June 12, 2024 • 26 mins
In this episode of Experts Uncut, we explore Leadership best practices in the face of uncertainty with Kenneth Valentine, a prior-Special Agent in Charge of the Dignitary Protective Division in Washington, DC who served on the US Secret Service's Presidential Detail for Presidents Bush, Clinton and Obama.
Kenneth discusses the importance of vision in leadership through a compelling analogy from his Secret Service training, emphasizing how lifting your gaze can help navigate life's obstacles. He also shares fascinating stories, including a memorable interaction with Tiger Woods, to illustrate key principles of leadership and preparation.
Whether you're a new leader or a tenured CEO, Ken's insights offer valuable lessons from a fascinating and unique career in security and crisis management.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
If you become a limousine driver in the Secret Service, you have to go through
what they call protective operations driving course.
When you get started, it's orange cones everywhere.
From down low level, all you see are cones and you don't see any way to navigate through the cones.
It's about where you fix your gaze. If you look at those cones as you're going
through, you will hit the cones.
(00:21):
But if you lift your gaze above the cones and look through the curve,
your hands and your eyes will work together unconsciously and you will hit the
opening of the curve and you won't hit any cones.
Life is a lot like that. If we're constantly looking down, we're looking at
the problems instead of the solutions, our vision can get us in trouble.
But if we have that gaze fixed further out, then it actually enhances our ability
(00:45):
to navigate the cones of life.
Hi everybody, welcome to another episode of Experts Uncut.
That's your host here, Simon Rycroft. I'm super excited about who we have here
today, Kenneth Valentine.
I am going to give a bit of a background on who Ken is. I really appreciate
your time today, Ken. Thank you for coming on. Glad to be here.
(01:07):
So if you can't tell from the decorations in the background,
Ken is a Secret Service agent, or now retired.
Started his career back in 1996, assigned as a special agent in Louisville, Kentucky.
2000, he's transferred to the Presidential Protective Division,
got a five-year assignment with Presidents Clinton and Bush.
(01:29):
And then in 2009, President Obama took office, Ken was promoted back to President's
detail after serving as a special agent in charge of the Dignitary Protective Division in DC.
And for those who don't know that is the highest rank in that division, which is fantastic.
Ken held that position from 2008 or 18, sorry, to 2020.
(01:52):
Then retired from government service to take his leadership experience to the
corporate and the nonprofit world.
Ken also has a book, Cheating Death, which is out and could be pre-ordered now.
It was out in a few weeks. So I encourage anyone to go online.
I think it's at Barnes & Noble, Amazon, Walmart, available across all of those platforms.
(02:13):
So, honored to have you here today, Ken. I appreciate your time.
Oh, the honor's all mine, Simon. Glad to be here. Thank you.
So, so many questions, so many things to go through.
You know, I think Experts Uncut, we really focus on experts across multiple disciplines.
I think with your extensive honorary background in law enforcement,
(02:36):
what you're bringing expertise wide into the corporate and kind of commercial
world really is leadership, but also executive presence.
So I want to go into that in a little bit of depth, but let's start from the
beginning just so I can learn a bit more about you as well as people that are
listening and watching in.
So how did everything start when you started in law enforcement?
(02:59):
Was it a dream to get into the Secret Service? Was that ultimately a goal or
something that just kind of happened by chance?
Well, I like starting in the beginning. That's a great place to start.
You know, I grew up with a father and an uncle who had been in the FBI.
Okay. And then a grandfather who had been a police officer for a short time.
So I think law enforcement was kind of in my blood.
(03:22):
I think I was enamored by it. Those role models in my life were good.
They were good role models. They were terrific mentors.
And they never did dissuade me from that.
So I think I kind of had this natural inclination to do what they did and to
be like them. And they never did talk me out of it, so to speak.
(03:46):
So I think that was what was driving me, was I saw how much they seemed to enjoy that.
And maybe a little bit of genetics there with the interest in law enforcement.
But interestingly enough, as I moved through the process, the Secret Service
really wasn't on my radar. are.
(04:07):
I was interested in it, applied with a variety of other federal,
state, and local agencies.
But in the final analysis, it was Ronald Reagan coming to Purdue University,
which is where I graduated from, undergrad degree.
And Ronald Reagan came there. My roommate and I had really no interest in the crowds and the people.
(04:30):
And he was such a popular president there about 1988. 88.
But at the last minute, we decided to walk the entire way across campus,
several miles to the airport just to see what it was all about.
And so we did that. I think that I was left with some appreciation for the coordination,
for the magnitude of what they were doing.
(04:51):
Got to see the counter-assault team and the agents in action.
And certainly that left a big impression on me.
I think my dad and my uncle both went to law school.
They really pushed me, hey, if you're going to do this, go to law school.
So I did. As I'm coming out of law school.
My dad, in particular, really encouraged me to apply to Secret Service,
(05:13):
and it was hard to say no after that good experience, kind of seeing the Secret Service in action.
And he actually was able to participate in that event from an intelligence standpoint,
and he really loved the way the Secret Service agents interacted and collaborated with them.
So I had a lot of encouragement to go that direction.
