the homeless community, or at least started a long term
initiative to do so. This is my do over, this
is our new beginning.

Speaker 3 (01:32:59):
To get.

Speaker 2 (01:33:00):
We can attack this at the route by specifically helping
our homeless Black boys who are already disproportionately represented in
the American fossil care system.

Speaker 3 (01:33:11):
I'm the Terissar Whickfield.

Speaker 2 (01:33:12):
I've been nominated for three regional Emmys documenting my work
with the homeless as well as my personal adoption journey.
Despite those accolades, the greatest award for me is truly
providing the infrastructure for a transformed life. Visit Kingdomroyal dot
com for more details Crown of King and make a

(01:33:33):
donation today. Man, let me tell you something that was powerful,
absolutely powerful. I'm telling you y'all heard me talk about

(01:33:54):
the book Student of Love, and the reason why that's
so important is because that thing that you just heard
me walk in, it's all in the book. So click
on that link so that you can get set free
and healed and life restored. Man, here's my favorite part

(01:34:15):
of the podcast where I speak to my future Wifey,
dear future wife.

Speaker 1 (01:34:18):
He healing isn't glamorous.

Speaker 2 (01:34:21):
It's messy, inconvenient, and sometimes feels like punishment, but it's
also necessary. I had to learn that before I could
ever prepare my heart to love you well. There were
moments when I wanted to rush through the pain, put
a band aid over wounds that needed surgery, or distract
myself with business instead of sitting still in the silence.
But I discovered healing. It's not passive. It's a choice.

(01:34:46):
A choice to confront would hurt me, forgive who wounded me,
including myself, and invite God into the broken places I
tried to hide. The beauty of healing is that it
doesn't erase the scars, it transforms them. My scars are
no longer reminders of shame, but testimonies of survival and
God's restoration. Their proof that I am still here hold

(01:35:10):
enough to build something lasting with you. By the time
you read this, know that I've done the work. I
didn't wait for marriage to fix me. Allowed God to
heal me, so marriage can bless me. Healing prepared me
for you. Healing is the gift I bring to us

(01:35:30):
your future, Hoby. I hope you enjoyed this episode of
the Dear Future Wife You podcast. Remember belt live intentionally
and transparently, and don't stop loving.

Speaker 3 (01:35:41):
Make sure to subscribe to our Dear Future Wife and
YouTube channel.

Speaker 2 (01:35:44):
We're available on Apple podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, and Stitcher.
You welcome your support. Simply share our podcast with your
friends and family.

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