BeTempered Episode 78 – Robert Rogers Lost His Entire Family in a Flash Flood and Still Chose to Praise God - BeTempered

Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_04 (00:04):
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SPEAKER_05 (02:09):
Welcome to the Be Tempered Podcast, where we
explore the art of findingbalance in a chaotic world.

SPEAKER_01 (02:14):
Join us as we delve into insightful conversations,
practical tips, and inspiringstories to help you navigate
life's ups and downs with graceand resilience.

SPEAKER_05 (02:22):
We're your host, Dan Schmidt, and Ben Sparr.
Let's embark on a journey tolive our best lives.

SPEAKER_01 (02:29):
This is Be Tempered.

SPEAKER_05 (02:30):
What's up, everybody?
Welcome to the Be TemperedPodcast, episode number 78.
Good job, Ben.

SPEAKER_01 (02:37):
Thank you.
My job is complete.

SPEAKER_05 (02:40):
There are moments in life that test the very limits
of faith.
Moments that shatter everythingwe thought we knew about love,
loss, and God's plan.
Our guest today has livedthrough one of those moments.
In the blink of an eye, hisworld was swept away.
Everything he cherished,everything he worked for, gone

(03:05):
in a single night.
And yet, out of the depths ofthe unthinkable tragedy came
something extraordinary.
Not what followed was notbitterness, but belief.
Not despair, but devotion.
And through it all, a newpurpose was born.
A ministry that has touchedhundreds of thousands of lives,

(03:28):
carrying a message of hope,healing, and the power of living
with no regrets.
Today on the podcast, we welcomea man whose story reminds us
that God can bring beauty fromashes, that faith can rise from
the flood, and that even in ourdarkest nights, his light still
shines.

(03:48):
Robert Rogers, welcome to the BeTempered Podcast.

SPEAKER_02 (03:52):
Thank you.
Thank you, Dan.
Thank you, Ben.
Thank you.

SPEAKER_05 (03:54):
Honored to be here.
You know, I heard your story,it's been a couple years ago,
when you spoke to a large groupup in Mercer County, Ohio, and
uh it's a story that uh oncepeople hear it never forget.
And it's a story that that youhave retold, I think you just

(04:16):
said thousands of times, right?
And this is a uh it's a it's atragedy, but I think what
everybody will gain from this isthe amazing power and love that
Jesus has for us as his people.
So before we get into that, howwe always like to start the

(04:39):
podcast is we like to start fromchildhood, to lay that
foundation to learn about whatlife was like for you growing
up, where you grew up, and whatyour family was like.
So give us a piece of that.

SPEAKER_02 (04:49):
Sure.
I'm the youngest of eightchildren, grew up in Cincinnati,
Ohio, into a beautiful family.
We live on the west side oftown.
So five boys, three girls.
My parents began naming them allwith single syllable names,
Paul, John, George, and youknow, Paul, John, and George, if
I was Ringo, we could have hadthe Beatles, right?

(05:10):
But uh Ann, Mary, Ellen, Markin,and Robert, so branch off into
two syllable names by the timethey got to me.
But kind of a 12-year gapbetween the top and or 12-year
spam between the oldest andyoungest, and and just a lot of
fun growing up.
You know, we lived simply.
Um remember my mom would go tothe Kroger store there in
Cincinnati and ask for theirdented canned goods.

(05:32):
And they would sell her wholebox for a dollar.
And they were either dented orthe labels were missing or
something.
So what's for dinner tonight?
Well, I don't know, let's openthe can without the label.
Uh, is that tuna fish?
No, it's cat food.
Okay, you're kidding.
You never knew what you weregetting, but you know, we never
were hungry, and God alwaysprovided.

(05:54):
And uh my mom, incrediblehardworking lady, she um she was
married at 18.
My father, I think, was 23.
And thanks, thanks be to God,they celebrate 60 years of
marriage.
Wow.
In 2012, I believe it was.
So we come from good stock byGod's grace and great example.
And my father often talked aboutthe power of good example, and

(06:16):
they gave that to us, thanks beto God.
And so uh growing up, my mom hadall 12 of us, all 10 of us,
sorry, all eight of us in uhabout 12 years before she
started going to school.
So after I was born, she beganschool at the University of
Cincinnati for her uh educationdegree.
And as soon as she graduated, myfather took her by the hand to

(06:38):
the bursar's office and said,now sign up for your master's
program.
She wanted to punch him and slughim.
I'm kidding, I've finallyfinished my bachelor's, you
know.
But uh she finished hermaster's.
She was so glad she did.
Uh truly no regrets decision.
And she went on to teach over 30years in the Kentucky, Northern
Kentucky public school system.
Wow.
So uh part of her, she taughtinitially special needs children

(07:00):
in uh Newport, Kentucky, andthen went on, got qualified and
gifted, and then uh taught at atreatment facility in Northern
Kentucky University, NorthernKentucky for youth felons,
youthful offenders.
So taught the whole gamut,really.
But as part of her special led,uh she led the Northern Kentucky

(07:20):
Special Olympics one year.
And she was in charge of it, andof course, a ton of details.
And I was, I don't know, um,eight, ten years old, something
along those lines.
And I just remember there beinga lot of children with Down
syndrome and special needs, andthe people at the end of the 100
yard dash would wear a big, Ithink a red t-shirt that said,

(07:42):
I'm a hugger.
And so they would run down andjust full of joy and just bam
into their arms, it's a greatbig hug.
That made a big impression on meand started kind of tenderizing
my heart toward those withspecial needs.
And God was going to use thatlater in life.
And so um my father had been athree-pack a day smoker until

(08:06):
his doctor said, Do you want tolive to see all eight of your
children grow up?
And when he picked his jaw upoff the floor, he quit cold
turkey.
And that's amazing.
It's a tough thing to do.
It's a very addictive, ofcourse, substance.
And uh he used to drink uhoccasional beer here and there,
and then he you know quit allthat.
And so they challenged us tostay clean, to stay pure.

(08:29):
And they kind of bribe each oneof us to say if you don't smoke
by the time you're 18, we'llgive you 100 bucks.
A lot of money then.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, with the 12-year spanbetween the oldest and youngest,
by the time my sec my b brother,two years older than I reached
that time of his life, he said,Hey mom and dad, you know, with

(08:50):
inflation, uh, doing somecalculation.
Can you make it 125 instead of100?
So they did sure, Mark.
So I got 125.
But never touched it.
Just never needed to.
I don't like alcohol, nevertouch you know cigarettes or any
of that garbage or drugs.
And I don't brag on me, I bragon God.
I was just saying no regressdecision looking back, that I

(09:13):
guess I just respect this bodytoo much that it's not mine,
it's God's, it's God's temple,and I'm to use it for his glory,
however that may be.
I don't know where, when, orhow, but I want to be an
instrument in the hands of Godthat he can use.
And so I try to, you know, takecare of myself and just watch

(09:33):
what I eat and all that stuff.
So growing up, we'd all go tochurch together, and we fill up
an entire pew at church, and Iwent to um uh parochial grade
school and uh Jesuit HighSchool, St.
Xavier in Cincinnati.
And uh all ten of us would fillan entire pew at church, and I
called God Lord many, manytimes.

(09:54):
I was an altar server and youknow just loved serving at
church and being involved.
But I hadn't yet made him Lord.
And there's a big difference,whether what no matter what
denomination we grew up in, wecould all be guilty of just
going through the motions andjust paying God lip service.
I was sitting in a pew and Ijust didn't have a clue.

(10:15):
And as a teenager, I startedasking all these questions.
You know, God, are you there?
Are you real?
What does all this mean?
What am I doing at church everyweek?
And it brought me on a spiritualjourney where I had started
going to a non-denominationalchurch in northern Kentucky, and
and uh they had a moment whereyou could just publicly just

(10:36):
completely surrender your lifeto Christ.
I thought, you know, I've alwaysloved the Lord, I've always
believed in Him.
I've known of God, but have Iknown God intimately and
personally?
Have I made a public professionof my own will to do so?
And I thought I want to do this.
And so I went forward and I didthat.
And I didn't feel any tingles orthis or that, but it was a stake

(10:58):
in the ground to say, yea,verily, as for me and my future,
my life, I will serve the Lord,and he is my Lord.
Because so many people want tobe their God, but don't always
want to be their Lord.
There's a big difference.
We like him to be our God, ourFather, but Lord means he calls
shots, means I align my lifeunder his rule, under his

(11:19):
authority.
And uh, up to that point I nevermuch owned a Bible or read the
Bible on my own.
We would hear to church.
And I've told most people todaybarely hear to church.
About 80% of the people don'tread their Bible outside of
church of all denominations.
And so I was certainly guilty ofthat.

(11:39):
So I got my first Bible, and itwasn't this one, but I fell in
love with the words on thesepages.
I started studying it, startedreading it, signed up for a
Bible study class called theNavigators 2-7 series.
And we'd have these littlepocket scriptures, put in your
pocket, pull it out, read it,memorize it.
For God so love the world thathe gave, you know, John 3 16.

(12:01):
For it's by grace you've beensaved through faith.
And I just started to memorizethe word and get the word into
my heart.
And boy, that really took root,and that solidified me and put
down a deeper root into the soilof the good Lord.
And of course, little did I knowhow much I was going to need it
later on in life.

(12:22):
And so I thank God for thatmoment.
And when you fall in love withthe written word of God, with
his scripture, you'll fall inlove with the living word with
Jesus Christ.
And it just seemed to blossom myfaith and make it come alive in
ways I never had experiencedbefore.
And it was beautiful.
So growing up was great.

(12:43):
It was uh beautiful time offamily.
We'd all pile into a VW bus andhead out east to the beach and
uh just spend time on the surfand sand and pick in a basket
and good clean, just family fun.
We'd pitch a tent and stay staythere overnight and just have a
lot of fun as a family.
So I just remember goodmemories, and my father worked

(13:05):
incredibly hard, as did mymother.
In fact, my mom, when she wasgoing to school for her college
degree, she'd come home on adinner table, just a little bit
bigger than this table here.
She would have her textbookstrying to do her homework, have
the checkbook, trying to balancethe checkbook, and have dinner
going ready all at one time.

(13:26):
How she did it all at one timewas just incredible.
It still amazes me.
Uh, my father was working duringthe day, and he was also getting
his master's degree at night andteaching at night at Zave
University, teaching some oftheir broadcasting uh classes
when they were just beginningthe program.
And his mother was all was apianist, and um, I play the

(13:48):
piano as well.
And I guess I get a lot of mytalent from her.
Her name was Alice Rogers, andum, I would sometimes go and she
never drove a day in her life.
So when I got my license, Iwould go and pick her up from
the hospital because she wouldwork at the Veterans Hospital as
a music therapist.
Very fascinating field.
She's one of the pioneers in thefield.

(14:09):
It was very new then.
She taught at the New EnglandConservatory of music and
elsewhere in the field ofveterans and music therapy.
And again, that just opened myheart, not only to fulfill a
commandment honor your fatherand your mother, that includes
your grandparents, of course, aswell.
But also for those in need,because she would always look

(14:33):
people in the eye.
Say, hi, Mr.
Smith, how are you doing today?
She was always called a Mr.
or Mrs.
until she had permission to useher first name.
Very respectful.
She never wanted to be a botherto anybody, never wanted to be
in the limelight or get theattention.
Don't bother with me.
She had a thick Bostonianaccent.
I'm all right, dearie.
Don't bother with me.
Robert, my dearie, how are youdoing, dialing?

