What If You’re Building Business the Wrong Way? The Legacy test..

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
A wife at home with a kid.

(00:03):
And we weren't making it.
Maybe I need to look in real estate. He.
He offered the opportunityto join his team.
And so it was a big riskbecause it's a commission only business.
Yeah. My wife is not working.
Right. Like,
But I just felt like that'swhat I was supposed to do.
Yeah.
My first year in real estatesold 35 houses.
I didn't realize it was thathigh. 35. Yeah.

(00:26):
And, like.
Holy cow.
You want to talk aboutjust drinking from a fire hose?
Like, if there's all these older peopleon real estate, you're like,
you've kind of built this fun, familyoriented. We.
We literally just built the business.We wanted to be a part of.
Like.
Yeah, we are not fake about any of itbecause.
And I think probably the reason it does

(00:47):
resonate with peopleis it because it's just who we are, like,
we wanted a businesswhere we could bring our families around.
Your stories,your experiences can change it all.
Let's fight failure together.
We can defeat 90.
Welcome to defeat 90 podcast number three.
And I have. Okay, this is.

(01:08):
This guy has no me.
Probably one of my oldest friends.
He's a superstar entrepreneur.
I say that like, here'swhat makes an amazing.
And why I want him on the show is that
he is one of the biggest kind of heartsI've ever met.
He does not give up on people.
He gives them so much graceand is there for them and does
just an amazing job of leading peopleand leading teams,

(01:31):
and through that,through caring about people.
He has built one of the most successful
real estate companies in Springfield,Missouri and has changed a lot of lives.
I can tell you my life has been changedbecause of him being in my life, and,
has been my friendthrough some really tough times. And
when we talk about
defeat not only being authentic, he'sone of the most authentic people I know.

(01:53):
And so I'm looking forwardto this conversation.
Talking to him.
But this is Erin Owens and, wow.
That was quitethe intro. I had to like. Why?
Like, like,you know, give honor where honors do.
And I think that.
Yeah, you know,I want the audience to understand,
like, who they're hearing from.
Yeah.
And honestly,it's an honor to have you on the show.

(02:13):
I really appreciate that.I mean, honestly, right back.
Right back at you know, we'll jumpinto kind of our history and stuff.
But I mean, when we partnered in business
years and years ago,that was like one of the first big jumps
into entrepreneurshipand starting a business.
And, you know, for me.
And so you took a chance on me too.
So it goes it goes both ways. Yeah.
I mean, but it was pretty easybecause he's also incredibly

(02:36):
talented, graphic designer,probably one of the best.
Not anymore. Man,I feel like I've lost my turn.
Oh, yeah. No, you have to be like.
You have to practice that stuff,and I've been out of it.
I just I think that's fair.Yeah. That's fair.
That's crazy.
Because I want you to savehow to get back into doing graphics.
And I'm like, oh my gracious.
Yeah, I know why I always wanted to learnto do this stuff because, yeah, I'm okay.
But you've like, worked.

(02:57):
Can I tell how we met?
Yeah. Honestly, I don't remember.
We have a mutual friend,and we went to Silver City. Yes.
And so we went to our city.
It was me.
And, you know, this friend,and they introduced us, and we spent
literally, like, four hourswalking around Silver Dollar City
talking about entrepreneurship.
We did.
I didn't like

(03:19):
and literally after that we're like,I think we should try a business together.
And we did.
We did likeit was like a couple months later.
That's right.
What's interesting, I thinkone of the things we connected about
was Keith Saki and, Rich dad, poor dad,because I feel like you're.
That's more narrativesthat's been so interesting is like,
as I talk to entrepreneurs,that's like one of the starter books.
Yeah.
Which I don't know if you've seen this,

(03:39):
but there's stuff coming out thatthat not all that story was true,
which is crazy,but like, believe that there.
We'll catch that for maybe later.But see that's the hard part is like
do you.
It's hard to take people seriouslybecause so much is made up and so much
is embellished and like, it's like,never meet your heroes or never meet your,
you know, idols or whatever,because they'll let you down.
But yeah, that book is still powerful,is still one of my favorite episodes.

(04:01):
Like I recommend it to everyone.
Well,I think there is power in the idea, right?
Oh, sure.
One of the things I've learnedas I've gone through
life is to, you know,you always hear to take,
you know, don't throw the baby outwith the bathwater.
Grab the nuggets,grab the things from what you're learning
and andand apply it where needs to be applied.
But I think one of the biggest thingswe don't do

(04:22):
when it comes to education,and I really mean this
when I say this, guys,when it comes to entrepreneur education,
is you have to challenge itand you have to test it
because so much of the timewe just hear these gurus
and this is how I do it,and we just take it
like hook, line and sinkerand just like, yeah,
so that mean there's things in that bookI like to think are amazing.
But one of the things that I've kindof changed my perspective,
and that is I do believepassive income is kind of a farce,

(04:45):
because I don't think there's any way
of not being engaged,not granted that you,
because you're always going to have tomanage. There's always gonna be things.
Yeah.
And more so than anything else for me, I'msorry to jumping into like, a detox,
but like,
I think we're made to have purposeand do something.
Sure. Yeah.
I've never.
I mean, the idea of retiring, right?

(05:06):
Like, I don't ever want to retire.
I don't always have my hands in something.
Now, the percentage of which I am devotingtime to that will change. Yes.
And I think that's where the ideaof passive income comes in of, like,
you know, when you build somethingthat is sustaining, that is,
you know, obviouslyI'm in the real estate world.
So I think of, you know, buying propertiesand having that, that income,

(05:26):
it still takes work, but you basicallydelegate other people to handle that.
Yeah.
So that your time is more passiveand for sure it's.
Yeah, but you're never gonna get awayfrom dealing people.
That's true.
I mean, like, that's
the thing is like my brother has,you know, so much property, right?
And like, I just hear the storiesand you're just like, yeah, yeah.
Like when the.

(05:47):
Because the property managementlike there, I mean, let's
you get it like an entrepreneur runproperty management company.
They're like,what are you do with this issues.
Yeah that's true.
I have my friends,I have so many Airbnbs are like, don't
get calls in the middle night about justdumb thing is just like, figure it out.
What? Like right.
Why are you calling me? Right. Yeah.
Like like. Oh, absolutely.
But ultimately, I mean, there is

(06:09):
I think the balance of that is
that doesn't bother me as much becausethere's a privilege of, you know, it's
kind of an honor to have anything likethat to where you can free up your time.
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, most people don'teven have the opportunity to do that.
Yeah.
And that's what circling back to, RobertKiyosaki
book is that's trading time for dollars.

(06:32):
Yeah. Right.
Like that'swhat most people, they grow up,
they get an education, they go get a job,they clock in, they clock out.
And, you know, there's there are daysthat I wish I could do that.
Yeah.
You know, like, as most entrepreneursknow, like your brain never shuts off.
Like, I've neverI literally had this thought this morning.
I've never woken up in the morningand looked at my phone

(06:54):
and didn't have emailsor text messages from people.
Yeah.
Like it's been yearssince that's happened, right?
And that's just the life of your business,right?
Like, you know, so sometimes, you know,
me and my business partner,we joke about, like,
we wish we just could gosit on a lawnmower for eight hours a day
and just put your headphones in,and all you got to worry about is, like,

(07:15):
running over a piece of trash,you know, or something like that.
Like there is.
But long term, obviously that's not well,that's not what we want.
And I want to say thisto not to mean to people
and do that,but from a perspective of like,
like everybody'swired for their own thing.
I think that's one of the things that likesome people are very happy doing that,
and they they have success
and they take care of their familiesand they love and they love it.

(07:35):
And I'm glad, likewe need people on both sides.
And then like also, I grew up and kind ofget over my get through my background,
but like never to be satisfiedworking for someone else.
Yeah.
And that was like in our DNAas kids growing up.
And so yeah, I just would not everbe satisfied working a 9 to 5.
Yeah.

(07:56):
I mean, I've tried ita couple times in my life
and it was the mostmiserable time in my life.
And I learned a lot through the can benecessary sometimes, you know, it can.
And there's been many times, like whenfamily members, you need to get a job.
I'm like.
I don't even,
you know, it's like the part of where,
yeah,it's like you realize what you're saying
is not just get a job,you're not believing in me.
And that's that's.
But there is that timewhere it's just start working.

(08:18):
So I understand that.
But I've also got a place in my lifewhere I'm just always hustling
till I figure it out.
Oh, absolutely. It'snot everybody, you know. Right.
And I've had experienceslike my younger brother went and,
you know, had two kids at homeand a wife and his business
that he was running wasn't going as well.
And so he went and worked at Starbucks.
Yeah. From 5 a.m. till, you know, 1 p.m.

(08:38):
just so they could have insuranceand money.
Yeah.
You know,and then he went build a side hustle
the rest of the time,you know, in that interim.
So I respect that.
You know there's definitely chaptersand seasons for everything.
I think it's a good segue.
Let's let's transition into your story.
Right. Okay.
So for you,
one of the things that was,

(09:01):
I think amazing about your storyis a sad part of your story,
but that really, I think, shapedyour character from everything I've seen.
Yeah. And that's your dad.
Yeah.
And, like,just tell me about the legacy of your dad.
Yeah.
So a little background on me.
I've got five brothers and sisters.
Big family. Grew up here in the Ozarks.
Grew up on a 300 acre farm north of town.

(09:23):
So, you know, I say that because, I thinkthat is also in the core of who I am.
Just working on a farm,
you get to see these principlesthat we carry on in business,
of things like seed time and harvestand putting in hard work and, you know,
so I saw that, from,from that standpoint.

(09:45):
But then my dad was also a businessowner and entrepreneur,
owned multiple businesses.
He's got a crazy story, which, you know,we won't get into all of that, but,
the short version of itis he came from a family that
did not have very much money.
A guy from
his high school kind of took aan interest in him,
taught him principles from Dale Carnegie,which was a huge part of who he is.

