The Truth Is Out There? Richard Doty on UAPs and The Men in Black

In this EXCLUSIVE episode of Across the Pond, host UAPLee sits down with Richard Doty, a former U.S. Air Force counterintelligence officer whose name has become synonymous with some of the most intriguing—and controversial—stories in UFO history. 

Drawing from his years within the intelligence community, Doty offers a rare insider’s perspective on how the military and government have dealt with unidentified aerial phenomena, covert operations, and the mysterious figures often referred to as the "Men in Black." Throughout the conversation, Doty recounts his background in counterintelligence, details the shadowy operations of special units tasked with investigating UFO activity, and sheds light on the secrecy surrounding these programs. He also reflects on the psychological and societal impacts of extraterrestrial encounters, raising thought-provoking questions about how much the public has been told—and how much is still hidden. The discussion doesn’t stop at history, however.

UAPLee and Doty also look ahead to the upcoming U.S. congressional hearings on UAPs, considering what future disclosures might reveal about extraterrestrial life and what those revelations could mean for humanity as a whole. This episode blends first-hand testimony, deep analysis, and a touch of mystery, offering listeners a fascinating glimpse into the intersection of intelligence work, UFO lore, and the possibility of life beyond Earth.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You know, for effect, dear our aliens.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Our difference is worldwide would vanish if we were facing
an alien threat. Perhaps we need some outside universal threat
to make us recognize this common bound. Breaking news tonight,

(00:28):
Sean Diddy Combs has been arrested in an unhappy hotel.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
There's a relation to some comments that you made on
a Facebook page. This is a Fox News alert.

Speaker 1 (00:47):
The Epstein files have been released.

Speaker 4 (00:51):
Across the Pond.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
You're looking at now, sir.

Speaker 5 (00:55):
Everything that happens now is happening for sure.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
Now, good evening, and welcome to another episode of Across
the Pond.

Speaker 5 (01:04):
You with me, u ap Lee.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
We're back with an impromptu episode that kind of sprang
on us yesterday, but it's something I got to grab
with both hands an opportunity. This evening, we're joined by
a very special guest, none other than Richard Doughty or Rick,
which would you prefer to be addressed as sir?

Speaker 1 (01:21):
Rick?

Speaker 5 (01:21):
Rick is fine, Rick, it is Rick.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Thank you so much for jumping on and spending a
bit of time with us this evening.

Speaker 5 (01:28):
I appreciate you. A very busy man.

Speaker 3 (01:30):
Just to put some context out there, Rick was a
former US Air Force member and worked in there some
of the shady areas of the intelligence services. Shall we share?
Shall we say? But I'm gonna let you explain. I
don't want to, you know, jump in and I've got
the man here. I may as well hear it from
the US's mouth. Rick, Please do give us a little
bit of a background on what it is you did

(01:51):
get up to to the US Air Force.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
Yeah. I joined the Air Force Office of Special Investigations
back in the seventies.

Speaker 5 (02:02):
I was.

Speaker 1 (02:04):
Joined as a counter intelligence officer. I went to a
number of different schools to be trained in counter intelligence,
counter esimonage operations. The schooling lasted about a year and
then it was assigned. My first assignment was Kirtland Air
Force Base in New Mexico, Albuquerque, New Mexico, and that's

(02:27):
where I am famously connected to the Paul Benowitz case.
That was one of the cases that I ran during
my time at Kirtland Air Force Base. It wasn't the
only one, but it was one that is quite a
prominent in the UFO community today. I've spoke many, many,

(02:54):
many many times about what happened and what I did,
what I had to do as a kind of intelligence officer,
people have. The utiful community in general has accepted the
fact that I was ordered to do things and I
did it. But there was also there's always skeptics out
there who flood the market with innuendos or lies about

(03:21):
what I did during that time. It's just we're not
here to talk about Paul Benowitz. I just wanted to
clear the error, so to speak, that everything I did
was in fact a sanctioned by the United States government.

Speaker 5 (03:38):
Yeah for sure, you know, I'm a military things.

Speaker 3 (03:41):
Oh sorry, I was just going to try and reassure
people though, I wanted to say, just coming from my side,
I spent twenty years in the British military, you know,
and we've been to Afghanistan and Iraqi. In those times,
there are times when you're just doing your job as
a military, you know, man, as a service personnel, you're
just doing your job.

Speaker 5 (03:57):
You're following the orders.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
But I want to tell people now that there are
there is humanity within us. We're not just these robotic machines.
We are human and you know, so we just job's
a job. And this is why I suppose you've come
forward after the years that have passed then and I
told your story and where we are now is humanity
is legis to this point, am I right?

Speaker 1 (04:17):
Yes, exactly. I had a a non disclosure agreement up
until two thousand and two, and after that I was
free to talk about well not everything that I did,
but most of what I did during my time in
And then I came out and did it, and I've
talked about it. I have shows on GAYA and You

(04:41):
and m N TV. So I'm telling my story and
I've told it over the years. Uh So, I hope
that that people can understand. Like you said, thank you
for your service to your country. U. You know, I served.
I didn't serve the twenty like you did, but I

(05:04):
served Indian counter intelligence, which is different than being in
the military. You're a civil servant. I was. I did
serve in the Irregular Air Force for four years. I
got out, went to college and joined the Intelligence Service,
and the intelligence US Intelligence Service is a bit different people.

