Embracing Grit & Hardwork | Bhakti Rose - Anchor Your Dreams

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Meghan (00:05):
If you are
someone who has a dream, but feelstuck, if you are facing obstacles that
seem overwhelming, or if you just needa dose of motivation to keep pushing
forward, then you are in the right place.
So buckle up dreamers, Anchoryour Dreams is not just a podcast.

(00:26):
It's a community, a community of dreamers,supporting dreamers, women, supporting
women, subscribe, follow along, and let'snavigate the seas of ambition together.
Thank you for joiningme on this adventure.
Get ready to be inspired,motivated, and empowered.
The journey begins now.

Katie (00:50):
Hi there.

Meghan (00:51):
Hi.
How are you?

Katie (00:53):
Good.
How are you doing?

Meghan (00:55):
Very well.
Thank you.
Can you hear me?
Okay.

Katie (00:58):
Perfect.
Did you sort out your mic issue?

Meghan (01:01):
Yes.

Katie (01:03):
There's always a bit of love in it tech.
It's part of it.
Like you just have to, yeah,it's, it's part of the process.

Meghan (01:10):
And just when I think I have these things like known to, to me, it's like
something happens and it doesn't work.
And anyways, I think itwas more of a user error.
Right.
Oh, gosh.
Um, well, thank you so muchfor meeting with me and all

(01:32):
the way, um, from Australia.
What part of Australia are you in?

Katie (01:37):
I'm in Sydney, which is a beautiful city.
I am so blessed to live here,but I'm originally from London.
So I moved here when I was 26 andI've lived here for the last 20 years.
So you may not be able to tell, butI've got a bit of a mixed up accent.
It's part English, part Aussie.
It's kind of a hybrid now.

Meghan (01:57):
Oh, that's, I love that.
I it's, it's funny because I, well, I loveaccents and when I was younger, I thought
I was going to be moving to England.
I had an aunt that lived there and part ofme was like, I'm going to get an accent.
I want to move therebecause I want an accent.

(02:20):
Like I want to gain an accent.
And then I thought that's so silly.
Who does that?
And then, but it, itmakes sense when you live.
somewhere for so long, youstart picking all of that up.
Like, and yeah, so that's so interesting.

Katie (02:37):
I mean, the accents one element, but also slightly
different vocabulary as well.
Like there's differentwords that Australians use
and yeah, American English.
I mean, we're all speakingthe same language, but there's
subtle, subtle differences.

Meghan (02:52):
Yes.
Yes, exactly.
Well, and it goes from, I'm sure.
different areas of Australiaprobably also uses different like,

Katie (03:02):
Well, it's funny that you say that actually.
No, I mean, I know in America that'strue and in the UK, but the thing
about Australia is first of all,very low pop, small population.
So we're a huge country, but atiny population, very spread out.
And then also fairly recently comparedto the rest of the world colonized.
So it's only 230 years or something thatwhite settlers have been in Australia.

(03:27):
So we haven't really had the opportunityyet for accents to become regional.
So there's like a stronger Australianaccent and then a less strong one.
And that's really aboutthe only difference.

Meghan (03:41):
Interesting.
And maybe that's one thing that I, I hadnoticed just like watching different, um,
series and things likethat and movies and things.
There are some people that definitely havea much stronger accent, um, than others.
So, is it, help me pronouncethis please, is it back tee?

(04:05):
Bhakti.
Bhakti.
Bhakti.
Okay.

Katie (04:09):
Like, think of a buck like the deer.

Meghan (04:11):
Oh, okay.
Okay.
Bhakti.
Bhakti.
And where, where does that originate from?

Katie (04:18):
So, bhakti is a Sanskrit word, so it originates from the yoga
lineage, um, and it means wise love.
So, to apply love in a waythat is filled with wisdom.

Meghan (04:30):
I love that.
Well, speaking of wisdom, you havehad, you've been a guest on many
different podcasts, so one of thethings that, sorry, I have a child
walking in here right now with anote that I'm supposed to read.

(04:53):
Oh, whoops.
Mom fail.
I was supposed to unlock thescreens before I started this.

Katie (05:02):
Yeah, that's really essential.

Meghan (05:04):
So if you don't mind

Katie (05:06):
Please, I understand how necessary that is.
How old are your children?

Meghan (05:12):
I have a nine year old and an eleven year old.

Katie (05:16):
I have an eight year old and a ten year old, so I
totally understand the territory.

Meghan (05:21):
Yes, and they love their Minecraft, , games.
Whoops.
Sorry.
Locked one, unlocked the other.

Katie (05:33):
That's a well trained child though that knows to give
a note rather than interrupt.
I like that.

Meghan (05:38):
We had a big conversation before I started and I was like, you know,
totally meant to unlock their tablets.
But yes, they, they are goodabout doing these little notes.
Um, and helping me in that sense.
I do work from home.

(05:59):
Like I, um, I think I did it.
Well, we'll see.
I'll get another note, I guess.
I also work for somelawyers from home as well.
So sometimes I need to be on different,conference calls , things like that.
So they've, they've, they, they do learn.
I just sometimes.
Forget to give them credit for havingthat and doing that until it happens.

(06:23):
And then I'm like, I'm sorry.
Thank you.
You have two or five kids because inyour notes, I said, Five kids, but
you have two that are similar in age.
Is that what you were trying to say?
Okay.
I was like two, I think I read something.

Katie (06:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So my youngest is two, my eldest is17 and then I've got a 15 year old,
a 10 year old and eight year old.
So they're pretty spread out.

Meghan (06:55):
Two.
Oh gosh, it's been, it feels likea lifetime ago to have a two year
old, but then at the same time, itfeels like it was just yesterday.

Katie (07:06):
Yeah, well actually she's been very easy, partly because
she is just an easy easy human.
Um, but also because I've gotall the boys, she's a girl.
The last one was a girland all the rest of boys.
Um, they really help with her a lot.
So like my 18 year old can, he's drivingnow, you know, he can do things like
pick up the little kids from school.

(07:26):
If I need him to, he's also working,but, um, I get a lot more help.
It's, I find it a lot easier thanI did when I just had like one or
two and it was mostly all on me.
When she's at home and the kids are athome, there's always someone to play with.
Like I very rarely have tosit and give her attention.
And because there's so many of them, shecan kind of cruise around from person

(07:48):
to person and no one gets sick of her.
Cause if somebody'slike, go away, I'm busy.
She just can go to someone else.

Meghan (07:55):
Oh, I love that.
I feel like I could just kind of watch.
The different transition from,you know, sibling to sibling and
see how they interact differently.

Katie (08:07):
Great idea.
I should put a little camera onher sometime and we just do like a
little time lapse of because I sawthe time I'm like, where is she?
Who's she with?
What's she doing?
That would be fascinating.

Meghan (08:17):
That would be that would be.
Oh, and that's interesting too.
I've heard a lot of people say that.
Going from either one child to two ortwo to three is sometimes a difficult
thing, but anything three and up, itjust kind of like, it's so much easier.
And it's, You don't really hear of a lotof larger families, like that anymore.

(08:42):
There's so many people just haveone or two and that's about it.
Yeah, it is definitely more unusual.
Two is my, two is my max.
My youngest kind of is like fivechildren in one, I feel like.
It definitely demands a lot more from me.

(09:03):
So two, two was good, going back towhat I was saying before is that you
have been on many different podcasts.
So I'm actually, if you don't mind,really interested to ask you what,
what What makes being a guest on apodcast, um, a better experience?

(09:27):
If, if you can share what, what is

Katie (09:30):
Yeah, I love that question.
I think there's a few things.
I think one is If the person interviewingis a little bit open in terms of where
the conversation can go, like I findif it's a very rigid set of questions,
it can start to feel a bit like ajob interview or something like that.

(09:51):
And, um, it's beautiful when theconversation can just be allowed
to flow you know, wherever it goes.
I think that works.
And I think listeners prefer that too.
Cause it's like, you're literallylistening in on a conversation rather
than a kind of very formal back and forth.
So I love that.
I personally also really like,and I'm not sure if every guest

(10:12):
would feel the same, but I likebeing asked difficult questions.
Like I'm, I'm up for, you know, maybeI don't necessarily agree with you,
or we don't necessarily have the sameperspective on something, or, uh, it's
a question I don't even know the answerto, like, I feel like those are the
best questions because they're kind ofthey lead to the best conversations.

(10:33):
But for a person who was lessexperienced in giving podcast interviews,
that might be quite confronting.
Like for me, I'm like,you can ask me anything.
Um, you know, and if I don'tknow, I'll just be fine with that.
But I guess if you were a littlebit like more nervous, then that
could be quite, I think the otherthing too is about the guest.

