Helping Artists Tell Their Stories with Songwriter Kayliann Lowe

8 years ago I wrote my debut record together with Kayliann Lowe - a professional songwriter based in Nashville. Today, she’s sharing a behind the scenes look at what it looks like to help other artists write their stories.

📍Mentioned Resource: Follow Kayliann here: https://www.instagram.com/p/Bu2k9-mBwcN9xCJP5uBK7qln3sXbFvQZgntt8s0/?img_index=1

Check out the songs Kayliann wrote for other artists: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/4OGvvufmvYPdTyIuoF3UGe?si=XZzEd4bLSfKlReQge0p0-Q&nd=1&dlsi=7d8ecd60015b4acb

👉 Grab the Songwriting Framework PDF here (currently on sale for just $7!): https://lessons.voxtapestudios.com/the-songwriting-framework-pdf

👉 Join our live class called How To Write Songs You’ll Actually Like happening on October 14th: https://lessons.voxtapestudios.com/how-to-write-songs-youll-actually-like-live-masterclass

🔔 Subscribe & follow for new episodes every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday!

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
writing a song for her but not knowing what I was doing
I was not the sole writer
of all of these songs on that album
mostly writing for other artists
just like
trying to help them write what's on their heart
using our imaginations to go
what would we want this to sound like
Allah which song
yep can we hear is just doing it stripped down
bare bones no track

(00:23):
it's just gonna be a rough work tape
some people if you're visual
you know you could draw the melody that you're hearing
yeah seeing where it dips
where it goes high who cares
it's a great story we'll change the names
no one has to know and they're like
they will know it can feel so hard
to really be so vulnerable in what you're writing

(00:44):
think a lot of artists now
are coming from a place of
wanting to say something more than just
I love my voice and I want it to be heard
it gives them a chance to be like
this is what's on my heart
who is Kayliann
and how did you end up in this world of songwriting

(01:08):
Hey Vox Star
and welcome to from singer to artist
I'm Lara Chapman award winning singer and songwriter
turned viral vocal coach and the host of this show
at VoxTape Studios
we help singers from all over the world
level up their voices by teaching them
the three fundamental skills all singers need technique
awareness and artistry whether you're looking to go pro

(01:29):
or just develop your voice for fun
my team and I are here to help
check the link in the description
to book your first session
or grab some of our other resources
Alrighty are you ready
let's get started almost a decade ago
I wrote my debut album that I released in Nashville
and it was called me plus you
and it's so cute
and I love all the songs that were on it

(01:51):
but I was not the sole writer
of all of these songs on that album
and I have one of my co writers from that album
from almost a decade ago
right here in the studio with me
hello Kayliann Lowe
hello girl it's been from afar
hello from afar yes
I know actually
we're not even that far apart
we're only like four or five hour drive apart

(02:12):
I should have just come down and
we could have hung out in person
next time I we need to do that
but yes
it's so good to see you it's been a minute
it has been a minute
I didn't realize it had been that long
yeah yeah
at least I think covid and like
the pandemic just kind of warped time
I know and I'm like
wait what
wasn't it just a few years ago

(02:33):
yeah yeah
but it's like at least eight to nine years ago
when we wrote all of these songs
when I had the pleasure to meet you and work with you
it was so fun I Learned so much from you
I'm so grateful that I you know
got to be in the room with you and and
and learn from you
because you were way more experienced uh
than than I was
I mean
you still are way more experienced now than I am now

(02:55):
but hahaha
it was just such a pleasure to
to meet you and get to work with you and same uh
we even we even got a little award together too
the the John
I mean it's not an award
it's more of a contest that we won
the John Lennon Songwriting contest
right with White Lies
hey anything that has John Lennon in it that's
it's a win you know

(03:16):
absolutely actually
these two guitars that you can see right here
I got those uh
because we won that contest
oh my god
they sent me that stuff and I was like
oh that's great hahaha
yes do
the real question is do you play them
not once have I touched them
but they look pretty hey
you know what little wall candy
little wall exactly

(03:38):
I can like strum basic chords
but for some reason like the
the acoustic guitar has a pretty thick body
and the one that I'm used to playing
has a much thinner body and so now with the thick one
I'm like oh my gosh
I'm like playing out here
what is happening
I'm just not used to it cause I'm such a small person
you know uh huh
ugh yes you are

(03:58):
I do remember that I could just
I mean I'm not super tall
I'm 5 7 but you know
oh yeah no
I'm a I'm a midget next to you
easily hug you
well um
before we dig into everything else
can you tell us a little bit more
how you got started with songwriting
and cause you you have written for other people

(04:19):
you do jingles you record jingles as well
like who is Kayleen
and how did you end up in this world of songwriting
a chameleon um
I don't know well no
so backstory
I grew up performing with my family
so we toured internationally
that was like our bread and butter
that's how um

(04:40):
we made money and
I'm the youngest of seven children
and so like I literally grew up on the stage
and so I think because of that background
I grew to love like
a variety of song uh
not just songs but like
styles and genres
and so that kind of influences how I write

(05:03):
and that's why I kind of joke saying
like a chameleon
because it's not just like
I only grew up on the Beatles
or I only grew up on Tim Mcgraw or
you know what I mean yeah
um it was such a variety
like classical bluegrass
Irish jazz wow um
you know country
pop etcetera like
and so that kind of

(05:24):
before I even knew songwriting was a thing
that's what I was in the world of
was performing on stage um
and it was like a production
variety show so singing
dancing instrumental
and so did that for a gazillion years
and um
then when I was about 11 I think 11 or twelve

(05:47):
my sister got married and I found myself like
writing a song for her but not knowing what I was doing
I was just like well
I'm in music like
that's what we do so I'm just putting my diary
so to speak to a melody right
um not having any clue that people do that for a living
yeah and that

(06:07):
you know you can actually like
make money and it's a job right
it's a career yeah
like it's
it's not just like a hobby and um
so I started doing that and at the time
we were
my family was performing in a show town called Branson
Missouri so we were there for 10 years
and we would perform six days a week and yeah

(06:31):
and so it allowed us to like
time and opportunities to be able to write songs
and then kind of try them out on the stage
and see how the audience reacted
and see what they liked what they didn't you know
and then my brother Doug and I started writing more

(06:51):
and started co writing with other entertainers in town
who also enjoyed writing songs
and it just kind of went from there
it still wasn't like like
I still didn't really understand like
this could be what I do for the rest of my life
you know um
it was just more fun like
I was making music it was like jam session

(07:12):
so to speak um
with people that I loved you know what I mean
so um yeah
that's what we did and then I'm trying to think
uh I wrote a Christmas song for my family
and it was like
the title track for one of our Christmas albums
called Coming Home and there was a

(07:34):
I guess this is like how long do you want the story
you can cut out what you don't like right
you can cut out what you don't need
but um
because my family was performing
there was uh
some type of like agency
performing agency in Nashville
and we were talking to them and trying to see like
hey do we want to get on your guys's um

(07:55):
touring list basically and like
tour to the places you would book us etcetera
and the guy said wait a second
what are your kids doing and long story short
he said you need to talk to my wife
who ended up being Cherise Bultori
who was over the um
songwriters at NSA
the National Songwriters Association International

