April 23, 2024 • 40 mins
Welcome to episode three of Inside the Wave! Today, I had the pleasure of sitting down with one of my dedicated students, Tanner Brooks. Tanner, who owns a tree cutting service, shared his journey into Jiu Jitsu and how it has impacted his life.
Tanner recounted how he stumbled upon Jiu Jitsu through a Facebook ad offering a two-week free trial. Intrigued by the idea of trying something new and getting back into shape, Tanner decided to give it a shot. Despite initial nerves and feeling out of place in his basketball shorts among the gi-clad practitioners, Tanner found himself hooked on the art of Jiu Jitsu.
Throughout the episode, Tanner shared insights into his training approach and mindset. He emphasized the importance of showing up consistently, seeking mentors, and being open to learning from others. Tanner's dedication to self-improvement and willingness to step out of his comfort zone have been key factors in his growth as a practitioner.
We delved into Tanner's training routine, his favorite submissions (with a soft spot for the kimura), and his preference for no-gi training. Tanner also highlighted the significance of seeking mentors and engaging with educational content, such as philosophy podcasts and YouTube channels.
In a heartfelt message to parents considering Jiu Jitsu for their children, Tanner encouraged them to take that first step onto the mat, emphasizing the transformative power of the art.
Overall, Tanner's story serves as a testament to the transformative impact of Jiu Jitsu on both physical and mental well-being. His dedication, open-mindedness, and commitment to growth are inspiring reminders of the profound benefits that come from stepping onto the Jiu Jitsu mat.
If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to leave us a five-star review and share the podcast with your friends. Thank you for tuning in to Inside the Wave with Tanner Brooks!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:12):
Welcome to episode three of inside the wave today. I
am joined by one of my awesome students, probably one of the hardest working
people I know. He literally climbed out of a tree to
be here with us today. Tanner Brooks. Um, and
it's not because he's Tarzan. It's because he actually owns a tree cutting
service. Right. So Tanner, tell me, uh, tell me
(00:33):
about yourself. How long have you been with utopia? How
Yeah. So I think I've been training with you for somewhere
around three years. I'm not exactly sure, but, um, how
it actually started was time flies. Yeah. Time does fly. But
how it started was, um, I think I was on Facebook and
(00:54):
I saw like, uh, coming for a two week free
trial Jiu Jitsu. And I'm like, Oh, what's that? I
was flexing my marketing arm. Yeah. You're flexing your marketing arm
pretty hard. It kept on coming up. I don't know what it was, if it was a demographic thing
or whatever, you know, age. And then, I mean, obviously
I heard about Jiu Jitsu a few times. Um, um, and
(01:15):
I've heard like Joe Rogan talk about it a few times and stuff like that. So
then, um, I was like, well, I'll check
it out because I used to work out. Right. But, um,
what kind of stopped working out? And that was my, why'd
you stop working out? Um, I'm
not sure. So, you know, I was pretty active like in high school and
(01:38):
then I had a break and then I got really into it for a
few years. And then I think it was just work. I
think it was just like... Caught up in life. Yeah, caught up in life, working.
I alluded to you that you climbed out of a tree. I don't think I actually said you own a
(02:00):
tree removal company. Your
work is physically demanding. There can be
a lot of hours to it, especially during tree season. Right.
Very easy. Especially coming home. Like, I mean, it's dark.
Like the last thing you want to do is what
(02:26):
And I do. So like literally I take a shower twice a night,
Yup. Yup. Yup. And, uh, so, so that's what I
do. But, but back to it, I mean, I, I saw that, right. And
I wanted to, I don't get into something. And
I figured, um, I'll give it a try. So I went
(02:47):
Okay. So this is Fuji Fuji to also teach you in the Academy a
Yeah. And then what he did is he actually sent me a video
and I thought it was, I was basically nervous to
come in. Right. So he sent me a video. He's like, Hi, Tanner. You
know? Oh yeah. The personalized video personalized video. And he said, I didn't, I
didn't expect that at all. You know? And he's like, Hey,
(03:08):
you know, blah, blah, blah. Come in. Just make sure you bring shorts and t-shirts.
So I just have basketball shorts. Right. Yeah. And I think I came in
Man, I guess, you know, how old are
I guess I'm 29, but I just turned 29 in
February, end of February. So I
(03:29):
had to have been at least like 25. Yeah. That
would have to be my guess. So I mean, I was still young and I still
But you definitely had a gap between like school and training. Oh,
yeah. Right. You didn't roll straight from like college or high school
to be like, oh, here's my new thing. No. So
during that break between that and you were just, you started your own business, you
(03:52):
were, you were lifting. And then what did you hear on
Joe Rogan or whoever you're listening to about Jiu Jitsu? That's like, maybe
Um, without much, I think, I think, I think what
it was is basically my main pole at first was
I knew that it was some sort of grappling in MMA ish.
(04:15):
Oh, okay. I didn't know what it really entailed, but I
knew it was going to be a good workout and I wasn't going to join a yoga class. Yeah.
Right. I'm like 25. Am I going to be the only guy in a
Right. Right. I guess. I mean, you could be pretty creepy too. Definitely.
Yeah, you definitely don't want to do that. So, um, so
(04:37):
I remember just going in my first, my first night and
I was terrified when I finally got there. And then I think,
you know, I just got paired up with somebody and I was just in shorts and
a regular t-shirt and everybody's dressed up. It's got their
D on. I'm the only one in shorts and a regular. Yeah. I'm like, oh shit,
you know? And then, and then we.
(04:58):
What were you nervous about? I mean, new
people. Yeah, you should be nervous because most people are nervous when they come in. Almost actually
I was nervous my first night. I didn't know what to expect. And
I think doing like a brand new thing. I also didn't know
I was going to physically go head to head with another human right away. I
(05:18):
Did you research Jiu Jitsu before you came in? Like, did you go like
No, no, no. I didn't have, I didn't have a good idea of that, but
I, I knew it was wrestling. I knew the basics. I knew we were going to be choking tap.
Like I knew like UFC stuff. Okay. Right. So I had a, I
(05:39):
You knew it on TV. Yeah. I knew, I knew it. Yeah. I
Okay. Sweet. And how was that first class?
The first class, like I said, it was just terrifying. I remember the very first person
that I went with was Brown
Belt. He started a school. I just. Joe? No,
(06:01):
no. Tim? No, he started a school. Dan,
Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy, who was my very first role. Yeah.
And, and talking to me, the guy like not tattoos everywhere, but
like the nicest guy in the world, this super, super nicest
And, and, and I think it was scary as shit. He's scary. Yeah.
(06:21):
So what I did was he was an open guard. I remember it to this day
and I'm flailing around like crazy. Right. As
new people do as new. Yeah. Right. I'm like, I'm like,
I'm trying to get past this guy just told, Hey, just get past them.
And I'll say like the one thing that has made you super successful outside
of you just being a hardworking individual is you
(06:43):
do not give up. Oh no. Like you just, you
just go. And it's not like you go like to try to kill me, but
like you try to win and you're not a pushover in
any way whatsoever. Usually a new person, like I can just like push them
over. You like, you're like a bouncy ball. Like if I throw you at the ground,
you just spring back up right away. Bounce back up, yeah. All
(07:03):
right, so you're going with Jimmy, you're flailing around like a, as new people
I hit somebody, my foot literally hit somebody in
the head. Okay. And that person looked at Jimmy and
said, you should be controlling him better. And
then I got controlled better. And,
and, uh, yeah, I mean, I might've got like, and Jimmy's such
(07:25):
a sweetheart. Right. So, so he
told, and then he told me to go with somebody next and
I got my first Leon Valley experience. Right. Really getting
done to you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Somebody sticking there.
So Jimmy, you let you play on top a little bit. And then the roles reverse
(07:45):
Yeah. He, he sent me to somebody else. Basically, you
And it's funny, like new people, it's humbling. Yeah. New
people can always play a little bit on top. Right?
Because you just know that you want to keep the other guy down. You have gravity on
your side. But you put that new person on bottom, they're lost. Yeah,
it's bad. Right? Because you don't know how to escape. Yeah. Outside
(08:08):
of maybe trying to bench someone off. And that's going to be super hard. Right.
It's terrible. You're tired. And a few things. We hand off the
new people, right? Because we want to put someone
who's not experienced and you're in the experienced batch
now. I will put any new person with you because I know that
even though you could be the most dangerous person they roll with,
(08:30):
you're actually the safest person for them to roll with because you can tie them
up so they can't hurt themselves. Or you or
flail and accidentally kick another training. Exactly. Right? So
like we just do it for safety and it's kind of, it's to new people. It's like,
Oh my God, I have to go with the best person in the gym. I have to go with one of the brown belts,
the black belts. It's scary, but it's actually the safest. Yeah.