(10:54):
Like if you have someone and there arepeople out there like this, who has a
large divide between their work and theirpersonal life, or, you know, there's
a real sort of, maybe even a bit ofa disconnect, then that can be quite
difficult because those people maybedon't want to be asked about anything
like they're sort of like we we can'ttalk about these areas we can only talk

(11:17):
about these areas whereas for me i'mi'm like an open book i'm like look i'm
ask me anything and if i can easily talkabout the ways in which my business is
amazing but i can also tell you the waysin which i wish i was doing better same
with parenting like it's you know, I'mrelaxed about my strengths and weaknesses.
So I think some of it's, youknow, some of it is definitely the

(11:39):
interviewer, but some of it's theguest and how comfortable they are.
Cause I've, I mean, I've donein my work, I've also done quite
a lot of interviewing people.
Like I run summits, uh, once ayear, virtual summits, and you've
probably had this experience too.
And it's so fascinating when this happens,it hasn't happened to me a lot, but
it has a couple of times in my careerwhere I've interviewed someone who I've

(12:02):
been so excited to interview, like, anauthor of a book or someone that I've
followed for a long time that I loveand I'm like bursting with excitement.
And then actually as an interview, likeperson to interview, they're quite flat,
like they write amazing or they're,what they put out is amazing, but the,
the conversation is not, it's clunky.

(12:24):
And that's so interesting to me.
I'm like, Oh, I did notexpect that to happen.
Um, so it's, it takes two, doesn't it?
It's like anything, you know, you'veboth got to be in the in the zone.
I don't know if that really answers yourquestion, but that's some of my thoughts.

Meghan (12:39):
Oh yes, it sure does.
Like that, that waseverything you said was great.
I, I have like my, my form thatI get everyone to fill out.
And before I started doing this, Idefinitely felt like I needed to make

(12:59):
sure that I would connect with people.
With the guest and vice versa beforecoming on, because that was one of my
fears was I love talking with peopleand I had previously done a podcast
with a couple of friends and I knewthat this would be so different and

(13:20):
the feel would be different, but Iwanted to somehow make it feel easy.
And the only way thatI could think of was.
Yeah, to suggest to everybody whowanted to be a guest, like, listen to
the trailer, what sparked something inyou, because if something sparked In
you out of that trailer, then clearlywe're going to have things to talk about.

(13:45):
Um, but then I also want to makesure that we're talking about
what's important to you, the guest.
So, and then the whole, um,asking certain questions.
I'm one of those people, like I'll startto kind of listen and then an idea of
thought, whether it's something I canrelate to or something that I really
want to know more about, I'll ask.

(14:06):
Um, I don't really in mind for myself.
I'm sometimes I don't think aboutthe question in terms of difficulty
or would they answer this.
It's just something that pops in my mind.
And I'm like, I'm, I'm justgonna, I'm just gonna say it.
And yeah, so, um, but you're right.
Some people do have topics that theydon't necessarily want to talk about.

(14:30):
And I get that.
One of the things.
And you and I, we justkind of started chatting.
Normally I go through a littlebit of a podcast structure and
let my guests know what to expect.
And one of those things is, youknow, I want this to be a safe space.
And if there is a topic or somethingthat you do start talking about, and

(14:53):
afterwards you're like, yeah, I talkedabout that with you because I felt
comfortable in the moment, but I'dactually not want you to air that.
That's fine too.
So just also

Katie (15:06):
that does create a beautiful safety for people.

Meghan (15:12):
Well, and I think, well, and that's one thing that I've realized
over, you know, the years is when youtalk to someone that you feel safe with.
You do tend to open up a lot more.
And that's this container.
That's, that's just thiscontainer right here.
But then, of course, leaving theinterview, it can get overwhelming, this
idea that there could be who knows howmany hundreds of people or thousands.

(15:37):
upon hundreds of thousands of peoplelistening to what you're saying.
So, um, I'm not quite there yet.

Katie (15:42):
It might not necessarily be, um, something you didn't want to talk about,
but I've definitely done interviewswhere afterwards I've been like, well,
I just didn't articulate that very well.
Like, You know what I mean?
Like, I'm not happy with the waythat I explained that, or like,
it didn't come out quite right.
Like maybe it seemed a bit, Idon't know, like prejudice or a bit

(16:04):
ignorant or something like that.
And then you'd want to retract that.
Cause you kind of realized,oh, that wasn't me at my best.
So yeah, I think that'slovely that you offer that.
The other thing that was reallygood about, um, setting everything
up with you is it was so easyfrom an admin perspective.
I love the form and the emailreplies and like so seamless.
I love that.
Like it was just a dream.

Meghan (16:26):
Thank you for that feedback.
That was one of the things originallythat I got hung up on was like, sorry,
I, I do want to ask you all theseother important questions to about you.
Um, but that's really nicefeedback to hear because.
Uh, it was something that I tried toput myself in as a guest and like what

(16:47):
the steps were and how easy I didn't, Ididn't want you to have to go to all these
places or back and forth, um, schedulingfor, cause that's what I was doing
originally before I had a calendar set up.
And it was time consuming for me andit was kind of energy sucking and
I was like, if I keep doing this, Idon't know if I can even continue.

(17:13):
So I do appreciate that.
Thank you very much.
Um, so, Bhakti Rose.
Now your name is Katie Rose.
So Bhakti Rose is your business name,

Katie (17:28):
correct

Meghan (17:29):
I love that you've kind of taken something personal from you, part
of your name and added it in there.
Um, and I love roses and thesmell of them and everything.
So I was really kind of likeengaged in that as well.
So, as we get started into this converwell, more into this conversation, can

(17:52):
you share a little bit about what yourjourney has been like, sort of, a little
bit of your start up to where you are now?

Katie (18:01):
Yeah, sure.
So, I have been a yoga teacherand a wellness teacher.
mentor.
I have had a practitioner for a long time.
I left school.
Um, when I was very young, Ileft at 16 and went and started
to work in a yoga studio.
Um, because I had this yearning andthis passion for the teachings of yoga.

(18:22):
Um, and so it's reallybeen my entire career.
Um, that was back whenI still lived in the UK.
So I lived and worked in Londonfor 10 years in various different
yoga studios and natural healthcenters and did different trainings.
And yeah, I had lots of beautifulopportunities then to study
deeper and just to really set thefoundation, I guess you could say.

(18:43):
Then I moved to Australia in 2004.
And, um, I opened up my own studio.
So I got to Sydney, Australia, andI realized there was not much of
an industry back in 2004 of yoga.
And, you know, in London, itwas exploding at that time.
It was really the peak.
It was when Madonna was, you know,um, making her Ray of Light album.

(19:07):
And it was all just like,just a big yogic explosion.
Um, but not so much here in Sydney.
So it was kind of just very fortunatetiming that I happened to get here.
I came following a boyfriend, so itwas nothing to do with my career.
Um, and I found myself inSydney and and there was just

(19:27):
like two other yoga studios.
So I was like, okay I'm gonna open astudio and it was the kind when I look
back now I feel like my older self wouldprobably talk myself out of it But when
you're young and bold and you've gotnothing to lose you often just throw
yourself at these things and it feelsat least for me, it didn't feel scary.
It felt exciting.

(19:48):
Um, and the studio was a great success.
I really focused on building community.
And because the other thing wasI just arrived in new country.
I didn't know anyone.
I had no friends.
So not only did I create alivelihood for myself, but I also
created a social and spiritualcommunity, which was So wonderful.
And I still have many closefriends now, 20 years later,

(20:11):
that are from that, that time.
So the studio, um, ran for, in differentpermutations, it evolved and we changed
location, but it ran for a good,oh gosh, I think 12 or more years.
Um, and expanded and eventuallyI had four studios in four
different locations across Sydney.

(20:34):
Um, and at that point when Ihad the four studios, I got
pregnant with my third child.
And I basically just said to myhusband at the time, I was like, I
can't, it's either another baby orthe studios have to go like I just
cannot keep all these balls in the air.
It was really draining.
Um, even though I loved it, I lovedbeing a mom and I loved running

(20:56):
the studios, but you know, anyonewho's a mother who is also runs a
business knows it feels like a lot.
So I decided to take a break.
I passed the studios on andagain, in different sort of
variations they still exist.
So I feel like that was really beautiful.
I got to, there's a sense of legacythere, which is really lovely.
Um, and then I had a bit of a break.

(21:17):
I was still working.
I'd still teach for other peopleand, you know, um, teach on some
different teacher training programsand what have you, but it was more
dabbling than, than serious work work.
Um, and then six yearsago, I, got divorced.
And at that point we had fourchildren, and I moved just down

(21:38):
the road from my ex husband.
I still live just down the road fromhim and we co parent quite a bit.
Most for the most part quite successfully.
Um, and you know, our kids arevery much back and forth between
the houses and we're still, yeah,very much in each other's lives.
But I did need to start standingon my own two feet financially.
So it was a big shift.
It was like I went from beingvery financially dependent on my

(22:02):
husband who earned a good income.
So we were very comfortable to suddenly,not having all of that ease and comfort.
And, um, I've always been quitea, an entrepreneurial person.
I think that's definitely partof my personality, part of my
kind of, yeah, just who I am.

(22:23):
So I decided at that timeto start an online business.
I, you know, I had a lot ofexperience, mostly what I was
teaching by then was yoga philosophy.
So, um, and sort of lifestylemore than the physical practice.
So I started an online businessaround pregnancy yoga, Ayurveda
and yoga, yoga philosophy.