(05:27):
Most people don't realize what it entails, and what we
have to do to get in and what we have
to do while we're in. There's a lot of Almost
everything you do within the intelligence community is classified one
way or the other, whether it's top secret or secret

(05:48):
or just confidential. But there's strict rules on what we
can do and what we can't do, and we have
to follow those rules. And during my time in FRONT
and I left via US Intelligence in nineteen eighty eight,
so I've been out a long time. But after that

(06:09):
time I got out, I worked for doctor but Hal
put Off at the Institute for Advanced Studies for a
number of years, and I did have a security clearance
there and I had to do some things there that
were sensitive. But now I'm out, I'm free to talk
about what I do again. There are still things that
I can't talk about and I don't won't talk about,

(06:32):
but the majority of the work I did during my
time in US Intelligence, Color Intelligence, for the Air Force
Office Special Investigations, I can talk about.

Speaker 3 (06:42):
Yeah, And I suppose that mean, you know, there's a
lot of things that you've come out and spoke about
over the years, and we could hone in on any
one of those things and probably spend the entire you know, call,
talking about that one area I wanted to hone in on,
particularly this evening. It's something you've sort of alluded to
already been a member of the intelligence. I suppose it
would make you privy to certain information of maybe who

(07:05):
this is these individuals are, so that area being the
men in Black or this cleandestine group of individuals that
you know, they show up very conveniently and remove sort
of evidence and suppressed conversation and all the rest of it.
And yeah, as I've said already, the men in black,
and I suppose you you've come out and you've spoken

(07:25):
about that before, but I'd love to just go into
a little bit of detail on who these people are,
if you would, if you would share that with us.

Speaker 1 (07:32):
Okay, well, let's talk about the history of the men
in Black. You know, the the cliche or the name
men in black, those three words just in the show
up one day. The prominence of that came back in
the fifties when a guy wrote a book about UFOs

(07:52):
and sorcerers and ended up mentioning the men in Black,
who've alleged visited him and told him not to write
about a certain story. And over the years there's been
other people within the UFO community talking about the men
in Black, and back in the days of the fifties

(08:14):
and sixties, these men in Black were allegedly aliens or extraterrestrials,
because they would show up right after a uf OH
landing or any event, and then they would visit the
witnesses and ask for film or trying to convince the

(08:34):
witnesses that not talk about what occurred and so so.
Who they were back in those days is a good question,
because there was an incident happened in nineteen fifty nine
in here in New Mexico where I live, where a

(08:57):
two fishermen happened to see something land at a lake
that they were at, and these men in black showed
up before the authorities showed up, before they were before
they had the opportunity to report what they saw. Now
New Mexico, back then, where it was remote, there wasn't

(09:17):
a phone. Obviously nobody had cell phones back then. These
these two fishermen would have had to gone miles to
a phone to report this incident. But just after the
incident and after the craft had left, these two men
in black showed up. And there's a really classic case.

(09:40):
It's been talked about by Wendell Stevens. In fact, one
of the uh one of the witnesses, one of the
men that confronted these two men in black and one
of the fishermen showed up at the UFO convention some
years ago. There of course passed. They're they're dead now,
both of them, but they he talked about his that event,

(10:02):
and he referred to him without any prior knowledge as
the men in black, because they were dressed all in black,
had a hat, dark glasses so you couldn't see their eyes,
and so it was somewhat of a classical contact with
the men in Black. Now, he was thoroughly convinced. This person,

(10:25):
his last name was Harris, was thoroughly convinced that these
things were aliens and not humans because of the way
they spoke. They spoke mechanically, and so now I can't
connect what happened in the past with what I can
talk about as I know, or connect the men in

(10:47):
Black today. Now, we do have within the intelligence community
a group of people that, because we don't call them
men in black, but the public would call them men
in black. We have a special unit within the Air
Force Special Activities Group out of Fort Belvoir, which is

(11:10):
in Maryland. These guys are specially trained gals and girls.
Because there's females involved. They're specially trained to do the
type of work that nobody else wants to or can do.
They operate pretty much outside the law, so to speak,
and they do show up at UFO events or after

(11:32):
UFO events to obtain information that I couldn't get. Me
being a counter intelligence officer, I would go out and
try to get information from a witness or somebody that
had contact with an extraterrestrial and I would have to
operate under the law, within the law. If I couldn't

(11:55):
obtain something, or if I couldn't complete a particular mission,
then I would notify my headquarters, who would then notify
this unit out of Fort Belvoir, and they would send
out the men in black, so to speak. We would
call them that, we call them the the We just
call them the oddmen within the intelligence committee. But we

(12:19):
would send out these men in black to get men
or women depending on the situation and depending on what
type of access we needed to that victim or that
purse witness, and they would come out and they'd get
the information one way or another. Now, I can't speak
for how they do their work or what information they

(12:44):
can get or can't get, but believe me, the few
times that I've used this particular unit out of Fort Belvoir.
They were able to obtain what we needed and how
they did it was up to them. But off the record,
so to speak, they probably were able to break into

(13:06):
a person's house or convince them in some way, whether
it would be a bullying tactic or a strong arm
tactic to release the information that we needed pertaining to
a particular case involving a ufou. These men and women
were dressed, not necessarily all in black, but they had

(13:30):
their own clothing, they had their own appearance, some of
the appearances can be disguised, uh, and they have a
they had a unique ability to act in a certain
way to convince a person to release whatever we wanted them,

(13:53):
whatever information we needed from that particular witness or or
the victim. And so these men and women were especially trained,
highly trained.