(08:51):
You're actually more safe. You're in better hands. And from my standpoint, The
new people are sometimes the hardest people to roll with because it's
scary because you've been doing jiu-jitsu for a
while now. If I roll with you, you're semi-predictable because I
know that you're going to do jiu-jitsu against me and I know in general what
your repertoire of techniques are and what your strategy is because you
(09:12):
do jiu-jitsu. A new person is random. It's a
roll of the dice at what they're going to do, but it's like an 80-sided dice. at
any point in time, they could just do a front flip onto your face. Yeah. Like
you just don't know. Yeah. Right. Yeah. They can
get hurt. They can hurt you. So how were you feeling after your first
(09:33):
I, I, man, I, I would, I, I was
sweat. Like I was so sweaty. Yeah. Like as
soon as my face would go down. Did you have to rest at all? There
was, um, just like, no, I think, I think I kind of
went through it because like, I just don't have that off button.
Yeah. I don't have that off, but I didn't know any better. Yeah. You know? So
(09:54):
I was just. Obviously the people that were rolling with
me were probably taking care of me and didn't push me, pushed me just as
far as I needed to go. But I just remember being so tired, so
sore, so sweaty. I had regular cotton clothes on.
I was just drenched. You'd like wring it out. I couldn't believe it. Yeah. So
one other memorable thing is like, Um, like,
(10:19):
I guess I just had like a sense of clarity after, like, I remember going into the
locker room and I just kind of like sat there a little bit and,
and my mind was just clear. Yeah. I was clear. I
wasn't anxious about the day. Um, I wasn't worried about business.
I wasn't worried about, um, family or anything outside of
that. My mind was clear. I was just like, And
(10:43):
so right after that, boom, right? Hey, this is
our program. This is what we get. I signed up right away. Awesome. I mean,
I think, I think I might've even like prepaid like
Dude, it's so funny because people a lot of times think like, you
need to be a master at meditation. You need to meditate for months to
get a clear mind and find a way to meditate and get a clear mind. And
(11:05):
I get that when I do jiu jitsu. But you even
got that when you're doing jiu-jitsu, but you weren't even really doing jiu-jitsu. Everyone
else was doing the jiu-jitsu to you. Yeah. Right? And you still
were able to finish class and be like, okay. Yeah. It's
Yeah. I think for me, it's, it's,
um, Maybe like
(11:27):
being high, strong in my mind is always racing.
Like it's even, it's even something that I learned about myself,
like being able to go to sleep at night, shutting my mind off.
I have a few like techniques and things that I'll do if I need to.
Sometimes it'll just happen. And most of the time it'll just
happens right if I go to jiu-jitsu that day. So,
(11:49):
and so I kind of use it as a tool in that way. But
I think, I think it's just something that I needed was I needed that
physical exhaustion. Yeah. Like my body needs.
And probably mental exhaustion. Mental exhaustion. Cause you're like
trying to, like, how do I survive? How do I win? How do I survive? Yeah.
Right. And your mind's going to tell your body what to do. Like, oh, this guy's trying to
(12:09):
kill me. Yeah. How can I stop that? How can
And it's humbling. Talk about another thing that I realized very
quickly was, boy, you
might have an idea in your head of what you're
capable of. Like, Oh, if this happens, like, maybe
I'm going to do, maybe I'll do this or whatever. You know, like I
(12:32):
was a little, I went a little bit scrappy, like high school
fights type of stuff, a little scrappy. Um,
decent. But as soon as you step in
there and, and as soon as that first person
grabs ahold of you, it's all out the window. You're like, Oh my gosh, like
this is real. Yeah. And, and you don't know it's real. until
(12:55):
you physically go and do it. You can imagine. You
can look at the people like on UFC, like, why doesn't he just get up? Yeah.
Like you let them get your arm. Easier said than done. You let them
How'd you get choked out there? Like their favorite person. They're all like, what? You
know, like, yeah, go
(13:16):
Show up. But to me, that's like, it never goes away. No,
I get manhandled. You know, I was, I think
it was last year I got the opportunity to roll with Rafael
Lovato Jr. You know, UFC fighter, Bellator fighter,
multi-time, like one of the best American black belts in Jiu-Jitsu. When
I did a private lesson with him, I'd roll with him. The
(13:38):
only Jiu-Jitsu I did with that guy was the Jiu-Jitsu he let me do. So
like I, he did all the stuff and I've been doing jiu-jitsu for like 16 years. And
I was like, I can't do anything to you. You're just a
monster. Like you will always get humbled. Unless you're like you're Gordon Ryan
and you're like literally the apex predator on the food chain. Like
(14:00):
Yeah. I mean, it's, it doesn't matter. There's always going to be
that guy that's going to show you something or give
And it might even be a new person. Yeah. Oh yeah. I
learned. Like you move your
jiu-jitsu movement is beautiful
in a way that like, to me, sometimes it feels like scrambly and
(14:22):
random. Yeah. Like you'll, you'll go for risks that most
people won't take. Yeah. And I'll learn stuff from
your movement when I'm bowling with you. And I've been training for like
15 years longer, but I'll still learn stuff from newer
And you'll learn if you're watching a hundred percent, if you're willing to learn.
Yeah. And that's the thing too, is like, Jiu
(14:44):
Jitsu is another, another, another thing that, that
gives you an idea that, Hey, you
know, be willing to learn, be willing to be taught, you
know, don't give up on, you know, don't think that, you know, at all.
Oh yeah. Well, as soon as, yeah, as soon as you think you
(15:06):
do, then that's when you stop learning. You know, it's like, go find those,
go find those teachers in life, you know, have,
have mentors in life and a mentor will probably take you so
far. Yeah. Right. And then it's time for a new mentor. Yeah.
And, and, you know, and like in jiu-jitsu specifically, because,
I mean, this is a podcast, you know, it's like when
(15:29):
I first started out, it's like, I look at you, I look at Dan, I
look at Fuji and it's all different. Like a lot of
that movement that, that I'm talking about. Yeah. That's a
Like his style of his style of training. Right. Yeah. And,
and, and everyone's execution of the art is
(15:49):
different. Yeah. Right. Like I could teach you a rear
naked choke. Right. And everyone's going to do it a little bit. That's
true. Actually. And, you know, even though we're
talking about like depth in the sport, like a lot of people think
like, Oh, you're building up new techniques. I will learn the
smallest modification to a technique I've been doing for a decade that
(16:10):
will completely change the game on it for me. Yeah. Where it's like, Hey,
put your hand an inch higher for this reason. And you're like, At
first, the first time someone gives you feedback like that, you're like, what the
hell is that going to do? But then it works and you're like, why
did that happen? Why did that work? So
it's not like Datsun having more tools,
(16:33):
but it's sharpening those tools and learning different variations on how to use
those. That's beautiful. Now you were talking
about learning a lot through watching jiu-jitsu and you
came to class the other night and you're, you did,
you're way better at me than at it. Cause if I have a key and
I'm on the mat, like I'll end up training and doing something stupid, even
(16:53):
though if I'm injured and you put a guy on, you're in class and you're like,
Hey Perry, I'm not training tonight. I'm just watching. Yeah.
Cause you're a little injured. Yeah. Tell me about that.
That's not something most people will do. Most people, when they take an, when they have an injury, They're
either most often, they're just not going to come to the gym or
B they'll come and they'll just sit on the sidelines, which is even more super
(17:14):
rare. I would say like 98% just don't come. 2% will
come, but stay on the sidelines. And the 0.1% you
in this scenario puts your D on is like, Hey, I'm
How do you get to that? That's not something, especially with younger guys,
like older guys, we're old. We know we get hurt. Like
(17:38):
that happens. And you know, we know to take time off,
but usually younger guys are like, I'm injured. Rubbed
dirt on it. You know, I'm just going to power through it. Yeah. Right.
I think my perspective has been a bit like it's
been, it's been progressive. So I've been injured before. And
(17:59):
I've, I've went through it. And, and, and I think the
reason why I went through it is like, when you first
start like tapping people, it's fun and all this stuff. And like
my idea of jiu-jitsu has changed to, I want to do it for a
long time. I want to be like you. I want to be
like Paul. I want to be like Dan, right. I want to do it for a long
time because it is such an important thing to me. I think mentally, even
(18:23):
spiritually in some aspects, I think it is that
important. So like, I'm willing, I had to look at myself and
I was training for a little bit, injured, like my
back. So the injury is, you know, my back, it's important. And
it could possibly get bad. And you need that
(18:43):
Most people are like, I need it for life because
I teach jiu-jitsu, but I don't need it to work at a computer all day, right?
