Butter Knife Protection, Abandoned Post, 30x30, and a Violent Foot Pursuit

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Music.

(00:11):
Hey, when are we telling people that you retired? We did.
No, we didn't. Yes, we did. We told the patrons. We didn't tell the public.
Oh, really? Well, we could do that now. I just did. That I retired?
Yeah, I retired from Lancaster City early July.
Congratulations, Jerry. Thanks, man. Thanks. That's awesome.

(00:32):
And we will not share what you're doing now. It's top secret.
I don't know if it's top secret, but let's just say this. Can we say that what
I have to say is as relevant as it was back then? Yes.
As it is now. Well, for sure. You still have experience. All the experience.
You can say as much as you want to say about what you're doing now.

(00:53):
Well, thank you, Anthony, for your permission to tell people about my life,
which I don't like to do to begin with.
I know. You don't like to tell people anything, but it endears you to people
when you share a little bit more about your life. You aren't so guarded.
I like to be guarded. It's how I, I feel like I say, stay safe.
I I'm having problems with stay.

(01:14):
I can't say it right now. I don't know why.
I don't know. Um, yeah, so I'm retired as of early July and,
uh, now I do, I'm still in law enforcement.
Let's just say that. Yeah. We'll say that totally different department.
No longer with Lancaster city bureau of police.
Um, had a great career 22 and seven months, I believe. There you go.
Yeah. Um, although I left as if I had 25 years on so that's pretty exciting

(01:39):
which is key yeah it's super cool dude it's it's.
It's been great. Like I feel rejuvenated going after it again.
Nice. Just in a different way, I guess. Yeah. But yeah, dude,
14 and a half years of doing nothing but sex crimes was probably a mistake.
Probably. Looking back, I might have people in my lives who have told me to
probably make a change many years ago, which I didn't listen to,

(02:02):
but I'm, I love my career.
I had a great, great time putting lots of bad guys away for a really long time,
helping kids out and women out.
Yeah, for sure. Sure. And obviously anyone with a brain could tell that we had worked together.
I mean, we talked about working together on Diakonos, but we also tried to be
careful because you were still at the department.
Oh, that was scary, dude. That was a scary time being at the department and

(02:26):
then trying to like, trying to, trying to dodge landmines, dude,
especially in the world we live in.
You can't say anything without, you know, right.
Right. Without getting absolutely destroyed. Well, the police do not have the
same first amendment rights as other people.
And it's probably rightly so maybe I think we should be care like current law

(02:47):
enforcement officers should be careful what they say. Cause you don't speak for your department.
I mean, if you do speak for your department, then you're really putting yourself out there. Yeah.
But yeah, I mean, I'm glad that we talk about law enforcement things and we've
been doing that for a long time because you don't hear this stuff anywhere.
Right. Right. You won't hear this anywhere. And the bottom line is we,
you know, you and I have certain convictions. We have certain beliefs.

(03:10):
We have we have a faith.
We're unique. And that comes into play in how we view our our our jobs within
the law enforcement community and who we are as husbands, fathers,
like people in the church.
You know, all that comes into play. And community members, because we still are part of a community.

(03:33):
Right. So, yeah, I think we have... So I do bristle a little bit because it
seems like First Amendment rights for police officers...
The the they're protected only or more
so in one direction yeah for sure in other words you're pistol
about everything though anthony well that's to be honest and and
i should say this in our culture in general first

(03:54):
amendment rights seem to be more favorable and favorable in one direction so
if you have certain beliefs uh you're allowed to say those things and you can
actually say almost anything you want if you're on the other side or you have
conservative beliefs it's it's It's much more difficult to get through the landmines.
There's lots more landmines as having conservative values versus progressive

(04:17):
values in the culture in which we live.
Correct. And then for us, what's wild to me is like a lot, not a lot,
all our values, we try to ground all our values on the Bible and what the Bible says.
And those are extremely considered extremely radical in our day and age.

(04:38):
It would be considered extreme, for sure.
Right. Yeah. Which is, you know, unfortunate because it's kind of been those types of beliefs,
those conservative values are kind of the bedrock of our country and are eroding
to the point now where they're considered radical in nature,
which is partly why we're doing this podcast. What episode are we on?

(05:00):
This is Low Expectations, episode number 17.
17. Yeah, 17. It's good to see you, Anthony. Good to see you.
Let me ask you something. Oh, here we go.
Let's say, all right, if you had like an action figure, all right, and it was made of you.
Okay. All right. What would you, how would you deck yourself out?
You know what I mean? Like what accessories would you have? What would you be wearing?

(05:25):
How would you want your action figure to look?
Do you want me to start with something that I think you should have?
Oh, with something I have? Yeah. No, something you have. No,
no, no. Why are you picking it? You're asking me to pick for myself and then
you're going to tell me. Okay, go ahead.
Well, I didn't know because I sprung this on you. This wasn't in our show prep. Yeah, I have no idea.
You have no idea. I think you'd be wearing cargo shorts.

(05:47):
Cargo shorts? Yeah, dude. I've grown out of cargo shorts. I've finally grown out of them.
I am not wearing cargo shorts very often. in like in a
chill like like that would be one of the outfits you would have as a cargo shorts
and a t-shirt all right you're already like completely missing the
point you'd have like nice shoes okay but what
would you have like as like a big pickup truck

(06:07):
maybe i literally what kind of hat would you have green bay hat i would have
hair you what would your hair look like it would be thick and luscious yeah
dark oh dark hair yeah all right because because my my bride I'd always thought
she would marry someone tall with, with dark hair.
Yeah. You know, but your average height, you're not, you're not short.

(06:29):
No, I'm not short, but I, I, you know, yeah. You wish you were like a couple inches taller.
No, I don't. Your action figure though. Would your action figure be tall, be taller or no?
Probably like six foot. Yeah. Maybe six foot. Just like, you know,
busting out of a t-shirt or something.
Chest hair or no chest hair visible? Like no chest hair visible. Okay.

(06:52):
Would you so you said long hair long luscious hair
not long like man bun long you
wouldn't have a man bun no all right all right but how about a perm like those
kids are now dude kids are perming their hair oh my word what is happening and
they have that like the mullet things going on now yeah and that the mullet
i kind of i like the mullet they have the front hair that's like fluffy and

(07:13):
permy yeah dude i want to slap those kids around yeah what are
their accessories i i don't probably a green bay like
helmet or hat or something i think this is
so dumb why i don't know i'm trying to
think what else what else would because i'm trying to think of some of your
habits like what what would you want with your action figure a gun what kind

(07:33):
of gun like would you have a pistol would you have a long gun like dangling
like how would you just a pistol i guess a pistol like kind of sticking out
like a handgun would it be in your hand or would it be like in your outfit?
Open carry so that I could sue officers that stopped me illegally.
I love that. Yeah. I love that. I love that.
What else? What other accessories would you have? I don't know.

(07:55):
Gary, you're asking me this question. I literally just woke up.
Oh, I just woke up. You're asking me, what do you think I would have?
Cause I have like a, like if I want it, I want myself to have an action figure.
I really do. You, you would have your shirt open with your chesties out.
Yes, for sure. And you'd have some sort of.
Leather satchel yes or backpack something something leather handmade

(08:18):
yeah he said make made in the usa for sure
i want a stamp it's gotta it's gotta say that you'd have
you'd have a lot of trinkets see you're like you're like a guy that
has a lot i don't like i don't want to carry anything and yet
i find myself carrying everything actually i
if my wife carries my brides with me i'm like i put this
in your purse yeah hold my sunglasses be like the only thing the

(08:39):
only thing i want on me is a gun that's all you want i
don't want my wallet it i don't want a badge nothing i'm just
like rolling with a gun yeah and you
know that that's it but you your action figure
is kind of boring then perfect that's how
you want that's that's what i want i roll up on this guy and
and i'd be like this guy what's this guy gonna do

(08:59):
and then wham all of a sudden i'm doing something action you and
your cargo shorts yeah roughing somebody i don't know why you went with cargo shorts
i literally don't when i i may wear cargo
shorts when i don't really care anymore when
i think if i'm going to and from work when i think of you i think of you in cargo
shorts yeah they were i did wear
them for a long time and i think they're coming back lauren was like you have

(09:21):
got to stop wearing cargo shorts they are stuck in the 90s they're very good
for like for people that carry things yeah i mean you throw your pet your phone
in one you throw yeah but you know what i bought in another one like whatever
my go-to right now are nice, nice shorts.
The only company I found that makes them is Dockers. Shout out to Dockers. Yeah.