(22:45):
Um, and I didn't have hugely clearvision about where it was going to go,
but I knew I needed to generate income.
And I often say to people, when itcomes to the business side of things,
especially spiritual people, the biggestmotivator is when you need the money.
And I don't mean that in a kind ofcrass way in any way, but I know for

(23:05):
myself, I've had times in my life whereI could play it working and it could
kind of be a hobby and I could havea side hustle, but it didn't actually
matter if it generated income versus.
This is going to pay my mortgage.
This is going to feed my kids.
And it comes with a differentlevel of discipline.
That's the word I would use.
Like I would wake up in the morningand I would be very focused on

(23:28):
creating a website, creatingcontent, thinking about marketing.
Um, because I knew if I didn't make thatwork, I'd have to go out and get a job.
And with four children, I didn't want todo that because I wanted to be able to
be around for them, you know, and, andalso I've been self employed forever.
And it felt, I mean, I didconsider it in the early days.
I did think maybe I just need togo out and work for someone else.

(23:50):
Um, but the business grewand I was very fortunate.
Again, there'd been so many blessingsin my life, but I was fortunate
that COVID happened about 18 months.
into my business.
The pandemic happened.
And I had just got to the pointwhere I was really happy with
all the offerings that I had.
Like I had a really solid website.
I had really solid programs.

(24:12):
I knew what I was doing.
I have my branding in place.
Like it was 18 monthsin and it felt robust.
And then all of a sudden the wholeworld wanted to learn online.
Um, so I just got really lucky,you know, it was that timing.
It couldn't have been better.
I was so ready.
And that's when my businessreally started to blossom.
And, um, and really has just gonefrom strength to strength since then.

Meghan (24:36):
Oh, wow.
What a journey.
And I imagine that some of the communitythat you had from the studios also really
supported you and showed up for you, uh,when you changed and sort of transitioned
into the online way of doing things.
Did you find, like, did you find that, um,

(25:03):
they really wanted to followyou to what you were doing?
Did you find that there was sort oflike, yes, you had a multitude of
studios, but there was also you thatwas at the sort of the head of it.
Did you find that a lot of peoplenot only showed up for themselves for
the yoga and learning and everything,but also for you as the owner, as

(25:24):
the founder of these studios too?

Katie (25:27):
Yeah, I love that question.
And I haven't really reflected on itthat much, to be honest, but what I.
what comes to me when, whenyou ask me is yes and no.
When I ran the studios, I was very,it took me time to really come into
as a teacher, as a yoga teacherand as a, as a mentor, um, making

(25:50):
it oriented around me as a person.
When I was in my twenties and mythirties, I think I felt very much like,
who am I to be a spiritual teacher?
Like even the word spiritualteacher would have kind of freaked
me out because I felt like a baby.
Um, and it was much more aboutme showcasing My teachers and
other more senior teachers.

(26:12):
So when we had the studios, one of thethings that was really successful is
bringing in, and again, this is pre,you know, we're going back in time.
So it's pre zoom, it's preonline learning, bringing in
teachers from all over the world.
I mean, my teachers, Sharon Gannonand David Life, who are American,
they came over multiple times.
We brought different teachers from allover, literally all over the world.

(26:34):
And that was a great part of our success.
So what I was really good at whenI was running the studios was
creating community and then bringingteachers in to that community.
But it wasn't really so much about me.
Um, I mean, I did teach, butI certainly didn't see myself
then as a senior teacher.

(26:54):
And then I, you know, When I passed thestudios on and sort of had that break,
that's when I really started to come intomyself with more confidence as I've got
something to share with my own wisdom.
You know, I'd had a bunchof children by then.
I'd lived through a divorce.
Um, you know, I had some reallysolid life experiences and all

(27:16):
through all of those things, myspiritual practice had kept me steady.
Like it was the yoga that had kept me.
You know, feeling, feeling steady,feeling stable, feeling good,
even, and that was the con, sorry.
No, go ahead.

Meghan (27:34):
I was going to just going to say that was the constant in your
life amongst all the other changeand everything that was going on.
That was the one thingthat was constant for you.

Katie (27:43):
That's exactly right.
That was the thread.
That was the ground, the earth.
Yes.
And so when I decided to do theonline business, um, I was ready.
I was ready to say,okay, this is about me.
Not in an egotistical way at all,but just to be the face, you know,

(28:04):
like if I look back, even just, itsounds silly, but if I look back at my
Instagram grid, I never put picturesof my face or me or made it about me.
I didn't even write in thefirst person I would write we,
or talk about the business, butit wouldn't be coming from me.
Whereas now, I don't hesitate to do avideo, to put my face in photos, um, I

(28:27):
speak in the first person now, peopleknow it's me, so it kind of seems silly to
hide behind we, or the name of a business.
Um, and, yeah, I feel comfortablewith that, but that's been a,
that's been a long journey.
And to answer your question, Yes, manypeople did come with me on that journey.
And I think it took me by surprisebecause I didn't think that they

(28:48):
were ever there for me, really,but turns out quite a few were.
And now I just have the most beautiful,heartwarming stories of women.
And most of my work is withwomen who have, been in my
community for, you know, 20 years.
I mean, we've watched each otherhave children go through all kinds

(29:10):
of all life events, births, deaths,marriages, divorces, you name it.
And it's so beautiful.
I mean, nothing lights me up more and ithappens all the time than someone coming
back into my world and saying, Oh, Iused to take yoga class with you 15 years
ago, or, Oh, I, I read your book thatyou wrote, you know, 10 years ago and

(29:34):
it's, yeah, I just, I love that so much.

Meghan (29:37):
Oh, that's so many things that you went back to and said really
kind of resonated and one of them.
Was when you were talking aboutbringing other teachers in and
kind of rather than the focusbeing you showcasing other people.

(29:58):
And it's really interestingbecause that's essentially kind of
why I decided to do a podcast israther than be the speaker myself.
I'm trying to allow other peopleto do the speaking more or less.
And then, um, when you said sayingwe, and, and kind of, even though it

(30:21):
was you that was behind everything andonly you, um, that's another thing.
I just had a conversation with someonethe other day and I was like, cause
I pretty sure on my website, someof, some of the things refer to we.
And they're like, why is that?
It was like, it's kind of a good question.

(30:42):
But I think when I wrote that out,I wasn't confident in being, I think
part of it is held accountable andresponsible for all the things, even
though my heart was in all of it.
Um, so I'm trying really hard tochange all the weeds to eyes because

(31:07):
my heart is what leads it all.
Although I'm thinking about it in acollective way, um, when I say we,
I usually now, I mean we as in theguests, we as in the audience, we as
in that, um, so I'm a lot more mindfulabout how I, how I approach that.

Katie (31:31):
It's interesting.
I think if we go back a few years, thewe thing was often, and this happened
a lot in the coaching industry, itwas sort of, and I'm not saying at
all, this is what you did or I did.
Cause I don't think in our cases itis, but a lot of people would say we
to sort of imply like, Oh, there'sa big team behind me or like, you
know, Like almost like a corporation,you know, like it's this big entity.

(31:52):
It's plural.
It's more than just littleold me at home on my laptop.
Um, and, and that was kindof what people wanted.
It was like, Oh, that's professional.
And that's, you know, it's, it'slike all the bells and whistles.
But actually, now, I think it'skind of a full circle moment where
people don't want that at all.

(32:12):
We're so over big corporations andnameless, faceless organizations.
We love the individual at home,you know, in their intimate
space, sharing from their heart.
Like that's, that feels so muchmore real and so much more genuine.
And yeah, I've really realized that too.

(32:34):
I don't need everything to be superprofessional and polished and perfect.
Um, it's okay to just show up as I am.
And people Can relate to that.
It's so much more real.

Meghan (32:46):
Yeah, I agree.
And especially and especiallynowadays with the social media and
what you know, the quote unquotehighlight reel of everything.
And that is part of all of this forme as well as bridging that gap.
Um, you know, well, well, youare at a very successful stage of

(33:09):
making six figures in your business.
There are people out there thatare not sharing how they got there.
They're just flashing it on a screento say that you too can make this,
but where's the messy middle of it?
How do I get there?
Sure, I can start up rightnow, but I still need guidance.

(33:34):
And I still need to understandthat there are real people.
That have gone through all the differentthings, all the different transitions,
possibly divorce, um, and, you know,other forms of grief in their life and
still were able to make it to that stage.
So thank you, um, for sharing that becauseit, it, it is true, um, that people

(34:01):
really are over the big corporations.
They do want to see real people and
that's, that's what.
I think meeting one on one and approachingit from a heart centered place is
really allowing that all to come out.
Um, one of the things that youhave mentioned that your life's

(34:28):
work is, is bridging the gapbetween the unknown and the known.
So kind of going back to what Iwas saying about, you know, this
highlight real aspect of things.
That's what we think we know.
When we look online and wesee things, that's face value.
So there is so muchbehind that is unknown.

