BeTempered Episode 62 – Jeff Swanson: Finding Fire in the Fog of Depression

Some friendships are built on shared victories, bruises, and sweat—on long bus rides and harder losses. But the deepest friendships aren’t just remembered; they return when we need them most.

In this deeply moving episode of BeTempered, hosts Dan Schmidt and Ben Spahr reconnect with Jeff Swanson, a former University of Dayton teammate and roommate whose story is both heart-wrenching and hope-filled. What begins as a conversation between old friends quickly transforms into a profound exploration of grief, resilience, fatherhood, and the transformative power of mental toughness.

Jeff opens up about one of the darkest chapters of his life: losing his father to cancer and the silent storm of depression that followed. On the outside, he appeared strong—working, functioning, pushing forward. But internally, he was unraveling. The moment that snapped him out of the spiral wasn’t some dramatic intervention—it was something bizarre, almost absurd. In the middle of a therapy session, his counselor fainted, and Jeff had to help him. The moment of role reversal jolted something inside: “If I can help someone else while I’m at my lowest, maybe I’m stronger than I think.”

That realization sparked the beginning of Jeff’s transformation. He made the decision to stop relying on medication, not out of recklessness, but out of a renewed commitment to taking ownership of his mental and emotional healing. He leaned into gratitude. He embraced daily discipline. And over time, he began rebuilding his life from the inside out.

But this isn’t just Jeff’s story. It’s also the story of how one man’s decision to change himself ended up changing the lives of many—including Dan’s. At a high school football game, Jeff casually mentioned a program called 75 Hard. That brief conversation planted a seed. Dan took on the challenge, pushed himself mentally and physically, and ultimately, that experience became the foundation for the Be Tempered podcast itself.

Together, the three men reflect on how discipline and vulnerability walk hand-in-hand—how strength is born not just in lifting weights or showing up every day, but in daring to be honest about where you are and what you’re struggling with. Jeff's journey illustrates a core theme of Be Tempered: the idea that pain, when faced head-on, becomes purpose.

One of the most powerful moments in the episode comes when Jeff reflects on being a father—something he almost couldn’t imagine during his darkest moments. “I look at my son… I put him down to sleep and I’m like, I can’t believe I’m blessed to have this child.” It’s a moment of clarity, of awe, of deep and quiet joy that only comes after walking through the fire.

Throughout the episode, Ben offers sharp insights that ground the conversation, reminding listeners that we are never the only ones going through something. And Dan, now years removed from that high school football game conversation, speaks from a place of gratitude—thankful not only for the friendship but for the chain reaction it caused. The podcast itself, this community, this movement—it all began with one vulnerable conversation.

As Ben reflects, “You never know who’s watching you. You never know who you’re going to impact by one decision you make.” That one decision—choosing vulnerability over silence, courage over comfort—can ripple into lives you may never see.

This isn’t just an episode about football or mental health or personal transformation. It’s about what happens when we stop pretending we’re fine and start showing up as we are. It’s about how true strength is forged—not in comfort, but in fire.

Listen now at BeTempered.com or wherever you get your podcasts. And remember: your toughest challenges might be the

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, my name is Allie Schmidt.
This is my dad, dan.
He owns Catron's Glass.
Thanks, allie.
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(00:20):
and services.
Call 962-1636.
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kitchen's best, the clear choice.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Welcome to the Be Tempered Podcast, where we
explore the art of findingbalance in a chaotic world.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
Join us as we delve into insightful conversations,
practical tips and inspiringstories to help you navigate
life's ups and downs with graceand resilience.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
We're your hosts, Dan Schmidt and Ben Spahr.
Let's embark on a journey tolive our best lives.
This is Be Tempered.
What's up everybody.
Welcome to the Be Temperedpodcast, Episode number 62.
62.
That's 10 stronger than 52,which was, a year ago, Our goal.
Yeah, Wow, Still cranking man.

(01:05):
Today on the Be Temperedpodcast, I'm sitting down with
one of my best friends, JeffSwanson.
Jeff and I go way back collegefootball teammates, co-captains,
roommates.
For two years.
We shared blood, sweat andtears on and off the field.
We've stood beside each otherat our weddings and now we watch

(01:26):
our kids grow up while we keeppushing each other to get better
every single day.
Jeff is the guy who introducedme to 75 hard and, trust me, he
doesn't just talk aboutdiscipline, he lives it.
He's a dedicated teacher, astrong leader and someone who's
never backed down from achallenge, From high school
bodybuilding to tearing it up onthe football field to running

(01:49):
his first half marathon recently.
This is going to be a good onea conversation about friendship,
discipline, growth and the gritit takes to keep showing up for
yourself and for the people youlove.
Jeff, welcome.

Speaker 4 (02:04):
Well, that was a much better intro.
I remember hearing one of yourpodcasts early on.
You had mentioned my name andyou just kept saying, yeah,
Swanson's, he's something.
And then you said he's the showand I'm like I don't know if
this is good or bad.
I feel like I got to redeemmyself, so it only took maybe 58

(02:24):
episodes before you got me onhere.

Speaker 2 (02:27):
But no, I'm excited to be here, excited to meet
everyone, ben listen to you andDan, and so, yeah, this is great
yeah man, you know, like wetalked about just a little bit
ago before we started recording.
You know, everybody that I talkto is like I don't have a story.
I don't have a story and whatpeople are going to gain from

(02:49):
this one is our friendship, buttwo is I told you earlier you're
the reason that we're sittinghere right now because you know,
two and a half three years ago,in October of 2022, when, when
we were at a football game andyou started telling me about 75
hard, that was the moment thatchanged everything for me, and

(03:11):
so, um, there would be no betempered podcast without that
conversation, and so I am, I amforever grateful for you talking
about that and sharing thatwith me, and so, anyways, we'll
get into that.
But you know how we like tostart every podcast is we want

(03:32):
your story, we want to hearabout where you grew up, what
life was like for you as a kid,and then we'll get into high
school and college.
So tell us about growing up inCincinnati.

Speaker 4 (03:40):
Yeah, so I grew up in a pretty big West Chester's
north of Cincinnati as a suburband lived there most of my life,
born in Miami and then with mydad's job at the time, you know
we kind of moved around previousto me being born so ended up
back in Cincinnati where Ohio iswhere all my family roots are

(04:02):
from.
Was the youngest of two olderbrothers.
My parents divorced early on soI didn't really remember the
divorce but growing up I waswith my mom and my mom ended up
remarrying and my dad ended upremarrying.

(04:24):
My mom and my mom ended upremarrying and my dad ended up
remarrying and to my mom'scredit, she shared with me one
time that after that divorcebecause she's her family's
originally from Cleveland, thatshe was, you know, really
wanting to move back.
But just a testament to herstrength, she wanted us to have
a relationship with my fatheryou know me and my brother.
So we didn't she didn't't wantto move us too far away.

