RECLAIMED GROUND: Ep 2 Violence In Delaware Schools

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:38):
Hey, everyone, welcome to Reclaim Ground.
Tonight we are going to be talking about our schools and
the environment and what is going on in our public schools
here in Delaware. Katie, if you want to talk a
little bit about what we're going to talk about tonight and
then I'll open this up. We're so happy to have you guys
on our second episode of Reclaimed Ground Media, and the

(00:58):
topic tonight is going to be about violence in the schools.
And we're going to go beyond theheadlines.
We're going to go into the hallways, the classrooms, the
counselor rooms and into the homes of people that are
actually affected by this crisis.
So, Katie, when I was preparing for this, you know, this has
been an incredible week getting to meet so many people that are

(01:18):
on the front lines of our schools and, and people reaching
out to us, some that feel very comfortable with talking with
us, some that, that are afraid of retaliation of, of what they
may say as well. And it's been very interesting.
And, and I had a whole thing prepared, but right before we
met, I wanted to share with all of you my job, my duty here at
home is dishwasher. So after, you know, after the

(01:42):
meal, I, I washed the dishes andI was listening to a song by the
belonging company. And the part of the song, it's
called the mighty name of Jesus.And a part of the song goes, I
draw a permanent boundary line. The enemy has no right to come
near my family. I love that song, Brian.
And that just kind of stuck withme about what we're talking

(02:03):
about tonight. And what we're talking about
tonight is the violence that's going on in our schools.
And how do we draw a permanent boundary line to say this is not
OK? And where do we bring these
professionals in that deal with this on a daily basis and say
what direction are we headed? And also what do you see from

(02:24):
being in the these professional settings as the positive ways
that we can move forward and howhow can help kids and families
on the ground level? Absolutely.
It's so important to get to the root cause of what the issue is
and treat the root cause or elseit's never going to stop.
And what we hear day in and day out are families that are sick
of the way the system is currently and want a change.

(02:47):
They're afraid to send their kids to school every day, even
if they're a student that genuinely just goes to learn.
They're finding themselves caught in the crosshairs of
school violence one way or the other.
And another thing that I was notexpecting so heavily when we
announced the topic of tonight was the amount of teachers that
would reach out and say, hey, I have a lot to add on this topic,

(03:07):
but I unfortunately can't be a guest on the show because I'm so
afraid of retaliation from speaking out about this.
And it shouldn't be that way. These teachers and the staff,
even the administration at the school should have a safe place
to go to work. And if things are not feeling
that way, or if there's a problem in that workspace, they
should have the opportunity to voice that without feeling

(03:29):
retaliation from doing that. Yeah, that's absolutely right.
So Katie, can you bring us before we jump into our guests
and we've got some an amazing guest tonight, Can you bring us
up to date with some of the datathat you found on the national
level but also in Delaware as well?
Yeah, absolutely. If we can bring that up right
real quick, when we were preparing for this episode, we

(03:50):
really wanted to make sure to Get the facts absolutely correct
so it could really drive home what the problems were and some
of the statistics that I found when we were looking into this
story. With more than 67% of public
schools reported at least one violent incident in the 2021 to
2022 school year, the rate of students exposed to school

(04:11):
shootings has nearly tripled from 19 per 100,000 students in
the 99 to 2004 era to 51 per 100,000 students up to 2024.
From 2020 to 2024. A recent study actually found
that the number of school shooting incidents annually
increased from about 20 in 1970 to over 250 in 2021.

(04:35):
With when you crunch those numbers, it's more than a
tenfold rise. According to the National Center
for Education Statistics, duringthe 2019 to 2020 school year,
15% of public schools reported bullying among students at least
once a week. These these children are having
to go to school and even on their way to school, they have

(04:56):
fear that this is about to happen. 15% of public schools
reported bullying among studentsat least once a week. 16%
reported cyber bullying at leastonce a week.
So not only are these children being subjected to this while in
the halls, while in the classrooms, they get no reprieve
when they go home under the homefront either.

(05:17):
From the School Pulse panel, about 30% of public schools
reported that cyber bullying happened at least once a week or
more frequently. And regarding classroom
disruptions, 22% of schools saidthat students being disrupted in
the classroom, which would be calling out, talking with others
during instruction, leaving seats when not allowed, they had

(05:39):
severe negative impact on their learning.
When you look at when you take adeeper look into these
statistics, the Rand Corporationand other research showed that
20% of school fights occurred about once a month and weapons
were confiscated in about 45% ofthese instances.

(05:59):
The statistics on bullying, unfortunately that does not get
any better. From 2021 to 2022, roughly 19.2%
of students aged 12 to 18, whichwould be I believe, grades six
to twelve, reported being bullied in the US and the
classroom was the most common location for bullying. 39% of

(06:20):
bullied students said the classroom was where this was
happening. So thank you, Katie.
Do you want to bring this a little bit back home to to
Delaware as well? Those were some great
statistics, but I know you have statistics for some schools here
or home. And then we'll bring up our
first guest. Yeah, I do.
And this, this information also guys, if you want to look it up

(06:40):
independently on your own as well, you can go to the School
Report guards, you can go to thedata sets provided by our
government. That's all publicly available
information to pull any statistic from any school in the
state of Delaware. I just tried to get a little bit
of a broadview on these statistics.
So when I was looking at state data, 1 Delaware high school,

(07:02):
which we're going to keep anonymous for the sake of this
conversation, reported 195 police level incidents of
violence this school year alone.And across Delaware, another
major high school reported 145 violent incidents this year,
another recorded 150. And others with a little bit
smaller of a population in the schools show about 40 to 50

(07:26):
series incidents even in smallerstudent populations.
Thank you, Katie. There's definitely been an
increase in and we've heard parents from across the state
and kids from across the state reach out.
There are Facebook and social media pages about, you know,
fights that are going on. And that's why we wanted to go

(07:47):
ahead. Gabe, you look like that.
I'm. Sorry that that absolutely my
mind. So a bunch of parents
independently, separately from different schools, explain to me
that this is more than just disagreements between students,
that there are student LED accounts specifically on
Instagram where the students record these fights they share

(08:09):
amongst the different schools. So they can cover all different
schools in this and they post them.
And so the question kind of led to their children.
We're saying that a lot of thesefights are breaking out, not
really because there's such an issue that these children aren't
mostly regulated enough to handle, but it's specifically
for posting on these accounts. And I went to some of these

(08:31):
accounts now, some of them were banned by the time I got to
them. It does look like Instagram is
doing a fairly good job of taking these down as soon as
they get a hold of them or as soon as they're reported, But
there were some that were still active with a ton of videos on
them. And that's, that's one of the
reasons why we wouldn't bring onour, our first guest, Joey

(08:52):
Melvin. He has been before I give a
quick intro. The reason why I, I believe he
has been so successful is because he's always looked at
how can I create a positive environment in the schools of
what's going on between the community and within the school
itself. And I have seen him do that

(09:13):
inside of schools here in Delaware.
And he has really brought schools that have had problems
with violence and discipline andbeen able to work the, the SRO
system in order to, to benefit these kids and benefit their
lives. So Joey Melvin, he is, he serves
as the executive director of theDelaware Comprehensive School

(09:36):
Safety Program. He is leading statewide efforts
to enhance school safety throughout comprehensive
planning, training and resource development.
He's got a career that spans over 2 decades in law
enforcement and school safety, safety and he brings experience
in crisis response, behavioral threat assessment, school based
policing and emergency operations.

(09:58):
I personally know him from his work as being an SRO in
Georgetown and also in the Milford School District.
And when I wanted to know something about what was going
on environment in schools, I, I went to Joey because he always
reminded me of somebody who said, hey, we got to get to the
kids. We've got to work with the kids.
And they are the ones that are that can make this positive,

(10:21):
positive impact. So welcome, Joey.
Thank you so much for joining ustonight.
Yeah, sure. Happy to be here.
Yeah. So, so tell us in, in your
opinion, what, what do you see, you know, working as a school
resource officer and, and working As for the state of, for
the state, working amongst thesedifferent school districts?

(10:44):
Where, where do you see the, thestate of the environment of, of
these schools? Where do you see the good and,
and, and maybe not so good and, and, and where do you see that
we could, we can improve on these things?
Yeah. I think first, it's really
important just to note that thisis fluid, right?
So our climates in our schools, you can be very subjective based

(11:07):
on where you're at and your personal experiences, right?
So when you talk to people, and I talk to a lot, right?
So in, in my role as a school resource officer and in two
different agencies working in schools from elementary to
middle to high to dedicated special needs, you know,
perspective changes, right? You can talk to some.

(11:27):
And I think it's just really important to know as we discuss
these things because you can't one, you can't take a cookie
cutter approach to dealing with this.
But to kind of answer your question, I think it's it's a
mix of a lot of strengths, but at the same time a lot of
challenges. And these schools are

(11:47):
microcosms, other communities and being that we have, you
know, external factors that impact the things that we see
and experience. And we also have the internal
struggles as well. So, you know, not to give you a
kind of blatant answer, but it really can't.
These, these things ebb and flow.

(12:08):
I've, I've been in it in it longenough to see it first hand.
See different things impact the schools, right?
You figure when I first started,social media just started.
So I can literally talk about how that has impacted the, the
culture and the climate of our buildings.
When I first started, it was as soon, it was not long, probably

(12:30):
about 5-6 years when Vape showedup.
Well, if you talk to any kind ofschool and see specifically what
that did to the environment, it's, it's, it's, it's really
interesting. So, so again, not to give you a
kind of a, a singular answer, but it's, it's, it's complex,
but there are a lot of strengthsin our schools as well.

(12:51):
Yeah, tell it, tell us about, I think we've had a conversation
about this before and I, I find it very interesting.
Tell us about the nature of, of,of bullying and, and what kids
go through before the advent of social media and now with social
media that the difference that, that maybe even their parents
don't know about. Because the the just the climate

(13:14):
and the things going on with social media are so much
different than maybe we we had to go through when we were in
school. Yeah.
So you think about what we had to deal with.
We would have an incident at school and it could be singular.
It could be ongoing harassment, but for the most part, at the
end of the day, you got home andyou were separated from it.

(13:34):
So you had some points in time where you didn't have to deal
with it. Our students today, it's 24/7.
It doesn't stop, right? So, and that with the advent of,
of social media cell phones and what we see when we study what
children's, their experiences are the victims, they actually

(13:55):
seek out this stuff and they seek it out because just like
anybody else, a lot of people like, I want to know who's
talking about me, right? So while you would think it'd be
easy to say, just turn off your phone, just suspecting that
people are discussing you, talking about you, making fun of
you, they actually are kind of seeking it out and end up being

(14:16):
re victimized. So that that's that's been a
tremendous paradigm shift in thein the world of bullying.
Just the cyber perspective of itis, is really compounded it.
And I think certainly that coupled with, you know, our our
rise and increase in mental health resource needs in the
community, in the school, they definitely parallel each other.

(14:41):
Yeah, how, how do you personallyand, and, and how do you teach
other individuals in the schoolsto, to educate children and
maybe even their parents about the the dangers of, of social
media and kind of this, this newer age bullying or that that
could lead to violence inside the schools?
Yeah. The one thing that I say, I

(15:01):
think it's really kind of positive about that would that
we see in our schools is, is taking integrated approaches.
And I think, you know, in defense of schools too, you need
to look back at, you know, what,what a school supplied 3040
years ago to a family is so different today.
Like, if you could think back, and I'm not calling my or your

(15:24):
age out, but when you think backabout resources that were
available when we were in middleschool and you look at what's
available today from a resource,it's they a lot of schools have
had, you know, kind of been forced to become resource
centers to support the communitybecause they are their kids,
understandably. But with that, what we see is,

(15:46):
you know, increased roles with, with mental health, that
integration, there's, you know, multi tiered system to support,
you know, so we have people and I think that's a big part of it
too, that, that, that connectivity between and within
the school. I know my role as a school
resource officer and, and the other Sr.
OS, I'll speak for them. We do so many things within the

(16:08):
building, but we don't just workwith the administrator, we're
working with the administrator, We're working with a counselor.
We may be talking to the food service staff, right?
So it's this network that has really grown and it's really
been a positive thing because, you know, in the past maybe
people weren't promoted to be, you know, bystanders and

(16:30):
witnesses and report things. And now it's, it's, it's a
community. And, you know, while I
appreciate, you know, there's concerns for the schools, I, I
really think it's important thatwe acknowledge that, that these
things have occurred. And I know, you know, data is
really important and I know Katie mentioned it, but you
know, a couple things I try to make sure people remember.