(34:48):
And I would love to hear sort of whatyour take is on in that way, in sort
of a clear and practical connection.

Katie (34:59):
There's a couple of things there.
The first is that, The truthis everything is unknown.
You know, if we want to talk about whatwe think we know and what's unknown,
the only true reality is that we haveno idea what's about to happen next.
Um, and one of the things that Ioften reflect on, and this sounds so

(35:20):
morbid, but it isn't morbid at all.
It's only sounds morbid because ofthe way our culture thinks about
death, but you know, we don'tknow how much time we have left.
Um, and It could, you know, todaycould be my last day on the planet.
Really, truly.
And I think about that sometimes.
And I, I truly mean not in amorbid way, just in a way of
like, are my affairs in order?

(35:41):
Am I good in my heart?
Is there something unresolvedthat I need to tend to?
Um, have I been hurtful?
Have I left somethingundone that was important?
Is there a conversation I needto have with one of my children?
Whatever it might be.
Like, living life in this waythat really acknowledges the,

(36:03):
that we're living in the unknown.
Um, and, and being in reverenceand awe of that rather than fear.
So that's one, one part.
And then on a more practicallevel, I feel, and again, this
is something I've grown into.
Like I, I feel so much moreclear about who I am now at

(36:23):
46 than I ever have before.
And for that reason, I reallylove the aging process.
I don't necessarily lovethe physical aging process.
Like I wouldn't mind still having theenergy of 25 year old me, but the, The
wisdom that comes with aging as a woman,I think is such a beautiful thing and
it's not celebrated enough in our culture.

(36:45):
So part of my work is that celebration.
Um, and one of the things thatI've worked very hard on in my life
over years consistently is to nothave huge gaps between the person
I want to be and the person I am.
So I try very hard to, as far as possible,and of course it's never perfect, but

(37:08):
to align my values and my, what, whatis important to me with my actions.
So for example, if I say, I'm ananimal rights activist, I care about
animals, I'm not going to eat meat.
Right?
Or if I say, Um, I believe in goodcommunication with my children.

(37:31):
I'm going to apologize tothem when I shout at them.
It doesn't mean I'm not goingto shout at them, but when I
do, I'm going to acknowledge it.
And I'm going, we're going tospeak about it and I'm going
to take responsibility for it.
So these are just two smallexamples, but the point is when
you live like that, or when you atleast attempt to live like that.
Um, there's nothing that you feelfearful about showing people.

(37:51):
Like last night, this was reallyinteresting actually, and I
think this is somewhat relevantto what you just asked me.
My son wanted to look for a photo,a video of him when he was younger
on my phone, and it's back farthrough all the photos I've taken.
It's from a few years ago.
I gave him my phone and he was hesitantbecause he was like, do you mind if
I scroll through all your pictures?

(38:13):
You know, it's a very intimatething actually to share the
entire contents of your phone.
And I had to think for a moment,I was like, you know what?
Totally fine.
Go for it.
And what a beautiful thingthat my, there's no, hidden.
There's no, um, shadow, you know, it'slike, I'm pretty much actually, because

(38:35):
I thought about it afterwards, I'dpretty much let anyone look at my phone.
There's nothing going on in my lifethat is a skeleton in the closet, or
that makes me clench up and go, oh, Idon't want people to know about that.
Um, and that's taken work.
That didn't just come, that'snot just natural, that has.
I've had to, for example, again, justanother small example, stop gossiping, you

(38:59):
know, how easy is it for us to just say alittle mean thing, text a little gossipy
remark about one friend to another friend,you know, like when we stop doing those
things, there's nothing to hide anymore.
And it's a very relaxing way to be.
So I'm not in any way saying I'm perfect.
I make mistakes all thetime, but I am transparent.

(39:22):
And I think that that dance betweenknown and unknown that transparency
is, is part of that dance.

Meghan (39:31):
Oh, yes, I feel that very deeply.
I really do because that is, um,that's exactly how I try to show up
in the world with my kids as well.
Um, and with my friends going back tosort of the gossiping thing as well.
Um, it is.

(39:53):
Easy to get caught upin that kind of stuff.
And over the last couple ofyears, I've really tried hard
to be like, okay, whatever'sabout to come out of your mouth.
Is that something that you wouldsay to this person, to their face?
If it's a no, then do not say it.

(40:14):
If it's a, well, maybe thenquestion that again, kind of thing.
If you would say that or you'rehesitant, why are you hesitant?
And then that to me is I just try toget curious about everything I think
that's really what for me sort ofboils down to we don't know everything

(40:34):
and like you said, in kind of goingback to the piece about death.
I am not afraid of death, either.
Like,
What I think, and I thought about itnot too long ago, I think what a lot of
people actually fear more is suffering,

(40:58):
and they connect death with suffering.
And that, oftentimes, I think is whythey just marry the two, and Rather
than having open conversations aboutthese other things, like, yeah, you
know, like, today could be our last day.
So is there a conversationthat we might want to have?

(41:20):
Is there something that we mightwant to repair before that happens?
And I think people sometimesgo from one extreme to another.
It's that.
You only live once, YOLO, do allthe things because you never know
what your last day is going to be.
But also there's just the intentionalshowing up from your heart slowly

(41:41):
about like, okay, well, what atthe end of the day could I do,
um, to have a better tomorrow?
So that if today or tomorrow wasto be my last day, that it's kind
of, taken care of, so to speak.

Katie (41:59):
Yeah.
And sometimes that idea of do all thethings, you know, we think about that in
a sort of hedonistic or materialistic way,like, Oh, I'm going to go on a holiday
or, you know, whatever it might be.
But sometimes the do all the thingsis do the really hard things, you
know, have the difficult conversation.
start the business, even though you feelvery scared and unsure, uh, whatever,

(42:24):
whatever your big goal is, you know,your kind of bucket list dreams.
Some of those things are going to bethings that require a lot of time,
effort, energy, bravery, courage.
Um, and so yeah, that part of thatYOLO, if we take it out, out of the
cultural context of just like, I'm goingto buy a bunch of stuff and, you know,
be very materialistic and hedonistic.

(42:46):
It's, okay, well, I don't have forever.
So if I don't start this businessnow, you know, maybe I never will.
And that's another thingabout middle age, right?
When you're in your twenties and yourthirties, you don't think about it.
Everything seems infinite.
Like I've got forever.
It doesn't matter.
You know what I've spoke about beforewhen I opened my first yoga studio,
I was like, well, if it doesn't workout, I'll do something different.

(43:06):
Who cares?
You know, I don't reallythink like that anymore.
I think like, okay.
I don't have forever.
Five years can just go like so quick.
Um, where do I want tospend my precious time?
You know, what am I going to dowith the time that I have left?
It feels more important.

Meghan (43:28):
I like that.
What am I going to dowith the time I have left?
I love that.
A lot of people, well, listeners,I should say are women who probably
have kids or are eventually going tohave kids and they're entrepreneurs.

(43:48):
So.
We have talked about kids quitea bit already, but how did you,
how did you juggle it all as beingan entrepreneur and having kids?
And if you can recall sort ofwhen you maybe had, you know, two
kids, What was it like for you?

(44:09):
Cause it did sound like itwas a little bit trickier.

Katie (44:14):
Well, there've been lots of different phases.
I've got five children andthey're spread out over 18 years.
So there've been lots of differentphases of the parenting journey for
me, which I think is helpful because itmeans I can speak to different people's
circumstances and probably relateto a lot of different circumstances.
When I was married and I have fourboys with my ex husband, we had a

(44:38):
pretty comfortable financial situation.
So I had a lot of help.
We lived with our in law, his parents.
So I live with my parents in law.
Um, and in the beginning they were partof the sort of support team, but then
over the time that we lived with them,they became older and more frail and
actually they've both passed away now.
So it ended up that we wereactually caring for them.

(44:59):
So at certain points I had not onlyyoung children, but also elderly,
uh, family members in my homethat I was caring for alongside.
the children.
But, and I'm just going to be reallyblunt and upfront about this because
it's the truth, money helps a lot.
So, you know, we had a cleaner and I hada nanny and we had someone that would come

(45:19):
in and do the garden and, you know, I hada very beautiful, very supported life.
Um, and I had the money to do thingslike buy organic food from the farmer's
market, go to the beautiful WaldorfSteiner play group that was expensive.
Like, it, it makes a big difference.
And anyone that says it doesn't is.

(45:40):
usually someone who has a lot of moneyand doesn't realize their privilege.
Right.
So that was that part.
And then after the divorce, I suddenlyplummeted into still being deeply
privileged in comparison to 99 percentof the world, but really having to
count the pennies, not being ableto go to the supermarket and buy
whatever I want, losing a lot of thatsupport network, could not afford a

(46:04):
nanny, could not afford a cleaner.
You know, it was doing allthose things suddenly myself.
And.
It's so interesting when I look backon those two phases of my life, I
can honestly say, both had a lot ofhappiness, both had a lot of challenges.
But it wasn't that one was so muchbetter because the money was present.
And one, there was something aboutthe grit of the struggle, and the

(46:27):
doing it myself, that was also verybeautiful and building something from
the ground up without a safety net.
I Maybe that's just my personality,but I love a challenge like that.
And it really motivated me.
Um, so the second phase after thedivorce, when I was building the
online business, I mean, my goodness,I just worked really, really hard.