(09:41):
Support the show. They have a side pocket for your phone. So you have your front
pockets like you do, your back pockets.
And then there's along the side of your leg, there's a special pocket that you can fit your phone in.
It's low key. It's not printing on the front of your pocket.
Which I hate. I hate having a phone in my front pockets. I don't know why.

(10:02):
I can't stand it. but you would have a lot of trinkets
you'd have like a a pen maybe a fountain pen you'd
have like a tablet that you never write in but you carry
with you wherever you go when you say open it up
you mean a like a leather leather yeah a leather
bound tablet that you open up like a field notes cover yes that's what i would
have yes for sure yeah that's that's that's what that's i think that's what

(10:24):
you would have and yours no one would ever know they'd be like dude this guy
this guy's you know he's he's a pushover look at him look at him with all his little doodads and,
doodads and things and then they come up and try to mug you and
then boom action yeah yeah your pen
turns into something yeah your pen turns into a knife oh dude

(10:45):
yeah there was a time i did an interview with another guy i think i probably
told this story if i did it's real dumb it involves a a butter knife so we're
talking about pens like it might stab somebody we were interviewing this this
guy for a homicide and we get through Miranda or we go through Miranda and the
lead detective goes, do you understand what we're saying?

(11:06):
And the guy just starts grinding his teeth.
I can't even do it. He's grinding his teeth and you could like audibly hear
it in the room. And it was like echoing off the walls.
And he probably did this. It felt like minutes, but it was probably like 12 seconds.
It felt like forever. And he, and the other detectives like,
Hey man, do you want something to drink?
And he's like, yeah, I go, I got it. So I'd leave the room. I'm,

(11:28):
I'm back in like, like three and a half seconds.
I have a cold cup of coffee. Cause I'd put hot coffee in it and then just added water.
Cause I was like, I'm not giving him hot coffee, right? You don't, you don't do that.
And I grab a butter, a butter knife. Cause you're not, we weren't allowed to
have guns in the, in the interview room while we're interviewing this guy.
So I grabbed a butter knife.
I put it in my pocket and we go through the interview.
Neither of us took one single note, not one note the entire time.

(11:51):
Cause the guy just like stared off into space and he had basically cut this
guy's head off like previously.
So, so he, he tells us that. So he tells us he did this thing with a,
with a cheese knife, the size of a cheese knife, which is a butcher's knife.
But anyway, so he goes, and then he, then he admits to killing his mother like
years and years before he smothered her with a pillow, which was crazy.

(12:12):
So this guy was out of his mind and I literally, and he was a big fella.
And I was like, man, if we have to fight this guy, it's going to be real bad.
So we get to the, so we go through the interview. It's like an hour and a half
long. He admits to all this stuff.
We take him to the holding cell and we put him in the holding cell.
We, as soon as we closed the door, I go, I go, Hey, I go,
look at this i pulled the butter knife out of my out of
my pocket and he goes he starts laughing right

(12:35):
just like you are he goes what were you gonna do what what were
you gonna do with that thing i said dude if he came at us i was going jugular
thigh jugular thigh and i'm literally like motioning it and he's just cracking
up laughing about this guy dude that was nuts anyway yeah a fountain pen would
be a great can we keep that story in yeah man okay yeah all right good we'll keep it in Yeah.

(12:58):
That was a long time ago. That was a good one. That was wild, dude.
That is pretty wild. Like grinding, like his teeth were grinding.
And it was one of the scariest moments of my life. Isn't it crazy how you can...
On this job, there's certain people you come across, they're knuckleheads,
they're idiots, they're criminals, but then you can be around someone and literally

(13:18):
be like, this person is possessed by evil.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I could picture him, he would have killed us if he had
the chance and walked over our dead bodies as if nothing happened.
It literally wouldn't have bothered him. What do they call that?
That's like- A sociopath? A sociopath, yeah.
Yeah. It's wild. Yeah, it's wild to be talking to someone.
Out there yeah talking to someone that you're like wow this

(13:40):
person is actually legitimately yeah i mean
most people see this stuff on tv and it's all like hollywood it
up right but in reality there are
people out there that are like that oh yeah yeah for sure for
sure and some of them might even look like your neighbors you never
even know you know what i mean you wouldn't know till you're like till it happens
that's true that's true dude what all

(14:03):
right so what uh we got off to a normal ridiculous start a rough start dude
that was a rough start you know i i i get i just woke up i'm you got cobwebs
man i got cobwebs drinking coffee you know my bride says though that when i
wake up so i'm hoping this gains us listeners she says when i wake up i have a lower raspier.

(14:23):
Sexier voice when i wake up all right so maybe that'll come through on this
episode and gain us Gain us some listeners and some followers,
some subscribers, but probably not. Yeah. Subscribe to the show.
Probably not. Like us, give us a five-star review. Yeah. Hey,
our last episode on Officer Marquette. Yes.

(14:43):
That really resonated with people. Good. It was really cool to see.
I was able to reach out to some of his supporters on social media.
They were very appreciative of that episode. episode
you can you know if
that if that episode resonated with you you can
support him there there i included in the show in

(15:04):
the episode notes for that episode a link to his website facebook page i don't
know if these are family members friends that are have this support mac uh website
and and is it like a gofundme thing like he's like you you can donate yeah you
can donate uh to legal fees and everything or just show your support like hey
we're thinking about Yeah.

(15:24):
So that really resonated with people. And it also put on my radar some other
officers who have been charged with murder.
That I think, you know, we'll look at here in some future episodes because it's, it's really crazy.
There, there are officers out there who get in charge and there's not a ton
of press about some of them or they've just been forgotten.

(15:46):
You know, it was an incident that happened several years ago.
It was in the news. It was big, big news. And then the officer,
you know, gets charged and, you know, then it just quiet down and,
and you never, you never hear updates. You never hear like what happens to these officers?
Are they convicted? Are charges dropped? That sort of thing,
which is, you know, for instance, kind of in the same realm of things like Columbia,

(16:11):
Ohio or Columbus, Ohio PD.
There was, back in 2020, huge, like, all kinds of stuff on social media about
how they were roughing people up in the riots and protests and excessive force
this and excessive force that.
And acquaintances and family members sharing stuff like Columbus PD,
horrible, they're terrible.
And now the feds did an investigation and said, no, they didn't do anything out of line.

(16:36):
But it's like four years later and it's buried in, you know,
the quagmire of our national media.
No one ever knows. everyone just believes those stories they
hear initially when they come out so and we're
all guilty of it like we talk about stuff on this podcast all the time we're
like oh we should keep up with that we we just you know we forget about it and
we don't we don't talk about it much anymore or at all so anyways yeah that's

(17:02):
that so i like it yeah so can you turn my ears down just a little bit.
Thanks, buddy. You were crushing my ears. I like your voice. Maybe not that much.
I like your voice a lot, but man, it was really, I'm sorry. It's crushed me.
Maybe just up a little bit, just a tad.
I got to be able to hear myself. Dude, I did a centimeter on the volume. Well, I don't.
You're asking me to do a lot over here. Well, our tech person's not around,

(17:25):
so I don't know who else to ask. Is that better?
Yeah, that's good. Thank you. I don't really know if I did anything.
Maybe if you start yet. I just put my hands over there and made it look like I did something.
I didn't really do anything. That's why it's like, yeah. Yeah.
So this episode, we're going to talk about the Secret Service again.
Okay. And then we're also going to break down a foot pursuit out of Chicago.
Yeah. PD. That's a wild one. Yeah.

(17:46):
So yeah, what do you want to talk about first? Let's just talk about the Secret Service agent.
So you asked me the question, didn't give me an opportunity to respond,
which is pretty normal. That is pretty normal. You run the show,
dude. I'm just here for color.
I'll just add color to the- Color commentary. To the mix. So there's a report that just came out.
I saw it on Newsmax.

(18:08):
I think that the news agency that broke it was Real Clear Politics or something like that.
But I saw this on Newsmax, that this report of a female Secret Service agent
abandoning her post recently at a Trump event to breastfeed her baby.
So this is being investigated right now by the secret service.