Yeah. And my point is, I'm
willing to sacrifice my desires
or my appetites now and let the
(19:04):
different part of my soul reason take over
a little bit and tell me to calm down and
just show up because I actually enjoy seeing the
people. I mean, I've been knowing these people for years now every
single day. It's like family. So like, I want to come and I want to say,
hi, I want to say hi to you. I want to say hi, you know, um,
(19:26):
to other people in the gym and be a part of the community as
It's hard not to roll, especially like, and
You're like, Oh no, not tonight. It's hard. And
then they're like, are you okay? Are you okay? It's like, yeah, I'm okay. I
just, You know, I'm just gonna, I'm just going to sit out
(19:50):
It's like a little bit. Hey, like take one week off now to
get your injury better. Because if it gets worse, you're going to
have to take 10 weeks off. Yeah. Right. So it's like the, the short sacrifice
for the greater victory. Right. And I think that's a great
life lesson that a lot of times it takes people a major
injury for that to happen or a lot
(20:11):
of injuries for that to happen. It's a, it's a really smart training
approach. Yeah. Um, you
said that jiu-jitsu does a lot for your, for your life spiritually. What
Um, this is like a little bit in a
little bit in the wheat. I feel that. I
(20:31):
feel that there's three parts of our soul. Yeah. So, so
we, I mean, I know. I like it. Let's go. Okay. So,
so, so you have reason. Okay. Right. You
have courage and you have your appetites. Yeah. And,
and reason, like the Greeks would say, like, you know, reason is
here. Courage is cur of the heart and
(20:54):
then your appetites, you know, like your stomach. Yeah. And
when I brought that up, what
I would say, just for this example, is going
to roll and being hurt would be me feeding my
appetites, right? The
lowest form of good for myself and my soul. And
(21:20):
when I am being virtuous or just, I
have to listen to my reason and say, hey, no, maybe you
should take some time. Maybe you should go experience, like it was
deliberate, go there. Go in your gi. Go
say hi to everybody. Go experience it. And do
(21:40):
not let yourself, I've failed so many times of going there
and trying to do that same thing. And I said, do not let yourself do it. You
get suckered in. Right. So, so, so, and
I, I feel that, um, like when I
say, you know, spiritually, um, you
know, I think that, that, you
(22:00):
know, just on, on that small example, but,
um, I think that when there's a place where a
bunch of people are coming together for a common goal,
right. And, and honestly, it's to, to be better. you
know, it's not, it's not so much like people are coming there to want to be
able to go hurt other people. It's, it's so much not about that. It's
(22:22):
just, which is so crazy. You know, at first you,
I think that changes, but, um, it's, it's like
e pluribus, e pluribus uno, right. Out of many
one, like the great, you know, on the great seals, like you
have a, you have a tree cutter. Yeah. You
have the gym owner. You have a lawyer, right? Out
(22:46):
of many one, just like in the United States, like you have all these people
And I think a lot of times, you know, even if you are talking
politics, it's a lot of like accepting of everyone else's
views. It's more open in that room. It's like, it's
(23:06):
not a battle. Like we all have our own perspectives on, and
I think it shows up in techniques. Like I, my way, I do a sweep. I have you
have your way of how to do a sweep. Like neither of we know in jiu-jitsu, like
neither of us are right. Like I could have my political views. You could have your political
views. It doesn't mean that we're right. It's just. It's our interpretation
of things. Yeah. And it's our viewpoint on things. And like, there's a
(23:28):
lot of space in the middle for, and on the outsides for
everyone else to sit. Yeah. And I think jiu-jitsu teaches us that.
It teaches us that and it gives us a place to come to where we can experience the
ability for multiple people
in society to come together and have those conversations. And
God is present in that. Yeah. Because of that. You
(23:51):
know, like, and I, I feel, um,
I feel that there. And I think like, that's where Jiu Jitsu has changed a
lot for me is like, that's where I'll come. I'll come with my gi and
not roll. I will drive 20 minutes. Yeah. Spend an
to experience that. And two hours of your day to not even train
(24:13):
and get your workout in. But you get everything else out of it, right? Because we
don't all do jiu-jitsu just for the act of doing jiu-jitsu. We do it for being
with our community, being with our people. I tell people I
kill so many birds with one stone when I go to jiu-jitsu class. I
get to spend time with my friends. I'm, of course, running my business. I
get to help other people. I get my workout in. Right?
(24:37):
It's so many other things. And if it's like, hey, if I'm injured and I still go to
the gym, and I get instead of five things out of
it, I get four, That's still a lot of
benefit for me to do it versus me just like watching Netflix. Right.
Right. And there's no problem with taking a day off. I'm not saying like, Hey, you should go
to the gym every day and you need to, you need to do this. Like
(24:57):
take a day off every once in a while, but be deliberate about it. Yeah. Right.
And especially if you're trying to build a routine, like
in your, maybe you're a two day a week person, Tuesdays and Thursdays, like make it a
habit two days a week. Cause you know, as
well as I do, like once you break a habit, it's hard to get back into
it. Yeah. It's hard to restart it. Just like you,
(25:18):
when you said, Hey, I was working out for a while. I kind of fell
out of my habit with my business and it's hard to get back into it. Yeah. Cool.
What's the biggest change you've seen in your training?
Right. So you started, you've been training for about three years. You
have some pancreation sites under your belt. You have some jiu-jitsu tournaments
under your belt. Yeah. You're relatively
(25:41):
newer blue belt, but not that much newer of one. You've had it for a while. What's,
what's the biggest shift you've seen in your
training that has helped you from like the day you walked in
My biggest shift is like, I think is mentally.
I'm willing to go there and put my butt on
(26:04):
the mat for that other new person. You
know, and I was just talking about this before, honestly, we're talking about Caleb. Yeah.
And when he said to me, and I was struggling, he said, Hey, man, I
got you. Got you. It's okay. Just
breathe. Right? That feeling. I've said that same
thing to another new person. Right? With
(26:26):
intention. Because it was a core memory. It
meant something to me. And it does. So, like,
my training has changed to, like, you know, when you first get that first
tap, you want to go get more. I want to just armbar the
shit out of somebody. Yeah, because you get that first taste of victory. Yeah. Oh,
wow. And then you choke somebody out
(26:47):
and stuff. My point is that I'm willing
to go and get myself in a bad situation. I'm
willing to get choked out by a white belt. I'm willing to let him take
my back, feel where his choke is. It's
not always that every training or every role, it's about
me winning or just being on top or showing that
(27:07):
I am dominant. Now, there are times when
I have to switch myself out of being passive. And
do jiu-jitsu for yourself. And really do some jiu-jitsu. That
happens sometimes, you know, but, but
I think that's probably the biggest shift is like, no,
(27:27):
I'm willing to, cause you get to work on whatever you're working
on. If I like, Hey, white button, you can work on getting my back and choking me.
That gives me the opportunity to work it out. Defenses against you. Yeah. You
can always work on something. And I say this all the time, but
if I help you with your goals, it inherently helps me with my
own goals. It's all about helping each other. If I just focus on
(27:48):
me, I'm only going to get half the benefit. But
if I focus on helping you, then I'm going to get double. Times
that by the 30 people we have in class that night or the
10 people I roll with. Have you ran into
a plateau in your training yet? Have you felt like, man, I hit a wall?
Like, what do you mean by plateau is as interest
(28:11):
or, or the ability to physically get
Yeah. Either like either plateauing as in, I never
thought about plateauing an interest or plateauing
like, Hey, you feel like you're just not getting better at Jiu Jitsu. Have
Um, honestly, so, so
(28:34):
I guess I, I've never thought, I haven't thought about it till right now. So
let me, let me think through that. So interest wise,
no. Um, I haven't plateaued, uh,
jiu-jitsu wise. Um, Let
me, let me just ask this. What, what have I learned that's, that's
(28:54):
brand new lately, or what am I working on? So, um,
I've been trying to do a lot more arm bar stuff. Um,
and, and you have an interesting thing that you showed me a while ago,
and then I see you naturally go to a lot. It's an arm bar series from
having someone's back and actually flipping your arm
around their head. Yeah. So I've been a little bit interested in
(29:16):
that, but I don't think I've gotten any better at it, to be honest. So,
so, um, I don't have any really cool new jiu-jitsu
things that I'm working out either, like reverse daily Hiva or
X guard things. So in that way, maybe I have like plateaued a
(29:37):
Yeah. I, I do feel like I'm
improving. Awesome. Don't think about it.