(08:17):
and he said you've got to talk to her
this I think this will be really helpful
so even though we were talking for business
in terms of like performing
it ended up connecting us with her wife
with his wife and um
we came to Nashville met with her
and I like
I brought these two songs
Laura that I was like
oh my gosh

(08:38):
this is like
the next Martina McBride smash
and I still remember to this day like
playing it for her live like
feeling so confident they had this beautiful like um
you know grand piano in NSA
I right downtown on Music Row
and I'm like
playing it for her and it was called spring cleaning

(08:59):
and it's like I'm spring cleaning you out of my life
like I still like I
it's like
haunts me but like
in a in a like
no whatever
you know you were learning kind of way
um
and yeah
and she was so sweet she was like OK
I can tell you guys have a lot of Broadway experience
and I was like no no no
this is country and she's like

(09:20):
I can tell you have a lot of experience with Broadway
and performing now we're gonna get you like
if you wanna do country great
but you've gotta like
you know so anyway we
we showed her a couple different songs
she was so amazing we talked um
forever and uh
yeah and then from there it basically was like

(09:41):
if you wanna do this you can
but this is how hard you have to work
here's the competition and not like
competition like oh
like Dog Eat World but just more like
this is the bar
I guess I should say that's a better word for it
I think like
here's the standard of excellence
and
like
you know it's like those people who are like constantly

(10:02):
I'm not super sporty but what is it in the Olympics
like they like
jump over that like
really tall oh yes
high jump high jumper
yeah high jumper whatever
I don't know what you're talking about
like yeah whatever
you know you can tell we're in music
but um
I feel like it's like that right
where it's like you have to know that bar to know like
not just to meet it but to like

(10:23):
jump over it yeah um
and then it's constantly being raised
you know which is so exciting
yeah um
cause it really leveled the playing field
now with the internet and
you know it's like
more and more
and more people have access to writing music
and recording music and releasing music and
and um

(10:43):
and yeah
just being involved in that world
so you know
more people are doing it
so the bar just gets higher and higher and higher
I can totally see that what do you
what do you do mostly now
do you write for others do you have your own project
or what's a little bit of both
but I would say mostly writing for other artists
okay and just like

(11:04):
trying to help them
right what's on their heart
you know yeah
so so okay
cause this is what we did right
like I was like
the artist and you were like
I don't know how but you were somehow put to
to like
right with me haha
assigned to write with me right
um so we showed up to Matt's studio and

(11:27):
shout out to Matt Bronley
yes he is the bomb
I remember I brought grant
my husband I brought him down once to meet Matt
when we were recording vocals
this was like a year after we wrote the song
yes
and so grant watched him work while I was in the studio
like in the vocal booth
and we left that session and grant was like

(11:50):
that man is a freaking wizard
he works so fast and is so good
grant is not easily impressed
but man was he impressed so hahaha
he loved Matt too I love Matt
Matt is fantastic yes
Matt is amazing I love any chance I get to
to write with him yes yes
it's great so
you know what we did was we were

(12:13):
the three of us in Matt's studio
Matt created the track I mean
first we had a chat about what do we wanna write about
and I would usually come in with a song title
and an idea of what that song could be about
yeah and then that was it
like no lyrics
no melodies no track
no chord progression no nothing right

(12:33):
just an idea and a song title
and then Matt would be like alright cool
got it
he would just create a track on the spot out of nothing
again Wizard
and then you and I would you know
come up with lyrics and melodies to go over that track
essentially what we were doing is toplining right
mm hmm and Matt was the

(12:55):
the producer for the track and all that stuff
so we were toplining
and I did not know that that's what people did
top lining I didn't even know that top lining existed
like I had no clue
and so my question for you is
what do your sessions with all these artists look like
now is it similar

(13:15):
or do you ever also create core progressions
do you mostly just topline
what does it look like it depends on the session
so I would say probably a balance of both
a mix of both okay
um the
I think there's like
beauty and um
adjective like
especially for artists

(13:35):
I think it's important to have a mix of how you write
okay because when you're just top lining
like you're saying
you know it's great
but sometimes it can be a crutch
because you get so lenient and or not lenient
dependent on the track and sometimes like oh

(13:57):
I hate to say names because I could be wrong
but I want to say it was maybe like
Luke Bryan or somebody that was um
but maybe don't quote me in case it's not
but yeah
it was a famous country male country artist
let's say that um
but one time he was like oh man
this song is awesome and
and somebody in his camp was like

(14:18):
no man
that song is crap and he's like
no man
listen it's so great
and the guy finally like
stripped back the track and was like
listen to the song played it on guitar
and he's like oh
you're right that's it
that's you know like
like not that it was like
the worst song in the world
but because the track was so fun

(14:38):
it kind of like
disguised the more mediocre
average lyric melody mmm hmm right
and so like
writing with a track is amazing if you can also
make sure your lyrics and melody are matching that
does that make sense no absolutely
um and so I know like

(14:59):
that's kind of like a Tangent to what you asked
but I think that's super important
since a lot of people I'm guessing
that listen to this are artists
like I think that's super important to um
be considerate of and be mindful of
balancing how you write so that it like
shakes things up yeah
you know yeah

(15:20):
so that you don't get too dependent on one way
so that is one way I still write a lot
so I'll go in with a producer just like we did with you
and it'll it'll mostly just be the melody and lyrics
that we have to worry about
um I would say though
a good chunk of what I'm doing is me at the piano
even if it's meant to be a guitar song

(15:40):
me at the piano with the artist deciding the chords
deciding the melody deciding the tempo
deciding the rhythm
and then using our imaginations to go
what would we want this to sound like
Allah which song
yep can we hear
you know what I mean yeah
like and so we'll put in like
production notes in the little Google DOC of our lyrics

(16:01):
and say we could hear this sounding like
fill in the blank mm hmm
consider this tempo or this style of
um production or string section or whatever
yep and reference different songs
so that way when it goes to a producer
they have like a little
a guideline like an idea of what you want it to be

(16:24):
cause it's not like I mean
ultimately we're not the producer once
once it leaves our hands it's like
it's like your baby right
you're just like oh my gosh
I really love with you love you with blonde hair
but if you end up with purple hair
love you too you know
but like yeah yeah
you kind of have hopes
for what you want your song babies to sound like
and look like and all that kind of stuff right

(16:45):
yeah um
so we try to put in those production notes
just to help guide like you're saying
and give some reference
of what we were hearing as we wrote it
okay so that's another way of songwriting
is just doing it stripped down
bare bones no track
it's just gonna be a rough work tape
and a lot of times it's not even a studio work tape

(17:05):
where it's like punch in Punch Out
it's literally like your voice memo on your iPhone hmm
to just say uh huh
record and we'll do a few takes
and after that we're done
and you just pick your favorite one
you know what I mean yeah yeah
do you mostly work with or like
write with the artist
or do you ever also just write songs for people

(17:28):
well I do both but I would say
ninety something percent is with that artist now
with the artist okay
just because it's just labels and the
the change in the industry
like there are certain artists
like Celine Dion does not care if her name is on a song
hmm she will take outside songs all day long

(17:49):
but for the most part
I would say all these up and coming artists um
the labels are gonna want them on there
they wanna they wanna be on there right
because they have something to say
I think a lot of artists now
are coming from a place of wanting to say something
more than just
I love my voice and I want it to be heard
yeah if that makes sense