(18:30):
Okay. Basically what happened is someone reported that she abandoned a post
that she was supposed to be on and she went into a secure room that was set
aside for official secret service business and or like emergency.
Okay. And that she was in there with unpinned people, which means people who

(18:51):
did not have security clearances to be in this room.
Okay. And she was feeding the baby that was feeding her baby that was maybe
brought by other family members to the event or something like that.
And she had just basically was
like, well, I'm just going to leave my post and go in here and do this.
I read this. I was like, wow, this is a crazy report.

(19:15):
Now, here's the thing. I don't. So it's an allegation at this point.
It's an allegation that was put out to the media. They asked the Secret Service about it.
The Secret Service said, we received this allegation, this complaint,
and we are investigating it, and we won't say anything more about it ever.
Ever? Ever. Okay. Of course they won't.

(19:36):
Just not saying anything about it, which is like the Fed way.
It is the Fed way. It's the Fed way.
Unless it's something that they like or they want to manipulate the public.
Right, unless it's in a certain direction.
Sure. Look at the Trump thing. This is what's amazing to me about the attempted Trump assassination.
You have a 20 year old who reports now he had multiple accounts like.

(20:03):
Overseas like so like he was
he was interacting overseas he was on gun ranges
that were shared by federal agencies like
that federal some federal agents visited and there's
like nothing it's like complete silence on this guy like who was this 20 year
old yeah who was he who was he connected to interesting and there's nothing

(20:26):
there's nothing it's it's the problem is if you don't say things Like if you
don't release information,
conspiracy theories run rampant.
Right. But like you just saying that makes it sound like the FBI or some federal
agency is involved in like either getting him to do this or there's some dark

(20:46):
like government entity that met with him through the webs,
through the web or at a gun range or, you know, give some details of what's
going to happen when it's going to happen. Like it just makes you think that.
Oh, for sure. For sure. Sure. And I'm, I'm completely aware of that,
but it's just, you know, there's this, there has not been much information released by that, by the feds.

(21:09):
In fact, it, it seems like what, what the secret service has mainly wanted to
do is to blame the local cops and just move on and just move on.
And, and it's just, it's just, it just seems odd to me, which is a good technique
in this world because curiosity will dwindle.

(21:30):
Right. Except for fringe people. Yeah. Does that make us fringe?
I don't, I mean, I don't feel like I'm a fringe.
I mean, I don't think a conspiracy theorist, but I, I guess I have questions,
you know, they're like, I have questions just like I did during COVID.
Yeah. And like, why can't we get answers?
Right. To questions. Why isn't. Questions isn't a bad thing. why

(21:53):
isn't there some sort of release on you know
up what's it been six weeks seven weeks i
guess since since the attempted assassination and it's
like everyone's forgot about it yeah do you think like was
the injury to former president trump in his ear
is that something like he could put a gauge in like one
of those uh earring gauges like what size

(22:15):
gauge it gets is 223 right or 556 the
same thing yeah like i guess you could put that size gauge in
that hole in his ear i wonder if he probably won't
do that and then put maga in it like have yeah
written in it dude that would be awesome i guess he's probably not gonna put
a gauge in his ear though i don't think no but anyway i saw i listened to well

(22:35):
i started do you hear do you hear elon musk and former president trump had a
conversation on i think it was on x yeah i didn't listen to any of it it's worth
listening to. I'm like halfway through it. Okay.
It's just interesting because it's not, it's not media. You know what I mean?
It's just, you can actually listen to somebody talk.
He gets asked questions from, from Elon Musk, who is either very smart,

(22:57):
which I think he's very smart.
Right. And also is around lots of really smart people.
Right. He's employed lots of really smart people. He's put himself around lots
and lots of smart people. Yeah.
So it's just, it's really, it's worth it. Yeah.
I heard that the audio on the, the live call was terrible, but they've cleaned
it up, I think as best they could and you could find it anywhere,

(23:18):
but it's, it's definitely worth, worth it. Yeah. I mean, Trump is going to making
his rounds and talking to all types of people.
He just, he just does sit down on what's that comedian's name?
Theo Vaughn. Yeah. I listened to that. That's wild too.
And it's crazy what they're talking about. And it's just, it's just cool.
You know, you don't see Kamala doing that.

(23:40):
Right. Did I say her name? Right. I still don't know how to say her name,
but I know I, what I do know is if you say it wrong, you might be a racist.
That could be but i think it's kamala but
right anyways she's not doing these interviews
right she's she's not doing them and and trump's
doing them that theo's talking about when he was addicted to
coke dude it was funny and like trump's like asking him questions like yeah

(24:03):
like what's worse is alcohol worse than coke and he's like he's like well cocaine
you know he says he's a comedian so he's hilarious like i think he's not very
clean no he's not so if you know but he You have sensitive ears.
Don't listen to him. But like, he's super funny.
He does have some very funny things.
But yeah, that was hilarious when Trump's asking about his cocaine use.

(24:23):
And Theo's like, yeah, man, I'll have you up all night like an owl.
Turn you into an owl. You're on your front porch. Like, it's like,
it's so wild. Yeah, that was pretty funny.
Oh, all right. So back to the, where did we go?
Dude, we got off on the Secret Service to the feds. So this lady had a baby
and she has to feed the baby.
I don't blame you for that. You got to take care of your baby.

(24:44):
Right. It's a little odd that she's on the job or that they assigned her to
this position, knowing that she...
If it's good for her baby, which I think it is, to breastfeed,
why be put on that job? So that's a leadership problem.
And it's a leadership problem not knowing that somebody left their post to go

(25:04):
breastfeed, if in case that happened.
It's an allegation right now. And family members bringing the baby to this thing.
There's a lot of problems with that. There's a lot of weirdness.
But it again goes into this whole 30 by 30 initiative, because the Secret Service
is part of this 30 by 30 initiative.

(25:25):
Our last agency is part of this 30 by 30 initiative. And again,
it's this idea that- Well, a lot of police departments. A lot of police departments.
Many police departments. Yeah. This initiative that the desire is to have 30%
of their agency women by 2030.
Right. It's basically like affirmative action for women. Like it's,

(25:48):
it's, it's a way they're, they're trying to get more women into law enforcement,
into these, these agencies.
And I know, I know that when I bring this up, people, people automatically,
this is what I hate about the polarizing culture we live in.
If you bring this up and you have conversations about

(26:08):
this you automatically hate women you are
a misogynist and that's not that
is not true right of me but it's like it's stressful to even talk about it because
you feel like people are automatically taking that view of you that you somehow
think less of women right because because you don't want to be looked at like a bigot like

(26:32):
a guy who doesn't like women. Right. You don't want to be looked at like that.
So then you're assuming that whoever listens to this and has their.
I don't know, they get all worked up about this, that they're assuming that
about you because you can't even bring it up. That's what you're saying.
Yeah, I think it stresses me out sometimes to even talk about this stuff because

(26:54):
things are suggested about you or believed about you if the wrong people hear it.
Automatically. They automatically assume that you are a certain thing or you are a certain way.
But don't you think you're assuming that these people who on 30 by 30 are just
going to hire women, even if they're unqualified?

(27:16):
Like I would imagine that anybody who signs onto this, I would hope this to be true.
That people who have signed in, signed up for this 30 by 30 thing that they're
like, yep, we're going to try to do this.
We're going to, but they're, they're still gonna have to be qualified people
that we hire. I hope that to be true.
Right. So like, I don't want to assume that they have bad intentions of,

(27:38):
Oh, we'll just find however many women we need to hire and we'll just hire them.
Like, I don't think that's the case.
I think they're trying to hire legitimate candidates who can do the job.
Do you know what I mean? Cause there's all levels of people who can do the job
is basically what I'm saying.
Both men and women, people of all different shades of color.

(27:58):
You know what I mean? Like, right.
So I, I don't want to assume that these 30 by 30, but I don't know any,
like, you know what I mean?
Like I have a research 30 by 30, what they actually mean.
Yeah. I mean, here, here's the thing I've done. I did a deep dive on 30 by 30.
And I talked about this in one of our past episodes.
I think it was season two, episode 15. It was, it was the same episode that

(28:19):
I had officer, retired officer or retired Sergeant Manny Luciano.
Okay. So later on in that episode, after my interview with him,
I talked about the 30 by 30 initiative and I really dove into their stuff.
And, and the goal, the goal of the initiative is just that it's not to get qualified
women into law enforcement.