(05:36):
I think as the application processes went,
the Secret Service did such a good job of fostering you into the family,
so to speak, and ushering you through that very long and kind of bumpy process
that by the time it was done, I didn't want anything else.
I really was sold out for Secret Service. I think I would have been disappointed
(05:59):
had I not been able to go into the Secret Service. And so they were number one
and they came across the finish line first.
So I took it and ran with it. And I love every bit of 24 years serving with the Secret Service.
And so I'm so grateful I did. I think that was a good fit for me.
I think my dad was very wise.
(06:20):
And I think that that worked out beautifully.
I mean, is there a high volume of applications?
Is there a very limited acceptance rate that they share that data?
I was told when we applied, this would have been in the early 90s,
that one in 10,000 applicants was accepted and got in and made it through training.
(06:41):
So I think that was a bit of a high watermark, too.
I don't know that they're seeing that kind of an application backlog at this
point, but it is still certainly competitive.
I think there are some pretty high hurdles to get through because every agent,
every employee of the Secret Service has to have a top secret security clearance.
(07:02):
So there are some hurdles you have to get over.
You have to pass a background investigation, obviously, and then a polygraph exam.
So, you know, if you've got things in your past that you don't want to talk
about, then you're just not going to pass the polygraph. And I think that knocks some people out.
But if you're willing to be transparent, talk about it, they'll get you through
it. It's just a matter of putting your heart on the table and letting them dissect
(07:26):
it a little bit and see what's making that thing beat.
So it is a long process. I think it took me more than a year to get in,
probably closer to two years.
And I know that's been a big deal. And they have worked very hard to winnow that process down.
And so now I think they have sped it up to the point where it never takes a year anymore.
(07:48):
And you know, you can start playing in your life. it's either yes or no.
And so they've done a great job reacting to that.
And how much I know from the way that the career path or the particular role
is shown for people who have only really seen what the secret service do on
TV, be it news or in the movies.
(08:10):
How much of it is outside of being there for, you know, dignitary,
you know, be it the president or otherwise, versus behind a desk,
you know, research-related work? That's a great question.
And I'm thankful that you asked that because the majority of nearly every Secret
(08:30):
Service agent's career is in the world of investigations and not protection.
And so at their core, Secret Service agents are investigators,
criminal investigators.
They're working on white collar crime and financial crime investigations.
If you're assigned to the field, whereas I started in Louisville,
(08:51):
Kentucky, day one, you're working on financial crimes.
And at the drop of a hat, they notify you that the president's coming to town
next week or the vice president or a visiting head of state.
And we need you to stop what you're doing and start working on this.
And that is really the way it goes with the Secret Service.
(09:12):
You will be busy working a great case, looking forward to locking up some bad
guys, and you have to stop, put that on hold, and go do this protection thing.
And it might be in your town.
It might be in a town the other side of the world.
So we go all over the world, wherever the president, vice president goes,
and, and affect that security plan.
(09:35):
So you, you just kind of learn to live life in, in sound bites and,
and take smaller bites of, of, of life because you, you might not be doing this tomorrow.
You might be doing something totally different. And frankly,
that's one of the things I loved about it.
I think if you've got a little attention deficit disorder, this is right up
your alley because, you know, nothing stays the same. It's, it, it annually changes.
(09:59):
You, you really don't count on anything.
You kind of learn to, to deal with that reality and to embrace it a little bit.
And, and, and so that's good. And, and then.
After an agent has been in the field for, and I don't know how many years it
is now, for me, it was only four years before I got the call to make a decision
(10:19):
about which detail I wanted to go to.
And, you know, for me, I still wanted to do the president's detail.
I got selected for that. So that was a good fit.
And then you do it full time. And so the detail time, it is full time.
And you kind of have to put that criminal investigator hat in the drawer for a minute.
(10:39):
But you're never really that far from it because I think that's one of the distinctions
with the Secret Service.
And one of the things that makes the agents good is that they are criminal investigators first.
And so kind of like a knife, you get sharpened on one side.
And if it's only sharp on one side, that's not a great knife.
(11:00):
So you want to be sharp on both sides. And I think the criminal investigations
helps sharpen you for, you know, greater purpose.
And then the protection kind of helps you with your investigations.
It teaches you to get things done now, to get, you know, paying attention to
detail and moving things forward. So I think they complement one another.
(11:22):
I've always appreciated getting to do both. And so I think that that's been
a great fit. And have you, I mean, from the, you know, the brief opportunities
that we've had to chat so far, obviously your personality is very calm, collective.
Has that always been the case or that's something that, you know,
has come throughout your career? Oh, good question.
(11:45):
Well, I hope if you ask my friends and family, they would say that's just me.
I think Secret Service helps you with self-awareness for sure.
And I think, you know, one of the things that is continually apparent to us is that you need a plan.
And I think, you know, you can have a whole lot more presence about you and
(12:11):
calmer demeanor when you know what you're going to do when things don't go right
and when things go wrong.
And so I would like to think that I've always had that. I certainly think it's
ingrained in me for sure now, if not, you know, by biology, certainly by practice.
And so, you know, I think 9-11 was a good example.
