278. Saving Venice - What does the Future Hold for the Lagoon City? - Untold Italy travel podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Venice is a dream.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
There's no place like it and you really must see
it once in your life. But this beautiful city is
facing existential challenges. On this episode of I Told Italy,
we talked to journalist Erka Hill about Saving Venice, an
important film she and her team made in conjunction with
local Venetians, on how they are working towards a brighter
future for La Serenissima.

Speaker 3 (00:28):
Tawatuti and Benvenuti. Tuan Told Italy, the travel podcast to
where you go to the towns and villages, mountains, the lakes,
hills and coastlines of Bela, Italia. Each week, your host
Katie Clark takes you on a journey in a search
of magical landscapes, history, culture, wine, gelato, and of course

(00:49):
a whole lot of pasta. If you're dreaming of Italy
and planning future adventures there, you've come to the right place.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
Dreaming of arriving in Italy, strolling into a gelatia and
ordering your gelato with confidence. If you've been learning Italian
with language apps but still can't string a sentence together,
it might be time to try another approach. My friend
Michelle from Intrepid Italian offers a practical way to learn
travel ready Italian.

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Thanks to her.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
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need to know to connect with locals and have more
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(01:49):
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last four weeks than I ever did on my own
or using other language apps. To find out more and
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the show notes. As a bonus, you'll also get an
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(02:11):
Michelle's online self paced courses. So visit untold Italy dot com,
forward slash Italian and accelerate your Italian language of journey today.
Jail friends, Benvenuti, Welcome back for another episode of Untold
Italy where I get to talk about my favorite city, Venice.
This beautiful magical place is often in the news these

(02:32):
days for all the wrong reasons, and so when the
team at Max reached out and shared their wonderful film
Saving Venice with me, I was delighted to invite presenter
Erica Hill onto the show. Venice, of course, is a
victim of its own beauty, often the go to place
for examples of overturism, it's sometimes hard not to feel
fatalistic and despondent about her future. But what Erica and

(02:54):
her team have done with this documentary is to provide
hope and show Venice as a living, breathing city that
has and will adapt to the sea and all manner
of challenges and remain a place that welcomes visitors from
all corners of the globe to marvel at her beauty
and resilience.

Speaker 1 (03:10):
Ben Venuta, Erica, Welcome to the Untold Italy podcast.

Speaker 4 (03:14):
Pier Cherre e pia Cherre, pia chera, which one is it?

Speaker 2 (03:18):
Ye?

Speaker 4 (03:19):
Thanks for having me, Katie.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
Oh, it's fantastic to have you here to talk about
one of my favorite cities in the entire world and
a topic that I'm really passionate about, and that's sustainable
travel in Italy. You've had just this amazing experience making
this film in Venice Saving Venice. Could you share with
our listeners your story and your background and how you
came to be making this film.

Speaker 4 (03:42):
Yeah, happily, and thank you again for having me on.
I'm so excited to be able to talk about what
was really a dream project for the entire team that
worked on it. It's CNN and really a bit of
a labor of love. So I'm Erica Hill. I'm an
anchor and a correspondent. It's CNN, and I had pitched
this story about a year and a half ago after
reading an article titled let Venice Sink, and I thought

(04:02):
that's interesting. I've never been to Venice. Maybe I could
pitch that story. And the more I read into it,
I started interviewing a bunch of different people as I
was doing my research before I could make a proper pitch,
and one of them, Fabio Carrera, who is featured in
our documentary, said, you know, Erica, it's not Venice that
needs saving, it's the Venetians. And that is what really

(04:24):
got the wheels turning and brought us to the point
where we put together this one hour show called saving Venice,
which is you know, I like to say, you come
for what you think is the sinking, flooding city that
needs to be saved, but you stay for the reality.
It's the heart and the soul and the people of
this community who need to be saved. And so that's,

(04:44):
you know, that was the genesis of this project, and
it was such a treat and honestly such an honor
to be able to tell that story with so many
of the wonderful local people that we met.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Yeah, that's I love that story behind the documentary.

Speaker 2 (04:59):
I think it's really amazing how Venice just captures your imagination.
I went there myself the first time when I was
I think I was about twenty and while I was
just awestruck. But that was your first time in Venice,
wasn't it. And I guess she'd done a lot of
pre research, as you've just mentioned, But what were your
first impressions, even having that all that background that you'd

(05:22):
read and seen and talked to people about.