(28:40):
It's to get these agencies to be at 30% women by 2030.
That that's what they, that's what they say. I mean, the, the,
the, the quote from them is that the, the,
Under-representation of women in policing undermines public safety.
All right, say that again. The under-representation of women in policing undermines public safety.

(29:05):
That was on their homepage.
That's a weird quote. It's a weird statement.
That's what they believe.
It's all part of this reimagining policing. Okay.
Reimagining what policing should be. And this is like the Trojan horse for all
the other craziness they want to bring in, because if you dig further into their stuff,

(29:30):
they say, though 30 by 30 focuses on increasing the representation of women,
we teach participating agencies to use an intersectional lens when analyzing
their culture and practices.
Practices intersectionality again huge
woke word acknowledges the ways in which people's multiple
identities race and ethnicity class

(29:52):
gender sexual orientation religion ability and more magnify or transform their
exposure to discrimination when agencies identify and address sorry when agencies
identify and address inherent biases and policies or practices that discriminate
against diverse candidates,
they help to promote the creation of a more inclusive workplace for everyone.

(30:14):
So it sounds super nice and kind, like we just, we want to welcome everyone.
The problem is that not everyone is meant to be in law enforcement.
And things like law enforcement, the military tend to be more masculine-based jobs.
Like we're created differently. And so to push those gender roles out of the way and say,

(30:46):
no, that is old-fashioned, it's silly, it's stupid,
we need more women into a masculine job that may not be qualified to do it.
But you create problems like this where you have a Secret Service agent who
then has a baby who's breastfeeding and needs to breastfeed that baby.

(31:06):
So then what do you do? Do you create special positions, special rooms for that lady to breastfeed?
And they talk about this stuff. They talk about changing the schedules of women
to better help serve their families.
So they're acknowledging that they have other important responsibilities,

(31:29):
but not so important that we shouldn't put them in these positions that have
historically been filled by men. Yeah.
You got nothing. Yeah. I'm thinking, I'm thinking, man, I like,
if we just take this one incident, if you leave your post and nobody knows about it, that's a bad thing.

(31:51):
Right. Whether or not you're a woman, whether or not you're a woman.
Sure. We're bringing this to this one to light because it involves a woman.
It was in the news. And it was in the news. Yeah. Yeah.
I, you can't abandon your post. You also can't say that just because you are
a woman, you can't do this job.

(32:14):
But we have to decide.
I think the keep it simple, stupid always comes to mind when we talk about these things.
Like we're living in a culture right now that seeks to make everything so confusing,
so bogged down by these like progressive ideas.

(32:39):
And it just muddies the waters of everything.
If you say that generally speaking, and you can't say this anymore,
but if you say generally speaking, law enforcement is a masculine job.
As masculine traits, men who do well in it, testosterone is needed.

(33:02):
Testosterone gives you stronger bones. It gives you better athletic ability.
It produces like a level of aggression. We need a level of aggression in our
police officers. It makes you faster.
It makes you able to just compartmentalize better. Right.
Because men don't think about things generally.
Men don't think about things and dwell on things. Yeah, for sure.

(33:25):
And so, you know, for, for, for all of history,
men have been regarded as the ones who go out and hunt, who go out and conquer,
who go out and engage in these physical endeavors.
And women have generally been the ones who have been considered the managers and, and.

(33:52):
Those in charge of the home and the family.
And that has been completely abandoned and it's viewed as old-fashioned, right-wing, radical.
And then what has happened is these women are then forced.
This idea is forced on women that you have to be in these professions.

(34:13):
You have to be working full-time. You have to be doing these things in addition to serving your family.
So instead of saying, no, serving your family and being a mom,
being a wife, those are great things.
Those are awesome things. Those are God-given, amazing talents and gifts that

(34:38):
have been given to women.
It's like, no, you need to do that. We understand that you still need to do
that, but you should also be working.
And not only should you be working, but you should be working in a masculine profession.
Right. So do you think the left believes that women would be better police officers?
Like, do you think that's the real, like, as if like,

(34:59):
there's like this change that needs to be made within law enforcement that women
would be better at doing versus the traditional men, men generally are the law enforcement officers.
That's, that's their, that's their push. That's, that's pushes that women,
women are in general are going to be better cops. Yes. And they put that in.

(35:22):
Yes. Really? They put that out there all the time when they say things. For what reasons?
That women will hear there, there are four.
Well, first of all, if you go into their stuff and, and you look at it,
it says, it says research suggests that this, this, this, and this about women in law enforcement.
So it never says, it never says proven. It never points you to any studies.

(35:46):
It just says research suggests.
And one of the things that's probably true, or it might be, we think this,
like, that's literally what they're saying.
Right. I mean, I looking down over this, I would, I would guess that they are true.
Like one of, one of the things that this research suggests is that women use
less force and less excessive force than men.

(36:08):
I believe that because men tend to be more, they're the aggressive agenda.
They're the ones that generally are pushing. I mean, you don't see men,
you don't see women getting into fights because they're like,
you know, you disrespected me beating their chest or anything.
That's a man thing. Like, you know, and so you, and you don't,

(36:30):
you don't want your male police officers engaged in excessive force,
but you do want them capable of using force.
So if you say research suggests women use less force and less excessive force
than men, that sounds really nice.
But that could be a huge problem.
Well, using less excessive force would be a good thing. Well,

(36:52):
sure. Yeah. Less excessive force.
And in reality, using less force is good if it's not needed.
So it's kind of a rigged statement anyway.
The statement's rigged. Right. So basically, it's assuming that that that male
cops are out there using excessive force and using more force than reasonable

(37:13):
and necessary. That's what it's suggesting.
Just logically, I think I'm not a lot. I'm not a logic studier of the logic.
What I'm saying is just because someone uses less force.
Sure, I can get totally behind using less excessive force.
I don't want officers to be using excessive force at all. But getting behind
the idea that they use less force is not a good thing.

(37:37):
You do not want police officers unwilling to use force.
That's what I'm saying. The statement's illogical. Right. It just is.
But maybe I'm just an idiot. So, I mean, I don't know. So, in other words- I agree with that.
That's a statement that we can all get behind, right? We would like law enforcement
officers to use less force and use less excessive force. I want that.

(37:59):
I don't really want to have to rough and tumble a guy, but I might have to.
But what's odd about you saying that is the fact that the focus is not on bad
guys controlling themselves and acting correctly, the focus is on the police officer.
And we talk about this all the time. The focus is on the police officer.

(38:21):
The police officer should be losing less force.
Criminals should not be acting the way they're acting, but police officers need to use less force.
It's not criminals should be held accountable. It's the police should be held
more. The police should use less force.
We need to reimagine policing and women can help us reimagine policing because

(38:42):
generally they use less force.
And again, if I'm on the street, I don't want someone with me.
I don't want an applicant with me who got the job because we believe they will
use less force. I want someone with me who understands how to use reasonable
force based on the totality of circumstances.

(39:02):
I don't want someone with me hesitant to use force regardless of the totality
of circumstances. Right.
Like that's that's not that's not helping anyone.
That's not helping your citizens. That's not helping your victims of crime.
That's not helping the fellow police officers.
You know, if you're if you're creating again, it creates a funny statement because

(39:23):
in reality, a female officer who's smaller, right, a small female, right?
Right sometimes they're generally smaller a small female can do more can use
more force on a on a suspect than i can use correct if they throw a punch at
her she potentially can shoot them yeah potentially if they're real small and

(39:47):
that's true of a small a small male too but.
I can't do that if i take i gotta take a punch right right i can't just shoot somebody right Right.
There are, there are terrible videos out there of female officers getting punched
and then just pummeled and it is heart wrenching. And it's funny because,
and maybe this is just me, but like if I watch a male officer getting beat,

(40:08):
I don't have the same reaction.
Like it still bothers me. But when I see a female officer getting beat,
it is literally like heart wrenching.
Cause it's, I mean, it's, it's a terrible thing.
It's wild to think about that. You could have a female on the job who weighs
like 120 pounds, 110, 110 pounds.
Their, their level of force.