(14:54):
Great Bostonian accent.
I loved it.
So I miss her very deeply.
But uh she encouraged me to playthe piano in public at family
gatherings at uh Thanksgivingand Christmas.
And I was shaking at the pianoand shaking at my knees, and I
learned to kind of, you know,get a grip on nerves and just go
with it.
And you mess up and just keep ongoing.

(15:16):
And those are all life lessonsthat we learn.
You know, life is not alwayseasy.
And a lot of times beingcourageous is not the absence of
fear, but knowing there'ssomething more important.
And you keep your eyes fixed onthat.
You keep on trudging through.
And you mess up along the way,but you keep on flowing through.
So I wasn't a big sports guy.

(15:37):
I played soccer a bit here andthere, but you don't want me on
your baseball team.
I'm not good at tossing the balland all that, but I was good at
piano.
And I I taught as I learned as ayoungster at the Conservatory of
Music in Cincinnati.
And uh that taught me a lot ofdiscipline where you just lock
yourself in a practice room andwork at it and learn all the
music and get it down.

(15:59):
And I taught me discipline to bewith the word, you know, with
the word of God.
And I found the word that meansthis quiet time in God's
presence, reading scripturesevery morning.
It begins as a duty and evolvesinto a discipline, but then it
become a delight.

(16:20):
And I look forward to it everymorning.
And several years ago, a wiseman challenged me with these
words.
He said, No Bible, no breakfast,no Bible, no bed.
And those are good words to liveby, real simple.
I like simple phrases.
So, in other words, I start mymorning with the word of God
before I feed my stomach or fillmy foal with fruit loops or

(16:42):
frosted flakes.
You know, fill your soul withthe bread of life.

SPEAKER_05 (16:45):
And you did that even as a as a young kid?

SPEAKER_02 (16:48):
As a teenager, yes.
After I bought my first Bibleand started reading it on my
own.

SPEAKER_05 (16:52):
Was it was there ever a time in in those high
school and and maybe collegeyears that you wavered away from
that?
Things pulled you away.
I mean, that that's a you know,as kids are growing, going
through puberty, and you haveall these different outside
influences.
Were you able to continue tostay on that path?

SPEAKER_02 (17:10):
Not religiously every day.
Sure.
But I never lost my love for theLord.
I never strayed way off thereservation.
Um my parents had a rough patchwhere they were separated for
about six months.
And so I I didn't rebel, but Ijust, you know, spent a little
more time away from home, and Iwas just learning to drive.

(17:31):
And so we were all just tryingto find our way because suddenly
my older siblings were out ofthe home, and I was there, I
think just my older, one olderbrother and myself, and it felt
very disjointed.
I'm so thankful my parents cameback together and reconciled,
and and I stayed at home even uhthrough most of my college
years.
I commuted from home.

(17:52):
So that was terrific.
So yeah, I I continued my lovefor the Lord, and I got involved
in musical theater and playing apiano here and there, and
playing piano at theconservatory for dance classes
and children's theater, you nameit.
So I was very involved in thatway.
But um I did well in high schooland graduated with good numbers
and so forth, and wanted topursue music in college.

(18:15):
And I went to uh here inIndiana, Anderson College for a
few years, studying piano andmusic ed and also computer
science, because I I had a gooduh scientific bent and
engineering kind of bend.
So I was doing a dual majorcomputer science and music.
And it was it was good for awhile, but I wanted to really
challenge myself moreeducationally.

(18:38):
I knew electrical engineeringwas a really tough curriculum.
And I was still taking pianolessons and doing what I wanted
to do music-wise.
So I thought, you know what, Ithink I better switch gears and
go back to school in Cincinnatiand study engineering.
Well, that was a big kind ofsell to my parents to say, I
want to kind of start my collegeall over, mom and dad.

(18:59):
And by the way, I spent twoyears studying music.
This curriculum is five years.
That's seven years for a degree.
That's a long time.
Five-year curriculum because oneand a half years of it is spent
co-oping as an intern at acompany.
Six months on, six months inclasses, another six on, back
and forth a few times.
So a year and a half totalco-oping.

(19:21):
And um it was a big, it was along haul.
I had to dig my heels in again,and just that tenacity and
discipline that I learned uhwith piano and music, I had to
apply it to engineering and justlock myself in the library and
just put my nose to thegrindstone and learn the
material.
I wasn't a natural at it.
I mean, I got good grades, Igraduated modnicum laude, but I

(19:44):
had to really work at it.
It didn't just come naturally,and I hadn't, I wasn't one of
these guys who had a um a tinkertoy set and you know, messed
with electronics and a solderingiron and everything as a
youngster.
So I had to learn it all goingalong.
But I did well and I co-oped upin the Boston area of all places
where my father had grown up andhis parents, and so it was great

(20:07):
to be up there.
I was on the um westernoutskirts of the Bostonian kind
of big circle freeway out inMarboro and Hudson area.
I worked on a high-tech companyhelping to design computer chips
during the day.
Well, on evenings and weekends,I got a job in downtown Boston
playing a piano of all places ata Sidewall Cafe.
My buddies and I, there werefour of us together in one

(20:28):
house, uh, four, threeclassmates.
We had just kind of wanderedaround Boston for some
sightseeing, and I saw this uhpiano player at an uh outside,
uh, just baby grand in a cafe.
It just looked like a lot offun.
So I walked up to him and hesaid, Hey, just play me a song.
So, okay, so I played something.

(20:48):
He said, Hey, give me yournumber.
Can I uh have you come in for asubstitute every now and then?
So uh he gave me a lot of work.
Just uh after hours or onweekends, I would play four
hours, six hours.
Six hours was a typical shift.
Sometimes you do a double shiftbecause somebody called in sick.
I'd do 12 hours playing thepiano.
It's a long time.
My fingertips, my fingerprintswere gone at the end of the day.

(21:12):
But I built up my chops and meta lot of neat people because it
was at uh Quincy Market FannualHall area, so very touristy area
of Boston.
People came in from Germany andall over the country and all
over the world, so it wasbeautiful.
Got a lot of tips and saved upmoney and bought some music gear
and that kind of thing.
Uh and of all places, God chosesomehow to intersect my life

(21:36):
with this beautiful blonde fromKansas named Melissa.
And she had had a rough timewith her father.
Turned out he had uh apparentlyevidently molested her when she
was very young.
And uh they struggled throughthat.
They went to counseling togetheras a teenager, but she was
trying to just find herself andneeded to get away from the her

(21:59):
roots in Kansas for a time anduh find herself.
And so she was a nanny for threeyoung children in the Boston
area.
And uh she just plopped down apiano bench next to me, and it
never happened to me.
I'm kind of a geeky nerdyengineering type.
I'm a shy, reserved introvert.
I didn't date a whole lot, Ididn't know what to say.
I was shaking to my boots again,just trying to keep my fingers

(22:21):
on the right notes.
But we just started talking andwe started laughing together,
and the words just startedflowing.
And uh she kept on laughing,probably because at that time I
had a mullet.
She kept on looking at my hair,which was disgusting.
But uh it was great.
And uh we dated a bit at first,and then I had to go back to
school for six months.

(22:42):
I came back and we dated more,and we essentially fell in love
over a big huge honking icecream sundae at Friendly's ice
cream.
Peanut Reese's peanut buttercupice cream sundae, I believe it
was.
Okay.
That's a good one.
Yeah.
And so I thought, boy, if shelikes ice cream like I like ice
cream, I better marry this girl.
So um we married in Cincinnation New Year's Eve on the Ohio,

(23:06):
on uh sorry, I proposed on NewYear's Eve on the Ohio River on
a riverboat cruise.
And she said yes.
And one full year later, sothrough my senior year, we were
planning our wedding and savingup our money because we paid for
the bulk of it.
We also married on New Year'sEve in Cincinnati.
And so, after seven long years,I finally graduated with one

(23:27):
degree, yay, one job offer.
It was during a recession, andso the offer is from California
and Silicon Valley area.
So I thought, well, I guess Ibetter take it.
So we packed up our cover wagon,moved west, and started our
lives together.
And we always wanted a bigfamily, and God blessed us with
children, but none ever cameeasily.

(23:47):
Our first we named McKenna.
She was over two weeks late.
So we we had wanted to do a umhome birth and we and a water
birth.
So we had a midwife, we had abig inflatable little swimming
pool, like a tub thing, and uhvery small apartment, 600 square
foot apartment, very expensivein that part of uh central

(24:08):
California.
And things were progressingalong, but uh she wasn't
dilating like uh the midwife hadhoped.
And after two long days of toughlabor and delivery, after
actually after about a day and ahalf, the midwife said, I think
we better get some help.
So we went to the hospital, andafter 12 more hours of trying,

(24:30):
they were just we wereexhausted, excruciating.
I don't know how Melissa did it.
But I finally had a C-sectionand gave birth to a beautiful
girl named McKenna.
Nine pounds, eleven ounces,twenty two inches long, upside
down.
So it's no wonder she didn'tcome out naturally.
Yeah.
That's okay.
At the end of the day, you stillhave a baby, and that's what
matters.
And she was healthy and whole,thanks be to God.

(24:52):
So when she was about a yearold, uh I was uh gonna go to
church go to work early thatmorning, and Melissa had
collapsed on the floor at ourapartment.
Had no idea what was happening.
Turned out she was bleedinginternally and she couldn't
move.
Had I gone to work early thatmorning, I most likely would
have come home to a dead wife.

(25:14):
And I didn't know what to do.
This was actually before cellphones.
And I got her into the car andjust raced to the hospital.
And they admitted her foremergency surgery, transfusion.
Turned out she was pregnant,which we didn't know.
And the baby apparently lost inone of her tubes and exploded.
It was an ectopic rupture.

(25:34):
She lost a huge amount of bloodinto her abdominal cavity, so
she was bleeding eternally.
And what I really stretched ourfaith, because here we wanted a
big family.
I'm from a big family, we'rehoping to have many children.
And suddenly we lost a baby.
I almost lost my wife.
She lost uh almost half herreproductive organs.

(25:56):
You know, it's gonna be at leasttwice as difficult going forward
to even have another baby.
So I just kind of threw my handsup and said, Lord, uh, what do I
do?
What what is this?
What why are you stretching uslike this?
Why would you let this happen?
I mean, we're passionatefollowers of Christ, we're
reading the scriptures, we'regoing to church regularly, we

(26:17):
tithe faithfully, you know, wedo all these things, and life
still happens, right?
So you do don't you do all youknow to do, and it rains on the
good and the bad.
No matter what happens, lifestill has its course.
And so it stretched our faith toreally trust God even more when
it doesn't make sense.
And so we said, Well, Lord, westill want a big family, and lo

(26:41):
and behold, within about half ayear we found out we were
expecting again, thanks be toGod.
By then it was about five yearsin California.
We had had enough of the WestCoast and wanted to move back to
the Midwest, be closer tofamily.
We could have moved toCincinnati, close to my parents,
or to Kansas City area, closerto Melissa's family.
And we intentionally choseKansas City for a reason uh just

(27:04):
to help foster reconciliationbetween Melissa and her father.
Because uh their relationshipwas still strained a bit.
There was forgiveness, but justneeded to repair and restore
that relationship over time.
And that proved to be a very uhblessed and fortuitous decision.
So I'm glad we did.

