May 9, 2024 • 41 mins
In the United States, more than 75% of prosecutors are white. A mere 5.6% are black, but only 1% are Black women. Despite this small number, Black women prosecutors are not only leading some of the most prolific work in our country but being purposely attack at extreme rates. Today, Chantel Mullen and I will discuss this phemmomia and provide information about how Black women can support these amazing and courageous women, like Marilyn Mosby, Fani Willis, Monique Worrell and many others.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:01):
welcome to clap back get the
facts podcast where we are
providing you with the
information you need to
know about what's
politically impacting black
women across the country in
a world filled with myths
and disinformation we
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(00:35):
Hello, hello, hello,
and welcome to Clap Back, Get the Facts.
I am your host, Holly Holiday.
Welcome to episode four.
We are here talking about a
very timely issue.
We're going to talk first
about Marilyn Mosby,
who is the former state's
attorney in the city of Baltimore.
(00:56):
We're going to use her as a
way to talk about a bigger issue,
which is Black women
prosecutors under attack.
This is a real, calculated, very organized,
unfortunately well-funded threat.
Marilyn Mosby is but an example,
(01:18):
and so we're going to use
her case to get into this.
But understand that when we
have a situation where 75%
of all prosecutors
In this country,
roughly sixteen hundred
prosecutors and 75 percent
of those are white.
That even amongst that,
only five point six percent
(01:38):
are black and roughly two percent, which,
by the way,
has doubled in the last three
in the last four years.
That's gone from one to two
percent doubling.
are Black women,
you would think that we
were everywhere by the way
that we are persecuted,
by the way we are attacked,
not just for the work that we're doing,
(01:59):
but being personally attacked.
being overly investigated,
digging into our lives,
being targeted for any and
every little possible thing we can do,
looking for opportunities to embarrass.
You all have seen this and
we're going to talk about it.
(02:19):
And who am I talking about it with?
Of course, you know,
we're talking about things
in the legal spectrum.
It's going to be with Chantel Mullins.
Hello, Chantel.
Hello, Holly.
Oh, my God.
Happy whatever day this is.
Whatever day this is.
And let me just say we are
(02:39):
going to do a series of
these podcasts about black
women under attack.
But I wanted to kick it off
with prosecutors because let's face it.
Oh, my goodness.
Prosecutors are catching hell.
They are.
And, you know.
They've been catching hell
even when they're not in
the prosecutor's office,
(03:00):
because we can just look at
the vice president who is a
former prosecutor.
Talk about it.
People are still giving her the blues.
over her service as a prosecutor.
And, you know,
you would think Black women
were the majority of
prosecutors in America and
(03:23):
they're just throwing, I mean,
they're just doing everything.
If you listen to what's
being pushed in the media, but hey.
They're an infinitesimal
amount of prosecutors and
they're getting
disproportionate coverage
and disproportionate attacks.
(03:45):
And there are some
prosecutors out here that
they should really be looking at like,
I'll have to pull it up,
but there was the one who
just stepped down from
office that they found,
I believe she was a white
woman and she was literally
cooking cases and framing folks.
If y'all really want to go look at some.
(04:08):
Listen,
we could call the role is the reality.
of the Black women.
And we will.
We're going to call many of
them because I think it's
important for us to name
them so that we can prepare
those listening to know
exactly what is going on.
(04:30):
But let's start with Marilyn
Mosby because honestly,
I think the Marilyn Mosby
case really represents to
me one of the most egregious
egregious and over
prosecuted over
investigated case of women
(04:53):
black women sitting in
these prosecutorial roles
being threatened and I also
do not want to leave
without talking about why
this is they do this also
not just to damage our
existing leaders but to
(05:15):
chill others who might think
about pursuing these paths.
So I want to start by saying
that Marilyn Mosby was
elected under great enthusiasm.
Marilyn Mosby is the former
district attorney,
which is the city of
Baltimore's top prosecutor
(05:36):
in the city of Baltimore.
She served in that position
from 2015 to 2023.
And during that time,
she held up some very high profile cases,
one of which was Freddie Gray.
(05:59):
Now, truth be told,
the initial Freddie Gray
prosecution of police
officers did not go in her favor.
And there's a lot of
commentary about that.
But I don't think that's why
(06:20):
they're coming after her.
What do you think?
Well, let me just say,
I think the Freddie Gray case,
certainly a lot of people
know her from that.
But I think what happened
was not the first set of
cases around these police officers,
(06:41):
but the next set of cases
around these police officers.
What are the next set of cases, Holly?
Most people have only heard
about Freddie Gray.
But what else happened after Freddie Gray?
Yeah.
Well,
what else happened was they began to
put stricter standards on
(07:04):
the police department.
What else happened were other people,
other police officers who
have been engaged in
misconduct that resulted in
negative employment actions for them,
right?
Everything from, in other words,
even though the Freddie
(07:24):
Gray case was not
successful in terms of
prosecuting those police officers,
it was successful in shining
a light on the fact that
greater accountability
needed to be had with the
Baltimore City Police Department.
And in that respect,
that trial and her having
the courage to bring the
(07:45):
trial against the police
officers was a catalyst to
so many other things.
And I think that's the part
that often gets left out.
And I think because of that,
and we all know,
and I don't think we need
to spend a lot of time here,
but we will at some point
know that when we look at these things,
(08:08):
we gotta recognize, hey,
even a little success is
problematic for a lot of people.
It's problematic for a lot of people.
So fast forward, right?
And here's some realities.
They investigate her for a very long time.
(08:35):
I mean, a long time.
They started investigating
her shortly after the
Freddie Gray prosecution.
And that was in 2015,
shortly after she was elected.
You know what that reminds me of?
(08:56):
Like what?
Well,
it reminds me of a couple of things
because, you know,
I'm originally from Arkansas.
Yes.
Okay.
What happens in Arkansas?
Well, you know,
Bill Clinton was
investigated for a very
long time and they ended up
(09:17):
getting him related to
fellatio with an intern in
the office that he not the actual act,
but that he lied under oath
about the act.
They have been investigating
Hillary Clinton probably
(09:38):
for most of my life.
I remember her being
investigated when I was a
teenager and I am long past
those teenage years.
Just a few years past.
Just a couple, just a couple.
But, you know,
I think it's interesting
that if you look at what
they got Marilyn Mosby on,
(10:00):
what they started
investigating her on and
where they ultimately
landed was just some BS.
And, you know, I think it's just.