Speaker 4 (14:04):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (14:04):
They didn't you didn't just get hired off the street.
Most of them were military. And then in the military,
we have a uh a procedure called sheep dipping. And
what what that meant was we would hire, we would
recruit somebody within the military ranks, whether it was army, Navy, Marine,

(14:27):
or air force, and then we would train them to
do this job and we would consider that job as
human or human collection, human collection of information. Human that's
what human is called. And that's their primary mission is
to obtain intelligence. Uh and so uh. But when after

(14:53):
all the training, which would be military and some civilian
training at d I A and c I A, they
would then be put into the field. There were certain
operating locations all around the United States and all over
the world like actually, and they would operate out of
these secret locations and then they would be sheep dep
meaning they would their military identity would be taken away

(15:17):
and a Saville identity would be placed on him. And
now I almost guarantee you those Savillan identities were not
the real identities. There were fake identities or cover identities,
we call them cover identities so they could do their job.
And so one day they may be John Smith, the

(15:40):
next day they would they might be a Timothy Harris,
the next day they might be somebody else.

Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah, we've got a similar thing in our Yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
We and we worked with we worked with mod we
worked with say yes, I know had a team of
people and fact I was talking about this not too
long ago. We were actually were going to do a
show about this particular unit within the sas, your British

(16:10):
sas that were trained to do some things out of
the ordinary, so to speak, and we trained him. They
picked us a site and we went to the Shetland
Islands and and we trained them. Uh this is back
in the eighties. And we also trained them to do

(16:31):
certain things that're kind of out of this world so
to speak. And regarding extraterrestrials, what if getting sidetracked a
little bit, but what if what if a extra trustrial
race was trying to invade Earth or maybe just a
group of them, how do you fight him? So we
knew how we developed the method and that was in

(16:53):
our Tier one system, meaning our special forces. And so
we did train the British, say as a particular team,
I think it's thirty five of them, how to do it,
how to train them, and it's still probably class some
of its classified. But it wasn't just it wasn't just
a British. We trained the Germans in the French ausele.

Speaker 3 (17:14):
When you say that you knew how to fight an
extraterrestrial threat, can I can you speak anything about that?
I mean you've just kind of threw that cara out
there dangling. I'll be stupid if I didn't ask, how
do you know?

Speaker 1 (17:27):
What?

Speaker 5 (17:27):
Would you say? We knew how to fight? What did
you know how to fight?

Speaker 1 (17:32):
Well? When I say we, I don't necessarily mean me.
I mean our special forces people, our Tier one people,
And you know Tier one is our our best of
the past. Our Rangers are special Forcer, our Delta, our
Navy seals, our Air Force commandos. We Uh, the US

(17:56):
government developed the system. Uh now, let's go back a
little bit. Uh, we have been visited. I think that's
pretty much a given, even though the US government or
the or the nations haven't come out and said, yeah, well,
we'll accept that. But we we have been visited by extraterrestrials.

(18:20):
We found them in crash sites, we've had it in captivity,
we have we have their spacecrafts. So that's a given.
As far as I'm concerned, that's a given. I think
there's so many people out there that have already come
forth and talked about it. Uh, So now we know
that they are here. You know, one of the things

(18:40):
we found out is it's just not one particular race
of extraterrestrials. There's more than one that have visited Earth,
and we've had more than one in captivity. They different
biologics that come from different star groups and and so
they're different. So some of them even we have to

(19:00):
breathe certain atmospheres, such as methane, So we had to
develop away just in case we had to neutralize these things.
And so we found that the ten depending on the
category of extraterrestrials, we could use a particular method, such

(19:22):
as depriving them of oxygen or their environment to neutralize them.
And we also had some high energy tasers. They were
called energy probe back in those days. It's like a
high energy taser that the law enforcement police officers carry today,

(19:47):
but there were high energy because some of the extraterrestrials,
a bullet will pass right through them. If you fire
a nine millimeter or a seven point six y two,
it just goes right through them. They're almost like a vegetab.
It doesn't hurt them. So how do you hurt them.
You have to penetrate their vital organs. So you have

(20:07):
to teach somebody where their vital organs are and and
and so that's the type of method that that we
taught other various special forces around the world, not just British,
but German and French and I think a couple other countries.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
Yeah, I mean it's something that you hear about a
lot without it. I mean, for myself, I was in
the raw Chorps signals, so I was all communications based
and there's branches within my core. That's you know, it
spreads out within special Forces and the special communications type
of work, and that does involve you know, small pockets

(20:48):
of very small teams dotted all over the world. So
I can see how that would how that would work
until you know with the same with what you guys
basically do. It's sort of what a lot of our
guys do as well, where and intelligence the special agent
handling agent handling stuff as well. But one of the
I don't want to I mean, we're getting very sidetracked.
I know he was talking about the Men in Black,

(21:10):
but one of the things that you mentioned there that
I found interesting.

Speaker 5 (21:15):
Was talking about with the with the mood getting involved.

