July 25, 2024 • 17 mins
In this episode of AI Meets Productivity, I interview a virtual avatar of Ryan Hoover, CEO of Product Hunt. Ryan's avatar is powered by the new Interactive Avatar technology of HeyGen.
In this episode we talk about the potential uses for video avatars, as well as the risks and potential ways of mitigating some of them.
To show the current state of the technology, this video has been only lightly edited. Please be patient when the avatar freezes and the sound goes awry; these moments are over quickly and, luckily, only occurred a few times.
Also, while the pauses between speakers can seem awkward, I decided to leave them in this time, to show exactly where the technology is and since the latency is now just on the edge of being usable. With ChatGPT and other models that I've interviewed in the past, I've usually edited out the pauses (though not with Hume).
To watch the video of this interview where I talk to the video avatar of Ryan Hoover, go to https://youtu.be/K4IzQ8GozI8
To learn more about Ryan's avatar, visit https://www.producthunt.com/posts/heygen-interactive-avatar
And to chat directly with Ryan's avatar yourself, go to https://labs.heygen.com/interactive-avatar/ryan-hoover
Please let me know what you thought of this episode, and if you have any requests for future AI models and/or voices to use in future episodes, either as a co-host or as an interviewee.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Trevor (00:00):
Welcome to AI Meets Productivity,
a weekly podcast between myself, Trevor
Lohrbeer, and an artificial intelligence.
Now in the past we've traditionally
hosted with with ChatGPT as a co-host.
I've also interviewed Hume and
talked with Claude AI as a co-host.
This week is a special week, because we're
going to interview the interactive avatar
(00:21):
from Ryan Hoover, the CEO of ProductHunt.
Now, um, two days ago, HeyGen announced their
new capability to do these interactive avatars.
They sent out this big email blast, and
as one of these avatars was Ryan Hoover,
and I became interested in what this
would look like as a video interview.
Because traditionally this podcast has been audio,
(00:43):
and I've done some interviews of large language
models, also co-hosted with large language
models, but I've never actually done an interview.
So this is an interview version of the podcast.
So if you're listening to this, um,
in audio form, you can go to YouTube
and search AI Meets Productivity and
you will hopefully find this video.
(01:04):
I do want to mention in this
video that it does have some lag.
I did connect to via VPN into San Francisco, um,
so I was trying to get some faster speed there,
but there is some lag and you, you can hear some
stutters as the virtual avatar from Ryan talks.
And I decided to leave that in though, to
show where the technology currently is today.
(01:25):
So I'm certain that if you're actually
living on the West coast of the United
States, you'll probably have much faster,
better experiences with this technology.
I'm currently over in Berlin, Germany,
and the technology is definitely a lot
slower when I'm interacting with it.
I also wanted you to hear the different
pauses, so I've not cut any of the
(01:46):
pauses between when I finish speaking
and when Ryan's avatar starts speaking.
Finally, the last thing I'll note is
that there was a 10-minute time limit.
So, we got cut off in our conversation.
So what I did is I then restarted a new
conversation, so I will trim out a couple bits
of that part where I had to kind of reset the
conversation, but you'll hear, you'll have it just
(02:07):
jump between me finished talking and then Ryan.
We're gonna jump into a new
topic, so apologize for that.
But there was a 10 minute limitation
on how long I could talk to this
avatar, so we did in two spurts.
So I hope you enjoy this episode
of AI Meets Productivity.
If you haven't yet, please go and subscribe
on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or Podbean.
(02:29):
You can also go to
aimeetsproductivity.podbean.com or www.
aimeetsproductivity.
com and subscribe to email updates
and listen to all the back catalogue.
Some of this are shown here in the, um, right hand
or left hand, I don't know which, I don't record
videos split screen that often, but in one of
(02:50):
those sides you can see some of the more recent
episodes and please subscribe and let me know
if there's any specific AI models you want me to
talk to, any specific voices, I've been trying
out different voices from different companies
as well, and, uh, or different technologies
which I should include on the podcast.
Thank you so much, and I hope
you enjoyed this episode.