(27:25):
So I found a job in the KansasCity area, and we bought our
very first home, and we justfound out we're expecting
another child a few monthsbefore.
So a few months later I gavebirth to our very first boy, and
we named him Zachary, anothereight-pound whopper, another day
and a half of tough labordelivery, another tough uh
undergoing, but he was bornnaturally, thanks be to God.

(27:50):
But uh the day after he wasborn, the doctor said, We
believe your son has Downsyndrome.
And we had not done anamniocentesis, we were just
willing to take whatever God hadgiven us.
And boy, that was like a suckerpunch to my gut, like a four by
four to my head, just saying,Lord, what what's going on here?
Why is it so tough to get eachchild here?
Why does each one have his ownchallenges?

(28:12):
And suddenly we had to face thefact that life would never be
the same.
You know, our son may neverlearn to drive, may never get
married, may not have children.
Who knows?
But it was developing us,developing our faith, developing
our trust in God.
Because trusting God is reallyfaith in action.
And he was stretching us, andtrials have a way of doing that.

(28:36):
And I've come to really see thattrials are really divinely
appointed uh difficulties,detours, delays that God either
causes or allows in order todevelop us, to make us more like
him, to conform us into hisimage.
And so it's tripping myself awayand filling myself with more of

(28:59):
him.
As I heard a pastor say,marriage is a long, slow death.
That's the truth.
It's the death of myself, medying to myself.
Because especially husbands areto love our life, our wives as
Christ loved the church.
He gave himself up for her, hedied.
So I'm a dead man.

(29:20):
I have to lay down my life formy wife, for my children.
And we were learning that onestep at a time and one shot at a
time, because you lay down yourlife for your children,
certainly.
And so it was a whole new worldof therapy visits, hospital
visits, um, being involved inthe Down syndrome guild of
Kansas City, the buddy walkaround Arrowhead Stadium and all

(29:42):
that.
And he went to teach them signlanguage to communicate and
gross motor therapy, fine motortherapy, feeding therapy, all
these things.
It was very challenging.
But now I see how God tied in mymother's love for special needs
children as a teacher, as aneducator.
And my exposure to the specialOlympics in northern Kentucky.

(30:04):
And now we had a special child.
And the verse from Ephesianschapter 2 that says, You are
God's workmanship, hismasterpiece, his handiwork, his
majestic splendor, onetranslation says.
You're not an accident, not amistake.
No, you are God's workmanship,created in Christ Jesus to do
good works, which He hasprepared in advance just for you

(30:26):
to do.
That verse really came alive offthe pages of Scripture and was
truly the word made flesh,literally in our lives, with our
son's acry.
So we learn a lot of greatthings.
Disability is really not a, youknow, that horrible of a
difficulty, but it's anopportunity to grow closer to

(30:47):
God and grow closer to eachother.
And so we did this as a family.
And you know, the nationaldivorce rate is somewhere around
50%.
And for families with, which ishorrible enough, for families
with special needs children,it's around 80%.
How much more they need mom anddad intact.
And so we had to work at ourmarriage.
You know, you had to work atstill having a date night with

(31:10):
my wife, and still writing hernotes, and still telling her I
love her.
When there's a messy diaper andour son had a colostomy bag for
a while, and that thing wouldexplode and have a great big
mess, and nights at the hospitalfor surgeries and so forth.
It was very tough.
But it was a tempering process,truly, of our character and of
our faith, of our trust in God.

(31:32):
And so a few years later, wefound out we were expecting it
again by God's grace, gave birthto another son, we named him
Nicholas, another nine-poundwhopper, another day and a half
of tough labor and delivery,another C-section, but another
miracle.
And uh and then uh we found outwe were expecting again, but
then we miscarried again.

(31:53):
And uh remember Melissa evenpassed what she believed was
part of the tissue of that baby.
And so we put it in a little boxand buried it alongside the
house and just kind of had ourown moment with uh what was what
remained of our child.
And again, that stressed ourfaith even more.
We just said, Lord, why is it sodifficult to have children?

(32:15):
Why is it so tough to get themall here?
And uh we didn't receive a textor a facts or an email from God,
but we have his holy word,right, who speaks to us through
the scriptures, and we have hisholy spirit in our hearts.
And we just had an unction toadopt, just a little inkling,
adopt.
So we just went for it.
We went to an informationalmeeting at an adoption agency in

(32:37):
the Kansas City area, and withthese tears rolling down our
cheeks, we knew this is for us.
Long story short, 11 monthslater, we're on a 747 airplane
flying from San Francisco allthe way to Beijing, China,
because we heard about a littleorphan girl that nobody else
wanted because she was specialneeds as well.
She had a heart defect.
We thought, well, hey, we have aspecial needs boy.

(33:00):
Let's go get a special needsgirl.
She's perfect for our family.
So the whole adoption processwas about 11 months.
It was relatively uh short.
And so in January 2003, webrought home this beautiful
bundle of joy from China.
We named her Alina, AlinaWenying Rogers, and she was just
embraced by her siblings.

(33:22):
And so here we were, finallywith two boys, two girls,
beautiful family.
We had two missing carriagesalong the way.
A lot of work, but a lot of joy,a lot of fun.
And uh we had made up our mindswe wanted to start homeschooling
our children.
We hadn't yet up to that point.
But um that summer of 2003, wejust kind of pulled back from

(33:46):
all the extracurriculars fromthe soccer and other
involvements, and just said, youknow, let's just be a family.
Let's just hang out and havefun.
Pitch a tent in the backyard,you know, do the inflatable
swimming pool on the deck, andget out some popsicles in the
backyard or on the front porch,and just simple stuff, nothing
real glamorous.

(34:06):
But it was just fun.
We just had great times witheach other.
And uh Melissa kept a journal.
And she wrote in that journal,this summer's been the best
summer of my life.
I'm so glad that we simplifiedeverything and just spent time
with our family.
She said, I wonder what God'sgonna do next.

(34:27):
And that was her last journalentry.
And uh towards the end of thesummer, it had been a long, dry
summer in the Midwest, uh, kindof a big drought, and everybody
was praying for rain.
Well, we got it, but we got itall at once.
It was the uh Hurricane Isabellastorm system that came up from,

(34:48):
I think, the Gulf Coast andparked over the Midwest and
dumped a huge amount of rainover Labor Day weekend.
And we had traveled three hoursfrom Kansas City to Wichita,
Kansas for a relative's wedding.
We had a great time at thewedding and the reception, and
our kids were playing with theircousins and running around and
grabbing slices of cake and soforth and just having fun.

(35:12):
Well, as you can tell, ice creamis very important to our family.
It was how I met my wifeMelissa, and we would all often
have it as a family together.
And in fact, let me back up alittle bit.
Um, I was a field applicationsengineer in the Kansas City area
by that point.
And I would drive to Wichita,Kansas about every three weeks.
On the way back, I would stop atthis ice cream product called

(35:35):
Brahms Ice Cream.
They have their own dairy farmin Oklahoma.
And so they only deliver withina day's drive of that dairy
farm.
So it's really good, fresh,delicious ice cream.
So I pick up a few tubs of icecream, wrap it in paper sacks,
and zip home.
And by the time you get home,you can just skim it off the
top, and it was like a littleslice of heaven.
So we we thoroughly enjoyed thatas a family.

(35:57):
Well, after the weddingreception, we thought let's go
to Brahms Ice Cream, becausethey had a like grill and chill
ice cream shop, and uh Melissa'sbrother and his family, and we
all just enjoy the time togetherand had an ice cream and talking
and so forth.
But it was starting to get late.
We still had a three-hour drivehome and it was still raining,
so we thought we better getstarted.

(36:17):
So we filled up on gas andMelissa said, I like to drive
first, and then we'll switchabout halfway home.
I said, Okay, so I'll try torest my eyes while you drive.
But the wife was going fullblast.
It was a heavy rain, and she wasbeing very careful on the
turnpike, Kansas turnpike.
And uh I, of course, couldn'tkeep my eyes closed because it

(36:37):
was pretty treacherousconditions.
And uh somehow we splashed intothis.
Turned out to be a flash flood,but at that point it was a river
flowing across the turnpike fromright to left.
And the cars were slowly goingthrough it, and so we were

(36:58):
following the vehicles.
It didn't appear to be thatdeep.
The raindrops were pounding offthe surface of the water, and
there was a semi going throughas well in front of us, so we
tried to follow his tracks andstay with him.
And uh he paused for somereason, and we we couldn't go
around him.

(37:18):
It was pretty much one-lanetraffic going through, and he
was not moving.
And Melissa started gettinghysterical.
Why isn't he moving?
We've got to get through this,and and the water kept rising,
and now it had sleep seeped intothe floorboards, and it was
getting very scary.
And we figured it was gettinginto the engine, the engine

(37:42):
could stall.
What do you do?
Your mind is racing.
But this time, several of ourchildren had fallen asleep, and
of course, now we're stopped.
Wipers still going full blast,rain's pounding down, the
water's seeping in.
It's getting scary.
And what do you do?
And now the water is rushing bypretty quickly.
There's about a 30-inch, 33-inchconcrete median that we're kind

(38:06):
of right up against, and thewater's starting to flow over
that.
So it's getting extremely deep.
And now, really, too deep to tryto get out with two kids, one in
each arm, to try to navigatethrough the waters on foot when
it's up to your waist, knowingthat ankle-high water can knock
you over.
It's moving water is incrediblypowerful.

(38:29):
And so Melissa and I were inagreement that we just gotta
say, put, at least here we'repinned against the median.
The water is overflowing themedian.
It'll go down by the grace ofGod, and we'll get towed.
We'll be all right.
And so, looking back, threethings were very important that
we were doing.
Number one, we are sayingscripture.

(38:51):
I turned to Psalm, not turned toit, but I recalled Psalm 46,
that says, God is my strength,God is my refuge, an
ever-present help in time oftrouble.
We will not fear though theearth give way and the mountains
fall to the heart of the sea,though the waters roar and the
mountains quake, the Lord ourGod is with us.
He is our fortress.

(39:12):
So he's an ever-present help intime of trouble.
That means he's here.
He's with us.
He will not leave us nor forsakeus.
So we're saying scripturebecause we had taught our
children scripture and taughtthem to memorize scripture.
That's number one.
Number two, we're singing a songof praise of all things.

(39:32):
I mean, music was very importantin our household.
And our children have woken up,their feet were touching the
water now, and we're just tryingto calm them as best we could.
We're singing a song that says,uh, Lord, I lift your name on
high.
Lord, I love to sing yourpraises.
I'm so glad you're in my life.
I'm so glad you came to save us.