(18:10):
I was still in that generation
I still just wanted to sing
and you know what and I love that
I love that because
because then you're just getting like
these killer voices right
so there's beauty to both
like I'm not knocking that
I love it I love the people who just want to sing
because their voice is that good
you know see
I think my voice is not good enough to be just a singer

(18:31):
so hahaha
I was like alright
I gotta learn how to write haha
hey you know what whatever
whatever you want but these
these artists that you write with
especially like the up and coming ones right
like they don't have a hit song yet
they're just kind of like starting out
uh how experienced with songwriting are these artists

(18:52):
I would say it depends there are some that really
actually blow me away and I go wow
you are a true songwriter
and then there are others that have something to say
but have never explored expressing it in songwriting
um so something you already mentioned earlier
I try unless unless it's like

(19:16):
you know I can't get a hold of the artist or what not
I try really hard to ask the artist
to bring in a short list of titles
that they wanna write
because it helps me a couple things
it helps me get to know the artist
I I do two things
I say send me some songs you love

(19:37):
that you wish you had written
just like 1 or 2 or or a sound that you love for you
which sometimes can be funny cause artists are like
I don't sound like anyone right
yeah yeah yeah
I sound like myself yeah
but um
but you get what I think you get what I mean
so people that you know
songs they wish they had written
or the sound etcetera

(19:58):
and then um
the titles and the reasons for the titles are because
it helps me see a little bit into who they are
currently um
depending on the nature of their titles
you can kind of tell are they in a happy place
are they in a dark place are they in a um
super confident place

(20:18):
or are they in a vulnerable place like you
yeah you can just really get to know an artist
sorry looks like I'm waving
I just realized that oh haha um
you're like
season pro at this but
you know little newbie over here um
so uh
anyway so yeah
so you get to know them through their song titles
but also it gives them a feeling of like

(20:41):
I'm participating in this songwriting
because they brought the title
yeah does that make sense
like
it gives them a chance to be like
this is what's on my heart
and so even if they don't yet know how to craft that
they can feel like
they actually did have a part in the songwriting
because they did yeah
because the title is huge right

(21:02):
the title's gonna shape your song
it's gonna tell the story
it's gonna give you like
a launching board it's
it's gonna drive all your lyrics to that hook
and I'm so yeah
I'm just looking up uh
my song White Light uh
5,000 miles right now credits yeah

(21:22):
there you are yup
you're on here okay
cause when you're like you know
I'm trying to see uh
what state of mind is is the
is the is this artist in right now and uh
you remember I'm from Switzerland right
yes but do you know what
I remember why we wrote this now
that you're bringing up that title
yep 5,000 miles
I got interrogated by the um

(21:45):
immigration officers in the Chicago airport
like a week before our writing session
and so I I came down to Nashville to write with you
and I was like guess what just happened to me haha
we should write a song about this
and we did and do you wanna know the funniest thing

(22:06):
that song was never released as a single
it was never submitted to songwriting contests
like White Lies that we wrote
uh huh
but it is the song with the most streams of my platform
of my album that's so interesting
yeah you never know which ones are gonna go
it is crazy but I truly and

(22:27):
but when people message me about it
like today still
I have like people that message me about like
my music or a song that they found
and I'm like where the heck did you find this
it's been eight years haha
but when people message me
they always almost always message me about 5,000 miles
it's almost always that song
yeah well
and I think too you can kind of hear the heart

(22:48):
yes because if I remember right too
besides the um
immigration experience it was also because
you were having a long distance relationship right
it was gonna be a long distance relationship
if they would take me and yeah
deport me yeah
so like
because like I
right yeah
so you know
Switzerland versus you know
the States

(23:08):
and so I think you could feel that in the lyrics
you have that like
angst and vulnerability of sharing that
and people relate when you share your heart
yeah that's definitely
people want people want people to share their hearts
yes yes
and I
I definitely would say that was my most vulnerable song
uh where I

(23:28):
you know put in all of my heart
my emotion my
my everything much more so than the others
doesn't mean that
the other songs didn't mean anything to me right
but they were not that raw maybe
maybe that's the right way to put it
and I know like it I think
for a lot of people
who are just getting started with songwriting

(23:49):
it can feel so hard
to really be so vulnerable in what you're writing
cause you don't want people to judge you right
yeah hahaha
but there can be or like
we'll have times
where someone will tell me the juiciest story
and I'm like let's write that
and then they're like I can't
yeah I'll be so mortified if this person hears it

(24:10):
they'll know it's about them
I'm like who cares
it's a great story we'll change the names
yes like
no one has to know and they're like
they will know right
so it's like getting over that hump to go
okay am I willing to expose that part of my heart
and put it out there right like

(24:32):
and I'm not talking like be
be nasty to people I'm not saying that
but just like
to share your story in a way that is authentic
because that's what people connect with and resonate
yeah when they
they can tell when it's a
and that's like experience from the stage
people could tell like
the songs we were singing
there were certain ones that

(24:52):
like I if I was going through a breakup
or if I was in love or if
whatever it was at the time
people afterwards in the show
you know they would come up afterwards and be like
oh my gosh
that particular one yeah right
and it was usually
whatever was going on in my life at that time
where they could really feel that wow
extra emphasis right
that I didn't really realize I was putting on that song

(25:15):
but yet they could sense that and feel that
like energetically
you know what I mean yeah
it translates so well
one thing that I'm hearing you say is you really
like when you first
especially when you first meet someone
like a new artist that you're writing with um
you really try to get to know them
and have them tell you stories

(25:37):
so like
you know they have a
a title like 5,000 Miles or whatever
and they're like alright cool
tell me the story around this
like why 5,000 miles
what happened what's going on
and I so
I have a four step lyric writing formula
that I use myself to write songs
but that I'm also teaching to our
to our students um

(25:58):
when they you know
first learn about songwriting
because I've always been a terrible lyric writer
I would always struggle very much to put my
my thoughts and emotions out there on a piece of paper
and then I always also say
you know English second language over here
my vocabulary is limited and you know
it's like alright
you know it's
it is what it is and
but this four step lyric writing formula really

(26:19):
really helped me
and step two in that formula is topic writing
so just basically you know
you have your topic or your song title or whatever
and then you just write about that topic
or
you have a conversation with someone around that topic
so you can really get all of your thoughts
and all of your emotions and all of your feelings

(26:40):
and everything on a piece of paper
before you start writing lyrics
before you map out the song or anything
because I feel like a lot of people
and again myself included
when I first started out
I would have like an initial idea
and then just immediately start writing lyrics
and I would always get stuck somewhere
and then the lyrics would be very me

(27:03):
you know OK
and yeah and so this really helped me
cause a lot of times
I would just pull lyrics from that topic writing
and I remember when we were writing 5,000 miles too
you know you were like alright
well walk me through step by step what happened
and the lyrics are literally like
frozen in a crowded room full of strangers
where are you

(27:26):
I think something like that is like the first verse
and like
I literally remember describing that room to you
and we were like alright
here's the verse right
and like it's yeah
we just used those words I
I feel like a lot of times
people wanna sound very poetic and clever
and I'm like well actually
can we just tell the story