Speaker 3 (21:21):
I know that Nick Pog Nick Pope, he's been one
of the guys that's that's been quite vocal about the
mod and their desk. And we're going to spiral back
round to the Men in Black. I want to talk
about the Calvine incident, which is something that Nick Pope's
mentioned before as having the photo that was blown up
above the desk of the mod well that during that incident.
The men in Black obviously were noted to be on site.

(21:43):
And again they were dressed into and the way that
you described with the heart of the glasses, and they
were they seemed to be unaware of the weather and
the situation around them, the pouring rain. They scared the
Jesus out there. The two chaps, the hikers that had
the photos, they made them hand over the evidence and
be quiet. And the chef was a witness to it,
and he pretty much describe what you described. But what

(22:07):
you mentioned is you came from a group of people
that work within the US Intelligence Service. From what I've
gathered or what other people may suggest, is the Men
in Black themselves seem to be a global organization. It
doesn't seem to matter where these events are happening. They're
tearing up there regardless of whether it's a NATO country
or somewhere that the US would have access into, which

(22:28):
does again suggest that perhaps it's not just a government
or you know, this isn't just a government agency. Maybe
it could be a multinational agency with corruption, you know,
fingers into the tentacles of the military might that is
the US military, you know what I mean, as Eisenhower said,
be where they might of the military complex.

Speaker 5 (22:48):
Do you think there's anything to that?

Speaker 1 (22:50):
Yeah, I think there is. I think that there is
a I know it's a worldwide phenomenon. I've lectured in
and I've lectured in Singapore, I've lectured in UH, Soul
of South Korea, UH, South Africa, New Delhi. I've been

(23:12):
all around the world Manchester, Blackpool, uh, uh, London, Copenhagen, Stockholm.
I'm all over the world, and this is a question
that is brought up at at every I can. I
can't think of one UH lecturer convention I was at

(23:34):
that the question about the men in black hadn't come up.
And they're saying the same thing as you, saying that
they had a new UFO event and these men uh
and and and in some cases a woman would show
up after the event to get information, and so they

(23:56):
they would coing them depending on the languge but men
in black, and so they're connecting those men in black
with the United States, but I can't. I mean, I
don't know everything there is to know about the government
or about how we operated. But I think that there

(24:18):
are some cases where that case that Nick, I mean,
Nick's a good friend of myn In fact, we've just
filmed Nick and I filmed Asian Alien episode which will
air later on this year in California. But that incident,

(24:39):
there's really no explanation of where these two humanoids came from.
I would like to think that they were probably US
personnel station at the base and the UK, or at
a location in the UK that knew about this, But

(25:00):
it doesn't fit the category. Listening to Nick explain it
and the witnesses, it doesn't fit the category of somebody
that I would identify as a man in black. So
you might be right that there is some secret organizations

(25:21):
that's governing these things all over the world. I don't
know about them. I wish I did. I've heard rumors.
I talked to a when I was in Blackpool in
twenty twenty two at a UFO conventionaire, I met an
Inner Pol officer. He worked for in a Pol. He's
British but he was stationed he was stationed in Germany,

(25:45):
and he talked about this, and he said that he
thought maybe that the United Nations had a particular secret
society or secret group that did this. Well, I checked
into it, and I can't find any information on't it.
And I can't say that there isn't. But like you say,

(26:06):
it's just in the United States, but over the world.

Speaker 5 (26:12):
Yeah, it's for sure.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
And if you just allow it, I mean, if you
just connect a few dots with me, if you can
just allow yourself to indulge in a child, let's connect
the dots for a moment. We're talking about the potential
multinational organization here, also known as potentially the Men in Black.
But then you hear other stories about things like maybe
Michael Herrera's case, for instance, where him and a group

(26:33):
of Marines strolled out through the jungle into a clearing
and there was a group of people dressed in black
military paraphernalia, no badge is nothing on display, what looked
to be this huge UFO there, which took off at
a ridiculous pace, and it looked like they were trafficking people.
They looked like they were putting people on board. From
his account, and then recently again we've had the other

(26:54):
from it, Roddy. The new account that's come forward from
Roddy a military manner. Another marine again that's come forward,
said a similar case that him and his patrol they
were out on maneuvers. I think it was somewhere down
your neck of the woods, actually somewhere down in New Mexico,
and they came through this desert clearing what looked to
be this huge UFO and a load of people in

(27:14):
black again black homvies, no badge, is nothing, but speaking
with military accent that basically shusted them, threatened them at gunpoint,
told them to shut up, and then again with that
hierarchy that when the Marines returned to base again told
nothing to basically be quiet about it, and that be it.
Is there a potential case here? Could you make a
connection perhaps with the men in black, these people that

(27:36):
go around suppressing people at doors, basically at the front doors,
and maybe these random groups of what seems to be
mercenaries or military, very highly trained military personnel working with
these reverse engineered craft, maybe for these multinational companies. Is
there a connection there? Do you think if you could
allow yourself to play with that.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
I can I can rationalize at and I can foresee
a company like Lockheed or Raytheon hiring people like that.
We we know, I mean, the public knows that Lockheed
hires X intelligence officers counter intelligence officers. I know some yeah, yeah,

(28:26):
I know some uh former retired or former os I
agents that now work for a defense contractor Boeing, a
Raytheon or or or some of the others. So yes,
I can I can foresee that these defense contractors would
have a unit like that that could go out and

(28:50):
and uh pose as men in black to get information
or to uh to to create some disinformation or deception
operation to keep whatever secrets that the company wants to
keep away from the public. I can. I can foresee that.

