February 13, 2024 • 21 mins
This week’s question is about when puppies should go to their new homes:
“I've known breeders who keep their pups till 8 weeks, and some till 10 weeks. Some even until 12. What are the deciding factors in how long pups stay with the breeder? Does it depend on breed, the specific litter, or does it just come down to breeder preference?”
In this episode, I talk about:
- Optimal age for placing puppies.
- Factors that go into determining what that optimal age is.
- Extenuating circumstances that influence the decision when to place puppies.
Visit our website, madcapradio.com for further reading.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I'm Jane Messineo Lindquist,
and this is a Puppy Culturepotluck podcast.
You bring the topics,we bring the conversation.
This week's question is about
(00:21):
optimal age for placing puppies.
And here it goes. This is the question.
I'm not a breeder,but I have a good friend who is and uses
Puppy Culture.
And I've helped her whelpand raise a couple of litters.
So I like to learn all I can.
I have my own PuppyCulture raised pup and I love him.
(00:44):
But I have an honestly curious question.
I've known breeders who keep their puppiestill eight weeks
and some till ten weeks,some even until 12.
What are the deciding factors
for how long pups stay with the breeder?
Does it depend on breed,the specific litter,
(01:07):
or does it just come down to breederpreference?
I'm honestly just curious.
And to me, there is no wrong answer.
My dog's breeder keeps them till ten.
But my good friend that I've workedwith on her pups keeps them till eight.
Two different breeds.
So I'm just curiouswhat other breeders thoughts are on this.
(01:30):
Great question.
And it hits all the high points.
I'm going to zoom out.
Okay, and give you the big picturedirect answer, which is that
if you are a Puppy Culture breederor doing a program
similar to Puppy Culture,
where you're really workingwith the puppies as a breeder,
(01:51):
the optimal
time to place those puppies
splits the last part
of the critical socialization period
so that the breeder has
two weeksand the puppy owner has two weeks,
so the last monthof the critical socialization period
(02:12):
is splitbetween the breeder and the puppy owner.
So just taking it as the, let's
just say, very average breed.
That would probably meanthe critical socialization
period, best practice figure,it ends at 12 weeks old.
And that means that the breeder would besending the puppy home at ten weeks.
(02:35):
So that puppy owner has that lasttwo weeks in the critical socialization
periodto customize the socialization experience.
But why do we recommend this?
We recommend thisbecause in our experience,
and this is what Puppy Cultureis, advocates, I should say,
(02:57):
breeders being more experienced
are generally in a better position
to navigate the puppy
through all those firstsin the socialization period.
So first outing away from home,
first playdates with outside dogs,
(03:18):
first vet visits,first walk in an urban area,
walk in a country area,first intros to livestock, first anything.
You know, there's just a lot of waysthat you can go wrong.
Okay.
With all these first experiencesand again, the breeders being more
(03:39):
experienced are going to be quickerto read the puppies,
quicker to know,you know, when to go and when to hold,
and if the breeder can just lay in
those first impressions with the puppies.
It just paves the way for the puppy owner.
Similarly, there's a lot of things
(04:00):
like housetraining and crate and confinement
training that puppy ownersjust really struggle with.
And we breeders can do thislike breathing air.
Okay, so the difference between placing
an eight weekold completely on house trained
(04:22):
and never been introduced to a crateor confinement away from its littermates.
The difference between and placinga puppy like that and placing a puppy
at ten weeks that has had two weeksof learning to sleep in its own crate
and learning to be in a room by itselfand with its other litter mates.
It's night and day, okay, Night and day
(04:46):
and again, breeders just it's easy for usand it's hard for the puppy owners.
Things like
grooming, leash walking, you know,there are things that puppy owners
just struggle withand we find second nature.
So when you're looking at this
(05:08):
end of the critical socialization period,
you know, as a breeder, you don't wantto hold them for the whole thing
because then, you know,if the puppy owner,
let's say, has a boatand you don't have access to a boat,
that the puppy is not going to beacclimated and customized,
(05:29):
the socialization
is not going to be customizedto what the puppy owner's lifestyle is.
So I do think it's very importantthat the puppy owner has the puppy
for some of the critical socializationperiod.
So splitting those last four weeksto me is the best of both worlds.
Another reason
I like to keep my puppiesuntil ten weeks old
(05:51):
is that typically my puppies are goingto have a fear period somewhere between
eight and nine and a half weeks,sometimes as early as seven and a half.
So let's say seven and a half to nineand a half weeks.
It's you know, it's a pretty big range.
And again, as a breeder, I'm experienced.
I can see it.
I recognize the signs.
I know what to do. Okay.