(04:48):
But growing up, you know, it'slike just typical, like you had
a bunch of neighbor kids, youknow I remember playing like a
lot of housing houses were beingbuilt at times.
We were playing around likefoundations and throwing like
rocks at each other and playingsports backyard football and
basketball and then I got into,you know, youth sports and for

(05:16):
me, like I got into playingfootball and baseball and
basketball and for me it was,you know, because there was
times like I'm very grateful fornot only having family, like in
my life, my mom, my dad, youknow, my step parents, played a
role in all me growing up.
But there was also family drama, you know there was arguments

(05:40):
at times and for me it was theplaying football as an outlet
because I I could, I was kind ofa contact kid.
I was quiet, you know, in theclassroom but I was kind of a
contact kid and I always likedthe physicality of sports and
especially football.
And and my two older brothers,you know they were, they're both
, uh, they got, uh, they wereengineers post-college.

Speaker 2 (06:04):
They're smart ones.

Speaker 1 (06:05):
They're very smart.

Speaker 4 (06:07):
And they they always were into their hobbies, like
they would get a new bike andmom would buy probably get them
a new bike, you know, forChristmas or something, and so
they'd take it apart, you know,and put up a sign like bike shop
.
You know they were just intothose things.
But they also played a hugerole in developing me as this

(06:30):
other kid that liked to playsports.
I was more into that area and Ithink that was an outlet for
them because I think they kindof took the blunt of going
through that hard time ofdivorce, but especially my
middle brother, brian.
My little brother's name isMike, but they just played such

(06:57):
a huge part in my upbringing.
So later on in high school wenton just you know, okay student
more interested in playingfootball wrestling.
You know that was my maininterest and that's all I could
really think about, you know wasjust playing sports.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
Were there any coaches, maybe at the youth
level or maybe even high school?
That had a big impact on you.

Speaker 4 (07:20):
You know, yes, I got to say all my experiences with
and I'm going to paint a broadbrush with my coaches were all
positive, like I don't have anegative experience and later on
, when we talk about UD, it wasall like they never got personal
, like when they went after youfor something you did wrong,

(07:42):
they corrected you, they werevery honest, but it was always
at that level where, like theydidn't call it your manhood.
You know what I mean.
Everything was, and I thinkthat's really important.
It's something I carried onwhen I coached post-college.
But just even like my wrestlingcoach, my head football coach

(08:03):
at a high school level likethose are guys I still talk to
and I was still like I saw thema couple years ago, like my head
wrestling coach, and we gaveeach other a hug.
You know what I mean.
It's like we had, I had a lotof respect for them and yeah, so
it was always a great positiveexperience for me.

Speaker 3 (08:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:25):
No, that's all good stuff.
So you go through high school.
Had Lakota switched to East andWest at the time, or was it one
?

Speaker 4 (08:32):
I was still one.
We were the last class to gothrough, so it was almost like
700 kids that I graduated with,and then it split after that.

Speaker 2 (08:40):
So you graduated in 1997.
Correct, yeah, right, so we'rethe same age and that you
graduated in 1997.
Correct, yeah, it's for thesame age.
And obviously had some successin football, because where you
and I met was the University ofDayton.
So talk about that.
What made you want to go to UDand kind of that transition from
high school into college?

Speaker 4 (08:58):
So I remember I was going to a couple other
universities and you know, atfirst you're getting letters and
questionnaires from the bigschools and you're excited and
you know you walk around schooland you kind of have that
envelope with West Virginia on.
You know, you know, and uh, andI remember my freshman, uh,
football coach, um, he wascoaching to freshman level but

(09:21):
he saw me in the hallway mysenior year and he goes.
You know, you're going to knowthat you're in the right spot on
these recruiting trips becauseof the feeling you'll get.
So I went to a lot of differentvisitation visits with schools
and when I went to UD the firstthing there's a couple things I

(09:42):
noticed right away was howprofessional it was.
I felt a connection with CoachChamberlain who was that
recruited the Southwest Ohio andhearing the stories, it
actually it was Coach TrevorAndrews.
He was a senior, he's the headcoach there now at UD.

(10:03):
He said you know, I have, um, Ihave friends that are playing
division one, but they don'thave the same relationships that
we have here with most of theplayers at UD.
And then the last one was theyplayed the highlight video, uh,
in front of all of us, and I'msitting there with my mom and I

(10:24):
look over and she's like cryingReally, and I'm like, and then I
see what they're playing.
They're playing the senior,last senior game, where they
call the names up and theplayers run and hug their
families.
So that got mom, which I knowthey did on purpose.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
But yeah, so it was instant, not instant, it was
still some back and forth, butyeah, I knew it was, uh, instant
, like not instant, it was stillsome back and forth, but yeah,
I knew it was a good fit for me.
Yeah, I had a similarexperience.
Uh, you know I don't remembermom crying, but you know just
the same kind of feeling.
It was one of those where, youknow, when I I was fortunate
coach kelly was was my, myrecruiting guy.

(11:02):
So you know, it was nice havingthe head coach, as it really
made you feel extra special eventhough I was from the
cornfields of Preble County,ohio.
So just the same thing, justthat feeling of unity, that
feeling of family, I mean itjust felt right.
And so I was thinking aboutthis this morning.

(11:23):
I was listening, I was running,listening to uh Jocko and uh um
, they were talking about who'swith Jocko, who's his, who's his
Ben.

Speaker 4 (11:34):
Oh gosh, the big black guy.
I know I should know this too.
Uh, Echo Charles.

Speaker 2 (11:38):
Echo Charles.
So Echo must've played collegeball, okay.
So he was talking about goingthrough three days in college
and just the the torment and thetorture and just the hell that
it was and how, when he was afreshman, he went in and was
like this really sucks, you knowthis.
This is like what am I here for?

(11:58):
Why am I doing this?
And he kept watching theupperclassmen just saying, hey,
just wait till school starts.
When school starts, things willease up.
So what I what it made me thinkof was our freshman year three
days.
Do you remember where we wentand how they were busing us?

Speaker 4 (12:12):
Oh yeah, and you know it's everything's new.
And I'm looking at theseupperclassmen.
I'm like they look like they'reold enough to be my dad.
They got like mustaches andthey're balding already.
And I'm like, because you comefrom the high school, you're the
top dog and now you're gettinghumbled big time.
And this time, like you said,our field was being redone.

(12:34):
So we had to go and bus toKettering Fields, which you know
it sounds pity, but that waslike an extra 20 minutes each
way.
But now that's your break thatyou're not getting, and then at
that time you're looking forwardto that break.
And I remember we had to dolike a 40-yard running test or

(13:00):
something to that effect and theupper class were running beast
and they they measured the fieldwrong.
Yeah, so, uh, they weren'tmaking time.
They weren't making times andthey were just looking like they
were dropping and I'm like thisis crazy, like what am I doing
here?

Speaker 3 (13:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
And so, you know, and I was, you're kind of like, you
know I'm waking up.
You know you have that routine.
I'm tired, I'm eating my cerealwith a fork, cause I have no
idea.
You know, I'm just trying to.
I'm and, and I started, and Ididn't know anybody at school,
nobody.
And I remember meeting you forthe first time and um and

(13:42):
actually this is probably youhad a witty question this is
actually at lunch when youstarted talking and I don't
remember this, but you had acomment about a tuna fish
sandwich I was eating, so Ilaughed and then I got to know
you and Brad and then we startedforming those bonds and

(14:05):
connections early on.