Yeah. I, and I, and I don't care about like the stripes or
I think that's why you, you probably haven't hit a plateau is
because you just keep Jiu Jitsu fun. You know, you move a lot.
So you're always opening up new opportunities. Uh, you
(29:58):
love learning. So you're always looking for something new, like a new toy
to play with. Yeah. Right. And I feel like a lot of people that run into plateaus, they
run into it because, um, that
they keep playing with the same toy too much. Yeah. And that toy
gets boring. Oh, that's a good point. Right? And then they don't find something new
and fun to play with. That's a good point. And you don't want to like just jump
(30:18):
to new stuff and forget about the old stuff. Yeah. But like you
need to keep introducing fun into your game. And I think you've done
amazing at that. Yeah. Like there's always smiles on your faces and
And I'll switch my game. I'll switch my thing that
I'll start going to rear naked chokes now. Okay, I'm only doing
(30:42):
arm bars with this person. I'm only doing Kimuras with this
person. Now, and a lot of times, I'll
just grab it and let it go. A lot of times I'll just get
there, grab it, like a Kimura, make sure I
could have scooted my butt out. Yeah, let it go. Yeah.
Like I don't need to, who needs that 30 seconds or reset anyway.
(31:03):
Yeah. Right. Like take this mission, go until you might be able to
tap them and move on with it. And you don't want to do that all
of the time because then you never practice the actual finish. I've done that. Right.
Cause then you'll get into a tournament and you'll get a Camorra and then you just let it go for no reason. And you're
Right. Awesome. Uh, how about some rapid fire questions for
you? Yeah, sure. Sweet. Uh, first one. You
(31:27):
ready? Yeah. This is challenging. Okay. Is it? Okay. Yeah. Gi
Okay. Uh, why? Because I
feel that a lot of times when I'm rolling with people, the gi slow
gets slowed down a lot and people get too focused on grips and
(31:48):
It just, I like it. It seems like it stops your jiu-jitsu. Uh, we touched
Um, I I would say I would say armbar sweet
um armbar from different spots Uh, it
Like you'll just go to your favorite one to hit kimura kimura Sweet
(32:09):
from any certain spot or just everywhere. Um, honestly, where's the
So many different places. I always grab
and threaten from half guard and then I
usually get the sweep. Bottom half guard? Yeah, bottom half guard. I
am terrible at that. I'll get, I usually get the sweep from
there. So I'll try to elevate them too and sweep and
(32:34):
Awesome. Top person you would love to train with given the opportunity. Dead
That I would love to train with? Yeah. Um, I
would say I, I, I've never thought about that. I
don't really have, I don't idolize that much. I, I
would say, uh, any UFC
(32:57):
Maybe, maybe, maybe one of the Gracies. One of the Gracies. Yeah. Cool. Um,
fun side fact, uh, I went to a
seminar with Hickson Gracie. Hickson, yeah. It was awesome. They're
the pioneers. Yeah, he is. He made
jiu-jitsu huge. I
was his uke for a technique. Really? He taught a technique on me. Dude, that
(33:19):
guy feels like a brick. When
did you do that? It was probably like a decade ago in Chicago. I went to a seminar with
him. It was a really cool opportunity. You still are. Yeah. Okay. Yeah,
for sure. I don't think he does seminars anymore unless you go to I
don't know, some huge one. Maybe he does one a year,
maybe one every other year. Best advice
(33:44):
Oh, man. Okay, Vec, just
come, just show up. Relax and
Don't do it. And as we said, all easier said than
Uh, one word to describe your Jiu Jitsu style. Um,
(34:08):
this would be one of those ones where like we write on a sheet of paper and we show everyone at
the same time and see what it says. Like, I'll
So I would say, Spazzy.
I would say more bouncy, flowy.
Flippy. I would say flippy. Yeah, you are bouncy. I would
(34:30):
say Dan is also flippy. You're
like holding on to something I can't grasp. Yeah. I don't know what
they are, but they're those, we used to have them as kids. You win them at the carnival, but
it was like a, a tomb filled with water that rolls in
on itself. When you grab it, it slips out of your hand every time. That's what I feel like. It's like,
it's like I'm here, then I'm over here and I'm over there and I'm cartwheeling over you. You
(34:50):
can like teleport. Uh, the toughest aspect
of BJJ to master. And this is interesting because I'm asking you a blue belt
this. I, I learned a lot in three years. Like what's the
My most important thing is I just want to do it for a long time. So just,
just take care of your body, self-control, don't
(35:11):
get injured. Don't keep on training over the injuries. It's
What is one habit that has significantly improved your jiu-jitsu
Um, one habit that
has improved my jiu-jitsu game. Um,
(35:34):
Don't, I don't, I don't really know. I mean, just, just
showing up, you, you can only get better at Jiu Jitsu by just coming,
You can't think it. People ask me all the
time. They're like, Hey, my goal is to get my, my blue belt. I'm like, Hey, that's a
great goal. But the goal that's going to get you there is
That's, that's one thing that your goal should be to train. I'm
(35:57):
going to say, well, I'm going to say one thing about it. What
bothers me so bad is the four-stripe white
belt that leaves because he didn't get his blue belt
in time. Man, I don't know because
Oh, my blue. No, no one. So
(36:19):
no one comes to me with that. They should, they should. Like I'm,
I, I am that apparently the juice to outlier. Like if
you want to know what you need to work on, you can ask me, but it better be
a good question, but I'll tell you full transparency, what you need to work on.
You have to be okay with that. That might, the answer might be train more
or be more consistent or don't take a month off. Right.
(36:40):
But I hear more of that, like, through
the grapevine, like blah, blah, blah. They didn't get
a stripe. And someone will tell me that I'll be like, they
can just ask me and I'll tell them why. Yeah. Yeah. And
they're like, does it, I get, you want it,
you want that as a way to see your progress, but
(37:03):
like whatever. By the time you get, by the time you get a black belt,
How about, how will, yeah, yeah. How about the next time someone can put, listen, everybody
just take your belt off. It all comes. Everybody's got a white belt now.
It all comes with a, all that more stripes and
more belts come with is a, is a bigger microphone, right? More people listen to you.
(37:24):
So your work matters a little bit more, right? So a lot
of responsibility comes with it, but also a huge target on your back. Okay.
Like, right? You get that blue belt, people want to kill you. Right?
I don't know so much about blue belts. I think blue belts are kind of considered to
be basically white belts that know how to tap. Know some stuff, yeah.
(37:45):
No, just know how to tap. But, you
know, it's like, I could see that with a black belt. Yeah. Because
That's true. It's not as bad. I feel like it was way more when I was a purple belt, like you
get that purple belt, people want to like kill you. I feel like when you get your
black belt, some people want to kill you, but more people just like are respectful.
Yeah. More might even roll with you softer.
(38:08):
Yeah, for sure. Than somebody else. For sure. Uh, what's
Oh, that's improved my life. Um, I
would say. I
would say talking to people that
(38:31):
have more knowledge than me, just being good student mentors. Yeah.
Seeking mentors. And if you get a hold of a mentor. You
ought to know how to be a good student. Otherwise you won't. It's
a funny thing. So like if, you know, realizing, realizing
what you have in front of you. So I would say the biggest thing would be mentors, older,
(38:51):
older, older men, specifically in my life. Then that
have done things maybe that I want to do or, or,
or somewhere that maybe I want to be, or just emotionally more
intelligent than me, you know, for
Uh, last one, favorite book or podcast or
(39:16):
Well, right now I listen to a lot of
Philosophize This. It's like a philosophy podcast.
I've not listened to that one. I'll have to
check it out. Check it out. Yeah, check that out. I also listen
to Joe Rogan as well. Not as
(39:38):
much. His podcast is just so good. Yeah,
they're a long time. And, and then I do
a lot of like YouTube stuff. Like what on YouTube? Um,
like I'll do educational YouTube or like fun YouTube? No,
not fun YouTube. It'll be about biblical stuff.
(39:59):
I'm a big into like symbolism, kung, stuff like
Yeah. It's that it's only weird. I should make it weird. It's like jiu-jitsu.