If you're if you're.
if your allegation is that
(10:20):
you have a public servant
who is doing wrong and is
doing wrong doing.
And you start in one place,
but you have to just keep digging.
And ultimately what they
convicted her of has
nothing to do with her public office,
her public trust.
(10:41):
And I'm still trying to wrap
my head around the fact
that she got convicted
around using her own money.
I still, that part just, you know,
that almost seems
anti-American at this point,
that the money that you put
into an account,
(11:01):
Yes.
And the rules allow you to withdraw it.
And they say, well,
you really technically
weren't supposed to
withdraw it for that reason.
Well, listen,
let's be really clear about this.
So just in case people have
not heard about Marilyn Mosby's case,
let's start with where she is right now.
(11:21):
Marilyn Mosby was convicted
of essentially perjury.
Because in 2020,
she withdrew $90,000 from a
retirement account that she
was allowed to withdraw
from under the Coronavirus Aid, Relief,
(11:45):
and Economic Security Act,
otherwise known as the CARES Act.
What the CARES Act allowed you to do
is to tap into retirement, i.e.
your own money, money that you have saved.
If they were saved in
retirement instruments, as you all know,
many times you're not
allowed to do just random withdrawals.
(12:05):
But if you could demonstrate
that there was a hardship, and hardship,
by the way, I'm sorry,
adverse financial consequence,
that was the little language.
And if an adverse financial consequence,
by the way, has no legal definition.
It can be whatever you say it is.
It has never been challenged
and it has never been properly defined.
(12:28):
If you choose to do that.
And then she took that money
to buy a home in Florida or
some property in Florida.
Basically,
the jury said that when she
applied for that money.
because they said she lied
(12:50):
about having an adverse
financial consequence,
that is the perjury charge
that she was convicted of.
The second thing is she
submitted a letter to her
mortgage company
claiming that her husband at the time,
Nick Mosby, who they are now divorced,
agreed to give her $5,000
(13:11):
towards the condo.
And although this is also in controversy,
the jury determined that that was untrue,
which represents a second perjury,
maybe fraud action.
And that's what she was convicted on.
So there's no victims.
Nobody was hurt, harmed,
(13:31):
or put in any danger.
But they went to find this
form to say that she had
committed perjury.
Now, here's what's interesting.
Yeah, come on with it.
We know a lot of people have done this.
In fact, in Maryland alone,
(13:53):
they know that at least 35,000 people
took money from their
retirement account under this clause,
not a single one of them
have been investigated.
Zero.
I want you to understand
(14:14):
that even across this country,
we're talking hundreds of
thousands of people who
took advantage of this change in law,
which was designed to help
us maintain our financial
stability during COVID,
took advantage of this law
(14:35):
to take their own money and
use it immediately as
opposed to using it for retirement.
No one else in the country
is being prosecuted for
this except Marilyn Mosby.
So now we have that.
Now, it was crazy,
crazy as if that's not enough.
(14:57):
And I just want to say I am
admitting to no wrongdoing
in case they try to prosecute me.
I provided no information on
what I may or may not have
taken out of my retirement
account during the COVID
under the CARES Act.
I have no comment about that issue.
Okay.
(15:20):
But what I will say is...
even though she is certainly
the only one this is no
time to set a precedence
that would put her in jail
for 40 years can you even
imagine well no I can't
number one um you know because I guess
(15:45):
I guess as a lawyer,
my first question would be,
is this actually a crime or
something that's just being made up?
Because there are times when
there are things that may
be inappropriate or may
later be deemed inappropriate.
And I'm not saying her actions in any way,
(16:08):
one way or the other, are inappropriate.
But the question then becomes,
when you're signing that form,
I'm just trying to think of
another example.
So for example,
if you get some money that
you shouldn't have,
(16:29):
they usually just claw that money back.
And it's not,
they just take the money back.
They send you a message and say,
you weren't eligible for this.
Pay the money back,
particularly when it's your own.
And usually that's what
other folks' money or money
you should not have had.
This is your own money.
(16:50):
That's the part.
I'm still trying to
understand the money that
she is getting is money
that she has gone to work,
Those are her contributions to it.
And if the rules have
changed and there's no set definition,
(17:12):
it doesn't say you have to
take the money.
You have to have an economic
hardship or whatever it is
or adverse action.
And you have to use the
money for that action.
That part.
Here's another thing.
See,
this is how you know it's intentional.
This is how you know it's a target.
(17:33):
Come on now.
Of all the thousands of
people who took money out
of their retirement account
under the CARES Act,
how in the hell did you get
to Marilyn Mosby?
Correct.
How did you even make the choice?
And keep in mind, perjury.
(17:57):
Perjury is typically a
charge and a charge that we
use when a person has lied to the court.
We are trying to impeach
evidence when we are trying
to show that that under
(18:18):
oath you have lied.
That's typically the way perjury is.
I've never even really seen
perjury used in this way in
terms of lying on the floor.
No,
a third party that is not a party to
this lawsuit at all.
Correct.
And here's the other thing.
Perjury doesn't actually.
(18:40):
usually result in people going to jail.
Well,
the perjury was the foundation of
them then convicting her of fraud.
Those are her two counts.
If you get rid of the
perjury and you say there is no perjury,
then you cannot get to the fraud.
(19:01):
Mm-hmm.
They just made up some... I
was about to cuss.
Don't do it.
Don't do it.
Don't do it.
We might have to because
this is pretty ridiculous.
Now,
I want to say that as ridiculous as
this is,
(19:21):
as horrible as a situation as
this is for Marilyn Mosby,
there are things we can do
to support her.
Mm-hmm.
And that although she finds
herself in this predicament today,
this does not have to be her future.
It does not.
(19:42):
And Black women and people
of good conscience and faith,
one of the things we want to do,
first of all,
is we wanted to have a
conversation about her case.
Before we get into what you can do,
I do want to share that
while I think this was the
tipping point was certainly
the Freddie Gray piece,
(20:03):
I want to talk to you about
the bigger point
particularly between 2017 and 2020,
was the impact she was
having on the system.
Because I mentioned that the
Freddie Gray case,
which happened shortly
after she was elected,
was actually the tipping
(20:24):
point to a number of very
critical things that
changed and challenged the
system of law enforcement
in the city of Baltimore.
One of the things was that
she reviewed and dismissed
cases involving police
officers who were planting evidence.
(20:45):
She identified 2,000
criminal cases that were
connected with only eight
Baltimore officers that
were arrested on racketeering charges.
She released three men who
were wrongfully convicted
in 1983 for murder.