(39:53):
It felt real right then.
Lord, please save us.
So we had scripture on our lips,we had praise on our lips, and
thirdly, we had Jesus on ourlips.
We were crying out, Jesus, saveus, Jesus, save us.
And this wall of water,apparently the eyewitnesses say

(40:14):
about seven feet tall, washedour minivan off the road, took
out, I think, over a thousandfeet of that concrete median,
just tossed it like splinters,like toothpicks.
And took our minivan and severalother vehicles with it and
plunged us into the deluge.
And at that point, the minivan,as best I could tell, started

(40:40):
turning, floating.
I just said, Well, I gotta geteverybody out of here.
So I kicked the driver's sidewindow out, and it was like
popping balloon.
The force of the water flushedeveryone, everything out that
wasn't tied down, including nowme, Melissa.
We were out of our seatbelts atthat point, and our oldest

(41:01):
daughter, McKenna.
We were just sucked into thetorrent.
And I just remember tossed intowater like a ragdoll in a
washing machine.
I couldn't see, I couldn'tbreathe.
I could feel things flying by myfingertips, I just grasping for
whatever.
And strangely at that moment,Dan, it felt very peaceful.

(41:25):
And that makes no sense.
But people who have had anear-death experience can
probably relate that God isthere.
He says, though you go throughdeep waters in great trouble, I
am with you.
I believe he was there with me.
And it felt as if we were allsix of us going up to heaven,
like he had his hand around allthe six of us lifting us up to

(41:46):
heaven.
But my head bobbed above thewater, and I could see treetops
whizzing by, and I again tryingto grasp for anything I could
and to no avail.
I could kind of make out theshore to one side, but I was at
the mercy of the current, butmore the mercy of God.
Somehow I washed up against theleft-hand shore.

(42:07):
I don't know how, but by God'sgrace am I here to this day.
I crawled out on my hands andknees.
I felt my stomach tighten.
I threw up all the stuff I hadapparently ingested.
And just cried out for myfamily.
Cried out for the Lord, justcomplete desperation, just with

(42:28):
rain pouring down, tears pouringdown, just mud everywhere.
And I couldn't see them,couldn't hear them.
It just sounded, if you've everbeen to Niagara Falls, it
sounded like that.
Just torrential.
Water rushing by.
I think they said thatafterwards it was 30,000 gallons
per second.
It's like a swimming pool everysecond just rushing by.

(42:55):
But I could make out lights onthe freeway, and I was about,
oh, half or three-quarters of amile away.
So I just slowly made my way andslipped and slid and went over a
barbed wire fence, had to go upan embankment, and found a
police officer.
I said, My wife and fourchildren are still down there.
They're down there.
You gotta help me, you gottafind them.

(43:18):
And so he ushered me to a carbefore an ambulance was able to
come.
And then they ushered me intothe ambulance, and uh I was in
shock, of course, and theywrapped me and put something on
my finger to take some vitalsand so forth, and it just felt
like an eternity.
I just was praying that thosedoors of the ambulance would

(43:39):
swing open.
I'd hear, Daddy, daddy's okay,we're okay.
They'd found him.
But uh nothing ever happened.
And uh after a few hours, theytook me in the ambulance to a
nearby hospital in Emporia,Kansas, and uh checked me over.
I may have nothing, just theclothes on my back.

(44:02):
And uh amazingly, I had nobroken bones.
It was very strange.
I don't know how that evenhappened, but they officially
released me, but I had nowhereto go, nothing I could grasp at
that moment.
And uh Melissa's brother, whowas with us at the ice cream

(44:24):
parlor, his name is Matt.
He also had four children at thetime.
They were also in a Fordwindstorming van like ours on
the same stretch of highway,only about two minutes ahead of
us.
I think because we had stoppedfor gas, they hadn't.
So we both left the ice creamparlor at the same time.
They went through the water muchlike we did.
And uh Matt's wife said, youknow, Matt, should we stop?

(44:47):
He said, We're already in it, wegotta keep going.
And uh cell phones had just kindof started becoming popular
then, so we had a crude, simplephone.
They tried to call us, butwithout speed dial, phone book,
all that stuff.
By the time they got us, it wastoo late.
We were already stalled in thewater.
So they kind of knew ourwhereabouts, but didn't know

(45:08):
what had happened.
And uh somehow he got with theKansas Turnpike Authority and
found out I was at the hospital.
And he and his father, Melissa'sfather, met with me at the
hospital.
Boy Matt and I just embraced andjust cried and just prayed.
He was a he's a very God-fearingman, a very strong Christian.

(45:32):
And he just said, I remember hisprayer to say, Lord, what are
you doing?
Lord, what are you doing?
And my only prayer was, Jesus, Itrust you.
Jesus, I trust you.
Real simple prayer for prayerand divine mercy, saying, I
place my trust in Jesus.
If they find him, they're okay,we're gonna be reunited.

(45:54):
All is well.
If they find him, they'vealready passed away.
Then they're with you.
Because to be absent from thebody is to be present with the
Lord.
And I just had a sense in myheart they were already with the
Lord.
And so, middle of the night, anofficer and a chaplain came to
my room, they had their hats andtheir chests, very solemnly

(46:15):
walked in with the news I'dfeared the worst.
They said, Robert, we found yourminivan.
It was upside down a mile and ahalf from the freeway.
They said three of your youngchildren were still in their car
seats and they are dead.
And Robert, we need to ask youto identify their bodies.
And what do you do when you hearthose words?

(46:37):
Every parent's worst nightmare.
All my blood just went to mytoes.
I felt numb.
I mean, our first day, and Icouldn't even cry.
They just led me down this longhallway to the emergency room
and pulled back the drape.
And every form of Zachary.
A little big guy with Downsyndrome, just five years old.

(47:00):
I mean, we had poured everythinginto him, our lives, everything,
just to try to help him beeverything he could be.
Nicholas, our buddy boy, justthree years old.
Alina, a precious little sweepiefrom China, still only one year
old.
We only had her for eight shortmonths.
Never got to celebrate herbirthday or Christmas together.

(47:23):
And suddenly the flug eats of mytears just burst forth.
I collapsed over each of theirbodies and stroked their wet
hair and cried and groaned andwailed from my gut as if I was
going to throw up again.
And somehow I believe only bythe Holy Spirit, with one hand
on each of their chests, Iraised my other hand up to
heaven.
I said, Lord, into your hands Icommend their spirits.

(47:47):
The very words of Jesus on thecross, just before he breathed
his last, exemplifying hislifetime of surrender to the
Father's will.
And so must we.
One of the hardest things to doas followers of Christ is to
surrender all, right?
And yet he's not Lord at all, ifhe's not Lord of all.
That means everything.

(48:08):
My family, my time, all that Iam.
After all, we own nothing.
Everything, every one we have onthis earth is unloan, a gift
from Almighty God.
How many times have we sung withour children?
Jesus loves me, this I knowlittle ones to him belong.
Yeah, they don't belong to us,they belong to him.

(48:29):
And looking back, I can see thatreally helped in the healing
process.
To surrender at that very momentof identifying them and seeing
them at the worst moment oflife.
Because I've met many people,and so often we grip the pain of
the past, we hold on to it, andwe don't want to let it go.

(48:51):
Or we hold on to our loved oneand want to keep them or love
them the way they were and notlove them where they are.
And that can be a toughtransition because we always no
one likes change and we wantthings to be the way it was, you
know, with intact household orfamily.
And thank God I had surrenderedthen by God's grace.

(49:14):
And um, a few hours later theycame to my room again and said,
Robert, we found McKenna.
She apparently caught on abarbed wire fence a short
distance from a minivan.
So I had to go down that longhallway once again, identify
Daddy's first little girl.
She had just turned eight yearsold, only two weeks before.
We had a great birthday partyand everything with her.
In fact, I had taken her on abusiness trip to Wichita just

(49:38):
shortly before the flash flood.
Just a daddy and daughter, andso we had a beautiful time
together.
And I thank God that we spentthat time with each other.
No regrets.
And so that that day they haddied, I'd hugged them all.
I told them I loved them.
Our hearts were clear, thanks beto God.
But for days we prayed and hopedthey would somehow find my wife

(50:01):
Melissa intact, and okay,somehow.
By this time, my parents, mysiblings had all descended on
the Emporia, Kansas area.
And they went to the localWalmart and bought some muck
boots and started traversing theFlint Hills there themselves,
just trying to find her, justtrying to find anything.
They found some of ourbelongings and my wallet and

(50:24):
other things from our minivanand from other people's
vehicles.
And but on a third day, theycame to my room and said we
found Melissa.
And her body was two miles fromthe freeway.
And the retention pond had atripled in size from all the
flood waters.
It was just enormous tragedy.

(50:45):
I had to identify my wife ofover 11 years.
And what do you do?
Where do you run?
And what's going to hold you upat a time like that?
I'm here to testify it can onlybe the sheer grace of Almighty
God.
The power of prayer, because somany people across the country,

(51:07):
I mean, all walks of life, alldenominations were just lifting
us up in prayer because it hadgained some news coverage, and
people found out about it.
And people were silentlypraying.
They've told me over these pastfew decades how they prayed for
me then.
So I know it's God's grace, thepower of prayer, and the power

(51:28):
of God's word.
I love God's word.
And the Bible says in Hebrewschapter 1, verse 3, that he
upholds the universe by thepower of his word.
Okay, so if God can keep theplanets in orbit, then he can
keep my world from spinningapart when it feels like it
might go out of control.

(51:50):
I ran to his word.
To um that Psalm 46, God is mystrength, God is my refuge.
I run to him, to many otherverses, like Job 23, verses 10
through 12.
You know, Job had it all.
And he lost it all.
He lost his health, lost hiswealth, lost all ten children,

(52:14):
seven boys and three girls.
And he had his moments with God.
You know, he had a few choicewords for the Lord.
He mouthed off and all that, buthe still stayed there.
He still stayed in contact withGod.
That's what's so important is tostay in his presence.
You know, no matter what thewords are, at least stay talking

(52:37):
to him.
Let your tragedy not drive youfurther from him, but draw you
closer to him.
I think Job did that.
Even after his friends who firstcame at least to be with him in
his grief.
But then they started pointing afinger at him.
Hey, Job, maybe this is yourfault.
They started blaming him, right?
That's tough too.
But in Job 23, he says, he'strying to figure it out.

(53:00):
He says, Lord, I don't get this.
I look north, south, east, andwest.
I can't find you, I can't figureit out.
But I know this.
He says, I know the way that Itake.
No, I'm sorry, he knows the waythat I take.
When he has tested me, I willcome forth as gold.
That's a great statement.
Much like your logo on betempered.

(53:20):
That's he's being refined in afire.
When he has tested me, I willcome forth as gold.
Then he goes on to say, My feethave closely followed his steps.
I have kept to his way withoutturning aside.
I've not departed from thecommands of his lips.
But here's the key.
I've treasured the words of hismouth more than my daily bread.

(53:42):
More than my daily bread.
No Bible, no breakfast, noBible, no bed.
That was Job's secret, I think.
He treasured God's word evenmore than food.
I kept him in touch with God.
Sometimes we just have to get abulldog grip on God and his
promises and say, Lord, I don'tget this.
It doesn't make sense.
It's excruciating.
My heart is hemorrhaging.

(54:05):
But I still take you at yourword.
I heard a wise pastor say that alot of times faith is just
acting like God's telling thetruth.
And that sounds simple, but it'strue.
It's just proceeding forth asthough God's word is true.
Because it is.
Do I feel like it?
Not always.
Heck no.
But I still trust God.