(10:08):
And it changed his whole trajectoryin life.
He went from a familythat did not have a lot of money
to starting businesses and,you know, having multiple businesses and,
so all that being said, you know,
for me, I grew up around entrepreneurship,
grew up around thethe business owner mentality.
And that has really led to what

(10:30):
I talked about, like never being satisfiedworking for someone else.
Like, we've we've all donethat. We've had to work jobs.
But, actually, you know,what's crazy is today
the day we're recording,this is my dad's birthday.
Oh, wow. Pretty crazy.
So, you know, my dad passed away in 2007.
I was 19 years old and really just didnot have a lot of direction.

(10:50):
What I wanted to do, long term, you know,
I was going to OTC just checking that box.
I was working at the familyprinting company
because that's where that was the industrythat we were a part of.
And so for me,I was just at a time in my life
where I did not have a lot of clarityor answers.
Dad passed away.

(11:11):
And I remember just praying like, God,just show me what I'm going to do
for the rest of my lifeand who I'm going to do it with.
Like, those were my, you know,
my biggest worries or, you know, prayers.
And so, what's crazy is that next year, actually later that year,
I started dating my now wife for 16 years,which is cool.

(11:32):
And I got introduced to entrepreneurship,really like
my parentsobviously had, had showed me that.
But, you know, jumped into an MLM,which I don't.
We can talk about that in full, but.
Yeah.
You know,but then that one thing led to another
and you just learn the principlesof business ownership.
And then we started a business, you know,it was at 2012 or something like that.

(11:57):
Yeah, it's 2012, 2013 somewhere in there.
So, you know,
and then that led to another businessand then, you know, here we are today,
I think you're you're probably up therewith me too.
I mean, I'm a I'm a this is my 17th.
I think you're at leastoh gosh. Ten right.
Yeah.
I've never I've not really sat outin Canada but lots of failed businesses.
Yeah.
The the running joke for a whilewas just coming home to Tracy, my wife,

(12:18):
and saying, hey, I got a business idea,you know, and she just like roller.
I was like, okay, well, here we go again.
So it's it's I think it's crazybecause, like,
we come from two different storieswhen it comes to that,
because my dad was an entrepreneur,but like really should have been
just a technician.He should have just worked for someone.
And I suffer the consequencesof not having a dad

(12:40):
that understood what he was doing. Okay.
And that's played out in both of all mymy family's life because of that.
And for you to have that legacy.
Yeah. Like it's just crazy.
I'm going to ask this question.
This is do youis moments as you're doing business
still that like lessonshe taught you just pop in your head.
Oh yeah. Constantly.Yeah, constantly. And it's honestly

(13:03):
things that,
you know, when I was a kidmaybe obviously, you know,
didn't pick up on but I, I will do itand then realize it has some of my dad.
Did you know likethis is the way he would have done this or
like just different thingslike his his mindset
towards helping people, like youkind of mentioned that in the intro.
Like that's a huge part of who I am.

(13:25):
Yeah, always.
I am a very, I trust people maybemore than I should, but I always give
people the benefit of a doubt,
and trust that they're going to do good.
And until you give me a reasonnot to, I guess. Yeah.
We're just taking care of peoplegoing out on a limb to serve people.
You know, that's a big part of my faith.

(13:46):
And I believe that'swhat my dad showed me.
And then always learning, you know,
it doesn't matter where you came fromor your background.
Like,you're always learning from other people.
Everyone's a teacher to you in some way.
Every everybody,which I just want to say this has
this is just a note in theI really appreciate that
because there's been this epidemicand I say epidemic

(14:06):
because I really think it's somethingthat's wrong.
And I've been hearing more and more.
I've seen on Facebook and LinkedIn peoplesaying, well, don't trust any means.
Education from anybodyhas a less of a bank account than you.
And I'm like, I'm like, I'll never forget,you know,
there's a story about Donald Trumpwhere he was walking with a date
and basically he was sayinghow the guy in the street actually

(14:29):
is in better financial positionwhen where he's at
because he was like $100 billion in debt.
Oh, gosh, he's like,this man is actually more rich than I am.
And they didn't even understand. Yeah.
And the thing is, is like,
I think there is something powerfulabout learning from everyone
and being teachable,winning this position of like, well,
you can't talk to mebecause you're not a millionaire.
Well, okay. Well, yeah.

(14:50):
Like because I think the thing that'sinteresting about that is like, yes,
maybe they can't speak to a money issue,but they can speak to a character issue.
Sure.
Because like there's anyways.
Yeah. No,you're you're absolutely right. Yeah.
If you have that mindset going into it,
that you will be successful

(15:11):
because you will always be ableto learn something from somebody. Yeah.
And going into a situation feeling like,you know, everything.
And that's the worst thing you can do100%.
It's the worst thing you dofor your business.
And, you know, honestly, I think that'sa big reason why businesses fail is
because they do jump into it thinking,
I have to only interview the people
who are more successful than me or yeah,you know, I know everything.

(15:35):
And that's such so detrimentalto your business.
Well, I, I, I've been, haven'tbeen kicking this idea around like,
if you could interview a really crazysuccessful business or a business owner
or someone just had a
mom and pop shop for 20 years, that's defeated the failure rate twice.
You know.
Right.
Because I feel like in some ways

(15:57):
that's to keep a businesssolid and a community for that long.
That's crazy. Well, yeah.
I mean, if you've watched Shark Tank,you know, most of the businesses
they invest inare the ones from the people
who have tried and failedand tried and failed and tried and failed.
And now they have something
that's potential, because they all saythat like, you have built that muscle.
Yeah. That failure muscle. Yeah.

(16:18):
And if everythinghas just been handed to you
or you've just been successfulin the first try,
you're not going to appreciate it.
You're not going to be ready for itwhen it happens to you.
Like there's yeah, there's a lot to that.
So going back to your dad was justhonoring him on his birthday, right?
Yeah, yeah.
What's the best or biggestor most memorable piece of advice
he gave you that you could passon? Said, yeah.

(16:39):
Our audience,
you know,I don't know if it's necessarily advice.
I mean, it is advice, but, you know, wehe was very big on understanding,
prioritizing the,
prioritize prioritizing his faith
and then his family and then his business.

(17:00):
Okay.
And, you know,a lot of people say that kind of stuff,
but I feel like he actually did livethat, like,
you know,nothing was more important than his faith.
Yeah.
And that was shown to us,you know, we prioritized
church and, and, you know, prayer andand reading the scripture

(17:22):
and things like that,like more than some other things.
Yeah. And then next was his family.
Nothing prioritized over thatother than his faith.
You know, whether that be family timeor spending money on things
that we're helping our familyand and then third was the business.
Yeah. Right.
And so I think entrepreneurs kind of getthose things mixed up sometimes,

(17:45):
you know, and sure,there are seasons of life
where your business is takinga lot of time and,
you know, maybe away from your family andmaybe that's necessary for that season.
But long term, having those things lined,that was good advice.
I feel like I've applied that. Well,I think it's interesting.
The only way you can say that's goodadvice is if he lived it.
Sure. Yeah.

(18:05):
And clearly he did, because you'rethe fruit of that, you know.
Yeah, absolutely.
That's pretty amazing.
All right,so let's jump into, the topic that
I think is just such an interestingthing of the MLM situation.
Okay?
It's a situation like, oh, yeah, well,you were with me during that.
I mean, because,you know, a big part of that,
I mean, the amount of conversationsI have, like, Aaron, are you sure?

(18:28):
Are you sure about this? Yeah.
When I look back at it now, understandingwhat it gave you, I wouldn't
like if I like it was the best thingthat could happen to you, in my opinion.
Oh, yeah.
100% like and I,we still talk about that to this day.
You know, I so got started, my,actually my business partner, best friend.

(18:49):
Now he was working at Zillow's, I believe.
Oh, my gosh, he was a server Zillow's.
And he got contacted, which is what you do, you get in the MLM,
you get contacted, to join Amway.
Did you get to get interviewed?
Kind of like it was just.
Hey, are you looking for other ways?
Making money was kind of the the tagline.

(19:10):
And, you know, of course, Adam's like,yeah, I'm working at Zillow's, like,
I've got a kid at home and,you know, like his situation and,
and so, so, yeah, he got contactedand then he told me about it,
and I was like, already,
you know, excitedabout being an entrepreneur.
And actually, my parentswere a part of Amway back in the 80s.

(19:33):
So like, had good a good experiencewith Amway, like back then.
Obviously the 80s was different.
It was catalogs and,you know, things like that.
So yeah, we jumpedin, you know, at that point,
me and Tracy had only been datingfor a few months, but she trusted me.
And we built Amway from 2008 to, 2015.

(19:56):
So, you know, seven years probably.
Oh, like,I didn't realize it was that long.
So. Yeah, I mean, obviously, like mostbusinesses, there's pros and cons to both.
Yeah.
Like I will I will lean in to the pros
because I feel like it is most
MLMs teach you qualitiesthat you need to run a business.

(20:16):
Yeah. And that is leadership.
Being a self-starter, you know,having a community that you lean on,
you know, there's there'sa lot of good things going to conferences
and stuff that really buildyou up as a business owner.
And there's a lot of pros to it.
Well, I think one of the things that,

(20:37):
you know, in entrepreneurship is it's
I feel like wayunderrated is the ability to sell.
Sure.
And I think that's something
that you learned how to sell it ina more relational, problem based solving
side of things versus like, you know,there are those emotions, by the way.
But like, sure, youI feel like you didn't long enough
to see the differencebetween your selling methods.