Speaker 3 (14:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (14:07):
And even so, like I remember you asking like hey,
like Swanee, we want we'restarting to plan our sophomore
year.
Yeah, and I was on a floor withlike seven other guys and like
half of them played football andwe were in different dorms.

Speaker 3 (14:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (14:21):
And, um, we, um, and I remember, like man, like man,
I'm already, I'm already kind ofgonna live with these guys, you
know.
But I knew the quality ofperson you and brad were and the
guys you were with, um, andwhat turns out that I saw from
here today it was me and one ofour person that came back
because everybody quit,everybody quit, wow, you know.

(14:42):
And so, um, jumping ahead,going to my sophomore year, that
was very hard for me and I waskind of I felt like I was, you
know, your freshman year.
You're kind of get a lay of theland, you want to help out the
most best you can, but you'realso trying to form
relationships, um, you're tryingto understand the playbook and
everything's new, and and thenthen you want to start

(15:05):
developing yourself in afootball player.
Well, my sophomore year Ireally felt like I went through
the motions, like I was on ateam, but I didn't feel like I
was making and I think it was achoice, like I just wasn't, my
head wasn't in there, you know.

Speaker 2 (15:25):
And um.
So it was.
You know, I I same thing.
You know, sophomore year for mewas the most challenging year
because I was the.
I was the last guy on the depthchart on the D line to travel,
so I traveled to every game butI never played.
Like maybe that we were inMonmouth, new Jersey, I think I
may have got in like the lasttwo minutes of the game and that
was the first game of theseason, and then maybe a handful

(15:45):
of times the rest of that yearand then in practice, when
you're that guy, you don't getmany reps right.
It sucked.
I mean, I'm the same as you.
I just was going through themotions.
I was, quite honestly, if itwouldn't have been for Brad and
his, his determination and hismotivation to improve, um, and
his attitude towards everythingI don't, his motivation to

(16:07):
improve and his attitude towardseverything I don't, I'm not
sure I would have would havehave finished out.
And so sophomore year waschallenging.
But well, tell what positionyou were, what position did you
play?
defensive end the end.
I was a D tackle, yeah, so thenwe get into our junior year,
yeah so I remember.

Speaker 4 (16:22):
So I was starting to like, okay, I have a chance to
compete here.
And I remember in our innersquad scrimmage my shoulder
popped out of place and wentright back in and I didn't say
anything.
I stayed on the field becauseI'm like hey, I'm trying to
compete here, junior year, thisis a junior year.
Yeah, okay.
And then a couple plays laterit just popped out and didn't go

(16:44):
back in.
I had to go and took a waterpop, get it back in.
So that season was basically mein a sling, and that was at that
time.
Then I'm like this, I couldn'tstand it.
I'm just like I'm sitting here,I'm not even contributing to
anything, and it was.
I remember you were playing,you're done with your season,

(17:08):
and I'm like schmidt, let's goto the weight room, like I was.
We're like squatting threetimes a week in december and I
like, because I was, I was likeI had made that switch of, like,
hey, I, I want to do better.
You know, I want to get better.
I want to like, get 100%, put100% into this.
So, um, and you did, you, youworked, you worked out with me

(17:29):
and we pushed each other.
Yeah, I had a great offseasongood, spring ball and then, um
yeah, going.
I took a red shirt because Iwas, I didn't play my junior
year and then I had two moreyears of eligibility.
So I'm'm looking back.
I looked up to you and Brad andsome of the other guys.
I was like Sean, eddy andMcAfee and these guys were

(17:50):
playing and I was like I want tobe a part of that and then we
were living together very close,I mean like a brotherhood.

Speaker 1 (18:01):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 (18:04):
And so that pushed me to like I was 100 invested
watching film in between classes.
Like you know, I was investedand had a very good uh year.
That year we did well as a team.
You know, the thing about ud is, like I said, the coaching was
outstanding.
All those coaches were likethey.

(18:25):
You look up to them and youcould tell they were in.
You had to win at the collegelevel.
But they're also developing menand get stewards of the
community and they weredeveloping these men that you
know.
The attrition rate too is likeafter your freshman year.
The guys are leaving and youknow it's um, the guys are

(18:46):
staying there.
You can tell they're investedand yeah and uh buying into the
coaches and stuff yeah, and it'spowerful.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
And that that's what made me think with listening to
jocko this morning, you know,just took me back to those those
years, those, you know, I meanwe hated camp, right, I mean
college football.
Two a days was three days, youknow, we, we started at, you
know, practice I don't know nineo'clock.
We'd get up, have breakfastpractices from I don't know nine
to 11.

(19:11):
We'd come back, we'd eat lunch,shower, crash, right, bodies
aching, I mean just hurting.
Go back out to the afternoonpractice in the heat of the day
on AstroTurf not FieldTurf,which is concrete um two hour
practice.
Come back, eat dinner, showerup, go out for special teams

(19:31):
which, whether we were onspecial teams or not, we were on
special teams because we had tobe at practice.
And then we turn around and wego to film till 10 o'clock at
night and and you do that foressentially two weeks straight,
two to three weeks straight, andit's, I mean it was hell.
I mean, it was very challenging.
So when I hear like my soncomplain about how hot it is and

(19:52):
going to practice, I'm thinkingit does, that's part of it, but
I think that's where you becomea man Like, that's where you
learn life sucks.

Speaker 4 (20:03):
And it's.

Speaker 2 (20:03):
You know, there's highs and there's lows.
There's probably more lows thanhighs and by going through that
, that really helped to show meand to shape me and I think you
too that we can get throughanything after going through the
hell.
That was that so talk aboutyour, which would have been my
senior year.
Talk about that.

Speaker 4 (20:23):
Yeah.
So let me just it's thatcommitment.
So I mean just it's thatcommitment.
So I mean you think about, likewe were in a unique position,
how often you realize it's morepost-college when you're in your
career, but you had 100-plusindividuals, all from diverse
backgrounds, all trying tostrive for a common goal.
I mean, when does this happen?
You know, and that's somethingthat, like, you're not going to

(20:47):
like everybody on the team, butyou're going to work with them
and push them because that makesthe team better.
And that was an importantlesson I think you know you
learn through sports.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
You know, at any level.

Speaker 4 (21:03):
So it was very, you know, then, um, going into my
last year, like it was verydifficult, like when you guys
left because I was so close butI had other strong relationships
with the class underneath methat I was now a senior, you
know right um, like martymcnamara and alan sanders, you
know, and we had a very goodteam.

