Loved By Strangers But Cut Off From Her Dad. Why ‘The Girl Who Fell From the Sky' Turned Away From Public Life. Uncut with Em Carey

Today’s guest is a special repeat offender to life uncut! She first joined the podcast back in 2021 and has also been a special guest at 2 of our live shows. There are only a few people that we refer to with the description of ‘human sunshine’ but Em Carey is absolutely one of them! You can listen to Em’s episode from 2021 here.

Em Carey is a survivor of a 2013 skydiving accident in Switzerland, which resulted in a paraplegic spinal cord injury, leaving her with no feeling from the waist down. She is now a bestselling author of The Girl Who Fell from the Sky, a keynote speaker, an artist and potentially a future marathon athlete!

A lot has happened in Em’s life since we last spoke publicly. Some of what Em has been up to has been shared on social media but a lot of it hasn’t. Em has, in her own words, clocked off from social media in the last two years and so today we wanted to speak with her about why she decided to enter herself into the New York Marathon, an uncommon form of parental estrangement, dating with a disability and finding an identity outside of being the girl who fell from the sky. 

In today’s episode we speak about:

• Why Em feels so detached from being the ‘girl who fell from the sky’
• The guy who dumped Em ‘because she had a disability’
• Em’s dad cutting her off the same week that her book came out
• Struggling with strangers loving and admiring her when her own parent didn’t want anything to do with her
• Most estrangement is adult child cutting off parent, but Em’s situation is the reverse
• Why Em lost her confidence and turned away from public life
• Why she chose to attempt a marathon when she can’t physically run
• Em’s ambitious goal of raising $100k for
• “Who” Em is now in her 30s and her identity feeling different

You can follow Em on Instagram 

You can find more from her website 

You can donate to the Perry Cross foundation 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This episode was recorded on cameragle Land.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Hi guys, and welcome back to another episode of lifelun Cut.
I'm Brittany and I'm Tsher, and we have a very
special guest. She is a repeat offender of Life un Cut.
This will be her second episode with us, and she
was a guest at two.

Speaker 1 (00:24):
Of our live shows. I don't think he should correct
if I'm wrong.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
I don't think we've ever had somebody frequent the podcast
so many times.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
No, I think we've had some people do three episodes.
You never Yeah, like a couple of people.

Speaker 4 (00:35):
Have done three. There's only like maybe three of them.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
I think that.

Speaker 4 (00:38):
I can think of the top of my head.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
Definitely not someone who's done two episodes and two live shows.

Speaker 4 (00:43):
We're obsessed with her.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
Preferred during the past as Human Sunshine. We're talking about
em Carey now.

Speaker 2 (00:49):
In case you have been under a rock and you've
missed one of the episodes or you didn't come to
our live show.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
Em Carey was on our podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:55):
Back in twenty twenty one, so four years ago, and
in twenty thirteen, she became the girl that fell from
the sky. She was the woman that survived something that
no one should survive when she was in a skydiving
accident over in Switzerland, and we've spoken to her about
so many things, and we do recommend if you are
new to this and you haven't heard her episode, maybe

(01:16):
stop down now. We're going to put the link in
our show notes, go back and listen to the episode
that we did, and then scoot on back here to
listen to this episode. But we're talking about a few
different things today. M. I don't want to say disappeared
from social media the last couple of years, but there
was a bit of a hiatus.

Speaker 1 (01:32):
There was a bit of a quiet time.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
A soft fade, yeah, a ghosting maybe, like a soft ghosting.
But she's zombied and she's come back, and we're here
to talk about some of the reasons surrounding that because
there are some pretty personal things that En was going
through with I guess a pretty specific form of parental estrangement.
And we're going to talk about a few other things
as well, like dating with disability. And I'm just so

(01:54):
excited to welcome you back into our chair today, and
I say chair and studio, M, because last time you
were with us, we were in my apartment.

Speaker 4 (02:01):
I know, I walked in. I was like, you guys
have really upped it since last time.

Speaker 5 (02:05):
Well, we're wearing pants, we're all dressed, but thank you,
and you've given me a popper look very generously are.

Speaker 4 (02:12):
With the budget pie.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
People don't realize how professional we are.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
You coming in, We've got pants on and you get
a pop off Apple or Black Carrol.

Speaker 5 (02:18):
What else could you want? But yeah, thank you so
much for having me back. I truly can't believe I'm
the most frequented guest.

Speaker 4 (02:24):
I say, we're just obsessed with you.

Speaker 3 (02:26):
And as you do know because you've been too of
our live shows, and this is the ninety second episode.
We start every episode with an accidentally unfiltered, your most
embarrassing story you've had to share a couple.

Speaker 4 (02:35):
Do you have a new one for us? Do you
know what?

Speaker 5 (02:37):
And not a day goes by where I don't live
and accidentally unfiltered, and I was trying so hard to think.
I was like, Okay, let's do one that's not per related,
because they're always peer related, which if anyone doesn't know why,
it's because I'm incontinent from my spinal cord injuries.

Speaker 4 (02:50):
So it's just a part of life.

Speaker 1 (02:52):
If anyone's allowed to have a poo accidentally unfiltered, though
it's you.

Speaker 4 (02:55):
Yeah, but it's like they get old.

Speaker 5 (02:56):
But normally, honestly, they're not even that embarrassed because it's
so frequent. But this one happened recently and it was
one of the worst yet.

Speaker 4 (03:05):
So to set the scene, it was a few.

Speaker 5 (03:08):
Months ago and I was in South America with my
some at the time somewhat recent boyfriend. Oh, I have
a boyfriend, by the way, great, we love La.

Speaker 4 (03:15):
We're getting too that we love La.

Speaker 5 (03:17):
But anyway, we're in South America and we're about to
go and do a five day hike. And when you're
doing a hike for that long, you obviously can't carry
your big suitcase that we brought.

Speaker 4 (03:27):
You just have to leave it somewhere and take a
little backpack with you. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (03:30):
So we were staying at this tiny little hostel and
the people working couldn't speak a word of English. I
can't speak Spanish, but I somehow would Google Translate organized
with them that I could pay to leave my big
suitcase there for the five days.

Speaker 4 (03:43):
Amazing.

Speaker 5 (03:44):
Go to bed the night before and I suddenly am
awoken from my slumber and say, Ohm, I God, I
got to vomit. And I go to the bathroom vomit
like three times.

Speaker 4 (03:53):
Really weird.

Speaker 5 (03:54):
I'm not a vomitor, but felt immediately better, and I
was like random but efficient.

Speaker 1 (03:58):
Yeah, like hashtag South America.

Speaker 4 (03:59):
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 5 (04:00):
So went back to bed, all is well, and then
I wake up like half an hour later.

Speaker 4 (04:04):
I don't know how, but to my own voice, saying
oh my god. And my boyfriend's like, what's wrong? What's wrong?
And I'm like, shut, I've shut the bed. Not metaphorically, yeah,
I've shut the bed.

Speaker 5 (04:17):
Picture like the worst thing you can picture, like just
so liquidy and just awful, and times it by times
it by a thousand, what you're picturing. It was horrific,
and it was all over him, my new boyfriend. But
that was not the embarrassing part of the story.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
Oh it gets better.

Speaker 4 (04:33):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (04:34):
So anyway, he's so lovely, He's like, Okay, what can
we do? You get into the shower, blah blah blah,
and then, bless his soul, he says, do you think
it's on the sheets? And I said, oh, darling, you've
severely underestimated what's going on here, Like, is it on
the sheets is the sheets like we are we're swimming,
and we're swimming. So anyway, I get into the shower,

(04:54):
he brings in the sheets. I'm trying to like rinse
them off and just do everything I can, but it
is like it is crime scene horrific, okay, And we're
cleaning up for hours. I think it's probably three in
the morning. Our alarm goes off because we have to
then get a bus a few hours to go to
this hike. And because this hostel that we're staying in
is so tiny, there's no reception, there's no one we

(05:16):
can contact, and we'd already organized to leave our bags there,
so it's like, I don't know what else to do.

Speaker 4 (05:21):
This town's so little.