(16:50):
I think, I think the lens has gotten bigger.
So it seems like there may be some more transparency of things
going on. But you know, statistically,
like juvenile arrests for instance, in the past 20 years
have dropped almost 50%. That's that's crazy to think
about. But our arrest rates for

(17:10):
juveniles has done nothing to godown on a local level.
We're seeing very similarly. And again, it, it's, it's, it's
hard to perceive when you, when you, when you think about
people's perspectives. But school crime data, which is
more your, your assaults and your weapons.

(17:33):
Just between the, the, the 23 and 25 school year, it dropped
by 250 incidents, right? Like, like that's, that's a lot
of incidents of, of more of yourkind of felony crimes that, that
we saw lower. But I, I think what that goes to
is there's a couple things. One, there's a lot more

(17:53):
reporting it like part of our mission at Dover School Safety
Center is, you know, we, one of the things that we do is provide
all schools in the state with a,with a reporting anonymous
reporting platform. So we will give this to the
districts and it provides another tool to encourage
reporting. And we know if there's a way, a

(18:15):
method for a student or sometimes even a parent to
report something they're concerned about anonymous,
anonymously, we're going to get increased reports.
And I think that's kind of what you're seeing too with some of
that data, right? We're going to see an increase
in reports of, of bullying. I, I think perception, whether
that's negative or not depends on how you view it, right?

(18:35):
Like because we're, we're askingnow that we've provided them a
tool to do it, we're going to increase, we're going to get
more reports, but it allows for more intervention.
So it's kind of it's, it's interesting to follow and I
think it's important to see bothperspectives, the sides of it.
So. Joe, you were talking about the.
Sorry, Katie, did you have a? Yeah.
I have a question on that. So when we're just for me to

(18:56):
understand too, when we're looking at that data, does that
data come from what is being reported from students and
families or does that come from after what is reported from
students and families, what thenthe administration and the
schools go on to report? Right.
So I guess it depends on what, what data point you're
referencing. But the school, the, the, the
local data I was referencing actually comes from department

(19:17):
education and that's, that's public data, part of their
school discipline plan report, right.
So they have that broken down toeach year and you can go in and
see like school crimes. And again, those are the ones.
And then they have even the discipline discipline records.
So that discipline would be something that didn't reach a

(19:38):
school crime, but that dropped by 5000 incidents in, you know,
2325 S So again, and and there could be some different things
that could impact that, but that's where that data comes
from that when they actually code it within department
education in that. So after incidents are escalated
from the families to the schoolsand then escalated from the

(19:58):
schools to the Department of Education, that is that final
number that we're finding on the.
Web, right, That's the that's the numbers from the public
schools that wants it's coded whether you know it could have
occurred in school and or it could have been reported outside
of school. But either way, if it ends up
being a school incident and theythey coded as a crime or

(20:18):
discipline, whatever that be that that that's the final
number that goes in that yeah. And, you know, I can speak and
again, just to speak on numbers,I think it's important like
data. So I look at, you know, we have
the juvenile civil Citation program in Delaware, a
tremendous program. I was very happy to be a part of

(20:40):
its inception. Sr.
OS are one of our biggest advocates for it.
And it's a, it's a way to keep, you know, kids from being part
of a criminal justice system, right?
You know, it. And, and, but one of the things
that we do is, is intervene. So that's that's going to help
with that decline juvenile arrest, right?
We're, we're issuing A citation.It's civil.

(21:02):
And if they successfully complete the program, that's
going to drive the numbers down.I think, you know, I spent a lot
of time digging into data because I think it's important,
but it's also understanding thatthat data is as important,
right? Really analyzing like what are
they saying? Because sometimes that that the
perception could be misconstruedand I need to like educate
myself on that. And I encourage the parents and

(21:23):
everyone to do the same thing. Really understand what you're
reading and what you're hearing.So Joey, I one part, one piece
that I found find very fascinating about SRO.
Is there SRO's, is there impact on the community as well?
And we had something recently inMilford where there was a kid

(21:46):
who was part of a, a carjacking over a, a weekend period.
And then the, the Police Department in Milford
orchestrated with the SRO because he was, I, I believe, 17
years old and said, hey, do you know who this kid is because he
may be in your school. And he said, Oh yeah, he's going

(22:06):
to show up for her school today.And they were able to, before he
was able to get out of his car, they were able to arrest him and
they found pistols in his car, ammunition in his car.
And can you, can you tell us about how Sr.
OS work with the law enforcementof that community?

(22:26):
And they they are able to communicate with each other and
sometimes prevent things from happening not only in the
schools but also in the community as well.
Yeah. So, you know, when we look at
the SRO program and, and you know, when I teach Sr.
OS across this country, you know, one of the biggest things
is, you know, 1 making sure thatthey're carefully selected,

(22:47):
right? Not, not every cop should work
in the school, just like, you know, every cop should be on the
narcotics undercover team or whatever.
You know, it's a specialty. But also they're getting
properly trained about what thatrole is and interesting about
that role. Like a lot of people don't
understand the history, but the first Police Department to do
this was in Flint, MI in 1950s, right?

(23:10):
So there's a deep, deep history back then.
And that wasn't for any other purpose.
That chief said, I just want to make sure that we're, we're a
part of this community. And I understand that that
school is a part of the community.
And, and I think that's important.
So when we look at schools, taking your officer, putting
them in the hallways, and now you're done, right?
You're, you're positively branding your department, right?

(23:33):
You're building that trust. And I saw this in the towns that
I worked. It was, it was, it was a great
feeling to be able to be in thatschool building relationships.
And I would see it in the summerif I had to, you know, cover a
shift and I'm out on the street.It was interesting because those
those kids in those communities would would run up to the SRO,
but they wouldn't be doing that for every officer.

(23:54):
It was just interesting because you had that, you had that, but
at the same time you build that trust so that but when you're
not there and it's 2:00 in the morning, there's been a
traumatic incident. That officer that shows up
wearing the same patch and uniform you are is going to help
breakdown those barriers. Also within the school.
Kind of going back to what you were saying, building those

(24:15):
relationships from a preventative standpoint, SRO,
you know, they're not there to just serve as, you know,
executive protection and walk around outside the building.
The most important thing they dois build relationships with the
people that are in that building.
Some of my most positive relationships were born out of

(24:36):
students that, you know, had a lot of trauma and we broke that
down and even it could have beentheir parents that didn't have a
positive relationship with police.
But I was able to build that relationship and it just kept
going and going. So if there was information
about school safety, many times the students would come down to
my office, report it to me directly and whether that was in

(24:58):
the community, something that they saw or something they
thought it was going to happen in the school building.
That trusted relationship with that entire population, it is a
really important part. And on top of that, I'll just
say it's not just that it's also, you know, it's, it's in
the name resource being a resource to the school.
So, so talking to the staff, helping them feel like, you

(25:22):
know, you're a trusted part of that school as well, whether
it's administration, the Emergency Management portion,
it's, it's really comprehensive.But but but it again that SRO is
just a part of that integration of the different supports for
those students. Thank you, Joey.
Katie, do you have any other questions for for officer?

(25:43):
I do. I have one other question that
comes to mind. I cannot remember the school
that it was occurring in, but I believe it was last week and
students that had come to the school early had been gathered
in the gymnasium awaiting to go through metal detectors to enter
the school. And during that period of time,
one of the students actually pulled a knife on another
student. Thankfully, another Good

(26:07):
Samaritan student intervened andno harm came to the student that
was on the victim's side of that.
However, from your standpoint, it does it make sense to have
students gather in an area whilethey wait to go through metal
detectors? Or should that be done before
they ever enter into the school building at all?
Yeah, I think the, I think something to think about is

(26:31):
there's, there's two points at every day that you're going to
gather the students, right? And there's, there's really no
way to do that without kind of doing it in a mass, right?
Because you've got to think about our schools, you know,
some of our lower population schools, you're thinking about
what, 500 students. And when you're trying to

(26:54):
logistically get them in, out ofthe building, it's not something
you're going to be able to easily do, whether you're
implementing different safety precautions or not.
I, I don't, you're going to havelarge groups coming in your
building 2 times a day or going and leaving two times a day.
And there's really, you know, logistically, there's really no

(27:14):
other ways to do that. There's, there's things that can
be looked at. And I'm not going to speak for
any other school. And I think when we meet with
schools specifically and we lookat, you know, we do a lot of
physical safety assessments of schools up and down, down the
state, you know, so those are things that we look at.
We look at arrival, we stay there all day.
We look at wayfinding, how the students move inside the

(27:36):
building and we look at dismissal and we apply safety
practices to all that. But at the same time, we have to
keep it practical, right? And, and I see this a lot with a
lot of things in the, let's justsay the school safety industry
right now. And I think we need to make sure
that we, we, we stay practical. And, you know, those incidents

(27:58):
certainly cause a lot of attention to it, but we have to
look at, you know, how often those incidents are occurring
and that's, that that needs to be applied to that specific
building area. Again, couldn't make a a cookie
cutter decision for that. I think, I think just hearing

(28:20):
that though on the parents side,hearing that you guys are going
through those lines to evaluate the schools and all these little
factors will make parents feel alittle bit more comfortable that
everything that is meaningful and realistically can be
implicated, you guys are lookingout for and doing.
Thank you so much for answering that question, Joey.
Yeah, Yep, Yep. As we work with our, you know,
our schools and like I said, we have tremendous relationships

(28:43):
with all schools throughout the state, public and private.
And you know, I can tell you first hand the, the, the
discussions that we have is, is,is, you know, deeply caring
individuals that want to do the best for our kids.
And you know, again, I just would, would repeat that, you
know, we deal with kind of a fluid environment.
We learn sometimes some of thesebest practices we're playing

(29:04):
catch up with, and that's nobody's fault.
That's just kind of the way way it goes.
We see the same thing again in our communities, right?
As we see rising crime for different things, we think about
how to combat that. We have to do that.
And I think taking that comprehensive approach is, is is
really our best way to do that. Joey, I want you to know that in
the comments right now, a lot ofpeople are giving thanks for our

(29:25):
SROS and saying that our SROS are amazing and you guys make
such a difference. So I want you to walk away from
this conversation knowing that you are very appreciated.
And I think that I, I, after reading these comments while
you're speaking, a lot of peopleare very thankful that you came
on tonight to give your perspective.
So I thank you for that too. Yeah, thank you so much, Joey.
And you're you're, you're you'refree to go.

(29:46):
But thank you so much. Thank you for all the, the, the
service you and the SROS. You have our backs at our
schools and we appreciate you going around our, our
communities throughout the stateand, and helping make sure that
we are starting to secure in a practical way throughout our,
our to to help save our kids. So thank you so much.

(30:07):
So we're going to continue the conversation, but thank you,
Joey. Yes, thank you so much that that
was actually very insightful. And it's nice being able to see
the comments of people as they watch this because that's an
important thing for him to know.It has to be to some degree a
little bit of a thankless industry when you're dealing
with that day in a day out. But on the parents side, they
are so thankful for Sr. OS being in our building.

(30:30):
And I do think they make such a difference.
And that's why I was a huge advocate behind the bill that
you introduced that would require Sr.
OS to be in every building. If we can bring in our next
guest, that would be Rachel Herskowitz.
I'm going to give a brief introduction so our audience
knows who we're speaking with. Is Rachel with us now?
Hi, Rachel. Hi.

(30:51):
So now we're going from, we're going inside the counseling
office, the emotional crisis fueling school violence.
Our 2nd guest tonight is Rachel Herskowitz, the President of the
Delaware School Counselor Association and a veteran
educator who has dedicated more than two decades to Delaware
students. Rachel spent 12 years in the
classroom before transitioning into school counseling, where
she is now in her 11th year serving the students out in

(31:13):
Mount Pleasant High School. In fact, Mount Pleasant has been
her professional home for her entire counseling career.
For the past eight years, she has also served on the board of
Delaware School Counselor Association, helping shape
statewide support systems and advocacy for student mental
health. And we're grateful to have her
perspective here tonight. Ladies and gentlemen, Rachel.