Yeah. Outside person looking in on Jiu Jitsu, you're like, it's pretty weird when
you're doing Jiu Jitsu. It's only weird if you make it weird. Yeah. Cool. Uh,
anything else you would like to share today with our listeners, people getting
(40:20):
interested in Jiu Jitsu, people starting out Jiu Jitsu, any
To all the parents that bring their kids to Jiu
Jitsu, it was really scary, right? For
your kid to join Jiu Jitsu, step on the mat one time. Ooh.
Step on the mat one time. Just one time. It's like, I don't think jiu-jitsu
(40:40):
is just for everybody. Yeah. Like you need to step on the mat one time.
Experience it. Try it out. Yeah. Awesome.
Well, I appreciate you, man. Thank you so much for climbing out of a tree, giving
up part of your work day to come here and join us on Inside the
Wave podcast. If you guys listen, you guys like this, give
us a five-star review or whatever your podcast platform is. Like
Welcome to episode three of inside the wave today. I
am joined by one of my awesome students, probably one of the hardest working
people I know. He literally climbed out of a tree to
be here with us today. Tanner Brooks. Um, and
it's not because he's Tarzan. It's because he actually owns a tree cutting
service. Right. So Tanner, tell me, uh, tell me
(00:33):
about yourself. How long have you been with utopia? How
Yeah. So I think I've been training with you for somewhere
around three years. I'm not exactly sure, but, um, how
it actually started was time flies. Yeah. Time does fly. But
how it started was, um, I think I was on Facebook and
(00:54):
I saw like, uh, coming for a two week free
trial Jiu Jitsu. And I'm like, Oh, what's that? I
was flexing my marketing arm. Yeah. You're flexing your marketing arm
pretty hard. It kept on coming up. I don't know what it was, if it was a demographic thing
or whatever, you know, age. And then, I mean, obviously
I heard about Jiu Jitsu a few times. Um, um, and
(01:15):
I've heard like Joe Rogan talk about it a few times and stuff like that. So
then, um, I was like, well, I'll check
it out because I used to work out. Right. But, um,
what kind of stopped working out? And that was my, why'd
you stop working out? Um, I'm
not sure. So, you know, I was pretty active like in high school and
(01:38):
then I had a break and then I got really into it for a
few years. And then I think it was just work. I
think it was just like... Caught up in life. Yeah, caught up in life, working.
I alluded to you that you climbed out of a tree. I don't think I actually said you own a
(02:00):
tree removal company. Your
work is physically demanding. There can be
a lot of hours to it, especially during tree season. Right.
Very easy. Especially coming home. Like, I mean, it's dark.
Like the last thing you want to do is what
(02:26):
And I do. So like literally I take a shower twice a night,
Yup. Yup. Yup. And, uh, so, so that's what I
do. But, but back to it, I mean, I, I saw that, right. And
I wanted to, I don't get into something. And
I figured, um, I'll give it a try. So I went
(02:47):
Okay. So this is Fuji Fuji to also teach you in the Academy a
Yeah. And then what he did is he actually sent me a video
and I thought it was, I was basically nervous to
come in. Right. So he sent me a video. He's like, Hi, Tanner. You
know? Oh yeah. The personalized video personalized video. And he said, I didn't, I
didn't expect that at all. You know? And he's like, Hey,
(03:08):
you know, blah, blah, blah. Come in. Just make sure you bring shorts and t-shirts.
So I just have basketball shorts. Right. Yeah. And I think I came in
Man, I guess, you know, how old are
I guess I'm 29, but I just turned 29 in
February, end of February. So I
(03:29):
had to have been at least like 25. Yeah. That
would have to be my guess. So I mean, I was still young and I still
But you definitely had a gap between like school and training. Oh,
yeah. Right. You didn't roll straight from like college or high school
to be like, oh, here's my new thing. No. So
during that break between that and you were just, you started your own business, you
(03:52):
were, you were lifting. And then what did you hear on
Joe Rogan or whoever you're listening to about Jiu Jitsu? That's like, maybe
Um, without much, I think, I think, I think what
it was is basically my main pole at first was
I knew that it was some sort of grappling in MMA ish.
(04:15):
Oh, okay. I didn't know what it really entailed, but I
knew it was going to be a good workout and I wasn't going to join a yoga class. Yeah.
Right. I'm like 25. Am I going to be the only guy in a
Right. Right. I guess. I mean, you could be pretty creepy too. Definitely.
Yeah, you definitely don't want to do that. So, um, so
(04:37):
I remember just going in my first, my first night and
I was terrified when I finally got there. And then I think,
you know, I just got paired up with somebody and I was just in shorts and
a regular t-shirt and everybody's dressed up. It's got their
D on. I'm the only one in shorts and a regular. Yeah. I'm like, oh shit,
you know? And then, and then we.
(04:58):
What were you nervous about? I mean, new
people. Yeah, you should be nervous because most people are nervous when they come in. Almost actually
I was nervous my first night. I didn't know what to expect. And
I think doing like a brand new thing. I also didn't know
I was going to physically go head to head with another human right away. I
(05:18):
Did you research Jiu Jitsu before you came in? Like, did you go like
No, no, no. I didn't have, I didn't have a good idea of that, but
I, I knew it was wrestling. I knew the basics. I knew we were going to be choking tap.
Like I knew like UFC stuff. Okay. Right. So I had a, I
(05:39):
You knew it on TV. Yeah. I knew, I knew it. Yeah. I
Okay. Sweet. And how was that first class?
The first class, like I said, it was just terrifying. I remember the very first person
that I went with was Brown
Belt. He started a school. I just. Joe? No,
(06:01):
no. Tim? No, he started a school. Dan,
Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy, who was my very first role. Yeah.
And, and talking to me, the guy like not tattoos everywhere, but
like the nicest guy in the world, this super, super nicest
And, and, and I think it was scary as shit. He's scary. Yeah.
(06:21):
So what I did was he was an open guard. I remember it to this day
and I'm flailing around like crazy. Right. As
new people do as new. Yeah. Right. I'm like, I'm like,
I'm trying to get past this guy just told, Hey, just get past them.
And I'll say like the one thing that has made you super successful outside
of you just being a hardworking individual is you
(06:43):
do not give up. Oh no. Like you just, you
just go. And it's not like you go like to try to kill me, but
like you try to win and you're not a pushover in
any way whatsoever. Usually a new person, like I can just like push them
over. You like, you're like a bouncy ball. Like if I throw you at the ground,
you just spring back up right away. Bounce back up, yeah. All
(07:03):
right, so you're going with Jimmy, you're flailing around like a, as new people
I hit somebody, my foot literally hit somebody in
the head. Okay. And that person looked at Jimmy and
said, you should be controlling him better. And
then I got controlled better. And,
and, uh, yeah, I mean, I might've got like, and Jimmy's such
(07:25):
a sweetheart. Right. So, so he
told, and then he told me to go with somebody next and
I got my first Leon Valley experience. Right. Really getting
done to you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Somebody sticking there.
So Jimmy, you let you play on top a little bit. And then the roles reverse
(07:45):
Yeah. He, he sent me to somebody else. Basically, you
And it's funny, like new people, it's humbling. Yeah. New
people can always play a little bit on top. Right?
Because you just know that you want to keep the other guy down. You have gravity on
your side. But you put that new person on bottom, they're lost. Yeah,
it's bad. Right? Because you don't know how to escape. Yeah. Outside
(08:08):
of maybe trying to bench someone off. And that's going to be super hard. Right.
It's terrible. You're tired. And a few things. We hand off the
new people, right? Because we want to put someone
who's not experienced and you're in the experienced batch
now. I will put any new person with you because I know that
even though you could be the most dangerous person they roll with,
(08:30):
you're actually the safest person for them to roll with because you can tie them
up so they can't hurt themselves. Or you or
flail and accidentally kick another training. Exactly. Right? So
like we just do it for safety and it's kind of, it's to new people. It's like,
Oh my God, I have to go with the best person in the gym. I have to go with one of the brown belts,
the black belts. It's scary, but it's actually the safest. Yeah.
(08:51):
You're actually more safe. You're in better hands. And from my standpoint, The
new people are sometimes the hardest people to roll with because it's
scary because you've been doing jiu-jitsu for a
while now. If I roll with you, you're semi-predictable because I
know that you're going to do jiu-jitsu against me and I know in general what
your repertoire of techniques are and what your strategy is because you
(09:12):
do jiu-jitsu. A new person is random. It's a
roll of the dice at what they're going to do, but it's like an 80-sided dice. at
any point in time, they could just do a front flip onto your face. Yeah. Like
you just don't know. Yeah. Right. Yeah. They can
get hurt. They can hurt you. So how were you feeling after your first
(09:33):
I, I, man, I, I would, I, I was
sweat. Like I was so sweaty. Yeah. Like as
soon as my face would go down. Did you have to rest at all? There
was, um, just like, no, I think, I think I kind of
went through it because like, I just don't have that off button.