(40:29):
You're, you're absolutely right. They can use more. Much higher based purely
on their, their stature.
And in reality, police departments train them to use more force if it's reasonable
and necessary. It goes completely against what this statement,
this illogical statement is.
They're literally said, like literally, if you have a female in your class,

(40:50):
that's small, the, the, the training person will literally look at them and
say, you can step it up. Right.
I mean, it's crazy. So they're going to use more force. And that's always used.
Whenever you do a use of force report, there's always discussion in that report
about your size, the size of the suspect, your physical ability,
your physical ability, what the suspect look like. Yeah. Yeah.

(41:13):
So the idea that using less force is somehow a good thing is not necessarily a good thing.
Another claim, women are named in fewer complaints and lawsuits.
Well, yes, of course, because generally women are not as aggressive in their job duties.
They're generally, again, these are generalities.

(41:36):
Generalities. Yeah. Did I say it right? Yeah. General statements.
General statements, you know, generally men are more aggressive in going after
the criminal element generally.
Okay. So they're going to generate more complaints. Criminals hate.
Law and order. They hate having someone willing to go after them.

(41:57):
And so they will complain about officers who are going after them and trying to do their job.
Women generally do not do that at the same rate, level aggressiveness as male officers.
So just because you're getting less complaints could actually mean that you're
not doing the job as well as a male counterpart.
Yeah, you're not chasing the bad guy. And I'll say this again.

(42:20):
In general. I've worked with women who have been fully capable of passing all
the physical requirements.
They've I've I've worked for
female supervisors who have been more than capable of doing their jobs.
But I'm saying when the push is we want to.

(42:40):
First of all, the left can't even define what a woman is.
But when your full initiative and your full focus is to make sure that we have
this many women on our police department, that will never end because the appease...
Okay, so we get 30% women on these agencies by 2030. Is that the end?

(43:04):
100% no, because they're already talking about intersectionality and how race
and gender and how you identify play into it.
So then that's going to be like well how many of these women are
minorities right how many
how many how many identifying trans people do you
have on your department this is only the beginning and we as law enforcement

(43:25):
continue to appease this ridiculousness have your standards if you are a female
that can meet the standards to get on the police department and i think the
standards should be the same across the board based on your age or whatever
make them the same across the
board, if you want to do the job, then you have to meet the standards.
Have that and get the best people possible. If you, if you start focusing on

(43:50):
how someone looks to get a job, you are going to run into problems because you're,
you're absolutely not going to be looking at all the other things.
The other thing that's interesting that I see them often say is that women research
suggests that women, women,
you, women use or women make less discretionary arrests of minorities. Okay.

(44:16):
Research suggests women law enforcement make less discretionary arrests of minorities.
Okay. So you put that up, all these police departments put it up.
Oh, 30 by 30 initiative. It's so great.
So they put that up on their social media and I had a friend reach out to me
and say, does this mean that all the male officers are racist on this department?

(44:38):
Because that's what it sounds like. It's a valid question.
Basically, what you're saying is our men in our profession are not doing their job correctly.
We need women to come in and do the job correctly.
Right. And it's disgusting. Because women let more minorities go than males.
That's what it's saying.
That's what it's saying. So basically- So they committed a crime.

(44:59):
All right. This is literally what it means. This is what it's saying.
Yep. All right. Female officer approaches a guy who committed a crime.
She decides not to arrest him and just let him go.
Well, you're not doing your job.
And as a community member, you're not doing your job. You've been asked to enforce the laws.

(45:20):
And we all have discretion, but that's not a good statement.
Yeah, we have tons of discretion. But again, the, the desire to use less force
coincides directly with making less discretionary arrests.
Yeah. Let more criminals go. That's what, because I, I may have to fight with this person.

(45:43):
Maybe, or it's just part of their kind. Maybe they're more kind and they think
about, maybe they just think differently than men, which they do.
Right. You know what I mean? Like they, maybe they feel bad about arresting
a person because they got a story, you know? I mean, there could be a thousand things.
In reality, a female has the motherly instinct. You really do.

(46:05):
Like you have this like tender spirit in general.
General so like of course that 100 makes
sense they have a tender spirit more than men
yeah in general i'm not saying that we're saying that every 10 seconds in general
in general but you have to well you have to because i again i don't think you
can make you you can't make blanket statements like more women in policing will

(46:29):
make policing better right like like they said at the.
You know, this idea that, you know, women, we want women be treated as equal
and to have these positions on jobs that are generally more masculine in nature,
but yet let's figure out a way to make that work because women are different than men.

(46:54):
Right. That's like the whole, the whole initiative, like for it,
they, they ask a question is rotating shift work necessary.
Yes. Right. It's a 24-7 job. So, you know, it says, are other more family-friendly policies feasible?
Again, if you want to work in law enforcement and you can't do that because

(47:16):
of how God created you, there's a reason for that, you know? I don't know.
But I mean, I'm looking down what I'm doing.
I'm looking down because I did a whole monologue on
30 by 30 and and did a
lot of dismantling of it in that episode

(47:39):
that i did in season two right again i
think it was episode 15 and i would encourage anyone who's
more interested in learning about 30 by 30 and what it's really about to listen
to that episode because it's super super interesting yeah so that's wild dude
i i don't know man again i you know So I have to quantify it.

(48:02):
I'm not saying that women don't belong in law enforcement.
I think they're a great asset in law enforcement. And I think you agree with that.
Yeah. And the other thing they do is research claims that they do a better job
dealing with people who have been victims of sexual crimes, sexual abuse.
100%. I 100% agree with that. 100% believe that they do a better job dealing

(48:26):
with those cases, talking to those victims, and everything.
But again, that doesn't mean that we should.
Say the percentage of a police department should be that many, like 30% should be in.
I want the best people for the job.
Don't put percentage. You would never say, you would never say,

(48:48):
I want 50% of my police department to be white males.
You would never say that. Or I want 50% to be under the age of 30.
Correct. You would never say that. that so why are we saying which in reality
well probably under 40 is probably your probably 35.

(49:08):
In reality would probably be your best street cops yeah probably sure absolutely
you know there'll be outliers of course right just like with there's outliers
right but yeah i don't know man you wouldn't you would never make that statement
about you know any other you know know, part of,
but that any other part of the population,

(49:30):
but that's what, you know, affirmative action, this 30 by 30 initiative,
it focuses on how a person looks, who they are and says,
you need to belong in this, in this profession.
Instead of saying, we don't care how you look, who, like what color you are.

(49:51):
If you can come in here and do the job and perform the tasks and complete the tests, we want you.
Yeah. If you can stay at your post without breastfeeding your baby.
Right. And do your duties.
You're welcome. Yeah. Do your thing. And there's nothing wrong with you having
a baby and there's nothing. You should have babies. Women have lots of babies.
It should be. But maybe then you shouldn't be on the secret service on a post.

(50:16):
Maybe that's not the job for you.
Okay. And maybe that's the boss's fault. If she's like, my baby's more important
than this, which the baby is more important than that post. Right.
That's on the supervisor.
So like, that's, you know, I'm not going to blame her if that's what happened.
If the boss is like, nope, doesn't matter. You have to be at this post.

(50:37):
She's choosing her, her baby over, over a job. Right.
But that again means. That's means she has her priorities correct.
Which means the supervisor messed up by putting her in that spot is what I'm saying. Right.
Cause you can find a different spot for her and give her a break to go breastfeed
her baby. Like, I mean, it's, that's reasonable.
Yes. It's reasonable. Sure. It's, it's reasonable. You take a lunch break.

(50:59):
She can take a lunch break and breastfeed her baby. Like she shouldn't be allowed to do that.
Change the rules. Change all the rules. What do you mean?
Like changing the rules and making things better, I think is a good thing.
Yes. I'm not disagreeing with that. But what I'm saying is if you're in a profession that, that.
Requires you to be in it, that you're not able to feed your baby for six hours.

(51:21):
Right. You, you're required to work a 12 hour shift.
I'm sorry. You can't leave to go breastfeed your baby.
You either have to figure out a way to have that baby fed, or maybe this isn't the
job for you and no one wants to say that well that's that equal that's not equality
that i think we can be reasonable anthony i mean you can be reasonable and give

(51:41):
her you know 20 minutes to,
to pump or whatever sure like and i think that they they should we should make
changes and we should be able to be reasonable with people.
Because there, there should be some life work balance, which is like a big,
big word now. I totally, I totally get that.
I totally get that. So just because you have a baby doesn't mean you can't be,

(52:02):
you're not saying, I don't think you're saying that. I'm not saying that.
It comes across like that just a little bit, Anthony, you're a little spun up.
I just, not that I'm trying to protect you because you're a grown man,
but you're not saying, I mean, you're not saying that.
Just like a guy, just like a guy who, who goes out on injury,
you know, he, he played softball and he slid into second base and hurt his ankle.
Well, you can't do the job. Bob, you're done.