She announced indictments
against 25 city
(21:06):
correctional officers on
their use of excessive force.
She identified and reviewed
over 800 convictions to be
overturned that involved
the corrupt police officers
connected to the Gun Trace Task Force,
also known as the GTT Force.
And
(21:32):
She looked and made sure and
advocated for the release
of people who were under a
threat of death due to
COVID who were sitting in
prison or in a jail awaiting trial.
and allowed and stopped the
prosecution of minor
offenses to enable people
to be released from prison
(21:53):
to help stop the spread of
violence for incarcerated people.
And we know that during COVID,
people who were in confined
spaces like prisons and
unable to have proper
safety or protect
themselves with six feet
distancing were some of the
people most vulnerable to
the coronavirus.
(22:13):
And she took aim at that.
And those are the things
that she did to specifically challenge,
improve,
and make corrections to the system.
And I think it was these
things and her
effectiveness in those
things that made her a target.
(22:34):
And I think had she done
those things and not been a Black woman,
we would not be here.
I agree.
Yeah.
So what can we do?
Well,
the first thing is there is a
petition and the petition
is available on change.org.
It is asking you to sign a
(22:56):
petition that would
encourage President Biden
to issue a pardon.
Now,
if you are a legal expert like Chantel
and I, you may ask yourself, self,
Why are we asking for a pardon now?
She hasn't even been sentenced yet.
(23:18):
Well,
one of the reasons that we're asking
for a pardon now is that a
sentencing and conviction
would cause her to lose her law license,
which would then impact her
financial ability to care for her family.
She is raising young daughters.
And so she would like to be
(23:39):
able to continue supporting her family,
especially newly divorced.
And having her law license
would enable her to do that.
The other thing is,
because this is so unprecedented,
we want to send a message, right,
that this is not acceptable
level of prosecution.
(24:01):
This is a federal case,
and we think the president
needs to pull his folk back and say, hey,
y'all went too far on this one.
Y'all went too far.
So we need you to sign the petition.
Go ahead.
I'm sorry.
I was just going to say the
question then becomes,
why are the feds involved?
(24:24):
Well, I want to note the timeline here.
The feds have been
investigating her since 2017.
So this predates Biden's administration.
I want to note that.
And I want to note that the initial loss,
(24:44):
the initial charges were
filed against her, I believe,
right as President Biden
was being sworn in in 2020.
It has just taken all of
this time after countless
motions and countless other
pre-trial depositions, blah, blah, blah.
(25:05):
It's just taken all this
time to get to court.
But a lot of this...
is not a function of a Biden
administration.
It is a function of things
that were in play prior to
Biden's election that just
manifested during his time in office.
(25:27):
So I'm glad you brought that
up because that timeline is important.
And needless to say,
and if you all go back and
look through the record,
Trump actually calls her
out on several occasions,
particularly during this
time that she's looking at
this 800 cases of police corruption.
(25:48):
That, by the way,
we're all basically
exonerated the police and said, no,
there's something here.
And that's when Trump really
started to call her out in
the media and in public.
And as we know,
what Trump does in public
is just a small sliver of
what he's plotting and
planning behind the scenes.
(26:09):
And we see the results of
that in this conviction.
So we got the petition.
We need folks to sign the petition.
You can sign the petition at change.org.
The other thing we'd love for you to do
is to call the US Attorney's
Office in Maryland and let
(26:31):
them know that she deserves
a sentence without jail time.
She deserves a sentence without jail time.
that this is unconscionable,
and while the U.S.
attorney is not in a position to change,
well, he shouldn't have brought the case,
but is not in a position to
(26:53):
change the verdict,
he is in a position to
provide his recommendation
as it relates to sentencing.
And we think that
recommendation should be
extreme leniency.
That includes no jail time.
(27:15):
I'm going to give you his information,
which I thought I had at the ready.
And guess what?
I don't.
I do not have it at the ready.
That's terrible.
All right.
His name is a U.S.
attorney, Eric Barron, E-R-E-K-B-A-R-R-O-N,
(27:36):
Maryland U.S.
attorney, Eric Barron.
And his phone number, write this down,
replay this podcast to make
sure you get it, is 410-209-4800.
And what we are asking him
to do is to not seek jail time,
(27:58):
prison time for Marilyn Mosby,
that we do not need probation,
we do not need jail time,
that the damage is done,
that she should be released
with time served.
This is a woman who has no
background of a criminal record.
(28:18):
and she has a history of
being an effective
prosecutor as well as a
pillar of her community not
only that they have seized
and forfeited all of her
assets including her last
and recently filed a
forfeiture motion to seize
her last remaining asset
and again as you pointed
(28:39):
out this is all over
I don't know if we said this,
but I was told I actually
had an opportunity to have
a conversation with Marilyn.
And she told me that, in fact,
before she even filed to get the money,
that she was advised by the
(28:59):
retirement of the financial
institution that holds the
retirement account that this was okay.
Okay.
And that he had been
prosecuting these all the
time during this period.
It just gets more and more outrageous.
I can't stand it.
I just can't stand no more.
(29:20):
So that's what you can do.
But here's the problem.
Marilyn Mosby is one.
But oh my goodness,
there's a whole lot more out there.
There's a whole lot more out there.
We've heard about what's
happening in your home state of Georgia.
Oh, yes.
(29:41):
Connie Willis.
Well, in fact,
we just got a little bit
more on that case today because, you know,
the judge,
the trial judge who is actually
up for election.
How about that?
He is on the ballot.
If you happen to be in
Georgia or know someone in
(30:01):
Georgia who lives in the Fulton County,
I will be filling out my little ballot.
But he is on the ballot.
That decision...
Because I really had an
issue with him taking up this motion.
(30:22):
But that's a whole other discussion.
That's a whole different story, yes.
And he reminded me of the
attorney who released the
latest decision.
Was that her that wrote the decision?
Yeah.
where he talked about Biden
(30:43):
and the documents at Biden's house.
And he made those comments
about would be seen as a nice old man.
You know,
that's some petty stuff that
well-trained lawyers don't do.
Correct.
And so the decision that was
(31:06):
written in that case
I thought the judge took some unnecessary,
he wanted to do something.
And this is a Kemp appointee
who was appointed to that
office to fill- Kemp being
the governor of Georgia who
happens to be- Governor of Georgia.
(31:28):
And I felt like he wanted to
do something because it
really was not there.
The law was not in his favor.
The Georgia law as it
currently stands was not in his favor.