(54:26):
I take him at his word.
His word that says in Psalm 71that you have allowed me to
suffer much hardship.
We could probably all agree withthat.
Yes, Lord, you've allowed me tosuffer a whole lot of hardship,
but you will restore me to lifeagain and lift me up from the
depths of the earth.
You will restore me to evengreater honor and comfort me

(54:49):
once again.
That's a great verse of hope foranyone who's lost.
Their loved ones, their spouse,their parents, their children,
their home, their livelihood,their health, anything.
God is a God of restoration.
And He has a great plan throughit all.
But it's oftentimes adevelopment process.

(55:11):
God allows us to go through thefire many times or the flood.
When that fire goes through us,it can reshape our souls, it can
forge our faith.
It can cultivate our characterand make us more like Him.

SPEAKER_05 (55:29):
Do you know we you know we we lean on a Bible verse
that be tempered and it's Isaiah43, verse 2.
Do you are you familiar withthat verse?

SPEAKER_02 (55:38):
I know 43.
Remind me, verse two, which onethat is.

SPEAKER_05 (55:41):
When you pass through the waters, I will be
with you.
Yes.
And through the rivers, theywill not overwhelm you.
When you walk through the fire,you shall not be burned, and the
flame shall not consume you.

SPEAKER_02 (55:52):
I love that.
I can testify firsthand.
You can't be part of that.

SPEAKER_05 (55:57):
Yes.
Did you did you ever questionthat when all that happened?
Did you ever question God?

SPEAKER_02 (56:03):
Sure.
I didn't question myrelationship with Him.
But I asked why?
Why God?
Why would you do this?
Why would you allow this?
Doesn't make sense.
I mean, one minute, two minutes,any direction, we we could have
missed it.
Have we not gotten out for icecream?
Have we not gotten gas, we did?
Maybe if I had been driving.
I mean, as an engineer, I'mthinking through all these

(56:26):
minutiae, all these details, theshoulda, coulda, woulda.
Just have to say, somehow Godallowed this to happen.
I don't get it.
But thank God we were ready.
I mean, my family was ready togo to heaven.
We lived a full life, not aslong as I would have liked, but
they loved the Lord.
We loved each other.

(56:47):
What if it happened to a familythat wasn't ready?
At least I know where they are.
I have complete confidence theyare in heaven.
I will meet them one day.
So I went from asking the Lord,why me to why not me?
Why not me?
Why did I survive?
Well, perhaps so we can be heretalking today.
Perhaps it wasn't just a blip onthe news cycle.

(57:09):
Well, too bad for that family,and keep on going.
The police had asked me to givea press conference because there
was so much media attention.
I went to my father and said,Dad, what in the world do I say?
I don't know where to evenbegin.
Again, I'm the shy, reservedintrovert.

(57:31):
I'm not good in behindmicrophones and all that
normally.
So I think when you face yourworst fear, you have to face
death, the death of your lovedones.
Every other fear just kind ofmelts away.
So my dad said, Robert, justgive it straight.
Just share your heart.
Just talk about your family,talk about your faith.
That's what I did.
And so I gave two pressconferences over, I think three

(57:52):
days, and one in Emporia,Kansas, one up in the Kansas
City area.
I said words like, We will getthrough this, we will rise above
this.
And by God's grace, he willsomehow bring good through this.
Because we knew Genesis 50,verse 20.
It says, But as for you, humanevil against me, but God meant

(58:14):
it for good.
God means it for good.
He can turn all things around.
Romans 8 28.
God causes all things to worktogether for good.
Not of everybody, for those wholove him and those that are
called according to his purpose.
So you maintain thatrelationship with him, then he
can turn your misery into aministry.

(58:34):
He can turn your tragedy into atriumph if you trust if you
trust him through it.

SPEAKER_05 (58:40):
So how do you pick up the pieces from that?
Life still goes on, right?
You still have work.
You, you know, and now insteadof having this family, now you
come home to an empty home.
How do you pick up those pieces?
How do you keep going?
Where do where does life go fromhere for you?

SPEAKER_02 (58:58):
Right.
That was a long ordeal, veryexcruciating.
And we all grieve as differentlyas we all look.
I've learned never to tellsomeone, I know how you're
feeling, because nobody does.
We all have unique experiences.
Every loss can be uniquelydevastating when you're the one
going through it.
And uh for me, it was a adeafening silence at our home

(59:23):
from all the cheers and noisesof our family and the diaper
changes and the spills and thebills and everything and cleanup
and just everything it takes tokeep a family going, suddenly it
just halted.
I remember trying to drivearound town just to get some
groceries and seeing all thesepeople in a hurry.

(59:44):
I thought, I am not in a hurry.
I just am trying to get fromhere to there and just take my
time and just process it all.
Because it's overwhelming.
I mean, our brain just can'twrap around it.
And I think because we weren'tcreated for this, you know, in
the garden Adam and Eve, wewere.
Meant to keep on living forever,but because they sinned, then uh

(01:00:04):
death and suffering are thehuman condition, and we have to
deal with it.
But it still catches off guard.
When someone dies, it feels likepart of your life is completely
gone, like you're limping aroundlife without a limb attached,
just trying to gain yourequilibrium, your balance again.
It makes sense of things.
So bit by bit I went through ourchildren's belongings into their

(01:00:28):
room and I would just cry, oreven you know, in the in the
shower area with seeing theirtubby toys and things, and just
cry over that and see theirartwork on a refrigerator, and
every tear helps wash awaylittle specks of grief at the
time.
I would open my Bible and put onthe piano and just start playing

(01:00:48):
to the Psalms.
I compose many songs right thereat the piano or just worship God
alone.
Being an introvert, I do my besthealing, I think, just alone.
So a lot of times I just fallasleep with the Bible on my lap
and just some soft musicplaying.
But uh I went to counseling aswell.
So three whole years ofprofessional grief counseling

(01:01:11):
with a uh with a professional.
So I highly recommend that toanyone who's been through any
kind of trauma, divorce, youname it, loss, it's it's worth
going because the the brain isvery intricate and it's like
peeling back layers of an onionto get to the core.
And each layer brings tears, butthose tears help to heal over

(01:01:34):
time.
It's a good thing.
Uh by God's grace, I never hadany depression, no nervous
breakdowns, never did drugs, nopromiscuity or drunkenness or
smoking or internet garbage.
And I'm not bragging on me, I'mbragging on God.
Because humanly speaking, that'simpossible.
But with God, all things arepossible.
I stayed immersed in his word,most of all.

(01:01:57):
I did eat lots of ice cream andpeanut butter.
Chocolate therapy was a realhappy place for me.
Took me a while to get back toice cream, though.
It took at least half a year ormore.
I just couldn't take, couldn'ttaste the sweetness of it and
enjoy it.
So it took a while before I evengave myself permission to try to
enjoy it.
And then to the point where itwas sweet again.

(01:02:18):
It's a process of healing.
But God knew what he was doingbecause I tried to go back to
engineering.
And I spent about two weeksdoing that.
It just felt like this doesn'tfit.
It's just not right.
It's like a shoe that no longerfit.
And uh I thought, you know, Ijust need to go on a journey, a
little pilgrimage, as it were,retrace our steps across the

(01:02:41):
country, Boston, California,East Coast, in between.
So I hopped on a train, Amtraktrain, Kansas City, downtown.
Went uh all the way west, acrossthe Great Plains, all the way to
California, and visited somefriends there that we had known
and church we'd gone to, andmade my way all the way back
through Chicago to the east andthrough Pennsylvania to the East

(01:03:04):
Coast, and uh spent a few weeksdoing that.
Brought my keyboard with me andcomposed some music along the
way, and just looking out thewindow of the train, just seeing
the beautiful scenery go by, andthe constant rhythm of the
tracks just helped the rhythm ofmy heart kind of like a restart,

(01:03:25):
kind of like a defibrillator, soto speak.
That was very helpful.
And people just startedcontacting me from all
denominations, just saying, Boy,we saw your press conference.
And could you come to our churchor we're having a pancake
breakfast Saturday morning andjust talk about your faith and
how you can maintain your faithafter something like that?

(01:03:47):
I said, I don't know, I've neverdone anything like this before.
And we had these little posterboards of our family's
portraits, pictures that we hadup at the funeral.
By the way, the funeral was, Imean, five caskets in the front
of church.
It's a whole nother difficultmoment, but you can't even wrap

(01:04:08):
your mind around it.
Very difficult for my siblingsand parents to behold the bodies
of my family members.
But I took these poster boardswith their pictures to a church
afterwards and just held them upand would just tell our story
like we are right now.
And afterwards, people wouldtell me, boy, that really
impacted my heart.
Boy, it really helped me to putmy tra my trust and faith in

(01:04:30):
God.
That really inspired me.
Because I didn't know what tosay.
I just said, I felt like Mosesin a way.
You know, Moses stuttered, hewasn't good at this public
speaking.
Like, not me, Lord, you got thewrong guy, right?
But um, I said, Lord, you'rejust gonna have to speak through
me and give me the words tospeak.
And we find that even in the NewTestament where Jesus says,

(01:04:51):
Don't worry about what to speak.
You'll be given the right wordsand such wisdom at the right
time.
It won't be you doing thetalking, but the Spirit of my
Father speaking through you.
And so that's why I trusted Godto do.
I said, Lord, I'm gonna open mymouth.
You're gonna have to fill it.
And he has ever since.
It's been beautiful.
And uh that first year, I thinkover a hundred places or people

(01:05:13):
invited me to come share.
So I was traveling a lot.
Uh Kansas City area, but alsoacross the country.
And then a year after that,about 110 places or people.
So me, I kind of need a four byfour to my head again and just
say, okay, Lord, I think I getit.
You want me to do this as afull-time ministry?
And uh and so I found a goodcircle of wise counsel and asked

(01:05:39):
them to be a board of directorsfor this uh ministry called
Mighty in the Land Ministry,based on Psalm 112, that says,
His children will be mighty inthe land.
And they truly are.
And God wants each of us to bemighty men of God, mighty women
of God across this great land,and to bring forth great fruit
for his kingdom.
And so we became a nonprofit501c3 officially, and board

(01:06:04):
directors, I wantedaccountability, I wanted good
transparency and all that.
But most of all, just to do whatGod wanted me to do.
And I just prayed, Lord, I'mgonna trust you to open every
door, provide every need, andprotect me every step of the
way.
And now, it's hard to believe,22 years later, it does not feel
like it.
I've shared over 1,400 times tohundreds of thousands of people

(01:06:28):
in person and many more throughmedia and resources and so
forth.
And God has brought forth greatfruit.
And uh we began a foundation aswell.
In fact, in 2004, I traveled toIndia after the tsunami that
claimed the lives of hundreds ofthousands of people in those
flood waters.
So I feel like I had a kindredspirit with them in a in that

(01:06:50):
way.
And it was a powerful missionstrip.
We brought some medical suppliesand just cared for them as best
we could.
You feel like you're a drop in abucket, like what can I do?
But I got to, I brought somebubbles and some balloons, just
play with some of the orphanchildren and just try to have
fun, just be Jesus to them andto show them love because we

(01:07:12):
couldn't communicate verbally.
So but it's very formative, verypowerful.
Because when you look into theeyes of an orphan or a child
like that, it it'll change yourheart.
It'll help transform and healyour heart.
And so I began a foundationcalled the Mighty in the Land
Foundation, a separate entity,and that's uh to help care for

(01:07:33):
orphans and special needschildren around the world.
And so we're our goal was tosponsor at least five orphanages
worldwide and honored by fiveheavenly family members.
And one by one, God's beenbringing them to pass.
We've sponsored eight now andgranted over$600,000 to help
care for orphans and specialneeds children worldwide,

(01:07:54):
including here in the UnitedStates as well.
So that can only be God.