(52:22):
You know what I mean? Like give him a chance to get back into the mix, you know?
But at the same time, you get to a point with certain, certain male officers
where you have a fitness for duty test because you're like, I don't know that
you can perform this anymore.
So we're going to put you through fitness for duty and see if you can perform this.
So if you have, if you have a woman who, you know, gets on the job and then

(52:45):
she, she's having kid after kid after kid, which is what she should be doing.
At what point do you say, we can't give you any more time off?
Like we can't, we, we, like you, you have a job, like you have 12 hour shifts to work.
Like we can't, we can't do, we can't accommodate what you need for your family work balance.

(53:08):
And no one wants to have that, that conversation. They're like,
no, you just have to give them whatever they need.
Okay. Well, you're done. I mean, where does that end? Where does it end?
That's all I'm saying. Where does it end?
So yeah, anyways, that's my whole little thing on, I've been really bothered by this initiative.
So I think it's, again, mission drift.

(53:32):
So worried about who we're hiring, what they look like, how they identify.
Just hire the best people for the job and do your job. Yeah.
It's your job. Go after the lawbreaker.
So these guys in Chicago did.
Yes. So we got this foot pursuit. How old is this?

(53:53):
So this happened in Chicago June 23rd of this year.
Man, that's recent. But it was just released to the public by COPA.
Okay. Good old COPA. Good old COPA. Remember the civilian or citizen office
of accountability, police accountability or whatever it's called in Chicago.

(54:14):
So they released this video of this foot pursuit by Chicago PD.
And it's, it's a crazy foot pursuit.
Did you watch all the body cam and the, and the in-car camera of it?
Yeah. Up to the end, up to the, when he's on the ground. Okay.

(54:34):
You got to break it down a little bit. So how does So I'm breaking down.
So basically, officers get a two nine one calls from a victim who is crying
and saying on the phone that her boyfriend,
baby's daddy, whoever he is, is unconscious.
Hitting her possibly with the gun, like hitting her with a gun or possibly just

(54:57):
assaulting her with his fist, but that he has a gun on him.
Right. While he's doing this. So a name caller.
Name caller. 911. Please help me. Yeah. She, she is, she's saying, you know, she's crying.
The one 911 call, she sounds absolutely terrified in it.
Okay. So police get there. They end up. Hold on before we go there. Okay. She calls 911.

(55:17):
If police don't go, no one goes, right?
She's getting beat up. Yeah. Right. So we have this system in the United States
of America, which I think is pretty good.
You call for help. Someone's going to come. Right. And they're going to try
to help you out. Yeah. Right. So they go. So the cops go.
And they see him walking away. Matches the description.
They track him down. Yeah. They see him in a foot out or an alleyway. He ends up running.

(55:45):
Sees the police and runs. Sees the police and runs. That is a clue that you
probably, it's probably the right guy.
Right. Right. Just after he assaulted a woman.
And back in, I think it's the episode I did on the 5th of July,
2022, that you and I get it. We talked about the Chicago PD and their quagmire
11 page policy on foot pursuits.

(56:06):
Yep. Can we pursue? Can we not? When can we? Is it safe?
So based on my understanding of the policy, they were okay pursuing this guy
on foot because he had just assaulted someone and he was armed.
Right. Or the report was that he was armed. so i
think they were okay doing the pursuit so they
state they're in their car they're in their car they get up

(56:27):
closer to him passenger officer bails out
starts chasing him so before you go there yeah when he's in the car does he
say like you can't get in front of him don't get in front of him because i think
that's part of the policy like they couldn't they couldn't like go right up
to him okay i think like okay it's weird i couldn't quite he's like he's like

(56:47):
he's like no no, no, no, no. You can't go, you can't go up.
Like as if you can't go in front, you can't go in front of him,
which is a pretty good technique in a foot pursuit to go in front of him or like.
Yeah. I didn't catch that. I thought, I thought the driver was just telling
the pastor, just wait, let me get a little close.
I thought he was just telling him to get a little closer. And I thought the
pastor. It was weird that he didn't get closer. Cause why lose your mechanical advantage?

(57:07):
I just thought that was weird, but anyway, sorry, sorry to cut you off.
I don't know that you'd, you know, want to go past an armed subject.
So, but regardless, at one point I thought maybe one of the officers said he's
reaching or he's grabbing or something like that.
The in-car camera. Did you watch an in-car camera video? No.

(57:28):
Okay. So the in-car camera video, as they're coming up behind him and he's running,
suspects running away, you see him take a gun out of his waistband and throw
it onto the roof of a garage.
Okay. Okay. That's, that's in the video. They, they didn't release to the public.
If you go on COPA's website.
Of course they did. If you go on COPA's website, they, they

(57:49):
have that video of him pulling the
gun out of his waistband throwing it up on to the the
roof of a garage as he's running from away
cop gets out pastor cop gets out starts
chasing him bad guy slows up turn turns
on the officer and the officer it appears shoves

(58:09):
him yeah like in in the video it appears the officer shoves him to the ground
he trips falls when he shoves he get tangled whatever he he cracks his head
bad bad like Like immediately bleeding from the ear, which is a bad sign.
This suspect ends up dying, I think, a week later. Yeah. And the suspect ends up dying a week later.

(58:34):
He's sitting up and semi-conscious at one point.
Like toward, yeah, 10 minutes into them dealing with it. They call an ambulance right away. Right.
So this recently came to light. The only video that's shown of this incident
is the brief period where the officer exits the car,

(58:54):
suspect starts slowing down, turns towards the officer, and the officer appears to shove him.
It's kind of hard if he runs into him or it looks like he shoved him.
Automatically so i mean i've done some running in
my life as soon as you somewhat turn you
you are slowing down right like you can't
run the same speed sideways or backwards than you can forward right you just

(59:18):
can't so there's a couple issues with i i think what they need to start doing
with these cases is release the 911 calls and sometimes they do release the
911 calls with but the actual recording of what is being reported.
Because if you listen to the 911 calls, it gives you a different flavor and

(59:41):
a different idea of what's going on.
Because you watch a video, you have no context. Sure, you have an article telling
you that a female called and said he assaulted her, possibly assaulted her with the gun.
But it's just in black and white. But to hear someone on the phone actually
crying and filled with terror and asking for help gives you a different perspective.

(01:00:07):
And obviously these officers don't hear that 911 call when they respond.
But it takes it from just being a clinical, like, here's a paragraph about what
happened, and then here's a video of what the officer did.
Oh my goodness, it's so violent what this officer did. It gives you perspective

(01:00:27):
into what is really going on and what the police are dealing with.
But of course, they didn't release the 911 calls. They didn't release the in-car
camera showing him throw the gun.
And so the question is, well, if he threw the gun, why would the officer need
to shove him or push him to the ground when he got up to him?

(01:00:49):
Where there's one, there might be two. That's always been training.
Or there's one, there's always two.
Like if you have a, a, a suspect fleeing with a gun, you can't like,
we don't have the luxury as law enforcement to assume that there's only one gun present.
Yeah. You don't even have to wait to shoot to see a gun. Right.

(01:01:12):
You don't. Right. By law, you don't have to.
It's, it's wild to me. Yeah. So, for instance, had this had the suspect just
been reaching in his in his waistband while he's running away and the officer
gives chase, an officer did have his gun out initially when he gives chase.
If he's running after this guy, he has a name caller that says this guy just engaged in assault.