There wasn't even
administrative law because
they had gone to the Fulton
County Commission,
which gives the funding for that office.
(31:51):
And they were like, no,
we can't do anything with it.
And so but that being as it may,
he made a decision.
The defendants appeal that decision.
And we have been awaiting in
Georgia to see if the
Georgia Court of Appeals
was going to take that case up.
(32:13):
And they are.
Now, why?
Yes.
And so we just got that word, I believe,
on yesterday.
But what I will say about
the Georgia Court of
Appeals is they are elected
and a number of them are on the ballot.
And so it is important that
we understand that, you know,
(32:35):
we're in the midst of a
presidential election,
but some of the decisions
or actually most of the
decisions that will impact
your day to day life.
Yeah.
are happening at your state
and local level and those
state and local elections.
So it is important that we
pay attention to those
elections and we understand
(32:58):
who is on the ballot and
the decisions that they can
make in those positions.
And so I'm going to just say
it one more time,
the Georgia Court of Appeals
the judge overseeing the
Trump case is elected,
as is the prosecutor.
(33:19):
Well, listen, we don't have to,
not only are those folks on the ballot,
we could look at another
example of a targeted
person in the state of Florida,
a target of Governor Ron DeSantis,
Monique Worrell, right?
Yes.
(33:39):
who she had the audacity to
examine a series of
prosecutions that were
coming out of her office
and determine that there
was an inequity around
prosecutions between white
defendants and black
defendants and had the
audacity to put in equity
(34:00):
practices that would
address that disparity.
He, having no authority to do this,
sent word to her that she needed to stop.
She refused.
And he, with again, no authority,
removed her from her elected office.
(34:21):
We cannot make this stuff up.
Removed her from her elected office.
And now Monique is back on
the ballot running to be, she's up for,
well, she would have been,
she's up for reelection,
but she's not currently serving.
And let me tell you, in doing this,
(34:42):
they're trying to break you financially.
Mm hmm.
Because Monique, in this situation,
when she was removed from office,
she's no longer a she's
still because she is still in name.
The district attorney,
she cannot practice law
independent of her office
because it would be a
conflict of interest.
But she's drawing no salary.
(35:04):
So she has no income during this part.
like with Marilyn Mosby,
who has no income doing this part.
So I encourage you to also
think about the fact that
these women who are
standing up for justice,
that are doing all the thing,
are doing so at great parts
personal financial risk,
(35:25):
personal financial instability,
not just to them,
but the families that they support.
And listen,
we could go on and on because
we know they are not alone.
We could talk about Kim Scott in Chicago.
No, Kim Fox.
I said her name wrong.
Okay.
(35:46):
We could talk about Letitia
James in New York.
And you would think,
as many of these women that exist,
that we are a huge percentage.
And so as we close out,
I want to share for those
of you who are watching this on video,
I'll walk through it.
We have this graphic that
shows in proportion.
(36:07):
Where are the Black women?
So look at this.
This is literally 2021 and 2022.
Now, the biggest portion is white men,
well over 1,500 white men.
And in fact, between 2021 and 2022,
their number went up a little bit.
Mm-hmm.
(36:30):
Now,
what you can see by looking at this is
infinitesimally,
there's a little speck in
2021 of Black women.
You have to squint to see it.
It is so small on this bar chart.
I need a magnifying glass.
And it doubled.
(36:52):
And so currently we have out
of the almost 1,600
prosecutor jobs in this country,
and this is the top
prosecutor jobs in this country,
20, 20,
only 20 of them are held by Black women.
And if you need any more incentive,
if Chantel and I have not
been persuasive enough
(37:13):
about how we need to protect Black women,
I want you to know that out of those 20,
Marilyn Mosby started a
sister circle for those 20
women so that they could
support each other.
(37:33):
And so I say that in closing, just to say,
these are the kind of women
that are running for these offices,
that they are on the ballot.
And what we don't have time
to talk about today,
but we should probably make
another episode is let's
look at some of these women
on the ballot and what they
(37:53):
started to do because they
know how effective they can
be is they started taking
them out before they can
even get elected.
Yes.
And they're putting laws in
place that if they do get elected,
they can remove them easily.
Oh, my goodness.
It's so much.
Well, listen,
(38:14):
we know this is but the
beginning of the conversation.
But I hope and we're running
a little bit longer than we
normally do today.
But I hope that what your
takeaways are from this is
support black women prosecutors.
support Black women
prosecutors on the ballot,
and support them when they get in office.
It is a tough job in a
(38:36):
system that was not meant
for them to challenge the
inequities that happen.
And that's exactly what they're doing,
each and every one of them.
We especially encourage you.
I'm sorry.
Go ahead, Chantel.
I was just going to say that, you know,
when you put black women in
office and they bring an
(38:57):
equity lens to that work.
Yes.
You get an Angela also
Brooks who was state
attorney and who reduced
violence or violent crime by 50 percent.
Yes.
Because, you know,
The definition is insanity
is doing the same thing
over and over and thinking
(39:18):
you're going to get a different outcome.
We've been locking folks up
in this country for
hundreds of years and we
have not yet gotten a different outcome.
We've got folks trying a
different approach.
And in some cases,
it's a successful approach.
And we've got people who are
who don't want that, don't want that.
(39:39):
Yeah, that's right.
For various reasons.
For various reasons.
Well,
that gives us the opportunity to clap
back.
We need y'all to stand up
for Black women prosecutors.
We especially need you to
stand up for Marilyn Mosby right now,
right in this moment.
Go to change.org and sign the petition.
to support President,
(40:00):
encourage President Biden
to consider a pardon for her.
I want you to go to
justiceformosby.org is her
website and do all the
things and especially reach
out to this US attorney and
make sure that he knows that no jail time,
no probation is necessary.
She has been punished enough.
(40:23):
And then when you've done all of that,
like and subscribe to our
podcast because we will be
back next week with more
information on other ways
in which the system is
attacking black women.
Listen.
Black women,
if we don't stand up for each other,
who else can we expect to stand with us?
(40:43):
So let's make sure we are
clapping back now that
Chantel and I have given you the facts.
Until next week, we'll see you then.
So long.
Thank you for joining us here on Clap Back,
Get the Facts podcast.
We hope that you're leaving
feeling more informed and
ready to provide others with the facts.
We would love to hear your
(41:04):
biggest takeaways from this episode.
So post the show on your
Instagram story and tag us
at Sisters Lead.
Also, if you haven't already,
don't forget to subscribe
so you'll never miss an episode.