SPEAKER_05 (01:07:59):
It's amazing.

SPEAKER_02 (01:08:00):
But you know, God was really leading me because I
found as you serve, as you keepthat outward focus and pour out,
which sounds backwards.
When I'm in pain, I need othersupport into me.
But when you pour out your lifeand give, you're gonna receive
more than you give.
It's a giving that you receive,you're gonna reap what you sow.

(01:08:20):
And so I think God was purposelyleading me down that path
without me knowing it.
I just said, Yes, Lord, here Iam.
Send me.
And uh through serving, it camethe healing.
And then uh I started sharing inthe Indiana area quite a bit as
well.
I had some good friends fromcollege from uh Anderson time,

(01:08:40):
could be great musicians anddear friends.
And uh they had me come to theirchurch and a few other churches,
and they had befriended anotherfamily that they had bought some
land from.
And uh little did I know behindthe scenes, they were playing
matchmaker, matchmaker, make mea match.
I wasn't looking, I wasn'tlooking to even date to remarry

(01:09:02):
or any of that stuff.
I just didn't want to evenconsider dating by any means.
I just felt blessed that I gotto be a husband once and
happily, faithfully married, gotto be a father for eight years,
four children.
I'm blessed, Lord.
I'll just keep doing what I'mdoing and you lead on, Lord.
Uh but we got to know oneanother, and and uh first time I

(01:09:27):
saw her, her name is Inga.
She was eating ice cream, youknow, and uh magnificent chef,
magnificent cook, and beautifulfamily.
Her parents, before her fatherpassed away, were married 45
years.
So my parents 60 years, herparents 45 years, over 105 years
of faithful, great godlymarriage.

(01:09:47):
So thank God we come from uhgreat example, great parents.
And so um we fell in love, andit took some time because I
wanted to make sure I was lovingher for her, not for poor old
Robert, or I need a companion,someone to be with.
No.

(01:10:08):
She hadn't been married before.
She maintained her purity.
She could have been with any guyshe wanted.
Why would she choose me?
A guy like me with a past likemine.
She could have anybody, why me?
But I can't explain it.
I still ask her, I said,sweetie, why would you marry me?
Why do you love me?
What do you see in me?

(01:10:29):
But it's it's the good Lord, andit's God somehow planted desire
within her.
And I want to make sure my myfeelings for her were before I
said I love you, that I'mhanging for life.
And so I even talked to mycounselor about it to make sure
that these feelings were bonafide and not misplaced or

(01:10:49):
anything like that, because Iwant to cherish her for the
woman that she is and love herfully.
And so it was about three yearsafter the flash flood that we
married in uh Fort Wayne,Indiana in 2006.
And we will celebrate 20 yearsof marriage next May.
Thanks be to God.
So God's a God of restorationand healing, because um, we've

(01:11:11):
always been open to life.
And God bless us in 2007 with ason.
We named him Ezekiel, EzekielThomas.
And then in 2008 with thedaughter, we named her Estella,
Estella Eve.
And then we endured amiscarriage where she began
hemorrhaging.
My wife Inga began hemorrhagingon the cushion of the seat she

(01:11:31):
was on and took her to thehospital.
Long story short, turned out wewere pregnant.
We didn't know it either.
And the baby was inside of herand was not moving.
They did an ultrasound.
I thought I could see theoutline of a baby, and uh the
doctor had to come in and givebirth to a little tiny baby
about five inches long, aboutfive months along.

(01:11:54):
I I held him in my hands.
Clearly little boy.
We need him little Dale.
And so we we had a burial and alittle ceremony for him.
So again, come on, Lord, why?
Another death, you know, but Idon't know.
Perhaps God wanted Inga toexperience the loss of a child

(01:12:14):
as well, to be connected in thatway to this ministry, because
it's really our family ministry.
Because now our family nowwouldn't be here if it weren't
for our family in heaven.
And so it's us sharing the goodnews of Christ through our
family story, to bring Jesus topeople, bring people to Jesus.
That's really the crux of thisministry.

(01:12:37):
And so we had a boy, then agirl, and each one of our
children we never found out thegender until the moment of
birth.
So it was a great surprise.
There's very few good surprisesleft in life, and that's one of
the great ones.
So I got to be there for eachone and say, it's a boy, it's a
girl, yay! So it's such a greatjoyous moment.
And then after uh ourmiscarriage, God bless us with
another son.

(01:12:57):
We named him Leo, Leo George, inuh 2010, 2012, another girl.
We named her Lola Elizabeth.
So here we are, two boys and twogirls by God's grace.
And previously I had two boysand two girls.
You can't make this up.
You can't plan it, you can'tfabricate this or anything.

(01:13:20):
This can only be God.
He says, I will restore, I willraise you up to even greater
honor and comfort you onceagain.
Psalm 71.
It's beautiful.
Then about six years after ouryoungest daughter was born, my
wife Ingo's turn on some pants,saying, Am I getting fat?
As a husband, you've got to bereal careful how you answer the

(01:13:40):
question, right?
You get yourself in big trouble.
Yeah.
Turned out we were pregnantagain.
So we found out right away, youwere expecting.
And in 2018, gave birth to amighty son.
We named him Solomon.
Solomon Gideon Rogers.
And so we have four teenagersnow and one seven-year-old.
So life is full.
We have a very loud and activehousehold.

(01:14:02):
We home educate our childrenstill.
I work out at my home office.
We travel together whenever wecan.
But uh life is challenging, butlife is good.
And we trust God for every doorto be open.
Again, I still share at everyplace that invites me.
I don't charge any set fees.
I come in complete faith.
It's a mystery of faith.
When I first started sharing,people asked me, Well, what do

(01:14:24):
you charge?
I said, charge?
I mean, I can't.
If I put a price take on this,you couldn't afford it.
That cost me everything.
But like Apostle Paul said, youknow, I cannot charge for the
gospel.
And so I just share freely.
If people want to givesomething, we accept support and
so forth.
But it's amazing, even throughthe pandemic, through COVID, how

(01:14:46):
God provided.
It's like the loaves and fishes,and how he provides our every
need and opens every door andhas protected us every step of
the way.

SPEAKER_05 (01:14:55):
That's amazing.
Do you do you ever have fears?
You know, let's say when we geta bunch of rain, are there
triggers in in your life thatthat take you back to that
moment to where it can overwhelma lot of people?

(01:15:16):
Um, and I know you are extremelystrong in your faith, but are
are there are there things thathappen in life like rain, or
have you been out past uh, youknow, on that road again?
Are those things that you knowthat bring back those flood of
emotions?
I mean, we we just talked aboutbefore we started recording, you
know, and you shared that you'veyou've shared this message over

(01:15:39):
thousands of times.
And I, you know, I say, how doyou do it?
You you said I relive it everytime I tell it.

unknown (01:15:46):
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (01:15:48):
That's a lot.
Yeah.
That's a lot to get through.
How do you do that?

SPEAKER_02 (01:15:53):
Depend on the Holy Spirit.
Because even I told it in a lotof detail right now in this
setting, and it's very difficultbecause it unearthed a lot of
memories and details andemotions.
And uh I often don't cry inpublic.
I I cry better in private justby myself.
But sometimes I still melted toa puddle in front of people.

(01:16:14):
I'll just choke up and can'teven go forward.
I just roll with it, and so Idon't, nothing's contrived by
any means, but uh I share ourfamily story because it is
heartbreaking.
It is tearful, but it's alsohopeful.
When people hear it, it seems tobreak open their hearts, and
then the Holy Spirit can enterin and do work.

(01:16:36):
And I pray that these scripturestake root.
But I'm able to now appreciatethe rain.
It took a while at first.
Um I do vividly remember drivingin a Kansas City area, of all
things during a snowstorm, kindof a blizzard.
And when it's more of a powderysnow and just rushing across the

(01:17:00):
highway from left to rightbecause of crosswinds.
And for a while, for a moment, Iwas it was on a freeway, and I
couldn't see the edge lines.
And I just almost froze.

(01:17:27):
But that the snow blowing acrossthe freeway really brought forth
a lot of the flood memories ofthe water across the freeway.
Uh but uh a rainstorm right nowI can appreciate it.
And uh even in our home, we liketo hear the rain pitter-patter
on the roof when we need it.

(01:17:48):
And and our kids like to run outand play in the rain when it's a
gentle, peaceful rainstorm, andso it doesn't bother me.
But I guess I somehow God hascauterized those wounds and
enabled me to go on.
I can't explain it, but it's hisgrace.

SPEAKER_05 (01:18:06):
It's a blessing.
I mean it's it's an amazingstory.
What do you think?

SPEAKER_01 (01:18:11):
Um one thing that really caught me was Job.
Like how you talked about Joband about how to have a
conversation, I feel like.
Because I feel like a lot oftimes people always go to God
for like thanks andappreciation, and then you read
Job, and Job goes there withheartache and with pain, and
with like it just I feel likethat's when when you read Job,
like you really realize the realrelationship and the real

(01:18:33):
conversation that God kind ofwants from us.
And I just love that you youtalked about that.
I mean, did you lean into Jobduring that time too?

SPEAKER_02 (01:18:42):
You bet.
Yeah, big time.
I related to him firsthand,absolutely.
And I just appreciate Job'shonesty.
I'm glad you glad you mentionedthat, Ben.
There's a lot in there.
And uh Job had a few choicewords for the Lord, and God
comes back.
You know, God was silent forwhat, 40 chapters or so?
And then God comes back, excuseme, Job, where were you when I

(01:19:03):
laid the foundation of theearth?
Do you know better?
And Job's like, okay, I get it.
I get it.
And Job essentially says, youknow, before I knew of God, now
I know God.
And that's the motto of thisministry is to know God
personally, to live a life of noregrets.
So an experiential knowledge.

SPEAKER_01 (01:19:22):
Yeah.
I just I love Job so much justbecause you see the pain.
I mean, this world is a brokenworld.
Like we live in a broken worldand things aren't perfect, and
you're like, well, if God'sreal, God wouldn't let this
happen to me.
God wouldn't let this happen tome.
It's like, no, like God letsthat happen to you for like you
you said you always talk aboutwhat was it like uh kind of flex
like spread, you guys, and it'slike a spirit, like you grow.

(01:19:45):
Like during those times, that'swhen you grow in faith, and you
know, you're using it for Imean, I'm sure you say, you
know, you talked about you know,talking and sharing with
thousands of people.
How many people have you savedwith that?
You know what I mean?
Like oh, I'm sure, yeah,exactly.
By but by God's grace and by youbeing a faithful servant.
And it's just inspiring.