Speaker 5 (05:22):
I don't know what else we what we can do
besides just leave our bags and go. And I wanted
to leave money and a note. I didn't have any cash.
I didn't have anything to write a note with. So
I was like, I don't know what to do. We're
just gonna have to least trust them.

Speaker 4 (05:34):
Yeah, we're just gonna have to leave. And I felt
so awful, but we leave.

Speaker 5 (05:37):
We go out into the wilderness for five days, have
this whole transformative, beautiful experience to the point where I've
kind of forgotten with a clean bell yea.

Speaker 4 (05:46):
O my god.

Speaker 5 (05:46):
Literally I was like, thank god this didn't happen the
next night in a tent, in a sleeping bag without
a shell.

Speaker 4 (05:51):
Oh my god.

Speaker 5 (05:53):
But I've had this whole amazing experience that I kind
of forgot about it.

Speaker 4 (05:56):
And then we get back to this.

Speaker 5 (05:58):
Little town and we're like, oh, no, we have to
go get our suitcases. And I was like, oh, that's
like the one hostel I would never like to return
to in my life is this one.

Speaker 4 (06:07):
And I've got to go back And is.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
This just because you destroyed it? Like you left it
in a scene.

Speaker 5 (06:11):
Of like yeah yeah, and like we cleaned it as
much as we could, but I didn't leave. I just
there's no one I could contact to be like I
am so sorry, Like I'm so sorry about this. And
when we go back, I was like, Oh, this is
going to be so embarrassing. And my brofriend's like they
this would happen all the time, like, don't worry about it,
It'll be fine.

Speaker 1 (06:30):
Narrator, this never happened.

Speaker 5 (06:31):
Yes, we walk in and sitting at the little desk,
is this young guy who we hadn't dealt with before.
I was like, amazing, Like we can just grab our
bags and go. And this guy agreeed to this in English,
so I was like, oh, amazing, I can speak to
him and was like, hey, just here to collect our luggage.
And then all he says was una momento and I
was like, oh my god, not a good sign. And
then he walks to the back brings out the owner

(06:53):
of the hotel, who's the one we've been dealing with.

Speaker 4 (06:56):
And I feel so awful for.

Speaker 5 (06:58):
This young He was like a twenty years old guy
that had to do the translating between his boss and
us standing in front of him and they're talking in
Spanish and all I can imagine them saying to each other.

Speaker 1 (07:08):
Is this is the girl that sh the bet.

Speaker 5 (07:10):
Yeah, yeah, like we've got it. We've got to sort
this out. And then so this young guy he just
looks at me and he looked so scared, and all
he said was did you defecate z the bed? And
I was like, oh my god, this is even worse
than I envisioned, Like what do I do?

Speaker 4 (07:27):
So I just had to say, yes, yes, I did,
that's me. Yes. And then and then oh my god,
I got worse.

Speaker 5 (07:34):
Then the owner goes around the corner again and he
brings out a tub of the sheets. I was like,
it's been five days. Why do we still have these sheets?
Like was he'd saved them to show me? And I
was like, yeah, I'm I'm familiar. I was there, like
I witnessed it. I'm happy take my money, like do
what you need to be done, but why do we
still have these sheets? And he was holding them up

(07:55):
and be like, you know, like take it or like
just like look what you did. And I was like
I know, I'm so so sorry, and we just couldn't translate.
So anyway, sent them a lot of money, got our
bags and was out of there.

Speaker 2 (08:06):
But is actually such an unusual response from the hostel.

Speaker 3 (08:11):
That's worse than walking through a square having everyone's shout shame.

Speaker 4 (08:15):
Like look at what you've done? Yeah the crime throw
them out mate.

Speaker 2 (08:18):
Like it's like he thought maybe you guys had just
gone and had a party and like gotten off your
heads and like like it's pretty obvious you had an accident,
or maybe he thought we didn't notice.

Speaker 4 (08:27):
So he's like, oh, maybe maybe they didn't realize. I'll
show them.

Speaker 3 (08:30):
I was like, oh, we noticed it and video did
you not tell them about your spinal cord?

Speaker 4 (08:34):
And we could only speak basic words to each other.

Speaker 3 (08:37):
I feel like if there's ever a time to use
anything as an excuse, that's the time.

Speaker 4 (08:43):
It was just like, how much money do you want? Here?

Speaker 5 (08:45):
You go, please give me my bag. And I love
that they be using the bag as a bargaining chip.
They're like, you can't take this bag until you look
at these sheep.

Speaker 4 (08:52):
You're like, I'm looking.

Speaker 1 (08:53):
He's like, put your head.

Speaker 4 (08:56):
Like a dog.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
But I was playing at home. That might not know.
But m doesn't have control of her bowet.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
So at the best of times, if you're not unwell,
you can't feel it. So it's not that I don't
want anyone at home thinking that you just sat there
and spray you shit like a hawk.

Speaker 4 (09:08):
You know how hawks bray their pood like a third
world country. Sometimes it can happen.

Speaker 5 (09:13):
Yeah, I have no idea when it's gonna happen. I
can't feel when something's like going on in my belly,
and I also have no way of stopping it. So
even when you have a saw belly, normally you're like, okay,
I'll quickly run to the toilet. There's just no warning,
so you know, Oh, I guess, I guess this is
what's happening now.

Speaker 4 (09:28):
It's I love.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
The way can I know, we've got so much to
talk about, but it seems the perfect time to talk
about this. Also, I love that you started that a
feeling filtered with like, you know what, it's always about shit,
I'm not going to do it, and then you're.

Speaker 4 (09:40):
Like, but I am, but yeah, nothing else compares.

Speaker 5 (09:43):
And to me, that's like, yeah, that was like a
pretty horrific situation, but it's not that wild. Like things
like that are happening, maybe not to that extent, but
like once a week, you know. But I'm like, to
the average listener, that might be their worst nightment.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
So can we talk about your boyfriend? I know we're
gonna get into it later, but you just said you're
in a relationship. You're with a new guy?

Speaker 4 (10:00):
Is this secret? Squirrel?

Speaker 1 (10:01):
Can you tell us how you met?

Speaker 5 (10:02):
No? Yeah, we've been together for so long, like every year,
and I just haven't done the whole hard launch.

Speaker 4 (10:07):
Can we hard launch him here? Yeah, let's let's hard launch.
That's the blood tight what's his adject and do you
know where we met on Hinge? Nice? I met mine
on Hinge.

Speaker 5 (10:16):
I met my husband on I mean a dating out rayal,
but not Hinge. But ray is a bit cooler than Hinge.
At least it's not Tinder.

Speaker 1 (10:22):
At least we're not my sister got married off Tinder.

Speaker 4 (10:26):
You know what.

Speaker 3 (10:26):
I'm not young in anyone's yum, however it happens. I
really think we need to get over this narrative of
like I need to meet them in the wild, while, however,
you reach the destination who cares and me in the
wild is shitting in public?

Speaker 4 (10:40):
Like?

Speaker 5 (10:41):
How am I going to meet someone's online?

Speaker 4 (10:44):
Like this receptionist at the hostels?

Speaker 3 (10:46):
That my guy?

Speaker 4 (10:47):
Anyway, but yeah, we met.

Speaker 5 (10:49):
The only reason I'm I don't love the Hinge story
is because I just love.

Speaker 4 (10:52):
A good love story and it's just a bit anti climatic.

Speaker 5 (10:55):
But it really did the job. I was on Hinge
for one day, downloaded it for.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
I mean, that's a story in yeah, yes, I do.

Speaker 4 (11:02):
I know anyone I tell this story too, they're like,
I hate you.

Speaker 5 (11:06):
We matched immediately, like went over to text and then
met in person I think two days later. Deleted the app.
I was like, that was efficient, Yes, so very happy
with that.

Speaker 1 (11:14):
Okay, and then so do you guys live together? What's yeah?

Speaker 5 (11:17):
Yeah, basically since that first day basically, Wow, it's going great.

Speaker 4 (11:21):
His name's Matt and he's just yeah, a little angel.

Speaker 1 (11:25):
So then how does we are so jumping ahead?

Speaker 2 (11:27):
But we may as well sit in it? But how
does that work for you with dating with a disability
when it's something like, you know, there should be no
pressure to ever have to talk about things you don't
want to ever. But I guess it's a bit different
when you know that you might shit the bed every night, Like.