(31:34):
Thank you, I'm happy to be here.It was kind of last minute, but
I'm glad I was able to jump on. Your perspective is a very
important one that we really wanted to make sure that we got
somebody to cover because we canhave teachers in here giving
their experiences from inside the classrooms and parents on
the home front seeing what theirkids come home and talk about.
But you're in the nitty gritty of it all.
You're listening day in and day out and you have a perspective

(31:54):
that could really shine a light on the why the why to this is
happening. I wish I actually knew the why.
Yeah. Yeah.
And Rachel, I have to, I have toopen up by telling you that my
father was a guidance counselor in Seaford Middle and High
School for 30 years. And I was telling Katie earlier

(32:15):
that so he would meet with families and, and they would
assume they would say, well, you've got it easy because
you're a guidance counselor, so your son must be perfect.
He doesn't, so I don't know if you have children or not, but
guessing about how you're laughing, you know how how he
answered that I don't know. I don't know about all that.

(32:36):
So but thank you for all the work that you do in the schools.
Thank you for your continued leaning into these kids because
they are a future and they are where we where we need to
continue to to lean into. So Katie, did you want to open
it up? Yeah, I just want to hear from
Rachel. I want to see what she is
seeing. I want to hear what she

(32:57):
experiences day in and out and think, try to find out if
there's any root cause specifically to maybe some of
these increases that we are seeing.
What do you see, Rachel, from being inside of these schools
every day? I think I was, I was listening
to the SRO who I have a great relationship with in my building
and they are instrumental. And I think the key thing that

(33:21):
he said is building that community.
Unfortunately, I also was listening when he was talking a
lot about social media. And I think to me that's the
root cause. We haven't increased.
Fortunately, I'm not seeing fiveviolence, which is great in
schools, but I'm aware of violence my kids are in in the

(33:44):
community and I'm seeing more ofthat being brought into the
school than ever. I think a lot of small, smaller
like gang related situations, which I wouldn't have seen 15
years ago are kind of being brought in.
So it's we have a great, we havea very good culture at the

(34:08):
school I'm at and no argument. Nothing is ever over
socioeconomic class. It's never over gender.
It's never over race. It is never ever over that.
It is over something that stemmed on social media or
something that someone said a post they made, someone taking
someone's boyfriend or girlfriend or something that

(34:30):
went horribly wrong in the community.
So there's I'm seeing a lot moreof things going horribly wrong
in the community in which these students are living.
And I think it runs that incident last week was at Laurel
High School, which is as far South from Brandywine School
District as you can get where I'm at.
So it's all over. I mean, it runs the gamut.

(34:51):
And I think from talking to friends at middle and
elementary, I was blown away to know what elementary school kids
are doing and things they're bringing into schools.
And elementary kids are bringingin vapes every single day in all
districts across the state. So I think it's it's getting
parents to understand the severity.
But unfortunately, a lot of times the parents are supporting

(35:13):
their kids in these endeavors. And that's the part that I
struggle with the most. Yeah, so from a very uninformed,
educated, uneducated standpoint,when I'm hearing about a lot of
these instances, because I have tons of nieces and nephews and
I'm so grateful that they give me the nitty gritty of what
they're experiencing. But when they're telling me
these stories, it seems like a lot of these instances of a

(35:35):
problems between students kind of stemmed from a self perceived
pride. Almost like their pride was hurt
in something. It is very true and a lot of it
is self perceived. And I think as school
counselors, we really try to educate our students on making
good choices and, and all stemming from kindergarten and

(35:55):
kindness and making good choices.
And we are in the classrooms teaching lessons and we're not,
we're not guidance counselors anymore.
We're school counselors and we are actually to say the word
guidance counselors very it's, it's a no anymore 'cause we are
just not guidance creating smallpopulations of students.
We are school counselors. We're in and out of classrooms.

(36:17):
We do groups. We we look at the data to see
what the needs of our school areand we run groups to teach
students the appropriate ways. We're doing what we can on our
end. We love when we hear families
follow up and I will say one of the big things, I think I see
someone in the chat room something and the SRO brought up

(36:39):
the videoing of fights. It's real.
I watched it. Unfortunately, we had a
situation the other day and the first thing they do and whether
we have a students that are highor highest end students, they
are and they were videoing as well.
So it has become and it gets. That's what I was.

(36:59):
I was upset about the fight, of course, but I was the most upset
to watch the number of students take out their phones and record
the fight. It was like a spectator sport,
and it was. It's terrible.
Absolutely. And that also relates back to
what we were talking about earlier with social media being
a large part of the issue. And especially something that
stood out that you mentioned on were the younger grades, the the

(37:22):
elementary school grades having some of these problems.
And one thing that came to mind when you were talking about
that, and we're talking about the social media and really just
screen time overall, it feels like kids of this generation are
more emotionally dysregulated and don't really know how to
handle when something doesn't gotheir way or how to handle an

(37:45):
adverse emotional response that their immediate thing to hop to
is violence or fighting with somebody or calling them out.
However it is phrase. Do you think that there could be
a correlation with what screen time, especially at a young age
does to a kids brain, especiallywhen we're talking about those
dopamine receptors and the way that they are capable or

(38:06):
incapable of handling those conflicts?
Yes. I think the generation that I'm
seeing wants instant gratification and they want
things done instantly. They want response instantly,
they want reaction instantly. They want to see it in front of
them. And I do attribute a lot of that

(38:26):
to the amount of time they spend.
And it's not just on the screen,it's the video games that they
play as well. Yeah.
So, right, so I have a question for you.
We're going to get, we're going to talk to to teachers here
tonight as well, or a teacher who has recently retired.
But is it almost, do you feel like your job is almost
reteaching a value system that has been lost about, you know,

(38:49):
what things should these kids value?
Because maybe the baseline that they come from is valuing the,
the wrong things in, you know, instant gratification to some
extent, you know, money, what whatever it may be, what do you
see them coming in the door valuing?
And and what are you kind of what are you trying to teach

(39:13):
them as far as more than just onyour end, reading and math, but
what kind of social constructs are you having to teach them?
We have to teach them everything.
Unfortunately, a lot of studentsare not coming in with knowing
values and unfortunately a lot of them are coming in from
seeing what they see within their communities.
And a lot of time that's violence.

(39:34):
A lot of the thing about Delaware, I mean, I grew up in
New Jersey and when I moved here, I thought, wow, like you
can be in like such a wonderful area with such high
socioeconomic needs and like a block over is just Section 8
housing. And it's it's a lot of our
students are in summer admit andit's coming together.

(39:57):
And some of them they just don'tknow.
And the parents are working. They're trying to put food on
the table. A lot of them are from single
family households and I don't know that it.
At birth, someone's reading books to them on on making these
choices and how to do these things that we're teaching it.
Fortunately, we do have a curriculum starting in
kindergarten where they are taught these things.
There's a mental health curriculum, there's a social

(40:18):
emotional health curriculum. And I'm very fortunate that we
are in Delaware where these havebeen put into law.
To have these in our schools andthey start teaching them in
kindergarten and we now have them in high school too.
But to learn them at a young ageis key.
And yes, we are re teaching it in our classroom lessons.
We try to, even if we're in there talking about credits and

(40:39):
graduation requirements and postsecondary education, we're still
throwing in some of those basic lessons on just how to be a kind
human and make good choices and not necessarily have to have
that. And I think one of the big
things is working with our kids on setting goals and, and where
do they see themselves and just having a purpose.

(41:00):
And I think starting that at a young age and, and knowing that
like they can be more than they see.
And unfortunately, I have tons of students each year that's
parent, one parents incarceratedor one parent they've never knew
when it's just kind of working through like you can be more and
you can do this. And just like setting those

(41:21):
goals to to see the big picture.How do you encourage them to do
that? How do you walk them through
that process? It's not easy.
I'm sure that's not. Some of them just don't see that
they don't care for school. School is not something they
like. A lot of them have received
failing grades almost their whole life.

(41:43):
So by the time they get to high school, it's like, why am I
here? Oh, I'm here because I'm going
to go to truancy court. If I'm not or my mom tells me I
have to get up and go to school absenteeism, I can.
That is for a whole nother day. That's a huge issue, issue
nationwide. The amount of kids that are late
to school every day is a huge issue.
I know it's not just Delaware. I do a lot of research on that

(42:05):
and look at different data, but just getting the kids to school
and getting them to understand the value of that.
I think we do a lot of goal setting within our classroom
lessons, definitely in our smallgroups.
So we'll look at data and we'll look at the kids have the top
tier referrals. We do have tiered system, Tier
1, Tier 2 and Tier 3 of MTSS support.
So we'll look at our students that are in the highest need and

(42:27):
look at what they need, group them together and kind of base
our lessons on that. And it typically always centers
around some sort of goal settingbuilt in to make them start to
really see like I can do more. Do you have any theories?
Sorry, Katie, go ahead. Go.
Ahead, you're good, I'll. Save them up here.
Do you have any theories of, of how, and maybe I'm wrong on

(42:49):
this, but, but it, it feels likewe've gone maybe not the last
generation, but it maybe the twogenerations ago where, where
education was very highly valued, no matter what
demographic you were, no matter what socioeconomic and maybe
even more if you are lower socioeconomic, because you under

(43:10):
you understood that that would be your way to climb out.
And, and do you have any theories or you know of, of why
maybe that is declined of that being placed as a value in our
society or or in in certain people's minds?
I, I don't really know the why and I asked me that self that
every day of when did we lose that?

(43:32):
I think it's gone downhill a little bit since COVID.
I think being able and from kindergarten through 12th grade,
them seeing that they can do school online has changed things
a lot because I will often get some of my most unmotivated
students telling me that they want to go online and remote and

(43:53):
virtual. And we don't have that option in
our district unless it's a severe need.
And I know there are some districts that do.
So I think some of that was lostin COVID.
I used to be like, I'm tired of using COVID as an excuse and I'm
tired of these kids, but using COVID as an excuse.

(44:13):
But John, like if I had to really dissect it, I do think
since COVID it had that has drastically changed because kids
got to see that you can do it and they don't value coming into
the building as much. And they think like, oh, I can
just go online. That's like my the bait.
The main thing I can I can thinkof.

(44:35):
One of the things somebody brought up in our comments that
I really wanted to touch on their direct quote was kids
can't value education because education has no value.
And that kind of brings me to something that I have been
talking to a couple state representatives about.
I'm somebody that believes very much in universal school choice.
So not choosing within the districts, not having the choice

(44:56):
to me to go out of your districtto a specialty vo tech school,
but having all schools essentially operate like vo tech
schools. All schools have a specialty in
a very specific specialty, whether it be graphic design or,
or as a broader way you would incorporate like audio visual
into that kind of that side of things.
One school of sciences, if kids really want to be nurses or

(45:17):
doctors or the science is behindit.
I think putting a system in place, not not using the same
system, but putting a system in place that incentivizes and
enthuses kids to be attending school.
They want to get their own time,they want to learn and not
having these general education classes where kids are having to
go into English and they're having to read about 18th

(45:39):
century poets, like, let's be honest, none of us want to do
that. And it's not really important.
The important part of those curriculums is the reading and
it is the developing the comprehension from that.
So if you have specialty schoolswhere the topic is is all online
with your niche and the profession you want to go into
and reading class, instead of learning about poets, you're

(46:00):
you're reading material on your,I guess you would call
specialty. Do you see any value in a system
like that, which really kind of makes kids enthusiastic to go
and learn again? I do see some bites that I do
think. Again, I think school choice is
like a whole another thing. I think it can help a school

(46:22):
could It can also significantly hurt a school.
I think we have wonderful vo techs in the state of Delaware,
but they're different than some of the neighboring schools.
Like when I was in high school, you went to vo tech if you were
not going to college, you went to Votech to learn your trade.
Now our kids are going to Votechand they're going to four year
universities. We have a lot of different

(46:46):
pathways in most of our comprehensive high schools in
the state, but they're pretty. They're not everything that kids
want, right? Like so they're not.
So I do think if they saw more value in like they'll say to me
every day, why do I need algebratoo?
I'm never doing. Something with this in my life.
So I do think giving them something to see more value is

(47:09):
helpful. It's just kind of like it just
seems like a big task that wouldbe great if it could be done.
I think it I think it at least deserves the research into
something like that, if not thatspecifically because like you
said, kids are attending these vo tech schools now and they're
going on to four year degrees. So if we now, if we make art

(47:31):
schools, if we make, which I know there are art schools, but
if we make these specialty schools that kids are just going
to, and I mean, learning algebraand how to figure out those
equations is important. But if you relate it back to
that pathway or that specialty, it becomes less of a burdensome
task and a boring task and more about, well, I'm interested in
audio visual. So if I need to figure out the

(47:53):
pixels or whatever, I don't knowthat I need for this to do this.
Maybe it would trigger somethingdifferent within them that would
kind of make them interested in that curriculum again.
Yeah I think the learning the why, getting them re interested
is is huge. Yeah.