(46:50):
I honestly did.
And I, people ask me all thetime, well, how did you build
such a successful online business?
And the honest truth is hard work.
And I know that's not a sexy answer.
I know it's not a like, I made, you know,50, 000 in a launch and I didn't even
get out of my pajamas kind of answer.
Um, but I would work whenthe babies were sleeping.

(47:11):
I would work at night whenI put the babies to bed.
I would get up at five o'clock inthe morning and work for a couple
of hours before they woke up.
I, um, would put them, uh, in a littleplay pen and sit and work next to them.
I'd, you know, be answeringemails on my laptop while they're
playing in the bath, like.
You know, it just, I usedevery moment of every day.

(47:34):
I used every opportunity.
I hustled.
I visioned.
I, you know, not, not only, not onlydid I work hard on a sort of practical
and strategic level, which I did, Ialso worked really hard on my mindset.
I, I got a great coach.
Um, I did a lot of vision boarding andvisualizing and mindset, just solid work.

(48:02):
And.
it paid off.
And I think, you know, if I reallybelieve, I really believe if a woman
has access to the internet and a laptopand a vision for something she wants to
create, if she's willing to work hardand consistently, not just for like a
month and then, oh, that was exhausting.

(48:24):
I'm going to throw it all in the bin.
Consistently, diligently overyears, you got to play a long game.
Um, Everything is possible.
Everything is possible.
But if you buy into the dream thatit can all happen within a week and
that there's a magic spell that canoccur and it will just, uh, money
will start raining down from thesky, in my experience that isn't how.

(48:49):
Business grows.

Meghan (48:53):
And I don't know if that's the way I would want my business
to grow in the first place.
And it's easy to say that now.
And I feel like because of myage, I feel like, um, but also
like you, I do like a challenge.
So if it came too easy for me, Ifeel like I'd get kind of bored

(49:15):
really quick or the connection toit probably wouldn't be as strong.
The long game, it, that is probablythe best word that I have found over
the last, year about doing anything.
Um, it is a long game.

(49:35):
And even with this podcast, like,I very naively thought, oh yeah,
I'll, uh, I'll get sponsors andI'll get, you know, no problem.
I'll monetize this podcast.
Easy peasy.
Oh my goodness.
Like so naive to think that way.

(49:55):
Um, but I'm okay with it too, youknow, and it is the long game.
And I know that The connections thatI'm making with all the different guests
and the listeners and everything to me.
That's the center, um, or sortof like that circle around the

(50:20):
center, which is my heart in it.
Um, that I'm really looking for.
And if eventually I get there, um, great,but there's, there's, there's that piece.
that I would way rather itbe the long game part of it.

Katie (50:38):
Yeah.
And I think what you're touching on there,which is another essential ingredient in a
successful business, especially a businessthat has any kind of spiritual, anything
connected to it is orienting yourselfin the mode of service and community
rather than sales and what can I getfrom these people, you know, it's like

(51:02):
to use your example of the sponsorship.
It's like, okay, you could go outthere and hustle and find sponsors and
sell yourself and what have you, oryou build this beautiful community.
You focus on the guests and thelisteners and the service element.
And then.
the thing grows because that'swhat happens, especially
in communities of women.

(51:23):
We, we expand and elevateeach other for the most part.
And all of a sudden the sponsors comeknocking on the door and they want you
rather than you've had to go out andlook for them because you've come from
this place of generosity and giving.
And that's another thing I'velearned in business over and over
again, when I give more, when I'mgenerous, when I, when I really orient

(51:47):
everything I do around service.
and caring.
Like I really care about the womenthat come into my programs, that they
actually get the outcome they want.
Nothing breaks my heart more thansomeone signing up for an online program
with me and then never logging in.
I'm like, please do the thing that youpaid the money to do, you know, because

(52:11):
I know it will be transformative for you.
Like I want so desperately forpeople to Yeah, do the things.
So I think that's a huge part ofit too, is the, the attitude of how
can I give, how can I be generous?
How can I build community?
How can I serve?
And then it really just allthe abundance flows from there.

Meghan (52:33):
Well, exactly.
And just sort of going back to that too.
Um,
I'm also realizing that
It's become more of a spiritualthing, like as I'm getting older,
um, versus like, you know, yeah.

(52:55):
What year?
Well, it's 2024.
So 2020 when I had, I, I had thisidea of building like an, an online
community and everything in me was,I was ready to pour so much into.
Everyone that signed up for that.
And when I would see people not attendsome of the stuff that I had created,

(53:19):
it, it wasn't so much of a feeling ofrejection on my part, but it was like
this deep knowing that they really couldutilize and, and then I thought, you
know what, at the same time, there'sa reason why they're not showing up.

(53:40):
And.
That has to be okay, too.
And that's the thing that I've, I've,yeah, I think with wisdom that has
come a lot more, um, that there is.
There's a reason why people show upfor things and there's a reason why
I connect with them differently than,um, another way, another person.

(54:04):
Um, sort of going back to, we kind ofgoing a few different places here with
this conversation, but, um, I kind ofwanted to go back to, you know, your,
the moment where you switched and goingback to the divorce as far as, Switching

(54:26):
gears, because I do know in my community,as well as in other communities, there
are lots of women who really feellike they won't make it after because
financially, um, they've either they'reeither relying, I shouldn't say relying,

(54:49):
but there's a lifestyle that was created.
As a couple and they areno longer a couple and that
lifestyle no longer is there.
So I do feel like there are eitherlots of women who feel like they
can't, they won't be able to start.
Doing something, creating a business, orthey're going to have to end the business

(55:13):
that they may have already createdbecause of that happening in their lives.
So I'm just, if you could share alittle bit more, you did mention the,
it was kind of a had to thing, um, foryou as well, but if you could share

(55:34):
how you stayed motivated as well as
supported by a community that youhad to get through all of that?

Katie (55:46):
It's a great question.
And I do see a lot of women stay inunhappy marriages for financial reasons.
I see that a lot.
And, um, first of all, and this mightsound ironic coming from someone
who's divorced, but really the firstthing I would say is when you find
yourself in that situation, work onyour marriage as much as you can.

(56:08):
You know, that would be my first, um,piece of advice because sometimes what
we, we think we need the marriage toend and actually we just need to do
things a little differently, you know?
Um, so I do, I, I genuinely see womengiving up on relationships way too easily.
And we can kind of go intothat sort of like, all men are

(56:29):
dreadful kind of eye rolling type.
Vibration.
And I think it's really unhelpful.
Um, so that would be my, my first thing.
And I would say strangely sincedivorce, my ex husband and I have kind
of done that work now so that we havea healthy co parenting relationship
and we do well co parenting.
Back to what you were saying, workingon the marriage and trying, uh,

(56:53):
sort of like taking pause and doingsomething differently versus sort of.
An all or nothing, maybe,uh, way of thinking about.
Right.
Yeah, rather than polarizing.
And, and, you know, if you are going tostay in a marriage for financial reasons,
which is totally valid, like if, you know,if you've gotten to a certain level of

(57:16):
comfort and lifestyle that you enjoy andyou know that getting divorced is going to
completely compromise that, I understandwhy women would stay in that situation.
I really do.
But then, you know, Make thesituation the best it can be.
You know, you're twohuman beings together.
Don't live in resentment and bitterness.
Um, I have a very close friend whowas in a very challenging marriage

(57:41):
around the same time I got divorced.
I got divorced.
She stayed married.
And her and her husband haveworked so hard on their marriage
in the years in between.
And I have so much admirationfor where they're at now.
Like it's so And at thetime I was advocating.
I was like, you should leave him.
He's dreadful, you know, causeI was on the leave him train.

(58:03):
Um, but they have healed andgrown together and worked
through a whole bunch of stuff.
So that's another thingthat's come with wisdom.
You know, I.
It's easy to just kindof throw things away.
It's harder to take responsibilityfor your part and also heal together.
Um, however, sometimes the right thing todo is separate and that is what it is and,

(58:27):
um, you know, it is the right thing to do.
And honestly, we just have to make adecision at that point because it just,
how attached are you to your lifestyleand to, you know, a certain level of
material comfort, like for me personally,and I don't mean this with any vanity.
It just is the truth.
It's very comfortable andlovely to live in a nice house.

(58:49):
And, you know, we had a swimmingpool and we had all the things and
it was very beautiful and lovely.
We'd throw big parties every Christmasand, you know, I, I thoroughly
enjoyed all of that, but that's notactually what's important to me.
It's not my deepest value.
My deepest value is my emotional,spiritual, and mental health.
My relationship with my children.

(59:10):
Um, you can make things look very shinyon the outside, but the core can be very
rotten and I'm interested in the core.
So when the divorce happened.
For me, the first few years were all aboutmaintaining closeness with my children.
It was all about keep the children close.
And yeah, there was a lot less money.
And their dad was still around.

