August 15, 2025 • 41 mins
Love travel and history? Join us as anthropologist Dr. Monique Skidmore unveils the world of the Etruscans in Tuscany - the original Italians - revealing their unique culture, powerful women, and the incredible sites you can visit to walk in their footsteps today.
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The Untold Italy travel podcast is an independent production. Podcast Editing, Audio Production and Website Development by Mark Hatter. Production Assistance and Content Writing by the other Katie Clarke
Read the full episode show notes here > untolditaly.com/286
NEW! - the Untold Italy app - DOWNLOAD FOR iOS • DOWNLOAD FOR ANDROID
The app is FREE to download and check out our Milan guide and general travel content. Upgrade to PREMIUM for a one time fee to access Rome, Florence, Venice, Sorrento, Cinque Terre, Amalfi Coast, Capri, Ischia, Tuscany, Lake Como, Lake Garda, Veneto, Lombardy, Campania, Lazio, Puglia, Abruzzo, Calabria with much more to come
Support the show
Join our mailing list and get our FREE Italy trip planning checklist - subscribe here | Join us on tour: Trip schedule | Discover our Trip Planning Services | Visit our online store | Follow: Instagram • Substack • Facebook • YouTube • Italy Travel Planning Community • Online travel assistant
The Untold Italy travel podcast is an independent production. Podcast Editing, Audio Production and Website Development by Mark Hatter. Production Assistance and Content Writing by the other Katie Clarke - yes there are two of us!
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- Subscribe to our mailing list and get our FREE Italy trip planning toolkit - subscribe here
- Need help with your trip? Check out our Trip Planning Services
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Editorial Information
The Untold Italy travel podcast is an independent production. Podcast Editing, Audio Production and Website Development by Mark Hatter. Production Assistance and Content Writing by the other Katie Clarke
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Long before the Romans ruled, a mysterious civilization shaped the
hills of Tuscany and left behind clues in tombs, towns,
and traditions. Join us as anthropologist doctor Venigskidmore takes us
deep into the world of the Etruscans, revealing what their
ancient sites still whisper to those who know how to listen.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Tawatuti and Benvenuti Tuan Told Italy. The travel podcast to
where you go to the towns and villages, mountains and lakes,
hills and coastlines of Bela, Italia. Each week, your host
Katie Clark takes you on a journey in a search
of magical landscapes, history, culture, wine, gelato, and of course,
(00:46):
a whole lot of pasta. If you're dreaming of Italy
and planning future adventures there, you've come to the right place.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Dreaming of arriving in Italy, strolling into a gelatia and
ordering your gelato with confidence. If you've been learning Italian
with language apps but still can't string a sentence together,
it might be time to try another approach. My friend
Michelle from Intrepid Italian offers a practical way to learn
travel Ready Italian.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
Thanks to her.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Unique eighty twenty method, Michelle teaches you exactly what you
need to know to connect with locals and have more
authentic travel experiences. There's no getting bogged down in awkward
phrases and unnecessary grammar. As an adult learner herself with
Italian heritage, Michelle really knows how to bridge the gap
between English and Italian. As Roma from London said, the
(01:46):
learning methodology is great. I progressed much faster in the
last four weeks than I ever did on my own
or using other language apps. To find out more and
claim your free Italian travel phrase guide, visit untold Italy
dot com, home, forward slash Italian or visit the link
in the show notes. As a bonus, you'll also get
an exclusive twenty dollars coupon code to use on any
(02:08):
of Michelle's online self paced courses. So visit untold Italy
dot com, Forward slash Italian and accelerate your Italian language.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Your journey today. Jiao by Joanno.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Everyone, welcome back to the show and thank you for
joining us on another Italian adventure. Before we dive in,
though I wanted to do a big shout out to
one of our listeners who left us such a lovely
review and I just made me smile, so I wanted
to share it with everyone. And this is from me
and her travel in the United States, and they said,
unimaginably helpful. My husband and I are accomplished travelers. We've
(02:43):
been to a lot of places, having checked the box
on many of the iconic sites in Italy. We crave
learning about adventures and experiences off the beaten path that
we didn't know about. And that's what makes this podcast
so special. Consistently informative, inspiring and fun to We have
heard almost all of them and some twice. It's a
(03:03):
great way to educate yourself on all things Italy, from
cultural dos and don'ts, to logistical on the ground advice
and hundreds of hidden gems to help you create the
itinery and trip of your dreams.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Thank you Katie, Thank you me and her travel. That
just made me smile so much.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
And it's really means the world to me and the
entire team because we're now into our fifth year of
the podcast and it remains a joy to make. And
it's because of feedback like these from listeners like you,
So Grauzi milit Thank you for taking the time to
show your support, as it keeps us motivated and excited
to bring you more episodes and reached all of the
(03:42):
Italy loving travelers out there. Now, what dreams have you
been having about Italy lately? Over the weekend, I was
craving some cutu a pep bear, and luckily for me,
there is an excellent one to be had just a
short walk from my house.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
So that's questionniche.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
But I've also geeking out on history quite a lot lately,
which is one of the main reasons that I love
to travel, because I like to explore and see in
real life the places that I've been reading or hearing about. Now,
one era of Italian history that I don't know much
about is the Etruscan civilization.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
And I've been trying to learn more.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
It's a lot harder to access information about the Etruscans.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
I guess it doesn't get the hype of.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Ancient Rome, and also they didn't leave behind incredible monuments
like the Colosseum, and also their literature has all but
disappeared over the centuries.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
But this civilization left.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Its mark on the Italian peninsula, especially Central Italy. So
I've been curious to learn more. The Etruscans especially appeal
to me because women in their society held visible public
roles and enjoyed more freedoms than their Greek or early
Roman counterparts. They dined with men, were depicted by name
in inscriptions, and even appeared prominently in art. Recently, I
(04:54):
caught up with my friend doctor Menique Skidmore, and she
suggested that we have a chat about the Etruscan sites
in t Monique is an expert on anthropology who shares
my love of travel, and I can't wait to hear
the places to visit.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
So andiamo, let's jump.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
In, ben Benita Monique, Welcome on to the Untild Italy podcast.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
Thanks for having me, Katie Monique.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
I'm so thrilled to have you join me today.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
I've mentioned to our listeners quite a few times now
how I've become interested in the Etruscan civilization, So when
you suggested this podcast topic, I was so thrilled. But
you know, before we get started, can you introduce yourself
to our listeners and share why you love traveling in Italy?
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Okay, well, my name's Monique Skinner. I'm an anthropologist, I'm
the owner of a small boutique Mediterranean tour company that
focuses on archaeology and history tours, so we operate mainly
in Cyprus, Malta and Greece at the moment. I've been
an anthropologist for many many years, conducted lots of film work,
(05:57):
and I just wanted to be able to stop telling
writing and starts showing. So it's really about allowing people
to come through the world that I inhabit with us,
with our guides, with our archaeological experts, in a play
that's kind of modern and it's not like those old
tour companies that are full of lectures and Western experts.
(06:19):
It's more about being in these countries and meeting the
people who live beside the monuments that their ancestors created.
So that's kind of why I do now what I
do amazing.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Yeah, it's so exciting to know what you're doing, and
not that you're doing anything in Italy just yet, but
I thought it was worthwhile sharing your knowledge about this
area because it's so interesting and Italy is just such
a lot of guides call it Lasagna layers of history,
and unfortunately we kind of tend to stop at ancient Rome.
(06:53):
We get from medieval Renaissance, then we go down to
the ancient Romans, and then we kind of stop at
ancient Rome and that most people are familiar with. But
today let's have a little bit of a learn about
those that came before them.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Tell us about the Etruscans.
Speaker 4 (07:07):
Well, it's true that the Romans were really good at
pr so we do tend to think about the Romans
and you go to Rome for the first time, you think,
oh my god, look what they created. And what we
don't realize and we're only just starting to realize, is
how much of that is actually stuff they just nicked
from the Etruscans nicked is stolen. Yeah, we could say plagiarize.
(07:29):
Maybe there were lots of ideas about Etruscans being a
mysterious culture. Where did they come from? And that just
means that we didn't have digital archeology, we didn't have
DNA testing, We just didn't really know enough. And because
so much of their culture was lost when their culture
was absorbed by the Romans. So now we know that
they were always indigenous to that area since at least
(07:51):
the Early Bronze Age, the Late Bronze Age, They came
from a Proto Villanova and then a Villanovan culture and
then the Etruscans, so they didn't come from the Aga
or Turkey or anywhere else. They were just there. They
were there around the ninth century BCE until eventually the
Romans vanquished them by about three hundred BCE. And during
this period of time they inhabited the area from the
(08:13):
Tigris River to the Anna River, and they were mainly
in the south and west of what is now Tuscany,
but they were over much of it and they created
a society that was based on mining. They are really
good at mining. They became the scourge of the western
Mediterranean as pirates. They were very good at training, and
(08:36):
because there was also a lot of pine forests, they
became good at shipbuilding as well. They were people who
were agriculturists. They introduced the Romans to how to grow
grapes and how to grow olives, and can you imagine
in Italy without olive oil or wine. So they were
really important agriculturists. And because they had mines and they
had farms, they needed roads, so they gave us paved roads.