(06:12):
I think it's asking the puppy ownera lot to recognize the fear period
and to recognize how to shepherd the puppythrough that.
So, again, I think that the puppyis probably going to do better
in an experienced breeders, or at least
a motivated breedershands during a fear period.
(06:33):
Now. I'm going to circle back a little bitbecause again, I touched
on, well, why not just have the breederkeep the puppies
through the entire,you know, critical socialization period?
And, you know, the answer is,
first of all, the customizationof the socialization experience, but also
(06:54):
those last four weeks, I mean,
they're really changing from
babies who are almost don'treally have an identity.
Okay?They're they're just part of this litter.
And a litter is an organismand they're really morphing from that
to individuals that really need one on one
individual attention and a lot of it.
(07:18):
And so it comes to a point,especially if you have a large litter
where you have to startmaking decisions about physically,
how many hours, you know, doyou actually have in a day
as a breederto spend individually with each puppy?
And it becomes a point of diminishingreturns as as the puppies get older.
(07:39):
And at some point, especially if you have
an experienced home or,
and also a home,I should say, with a good,
what we call a lead pony,an adult dog that can act
as sort of a role model,something for the puppy to model on.
You know, I mean, that can be a good betif you have a large litter
(08:02):
to start moving some of those puppiesmaybe a little bit earlier than others,
but in any event,
it does reach a critical pointwhere you just literally as a breeder,
don't have the hours in a day to devote to
a nine puppy litter to really do themjustice.
And again, so at that point, the puppiesreally need to go to their homes.
(08:27):
Now. That sounds great.
And you may all be thinking, “Well,there it is,
you keep the puppies until ten weeks.”But it's not that easy.
Not that easy at all,because a couple of things.
First of all, developmentally,you know, puppies are at least
two weeks different average by breed.
(08:49):
And I talk about that studyall the time where they found
a sixteen day difference in average timebetween breeds
that the puppiesshowed an initial fear response.
So that would be aroundthe five week fear response.
And at the risk of being boring,I'm also going to mention the study
(09:10):
that showed that 95% of German Shepherdpuppies had a fear
responseat five weeks and only 5% of Labradors.
So you have to take
into account breeder expertise here.
Like my my friendthat breeds Norwich Terriers
at 12 weeks old, they're still nursing,whereas my friends that breed German
(09:30):
Shepherds at nine weeks old,they are seriously taking
on their other littermatesand starting to mistrust novelty.
So those puppies are approachingthe end of their critical socialization
period, you know, at nine, ten weeks,whereas the Norwich Terriers
are still very neotenous,they're still babies at 12 weeks.
(09:51):
So youso there's just no answer to the question.
Okay.
Except for your expertiseas a breeder to clear the fear period
and then split that time between youand the puppy owner
in those last four weeksof the critical socialization period.
So the puppy owner gets a crackat customizing
(10:11):
critical social socializationand also gets the puppy
when it's in need of intense individualtraining and attention.
And you have already had a chanceto lay in all those foundations and first
experiences that can be stumbling blocks
for the average puppy owner.
(10:34):
Now, all that having been said,
I just want to pause here and saythere is no magic
in warehousing puppiesfor an extended period of time.
Okay.
So if if you're a breederthat for whatever
reason, you're either unable or unwilling
to do active socialization of the puppiesand you know, it happens.
(10:57):
We have crises in our community where,
you know, some a breeder will fall illor a breeder spouse will fall
ill or there's some other calamityand the breeder just can't do the work,
just holding on to the puppies for,you know, two more weeks
than you normally wouldis it's not doing the puppies any service.
(11:18):
Okay. So
I'm not going to lie to you,
keeping the puppies for me from, you know,
8 to 10 weeks, there are times reallywhere you just feel like,
okay, I'm broken, I can't do this anymore.
It's intense. It's a lot.
You get up every day.
I mean, keeping those puppieson a schedule, doing things,
(11:42):
enrichment, training, it'sit's like a full time job.
But it is so fantastic at the same.,
by the same token, it is suchan exhilarating, wonderful time.
But it is nerve wracking and you alwaysfeel like you're not getting enough done.
So, you know,that's a different conversation. But
(12:05):
the bigger point
is if for any reason you can't do that,okay,
or you don't want to, or you justyou just sure you can't.
Even if it's just like,I don't know, I don't have the expertise.
I can't do it.
The puppies, you know,are probably going to be better off
going to their homes a little bit earlierwhere at least they're going to get some
individual attentionand puppy class and training.
(12:30):
So looking at thisfrom a slightly different perspective,
from the puppy buyer's perspective.
So you're a puppy buyer and you're lookingat this breeder and you're wondering,
you know, what is the responsibleage to place puppies?