Yeah. I don't have that off, but I didn't know any better. Yeah. You know? So
(09:54):
I was just. Obviously the people that were rolling with
me were probably taking care of me and didn't push me, pushed me just as
far as I needed to go. But I just remember being so tired, so
sore, so sweaty. I had regular cotton clothes on.
I was just drenched. You'd like wring it out. I couldn't believe it. Yeah. So
one other memorable thing is like, Um, like,
(10:19):
I guess I just had like a sense of clarity after, like, I remember going into the
locker room and I just kind of like sat there a little bit and,
and my mind was just clear. Yeah. I was clear. I
wasn't anxious about the day. Um, I wasn't worried about business.
I wasn't worried about, um, family or anything outside of
that. My mind was clear. I was just like, And
(10:43):
so right after that, boom, right? Hey, this is
our program. This is what we get. I signed up right away. Awesome. I mean,
I think, I think I might've even like prepaid like
Dude, it's so funny because people a lot of times think like, you
need to be a master at meditation. You need to meditate for months to
get a clear mind and find a way to meditate and get a clear mind. And
(11:05):
I get that when I do jiu jitsu. But you even
got that when you're doing jiu-jitsu, but you weren't even really doing jiu-jitsu. Everyone
else was doing the jiu-jitsu to you. Yeah. Right? And you still
were able to finish class and be like, okay. Yeah. It's
Yeah. I think for me, it's, it's,
um, Maybe like
(11:27):
being high, strong in my mind is always racing.
Like it's even, it's even something that I learned about myself,
like being able to go to sleep at night, shutting my mind off.
I have a few like techniques and things that I'll do if I need to.
Sometimes it'll just happen. And most of the time it'll just
happens right if I go to jiu-jitsu that day. So,
(11:49):
and so I kind of use it as a tool in that way. But
I think, I think it's just something that I needed was I needed that
physical exhaustion. Yeah. Like my body needs.
And probably mental exhaustion. Mental exhaustion. Cause you're like
trying to, like, how do I survive? How do I win? How do I survive? Yeah.
Right. And your mind's going to tell your body what to do. Like, oh, this guy's trying to
(12:09):
kill me. Yeah. How can I stop that? How can
And it's humbling. Talk about another thing that I realized very
quickly was, boy, you
might have an idea in your head of what you're
capable of. Like, Oh, if this happens, like, maybe
I'm going to do, maybe I'll do this or whatever. You know, like I
(12:32):
was a little, I went a little bit scrappy, like high school
fights type of stuff, a little scrappy. Um,
decent. But as soon as you step in
there and, and as soon as that first person
grabs ahold of you, it's all out the window. You're like, Oh my gosh, like
this is real. Yeah. And, and you don't know it's real. until
(12:55):
you physically go and do it. You can imagine. You
can look at the people like on UFC, like, why doesn't he just get up? Yeah.
Like you let them get your arm. Easier said than done. You let them
How'd you get choked out there? Like their favorite person. They're all like, what? You
know, like, yeah, go
(13:16):
Show up. But to me, that's like, it never goes away. No,
I get manhandled. You know, I was, I think
it was last year I got the opportunity to roll with Rafael
Lovato Jr. You know, UFC fighter, Bellator fighter,
multi-time, like one of the best American black belts in Jiu-Jitsu. When
I did a private lesson with him, I'd roll with him. The
(13:38):
only Jiu-Jitsu I did with that guy was the Jiu-Jitsu he let me do. So
like I, he did all the stuff and I've been doing jiu-jitsu for like 16 years. And
I was like, I can't do anything to you. You're just a
monster. Like you will always get humbled. Unless you're like you're Gordon Ryan
and you're like literally the apex predator on the food chain. Like
(14:00):
Yeah. I mean, it's, it doesn't matter. There's always going to be
that guy that's going to show you something or give
And it might even be a new person. Yeah. Oh yeah. I
learned. Like you move your
jiu-jitsu movement is beautiful
in a way that like, to me, sometimes it feels like scrambly and
(14:22):
random. Yeah. Like you'll, you'll go for risks that most
people won't take. Yeah. And I'll learn stuff from
your movement when I'm bowling with you. And I've been training for like
15 years longer, but I'll still learn stuff from newer
And you'll learn if you're watching a hundred percent, if you're willing to learn.
Yeah. And that's the thing too, is like, Jiu
(14:44):
Jitsu is another, another, another thing that, that
gives you an idea that, Hey, you
know, be willing to learn, be willing to be taught, you
know, don't give up on, you know, don't think that, you know, at all.
Oh yeah. Well, as soon as, yeah, as soon as you think you
(15:06):
do, then that's when you stop learning. You know, it's like, go find those,
go find those teachers in life, you know, have,
have mentors in life and a mentor will probably take you so
far. Yeah. Right. And then it's time for a new mentor. Yeah.
And, and, you know, and like in jiu-jitsu specifically, because,
I mean, this is a podcast, you know, it's like when
(15:29):
I first started out, it's like, I look at you, I look at Dan, I
look at Fuji and it's all different. Like a lot of
that movement that, that I'm talking about. Yeah. That's a
Like his style of his style of training. Right. Yeah. And,
and, and everyone's execution of the art is
(15:49):
different. Yeah. Right. Like I could teach you a rear
naked choke. Right. And everyone's going to do it a little bit. That's
true. Actually. And, you know, even though we're
talking about like depth in the sport, like a lot of people think
like, Oh, you're building up new techniques. I will learn the
smallest modification to a technique I've been doing for a decade that
(16:10):
will completely change the game on it for me. Yeah. Where it's like, Hey,
put your hand an inch higher for this reason. And you're like, At
first, the first time someone gives you feedback like that, you're like, what the
hell is that going to do? But then it works and you're like, why
did that happen? Why did that work? So
it's not like Datsun having more tools,
(16:33):
but it's sharpening those tools and learning different variations on how to use
those. That's beautiful. Now you were talking
about learning a lot through watching jiu-jitsu and you
came to class the other night and you're, you did,
you're way better at me than at it. Cause if I have a key and
I'm on the mat, like I'll end up training and doing something stupid, even
(16:53):
though if I'm injured and you put a guy on, you're in class and you're like,
Hey Perry, I'm not training tonight. I'm just watching. Yeah.
Cause you're a little injured. Yeah. Tell me about that.
That's not something most people will do. Most people, when they take an, when they have an injury, They're
either most often, they're just not going to come to the gym or
B they'll come and they'll just sit on the sidelines, which is even more super
(17:14):
rare. I would say like 98% just don't come. 2% will
come, but stay on the sidelines. And the 0.1% you
in this scenario puts your D on is like, Hey, I'm
How do you get to that? That's not something, especially with younger guys,
like older guys, we're old. We know we get hurt. Like
(17:38):
that happens. And you know, we know to take time off,
but usually younger guys are like, I'm injured. Rubbed
dirt on it. You know, I'm just going to power through it. Yeah. Right.
I think my perspective has been a bit like it's
been, it's been progressive. So I've been injured before. And
(17:59):
I've, I've went through it. And, and, and I think the
reason why I went through it is like, when you first
start like tapping people, it's fun and all this stuff. And like
my idea of jiu-jitsu has changed to, I want to do it for a
long time. I want to be like you. I want to be
like Paul. I want to be like Dan, right. I want to do it for a long
time because it is such an important thing to me. I think mentally, even
(18:23):
spiritually in some aspects, I think it is that
important. So like, I'm willing, I had to look at myself and
I was training for a little bit, injured, like my
back. So the injury is, you know, my back, it's important. And
it could possibly get bad. And you need that
(18:43):
Most people are like, I need it for life because
I teach jiu-jitsu, but I don't need it to work at a computer all day, right?