(21:25):
I mean it was.
I think we went 10-1.
That was the year that 9-11happened, yeah, so we lost the
game.
We didn't go to Austin Peay andplayed, but, yeah, we had a
great team that year and I wasfortunate enough to be voted
captain amongst my peers, youknow, which is, you know, you

(21:49):
play, you get awards andrecognition and stuff.
But that was my greatest honorto have that, because I've
earned the respect of my, mypeers, my the player, the guys I
was playing with and myteammates and I know you wrote
me a letter, a very heartfeltletter, and so that was very

(22:10):
special.
I remember Coach Kelly bringingme in and one of my best friends
, Marty McNamara, played safety.
He was a safety and corner.
He got voted captain, you knowhe was like and Jermaine Bailey,
and that's you know it's likethe thing is.
From that experience you knowyou might, just because of the

(22:32):
ebbs and flows of life, you losetrack of guys.
You might not talk to them on aregular basis.
You know you go from seeingthem every day, living with them
, hanging out.
Now you're in real life, You'redeveloping family, making
families and stuff, and you'reall over the country, and now
you're.
But what's special is you canjust jump right back in.
Oh yeah, the conversations andthe brotherhood, even if you

(22:54):
haven't seen each other in twoor three years.
Yeah, and that's something Ithink that I'm always grateful
for and very fortunate to havegone through that experience.
I mean, think about if, like,there was a small like.
I remember, like my sophomoreyear, I was like, do I really
want to do this?
Like this is hard, you know.
Yeah, and the two things thatlike cut me on the team was my,

(23:16):
which is you guys like it wasthat bond we had shared, yeah,
and I know my mom would never,ever want this to be a reason,
but I also wanted to give herthat senior moment Cause I I
could tell I meant a lot for heryou know what I mean and she
was like, oh, I don't, youshouldn't have done that for
that, you know that's.
But it was a special moment,you know, and I was like you

(23:39):
know, those are things that Iwant to make sure that happens.

Speaker 2 (23:42):
So yeah, that's awesome, man, awesome awesome.
Great memories, great times.
That brotherhood, you're right,I mean, it's something.
We had Marcus Colvin up here, Ihadn't seen Marcus in.
I don't know, probably 15 years,and Marcus and I weren't super
close when we played, but wewere teammates.
And when you go through astruggle like that with people

(24:02):
and you face all those differentadversities together, it's
amazing the bond that comes fromthat Cause you're right, you
can pick up right where you leftoff.
If you haven't seen anybody in20 years, it's amazing.
You know, just like you and Itoday we hadn't seen each other
in quite a few years.
Uh, I mean, we talk a lot but,um, you know that brotherhood
that's not something that evergets broken.

(24:23):
I think that's special, um in alot of sports, but especially
in the sport of football, forsure.
So, all right, so you getthrough college.
Now life's changing, now it'sgoing to get real right.
So talk about that transitionfrom college to the real world.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
So you know I, I got into teaching um, teaching phys
ed, and started coachingfootball and started dating
public schools for a couple ofyears and it kind of bounced
around, lived in Columbus for ayear and then got a job at
Lebanon High School, which isnorth of Cincinnati, and yeah
and there's all things weregoing well.
You know, I felt like it was agood place, I was a good place.

(25:03):
What happened kind of changedeverything.
Was my dad got diagnosed withcancer, colon cancer first, and
I was living with you thatsummer I think when I first
found out, maybe, but anyway.
So he had gone through surgery,got the tumor removed and then

(25:23):
went remission for a coupleyears but his health was
deteriorating and over five,five, eight years or so.
So I started to see like Ialways looked up to my dad, you
know, like my dad he was.
You know he was great with meand my brothers.

(25:43):
Like I said, my brothers wereengineers, so he would take the
time to do the hobbies and sharein their interests and I was
the sports kid and he would workwith me the best he could.
You know, and you know I mean Isaw my father every other
weekend and maybe a couple oftimes on occasion during the

(26:05):
week.
Uh, cause he would.
He would try to be involved,but he's also busy working.
He was selling hospitalequipment, you know.
So he's on the road a lot andstuff.
But I always looked up to himthat's my dad, you know what I
mean.
It's like he's in the.
So I started to see him justdeteriorating.

(26:26):
He's becoming a shell of hisformer self, and so basically we
got news that there wasn't awhole lot anymore they could do
for him.
So I was probably 27, 28,somewhere around there, and the
last couple weeks before hepassed away he was at a hospital

(26:51):
and there was a hospiceconnected to the hospital.
So it was a back and forth ofthis is it he's going to pass
away?
There's one more thing we cando.
Let's get him back in thehospital.
We're constantly.
It was like kind of a back andforth and it finally was like

(27:12):
there's just nothing we can do.
So and he, like I said, hishealth was deteriorating very
rapidly the last couple yearsthat this was going on.
So basically we were in thehospice for two weeks and I got
the call.

(27:32):
I was teaching.
I got the call on a Friday.
My stepmom was like this, is it?
So I ran out of school, went tothe hospital and I saw him like
it was.
I saw the whole dying processUp until that point it was like

(27:53):
you witness it.
He's gasping for air, gaspingfor air like three or four or
five times, and then he takeshis final breath and his skin
just turned gray and I'm likewhat just happened?
And so, you know, tears arepouring down.
I drive back to an emptyapartment in Hyde Park in
Cincinnati, you know, cincinnati, and I'm like what just

(28:16):
happened?
Like you know, I couldn't, Iwas like shocked almost, you
know, and what transpired andI'm like what just happened?
I couldn't, I was like shockedalmost.
And what transpired after thatwas a dark period and I've never
had this like a feeling ofdepression.
Really, I have dealt with.
I had to bury like a highschool friend and I've dealt

(28:37):
with like people dying, but itwas, you know, it was your dad.
It was different.
So the next couple years afterthis happened, so he died,
passed away at 59.
You know, three months prior tothat I was a pallbearer at my
grandfather's funeral.

(28:57):
Now he lived a great life, butI was like that was kind of like
, but he was a great man.
Like you know, I love mygrandfather.
And then my dad died and then Iwas at this time I was in a
long-term relationship and Ikind of knew that we were headed
our separate ways.

(29:17):
But I could not face anotherloss.
I was just paralyzed withdecision.
I couldn't move on.
I was just spinning my wheelsand it wasn't fair to her.
You know what I mean.
It was like she's trying tomove on, she wants to.
You know, maybe we could betogether.
But we just knew.
But I couldn't just make thefinal twist like, hey, we gotta

(29:42):
go our separate ways.
So the thing is I I was dealingwith emotions that I've never
dealt with before.
I didn't know how to handlethem.
I would put on a good face,like when I was around people
they see us guys happy and stuff, but then I would go back.
I'm just like in some prettyheavy I guess it was depression,
you know and I would call youand lean on my friends and my

(30:04):
family and and they they were.
You guys are so amazing.
But when you're in this spiral,there's this you don't see what
other people see.
So this I remember, like I wascoaching football, you know, and
I'm trying to do a good job, myhead was a different place.
We were playing Trotwood and Ithink the D coordinator was like

(30:25):
hey, what did you see?
I'm the D-line coach at thetime and I'm just like a blank
slate.
There's just nothing.
I mean, I'm just like, and Iget off the field.
I'm trying to hold back tears,it's just like it was a dark
place.
So I back two years like it'sjust like it's a dark place.
So you know, I'm getting a lotof trying to people trying to
help me.
Um, the relationship at thistime was done, it was over and I

(30:47):
was just kind of like I'm by myuh, I I went to a doctor again

(31:09):
this is not medical advice, okay.
So he had put me on anantidepressant because I was
like I'm gonna going to tryanything, you know.
And I seeked out, like, I guess, a counselor or therapist, okay
, so I could walk to thiscounselor just trying to get

(31:30):
help, just trying to getsomething.
And we had three or four visitsand it was going okay.
I wasn't didn't feel like I wasgetting in any better place or
not.
But on the fifth visit I had anexperience that kind of changed
things around.
So what had happened it was on aSaturday afternoon I get to
this guy's.
I'm sitting on the couch andwe're talking.