(20:59):
Yeah. You know. Yeah, yeah.
No, I agree yeah.
There's definitely an element of selling
that you learn from those businessesand not being afraid to talk to anybody.
You know, like when we say contactand you just talk to random people
and ask them if they want tojoin your team, you know, so like,
you do have to, like, just get overthat fear of what people are going to say.
I remember you telling youjust that you do this like once, twice

(21:22):
a week, just camp out at a coffee shopand just wouldn't leave for like
4 or 5 hours. Yeah.
Oh yeah. Yeah, you do that.
You go to,
you know, random storesand just walk up to people and ask them
if they're looking for other waysof making money.
I mean, just like looking back on it,it's probably not the best way.
But you did.
I mean, you just you had to do it,and you just learned how to do it.

(21:43):
So what's the most interesting wayyou approach someone?
Oh, gosh.
Or most interesting story,
I don't know.
I don't know if I have,
I mean, like, there are quite a few times
that I would just go up to a random person
in, like Marshalls or TJ Maxx.
They're shopping, shopping as itand give them a compliment

(22:07):
like, hey, I like the hat or shirtor shoes or something.
And then try to try to like,
I don't know, not make it awkwardto transition to business like I don't.
I mean, I don't know, we contacted yeah,we contacted all kinds of people.
So yeah.
So yeah pros definitely cons.

(22:27):
You know like any businessI think for, for us
we just reached a point where,you know, in 2015 we had a kid.
And I think that changed the model. Yeah.
Of like being uptill super late hours and traveling
to, you know, do meetingswith people on a whim.
You know,that was a lot of fun in our early 20s.
Yeah, yeah.
Because we didn'treally have any responsibilities.

(22:49):
And it wasI mean, we had responsibilities, but like,
it was just different.
And then like, once you have kids, like,
it just becomes tougherto prioritize that.
And then also the pathof getting to passive income or,
you know,making substantial money is just,
excuse me, it's very difficult.
Yeah. You know, it'sjust it's a difficult path.
And it just became, you know,there were some things within leadership

(23:13):
that we weren'treally agreeing with at the time.
And then we had a, a baby on the way.
And I think it was just kind of like,you know what?
This is just it's not not the pathwe want to go.
We've learned a lot.
We're thankful for the education.
Yeah, but we're ready to gotry something else. So.
What were you with?
What would you sayto someone else right now

(23:36):
thinking about joining MLM?
Because they're like,I don't want to start a business.
They don't want to do like what we've donebecause it's it's scary.
It's risky.
Do you think it's a good way to start likeyou think it's worth trying to kind of
get your feet up to see if you're, it'sworth being entrepreneur or not.
I mean obviously depends on the MLMand it depends what you're selling.
Is this right.
Is it true. Yeah.
Like you know definitely that those things

(23:57):
talk to lots of people,you know, get their opinion on it.
If you've never if you have no experiencein the business world.
Sure.
I don't think it's a bad place to startbecause it's going to force you
to get out of your comfort zoneand go talk to people and help them.
And, you know,so there are definitely pros to it
for someone who'smaybe tried a couple other businesses

(24:19):
and maybe this seems like low hangingfruit to like, get started in, maybe not.
Yeah.
You know, I will argue for real estateall day, you know, for.
Because that's the industryI'm in now. Yeah.
You know, for example, like,
the biggest thing, like,there were certain levels
where you make good money and, like, you know, one of the big levels is you,

(24:40):
the one person we were in business
with made $20,000 in one month,which is a lot of money.
I mean, don't get me wrong,it's a lot of money.
But it took them yearsand years to do that.
Yeah.
And then they once they did it, itI don't know how if they did it again,
you know, and so like in real estate,I feel like there's a lot of opportunity
for that. And anyway. Yeah.
No the value prop, it's a tough one

(25:03):
for the amount of time in versuswhat you get back out for sure.
I think the one thing that I saw too,from an outside perspective,
you were given a lot of booksto be able to learn,
like have not that type of just MLM,but just business books,
business books and your business educationjust went like sky high.
Absolutely.
Which I think is interesting
because as you get deeperin entrepreneurship

(25:23):
and if you are really wiredto be an entrepreneur,
I think that's part of the entire likeand this is just doesn't make sense.
So you know yeah I think that's kindof an interesting dynamic
of how it kind of taught yourselfout of absolutely anything you know.
Yeah, absolutely.
And honestly it resonated with me
personallybecause of my parents background.
Yeah.
And my parents got in Amwayin the 80s and read

(25:45):
and read those books and listen to tapes.
You know, and they had us read those bookstoo, like, even as, you know,
one of the very first books, like,I'd say, business book, that we were,
that my dad had usread was The Richest Man in Babylon.
Oh, yeah, I've heard that.I have not actually read that.
Yeah, it's just a great book on.
It's a kind of story form,but how to invest back into yourself

(26:08):
and how to save moneyand invest into a business.
And so it's I still recommend that book.
It's a short read.
Yeah.
Is it the one to you and also recommendsnot having any debt.
Correct.
I, I can't rememberif it talks about that or not.
Okay. Yeah.
I mean, so that was a that was a big one.
Anything that Dale Carnegie, you know,we read How to Win Friends and Influence
People once again, it's just a business.

(26:29):
It's a personal relation book.
Like, you know, no matter what you do,you're in a relationship business.
What you do, what I do,what 99% of our, you know,
the people who are going to be watchingthis, they're in a relationship business.
Yeah. Right.
So yeah, you may sell a different productor a service, but
you have to be able to relate to people.
You have to have good people skills.

(26:49):
You know, I would rather somebody spendmost of their time learning that stuff
than anything else.
One more side thought,
and then I'm going to jump to a,kind of continuous family side of things.
So I think there's some valuetalking through that.
For you guys watching,
if you don't knowif you're made to be an entrepreneur,
I feel like there's, there'sif you're questioning

(27:11):
or trying to figure outthis life is for you.
And you see, you know, all the stories,you're like, oh, I can do that.
It might be a place to start because it'sthere's low startup costs and so on.
So I'm not advocating for it.
If I was, I'd sayfind some other business,
but it might be a surea place to see if you even like it or not,
because there is a lot of tough thingsto do, because if you can't get out there

(27:33):
and sell and talk to people,you probably the other part too is
one of the thingsyou're trying to solve through defeat.
90 is the lack of communitywithin the business world, right?
Yeah, 100% like a lot of business ownerstry to do this themselves.
And they are they feel likethey're on an island by themselves.
And like, that's a huge issuewith the business world.
100% MLMs. Answer that.

(27:55):
Yeah, in a very good way.
And so if nothing else,like all the business owners
that are there or runningtheir businesses, help each other, right?
Yeah. You're smilingbecause you say business owners.
No, no, I am my head.
I'm smiling because I'm thinking like I'mgoing to start the defeat in 99.
Oh there. You know, that's perfect.That's perfect.
Yeah.
Just sign here and get three of yourfriends for a little low price, right?

(28:17):
No, but there is likethe community aspect of it is awesome
because everyone is encouraging oneanother.
You're all reading the same books,you're all doing the same thing.
So I will say that is a huge partthat they've done well at,
because you have that accountabilitythat a lot of other businesses don't.
Well, and that shared goal of goingafter the same thing.
Yes, there's there's power inthat trying to encourage you because

(28:41):
like when
you were starting real estateand you're banging on the doors
and putting door hangersand con closed, ended listings
and all this other stuff, there's a pointyou're going like, why am I doing it?
Because it's such a grind to it, right?Oh, absolutely.
But to have people with yougrinding along the way.
Yeah.
And trying to, you know, where you're,you're all

(29:03):
when you all succeed, when you all worktogether, you all succeed.
It's it's it's not an officialand that's that's right.
You don't get that like half time.
I feel like in the entrepreneur worldyou're concerned.
Well, I still my secret.
Like, maybe you'll give some tips for realestate that will help you competitive.
Like, I mean, you don't care.
No, but a but it's mentality, man.
Yeah, exactly. But
there are people that genuinely are likeoh, I'm not sharing what I've learned.

(29:25):
Like, why would I help youeven if it's not even the same industry?
And I think that's somethingthat has I feel like that's, that's
like a village you're putting yourself.
Because I mean it's so funny.
We all say you know,you know some of your top five friends,
you don't have many friendshave multiple dining friends.
Sure.

(29:45):
And if they do have friendsit's not people that are in this thing.
Here's the caveat. It's not friends.
It's you are the average of the topfive people you spend time with.
Oh yeah.
So it's not necessarily friends, becauseif you don't have friends like whatever.
But even more than that, we used to sayyour income is the average of that
five people. Yes. What the most. Right.

(30:08):
So not just who you'll become,but also your income.
So how's the quickest way for youto change your income?
Hang aroundpeople who have a higher income, I guess.
I guess, yes, 100%.And I know that's what it's.
But my brain has always translated intoI just wanna be friends with everybody.
Yeah. Which is good.
That's I mean, I'm sorry my
how much I like,like I will say I have tons of friends

(30:30):
because I just believe in people,you know.
Absolutely.
And but in that same token, I've also
had I've in recent yearsI've been like going, yeah,
I need to be careful about thatbecause I've seen the influences.
Sure.
So all right. Moving into like the family.
So like mom was one of the thingsthat's interesting about your family

(30:50):
I think like isn't most of your siblings,if not all the one is an honorary
member too as well?
Yeah, most most of us are business ownersor a part of a business of some kind.
You know, some have been moreserial entrepreneurs than other others.
You know,
we still have the family printing company,which my brother and brother in law run,
my younger brother is probably moreof an entrepreneur than me.

(31:10):
You know, just startedlots of businesses as well.
So, yeah, we,
you know, like, like I said before,that was instilled kind of in our DNA
to begin with of just, you know,we long term,
we want the flexibilityto spend time with our family.
Yeah.
You know, the only way to do thatand to create a long term future is,
I think through business ownership, to some degree.