(08:58):
Something I always thought the Romans had given, they created
this interesting society based on little city states. They didn't
like to get together very much. Once a year they
get together politically, and they created these sunken roads called
the via cava, which were between different settlements. Their society
was urban city states, class based. They were governed by
(09:23):
noble elites because they had a lot of money, so
from mining in our culture, they were able to create
a noble society. Eventually these nobles became part of the
Roman nobles, but in the meantime they had nobles men
and women. They had then free slaves. They were sort
of a working class that did all the productive stuff.
(09:44):
They worked on mines and estates and the slaves, and
then we had the slaves themselves. So we had a
class based society based on little city states all over Tuscany,
and they had a priestly class, and religion was really important.
The role of women was really different compared to the
Romans or the Greeks before them.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
What I'm hearing, Monique, is that you're saying that they
are the original Italians, the og Italians if you want,
if you want to talk like my children. So everything
that has come after has kind of evolved from these
people that lived in this area.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
Yeah, the Romans at the time were a bunch of
Italic tribes living south of what was then Rome. Rome
wasn't founded, so these guys were there earlier, and they
had evolved all kinds of important architecture and agriculture and
hydraulic engineering. They developed the arch There wasn't much they
didn't do. They were really quite important to what then
(10:44):
became Rome, and their societies were so based around religion.
They believed in lots of gods like most people did
at the time, but it was called immanent, so not
imminent but imminent polytheism, which just meant that God was
in everything, the divine was in everything. You know that
the grass over there. And I think Etruscan kids probably
didn't grow up saying why is the sky blue? Why
(11:06):
is the grass green? Why? You know why? This was
because I think the answer, if you're an a Truscan
parent would always have been well because the gods made
it that way, So there just wasn't a lot of
stuff you needed to ask, I think as a kid,
so they probably had much easier parenting than we do.
They needed a priestly class because if the gods are
in everything, you're always interacting with the gods. So they
had this series of ancient texts called the Etrusca Discipline,
(11:30):
which have been lost now, but they pretty much told
you exactly what to do. So, you know, how should
we harves now? Should we harve us next week? You know,
it's been a warm winter. And they had two kinds
of priests, harris BECs who were really good at ripping
open dead animals and reading people, reading their livers, and Auguri's,
who are much nicer. They would hang out at the
top of heights and look at the birds and stuff
(11:52):
in the sky like lightning. So these are the two
kinds of priestly class that would tell the Etruscans how
to go about what they needed to get done to
be really important military invaders, pirates, and agriculturists. So that
meant that because they were wealthy now, they thought they
were to be wealthy in the afterlife. And it's hard
(12:13):
to think of a culture, maybe the Greeks, but to
think of a culture that had more important beliefs about
ritual and the afterlife. So when we open tombs, Etruscan tombs,
which is how we know nearly anything about Etruscans. We
find these incredible frescoes, freezers in bright colors, and everyone
is just partying. It is a non stop party in
(12:35):
Etruscan tomb. There's dancers, games, men and women, dancing, cavorting, eating,
it's just party time. And these tombs are made of
a soft volcanic material, so they're carved like a really
important house. There are columns, windows, doorways, furniture, and if
you think about going off to the wilderness for a month,
(12:56):
you think of everything you needed to take right because
you can't just get to a store. And the Etruscans
kind of believe the afterlife was like that. They really
had to just take everything they needed because they were
going to be there for a very long time and
apparently there aren't a lot of shops in the afterlife.
So that's why we find furniture and food and mirrors
and anything you can imagine inside Etruscan tombs. And that's
(13:18):
why we know about the Etruscans, because we've found their
tombs and we know what they thought about in the afterlife,
and that told us so much about how they actually
live their real lives and what their houses were like.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Yeah, amazing because there's not a lot of literatureies there
because for a variety of reasons, it's all been destroyed
over time.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
One of the few things we've got is a piece
of cloth that made it to Egypt. Then, because the
Egyptians are really into mummification, they cut it up into strips,
wrapped it around mummies, and then a Yugoslavian traveler took
it to Yugoslavia. And that's the only reason that we
have those Etruscan writings. We don't have a lot left.
We have some stone stelle, some pillars of stone that
(13:59):
have stuff on it. Most of the stuff we have
is a bit of graffiti and just stuff on funerary
saying you know, this person died. Then it's not really
enlightening stuff. Most of what we get from them we
get from the Egyptians and the Greeks and the Phoenicians
telling us about what the Etruscans did and said.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Time for a quick break shorter than your morning espresso.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Wow. So secondhand, that's always problematic.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Though, and especially if they didn't like them very much.
But they also left a lot of jewelry, didn't they
They liked their bling.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
In part that's because of the status of women too.
So that was two reasons. One was because they had
a whole class of people who had time on their
hands to use different materials, and they've got some beautiful bronzes,
particularly if you look at the Chimera of Arezzo or
some of the statues that you can find in the
Etruscan Museum in Volterra, you can find beautiful statuary bronze.
(15:01):
But it's also because women were important in the sense
that later in Roman times they weren't, and in ancient
Greek times they weren't. But for some reason, there's this
little blip in Mediterranean history where women had their own names,
they were named as well as men, they were depicted
in public life, they could go to banquets with men,
(15:21):
and they could own property and pass property on. And
that's really odd for women at that time.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
It's pretty odd for women in history, really unfortunately, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
That's so let's all hail the Etruscans. What else did
women do? It sounds like they're very important in that society.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
They were respected, they were landowners, they were matriarchs. There
were women like Tanakil, Plowtia, Erga, Nila. These were women
who were known as important women in that society, and
it's hard to find other women and societies at the
time that you could say were important like that, and
we even have There's this tiny, tiny piece of boucro
(15:59):
which is in indigenous Etruscan pottery from the northeast of Tuscany.
It's called a birth stamp. It shows it's just a fragment,
and it shows a woman with her legs open and
a baby emerging with a head and shoulders. And the
only reason I remembered this particular view of women because
you don't see a lot of those kinds of images
in the Mediterranean at the time. It's really unusual. What
(16:19):
I liked about it was that early Archaelis thought that
she was reclining on a chair with her hand behind
her back, but I reckon it must have been a
female archaeologist. Rater came along and said, look, she's actually
gripping that tree. There's a thought, and I reckon that's
probably a more accurate reading of this tiny, tiny bit
of fragment. But it does show you that images of
(16:41):
women weren't just all about oh, fertility and the nature goddess.
They were doing all sorts of stuff and being depicted
and being allowed to have names and be represented as
powerful and is not hidden away.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
Yeah, because you do get some Roman women named later on.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Like I was just listening to a podcast about, for example,
on the Ancients podcast last night.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
But she was like the Empress, she was like the ultimate.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
So what you're saying is like women were way more
integrated into society at various different levels that they were
known and respected and included.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Yeah, they couldn't do things like you know, the men.
They still had their judiciary sewn up politics, but women
could circulate in the daily lives. You think about a
town like Volterra hilltown like Volterra and Etruscan town, women
were able to move around it, meet with men, go
to banquets. When they died, their names would be written
beside the men on the tombstones and there would be
(17:39):
statues of both of them. And there were things that
were made for women that were perhaps possibly more interest
in making things for women, more crafts for women than
in periods in which most women were just at home.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
So interesting, isn't it.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
I wonder why that is the case something obviously, you know,
I think everyone would love to know the reason is
why they evolved that way when the other civilizations weren't.
Speaker 4 (18:05):
It's hard to understand. We just don't have enough material
that survived the Etruscan period. And because we don't see that,
we see lots of aspects of Truscan society today in Tuscany,
but the role of women was not accepted by the Romans,
and so it wasn't brought forward into the Roman society.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
They might have destroyed it, who knows. Anyway, let's not
go there. So, Benig, that you've mentioned a couple of
places that you can go to experience and look further
into the Etruscan civilization, and they're mainly in Tuscany, where
the civilization evolved. So tell us more like, let's maybe
start with Volterra, maybe because that's a lovely It's a
(18:46):
beautiful hilltop town, isn't it, And a lot of people
go there, you know, just because it's gorgeous and it's
got a beautiful piazza, lovely cobblestone streets, and it's got
a beautiful view over the Tuscan countryside. But obviously there's
a lot more going on there than first meet Ci.