Speaker 4 (11:42):
It's something that you how do you warm into that? Well?

Speaker 2 (11:44):
How do you have that discussion? And like what does
that look like for you? Do you just go in
really open on day one?

Speaker 5 (11:49):
Yeah, It's something I'd never really thought that much about before.
It had never been so my accident was about twelve
years ago, and not that I've.

Speaker 4 (11:58):
Dated that many people in that timeframe, but whenever.

Speaker 5 (12:00):
I have, it hasn't even really been a discussion, Like
it hasn't been a big deal at all, And so
I'd never had any kind of qualms with it. But
after I left my last long term relationship, which was
maybe two years ago. Now, I had my first experience
where it was.

Speaker 4 (12:17):
Like a point of contention, Yeah that's the word.

Speaker 5 (12:20):
I was, yeah, between someone else, and I'd never encountered
that before. And it's interesting. I think we spoke about
this at the live shows. But after probably the ten
year anniversary of my accident and when I released my book,
I kind of found myself going through this thought pattern
of like, I just feel so detached from that whole

(12:40):
part of my life, like the accident side of it and.

Speaker 4 (12:43):
The whole story of it all.

Speaker 5 (12:44):
And because it's a skydiving accident, people find it so interesting, yes,
but when it's just my real life, I'm like, it's
just it's the most mundane topic, Like it's not who
I am, yeah, exactly. So I found myself like really
trying to not make that the most interesting thing about
my life. Obviously, the disability is different, because that's something
I live with every single day and I'm not at

(13:05):
all ashamed of that and that like that's the part
that still affects my day to day life. But I
also don't want that to be the most interesting thing
about me. So when I meet someone new, I try
really hard, not just in dating but anyone really. I
try to avoid it coming up the first time we meet.
So I don't even know how I do that. Maybe
in not going for a walk on the first date

(13:26):
where they're like why are you limping and I'm like, oh, strange,
both of my knees at ne ball but I don't play,
or you know, or just being very vague about it
because I want them to get to know me without
that first.

Speaker 4 (13:41):
But yeah, a few months ago, I know, sorry.

Speaker 5 (13:44):
A few years ago, I met this guy and we
were dating for a few months and he was really,
really lovely and it seemed like it was going in
a really good direction.

Speaker 4 (13:53):
And then one night he randomly.

Speaker 5 (13:55):
Turned to me and was like, I, oh, we lived
in different cities, so I was like, it's actually pretty
funny in hindsight. I was like when he was leaving
the next day and I was like, when do you
want to see each other again? And he just said never.
I was like, he said, unexpected response, but okay.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
He literally wrote never, yeah.

Speaker 5 (14:12):
In person to my face, like he's in my bed
and he's like never. I was like, okay, and were
we going to discuss this? Had I not brought it up,
and then I was very rattled because everything seemed fine
until that moment. And then when we were talking about
it and I asked him why, he said it was
specifically because I had a disability, and oh my god.

(14:33):
I gave him so many opportunities to be like, look like,
if you're just not interested, that's totally fine.

Speaker 4 (14:39):
We're just getting to know each other.

Speaker 5 (14:40):
It's so you know what I mean, It's so fine
if you normal, yeah, whatever, like no hard feelings, you
can just say you're not interested. And he just kept
doubling down. He's like, no, no, no, I love everything
about you. I've never felt so close to someone before.
It's specifically because of your disability. I was like, I'm
going to give you another chance to not say that,
and he just kept like doubling down.

Speaker 1 (15:00):
I'm making a choice here to say this to me.

Speaker 4 (15:02):
Yeah, And I just never encountered that before.

Speaker 1 (15:06):
How horrible. I'm sorry.

Speaker 4 (15:07):
Sure.

Speaker 3 (15:07):
I was on the floor, like I'm actually speech I
was so shocked, and I remember I had kind of
two main thoughts afterwards. The first one was my immediate
reaction was to defend myself and be like I do
so many things that I never thought I would be
able to do, and I like try to make the
most of my body every day, and I'm like, wow,

(15:29):
like I can't you see all the things that I'm
capable of?

Speaker 4 (15:31):
And I wanted to defend myself in.

Speaker 5 (15:33):
That way and be like, how can you claim to
know me when you don't know that I'm capable of
all these things despite my disability.

Speaker 1 (15:40):
You do more than most people I know.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
Even if you didn't and even if you couldn't exactly.

Speaker 5 (15:46):
And that was my second yeah thought. I was like,
that's just my ego. That's me being like, you know, like,
can't you see how much I drive? And then the
second thing, I was like, but that's so besides the point,
because what if I was still in a wheelchair, Like
what if I couldn't Like one of his reasons was
you can't go on hikes?

Speaker 4 (16:03):
And I was like, weird, weird.

Speaker 3 (16:06):
Yeah right, It's like now I get why he wasn't
in that bed.

Speaker 4 (16:14):
He would have been like, and this is what I
was talking about.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
It would have been like, actually, he's like just circling back.

Speaker 4 (16:20):
I told you this would happen. I'm queer. Yeah, But
but I was like, man, and I gave him.

Speaker 5 (16:25):
Normally, I'm quite reserved and I don't really stick up
for myself as much as I want to internally, but
I have never given. I wish it was recorded, like
a two hour talking to this guy, being.

Speaker 4 (16:36):
Like, why does it matter?

Speaker 5 (16:37):
Like why are you basing who you want to spend
your life with or even the next few months with,
whatever it is on something that is so like it
beyond our control and something that doesn't actually determine who
a person is. I remember him saying, I've never met
someone with a disability before, and I thought, have you
ever been in the world, Like, I don't know what

(16:59):
you mean, but I think because of that, if that
is true, he had such an idea built up in
his head of what it means what someone's life must
be like with a disability, that he didn't actually give
me a chance to get to know me. He just
had all these assumptions and yeah, but it just got
me really upset because I was like, I'm outraged, because

(17:20):
I'm shocked. But what actually I found really really nice
is that, for not a second did I believe anything
he said.

Speaker 4 (17:29):
Yeah, And I thought, wow.

Speaker 5 (17:30):
If this was ten years ago, straight after my accident,
I would have really really let that affect me. But
there was not a second where I questioned my worth,
question my value, questioned whether or not someone would be
able to love me.

Speaker 4 (17:40):
I just thought, Wow, that is his thing.

Speaker 1 (17:43):
And I so much more about him than you.

Speaker 5 (17:45):
Yeah, but it got me really upset for other people, thinking,
maybe I'm really naive in being so shocked that he
has this view, because I'm sure there are people living
with disabilities that are perhaps far more obvious externally than
mine is, that are dealing with this every single day.
And I got so upset and angry on behalf of

(18:05):
those people because I just hadn't really expected it before
when it gave him.

Speaker 4 (18:10):
A ted talk.

Speaker 3 (18:11):
Oh yeah yeah yeah, but like also, not your responsibility
to educate, Like that's just such a gross mentality. Did
that impact dating afterwards? Like did you did you do
anything differently after that experience?

Speaker 4 (18:23):
No, it really didn't impact me.

Speaker 5 (18:26):
Yeah yeah, I was more just so shocked and didn't
realize how much I wanted to rally for everyone else
with a disability until this moment. It really like unlocked
something in me where I just felt suddenly so protective
of everyone else in the dating world that has a
disability in me, Like, wow, I'm so sorry to anyone
else who was going through this, and I feel really
naive that I hadn't even considered that's something that.

Speaker 4 (18:48):
People are judging us for on the outside.

Speaker 3 (18:50):
I really hope that you can retell yourself that story
and be so proud of yourself for the advocacy that
you have done for other people that live with disabilities.
You know, I know that over the past couple of years, years,
even since your accident, the amount of perceptions of disability
that you would have changed in a really positive way,
something that I doubt you would even know the.

Speaker 1 (19:09):
Tip of the iceberg about.

Speaker 3 (19:10):
Like you've educated me so much on thing. There's something
you said four years ago that I have never ever forgotten.
What it's to do with going and using public toilets
if you're in a line for something like if there's
a line for the women's like at a football game,
or like at a concert or something like that.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
If you're at a bar or a club.