(27:48):
yeah it doesn't need it
and if you can do both great
yeah yeah
like if you can tell the story in a way that's like
super full of visual and imagery
I love it right
and then sometimes like
I was just listening to a song on the radio today
that I was like there is no visual imagery in here
but I'm still hooked it felt really right

(28:09):
and so like you know
I think you gotta learn the rules before you break them
kind of thing
and I think like I would always encourage artists
to really dig into good lyrics
because you can always trim back and go
you know not visual and not imagery
but boy is it nice to have some good furniture
and not just tell me you had a couch

(28:31):
but like
what did it smell like what did it look like
what was the color you know
was it faded was it your grandma's like
um did it squeak when you sat down
you know so
I don't know I think I love the topic writing
I remember a songwriting camp I went to when
I don't actually
we hadn't even moved
my family hadn't even moved to Nashville yet

(28:53):
my brother and I
just came out for the songwriting camps
through NSA and not that this is a plug for NSA
I love NSA but not like they're
they're not like
sponsoring or anything it's just
that's where a lot of my early songwriting camps and
you know experiences came from
but um
I remember them saying like
every morning just keep a notepad by your bed

(29:14):
and before your like
feet hit the floor just literally do like
a free write for like
two to five minutes it's
and like
don't tell yourself what's right
it's literally just like
whatever comes to head so it's just like
almost like a stream of consciousness
um is it our conscience
what is it screamers conscience
yeah I think so
you know what I'm saying yeah
it's either conscience or consciousness whatever

(29:34):
yeah
it's it starts with the letter C um
and just like right
you know and just because then all of a sudden
you can go back and circle certain words
that you're like oh
my gosh that could be a really cool title or
oh wow that was actually like
this connects here and you kind of start like do do do
do do
do do
you know I'm so glad you're talking about this

(29:56):
cause that's literally what we do
when we do topic writing right
I was like alright
you're gonna have
that's what it reminded me of with the topic writing
you have your title in there
you probably have a lot of lyrics in there
you might have like an overall theme in there
that you can then find relative words for
to make your lyrics sound more clever
and you know
there's like all these things that you can do
but just practicing
getting your thoughts out on a piece of paper I

(30:17):
I really think this is why so many people
you know struggle with like
anxiety and uh similar kinds of
of um
of emotions where
we don't know how to
process our own thoughts and feelings anymore
because we always distract ourselves with this
beautiful thing like

(30:38):
don't get me wrong
I love my phone and it comes with me everywhere I go
and I am very much addicted to it
I'm not even gonna pretend like I'm not
but uh
it is it's a beautiful thing
but also a little bit of a dangerous thing
where it's like
we never process our thoughts and our emotions anymore
and I think that's why a lot of people feel

(30:59):
anxious underneath
because they don't really know what's going on
and this stream of consciousness writing that you said
in the in the morning
that can really help with that
journaling can help with that
which is I guess
is something similar to that
or then the topic writing
when you're sitting down to write a song
which is so so exciting or
and I think this is basically what you're saying

(31:20):
topic writing but someone else would it
tell me if this is what you're saying
actually let me make sure I'm
that we're talking the same thing
cause someone also told me at one of those camps to be
like pick a topic
and then write everything you can
about just that topic
so like
you could say like
red car or whatever or like
gas station that would be like object writing

(31:44):
okay right
like when you're
that's why I was trying to figure out with your topic
if that's what you meant
but that's another way to do it right
where you're just kind of like
it's just a random thing and then just
yep right yep
you know that's object writing
and that's definitely also a great
great way to go about it uh
Coach Juliana on our team
likes to talk about object writing
as well because um

(32:06):
she says it really helps her figure out
different ways of saying the same thing
right and not just like
kind of the first thing that comes to mind
but then also figuring out
well how else can I just describe this object
this thing right
yeah and then
or write a story about it
or write a story make up a story right
like hey

(32:26):
what happened at the gas station
was this where they broke up
was this where he found this person
you know what I mean yeah
did he find a wallet on the ground and it like
I don't know you just
the world's your oyster and come make up a story
you know what's funny uh grant
that's the only person I hang out with
so that's why I talk about grant a lot
but hahaha um

(32:47):
he loves listening to fiction books to fall asleep to
and uh and when he's on vacation
he just listens to audio books
and you know that's just what he likes to do
but always fiction not like self help books or whatever
he doesn't like that just fiction books
and then one night we were laying in bed and he said
you know what I find so interesting

(33:08):
and what
I just really don't understand how people do it
I don't understand how they write books
I don't understand how they can just
come up with all of these ideas
and just make up these stories
and I was like what
what do you what do you mean you don't
hahaha
he's such an engineer such
so like math focused and following rules and

(33:29):
you know he yeah
it's it's so
so interesting how it can be so foreign for people
to just make things up make up your own story
be a little kid again right
and play pretend essentially
it's great there are so many ways to get like ideas
but I think for me regardless of like

(33:51):
in terms of writing
sure you could start with a melody
sure you can start with a chord progression
but ultimately
I really wanna know what that hook is and that title is
before I get too far down the road
I know some people start just noodling
and then whatever title falls out as
it falls out fine but for me

(34:12):
I wanna know where I'm driving to
because then I know where to
where to steer the car you know what I mean
like it's not just like
I'm on an ocean and wherever the wind blows
which is great like
it does work I'm not saying it doesn't but I think
for a lot of aspiring artists
especially if they're new to songwriting

(34:34):
it's really helpful to have somewhere to point to
you know like
a little end goal um
because then what happens is it's gonna influence
you're like oh wait
okay this is like
like 5,000 miles
sure we could have made it a happy
like pop song
but that wasn't your story right

(34:56):
so because we knew that's what it was
we knew it would influence like
Matt could go oh
this is gonna be a more emotionally charged um
ballad versus like
this dance like whatever right
and then we knew how to like
set up the verses and and the chorus
because every line like
that's another thing I Learned
they're like the

(35:17):
the test of a good title and a good song is if like
every line can like
lead to the hook so if
if you're like there was this song that um
called Billboard Girl that I wrote with my brother Doug
and then um
one of my good buddies Garen Brett and
and like
literally every single line went straight to the title

(35:40):
and it won the grand prize
of the International Songwriting Contest
for NSA and CMT which was funny cause CMT's country
but they were so like
impressed with the actual lyrics
they're like what in the world
like we don't care that this is like
super pop like
this is incredible writing and
and that was like one of those things where I'm like
wow you really can read every single line of this lyric

(36:03):
and it's leading you to the hook
do you mind share like
showing us the example do you remember um
okay I'm trying to think Lisa
another blind date with another Mister Cal
so another blind date with another Mister Calvin Klein
the man's just um
consumed with himself and a waitress named Michelle
throwing down pickup lines

(36:25):
so it's like billboard girl right
he wants a billboard girl
so every every lines leading to that
I see this ending early see this ending early
as he puts her number in his phone
um
I reach for my purse in my coat and or keys in my coat
something like that and I ask it if we can go
and he says what for
and then the chorus is
I think you want a Hollywood smile um

(36:47):
gosh this has been years
what is it I think you want a Hollywood smile
tomorrow she'll be yesterday's news
walking out the same door she came through
and I'm not that billboard girl
and so but do you see what I'm saying
where it's like you could go