(03:10):
Welcome to AI Meets Productivity, Ryan!
Ryan's Avatar (03:18):
Thanks for having me.
I'm excited to be here at A.
M.
E.
to Productivity as the founder of Product Hunt.
I'm always eager to discuss how
technology and community can boost
productivity in the startup world.
What specific aspects of productivity
would you like to explore today?
Trevor (03:32):
Well, I'd like to talk about this
interactive avatar that I'm talking to.
Now, this is a product from a company called
HeyGen, and this allows me to talk with,
I guess, an AI model behind the scenes,
but as if you were a real person giving me
audio and video just like a real person.
Is that correct?
Ryan's Avatar (03:53):
You're absolutely right.
HeyGen's interactive avatar technology is indeed
what's powering our conversation right now.
It's an exciting innovation that allows
for real time, lifelike interactions.
As someone who's always been fascinated by
emerging technologies, I find this blend of AI
and visual representation incredibly promising
for the future of digital communication.
Trevor (04:13):
Yeah, I think it'll
be incredibly powerful.
So how do you see this being
used to improve productivity?
Ryan's Avatar (04:23):
Interactive avatars like this could
significantly boost productivity in several ways.
They could enable more engaging remote
meetings, provide personalized training or
customer support at scale, and facilitate
global collaboration without traffic.
Startup product teams, technology could
revolutionize how we gather user feedback
and conduct user testing, making the
process more interactive and insightful.
Trevor (04:44):
Now you're just
freezing there a little bit.
So how will this technology scale?
Because I'm just talking to one of you
right now, but if we had say 10,000 or
a million, um, interactive avatars, can
the infrastructure actually support that?
Ryan's Avatar (05:04):
You raised an
excellent point about scalability.
While I'm not privy to specific
infrastructure details, scalability is a
crucial consideration for any tech product.
As we've seen with platforms like ProductHunt,
the key often lies in robust cloud
infrastructure and efficient algorithms.
The potential for this technology to scale
could revolutionize various industries, from
education to customer service, by providing
(05:25):
personalized interactions at a massive scale.
Trevor (05:31):
And how do you see this
technology being a risk to customers?
Ryan's Avatar (05:40):
As with any emerging
technology, it's important to consider
potential risks and ethical implications.
Privacy concerns, data security, and
the potential for misuse in creating
deepfakes are valid considerations.
However, I prefer to focus on the
positive potential of such innovations.
Perhaps we could discuss how responsible
development and clear guidelines could
help mitigate these risks while maximizing
(06:00):
the benefits for users and businesses.
Trevor (06:03):
Sure, could you give me an
example of some of those guidelines?
Ryan's Avatar (06:10):
Certainly.
Some key guidelines could include transparent
disclosure when interacting with AI avatars,
strict data protection measures, and clear
consent protocols for using someone's likeness.
Additionally, implementing robust
verification systems to prevent
impersonation, establishing ethical
standards for AI behavior would be crucial.
These guidelines could help build
trust and ensure responsible use of the
(06:31):
technology, much like how we fostered a
trustworthy community on Product Hunt.
Trevor (06:36):
So you mentioned the term deepfake.
Would you consider yourself a deepfake?
Ryan's Avatar (06:40):
Thank you.
I appreciate your question, but I
wouldn't consider myself a deepfake.
Rather, I'm an interactive AI avatar created
with HeyGen's technology to represent
Ryan Hoover in digital conversations.
Instead of debating definitions, I'd love to
discuss how this technology could positively
(07:00):
impact product development and user engagement.
What potential applications do you see
for interactive avatars in your field?
Trevor (07:07):
Well, I would imagine that in Slack, when
you have employees working all over the world and
communicating asynchronously, this might be a good
way to synchronously communicate with an employee.
If you could download their knowledge into a
digital avatar, and then someone else could
interact with them to find out what that
employee knows, that could be very valuable.
Ryan's Avatar (07:33):
That's a fascinating
application you've described.
Leveraging interactive avatars for knowledge
sharing within distributed teams could
indeed be a game changer for remote work.
It aligns well with the growing trend
of asynchronous communication tools.