(29:10):
And another idea that I think that has been mentioned
out there, not by me, but I think it's a
valid point is DARPA. DARPA is the one that funds
these companies, these these defense contractors. Now, DARPA in itself
only only has about two hundred and twenty five employees,

(29:34):
but they they dealing in about six b and the
twenty billion dollars. Could they have some kind of a
secret out of those two hundred and twenty five employees
of a secret group that did this absolutely, I think
I think DARPA could very be, very well be one

(29:57):
of the guilty parties, so to speak, and sending people
out posts of men in Black.

Speaker 3 (30:05):
Well, again, if we can just allow ourselves just to
play with it, maybe as children think of the people
as well that say, and there are people out there
that do suggest that deals have been struck within the
last sixty years between maybe NHI and certain government entities
that may have been farmed out to these multinational companies.

(30:26):
Do you think that it's possible that there is some
kind of relationship between these companies and legitimate NHI where
everybody's in on it and they are working together the
reverse engineer craft. There are these subterranean facilities where the
bottom floor is strictly for NHI to work and operate clandestinely.

(30:46):
And then maybe there is an element of these men
in Black, these mercenary groups that have been assembled by
these multinational companies, there is an element of NHI embedded
within there which would give credence to what you suggested.
Perhaps in the early days where an Hi were part
of the Men in Black as we know them or
as we knew them, then what do you think maybe
to that as it's just a speculative idea, do you

(31:11):
think there's anything.

Speaker 1 (31:12):
There, Well, you could speculate. You can speculate on anything.
I personally, during my time, in all my time in intelligence,
and I had access to a lot of special access
programs or sense of compartment and information, I never read

(31:32):
or I never spoke to anyone that mentioned any kind
of secret alliance we had with extraterrestrials. So officially, I
don't know. Now I can foresee that maybe that and
I didn't know everything. I didn't have access to everything, Okay,
so obviously it could be happening. I just didn't have

(31:55):
access to it. But I'm saying I've never heard about it.
I heard a lot about about a lot of things,
and a lot of which I can't even talk about,
but that wasn't one of them I heard. But I
can foresee that if we had contact, and we've had
contact over the years with a particular extraterrestrial race such

(32:17):
as the Evens, the one that we found in the
Roswell crash that was alive kept in captivity fifty two,
maybe we formed some kind of alliance with them. J
Rod the extraterrestrial founder the kingman Craft that was working
with US at Area fifty one. A side note on

(32:37):
that I worked at Area fifty one. I was a
counter intelligence officer there on two different occasions, on a
temporary duty assignment there to relieve somebody that had gotten sick. Now,
I saw a vehicle every morning when I walked from
my billets over to the OSI office, I saw this vehicle,

(32:58):
a special vehicle box next with almost like a communications box,
no windows in it, with J j Rod on the
side of it. Well, I thought it was a company.
I never said I didn't know. I was never briefed
in about it. But once I got to the office,
I asked my boss, I said, what's this company called

(33:21):
J Rod? He said, what do you mean? I said,
I see this vehicle every morning and they had Jay
ride on it. What does that mean? He said, you're
not cleared for it? So I said okay. So so
later on I had access to S two. Now everybody
out there is talking about S four, A lazaar is

(33:41):
talking about S four, But actually I knew it was
S two. I went out to S two. I saw
a park there, that vehicle with j right on it,
and Over the time I spent there, bits and bits
of information came out that we had an extraterrestrial that
worked there at US two that was helping us. And

(34:02):
then later on we connected it to the Kingman crash
and that's the history of that. But so we know
we had extraterrestrials working like jay Rod. Maybe there were
more than that. So in that case, yes, we did
have an alliance with it. They helped us with technology
or reverse engineering, and we helped them do whatever. I mean,

(34:24):
I don't know what we would have helped them with,
but maybe biologics, maybe genetics. Maybe we allowed them to
cross breed because we know and I knew that we
had hybrids. Now maybe these hybrids are part of the
Men in Black two. I mean, that's another category of

(34:47):
entities that we know exist. I knew exists when I'm
during my time in I have to be careful, I say,
but we knew that there were hybrids. In fact, if
you go to Gaya you listened to my episode on
the Katie Smith story. Katie Smith was a hybrid and
she worked for OSI. She was a counter intelligence officer.

(35:08):
She didn't know she was a hybrid until an event
occurred in her life where she realized that she was
a hybrid and she had atnomical features that were different
than a human, uh, and other things that were different.
I can't go in in details, but she had and

(35:30):
and then she had a unique unique abilities. I'll just
leave it at that. And so she helped us identify
other hybrids. So we know there were a lot of
other hybrids. So that what's that mean? That means that
at some point in our evolution, extraterrestrials were involved.

Speaker 3 (35:54):
You know, we had we had a reverend on the
other week and we were discussing this and I was
going into date tale with the reverend regarding the Book
of Enoch and the Nephiline and what that means really
and what you know, And you can look around at
two hundred and fifty religions worldwide, I think it is,
and they all mention that there's these gods or whatever

(36:16):
these deities are, these divine entities that take the wives
of the humans. You know, they take the humans wives,
and that's how these deities are born. And you know,
these nephilie and the gods, the giants and all the
rest of it.