(37:08):
every single line was straight to Billboard Girl
like it wasn't like oh
where are they going with this story
veering to the left or right
it was like it kept it kept going
you know um
and then Garen came in with a really cool
like some pop jazz chords
you know that really helped that as well
but yeah
anyway so that's just like a random example of

(37:30):
of if you can get your songs where
like every line
the hook pays off
where you could read a line and then read the title
and it makes sense uh huh
then you're you're on the right track
okay um
I've never never even thought about that
I'm gonna see if any of my songs do that
or if I need to start rewriting

(37:50):
you're like you're like Kaylee
and we're rewriting all of them
we didn't we didn't hit the nail on the head
hey we won the John Lennon Songwriting Contest
yeah I think we did
we did what I'm saying
so even if we didn't know the rules
then you can break them so yes yes
well know the rules so you can break them
what would you say like
you know
for people listening and they're new to songwriting
what would you say

(38:11):
are some of the most important songwriting rules
oh gosh
I mean
I think it's different for everyone
but like
have something like again
drive to the hook I think that's such a rule like
like when you think about like
Taylor Swift is such a master at
all of her lyrics lead you to that hook

(38:32):
they're always paying off that title
um so
you know I
I would honestly say I don't know if this is a rule
but a suggestion is
make a list of like
10 songs that you wish you would have written
and then study the heck out of them and go
what's their rhyme structure
what's their song structure

(38:53):
is it verse chorus
verse chorus bridge
chorus or is it verse verse
bridge which is probably more country than
than pop but you know what I'm saying
like just like
see what
what is it is it the chords that you like
is it the beat that you like
is the melody like how
what's their arc is it like
are the verses down here and then the melody pops

(39:15):
are the verses up here and the melody goes down
there needs to be you know
it's like kind of a roller coaster right
like you don't want everything just same
here's my melody and I never change
and it never goes up or anything
you know yeah yeah yeah
um contrast
we need rhythm yeah
like the contrast and all that stuff
like just like
really analyze

(39:36):
I think I analyzed probably 60 different songs
just trying to see like and I
so I did this I did two different things
I analyzed songs I loved
and then I analyzed the No. 1 songs of that entire year
on the country chart and on the pop chart
whatever genre you're hoping to write in

(39:57):
analyze those songs
cause there's a reason why some of them are going No. 1
right maybe there are some politics involved
but ultimately a great song is gonna make its way
and so if you can analyze those and go oh
this is what they're using
this is you know
these are the rhymes these are

(40:17):
this is how long it is like
I literally picked it apart
every single song and it just kind of helps
like scrub your ears and retrain and rewire your brain
to look at songs in a different light
and it is a business right
like you said it's a career
it's a profession so like

(40:37):
you have to treat it as such
and that doesn't mean you lose the magic of it
but you do have to treat it seriously to go
oh yeah
like
I'm not just here throwing paint as a wall for a hobby
if you're doing it for a hobby
knock yourself out but if you're wanting to like
play with the big guys like
you've got to know there are
there are things so that's what I would say

(40:58):
like say with the rules
look at what's going on in this year's music
because the rules kind of change a little bit each year
and maybe rules is not the right word
but hopefully you catch my no
absolutely you catch my drift yeah
this is actually the second thing that we teach people

(41:20):
in our songwriting for singers program
and it's like
super beginner friendly right
this is for people that they have a bunch of ideas
but they don't really know how to turn them into songs
um or they started
but they always get stuck
and they just they don't really know how to
initially get the idea from here
onto an actual piece of like

(41:41):
not a piece of paper but like
an actual song right
and so the first thing is like
well let's figure out what you like because
because we teach voice lessons
I work with a lot of different singers
and a lot of them like
I would ask them before we start singing well
what do you like to listen to
and then they usually say everything
a lot of them say everything
and I'm like alright
well give me a couple artists

(42:02):
a couple bands that you like
and then really quickly I'm like no
you like a very particular thing
but okay
a lot of people just have no idea what they like
and so you know
the first thing and sometimes
it takes the exploring to discover what you like
exactly so I love that you're asking that question
like you're getting curious about the person
so they can then get curious about themselves

(42:22):
yes so anyway
and a part of that is writing down same
like you said you know
tell me a couple songs that you wish you wrote
that is on that list of questions to like
figure out what do you even like
um that's
that's on there as well
so they ask themselves all these questions
and then the next step step two
is Alrighty
let's go analyze all these songs and figure out

(42:43):
what about those songs do you like
and um I guess we don't go as nitty gritty as
as um
as what you're doing with like
the timing like
how long is each phrase and the whole song
and then each section and um
but we do analyze what is the rhythmic structure
obviously but also um
and the rhyme structure is what I was trying to say

(43:04):
sorry the rhyme structure
but even rhythm too
I would say rhythm and
because if things are like
super the whole time it's obnoxious
so you need like
a balance of like
get you some long notes
but then get some fun rhythms in there
right so I love that you accidentally said that cause
yeah
I love the rhythm I love analyzing rhythms as well
well you know how you have like

(43:25):
a B a B
rhymes or a B
B a
or a a
B B
or whatever a lot of people know that about rhymes
because that's kind of what we learn in school in like
English class or whatever language right
we learn that in school already
but a lot of people don't understand that
you can do the same thing for melodies
so you can see what is the structure of these melodies

(43:45):
which ones repeat which ones are different
and um
just kind of like
not even looking at or listening to the song
but just looking at what is that melodic structure
it's almost like yeah
I can kind of sing this song to you now
even though I have no idea what it sounds like
but yeah
like it would be something similar
at least you could draw it too
some people if you're visual

(44:06):
you know you could draw the melody that you're hearing
yeah seeing where it dips
where it goes high you know
oh I love that
I've seen people do that too
and that kind of just gives you that idea to
to where you realize it's not all yes
I actually do that when I teach singers how to riff
I would like
make them draw out the riff
usually we would use like
little bars like

(44:27):
each bar is a note so we can see is it going up
is it going down is it the same note
is there a big jump a smaller jump
and then that way
you can do it without knowing how to read music
or write down music right
you don't need to know any theory or anything
you can just rely on your ears and then draw it out
and so I never considered
about drawing out the melodies that you're writing

(44:48):
I only ever considered doing this for riffs
but that makes yeah
so much sense ugh
thank you for that I'm gonna start using that too
to visualize visualize the melodies that
I'm glad one thing can be helpful
more than one thing let me tell you
well okay
so here's a here's a weird thing
um you know
when I was putting together this

(45:09):
songwriting for singers program
I was going through all of my old songs that I wrote um
not the the ones on the album
but other songs that I wrote by myself and um
was just like OK
well do I remember these songs
cause they're eight eight
nine 10 years old
like do I remember any of these
and funny enough

(45:32):
the ones that I finished I remember all of them
the ones that I didn't finish
I was like yeah
I don't really like
I would remember a little bit of it
but I'm like
I don't remember how the verse goes and what not
but I would remember a lot of these songs
and one song on there
I just was thinking about again today
like literally 30 minutes before
we hopped on this podcast recording

(45:55):
and it's called fireflies um
because I had never seen fireflies in my life until my
it was technically my second date with grant
and he took me to a fourth of July party
and it was out in the country okay
in the cornfields
and a little different than Switzerland
very different we don't have fireflies in Europe