Yeah. And my point is, I'm
willing to sacrifice my desires
or my appetites now and let the
(19:04):
different part of my soul reason take over
a little bit and tell me to calm down and
just show up because I actually enjoy seeing the
people. I mean, I've been knowing these people for years now every
single day. It's like family. So like, I want to come and I want to say,
hi, I want to say hi to you. I want to say hi, you know, um,
(19:26):
to other people in the gym and be a part of the community as
It's hard not to roll, especially like, and
You're like, Oh no, not tonight. It's hard. And
then they're like, are you okay? Are you okay? It's like, yeah, I'm okay. I
just, You know, I'm just gonna, I'm just going to sit out
(19:50):
It's like a little bit. Hey, like take one week off now to
get your injury better. Because if it gets worse, you're going to
have to take 10 weeks off. Yeah. Right. So it's like the, the short sacrifice
for the greater victory. Right. And I think that's a great
life lesson that a lot of times it takes people a major
injury for that to happen or a lot
(20:11):
of injuries for that to happen. It's a, it's a really smart training
approach. Yeah. Um, you
said that jiu-jitsu does a lot for your, for your life spiritually. What
Um, this is like a little bit in a
little bit in the wheat. I feel that. I
(20:31):
feel that there's three parts of our soul. Yeah. So, so
we, I mean, I know. I like it. Let's go. Okay. So,
so, so you have reason. Okay. Right. You
have courage and you have your appetites. Yeah. And,
and reason, like the Greeks would say, like, you know, reason is
here. Courage is cur of the heart and
(20:54):
then your appetites, you know, like your stomach. Yeah. And
when I brought that up, what
I would say, just for this example, is going
to roll and being hurt would be me feeding my
appetites, right? The
lowest form of good for myself and my soul. And
(21:20):
when I am being virtuous or just, I
have to listen to my reason and say, hey, no, maybe you
should take some time. Maybe you should go experience, like it was
deliberate, go there. Go in your gi. Go
say hi to everybody. Go experience it. And do
(21:40):
not let yourself, I've failed so many times of going there
and trying to do that same thing. And I said, do not let yourself do it. You
get suckered in. Right. So, so, so, and
I, I feel that, um, like when I
say, you know, spiritually, um, you
know, I think that, that, you
(22:00):
know, just on, on that small example, but,
um, I think that when there's a place where a
bunch of people are coming together for a common goal,
right. And, and honestly, it's to, to be better. you
know, it's not, it's not so much like people are coming there to want to be
able to go hurt other people. It's, it's so much not about that. It's
(22:22):
just, which is so crazy. You know, at first you,
I think that changes, but, um, it's, it's like
e pluribus, e pluribus uno, right. Out of many
one, like the great, you know, on the great seals, like you
have a, you have a tree cutter. Yeah. You
have the gym owner. You have a lawyer, right? Out
(22:46):
of many one, just like in the United States, like you have all these people
And I think a lot of times, you know, even if you are talking
politics, it's a lot of like accepting of everyone else's
views. It's more open in that room. It's like, it's
(23:06):
not a battle. Like we all have our own perspectives on, and
I think it shows up in techniques. Like I, my way, I do a sweep. I have you
have your way of how to do a sweep. Like neither of we know in jiu-jitsu, like
neither of us are right. Like I could have my political views. You could have your political
views. It doesn't mean that we're right. It's just. It's our interpretation
of things. Yeah. And it's our viewpoint on things. And like, there's a
(23:28):
lot of space in the middle for, and on the outsides for
everyone else to sit. Yeah. And I think jiu-jitsu teaches us that.
It teaches us that and it gives us a place to come to where we can experience the
ability for multiple people
in society to come together and have those conversations. And
God is present in that. Yeah. Because of that. You
(23:51):
know, like, and I, I feel, um,
I feel that there. And I think like, that's where Jiu Jitsu has changed a
lot for me is like, that's where I'll come. I'll come with my gi and
not roll. I will drive 20 minutes. Yeah. Spend an
to experience that. And two hours of your day to not even train
(24:13):
and get your workout in. But you get everything else out of it, right? Because we
don't all do jiu-jitsu just for the act of doing jiu-jitsu. We do it for being
with our community, being with our people. I tell people I
kill so many birds with one stone when I go to jiu-jitsu class. I
get to spend time with my friends. I'm, of course, running my business. I
get to help other people. I get my workout in. Right?
(24:37):
It's so many other things. And if it's like, hey, if I'm injured and I still go to
the gym, and I get instead of five things out of
it, I get four, That's still a lot of
benefit for me to do it versus me just like watching Netflix. Right.
Right. And there's no problem with taking a day off. I'm not saying like, Hey, you should go
to the gym every day and you need to, you need to do this. Like
(24:57):
take a day off every once in a while, but be deliberate about it. Yeah. Right.
And especially if you're trying to build a routine, like
in your, maybe you're a two day a week person, Tuesdays and Thursdays, like make it a
habit two days a week. Cause you know, as
well as I do, like once you break a habit, it's hard to get back into
it. Yeah. It's hard to restart it. Just like you,
(25:18):
when you said, Hey, I was working out for a while. I kind of fell
out of my habit with my business and it's hard to get back into it. Yeah. Cool.
What's the biggest change you've seen in your training?
Right. So you started, you've been training for about three years. You
have some pancreation sites under your belt. You have some jiu-jitsu tournaments
under your belt. Yeah. You're relatively
(25:41):
newer blue belt, but not that much newer of one. You've had it for a while. What's,
what's the biggest shift you've seen in your
training that has helped you from like the day you walked in
My biggest shift is like, I think is mentally.
I'm willing to go there and put my butt on
(26:04):
the mat for that other new person. You
know, and I was just talking about this before, honestly, we're talking about Caleb. Yeah.
And when he said to me, and I was struggling, he said, Hey, man, I
got you. Got you. It's okay. Just
breathe. Right? That feeling. I've said that same
thing to another new person. Right? With
(26:26):
intention. Because it was a core memory. It
meant something to me. And it does. So, like,
my training has changed to, like, you know, when you first get that first
tap, you want to go get more. I want to just armbar the
shit out of somebody. Yeah, because you get that first taste of victory. Yeah. Oh,
wow. And then you choke somebody out
(26:47):
and stuff. My point is that I'm willing
to go and get myself in a bad situation. I'm
willing to get choked out by a white belt. I'm willing to let him take
my back, feel where his choke is. It's
not always that every training or every role, it's about
me winning or just being on top or showing that
(27:07):
I am dominant. Now, there are times when
I have to switch myself out of being passive. And
do jiu-jitsu for yourself. And really do some jiu-jitsu. That
happens sometimes, you know, but, but
I think that's probably the biggest shift is like, no,
(27:27):
I'm willing to, cause you get to work on whatever you're working
on. If I like, Hey, white button, you can work on getting my back and choking me.
That gives me the opportunity to work it out. Defenses against you. Yeah. You
can always work on something. And I say this all the time, but
if I help you with your goals, it inherently helps me with my
own goals. It's all about helping each other. If I just focus on
(27:48):
me, I'm only going to get half the benefit. But
if I focus on helping you, then I'm going to get double. Times
that by the 30 people we have in class that night or the
10 people I roll with. Have you ran into
a plateau in your training yet? Have you felt like, man, I hit a wall?
Like, what do you mean by plateau is as interest
(28:11):
or, or the ability to physically get
Yeah. Either like either plateauing as in, I never
thought about plateauing an interest or plateauing
like, Hey, you feel like you're just not getting better at Jiu Jitsu. Have
Um, honestly, so, so
(28:34):
I guess I, I've never thought, I haven't thought about it till right now. So
let me, let me think through that. So interest wise,
no. Um, I haven't plateaued, uh,
jiu-jitsu wise. Um, Let
me, let me just ask this. What, what have I learned that's, that's
(28:54):
brand new lately, or what am I working on? So, um,
I've been trying to do a lot more arm bar stuff. Um,
and, and you have an interesting thing that you showed me a while ago,
and then I see you naturally go to a lot. It's an arm bar series from
having someone's back and actually flipping your arm
around their head. Yeah. So I've been a little bit interested in
(29:16):
that, but I don't think I've gotten any better at it, to be honest. So,
so, um, I don't have any really cool new jiu-jitsu
things that I'm working out either, like reverse daily Hiva or
X guard things. So in that way, maybe I have like plateaued a
(29:37):
Yeah. I, I do feel like I'm
improving. Awesome. Don't think about it.
Yeah. I, and I, and I don't care about like the stripes or
I think that's why you, you probably haven't hit a plateau is
because you just keep Jiu Jitsu fun. You know, you move a lot.