Speaker 3 (19:28):
I have never used the disabled toilet since, but sometimes
if I was at like a club or something like
that and there was a massive line and there was
just like an empty disabled toilet or whatever, and there
might be two of us, so we could go in together.
I'd be like, oh, we'll just quickly run in, you know,
we'll just quickly use it, quickly quick. And you taught
me that like a lot of the time, people that
have disabilities, they don't have the minute to wait, you know,

(19:50):
if they need that toilet, it needs to be available
for them right now. I have not used one since.
So I think that even though this guy seems like
the grossest of examples of someone who is so judgmental
of anyone's capabilities, I think that you've done a real
like you've done so much to change people's perceptions of
what living with a disability can be like. And when
your book came out three years ago, I think that

(20:12):
that really did do a lot for changing people's perceptions
of what spinal cord injury can look like and what
that recovery process is like. And it was a fantastic
But you were just such a beautiful, beautiful writer. The
way that you create stories and make people feel as
though they're in that moment with you is quite exceptional.
But when your book came out, you actually experienced something

(20:33):
really really sad personally that was going on at the
exact same time. That should have been this kind of
joyous moment for you. Can you talk us through that?

Speaker 4 (20:41):
Yeah, for sure. So yeah, I'd been writing my book
for years and years.

Speaker 5 (20:45):
It came out just before the ten year anniversary of
my accident. So I feel like for that whole ten years,
I became really proud of myself, not just for writing
the book, because that's a dream I'd always had, but
for getting my life to a point where it was
worth writing about, it was worth reading about.

Speaker 4 (21:00):
I when you know, when my accident.

Speaker 5 (21:02):
Happened, I never imagined that it could turn into something positive,
or that any good lessons could come from it.

Speaker 4 (21:09):
I just never imagined that.

Speaker 5 (21:10):
So the book was kind of the epitome of like,
look at what you created from that awful time.

Speaker 2 (21:16):
But I imagine maybe it was it a bit of
a a closing of a chapter.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
Yeah, you said you didn't want to be that person.

Speaker 4 (21:24):
It definitely felt like that.

Speaker 5 (21:25):
It was very cathartic to write, and it very much
felt like that's that chapter, let's move into the next one.
It was also, yeah, the ten year anniversary and I
was turning thirty. It just there were many chapters that
were like, Okay, I'm exiting that stage and entering the
new one.

Speaker 4 (21:38):
Release my book.

Speaker 5 (21:39):
Felt so proud of myself, so happy, and was just
on like quite a high and was about to embark
on the book to it, which I was really excited about.
But then a few days after my accident and.

Speaker 4 (21:51):
Sorry I'm so used to say my accident.

Speaker 5 (21:53):
A few days after the book came out, it was
Father's Day and I went to call my dad to
say Happy Father's Day, and he didn't answer, and I thought,
that's that's weird. But I felt that's weird, not in
the way that you know, he didn't call. It just
immediately had that like pit in my.

Speaker 4 (22:10):
Belly of like, oh, something's wrong, Like something's wrong.

Speaker 5 (22:13):
And I kept calling throughout the day, and that feeling
just kept growing of like something's really not right here.

Speaker 4 (22:18):
And of course what I was thinking.

Speaker 5 (22:20):
Is he's had some kind of accident or he's like
in some kind of crisis, and that's why he can't answer,
because he would usually answer a call yeah, or just
it was more just my intuition like something's off. And
then when I eventually did get hold of him, he
was so angry, and he basically just said that he

(22:41):
didn't want anything to do with me or my sisters again,
never wanted to talk to us again, and that was that.

Speaker 4 (22:48):
And it was just the most first of all confusing.

Speaker 5 (22:52):
Thing because it was so out of the blue, and
especially the contrast of I was on this high and
then I was suddenly just like whoa, Like what's what's happening?
And I to this day like don't know what happened,
don't understand, And he really meant he'd never wanted to
talk to us again, because it's been three years and
we haven't.

Speaker 4 (23:12):
And I've been really nervous to talk about this.

Speaker 5 (23:15):
I've never been nervous for a podcast in general before
because it's always on topics that I speak about so frequently,
and it's just about my life, so there's nothing really
at stake, and I feel really just really cautious when
I'm talking about someone else because obviously I can only share.

Speaker 4 (23:32):
My perspective and he can't share his.

Speaker 5 (23:34):
And I've always very much been of the belief that
if we had lived someone's exact life, we would make
the exact choices that they make.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
What was your relationship like with him before?

Speaker 2 (23:46):
This, Like, was there any part of this where you
could tether it together and say, oh, I sort of
get it, we'd had these fallouts before, or did you
just have a great relationship and then this was just a.

Speaker 5 (23:57):
It was very very out of the blue, Like he'd
spoke to me just a few days earlier saying that
he'd read the book, and yeah, it was just very
very out of the blue.

Speaker 4 (24:06):
And yeah.

Speaker 5 (24:08):
But the most confusing part of all of it, I
think was the time that it happened in my life.

Speaker 4 (24:16):
And I think when I tell friends.

Speaker 5 (24:18):
And stuff this, they're like, oh, what was it that
was in the book that made this happen? Just because
of the timeline, But that I truly do believe is
so unrelated.

Speaker 4 (24:25):
It was just coincidental timing.

Speaker 5 (24:27):
Because there's nothing in my book that was negative at
all about him. But it was confusing in my life
because I was then on this book tour and people,
you know, were taking time out of their nights to
come and listen to me speak and to get their
books signed and to tell me such lovely things.

Speaker 4 (24:45):
And suddenly I just.

Speaker 5 (24:47):
Had so much doubt about all of that, because I
was like, how can these people, these strangers who don't
know anything about me think so highly of me when
someone who's known me my entire life doesn't want to
hear me speak at all and refuses to ever talk
to me again. And I thought if, like, if all
these people knew me that well, would they think that

(25:08):
way of me.

Speaker 4 (25:10):
As well? Yeah? It was just such a contrasting time
in my head.

Speaker 1 (25:15):
You like, how can the person that's supposed to love
me not love me? Why would anyone else?

Speaker 4 (25:20):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (25:20):
Yeah, I mean like this person is the one person
on this put on earth that is.

Speaker 4 (25:24):
Supposed to kind of their duty.

Speaker 1 (25:25):
Yeah yeah, it's like that's what I'm supposed to have,
that support and love.

Speaker 4 (25:28):
Yeah exactly.

Speaker 5 (25:29):
And being twenty nine years old, I'm like, he's got
the chance to know me over twenty nine years. He
knows me really well, and if he has this view
of me, then everyone else's view of me must be wrong,
Like that must be the accurate version of me.

Speaker 3 (25:44):
Like you're holding up this facade that everyone's fallen in
love with, but if they were to get to know
the actual you, this person has shown you that that's
not lovable exactly.

Speaker 5 (25:53):
I truly felt like a fraud. I just remember people
were saying such lovely things to me. I was just like,
you have no idea. I'm awful, I suck like you don't.
You don't know if you were to know me, you
wouldn't be saying these things.

Speaker 3 (26:05):
And you wrote something like related to this that I
just it really hit me like a brick, to be honest,
And it was something along the lines of like, if
a father chooses to leave a baby, they're rejecting the
idea of being a father.

Speaker 1 (26:17):
But if a father chooses.

Speaker 3 (26:18):
Or a parent of any kind chooses to leave an
adult child, they're rejecting you because they know you. But
it's quite unique in this situation because it wasn't just you,
it was also your sisters.

Speaker 4 (26:29):
You know, how have your sisters felt?

Speaker 3 (26:31):
And I guess you might not want to speak for
them as well, but have you kind of sought closure
within each other of like trying to work out why
this might have happened, or like, I don't know, how
have you been able to lean on each other throughout it?

Speaker 4 (26:44):
Honestly, it's something we don't really talk about that much.