(46:17):
so I was like wow
this is crazy because
the entire field lit up with millions of fireflies
and it created these beautiful waves
like it almost looked like an ocean moving
because like
you know they would like
blink the it was incredible
I loved it so I found the song again and I was like
I like the idea of the song so much

(46:39):
but it's just not I
I created a verse refrain song out of it
rather than like a regular like
chorus song and I'm like alright
let's see if we can change the melodies of this and
like rewrite this
but still keep that same idea
so again literally like 30 minutes ago
I uh
pulled up YouTube and typed in like
type beats so I would

(47:00):
could find some tracks to write to
and I found a country track that was like hmm
cause I literally talk about like
Indiana and sunset like it
it could totally be a country song right
and then I just kind of
started rewriting the melodies and the lyrics
a little bit to that like
so that it would work with this country track
that I found and I'm like okay

(47:21):
I like this a lot better it's still like
not great but I already like it a lot better
so maybe I I will go and
and finish finish up that
that song I love it
yeah cause rewriting
I mean that's where it's at
that's what do they say that's where the money's at
I think that's what they say
yeah because a lot of times
the songs that end up getting recorded

(47:41):
are the ones that were rewritten
not always but a lot of times
um so yeah
I mean just at least
like all the songs I've had on radio
I think we've rewritten at least a little bit of them
okay and so
for what it's worth no
I think a lot of people there's
there is value in rewriting
yeah I think a lot of people think

(48:02):
that the first thing that they write
needs to be great and it is like yes
this is gonna be the song
and
I think it's more important to just get your thoughts
and everything on the piece of paper first
and then like alright
now I have the the outline of the song
like I have the melodies
I have the lyrics
now I can go in and edit and make tweaks to it
and make it and make it better
I know it's so hard to just not get

(48:24):
not get stuck in the thing that you already created
cause once you have it in your head
it's hard to it's hard to forget it
yes and
and hear something different
yeah but I mean
think about that like for people with books or
or even kids in college like
can you imagine being like OK
go write your essay the first thing that comes out
it has to be flawless boom

(48:45):
like are you kidding me
no professor would expect that right
yeah um
that is a great comparison
of course
of course you're going to get it out and then be like
hey what do I love about it
okay maybe I wanna move some puzzle pieces around
to make it fit better
maybe I'm gonna just take this out completely
this paragraph out of the essay

(49:05):
right like
I feel like so many other careers and um
not just careers but like
what people do in terms of writing are so lenient
to be like of course
you're gonna revise and edit
and red line and all the stuff
but then when it comes to songs
it's like don't touch it
it's like of course you're gonna touch it

(49:26):
like yes
make it better you know
every once in a while a song is gonna fall out
and you don't have to touch it
but a good chunk of times
you're gonna need to red line some stuff
and you have to be okay with like
redlining your baby you know
yeah oh
not personal yeah
not personal but it feels so personal right
it's like ah

(49:46):
that nose was a little crooked
let's make that a little bit more straight
I just did a writer's round with Tony Martin
he is a um
he has like 16
16 or 17 NUMBER1 hits in country music
yeah um
and he's getting inducted
into the Songwriters Hall of Fame in like
I guess a week
I think yeah

(50:06):
cause it'll be October so anyway
I'm doing this writers round with him
and he was talking about how um
he's like you know
your songs are like your children right
everyone feels that he's like
some of them actually grow up
to go on and make a living
and then some of them he's like
some of them stay in your basement
because they're too artsy
you know and he's like

(50:27):
you gotta like
you gotta be okay with being like
hey let me give you a launching board
to actually make a living
you know yeah
and not just like
be like but this is mine
it's like great
you can have that it's gonna be living in your basement
the rest of your life so yes
figure out what you want yeah
do you want it to go earn a living
or do you want it to live in your basement

(50:47):
so I love that that um
thank you so much Kaylee
and like
no just for coming on here
but also for you know
really kind of like
showing me how it's done eight
nine years ago whenever that was and uh
you know for writing these amazing songs with me
I'm really like the

(51:08):
the songs that we created there
I was like wow
yeah like
just that the writing process and the
the songs like
how they turned out
was just such a beautiful experience
and I was like wow
like we did this
we created something out of nothing
this is incredible so I loved that experience
you know even though I'm really
no longer at all pursuing an artist career

(51:30):
or anything like that
I really love being in the coaching world
this is where I feel very
very at home
but don't you feel like you doing that allows you like
you have more not just experience
but perspective
you have a different perspective on how to coach
well duh
whereas had you never done that

(51:51):
you would just you know
it would be a different type of coaching right
no 100%
and uh that's why I'm so grateful that
that I got to do it because it
it showed me what the real world looks like
cause like we we learn a lot in school about
you gotta do this and you gotta do that
and then you go and do your job and you're like ha
nothing I Learned prepared me for this

(52:12):
thank you very much yes
and people think that's just in the music
but that's real life just no ever parenthood
marriage anything right
yes you're like
oh yeah wait
I thought I had it figured out
just kidding just kidding
you gotta go and and live it and do it
and so that's why I'm so grateful that I
that I got to have this experience
even though you know
I realized yeah

(52:33):
maybe I don't wanna be the next Lady Gaga
cause that sounds exhausting hahaha
but you have to show up to figure it out
yes right
like that's half the battle
just show up like to all these artists and songers
just show up start doing it
because you'll figure out what you really want
and for some people it is like
oh my gosh I wanna be an artist

(52:54):
I have no desire to write or I wanna be an artist
and I wanna write what's on my heart
or you know what
I actually like you said
I don't actually wanna be the next Lady Gaga
I don't actually want to do that
but I do wanna write or I do wanna coach or whatever
like it's just
I feel like you show up and magic happens
and it just leads you to the next thing

(53:15):
yeah you know
and there might be some some hardships along the way
cause like
I went through an entire identity crisis
when I realized that
maybe I actually don't wanna do this
cause my entire life I was like
I'm going to be a star in Hollywood period right
and then I was so hard
when you have that pivot and that realization
I felt so guilty I felt so guilty

(53:37):
and also you know
towards my parents
cause I was so lucky to have such supportive parents um
that were like yeah
like you go follow your dreams
like let's go do this
but uh
you know I was like
now I don't want to do it anymore
and I don't wanna disappoint them
and I don't wanna disappoint myself
and I don't want people to think I quit
because I'm not good enough
and I can't make it you know
but I just didn't wanna do it anymore

(53:59):
so I went through a whole identity crisis
and it took me months like
it took me more than a year to be like alright Laura
like
you don't have to do this if you don't wanna do this
yeah like you can
you are allowed to pivot and do something else
so it's not it's not easy
but you gotta show up to figure that out
like you said 100% yeah yeah no
I had a similar experience when um

(54:20):
right before I got married
and I had finished with my family
like performing
like after 25 years you know
of doing it and I met with some record labels
and we were looking into the solo artist route
and I just kept going do I actually want this
like I love singing

(54:41):
I love performing like
put me on a stage I am at home
like it is my happy place
but I had grown up performing and touring all over
and at some point I was like
I'm down the road when I have kids
which I do now I'm like
I don't want to be gone 10 months out of the year
yeah and so I knew like all the different steps
like to really hustle and make it as an artist