And while you're at it,
please leave a review so
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Finally,
if you would like to learn more
about local resources and
(41:25):
other projects we're working on,
go to sistersleadsistersvote.org.
welcome to clap back get the
facts podcast where we are
providing you with the
information you need to
know about what's
politically impacting black
women across the country in
a world filled with myths
and disinformation we
provide you with the real
if you're a black woman
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women we are here to clap
back and give you the facts
(00:35):
Hello, hello, hello,
and welcome to Clap Back, Get the Facts.
I am your host, Holly Holiday.
Welcome to episode four.
We are here talking about a
very timely issue.
We're going to talk first
about Marilyn Mosby,
who is the former state's
attorney in the city of Baltimore.
(00:56):
We're going to use her as a
way to talk about a bigger issue,
which is Black women
prosecutors under attack.
This is a real, calculated, very organized,
unfortunately well-funded threat.
Marilyn Mosby is but an example,
(01:18):
and so we're going to use
her case to get into this.
But understand that when we
have a situation where 75%
of all prosecutors
In this country,
roughly sixteen hundred
prosecutors and 75 percent
of those are white.
That even amongst that,
only five point six percent
(01:38):
are black and roughly two percent, which,
by the way,
has doubled in the last three
in the last four years.
That's gone from one to two
percent doubling.
are Black women,
you would think that we
were everywhere by the way
that we are persecuted,
by the way we are attacked,
not just for the work that we're doing,
(01:59):
but being personally attacked.
being overly investigated,
digging into our lives,
being targeted for any and
every little possible thing we can do,
looking for opportunities to embarrass.
You all have seen this and
we're going to talk about it.
(02:19):
And who am I talking about it with?
Of course, you know,
we're talking about things
in the legal spectrum.
It's going to be with Chantel Mullins.
Hello, Chantel.
Hello, Holly.
Oh, my God.
Happy whatever day this is.
Whatever day this is.
And let me just say we are
(02:39):
going to do a series of
these podcasts about black
women under attack.
But I wanted to kick it off
with prosecutors because let's face it.
Oh, my goodness.
Prosecutors are catching hell.
They are.
And, you know.
They've been catching hell
even when they're not in
the prosecutor's office,
(03:00):
because we can just look at
the vice president who is a
former prosecutor.
Talk about it.
People are still giving her the blues.
over her service as a prosecutor.
And, you know,
you would think Black women
were the majority of
prosecutors in America and
(03:23):
they're just throwing, I mean,
they're just doing everything.
If you listen to what's
being pushed in the media, but hey.
They're an infinitesimal
amount of prosecutors and
they're getting
disproportionate coverage
and disproportionate attacks.
(03:45):
And there are some
prosecutors out here that
they should really be looking at like,
I'll have to pull it up,
but there was the one who
just stepped down from
office that they found,
I believe she was a white
woman and she was literally
cooking cases and framing folks.
If y'all really want to go look at some.
(04:08):
Listen,
we could call the role is the reality.
of the Black women.
And we will.
We're going to call many of
them because I think it's
important for us to name
them so that we can prepare
those listening to know
exactly what is going on.
(04:30):
But let's start with Marilyn
Mosby because honestly,
I think the Marilyn Mosby
case really represents to
me one of the most egregious
egregious and over
prosecuted over
investigated case of women
(04:53):
black women sitting in
these prosecutorial roles
being threatened and I also
do not want to leave
without talking about why
this is they do this also
not just to damage our
existing leaders but to
(05:15):
chill others who might think
about pursuing these paths.
So I want to start by saying
that Marilyn Mosby was
elected under great enthusiasm.
Marilyn Mosby is the former
district attorney,
which is the city of
Baltimore's top prosecutor
(05:36):
in the city of Baltimore.
She served in that position
from 2015 to 2023.
And during that time,
she held up some very high profile cases,
one of which was Freddie Gray.
(05:59):
Now, truth be told,
the initial Freddie Gray
prosecution of police
officers did not go in her favor.
And there's a lot of
commentary about that.
But I don't think that's why
(06:20):
they're coming after her.
What do you think?
Well, let me just say,
I think the Freddie Gray case,
certainly a lot of people
know her from that.
But I think what happened
was not the first set of
cases around these police officers,
(06:41):
but the next set of cases
around these police officers.
What are the next set of cases, Holly?
Most people have only heard
about Freddie Gray.
But what else happened after Freddie Gray?
Yeah.
Well,
what else happened was they began to
put stricter standards on
(07:04):
the police department.
What else happened were other people,
other police officers who
have been engaged in
misconduct that resulted in
negative employment actions for them,
right?
Everything from, in other words,
even though the Freddie
(07:24):
Gray case was not
successful in terms of
prosecuting those police officers,
it was successful in shining
a light on the fact that
greater accountability
needed to be had with the
Baltimore City Police Department.
And in that respect,
that trial and her having
the courage to bring the
(07:45):
trial against the police
officers was a catalyst to
so many other things.
And I think that's the part
that often gets left out.
And I think because of that,
and we all know,
and I don't think we need
to spend a lot of time here,
but we will at some point
know that when we look at these things,
(08:08):
we gotta recognize, hey,
even a little success is
problematic for a lot of people.
It's problematic for a lot of people.
So fast forward, right?
And here's some realities.
They investigate her for a very long time.
(08:35):
I mean, a long time.
They started investigating
her shortly after the
Freddie Gray prosecution.
And that was in 2015,
shortly after she was elected.
You know what that reminds me of?
(08:56):
Like what?
Well,
it reminds me of a couple of things
because, you know,
I'm originally from Arkansas.
Yes.
Okay.
What happens in Arkansas?
Well, you know,
Bill Clinton was
investigated for a very
long time and they ended up
(09:17):
getting him related to
fellatio with an intern in
the office that he not the actual act,
but that he lied under oath
about the act.
They have been investigating
Hillary Clinton probably
(09:38):
for most of my life.
I remember her being
investigated when I was a
teenager and I am long past
those teenage years.
Just a few years past.
Just a couple, just a couple.
But, you know,
I think it's interesting
that if you look at what
they got Marilyn Mosby on,
(10:00):
what they started
investigating her on and
where they ultimately
landed was just some BS.
And, you know, I think it's just.
If you're if you're.
if your allegation is that
(10:20):
you have a public servant
who is doing wrong and is
doing wrong doing.
And you start in one place,
but you have to just keep digging.
And ultimately what they
convicted her of has
nothing to do with her public office,
her public trust.