(12:35):
You know, Secret Service had been worried about airplanes for a long time.
You know, we'd already had smaller aircraft land at the White House,
crash into trees at the White House.
So, you know, those kind of things were always there.
On our mind, it was something that we were prepared for. It was,
you know, if we weren't prepared to defend against it necessarily,
(12:56):
especially in a foreign country, we weren't prepared to react to it and get
early warning for it and then, you know, make a plan and stick to the plan.
And I think, you know, when you talk about demeanor and calm in the storm and that kind of thing,
for me, having a plan enables you to be calm when other people might not be,
(13:17):
You know, when they're flipping out, freaking out, those with a plan can stick
to the plan and maintain their composure a little better.
I think people that might be looking for insights that you can bring,
obviously, from the book as well, if I think on the corporate world, a lot of change.
A lot of risk management, a lot of planning, but also dealing with uncertainty
(13:41):
is something that people in, especially chief supply chain officers, heads of procurement,
chief operating office, chief commercial officers, and obviously CEOs have to
deal with on a regular basis.
But listening to people that come from law enforcement, especially at the ranks
that you've achieved in your career.
(14:01):
It just gives a different perspective of how to deal with uncertainty and kind
of lessons learned from real life situations.
So I think that's why a lot of the books that come from the field are hugely popular.
But I think yours is somewhat unique. nick i haven't seen
one in in the commercial or
(14:22):
having a commercial angle to it that's come from the secret
service before there's a lot from you know vi agents etc
and police officers etc but so i'm
very excited to to see yours considering that the book has just come out can
you share some stories for people that haven't read it yet maybe just one uh
with the audience i think that'd be great just one you want me to pick one story
(14:44):
i could go all day and i could listen to listen to you for hours if you have more than one.
Well, you know, part of the fun of writing this book was that I was trying to
give practical advice for not just work, but life in general.
And what I tried to do was take some stories that occurred during my tenure
(15:07):
with the Secret Service and make those apply to whatever principle you're trying to teach,
whether it's leadership or dealing with hardship or, or decision-making.
And, and, and so there, there are stories in every chapter that,
that I think either explain a situation better than I could without it,
or that, that I wanted my kids to know this story and it just didn't come up organically.
(15:31):
So, so there are a lot of stories in there.
You know, I, I don't know if it's a story, but the, the one that's,
that's in front of me right now, I think is, is one that I tell regularly.
And I'll skip to the more of the principle, but we were in Florida with President
Obama and it was a vacation for him.
He was at a golf course and we were playing golf with Tiger Woods.
(15:55):
I say we, you have to forgive me for using that language. The president was
playing golf with Tiger Woods.
I was there to do my job and to work, but Tiger seemed a whole lot more interested
in talking to me, which was a little unnerving because he was supposed to be
there with the president, but it'd been a long day.
And Tiger's a bit of a nerd when it comes to security and military.
(16:17):
And he was much more interested in learning about, you know,
what are you doing and how are you doing it?
And what, you know, what kind of assets did you bring, you know, today?
And, you know, how are you affecting this security plan out here?
Because it's a huge golf course kind of out in the open there.
And in the process of talking about that, I tell the story about Tiger Woods
(16:41):
because I'm talking in the chapter about leadership, about vision.
And one of the axioms from our training, well, it's actually specific training.
So if you become a limousine driver in the Secret Service, you have to go through
what they call Protective Operations Driving Course. And that is a course that's
(17:03):
taught by Secret Service personnel who've been to all the driving courses.
You know, they go to race driving.
They go to tactical driving. They go to all this. And then they come back and teach and train us.
And they have a huge driving pad out there. And depending on who got the low
bid on the contract, you might start off with Mustangs or Camaros or,
(17:23):
you know, some kind of fast car.
But you're working your way up to the limousine. And when you get started on
this obstacle course, it's orange cones everywhere.
And from down low level, all you see are cones and you don't see any way to
navigate through the cones.
(17:44):
When you get into the course, you start seeing the paths and you kind of learn the rhythm to the paths.
But there was one point within the protective operations driving course,
obstacle course, that it's called the banana curve and it starts off very wide.
So you know where to enter and you're trying to get through there at a hot pace.
(18:04):
I mean, you got a time to beat, but at
the end of the banana curve the cones are set so close
together that your first couple of
runs you don't think you can squeeze the car through the cones and you're going
to hit the cones on both sides and what the what the training is teaching you
to do is not only to use your feet and they they teach you how to squeeze your
(18:28):
toes and do all this stuff that that makes you just a little bit better driver,
what to do with your hands, you know, placement during, during high speed navigation and whatnot.
But when we got to the, to this part of the course, the instructor gave us probably
the most valuable piece of information or, or advice that, that he could. And it was about vision.
(18:50):
And he said, it's, it's not in the hands or the feet. It's about where you fix your gaze.
And he said, if you look at those cones, as you're going through,
you will we'll hit the cones.
But if you lift your gaze above the cones and look through the curve.
Your hands and your eyes will work together unconsciously and you will hit the
(19:12):
opening of the curve and you won't hit any cones.
The car fits and he showed us how he could do it at a tremendous rate.