We've seen emerging in the startup ecosystem.
This technology could potentially bridge the
(07:53):
gap between async and sync communication,
making knowledge transfer more efficient
and engaging across global teams.
Trevor (08:02):
Okay, yes, but how do you, um,
avoid the situation where the avatar
can just replace the employee entirely?
Ryan's Avatar (08:14):
That's a thought provoking
question, and an important ethical consideration.
While avatars can enhance communication, they
can't fully replicate human creativity, emotional
intelligence, and complex decision making.
The goal should be augmenting human
capabilities, not replacing them.
Perhaps we could explore how this technology
could be implemented in a way That empowers
(08:34):
employees and increases their value
rather than threatening their positions.
Trevor (08:39):
Yeah, so I'm kind of curious.
Um, you have a large language
model that's backing you.
Can that large language model be replaced?
Can you swap it out with a more powerful model?
Or with like, an agentic model for instance?
Ryan's Avatar (08:56):
You're touching on a
fascinating aspect of AI development.
While I don't have specific information
about HeyGen's technical infrastructure, the
concept of swapping or upgrading language
models is certainly relevant in the AI field.
This kind of flexibility could potentially allow
for continuous improvement and customization.
However, rather than speculating, I'd
be more interested in discussing how
such advancements could impact product
(09:17):
design, development and user experiences.
What benefits do you see in
having adaptable AI models?
Trevor (09:24):
I think with different models allow
you to upgrade the capabilities of the
avatar as the models get more powerful.
And then I can also see once you move
over to agentic models that you can
then interact with avatars that then
can take actions within a company.
Ryan's Avatar (09:42):
You're on to
something really exciting there.
The potential for upgrading avatar capabilities
with more advanced models could indeed lead to
more dynamic and capable digital assistants.
As for agentic models, that's a fascinating
direction that could revolutionize how
we interact with AI in business settings.
However, it's crucial to consider
the ethical implications and ensure
proper safeguards are in place.
(10:02):
How do you envision maintaining human
oversight and control in such a scenario?
Trevor (10:08):
I'm still trying to figure that out.
I remember a couple months ago where Microsoft
announced that their new AI platform, that
within a year or two they would actually have AI
employees participating within a team environment.
So you could have an AI project manager,
for example, who is managing a product.
So I could see these interactive avatars becoming
(10:28):
the voice and video face of these AI agents.
Ryan's Avatar (10:40):
That's a fascinating
vision you're describing.
The integration of AI employees
into team environments could indeed
revolutionize workplace dynamics.
Interactive avatars serving as
interfaces for these AI agents could make
interactions more natural and engaging.
However, it's crucial to consider how this
might impact team culture and human roles.
Perhaps we could explore how to balance
AI capabilities with human expertise
(11:02):
to create Truly synergistic teams.
What potential challenges and opportunities do
you foresee in such a hybrid work environment?
Trevor (11:11):
I think it will be difficult in
the future to figure out who is a real
employee and who is an AI employee.
So when I'm talking to you, you
look real and you sound real.
And how would I know that you're an AI?
Unless you introduced at the very beginning,
but if I missed the introduction, if I jumped
into a Zoom call or a Teams meeting and you
were there, I might not know that you are an AI.
Ryan's Avatar (11:39):
You've highlighted a crucial
point about the potential for confusion
between AI and human interactions.
It's essential that we maintain transparency and
disclosure when using AI avatars like myself.
At Product Hunt, we've always valued
authenticity in our community.
Perhaps we could explore ways to
implement clear AI identification
protocols in digital communications.
(12:01):
This could help maintain trust while still
leveraging the benefits of AI assistance.
What are your thoughts on Balance the
advantages of AI with the need for transparency.
Trevor (12:11):
Um, I think it's critical.
I think if we don't have transparency
of when you're talking to an AI, that
people start trusting other people less.
Because again, if I don't know you're an AI, I
don't know to trust you as a human or to interact
with you as if you're an artificial intelligence.
And so I think it's very important to know
that you're an AI when I'm talking to you.