Speaker 4 (05:25):
Yeah, so that first day I came in on this
gorgeous July day and it was like a postcard. I
was pinching myself in the boat from the airport, coming
into the city, and I had to your point, I'd
done a lot of research, and I had watched a
number of things, and I've gone through all these pictures.
So it looks both familiar to you because you've seen

(05:45):
the images, but also surreal in that moment, because I
couldn't believe this was it. And so I really it's funny.
For the first few days, I would look at the
team and I'd say, I feel like we're working at
a postcard. I mean, it's just amazing, struck at just
the raw beauty of it. And I love buildings, and
I love windows and doors. These are things that I just,

(06:07):
you know, I kind of love to focus on when
I travel. And so even just looking at when I
say raw beauty too, I think even just as you're
in a boat going along slowly in the canals, right
as you look at the edge of the buildings and
you see the way that they've been worn by the
water in the wake over hundreds of years, and that
these beautiful buildings are still standing right or maybe some

(06:27):
of them are sort of crumbling or sinking, and you think, oh,
you know, it's just so interesting to see the passage
of time. And I was also struck by just the
history that is there and the way that this city
has endured. I mean, Venice is a city of entrepreneurs
and you know, really smart people who when a challenge arose,
they found a way to work with it and work
around it and more often than not, really profit from

(06:50):
it and turn it around. And so it also struck
me that this is yet another opportunity for this city.

Speaker 2 (06:57):
Yeah. Absolutely, they are really creative and inspiring people and
they always have been. I mean the history going back
onto the lagoon and the islands and building what they built,
I mean, it's just incredible.

Speaker 1 (07:11):
They definitely have that entrepreneurial spirit. How long were you there?
Feel me?

Speaker 4 (07:15):
So we were there. We had two trips, which was
pretty fantastic. So we were there for a little over
a week in July, and we happened to be there
for Redentore, which is just it was magical. It also
happened to be on my birthday, so it was pretty
much the best birthday ever. It was a great way
to turn forty eight with my own firework show. And
we were back for a little over a week in October,

(07:36):
and it was great to see the difference in those moments,
not only in the crowds and the amount of people
in terms of tourism, but just the weather and how
the city looks different in different light, and how it
feels different when it's sort of cold and dreary and rainy,
which added, I think to the magic.

Speaker 1 (07:51):
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (07:51):
I was there in January actually, and it was very cold,
but it was clear and there was no one there,
and it was just delightful to be able to wander,
you know, through some of those the high magic moments
that people go to with their first there. But you know,
I think, like you, I think that you've come to
appreciate it's those smaller off the beaten path, if you

(08:13):
want to use a cliche, places that really do capture
your heart in the end.

Speaker 4 (08:18):
Yeah. Absolutely, you know, those are the places that we
really fell in love with. Some of the neighborhoods that
we were introduced to through, you know, the local Venetians
who we were working with, And when we went back
in October, we would jokingly call certain areas We're like, oh,
we're back in our neighborhood. But it was nice to
be in that area that felt really local. There was
a beautiful our last day of filming in July. We

(08:39):
were over in Castello and we were at a square
and then it was all hot and it's been a
great shoot. But we were ready for lunch and we
looked down this street and I mean back to the postcard.
There were just clothes lines, and on all of the
clotheslines you saw striped shirts from gondoliers. And then there
were kids. It was a Sunday. There were kids sort
of running up and down the street, and there was
a dog. And we went into this little tiny restaurant

(09:02):
that seemed like a neighborhood restaurant and I thought, this
is I mean, this is the magic of Venice, but
this is really the magic of any city, right when
you can get to the place where the locals are.
And it was really it felt like a real gift
for us to be able to be there.

Speaker 2 (09:15):
Yeah, and it's not that difficult to find those places actually,
because obviously.

Speaker 1 (09:19):
Everything's walkable there.

Speaker 2 (09:22):
And you know, I really encourage people to go for
the walk, like get out of Piazza San Marco, as
amazing as it is, but go for the walk. Go
to the gardens. People don't know there's gardens in Venice.
That's a surprising thing to me.