(10:41):
And I'm still trying to wrap
my head around the fact
that she got convicted
around using her own money.
I still, that part just, you know,
that almost seems
anti-American at this point,
that the money that you put
into an account,
(11:01):
Yes.
And the rules allow you to withdraw it.
And they say, well,
you really technically
weren't supposed to
withdraw it for that reason.
Well, listen,
let's be really clear about this.
So just in case people have
not heard about Marilyn Mosby's case,
let's start with where she is right now.
(11:21):
Marilyn Mosby was convicted
of essentially perjury.
Because in 2020,
she withdrew $90,000 from a
retirement account that she
was allowed to withdraw
from under the Coronavirus Aid, Relief,
(11:45):
and Economic Security Act,
otherwise known as the CARES Act.
What the CARES Act allowed you to do
is to tap into retirement, i.e.
your own money, money that you have saved.
If they were saved in
retirement instruments, as you all know,
many times you're not
allowed to do just random withdrawals.
(12:05):
But if you could demonstrate
that there was a hardship, and hardship,
by the way, I'm sorry,
adverse financial consequence,
that was the little language.
And if an adverse financial consequence,
by the way, has no legal definition.
It can be whatever you say it is.
It has never been challenged
and it has never been properly defined.
(12:28):
If you choose to do that.
And then she took that money
to buy a home in Florida or
some property in Florida.
Basically,
the jury said that when she
applied for that money.
because they said she lied
(12:50):
about having an adverse
financial consequence,
that is the perjury charge
that she was convicted of.
The second thing is she
submitted a letter to her
mortgage company
claiming that her husband at the time,
Nick Mosby, who they are now divorced,
agreed to give her $5,000
(13:11):
towards the condo.
And although this is also in controversy,
the jury determined that that was untrue,
which represents a second perjury,
maybe fraud action.
And that's what she was convicted on.
So there's no victims.
Nobody was hurt, harmed,
(13:31):
or put in any danger.
But they went to find this
form to say that she had
committed perjury.
Now, here's what's interesting.
Yeah, come on with it.
We know a lot of people have done this.
In fact, in Maryland alone,
(13:53):
they know that at least 35,000 people
took money from their
retirement account under this clause,
not a single one of them
have been investigated.
Zero.
I want you to understand
(14:14):
that even across this country,
we're talking hundreds of
thousands of people who
took advantage of this change in law,
which was designed to help
us maintain our financial
stability during COVID,
took advantage of this law
(14:35):
to take their own money and
use it immediately as
opposed to using it for retirement.
No one else in the country
is being prosecuted for
this except Marilyn Mosby.
So now we have that.
Now, it was crazy,
crazy as if that's not enough.
(14:57):
And I just want to say I am
admitting to no wrongdoing
in case they try to prosecute me.
I provided no information on
what I may or may not have
taken out of my retirement
account during the COVID
under the CARES Act.
I have no comment about that issue.
Okay.
(15:20):
But what I will say is...
even though she is certainly
the only one this is no
time to set a precedence
that would put her in jail
for 40 years can you even
imagine well no I can't
number one um you know because I guess
(15:45):
I guess as a lawyer,
my first question would be,
is this actually a crime or
something that's just being made up?
Because there are times when
there are things that may
be inappropriate or may
later be deemed inappropriate.
And I'm not saying her actions in any way,
(16:08):
one way or the other, are inappropriate.
But the question then becomes,
when you're signing that form,
I'm just trying to think of
another example.
So for example,
if you get some money that
you shouldn't have,
(16:29):
they usually just claw that money back.
And it's not,
they just take the money back.
They send you a message and say,
you weren't eligible for this.
Pay the money back,
particularly when it's your own.
And usually that's what
other folks' money or money
you should not have had.
This is your own money.
(16:50):
That's the part.
I'm still trying to
understand the money that
she is getting is money
that she has gone to work,
Those are her contributions to it.
And if the rules have
changed and there's no set definition,
(17:12):
it doesn't say you have to
take the money.
You have to have an economic
hardship or whatever it is
or adverse action.
And you have to use the
money for that action.
That part.
Here's another thing.
See,
this is how you know it's intentional.
This is how you know it's a target.
(17:33):
Come on now.
Of all the thousands of
people who took money out
of their retirement account
under the CARES Act,
how in the hell did you get
to Marilyn Mosby?
Correct.
How did you even make the choice?
And keep in mind, perjury.
(17:57):
Perjury is typically a
charge and a charge that we
use when a person has lied to the court.
We are trying to impeach
evidence when we are trying
to show that that under
(18:18):
oath you have lied.
That's typically the way perjury is.
I've never even really seen
perjury used in this way in
terms of lying on the floor.
No,
a third party that is not a party to
this lawsuit at all.
Correct.
And here's the other thing.
Perjury doesn't actually.
(18:40):
usually result in people going to jail.
Well,
the perjury was the foundation of
them then convicting her of fraud.
Those are her two counts.
If you get rid of the
perjury and you say there is no perjury,
then you cannot get to the fraud.
(19:01):
Mm-hmm.
They just made up some... I
was about to cuss.
Don't do it.
Don't do it.
Don't do it.
We might have to because
this is pretty ridiculous.
Now,
I want to say that as ridiculous as
this is,
(19:21):
as horrible as a situation as
this is for Marilyn Mosby,
there are things we can do
to support her.
Mm-hmm.
And that although she finds
herself in this predicament today,
this does not have to be her future.
It does not.
(19:42):
And Black women and people
of good conscience and faith,
one of the things we want to do,
first of all,
is we wanted to have a
conversation about her case.
Before we get into what you can do,
I do want to share that
while I think this was the
tipping point was certainly
the Freddie Gray piece,
(20:03):
I want to talk to you about
the bigger point
particularly between 2017 and 2020,
was the impact she was
having on the system.
Because I mentioned that the
Freddie Gray case,
which happened shortly
after she was elected,
was actually the tipping
(20:24):
point to a number of very
critical things that
changed and challenged the
system of law enforcement
in the city of Baltimore.
One of the things was that
she reviewed and dismissed
cases involving police
officers who were planting evidence.
(20:45):
She identified 2,000
criminal cases that were
connected with only eight
Baltimore officers that
were arrested on racketeering charges.
She released three men who
were wrongfully convicted
in 1983 for murder.
She announced indictments
against 25 city
(21:06):
correctional officers on
their use of excessive force.
She identified and reviewed
over 800 convictions to be
overturned that involved
the corrupt police officers
connected to the Gun Trace Task Force,
also known as the GTT Force.