Speaker 5 (36:30):
So there is there's a.

Speaker 3 (36:31):
There's a massive religious link to the silly topic as
well as the technological stuff that everybody thinks and knows
of today when they're talking about the the UFOs and
spaceships flying around. But these things are been here a while,
so people are saying, oh, so people think and probably
are going to be around for the future. But which
I'll start tying a bone it now. I know that,
like I said, you're a busy man and you've joined us,

(36:54):
you know, in your own time this evening, and I'm
very grateful for that.

Speaker 5 (36:57):
But one thing I want.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
To do is just just finish off with maybe a
couple of questions, one of which is the hearing coming
up next week in the in the Senate, I believe
the next congressional hearing on UAPs and the declassification of
I don't know what they're trying to do and to
classify anymore. It's having that lost on this topic. Now,
are we going for disclosure or anything else?

Speaker 5 (37:19):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (37:19):
We'll just see what happens. But you've mentioned and alluded
to the fact that this is very compelled, compartmentalized as
a topic, and maybe we'll never get through the red
tape and the bureaucracy. What do you think of the
next hearing coming up next week? Do you believe that
it's going to gain any ground? Could there be something
big coming? What do you think?

Speaker 1 (37:37):
Good question, it's going to be. It's going to depend
on the whistleblowers that they bring for and what the
whistle brolwers are allowed to say. Now, you know that's
a touchy topic within the government. I'm a member of
the Advanced Working Group, which a group of retired almost

(38:00):
all retired intelligence officers or retired military intelligence officers. Some
go back. They've been around a long time. Some of
them are up there in their eighties and nineties and
they've been around a long time, and we are trying
to facilitate a disclosure within the government. We deal mostly

(38:21):
with a US Senate but which is like similar to
your horse house lords. But we try to help them.
We try to assist in identifying whistleblowers or the right
people that have experienced a UFO incinerary event to come

(38:44):
forth and talk about it. Now, it's going to depend
on what the House of Representatives or the Senate will
allow and what the government will allow. You know, we
have three branches of the government, all the secret stuff,
all the intelligence communities, all a military is stuck in

(39:04):
the executive branch of the government. So that means the
executive branch has control over what information can be released
to a legislative branch, right, and they're the right And
so it's a it's a touchy, touchy situation. I don't

(39:26):
imagine I can't imagine disclosure, full disclosure from ever happening,
but I can I can imagine partial disclosure happening. Now,
we're not going to come and open our open the pentagons,
uh vaults, and and since here's what we have, we
here's everything we have, and here's everything that the extra

(39:48):
trust has given us. We're not going to disclose sources
and methods or high technology because we don't want their Russians,
the Chinese, the Iranians, or the North Koreans to get
a whole of any of that stuff. So that stuff
will never come out. But the mere fact that we
have been visited, uh, they've been here, We've gotten things

(40:10):
from them. I think if it's if disclosure is done
in a practical, uh, in an intelligent manner, I think
I think it can happen. Sharing, hearing no, I don't think.
I think we'll get a little bit. But you're going

(40:34):
to hear this phrase. I can't talk outside, I can't
talk to you in the public. I have to go
to a skiff to talk. That's what you're going to hear,
because that's the information, the real, real, real good information
that we want to hear of the public. And I'm
a part of the public. Even though I know some things,
I don't know all I want to hear more. Uh,

(40:56):
that's what we won't hear is what's going to be
discussing the skiff.

Speaker 3 (41:01):
Sadly, I think I think we could both agree that's
probably going to be the case, which leads me on
to the final question. Actually, and it nicely leads on
to it. I think there's a lot of people in
the world talking about catastrophic disclosure potentially being an option.
There's a lot of whispers in the air with potentially
what this three eye Atlas thing may be, and talks

(41:22):
of you know, elevations of consciousness, and you know, Chris
Bledsoe talks about a new knowledge being bestowed upon mankind
in twenty twenty six, which again falls in into you know,
what this potentially could bring with three eye atlasts, and
you know, there's a lot of talk about things happening
within the next couple of years, whether we like it
or not, whether the governments are these multinational entities like

(41:43):
it or not. What do you say to that, Well,
I think.

Speaker 1 (41:47):
The three eye Atlas is a comment. My personal feeling
is a comment. I'm an amateur astronomer. I have a
cabin up in the mountains. I had my small observatory
with my own telescopes. I tracked that thing. It doesn't

(42:08):
have it doesn't show any abnormal amount anomalies. I think
it's a comic. That's my personal feeling. Just be talking.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
Well, there seems to be a lot of information coming
from I mean, Harvey Lobe spoken about it, and then
there's recent information that's come from James Webb that NASA
are finally released, and the thing that they seem to
be very surprised by the amount of light this thing's radiating.
It doesn't seem to be matching with the amount that
should be be radiated from essentially ice particles or what

(42:40):
we would usually see on a comet. It seems to
be making its own light. So they seem to suggest
which seems to be, you know, raising more questions than
giving answers. Whether it's an NHI thing, I don't know.
But do you think something catastrophic in the way of
disclosure could be on the horizon for us based on
how much tiptoeing around the topic and government seemed to