SPEAKER_02 (01:20:06):
So I pray people have heard the gospel through
it.
That's our main focus just toshare the goodness of Christ
through it, that they mightreceive it.
Just receive his love, receivehis salvation, receive his
mercy, because most people don'tfeel as though they are loved by
God.
I've done so much bad stuff.
How could he love a guy like meor girl like me?

(01:20:29):
And uh, God loves you and hewants you to live with him.
That's plain and simple, thegospel.
He came to earth to live withus, to die for us, so we could
live with him.
We just have to accept andreceive it.

SPEAKER_05 (01:20:41):
For someone that might be listening today that
feels like they're they'redrowning in their own storm,
what's the first step for thatperson to find faith?

SPEAKER_02 (01:20:52):
I'd say run to the Lord, don't run away from him.
Uh I spent a lot of time in Job,like you mentioned, Ben, also
the very next book, book ofPsalms.
Psalms are like a school of highhighs, low lows, everywhere in
between.
And Job was very honest withGod, so is King David.

(01:21:14):
You know, he pours out indespair.
God, where are you?
Why, God?
And yet I will put my trust inGod.
I choose to put my hope in him.
Over and over through thePsalms, King David does that.
And it's it's a great teachingmoment.
And so, you know, David says inPsalm 23, the Lord is my
shepherd.
And that my is personal.

(01:21:36):
So if someone is in that moment,make it personal.
Again, we need an experientialknowledge of the Savior to go
through that valley of shadow ofdeath with him, to walk through
and let him hold your hand, lethim hold you.
And that it sounds simple, it'snot easy because it's

(01:22:00):
counterintuitive.
And people want to run to drugsor substances, or their phone,
or their vice, or whatever itmight be.
So much this world has to offer,none of that's going to satisfy.
It just doesn't work.
But the Bible says in Hebrewsthat the Word of God is alive
and active.
It's sharper than a two-edgedsword.

(01:22:21):
It cuts all the way through forsoul and spirit meet.
So this book is alive, and Ibelieve it can enliven our
spirit when it feels dead.
They can bring it back to life.
It can bring life where therewas none before.
They can bring our faith tolife.
That's what brought my faith tolife as a teenager.
I thank God for every singleBible verse I memorized, because

(01:22:43):
I needed it.
I need at that moment my lifewhen I was at rock bottom.
And I discovered he was a rockat the bottom.
So fall into his arms.
Don't go the way of the worldand allow them to fill that void
because something will consumeyou.
Something will fill thatemptiness.
And too many people try to fillit with a substance.

(01:23:06):
You'll never find the bottom ofa bottle of any substance or
anything else you stick in yourmouth that's going to satisfy
that craving.
Our cravings for him, ourcravings to be held, to be
loved, to be whole.
And only he can do it.
It's true.
Too many people run to that asan escape to other things.

(01:23:27):
And yeah, you might forget aboutit for a moment.
Still there tomorrow.
Gotta deal with it now and faceit head on.
This book I wrote called RiseAbove goes through three basic
steps.
I won't call them simple.
But number one is to face it.
And it's not easy to face it.
I had to do that when Iidentified my own family
members.

(01:23:47):
To face it head on, not to brushit under the rug and pretend
never happened.
Even after they'd found my wifeMelissa, I'd asked the police if
they could take us to back tothe flood scene.
I felt like I had to face it.
And so they gave us an escortback to the turnpike so we could
go there safely, and my parentsand our pastor with us, and we

(01:24:10):
got out of the car and walkeddown the embankment to the
waters, which has now subsided.
And I just slipped my fingersinto the waters.
I just felt like a rush of justgo through me into the waters.
Those waters that ushered myfamily home.
And that was just important forme to face it, to deal with it.

(01:24:31):
All through scripture we seepeople who had to face certain
things.
How Jonah had to face Nineveh,right?
King David had to face his sinwith Bathsheba and murdering her
husband Uriah.
Even Jesus faced the cross.
He said, Lord, if it's possible,let this cup pass from me.
Yet not my will but yours bedone.
A powerful scene in Passion ofthe Christ, where he embraces

(01:24:53):
the cross.
I love that scene.
Because that's a the second stepI suggest is first of all, you
face it, then you embrace it.
You embrace that cross that Godhas entrusted to you.
And Jesus said, if you want tobe my followers, you must first
what?
Deny yourself, take up yourcross and follow me.
That's to be his disciple.

(01:25:15):
So I lay my life down, denymyself, take up the cross,
whatever it may be.
In my life, it may be adifficult testimony, difficult
experience, but also the crossthat he's my Lord.
I place my life under hislordship every day.
Say, Lord, I want what you want,plain and simple.
And follow him.
I follow him by spending timewith him in the morning.

(01:25:36):
No Bible, no breakfast, noBible, no bed.
So face it, embrace it, and thenreplace it.
Ask God to replace that sadnesswith joy.
And you can never replace whowas lost at all.
If you lose things, those thingscan be replaced.
But restoration is God'sbusiness, and he can restore
like none other can.

(01:25:58):
Psalm 30, I love.
It says, um, help me, Lord.
You've turned my mourning intojoyful dancing.
You've taken away my clothes ofmourning and clothed me with
joy, that I might sing praisesto you and not be silent.
Oh Lord my God, I will give youthanks forever.

(01:26:20):
So he replaces garments ofmourning and sadness with joy.
Why?
To give him praise and thanksforever.
That's what heaven's gonna belike.
So it may as well start now.

SPEAKER_05 (01:26:33):
I always end the podcast by asking one last
question.
If you could sit on a park benchand have a conversation with
someone living or deceased, whowould it be and why?

SPEAKER_02 (01:26:49):
Hard to narrow down to one person.
If it's okay, all those three.
So I'll end with the probablythe one, but at least two others
I would love to do that with.
Uh one is uh Erica Kirk, CharlieKirk's widow.

unknown (01:27:08):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:27:09):
Because here a great godly man was uh assassinated,
and she's left with twochildren, and she's on the
public stage and giving glory toGod and doing great strides for
the kingdom with her work.
And I believe God is giving herthe words to speak, and I I

(01:27:31):
could just sense through herwords at the memorial the same
kind of spirit that I feltflowing through me after my
family died, and I had to facedeath, and she had to face the
body of her husband uh withinmoments or hours after he was
shot.
It's an awful thing to behold.

(01:27:53):
I can't imagine what she has todo with forgiveness.
And yet she forgave publicly.
That is so beautiful.
I mean, that's not just anelement of our faith, that is
the crux of Christianity.
It's forgiveness.
I am a sinner.
Jesus died to forgive me.
I must forgive one another.
Forgive us our trespasses as weforgive those who trespass

(01:28:16):
against us.
That little word, two-letterword as means to the extent that
we forgive others.
And she's embodied that and donethat.
So I'd love the opportunity totalk with her.
Another one, totally different,is of all people, President
Donald J.
Trump.

(01:28:37):
He's a very polarizing figure,and whether people like him or
don't like him, you can'tdisagree that he's endured such
amazing adversity.
I mean, legally, personally,emotionally, electorally, I
would argue spiritually,physically, I've been shot at.

(01:29:00):
At least two attemptedassassinations that we know of.
And yet here he is almost 80years old and still going
strong.
Incredible tenacity, incredibleendurance and perseverance.
Uh if anybody in the public eyehas been tempered, he certainly
epitomizes it.
Um I understand one-on-one, he'sa very funny person.

(01:29:22):
It'd be fun just to sit down ona park bench and talk to him.
And I I also understand that hedoesn't drink alcohol.
And neither do his children.
And he uh the way they roll intheir home was don't even start.
That's pretty good.

(01:29:42):
If you knew your propensity,that I might go down this
slippery slope if I even justtaste a little bit.
It's like trying to eat oneDorito.
Can't be done.
You eat one, you want to havesome more, right?
And uh so you just don't even doit.
And that's an admirable quality.
Uh, to say, I have a weakness orI have a propensity for

(01:30:03):
weakness, so I'm not even gonnastart.
And when you feel that maybecraving for something with the
presence of God, with his word,with the spirit, you find out I
just don't need that.
So many people when they're at arough road said, I need a drink.

(01:30:24):
Now I need Jesus.
And even after the flood, I knewthat's what I needed.
I need Jesus.
I need him.
Only he can satisfy, only he canheal and fill and restore.
But uh after my family died,they're at the hospital in
Emporio, Kansas.
They had a little chapel.

(01:30:45):
And I went to the chapel and Iopened up the hymnal.
Actually, I asked someone to getme a hymnal because I knew I
needed a hymn in particular.
And they got me one, and it hadthe hymn called It Is Well with
My Soul.
Written by Horatio Spafford.

SPEAKER_01 (01:31:04):
His family where I passed away in the sea.

SPEAKER_02 (01:31:06):
Exactly right.
Yeah.
So he's the man I like to sit ona park bench and talk with.
Because we have uh a few thingsin common.
Yeah.
Here he was a man of God.
He was uh a businessman inChicago and partnered with D.L.
Moody of Moody Bible Institute,great godly man, who was doing

(01:31:26):
some evangelization over inEurope, apparently.
And they were gonna go, he andhis wife and four daughters were
gonna go on a ship across theAtlantic and be with him.
And apparently he got caught upin some business affairs and was
detained, and so he said to hiswife, four daughters, you you go
ahead of me and I'll meet you upthere a little bit later.

(01:31:47):
Well, their vessel was struck,apparently, and sank very
quickly.
And they sent a wire cable tohim just from his wife, just
said survived alone with yourwife, something like that.
Just about four words.
So she was a sole survivor.

(01:32:08):
And how his heart must havesunk, I can only imagine, right?
But um, he took that journeyacross the Atlantic, and the
captain of his ship said, We'reapproximately at the point where
your family died, where yourfour children died, and the ship
went down.
And as the story goes, he was onthe deck of the ship and wrote,

(01:32:30):
penned those words when sorrowlike sea billows roll, whatever
my lot, thou hast taught me tosay, it is well with my soul.
So powerful.
In other words, no matter whathappens, I'm still good.
You've got me, Lord.
I've got you.
We're good.

(01:32:50):
You're gonna carry me through.
It is well with my soul.
It's like that uh hymn over athousand years old, be thou my
vision.
The very last line of it says,Whatever befall, be thou my
vision, O ruler of all.

(01:33:11):
In other words, no matter whathappens, Lord, whatever befall,
I'm gonna keep my eyes fixed onyou.
You're the author and thefinisher, the pioneer, the
perfecter of my faith, andyou're ruler of all.
So you're still on the throne.
You're still sovereign over me,over my life, over this planet,
over this earth, and so I trustyou.
I've got you, God, you've gotme.

(01:33:31):
We're good.
Doesn't make sense all the time.
Hurts a lot along the way, but Istill trust you.
Be thou my vision, O ruler ofall.
And that was King David'ssecret, too, I think.
Psalm 16, verse 8.
King David says, I will keep myeyes always on the Lord.
Be thou my vision.
With him at my right hand, Iwill not be shaken.

(01:33:54):
If he's got me, I'm not gonna beshaken.
I may have been inundated, butI'm not devastated.