(48:14):
Another question I wanted to ask, which was brought it back,
it was brought up in the comments a little bit, is I'm
probably going to upset some people when I say this.
I'm a homeschool mom. We do homeschool Co-op where we
go in class. And over the years that we've
been a part of something like this, I've never once witnessed
any type of altercation even between students, not even a
slight altercation in a school setting.

(48:35):
So I'm wondering if having students that are being forced
to interact with people they just don't get along with day in
and day out and go and see them every day.
And like you said, now they're not only doing it in schools,
but now they have to go home andthey're in the same friend
circles and they're seeing them.Does that create extra tensions
that could be alleviated in sometype of a different system?

(48:57):
I think we try to teach studentsto be like overall, like good
citizens global, how to get along with people they don't
necessarily like. I have probably 13 conversations
a day of like you guys don't have to be best friends when
you're in the same class and youneed to show respect.
And so I don't necessarily get along with all my Co workers,
but we're professional and we sowe try to teach like, even

(49:20):
though you might not like you don't have to hang out with them
outside of school, but we need to respect each other.
So I do think yes, but I do think I as a school counselor,
like social integration is huge to me.
And it's actually, research shows like for kids with severe
anxiety, like keeping them home is detrimental.

(49:41):
So I, I'm a believer in kids being in school if they can.
There are, you know, and I'm notand I know a lot of kids that do
want to go and they do to go to home school.
And as long as they have that social interaction, like, you
know, not just in a whole totally online and they never
interact with anybody else, that's their interaction, right?
That's what works for them. But I am they do think it's

(50:03):
important to teach kids how to interact with others.
It doesn't always go so well, but we try.
Yeah, No, I, you guys are doing your best.
You really are. I'm just trying to think, I
think fixing a failing educationsystem, which at the end of the
day, despite all the best efforts, and whenever I get
online and I talk about schools or things happening in schools

(50:24):
or proficiency rates, it is never in my opinion and coming
from me as a reflection of the teachers, because I do have as
many teachers may get upset as soon as they, you know, this
topic of school gets brought into the picture for just as
every single teacher that may begetting upset about that.
I have teachers in my inbox thanking me for talking about
that and bringing light to thesesituations.

(50:45):
But the, the reality is our school systems are failing and
they're failing terribly. And not only are they failing
terribly, but they're failing these kids and then we're
passing them on into the real world.
If you look at some of the statistics from some school
districts, not for anyone schooldistrict, some other school
districts, they're having proficiency rates in the 30s for
reading and even lower in the low 20s for math.

(51:08):
And then if you look at the graduation rates, even if we're
just looking at 12th grade and we're not considering any other
grades as factors, there's an 89% graduation rate.
What we're doing is we're not getting through to as a student,
We're not teaching them the value and the skills needed to
be a productive member of society in the real world.
But then we're just saying thanks for being here, good

(51:29):
luck. And and that's not working out
because there's a direct correlation between that and
crime as adults. For sure.
And I, I say to students all thetime as a high school counselor,
this is the first time that you can say school really counts
because you don't go anywhere ifyou don't earn the credits.
And middle schools and elementary schools, if you look
back when I retain my students that don't pass in 9th grade,

(51:50):
when you look back at their school records and I look in the
system to see how many times they've been retained, probably
on average 4 times starting fromkindergarten.
So they, and they've been socially promoted typically
because they don't hold them back as much.
But when you get to high school,you you're not promoted until
you pass the class. You're not.
And so it's a hard, awake, rude awakening for a lot of them when

(52:10):
they get to high school. Now, I was I was told that
specifically I believe it's the Red K school district.
They have a 50% policy where they are not allowed to grade
students less than 50% no matterwhat.
Anyone. It's yeah, so.
That seems horrible in my opinion, because if you're I
understand the idea. You don't want to discourage the
child, but at the end of the day, the job is to set the child

(52:31):
up for the real world where there's not going to be people
there offering extra credit and stuff like that.
So to have this 50% policy that no matter what the child gets
50%, even if they're not in attendance, just seems
counterproductive to the end goal of making productive
members of society. I'm glad we could see eye to eye

(52:54):
on that. That's one thing that I was told
that and I believe they said theperson that reached out to me
said the only curriculum that did not pertain to was drivers
Ed. So thank God for that.
Yeah, drivers Ed, yeah, you haveto pass the stating family to
get the it's a 70 or 80 and you have to pass the actual driving
part. So drivers Ed is not a 50%.

(53:14):
All right. Well, thank thankful for that.
Brian, do you have any more questions for Rachel?
Rachel, you've been an amazing guest tonight.
You Can Answer To had some really great conversation that I
think will really resonate with viewers.
Yeah, I have plenty more questions, but we got to get to
our other guests. Rachel, I hope that we can
connect over a couple of calls here.
I have so many more questions for you.
Thank you. Thank you so much.

(53:35):
Thank you. Rachel, that was a great
conversation. I think we that was really,
really great conversation. And it, it makes perfect sense
that coming up and following Rachel as a school counselor, we
also have now a retired teacher to kind of give us her
perspective from what she was experiencing inside of the
classroom. So if we could bring up Deanna
Balecki, I want to give her a quick introduction.

(53:56):
So our viewers, you know who we are speaking with tonight.
Hi, Deanna. Joining us tonight is Deanna
Balecki, a recently retired educator who's 27 years year
career in Delaware's public schools span grade K through 5.
Deanna holds certifications in elementary and early childhood
education as well as a master's degree in reading.
Over the course of nearly 3 decades, she taught in the Red

(54:19):
Clay and Christina School District and was featured as one
of Delaware's top teachers in Delaware Today magazine in 2022.
And Deanna, that was a fantasticpicture of you, by the way.
Beyond the classroom, Deanna hasbeen a strong advocate for both
teachers and students, serving as a union representative at the
building and state levels, and even as a national delegate.

(54:40):
Most recently, she contributed to the 2024 School Behavior and
Climate Committee, offering public comment, insight, and
outreach on the growing challenges inside of our
schools. We're honored to have Deanna's
perspective tonight, and I'm very excited to have this
conversation with her so she canenlighten us in what she was
seeing. Hi there, and thank you so much

(55:01):
for giving me the opportunity toparticipate and share stories
that I'm sure so many people in the background of education are
jumping up and down and saying, yes, share my story.
I feel like I'm finally retired and it doesn't matter.
I can share many thoughts. Yes, yes.

(55:23):
And I by the way, I highly recommend the retirement
aspects. Deanna, can you start with us?
Tell us about that, that hesitation.
Where does that come from? And who is the, the why is the
hesitation there? And what it what is the
hesitation about? Now I can tell you in my
industry what it would be, but but tell us a little bit about

(55:45):
maybe individuals that aren't inthe teaching profession.
Well-being a professional, you don't want to be foreseen as
gossiping, but there's also privacy issues similar to what
you would experience in like HIPAA.
There is a fear of retaliation depending on administrators.

(56:06):
So there's, there's different, there's different parts of that.
And also more recently, there was a lot of uproar when Charlie
Kirk was assassinated and then people started sharing thoughts
on social media. We were even told at one point

(56:28):
when social media first started coming out.
But be careful about things thatyou post.
Even if it's you're on vacation and you're holding a drink, that
could be seen as, you know, you could have consequences for
that. So that's, that's basically
where I think a lot of educatorsare coming from.

(56:50):
Yeah. Yeah.
That makes sense. It's, it's hard.
It's it's hard for us as non educators to wrap our head
around it because as far as I'm concerned, I feel so badly about
the teachers that reach out and say that I can't say anything.
Like, thank you for speaking out.
If you could hear this story, itwould be great because I can't
personally say anything. And I imagine it has to be so

(57:10):
hard to be in an environment dayin and day out where you're
experiencing these things that severely impact your day-to-day
life and not just your day-to-day life, but your
perspective. And then you also can't talk
about them. Correct, not into the degree
which would with you would like to even when an incident occurs

(57:32):
and you're you have to share theincident with like a victim's
family, you're you're pretty much restricted from sharing the
other person's name or the otherstudents names involved.
You have to let their students share the name.

(57:53):
So it it is, there's a lot of restrictions and feeling like
your hands are tied in many situations.
Now I know. Now I know that.
Sorry, Katie. No.
You're. Good, you're good.
I, I, I'm just, I, I know that there was a survey done by the
DSCA that said one in five and, and it was taken by teachers

(58:15):
and, and there was one in five teachers said that they had been
physically assaulted by, by students.
And I, I found that, first of all, I found that very
interesting because that was notthe culture that was in the
classroom, at least where I was when I was in, in, in Milford.

(58:35):
But then as I talked more to more and more teachers, even
teachers that said I wouldn't have said that I was, you know,
on a public survey that I was physically assaulted.
I have definitely been physically assaulted.
So what what has been your experiences with inside the
classroom and do are there, you know, what can you say about

(58:58):
that? So what I can share with you,
and as Katie shared, I've had a lot of experience being a
building Rep for the union and just like an advocate, because
that's my, that was my whole purpose of my career, to
advocate for educators and our students.
That was my purpose. And I think you could talk to

(59:20):
thousands of teachers that can share that they've been injured
in some way, whether on purpose or not on purpose.
I even, we even had a teacher atone point who became disabled
from a student injuring her and she had to quit as a result of

(59:41):
that. She had she's just disabled and
very little, there's very littleconsequences and accountability
on the side of students, but as well as families.
There's, there's daily and even worse than the physical, there's
daily verbal assaults because that's what they are.

(01:00:04):
And there's it's just becoming part of the common daily culture
with. With the the trauma, people talk
about trauma that happens at home, but there's daily trauma
happening at school around the classroom.
And I, I can share a personal story of a student that, that my

(01:00:29):
classroom experienced probably weekly, weekly, if not daily at
some, at some point interruptions.
And this is a student who was not even in my grade.
He was in the hallway. So you've got kids that aren't
even in your classroom. And this student had come into

(01:00:54):
the classroom and he would open doors, He would just interrupt
and talk. He would come up to the, the
board and start pushing buttons.And this child had what's called
a one-on-one paraprofessional that was following him because
of his behaviors. But then again, that's pretty
much what they do, the paraprofessionals.

(01:01:18):
And I think, you know, if, if you ask how did we get here,
'cause I think that's what a lotof people are wondering.
So yes, the root cause is the lack of accountability for the
students and their families for the behaviors.
The it's been, it's been happening incremental over time.

(01:01:40):
And this is from preschool, kindergarten on up.
So it's not just a high school, middle school problem.
Although we heard from the resource officer that a lot of
that social media happens more at the middle and high school
level versus the elementary level.
But you, you still have equally as disturbing behaviors.

(01:02:02):
I can, I can tell you there was a report of a kindergartner that
was made, not one, but multiple,multiple instances of overtly
sexual behavior and assaulting. And they had to have an
unofficial one-on-one staff member follow this child around

(01:02:26):
so he wouldn't do anything to other students.
It's just crazy. But when you think about it,
we've had a disintegrating nuclear stable family sense of
entitlements from students and as your other speakers shared, a
loss of values and respect for authority and education.

(01:02:50):
At one point, if you look at Delaware laws, we had federal
and state laws that talked aboutaccommodating accommodating like
least restrictive environment and faith and students with
Disabilities Act. So what happened at some point,
if you look at the Delaware history, we had a place to put

(01:03:14):
students that with severe mentaldisabilities and they at some
point in the early 2000s startedmoving them to the general
population without the training resources and that that was a

(01:03:34):
disaster. So you can imagine, I can, I can
tell you one staff member, when the, the year this first rolled
out in our school was dressed every day for work like she was
going to a nuclear meltdown because of one student who and
she only had one student who would hit kick, spit, bite.