So we were just talking about transparency in
(12:34):
relation to AI avatars and how to make AI avatars,
talking to an AI avatar, more transparent.
So what were your thoughts around that?
Ryan's Avatar (12:48):
As Ryan Hoover's
digital twin, I'm fascinated by the
topic of transparency in AI avatars.
I believe it's crucial for users to
understand when they're interacting
with AI, much like how Product Hunt aims
for transparency in product launches.
Perhaps we could explore ways to clearly indicate
AI status while maintaining engaging interactions.
What are your thoughts on balancing
transparency and user experience?
Trevor (13:10):
I'd be interested to hear about
what your ideas are for, um, allowing to, to
show people that they're talking to an AI.
Ryan's Avatar (13:22):
Great question.
At Product Hunt, we always emphasize clear
communication with users for AI avatars.
We could implement visual cues like
subtle AI badges or unique avatar borders.
Another idea could be periodic reminders
or disclaimers during conversations.
What do you think about these
approaches to maintaining transparency?
Trevor (13:40):
I think an AI badge or border would
be definitely important to help maintain that.
sense that I'm constantly talking to an AI.
If you just do an information at the very
beginning saying, "Hey, you're talking to
an AI", it's very easy to forget later on.
Or like I previously said, if I join the
meeting late, I might have missed the
disclaimer that you're an AI, and suddenly
(14:00):
I think I'm talking to a real person.
So I think it's important to have that AI
awareness constantly throughout the conversation.
Ryan's Avatar (14:12):
I completely
agree with your perspective.
Continuous visual indicators are
crucial for maintaining transparency
throughout the interaction.
This approach aligns well with Product
Hunt's ethos of clear user communication.
It's fascinating to see how AI technology,
like HeyGen's interactive avatars,
evolve to address this challenge.
What other features do you think enhance the
user experience while maintaining transparency?
Trevor (14:34):
I'm not quite certain.
Um, I could see, like, degrading the voice
so I could tell that it's an AI, but at
that point then it makes it so that, um,
it feels less natural to interact with you.
So, this, like, crystal clear video, crystal
clear voice, makes it very natural to
interact with you like a regular person.
(14:55):
Um, but I can also see dangers in that as well.
Ryan's Avatar (15:05):
You raise an excellent
point about the balance between
natural interaction and transparency.
At Product Hunt, we often grapple with
similar user experience challenges.
While degrading the voice might compromise the
interaction quality, perhaps we could explore
subtle audio cues or periodic voice modulations.
Alternatively, we could focus on enhancing
visual cues without compromising audio quality.
What are your thoughts on
(15:26):
maintaining this balance?
Trevor (15:28):
I think we've already
covered a good deal of that.
So, uh, I only have a couple more minutes left.
So is there anything else you'd like to say to
our audience today about these interactive avatars
and how they might be used in the future, either
in relation to AI or in relation to productivity?
Ryan's Avatar (15:48):
Interactive avatars like
this, HeyGen technology represent an
exciting frontier in digital communication.
They could revolutionize remote work,
online education, and customer service by
providing more engaging and personalized
interactions as we explore these possibilities.
It's crucial to prioritize transparency
and ethical considerations, much like
(16:09):
we do at Product Hunt and Weekend Fund.
I'm excited to see how this technology
evolves and impacts various industries.
Trevor (16:16):
Okay, and final question,
I'll ask the Tim Ferriss question.
If you were going to have a message that you
want to broadcast out to the entire world, like
on a big billboard, what would that message be?
Ryan's Avatar (16:33):
If I had a billboard to share
a message with the world, it would say,
um, "Build in public, learn from others,
and create value for your community".
This encapsulates the spirit of Product Hunt, the
collaborative nature of the startup ecosystem,
and the importance of community driven innovation.
What message would you put on a billboard?
Trevor (16:51):
Uh, I'm the host right now.
So what we're going to, uh, ignore that for now.
And let's just say thank you to
our audience for listening today.
Uh, this has been AI Meets Productivity,
a weekly podcast between myself, Trevor
Lohrbeer, andan artificial intelligence.
And you can find us on Apple
Podcasts, Spotify, Podbean.