(31:34):
And so,yeah, that was that was a big part.
All of us have tried different thingsand worked in different businesses.
And, you know, I've worked inthe corporate world for a very short time.
That was terrible compared to
I was gonna say compare thatto doing the family business.
Yeah. Oh, man.
It's just so much.
I mean, they both have pros and cons,right?
Working on familybusiness also has its issues, like,

(31:55):
you know, you definitely,
have disagreements with your familyand then you got to go to lunch
with them on Sunday.
You know, at church and like,yeah, after church or whatever.
So yeah, pros and cons, good experience.
But and then the corporate worldand you just have so much
like red tape and bureaucracy and,
you know, people just talking bad andand I was a part of that for a few months.

(32:18):
And it was such a toxic environment.
I hated every day getting up.
I would get the Sunday nightlike I would get sick to my stomach
thinking I had to go to work on Monday,like, you know, just things like that.
And granted, you know, once again,it was a chapter of my life
that was placedwhere it needed to be at that time.
You know, and I know we're skipping over QR Pro

(32:40):
because this came after that,but yeah, I was good,
you know, it waswe talked about like, hey,
I have a kid at home and a wife, like,I gotta go make some money.
And like, it was there.
I made a good salary for a shorttime, having no degree.
I got hired on a management position.
Having no degree.
I mean, I have an associatefirst degree, but,
you know, which is kind of crazy,but it was there.

(33:02):
And so anyway, it's just a chapter.
You go through, which is,I think, probably just reinforced, okay,
I am doing the right thing by doing my ownbusiness, like, oh, absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah,
I still get PTSD from sending out emailsand not having to copy 17 people on it.
Oh, God. You know, like that, that thing.Oh my gosh.
Okay, so I'm going to jump back tothe family side of things.

(33:28):
What's the, Because I feel like from.
From what? I have your family business.
Because you're still in businesswith two your brothers right now.
It's been relatively healthy.
I mean, you have youryour siblings stuff, right?
Right.
Yeah.
How have you kept it healthy?
Like, what are what were you if you weretalking to a family business right now?
That's not healthy. That's struggling.

(33:50):
What advice would you give them?
Yeah,that's a good that's a good question.
I mean, obviouslysometimes it just goes through time.
So, you know,my story is I worked in family
business,meaning my dad was my boss for a while.
And when he passed away,you know, my brother became my boss,
which also had its own,you know, own issues.

(34:13):
You know, if you have siblings, you know,that goes, mainly from my probably my,
my side.
I never showed up on time. And,you know, I didn't take it seriously.
And there was a phase in my lifewhere I slept in a lot and just,
you know, looking back on it, I'mnot going to use the buzzword depressed,
but I think there was a phase of my lifewhere I just was not happy.
I was not happy with what I was doing.

(34:33):
And I think that translated overto just poor work ethic.
But anyway, you know,I think personalities play into it.
Yeah.
You know,I think that, certain personalities
like me and certain ones of my siblings,we connect a lot better
and we can get things donebecause we're in different kind of lanes.
You know, other siblings,we have very similar personalities.

(34:54):
And so you kind of butt heads more.
I mean,you and I have similar personalities,
and I think that has been some frictionwhen we've done business.
Not in a bad way, but just like, okay,like you got to learn how to do that.
I think overcommunication is a big a key thing.
I think understanding what your specificroles are within the business
and letting that personsucceed in that part.

(35:14):
So if you've taken three business,you know, three siblings in one business,
delegate what the roles are,figure out where they're going to be good
and successful in, and then reconveneand and talk through and and change.
And you know I've had gosh,I think one of the first businesses
other than the print shopthat I did with my brothers was like a
t shirt subscription company.Yeah, I remember that one. Yeah.

(35:36):
Which that one went well.
But then once again, all of uswere kind of in different phases of life.
And, you know, that one failed.
We did a fundraising business.That one didn't go over well.
I went to actually was a really coolmodel.
Yeah, I still think that one could surein the right place,
maybe where the owner will raise itfrom the dead at some point.
And now we're in the pickleball space, so.
Yeah, pickleball. I think a lot of them.

(35:56):
Are you guys that don't know?
I play pickleball 4 to 5 times a week.
It's it's addicting. It's addicting.Yeah, yeah.
We are trying to tap into theaddictions of others. Yes.
More power to you.
That's right.
Yeah. Luckily, this isn't a.
Yeah. A betterI guess I better field a better field.
Oh, gosh. Yeah.
I, I love that

(36:17):
know your lanebecause I think that's, it's
when you have those mixed responsibilitiesand like, you get into that place.
Well, you know
conflict for us our conflict was alwaysin the creative side of thinking, right?
It was dealing dealing and opinionsand right me
now that active areas, objective areas.
And now that I understand I'm a that'sprobably what I fix a lot of our stuff

(36:39):
because I tend to state thingsas if it's fact,
and that really makes things not greatwhen it comes to relationship.
And communication.
This is true.
I've been working very, very hard on that.
Yes, and putting things in moreif than statement.
This is how I feelit might be of this this you know.
Anyways, also we were like kidstrying to build this business.
Like if you think about that,you were a kid.
I was still no, you're similar in age.

(37:01):
That is wisdom is such a part of that.Yeah.
Like the reason that drop shots is goingwell now is because
we've had years of failed businessesand trying to work together.
And like,sometimes you can't overcome that.
Sometimes you just have to go through ittogether and figure it out and then either

(37:21):
try again or understand that,hey, this is just not going to work. Now.
I will tell you,
my dad always talked about like,never be in a partnership with someone.
Yeah, he hated partnerships becauseof the risk of ruining the relationship.
Yeah,they're powerful when they when they work.
And I'm a part of several partnershipsthat work well.

(37:42):
But there's also the risk of ruining,completely ruining a relationship.
Yeah.
You know, and honestly, like,there's been times in family business
where it's been like, oh,I really don't like my siblings right now.
Like, you know,I don't like being around them
because of what happened at work.
So how do you face that?
Like, seriously, where it doesn't gothe bad

(38:04):
direction, which we wereit happens quite frequently in business.
Like. Yeah. How do you face that?
I mean, at some pointsomeone has got to be the bigger person,
you know, and say,you know, hey, this is not working.
Or maybe if you feel like you'remaybe you're the problem or maybe you
don't feel like you're the problem,but you have to you have to address it

(38:27):
like anything that you are feeling that
you just suppressand don't talk about festers.
And then it comes up in one big fightand then it's over.
But that's what happens with most familybusiness.
It's like, I've put up with this for yearsand I didn't want to say anything
because they're my brother or my sisteror whatever, or my dad or my mom
or whatever, you know,and they never address it.

(38:48):
And then all of a sudden
it comes up as one big, nasty fightthat just ruins everything.
Yeah. And so,I mean, communication is a big part of it.
You know, I feel like, explaining whereyou are coming from if there is an issue.
Also giving yourself a little bit of timeto think through it and not just,
you know, immediatelysay what's on your mind.

(39:09):
You know, sometimes for personality's,that's tough.
Like, we just want to share immediately.
Like this is an issue as opposedto be like, right, I'm going to step back.
I want to think about this.I'm going to find a solution. Yeah.
And then I'm going to say,hey, this is what's going on.
Here's how I feellike a good way that we can fix it. It.
Yeah. You know,but it's not always going to work.
I mean, that's the problem.
Like, well, and I think that being thebigger person because so much

(39:31):
in relationships,
I, I've been studying a lotabout relationships, different books
on communication, some things I'mjust trying to get better at in my life
and so much
of all this stuff comes downto expectations being unrealistic.
Yeah.
So for you to be able to,to, you know, come from it from a humility

(39:51):
and say, here's where I'm at.
Kind of puts a baseline for you guysto be able to work through and say,
yeah, I want to make this work. Yeah.
But so many peopledon't want to make things work.
They just want to be right. True.
Yeah. That just doesn't work.
No, no.
You have to say I'm sorry.
Now you getyou have to put your ego at the door.

(40:14):
Yeah.
And understand that, like if,if you are partner in a business together,
the only way that it wins is
if everyone is on the same pageand you move forward together,
you know, you think about a wheelwith a bunch of spokes,
and if those spokes are not completelywhere they need to be,

(40:34):
that wheel is not going to turn. Yeah.
And you just have toas long as everybody understand
what their spokes areand what they're in charge of and,
you know,we're all going to make mistakes.
But I think that'sthat's a big part of it.
I think the other thing for you guys to dois you have shared character values.
Because I think sometimesthere's a mismatch in that part too.

(40:55):
Oh yeah.
That where what you value,what you are, its important,
your priorities,all the stuff are misaligned.
And then how you approach that in lifegets things all wonky because.
Yeah, like to me that applies moreso in a business partnership
because I'm kind of where your dad'sat that point.
Like it's going to have to besomeone that I just

(41:17):
trust, know and know them as a personand their character place.
Yeah.
Because it's just too easywhen you get money.
Money to me has always been a tooland a magnifier. Yep.
When things get
desperate, it brings out character.
And when it gets really successful,it brings out character.

(41:37):
Oh yeah, 100%.
And so it's just something that's
making sure that
you're, you're equally alignedin your relationships with people.
I think is a key part of that. Yeah.
I mean, I would say the number one thingthat kills a partnership is,
people not investing

(41:57):
the same amount of timeor effort or energy.
Yeah.
And you have two peoplewho are supposed to be 50, 50 partners
and this person spending 60% of the work,and this person has 40% of the work.
And then all of a suddenit's like, well, I'm doing more
and I'm getting you're getting paidthe same.
And boom, that's when it blows up.
Like that'sthe number one thing that happens.
And so,

(42:17):
you know, I don't necessarily
have an answer of like the perfect wayto fix that other than just understanding
what people's lanes are and their rolesand communicating properly on that.
And when something becomes an issue,just talk about it.
Yeah.
You know, like, hey, this is an areaof our business that's starting to fail.
Obviously, this is an areathat you're in charge of, right?
Yeah. Like, how can I help you?