Speaker 4 (19:03):
There is, and when you see Voltara now it does
look like a medieval center, but its an ancient name
was Vlathri, and it was an Etruscan town that was
surrounded by Hugerus Truscan walls that were over seven kilometers long,
and when you enter today you can go through the
monumental the Porta Alaco, which is a third century to
(19:24):
second century BCE gate through the Voltaan walls that the
Etruscans created. It was set up high for defensiveness because
by this time they were understanding that the Romans down
south were becoming a bit of a problem, and we
saw over from the fifth century BC, from the founding
of Rome through to the third century a series of
(19:47):
wars in which slowly they got picked off because the
Etruscans didn't get together and defend stuff, they just each
little city fell. And so Volterra wanted to be up high,
and that was one of the reasons it wanted to
be up high. But the other reason it wanted to
be up high was because light, particularly in the south,
which we can talk about in a minute, it's a
really good spot to see birds. So if you're off
(20:09):
really high, then you've got Augury's So these priestly class
can set up temples in which you can look for
birds and lightning and rainbows and whatever else. So it
was important for the priestly class, and it was important
for defense that it was so high. The acropolis's temple
foundations and all of the ancient water cisterns you can
still see now as a tourist if you go to
(20:31):
Volterra and around the city and outside the city there
are necropoliss like Portoni Marmini, and then in Truscan. In
in Voltaire itself is the Guanaci Museum, and that's the
best collection of Etruscan funery architecture. Really. It's got the
Shadow of the Evening, which is a masterpiece of bronze,
(20:51):
and it's got the sculpted earn of the Spouses, in
which you can see our husband and wife depicted together
as equals, you know, in beautiful. They're well wrought their
artistic images. Also, they really like funery urns. I don't
really understand the thing about funery earns, but gosh, they
like them. Voltaian started doing them not just in terracotta,
(21:14):
but in alabaster, and even today as you walk around
Volterra you will see that alabaster carving that they learned
from the Etruscans.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
That's amazing that it goes back that for all. I mean,
it makes sense really that it goes back that far.
And I'm beautiful for those people that don't know what
alabastera is. It's a beautiful white. It's quite a soft stone,
isn't it. And it's quite easy to carve it. It's
not as hard as marble. And if you want to
get up a few souvenirs, I've got these cute little
(21:43):
bottle stoppers.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
I mean, it's a beautiful place to visit.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Voltaire and like I didn't even know I had an
inkling about this Etruscan heritage, but not so much keep
going money.
Speaker 4 (21:54):
Well, I think it's one of my favorite hilltowns because
it does have a beautiful medieval core. They are a
fantastic There are always classic car rallies in the central
square and that's a fantastic museum. And it's only just
ever so slightly off the beaten track, but it's a
nut off the beaten track that it's not like a
San Jymnano kind of experience.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
One you have to get in the car for about
I think it's about an hour and a half from
Florence to get to Voltaira. So yeah, you do get
people that have a bit of more persistence going there.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Let's just say that's right.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
If you've looked at Voltaira, the next place I'd look
is down south. So it's another bit that's a bit
off the beaten track because you have to drive a
couple of hours down into Grossetta. So you're in an
area which has got soft volcanic cliffs, and the volcanic
stuff is called Tufa. So these are the cities of
(22:47):
the Tufa. You've probably talked about them on your podcast.
This is the best place really to have a look
at how the Etruscans lived. So there are the towns
of Savannah and Pittigliana, and this system of roads a
Truscan roads called the Viakava. Together are probably the best
places to see in Tuscany Etruscan landscapes. Really. Near Serrano
(23:10):
and Particulariano, you've got this this town called Savannah, which
has an archaeological park called the Sita del Tufo, and
it's got sacred and domestic architecture all in one and
all in this beautiful parklike atmosphere that you can hike around.
So Particulariano is connected to Savannah by a twenty kilometer
(23:34):
long system of via cava. These are sunken roads down
to about two meters that the Etruscan's built between places there.
Walls are six meters high at the lowest, but they're
well over twenty meters high. They're very narrow. Sometimes you
can only get a cart through, and sometimes you get
a lot of people. And if you still listen to
things like the Visit Tuscany website or whatever, it'll say like, oh,
(23:57):
these mysterious things. They could have been used for trade,
they could have view MIDFID defenses, they could have been
for ritual purposes, and which really means they don't know.
But if you look at these beautiful carved mysteriously looking
and they do look mysterious because they covered in moss
and ferns now, and they've got drainage ditches because they
are really big on hydrology, and there are ritual carvings, markings,
(24:18):
and there are little niches for icons. So it was
clearly a ritual space. And really, in the ancient world,
who was going to spend that amount of people hours
building something like that if it doesn't have something related
to the gods at the end of it. So my
view is that the via carve are a liminal space
between the land of the living and the land of
(24:39):
the dead, and it connected the two. So we can
walk from particularly Ono, that amazing hill type town where
the augers were sitting up there looking at the eagles
soaring over the valleys, and then walk through these beautiful
carved roads to the necropolises, to the cities of the
tombs where they bury their dead.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Yeah, amazing.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
I was going to ask you why, you know, why
were they sunken though?
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Do you think?
Speaker 4 (25:04):
I just think it was because it made them taller.
It's true that it made them a much more towering
effect because it was so easy to dig it out right,
because it's quite soft.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
Oh, that's so interesting. Everyone.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Monique's got a lot of expertise in other civilizations, so
I'm very tempted to ask her whether she's seen this
in other parts of the world.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
It's important in all ritual spaces that you create a
liminal space. So it's important that if you have even
if you have, say a menstrual hut in a jungle,
you still have to create a pathway. There's always a
sacred space in which you shed your current personhood and
to become someone new. So going through a long, dark,
(25:53):
narrow pathway gives you time, and you go past different
ritual symbols. You might have had images of gods in
those little niches. So by the time you've arrived at
the other end, you're ready. You're ready for the purification
rights that would have occurred outside these monumental tombs. That
kind of creation of eliminal space happens through music, through landscape,
(26:18):
and in this case it was largely through landscape and
through carvings, because we don't know how many of those
carvings and paintings may have been lost over the years.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
And so then now today when we have churches, when
you're walking down the aisle, then that's the same kind
of concept, when you're going past all the paintings.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
And that's right and same. It's temple architecture, isn't it
to move into any religious space? And I suppose Byzantine
churches are the best example of that because they're all
the same. You walk down the long pathway to get
to the important stuff at the back, and the Etruscans
actually built their temples different to the Greeks because they
(26:56):
in fact want to have a big, fancy opening and
a much more raised daist down the end. We're in
a Greek temple, the whole thing looks the same or it.
So the Etruscans were really into making an entrance. I
think you could say.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Back in a flash, right after these messages I've seen,
Like I mentioned, I'm a little bit obsessed with their jewelry.
When I was in London earlier this year, I went
and stopped at the VNA and they I don't know
where they got this Etruscan stuff from. I don't want
to cast any expersons on the British. Sorry British. I
(27:32):
am actually a British citizen, so I can feel like
I can't say this, but they did have a very
nice collection of the e Truscan jewelry, and if you're
over in London you can go and see that. But
back to our sides in southern Tuscany, what else can
we see around Pittiano and was it Saratana Serrano?
Speaker 4 (27:53):
And Savannah is where we want to go. So Savannah
is where we've got this archaeological park and if you
pull up there, it's just a very large car park.
And then you walk to this enormous archaeological site which
is a bunch of mega tombs and they're monumental. There's
the ildebranded Tomb. The Elderbrander Tomb is a remarkable example
(28:17):
of having a temple like fasad at the front of it.
There are amazing necropolises that you walk past them through
the park. You go past the stone carving's altars and
just there is where the Via Karvis starts, so you
can then walk the pathway. It's a long way to Particuliano,
but petic Gleano is such an incredible hilltown. It's well
worth the effort. It just don't do it in thirty
(28:39):
eight degree days in the middle of summer.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
It sounds like you've done that. So Monique is the site?
Speaker 1 (28:46):
I think I know already know the answer to this,
but it's a site well marked? Or is it a
little bit problematic, like would you know what you're looking
at and can you get an idea?
Speaker 3 (28:54):
Or is it really advisable to go with the guide?
Speaker 4 (28:58):
If you didn't know much about the etruscan, you wouldn't
know much and I had a hard time trying to
read their few little boards. You know, there hasn't been
good signage really in Italy since the Romans. I don't
think I have.
Speaker 3 (29:10):
To agree with that. Why why are they doing it?
Speaker 4 (29:14):
I think with a lot of these sites. It's fantastic
that Italy keeps its heritage. I love that it keeps
it and it allows it to exist, but it doesn't
really help you much with understanding what's there.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
I think they do in their Italian children get a
very very strong education in history and art history, and
so they do genuinely know a lot about it, but
it's not presenting it to the world. And you know,
there are two sites that if you really want an
excellent experience with understanding the culture and archaeology at how
(29:46):
it actually can come to life, is the Domus area
in Rome and also the Bars of carrac Color, where
they have done an actually excellent job with virtual reality
headsets where you can actually walk through the space. But yeah,
it sounds like it might need to do a little
bit of work with these Etruscan sites.