And
(21:32):
She looked and made sure and
advocated for the release
of people who were under a
threat of death due to
COVID who were sitting in
prison or in a jail awaiting trial.
and allowed and stopped the
prosecution of minor
offenses to enable people
to be released from prison
(21:53):
to help stop the spread of
violence for incarcerated people.
And we know that during COVID,
people who were in confined
spaces like prisons and
unable to have proper
safety or protect
themselves with six feet
distancing were some of the
people most vulnerable to
the coronavirus.
(22:13):
And she took aim at that.
And those are the things
that she did to specifically challenge,
improve,
and make corrections to the system.
And I think it was these
things and her
effectiveness in those
things that made her a target.
(22:34):
And I think had she done
those things and not been a Black woman,
we would not be here.
I agree.
Yeah.
So what can we do?
Well,
the first thing is there is a
petition and the petition
is available on change.org.
It is asking you to sign a
(22:56):
petition that would
encourage President Biden
to issue a pardon.
Now,
if you are a legal expert like Chantel
and I, you may ask yourself, self,
Why are we asking for a pardon now?
She hasn't even been sentenced yet.
(23:18):
Well,
one of the reasons that we're asking
for a pardon now is that a
sentencing and conviction
would cause her to lose her law license,
which would then impact her
financial ability to care for her family.
She is raising young daughters.
And so she would like to be
(23:39):
able to continue supporting her family,
especially newly divorced.
And having her law license
would enable her to do that.
The other thing is,
because this is so unprecedented,
we want to send a message, right,
that this is not acceptable
level of prosecution.
(24:01):
This is a federal case,
and we think the president
needs to pull his folk back and say, hey,
y'all went too far on this one.
Y'all went too far.
So we need you to sign the petition.
Go ahead.
I'm sorry.
I was just going to say the
question then becomes,
why are the feds involved?
(24:24):
Well, I want to note the timeline here.
The feds have been
investigating her since 2017.
So this predates Biden's administration.
I want to note that.
And I want to note that the initial loss,
(24:44):
the initial charges were
filed against her, I believe,
right as President Biden
was being sworn in in 2020.
It has just taken all of
this time after countless
motions and countless other
pre-trial depositions, blah, blah, blah.
(25:05):
It's just taken all this
time to get to court.
But a lot of this...
is not a function of a Biden
administration.
It is a function of things
that were in play prior to
Biden's election that just
manifested during his time in office.
(25:27):
So I'm glad you brought that
up because that timeline is important.
And needless to say,
and if you all go back and
look through the record,
Trump actually calls her
out on several occasions,
particularly during this
time that she's looking at
this 800 cases of police corruption.
(25:48):
That, by the way,
we're all basically
exonerated the police and said, no,
there's something here.
And that's when Trump really
started to call her out in
the media and in public.
And as we know,
what Trump does in public
is just a small sliver of
what he's plotting and
planning behind the scenes.
(26:09):
And we see the results of
that in this conviction.
So we got the petition.
We need folks to sign the petition.
You can sign the petition at change.org.
The other thing we'd love for you to do
is to call the US Attorney's
Office in Maryland and let
(26:31):
them know that she deserves
a sentence without jail time.
She deserves a sentence without jail time.
that this is unconscionable,
and while the U.S.
attorney is not in a position to change,
well, he shouldn't have brought the case,
but is not in a position to
(26:53):
change the verdict,
he is in a position to
provide his recommendation
as it relates to sentencing.
And we think that
recommendation should be
extreme leniency.
That includes no jail time.
(27:15):
I'm going to give you his information,
which I thought I had at the ready.
And guess what?
I don't.
I do not have it at the ready.
That's terrible.
All right.
His name is a U.S.
attorney, Eric Barron, E-R-E-K-B-A-R-R-O-N,
(27:36):
Maryland U.S.
attorney, Eric Barron.
And his phone number, write this down,
replay this podcast to make
sure you get it, is 410-209-4800.
And what we are asking him
to do is to not seek jail time,
(27:58):
prison time for Marilyn Mosby,
that we do not need probation,
we do not need jail time,
that the damage is done,
that she should be released
with time served.
This is a woman who has no
background of a criminal record.
(28:18):
and she has a history of
being an effective
prosecutor as well as a
pillar of her community not
only that they have seized
and forfeited all of her
assets including her last
and recently filed a
forfeiture motion to seize
her last remaining asset
and again as you pointed
(28:39):
out this is all over
I don't know if we said this,
but I was told I actually
had an opportunity to have
a conversation with Marilyn.
And she told me that, in fact,
before she even filed to get the money,
that she was advised by the
(28:59):
retirement of the financial
institution that holds the
retirement account that this was okay.
Okay.
And that he had been
prosecuting these all the
time during this period.
It just gets more and more outrageous.
I can't stand it.
I just can't stand no more.
(29:20):
So that's what you can do.
But here's the problem.
Marilyn Mosby is one.
But oh my goodness,
there's a whole lot more out there.
There's a whole lot more out there.
We've heard about what's
happening in your home state of Georgia.
Oh, yes.
(29:41):
Connie Willis.
Well, in fact,
we just got a little bit
more on that case today because, you know,
the judge,
the trial judge who is actually
up for election.
How about that?
He is on the ballot.
If you happen to be in
Georgia or know someone in
(30:01):
Georgia who lives in the Fulton County,
I will be filling out my little ballot.
But he is on the ballot.
That decision...
Because I really had an
issue with him taking up this motion.
(30:22):
But that's a whole other discussion.
That's a whole different story, yes.
And he reminded me of the
attorney who released the
latest decision.
Was that her that wrote the decision?
Yeah.
where he talked about Biden
(30:43):
and the documents at Biden's house.
And he made those comments
about would be seen as a nice old man.
You know,
that's some petty stuff that
well-trained lawyers don't do.
Correct.
And so the decision that was
(31:06):
written in that case
I thought the judge took some unnecessary,
he wanted to do something.
And this is a Kemp appointee
who was appointed to that
office to fill- Kemp being
the governor of Georgia who
happens to be- Governor of Georgia.
(31:28):
And I felt like he wanted to
do something because it
really was not there.
The law was not in his favor.
The Georgia law as it
currently stands was not in his favor.
There wasn't even
administrative law because
they had gone to the Fulton
County Commission,
which gives the funding for that office.
(31:51):
And they were like, no,
we can't do anything with it.
And so but that being as it may,
he made a decision.
The defendants appeal that decision.