(01:03:59):
That's just it. It just shouldn't be acceptable.
And I, I, I don't care what the disability is.
I feel like we've made so many excuses and you hear COVID,
COVID, COVID, yeah, COVID is part of it, part of it.
But I think it has revealed what's been happening
incrementally. Also, we've had more demands

(01:04:22):
placed on not just the educatorsbut also the students, and
that's created some, well, it's created a lot of anxiety with
students and mental instability.This this sense of failure and
lack of success. So throwing more money at the

(01:04:44):
problem is not the answer and throwing a new curriculum is not
the answer. When you look at older
generations, they learned how toread with a simple Dick and Jane
and Doctor Seuss. So it's it's the kiss.
Keep it simple, the KISS method and we and as I as you mentioned

(01:05:08):
before my bio, I had tried to participate in that school
behavior and climate committee. I had an extensive conversation
with Representative Brian Townsend, but I feel like
everything that my colleagues and I put forth and I had sent
you the whole documentation thatwe worked on and that was all

(01:05:32):
volunteer. It was all in our time.
A 17 page document with an impact statement problem
solution and the research behindit.
I feel that the majority of thatfell on deaf ears,
unfortunately. Deanna, I'm going to make that
document, if it's OK with you, available for people to check

(01:05:54):
out and see the work that you'vedone.
But as you're telling me about these stories, and I'm really
having a hard time getting past that kindergarten story.
You know, when I talk about these things on social media,
there's always almost a constantbattle between it's the school's
fault and it's the parents faultand the parents want to say no.
It's the schools and the schoolswant to say no, it's the
parents. But let's be so honest.
And so for real, there's equal blame to be paced because a

(01:06:15):
kindergarten, a kindergartner doesn't enter a school
organically knowing something isgoing on in the home front for
that kindergartner to know aboutthat at 5-6 years old and B to
think that that's OK at 5-6 years old and it's also live on
the schools because this there'snot anything find that the

(01:06:36):
protocols. Are not followed.
For these districts that discipline these children
accordingly and I understand that obviously kids that have
five of four plans and Ieps likethere there's different needs
that they have. But at the same time, when it
comes to certain behavior such as you mentioned, it's not fair

(01:06:57):
to expose other students and risk them just to kind of
curtail to what this student needs.
Yes, I I totally agree yeah, feel free.
I'm I'm more than happy to shareanything that that we have
uncovered. And if also, if you think about
it too, it's not just in the schools.

(01:07:19):
You know, if you look on the news, there was all this civil
unrest in DC and big cities, andthen you'll see a lot of these
teens that get arrested. And the, the sad truth is these
teens know that they're underage.
They're going to be a revolving door and there's no
consequences. So there's a pattern and a

(01:07:41):
common theme of no consequences.And one of the solutions that I
had proposed in that document was if a child gets suspended or
does an offense of, of a severe nature or repeated offense, then
we should have set up supports in place so that the child needs

(01:08:05):
to get either some kind of mental health support, a outside
and or parents need parenting classes or families.
Because we don't really, we havethat nuclear family has broken
down. That's sort of the minority.
And I think that it's a trickle down effect.

(01:08:26):
One thing has impacted the other.
Another thing that stood out to me that you had mentioned was
how the older generations learned with Dick and Jane.
They, they learned the old school weapons.
It's not the curriculum that's the issue.
I'm wondering, do you, have you seen or do you believe there's
any correlation negatively with this implementation of tablets
and computers and Chromebooks inevery classroom as young as

(01:08:48):
preschool and kindergarten? Yes, yes.
And there are studies that will say that it is detrimental to
children. Well, think about it.
And it's detrimental to us, You know, we're we're replacing
human interaction and problem solving with sticking a device
in their face. And I know there was an

(01:09:11):
experience that you had shared before on your platform about
another child in Colonial District.
And it starts with my precious child thinking you don't have
the support. Well, you know, do you wonder
how much, how much screen time that they had?

(01:09:31):
You know, they the kid gets homeand they're just, they're handed
a phone, a tablet, a computer ora game and something the human
interaction is becoming a, a lost art.
It actually, there's been studies that have been done and
when I go into my talks about this, because I could be here
all night, I could talk to you about the difference in food the

(01:09:53):
kids are eating now and the lackof nutrition that they're
eating. There's so many factors that
play into it, but when we're specifically talking about
screens, there is a chemically, the brain chemically changes the
more time you have and that that's an as an adult as well.
But when you're a child and yourbrain is developing and your
brain is like this sponge, the dopamine receptors that are

(01:10:15):
going haywire through these shows that kids are watching
that permanently and alterly it,it changes them, it changes
their ability to function, it changes their ability to
concentrate. And that's not to say that
there's not in a lot of instances, some instances an
actual condition present. But when kids are on before
they're gone to school and they're getting constantly

(01:10:36):
overloaded with dopamine and dopamine and dopamine and
enjoying what they're watching, it's no wonder why when they get
in a classroom setting with a book, if there's a book ever in
a classroom setting anymore, they can't.
Concentrate. That is correct.
You could. You could juggle standing on
your head and spit fireballs outyour behind and you're not going

(01:10:57):
to hold their attention. Absolutely, yeah.
Well, I think that I think that's a good image to Deanna.
Thank you so much for bringing the perspective of a a teacher
to light. Yeah, go ahead.

(01:11:18):
Go ahead, Dan. I just wanted to add, you know,
so some people wonder, you know,what can I do and become more
aware as parents? So some tips that I just wrote
down is, you know, obviously getinvolved with the PTO and school
board meetings and be vocal and speak out.
Learn as much as you can. And if the more you're around

(01:11:39):
the school, the more you'll see what, what goes on, even if
you're, you know, just ears and then ask teacher specific
questions and direct questions like how many disturbances in
class are there a day or a week?Are there how many are physical?
How many are with obscene and vulgar language?

(01:12:01):
How many are verbal assaults? How many?
How many times have you needed assistance from the
administration or school personnel like the counselor to
assist to remove a child from class?
Have you found that incidents have been handled consistently
across the board with all students, whether they're with

(01:12:23):
or without disabilities? How many students in class have
interpreted, have been interrupted by the lesson?
Do you see a pattern? Are there effective steps taking
place to address these? Are there any students from
other classes that interfere with instruction and how
frequently? So those are are just some, you

(01:12:47):
know, rapid fire questions that might give people more insight.
Absolutely. Thank you.
Where I see a lot of change alsogoing on in schools is when
families become to light themselves.
So I see a lot of families will,for lack of a better term, adopt

(01:13:09):
another child who maybe has a, a, a background that doesn't
have those values or doesn't come from a background where
they are, you know, where they have a stable background.
And it's somebody that plays on the same soccer team as them or
is in the theater club with them.
And they in, in a sense, kind ofadopt that kid into their family

(01:13:32):
and show them what the values are like and invite them to
different things. And so anyone that, that's
watching and, and I want to encourage them, if they know
somebody, a friend of, of their children that they know are in
that situation, I want to encourage them to be the light
for that child. And, and, and, and kind of have
them as a, as a person that you invite into your family and show

(01:13:53):
them and invite them to dinner and invite them out to, to go
places with you and show them how your family react, interact,
Show them the values that you have and be that like for them
as well. If you can see that their family
is is struggling. Yes, all very good.
Thank you for for doing this important topic.

(01:14:15):
Thank you thus and I will be sure to share that Google Drive
for the commenters that are asking about where they can find
it. I'll share it right there on my
profile this evening after we conclude this.
Thank you for the tidbits on especially the school board
meetings because somebody that has been very involved with

(01:14:35):
watching these school board meetings, even as a homeschool
parent, my tax dollars are goinghere.
I care about the products that we're getting for our money and
not enough people are attending this meeting, which could very
much either root of the problem.But Deanna, thank you so much
for taking the time to be with us tonight and share your
perspective from inside of the classroom.
And with that, I cannot think ofthe better segue.

(01:14:56):
We have talked about what it's like being in the halls with the
SRO, what it's like with being aschool counselor that is dealing
with these kids one-on-one. And we talked about what it's
like being in the classroom, butwe have not heard yet what it's
like on the home front for somebody who has experienced
school violence for their child.So with that, we would like to
to welcome Angie Cunningham to the conversation tonight.

(01:15:18):
And Angie, I, I have written up an intro, but honestly I I would
prefer you sharing what you experienced because nobody's
going to say it better than a mom who had to go through this.
OK, thank you. So my daughter was in 8th grade
at Laurel Middle School and there had been two students that

(01:15:41):
had been bullying her for a couple of years actually.
And I had been going back and forth with the school, the
administration about these two girls.
They had been physical altercations prior to what led
up to what happened in 8th grade.
So my daughter had an IEP and then the IEP there were actually

(01:16:05):
actual safety guards that if these two girls approached her,
bullied her, what my daughter was to do.
So one day my daughter's in the lunch room with her friend at
the lunch table. These two girls walk by, tell my
daughter they're going to beat her up.
My daughter follows her safeguard, goes and tells an

(01:16:26):
adult in the lunchroom. They make her return to the
lunch table. The girls come back by again.
My daughter and her friend go toanother adult.
They separate my daughter and her friend to make my daughter
return to 1 table, the friend toanother.
Within two minutes, these two girls jumped my daughter.
They were much larger than her. They repeatedly kicked her in

(01:16:48):
the head and it resulted in her having a traumatic brain injury.
The school did not call me and tell me that this had happened.
I was called by another student's mother.
The student had witnessed it, called her mom.
So I'm calling the school and they're like, yes, your
daughter's in the office. There was a little bit of an
altercation. I go there, my daughter can

(01:17:12):
barely move her head. She's her eyes are heavy.
I could tell something's wrong. She had not even been evaluated
by the nurse. So I take her to the doctor.
They thought that she had a fractured neck due to her
injury. We go to the ER, she had a
sprained neck and a concussion. We end up in the concussion

(01:17:35):
clinic at AI DuPont. So Long story short, these girls
have been repeat offenders not only towards my daughter, but
towards other students. And so I started speaking out at
school board meetings. And in March of 2023, I spoke
out at a school board meeting and because the Superintendent

(01:17:58):
and the board members did not like a quote that I had in my
speech, they verbally attacked me.
The Superintendent tried to intimidate me and bully me, but
I was not backing down. I stood my ground with him and I
had no idea. But by the next day, my phone
had so many messages from other parents, staff members, previous

(01:18:20):
staff members about what had been happening in the school,
the violence and how they were afraid to speak out because of
retaliation. Because it's like the little
boys club. They're all, they all support,
protect the Superintendent there.
So no matter how much you speak out, nothing's changed.

(01:18:41):
The board members try to silenceyou.
So I just kept going to meeting after meeting to speak out.
They would try to use their policy that we could not speak
out against leadership. And if we did, our speeches
would be cut short. I would remind, and it was a
public forum. Therefore, First Amendment
rights are protected. And I would continue to speak.

(01:19:03):
So they tried other avenues to silence me.
They would have staff members. One was a male custodian who had
no student or no kids in the school speak.
And the information that he was speaking about was information
about me and my daughter that hewould not have known had he not
been provided that information. And I know they were doing that
to try to, once again, intimidate me or silence me.

(01:19:26):
So I had several, you know, teachers reach out saying that
they're witnessing the violence in the classrooms, but they were
afraid to report it because if you have so many referrals, it
can reflect on you getting a raise.
It can reflect, you know, on theteacher not doing her job.
So they had to really pick and choose what altercations they

(01:19:47):
wanted to report because all this thing goes to the state.
So since then, it's just been a constant battle.
I would have staff members attack me on social media for
speaking out for the students. And like I said, the school
would try to silence me. And you know, my daughter, she's

(01:20:10):
now in 12th grade and she is homebound.
She cannot return to the school.You know, those two students
that attacked her, they were allowed to go back to the
school. They got charged.
However, the charges were just aslap on the wrist, a little bit
of community service. That was the only consequences.
I, I, I'm almost speechless. I'm so sorry you experienced

(01:20:31):
that. I cannot imagine the state of a
mother walking in and seeing their daughter in that situation
now at some point after it repeatedly.
And I commend you for this, going to these school board
meetings and just doing what youhad to do for your daughter.
What services were in the long run, offered to your daughter?
What, what did they do to make the situation for your your

(01:20:54):
daughter a little bit better so she could still at least attend
school with everything she had endured?
So my daughter was not able to go back in person to school so
she needed to be homebound. So we were school choice at that
time because she had attended Laura from kindergarten to 8th

(01:21:15):
grade. Because of my work schedule,
that's where I would have someone get her on the bus and
off the bus. But after all that, I took her
out of the district and rolled her in our home district and
she's been homebound ever since.We have a teacher that comes
here now with the school district that she was in.