And so what I tried to do with part of that chapter was talk about.
How life is, is a lot like that. If we, if we're constantly looking down,
we're looking at the problems instead of the solutions.
We, we got our, our gaze lift fixed, you know, right in front of us instead
(19:35):
of a little further out, our vision can get us in trouble.
But if we, if we have that gaze fixed further out, then it actually enhances
our ability to, to navigate the cones of life.
And what Tiger Woods was doing out there that day, and I tell the long story
in the book, but the 18th hole was very difficult, very long.
(19:59):
And I'm not a golfer, but the fairway was to the right, and then it jutted back
to the left up toward the green.
But all along the way you had hazards it was
all water on the left you had sand and
and trees and whatnot in front of you but it was a clear shot to the right and
(20:21):
the president hit the ball straight down the fairway and he got it almost to
the clearing where a risky shot he could kind of hit it you know kind of cut
the corner toward the green and then Tiger got up and and I watched Tiger address the ball and,
and I'm, and I'm thinking to myself, what's he going to do?
What, what is Tiger going to do with this ball?
(20:42):
And, you know, is he going to, would he dare go straight for the green?
And, uh, Tiger's got a different set of eyes, you know, he's been trained and
he's, he's just got a whole different set of, of, you know, vision as to what
he could do with the ball and, and what that green looks like to him.
And he did not hit it to the right. He didn't hit it straight.
(21:03):
He hit it to the left. And initially I thought he was.
Sending a signal to the Coast Guard boat. You know, I mean, he sent the ball way out over the water.
And I thought maybe he was trying to give them a souvenir or something. I wasn't sure.
But as I watched that ball, and the sound is unbelievable in person of him hitting
(21:24):
the ball hard, the ball started trailing back to the left.
And as it started coming down, it was getting faster and faster.
And it came all the way back to land and it landed on the green and is rolling
now perpendicular toward the hole. And it's just unbelievable.
His set of eyes and his set of skills, he could see a different way to get at
(21:47):
the green and ultimately to the hole than anyone else out there.
And I just think it's crazy. If you get your gaze up and see through the cones,
you will navigate the cones just fine. time.
And Tiger had that ability. I think great leaders have that ability to get their
gaze up and see other options, other avenues for success, and then take the risk and get there.
(22:13):
Yeah, absolutely love that. What is the chapter called? Is it called Through the Cones?
No, that chapter is called Regarding Leadership.
Okay, I love it. Yeah, I think some of that I presume also comes from experience,
the amount of preparation that's done that reduces anxiety and the familiarity,
right, I mean, seeing that Tiger's done that course multiple times and seeing
(22:35):
the direction of the wind and everything, probably more than Obama had at the
time, but the air of confidence that comes from experience that a lot of experts have.
But I think anyone that's in general leadership, I think would really benefit
from listening to those and being able to hear them told with such elaborate
stories behind them just makes it stick in your memory. I don't think I'll ever forget the...
(23:01):
Tiger Woods and, you know, through the cones, it's going to stick in my mind
for years to come. So I appreciate that. That's great.
Well, you actually tied in another concept that I talk about and I dedicated
a chapter to preparation.
And I called it opportunity preparation because one of my favorite slogans when
I was a shift leader on a president's detail was preparation meets opportunity.
(23:24):
And it's just something I'm sure I'm not the first one to come up with that.
But I don't know who to give credit to for creating that phrase.
But preparation breeds opportunity.
You know, opportunity craves preparation. So, you know, I think if you prepare
yourself and if you are willing to take the steps to get prepared, to be prepared,
(23:48):
it's funny how opportunity comes, you know, to those who are prepared.
So, I like how you tied that in, and that is another facet of the book where
I give a story and talk about that.
So, you mentioned offline and maybe a second book coming down the line.
Is that something that's already forming in your mind or pen to paper?
(24:10):
Well, thank you, Simon. It's already done.
Okay. Yeah, I couldn't help it.
It's very interesting. Once you start writing, I think it's like riding a bike.
I did not want to quit riding the bike.
And I turned in Cheating Death to the publisher and we had an agreement.
And so they started the process of publishing that and the edit copy and all this kind of stuff.
(24:35):
Meanwhile, I kept writing and writing.
One of the chapters in the later part of the book is called Support and Challenge.
And it's really about friendships and about how important it is in your life
to have friends who support you, but also you want friends who are going to challenge you.
(24:56):
It's great if you're riding that bike to get people to say, keep riding,
keep riding, keep riding.
But as you get closer to that cliff, you want someone who's going to say, hey, idiot, stop.
And so I talk about how important it is and how I think it's like a knife sharpened
on both sides that you have support in your life and you have challenge in your life.
(25:17):
And so this second book is called Staying Sharp.
And I just kind of take that chapter and run with it and talk about the importance.
If you're going to be a sharp knife and you're going to be useful for what a
knife is useful for, then you want to be sharp.
And if you're going to be sharp, you need to be sharp on both
sides of that of that blade so yes book number two is already done and we've
(25:42):
got an agreement so it should be coming out early next year well i think we
are when that's when that's up i'd love to have you back on and if i can try
and coordinate it so i had a coffee copy of my hand beforehand so we can kind
of go through it and in depth that'd be amazing but,
truly appreciate your time ken i was honored to have you on and you know share
some of your background details.