So you're always opening up new opportunities. Uh, you
(29:58):
love learning. So you're always looking for something new, like a new toy
to play with. Yeah. Right. And I feel like a lot of people that run into plateaus, they
run into it because, um, that
they keep playing with the same toy too much. Yeah. And that toy
gets boring. Oh, that's a good point. Right? And then they don't find something new
and fun to play with. That's a good point. And you don't want to like just jump
(30:18):
to new stuff and forget about the old stuff. Yeah. But like you
need to keep introducing fun into your game. And I think you've done
amazing at that. Yeah. Like there's always smiles on your faces and
And I'll switch my game. I'll switch my thing that
I'll start going to rear naked chokes now. Okay, I'm only doing
(30:42):
arm bars with this person. I'm only doing Kimuras with this
person. Now, and a lot of times, I'll
just grab it and let it go. A lot of times I'll just get
there, grab it, like a Kimura, make sure I
could have scooted my butt out. Yeah, let it go. Yeah.
Like I don't need to, who needs that 30 seconds or reset anyway.
(31:03):
Yeah. Right. Like take this mission, go until you might be able to
tap them and move on with it. And you don't want to do that all
of the time because then you never practice the actual finish. I've done that. Right.
Cause then you'll get into a tournament and you'll get a Camorra and then you just let it go for no reason. And you're
Right. Awesome. Uh, how about some rapid fire questions for
you? Yeah, sure. Sweet. Uh, first one. You
(31:27):
ready? Yeah. This is challenging. Okay. Is it? Okay. Yeah. Gi
Okay. Uh, why? Because I
feel that a lot of times when I'm rolling with people, the gi slow
gets slowed down a lot and people get too focused on grips and
(31:48):
It just, I like it. It seems like it stops your jiu-jitsu. Uh, we touched
Um, I I would say I would say armbar sweet
um armbar from different spots Uh, it
Like you'll just go to your favorite one to hit kimura kimura Sweet
(32:09):
from any certain spot or just everywhere. Um, honestly, where's the
So many different places. I always grab
and threaten from half guard and then I
usually get the sweep. Bottom half guard? Yeah, bottom half guard. I
am terrible at that. I'll get, I usually get the sweep from
there. So I'll try to elevate them too and sweep and
(32:34):
Awesome. Top person you would love to train with given the opportunity. Dead
That I would love to train with? Yeah. Um, I
would say I, I, I've never thought about that. I
don't really have, I don't idolize that much. I, I
would say, uh, any UFC
(32:57):
Maybe, maybe, maybe one of the Gracies. One of the Gracies. Yeah. Cool. Um,
fun side fact, uh, I went to a
seminar with Hickson Gracie. Hickson, yeah. It was awesome. They're
the pioneers. Yeah, he is. He made
jiu-jitsu huge. I
was his uke for a technique. Really? He taught a technique on me. Dude, that
(33:19):
guy feels like a brick. When
did you do that? It was probably like a decade ago in Chicago. I went to a seminar with
him. It was a really cool opportunity. You still are. Yeah. Okay. Yeah,
for sure. I don't think he does seminars anymore unless you go to I
don't know, some huge one. Maybe he does one a year,
maybe one every other year. Best advice
(33:44):
Oh, man. Okay, Vec, just
come, just show up. Relax and
Don't do it. And as we said, all easier said than
Uh, one word to describe your Jiu Jitsu style. Um,
(34:08):
this would be one of those ones where like we write on a sheet of paper and we show everyone at
the same time and see what it says. Like, I'll
So I would say, Spazzy.
I would say more bouncy, flowy.
Flippy. I would say flippy. Yeah, you are bouncy. I would
(34:30):
say Dan is also flippy. You're
like holding on to something I can't grasp. Yeah. I don't know what
they are, but they're those, we used to have them as kids. You win them at the carnival, but
it was like a, a tomb filled with water that rolls in
on itself. When you grab it, it slips out of your hand every time. That's what I feel like. It's like,
it's like I'm here, then I'm over here and I'm over there and I'm cartwheeling over you. You
(34:50):
can like teleport. Uh, the toughest aspect
of BJJ to master. And this is interesting because I'm asking you a blue belt
this. I, I learned a lot in three years. Like what's the
My most important thing is I just want to do it for a long time. So just,
just take care of your body, self-control, don't
(35:11):
get injured. Don't keep on training over the injuries. It's
What is one habit that has significantly improved your jiu-jitsu
Um, one habit that
has improved my jiu-jitsu game. Um,
(35:34):
Don't, I don't, I don't really know. I mean, just, just
showing up, you, you can only get better at Jiu Jitsu by just coming,
You can't think it. People ask me all the
time. They're like, Hey, my goal is to get my, my blue belt. I'm like, Hey, that's a
great goal. But the goal that's going to get you there is
That's, that's one thing that your goal should be to train. I'm
(35:57):
going to say, well, I'm going to say one thing about it. What
bothers me so bad is the four-stripe white
belt that leaves because he didn't get his blue belt
in time. Man, I don't know because
Oh, my blue. No, no one. So
(36:19):
no one comes to me with that. They should, they should. Like I'm,
I, I am that apparently the juice to outlier. Like if
you want to know what you need to work on, you can ask me, but it better be
a good question, but I'll tell you full transparency, what you need to work on.
You have to be okay with that. That might, the answer might be train more
or be more consistent or don't take a month off. Right.
(36:40):
But I hear more of that, like, through
the grapevine, like blah, blah, blah. They didn't get
a stripe. And someone will tell me that I'll be like, they
can just ask me and I'll tell them why. Yeah. Yeah. And
they're like, does it, I get, you want it,
you want that as a way to see your progress, but
(37:03):
like whatever. By the time you get, by the time you get a black belt,
How about, how will, yeah, yeah. How about the next time someone can put, listen, everybody
just take your belt off. It all comes. Everybody's got a white belt now.
It all comes with a, all that more stripes and
more belts come with is a, is a bigger microphone, right? More people listen to you.
(37:24):
So your work matters a little bit more, right? So a lot
of responsibility comes with it, but also a huge target on your back. Okay.
Like, right? You get that blue belt, people want to kill you. Right?
I don't know so much about blue belts. I think blue belts are kind of considered to
be basically white belts that know how to tap. Know some stuff, yeah.
(37:45):
No, just know how to tap. But, you
know, it's like, I could see that with a black belt. Yeah. Because
That's true. It's not as bad. I feel like it was way more when I was a purple belt, like you
get that purple belt, people want to like kill you. I feel like when you get your
black belt, some people want to kill you, but more people just like are respectful.
Yeah. More might even roll with you softer.
(38:08):
Yeah, for sure. Than somebody else. For sure. Uh, what's
Oh, that's improved my life. Um, I
would say. I
would say talking to people that
(38:31):
have more knowledge than me, just being good student mentors. Yeah.
Seeking mentors. And if you get a hold of a mentor. You
ought to know how to be a good student. Otherwise you won't. It's
a funny thing. So like if, you know, realizing, realizing
what you have in front of you. So I would say the biggest thing would be mentors, older,
(38:51):
older, older men, specifically in my life. Then that
have done things maybe that I want to do or, or,
or somewhere that maybe I want to be, or just emotionally more
intelligent than me, you know, for
Uh, last one, favorite book or podcast or
(39:16):
Well, right now I listen to a lot of
Philosophize This. It's like a philosophy podcast.
I've not listened to that one. I'll have to
check it out. Check it out. Yeah, check that out. I also listen
to Joe Rogan as well. Not as
(39:38):
much. His podcast is just so good. Yeah,
they're a long time. And, and then I do
a lot of like YouTube stuff. Like what on YouTube? Um,
like I'll do educational YouTube or like fun YouTube? No,
not fun YouTube. It'll be about biblical stuff.
(39:59):
I'm a big into like symbolism, kung, stuff like
Yeah. It's that it's only weird. I should make it weird. It's like jiu-jitsu.
Yeah. Outside person looking in on Jiu Jitsu, you're like, it's pretty weird when
you're doing Jiu Jitsu. It's only weird if you make it weird. Yeah. Cool. Uh,
anything else you would like to share today with our listeners, people getting
(40:20):
interested in Jiu Jitsu, people starting out Jiu Jitsu, any
To all the parents that bring their kids to Jiu
Jitsu, it was really scary, right? For
your kid to join Jiu Jitsu, step on the mat one time. Ooh.
Step on the mat one time. Just one time. It's like, I don't think jiu-jitsu
(40:40):
is just for everybody. Yeah. Like you need to step on the mat one time.
Experience it. Try it out. Yeah. Awesome.
Well, I appreciate you, man. Thank you so much for climbing out of a tree, giving
up part of your work day to come here and join us on Inside the
Wave podcast. If you guys listen, you guys like this, give
us a five-star review or whatever your podcast platform is. Like
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