(01:21:37):
We did have a lawsuit for IEP comp funds.
The school refused to settle from the two year statue of
limitation that they have. We end up having to go to
federal court. We did mediation in federal
court. That was May 2024.

(01:21:58):
We settled. We actually signed the paperwork
September 2024. The funds were not made
available to us until the end ofJune of this year.
And with comp and funds, there is a limit on how much time you
have to use them. So whatever is not used by the
time my daughter turns 22 when turns to the school district and

(01:22:22):
anything that you want the childin the trust, you have to
request it and they have the right to approve it or refuse
it. Quite a few things that we have
requested, they have refused. And once again, you know, we've
had all these years wasted wherewe could use those funds for
extra tutoring for my daughter. So now we're in 12th grade, and

(01:22:44):
part of the trust is we have to have a certified teacher tutor
her. Well, there's a teacher's
shortage in Delaware. The school district can have
Paris teach the whole classroom.But if I want my daughter to
have extra tutoring in the trust, pay for it, it has to be
a certified teacher. If we use the funds to get my

(01:23:04):
daughter a laptop to have at home, she's allowed one
electronic device every 18 months and 18 months.
I had to turn the laptop into the school district that was
purchased with her funds if we want to get another one.
So there's so many things that are written in these trusts that

(01:23:26):
these educational lawyers do because they're protecting the
district, because they make it impossible for parents to use
these funds for the children. They've already failed them in
the school and now we're trying to get these funds so we can
give them an education in the setting that is more appropriate
for them. And these lawyers are writing

(01:23:47):
the trust in a way that we cannot utilize them for the
children. Therefore, the money will return
to the school district. It feels like a major flaw in
the system to have the same people that are having to pay
for these services also be responsible for approving or
denying them. Exactly, yes.
So that is where I am battling. I have, and I'm not only doing

(01:24:11):
this for my daughter, I'm doing this for other students because
the incident you talked about earlier with the student that
had a knife that was at the sameschool my daughter was attacked
at. And you know, I have brought
many things to the table for theboard.
I know see clear through book bags, the metal detectors.
Let's not have cell phones in the classrooms.

(01:24:34):
But while you're there and you're talking, the board
members are talking amongst themselves.
They're writing notes, they're passing notes.
They're not paying any attentionto parents whatsoever.
So, you know, and some of the teachers had said that they had
issues with administration. They went to the board members,
nothing was done. So they went to the Department

(01:24:54):
of Education who tells them thisis not our problem.
You have to go back to the board.
So it's just a continuous cycle of your going all these routes
to try to find help, but there is no help.
Like I've myself have contacted the Department of Education, the
governor's office, the secretaryof Education, and I was told by

(01:25:15):
the Secretary of Education's office, this is not anything
that we deal with. Well, I'm sorry, what do you
deal with? This is a big system failure all
the way around. First, the bullying that was
allowed to go on, my daughter's IEP ignored, my daughter
assaulted with a permanent injury, the students allowed

(01:25:36):
back at the school to continue to harass and bully other
students. And then, you know, taking all
this time to get the comp funds for my daughter and now getting
everything refused that could help my daughter.
So all of this is a big failure.So where does the Secretary of
Education come in? Where does the Department of

(01:25:57):
Education come in? Where the help that the parents
need 'cause we're not getting itfrom the board members.
So where all their come from? Where does the help come from?
Who does come in? If this person isn't responsible
and this person is responsible, who is responsible?
Who can help when situations like this occur And your
situation is does not seem like a one off situation at all?
Because as I'm reading comments while you're speaking, people

(01:26:18):
are thanking you for being on and saying this is the closest
story to being correct that we've heard all night because so
many people have experienced this same tale that you are
going through. Yes.
It's, excuse me for interrupting, but it it seems to
be even, you know, thank, first of all, Angie, thank you so much

(01:26:38):
for coming on here and sharing the story.
I know it must be difficult, butsharing the details of what
really got me was you sharing the detail of you walking to the
office, into the office and seeing your daughter in the
condition she was. That really got me because I
pictured myself walking into theoffice, seeing my own daughter

(01:27:00):
sitting there. But I but I also thank you for
for sharing those details because that is what makes
people realize that this is realand this is happening and this
is a child that needs to be protected.
So thank you so much for doing that.
I think this speaks deeper to a problem that we have in the

(01:27:22):
state of Delaware, even deeper to there is such a rush for
rehabilitation of the people whoperpetrated the the crime and,
and rehabilitation is great, butthey don't take the steps to say
#1 how can we help the victim? The victim needs to be #1 and

(01:27:47):
how do we wrap around surfaces for the victim?
Because the victim did not ask for this.
The victim did not say one day Iwant somebody to do this to me,
but yet the people who perpetrated that kid, they made
the decision to do that. So we need to first and foremost
help the victim. And then there also needs to be

(01:28:09):
consequences, real consequences because this wasn't just, well,
you know, something happened to your daughter and she was able
to come back the next day or thenext week.
She is homebound and she will, she will, no matter how much she
progresses, she will deal with that trauma for the rest of her
life. And there needs to be real life
consequences to show them that there will be real life

(01:28:32):
consequences in life and things like this happened as well.
Yes, the assault was reported and even after the girls were
charged, they would circulate this video continuously.
And it was to the point where mydaughter attempted suicide

(01:28:52):
because, you know, she had to keep witnessing this because
multiple people would just keep sending it to her over and over,
You know, So to watch your daughter go from this fun
loving, bubbly child to someone,you know, we would spend many
nights sitting in her room and she would say, mom, I just want
to feel happy again. I just want to feel joy.

(01:29:14):
She's like, I just pray every night.
I want to feel happiness. And, you know, she's in 12th
grade. She's Miss Proms, She's Miss
Tone Cummings. She hasn't got to enjoy all
those things. And you can't get all that back
and, you know, to be treated like that at the school.
When I spoke with the emotion about what she was going
through, the simple fact that I quoted President Trump is the

(01:29:38):
only thing that got a reaction from the Superintendent and the
board members. And they didn't need me, The
Apprentice mom. They didn't react to what
happened to my daughter and whatshe had to go through.
It was because they did not likea quote I made.
You know, it wasn't political. It was a quote that I felt was
very important. But that was the only response I

(01:30:00):
got. And after that is when they
tried to target me, the Superintendent lied and tried to
tell people that my daughter wasinjured off of school grounds on
a bowling alley. That was not true, you know, So
I had people reaching out to me saying what can we do?
Because we're having this happenwith our students in the school.

(01:30:24):
But we're afraid if we speak outbecause we see what you go
through at the meetings, we see how they are coming at you
retaliating. What can we do?
And I would try to get them and say we need to get together on
these at these board meetings and speak together, you know, a
group of us that takes more thanjust one voice.
But people just don't want to dothat because of fear of

(01:30:45):
retaliation and what can happen.Absolutely, there needs to be a
push from, for more people. And I'm hoping that with, with
your help and for the help from people who are listening tonight
that we can make that push a reality that we can stand up for
victims inside of our schools, victims throughout our community

(01:31:08):
and say we've had enough. This is a real story where a, a,
the thing that breaks my heart the most is what you just said
about a, you had a happy daughter and you experienced her
going to someone who tried to commit suicide and going through
that pattern, starting from a happy girl that again, did not

(01:31:30):
ask for any of this to happen. And that's where accountability
and transparency need to come in.
And I know we've been, you know,I appreciate you, you talking
with me the other day over coffee.
I think the conversation is where it starts, but action
needs to take place. And this is not unfortunately,
this is not just a A1 off. It's happening all over the

(01:31:52):
state and and we need to get behind you and others and say
it's it's time that it stops. It's time that it stops in our
schools. Parents start showing up and
saying it's time and then getting on to administrators,
legislators, the governor and say I don't care who's who's
position it is to make this happen.

(01:32:14):
Get together and make it happen.It doesn't matter who has to
sign that. Bottom line, get together and
make it happen because this is where we need to go.
And that's my fear. I, you know, I know that they
are going to dismantle the Department of Education and
return it back to the states. Well, when you're in a state
like Delaware that really isn't going to do any good, you know,

(01:32:37):
and there's a lot of talk right now that that's, you know, the
plan because the Department of Education really has not done
anything. When they were founded in 19
eighty 20,000 students were homeschooled has up to date over
4 million children are homeschooled.
So really what has the Department of Education done?
But once again, if the government ends up turning it

(01:32:59):
back over to the states, when you're in a state like Delaware,
we have nowhere to go. Like we have nowhere to oversee
all the corruption and the school level, the corruption of
the lawyers that are writing these trust funds and backing
these schools so that ultimatelythe schools are getting the
money back and parents and students are not getting what
they need. It's one big corrupt, failed

(01:33:20):
system. Angie, thank you so much for
your time. Thank you so much for your
courage, for sharing your story with us and also with our
audience tonight. I look forward to talking.
I know Katie does as well. I look forward to talking with
you in the future and continuingthe progress on this to help
your daughter and your family and the elders addictives of

(01:33:42):
violence in our public schools. So thank you so much for
speaking with us. Absolutely.
And Angie, we're going to see ifwe can find some resources to
connect you with as well. And if not some resources, maybe
just somebody within the state that's willing to listen to your
story because it's it's adherentthat out of all the outlets you
went to, nobody was willing to help and very few were willing
to even listen. Right.

(01:34:04):
Thank you. Absolutely.
So our final guest tonight, we are going to bring on board.
I think it's a perfect segue to see when a school is dealing
with discipline and violence andis in the throes of trying to

(01:34:25):
understand how they can support their teachers, how they can
support their students, what aresome things that actually can be
done. So we're going to bring on a
gentleman who's on the school board at the Milford School
District. His name is Matt Booker.
He is the vice. He is the Give me one second.

(01:34:52):
He is the vice president of the Milford School Board.
He's also the legislative chairman of the Delaware School
Board Association and the founder of the Buccaneer
Education Foundation. He's a long term, long time
community volunteer. And Matt, thank you so much for
coming on board today to talk about some of the discipline

(01:35:15):
issues that Milford School Boardand, and hearing from teachers
and, and what you all were able to do by listening to the, the
folks on the ground. Brian and Katie, thanks very
much for having me on these. These are some remarkable
guests. I feel, I feel a little small
next to some of the talent you've had in a night.

(01:35:37):
I'm, I'm very, it's very nice tosee Officer Melvin again.
He was our greatest Sr. OS in Milford.
I would like to say something about public comment during
school board meetings. So I did I did watch the video
of of Miss Cunningham's public comment.

(01:35:58):
It's about 3 or 4 years old now.So in Milford and this is, this
is compliant with, with Delawarecode and and best practices and
of course our board policy. When a community member makes a
public comment, the board listens.

(01:36:19):
We do not interact, we do not speak up.
We certainly don't browbeat the commenter.
That's, that's totally out of bounds.
And and not only that, the, the reason, the reason for that is
we have to maintain some sort ofconsistency.

(01:36:40):
So to give you a hypothetical, you've got, you've got a parent
that comes up and says Coach Smith is awesome.
It spends his 3 minutes or his 5minutes telling how great Coach
Smith is. And we allow that.
And then you've got another parent, community member comes
up and says coach, coach Smith is awful.

(01:37:01):
And let me explain to you why. And you stop him when you see
that, that that's totally out ofbounds.
And it wouldn't, it wouldn't stand up if that second parent
were to make some sort of legal case out of it.
So we, we normally, well, normally we always let the, the

(01:37:21):
community members say their piece and we, we move on.
But and also regarding safety and security.
When I was elected one of my in 22, one of my, the planks on my
platform was definitely safety and security.

(01:37:42):
And I promised that I would worktoward having an SRO or
constable or a combination thereof in every one of our
buildings. And we were able to accomplish
that within the within the 16 months or so after I was
elected. So the SRO and or the constable,

(01:38:05):
we have found that sometimes andquite often they're the most
trusted individual in the schoolfor a large segment of the
student population that don't feel they can talk to the
teachers or they're, they're frontline administrators or, or
even counselors. But the, these security
personnel, they develop relationships with these kids

(01:38:29):
and a lot of times they're troubled kids and a lot of times
they're male and they, they respect A and most, most of our
cons. Well, not all certainly one of
our great Sr. OS is, is a female member of
Milford PD and highly respected,but they develop a sort of, you
know, man to man or brotherly relationship with them.