And anyone who hasn't ordered the book yet, I encourage you to go out and we'll
(26:07):
look forward to staying in contact.
So I appreciate it again. Thank you. Great pleasure. Thank you very much, Simon.
If you become a limousine driver in the Secret Service, you have to go through
what they call protective operations driving course.
When you get started, it's orange cones everywhere.
From down low level, all you see are cones and you don't see any way to navigate through the cones.
It's about where you fix your gaze. If you look at those cones as you're going
through, you will hit the cones.
(00:21):
But if you lift your gaze above the cones and look through the curve,
your hands and your eyes will work together unconsciously and you will hit the
opening of the curve and you won't hit any cones.
Life is a lot like that. If we're constantly looking down, we're looking at
the problems instead of the solutions, our vision can get us in trouble.
But if we have that gaze fixed further out, then it actually enhances our ability
(00:45):
to navigate the cones of life.
Hi everybody, welcome to another episode of Experts Uncut.
That's your host here, Simon Rycroft. I'm super excited about who we have here
today, Kenneth Valentine.
I am going to give a bit of a background on who Ken is. I really appreciate
your time today, Ken. Thank you for coming on. Glad to be here.
(01:07):
So if you can't tell from the decorations in the background,
Ken is a Secret Service agent, or now retired.
Started his career back in 1996, assigned as a special agent in Louisville, Kentucky.
2000, he's transferred to the Presidential Protective Division,
got a five-year assignment with Presidents Clinton and Bush.
(01:29):
And then in 2009, President Obama took office, Ken was promoted back to President's
detail after serving as a special agent in charge of the Dignitary Protective Division in DC.
And for those who don't know that is the highest rank in that division, which is fantastic.
Ken held that position from 2008 or 18, sorry, to 2020.
(01:52):
Then retired from government service to take his leadership experience to the
corporate and the nonprofit world.
Ken also has a book, Cheating Death, which is out and could be pre-ordered now.
It was out in a few weeks. So I encourage anyone to go online.
I think it's at Barnes & Noble, Amazon, Walmart, available across all of those platforms.
(02:13):
So, honored to have you here today, Ken. I appreciate your time.
Oh, the honor's all mine, Simon. Glad to be here. Thank you.
So, so many questions, so many things to go through.
You know, I think Experts Uncut, we really focus on experts across multiple disciplines.
I think with your extensive honorary background in law enforcement,
(02:36):
what you're bringing expertise wide into the corporate and kind of commercial
world really is leadership, but also executive presence.
So I want to go into that in a little bit of depth, but let's start from the
beginning just so I can learn a bit more about you as well as people that are
listening and watching in.
So how did everything start when you started in law enforcement?
(02:59):
Was it a dream to get into the Secret Service? Was that ultimately a goal or
something that just kind of happened by chance?
Well, I like starting in the beginning. That's a great place to start.
You know, I grew up with a father and an uncle who had been in the FBI.
Okay. And then a grandfather who had been a police officer for a short time.
So I think law enforcement was kind of in my blood.
(03:22):
I think I was enamored by it. Those role models in my life were good.
They were good role models. They were terrific mentors.
And they never did dissuade me from that.
So I think I kind of had this natural inclination to do what they did and to
be like them. And they never did talk me out of it, so to speak.
(03:46):
So I think that was what was driving me, was I saw how much they seemed to enjoy that.
And maybe a little bit of genetics there with the interest in law enforcement.
But interestingly enough, as I moved through the process, the Secret Service
really wasn't on my radar. are.
(04:07):
I was interested in it, applied with a variety of other federal,
state, and local agencies.
But in the final analysis, it was Ronald Reagan coming to Purdue University,
which is where I graduated from, undergrad degree.
And Ronald Reagan came there. My roommate and I had really no interest in the crowds and the people.
(04:30):
And he was such a popular president there about 1988. 88.
But at the last minute, we decided to walk the entire way across campus,
several miles to the airport just to see what it was all about.
And so we did that. I think that I was left with some appreciation for the coordination,
for the magnitude of what they were doing.
(04:51):
Got to see the counter-assault team and the agents in action.
And certainly that left a big impression on me.
I think my dad and my uncle both went to law school.
They really pushed me, hey, if you're going to do this, go to law school.
So I did. As I'm coming out of law school.
My dad, in particular, really encouraged me to apply to Secret Service,
(05:13):
and it was hard to say no after that good experience, kind of seeing the Secret Service in action.
And he actually was able to participate in that event from an intelligence standpoint,
and he really loved the way the Secret Service agents interacted and collaborated with them.
So I had a lot of encouragement to go that direction.
(05:36):
I think as the application processes went,
the Secret Service did such a good job of fostering you into the family,
so to speak, and ushering you through that very long and kind of bumpy process
that by the time it was done, I didn't want anything else.
I really was sold out for Secret Service. I think I would have been disappointed
(05:59):
had I not been able to go into the Secret Service. And so they were number one
and they came across the finish line first.