(59:30):
So it's not like, you know, they wouldgo back and forth between the houses.
My elder two live permanently with me now.
But, um, back then theywere all back and forth.
Um, and I worried for a long time.
I had a very legitimate worry.
Like they're not going to want to beat my house because my house doesn't
have a swimming pool and isn'tlike, they don't all have their own
beautiful air conditioned bedrooms.

(59:50):
And, you know, it's just not the same bar.
Um, but the truth is actually, andit was a very beautiful validation.
They just want a relationshipwith their mother.
So I gave them a lot of time and alot of energy and a lot of, love.
And we came through that phase and nowall of us have good close relationships.

(01:00:12):
So rather than focusing on thefinancial side of things, for me,
it was all about the relationships.
And also, I just don't care that much.
Like, sure.
I'd love to eat in a fancy restaurant ifit's available, but I'm also really happy
to eat rice and lentils and stay home.
Like both could bereally beautiful for me.

Meghan (01:00:35):
Oh, I love that.
It's so true.
I feel like
consumerism we get so wrapped up in asan in a from a luxury standpoint as well.
Um, and that that includes havinghired help for different things.

(01:00:59):
I am curious.
After the lifestyle change, didyou find it was hard to focus?
Knowing for instance, that you had apile of laundry that you no longer had
help with to focus on your business.
How did you get over?
Cause for me, there's alwaysgoing to be a sacrifice.

(01:01:22):
There's always going to besome form of a sacrifice.
It's either going to be thelaundry, it's going to be my floors.
Um, I do not recommendeating off of them right now.
It's, it's going to be my yard.
Like, there's always going to be somelevel of sacrifice because I will never
sacrifice my relationship with my kids.
Um, or, now, as well as my husbandbecause, um, Sort of going back to that.

(01:01:48):
That is something thatI also realized I am.
I can easily get wrapped up inthe shiny things in the moment.
Um, Because I'm passionate aboutit, but also starting to realize
that slowing down and being present.
Um, so going back to whatmy actual question was,

(01:02:12):
did you find it a little bit difficultin, in the first little while,
uh, the first, I guess, couple ofyears to really feel, I'm going to
put this word in quotes, balancedbetween business and personal life.

Katie (01:02:34):
Yeah.
And not just for thefirst couple of years.
Like that's still somethingI work on every day as my
business grows and expands.
And I now have support.
I have, um, you know, support withsocial media and I have a VA and I
have help in my business, but, um,
Oh, it's, it's never, it's neverending that juggle and I don't

(01:02:57):
think it will ever go away.
So part of being okay with thatis acknowledging it's never
ending and there's no perfect.
moment, you know, it just, it's just aconstant kind of keep working through it.
Um, part of it issystems and organization.
So I am very routined and I do have a lotof systems in place and I am organized.

(01:03:17):
So little things like I drop mydaughters in daycare three days a week.
Um, so they're my main workingtimes, like she's in daycare
now while I'm talking to you.
Um, So I dropped the kids at school,I dropped my daughter to daycare, and
then usually the house is a completemess because it's like five kids
leaving the house in the morning doesnot a perfectly curated home make.

(01:03:39):
Um, so then I, I literally,um, this, I mean, this is a
good multi tasking example.
Um, I'm usually at any given time doingone or two online courses, might be
expanding my knowledge in the areas thatI teach, like Ayurveda, birthing, what
have you, or might be business courses.
Like for a long time, I've been, I'mdoing less now cause I'm very established
now, but for a long time I was learninghow to build an online business.

(01:04:02):
So I did a bunch of courses and coaching.
So I'll pop in an earbud, I'll pop ona lecture or a podcast or something
that's actually going to help me.
Develop my business, not justrecreational, you know, I'm,
I don't listen to true crime.
It seems like everyone in the world.
I was just going to say, sonot listening to true crime.

(01:04:23):
Not that, or just somethingI would listen to.
That's just like a phase out, likea, no, like something that's actually
moving the dial on my business.
And then I'll, I mean, this ishow disciplined I am, but this
is the truth of how I do it.
I'll set a timer and I'll be like, right.
Half an hour blitz the house.
I don't get to like.
stop and get distracted and startrearranging the bookshelf or,

(01:04:45):
you know, whatever it might be.
It's like each room, make the beds.
throw some clothes in the laundry,put the, put the, um, laundry
on, clean up the kitchen, put thedishwasher on, bang, it's done.
Um, and then I always startwith the biggest piece of
work that I don't want to do.
So if I'm in writing mode,get the writing done.

(01:05:07):
If I'm, who knows,could be a tech problem.
It could be anything.
Get that done.
The big item of the day, just onething, not a list of 20 things.
Cause that's another way you getnothing done is by having too
much on your list of things to do.
Smash that out.
Um, and then after that, then I letmyself go a little bit more into

(01:05:28):
tinkering around, pottering around.
I might make some lunch, you know.
Um, quite often I will also give myselfa half hour rest in the middle of the
day, which I used to not do because Iused to feel so guilty, but I've learned
that's hugely serves my nervous system.
So if I lie down and do a guidedrelaxation and meditation.

(01:05:51):
Honestly, even just like literally anap for just half an hour 40 minutes.
That's phenomenal for me.
Like I just feel like a completelydifferent human when I get to do
that in the middle of the day.
And I do that often now.
Um, and then I go and get the kids.
So that's kind of the bigchunk of the working day done.
And then another thing, I mean, Iwon't go through my whole day cause

(01:06:13):
it's too long, but a couple of otherthings I'll say on that topic, cause
I get asked about this so often.
I don't spend a lot of time watchingmindless TV or scrolling on the internet.
So I do do that a bit.
Cause.
I'm a human being.
Um, but it's really limited.
I don't spend hours of everyday or like in the evening just

(01:06:33):
numbing out in front of the TV ornumbing out in front of Instagram.
So that's a huge time saver.
I'm very intentional aboutwhat I do with my time.
And the second thing is I give mykids a lot of time and attention
and I feel that I do a really goodjob of being present for them.
And they know I work.
And they are respectful aroundeven my two year old now.

(01:06:57):
I mean, it's sort ofsometimes quite humorous.
Like she'll ask my attention for somethingand I'll say, just wait a minute.
Or hang on.
I'm coming.
And she'll be like, Oh, are you working?
Um, and it's like, no, I'm, you know,in the shower or something like that.
But she understands that mummy works andthat that means she can't be interrupted.
Like she gets that as a concept.

(01:07:18):
And I think too many of us becauseof mum guilt, which is so huge, we
don't want to say to our children, I'mworking, I'm busy, I'm doing something.
It's like, okay, sweetie, I'mhere, but I'm not really here.
But I'm here, but I'm not really here.
Like it's okay to say to your kidsof any age, I mean, bar like a
newborn breastfeeding infant, that'sprobably quite different, but like any

(01:07:41):
child that can understand language.
I'm busy right now.
I'm here for you and I will tend to you,but you also may have to wait a moment.
Um, I'm shocked by how many mothers offive year olds, eight year olds, 12 year

(01:08:01):
olds, Say that they can't have a moment tothemselves in the day, that they can't get
anything done because their children are,for example, off school because they're
sick or at school holidays or whatever.
I think one of the best things we cando is train our children to entertain
themselves, ideally without a screen.
You know, sometimes we haveto use the screens too.
I totally do that.
Don't misunderstand me, but you know,not, it's not just, Oh, give them an iPad.

(01:08:23):
And that's always the solution.
Um, and, and sometimeswe're not available.
The one challenge with that,which is something you just have
to suck up and be okay with.
And I do have to work on that a littlebit is children who are entertaining
themselves without the input ofan adult or a screen make mess.

(01:08:44):
So, you know, it's like, okay, thekids are going to play, I'm not giving
them a screen and then the room isgoing to be very messy after that.
And I'm okay with that because I askedyou to entertain yourselves and you played
tea parties for an hour and a half andnow it looks like a bomb's gone off.
That's the trade off and that's okay.

Meghan (01:09:03):
Well, exactly.
And that kind of goes back tothere's always going to be a little
bit of a sacrifice trade off.
I, I like that word.
It doesn't feel sonegative as sacrifice does.
Um, and it's funny that you say thattoo, because before this, I, my youngest,

(01:09:23):
Bless her.
After an hour of having some freetime, she decided it would be
a good time to do some baking.
Now her older sister had just gotten home.
And I'm like, No, that's not happeningbecause I knew I was going to be doing
this and I thought, okay, she's going tostart baking and then she's not even going

(01:09:47):
to be ready to do the baking until I'mprobably getting onto this call with you.
Oh no, that can't happen.
I was like, nope, nope.
She's like, well, but mom, it's okay.
I'm not going to do anything wrong.
I was like, I know.
However, for me, myself.