Speaker 5 (26:47):
It's and I think, yeah, and I think we've all
gone through our different processes of emotions with it. Like
perhaps they've gone through anger or confusion, frustration, And they
both have kids as well, so I think that's another
factor of you know, he's not just blocking out them,
he's blocking at his grandkids as well, and so they

(27:08):
have that added element whereas I don't have that. And
for me, I went through so many emotions to the
main one just confusion, but above all of it, just
so much empathy and sadness for whatever it is that
must be going on in his world that made him
block out the closest people in his life, because you

(27:30):
don't do that if if you're okay, yeah, definitely yeah?

Speaker 2 (27:34):
Was? I mean, ha, guess how long did it take you?
Because I'm trying to put myself in this situation? How
many times had you tried after that phone call? Had
you tried to reconnect or see him or call him
or understand or get you know, get a reason, get closure?
How long do you try before you realize and accept that, oh,
this is this is real, Like he doesn't want me

(27:56):
and I have to accept that and move on?

Speaker 4 (27:58):
Yeah, oh countless, like I still do you still tried? Yeah? Sure?

Speaker 5 (28:01):
And especially because just after this there was so many
big milestones. For example, the Yeah, the ten year anniversary,
and when my accident happened, he was really really there
for me in hospital, so it's like, that will be
a day that he surely will have something to say.
And then it was my thirtieth, so I kept waiting.
I was like, oh, surely, like this is enough just
to send a text or something. And then it was

(28:24):
like his sixtieth and it was so bizarre to not
be with him for that. And there were just so
many milestones that I was like, oh, this will be
the one, and I think maybe this birthday two years
later was the first time I didn't anticipate it at all.

Speaker 4 (28:37):
I was like, okay, obviously not, but I've still tried
to call.

Speaker 1 (28:41):
I've still tried to yeah, and just nothing nothing. Yeah,
So how do you move on? How do you accept that?

Speaker 4 (28:50):
Oh? Have you?

Speaker 5 (28:52):
It's I think, Yeah, there's so many different waves of
and so many stages of it all, and I think,
and why.

Speaker 4 (29:01):
I did this post.

Speaker 5 (29:02):
The point of view that post was from was how
I felt, I guess in the years prior to this,
that self doubt and that thinking that I must be
an awful person and all of that, and I haven't.

Speaker 4 (29:13):
Felt that way for a while.

Speaker 5 (29:14):
So I think the way that I've come to acceptance
is kind of just reminding myself that this isn't about me,
This isn't personal, because it's both of my sisters as well,
So it's not you know, what are the chances we're
all awful people?

Speaker 1 (29:28):
No, I want to be kept.

Speaker 2 (29:29):
How I say this, There's never a time for a
parent to abandon a child, but often majority of the
time when it does happen, it happens because the parent
doesn't want the parental obligation, right. So usually it's when
kids are younger and it's like, this isn't the life
I wanted, and I'm not saying this is okay, but
that's usually when the men fuck off.

Speaker 1 (29:47):
Yeah, you know, but it seems so unusual.

Speaker 2 (29:50):
Because when you have kids that are thirty, you don't
have the same parental obligation. You're not physically in the
day to day financing them and raising them and running
them to school and doing their school projects, and like,
you can live whatever life you want and just still
provide the love and connection and pick up a phone call.
So it just seems like even more confusing and unfathomable

(30:11):
that he waited till he was at a point like
he was there for you when you needed it more
than anything. Like when you're in the hospital and you're
not walking and like your life has turned upside down,
seems like that's such a strange time to leave, is
when like, yeah, true, the responsibility is that you don't
have the responsibility of anything anymore.

Speaker 4 (30:26):
Yeah, that's such a good point of Actually never.

Speaker 1 (30:27):
Sorry, I didn't want to bring any more points.

Speaker 4 (30:30):
Yeah, it's really beautiful.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
That you guys have the compassion to go like, well,
something must be going on, you know, this is abnormal
and through all of the I mean, we've spoken about
parental estrangement a little bit on the podcast. We've done
an episode with Sam Fisher, who actually was on our
live show as well, and he is estrange from his dad.

Speaker 1 (30:48):
We don't just pick people for the live shows that
are strange from their parents.

Speaker 4 (30:50):
By the way.

Speaker 3 (30:54):
And we've done an episode on narcissistic parenting with one
of our listeners who also has cut off her mum
because of some stuff that had happened.

Speaker 4 (31:01):
But in both of those situations.

Speaker 3 (31:03):
And I think in the majority, it's the adult child
choosing to remove themselves from the parents' life rather than
the other way around. Yeah, and I actually think that
it is a really beautiful perspective that you guys are
able to kind of step back and park your ego,
park your kind of like personal You've hurt me and
you've abandoned me, and go, I feel really sad for
what must be going on. I think that that is

(31:25):
a really really beautiful perspective to have. And I also
understand why you've been hesitant talking about it, because firstly,
you don't really want to add any more fuel to
a fire. And I think that it would be hard
to talk about these kinds of things publicly when you're
not able to get that perspective of that other person.
And yeah, like I'm really grateful for you doing that,

(31:48):
because I think there would be many people in your position,
and I'm sure your dms.

Speaker 4 (31:52):
Were absolutely flooded by.

Speaker 3 (31:53):
People saying, oh my gosh, I thought I was the
only one. But I can also understand why you would
be hesitant to talk about it.

Speaker 5 (32:00):
Yeah, it feels very uncomfortable almost because I never want
to speak on someone's behalf. And so when I do
talk about it, and when I did that post and
talking about it now I want to focus solely on
my experience, particularly with losing my confidence, because I was
always quite a confident person inwardly before that, I just

(32:21):
had so much self trust and I completely lost that
because of all of this, And so that's the part
that I wanted to talk about, rather than him as
a person, because who knows what he's going through, who
knows what his point of view is, and he can't
respond to this publicly, so I don't think it's fair
for me.

Speaker 4 (32:37):
To talk about him.

Speaker 5 (32:38):
But I was so surprised at the feedback that I
received from my post about this, because I had tried
for so long to research and read about all these
kinds of things, and in all the scenarios I could find,
it was the adult child choosing to cut off their
toxic parent, which is still an awful and really sad
situation and would take so much DEI to get to

(33:00):
that point. But it's always them choosing it to do
it for their mental health or for you know, that's
what's best for them. And I never could find anything
about it the other way, whether it's the adult the
parents say no, I don't want anything to do with
my child, my.

Speaker 1 (33:15):
Adult child especially based off No Big Life exactly.

Speaker 5 (33:18):
Yeah, yeah, And so many messages from people were saying
they related. They were like, I've never heard anyone else
speak about this, but I one hundred percent relate, and
I thought I was the only person that happened to
And I've had no explanation in some people, like twenty years,
I've never had any explanation, And it just blew my
mind how many people could relate to it, which is
really really sad to think about. But also it was

(33:41):
really comforting, I think for both of us in that
situation to go, oh, wow, we're not alone in this,
and perhaps this means it isn't personal on us.

Speaker 4 (33:50):
There's something else going on that we're unaware of.

Speaker 3 (33:54):
I think this is the same with like romantic relationships
and even ghosting to an extent, YEA. When you have
no reason to have a conclusion, you're left to kind
of wonder what the reasons could be, and we often
fill those gaps with our biggest insecurities. Yeah, you know,
I know that. When I was in the dating world,
I was like, well, it must be this certain thing,
this is why they've ghosted me, And it was always

(34:14):
the things that I hated the most about myself was
that why, you know, was the effects of that why
you kind of took a little bit of a step
back from public life and just you're a little bit
more quiet. You know, you still were posting here and there,
but definitely not it wasn't the same end that we'd
gotten to know online.

Speaker 5 (34:31):
Yeah, I just, as I was saying before, I used
to have so much confidence, which sounds so weird to say,
because I'm innately such a shy person, so I'm not
really outwardly confident.

Speaker 4 (34:42):
But I just trusted myself so much.

Speaker 5 (34:44):
I think, going through something so formative so young, I
really just knew who I was, and I was like,
I can do.

Speaker 4 (34:50):
I can do whatever I put my mind to, you know.

Speaker 5 (34:52):
And when it came to even releasing the book, that
would be a scary thing for a lot of people,
but I was like, no, I feel so proud of this,
Like I think it's to do really well.

Speaker 4 (35:00):
I think people enjoy it like I for not a
second did I doubt that. And after all of.