Speaker 4 (30:05):
They do, and I think part of the problem is
that we don't know Archaeltists haven't known much about these sites.
It's really it was only a month or two ago
that the first unlooted tomb Etruscan tombor has ever been found,
and so almost everything that we know comes from looted tombs.
So the Truscans, there just hasn't been much information about them,
(30:27):
and because they're not the Romans, there's not that much
excitement to explain the Etruscans. And it's a growing field
and hopefully these kind of southern towns will become much
more interesting to people when they realize just how incredible
the landscape is and what's in it.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
So are their ongoing archaeological digs there.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
There are digs all over Tuscany. At the moment, there's
only been six hundred tombs found, but more a found
every year, and DNA analysis is really the thing that's
changing what we know about the Etruscans because most of
what we knew wasn't true.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
That's what historians do, though, they need to make assumptions
based on the evidence that's put.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Forward, and then you know, I think a lot of
things are changing.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
I heard this really interesting podcast about Stone Hinge where
they completely changed where they think the stones have come from.
They thought they were coming from Wales, but they now
they think they're coming from Scotland. It's incredible the technology
that we have today that can sort of illuminate what
happened in the past.
Speaker 4 (31:27):
And how people created the things they created. So quite
often we had, you know, alien theories or theories of
people who came across the water because we just couldn't
understand how they constructed that stuff back there.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
Yeah, it's so fascinating.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I could talk about this all day. So, Monique, you
spent a lot of time in these places, and it's
obviously the thing that lights you up. But what about
these ancient places. Has it changed the way that you
travel at all? Or did it inspire the way.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
That you travel? How do these two passions of yours interlink?
Speaker 4 (31:58):
Well, I guess being an anthropologist, I'm just as interested in
the lives of the dead as i am in the
lives of the living. So I'm really interested in seeing
the ways that things that occurred in the past can
be seen in the present. And in Tuscany, the past
is very much alive. But also learning what has come
from the Etruscans has really changed my view of Roman society.
(32:19):
So I didn't realize that the Romans were given the
alphabet and numerals by the Etruscans. I didn't know that
the toga came from Etruscans. I didn't know the word
person was a word that came from the Etruscans. I
didn't know that they gave us paid roads, that they
developed the arch lots of ways in which I thought
(32:39):
the Romans were, but possibly a greater innovative society than
they were, So that changed how I thought about the Romans.
Traveling is interesting though, because there are lots of ways
now that you can still see Etruscan culture alive in Tuscany,
and so I love following that around so I can
keep seeing those parts of Etruscan society today in Tuscany.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
Yeah, it's very good. We haven't actually touched on.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
I know, over in the east of Tuscany, in near
Aretzo and Cortona, there's also Etruscan sites there isn't there.
Speaker 4 (33:11):
Absolutely and up in the northeast as well, and you've
got you know, you've got a lot of Etruscan stuff
in the Aretzo Archaeological Museum, which is above that lovely Amphitheater.
So it's not confined just to the south. It's just
that we don't have as many ongoing archaeological sites being
dug in some you know, there's still a lot to
explore for the etruscans.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
You know, I really wanted to be an archaeologist when
I was a kid, and I should have done it.
And actually someone I went to school with shout out
to Liby if she's listening, she did go on to
be an archaeologist. But it sounds like today, if you're
really interested in this, you can. Actually there's so many
opportunities to pursue this field, which is amazing.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
I just love that for kids.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
You know, you think somehow that it might be, you know, finished,
but I know this always ongoing.
Speaker 3 (34:01):
Works in POMPEII and around that area as well.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
Two things I'd say about that. The first is that
many museums have got store rooms just full of stuff,
stuff that was found in an initial archaeological survey and
it's chronicled. Look there's this thing here and we found this,
and we found that. So it's written up and there's
a picture of it, and that's all that's ever done
to it. There's just too much and not enough archaeologists
and enough time to actually go through all that stuff.
(34:25):
So for young archaeologists, people who want to do further
work in archaeology, there's enough Italian stuff to last you forever.
There's also new forms of archaeology, GPS, different kinds of
statistical stuff. There's pretty much any kind of field you're
interested in. There is a method in archaeology now that
is opening up. So the view of methods is and
(34:46):
I think AI is going to be huge in how
we understand the archaeology. The trust caids.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Yeah, amazing.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
I was going to ask you about that because you know,
the ability to process information and match stater and images
and things like that will be quite illuminating.
Speaker 3 (35:02):
And I also love the fact that you can we're
getting another lens.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
And not to harp on about it too much, but
like history has definitely been informed mainly by the male consciousness.
And so you know, as you said, you noticed this
picture where you know there's a woman obviously giving birth
and in quite obviously in pain, not in ecstasy, that
it gives a different perspective on things and we can
(35:26):
probably learn so much more by having those different perspectives.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
Yeah, and the other thing I love to do in
Tuscanese to find the places where we can still see
Etruscan life today. You know that there's a fessov in Montepulciano,
the Bravo de la Botti, where people roll wine barrels
up the steep steps. They divide into different city districts
which are called contrade, and they go against each other.
(35:52):
All of those those kinds of things where you divide
a city up into parts. So for example, during the
horse racing in Siena, they divide the distry up again
into contrade and they compete against each other. You know,
in some of these places you'll find those enormous long
tables that go for kilometers where people eat feasts. That's
the Truscan communal feasting. All of the processions that you
(36:14):
see that the order of the processions, the music or
the drumming that is a Truscan. You can see a
Truscan stuff in every festival and celebration in Tuscany is
still today.
Speaker 3 (36:24):
Do they have something about flags, because there's a lot
of flag throwing going on in Tuscany.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
The banners, the kind of banners that you have are
in a Truscan thing.
Speaker 3 (36:35):
That's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
I love that, and so you can also see when
you visit Tuscany there's a very an Italy in general.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
Actually there's a very strong connection to the seasons.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
And it sounds like this is something that's endured for
a very long time in going back to those the
priest league cast or the social stratification that they were
very interested in how nature interacted with their day to
day life.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
It's amazing.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
And the other interesting day is November two, All Souls Day,
So around those necropolises, those big cemeteries around Savannah, all
of those kinds of you know, volterra takena then people
come out and have picnics with the dead, so they'll
feast next to the ancestors graves. And you still see
that in Tuscany every All Souls Day.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Amazing. I love it. It's so great. You know, if
anyone has I mean obviously most.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
People have a bit of a passing interest in history,
would you know, really love to go to Italy. But
I think there's so many layers that you can uncover
and just go deeper and deeper into your your nerd
tendencies or your geek tendencies like me, And this is
what I think, and what our podcast is all about
is to really go deeper into your interests and really
(37:46):
tease them out. So if you do have an interest
in history, yes, go see the Colisseum and Pompeii. But look,
there's so much more going on here that can really
inspire children, adults, or any one to go and learn
some more. And I think human beings are endlessly fascinating.
And we think always say this on these podcasts as well.
(38:09):
We think we know everything, we think we're so advanced,
but it sounds to me like that we're borrowing a
lot from the Etruscans.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
We are, and it makes Tuscany such an incredible place.
That's not just about rolling hills and gorgeous light and
wonderful cypress trees. There's so much going on in Tuscany,
even though we might be there largely for the landscape.
It's those minds and those cemeteries and those hilltowns are
alive with a history that goes back to the beginning
(38:41):
of the Bronze Age.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
Oh goodness, money, thank you for sharing all of that.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
It's so interesting and I just want to go and
find out more now, so and thank you for sharing
your passion It's really great to hear from someone who's
got so much Bik knowledge around the civilizations and how
they've evolved. And so I think if people I would
love to stay in touch with you, how could they
do that?
Speaker 4 (39:03):
You can visit our website take me to europetours dot com.
We've got lots of contact there. You can contact me
at Monique at take me to Europe Tours dot com.
We have a Facebook page also called handily take me
to Europe Tours. So really, just so long as you
can remember take me to Europe Tours, you'll be able
to get in touch with us, and we'd love to
hear from you.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
Amazing and wonderful. Thank you so much, Monik g rat Simier.
I can't wait to visit those Etruscan sites and even
further beyond. And how lucky are we to have the
time and the space to actually go and really go
delve deep into this. So I really appreciate you coming
on board and sharing all of that with us.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
That was lots of fun. Thanks Katie.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Honestly I could talk about history and civilizations for weeks
on end. How fascinating are the Etruscans, the original Italians
if you will, and to think that we're only just
beginning to understand how they lived and what they believed in.
Speaker 3 (40:00):
I did fall in love with.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
The Etruscan jewelry pieces I saw at the Victoria and
Albert Museum earlier this year in London. So if anyone
knows of any artisans that are making Etruscan jewelry inspired pieces.