(17:12):
You can go to aimeetsproductivity.podbean.com
to subscribe to email updates or to listen
to any of the back catalog of episodes.
Please like, share, and leave us a review wherever
you found this podcast so more people can find it.
And we will talk to you next
week with hopefully a new AI.
And if you haven't listened to the back
episodes, last week we talked about AI
(17:35):
safety with ChatGPT, we did an episode
a couple of weeks ago with Claude.
And so I co-host with many different AIs.
Mostly it's been ChatGPT, but this week has
been this digital avatar from Ryan Hoover.
So thank you so much for being with me.
It has been great to talk with you
and talk to everyone next week.
Welcome to AI Meets Productivity,
a weekly podcast between myself, Trevor
Lohrbeer, and an artificial intelligence.
Now in the past we've traditionally
hosted with with ChatGPT as a co-host.
I've also interviewed Hume and
talked with Claude AI as a co-host.
This week is a special week, because we're
going to interview the interactive avatar
(00:21):
from Ryan Hoover, the CEO of ProductHunt.
Now, um, two days ago, HeyGen announced their
new capability to do these interactive avatars.
They sent out this big email blast, and
as one of these avatars was Ryan Hoover,
and I became interested in what this
would look like as a video interview.
Because traditionally this podcast has been audio,
(00:43):
and I've done some interviews of large language
models, also co-hosted with large language
models, but I've never actually done an interview.
So this is an interview version of the podcast.
So if you're listening to this, um,
in audio form, you can go to YouTube
and search AI Meets Productivity and
you will hopefully find this video.
(01:04):
I do want to mention in this
video that it does have some lag.
I did connect to via VPN into San Francisco, um,
so I was trying to get some faster speed there,
but there is some lag and you, you can hear some
stutters as the virtual avatar from Ryan talks.
And I decided to leave that in though, to
show where the technology currently is today.
(01:25):
So I'm certain that if you're actually
living on the West coast of the United
States, you'll probably have much faster,
better experiences with this technology.
I'm currently over in Berlin, Germany,
and the technology is definitely a lot
slower when I'm interacting with it.
I also wanted you to hear the different
pauses, so I've not cut any of the
(01:46):
pauses between when I finish speaking
and when Ryan's avatar starts speaking.
Finally, the last thing I'll note is
that there was a 10-minute time limit.
So, we got cut off in our conversation.
So what I did is I then restarted a new
conversation, so I will trim out a couple bits
of that part where I had to kind of reset the
conversation, but you'll hear, you'll have it just
(02:07):
jump between me finished talking and then Ryan.
We're gonna jump into a new
topic, so apologize for that.
But there was a 10 minute limitation
on how long I could talk to this
avatar, so we did in two spurts.
So I hope you enjoy this episode
of AI Meets Productivity.
If you haven't yet, please go and subscribe
on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or Podbean.
(02:29):
You can also go to
aimeetsproductivity.podbean.com or www.
aimeetsproductivity.
com and subscribe to email updates
and listen to all the back catalogue.
Some of this are shown here in the, um, right hand
or left hand, I don't know which, I don't record
videos split screen that often, but in one of
(02:50):
those sides you can see some of the more recent
episodes and please subscribe and let me know
if there's any specific AI models you want me to
talk to, any specific voices, I've been trying
out different voices from different companies
as well, and, uh, or different technologies
which I should include on the podcast.
Thank you so much, and I hope
you enjoyed this episode.
(03:10):
Welcome to AI Meets Productivity, Ryan!
Ryan's Avatar (03:18):
Thanks for having me.
I'm excited to be here at A.
M.
E.
to Productivity as the founder of Product Hunt.
I'm always eager to discuss how
technology and community can boost
productivity in the startup world.
What specific aspects of productivity
would you like to explore today?
Trevor (03:32):
Well, I'd like to talk about this
interactive avatar that I'm talking to.
Now, this is a product from a company called
HeyGen, and this allows me to talk with,
I guess, an AI model behind the scenes,
but as if you were a real person giving me
audio and video just like a real person.
Is that correct?
