S1 E7 ADHD's Biggest Lie: You're either perfect or failing

ADHD loves extremes. All or nothing, perfect or broken. In episode 7, Jess and Jeannine unpack the sneaky illusion of black-and-white thinking and how it shapes everything from work to relationships to self-worth.

They dig into why women with ADHD are especially vulnerable to this trap. The role of rejection sensitivity, executive function overload, and decades of masking that hard-wire perfectionism into identity.

With humor, honesty, and a little chaos, they call out the myth that “good enough” isn’t enough and remind listeners that the gray area isn’t boring, it’s freedom.

🎙️ Angry on the Inside is a podcast for late-diagnosed women with ADHD who are done pretending they’re fine.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Jess (00:00)Let's talk about one of ADHD's trickiest illusions, black and white thinking.

(00:01):
Jeannine (00:05)Also known as all or nothing thinking, it convinces us we're either winning or failing, perfect or broken.
Jess (00:09)But here's the thing, it's not who we are. It's a distortion our brain leans on when the world starts to feel overwhelming to us.
Jeannine (00:18)For
ADHD women, that distortion can shape everything. Work, relationships, or self-esteem in ways that most people never see.
Jess (00:26)Welcome back. I'm Jess. Two mics,
one distortion. Black and white thinking at its best.
Jeannine (00:32)We're
here to prove that gray area isn't boring, it's freedom. Quick.
Jess (00:36)Disclaimer, we're not doctors or
Jeannine (00:38)therapist.
We are certified ADHD coaches, but this podcast isn't coaching.
Jess (00:44)to
late diagnosed women unpacking what we've lived.
Jeannine (00:47)Take what resonates, leave what doesn't, and remember, you're not alone.
Jess (00:51)let's really define black and white thinking. Black and white thinking or all or nothing thinking means interpreting people, situations, or yourself in extremes. There is no middle ground.
Jeannine (01:03)It oversimplifies reality, erases nuance, and leaves us boxed into success or failure when most of life happens in between.
Jess (01:11)And we're going to say nuance a lot today. That's another word we want to make sure we define. Nuance is subtlety. It's complexity. The ability to hold one or more truths at once.
Jeannine (01:24)Nuance is freedom. It disrupts the distortion by reminding us that two seemingly opposite things can be true at the same time. For example, thinking I didn't finish everything and also thinking I still accomplished something.
Jess (01:36)Let's get into it. Why ADHD women are more vulnerable to black and white thinking?
Jeannine (01:43)Let's
start with RSD, or Rejective Sensitivity Dysphoria. While it's not a clinical diagnosis, it's a widely used US term describing extreme emotional pain from rejection. RSD fuels catastrophic either-or