(31:54):
It's supposed to be an hourlong.
We're talking and about 20minutes in I notice this guy's.
Really he looks like he'sintoxicated or he's under the
influence, and I'm talking andhe's starting to pass out.
He's going in and out ofconsciousness and I'm like man
and then he just like completelyunconscious.

(32:15):
So I'm kind of man, I'm likeI'm just going to walk out, like
this is crazy.
But before I walked out Inoticed he had a jar of jelly
beans and a Coke and I don'tknow how I figured this out, but
he was in diabetic shock.
So I go over to him and Istarted giving him jelly beans

(32:41):
and I'm like hey, doc, how wefeeling.
And I also noticed he had likean insulin pump.
I called 911, and I'm on thephone with the 911 operator and
I'm like say my name.
And I'm like hey, I'm in thisdoctor's office, this is what's
going on.
And she's like what's yourpatient's name?
Again, I'm like no, you don'tunderstand.
I'm like hey, I'm in thisdoctor's office, this is what's

(33:01):
going on.
She's like what's yourpatient's name?

Speaker 1 (33:02):
again, I'm like no, you don't understand, I'm the
patient.

Speaker 4 (33:04):
The doctor's like complete flip, you know what I
mean.
And there's somebody elsewaiting.
We're like an hour and a halfin this.
I'm not sure I didn't want totreat this person.
I'm like hey, this doctor's notfeeling well.

Speaker 2 (33:21):
I need you to direct the.
We're going to need toreschedule, yeah.

Speaker 4 (33:25):
I played like secretary for.
So he came to Anyway, and whathad happened?
From that moment?
I was like man, I know I got todo some work, but that gave me.
It was like a flip.
I was like I'm going to getthrough this.

(33:45):
This is not going to define me.
Went home, threw theantidepressants away.
I was done.
I didn't call the doctor.
The counselor reached back outto me and was kind of like just
to check on me.
I think he was kind ofembarrassed.
I was like, hey, I just thinkI'll be okay.

(34:09):
That's when I started realizingthat your brain is I was a gym
rat, still am, I was a gym rat,still am but you train your
muscles, you go to the gym,train your muscles, make them
stronger, bigger.
You can do that with your brain.
And I started going down thatpath of understanding how you go

(34:31):
about doing it.
And it wasn't like every daywas rainbows, butterflies I'm
clicking my heels and all thisit was.
You know I might have one goodday, next day might start out
bad, turns good, or two gooddays, you know, but then the
good days outweigh the bad andthen you're having you're going
to a You're just, yeah, you'restacking the wins Stacking the

(34:52):
wins exactly.
And so I built myself into apoint where I'm like I am in a
good spot, like I felt it insidethat I was in a spot where I
was happy.
You know I had found that andno matter what happens, you know
I will my my outlook on lifehad changed and a week later I

(35:18):
met my wife you know we had setup and and um by a guy I coached
with and I met Jamie.
Um.
The next week came into my lifeand and I knew she's always
like when did?

Speaker 3 (35:32):
you know you love.

Speaker 4 (35:32):
I like I knew right away that I liked her and then,
very shortly after that, I waslike I love this girl, I'm going
to spend the rest of my lifewith her, you know what I mean.
So I mean you think about liketimes in your life where had you
not gone through with stuff, oryou know, I do think I had to
go through that situation tobecome the person I, to become

(35:55):
that person I wanted to become,you know, to attract the people
in my life that I wanted toattract to my life.
And God kind of did that, likehe's like you got.
You have to go through thishardship.
It's not going to be easy, butyou're going to get through it
and so, um, so yeah, that was avery change, like life changing
event.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
Yeah, man, that's thanks for sharing that.
That's powerful, I mean youyou're making me a little
emotional just thinking aboutthat because I I, as you were
talking, I vividly remember, uh,when we lived in town I was
mowing the grass and I rememberyou calling me and whatever, and
I knew all that you were goingthrough with that and the

(36:42):
challenges you were facing and,you know, did a lot of praying
for you.
But I vividly remember onephone call and I could tell you
were, I mean you were at bottom.
You know you were reallystruggling and it was a
difficult time for you.
But you know, and hearing youtalk about this, you know, just
brought back those memories andhow I felt for you because I

(37:04):
wanted to help but I knew therewasn't a whole lot I could do
other than being that supportand being those ears.
And I think we, you know, weprobably got together a couple
of times and maybe had dinner orhad a couple of beers or
whatever and had goodconversation.
But you were, you know, I knewit was something that you had to
figure out and but I didn't, Ididn't, I didn't remember that,
that part of that story.

(37:24):
So, thanks for thanks forsharing that, man.

Speaker 4 (37:27):
Yeah, I mean that's um and the thing about that's
all started with the bonds weformed.

Speaker 2 (37:31):
Oh absolutely.

Speaker 4 (37:32):
I mean all you guys, Sean, Eddie, I mean I look, I
lean on all you guys, yeah, andwe have done that for the last
25 years that we've known eachother right.

Speaker 2 (37:41):
I mean, anytime we have an issue, it's a or you
know, our kids have donesomething great, you know, or we
you compete in a half marathon,you know.
We're always sending texts andthings like that, and that's you
know.
That's that brotherhood, thatbond that we formed, definitely.
So, all right, so you meetJamie.

Speaker 4 (37:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
Right, so talk about how that relationship grows and
forms.

Speaker 4 (38:01):
Yeah, so you know we had set, so it grew very quickly
.
I knew I wanted to marry her.
I was kind of shuffling my feetbecause of that fear maybe of
you know you think about.
I knew what a successfulmarriage looked like because my
step parents were great peopleand but I was feared that maybe

(38:25):
I wasn't adequate enough, youknow, or I would make mistakes.
I think both my older brothersare in, have great families,
they're married.
They had the same kind of fear,you know.
They kind of shuffled theirfeet, proposing or whatever.
But obviously we got marriedand our marriage was.

(38:50):
I think what was great aboutbefore we got married is we did
marriage classes through ourchurch.
That kind of set the foundationto get us on the right page.
I didn't know anything aboutthat.
I grew up Catholic but I wasn'tpracticing and so I didn't know
this existed and I was kind oflike, okay, I'm going to do it
for her.