So I took it and ran with it. And I love every bit of 24 years serving with the Secret Service.
And so I'm so grateful I did. I think that was a good fit for me.
I think my dad was very wise.
(06:20):
And I think that that worked out beautifully.
I mean, is there a high volume of applications?
Is there a very limited acceptance rate that they share that data?
I was told when we applied, this would have been in the early 90s,
that one in 10,000 applicants was accepted and got in and made it through training.
(06:41):
So I think that was a bit of a high watermark, too.
I don't know that they're seeing that kind of an application backlog at this
point, but it is still certainly competitive.
I think there are some pretty high hurdles to get through because every agent,
every employee of the Secret Service has to have a top secret security clearance.
(07:02):
So there are some hurdles you have to get over.
You have to pass a background investigation, obviously, and then a polygraph exam.
So, you know, if you've got things in your past that you don't want to talk
about, then you're just not going to pass the polygraph. And I think that knocks some people out.
But if you're willing to be transparent, talk about it, they'll get you through
it. It's just a matter of putting your heart on the table and letting them dissect
(07:26):
it a little bit and see what's making that thing beat.
So it is a long process. I think it took me more than a year to get in,
probably closer to two years.
And I know that's been a big deal. And they have worked very hard to winnow that process down.
And so now I think they have sped it up to the point where it never takes a year anymore.
(07:48):
And you know, you can start playing in your life. it's either yes or no.
And so they've done a great job reacting to that.
And how much I know from the way that the career path or the particular role
is shown for people who have only really seen what the secret service do on
TV, be it news or in the movies.
(08:10):
How much of it is outside of being there for, you know, dignitary,
you know, be it the president or otherwise, versus behind a desk,
you know, research-related work? That's a great question.
And I'm thankful that you asked that because the majority of nearly every Secret
(08:30):
Service agent's career is in the world of investigations and not protection.
And so at their core, Secret Service agents are investigators,
criminal investigators.
They're working on white collar crime and financial crime investigations.
If you're assigned to the field, whereas I started in Louisville,
(08:51):
Kentucky, day one, you're working on financial crimes.
And at the drop of a hat, they notify you that the president's coming to town
next week or the vice president or a visiting head of state.
And we need you to stop what you're doing and start working on this.
And that is really the way it goes with the Secret Service.
(09:12):
You will be busy working a great case, looking forward to locking up some bad
guys, and you have to stop, put that on hold, and go do this protection thing.
And it might be in your town.
It might be in a town the other side of the world.
So we go all over the world, wherever the president, vice president goes,
and, and affect that security plan.
(09:35):
So you, you just kind of learn to live life in, in sound bites and,
and take smaller bites of, of, of life because you, you might not be doing this tomorrow.
You might be doing something totally different. And frankly,
that's one of the things I loved about it.
I think if you've got a little attention deficit disorder, this is right up
your alley because, you know, nothing stays the same. It's, it, it annually changes.
(09:59):
You, you really don't count on anything.
You kind of learn to, to deal with that reality and to embrace it a little bit.
And, and, and so that's good. And, and then.
After an agent has been in the field for, and I don't know how many years it
is now, for me, it was only four years before I got the call to make a decision
(10:19):
about which detail I wanted to go to.
And, you know, for me, I still wanted to do the president's detail.
I got selected for that. So that was a good fit.
And then you do it full time. And so the detail time, it is full time.
And you kind of have to put that criminal investigator hat in the drawer for a minute.
(10:39):
But you're never really that far from it because I think that's one of the distinctions
with the Secret Service.
And one of the things that makes the agents good is that they are criminal investigators first.
And so kind of like a knife, you get sharpened on one side.
And if it's only sharp on one side, that's not a great knife.
(11:00):
So you want to be sharp on both sides. And I think the criminal investigations
helps sharpen you for, you know, greater purpose.
And then the protection kind of helps you with your investigations.
It teaches you to get things done now, to get, you know, paying attention to
detail and moving things forward. So I think they complement one another.
(11:22):
I've always appreciated getting to do both. And so I think that that's been
a great fit. And have you, I mean, from the, you know, the brief opportunities
that we've had to chat so far, obviously your personality is very calm, collective.
Has that always been the case or that's something that, you know,
has come throughout your career? Oh, good question.
(11:45):
Well, I hope if you ask my friends and family, they would say that's just me.
I think Secret Service helps you with self-awareness for sure.
And I think, you know, one of the things that is continually apparent to us is that you need a plan.
And I think, you know, you can have a whole lot more presence about you and
(12:11):
calmer demeanor when you know what you're going to do when things don't go right
and when things go wrong.
And so I would like to think that I've always had that. I certainly think it's
ingrained in me for sure now, if not, you know, by biology, certainly by practice.
And so, you know, I think 9-11 was a good example.
(12:35):
You know, Secret Service had been worried about airplanes for a long time.
You know, we'd already had smaller aircraft land at the White House,
crash into trees at the White House.
So, you know, those kind of things were always there.
On our mind, it was something that we were prepared for. It was,
you know, if we weren't prepared to defend against it necessarily,
(12:56):
especially in a foreign country, we weren't prepared to react to it and get
early warning for it and then, you know, make a plan and stick to the plan.