(00:22):
Jess (01:57)is one of those blanket terms that once you start to learn about it, you realize it kind of touches everything, especially from the female perspective. Explain your whole life. That's awesome. Rejection sensitivity, as Jeanine said, not a diagnosis is widely accepted, but falls under the umbrella of emotional regulation.
Jeannine (02:07)It'll explain your whole life. It will.
Jess (02:21)in Europe and overseas. That is something that they recognize very openly and consider part of that umbrella. Executive function is another one that comes into play. When sequencing and prioritizing feels impossible, our brains will default to that all or nothing need.
Jeannine (02:40)really has lot to do with some difficulties with working memory. It kind of goes back to being able to hold those two things in your mind at one time when our default sometimes is being able to hold just literally what's right in front of us at that moment, not even remembering what happened two seconds ago.
Jess (02:57)It doesn't help that women take on more executive function, especially as they grow into adulthood, end up having partners, families, those types of things. Even at work, we pick up more of that executive function. And with ADHD, we are as ill-equipped to do that as any man is. And that RSD comes into play and that perfectionist cycle, it really is a case that it's a full web, spider web? Lost that.
What I was trying to say is women with executive functioning, we end up taking on so much more that in and of itself fuels that RS.
Jeannine (03:34)I ran across a quote the other day. I wish I could remember who said it, but I loved it. Have it up on my board. It says, find someone who loves you for your heart of gold, not your executive skills.
Jess (03:44)Ooh, that's good. That's good and kind of pisses me off, which means it must resonate. Because if it pisses you off, it probably resonates.
Jeannine (03:52)Yeah, when your ex says, want you to be his personal assistant, you really think, yeah, I think he just wants a personal assistant, not a partner, but I digress.
Jess (04:00)I get that. A lot of women get that. I think that is a big point that will resonate and something that becomes a serious problem. So we kind of start to lose the fucks that we gave about being nice about it. From the outside, for other people, when we are no longer taking care of all their executive functionings, that too can impact relationships. To pull us back on topic, why women are more vulnerable ⁓ and the types of women who are late diagnosed ADHD women, which...
It's the both of us, Janine and myself, decades of masking. Those decades of masking come because you were able to mask highly. You were a high masking person. You were really just piling it on yourself and creating that pressure. Those decades of masking, they just create shame and perfectionism hardened into an identity.
Jeannine (04:51)you always feel like, that explains my life. That unending kind of desire for perfectionism, even though it doesn't exist, but ⁓ it is social conditioning. I think it's really just a myth. Obviously we know there is no such thing as being perfect. But for some reason, especially a lot of women with ADHD still have this desire to chase it, even though we know it's fictional, just like multitasking. Our Sasquatch, you know, he lives up here in the Northwest.
Jess (05:17)My old boss would be like, you need to be able to multitask. And I'd like, multitasking is a myth. It's not real. It doesn't exist. Yes, I can do two things at once. No, dude, you talk on the phone and scribble notes. I pick up all your shit, take out your trash and handle all your other calls while you're doing that. And that's not multitasking either. That's just having to do a lot of shit really fast, back to back to back.
Jeannine (05:39)Well, don't you think ADHD brain tries to multitask all the time anyway? It's not actually what's going inside, right? Listen to this, doing that, doing it all and then never getting anything done.
Jess (05:49)That is an excellent point. The ADHD brain is on a constant multitask mission. Yeah. I haven't even thought about that.
Jeannine (05:56)What does this look like in real life? What is the impact that black and white thinking has on us?
Jess (06:01)Examples might be you miss an email. I'm terrible at my job. Lose patience with your kids. I'm a terrible mom. Canceled plans. Obviously, they don't care about me.
Jeannine (06:11)Imposter syndrome definitely thrives. Nothing ever feels like it's enough, even when you've succeeded.
Jess (06:17)does in some ways tie into that dopamine bump that we can easily get addicted to. Maybe we don't see it as that with the black and white thinking, because when we do succeed, we are like pushing and on a high to hit that point. The problem is, that after we succeed, many people with ADHD, we don't get that bump of dopamine for completing a task. When the task is completed, we then get more a form of
relief, like, thank goodness it's over. But then there's always that next thing coming up. In real life, I remember for me a where I was in a meeting and it was when I was at an executive level, but one of my upper level bosses, we were going back and forth and he kept asking me to re-explain myself and re-explain myself. At some point I was like, I don't know how to explain it in any other way.
So I'll need to step back and follow up with you later about this. One of the other bosses chimed in and he was like, Jessica, you are such a black and white thinker. I remember in the moment thinking, what the hell is he talking about? I am not a black and white thinker. I am all about the gray. We are 550 shades of freaking gray in between all of those things. I am open, I am progressive, I am all these things. I am empathetic, I can take everybody's opinion in the room.