(39:11):
But then it set us up forsuccess because you form a bond
with someone and you get intomarriage and you start having
kids.
You know there's going to bechallenges.
So, um, but yeah, we gotmarried and um have two great
kids, uh, eight year olddaughter, jolie, and a

(39:33):
five-year-old son, brody Um,they want to make sure I got
their names in there, Cause theywere like you can make sure you
talk about us, daddy the cutestkids in the world.

Speaker 2 (39:43):
They're at my mom and dad's house now swimming and
the thing is I learned.

Speaker 4 (39:49):
So one of the things I learned going through that
hard time was the practice ofgratitude.
I used to keep a gratitudejournal and I would write it
every day.
It was like if I had a bad dayit might be like I'm happy, I
have clean clothes to wear or Ihave food on the table.
You know what I mean.
It's like something.
Some days it's like I'm happyabout this, this, this, you know
, and so I still I don't have a.

(40:11):
I don't keep a journal becauseI don't.
It's in my head.
I looked at my son.
I put him down to sleep and I'mlike I can't believe I'm
blessed to have this child.
He's like the perfect kid.
I know he's not perfect, buthe's sleeping.
You're just so grateful.
The other day I was drivingsomewhere my daughter's in the

(40:34):
back seat and I parked and Ijust looked back and then I was
kind of just looking at her forprobably a minute and she's like
what are you looking at, dad?

Speaker 2 (40:45):
what's going on here?

Speaker 4 (40:46):
This is kind of weird , but I'm just like, how did I
have this beautiful daughter?
You know, you're just, you'regrateful.
Like I'll look at my phone IfI'm having a day.
It's kind of just.
You know, nothing exciting hashappened.
I look at my phone, I look atmy wife, jamie, you know, and
I'm like looking at pictures andI'm like how did I land this
beautiful woman, like inside andout, who's like in it, for the

(41:10):
rest of our lives together, likewe created two beautiful kids?
You know you have it's morelike you see, you're, you're
grateful for that, you'regrateful for those things.
And you, you look, you know youlook at I don't know.
Again, it's not like it'severything's perfect, but it's.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
You have that skill set and you when you went
through all the experiences thatyou've went through in your
life and the challenges that youface it, and the highs and the
lows and all those things.
I think, as we get older, asmen, we you know there are
certain things in our lives andit may just be that split second
in the car where you're lookingin the mirror and it hits you.
You know how blessed that youare and how grateful you know

(41:50):
that you are to have such ahealthy daughter and a healthy
son and an amazing wife, becausenot everybody gets to have that
.
So I think that's God's way ofof showing you those tiny little
moments when maybe you'refeeling stressed or anxiety or
work sucks or whatever's goingon.
You know those little glimpsesof hey, just kind of remember
what you got, you know, and how,how grateful you need to be.

(42:12):
So, um, yeah, that's that'simportant in life.
Um, okay, so you got thisperfect family.
You got this amazing wife youknow it's, uh, very successful
in college.
You're teaching life's, life'sgood and um, at some point in
time I want to get in.
I want to discuss the 75 hardthing, because this is where we

(42:35):
kind of reconnected a little bit, um and and quite honestly I'm
not going to tell you, you savedmy life, but I really felt like
I was on a crash course to belike your therapist was, quite
honestly, like I felt like I washaving dreams of being diabetic
.
I don't know why, but I was notin a good spot.
So talk about and I don't knowif you remember that

(42:59):
conversation that we had atDrew's football game, but you
know, let's talk about that alittle bit, let's go back to
that.
Talk about 75 hard and whatkind of led you down that path.

Speaker 4 (43:08):
Yeah, so I would.
I mean I was gettingcomfortable in life.
You know things were going okay.
I that was comfortable.
You know we talked aboutearlier conversation about that
and so, um, so kind of duringthe middle of the whole COVID
thing I had gotten together withmy father-in-law, rick, my
brother-in-law, dave, some oftheir friends, guys connected

(43:31):
with and have a friendship withnow and we're going to get a
couple of beers.
You know you got to sit outsideon the on the deck, 30 degree
weather, you can drink out there.
You got to go inside, put yourmask on, get your beer.
Um, anyway.
So my brother-in-law, dave's,he goes, he starts talking about
Andy Frisilla and the 75 hardprogram.
So again, I was, I wascomfortable, so I immediately

(43:54):
dismissed it.
I was like who is this guy?
Why 245-minute workouts?
Why not 30-minute workouts?
Why a gallon of water?
I was trying to validate my ownfeelings of why I couldn't do
this.
So we had this conversation and, like anybody that wants to

(44:16):
validate their feelings, they goto the internet.
I had typed in 75 hard and I'mreading this article and I'm
like and it's just a hit pieceon this.
And I'm like, yeah, this isexactly what, the way I'm
feeling.
And then I looked at what, whothe article is from was from
cosmopolitan, and so I'm like,okay, and then what?

(44:37):
Then?
The basically what happened wasI tried to do?
I learned more about it,started listening to Andy
Frisilla.
A lot of what he would saywould resonate with me and I
knew how to make a change.
I just I I was a gym guy, Ilifted weights.
I have my home gym, I'm lifting.
I actually thought I washealthy, but I wasn't.
I was a gym guy, lifted weights.
I have my home gym, I'm lifting.

(44:57):
I actually thought I washealthy, but I wasn't.
I didn't look the part Not thatI do now, but I was not the
best version of myself.
So I started 75 hard attempts.
I would attempt a couple ofdays, like multiple times.
The furthest I got before Italked to you about it was like

(45:21):
33 days, day 34, I think we weregoing to our third birthday
party.
I was starting to think aboutthe second workout and I'm like,
and I'm around kids it's, youknow, all day like screaming.
I'm like I'm having a beard,like Jamie, I'm done, and then I
would try again.
And the biggest hang-up for mewasn't the workouts, the gown of

(45:47):
water reading.
It was the anticipation ofhaving anxiety, of being at
social events and someone saying, hey, swanee, why aren't you
drinking a beer?
That was the biggest hangup.
I would ruminate this in myhead and that would cause me a

(46:07):
lot of angst.
I'm like, how am I going tohandle this situation?
Well, I should be like I'm notdrinking, just don't even give a
, you know.
But it was that anxiety of thatsituation.
So my brother, dave, had gonethrough it successfully and I'm
like man I just can't get pastsome of these barriers I'm

(46:27):
having.
So when I so when we went toDrew's football game so we were
playing elder yeah, so it's avery traditional like private
high school, catholic highschool they got the west side,
they're tailgating and they'revery passionate about football I

(46:50):
almost didn't go, and it wasn'tbecause I was afraid you were
going to and Vliet wasn't goingsay, or going to say stuff about
why I wasn't drinking a beer.
It was how I was going tohandle that situation.
So I'm like, okay, I have to go.
How am I not going to go?
So I pull up, and I pull up toVliet's tailgate and Brad's wife

(47:10):
, kelly, who's an awesome.
I mean I've known her sincecollege.
She's an incredible woman.
The Kelly, who's an awesome, Imean I've known her since
college.
She's an incredible woman.
The first thing she does ishand me a beer.
It's because she didn't knowright.
And I'm like, no thanks, kelly,but I really appreciate it.
And then I saw Schmidt.
So basically for the next twohours I saw Schmidt's wheels
turn in his head.
He's like what is?