And we have been awaiting in
Georgia to see if the
Georgia Court of Appeals
was going to take that case up.
(32:13):
And they are.
Now, why?
Yes.
And so we just got that word, I believe,
on yesterday.
But what I will say about
the Georgia Court of
Appeals is they are elected
and a number of them are on the ballot.
And so it is important that
we understand that, you know,
(32:35):
we're in the midst of a
presidential election,
but some of the decisions
or actually most of the
decisions that will impact
your day to day life.
Yeah.
are happening at your state
and local level and those
state and local elections.
So it is important that we
pay attention to those
elections and we understand
(32:58):
who is on the ballot and
the decisions that they can
make in those positions.
And so I'm going to just say
it one more time,
the Georgia Court of Appeals
the judge overseeing the
Trump case is elected,
as is the prosecutor.
(33:19):
Well, listen, we don't have to,
not only are those folks on the ballot,
we could look at another
example of a targeted
person in the state of Florida,
a target of Governor Ron DeSantis,
Monique Worrell, right?
Yes.
(33:39):
who she had the audacity to
examine a series of
prosecutions that were
coming out of her office
and determine that there
was an inequity around
prosecutions between white
defendants and black
defendants and had the
audacity to put in equity
(34:00):
practices that would
address that disparity.
He, having no authority to do this,
sent word to her that she needed to stop.
She refused.
And he, with again, no authority,
removed her from her elected office.
(34:21):
We cannot make this stuff up.
Removed her from her elected office.
And now Monique is back on
the ballot running to be, she's up for,
well, she would have been,
she's up for reelection,
but she's not currently serving.
And let me tell you, in doing this,
(34:42):
they're trying to break you financially.
Mm hmm.
Because Monique, in this situation,
when she was removed from office,
she's no longer a she's
still because she is still in name.
The district attorney,
she cannot practice law
independent of her office
because it would be a
conflict of interest.
But she's drawing no salary.
(35:04):
So she has no income during this part.
like with Marilyn Mosby,
who has no income doing this part.
So I encourage you to also
think about the fact that
these women who are
standing up for justice,
that are doing all the thing,
are doing so at great parts
personal financial risk,
(35:25):
personal financial instability,
not just to them,
but the families that they support.
And listen,
we could go on and on because
we know they are not alone.
We could talk about Kim Scott in Chicago.
No, Kim Fox.
I said her name wrong.
Okay.
(35:46):
We could talk about Letitia
James in New York.
And you would think,
as many of these women that exist,
that we are a huge percentage.
And so as we close out,
I want to share for those
of you who are watching this on video,
I'll walk through it.
We have this graphic that
shows in proportion.
(36:07):
Where are the Black women?
So look at this.
This is literally 2021 and 2022.
Now, the biggest portion is white men,
well over 1,500 white men.
And in fact, between 2021 and 2022,
their number went up a little bit.
Mm-hmm.
(36:30):
Now,
what you can see by looking at this is
infinitesimally,
there's a little speck in
2021 of Black women.
You have to squint to see it.
It is so small on this bar chart.
I need a magnifying glass.
And it doubled.
(36:52):
And so currently we have out
of the almost 1,600
prosecutor jobs in this country,
and this is the top
prosecutor jobs in this country,
20, 20,
only 20 of them are held by Black women.
And if you need any more incentive,
if Chantel and I have not
been persuasive enough
(37:13):
about how we need to protect Black women,
I want you to know that out of those 20,
Marilyn Mosby started a
sister circle for those 20
women so that they could
support each other.
(37:33):
And so I say that in closing, just to say,
these are the kind of women
that are running for these offices,
that they are on the ballot.
And what we don't have time
to talk about today,
but we should probably make
another episode is let's
look at some of these women
on the ballot and what they
(37:53):
started to do because they
know how effective they can
be is they started taking
them out before they can
even get elected.
Yes.
And they're putting laws in
place that if they do get elected,
they can remove them easily.
Oh, my goodness.
It's so much.
Well, listen,
(38:14):
we know this is but the
beginning of the conversation.
But I hope and we're running
a little bit longer than we
normally do today.
But I hope that what your
takeaways are from this is
support black women prosecutors.
support Black women
prosecutors on the ballot,
and support them when they get in office.
It is a tough job in a
(38:36):
system that was not meant
for them to challenge the
inequities that happen.
And that's exactly what they're doing,
each and every one of them.
We especially encourage you.
I'm sorry.
Go ahead, Chantel.
I was just going to say that, you know,
when you put black women in
office and they bring an
(38:57):
equity lens to that work.
Yes.
You get an Angela also
Brooks who was state
attorney and who reduced
violence or violent crime by 50 percent.
Yes.
Because, you know,
The definition is insanity
is doing the same thing
over and over and thinking
(39:18):
you're going to get a different outcome.
We've been locking folks up
in this country for
hundreds of years and we
have not yet gotten a different outcome.
We've got folks trying a
different approach.
And in some cases,
it's a successful approach.
And we've got people who are
who don't want that, don't want that.
(39:39):
Yeah, that's right.
For various reasons.
For various reasons.
Well,
that gives us the opportunity to clap
back.
We need y'all to stand up
for Black women prosecutors.
We especially need you to
stand up for Marilyn Mosby right now,
right in this moment.
Go to change.org and sign the petition.
to support President,
(40:00):
encourage President Biden
to consider a pardon for her.
I want you to go to
justiceformosby.org is her
website and do all the
things and especially reach
out to this US attorney and
make sure that he knows that no jail time,
no probation is necessary.
She has been punished enough.
(40:23):
And then when you've done all of that,
like and subscribe to our
podcast because we will be
back next week with more
information on other ways
in which the system is
attacking black women.
Listen.
Black women,
if we don't stand up for each other,
who else can we expect to stand with us?
(40:43):
So let's make sure we are
clapping back now that
Chantel and I have given you the facts.
Until next week, we'll see you then.
So long.
Thank you for joining us here on Clap Back,
Get the Facts podcast.
We hope that you're leaving
feeling more informed and
ready to provide others with the facts.
We would love to hear your
(41:04):
biggest takeaways from this episode.
So post the show on your
Instagram story and tag us
at Sisters Lead.
Also, if you haven't already,
don't forget to subscribe
so you'll never miss an episode.
And while you're at it,
please leave a review so
others can get some sense
of the facts that we're providing.
Finally,
if you would like to learn more
about local resources and
(41:25):
other projects we're working on,
go to sistersleadsistersvote.org.
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