Speaker 4 (09:36):
Yeah, and they're gorgeous. I mean, there are gorgeous gardens,
and there's so many like incredible museums that frankly are
still on my list. Because we were working, we didn't
get to go to them. But I think you're right.
It's not hard to get out of the of the
city center and sort of your Instagram spots. And before
I had gone, someone recommended to me. He said, one
of the best things you can do is wander the streets.
Forget your map because it's not really going to help

(09:58):
you anyway, because there aren't really names for the street,
he said. And you'll wander and you'll find yourself all
of a sudden stuck because you're at a canal. So you
turn around and go the other way. And he said,
I would just recommend you that you stop and you
listen to the traffic. He said, because the traffic is
the sound of your feet, and it's the sound of
the neighborhood. There are no traffic lights, there are no
stop signs, there are no car horns. Maybe if you're

(10:19):
closer right to one of the main canals, you'll hear
the horns and the boats. But I thought that was
really great advice to just go get lost in those
streets and just you know, the speed, he said, is
the flow, the flow of you and your feet and
whoever else is around you, which was really beautiful. Wish
I was there right now, me too.

Speaker 2 (10:40):
I think one of the things that you've noticed as
well is that it's the rhythm of life and people
that are actually living there, and that's what when you
go wandering, that's what you do see. You see the
people doing their things, and it never fails to mesmerize
me what happens when you see, you know, like the ambulances,
the little boat ambulance h the trash boat, the fireboat

(11:03):
going around.

Speaker 4 (11:04):
Yeah, I'm fascinated by the trash. I had actually watched
a really interesting story on the trash pickup before I
went to Venice. It was from a Canadian program, a
Kivaqua program, and it was so interesting the way people,
you know, they'll lower their trash down from the window
and the way it gets picked up, and the beautiful
relationship actually between the you know, the local sanitation crews

(11:25):
and the people in the neighborhood and the older people
that they'll help. And it reminds me I live in
a somewhat small town outside of New York City, and
it was really lovely because it reminded me too of
you know, we know all the sanitation workers on our
street because we see them, you know, a couple of
times a week for recycling and trash, and it just
reminds you of what a neighborhood and what a community
it is there in Venice. And to your point, you know,

(11:46):
there's trash pickup, and there are ambulances, and there's a hospital,
and there are schools. It's a real, living, breathing city.
The challenges maintaining.

Speaker 2 (11:55):
That, yeah, absolutely, And I think it does strike you
as soon as you were what those challenges are, because
is the sheer number of people in very small space.

Speaker 4 (12:07):
Absolutely, and the population of Venice itself has dropped, right,
so it's right around fifty thousand, which is a challenge.
But you think about all these people coming in for
the day, and you know, I would say, pretty much
everyone we spoke to they didn't say get rid of
Taurus altogether. They recognize that Venice. You know, Venice is
now an economy that is highly reliant, if not built
on right, it's survival in many ways. Is tied to tourism.

(12:29):
That being said, it's more about you know, which I
know is a focus for you. It's about sustainable tourism.
You know, how do you deal with all of those people,
for example, on the water taxis when you're trying to
get to work, or you're trying to get your child
to school, you're trying to get home to pick your
kid up, or to make dinner. Right, the question was
how could they better manage the flow of people and
get people also outside of those more touristy areas so

(12:51):
they can see and experience venice, not just the venus
that is, like you'll find in Times Square, right, Times
Square is not New York City, you know, for the
most part, sort of random restaurants and cheap souvenirs that
don't really say in their being New York. And that's
what you would find maybe in San Marco. But if
you move just a little bit off the beaten path,
which then reduces the number of people there. I mean,

(13:14):
the benefit is huge for anybody who's visiting.

Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, absolutely, and it's a much richer experience, and it's
really hard to explain to people, you know, like for
someone who works in tourism, as I do, is to
spread your time out a little bit more because we
all have those more magical experiences. Now, one of the
experiences you had that I've also done, which is absolutely fantastic,
is roy Vennis.

Speaker 4 (13:37):
Yes, it's so fun. I picked it up quicker than
I thought I would, but I loved it. I just
thought it was such a relaxing I keep using the
word magical, but then how it felt. It was such
a relaxing, magical experience to be rowing through the canals
and then just thinking about what a beautiful existence this is.