(01:10:08):
I just need you to find somethingquiet to do while I'm doing this call.
Um, but also going back to what you weresaying, I think one of the things that
was or has been quite apparent to me, um,even with my own kids, is not giving them

(01:10:29):
enough credit for their understandingof communication and of what we need.
What happens to me aswell is I do work a lot.
As I, as I said before, I work.
for lawyers as well.
So I, I'm constantly on my phonedealing with emails and putting out

(01:10:51):
fires and doing different things.
And
I'll have my phone.
I'm trying to write anemail or do something.
And it's mom, I need this mom.
I need that.
And I'll say just asecond or just a minute.
And I can't remember how old she was.

(01:11:11):
Um,
after like the third time it was like,She said something it was, it just,
it stopped me in my tracks and it waslike, Oh yeah, I have actually already
said that to you a multiple times.
So it's actually been not justa minute or just a second.

(01:11:34):
It's actually been like 10 minutes andyou actually have been extremely patient.
I just didn't communicateto you what I needed.
And I've done.
Much better at action at,at asking for what I need.
And that's usually not just a minuteit's 10 minutes or it's I'll explain.

(01:11:58):
I'm writing an email and as soonas I'm done, that's when I'll be
able to give you my full attention.

Katie (01:12:07):
Yeah.
And we have to cultivatetrust in our children by being
good for our word with that.
That's important.
Like if I say to my kids, look,I'm working all morning, okay,
we're going to be at home.
I'm going to be working, but thisafternoon I'm going to take you
swimming or I'm going to take youto this beautiful park or we're
going to do this fun activity.
Then you have to do the thingbecause that's how they.

(01:12:27):
understand that you are trustworthy.
And then it's a fair exchange, right?
Um, I was joking with a friend of minethe other day who has one child and
I spent, she came and stayed with us.
So we spent some time together andit sort of dawned on me at some
point that her response rate toher child was a hundred percent.
So every time he said, mom, shewas, Fully present, engaged, eye

(01:12:50):
contact, you know, what is it?
What do you need?
And I realized that my response ratewas like hovering somewhere around 50%.
You know, it's like, mom, mom, mom.
And like half the time, I'm just like.
I'll come to it when I'm ready.
And that's because there's so many,like I've got five of them, like
mom, mom, mom, mom, mom, mom, mom,you know, um, but I, in the past, I

(01:13:12):
would have felt so guilty about that.
When I had one child or two childchildren, I was like, Oh, it's so
important that I'm available for them.
And they feel listened toand heard and what have you.
And now I realize.
They know I'm available for them.
If it's important, theywill make themselves heard.
You get the vibe, you know, when it'slike they need to talk about something

(01:13:34):
and then you make space for it.
And I also do make space to spendone to one time with each of my kids.
I do that consciously becausethat's very important.
Even if you've only got two,sometimes one to one time is
very precious and important.
Um, but it's also okay to not be.
100 percent available allthe time and fully engaged.

(01:13:55):
It's okay.
It shows your kids you'rehuman and they are fine.

Meghan (01:14:02):
Yes, they certainly, they certainly are fine.
I think it comes back tothat whole mom guilt thing.
Um, and when you are an entrepreneurand you're the one that's doing
the thing, you have no one else.
You can't blame a boss.

(01:14:23):
You can't say.
You know, well, my boss wants meto work and go in after picking
you up and dropping you off.
I need to go back to the office.
It, you can't blame anyone.
It's, it's on you.
So not only is it on you as the mom, it'son you as the entrepreneur, as the boss,
as the, as the, every, the everything,

(01:14:46):
what tips can you share with theaudience for staying motivated during
like low points, uh, or perhaps likegetting through challenging times.

Katie (01:14:59):
Yeah.
Two, two big ones.
Number one, start doing somethingeven if it's a micro action.
So usually when we're feeling overwhelmedor we're a bit flat and lacking in
motivation, it's because the thingthat we want to do feels enormous.
Like let's say it's.
I have to build a whole website.

(01:15:19):
I have to create a whole website, right?
That feels like such a big task.
So easy to just put off eachday because, oh, so big.
So start by, okay, today, I'mgoing to write the words for
the about page of my website.
Tomorrow, I'm going to source fivephotographs that I can use and I'm
going to put it in a folder alongwith the words I wrote yesterday.

(01:15:42):
Next day is a break day.
The day after that, I'm goingto figure out the headers,
the menu bar for my website.
Like, so micro tasks, butyou keep chipping away at it.
And that's where the discipline comes in.
It's like each day I'm going todo something that has a productive
outcome towards this website.
And then what often happens, nine timesout of ten, is the project takes on

(01:16:05):
its own momentum and it sees itselfto completion because you've begun.
My yoga teacher used to say the hardestpart of any yoga practice, no matter
how advanced you are, is getting onthe mat and taking your first breath.
In other words, just start.
So that's a big piece of adviceand start with something small, not

(01:16:26):
necessarily even knowing what the endproject is going to look like, but
just that you've made a beginning.
Um, the other thing is.
And I find this really helpful is tojust change the channel on anything
that feels mundane in your life.
So for example, I'm very lucky.
I live in a big city.
I live in Sydney.
So there's lots of beautiful opportunitiesfor me to do things like, well,

(01:16:47):
the library is just down the road.
It's like an award winning,incredible, beautiful space with,
you know, filled with books,which is like my idea of heaven.
Um, or, free art galleries, museums,you know, there's an abundance
of different things like that.
Sometimes if I'm having a day where I'mjust like feeling a bit bogged down or
a little bit on the hamster wheel withmy work and my life, I'll go to the

(01:17:09):
art gallery for the afternoon and just,you know, have a coffee, walk around,
That completely resets everything forme, an afternoon like that, or a lunch
with a girlfriend, um, or I love to singkirtan chanting, like anything that just
is like a reset on feeling that thingsare a bit drudgy and a bit monotonous.

(01:17:31):
is really, really helpful,particularly something that nourishes
your soul, like art, music, andof course nature is wonderful too.
A walk in a forest, a swim inthe ocean, what a great one.
Um, so yeah, doing something thatjust is out of your normal routine,
that is nourishing for your spiritand your soul, will often then bring

(01:17:55):
you back in to be able to sort ofstart taking these micro actions.

Meghan (01:18:00):
I love that.
And also one of the things that Ithought about too, is reframing things
just as soon as you were startingto explain it, you, you mentioned
it in the redo my whole website.
If we reframe things to, for example,going back to your example, starting

(01:18:23):
with my about and then breakingeverything down into those micro tasks.
That's a great tips.
Definitely.
Um,
I'd like to talk about overcoming critics.
I feel like we have kind of talkedabout that sort of lightly, but it

(01:18:47):
really, the internal and external.
One of the things I, I used tostruggle with a lot, um, was
the idea of being criticized.
And only just recently have I refrained.
criticism with feedback.

(01:19:07):
And now I can see it and look at itcompletely differently, but I would like
to hear, uh, sort of what your take ondealing with or overcoming criticism is.

Katie (01:19:21):
I think this is another area in which we can go into polarity and
we can say, I'm taking on board everycriticism and it's, you know, piercing
through my heart and it's hurting meand it's impacting me emotionally.
And it's, completely overwhelming.
Or I don't listen to criticism.
I'm my own person.

(01:19:42):
I don't want unsolicitedadvice or feedback.
Uh, you know, you can take yourfeedback and you can blah, blah, blah.
And my personal take is that anintelligent response to feedback
or criticism, whether it is invitedor not, is to practice discernment.

(01:20:02):
Like, okay, this personhas given me some feedback.
First of all, let me lookat who this person is.
Is this someone who I value?
I respect?
I know?
You know, like if your best friendcomes to you and says, listen, I
actually really want to give yousome feedback about something, I
think that you, whatever, could havehandled this situation differently.

(01:20:24):
I'm going to really sit up and listenat that point, because this is someone
who I care about, whose opinion Ivalue, who feels brave enough to
give me some feedback like that.
Their message is from the universe.
Like we need to listen in those moments.
Kids, partners.
our own parents, you know, whatever,still through the filter of our own

(01:20:46):
discernment, though, you know, like,is this more about the other person?
Or is this about me?
So that's the second part.
First of all, who is it?
Second part is, is it really about me?
Or is it more about them?
You know, sometimes, very rarely,I'm very, very fortunate, I deal with
Very few complaints in my business,but occasionally I might get an
email from someone who's unhappy withsomething like a course or something

(01:21:09):
I said, or whatever it might be,something I've put out into the world.
And my very first question usuallyis, well, what's going on for them?
You know, is this triggering forthem for some reason, because I've
said something that Um, you know, hasmade them feel less than in some way.
So, and then I can come back witha compassionate response and try to

(01:21:30):
help them navigate through whateverit is they're going through rather
than feel completely blindsided,um, because I've been criticized.
Uh, and then the last thing is, youknow, sometimes you just got to cop it
and it's because you've done the wrongthing and you haven't handled something
well and you need to make a change.
And.
Just do it.

(01:21:50):
Just make the change.
Um, I mean, one realization I hadin my business recently, and this
is very personal and I'm not for aminute saying everybody has to do
this, but it was a, a big change forme was I used to offer paying full
options and then payment plan options.
And the payment plan would always bea little bit more expensive than the
paying full, which is very normal.