(01:01:35):
He has a gun on him. Now he's reaching his waistband while he's running away.
That officer is legally justified in shooting that suspect in the back. Right.
It's a legitimate, legal, reasonable use of force for an officer to do that.
So, and just because he threw the gun does not mean he's any less dangerous

(01:01:58):
or that he doesn't have another gun.
Right. And so for the suspect then to say, okay, I'm slowing down.
I'm going to turn around and face you. That's also a problem.
Why is he slowing down and facing me? why why
why is he all of a sudden stopping he
didn't stop and lay down on the ground he he slowed

(01:02:18):
and turned to face the officer why is
he doing that and the officer gets up there looks
like gives him a shove he falls he hits his head he ends
up dying tragic but tragedy does not mean a bad use of force or a use of force
that is outside of policy or the law it just means a A bad thing happened because

(01:02:40):
a bad person made decisions and the police had to respond to it.
That's all that means. That is what it means. Right.
So I'm sorry we didn't have a pillow on the sidewalk, you know,
like, right. Like, what is the officer supposed to do? Right.
It's the officer just supposed to go up and and just like try to take him in the custody standing.
Like, I mean, there's still it's a it's a short pursuit.

(01:03:03):
Yeah. Real short. Super short. 20 feet. Maybe. Maybe. Yeah. The suspect was not a good runner. No.
And maybe he was gassed because maybe he had been running for a while.
I don't know. But the use of force was justified. But of course,
now this is getting spun up.
And since COPA released this, I don't think it's getting a huge amount of bad press.

(01:03:26):
But I have seen it out there and people saying, officers shouldn't have shoved
them, this and that. We need police reform.
We need more women so that way this doesn't happen.
More women in law enforcement so this doesn't happen yeah i
guarantee you all the females that i've worked with would shove
that guy yeah every single one that

(01:03:48):
i've worked everyone i've worked with i don't think every single one
i've worked with would have shoved okay you worked with different women dude
but uh a lot of them would have yeah a
lot of them would have and and it would have been completely it's
a completely justified shove it's yeah
i mean they we go from them you can't tase them right because
that was like the initial thing when everybody got tasers it was

(01:04:10):
like someone runs from you tase them probably not a
great idea but like we've reformed that right a
little bit you know what i mean like you can't just tase somebody it's got
to be a little safer environment like whatever like i proportionality yeah whatever
it is that's that's the new word in all our use of force policies it's no longer
reasonable totality of circumstances now there's proportionality what crime

(01:04:32):
have they committed right where are where are they on on grass are they on my
catam like all these checklists i still don't think that's bad though.
I think it's, I think it's, I don't think it's bad per se.
What I think it does is it makes it very, very difficult for officers to operate
in confidence within a use of force incident because it adds some,

(01:04:54):
yeah, but we're professionals.
So we should be able to change and be better.
Like here's an example, Anthony, someone calls and said, oh,
this guy, I don't know, littered.
Okay. And you roll up. he takes off
running right we're still
gonna catch him and grab him probably push him i guess

(01:05:15):
that would be the same i don't know what i'm i don't know what i'm saying see that i
know what you're trying to push the guy i mean i'd push him down too yeah hey
man you literally okay but now if you're on mccadam or a sidewalk so when you
and i got hired proportionality was not in you it wasn't even a thing it was
not a thing you never thought about if they if someone ran doing a crime yes

(01:05:36):
you You chased them, tackled them.
Your use of force was based purely on the level of resistance you were being given. Right. Okay.
They had totality of circumstances, but that's different than proportionality.
So I get a guy, I just saw him litter. I get out of my cruiser. He runs.
I run after him. His level of resistance is flight to avoid apprehension.

(01:06:02):
It's active resistance.
Right. He is fleeing from me. my level of force is.
Is shoving him to the ground. Back in the day when we had tasers tasing him,
or I should say we still have tasers. When the policy was different.
When the policy was different, where you could use a taser at verbal noncompliance.
Right. That's why the taser was brought into the profession.

(01:06:24):
The taser was brought into the profession to keep suspects and officers safer
because it basically really cut down on the level of hands-on use of force, like strikes,
shoves, that sort of thing, things that officers were getting injured in.
I mean, whenever you go to hand-to-hand combat, more people are going to get injured.

(01:06:48):
So the taser was brought in and was used at a very low level on the use of force
continuum for that reason.
Now the taser has been shoved all the way up to active moving into to assault of resistance. Right.
Okay. That's where you can start using the taser. Generally nationwide,
that's where it falls in a policy.
So now you're back to having officers have to engage in more to go hands on versus using the tool.

(01:07:13):
Exactly. Yeah. So, and that was always based on level of resistance.
Now you bring into these use of force policies proportionality.
And what you have is you introduce officers to this idea like,
okay, now not only do you have to focus on level of resistance and what level
of force you can use to overcome that resistance.
But now you have to go through a checklist of proportionality.

(01:07:35):
And what that means is, well, why am I chasing the guy? What is the crime?
Is it a property crime? Is it a violent crime? Where am I chasing him?
Is he running on grass? Are we on McAdam?
Could he fall into a street? Is there a school coming up?
Is there... It's all these things. And so what it It does is it makes guys hesitant

(01:07:57):
to use force and less confident in the force they use because they're constantly
trying to determine is the force I'm using proportional to the crime that was committed.
And we just, you know, that's, that's the problem with that word in use of force.
So in this case, I know that these officers, as soon as this happened,

(01:08:19):
I believe the officer who appears to push him is automatically thinking about this.
And the reason I know he's thinking about it is because there is a person on
scene who sees this happen, tells the officer, why did you have to like push him to the ground?
And the officer says he tripped well

(01:08:40):
maybe he tripped but he probably tripped because you pushed
him and he sticks with that as other officers arrived you know he tripped he
tripped he tripped and i'm like bro yeah he it again maybe the body cam doesn't
show the whole thing the in-car camera doesn't show the whole thing so it's
hard hard to tell it looks like you shoved him.

(01:09:02):
Just say you shoved him. Yeah. Be honest. Just be honest about what happened.
But I think this officer was so terrified.
He sees that, Hey, this guy was really injured. He has blood coming out of his ears.
He tripped. Yeah. He tripped because I shoved him, but he tripped.
Yeah. And that, that's what I'm talking about.

(01:09:23):
This idea that this officer now is so worried about what he did.
There's a lack of confidence there. Again, I'm projecting.
Yeah. And it's self-protection.
It's self-protection, but I think it's born out of this idea of being not confident
in what you did and articulating what you did because it was a justified use of force.

(01:09:48):
You don't have to try to clean it up. You don't have to try to flower it and
make it sound different.
It is what it is. is you did what you did. You're justified in it.
But the problem is that he may not think he's justified in it.
And sadly, in Chicago, they may say he wasn't justified in doing it.

(01:10:09):
But I don't know what other options he has.
Does he stop? Does he give commands? Does he pull his gun and point his gun
at the guy because the guy turned on him and he already had one gun?
Are they going to jam him up if you point a gun at him like if
the officer points a gun at him there's so many things going on
there right yeah so they didn't charge

(01:10:29):
him or anything yet right no it's a it's an investigation by
the office of accountability in chicago you know they release what they want
to release you have to go on their website and look look up everything else
to try to find everything else i don't know what's going to happen to this officer
it's just it was just one of those use of forces that I saw that again,

(01:10:52):
you see it and you're like, Ooh, I.
But just because you have that reaction doesn't mean it's not a righteous use of force.
Yeah. I didn't get that reaction until you realize he died.
You know what I mean? Like it's a push. Right. Or he stopped and I ran.
I was trying to stop myself from running into him.
Like I think is another thing that he said, which isn't like, it looks like a push.

(01:11:15):
But if you're putting your arms out to stop yourself as you're running full
speed and someone turns sideways or slowing down, maybe.
Yeah. I mean, here's the thing. fully
justified shove that guy into oblivion yeah and
what happens after that pursuit that i've ever had i've shoved
or tackled shoved or tackled every single every
single one i never had a taser yeah yeah there's there's

(01:11:38):
no it was usually a lot of times it
was shoved they fall to the ground and then they're wrestling with you
spray them because that was like one of my go-tos because i liked
pepper spray i hated that stuff i loved it and then
i don't know and then then you're tussling with the
guy so like how many times have i tackled a guy
lots of times and the repercussions of that
the injuries sustained because of that do not

(01:12:01):
then justify or not justify the use of
force right you have no idea what's going to happen i mean i shoved
the guy one time and he felt broke his nose like you
chased a guy and lit on fire that was
crazy that was wild right how would you know that that's going
to happen you wouldn't know no but how you let
a guy on fire now anthony's he's Anthony's done well just it hit a butane lighter

(01:12:23):
it hit a big lighter it is in his pocket and it burned off in five seconds and
it was done I didn't light him on fire it wasn't burning it wasn't burning a
lot it was fine he didn't have any injuries yeah um what nothing get crazy.
So yeah so we I just thought it would be a cool cool case to break down and and talk about and Yeah.