(13:57):
And why Elena, who's figured in our documentary and who's
part of Rovenice, who is giving me my lesson, I
can understand why for her it's such an escape because
it's just an incredible way to see the city and
to experience the city even more than see it.

Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah. So for people who don't know, it's a group
of women that take people on traditional boats that are
not I think everyone thinks of a gondola, don't they
These are actually traditional boats and they are also a
racing crew, which, after having you know, tried it for
a few minutes, I was like, oh, these people are
pretty impressive they are.

Speaker 4 (14:35):
It is it is a serious athletic feet You're right.
So we were there for the Festival of Red and Taure,
which also has a big regatta, and it was just gorgeous.
So all the boats are different colors out in the
water and everybody is wearing white pants and striped shirts.
And you watch this race. I mean, they are going
so fast to your point in those boats. I was

(14:55):
exhausted watching them, and I was so amazed. You know.
Ellena said she's from a big rowing family in Venice,
and she said, you know, for us rowing, this is
really this is like the Olympics for us. If you're
a competitive Venetian rower, this is you know, this is
as big as it gets.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah, And I think just preserving those traditions is going
to be absolutely critical to saving Venners because those magical
moments we always use work magical on.

Speaker 1 (15:21):
This show because it's hard, not too hard not to.

Speaker 2 (15:26):
Is some of the most you know, the things that
you will actually remember the most. You're probably not going
to remember so much the details of the painting in
the Dog's Palace, but you will remember that feeling when
you see those boats zipping past you and knowing just
how hard it is to row and keep them going
in a straight line.

Speaker 4 (15:44):
Absolutely, it does give you a real appreciation for how
difficult that is. And to your point, it's not the
gondola that you may think of, although it looks similar,
but I think it also gives you an appreciation for
the gondoliers. Right. It's wild to watch the boats navigate
one another, especially in the narrowest canals early in the morning.
If you happen to be in some of the back
canals behind the hotels, maybe you'll see the garbage barge,

(16:05):
but you'll also see all of the deliveries, you know,
packed with sort of ups packages if you will, And
so to see the way they all navigate one another,
with the gondolas, with everybody else, it's impressive.

Speaker 1 (16:17):
It really is.

Speaker 2 (16:17):
We had a guide last year, I think, and she
was telling us that when she was pregnant the year
before and she went into labor. I was in awe
of her because you know, their houses don't have elevators.
You know, she had to go get the boat ambulance
to get to the hospital. Oh wow, I'm not going
to complain anymore about my birth experience.

Speaker 4 (16:39):
No, I don't think I would either. I was worried
about going into labor on the subway when I was
living in New York City, but not worried about navigating
the canals. So you're right.

Speaker 2 (16:50):
Anyway, amazing, Like they are just fantastic, And I think
what I enjoyed most about the film really were the
stories of the people in the residents and what they're
trying to do to make a friends because everything starts
with one individual, one group of people doing something, and
you know, momentum will build.

Speaker 1 (17:07):
And I loved these stories.

Speaker 4 (17:08):
Actually, I'm so happy to hear you say that, because
I have to say, each one of them holds a
really special place in my heart. Now, I'm always so
appreciative when someone shares their story with me as a
journalists with our team, that they trust us with their story,
that they open up to us, they bring us inside
their world, and each of the stories is their thought

(17:28):
provoking right, because each one of them is looking at
this issue from a different angle. So for example, Cesra
Bonelli who owns a restaurant called Alcovo that he and
his wife Diana, who's actually a Texan and I'm told
speaks perfect not only Italian, but Venetian as well. They've
owned their restaurant Alcovo for I want to say, maybe
thirty eight years, maybe more. He's part of this collective
of twelve or thirteen bars and restaurants in Venice that

(17:51):
they started Ostionorto, the host in the garden on this
island in the lagoon that's part of Venice, Cenerasmo, that
was traditionally a you know, where a lot of gardens
in farms. War they decided they wanted to have more
local produce and so they banded together, right, so they're
bringing in less from the mainland, not because they have
an issue with mainland produce, but they wanted it to

(18:11):
be it, as he put it, at zero mileage, and
they wanted to employ more people who live in the lagoon,
and they wanted to keep some of the business as
local as they could to support the local businesses, which
I thought was a really beautiful idea on their part,
and it's working really well.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
Amazing, and my goodness, I'm sure you did eat at
El kho O, but it's one of my favorite.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
We sure did.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
It was fantastic, just so delicious, and they're so kind
and generous they're and ah loveing us so much.