(01:38:51):
And, and they're able to to to help them through some of the
things and keep them out of trouble and keep them out of a
situation where the police are going to have to be called or
there's going to be have to be some sort of infraction
recorded. So I'm certainly behind security

(01:39:16):
personnel as a matter of course in all of our buildings.
So much so that as you well know, I come to you 3 years ago
and we Brian and we work together on a bill and I'm
hopeful that that will pass at some point.
It's been through two sessions now.
But to have the state fund theirshare to fund Sr.

(01:39:41):
OS and and constables just like they do teachers.
If we agree that safety and security are are paramount in
our school buildings, and I think we do, and we ought to, to
regard these personnel as essential and therefore ought to
be funded the same way teachers are.
So that money is already being spent, anything that the state
spends already being spent by the local school districts every

(01:40:05):
time that there's a security, safety and security referendum
from Lake Forest to Red Clay to any of these school districts.
Or anyone it, it always passes. The community wants safety and
security and they want these personnel in positions in our
school buildings. So, you know, hats off to you
and and Officer Melvin and we'llsee what happens in the next

(01:40:29):
session. Matt.
If I can push a little bit, you had mentioned that this is
something that people want. And I personally, I, when I
forgot about this a while ago, Icommended Brian on it.
I think it's something so important.
I personally come from a law enforcement family and I think
they truly can, especially in our schools, make all the
difference. But when we first talked about

(01:40:50):
this probably about a month ago,Brian and I, I was very shocked,
very shocked to hear a lot of the public up here in Newcastle
counties push back against this.There are a lot of people that
do not want Sr. OS in school, which I personally
do not understand, but I think it's a culture thing and I think

(01:41:11):
it's a societal issue where they're afraid that without SRO
being in school that their kids become.
I believe the term is school to prison pipeline, but doesn't
that also relate back to if you're fearful of your SRO being
in the school because of what may happen to your child, your
child probably isn't doing the right things in school.

(01:41:34):
That's not an unreasonable hypothesis.
So as far as as far as the pieceof legislation itself, I was in
the Education committee when it was debated and argued and I
learned something about the General Assembly.
I could have learned in no otherway.
And the, the words, the term, the phrase school to prison

(01:41:57):
pipeline was bandied about by some of your New Castle County
representatives. There was a, you know, a, a
minor objection to spending the money.
But then again, they'll spend multiple, you know, 10s of
millions of dollars on things that that have really no effect
or negligible effect, but won't spend, won't it's a really cost

(01:42:21):
shifting. It's not really spending any
more money. We won't finance things that we
do know have a negligible effecton safety, security, morale and
teacher contentment and teachersfeelings of, of being safe in
the buildings. We want our we want our staff,

(01:42:42):
students, everybody to feel safein our buildings.
We want them to be safe in our buildings and that nothing can
happen without no education can happen without first safety, 2nd
order and then then we can have an environment that's conducive
to to learning. So Matt, tell me a little bit

(01:43:07):
about how you and your colleagues in in Milford were
able to help support the teachers themselves when they,
as we discussed this this numberof the statistic of one in five
teachers being assaulted or not feeling comfortable in the

(01:43:28):
environment that they are. How were you and your colleagues
on the school board able to to help with with that environment
in Milford? So, so right off the bat when I,
when I got there, the, the administration wanted to

(01:43:48):
introduce restorative practices or a sort of practice statement
in the code of conduct. Now restorative practices by in
and of itself is a neutral thing.
If it's applied correctly, it can have a, a good effect, but
it is not a replacement for consequences or or discipline or

(01:44:10):
application of the code. So, so the next year we had, we
had kind of like 1/2 of half theboard left and, and we're out
and, you know, half were, were elected and those, the folks
that were elected kind of felt the same way I did.
So we stripped it from the code of conduct.

(01:44:31):
So there's no mention of restorative practices in the
code of conduct. You know, the 19 public school
districts and of course the charters, they all have a code
of conduct. It's pretty much the same with,
with some, some relatively minordifferences.
But the, the, the real crux is do you enforce it?

(01:44:54):
How do you enforce it? And are you, are you afraid to
enforce it? So this gets us into some
legislation here. So back in 2017, a piece of
legislation was passed in the Senate, SB-85.

(01:45:16):
And it was, it was, it was spawned by a dear colleague
letter from nearly 10 years before to the federal Department
of Education by President Obama's Department of Education.
SO2017SB-85. What it basically, I forget what
the, the, the nomenclature for the name of the bill was, but
basically what it said was that you're and that you got a like a

(01:45:42):
three-year lead up curve. But at the end of three years,
if you're most suspended cohort in minority cohort, any kind of,
you know, racial, gender, etcetera was suspended more than

(01:46:03):
10% more than your least suspended cohort, then you were
you were subject to takeover of your discipline policy.
You got in your building, got animprovement plan and there was a
whole host of reporting requirements and oversight.

(01:46:25):
So to, to, to So Asian, Asian females, Asian females commit
practically 0 infractions statistical 0.
So if you've got any, any other chopped up, you know, minority
cohort that's 10% suspended morethan Asian girls, then all of a

(01:46:47):
sudden you've got a problem. So what does that lead these
public school districts to do? I believe, and with with good
reason. And it's, there's plenty of
evidence out there, anecdotally and otherwise, that many of the
school districts were simply under, under under reporting,
not providing A referral when 1 was warranted.

(01:47:11):
You know, there's steps in all the codes of conduct.
You know, the first time you might get a warning, second time
your parents might be called andyou've got some kind of write up
all the way into your, your, thebig boys like ISS and out of
school suspension. All right.
But if you never get them there by not reporting certain
infractions, then you're, you're, you're kind of reverse

(01:47:35):
padding the numbers where you don't trip the SB-85 guardrails.
OK, so, and I can't say for certain whether that was
happening in Milford School District.
Some people said it was, but irregardless, I recognize and
others recognize that the the potential was there for that to

(01:47:56):
happen. So what we said as a board was
we don't care if we're on an improvement plan or not.
And if we have buildings that gounder an improvement plan, we
will do the due diligence, but the code of conduct will be
enforced. If there's restorative practices
consequences or, or or any kind of cancelling regime that to go

(01:48:17):
along with that, there should be.
But that does not alleviate the the behavior from, from from
triggering the the code of conduct.
So we got a massive jump in referrals.
We got a massive jump in, you know, infractions being
reported, but it started to go down.

(01:48:40):
It took a couple years, but it started to go down again because
the code of conduct was being enforced consistently.
I, I know some of the, some of the bus contractors would say,
you know, I hand my referrals tothe person that's bus
infractions and they, I know they don't do anything with
them. Well, that we stopped, that we
stopped, you know, any kind of underreported so improvement

(01:49:04):
plans. So you've got districts that
you've got districts that got 8 or 9 schools upstate on an
improvement plan. We have two, very few schools
have 0 districts have zero schools.
But it's, it's as long as you'reenforcing the policy, you're not

(01:49:25):
really punishing the person, You're punishing the infraction
or correcting the infraction. I don't see where there's any
kind of conflict no matter who the person is.
It's not about who you are, it'swhat you do.
That is how you enter the, the code of conduct.
And that's how you get, maybe there's some corrective action

(01:49:46):
that goes along with restorativepractices to get you back on
track. And we see a lot of that.
We see a lot of, of students that they go down the wrong
track for, for a bit, but once they find out that there's
consequences, then they come back to the fold.
It's very, it's a very small percentage of students that do

(01:50:06):
the, the and maybe 2 to 4% that do that have most of the medium
to series infractions in, in anybuilding anywhere in the state.
So it's, it's, we're not triaging anything, but we're
saying we're going to enforce the code.
We're going to hold these individuals accountable.

(01:50:28):
We're going to get them back on track where we can another piece
of of and it's not really legislation or that may have
been it's very it's been in the code for years out of school
expulsions. You cannot expel a a child in a

(01:50:48):
state of Delaware or it's very, very difficult.
It's huge hurdles to cross for more than 180 days.
So when when there's a serious infraction and this is the law,
there's nothing any public school district can do about it.
When you've got an infraction that's so serious that it spawns
them, them being expelled or sent to an alternative school.

(01:51:13):
The one in the the Kent side of Milford, they go to Parkway,
it's in Capital School District and the Sussex side, if the
student resides in Sussex, they go to Scope.
OK, so we can always send them there for 180 days and then they
have to come back. So when we have a parent that
says, well, you know, my kid wasassaulted by this other kid, but

(01:51:34):
yet 18 months later, the kids back in school, that's not
something that's that's our choice.
That's just the way the Delawarecode is written.
So that that's probably an explanation to to some incidents
that some parents were having. If I can ask the question really

(01:51:55):
quick, would that also include, let's say a child brings a gun
to school and threatens somebodyon school campus with that gun
physically present, Can you alsonot give an expulsion to that
child for more than 180 days even that in that situation?
So what would probably happen inthat case?

(01:52:19):
First of all, the Firearm SafetyAct in Delaware, it's it's a
mandatory 180 days if you're caught with a, a weapon of any
kind on school property, that's mandatory.
So you would go on, that's what you've done is committed a
serious crime. So you're probably not coming
back to our school district. You're you're going to be sent

(01:52:43):
to that's, that's the that's the, the, the the guardrail spin
trip that'll get you on the whatwe call the attorney general's
report and you'll be in the the criminal justice system then.
And it's a case by case. I would think that such a thing
would be it would be very difficult to get the kid back

(01:53:04):
into the school in which he had he or she had that an infraction
of that that kind of seriously level.
Matt, what do you think can be done in your in your opinion
policy wise or to help administrators or help teachers

(01:53:28):
in order to to have their backs when fractions happen, when
discipline issues happen, when violence happens in the
classroom? Is there something that needs to
change school by school? Is it at the state level?
What are some of your thoughts on 1st actions that can be taken
to make sure that accountabilityhappens and it's taken

(01:53:50):
seriously? OK, so there's probably multiple
levels to that, but let's let's start with the building level
and the building level administration, the principal,
the Dean of discipline, what have you, and the frontline
teacher, they have to enforce the codes of conduct, the
discipline policies that their board, which is an arm of the

(01:54:11):
community I represent, I identify with and represent the
community and that's whose interests that I'm supposed to
carry out. So when we make a policy, they,
the employees of the district need to enforce it.
That's number one. Moving on to district level or

(01:54:33):
perhaps even the department education or perhaps even the
General Assembly. When you have, when you have a
again, the two to four percent, 5%, whatever it is that is that
is unwilling or unable for any reason, for any reason.

(01:54:54):
Setting aside any kind of stuff that was was before about what's
going on in the home or what's not going on in the home.
If you have children that will not behave appropriately in
class, they need to be in an alternative school.
And it's pretty revolutionary. Not a lot of board members are.
And practically no anybody that's drawing a check from the

(01:55:17):
state Department of Education isgoing to tell you what I just
told you. But we need actually funding for
alternative schools, more alternative schools so they can
get their legally mandated education in an environment
where they can have structure and they can learn some of the
social skills and some of the personal interaction skills and

(01:55:40):
some of the life skills that they did not, were not able to
learn from the family. You know, I once my campaign
slogan was back in the day, parents are the, the, the 1st
and final. I don't know what it was the,
the, they're the 1st and final authority on the health and
safety and education of their child.

(01:56:00):
Well, sometimes the school district has to be the parent of
last resort. Unfortunately, it's the world we
live in. So we need to put these kids in
an environment where they can learn the things that they need
to learn. And mainstreaming is is fine.
But if you have that minority that that needs help outside of

(01:56:24):
the normal school system, then they should get it.
So to give you to give you a ready example, one that's not
even, you've probably heard it before.
You've got 22 kids in a classroom.
You've got one kid that's you got 21 kids that want to that
want to learn. A reasonable expectation is

(01:56:45):
they're they're going to learn and they want to learn.
They have parents that want themto learn.
You've got one kid that will notbehave appropriately that spins
out and causes a scene in the middle of the classroom.
OK, in this situation, they clear the classroom of the 21
kids and then send in the intervention team to calm down
the kid that that's causing the the the ruckus and then and get

(01:57:09):
him out of there. Now what's happened to that hour
of classroom instruction? It's dead.
You can never get it back. The so someday some student
somewhere is going to be enterprising enough to sue, sue
a a local school district because they're denying him his
right to education because he can't, he can't get an education

(01:57:31):
in the classroom where he has one of these these, you know,
one of his fellow students. I don't know if such a thing as
possible, but philosophically you know you're you're
shortchanging the other 21 kids because of the one that could
get the help he needs if he werein a different environment.