Speaker 3 (40:13):
Let me know.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
I'd love to pick myself up something gorgeous that's inspired
by the Etruscans. And if you'd like to learn more
about Monique's archaeology focused tours and adventures around Europe, we've
of course linked to her website and social media accounts
and listed the places that she mentioned during this episode
in Tuscany. All there for you on our website at
(40:35):
untold Italy dot com. Forward slash to eight six four,
episode number two hundred and eighty six. As always, thanks
again for listening to our podcast. Did you know it's
consistently in the top ten travel podcast globally and has
been listened to over five million times And that's all
thanks to you, our Italy travel loving listeners. Now, next
(40:56):
week we're going on another wine adventure, this time in Umbria.
Speaker 3 (40:59):
But until then it's chow for now.
Speaker 5 (41:02):
The Untold Italy podcast is an independent production podcast editing,
audio production and website development by Mark Hatter, Production assistance
and content writing by the other kJ Clark.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
Yes there are two of us. For more information about
Untold Italy, please visit Untold Italy dot com
Long before the Romans ruled, a mysterious civilization shaped the
hills of Tuscany and left behind clues in tombs, towns,
and traditions. Join us as anthropologist doctor Venigskidmore takes us
deep into the world of the Etruscans, revealing what their
ancient sites still whisper to those who know how to listen.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Tawatuti and Benvenuti Tuan Told Italy. The travel podcast to
where you go to the towns and villages, mountains and lakes,
hills and coastlines of Bela, Italia. Each week, your host
Katie Clark takes you on a journey in a search
of magical landscapes, history, culture, wine, gelato, and of course,
(00:46):
a whole lot of pasta. If you're dreaming of Italy
and planning future adventures there, you've come to the right place.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Dreaming of arriving in Italy, strolling into a gelatia and
ordering your gelato with confidence. If you've been learning Italian
with language apps but still can't string a sentence together,
it might be time to try another approach. My friend
Michelle from Intrepid Italian offers a practical way to learn
travel Ready Italian.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
Thanks to her.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Unique eighty twenty method, Michelle teaches you exactly what you
need to know to connect with locals and have more
authentic travel experiences. There's no getting bogged down in awkward
phrases and unnecessary grammar. As an adult learner herself with
Italian heritage, Michelle really knows how to bridge the gap
between English and Italian. As Roma from London said, the
(01:46):
learning methodology is great. I progressed much faster in the
last four weeks than I ever did on my own
or using other language apps. To find out more and
claim your free Italian travel phrase guide, visit untold Italy
dot com, home, forward slash Italian or visit the link
in the show notes. As a bonus, you'll also get
an exclusive twenty dollars coupon code to use on any
(02:08):
of Michelle's online self paced courses. So visit untold Italy
dot com, Forward slash Italian and accelerate your Italian language.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Your journey today. Jiao by Joanno.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Everyone, welcome back to the show and thank you for
joining us on another Italian adventure. Before we dive in,
though I wanted to do a big shout out to
one of our listeners who left us such a lovely
review and I just made me smile, so I wanted
to share it with everyone. And this is from me
and her travel in the United States, and they said,
unimaginably helpful. My husband and I are accomplished travelers. We've
(02:43):
been to a lot of places, having checked the box
on many of the iconic sites in Italy. We crave
learning about adventures and experiences off the beaten path that
we didn't know about. And that's what makes this podcast
so special. Consistently informative, inspiring and fun to We have
heard almost all of them and some twice. It's a
(03:03):
great way to educate yourself on all things Italy, from
cultural dos and don'ts, to logistical on the ground advice
and hundreds of hidden gems to help you create the
itinery and trip of your dreams.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Thank you Katie, Thank you me and her travel. That
just made me smile so much.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
And it's really means the world to me and the
entire team because we're now into our fifth year of
the podcast and it remains a joy to make. And
it's because of feedback like these from listeners like you,
So Grauzi milit Thank you for taking the time to
show your support, as it keeps us motivated and excited
to bring you more episodes and reached all of the
(03:42):
Italy loving travelers out there. Now, what dreams have you
been having about Italy lately? Over the weekend, I was
craving some cutu a pep bear, and luckily for me,
there is an excellent one to be had just a
short walk from my house.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
So that's questionniche.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
But I've also geeking out on history quite a lot lately,
which is one of the main reasons that I love
to travel, because I like to explore and see in
real life the places that I've been reading or hearing about. Now,
one era of Italian history that I don't know much
about is the Etruscan civilization.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
And I've been trying to learn more.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
It's a lot harder to access information about the Etruscans.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
I guess it doesn't get the hype of.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Ancient Rome, and also they didn't leave behind incredible monuments
like the Colosseum, and also their literature has all but
disappeared over the centuries.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
But this civilization left.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Its mark on the Italian peninsula, especially Central Italy. So
I've been curious to learn more. The Etruscans especially appeal
to me because women in their society held visible public
roles and enjoyed more freedoms than their Greek or early
Roman counterparts. They dined with men, were depicted by name
in inscriptions, and even appeared prominently in art. Recently, I
(04:54):
caught up with my friend doctor Menique Skidmore, and she
suggested that we have a chat about the Etruscan sites
in t Monique is an expert on anthropology who shares
my love of travel, and I can't wait to hear
the places to visit.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
So andiamo, let's jump.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
In, ben Benita Monique, Welcome on to the Untild Italy podcast.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
Thanks for having me, Katie Monique.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
I'm so thrilled to have you join me today.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
I've mentioned to our listeners quite a few times now
how I've become interested in the Etruscan civilization, So when
you suggested this podcast topic, I was so thrilled. But
you know, before we get started, can you introduce yourself
to our listeners and share why you love traveling in Italy?
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Okay, well, my name's Monique Skinner. I'm an anthropologist, I'm
the owner of a small boutique Mediterranean tour company that
focuses on archaeology and history tours, so we operate mainly
in Cyprus, Malta and Greece at the moment. I've been
an anthropologist for many many years, conducted lots of film work,
(05:57):
and I just wanted to be able to stop telling
writing and starts showing. So it's really about allowing people
to come through the world that I inhabit with us,
with our guides, with our archaeological experts, in a play
that's kind of modern and it's not like those old
tour companies that are full of lectures and Western experts.
(06:19):
It's more about being in these countries and meeting the
people who live beside the monuments that their ancestors created.
So that's kind of why I do now what I
do amazing.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Yeah, it's so exciting to know what you're doing, and
not that you're doing anything in Italy just yet, but
I thought it was worthwhile sharing your knowledge about this
area because it's so interesting and Italy is just such
a lot of guides call it Lasagna layers of history,
and unfortunately we kind of tend to stop at ancient Rome.
(06:53):
We get from medieval Renaissance, then we go down to
the ancient Romans, and then we kind of stop at
ancient Rome and that most people are familiar with. But
today let's have a little bit of a learn about
those that came before them.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Tell us about the Etruscans.
Speaker 4 (07:07):
Well, it's true that the Romans were really good at
pr so we do tend to think about the Romans
and you go to Rome for the first time, you think,
oh my god, look what they created. And what we
don't realize and we're only just starting to realize, is
how much of that is actually stuff they just nicked
from the Etruscans nicked is stolen. Yeah, we could say plagiarize.
(07:29):
Maybe there were lots of ideas about Etruscans being a
mysterious culture. Where did they come from? And that just
means that we didn't have digital archeology, we didn't have
DNA testing, We just didn't really know enough. And because
so much of their culture was lost when their culture
was absorbed by the Romans. So now we know that
they were always indigenous to that area since at least
(07:51):
the Early Bronze Age, the Late Bronze Age, They came
from a Proto Villanova and then a Villanovan culture and
then the Etruscans, so they didn't come from the Aga
or Turkey or anywhere else. They were just there. They
were there around the ninth century BCE until eventually the
Romans vanquished them by about three hundred BCE. And during
this period of time they inhabited the area from the
(08:13):
Tigris River to the Anna River, and they were mainly
in the south and west of what is now Tuscany,
but they were over much of it and they created
a society that was based on mining. They are really
good at mining. They became the scourge of the western
Mediterranean as pirates. They were very good at training, and
(08:36):
because there was also a lot of pine forests, they
became good at shipbuilding as well. They were people who
were agriculturists. They introduced the Romans to how to grow
grapes and how to grow olives, and can you imagine
in Italy without olive oil or wine. So they were
really important agriculturists. And because they had mines and they
had farms, they needed roads, so they gave us paved roads.
(08:58):
Something I always thought the Romans had given, they created
this interesting society based on little city states. They didn't
like to get together very much. Once a year they
get together politically, and they created these sunken roads called
the via cava, which were between different settlements. Their society
was urban city states, class based. They were governed by
(09:23):
noble elites because they had a lot of money, so
from mining in our culture, they were able to create
a noble society. Eventually these nobles became part of the
Roman nobles, but in the meantime they had nobles men
and women. They had then free slaves. They were sort
of a working class that did all the productive stuff.