(55:02):
and if you're doing radio tours
and all these different things um
and also coming from the variety show I came from
it was I loved all the styles of music
uh huh so how the heck am I gonna pick one genre
and not just one genre but within
say if I chose country
what kind of country yeah right yeah
what kind of female country artist

(55:24):
is it more the Dolly Parton
or is it more the Carrie Underwood
big vocal right
like there were
so are Martina McBride at the time
whoever and um
so I think the cool part though
is all of this stuff
is a training ground for the next thing
whether you land in this or not
and it it's just worth it
you show up and
like you said there it is hard

(55:45):
but when you
once you start realizing what you really want
all of a sudden that hard stuff is worth it
because you're like oh
this is part this is part for the course
like I have to work hard at this
like I
because like
for example
I don't know how how long this is
so I'll I'll hurry quick
no no no
go ahead I have all the time
if it cuts off at a certain time

(56:06):
no it doesn't
but like
coming from the show town I was in
a lot of these amazing artists were there
but they were there to retire
and so there was like
this amazing energy I loved it
it was so cool and then when you move to Nashville
no one here was looking to retire
they're all looking to launch

(56:26):
so there's a totally different energy
right yes
it's like both are great places
it's just what were you trying to do
and so when I moved to Nashville
it was like holy cow
if I'm going to do this I have to do it
because these other people are
literally starving themselves to make ends meet right
like they are busting their chops to like

(56:48):
play these crazy gigs downtown
like ten PM to 2:00am and all this stuff
just to like
get seen and get noticed and all this
all these things and then going to the um
oh gosh
if you've never been to a country music session
like a tracking session anyone listening
do yourself a favor
and come to a tracking session in Nashville

(57:10):
it will blow your mind these
these musicians literally hear a work tape
one time through maybe not even the whole way through
and then they go and record a song
that literally sounds in one pass
like a real record like
it's not like they
they are so gifted and so locked in in what they do

(57:33):
in their craft
and so when you see that talent and you see that level
that standard you're like
oh my gosh
this is what it takes
if I want to play with the big guys
you know what I'm saying so it just
I don't know I think it's
I think it's so great to explore and see what
see what you love and see where you land
because it's always worth it

(57:54):
like I feel like anything regardless
it's always gonna be worth it if you just show up and
you know see what happens yeah
and see see what feels right and stuff
and I that's kind of where I've landed right now
do I still love doing solo stuff
you bet so I'll do some film and TV things
I have some
Providence Falls I think

(58:14):
is a song coming out on Providence Falls this fall
and I think it's hallmark
don't quote me on it but meaning
like a solo project for me
right like
it's on there but then I love like
I crave and thrive off of helping developing artists
and signed artists um
say what's on their heart
because like
sure could I write just what's for radio

(58:37):
you bet but like
it's not as satisfying and fulfilling
and so if you can get that like
say what's on their heart
and then it lands on radio
it's a sweet spot for me you know what I mean
yes or filming TV whatever
like some of our songs
I was telling you before we started
I'm like wait a second
I just saw you know
this is like
airing in other countries
like Congrats
I had no idea like

(58:58):
it's a big deal yeah
I was looking at my BMI royalties
and I was like wait a second
I've got like
payments coming in from like
other countries
for some of our songs we've done together
so I don't know
it's kind of a random Tangent
but it's just like
you know you gotta want it more than anything
but then you've also gotta be okay to pivot like

(59:20):
and be flexible yeah
if if the road takes a different turn
and just be grateful for the ride and
and be excited about it
because really cool stuff happens all along the way
you know even if it's not exactly like how you said you
you initially grew up thinking
this is what you're gonna do
you're gonna be the Lady Gaga type thing

(59:40):
and it's like but now look at how fulfilled you are
in a different way you know
yeah very different
but very happy hahaha yeah
and I think it's so cool it also had to do with other
like life circumstances too
that's when I met grant and I was like
oh well
actually
I wanna have a life with him and not be on the road
like you said you know
you wanted to have kids
and you don't wanna be gone 10 months out of the year

(01:00:01):
so what what's uh
what's next for you um
I'm still doing the radio jingles for I Heart Radio
so for people
I mean tons of them all over the country
but like Z100 in New York
um kiss FM in
in LA and then just all of them scattered throughout
I'll have to check and see

(01:00:21):
if there's one in your hometown
so I can tell you I'll be like
tune into this station but um
so I still do that and I still record for like
vocals for writers here who need a female vocalist
so that like
they'll hire me to record
so they can pitch their song to say
Kelsey Ballerini or Laney Wilson or whomever
right yeah

(01:00:42):
um anyone who's gonna take an outside song
and then
a good chunk of it is just when my kids are at school
or my I've got a little six month old
so when he's napping I jump on sessions
on writing sessions with artists and um
so it's just it's fun
it's just I feel like about monthly now
I'm seeing artists releasing songs

(01:01:03):
and I'll get messages and be like hey
I'm releasing this or hey
this one just got placed in this movie or hey
and it's just such a joy right
like it's just like
if I can play a small part in somebody else's dream
and somebody else's story
it's really really thrilling
so yeah
that's kind of that's kind of what it is
I'm in what do they call it
like I'm a mom writer

(01:01:25):
yeah where I'm
I'm momming it up and then I'm
I'm writing while they're
you know well
when you say you hop on a
you hop on a session is that like a zoom session or
yeah so sometimes they'll come to the house
and then sometimes I'll zoom in
zoom really became normal
um
after covid honestly
like or during covid yeah

(01:01:45):
because everyone wanted to still connect and write
but there was no way to uh huh
to get together you know
and so we started zooming and
and that's become a thing
wow that's really cool
cause I think a lot of people are like
I can't co write with anybody
cause I live in the middle of nowhere right
yeah
and you have to put yourself out there

(01:02:06):
you know you gotta just try and
and see who's start locally
see who's in your area and say hey
I go to shows go to different places
hey I like that sound of this person
would you like to write
that's what I did when I first moved here
it's so uncomfortable
it is so uncomfortable for at least someone like me
it's like hi
it's like you know
they always tell you like oh
like when you're young it's like

(01:02:27):
go be friends on the playground or whatever
and then you're an adult like
nobody talks to you about how awkward it is to be like
hi would you like to be my writing friend
I really like your sound I think we'd go together
it's like dating and it's so awkward
yeah like so awkward
um so it's just like but
but go ask like what's gonna kill you

(01:02:48):
they're gonna say no oh well right
move on they ghost you or say no
that's the worst thing that can happen
oh my god hahaha yeah
but it's like that's not your person to write with
if that's what happens anyway
so it's like move on
but I would say co writing is where it's at
don't don't lose your ability to write alone
but co write
co write co write
because it will open your eyes

(01:03:09):
it will open your brain it will open
it changes the way you do things
you'll still be you but just
when when you co write with a variety of people
it's like challenging the way you write
and it's allowing you it's compromise
it's marriage it's all the things
it's dating right
it's the whole like oh
it can't always be my way

(01:03:31):
right which is so hard for creatives um
and humans in general I think
but I yeah
the co writing I think would be my number one thing
if I could suggest people
come with titles
if you don't feel like you're a strong writer
come with titles it will help so much
and then um
on top of that just co write