(43:01):
be doing well.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
I think if the government told us everything they knew about,
not just three, there are three other objects that are
in our solar system that unless you pick up an
astronomy magazine or something nobody's talking about, that could very
well be extraterrestrial. But three I atlas.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (43:25):
The thing that a lot of people are a lot
of with within not UFO people, but people within the government. Scientists, chemists. Uh,
you know, I went to college in my in the
chemistry lab. You can create light, you can create you
put certain elements. Now we don't know all the elements

(43:45):
that's in that. We know a lot. I mean, you
can google this and you can see all the different
elements that's in that comment. Uh. Yeah, there's carbon dioxide,
but there's some other could be other elements, and so
you could make its own light. So I mean that

(44:05):
in itself is not necessary. What I find fascinating is
what some people are privately saying that it hasn't necessarily
went full public is the signals that are being generated
from within that comment that are tones and pulses that

(44:27):
we can't answer. I be Lobe can't answer it. Gary
Nolan can't answer it. These some of these other astronomers
that I listen to and I watched I jump on
their website all the time they hear of this. Now,
NASA is not saying yes or no. They're noncommittal when

(44:50):
you ask them, are we getting signals from this? They're
not telling us. So if we are getting signals, obviously
that could be and intelligently being intelligently controlled. Now is
it remotely being controlled or if it is something inside it?
Now there's this other guy, and this guy he's he's

(45:16):
a fascinating person. He's a scientist and I used to
teach math too, So him and I get together and
we talk about things. He's claiming that the signals are
being generated from Pluto to that craft. Now I don't
know if that's true or not, but something, you know,
interesting if it was remotely but it's not going that

(45:38):
it's going fifty eight kilometers per second, which is not
really that fast, but it has changed course. Now can
a comment do that? Yes, you know there's scientists, astrophysics
physicists can say yeah, it can happen, but most say no,

(46:01):
it's on the direct path. And it's not a plane.
You know, you got the Earth in the sun. It's
coming in on a plane, which is really odd for
a comet to do. So there's a lot of anomalies
that maybe we can't answer. And and is it is
it intelligently controlled? And do we know about it? I

(46:21):
wish somebody, I mean, I wish a government would tell
us everything they knew about it. But I do find
that fascinating. But getting back to your your question about
the disclosure, I don't think we're going to get any
fascinating or or earth shattering disclosure during the congressional hearings
next week.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
But do you think, yeah, yeah, I know, I agree
with you. Like I said, I think I tend to
agree with you on that one. I don't think we're
ever going to get that from the official sauces. But
again there's been mentioned of the aliens or a t
n H I taken it into their own hands within
the next few years, and given as the catastrophic disclosure
that people fear, or maybe the government fears. Do you

(47:04):
think that that's a possibility, And maybe obviously maybe not,
you know, forgetting three iye atlas, But do you think
there may be something from the guys above as opposed
to the government, the men in suits telling us.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
Yes. I've listened to John Ramiras, I've listened to a
number of other people speak within our advanced working group.
We have very intelligent people. One particular one talks about
this event that's supposed to happen between August I mean

(47:40):
October of twenty twenty five in August of twenty twenty seven.
There's supposed to be an event, an extra trustoral event
that occurred during that occurs during that time period. Now,
I know that depending on who we talk to, the
dates vary, but I stick with it. I stick with
that timeline because I can't explain exactly why. But there

(48:06):
are people that I think probably would know something a
lot more than I would know, or the public would know,
who talk about that timeline between October of this year
and August of twenty twenty seven. Now, we hope it's

(48:27):
not catastrophic. I hope it's not earth shattering. I hope
it's that end of life event. But I think something's
going to happen. What that is, I don't know, but
I think there's something that's going to happen. And I
think there has been some members of Congress that's been briefed. Well.

Speaker 3 (48:48):
The interesting thing about that is Chris Bledsoe, and he
talks about a lot of these three letter agencies. Maybe
one of them probably maybe it could be one that
you work with. Very interested in him, so much so
that apparently the Pope's got a picture of him in
the Vatican. And he speaks about when the red star
of Regulus aligns with the Sphinx, which is in March

(49:09):
twenty twenty six next year, and a lot of people
have you know, greenlit that astronomers have said, yeah, that
is going to happen. So he puts a lot to that. Now,
when you think about the intelligence services of the company,
you know, those agencies that you worked for, paying close
attention to this guy, do you think maybe there's a
little bit more to what he's got to say than
meets the eye. Initially, just to finish off, and I mean,

(49:31):
I'll let you get off after this can imagine your
teas your dinner's nearly ready.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
Chris Bledsoe has information that the government finds interesting. And
there's a lot more to Chris bloedso Bledsoe then that
we know about you? Are you or I know about

(49:58):
And there are there a are intimate relationships between not
just him, but some others and Intelligence Community is CIA.
So the CIA is I worked with him many times India.
They're interesting, interested in anything that they can get that's

(50:23):
out of the ordinary in a paranormal frame. And that
goes all the way back to the creation of the
CIA back in nineteen forty seven. And because they hired
you know, you go back in the look of the history,
the first twenty people that hired were paranormal people. They
didn't hire the OSS guys. They hired these paranot.