(09:44):
They worked on mines and estates and the slaves, and
then we had the slaves themselves. So we had a
class based society based on little city states all over Tuscany,
and they had a priestly class, and religion was really important.
The role of women was really different compared to the
Romans or the Greeks before them.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
What I'm hearing, Monique, is that you're saying that they
are the original Italians, the og Italians if you want,
if you want to talk like my children. So everything
that has come after has kind of evolved from these
people that lived in this area.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
Yeah, the Romans at the time were a bunch of
Italic tribes living south of what was then Rome. Rome
wasn't founded, so these guys were there earlier, and they
had evolved all kinds of important architecture and agriculture and
hydraulic engineering. They developed the arch There wasn't much they
didn't do. They were really quite important to what then
(10:44):
became Rome, and their societies were so based around religion.
They believed in lots of gods like most people did
at the time, but it was called immanent, so not
imminent but imminent polytheism, which just meant that God was
in everything, the divine was in everything. You know that
the grass over there. And I think Etruscan kids probably
didn't grow up saying why is the sky blue? Why
(11:06):
is the grass green? Why? You know why? This was
because I think the answer, if you're an a Truscan
parent would always have been well because the gods made
it that way, So there just wasn't a lot of
stuff you needed to ask, I think as a kid,
so they probably had much easier parenting than we do.
They needed a priestly class because if the gods are
in everything, you're always interacting with the gods. So they
had this series of ancient texts called the Etrusca Discipline,
(11:30):
which have been lost now, but they pretty much told
you exactly what to do. So, you know, how should
we harves now? Should we harve us next week? You know,
it's been a warm winter. And they had two kinds
of priests, harris BECs who were really good at ripping
open dead animals and reading people, reading their livers, and Auguri's,
who are much nicer. They would hang out at the
top of heights and look at the birds and stuff
(11:52):
in the sky like lightning. So these are the two
kinds of priestly class that would tell the Etruscans how
to go about what they needed to get done to
be really important military invaders, pirates, and agriculturists. So that
meant that because they were wealthy now, they thought they
were to be wealthy in the afterlife. And it's hard
(12:13):
to think of a culture, maybe the Greeks, but to
think of a culture that had more important beliefs about
ritual and the afterlife. So when we open tombs, Etruscan tombs,
which is how we know nearly anything about Etruscans. We
find these incredible frescoes, freezers in bright colors, and everyone
is just partying. It is a non stop party in
(12:35):
Etruscan tomb. There's dancers, games, men and women, dancing, cavorting, eating,
it's just party time. And these tombs are made of
a soft volcanic material, so they're carved like a really
important house. There are columns, windows, doorways, furniture, and if
you think about going off to the wilderness for a month,
(12:56):
you think of everything you needed to take right because
you can't just get to a store. And the Etruscans
kind of believe the afterlife was like that. They really
had to just take everything they needed because they were
going to be there for a very long time and
apparently there aren't a lot of shops in the afterlife.
So that's why we find furniture and food and mirrors
and anything you can imagine inside Etruscan tombs. And that's
(13:18):
why we know about the Etruscans, because we've found their
tombs and we know what they thought about in the afterlife,
and that told us so much about how they actually
live their real lives and what their houses were like.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Yeah, amazing because there's not a lot of literatureies there
because for a variety of reasons, it's all been destroyed
over time.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
One of the few things we've got is a piece
of cloth that made it to Egypt. Then, because the
Egyptians are really into mummification, they cut it up into strips,
wrapped it around mummies, and then a Yugoslavian traveler took
it to Yugoslavia. And that's the only reason that we
have those Etruscan writings. We don't have a lot left.
We have some stone stelle, some pillars of stone that
(13:59):
have stuff on it. Most of the stuff we have
is a bit of graffiti and just stuff on funerary
saying you know, this person died. Then it's not really
enlightening stuff. Most of what we get from them we
get from the Egyptians and the Greeks and the Phoenicians
telling us about what the Etruscans did and said.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Time for a quick break shorter than your morning espresso.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Wow. So secondhand, that's always problematic.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Though, and especially if they didn't like them very much.
But they also left a lot of jewelry, didn't they
They liked their bling.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
In part that's because of the status of women too.
So that was two reasons. One was because they had
a whole class of people who had time on their
hands to use different materials, and they've got some beautiful bronzes,
particularly if you look at the Chimera of Arezzo or
some of the statues that you can find in the
Etruscan Museum in Volterra, you can find beautiful statuary bronze.
(15:01):
But it's also because women were important in the sense
that later in Roman times they weren't, and in ancient
Greek times they weren't. But for some reason, there's this
little blip in Mediterranean history where women had their own names,
they were named as well as men, they were depicted
in public life, they could go to banquets with men,
(15:21):
and they could own property and pass property on. And
that's really odd for women at that time.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
It's pretty odd for women in history, really unfortunately, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
That's so let's all hail the Etruscans. What else did
women do? It sounds like they're very important in that society.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
They were respected, they were landowners, they were matriarchs. There
were women like Tanakil, Plowtia, Erga, Nila. These were women
who were known as important women in that society, and
it's hard to find other women and societies at the
time that you could say were important like that, and
we even have There's this tiny, tiny piece of boucro
(15:59):
which is in indigenous Etruscan pottery from the northeast of Tuscany.
It's called a birth stamp. It shows it's just a fragment,
and it shows a woman with her legs open and
a baby emerging with a head and shoulders. And the
only reason I remembered this particular view of women because
you don't see a lot of those kinds of images
in the Mediterranean at the time. It's really unusual. What
(16:19):
I liked about it was that early Archaelis thought that
she was reclining on a chair with her hand behind
her back, but I reckon it must have been a
female archaeologist. Rater came along and said, look, she's actually
gripping that tree. There's a thought, and I reckon that's
probably a more accurate reading of this tiny, tiny bit
of fragment. But it does show you that images of
(16:41):
women weren't just all about oh, fertility and the nature goddess.
They were doing all sorts of stuff and being depicted
and being allowed to have names and be represented as
powerful and is not hidden away.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
Yeah, because you do get some Roman women named later on.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Like I was just listening to a podcast about, for example,
on the Ancients podcast last night.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
But she was like the Empress, she was like the ultimate.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
So what you're saying is like women were way more
integrated into society at various different levels that they were
known and respected and included.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Yeah, they couldn't do things like you know, the men.
They still had their judiciary sewn up politics, but women
could circulate in the daily lives. You think about a
town like Volterra hilltown like Volterra and Etruscan town, women
were able to move around it, meet with men, go
to banquets. When they died, their names would be written
beside the men on the tombstones and there would be
(17:39):
statues of both of them. And there were things that
were made for women that were perhaps possibly more interest
in making things for women, more crafts for women than
in periods in which most women were just at home.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
So interesting, isn't it.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
I wonder why that is the case something obviously, you know,
I think everyone would love to know the reason is
why they evolved that way when the other civilizations weren't.
Speaker 4 (18:05):
It's hard to understand. We just don't have enough material
that survived the Etruscan period. And because we don't see that,
we see lots of aspects of Truscan society today in Tuscany,
but the role of women was not accepted by the Romans,
and so it wasn't brought forward into the Roman society.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
They might have destroyed it, who knows. Anyway, let's not
go there. So, Benig, that you've mentioned a couple of
places that you can go to experience and look further
into the Etruscan civilization, and they're mainly in Tuscany, where
the civilization evolved. So tell us more like, let's maybe
start with Volterra, maybe because that's a lovely It's a
(18:46):
beautiful hilltop town, isn't it, And a lot of people
go there, you know, just because it's gorgeous and it's
got a beautiful piazza, lovely cobblestone streets, and it's got
a beautiful view over the Tuscan countryside. But obviously there's
a lot more going on there than first meet Ci.
Speaker 4 (19:03):
There is, and when you see Voltara now it does
look like a medieval center, but its an ancient name
was Vlathri, and it was an Etruscan town that was
surrounded by Hugerus Truscan walls that were over seven kilometers long,
and when you enter today you can go through the
monumental the Porta Alaco, which is a third century to
(19:24):
second century BCE gate through the Voltaan walls that the
Etruscans created. It was set up high for defensiveness because
by this time they were understanding that the Romans down
south were becoming a bit of a problem, and we
saw over from the fifth century BC, from the founding
of Rome through to the third century a series of
(19:47):
wars in which slowly they got picked off because the
Etruscans didn't get together and defend stuff, they just each
little city fell. And so Volterra wanted to be up high,
and that was one of the reasons it wanted to
be up high. But the other reason it wanted to
be up high was because light, particularly in the south,
which we can talk about in a minute, it's a
really good spot to see birds. So if you're off
(20:09):
really high, then you've got Augury's So these priestly class
can set up temples in which you can look for
birds and lightning and rainbows and whatever else. So it
was important for the priestly class, and it was important
for defense that it was so high. The acropolis's temple
foundations and all of the ancient water cisterns you can
still see now as a tourist if you go to
(20:31):
Volterra and around the city and outside the city there
are necropoliss like Portoni Marmini, and then in Truscan. In
in Voltaire itself is the Guanaci Museum, and that's the
best collection of Etruscan funery architecture. Really. It's got the
Shadow of the Evening, which is a masterpiece of bronze,
(20:51):
and it's got the sculpted earn of the Spouses, in
which you can see our husband and wife depicted together
as equals, you know, in beautiful. They're well wrought their
artistic images. Also, they really like funery urns. I don't
really understand the thing about funery earns, but gosh, they
like them. Voltaian started doing them not just in terracotta,
(21:14):
but in alabaster, and even today as you walk around
Volterra you will see that alabaster carving that they learned
from the Etruscans.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
That's amazing that it goes back that for all. I mean,
it makes sense really that it goes back that far.