(47:31):
What's going on with Swanson?
But I wasn't going to sayanything to him.
I wasn't going to like, justspill the beans.
I was going to make him likekind of ask some questions and
stuff, and so he finally startedtalking about it and I think I
sent you the book, the originalbook, and so this was in the

(47:52):
fall and that winter was likepretty cold, brutal winter.
I'm getting these videos ofSchmidt like he looks like he's
in Antarctica on a ErnestShackleton expedition, like he
is snowing.
He's telling me how much heloves, like loves me as a
brother, how grateful.
And I'm like I'm like Jamie, isthis guy for real?

(48:15):
Like I was like is he messingwith me?
You know, like this is crazy.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
Like I'm like I'm like Jamie, is this guy for real
?

Speaker 4 (48:18):
I'm almost like is he messing with me, you know, like
this is crazy, you know, andhe's going through these
workouts.
He's doing awesome and he makesit to 75 days I think the first
time he did it First time yeah.
And I'm just like I have got toget this, I got to be able to
do this, Like I mean, you'retalking about multiple attempts,
20, 30 attempts.

(48:38):
I did that over the years.

Speaker 2 (48:40):
So you did 75 hard, you just did it.

Speaker 4 (48:42):
Yeah, it was like 75 day ones, you know.
I was like I'm just going to doday ones, and that is I had up
to 75.
But, um, and it was a runningjoke between me and my brother,
brother-in-law, dave but um, sofast forward.
We, my wife and I, go out todinner on July 3rd, our wedding
anniversary and uh, we hadhaving to go to this fondue

(49:06):
restaurant.
She's gonna hate me for sayingthis but uh, and I just kind of
like we both kind of lookedaround, we don't go to this
restaurant at all.
Um, and we were just kind oflike we both kind of looked
around, we don't go to thisrestaurant at all.
And we were just kind of like Idon't know you, just like we're
just kind of maybe disgusted,not disgusted, but you're just
kind of like we can do better.
Like this is crazy, like youknow, and and so we.

(49:30):
The next, the July 4th, is whenwe start our first one, and we
and we did it together.
We came up with, like we had agame plan.
I would do my outdoor workoutfirst thing in the morning, come
back, make breakfast.
She's in the basement doing herworkout.
Afternoons we would switchoutdoor-indoor and we had a plan
Like we worked together and Ithink the first time she was

(49:58):
getting frustrated because she'sprobably 30 days in, she
thought she should see more ofthe physical changes.
She's already very fit, but sheshould see more of the physical
changes by day 30.
I was like you're working outtwice a day, you're eating
better, it's going to happen.
And then, literally a coupledays later she got very fit,

(50:19):
lean.
I mean completely transformed,and think about it.
She stopped right before themagic happened.
So that was great because ourkids now saw mom and dad taking
making health their priority.
So they would, I would, um,some days, like I get back from

(50:39):
school, I put up a pull-up barin my garage and I would do
pull-ups and push-ups and stuffand just so they could be
outside.
Could we, you know, and theywant to join in.
You know, they were likejoining that.
Being active I I always thoughtI could control my mornings and
because the afternoons orduring the day other people are
going to take your time, thingshappen.

(51:00):
So I would have a basket ofclothes like rain gear, shorts,
winter gear, boots, whatever Ineeded.
So there was no hesitation.
When that alarm clock goes offat 4, 4.15, I'm out the door.
I don't want to disturb anybodyand I already have stuff laid
out, and so you start thinkingand planning and making your

(51:23):
time more efficient.
So we had a great experience.
It wasn't always easy,obviously that we decided to do
a second one.
So we did two in a year and oursecond one started January 1st.
What I tell other individualsthat have questions?

(51:45):
I'm like, even on your worstday with this program because
Andy Frisilla says it's not aphysical challenge, it's a
mental strength challenge Evenon your worst day, you're still
doing more than you would havedone before and most people are
doing yeah, probably more than95% of the people in the world.

(52:07):
Exactly.
You're reading, you're workingout, you're drinking water,
eating good.
So we we had um, two weeks inwe had to put our dog down and I
remember Jamie calling me likeshe's crying, because that dog
is literally a physical memoryof your past 10 years, like we

(52:34):
got our dog before our kids,before we got married and stuff.
So I go home, go to Wendy's,get before we got married and
stuff.
Uh, so so I go home, you know,go to Wendy's, get her a double
bacon cheeseburger for like alast meal.
And I walked the dog in and Ijust I lost.
I was like deep, heavy sobbing.
I couldn't get words out.
I was like I had no idea thiswas going to affect me that much
.
So put her down and my initialthought was I'm going to quit,

(53:00):
I'm going to go back to house,I'm going to get a giant
cheeseburger, drink a couplebeers.
That's how I was going to copewith that situation and I was
like all right, you're betterthan this.
See, the difference between thefirst time I did it and the
second time was you kind oflevel up You're?

(53:20):
I'm trying to say yourperception of things or your
consciousness, your awareness isgreater.
So I went down to the basementand worked out.
I still had tears in my eyes,but that was better than the
alternative, so yeah, that'samazing, man.

Speaker 2 (53:43):
I'm impressed that you remember that conversation
too, because I remember at thegame you walking up and I think
I probably tried to give you abeer too and you're like you
know, you kind of shied away.

Speaker 4 (53:56):
And I failed that attempt.
Yeah, I was like a couple ofdays later, I failed it.
Yeah, oh, you did.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Cause you were in 75 hard then and I was yeah, so
that's yeah, yeah, and that was.
I mean, like I said, that was alife changing event for me and I
just basically, like I said, Iknew leading up to that moment
that something had to change,like if I did not change
something, like God was going tochange me, like either my
health was going to fail,something was spiraling out of

(54:24):
control, and so that's why, youknow, we were in the middle of
harvest at the time, so I didn'tstart for like two weeks after
that, but I spent those firsttwo weeks kind of prepping,
thinking, studying, reading here, you know plant, you got to
plan all that stuff out.
It's important, um, I mean, yes, you want to, you want to get
started right away.
You don't want to wait.
Um, you're better off to tojust jump in and do it.