Speaker 5 (35:05):
This happened, I noticed every single thing I went to do,
I just would doubt in a way that I never
had before, which is also probably a really normal experience
in a way, I think I used to be quite
arrogant that I never had had that experience before.

Speaker 2 (35:18):
But you know what, maybe it's not arrogance. Maybe when
you go through something like you have, where you almost
lost your life, you should have lost your life, you
should have died that day, and you didn't. I can't
imagine you are left untouched by that, like your life
doesn't change to the fact where you're like, I don't
care anymore, Like I'm going to live every single day.
I don't need to be embarrassed b anything. I don't
need to be ashamed of anything. I don't need to

(35:40):
be like I can only imagine what that does to
your day to day living where you want to just
grasp everything.

Speaker 5 (35:45):
Yeah, yeah, true. I just didn't think about things as much.
I was like, I've got an idea. I'm gonna do
that and it's gonna work out. Why can't I Yeah,
why wouldn't it?

Speaker 4 (35:53):
And that just has not existed since all of this happened.

Speaker 5 (35:56):
And it's weird because it's not a conscious thought that
I'm sitting there saying like, no, you're going to fail.

Speaker 4 (36:01):
You must suck.

Speaker 5 (36:01):
Everyone hates you. Like I'm not telling myself those things.
But when I look at the timeline of the way
that I used to act and the way that I
act now and feel within myself, that was very much
the tipping point of when things changed.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
I mean, it's interesting that we have this discussion about
I want to be careful with how I talk about it,
because you know, I can't talk for him, and I
think this happens a lot with romantic relationships as well.
But it comes down to, like, who owns a story.
It's still your story as much as it's his story,
and you're still entitled to tell your story. And I
can only hope now that you are talking about it

(36:33):
here you're talking about on your socials, that that is
going to help flip your narrative in your brain again,
to get you back to the m that you were,
because it's a shame that since that moment you've felt
like you're not the same person, or you're not worthy of.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
Whatever it is you're achieving.

Speaker 2 (36:48):
Maybe it's going to help you a lot by having
these connections with other people where like you just said,
you've realized, oh, you know what there are It's not
just me, it's not just my sister it's like, this
is something that happens, there's actually, unfortunately a whole community
of people in your situation.

Speaker 4 (37:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (37:03):
Yeah, and I already have felt that to some degree.
The conversations I've had with people in the last week
have just been so beautiful and so comfortying, and especially
hearing from people who dealt with this, you know, a
decade or two ago, talking about all the different stages
of them coming to acceptance with it. And yeah, so
I already can kind of feel that shift within myself,
like something's being you know, released and let go of.

Speaker 4 (37:26):
So that's positive.

Speaker 3 (37:27):
Yeah, I hope the blank confidence comes back, and I
have a feeling that maybe you're about to do something
that could bring it back in bucket loads. As we
were walking in here, I was like, how's your training
for the marathon going? So you've decided to take on
the New York Marathon. It's a very big event. It's
one of the world's biggest. It's something that I think

(37:50):
only about one percent of people will ever complete, is
a marathon during their lifetime.

Speaker 4 (37:54):
What gave you this idea? Well, do you know what?
Everything we were just talking about was kind of the reason.

Speaker 5 (37:59):
I was like, I used to do just I put
my mind to literally anything and be like, I'm going
to do that. So I was like, what can I
do to just I just wanted to remind myself of
who I am. That I'm someone that can reach for
things and achieve them, and even if I can't achieve them,
I'm someone that actually really enjoys the challenge and universe.

Speaker 4 (38:20):
Don't listen to that too hard because I feel.

Speaker 3 (38:23):
Like, I know it's about the journey, not the destination,
but I want to get to chat.

Speaker 4 (38:28):
But what I mean by.

Speaker 5 (38:29):
That is like I find when I am the most
me and I'm the most passionate and driven, it's when
I like have a goal that I'm working towards, and
whether that's a goal that I've set, like the marathon,
or whether it's something like when I was in hospital,
which was out of my control, but in hospital, every
day I was like, Okay, here's what I.

Speaker 4 (38:44):
Have to do. I have to get up and I
have to work on this, and it just gives me
like a bit of a I don't know, like a
bit of a dusto. But pep in my step was
also a purpose.

Speaker 5 (38:53):
Yeah, exactly exactly, And so I thought, Okay, I need
a big goal that can just remind me of that part.

Speaker 4 (39:00):
Of myself that's been missing for so long.

Speaker 5 (39:03):
And I chose a marathon specifically because it's always always
been a dream of mine to do. Before my accident,
I was a runner. I loved running, and so it
was always just something that I told myself one day,
I'll run a marathon, and I just imagined that I
would have more time to do that. But then when
my accident happened and I was told I would never

(39:24):
walk again, I then had to come to terms with
even more than that.

Speaker 4 (39:29):
I was more upset thinking about.

Speaker 5 (39:30):
The fact that I would never run again, because I
think running just people either get it or they don't
get it.

Speaker 4 (39:35):
But I feel like run, I.

Speaker 1 (39:36):
Don't get it.

Speaker 4 (39:37):
I tried to get it.

Speaker 3 (39:39):
I've tried runners high and I'm like, but how long
do you have to do?

Speaker 1 (39:44):
I did a half marathon. Don a brag. It was
a bush off marathon.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
Well I did that because I was like, I wanted
to take it off the loose as well do with
my whole family, because we're like that weird family that
wants to do that stuff here with the whole family.
And I was like twenty kilometers in no fucking high.
I was like, I don't get the run high.

Speaker 1 (40:02):
It's not going to hit me. I'm never running again.

Speaker 4 (40:04):
Well, well, time for doing it, Oh thank you. But yeah,
I used to just love it.

Speaker 5 (40:08):
I remember I just would just feel so like free
and strong and powerful and just like get in this
real zone.

Speaker 4 (40:13):
It was so cathartic, and I was like, love it
so much.

Speaker 5 (40:16):
And so when I was in hospital, I remember that
being the thing that I was like, I'm going to
miss a lot of things about my previous life, but
that's the one thing I will miss the most.

Speaker 4 (40:25):
And I made a.

Speaker 5 (40:27):
Really conscious decision in hospital to not set too many
physical goals because I didn't know whether or not I
was going to get better. It definitely didn't seem that
I would. So I was like, I don't want to
put all of my all of my happiness and all
of my expectations onto a physical thing that's pretty much
out of my control that might not happen. So I

(40:48):
wasn't like, oh I want to Well, obviously I wanted
to be able to walk again, but I tried so
hard to not make that my main goal. I wanted
to make sure I would be okay.

Speaker 4 (40:57):
With or without walking.

Speaker 5 (41:00):
So I put more of my effort into my mental
and emotional health. But there was a thing in hospital
that I would I never really told anyone, but I
just kept it in the back of my head. I
was like, if I ever am lucky enough to run again,
I'm going to run a marathon. Like that's the big
goal that I always always kept in the back of
my head. Then as the years passed, I couldn't run.

(41:23):
Even though I am so lucky to be walking, my
legs are still partially paralyzed, and they're paralyzed in a
way that makes me not able to run. Not because
it's painful or because it's bad for me, but because
I physically just can't. I can't go up onto my toes,
which means I can't get the spring in my step.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
You can't actually just do the movement. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 5 (41:42):
So I thought I just eventually let go of my
dream to run a marathon because I couldn't run. And
now that it's been so so long, my healing's definitely plateaued.
I'm not randomly well, who knows, but I highly doubt
I'm randomly after twelve years going to suddenly heal more
than I have to this point. But then a few
months ago, after all the hiking I was doing earlier

(42:04):
this year, I came back home and walking suddenly was
really really hard for me, And it's always a little
bit hard for me, but in a way that I
hadn't felt since hospital. I would have to like hold
onto the walls in my house to kind of pull
myself along, and I could only walk tiny little distances
each day.

Speaker 4 (42:20):
Is that from over use? Do you think? Yeah? I
think so.

Speaker 5 (42:23):
I think I must have done some kind of damage hiking,
but I didn't realize, and I had scans and there
was nothing obvious wrong. But ever since I had my injury,
doctors have said that it could worsen as I aged
the effects of the spinal cord injury. So I've always
kind of had in the back of my mind that
I may one day be in a wheelchair again, and I.