Speaker 4 (18:40):
Katie, what time should I meet you? Ah?

Speaker 1 (18:43):
Yeah, well you know, I'm heading over in a few
weeks actually.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
So the other one, other aspect of it, and I
loved how you showcase the artisans is particularly the glass blowing,
because I think somehow that's become you know, you get
a lot of the travel shows that show I guess,
like you could say the Instagram reels highlights of Venus,
and you know, all the glamour and the gleats and everything.

(19:08):
But I really love seeing these artisans. And the thing
about artisans that I love the most is why is
it they are always leading the way, like they're always
in the front line of you know, change.

Speaker 4 (19:19):
You're right, I mean maybe it's that. I don't know
if it's that creative spirit, but it's such a great point.
So when it comes to Morano glass so also featured
in the documentary Matteo's SILVERI who co founded rehub So
I didn't realize until I first met him that I
believe it's half of all the glass that's made, or
half of what is used, if you will, ends up

(19:39):
on the floor and it's waste and you can't reuse
that glass waste because of the way that it's been colored. Right,
so the minerals and the chemicals that are in those
colorants for the glass, I mean you can no longer
melt it down and reuse it. And so he said,
this is a huge problem. How can we have half
of this being waste? And so Mateo figured out a
way to take that glass waste melted at a lower

(20:01):
temperature so the environmental impact is actually less, turn it
into a pace that then you can use in a
three D printer. So he is looking at the problem
of we've got all this waste. We want to continue
this beautiful tradition of Morano glass. He and his wife
want to continue to live in Venice, they want to
raise their family there. So how can we make all

(20:22):
these things work? And so he figured this out and
now he's got this company, he's partnering with huge names,
and he's just posted again about a project that he's
doing with Loreal, which we saw some of that in
process when we were there. And he's figuring out a
way not only to be more sustainable for this beautiful
art form that is known around the world and has
been known for hundreds of years. He's figuring out how

(20:45):
to bring it into the next century in a smart
way and in a way too that could either bring
more jobs in or keep more jobs locally. And that's
the focus for a lot of people that we spoke with,
is making sure that there are other opportunities, not the
tourism is bad, right, but that there are other opportunities
outside of the tourism sector for people who want to

(21:05):
continue to live in Venice, who want to continue to
be Venetians. And maybe that's not what they you know,
not what they studied and not what their passion is
in a way that they can sustain their own life
and their own community.

Speaker 2 (21:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (21:19):
I think people sometimes conflate environmental sustainability and they don't
realize that it can also be economic sustainability as well,
so that the things aren't mutually exclusive.

Speaker 1 (21:29):
You can have both.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah, you know, that's kind of where the magic happens,
and it's a win win for everyone.

Speaker 4 (21:35):
You're right, it's often mutually beneficial. I think it's such
a great point.

Speaker 2 (21:38):
So like a lot of the times when I go
to Venice, you know, I've been a little bit sad
because people have seemed a little bit fatalistic, like there
is nothing that they can do to save their city.
But really loved the film because you managed to find
these people which were so positive about their future and
what they can do. And I think they're very yeah,

(22:01):
but also they have ideas and they're not afraid to try.
And I think one of my favorite people was Fabio
Carrera and it made me so happy to hear him talking.

Speaker 1 (22:10):
About his very practical ideas for the city.

Speaker 4 (22:13):
And he is I mean, he gets it right. So
Fabio had such a fascinating story. So, as I told you,
when I initially started doing the research for this project,
Fabia was one of the first people I spoke with
and we ended up on a zoom for an hour
and a half. And you know what drew me to
him in the first place was thirty years ago he
started the Venice Project Center. So he also works at
Worcester Polytechnic Institute in Massachusetts and Worcester, mass so he

(22:33):
splits his time between Worcester and Venice, and he also
has a project in Santa Fe. And so with the
Venice Project Center, what he's done over the last thirty
years or so, right is he has groups of students
that come over and they study various aspects of what's
happening in Venice. So there is pretty much there's nothing
that he hasn't studied or his students haven't studied. So
that's everything from you know, the impact of the speed