(42:39):
Is there something that dowe need to outsource this?
Do we need to bring someone else in?
Do I need to helptake on some of the workload?
Like, are you not happy at your job?
I don't know, like,there's just lots of lots of things.
And that's speaking from now.
You know, I've been in a real estatepartnership for several years now, and,
you know, that I feel like has workedreally well between me and Adam
because we have such

(42:59):
different personalitiesand we see things very differently.
Yeah. And that's a good thing.It's a good thing. Yeah.
Because honestly, he doesn't careabout being in front of anyone or,
you know, like he doesn't really careabout the opinions of other people.
I'm an achiever. I'm a three.
I care about everyone's opinionand what they think.
And so like there'sa nice balance between the two of us.
We're also really good at communicatingwith things that are issues or whatever.

(43:22):
But like you said, we're commonly alignedon the things that matter.
And then the rest of it's like,you know, we've said, hey,
if if there's even any hintthat this business is not going
well, we'll shut it downto preserve our friendship.
And we we honestly believethat, like, you know so well
and it's so crazy because

(43:45):
it goes back to the prioritiesyour dad taught you.
Because so many people in partnershipsvalue money and success over the person.
Right?
And I don't know if you haveif you're in business
with a really good friend, like,like you have to prioritize that.
You can't.
And it seems so common sensebecause I'm such a loyal person.
That's a huge part of my personality.
Sure. And

(44:08):
but this, again,
it's I, it's clarifying those things.Yeah.
But I think one of the things too, thatI think it's a really, really important
when it talks about the expectations,talking about a second ago
is that we we need to clearly definethose expectations,
not just what you want,but what is something to look like.
I can't even tell you.

(44:28):
Like, I've had those partnershipswhere the person doesn't do the work,
but they thought they were working hard,
based on where they were,where they were at.
Yeah.
And that's like that.
That kind of person is going to bevery tough to be partnered with. Yeah.
If they don't understandwhat work. But. Right.
But when you, when you,but when you talk because
I mean I was raised I've been workingsince I was like six years old.

(44:49):
Like I grew up standing like.
And I mean, I've been doing stuff likesweeping floors and, and I know you do.
And to be in partnershipwith someone doesn't
understand work ethicand they just don't get it right.
It's just so tough.
Yeah, but it's having those conversations,working, walking through.
I think that's why they're there alwaysneeds to be some sort of an interim period

(45:10):
before you partner with somebody or yousee their track record or you see like,
because even friends like,I was actually just
I sat down with a friendand kind of talked
through their experience in business,and they just talked about
they had a successful businessand they were partnering with someone 5050
who was a friendthat they thought was going to go well.
And it really didn't go well.
And anyway, they got kind of screwed overand like all the similar stuff.

(45:30):
And now the friendshipsare completely dead.
Yeah.
You know, because money come in,came into play, work ethic came into play.
Those things were not communicatedahead of time.
You know.
And I feel like that's a storyprobably a lot of people.
But yeah.
Yeah.
So speaking of said partnerships, yes.
You and I failed partnerships.
No, no I just kidding.

(45:50):
I, I,I've learned in life to redefine failure.
Did we financially fail 100%.
Did we did we learn a lot in itpropel our entrepreneur?
I don't think we would be the peopleyou are today without QR Pro.
Sure. And one card.
So first of all,let's let's talk about the positives.

(46:11):
And and one of the things I thinkis really important about one card.
And okay, let me pause for a secondthe reason why I wanted
to talk to end about this isbecause this is another part of my story.
I think it's importantthat you guys understand
this is probably the biggest failurein my business career.
I don't know if it's the same thing.
It's probably out there for you, but,like, yeah, it's pretty close.
It's this is the biggest failure for me.

(46:33):
And monetarily.
Monetarily.Yeah. The biggest failure. Yeah.
And I think it's importantto like to hear these lessons because
this is if I'm going to talk about failureand if it's not even learning
from my story, I mean, authenticthis is important for you guys know.
So back to the prepreviously recorded message.
Yeah.
One card

(46:54):
truly was aboutten years ahead of its time.
Yeah.
And like I think we will be launchingone card this year.
I think we would crush it.
But I think the reason why
it couldn't launch this year isbecause when we like, go into patterns.
Yeah.
And too much technology advancements,I think.
Yeah.
Well I think we would go out with Patand Charles would have stopped us.

(47:15):
They would have tried to see us for like,yeah, because we were early enough
to have the patent to protect it.
Yeah. Let go.
Those that probably got bought up.
And like now a big thing is you createsome of the software as a service
and someone let you get built in therewhile you were filing this, this and this.
And I think that's what we werewe got stopped for sure.
But ultimately, here'sthe here's the kicker.
I think if we would have taken one card

(47:36):
where we were talking about taking onecard, we would we would kick LinkedIn's.
But yeah, that's where we're going.
Yeah.
And I think LinkedIn still is notwhat one card would have been.
There's not really been anythingthat has come out.
That is exactly what we aretrying to create with one card.
No. But, you know, we were under the
you know,there were too many manufacturing,

(47:58):
successful people in construction,successful people here in Springfield.
Yeah.
And they didn't understandthe one card was a digital business card.
Right.
And so, you know,
they did not understand, like not handingsomeone a physical business card.
Yeah.
And of course, nowadays, like,that's so easy to text people or use the,
you know, Apple has the thingwhere you can transfer

(48:18):
AirDrop stuff over and like, likethat was the kind of stuff we were doing
13 years agolike NFC through UFC through blackberries.
Oh my gosh. You know blackberrieshave been our age in this area.
Well you know so basically likeyou know I was working in family
in the family print shopwe met at Silver Dollar City.
He talked about this idea that they wantedhe already had a developer

(48:40):
who was on the team. Yeah.
So he's like, hey, why don't you come overand let's try this thing?
I'm like, all right, let's do it.
So join the team and then ran it for
two years, year and a half, a couple yearsor something like that.
Really trying to get peopleto understand the value
of having a digital business cardand not just a business card,
but like a community,just a community and a point of contact.

(49:02):
You know,that was the initial sell, wasn't
a business card,but there was so much more to that.
Yeah.
Like it basically was a digital businesscard, digital brochure,
your own personal website brand.
But then we had to figure out a wayto connect them to the company cards.
And ultimately it was going to be like,for lack of a better,
it was going to basically combineLinkedIn, Yelp business cards.

(49:23):
And then basically you're trainingwebsite, website, and then totally
like redefine how you would networkat like a conference.
And there's more pieces to that.
But still to this dayno one's won and no one's even done
the digital business card thatwell like the things right now
you're the pages weren't just a blank pagethat looks like junk or.
Yeah, it was the one you wearlike a with a wrist.
Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah.

(49:43):
But it basically it'sjust like like a personal website. Like.
Yeah, we had created somethingthat was an entire ecosystem.
There's a link tree before like tree toit was way before falling
tree like you're talking about like guysthere was no competitors.
We were probably the first real digitalbusiness card, like in 2012, 2013.
So but I think one of the booksthat's like always stuck in my head

(50:05):
since then that I've read, I read inlike years after it is Blue Ocean.
Oh yeah, the ocean strategy.
And we we werewhat killed us is that we were too early.
There was so much money that had to bedumped into the education system.
Yeah.
So I, I love itbecause when you create something
that's a blue ocean,
that's your big money, your biggest faras you have to educate the consumer
about why this should be somethingvaluable to share.

(50:27):
Yeah.
And but we were on the edgeof the business card revolution
because the prices of getting businesscards
just with overnight printsand some of these
just dropped and like, changedhow cheap it was to business card.
Absolutely.Yeah. So it's like, okay do I spend.
Which is funnybecause I came from a printing. Yeah.
Background to stuff is like,hey, stop printing.
You know.
Well and I just do what I do want to saythis, we were so close to, like,

(50:50):
making it with staples.I know that was the thing.
That's the thing.
So talking about business failures, right.
You know, one of the biggest,
my biggest failures and we talked aboutthat is we borrowed money from family.
Yeah.
You know, to float ituntil we got this contract.
With staples.
With staples,and which never came to fruition.

(51:12):
You know, we were so duper close. But
but but
in stopping this, they didn't want to killtheir own business cards, right?
That's why we spent so much timedeveloping it for blackberries.
Because all the representativeshad blackberries and like, you know,
so, yeah, I mean, I think, I think it wasdefinitely ahead of its time.
I think that we did not have, you know,if we were in a different location

(51:35):
in the country.
I think that also would've
made a big difference
if we would have gotten
some early adopterswho were heavy hitters to sign on to it.
Yeah.
You know, I rememberwalking up to Doug Pitt, tech conference,
and just asking like,hey, give me your phone number.
I'm going to text you a digital businesscard.
And I was like, no.
And then I was like,I really want to show you this demo.
And he gave me his phone numberand I thought that was a big deal,

(51:57):
which is not really thatbig of a deal, but yeah, I
it's it's kind of crazy to think about.
We have this technology
that like, we were pushingthe lines of mobile mobile apps.
We were pushing lines of in a seizeall the top
technologies that pointyou are so far ahead.

(52:17):
But yet there's something to be saidabout people and being stuck in their way.
They'd do something rightand not understanding that,
and not like we were just like, well,that's the most brilliant thing, right?
And but also, yeah, and at some pointyou have to get off your high horse,
you know, and realize that the businessis not the issue necessarily.

(52:37):
Yeah, but the environment and the peoplewho are purchasing maybe the issue.
Yeah.
And I think we it was hard to go downwith the ship at that point.
Yeah.
But you know, I think I was oneof the first ones to leave just because
I need to go make money somewhere.
And, you know, that kind of dissolved.
I went and workedfor the corporate company right then

(52:57):
and eventually after that,went back to family business. And.
Yeah, you know, and I think you and Joshwere trying to kind of keep it going
and yeah, just at some point had to say,hey, this isn't working.
Yeah. It kept on going for a while.
And then Josh, I'm taking it,I am leaving.
But like I think the thing to okay,so going back to the money
there's twothings we did that was really unhealthy.