Speaker 4 (42:42):
Imagined it would be far more in the future.

Speaker 5 (42:45):
But when this started to happen, I thought, oh wow,
like I again had that sense of I thought I
had more time, and it got me really fearful in
the sense that I'd never got to achieve my goal
and even though I can't run, I thought, well, I
can walk, and I don't know if I can walk
a marathon. It's far more than I've ever walked before,

(43:05):
But I physically can walk, and maybe that won't always
be the case. So why why would I not do
something just because it doesn't look the way that it
once did when I first had this dream?

Speaker 2 (43:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (43:16):
Yeah, and so how I mean, how do you think
you're going to go?

Speaker 2 (43:19):
It's forty two kilometers? What's your at the moment? Like,
what's your limit with what's the.

Speaker 1 (43:24):
Longest you've gone in like your hikes or your training.

Speaker 5 (43:26):
Well, the longest walk I've done straight was the City
to Serve here, which is fourteen kilometers.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
Okay, so you got it?

Speaker 4 (43:32):
Got avery where I go? But I Everyone's like, what's
your training plan? And I'm going to be doing a
lot of training, but my plan for the day. People like,
what's your pace? What are you doing? Vibes like, I
think the vibes of your marathon I just the crowd.

Speaker 3 (43:48):
I think I think it's gonna get me by you're
an adrenaline girly.

Speaker 4 (43:51):
Yeah, and I.

Speaker 5 (43:52):
Also am a will see what happens in the moment
person like I think, obviously, I'll do as much physical
preparation as I can, but it's kind of best if
I don't know how.

Speaker 4 (44:03):
Bad something's going to be, because you just have you
just go.

Speaker 2 (44:06):
There's also just yeah, there's also something in the moment
that just drives you. Yeah, when you're there, you just
seem to be able to do things. And I don't
just mean you obviously you because you're walking when you
never were told you could. But like people hear these
stories of I don't getting off piece here, but these
stories of people that can lift a car orf a
toddler when it has to do like things that just
like your body just turns up the adrenaline and the

(44:27):
excitement to drive the goal is like, your body can
do amazing things when you put your mind to it.

Speaker 1 (44:32):
Are you doing this with anyone? You doing it with
your partner math or yeah, he'll be doing it with
me as well, So he's gonna walk it with you.

Speaker 4 (44:38):
Yeah, imagine he runs ahead like actually this is also
a bucket list side of me.

Speaker 5 (44:44):
Yeah, I'm gonna beat you by that's hilarious.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
I don't think that the whole running a marathon from
after having a spinal cord injury is a relatable thing
for many people. But I actually think there's something so
relatable in what you're talking about. And this is something
that and I don't mean to make this about myself,
but it's probably the one thing I've really questioned and
sat in this whole year.

Speaker 4 (45:07):
And it's to do with goals.

Speaker 3 (45:08):
And it was after a conversation I had with Mark Manson,
who wrote the subtle ard not giving a Fuck, And
basically he's like, goals are shit, Like, you know, I
almost want to say that they are almost useless.

Speaker 4 (45:20):
It's the directionality that they put you on.

Speaker 3 (45:22):
And it's kind of that, you know, the reason he
says that it's not so that you don't have any goals,
it's because reaching the goal often doesn't ever feel as
good as what you think it's going to. And so
you saying like I had to let go of the
goal of running a marathon, I actually don't think that's
the case. I think that you've just shifted it, you know,
you've just kind of shifted it to this different mindset

(45:44):
of like, Okay, well I can walk, and maybe that
will you know, do this and this and that. And
I think that that aspect of your story is relatable
for people. So you know, in my life, I'm kind
of like, oh, I've had all of these goals and
I feel disappointed if I'm not actually able to reach them.
More I'm not a to achieve them.

Speaker 4 (46:01):
Especially in the way that I thought I would.

Speaker 3 (46:04):
You know, we often talk about milestone anxiety around our
birthdays and around New Year's where we're not quite where
we thought we would be. But maybe there's actually something
really inspiring in the shifting of a goal to suit
your actual environment.

Speaker 4 (46:16):
That's so true as Miley, as Miley Cyrus says, it's
about the climb.

Speaker 5 (46:25):
But no, it's it's so true, it's and it's never Yeah,
it's never about the actual thing. It just sets you
off on a path that even if you don't reach
the thing, Like if I am not able to finish
this marathon, it doesn't matter because it got me on
this direction to strive for something again and to push
myself and to have developed self belief and confidence.

Speaker 4 (46:45):
And yeah, I love that.

Speaker 2 (46:46):
I feel I feel like I know you well enough
that you will complete it. I think that you would
drag yourself over the line. And even if you don't,
I feel like your boyfriend Matt would pick you up
drag over line. Yeah, at the end of the day
is exactly that, it doesn't matter. You've turned up and
you've given it a crack. And I think exactly off
what Kesh you'd have said. It's like half the battle
is just giving something to go. Yeah, And I would

(47:06):
hate for people to think that there was ever a
failure if they went to do something and didn't complete it.

Speaker 1 (47:11):
You turning up is more than I'm doing. I'm not
even going there to try.

Speaker 2 (47:14):
And you did the half marathon, never again, and half
half marathon in the Blue Mountains is not the New
York Marathon.

Speaker 3 (47:21):
Let's just put this and maybe you can imagine that
guy at the hostel, the one who speaks Spanish. Just
imagine he's two meters behind. Did you that's what you?
Oh my god, that will power me.

Speaker 5 (47:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (47:34):
I've never wanted to get out of a room quicker
than I have that room.

Speaker 6 (47:38):
Do you feel like, and I maybe I'm saying this
based on you know, a personal experience, do you feel
like there's any part of you that is wanting to
do it as a fuck you to this guy that
was like, you know, I don't want to be with
you because you have a disability.

Speaker 1 (47:53):
Like is there anything that's maybe even deep down?

Speaker 2 (47:55):
Because I remember when I used to go through like
a bad breakup or something, or the best revenge for
me was always like I'm just going to show you
what you missed out on, Like I'm going to show
you that I can do whatever I want to do.

Speaker 1 (48:06):
Do you think there's anything leased in that?

Speaker 5 (48:07):
And I'm not saying this is the right thing to
do when you break up.

Speaker 2 (48:11):
Validation sometimes sometimes it's a driving force for people when
someone says you can't do something, it's like watch me.

Speaker 4 (48:19):
Yeah, maybe I don't think so.

Speaker 5 (48:20):
And I also don't think he would ever know if
I did it.

Speaker 4 (48:23):
I don't think he would.

Speaker 3 (48:24):
He would he'd be lurking tell me his name after this,
and I'll make sure I did, imagine.

Speaker 5 (48:30):
But no, I really don't think so, because, as I said,
I was so even shocked at how much that didn't
affect me.

Speaker 4 (48:38):
It upset me because I thought this was going somewhere.

Speaker 5 (48:40):
With him, but it didn't affect me in the way
that I thought I was worth less because I couldn't
do these things.

Speaker 4 (48:47):
And in a way it I even felt the opposite.

Speaker 5 (48:50):
I was like, I don't want to prove that I
can do these things because then your love for me
is just circumstantial.

Speaker 4 (48:55):
On what I can physically do. So yeah, I kind
of feel the opposite.

Speaker 5 (49:00):
I almost was like, I want to do the least
that I've ever done physically in front of this man,
because I should still be lovable even yeah, yeah, even
without all of that.

Speaker 4 (49:08):
But who knows. Maybe it was for the hike because
when he said you can't go on hikes, and I
was like.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
Fucking watch and you've set a pretty ambitious target of
what you want to raise. Can you tell us who
you're raising money for with this new marathon?

Speaker 4 (49:21):
Yes?