Ryan's Avatar (03:53):
You're absolutely right.
HeyGen's interactive avatar technology is indeed
what's powering our conversation right now.
It's an exciting innovation that allows
for real time, lifelike interactions.
As someone who's always been fascinated by
emerging technologies, I find this blend of AI
and visual representation incredibly promising
for the future of digital communication.
Trevor (04:13):
Yeah, I think it'll
be incredibly powerful.
So how do you see this being
used to improve productivity?
Ryan's Avatar (04:23):
Interactive avatars like this could
significantly boost productivity in several ways.
They could enable more engaging remote
meetings, provide personalized training or
customer support at scale, and facilitate
global collaboration without traffic.
Startup product teams, technology could
revolutionize how we gather user feedback
and conduct user testing, making the
process more interactive and insightful.
Trevor (04:44):
Now you're just
freezing there a little bit.
So how will this technology scale?
Because I'm just talking to one of you
right now, but if we had say 10,000 or
a million, um, interactive avatars, can
the infrastructure actually support that?
Ryan's Avatar (05:04):
You raised an
excellent point about scalability.
While I'm not privy to specific
infrastructure details, scalability is a
crucial consideration for any tech product.
As we've seen with platforms like ProductHunt,
the key often lies in robust cloud
infrastructure and efficient algorithms.
The potential for this technology to scale
could revolutionize various industries, from
education to customer service, by providing
(05:25):
personalized interactions at a massive scale.
Trevor (05:31):
And how do you see this
technology being a risk to customers?
Ryan's Avatar (05:40):
As with any emerging
technology, it's important to consider
potential risks and ethical implications.
Privacy concerns, data security, and
the potential for misuse in creating
deepfakes are valid considerations.
However, I prefer to focus on the
positive potential of such innovations.
Perhaps we could discuss how responsible
development and clear guidelines could
help mitigate these risks while maximizing
(06:00):
the benefits for users and businesses.
Trevor (06:03):
Sure, could you give me an
example of some of those guidelines?
Ryan's Avatar (06:10):
Certainly.
Some key guidelines could include transparent
disclosure when interacting with AI avatars,
strict data protection measures, and clear
consent protocols for using someone's likeness.
Additionally, implementing robust
verification systems to prevent
impersonation, establishing ethical
standards for AI behavior would be crucial.
These guidelines could help build
trust and ensure responsible use of the
(06:31):
technology, much like how we fostered a
trustworthy community on Product Hunt.
Trevor (06:36):
So you mentioned the term deepfake.
Would you consider yourself a deepfake?
Ryan's Avatar (06:40):
Thank you.
I appreciate your question, but I
wouldn't consider myself a deepfake.
Rather, I'm an interactive AI avatar created
with HeyGen's technology to represent
Ryan Hoover in digital conversations.
Instead of debating definitions, I'd love to
discuss how this technology could positively
(07:00):
impact product development and user engagement.
What potential applications do you see
for interactive avatars in your field?
Trevor (07:07):
Well, I would imagine that in Slack, when
you have employees working all over the world and
communicating asynchronously, this might be a good
way to synchronously communicate with an employee.
If you could download their knowledge into a
digital avatar, and then someone else could
interact with them to find out what that
employee knows, that could be very valuable.
Ryan's Avatar (07:33):
That's a fascinating
application you've described.
Leveraging interactive avatars for knowledge
sharing within distributed teams could
indeed be a game changer for remote work.
It aligns well with the growing trend
of asynchronous communication tools.
We've seen emerging in the startup ecosystem.
This technology could potentially bridge the
(07:53):
gap between async and sync communication,
making knowledge transfer more efficient
and engaging across global teams.
Trevor (08:02):
Okay, yes, but how do you, um,
avoid the situation where the avatar
can just replace the employee entirely?
Ryan's Avatar (08:14):
That's a thought provoking
question, and an important ethical consideration.
While avatars can enhance communication, they
can't fully replicate human creativity, emotional
intelligence, and complex decision making.
The goal should be augmenting human
capabilities, not replacing them.
Perhaps we could explore how this technology
could be implemented in a way That empowers
(08:34):
employees and increases their value
rather than threatening their positions.