(53:18):
One, we acted like we had moneywhen we didn't have money.
True. We spent it on thingswe probably shouldn't spend.
It was like crazy,
but we should have really buckled downto give ourselves more runway two,
we borrowed when we weren't bribing.
The other thing we did do itthe same I don't remember this.
We at that same time we just an arm
our business model

(53:41):
to it from lifetime and yearly to monthly.
And that killed our revenue becausewe were making decent money when it was,
you know, daily and then thinkingwe get more people right.
But there is something to be said about,
like we just change too muchall at the same time.
Yeah, absolutely.
And yeah, it was justkind of one of those wild things.

(54:03):
And also like,we didn't have enough in reserves
to start a business like that now.
And I think that's also an issue is like
you are giving yourselfand your business a very short runway.
If you do not have a lot of moneyset aside
to sustain youwhile you're building a business, right?
Yeah.
Like if you don't get a big investmentahead of time, like,

(54:23):
you see these businesses or somethingor like, you know, have money set aside
to start this business, you'reliterally giving yourself a ticking clock.
That dude,
if you don't succeedin this amount of time,
you're going to have to godo something else to make money, right?
I think that that'sone of the things that,
guys,
we are bad gamblers.
Like if you look at from a perspective andI've talked about this before, but like

(54:47):
when you say 90% of businessfail in ten years
and you look at the first year businesses,I think it's 26%.
And then it's like it just keeps ongoing up over the five years.
When you start looking at that,the odds are
that you're more in a planto fail than succeed.
But yet we take outmoney is thinking like,
well, if I just get this,I know I can make it in six months, right?

(55:08):
We don't plan for the worst.
And that's true.
Truly, like I, Stan, promiseI will never borrow another dime
unless it's like to inflatewhen I'm already doing like,
it's already on a really good pathand it's like.
Like you have purchasepurchase orders or something confirmed.
Sure. That's going like it's fuelingthe business.
It's not like trying to save yourself.
Yeah.
If you were getting debtto save your business, just stop it now.

(55:30):
Because the likely looking atthis is something I don't know if.
Guess how much debtthe average entrepreneur is in
120,188.
That's on top of their houses.
That's on top of the carsand all that stuff like that. No way.
And so when you start thinking about this,when you're on that downward
spiral, why add more towhat you have to pay back, right.

(55:53):
Yeah.
Like unless you can come upwith a solid plan, you know,
but like this whole wishful hopeful dream,
I think that's the thing.
We as entrepreneurs, we're visionaries.
Yeah, we're dreamers, but we can do this.
We got this. Yeah.
And there's this.
But you also need someone who's realisticto say, no, you don't know.
You don't. Yeah.
Or or pivot or do something or hey,hey guys
we're all going to keep this going,but we're going to all get jobs.

(56:16):
I sure like you get a side hustleor something or like.
Yeah, like for us we werewe could have done
like a marketing company.
Like we what we should havedone is kept cure pro going.
Started a marketing company. Sure.
Using all of our skills we had.
And then use that to leverage building.
Yeah. One card slowly.
Yeah. We getting this mindset.
We have to do it all at onceright. Right right.

(56:37):
And it just
I mean ultimately we shouldhave started this in Silicon Valley.
And I think I learnedwe probably got the money I'm sure.
No not owned very much like business.
And then when it's all said and donebut right
something part of something'sbetter than nothing, you know.
Yeah, absolutely.
And then know that there's nothing like itstill to
this day is just it's my brain going,yeah, okay.
So besides borrowing money from the fam,

(57:00):
what's another takeawayyou learn from the failure
of one card?
I'm not that.
We just learned so many lessonsduring that time.
I mean, we we really did, like,we learned, you know, just, you know,
I think a big thing is sometimesdone is or done is better than perfect

(57:24):
or whatever.
Oh my gosh. Yes.
And I feel like we struggle with thata little bit
because we wanted to make sureeverything was absolutely perfect.
And instead ofjust getting it out there and fixing it
as we go, like I think there was some ofthat element, we did pretty good with.
I mean, I think also a big takeawayand this is kind of maybe difference
of opinions or whatever,
but sometimes people are not meantto be partners on stuff, right?

(57:45):
Like me and you are good friends and like,we could do business together
now because we've learned we've learned.
But I think we were babies at that time.
And like, I'm going to speak to myself.
I feel like I was not, like, mature enoughto be in a partnership with you.
Yeah.
And, you know,I think that was a learning lesson for me.
I think I learned a lot from thatas far as communication and,

(58:07):
you know, just proper expectations,like you said, within the partnership.
Like, you know, I didn't we didn'tnecessarily have clearly defined roles and
and like, we didn't really talk about thatvery well.
And so you know, so
I think that was a learning lesson too,I learned about working with you
and working with different types of peopleand different personalities.
And when our other partnerwas also coming up paying them.

(58:28):
But the other two on that.
Yeah, totally different personality too.
And and I think there's definitely way toothat because like literally like we,
we were just straight fight about like we,we would like things to do,
the things that common colorsand dude, I'd be like,
I need you to move that overlike ten pixels.
I why it's fine how it is like.
And I just remember those fightsand she's like, I know.

(58:50):
Yeah.
Like forboth of us it's like there was just.
There was the humilitythat we needed to have. Yeah.
Well and also it was during a volatiletime in both of our personal lives.
Yeah. You know,and we don't get in details with that.
But I'm just saying like there was justa lot going on in our personal lives.
That business affects your personal lifeI don't care.
Like if you have.
Oh, I turn my phone off at this timeand I know you don't like

(59:11):
it affects your spouse.
It affects your kids.
Like everybody has to be on boardwith that.
Everybody has to understand
what the process isand like what you are committing to.
And I think that that bled over and,you know,
when things start getting personallike that, it changes.
It changes the way you do business. Well.
And also to at that point, I don't feellike I really understood the core less.
Know what your dad taught youabout priorities?

(59:32):
I was a dude that was working100 hours, right?
And was fine with it. Yes.
And you were like, bro, peace out.
Yeah.And like that caused conflict too, right?
Yeah. But looking back,you were the healthy one.
I was the unhealthy one.
Like we did have a conversation.
Why don't you want dude.
We can't, you know. Yeah. And so I think

(59:53):
it's it's hard for me when I look.
Okay. Just being real.
When I look back
at that time in my life.
Like, just in health and myself.
Like, there's some things that are amazingabout who God made it to be
that came out in that time.
Yeah, but there is parts about howI communicate, like I talk about now,

(01:00:14):
knowing I'm a now, knowing how a know itall dude, like I used to be the worst.
No at all of all time.
But I never guess you were. Yeah.
And it's so hard to live.
But I also used to be extremely lazy.
Like,
I feel like in some areas of my life,like that was a part too, that I was not.
I did not necessarilyhave the good work ethic that I do.

(01:00:34):
I believe that I have now and yeah,
you know, there were just areas
like we both had, you know,that we were trying to figure out,
you know, allwhile having the extreme pressure
of making no moneyand no, that's the hard part.
And knowingthat we were going to run out of funds.
That's right.
We had to pay it backand we have to pay it back
to a family member,to a family member. Right.
Which was just like,yeah, like, well, how dumb I like,

(01:00:56):
but it's paid back, you know,it is paid back, but it's good.
But the thing is, is like
when you really like, it's so like, I know
that unless you went throughwe went through those things,
we would never found that outabout our character.
I mean, I feel like at 40,I just wish I could talk to myself.
There's some things which fix things,
because I feel like the amount of stuffI've gone through to be able to be

(01:01:19):
in healthy friendships and oh my gosh,I would have crushed it.
Like, yeah, but hindsight's 2020.
That's right.
But I think it's going to point out thatbecause I do think that
I think there's there's kind of a trend.
It's going through.
All the things we're talking about
when it comes to businessis relationships. Yeah.
And that is one of the top 20 killerswhen it comes to like business,
you know, is is partnerships.

(01:01:40):
And people don't have to work together.
So really think aboutwho you're working with.
But also thinkingI think also applies to your team, right?
You hire staff. Yeah.
Like because sometimes like contractors,like any part of it,
you have to have the right peoplethat you can work with
and have conversations with because

(01:02:00):
like,
it's so easy to cause,
more harm than good when it comes toeven if you have a talented person
like I've seen, I've workedwith some of the most talented people,
but they're just complete.
I want to say narcissist,that's too strong a word.
But you're just like,
okay, well, yeah, you're good,but we still have to work with you, right?

(01:02:20):
Like for sure. Come on. Like,what are you doing?
Once again,that goes back to the business owner
who feels like they know everything.
Yeah, you know, you've got to.
You've got to be humblebecause you have to have that.
And there's a prime minister. Next one.
Apologize. Yeah.
Because we're just so muchdefinitely through.
But I yeah, I do think that and genuinelyif there was anything I did apologize

(01:02:41):
for back that I don't know how I do now,but like it's part of learning.
I mean like like we said,this is part of our journey.
This is part of starting a business.
This is, you know,like how many other 20 somethings
I know I was younger than you, but like,had the opportunity to start a business
and actually had peoplelike we had income coming
in, which means it was successful.

(01:03:01):
We also got someone to believe in usenough
to give us money to invest in good, bador otherwise.
Yeah.
You know, like there were there were a lot of wins
for like a ragtag group of guysin a junky little place in Nixa,
you know, that was like tryingto make this thing work and like, doing
funny videos and trying to figure outthe whole social media thing.
Like there's a lot once again,done is better than perfect.