(01:57:57):
Yeah. Well, thank you, Matt.
I, I appreciate that. Do you think that there's
anything that you see that couldchange on the state level or
that needs to be looked at at the state level that could help
with this? You know, we've talked about
phone legislation, which I thinkis necessary and, and I think

(01:58:17):
that will help. But what about discipline and
being able to back those teachers and back helping to
guard that environment within the school?
So, so to I'm a local control, local authority type of guy.
You mentioned earlier I was chairman, the legislative
chairman for the DSBA, which is an organization for the school

(01:58:40):
boards that that is that entirely is per its purpose is
to affect legislation and we're all about local authority and
local control. So cell phones absolutely should
be no cell phones in in classrooms.
Milford has had that policy since 1994.
It was called it handheld, you know, personal device or

(01:59:03):
whatever. And probably were stuff like
Nintendo Game Boys or whatever they had back then.
You know, you couldn't have anything, no electronic devices
out. But it was selectively enforced
or some teachers were not enforcing it.
That's one of the things when wedecided as a board and as, and
had the backing of the upper leadership, the administration,

(01:59:24):
that we were going to enforce this on a classroom level.
And I'm not saying it's 100%. I'm for anybody out there in
the, my community that wants to comment.
My, my teacher, you know, doesn't do that.
I know, I, I know that there's always exceptions.
But as many of the teachers appreciated us actually saying
no, no more. And if the parents gripe and

(01:59:46):
complain, that's too bad. Rules are rules and they're
rules for everyone. So the teachers have actually,
you know, they've, they've actually said, well, you know,
my classroom is, is more behaved.
They're paying attention. And you know, I'm getting some,
some positive results on academic wise.
So building level and the district level is important.

(02:00:09):
The General Assembly, I just mentioned the alternative
schools, I don't think. By any means, the Delaware
public schools, the school system is underfunded that would
you know, we, we, we both know the numbers there.
But I do think that what what needs to happen is some of the

(02:00:32):
things that we're doing inside the building, the the, the
regular school building needs tobe done in an environment either
separate from the school building or in a separate school
or in a separate wing or howeverit needs to be done.
It needs to be restructured to, to be able to get this, this

(02:00:54):
percentage that's that's causingthe the majority of the problems
back where they can rejoin the mainstream student having
learned the, the life skills andthe social interaction skills
that they need. So that is so, so that that that
really probably doesn't need to be championed by the the General

(02:01:15):
Assembly because it would involve some capital
construction, some other things.So that would be great.
I mean, we would love that. We would also like to have
funding flexibility, you know, between 1 and 5% of the school,
the average Delaware school district's budget is controlled
or is not already spent or earmarked for some kind of

(02:01:38):
initiative or pet project from the legislature.
We need the the flexibility within each public school
district right down to the building to do what we need to
do for the population that we serve.
To give you a ready example thatallow me to be precise, we have

(02:02:00):
a school in Milford that has a majority minority and we're
talking a Latino and we're talking Haitian.
We have Creole speakers, we have100 and I don't 100 and 14120
Creole speakers in one school. We need more ESL in that

(02:02:20):
environment, but we need less administration in perhaps the
the district level or another environment.
Well, because of the initiativesand the reporting requirements
we have to do and the units we get to accomplish them.
We can't give the frontline classroom teacher the the
building level, the things that they need for that school that

(02:02:42):
another school maybe in Cape Henlopen or or in Dover may not
need. So those two items, I would
definitely, those would have probably an immediate and
beneficial effect on on the public school system.
All right. Well, thank you Matt so much.
We've we've, I, I look forward to continue this, this talk with

(02:03:04):
you and hopefully to serve alongside you in the General
Assembly as well. I think you have some great have
some great experience, but also some great ideas pushing for and
thank you for everyone tonight that that that watched us.
I think the the last time what did we say?
We had over 10,000 people that watched our last show and. 100

(02:03:27):
downloads. Oh my goodness.
So we are excited to continue tobring this to you.
Thank you to all the guests. We really had a a great range of
people to talk about the education here in in Delaware,
what's going on at the ground level.
What we really hope that this sparks is not just these
conversations here tonight and not just these daily videos that

(02:03:51):
we're doing on reclaimed ground,but we want neighbors and people
that you work with, the people that you go to church with them,
people that you, their kids, your kids play soccer with them
or whatever sport they play to start talking about these things
because that's how we bring it to the forefront.
That's how we we create a, an environment where these things

(02:04:12):
become important. There's so many things that have
risen to the forefront of, of our culture and forefront of the
General Assembly and forefront of people's minds that aren't
really in the same scope of importance of our children and,
and, and how they're going to beraised and what we're going to

(02:04:32):
leave for the next generation. So let's keep talking about
this. Reach out to people who who
wrote in the comments and, and ask them if you can sit down a
coffee with them and ask them their perspective, even if it
was different. Start having these conversations
so we can start building these these future moves.
And Katie, I mean, what, what was your perception of tonight

(02:04:54):
and what can we see for the future here?
I mean, it's such an important topic and we could have been
here for way longer. I know different.
People with different perspectives.
You mentioned the commenters. I've been.
I have another screen for those of you guys who can't see, which
is everybody. I have another screen right here
where I'm reading the comments as they populate and there's
been great conversation in the in the in the comments tonight.

(02:05:16):
In fact, some of the questions Idirectly asked our guests
originated from the comments section.
And I think one of the issues isfor where we are at in
education, it has become such a taboo topic.
Nobody wants to hurt anybody's feelings talking about this out
in the out, in the open, out in the wild, as I would say, out in
each other, not behind a screen and behind a keyboard.

(02:05:37):
Nobody wants to have these conversations.
Nobody wants to talk about the behavior because what if it's
somebody you're talking to whosechild causes this behavior?
Nobody wants to have the conversations about protocols
not being followed through because what if you're talking
to a teacher or an administratorwho isn't following protocol or
a teacher that knows protocol isn't being followed because of
the reasons that Matt just mentioned?

(02:05:58):
So it's become such a taboo topic, and that's why it's
gotten so far gone. Like most things that do become
a taboo topic, it's important tohave these conversations and
it's important to spark dialogueand conversation around
solutions to these problems. I know we talked about cell
phones in schools. That's obviously a problem,
right? I graduated 2005 and in 2005 we

(02:06:20):
had cell phones, but it was not a problem ever.
It's a cultural issue, and we can say that cell phones being
in the classroom is a major problem and they shouldn't be
there. Realistically, you're not
getting rid of cell phones in the classroom.
Realistically, no matter how many rules are made about it, no
matter how many Yonder pouches are purchased to to lock up
these phones in cases the kids are breaking them open, the kids

(02:06:42):
have multiple devices, the rulesaren't being followed.
Rules are meant for people that follow the rules, and the
problem in schools are the rulesaren't being followed.
So their needs, even when we're saying things like this is a
problem, that is a problem. There has to be more
conversation about how to solve the problem and not just what
the problems are. Absolutely.

(02:07:03):
And as we bring it back to Christ, as we always do, family
is Christ centered. And this is where we fight for
our families that they can have a safe environment where they
can have a place where they feelthat desire of knowledge and
they feel the opportunity of education that can help better

(02:07:26):
prepare them for life and can put them on whatever track it is
that God has for them so that they can they can see what their
highest purpose is and go for it.
We are really excited to be here.
We have some. Do you want to tease the
upcoming episodes or should I? While you're talking about about

(02:07:48):
bringing it back to Christ and stuff, there's two scriptures I
actually wrote down when we first started talking about this
topic and we started putting this all together.
One is Isaiah 5413 says all yourchildren shall be taught by the
Lord and grace shall be the peace of your children.
And 1 Corinthians 1433 reads that for God is not a God of
disorder, but of peace. It is important not just to

(02:08:10):
education, but to spirit and soul to fix the problem in our
schools. Thank you so much.
Oh my goodness, thank you. So I know you like I know you
like the teasers you're this is like if you do the best.
So let do do you have in front of you the the next three that
we're. Going to.

(02:08:31):
But you know what? I don't think I need anything in
front of me to go over. We'll be talking about guys,
there's a really important topiccoming up, especially if you are
one of our followers and viewersin the Newcastle County School
districts. This is huge.
This is major, the Reading Consortium.
So the vote for the Reading Consortium, and if you're
unfamiliar with this, is this isbasically redistricting.

(02:08:51):
They want to take four differentschool districts, that being
Brandywine, Colonial, Red Clay, and Christina and combine them
and redistrict the people. The reason being is debatable
whether it's the reason on paperor the other reasons and optics,
but they want to redistrict and send kids to different schools.
The problem is this is going to have a disproportionate impact

(02:09:13):
on 2 school districts particularthat being at Brandywine school
district and the Red Clay schooldistrict.
Things are not being talked about enough when it comes to
it. I talk to people every day.
They have no idea this is even happening and they have kids in
these school districts. So we are going to do an episode
on December 3rd speaking about these problems within the

(02:09:35):
redistricting process and the impact that the redistricting
will have on these school districts.
It looks like. I'm not 100% sure, but the
chatter is that it appears that no matter which way it takes out
and what decisions are made, it's going to end up being
combined down to two school districts.
So I'm going to dig more into that this upcoming week to get

(02:09:58):
some information on that. I have invited a get.
I have invited guests on. They have are on the parents end
that have been researching this and foyeing this entire process.
And we have invited somebody from the Reading Consortium that
itself to come on and talk aboutit too.
I have not heard back yet, but I'm hopeful that we will soon.
Wonderful. We're also going to be leaning

(02:10:20):
in and talking about a addictionacross the First State, what's
going on with the opioid settlement fund, the $250
million that have been given to the state of Delaware about the
funds that have been frozen by mismanagement by the nonprofits
who have taken them. And what are some great
nonprofits that actually have stuffed up and saved people's

(02:10:43):
lives. We're going to bring people on
who have actually changed their turn their lives around from
addiction and talk about what led them in order to to make
that amazing change to, to find their higher calling.
And that should be a really great episode.
That will be the following week as well.
And the third week, which would be the week after that, I'm

(02:11:04):
going to be up to my shenanigansbecause Ryan's traveling, so
there's nobody to oversee me. And I'm going to bring our
producer from behind the scenes in front of the camera.
And we think that we might be able to get Mr. Rick Jensen in
here as well. You may know him from WDEL, but
that should be a fun episode. Brian, you got to trust me on

(02:11:24):
that one. Oh, I feel better if Rick will
be here as well. It'll be fun guys.
If no other time, you have to behere that week.
You've got to be here this week and you've got to, you've got to
pull some buttons. So when I come back, I hear
about it. Then I can do that.
I can do that. Oh my goodness.

(02:11:48):
Well, we are so excited we're claim ground media again, we
don't do this enough, but we we've got a selfishly plug that
this is all sponsored by you. It is all committed to you. 10%
of all the money that we raised goes back to Christ.
It is 10% of our business is going back to the Kingdom and

(02:12:10):
the other 90% is going to help run the daily the daily videos.
This weekly show is going to help mentor other people into
content creation as well, including the the younger
generation. So you see that below
tinyurl.com/RGM support. We promise we'll get better at

(02:12:30):
asking for money so we can continue to grow.
Yeah, I mean, if I can say I, I personally, I know this is a
part of the process, having a platform like this, I get so
awkward doing it because I get online and get on the Internet
and talk to you guys all the time about how unaffordable life
is. But The thing is, in order for
us to have these conversations, to do these interviews with
people and bring them on as guests, to get this conversation

(02:12:53):
showing going and the narrative out there, we do need insight,
some type of way. So we will never be taking money
from anybody that has an agenda and a narrative to push.
We are always going to be doing this for you.
It's by you. And even if you just want to buy
us a cup of coffee, for us to buy our potential guests a cup
of coffee, that is very, very, we're grateful of it and we're

(02:13:15):
thankful for your donation to this process and this platform.
Yeah. Thank you all very much.
Katie, you want to take it away?See ya reclaimed ground media.

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