Speaker 3 (50:46):
Why well, I said, you know, when they did declassified
the stargate files, didn't they When I mean, when all
you have to do is take one look at that
and you can understand the kind of people that they.

Speaker 1 (50:55):
Were exactly exactly uh. And there were things going on
back in those days that pertaining to stargates and portals
and time time portals that still haven't been declassified. There
are smart people out there that have figured things out.

(51:19):
The pyramids, the underground facilities under the pyramids, the pyramids
in Sedan that a few people talk about. You know,
the British Empire had a vast amount of knowledge because
they they owned Egypt and in Sedan and back in
the thirties, twenties and thirties. There's a vast amount of

(51:44):
knowledge that the British government has regarding the creation and
some of the strange anomalies, including stargates or time portals
they called them back in those days around the the Sphinx,
and about Sedan's pyramids and Egypt's pyramids, and your government

(52:08):
has it someplace, and I'd like to see what your
government has. I don't know where it's, you know, it's
the Official Secrets Act stuff, but I would certainly. I mean,
I've talked to some people and I did a show
on Guy about what I about a diary that Colonel Blumenthal,

(52:28):
who was a great British expeditionary person he explored the
Egypt back in the thirties, twenties, thirties and the twenties
and the late thirties, talked about strange anomalies occurring in
the pyramids that he found. So there's a lot more.
I just wish that I could. I think I think

(52:51):
there's there's a lot more to that that has ever
been disclosed.

Speaker 5 (52:56):
Well if I could say something on that.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
You know, it's interesting that King Chow's his uncle, Lord Mountbatten,
was very very interested in the UAP, on the Nhi topic.
And it's also very interesting that there are people out
there that think or talk about these religious connections being
in the Middle East, you know, where essentially if humanity
was christened or borned of going in with nine to

(53:21):
eleven being a guys in order for us to be
able to get in because we discovered the location of
say the Ark of the Covenant for instance, being in
Iraq or something else. There are people that make those connections.
And then when you think about these, you know, the
royal family and the Lord mount Batten his connection to
the UAP subject and his interest in it, it could
very well be the case. It could very well with

(53:42):
the case that there is a dark and you know
Clendestine multinational corporation of elites essentially that are pulling the
strings on all of this.

Speaker 5 (53:51):
You know, there are no there's no there's no borders,
there's no nations.

Speaker 3 (53:55):
There is just them pulling the strings globally, which again
would made the militaries of the world being the puppets
going in causing the destruction while they sweep in and
take up these archaeological information sauces, these huge hordes of
information that they're taking and suppressing from the public.

Speaker 5 (54:13):
Maybe there is something to that.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
I don't doubt I don't doubt there I don't doubt
it there is. I find that that subjects be fascinating
that the connections worldwide connections, because I spoke in Japan
a year ago October at a university there in Oklahama,

(54:36):
and there were people came up to me afterwards talking
about some of the things, the connections that they have
their government has secretly with other governments, And I realize
that there's probably there is some entity out there that

(54:58):
control is controlling this m J twelve has probably probably
changed its name, but I think it's a foreign national,
foreign entity. It's not just US, I think, because there's
connections between other countries that could be controlling something. I
know there's a particular person and the Prince of Lichenstein.

(55:24):
I don't know if you've heard that Hans Adam he
has some strange as strange travel at times to the
United States and to other countries. There are people out
there that are talking about him being part of this

(55:46):
conglomerate of of m J twelves or whatever you want
to call him, that is pulling the purse strings.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
Well, if you look at the governments of the world, yeah,
and if you look at the especially if you look
closely at the UK government, Yeah, I know for a
fact that Keir Starmer, a Prime Minister, is part of
a secret society. I know that that's the fact, is
that that's out there, that's your public information. So it
wouldn't maybe it would have been a fast stretch to

(56:13):
think that perhaps the heads of these Masons are these
secret societies worldwide, the very heads the head of the
snake and make up the members of this global union
of multinational interests that control all of this thing.

Speaker 4 (56:29):
You know.

Speaker 3 (56:30):
I don't think it's much of a stretch to think that.
I don't want to spend too much time on it.
I think it's a dark deep state subject that potentially
gets people in trouble and gets visits from people like
we've been discussing earlier on this evening in the call.
But that's I think that's as good a place as
any to finish and take it way more than your time.

Speaker 5 (56:49):
Thank you so much, Rick for jumping on.

Speaker 3 (56:50):
I'm much much appreciated your big name obviously in the field,
and a lot of people listen to what you've got
to say and take what you've got to say seriously.
So honestly, very grateful for you jumping on. Thank you,
You're very welcome, great interview. Thank you, cheers, Rick, Thank
you very much for tuning in.

Speaker 1 (57:08):
Guys.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
What we're going to do is we'll put a few
links in the description of Rick's Geyer information and content
that he was talking about earlier in the show. I
don't know why I pointed up there down there the description.
Please do like and subscribe and share this with your
with your people. The more people that talk about this topic,
the sooner maybe we will get a little bit closer
to that disclosure that we're all yearning for.

Speaker 5 (57:29):
Otherwise, thank you very much for.

Speaker 3 (57:31):
Tuning in for another episode of Across the Pawn and
see you next TIMETTTTTTTS.

Speaker 4 (58:56):
Print System at attend and a stent contact and confect
at the transfer. Plenty