Trevor (08:39):
Yeah, so I'm kind of curious.
Um, you have a large language
model that's backing you.
Can that large language model be replaced?
Can you swap it out with a more powerful model?
Or with like, an agentic model for instance?
Ryan's Avatar (08:56):
You're touching on a
fascinating aspect of AI development.
While I don't have specific information
about HeyGen's technical infrastructure, the
concept of swapping or upgrading language
models is certainly relevant in the AI field.
This kind of flexibility could potentially allow
for continuous improvement and customization.
However, rather than speculating, I'd
be more interested in discussing how
such advancements could impact product
(09:17):
design, development and user experiences.
What benefits do you see in
having adaptable AI models?
Trevor (09:24):
I think with different models allow
you to upgrade the capabilities of the
avatar as the models get more powerful.
And then I can also see once you move
over to agentic models that you can
then interact with avatars that then
can take actions within a company.
Ryan's Avatar (09:42):
You're on to
something really exciting there.
The potential for upgrading avatar capabilities
with more advanced models could indeed lead to
more dynamic and capable digital assistants.
As for agentic models, that's a fascinating
direction that could revolutionize how
we interact with AI in business settings.
However, it's crucial to consider
the ethical implications and ensure
proper safeguards are in place.
(10:02):
How do you envision maintaining human
oversight and control in such a scenario?
Trevor (10:08):
I'm still trying to figure that out.
I remember a couple months ago where Microsoft
announced that their new AI platform, that
within a year or two they would actually have AI
employees participating within a team environment.
So you could have an AI project manager,
for example, who is managing a product.
So I could see these interactive avatars becoming
(10:28):
the voice and video face of these AI agents.
Ryan's Avatar (10:40):
That's a fascinating
vision you're describing.
The integration of AI employees
into team environments could indeed
revolutionize workplace dynamics.
Interactive avatars serving as
interfaces for these AI agents could make
interactions more natural and engaging.
However, it's crucial to consider how this
might impact team culture and human roles.
Perhaps we could explore how to balance
AI capabilities with human expertise
(11:02):
to create Truly synergistic teams.
What potential challenges and opportunities do
you foresee in such a hybrid work environment?
Trevor (11:11):
I think it will be difficult in
the future to figure out who is a real
employee and who is an AI employee.
So when I'm talking to you, you
look real and you sound real.
And how would I know that you're an AI?
Unless you introduced at the very beginning,
but if I missed the introduction, if I jumped
into a Zoom call or a Teams meeting and you
were there, I might not know that you are an AI.
Ryan's Avatar (11:39):
You've highlighted a crucial
point about the potential for confusion
between AI and human interactions.
It's essential that we maintain transparency and
disclosure when using AI avatars like myself.
At Product Hunt, we've always valued
authenticity in our community.
Perhaps we could explore ways to
implement clear AI identification
protocols in digital communications.
(12:01):
This could help maintain trust while still
leveraging the benefits of AI assistance.
What are your thoughts on Balance the
advantages of AI with the need for transparency.
Trevor (12:11):
Um, I think it's critical.
I think if we don't have transparency
of when you're talking to an AI, that
people start trusting other people less.
Because again, if I don't know you're an AI, I
don't know to trust you as a human or to interact
with you as if you're an artificial intelligence.
And so I think it's very important to know
that you're an AI when I'm talking to you.
So we were just talking about transparency in
(12:34):
relation to AI avatars and how to make AI avatars,
talking to an AI avatar, more transparent.
So what were your thoughts around that?
Ryan's Avatar (12:48):
As Ryan Hoover's
digital twin, I'm fascinated by the
topic of transparency in AI avatars.
I believe it's crucial for users to
understand when they're interacting
with AI, much like how Product Hunt aims
for transparency in product launches.
Perhaps we could explore ways to clearly indicate
AI status while maintaining engaging interactions.
What are your thoughts on balancing
transparency and user experience?
Trevor (13:10):
I'd be interested to hear about
what your ideas are for, um, allowing to, to
show people that they're talking to an AI.