(54:47):
But having a little bit of aplan and that could be just the
plan for the morning or, like onSundays, prepping your meals
right, getting everything readyto go, having all those extra
sets of clothes, depending onwhat climate you're in I mean
all those things are importantto be successful, because I
promise you, when you get tothat time, to do that second
workout after you went throughthe busyness of your, you know

(55:08):
work day, kids, whatever boy.
It's easy to let that doubtcreep in and say you know what?
Yeah, boy, it's easy to let thatdoubt creep in and say, you
know what, yeah, this ain'tworth it.
So, man, I can't thank youenough for turning me onto that
program.
And I know there's many peopleI know Ben's done it, I know

(55:31):
Rose at Works for Us has done itLots of people in our small
little community that have done75 art, some of them multiple
times.
Uh, my wife Kim, my brother,jeff, um, you know, and it's, it
is truly a life changing, uh,mental challenge.
It is physical, but the mentalis the biggest thing, and that
and that's what I needed.
So, um, grateful, grateful forthat.
All right, we're going to,we're going to try to wrap this

(55:53):
thing up.
We're getting getting close toan hour.
Dude, you've been, you've beenamazing.
Um, if you could sit on a parkbench and have a conversation
with someone, living or deceased, who would it be and why?

Speaker 4 (56:08):
Well, I'd be my father.

Speaker 3 (56:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (56:11):
I'm 100%.
So I mean the, the you knowfather, yeah, 100.
So I mean the you know he wasum, he always looked for the
good in people we would.
We watched a lot of moviestogether, so black back when
blockbusters were around, or youknow, I'm like anxious to get
home, or we were in a bunch ofmovies and he's like just
chatting it up with this.

(56:32):
You know, people around themaround him, like we couldn't get
out of stores because he's justtalking to everybody.
He'd always put a smile onpeople's faces and I would say,
you know, like, and towards theend he wanted to become a
teacher.
So it's like he's 50.
He's getting out of like hiscareer to pursue teaching.

(56:52):
He's going back to Xavier,getting an education degree, I
mean, which had to have beenhard, like most people are like
talking about retiring and he'slike wants to pursue this
passion.
So his perseverance was alwayslike something.
You know he wasn't perfect byany means.
He got knocked down but healways got back up.

(57:13):
You know, and I always try tohave that.
You know, internal dialogue,like.
I think he's speaking to me attimes, you know I, I did a, I
did a half marathon.
My older brother, mike.
Uh, recently that I almostdidn't do it took convinced my
brother-in-law, dave, and made acomic I was gonna quit.

(57:35):
I was like the training washard, I got sick.
My brother-in-law, dave, hadmade a comment because I was
going to quit.
The training was hard, I gotsick.
My brother-in-law Dave and mysister-in-law Kelly and Jamie
were all sitting there and Davewas like, hey man, would you
want your kids to do what youare doing right now?
Something to that effect youpreach You're not going to quit,

(57:56):
right, you know what I mean.
But would your kids, you know?
What are they going to thinkExactly?
So I end up doing it and I thinkabout, like, had I quit and not
gone through, I wouldn't havehad to experience my older
brother, like dad saw, like myfather was like probably so
proud of this gone through.

(58:16):
I wouldn't have had toexperience my older brother Dad
saw it.
My father was probably so proudof this.
In the same breath, the seedsthat were planted too, amongst
other people that were there,that said I'm signing up for
half next time.
You've inspired me, my kids.
Were you talk about having amoment where God's in the room?

(58:39):
My daughter like hugged me whenI got home because she was so
proud of her dad.
My 5-year-old son was likehugging me.
He was like I'm proud of you,dad.
You know, like he's a5-year-old and 8-year-old kid,
but they had that, we had thatmoment.
My wife was probably, you know,I mean, and so that was very
encouraging and and um, so Iknow I kind of went off the

(59:02):
track.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
No, you didn't.
No, that that was.
I mean, that was good, that'spowerful man.
Ben, you got anything to add?
Any questions you can think offor jeff?

Speaker 3 (59:10):
not questions.
I just I go back to think ofthat like dark time that you're
in, you know, and you talkedabout getting out of that and
you know, after experience withthe counselor.
And then all of a sudden youknow you dig yourself out of
that and you're like I'm goingto be okay.
And then every day makingbetter.
And then, because you did that,then it changed like Dan right,
yeah, not changed him, but Imean that's what gave you a path

(59:37):
you felt like in it.
And then, because of that, thepodcast, right.
And then now you know, doingyour trek the other day, what
did you say?
The same as I think, if I caninspire somebody else, and it
all started.
I mean, you inspired him andit's just a chain that should
motivate everybody.
You know, you never know who'swatching you or who you're going
to change by a decision thatyou make.
Yeah, that's an excellent point.

Speaker 4 (59:50):
That's something as you get older, as I get all
right realizing like you have noidea what action or what you
say, what kind of effect thatcan have on other people that
you interact with on a dailylife.
And even something as small asI was walking out of my son's

(01:00:11):
eye doctor, there was a piece oftrash on the ground and I
picked it up and threw it away.
It wasn't my trash, it's justsuch a small thing, but a lady
saw that and it was.
She picked up a piece of trash,it was something.
So like mine.
That's an example.
Think about the hard times Iwent through, but then I was

(01:00:34):
able to pass things on to youbecause you helped me out.
That's an example where, like,just think about like the hard
times I went through, but then Iwas able to pass things on to
you or cause you helped me out,and that's an excellent point,
yeah, and I think that's that'slife, right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
I mean, that's the importance of life, that's the
importance of doing the rightthing.
That's important.
That's important Sharing thestory of you being vulnerable
and telling all that stuff thatyou've went through throughout
your life, because that is acommon thing A lot of people go
through, but not everybody getsthrough it.
There's, there's somebodylistening right now who has has
been in those same dark spots orin those dark spots that you

(01:01:06):
have been in, and they don'tknow how to get out, how to take
that step, how to how to makethat change.
So, you know, your story isgoing to help someone in in a
spot that you have been, to takethat step, and I think it comes
with embracing the small things, those small wins.
And that's what 75 hard did forme is is, you know, not looking?

(01:01:29):
Yes, I have goals, I havevisions of the future, of where
I want to be and what I want todo and, uh, all these things.
But what can I control?
I can control what I'm doingright now.
I can control today.
I'm not going to.
You know, somebody asked me theother day were you ever going
to eat ice cream?
Again, I'm like I'm human, I'mnot going to say I'm not but I'm

(01:01:52):
not today, right, you know, andjust stacking those little wins
and recognizing there's goingto be times when it's going to
get difficult, but it's notgoing to stick around, you'll
get through it.
Just keep taking that step.
So, jeff, I appreciate you,brother.

Speaker 4 (01:02:05):
Yeah Well, I mean, you've always been an
inspiration, someone I look upto, you know, and you and a lot
of my close friends.
So, um, you, you, you alwayssay like how much it's changed
you and I'm so excited.
You know, I feel like I did asmall thing, I introduced you,
but when you come, when you tellme like how much it just grew

(01:02:28):
you as a person, that inspiresme to like help others too, you
know so yeah, I appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (01:02:36):
I'll leave you with all with this quote A real
friend is one who walks in whenthe rest of the world walks out.
Jeff, that's you, my brother.
I appreciate you, uh, sharingyour story.
I know you were a littleanxious and had some anxiety
about coming up here.
That's all right man, you didfantastic.
Someone is going to be affectedin a positive way by your story

(01:03:01):
.
So, everybody, we continue tothank you for the support and
the ears with the podcast Go outand be tempered.

Speaker 1 (01:03:11):
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