And I think, you know, when you talk about demeanor and calm in the storm and that kind of thing,
for me, having a plan enables you to be calm when other people might not be,
(13:17):
You know, when they're flipping out, freaking out, those with a plan can stick
to the plan and maintain their composure a little better.
I think people that might be looking for insights that you can bring,
obviously, from the book as well, if I think on the corporate world, a lot of change.
A lot of risk management, a lot of planning, but also dealing with uncertainty
(13:41):
is something that people in, especially chief supply chain officers, heads of procurement,
chief operating office, chief commercial officers, and obviously CEOs have to
deal with on a regular basis.
But listening to people that come from law enforcement, especially at the ranks
that you've achieved in your career.
(14:01):
It just gives a different perspective of how to deal with uncertainty and kind
of lessons learned from real life situations.
So I think that's why a lot of the books that come from the field are hugely popular.
But I think yours is somewhat unique. nick i haven't seen
one in in the commercial or
(14:22):
having a commercial angle to it that's come from the secret
service before there's a lot from you know vi agents etc
and police officers etc but so i'm
very excited to to see yours considering that the book has just come out can
you share some stories for people that haven't read it yet maybe just one uh
with the audience i think that'd be great just one you want me to pick one story
(14:44):
i could go all day and i could listen to listen to you for hours if you have more than one.
Well, you know, part of the fun of writing this book was that I was trying to
give practical advice for not just work, but life in general.
And what I tried to do was take some stories that occurred during my tenure
(15:07):
with the Secret Service and make those apply to whatever principle you're trying to teach,
whether it's leadership or dealing with hardship or, or decision-making.
And, and, and so there, there are stories in every chapter that,
that I think either explain a situation better than I could without it,
or that, that I wanted my kids to know this story and it just didn't come up organically.
(15:31):
So, so there are a lot of stories in there.
You know, I, I don't know if it's a story, but the, the one that's,
that's in front of me right now, I think is, is one that I tell regularly.
And I'll skip to the more of the principle, but we were in Florida with President
Obama and it was a vacation for him.
He was at a golf course and we were playing golf with Tiger Woods.
(15:55):
I say we, you have to forgive me for using that language. The president was
playing golf with Tiger Woods.
I was there to do my job and to work, but Tiger seemed a whole lot more interested
in talking to me, which was a little unnerving because he was supposed to be
there with the president, but it'd been a long day.
And Tiger's a bit of a nerd when it comes to security and military.
(16:17):
And he was much more interested in learning about, you know,
what are you doing and how are you doing it?
And what, you know, what kind of assets did you bring, you know, today?
And, you know, how are you affecting this security plan out here?
Because it's a huge golf course kind of out in the open there.
And in the process of talking about that, I tell the story about Tiger Woods
(16:41):
because I'm talking in the chapter about leadership, about vision.
And one of the axioms from our training, well, it's actually specific training.
So if you become a limousine driver in the Secret Service, you have to go through
what they call Protective Operations Driving Course. And that is a course that's
(17:03):
taught by Secret Service personnel who've been to all the driving courses.
You know, they go to race driving.
They go to tactical driving. They go to all this. And then they come back and teach and train us.
And they have a huge driving pad out there. And depending on who got the low
bid on the contract, you might start off with Mustangs or Camaros or,
(17:23):
you know, some kind of fast car.
But you're working your way up to the limousine. And when you get started on
this obstacle course, it's orange cones everywhere.
And from down low level, all you see are cones and you don't see any way to
navigate through the cones.
(17:44):
When you get into the course, you start seeing the paths and you kind of learn the rhythm to the paths.
But there was one point within the protective operations driving course,
obstacle course, that it's called the banana curve and it starts off very wide.
So you know where to enter and you're trying to get through there at a hot pace.
(18:04):
I mean, you got a time to beat, but at
the end of the banana curve the cones are set so close
together that your first couple of
runs you don't think you can squeeze the car through the cones and you're going
to hit the cones on both sides and what the what the training is teaching you
to do is not only to use your feet and they they teach you how to squeeze your
(18:28):
toes and do all this stuff that that makes you just a little bit better driver,
what to do with your hands, you know, placement during, during high speed navigation and whatnot.
But when we got to the, to this part of the course, the instructor gave us probably
the most valuable piece of information or, or advice that, that he could. And it was about vision.
(18:50):
And he said, it's, it's not in the hands or the feet. It's about where you fix your gaze.
And he said, if you look at those cones, as you're going through,
you will we'll hit the cones.
But if you lift your gaze above the cones and look through the curve.
Your hands and your eyes will work together unconsciously and you will hit the
(19:12):
opening of the curve and you won't hit any cones.
The car fits and he showed us how he could do it at a tremendous rate.
And so what I tried to do with part of that chapter was talk about.
How life is, is a lot like that. If we, if we're constantly looking down,
we're looking at the problems instead of the solutions.
We, we got our, our gaze lift fixed, you know, right in front of us instead
(19:35):
of a little further out, our vision can get us in trouble.
But if we, if we have that gaze fixed further out, then it actually enhances
our ability to, to navigate the cones of life.