(01:12:45):
I mean, I would just, he's, he had to, you gotta be honest.
Yeah. I think that's the biggest thing for this officer is if in fact you did
shove him, just say you shoved him.
You know, and maybe he doesn't think he shoved him because he he's like,
it's all in body cam, like its own camera.
So maybe he didn't think he shoved him. And he did trip.

(01:13:05):
His feet were tangled. Yeah, he did trip when he shoved him. Yeah.
And yeah, I just, I guess you can't, you can't just look at the end result and
be like, well, that wasn't justified use of force. It wasn't proportional.
He had a gun and he beat his girl. was it reasonable
right for an officer on the scene to shove
that guy based on the totality of circumstances and

(01:13:28):
was it proportional to the
crime committed and and even that yes
yeah they're all yeses yeah it's tragic this dude
died but you had a gun you beat
your girl you ran from the cops right i mean
i don't want to tell you yeah don't don't do
that don't do that don't do that you won't have any problems it'll be

(01:13:49):
fine so anyways that's i kind of
wish it was a female officer that did that that would have been a cool like like
it would have brought the show completely together that a
female officer did the exact same thing yeah i guess i i could i could but i
mean what else would have all right so in the left's world all right how would
a female officer have handled that because they use less force and they they

(01:14:14):
use less excessive force and they're under, what was it?
Discretionary arrest. They do that. So how would the left have want to seen that end?
Let's try to play that out. So I'm a female officer. I use less force.
Time out. I have to breastfeed.

(01:14:34):
Oh, dude. Time out, bad guy. Time out. Hold on.
I got to abandon my car here for a second. I mean, I do think it's interesting
that most of the use of force videos that you see coming out,
most of the use of force body cam, the vast majority are male officers.
Again, there's more male officers in law enforcement, but the vast majority

(01:14:56):
of the ones that everyone seems to have a problem with are male officers.
There have been some. We should find some, like some recent ones.
With female officers involved. Yeah. Let's do that for the next minute.
I mean, to be honest, a lot of the ones that I've seen recently with female
officers involved in force, it's been kind of an embarrassment to the point

(01:15:21):
where males have needed to step in.
Male officers needed to step in to deal with them.
I'm thinking recently of one I saw at a New York City where a female officer
got clocked in the head, went down, down and out.
Like this guy clocked her in the head and she's down and out.
And a male officer came in and he took care of business.
He took care of business. you know.

(01:15:41):
So again, I just, I think generally speaking, the job is a masculine job and
masculine men are the best people to generally do the job.
And if there's women out there that get into the job and there are,
and I've worked with some of them, so be it.
Come, come, go do the job, but we should not be changing,

(01:16:02):
changing the profession or making Making it a point of initiative to make sure
that this many women are in these agencies.
That literally, that has nothing to do with our mission.
It has nothing to do with anything.
You know, can you do the job? Can you perform the job to the same degree that

(01:16:26):
a male officer can perform the job?
Perfect. I have no problem with it. But if, if you're in there and you can't
do the job or you're scared to do the job or you can't perform physically,
then I don't, I don't, I don't want you to do the job.
Like I don't want you to be with me. because the reality is like a lot of people
live in an environment where there's not a whole lot of crime so there's not

(01:16:49):
a whole lot of need for masculine men to do the job because they're not,
dealing with armed criminals who just beat their girl and now ran from the cops
right you know i mean so like we're like i mean if you're living in downtown
philly if you're you know visiting downtown philly you're visiting chicago like
i want to be protected right and i want the same I guess if I'm in wherever Scranton,

(01:17:13):
right. Well, there's Scranton's pretty bad too.
So like, or wherever, like, so I guess there's small town and maybe women officers
would be even would be, would be better because you're not dealing with the
criminal element like they are in larger urban areas.
I don't know. I'm just thinking out loud. I guess I, I, I don't want the job

(01:17:33):
to be about who is doing the job. It shouldn't be.
It shouldn't be. And it shouldn't be right. And it doesn't, it doesn't apply to anything else.
Like you don't, like we don't have an initiative in nursing that 30,
30% of our nurses need to be men.
Right. Why, why is that? Why, why isn't that initiative?
Men, men, you know, do well performing under pressure. Like why,

(01:17:57):
why aren't, don't, why don't we have more women nurse or more men nurses?
Like, why don't we have more men teachers?
Right. You know, why isn't our initiative to have more men in teaching? You know...
Or EMS world. Right. Firefighters. Yeah. Like why is everything, it is interesting.
Like the police is the, policing law enforcement is the, the magnifying glass is always on that.

(01:18:21):
Why are, why are we taking a generally masculine job and making an initiative
to get more women into it?
Like, I think that's a valid question. Like what, what, why would we do that?
Why would we force, force that to be an initiative? Because they think that
they're better at the job.
Right. Whoever they are, the left or this initiative.

(01:18:43):
The researchers, right? The researchers who show. It's part of reimagining.
Who probably think it might be true.
Yeah. I mean, both the co-founders of the initiative, they did an article back
in September 2020 for Cosmopolitan.
And it was called How Women Want to Fix the Police Problem.

(01:19:05):
So they view women as the people who are going to reimagine policing.
Are they women authors? Are the authors of this initiative women?
Yeah. Maureen McGow and retired Newark, New Jersey police chief Yvonne Roman.
The tagline for the article was police departments and how they operate revolve
around systems built by men.

(01:19:26):
Systems that killed George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, Elijah McClain, and so many others.
Systems that are broken. I mean, this is like your classic Marxist stuff.
As the country grapples with how to move forward, it's time to listen to new voices. Women.
All right. So. They do have nice voices. They do.

(01:19:46):
But my, I mean, what's interesting when I have this conversation with my bride,
she, she is like completely in step with me.
She's like, I don't understand why a woman would want to even do law enforcement.
Like what, what's the drive? What's the drive there? No, that,
that's, that's her opinion. She doesn't have any drive to do that. Right.

(01:20:09):
She's like, I don't, you know, she's like, generally, if I, if I need,
if, if I have an emergency and I need help, I would prefer strong men show up to handle that.
Like not, you know, women who maybe aren't as strong or as physically capable.
But if she was a criminal, she would not want that. Hmm.

(01:20:30):
I might be onto something. Very astute. Yeah. If I'm a criminal,
I mean, in reality, if I'm a criminal, I would rather have a female officer
chase me. Oh, a hundred percent.
A hundred percent. Cause I'm, I'm, I'm in general, in general,
in general, I'm going to be able
to women who I wouldn't want to catch me because they would beat me up.
Like there's their doubt, but in general, you're going to be able to outrun

(01:20:51):
a female officer. You're going to be able to fight a female officer.
Like you're going to be able to do things that you're not going to be able to
do against a male officer in general.
Right. And if the police are to, I don't know, we're still talking about this, dude.
Yeah. If If police are supposed to be protecting people, wouldn't you want the best protectors?

(01:21:12):
I mean, that's what I want. No, we want women. We want women.
And again, it just opens the door for everything else.
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it eats him last.
And that's what we are doing. And we've been doing it for years in law enforcement.
This started years ago, where we started appeasing people, trying to appease

(01:21:32):
people. And where has it got us? Have we gained any ground?
Have we gained any good feelings and likes from these people?
No, they want more and more and more.
And it's completely eroded the mission of law enforcement.
30 by 30, just the beginning.
Intersectionality, that's what they want to usher in. Everything is

(01:21:54):
about this liberal woke agenda
how can we dismantle change reimagine
it's it's it's so convoluted keep it simple law enforcement we enforce the law
we go after evildoers we want the best people to do it the best people to do

(01:22:15):
it we want people who are good have good mental health aren't confused about who they are.
It doesn't matter what color they are. It doesn't matter what gender they are. Can they do the job?
And when you make it about, no, we want certain types of people to do the job
and not keep the mission the mission, not keep it simple, then everything goes off the rails.

(01:22:40):
So I like it, Anthony.
All right, dude, we did it. Episode 17 in the book.
Music.

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