SPEAKER_05 (01:34:02):
Wow.
How can people find you?
You know, I've got uh you youbrought you written many books.
That's a whole nother topic,right?
For um, you know, being anintrovert, now you're spending
your life sharing your storywith with hundreds of thousands

(01:34:23):
of people.
Uh you've written many books.
Kind of talk about the books alittle bit and how how that got
started.
Sure.

SPEAKER_02 (01:34:32):
Well, um nobody was knocking on my door asking for a
book, really.
And uh just the more I shared,afterwards people would say, Are
you thinking of writing a book?
I said, really.
No one's no publishersapproached me and no offers to
that extent so far.
And uh but I was journaling, Iwas writing.

(01:34:53):
I had to give a detailed policereport, and I guess that was the
impetus for just typing andgetting things out and any great
specifist specificity anddetail.
But uh I just kept writing, keptwriting.
And that helped me to healbecause it gets what's in here
out to there.

(01:35:13):
And uh I thought, well, maybe Ishould put this in book form.
And I asked some people I knew,how do I go about this?
I said, well, try to findyourself a co-writer.
And so we wrote this book calledInto the Deep, and the co-writer
is Stan Finger, a great guy fromWichita, Kansas, who had
interviewed me on the one-yearanniversary of the Flash Flood.

(01:35:34):
And he really got my heart andgot the story and the message.
And we just had a, we were likebrothers, a kindred spirit.
And so I someone just told me,When you write, just put your
heart on paper.
Plain and simple, just put yourheart on paper.
And so I wrote about 200,000words, a whole heap.

(01:35:54):
But that was a very healingprocess.
That was a good thing.
So Stan took it from 200,000,cut it in half to about 100,000.
Because I thought, who's evergonna want to read this?
It's way too heavy, way tootearful.
And then we sent it to four tosix publishers, and four of them
said, no, thank you.
It's oftentimes difficult to forthem to sell a tragedy book, as

(01:36:15):
it were.
But two of them said yes, andone was focused on the family.
And uh Dr.
Dobson, Dr.
James Dobson had interviewed meabout a half year or so after
the flood at uh their studios inColorado Springs.
And that was a great honor.
He's a great man of God.
He just passed away not longago.

(01:36:36):
Went on to be with the Lord, sowe miss him very much.
But what a great legacy he'sleft.
He was like America's dad.
You know, he was like our dad.
He taught family so much.
But it just seemed like theright fit with focus on the
family, with our emphasis onfamily and faith.
And so that came out in 2007,and it has all the details of
the flood and the aftermath andso forth.

(01:36:59):
And then people just startedasking me, Robert, what do you
do to live this life of noregrets?
That's where I wrote this bookcalled Uh Seven Steps to No
Regrets.
Just kind of encapsulating sevenkey principles of living a life
of no regrets with God and withone another.
Getting this verticalrelationship right to get these
horizontal relationships right.
So it's full of scriptures, fullof stories of all that God has

(01:37:23):
done.
And then that book Rise Abovecame about.
Again, people just startedasking me.
I'm a really slow reader, I meanan even slower writer.
So each one of these is a biglabor of love.
You saw my nightstand, mynightstand right now is stacked
high.
I read about one or two pagesand fall asleep.
So it takes me a long time toget through reading the book,
but writing a book is a biglabor of love.

(01:37:43):
And so several people have toldme that book has been a life
changer for them.
One guy even said it helped savehis life.
He was going to commit suicide.
It saved him.
Thanks be to God.
Even one life that's saved isworth it.
And in this one, uh Pat's atest.
So just how to endure the fireof affliction and emerge like

(01:38:06):
gold.
This logo looks similar to yourbe tempered.
I love the idea.
So it's we're formed in thevalley.
Growth takes place in thevalley, in that crucible, truly.
So full of over 300 scripturesof how to get through uh the
test of life, because life is atest, and God can take your test
and bring forth a greattestimony.

(01:38:28):
All depends how we respond.
He doesn't want us to fail thetest, like the Israelites in the
desert, but to pass a test, likeShadrach, Meshach, and Abednego
through the fiery furnace,right?
Like so many others.
But uh that's I pray is helpfulto people.
And here's one that I wroteduring the uh pandemic called
Stay Pure, about how to get pureand in a stay pure, to live a

(01:38:51):
no-regrets, regrets life ofpurity with God, with others,
and with yourself.
In this technological age, it'smore and more difficult for
people to stay pure.
There's so much junk out there.
As our pastor says, every cellphone is an open door to the pit
of hell.
And it can be.
It's very true.
It can be used for good, it canbe used for a lot of evil.

(01:39:13):
There's a lot of junk out there.
So it's how to get pure and staypure, not only of substances or
addictions, but also pornographyand illicit material.
It's for all age ranges, becauseeverybody needs it, whether
young, old, married, single,clergy, laity, we all need this
so that we can be a utensil inGod's hand, He can use for His

(01:39:36):
kingdom.
And then my heart is forfamilies.
And I wrote one about especiallyfor fathers, to father your
family, to responsibly raisegodly children with no regrets,
to inflame our hearts to dothat, because we live in an
epidemic of fatherlessness.
And if we can get the fathersright, then we have a chance to

(01:39:59):
get the families right and ourcountry right.
As the family goes, so the worldgoes.
Our family's under terribleassault and attack, as I'm sure
both of you can attest to.
So people people can find theseat our website called
MightyIntheland.com,MightyIntheLand.com, or on
social media at the same uh tag,Mighty in the Land uh podcast as

(01:40:22):
well and other things.
So You do have a podcast?
I do, yes, just uh audio so far.
So far.
Right.
Awesome.
YouTube channel, you name it.
But I'd be honored to come andto share in person at uh
anybody's church or gathering orfunction or community, any
denomination across thespectrum, uh anywhere across the

(01:40:42):
country.
I'd be honored to come andshare.
I've even been to a few othercountries as well and share it
in different lands.
So I try to go wherever we'reinvited without charging fees
and come in complete faith.

SPEAKER_05 (01:40:55):
It's amazing.
It's a it's an amazing story.
Um my emotions have been allover the place listening to
this.
It's it's it's powerful.
You are a remarkable man to havethe strength and faith that you
do.
And uh it's it's inspiring.
It's inspiring to me.

(01:41:17):
Uh and I don't know how it can'tbe inspiring to those who are
listening.
So thank you for yourvulnerability because I think
that is uh a very importantthing that I've realized in the
last year and a half of doingthis podcast is by people being
vulnerable, sharing their story,their test, and that testimony
that comes from it, that's wherewe really help others.

(01:41:40):
Right.
You know, that that may not befacing what you have faced.
But to hear that story and tothink, holy cow, he got through
it.

unknown (01:41:50):
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (01:41:50):
I can get through it.
That's right.
And that's what's important.
That's right.
So thank you for for making thetrek down here and for sharing
this this story.
Thank you for your faith.
Uh you're an amazing man.

SPEAKER_02 (01:42:03):
Well, we have an amazing God.
We do.
I deflect all the glory to him.
Thank you, Ben and Dan, forthank you the opportunity.
If it can help change or inspireone life, it's worth the time,
the travel, the commitment to dothis.

SPEAKER_05 (01:42:14):
Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 (01:42:15):
Always an honor to.

SPEAKER_05 (01:42:18):
Anything else you got to add?

SPEAKER_01 (01:42:19):
No, I just thank you so much.
And hopefully people will seelike no matter how dark the
story, how matter, you know, nomatter how much it it hurts and
pains.
Like that's that's yourtestimony.
That's what God placed on you toshare and changes lives.
I just can't thank you enough.

SPEAKER_02 (01:42:34):
Uh sure thing.
You know, we each have a story.
And I often try to encouragepeople to share your story.
Yeah.
That's important.
God can bring great glorythrough your story.
History is his story.
He wants to be glorified throughit.
The book of Hebrews says weapproach the throne of grace
with boldness that we mightreceive mercy, a find grace to

(01:42:59):
help us in our time of need.
So for those who are in a pointof need that are in a rough
patch of life, go to God boldly.
Get in his face, you know.
Just be connected to him.
And he'll give you that graceand mercy in your time of need.

SPEAKER_01 (01:43:14):
It's what the Bible's full of, right?
That's right.
People falling and then they goto God and it's restored, and
then there's the testimony, andthere's a chapter.
I mean, you talk about KingDavid, and I mean, you know, you
don't compare sins, but I mean,sending somebody out and I, you
know, the wife.
I mean, yeah.
I mean, uh no matter how faryou've fallen, God's not too

(01:43:35):
far.

SPEAKER_02 (01:43:36):
That's right.
I've heard said the saints arejust the sinners who fall down
and get back up.
That's right.
Don't give up.

SPEAKER_05 (01:43:43):
Yeah.
Well, everybody, share thisthing.
This is this is powerful.
Somebody out there needs to hearthis story.
Get online.
Mightyintheland.com.
Yes.
Support uh Robert, his mission,his books.
Um I'm excited to to get intothese and to read these and uh

(01:44:05):
just to share them with myfamily.
And uh, you know, just tocontinue to try to keep keep
doing what we're trying to do isjust to help that one person,
just like you.
So thank you again.

SPEAKER_02 (01:44:15):
You're welcome.
Thank you for what you do.
Thank you for this opportunity.
God bless you both.

SPEAKER_05 (01:44:19):
Bless you.
All right, everybody.
Go out and be tempered.

SPEAKER_00 (01:44:23):
Hi, my name is Alice, but this is my goddamn
heel Catron's glass.

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SPEAKER_03 (01:44:53):
I want to share something that's become a big

part of the B Tempered mission: Patreon. (01:44:55):
undefined
Now, if you've never used itbefore, Patreon is a platform
where we can build communitytogether.
It's not just about supportingthe podcast, it's about having a
space where we can connect on adeeper level, encourage one
another, and walk this journeyof faith, resilience, and
perseverance side by side.

(01:45:16):
Here's how it works.
You can join as a free memberand get access to daily posts,
behind-the-scenes updates,encouragement, and some things I
don't always put out on otherplatforms.
And if you feel called tosupport the mission financially,
there are different levels whereyou can do that too.
That support helps us keepproducing the podcasts, creating
gear, hosting events, andsharing stories that we believe

(01:45:39):
can truly impact lives.
And here's the cool part.
Patreon has a free app you candownload right on your phone.
It works just like Facebook orInstagram, but it's built
specifically for our community.
You'll be able to scroll throughposts, watch videos, listen to
content, and interact withothers who are on the same
journey.
At the end of the day, thisisn't just about content, it's

(01:46:00):
about connection.
It's about building somethingtogether.
Not just me and men putting outepisodes, but a family of people
committed to growing strongerthrough real stories and real
faith.
So whether you just want to hopon as a free member or you feel
called to support in a bitterway, Patreon is the door into
that community.
Because at the heart of BeTempered has always been simple

(01:46:22):
real stories, raw truth,resilient faith, so that even
one person out there that hearswhat they need to hear, and
Patreon helps make thatpossible.

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BeTempered Episode 78 – Robert Rogers Lost His Entire Family in a Flash Flood and Still Chose to Praise God

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}BeTempered Episode 78 – Robert Rogers Lost His Entire Family in a Flash Flood and Still Chose to Praise God