Speaker 5 (49:21):
So another component of it, there was the big personal
goal of just the lifelong dream, and then there was
the goal of wanting to just strive for something again
and show myself I was capable of, like working towards something.
But even when I was, when I was thinking about
those two things, I just can never shake the fact
I'm like, but I'm so insanely lucky, Like who else

(49:43):
that has a spinal cord injury is able to be like, oh,
here's the goal that I have. Maybe I can't run
but I'll still walk. It just still seems so like
just unfathomable to me that I have the opportunity to walk,
And more than anything, I wish that other people would
spin cord injuries, could experience that moment of taking their
first steps again in the way that I have, and

(50:04):
not just taking their first steps again, but then getting
to getting.

Speaker 4 (50:08):
To do the goals that they once had before injury,
the physical goals and even think about them. Yeah exactly.

Speaker 3 (50:13):
They're probably in that same mentality of you where it's
like I don't want to have unrealistic expectations or goals
yeah my physical capability, yeah exactly.

Speaker 5 (50:21):
So I was like, Okay, I want to make this
bigger than myself, and so I kind of set the
mission of walking for those who can't and raising money
for the Perry Cross Foundation who are in doing credible
research for spinal cord injuries. And yeah, I set the
goal of one hundred thousand dollars to raise for them,

(50:42):
and very ambitious goal. But again it's like you said,
the goal itself. If we don't reach that target, it
doesn't matter, like every dollar that we raise is going towards.

Speaker 4 (50:51):
That and it's not like the money is getting refunded.
We didn't reach it.

Speaker 2 (50:55):
Like sorry, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (50:58):
So we're going to put that link in out show
notes as well.

Speaker 5 (51:00):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (51:01):
Yeah, we will one hundred percent will be donating in
supporting you. But in your twenties, you've said that you
you know, your identity was shrouded and the girl that
fell from the sky and the accident in your disability
and figuring all that out. And then you've hit thirty
and you've really gone through it. You've had a lot
of things that have happened to you and you've overcome.
Who are you now in your thirties? What have you
learned from everything in their twenties? And this isn't just

(51:24):
about living life with a disability. I just feel like
everybody becomes somebody different all of a sudden when you
hit thirty, And it's not necessarily the milestone of thirty,
but it's just that next decade, like you've lived and
you've learned. It's just that you've lived and learned so
much more than most people. Who are you now?

Speaker 5 (51:40):
That is a great question, and I really I have
no idea, But I remember when I turned thirty and
there was a lot of talk in my friendship groups
about thirty and people were talking about, you know, feeling
like they hadn't reached the certain milestones of having a baby,
getting married, having a house, all of these things, and
I kind of felt the opposite. I was like, I

(52:01):
don't I don't care about all of these adult goals
that I haven't reached yet. I also feel like I
didn't do the younger things that you know, most people
do in their twenties. In their twenties, I think is
when people are you know, making mistakes, traveling, discovering themselves,
dating different people, or the sting in a hostel.

Speaker 4 (52:20):
Yeah have you?

Speaker 3 (52:21):
Yeah, I was on a boat in Egypt and I
had to ship myself in the desert. And not joking,
like as literal as you can take that statement in
the background.

Speaker 4 (52:31):
Like that she shut on the pyramid yep.

Speaker 1 (52:36):
To come to she tootored on his tub.

Speaker 5 (52:39):
No appreciate you sharing back to who are you?

Speaker 4 (52:42):
No? Who am I? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (52:44):
I really don't know, but I just I just the
last few years I felt like I went on this
I can say rampage.

Speaker 4 (52:52):
It sounds like I did some crazy stuff.

Speaker 5 (52:53):
But all the things that I didn't do in my twenties,
I just started doing and I don't even know like what,
but I just.

Speaker 4 (53:01):
You know, traveled a lot more.

Speaker 5 (53:03):
And because something so big happened to me so young,
and because I felt so lucky to have healed in
the way that I healed and to have survived in
the first place, I just have always had this view
that I have to do something so meaningful and so
important with my life because I'm.

Speaker 4 (53:21):
So lucky to have it. That's a pressure.

Speaker 5 (53:23):
Yeah, I put so much pressure on myself because I
just thought, like, how dare I waste a day?

Speaker 4 (53:29):
Like how dare I not cure cancer?

Speaker 5 (53:31):
Like I have to do something so important with my life,
and it really really weighed over me in I just
always felt so much pressure to be good, like to
just be a really really good person, which obviously I
still want to and see myself as a good person,
but I just kind of let go a little more
and just put less rules on myself in ways that

(53:52):
maybe a lot of people do in their twenties. But
just I can't even think of a basic example. Oh,
like I'd never had a coffee before in my life
until year.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
You are a psychopath?

Speaker 3 (54:02):
Because I just thought I don't know, it just felt
like bad. I think it might've been the second time
I met you in person. It must have been one
of our live shows, and we got into this pretty long,
deep chat. We were backstage together for quite a while,
and I remember walking away from that and being like,
I've always always loved your personality. There was a different
side of you. There was this darker humor side of
you that I got to to see.

Speaker 4 (54:22):
I loved it.

Speaker 3 (54:23):
I understand what you mean about this, not a facade.
It's just like a certain part of your personality where
you were this glowing ray of sunshine. You probably felt
that people had that expectation of you, that you would
always be so kind and so lovely and so nice
and like.

Speaker 4 (54:37):
All of those things.

Speaker 3 (54:38):
It's a lot of pressure, especially when you've got a
sassy side, like when you've got kind of that grittier,
more resilient, more like humorous side to you. I'm so
glad that you feel as though you were able to
unleash that a little bit more in your thirties. And
I think it's it's actually quite relatable for a lot
of people. I think we are conditioned to be good
girls and to be liked and to be polite and kind.

Speaker 4 (55:00):
I think it's just.

Speaker 1 (55:00):
Something in your thirty where you don't give a fuck
as much anymore.

Speaker 2 (55:02):
It's like you just have learnt your lessons in a way,
not all of them, Like you still make mistakes, trust me.
Like I was still drowning in red flags till I was.
I still am really, but I've never escaped it. But
I just think you don't care as much and you
probably learned that lesson earlier.

Speaker 1 (55:17):
But I say to a lot of people, like I
have a lot of younger friends.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
And it's hard when you're listening to some of the
things they're saying and you're what you want to say
is like, just you wait, in five years, you won't care.

Speaker 4 (55:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (55:29):
I remember people always saying that to me about their
thirty specifically, and I really felt. I was like, I
can't imagine not caring about people's opinions because.

Speaker 4 (55:38):
I already feel like I don't.

Speaker 5 (55:39):
I feel like I already had such a solid view
of myself that outside opinions didn't matter. So I thought
I was there, and then no, when I hit thirty,
like something changed again. I was like, oh, it's not
even outside opinions, it was my opinion of myself, like
all these standards that I was holding myself to, and
I was.

Speaker 4 (55:55):
Like, no, like, let go a little, Like, yeah, have
a coffee, So do.

Speaker 1 (56:01):
You drink coffe enough?

Speaker 5 (56:02):
I have an iced Armond mocha with only half strength coffee.

Speaker 1 (56:06):
You wank up, but I just it's basically.

Speaker 4 (56:10):
An ice chocolate with a little dash of She's like, okay,
I have milolo.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
Thank you so much for coming in today. I could
talk to you forever.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
I just can't thank you enough always coming and sharing
such a rare insight, like your experiences, and you might
not think they are, but they are.

Speaker 1 (56:29):
Like, not many people have.

Speaker 2 (56:30):
Experienced what you've experienced on every level, like even to
the situation with your father recently. And it's not easy
to talk about and it's definitely not easy to share with.

Speaker 1 (56:39):
You know, one hundred million people.

Speaker 4 (56:41):
But we've wait one hundred million people.

Speaker 1 (56:43):
Exaggerate, we've had a munch a million downloads. Yeah, but
we don't have that many people listening to.

Speaker 3 (56:47):
Yes, that is how many downloads we're expecting on this specific.

Speaker 4 (56:50):
Share it with your friends, take her off zero.

Speaker 3 (56:55):
We will have links to your social media so that
everyone can follow along with everything to do with the
New York Marria phone in all your travels, and also
a link to donate.

Speaker 4 (57:03):
What's the charity? Sorry, the Perry cross Man Perry Cross Great.

Speaker 3 (57:05):
There'll be a link for that in ASHURNUS as well.

Speaker 4 (57:07):
Thank you so much for being here.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
Thank you