And I'm beautiful for those people that don't know what
alabastera is. It's a beautiful white. It's quite a soft stone,
isn't it. And it's quite easy to carve it. It's
not as hard as marble. And if you want to
get up a few souvenirs, I've got these cute little
(21:43):
bottle stoppers.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
I mean, it's a beautiful place to visit.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Voltaire and like I didn't even know I had an
inkling about this Etruscan heritage, but not so much keep
going money.
Speaker 4 (21:54):
Well, I think it's one of my favorite hilltowns because
it does have a beautiful medieval core. They are a
fantastic There are always classic car rallies in the central
square and that's a fantastic museum. And it's only just
ever so slightly off the beaten track, but it's a
nut off the beaten track that it's not like a
San Jymnano kind of experience.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
One you have to get in the car for about
I think it's about an hour and a half from
Florence to get to Voltaira. So yeah, you do get
people that have a bit of more persistence going there.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Let's just say that's right.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
If you've looked at Voltaira, the next place I'd look
is down south. So it's another bit that's a bit
off the beaten track because you have to drive a
couple of hours down into Grossetta. So you're in an
area which has got soft volcanic cliffs, and the volcanic
stuff is called Tufa. So these are the cities of
(22:47):
the Tufa. You've probably talked about them on your podcast.
This is the best place really to have a look
at how the Etruscans lived. So there are the towns
of Savannah and Pittigliana, and this system of roads a
Truscan roads called the Viakava. Together are probably the best
places to see in Tuscany Etruscan landscapes. Really. Near Serrano
(23:10):
and Particulariano, you've got this this town called Savannah, which
has an archaeological park called the Sita del Tufo, and
it's got sacred and domestic architecture all in one and
all in this beautiful parklike atmosphere that you can hike around.
So Particulariano is connected to Savannah by a twenty kilometer
(23:34):
long system of via cava. These are sunken roads down
to about two meters that the Etruscan's built between places there.
Walls are six meters high at the lowest, but they're
well over twenty meters high. They're very narrow. Sometimes you
can only get a cart through, and sometimes you get
a lot of people. And if you still listen to
things like the Visit Tuscany website or whatever, it'll say like, oh,
(23:57):
these mysterious things. They could have been used for trade,
they could have view MIDFID defenses, they could have been
for ritual purposes, and which really means they don't know.
But if you look at these beautiful carved mysteriously looking
and they do look mysterious because they covered in moss
and ferns now, and they've got drainage ditches because they
are really big on hydrology, and there are ritual carvings, markings,
(24:18):
and there are little niches for icons. So it was
clearly a ritual space. And really, in the ancient world,
who was going to spend that amount of people hours
building something like that if it doesn't have something related
to the gods at the end of it. So my
view is that the via carve are a liminal space
between the land of the living and the land of
(24:39):
the dead, and it connected the two. So we can
walk from particularly Ono, that amazing hill type town where
the augers were sitting up there looking at the eagles
soaring over the valleys, and then walk through these beautiful
carved roads to the necropolises, to the cities of the
tombs where they bury their dead.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Yeah, amazing.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
I was going to ask you why, you know, why
were they sunken though?
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Do you think?
Speaker 4 (25:04):
I just think it was because it made them taller.
It's true that it made them a much more towering
effect because it was so easy to dig it out right,
because it's quite soft.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
Oh, that's so interesting. Everyone.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Monique's got a lot of expertise in other civilizations, so
I'm very tempted to ask her whether she's seen this
in other parts of the world.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
It's important in all ritual spaces that you create a
liminal space. So it's important that if you have even
if you have, say a menstrual hut in a jungle,
you still have to create a pathway. There's always a
sacred space in which you shed your current personhood and
to become someone new. So going through a long, dark,
(25:53):
narrow pathway gives you time, and you go past different
ritual symbols. You might have had images of gods in
those little niches. So by the time you've arrived at
the other end, you're ready. You're ready for the purification
rights that would have occurred outside these monumental tombs. That
kind of creation of eliminal space happens through music, through landscape,
(26:18):
and in this case it was largely through landscape and
through carvings, because we don't know how many of those
carvings and paintings may have been lost over the years.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
And so then now today when we have churches, when
you're walking down the aisle, then that's the same kind
of concept, when you're going past all the paintings.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
And that's right and same. It's temple architecture, isn't it
to move into any religious space? And I suppose Byzantine
churches are the best example of that because they're all
the same. You walk down the long pathway to get
to the important stuff at the back, and the Etruscans
actually built their temples different to the Greeks because they
(26:56):
in fact want to have a big, fancy opening and
a much more raised daist down the end. We're in
a Greek temple, the whole thing looks the same or it.
So the Etruscans were really into making an entrance. I
think you could say.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Back in a flash, right after these messages I've seen,
Like I mentioned, I'm a little bit obsessed with their jewelry.
When I was in London earlier this year, I went
and stopped at the VNA and they I don't know
where they got this Etruscan stuff from. I don't want
to cast any expersons on the British. Sorry British. I
(27:32):
am actually a British citizen, so I can feel like
I can't say this, but they did have a very
nice collection of the e Truscan jewelry, and if you're
over in London you can go and see that. But
back to our sides in southern Tuscany, what else can
we see around Pittiano and was it Saratana Serrano?
Speaker 4 (27:53):
And Savannah is where we want to go. So Savannah
is where we've got this archaeological park and if you
pull up there, it's just a very large car park.
And then you walk to this enormous archaeological site which
is a bunch of mega tombs and they're monumental. There's
the ildebranded Tomb. The Elderbrander Tomb is a remarkable example
(28:17):
of having a temple like fasad at the front of it.
There are amazing necropolises that you walk past them through
the park. You go past the stone carving's altars and
just there is where the Via Karvis starts, so you
can then walk the pathway. It's a long way to Particuliano,
but petic Gleano is such an incredible hilltown. It's well
worth the effort. It just don't do it in thirty
(28:39):
eight degree days in the middle of summer.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
It sounds like you've done that. So Monique is the site?
Speaker 1 (28:46):
I think I know already know the answer to this,
but it's a site well marked? Or is it a
little bit problematic, like would you know what you're looking
at and can you get an idea?
Speaker 3 (28:54):
Or is it really advisable to go with the guide?
Speaker 4 (28:58):
If you didn't know much about the etruscan, you wouldn't
know much and I had a hard time trying to
read their few little boards. You know, there hasn't been
good signage really in Italy since the Romans. I don't
think I have.
Speaker 3 (29:10):
To agree with that. Why why are they doing it?
Speaker 4 (29:14):
I think with a lot of these sites. It's fantastic
that Italy keeps its heritage. I love that it keeps
it and it allows it to exist, but it doesn't
really help you much with understanding what's there.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
I think they do in their Italian children get a
very very strong education in history and art history, and
so they do genuinely know a lot about it, but
it's not presenting it to the world. And you know,
there are two sites that if you really want an
excellent experience with understanding the culture and archaeology at how
(29:46):
it actually can come to life, is the Domus area
in Rome and also the Bars of carrac Color, where
they have done an actually excellent job with virtual reality
headsets where you can actually walk through the space. But yeah,
it sounds like it might need to do a little
bit of work with these Etruscan sites.
Speaker 4 (30:05):
They do, and I think part of the problem is
that we don't know Archaeltists haven't known much about these sites.
It's really it was only a month or two ago
that the first unlooted tomb Etruscan tombor has ever been found,
and so almost everything that we know comes from looted tombs.
So the Truscans, there just hasn't been much information about them,
(30:27):
and because they're not the Romans, there's not that much
excitement to explain the Etruscans. And it's a growing field
and hopefully these kind of southern towns will become much
more interesting to people when they realize just how incredible
the landscape is and what's in it.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
So are their ongoing archaeological digs there.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
There are digs all over Tuscany. At the moment, there's
only been six hundred tombs found, but more a found
every year, and DNA analysis is really the thing that's
changing what we know about the Etruscans because most of
what we knew wasn't true.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
That's what historians do, though, they need to make assumptions
based on the evidence that's put.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Forward, and then you know, I think a lot of
things are changing.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
I heard this really interesting podcast about Stone Hinge where
they completely changed where they think the stones have come from.