(22:55):
of boats and the wake on buildings, the number of boats,
the housing crisis in Venice, which a number of other
cities can relate to jobs. I mean, you look at everything,
and he studied so much of it, and he has
great ideas. He's actually brought in this phenomenal program which
unfortunately we didn't have time to get to in the documentary,
but called design X at MIT that they're partnering with

(23:16):
and that's actually how I found Mateo and Rehub where
they're you know, reworking this glass from Morano and it's
a it's a small business incubator that he is helping
with that project. Now they've brought that project into Venice
into his center, and his focus is finding ways to
bring the jobs into Venice so that people have a
reason to stay and to invest in Venice because there's

(23:40):
plenty of knowledge and know how and creativity and brilliant
people there, but they need the jobs. Sort of in
the lagoon to give them a reason to stay. And
so that's really his focus, and it is it is
the jobs that is his focus, and I think he
has some brilliant ideas.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
Oh, it was absolutely blown away.

Speaker 2 (23:59):
And it's interesting because I'd studied Renaissance history when I
was at high school and when I was actually pregnant,
I had twins, and I was very much late out and.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
I could and go very far.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
But Arista, at my local cafe, he would always bring
me a coffee and he was telling me that he'd
stayed in Venice as a student. He was a fine
arts student, and he'd stayed there for I think it
was maybe three months, helping to restore some churches.

Speaker 1 (24:25):
But I mean, these opportunities are.

Speaker 2 (24:27):
Out there for not just Venetians as well, but for
other people around the world to learn from these people
because they have, you know, such amazing talents and skills
that they've honed over generations and we can't lose them.
Like I think there's a goldsmith there that's I think
it's the last.

Speaker 4 (24:45):
Generation and the last gold better. Did you meet him?
Though no, I didn't, So it's funny. We actually we
spoke to them and there had been a number of
stories done about them, but he's the last school beater
in Venice, and there really wasn't anybody to take over
that business. And it led to an interesting conversation, you know,
off camera with other people, which comes back to in

(25:07):
some ways this article that I read in Wired magazine
almost two years ago now called let Venice Sync, which
was based on this research paper where you know, people
start to think about, Okay, we're spending all this money
trying to you know, sort of save Venice from the
water and everything that's around it and making the case
for other things around the world, and at some point,
do you just have to let it go and let
mother nature take its course. And so I had, you know,

(25:28):
I had an interesting conversation with some of the other
folks in Venice, you know, you get off camera. This
wasn't in the documentary, but just about it's really sad
that that's the last gold beater and that nobody wants
to take that over this beautiful creative process. But then
also with certain things, is there a time and a
place and do you have to sort of maybe maybe
you more in that right, But then it's a natural progression,

(25:49):
and so then which things as you're watching cities evolve,
and if you're watching a city like Venice decide what
it does and does not want to fight for like
who becomes the last gold beater and then who is
propped up right and who stays? And I think that's
the decision that they're facing on a number of levels
right now. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:09):
Right, So I think that's an interesting point because I
think maybe we want to keep things frozen in time,
but there is also a beauty about having things old
cities and places evolve also, So.

Speaker 4 (26:19):
Yeah, and the reality is it's always evolved, right. So,
even we were doing an interview in this home and
as we're setting up, I said, do you know when
the house was built? And it was just I mean,
it's just you know, it was magical. But you're in
this you know, this giant house and there's this beautiful
backyard and you know one of the old wells. So
you know, anybody who's ever been to Venice, or when
you do go for your listeners who haven't been yet,

(26:39):
you'll see these old stone wells all over the place
and they're just is sort of a cool reminder of
times gone by. And the woman who's home we were at, said,
you know, I don't know exactly what year was born,
but it's on the map. There's a very famous map
that was drawn, and I believe it's fifteen oh one.
The name of the map begins the B. It's escaping
me at the moment, but you said the house is
on that map, and I thought, oh, wow, it's been

(27:00):
here since then. And then she said, but you know,
it didn't look like this or it's not what we have.
She said, so, you know, and we were in the
backyard and she pointed up, but there were three or
FoST stories of windows, and she said, so now this
is this apartment and this is that one. And so
I thought to myself, well, even those houses change over time.
The house is still here, but all of these things
are changing. And then she started to point to other
buildings and so that building wasn't here at this time.