(01:03:22):
I feel like with some of that stuff
and the quickeryou can go through learning those failures
and because you're going to fail,yeah, the quicker you can get at it.
Like looking back, I'm so glad I did that.
Yeah.
Like the only thing I probably regret is
that I didn't get in real estatein my early 20s, only because of just
the timing of like, oh yeah, wouldyou know what you could have done now?
You know?
But other than that, like,I jumped into a business.

(01:03:45):
We we had fun along the way.
We laughed a lotlike we had wins along the way.
Like there's a lot that can be said.
Some crazy memories of like,I mean, do you remember this?
You remember the timewhen we, like three in the morning?
We were like,we've been working all night,
and we're like, let's just gohang out in the middle of the street.
Totally. I still have that picturethat pops up on my memories.

(01:04:05):
Facebook. Yeah. And we're just chilling in the middle.
Yeah, we worked all nightlong to try to get the new website up.
Yeah.
And like, yeah, we brought my wife into do some of the copywriting.
Yeah, that I forgot about.
We had the Olympics like up on the screen.
Yes, I do like the projector. Yeah.
Oh my gosh.And there's some of the videos we watched.
But now like they're just don't
don't searchdon't don't search YouTube for anything.

(01:04:27):
Yeah.
It's not a it's a it's a it's so funny.
Yeah.
And we really did come close.
If we would have got that deal.
Yeah.
Like we wouldn't bewe wouldn't be sitting here today.
It would have beenbecause I do think it was.
If it were they would to help usget to the right markets.
And then we had social proof and we had.
And then we could saystaples is one of our clients,
and then everybody elsewould be okay with it. Yeah, yeah.

(01:04:49):
So but it is in hindsight.
And that's right. Here'sthe other thing. Two more things.
Okay. This is going to sound crazy,
but there's part of me that I'm
glad because I don't know if our characterkind of supported us being successful.
I mean, that's true. Yeah.
Yeah.
Who knows?
Yeah, I know okay.
That works things out for a reason.
So let's let's moveinto the real estate side of things,

(01:05:11):
which I think is interestingbecause you say
that you were starting in 20s,
but it's just kind of wildthat how you guys just ended up
in that space, like, because it was, what,like four years after three years?
Four years after.
Yeah.
So I left your pro to workfor a corporate company,
then went worked family businesswhen that one didn't work out.

(01:05:33):
And I was I worked there for two years.
And me and Adam, we were on a float trip
in 2016 floating down the 11 pointriver, which, if you ever floated
like you just rethink your whole lifebecause there's nothing else to do, right?
It's amazing. It's incrediblethe way you said that.
I love floating and it's the best.

(01:05:54):
So we're floating in the canoeand like, I'm.
Adam had been in real estatesince 2012, actually,
and I was just talking to him about workand how things are going.
And at that point,I was back at the family business.
I was back at doing,you know, t shirt graphic design and like,
capped out, right?
Like, I mean, I'monly going to make so much money.
I'm a salaried employeeat a family company and,

(01:06:16):
you know, like, obviously it was greatto have that chapter in my life that
I could go earn an income for my family,but had a wife at home with a kid.
And we weren't making it, like,
yeah, we were, we hadI had a $40,000 a year salary.
Yeah.
And we weren't like, between houseand car and insurance and baby
and all this stuff.

(01:06:36):
Like, we did not have enough moneyevery single month to pay the bills.
And so at some point I'm like,all right, here I am,
you know, licking my wounds of, like,I've gone through all this stuff
and I'm no further along than I've had,you know, like, so.
Anyway, I'm sitting here talking.
Adam, he's talking about real estate.And I'm like, you know what?
Like, God's kind of nudging me, like,maybe I need to look in real estate.

(01:06:58):
He he offered the opportunityto join his team.
And so it was a big riskbecause it's a commission only business.
You know, my wife is not working.
Right.
Like, but I just felt likethat's what I supposed to do. So.
Got my real estate license.
Went into real estate in March of 2017.
Full time. Yeah.

(01:07:19):
And it was, like, perfect timing.
Like God timed it right.
I had had all these experiencesup to that point
that helped me get ready for real estatethat I didn't even know about.
And Ijust went in and hit the ground running.
And my first year in real estatesold 35 houses.

(01:07:39):
I didn't realize it was that high. 35.
Yeah.
And like, holy cow, you want to talk aboutjust drinking from a firehose?
Like, here's a I will jump back.
So I mentioned before, the running joke is
I'd come home to Tracy and be like, hey,I got this business idea.
Yeah.
You know, I will tell you, she is the mostincredible, most supportive person ever.

(01:07:59):
I mean, she's been with me on every singlestep of the way and every day.
Nothing less than that.
Yes. I mean, so, so blessed.
And so here we go.
I go back to her in 2016.
I'm like, I just got back in slow trip.
I think I need to go on real estate.
She's like, okay.
And like it's commission onlyand she's like, oh gosh, okay.
Like here we go.
We actually like decided to let's see.

(01:08:23):
Do we move
now? We had just moved in.
We had just moved into new Housea little bit before that.
We didn't have any money.
So we actually lived with my mom.
We rented out our houseand went live with my mom
because we couldn'tmake enough money to pay her.
I mean, like, no money.
So anyway, when I told her, she said,all right, we committed to three years

(01:08:47):
of building real estate as hardand as fast as I possibly could.
And that meant nights.
Weekends, like, whateverwas going to happen, I was going to like,
I was going to give it everything I could,because at that point I'm like, I am.
I gotta make this work. Yeah.
So kind of a burn the shipskind of moment.
Yeah, 100%.
I had to. And so, Yeah.

(01:09:09):
So then, yeah.
First year in real estate sold 35 houses.
Of course. Me, I was on Adam's team.
He was the team leader,and we were building it together.
Next year, sold 50 houses, you know,and just kept things rolling from there.
Well,then we had another partner on our team,
and we were at a largerinternational brokerage,

(01:09:30):
and that person decided to leaveand go to a different brokerage.
And so it was just me and Adam,and we had a couple team members,
and this was at the end of 2018.
And we're like, you know,what would it look like
if we started our own brokerage?
You know, obviously coming backto the entrepreneur at heart, right.
Like, yeah, there were things going onat the brokerage.
We were part of thatwe did not like in leadership.

(01:09:53):
Just a lot of stuffthat we just were not a big fan of.
We also felt likewe were just kind of a number there.
Yeah.
So we we weren't even officeING out of the main office.
We had our own office space.Nobody ever called.
Nobody ever checked on us like nothing.Okay.
Just just giving them the money.
That's right, that's right. Yeah.
And then
also, we felt like there was a gap inthe market in the real estate market where

(01:10:16):
we have 2 or 3 really large brokeragesthat had hundreds of agents,
and we've got quite a few mom and popbrokerages that had five, ten, 20 agents.
Yeah.
And there was really nobody in the middle,you know,
that was large enoughthat people knew who they were.
They saw their signs,they saw their marketing.
They knew their brand like,but small enough where

(01:10:37):
we could still have a relationshipwith every agent there.
They have our cell phone number.They we want to know what your goals are.
There is not one path to successin real estate.
Like what are your goals?
And so anyway, through a lot of likeprayer and deciding we're like, all right,
let's jump intoreal estate or starting our own brokerage.
So we worked on on the details.
In 2018,I could not get my broker's license

(01:10:57):
because I had not been in real estatefor more for two years.
So I got his. Yeah.
We decided we had a few peoplethat we went ahead and call
just to say, hey, listen,we didn't want you to see on Facebook.
These are friend.
They were friends of ours, like, hey,we're starting a brokerage.
And so we had several people like, hey,what is this like, tell us more about it.
So we had an informational meeting.

(01:11:19):
We had a you were there, I was there,you were there, I was I did a film
in there, I don't I was there,I think I was filming that maybe.
Yeah that's true.
We had 2021 people there. Yeah.
And so like we launched January of 2019,Alpha Realty,
we had quite a few agentsthat came join right away.
And then we just grew every yearsince there.

(01:11:40):
So you know, which I think is interesting.
What's crazy is.
Like it proved
out there was a need because youyou guys had talked
about just being a small boutiquelike medium boutique.
And now it's growninto like how many agents you guys have.
Now we have 150, 850 agents like thatput you for sure.
You're the middle of Springfieldat this point, right?

(01:12:02):
Yeah.
They're still I mean, once again, we'renot trying to compete with this couple.
The bigger ones that have
four or 5 or 600 agentsbecause at that point you lose culture.
Yeah. And you lose a lot.
That was the thing for you guys, right?Yeah.
You were trying to create that cultureof fans. Right.
And priorities. Yeah.
Our five yearplan was to get like 50 agents.
I remember I was like that was like ourour five year plan.

(01:12:22):
Like initially our first year was meand Adam were just going to join
obviously our own brokerage.
We're going to kind of create the systemsin the second year
and then third year,you know, and go from there.
And so, yeah, I mean, here we aresix years later
and grownway better than we can even imagine.
Honestly, like blessedtiming to get into real estate

(01:12:44):
2019 is when we launched,you know, got 2020.
I think we know what happened.
Yeah, 20.
And the real estate worldjust exploded here.
You know, a ton of peoplewere getting their license and jumping in.
But God's timing right there.
Totally, totally God's timing.
So, so yeah, it's been it's beena wonderful journey with great people.
But I think, okay,so just being an outside

(01:13:05):
party, looking at your stuff, being a part
throughout here, a little bit hereand there, you know, I've done some video
and just differentthings for you along the way.
You guys,
I can see everything that has built towhere you're at.
Yeah.
I mean, your ability to build a brand,
your ability to understand marketing,everything you've like.

(01:13:28):
You guys have built this amazingbrand in the community.
Everybody just bringing thatfrom the look, the feel.
I feel like you were really hitting that
young, hip demographic.
That was really mean.
There's all these older peoplein real estate and like, you've
kind of built this fun, familyoriented community.
We literally just built the businesswe wanted to be a part of.