(01:03:51):
mm hmm and see who you drive with
and write more with that you know
and see where it goes
submit your songs into song contest
all the things like
yeah anyway
help me a lot those song contest yeah
opened a lot of doors for me
so definitely yeah
cause it opens doors and and then like
you meet other people you can notice
that's another thing I would say

(01:04:12):
is look at who won the song contest
message them cold call them on Instagram right
like or not cold call
whatever you call it like DM DM yeah
slide into their DMs oh
my god it's so cringy
but you know
like slide into their DMs in a musical way and say hey
I saw you on this contest
so rad I would love to write with you
you know like just

(01:04:32):
just see and um
I don't know doesn't hurt to ask
doesn't hurt doesn't hurt
yeah well
I was so honored to be your co writer hahaha
well thanks for having
having me along with Matt
that was such a fun it's such a fun period of time
it was I would love to do it again
just for shits and giggles

(01:04:53):
you know just because
hahaha yeah
be like and like
it was so magical too
in his little treehouse remember that
like yes
we called it the treehouse
like it was above the garage and like
it just felt so fun he actually like
we were stealing away he moved his um
his studio between when we were writing
and then when I went to record
I was like oh
we're going to a different place now

(01:05:13):
yes yeah
so yeah
that was that's true
he did but it's still like
just writing in that it was
and he had his all of his books
you remember color coded yes
where it was like they were like
it was really fun and organized on the wall yes
it was like
blues and reds and yellow whatever
but it creates a beautiful space right
yeah and I think
especially when you then step into the studio to record

(01:05:36):
um the vocals and whatever it is you're recording
it's nice to have a a nice ambiance
you know yeah
feel comfortable yeah
so anyways oh
there's so much there's so much we could say
I know another time
another time there you go
thank you so much Kelly Ann
for coming on you bet
I appreciate you Whoo
if people wanted to follow along with your journey

(01:05:57):
where can they where can they find you
um Instagram
I I did have a website
and it is currently in limbo
okay cause it's like
it was like
five times as expensive to renew
and I was like uh
no thanks
I'm gonna find a different one
yeah fair enough

(01:06:17):
so it's like whatever we're
nobody needs to check my website that much
that badly um
oh I also do voice overs
that's been a fun thing to do to just shake things up
sorry
that's the only people that check my website usually
yeah yeah yeah
but um
anyway and uh
so yeah
Instagram Kayleann

(01:06:38):
I think I have like
dots after my name
because some other person who's not named Kayleann
took my handle so rude
and I tried to kindly message them
and it didn't work nobody responded
oh no
so well
that's okay I will link to it
so that people can just click on it and
and follow along to your journey and yeah
um cold

(01:06:58):
DM Kaylee and be like hey
do you wanna write with me
hahaha there we go
and see what she says and if I don't respond
it's cause I'm a mom yes
I'm like
I feel like I'm like
I used to think I was like
so young and cool and hip
and now I'm like wait
what is that term
is that what the cool kids say these days
you know what I'm not even a mom and I feel that way

(01:07:19):
I'm like I am so out of the loop
every so often I have to like
text my Gen Z friends and be like
what does this mean
my daughter will come home from school
mom do you know what this means
I'm like no
let me let me Google it
oh yeah OK
let's not use that one yeah
hahaha how old is your daughter now
she's nine and she plays violin insane

(01:07:41):
well you started her up like two
like she was so young
she was like less than one actually
oh my God Kelly and what
well because that was like what I grew up doing right
so like we had these
the violin is the smallest instrument
you can put in somebody's hand
and so like
before she was one boom
you know I did a solo at like
I think I was 15 months in Palm Springs California

(01:08:02):
I played a solo and then
you know I did the same for her
she was doing it I think she was 16 months
we had like our last family show
and she performed on stage all by herself and
and then clapped for herself after
and bowed and loved every second of it
you know and she's just been crushing it ever since
she's in the the Vanderbilt Orchestra here in Nashville

(01:08:25):
the Vanderbilt University Orchestra
and she's 9 and you just watch her walk out
and all these tall high school
you know seniors coming out and different stuff
and then here's this little nine year old
wow popping out
she's in the first violins and she just
that is incredible it's fun to see
it's fun to be able to share that love of music

(01:08:46):
you know
with your kids and see them take to it in their own way
so I can't like under one
these kids can barely walk at that age
yeah like
how do you know wow
it's insane she plays better than I do
and I'm not just saying that like
she genuinely she's excellent
it's so fun wow
and she just loves it so incredible
well you're really nurturing that right

(01:09:08):
so
that she wouldn't have just picked up a violin at one
hahaha no
so I mean
it helped that that's what
you know I grew up doing
but yeah I think that's the sorry
one more thought I think that's the other thing though
when people say oh well
I had a musical person and
and I'm not musical I'm like
but did they expose you to it
like
did your parents or whoever take you to work with them

(01:09:29):
did they show you because
I mean think about people who have like
crazy genius scientists for parents
but did they ever take them to the lab
did they ever talk about it outside of the lab
do you know what I'm saying
like yeah
there is something to be said about like
exposing your children
two things that you're passionate about

(01:09:50):
it doesn't mean that they'll take it
but it it's like
at least expose them yeah
and see where it goes you know
and then you gotta find that fine line of like
exposing but not pushing them
to do something they don't wanna do
but you want them to do right
right right
that is a hard thing to balance
oh my little boy
my my little four year old

(01:10:11):
forget it like he's
he beats to his own he like
makes his own drum he beats his own drum
like everything
so like
there is no like
my daughter was like all in
my boy is like I'll do my own thing
and you know what good for you
I love it it's exhausting
but I love it right
so oh
my gosh yeah
like you said the balance and just
but you can tell when somebody's in it

(01:10:32):
but I think just exposing them
that's half the half the thing
expose them to a lot of things
expose them to a lot of things
but um
and expose yourself to a lot of things right
like if you don't have kids
but you wanna do this stuff
go do it and expose yourself to it and just absorb it
the variety is so helpful
so helpful I love it

(01:10:53):
thank you so much Kaylee
you are the most wonderful human being
it was so great to see you again
only on so many years is this Wednesdays
I don't know whenever we're recording
only on Wednesdays am I wonderful
oh no you're always wonderful
come on and you know
you're all dolled up
even though you got three kids at home like
oh my three right
yeah yeah yeah
cause you just had another one a couple months ago

(01:11:13):
so yeah
Henderson yeah
six months so wow
well you have
you've got your hands full haha
well thank you again
and I'll link to your Instagram
so people can follow along
and thank you guys for tuning in
go follow Kaylee Ann and listen to some of her songs
cause girl can write I'll send you the link
I will send you the link of

(01:11:35):
I've got a better one than my Instagram
I have a Spotify playlist that I put your songs
are on there all the artists that release songs
I always it's like
I think the playlist is like
songs I write for other artists or something like that
wow and so I put that on there
just cause
it's exciting to see all the little song babies
that are out in the universe
with other artists so please
please please send me that playlist

(01:11:55):
I wanna listen to it I will
and link to it for sure as well
but thank you for uh
for joining and everybody listening and watching
thank you for tuning in
there's some songwriting resources in the description
below go check that out
but otherwise we'll catch you in the next episode
Alrighty bye Woohoo