And what Tiger Woods was doing out there that day, and I tell the long story
in the book, but the 18th hole was very difficult, very long.
(19:59):
And I'm not a golfer, but the fairway was to the right, and then it jutted back
to the left up toward the green.
But all along the way you had hazards it was
all water on the left you had sand and
and trees and whatnot in front of you but it was a clear shot to the right and
(20:21):
the president hit the ball straight down the fairway and he got it almost to
the clearing where a risky shot he could kind of hit it you know kind of cut
the corner toward the green and then Tiger got up and and I watched Tiger address the ball and,
and I'm, and I'm thinking to myself, what's he going to do?
What, what is Tiger going to do with this ball?
(20:42):
And, you know, is he going to, would he dare go straight for the green?
And, uh, Tiger's got a different set of eyes, you know, he's been trained and
he's, he's just got a whole different set of, of, you know, vision as to what
he could do with the ball and, and what that green looks like to him.
And he did not hit it to the right. He didn't hit it straight.
(21:03):
He hit it to the left. And initially I thought he was.
Sending a signal to the Coast Guard boat. You know, I mean, he sent the ball way out over the water.
And I thought maybe he was trying to give them a souvenir or something. I wasn't sure.
But as I watched that ball, and the sound is unbelievable in person of him hitting
(21:24):
the ball hard, the ball started trailing back to the left.
And as it started coming down, it was getting faster and faster.
And it came all the way back to land and it landed on the green and is rolling
now perpendicular toward the hole. And it's just unbelievable.
His set of eyes and his set of skills, he could see a different way to get at
(21:47):
the green and ultimately to the hole than anyone else out there.
And I just think it's crazy. If you get your gaze up and see through the cones,
you will navigate the cones just fine. time.
And Tiger had that ability. I think great leaders have that ability to get their
gaze up and see other options, other avenues for success, and then take the risk and get there.
(22:13):
Yeah, absolutely love that. What is the chapter called? Is it called Through the Cones?
No, that chapter is called Regarding Leadership.
Okay, I love it. Yeah, I think some of that I presume also comes from experience,
the amount of preparation that's done that reduces anxiety and the familiarity,
right, I mean, seeing that Tiger's done that course multiple times and seeing
(22:35):
the direction of the wind and everything, probably more than Obama had at the
time, but the air of confidence that comes from experience that a lot of experts have.
But I think anyone that's in general leadership, I think would really benefit
from listening to those and being able to hear them told with such elaborate
stories behind them just makes it stick in your memory. I don't think I'll ever forget the...
(23:01):
Tiger Woods and, you know, through the cones, it's going to stick in my mind
for years to come. So I appreciate that. That's great.
Well, you actually tied in another concept that I talk about and I dedicated
a chapter to preparation.
And I called it opportunity preparation because one of my favorite slogans when
I was a shift leader on a president's detail was preparation meets opportunity.
(23:24):
And it's just something I'm sure I'm not the first one to come up with that.
But I don't know who to give credit to for creating that phrase.
But preparation breeds opportunity.
You know, opportunity craves preparation. So, you know, I think if you prepare
yourself and if you are willing to take the steps to get prepared, to be prepared,
(23:48):
it's funny how opportunity comes, you know, to those who are prepared.
So, I like how you tied that in, and that is another facet of the book where
I give a story and talk about that.
So, you mentioned offline and maybe a second book coming down the line.
Is that something that's already forming in your mind or pen to paper?
(24:10):
Well, thank you, Simon. It's already done.
Okay. Yeah, I couldn't help it.
It's very interesting. Once you start writing, I think it's like riding a bike.
I did not want to quit riding the bike.
And I turned in Cheating Death to the publisher and we had an agreement.
And so they started the process of publishing that and the edit copy and all this kind of stuff.
(24:35):
Meanwhile, I kept writing and writing.
One of the chapters in the later part of the book is called Support and Challenge.
And it's really about friendships and about how important it is in your life
to have friends who support you, but also you want friends who are going to challenge you.
(24:56):
It's great if you're riding that bike to get people to say, keep riding,
keep riding, keep riding.
But as you get closer to that cliff, you want someone who's going to say, hey, idiot, stop.
And so I talk about how important it is and how I think it's like a knife sharpened
on both sides that you have support in your life and you have challenge in your life.
(25:17):
And so this second book is called Staying Sharp.
And I just kind of take that chapter and run with it and talk about the importance.
If you're going to be a sharp knife and you're going to be useful for what a
knife is useful for, then you want to be sharp.
And if you're going to be sharp, you need to be sharp on both
sides of that of that blade so yes book number two is already done and we've
(25:42):
got an agreement so it should be coming out early next year well i think we
are when that's when that's up i'd love to have you back on and if i can try
and coordinate it so i had a coffee copy of my hand beforehand so we can kind
of go through it and in depth that'd be amazing but,
truly appreciate your time ken i was honored to have you on and you know share
some of your background details.
And anyone who hasn't ordered the book yet, I encourage you to go out and we'll
(26:07):
look forward to staying in contact.
So I appreciate it again. Thank you. Great pleasure. Thank you very much, Simon.
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