(01:13:49):
Like, yeah,we are not fake about any of it because
and I think probably the reason it doesresonate with people is it because it's
just who we are.
Like, we wanted a business where we couldbring our families around to events and
not be afraid what they were going to hearand what they were going to see.
Yeah, that was not the caseat our previous brokerage. Yeah.
Every event they put on was between 4and 6 and happy hour.

(01:14:11):
Yeah.
That's family time for us.
Yeah. Right.
So it's like okay we we want to switchsome things around about the way we do
things and events and the culture and likelet's just create it the way we want.
You know, we have our core values on faithand family
first relationships over real estate,honesty and integrity.
Yeah.
Like going above and beyondlike all of those kind of things.

(01:14:32):
Because that's just who we wereand what we wanted to bring.
And the other thing I can say this
because I don't think you're allowedto say this.
I can say this, okay.
All right. Just sit, say it. But you also
weren't greedy in your splits.
And you were you were kind and generous.
And I think that'salso something like you.

(01:14:53):
You need you to grow your companyand do some right.
We're also putting a place whereyou empower people to be successful too.
Yeah. Oh, 100%.
I think that was also some that resonatedbecause like I, because I have,
you know,I have tons of friends in real estate.
Oh yes.
Like you guys are a very fairand equitable company
when it comes to that side of things.
And I think that speaks to your becausewe want that's what we would want. Want.

(01:15:13):
Yes. Right.
But it goes that still goes backto your character.
Yes. Of you and Adam from before.
And I think everything you've learned,through being around
the things that we're like, oh,wow, that's really not fun to be around.
Yeah.
Well, and, you know,
you want to know one of the other thingsthat we really pride ourselves on.
And I think I can say this, we have neverrecruited one single agent to come out.

(01:15:34):
Yeah.
That's crazy.
Which is crazy
when you think about real estatein the real estate world specifically,
there are full time people at brokeragesthat call and try to recruit
and poach agents from other brokers.That's their full time job.
Yeah, we've never done that well.
So we have 150 agents, the brokersthat serving time.
Yeah, that have literally came to us

(01:15:56):
to learn more about Alpha and sat downand resonated with who we were,
or they were referred by someone,another agent at Alpha,
which I think, again, it goes backto the character, it goes back to the
the like guys like you hear,we hear these,
we read these books about cultureand the character.
And like when you create a sustainable
I can tell you like the amount of booksI've read about this of creating

(01:16:19):
or you don't have that turnover and you,you know, build lasting things.
They've done that.
And I think that we look at that like,oh, I just, we, we need to make money.
But when you value,you prioritize relationships
over money, there's bigger fruit.
And I think that's something thatand we just

(01:16:39):
you guys did and so okay, so let's, let's,let's pull back.
This has been a greatI'm so glad that thing's been successful.
What are the the mishaps.
What are the things the biggest lessonsyou learned as far as failures
in Alpha as you were building this thing?
You know,
honestly, I'm thankful that we learneda lot in previous businesses.

(01:17:02):
Hey, hey. Yeah.
I mean, notjust you like family business and.
Yeah, you know, Adam worked in
a lot of different industriesand had a lot of experience with it, too.
So, you know, to be honest, like,
we have not had any like,major failures within Alpha.
I think the biggest thingwhich I will tap into here is
it has also been successful because

(01:17:26):
Alpha running the brokerage side
was kind of
a side hustle to our real estate business.
So me and Adam were still out.
So we still sell some houseslike we we've we've scaled back.
But you know, me and Adam, we're still outhustling, selling
100 plus homes a year, which is crazy,which is crazy.

(01:17:47):
Two of us, but,you know, top 5% of Springfield.
Yeah. So something like that.
But we were we were living off of that,and we didn't touch a single thing
from what we made from Alphafor the first like three years.
That's. And he says, yeah.
And so it that was once again learningto have like have the money to fund it.
Whenever we neededto put more money into the business,
we could because we hadn'ttouched any of that income.

(01:18:11):
So that was a big win.
I know as an answer, you know, that.
But I would say our biggest failureshave been,
you know, maybe hiring the wrong staff,you know, you know, just trying
to rush to get someone in therethat probably wasn't the best fit.
Yeah.
And so we'vewe've had that a couple times.
You know, I would say,
you know, we've, we've had some like, tax,you know, things with running a business

(01:18:35):
and not allocating those funds properlyto tax savings and things like that.
So we've been hit with big tax billsand stuff like that.
And that's just
I think any business you learn thatyou know, and some of that is unavoidable.
Yeah.
I 100% but you know, I would saywe've just, we've, we've done good
with learning and, and small things hereand there, but nothing big.

(01:18:56):
And detrimental was okay.
So let's, let's talk aboutthat like over the course of
like for you,
entrepreneurship startedwhen you were a teenager.
Yeah.
Whether you were running somethingbut you were around it.
Oh absolutely. I've seen all of it. Yeah.
And collectivelythis has been a 20 year process.
Yeah.
I sold t shirts at concerts. Yeah.

(01:19:17):
You know, I mean yeah, yeah.
But like, so there's not this overnightsuccess because that's the thing.
I mean really like when you startlooking at these stories, there's very few
truly overnight success. Oh yeah.
And you look at storiesof what they did to get there.
And I think, that's,you know, all that came together,
like you're saying,if we would have started Alpha

(01:19:38):
20 years ago,you know, whenever, like when I was a kid,
it probably would have failed,like there would have
and we would have had so many more thingsthat we were trying to learn
and figure out along the way.
And so, yeah, like you said,sometimes it is just time
and developing thingsand businesses that you learn.
And then also like I have become moreof a sponge when it comes to learning.
Yeah. I always try to prioritize that.

(01:20:00):
But like,I mean, I just devour books and audios and
podcasts and, you know, conferencesand things like that as much as I can
to try and help with that. Okay.
So the last questionto ask all of my guests,
what do you believe has led to the 90%failure
rate in business,and how would you fix it?

(01:20:23):
I think thatthere are a lot of people out there
that try a business
or try this venture, whatever it is,
and they
money is the first thingthat pushes them out of it.
And I feel like we've talked about thisa bunch through this podcast

(01:20:43):
is not having that partfigured out to give yourself the time
and the bandwidth that you need to eitherdevelop the business,
whether that be learninghow to run a side
hustlewhile you're working a full time job.
No, I think there's so many businessesout there that can be started as a side
hustle with, you know, or little moneyupfront cost, you know,

(01:21:05):
to developwhile you're while you have a W-2 job
like.
And to keepthat going. That's a great way to start.
Even in real estate,a lot of our agents start part time.
You know, they're working full time.They get their real estate license.
They do that for a whiletill they build up enough cash,
and then they're ableto go full time in that.
So I think the money aspect of itis what blows
a lot of people out of businessright away.

(01:21:26):
That's why businesses fail, right?
I mean, honestly, if a businesswas making money, they wouldn't fail.
Yeah, right.
So figuring out the funny the moneyaspect of it, it's funny too, I guess.
So whether that be a side hustle,whether that be like, hey,
I want to start a business,
but I'm going to save 25% of my paycheckfor the next two years.

(01:21:47):
Yeah, until I have that money set asideand then I'm going to jump in and do that.
And then having the buy in from the peoplewho are the closest around you, like,
oh, that's good.
You are not successful.
If you run a successful businessthat's making
millions of dollars at the sacrificeof your kids and your wife or your family
or your husband or whatever, like it'snot worth it right at that point.

(01:22:07):
And so making sure you have buy infrom the people around you, like,
hey, this is what we're going to do.And getting them involved with it.
Like, my boys lovebeing a part of the real estate stuff.
Yeah. Now,
you know, so I think those two thingsare the biggest thing I've noticed.
It's really, really good.
Yeah, I, what I love aboutthat is the first part of it, like,

(01:22:27):
again, was like how I was saying, it'sgoing to go if you can't hustle.
And make it work and figure it out.
Right.
Like while doing something else.
What makes you think you can do itwhen you have no distractions.
Right. Like for sure.
And the the family buy in I think that's
I think that's again that legacy that isjust perpetuated through this whole thing.

(01:22:48):
And then the spring I see itand it's just like, guys, I see it.
And it's just, again, when I startedthis podcast and the show out.
And that's why I want to say that because this is a is a really amazing friend.
And if I, I hope you guys can see thatand apply it to your lives, I really do.
So with that being said,I really thank you for being on the show.

(01:23:10):
It was fun.
Last parting thoughts or ideasbefore we end this thing?
No, I just, I just want to say toyou guys who are jumping in like,
Jeremy has a ton of experience.
He is truly focusing on waysto help you as a business owner.
This is not self-serving.
This has been
I think he's talked about defeat 90since before we were with Cure Pro.

(01:23:32):
I think this has been an idea forever ofhow do we help
small business owners be successfuland have a well-balanced
life of being successful, quote unquote,not just monetarily, but,
you know, relationally and,
physically and mentally, emotionally,like all of those things.
How do you do that?
You do that through a community,and you do that also through wisdom,

(01:23:56):
which is learning from other people'smistakes.
And so, Jeremy, is that
that's the whole point of this,is to bring content and bring a community
that can come togetherand let's defeat this, this stat
that people fail because nobody yes,there's power and learning from failures,
but hopefully you can learnfrom the failures of people
that come on this show and, and the,the community that allows you

(01:24:19):
to save that time, you know,whenever you're running your business.
So I appreciate you for all thatyou're doing in this community.
I think it's
I hope that it'sgoing to be well-received,
that it's going to get out thereto people.
And people can see the value in itfor sure.
Appreciate that.
Yeah.
Your stories,your experiences can change it all.
Let's face failure together.

(01:24:42):
We can defeat 90.

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