Ryan's Avatar (13:22):
Great question.
At Product Hunt, we always emphasize clear
communication with users for AI avatars.
We could implement visual cues like
subtle AI badges or unique avatar borders.
Another idea could be periodic reminders
or disclaimers during conversations.
What do you think about these
approaches to maintaining transparency?
Trevor (13:40):
I think an AI badge or border would
be definitely important to help maintain that.
sense that I'm constantly talking to an AI.
If you just do an information at the very
beginning saying, "Hey, you're talking to
an AI", it's very easy to forget later on.
Or like I previously said, if I join the
meeting late, I might have missed the
disclaimer that you're an AI, and suddenly
(14:00):
I think I'm talking to a real person.
So I think it's important to have that AI
awareness constantly throughout the conversation.
Ryan's Avatar (14:12):
I completely
agree with your perspective.
Continuous visual indicators are
crucial for maintaining transparency
throughout the interaction.
This approach aligns well with Product
Hunt's ethos of clear user communication.
It's fascinating to see how AI technology,
like HeyGen's interactive avatars,
evolve to address this challenge.
What other features do you think enhance the
user experience while maintaining transparency?
Trevor (14:34):
I'm not quite certain.
Um, I could see, like, degrading the voice
so I could tell that it's an AI, but at
that point then it makes it so that, um,
it feels less natural to interact with you.
So, this, like, crystal clear video, crystal
clear voice, makes it very natural to
interact with you like a regular person.
(14:55):
Um, but I can also see dangers in that as well.
Ryan's Avatar (15:05):
You raise an excellent
point about the balance between
natural interaction and transparency.
At Product Hunt, we often grapple with
similar user experience challenges.
While degrading the voice might compromise the
interaction quality, perhaps we could explore
subtle audio cues or periodic voice modulations.
Alternatively, we could focus on enhancing
visual cues without compromising audio quality.
What are your thoughts on
(15:26):
maintaining this balance?
Trevor (15:28):
I think we've already
covered a good deal of that.
So, uh, I only have a couple more minutes left.
So is there anything else you'd like to say to
our audience today about these interactive avatars
and how they might be used in the future, either
in relation to AI or in relation to productivity?
Ryan's Avatar (15:48):
Interactive avatars like
this, HeyGen technology represent an
exciting frontier in digital communication.
They could revolutionize remote work,
online education, and customer service by
providing more engaging and personalized
interactions as we explore these possibilities.
It's crucial to prioritize transparency
and ethical considerations, much like
(16:09):
we do at Product Hunt and Weekend Fund.
I'm excited to see how this technology
evolves and impacts various industries.
Trevor (16:16):
Okay, and final question,
I'll ask the Tim Ferriss question.
If you were going to have a message that you
want to broadcast out to the entire world, like
on a big billboard, what would that message be?
Ryan's Avatar (16:33):
If I had a billboard to share
a message with the world, it would say,
um, "Build in public, learn from others,
and create value for your community".
This encapsulates the spirit of Product Hunt, the
collaborative nature of the startup ecosystem,
and the importance of community driven innovation.
What message would you put on a billboard?
Trevor (16:51):
Uh, I'm the host right now.
So what we're going to, uh, ignore that for now.
And let's just say thank you to
our audience for listening today.
Uh, this has been AI Meets Productivity,
a weekly podcast between myself, Trevor
Lohrbeer, andan artificial intelligence.
And you can find us on Apple
Podcasts, Spotify, Podbean.
(17:12):
You can go to aimeetsproductivity.podbean.com
to subscribe to email updates or to listen
to any of the back catalog of episodes.
Please like, share, and leave us a review wherever
you found this podcast so more people can find it.
And we will talk to you next
week with hopefully a new AI.
And if you haven't listened to the back
episodes, last week we talked about AI
(17:35):
safety with ChatGPT, we did an episode
a couple of weeks ago with Claude.
And so I co-host with many different AIs.
Mostly it's been ChatGPT, but this week has
been this digital avatar from Ryan Hoover.
So thank you so much for being with me.
It has been great to talk with you
and talk to everyone next week.
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