(27:21):
That one was added around X state. This one was
added around you know, a couple hundred years later. And
so it reminds you too that even though you want
to preserve the old, a city is constantly changing and evolving,
and that's how that's how it endures.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
Absolutely So, Eric, if you had some pieces of advice
for people that were going to Venice, how do you
think they can enjoy the city not only just see
the highlights, but how would you suggest that people go
about exploring Venice and having some of the experiences that
you had.

Speaker 4 (27:53):
I think, you know, one of the best things you
can do. If you have the time, stay a little longer.
Don't rush your time there, So stay for a night.
It's safe for two nights if you can even three,
because that gives you a time to really get out
there and explore in the neighborhoods, wandering through a neighborhood
away from the more touristy areas. Get your picture on
rialto Bridge if you need it, visit some Marco it's beautiful.

(28:15):
But there are so many other areas, so I would
say get out of the more touristy instagrambable spots if
you will do a little exploring. Taking a row Venice
lesson to learn how to row and traditional venation style
is great. Also, there's a beach in Venice. You can
hop on a water taxi and go to the Belito Beach,
which is gorgeous. And then when you go home and
people say, what did you do in Venice. You could say, oh,

(28:35):
I went to the beach and they'll say, what are
you talking about? You were in Venice, So I think
that's a great thing to do. Also, it's lovely to
take a boat tour if you could do it at night,
and there are a number of all the boat companies
would do that for you. It is extra special to
see the city at night and to see the lights.
It's just really beautiful from the water, so I'd recommend
that as well. Definitely go to the local restaurants and

(28:57):
try some of the neighborhoods that maybe you aren't as familiar.
So Gestello is one, Canaatio is great. There's also if
you can go to a football game, so there's a
soccer team in Venice. You can take the water taxi there.
There is a full stadium in Venice. It's in the
southern part of the city where actually Fabio Carrera grew
up and where he still has a home. I mean,
that's a really cool thing to do in Venice. That

(29:18):
is probably not something that you would have thought of,
and there are so many wonderful items to check out.
I would also love to make a plug for the
beautiful Mikaela Borolozzi who started a really special shop and project.
She's an artisan called Relite Venice, and she loves to
meet people and to talk to you, and sometimes she
does workshops where you can make a candle in her shop.
And she also works with a number of local artisans.

(29:40):
So for example, I believe it's called a freako love,
which is the it's the wooden piece on a boat
that you'll see on like a gondola or if you
take a real Venice lesson where you put the ore. Oh,
and there's a gentleman who makes those and then his
leftover pieces of wood. Mikaela gets those pieces of wood.
She turns them into bases for her candles. Just another

(30:00):
example of how local Venetians are working together to sustain
one another. And it gives you a little a good
story of Venice to bring home in a little something special.
She makes beautiful campbells and jewelry and bookmarks, and she's
just a bright light, one of many in that city.
And so that's another great way to meet a local.
I think if you meet a local, you will never
go wrong.

Speaker 1 (30:20):
Oh. I love that. Next time I go, I'm going
to have to take a big suitcase.

Speaker 2 (30:24):
Last time I went, I went to Venisa, which is
the I don't know if you went to that winery.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
I didn't get to go. I'm a little jealous.

Speaker 2 (30:31):
Again I recommend and I was so excited that I
bought a bottle and it comes in this big wooden
crate thing.

Speaker 1 (30:39):
Oh, I was going on the train. I don't know
what I was thinking. Everyone here on who is a
podcast knows.

Speaker 2 (30:45):
I say travel light and I did not take my
own advice, but I don't regret it.

Speaker 1 (30:49):
And I haven't drunk that wine yet. I'm saving it
for special occasions.

Speaker 4 (30:52):
Oh. One other thing, you know, a sprits and chiquette
is so she get there. You know little basically apps
that you'll have with your with your sprits in the
after trade. Difference for Apparol's Lovely select is Venetian is
a Venetian liqueur that's used in the sprits. You could
also do Chinaar, which is made with artichokes, which is
also from the Finetto region. So just a little way
to branch out if you want with your sprits.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
I'm very impressed, Erek, are you all my spination? This
is fantastic and before we wrap up, I just I
really wanted to know how hopeful are you for the
future of Venters.