They thought they were coming from Wales, but they now
they think they're coming from Scotland. It's incredible the technology
that we have today that can sort of illuminate what
happened in the past.
Speaker 4 (31:27):
And how people created the things they created. So quite
often we had, you know, alien theories or theories of
people who came across the water because we just couldn't
understand how they constructed that stuff back there.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
Yeah, it's so fascinating.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I could talk about this all day. So, Monique, you
spent a lot of time in these places, and it's
obviously the thing that lights you up. But what about
these ancient places. Has it changed the way that you
travel at all? Or did it inspire the way.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
That you travel? How do these two passions of yours interlink?
Speaker 4 (31:58):
Well, I guess being an anthropologist, I'm just as interested in
the lives of the dead as i am in the
lives of the living. So I'm really interested in seeing
the ways that things that occurred in the past can
be seen in the present. And in Tuscany, the past
is very much alive. But also learning what has come
from the Etruscans has really changed my view of Roman society.
(32:19):
So I didn't realize that the Romans were given the
alphabet and numerals by the Etruscans. I didn't know that
the toga came from Etruscans. I didn't know the word
person was a word that came from the Etruscans. I
didn't know that they gave us paid roads, that they
developed the arch lots of ways in which I thought
(32:39):
the Romans were, but possibly a greater innovative society than
they were, So that changed how I thought about the Romans.
Traveling is interesting though, because there are lots of ways
now that you can still see Etruscan culture alive in Tuscany,
and so I love following that around so I can
keep seeing those parts of Etruscan society today in Tuscany.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
Yeah, it's very good. We haven't actually touched on.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
I know, over in the east of Tuscany, in near
Aretzo and Cortona, there's also Etruscan sites there isn't there.
Speaker 4 (33:11):
Absolutely and up in the northeast as well, and you've
got you know, you've got a lot of Etruscan stuff
in the Aretzo Archaeological Museum, which is above that lovely Amphitheater.
So it's not confined just to the south. It's just
that we don't have as many ongoing archaeological sites being
dug in some you know, there's still a lot to
explore for the etruscans.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
You know, I really wanted to be an archaeologist when
I was a kid, and I should have done it.
And actually someone I went to school with shout out
to Liby if she's listening, she did go on to
be an archaeologist. But it sounds like today, if you're
really interested in this, you can. Actually there's so many
opportunities to pursue this field, which is amazing.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
I just love that for kids.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
You know, you think somehow that it might be, you know, finished,
but I know this always ongoing.
Speaker 3 (34:01):
Works in POMPEII and around that area as well.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
Two things I'd say about that. The first is that
many museums have got store rooms just full of stuff,
stuff that was found in an initial archaeological survey and
it's chronicled. Look there's this thing here and we found this,
and we found that. So it's written up and there's
a picture of it, and that's all that's ever done
to it. There's just too much and not enough archaeologists
and enough time to actually go through all that stuff.
(34:25):
So for young archaeologists, people who want to do further
work in archaeology, there's enough Italian stuff to last you forever.
There's also new forms of archaeology, GPS, different kinds of
statistical stuff. There's pretty much any kind of field you're
interested in. There is a method in archaeology now that
is opening up. So the view of methods is and
(34:46):
I think AI is going to be huge in how
we understand the archaeology. The trust caids.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Yeah, amazing.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
I was going to ask you about that because you know,
the ability to process information and match stater and images
and things like that will be quite illuminating.
Speaker 3 (35:02):
And I also love the fact that you can we're
getting another lens.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
And not to harp on about it too much, but
like history has definitely been informed mainly by the male consciousness.
And so you know, as you said, you noticed this
picture where you know there's a woman obviously giving birth
and in quite obviously in pain, not in ecstasy, that
it gives a different perspective on things and we can
(35:26):
probably learn so much more by having those different perspectives.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
Yeah, and the other thing I love to do in
Tuscanese to find the places where we can still see
Etruscan life today. You know that there's a fessov in Montepulciano,
the Bravo de la Botti, where people roll wine barrels
up the steep steps. They divide into different city districts
which are called contrade, and they go against each other.
(35:52):
All of those those kinds of things where you divide
a city up into parts. So for example, during the
horse racing in Siena, they divide the distry up again
into contrade and they compete against each other. You know,
in some of these places you'll find those enormous long
tables that go for kilometers where people eat feasts. That's
the Truscan communal feasting. All of the processions that you
(36:14):
see that the order of the processions, the music or
the drumming that is a Truscan. You can see a
Truscan stuff in every festival and celebration in Tuscany is
still today.
Speaker 3 (36:24):
Do they have something about flags, because there's a lot
of flag throwing going on in Tuscany.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
The banners, the kind of banners that you have are
in a Truscan thing.
Speaker 3 (36:35):
That's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
I love that, and so you can also see when
you visit Tuscany there's a very an Italy in general.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
Actually there's a very strong connection to the seasons.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
And it sounds like this is something that's endured for
a very long time in going back to those the
priest league cast or the social stratification that they were
very interested in how nature interacted with their day to
day life.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
It's amazing.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
And the other interesting day is November two, All Souls Day,
So around those necropolises, those big cemeteries around Savannah, all
of those kinds of you know, volterra takena then people
come out and have picnics with the dead, so they'll
feast next to the ancestors graves. And you still see
that in Tuscany every All Souls Day.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Amazing. I love it. It's so great. You know, if
anyone has I mean obviously most.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
People have a bit of a passing interest in history,
would you know, really love to go to Italy. But
I think there's so many layers that you can uncover
and just go deeper and deeper into your your nerd
tendencies or your geek tendencies like me, And this is
what I think, and what our podcast is all about
is to really go deeper into your interests and really
(37:46):
tease them out. So if you do have an interest
in history, yes, go see the Colisseum and Pompeii. But look,
there's so much more going on here that can really
inspire children, adults, or any one to go and learn
some more. And I think human beings are endlessly fascinating.
And we think always say this on these podcasts as well.
(38:09):
We think we know everything, we think we're so advanced,
but it sounds to me like that we're borrowing a
lot from the Etruscans.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
We are, and it makes Tuscany such an incredible place.
That's not just about rolling hills and gorgeous light and
wonderful cypress trees. There's so much going on in Tuscany,
even though we might be there largely for the landscape.
It's those minds and those cemeteries and those hilltowns are
alive with a history that goes back to the beginning
(38:41):
of the Bronze Age.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
Oh goodness, money, thank you for sharing all of that.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
It's so interesting and I just want to go and
find out more now, so and thank you for sharing
your passion It's really great to hear from someone who's
got so much Bik knowledge around the civilizations and how
they've evolved. And so I think if people I would
love to stay in touch with you, how could they
do that?
Speaker 4 (39:03):
You can visit our website take me to europetours dot com.
We've got lots of contact there. You can contact me
at Monique at take me to Europe Tours dot com.
We have a Facebook page also called handily take me
to Europe Tours. So really, just so long as you
can remember take me to Europe Tours, you'll be able
to get in touch with us, and we'd love to
hear from you.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
Amazing and wonderful. Thank you so much, Monik g rat Simier.
I can't wait to visit those Etruscan sites and even
further beyond. And how lucky are we to have the
time and the space to actually go and really go
delve deep into this. So I really appreciate you coming
on board and sharing all of that with us.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
That was lots of fun. Thanks Katie.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Honestly I could talk about history and civilizations for weeks
on end. How fascinating are the Etruscans, the original Italians
if you will, and to think that we're only just
beginning to understand how they lived and what they believed in.
Speaker 3 (40:00):
I did fall in love with.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
The Etruscan jewelry pieces I saw at the Victoria and
Albert Museum earlier this year in London. So if anyone
knows of any artisans that are making Etruscan jewelry inspired pieces.
Speaker 3 (40:13):
Let me know.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
I'd love to pick myself up something gorgeous that's inspired
by the Etruscans. And if you'd like to learn more
about Monique's archaeology focused tours and adventures around Europe, we've
of course linked to her website and social media accounts
and listed the places that she mentioned during this episode
in Tuscany. All there for you on our website at
(40:35):
untold Italy dot com. Forward slash to eight six four,
episode number two hundred and eighty six. As always, thanks
again for listening to our podcast. Did you know it's
consistently in the top ten travel podcast globally and has
been listened to over five million times And that's all
thanks to you, our Italy travel loving listeners. Now, next
(40:56):
week we're going on another wine adventure, this time in Umbria.
Speaker 3 (40:59):
But until then it's chow for now.
Speaker 5 (41:02):
The Untold Italy podcast is an independent production podcast editing,
audio production and website development by Mark Hatter, Production assistance
and content writing by the other kJ Clark.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
Yes there are two of us. For more information about
Untold Italy, please visit Untold Italy dot com
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