(00:43):
and everybody's emotions in the room into account, process all of that shit, and make everybody happy in the room.
AKA pleasing before I knew it was an issue. But I remember thinking, this guy doesn't know what the frack he's talking about. Later on, I learned that I hadn't really turned that lens in on myself because I'm all about the gray for everyone else. I'm all about giving space and grace to everyone else. Where that black and white thinking affects me is the pressure I put upon myself to
reach unrealistic goals. Just for me personally, that's where it came from. Some of the examples we were using, I lost my patience. That makes me a horrible mom. know essentially I am not a horrible mom. I know that things can be both. I will tell you that if I see another mother stressing out in public and having a meltdown, I am more likely to offer help and I'm likely to sit back and think, this poor woman, she's just probably maxed out. She's overwhelmed.
but I can turn that in on myself and get extremely mean with myself. I am not good enough. I did not do the right thing. I have missed the mark. For me and my own reflection in the mirror, that's where two things can't be true.
Jeannine (09:05)Going back to that woman in the grocery store with her kid having a meltdown, I'm judging everyone else. Because I know they're judging her, so I'm judging them. Right back.
Jess (09:13)I can see that too. can see that too. People rolling their eyes and doing their thing.
Jeannine (09:17)me thinking of their black and white thinking, that's how horrible that they just see her only as this one instance in her life, which she herself is most likely not enjoying. And assuming this, she's a bad mom, right? This is the one thing we see of her. That's all we know about her. She's obviously a bad mom because her child's having a tantrum. But because see, I'm not a black or white thinker. I'm just like you. I can see the grace. I can see that, this woman's just having a tough day. I remember when someone told me I you know, I thought in black and white, I thought this had the same.
exact reaction that you had just like, I don't know, are you talking about? What do mean? I'm like open-minded. I'm progressive. I thought if there's areas of gray, I understand it. I understand that nuance. But when it came to me, it was very black and white. It either good or bad, perfect or horrible. It just was a horrible lens that I would really turn onto myself as well.
Jess (10:08)No in-betweens, just feast or famine. Exactly. There is fallout to black and white all or nothing thinking. That can come in the form of burnout, people pleasing, and a lot of missed opportunities.
Jeannine (10:23)That one's huge of that missed opportunity because it ties back hand in hand with perfectionism of if I can't do something perfect, ⁓ if I don't know how to do something 100%, then I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm going to fail. So I'm not even going to try. There is no like, maybe I'll learn as I go along. No, it's I don't know how to do it. And that's that. There's no, again, no in between.
Jess (10:47)And
for a lot of women who are of working age, I think that shows up and rears its head in overworking. Overworking at work, overworking at home, trying to stay in that zone where you are constantly on point. Just an impossible perfectionist view of yourself that leads into burnout. We will literally set ourselves on fire to keep everybody else warm.
Jeannine (11:14)It's
already a problem for women overall. You add the little gift of ADHD that never stops giving.
Jess (11:20)It is the gift that doesn't stop giving. When we joke about it being the gift that keeps on giving, it is very much the case for late diagnosed women. The longer our diagnoses get pushed out, the further down the line we get before we figure out and understand what is going on for us and how we need to lean into our own ADHD.
rather than pushing against it and trying to meet expectations that we think other people have of us. It does keep going. It does keep getting worse. And this is where we bring in that idea of making sure to keep an eye out for our younger generations. Environment matters. Us showing that we are doing the work will set the example and will make life better for them and will make their overall nervous systems healthier.
than ours, even if their diagnoses are later than we want them to be, we can still impact that environment by working on our own nervous systems.
Jeannine (12:22)We talked about that perfectionist thing. If I can't do it flawlessly, then we're not even going to try or we're going to delay. Maybe we will delay until we can figure out a way to make it perfect or I guess time starts to run out of us and we have no choice. And then the adrenaline kicks in. It definitely more often looks like avoidance. I used to always joke long before I knew I had ADHD of somehow I had something really important, you know, like I need to file my taxes, but for some reason suddenly I need to clean my garage out.
because that just suddenly seems more important.
Jess (12:54)can work so hard on a task that doesn't need to be done when I have one that has to be done right now. Has. ⁓ my goodness. I can get so much organizing done. Yeah.
Jeannine (13:01)two heads too.

(01:04):
Suddenly the dishwasher needs to be emptied. Or the laundry that hasn't been put away for five days suddenly needs to be done now.
Jess (13:13)It's like the opposite of rage cleaning because instead it's like, what would I call it? Avoidant task production? What would you call it?
Jeannine (13:22)That's a good one. Actually, is a term. Shoot, I'll have to remember it. There is a term for it that I've heard.
Jess (13:28)Yes, I know there is an actual term. I have no idea what it is. It's interesting when we talk about the missed opportunities because that really occurs when those gray areas that we think we're so good at, when they appear unsafe. It can be a new job, jumping on a new project, changing jobs or changing roles, continuing your education. Those things look unsafe.
Jeannine (13:31)can't think of it right
Jess (13:54)Even though there are opportunities in front of us and we will make connections in our brains to convince us that it's the wrong choice or the bad choice, we will miss out on opportunities. Even just to promote ourselves, we will miss out on opportunities like in front of our bosses or to set boundaries. Boundaries are missed opportunities too.
Jeannine (14:13)that's already something that most women already struggle with. You add on the diagnosis of ADHD and it's just that much more.
Jess (14:20)We know that was a lot. For today, we're gonna call it progress. Progress and chaos, the ADHD two-step. Thanks for listening.
Follow us, make a few comments, share us with somebody that you might think it might resonate with. It's all about trying to get out there. Thanks so much. And remember, you're not alone.