Speaker 1 (31:24):
Did it give you some hope?

Speaker 4 (31:26):
I tend to be pretty glass half full. I do
have hope, you know. I think there is a large
community in Venice that cares deeply about its city, and
they don't want this to just become a shell of itself.
They don't want it to be an amusement park. I
think their biggest challenge, probably in many ways, is what
most cities and towns around the world face, and it's
making sure the political will is there, you know, as

(31:47):
they said to me a number of times. So you know,
politics is a fickle business. I mean, we certainly know
that here in the United States, and so sometimes it's
not advantageous for a lawmaker to really get behind a
project if they're not going to be in office when
that project deck comes to fruition. And so that's one
of the biggest hurdles that they faced. But I am hopeful.
I think that, you know, as one of the folks

(32:07):
in our documentary said, we can do this, but we
have to be more than just fifty thousand. We have
to stand together and we all have to use our
voices collectively, and I think there is the will to
do that, and I think as citizens of the world
and as smart tourists, we can also play our parts.
So I'm going to go with yes, Venics can be saved.
But as we say in the documentary, it's the choice

(32:27):
of will we choose to do So I'm choosing yes.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
I'm all in, I'm all into, and I think if
everyone takes the time to watch the film, which is
on CNN Max, and I'll share all the details with
everyone when we wrap up the show. But I think
it's really important one to see and Erica, sometimes it
does take a woman to show this side of the city.

(32:50):
I have to say, because there are a lot of
you know, celebrities going to Venice, cruising around on their
boats and having a fantastic time, and you know that's
great and show showcasing the city. But I have to say,
I really did appreciate the work that you did because
it shows the humanity behind the city and it's so
much more than.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
Just a photo opportunity. So thank you, Erica.

Speaker 2 (33:14):
I thought it was a brilliant piece and I can't
wait for everyone to see it.

Speaker 4 (33:18):
Oh, thank you. I so appreciate the kind words and
those observations. And it was absolutely a team effort. So
we had an incredible team behind us putting this together.
So I will share that with them because I certainly
couldn't do it alone.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
Fantastic. Okay, grat to me, Erica, thank you for joining us.

Speaker 4 (33:34):
Got to me and it Katie. I really appreciate you
taking the time, No problem, and chow for now. All right,
I'll see you in Bennet.

Speaker 1 (33:41):
Okay, great ut listeners.

Speaker 2 (33:46):
I do hope you enjoyed my chat with Erica as
much as I did. I'm always so thrilled to meet
people who have a passion for this city and have
taken the time to go beyond the crowds on the
rialto Bridge in San Marco to discover the history and
magic of a city like no other. There are countless
shows of celebrities enjoying Italy and Venice in the most
fabulous of ways, and good for them. It's not lost

(34:08):
on me that I contribute to the hype around certain
places quite significantly myself. But if you're curious and are
looking to travel in a deep and meaningful way, and
I know that you are, please do have a look
at the film Saving Venice. It's available to stream now
on Max if you're in North America, or it can
also be enjoyed as a showcast wherever you get your podcasts,

(34:29):
if you have time for a longer read and you're
interested in the work local artisans and entrepreneurs are doing
to protect the city of Venice for future generations. Our
friend Valeria Necho, who has appeared on the show several times,
has written a brilliant piece for Italy Sigreta that we'll
also link to in the show notes at Untold Italy
dot com. Forward slash two seven eight for episode two

(34:50):
hundred and seventy eight. Gratzimile, Thank you so much for
tuning in today. If you enjoyed the show, we'd love
it if you could take a moment to leave a
quick rating or review, help help us reach more Italy
loving travelers and share the stories like the one we
shared today about magical Venice.

Speaker 4 (35:06):
That's all for today.

Speaker 2 (35:07):
Next week we're going to be practicing our travel Italian,
but until then, it's chow for now. The Untold Italy
podcast is an independent production podcast editing, audio production and
website development by Mark Hatter, production assistance and content writing
by the Are they kJ Clark, Yes, there are two
of us. For more information about Untold Italy, please visit

(35:31):
untold Italy dot com

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278. Saving Venice - What does the Future Hold for the Lagoon City?

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}278. Saving Venice - What does the Future Hold for the Lagoon City?