(01:22:11):
It's kind of industry standard.
And the justification for that is Um,you know, you might lose payments because
people default or it's more admin toset up a payment plan or whatever.
There's reasons whyorganizations decide to do that.
Now I've got the feedback from quitea few people saying it feels unfair
that you're penalizing people.

(01:22:33):
people that have less money,they have to pay more.
So if you have more money,more resource in the beginning,
you can afford to pay in full.
You get the benefit of paying lessthan the person who is under resourced
and therefore needs a payment plan.
They end up paying more.
It feels like the equitythere isn't quite fair.
And in the beginning, if I'm honest,I was like, I'm not buying into this.

(01:22:56):
This is just like, um, manipulation,you know, it's already generous
of me to offer a payment plan.
And then over time Istarted to think about it.
I was like, you know what?
I'm going to change my mind on this.
I totally get it now.
I see because I saw a big shift inmy business from people paying in
full to paying on payment plans.
Cause we're in a challenging financialmoment at the, you know, both here

(01:23:18):
in Australia and in America, thecost of living is through the roof.
People are struggling.
We're all heading towards recession.
We're dealing with post pandemic,crazy economies, political instability.
A lot of people have switched to paymentpan that initially or previously were
able to pay in full and I don't thinkthat they should be penalized for that.

(01:23:38):
In fact, I think if anything, thereshould be more opportunities for
scholarships and for discounts forpeople in genuine financial need.
And I have implemented nowscholarship programs and trade
programs for that reason.
Um, so that was as a result offeedback and then me initially
feeling a bit defensive.
and then working through that andlooking really honestly at my values

(01:24:01):
and myself and changing my way.
Now that doesn't mean I feel terribleabout myself because I used to charge
more for payment plans and I'm beatingmyself up and I'm a bad person.
No, as we know more, as we know better,we do better and I'm learning and I'm
growing and I'm willing to change my mindand I'm willing to take on board feedback.
If the person who'sgiving me the feedback.

(01:24:24):
is someone I respect and if thefeedback feels fair and reasonable and
that requires discernment on my part.

Meghan (01:24:35):
So true.
And I think
we forget that we can change our minds.
You know, like Whether it's the smallestlittle thing to the biggest thing.
I think a lot of people forgetthat they can change their minds.
They can change their values.
They can change so much.

(01:24:57):
I'm just watching time.
We've, yeah, I am going tohave to hop off quite soon.

Katie (01:25:02):
Okay.
That's about changing your mind though.
It's so.
It's so important because wefeel like often we're sort of
trained culturally to think it'sembarrassing to change your mind.
So sometimes we're holding on to theseoutdated beliefs or these outdated ways
of doing things that we don't actuallyeven feel aligned with anymore, but we're
doing it because kind of to save face.

(01:25:24):
And there's something so relaxingfor everybody when you can just
hold your hands up and say,I've changed my mind about this.
I'm doing it differently.
It's like everyone around you can kind of.
Take a sigh of relief becauseyou're, you're showing your human
side, you're showing your humanityand that's always beautiful.

Meghan (01:25:44):
Yes, exactly.
Okay.
Um, oh gosh, I feel like there's somuch more that we can talk about.
I didn't even really get into your,your, um, women's health or anything.
Although some of thesetopics were lightly covered.
Something that you had talked about wassharing that having the spark of an idea

(01:26:05):
can lead to having a thriving businesswith a sense of focus and discipline.
Discipline is something that you have,um, brought up a couple of times.
So I just want to go back to that.
What have you found to be
the, like, where does disciplinecome, come from for you?

Katie (01:26:25):
Yeah.
Um, can I speak just a little bitabout the idea of the spark of an idea
before I come to the discipline piece?
Yes.
So a lot of women in business orpeople in business think in order
to have a successful business, Ineed to have a completely new idea.
I need to come up with somethingno one's ever done before, and
I need to do it all differently.
And I really want to speak out againstthat mentality because It's so limiting.

(01:26:51):
My business does nothing that hasnot been done before and is not
being done by many other people.
I, you know, my main income is ayoga membership, um, a, uh, prenatal
pregnancy yoga teacher training and anAyurveda training for yoga teachers.
So they are all available allover the internet from hundreds of

(01:27:11):
different, people for lower costthan what I charge and also for
higher cost than what I charge.
So,
you know, if you go with the model of ithas to be new and different and something
have a unique selling point, then,uh, I wouldn't have a business at all.
What makes my business and my offeringsunique is that I created them and

(01:27:32):
I did so with genuine love andcare and dedication and experience.
And the people that come to me comebecause it's the right fit for them and
others will go elsewhere and that's okay.
So creating something from that sparkof passion or that spark of interest
from your heart with your own flavour,which it's going to have because

(01:27:56):
it's come from you, that's enough.
It doesn't have to be a completely newentity that no one's ever done before.
It's enough to do something that youfeel passionate about with skill,
um, and you know, with that, thatdiscipline and that dedication.
And I've seen many,many businesses created.
from that place alone.

(01:28:16):
So I just wanted to say that,that everything's already been
done before, and that's okay.
We can still bring ourown personal flavor.
Um, and that can be reallybeautiful and really successful.
Um, the discipline piece, look, whatI find is I, I'm a person that once
I get started, momentum happens.
So starting out is the hard part, but thenonce momentum is building, you're kind

(01:28:41):
of in the thing and that really helps.
I also find accountabilityis really helpful.
So I, for example, I have a social mediamanager and colleague that I work with
now, and you know, her and I often makea plan about things that we want to
do and then in the business, and thenthat creates its own momentum because
there's timelines attached to that.
And there's, Uh, you know, we'regoing to be launching this particular

(01:29:04):
thing or running this particularoffer at a certain time, and then
that creates its own momentum.
So it's a little bit like studyingfor an exam and having a study plan.
You know, you've got to have a visionof where you want to get to and then
work backwards with a plan from that.
So if I want to launch a new trainingin, let's say, September, well, I've got

(01:29:25):
to start thinking about building that.
now.
Um, so a bit of organization, a bit ofkind of mapping out a timeline and then
sticking to it, because when it's onlyyou working for you, it's really easy
to just shuffle everything around andgo, Oh, September could be November.
Um, and, and that's where thegenerating income piece is important.

(01:29:46):
Like I, if I bump a launch orbump a new offering out by a
month or a couple of months, well,that's lots of income for me.
And that matters.
Um, because I'm the solebread winner in my home.
So, That's relevant to, um, itdepends on your circumstances.
It depends on your situation,but generally speaking,

(01:30:06):
planning is really important.
Accountability, being in a groupcoaching program, having a mentor,
even just a buddying up with anotherperson, another woman in business.
These are all really helpfulthings to do as well.

Meghan (01:30:19):
Oh, that's great.
And that just.
Brings me back to that whole idea ofcommunity, because even though we do
do all the things we wear all the hatsin our business, having a community,
whether it's someone you've hired or abuddy, that's also an entrepreneur, it's
still someone that is supporting you.

(01:30:40):
So, before we say goodbye, is thereanything else that you might, that
you want to touch on that we didn'tget a chance to, I feel like we
could do a part two to be honest.

Katie (01:30:53):
I mean, it was such a great conversation.
You had so many great questionsand we're real kindred spirits.
I feel like you and I are, youknow, in similar kind of phases of
life and, um, doing very similarthings with similar, uh, outlook.
So yeah, we could sit andtalk for hours, I'm sure.
Um, but I, yeah, I feel like wegot, uh, I was, I was able to

(01:31:16):
share some really beautiful things.
So thank you.
Thank you for asking mesuch lovely questions.

Meghan (01:31:21):
Oh, no problem.
Thank you so much fortaking the time to be on.
I have a couple of freeresources I can share.
Oh, that's so wonderful.
Thank you for that.
Oh, I, I can't wait to diveinto both of them myself.
Right.
Well, thank you so much.
It's been such a pleasurechatting with you.
Same.

(01:31:41):
I really enjoyed our conversation.
Have a beautiful day with your kids.
Hopefully the spider has exited now.

Speaker 2 (01:32:07):
Thank you for joining this week's episode of Anchor Your Dreams.
I hope you enjoyed today'sconversation as much as I did.
A big thank you to our incredible guestsfor sharing their wisdom and insights.
If you resonated with today's episodeand want to explore more about
turning your dreams into reality,Be sure to subscribe to the podcast.
We have a lineup of amazing guestsand valuable content coming your way.

(01:32:31):
Don't forget to connectwith us on social media.
You can find us on Instagram and Facebook.
Share your thoughts, insights,and your own journey using the
hashtag anchor, your dreams.
Head over to our websiteat meganmcquillen.
com in the podcast section, where you'llfind the show notes, resources, and
information about upcoming episodes.

(01:32:52):
Before we wrap up, I want to express mygratitude to each and every one of you.
Your support means the worldto me, and I'm thrilled to
be on this journey with you.
Remember, anchored dreams becomegoals, anchored goals become results.
Until next time, dreambig and stay anchored.

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Embracing Grit & Hardwork | Bhakti Rose

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