What's the best age to place puppies?
And is this breeder followingthat responsible ethical placement age?
(12:53):
And the operant question is not so much
specifically what agethe breeder is placing the puppies as
what is the breeder doing with the puppieswhile they have them?
Are they keeping them long enoughto complete
important protocols,or are they just warehousing them?
Are they actually doing the work
(13:14):
or are they just throwing toys in a penand leaving them to be?
Are they being carefulto keep them through their fear, period?
So these are the kinds of questionsthat as a puppy owner,
when you're looking at a breeder,you want to ask yourself basically,
what are they doing with these puppieswhile they have them?
(13:36):
Okay.
Now, there are some outsidelimits to this.
I think it's safe to say that a breeder
who's looking to place puppiesat six weeks old is not doing
what needs to be done with those puppies,at least in terms
of what we at Puppy Culturebelieve should be done with puppies.
(13:59):
And when I say
Puppy Culture,I just always hasten to add, listen,
there's lots of good breeders,great breeders who don't do Puppy Culture
or never heard of Puppy Culture,but they do essentially similar protocols.
It's not that I made up the protocolsand Puppy Culture.
I mean, there are things that breedershave been doing,
you know, forever that were taught to meby other breeders. So
(14:22):
the point is six weeks.
I'm just saying you can't be responsiblyplacing those puppies
because you could not possiblyhave been doing what you need
to do with those puppiesin that amount of time.
So all that having been said,there are occasions
where I would place a puppy
(14:45):
at a younger age than ten weeks.
For instance,
if I had a giant breed
puppy, okay, If I was breedinggiant breed puppies and I was sending
a puppy home with someonethat had to fly the puppy home
and the puppy at seven weekswas small enough to fit in to a Sherpa
(15:06):
that could fit under the seatin the airplane
so the owner could takethe puppy home in the cabin.
But if we waited till ten weeks,the puppy would be too big
and would have to go in cargo in a crate.
I mean, I'm sending the puppy homeat seven weeks.
I'm not waiting until ten weeks.
I'm not giving a puppythat experience at ten weeks old.
(15:29):
Again, you know, then it comes downto ethically placing the puppy right?
So I'm not going to send a seven weekold puppy home to a first time puppy
owner that doesn't have another puppy inthe house or a dog in the house, rather.
But, you know, an experienced dog owner,maybe even a professional dog trainer
that has, you know, two really good lead
(15:51):
pony, shaper dogs at home, heck, yeah,I'm going to send that puppy home
in seven weeks, over ten weeks to save itthat experience of going in cargo
and, you know, it comes up frequentlythat people
say, well, they shouldn't be separatedfrom their littermates so young. And
it is true that
(16:13):
I would not separate six weeks old.
I wouldn't place a six week old puppies,but just, you know,
breeders, we do split the litters upfrequently when we co-breed litters.
If we have a big litter, we frequentlywill split litters at six weeks old.
So it's not likethey have to stay with their mother.
(16:34):
I mean, normally, again, for usthe dams are done with them at five weeks.
So by six weekswe do some cut times, share
the workload just so that we can do morewith the puppies.
Because if you split thembetween two breeders, you know,
if there's just that many more handsto work with the puppies.
And the reason I mention it isbecause I want to distinguish being placed
(16:56):
as an individual puppy,like taken out of the litter
and just that one puppy taken awayand put in a home versus
splitting up litters,which we do all the time.
You know,as a closing statement on this, I'm
just going to say I getI get how frustrating this is.
Okay.
As as a puppy seeker, I understand
(17:19):
you have a specific breed in mindand you're looking for a breeder
that's doing all these best practicesas far as you know,
what they're doing with the puppies.
And when they're placing the puppies,it it's frustrating
because it's hard to find itall in one package.
You know, it's it's hard to find a breederthat has puppies available
(17:39):
that's in the breed that you want,that's doing all the right things. And
I have experienced this myself recently.
I was trying to help my sisterfind a kitten of a certain breed and,
you know, finding one
that of that breed, that
all the correct health testingwas being done,
(18:01):
that they appearedto have good temperaments
and that the breeder was doing morethan just warehousing the kittens
and then shipping them offat a certain date.
I mean, it's not easy.
So unless you're flexible about breed,in which case I recommend
you just get on the Puppy Culturediscussion group and look at what people
(18:22):
are posting and go for those breedersand or rescue foster people
that are really doing a good jobin doing the work and showing you
they're doing a good joband doing the work in the group.
You know, it's difficult.
I get it. It's difficult.
Also, as a breeder, I
understand how frustrating this answeris because,
(18:46):
you know, we all just want to be toldwhat to do, right?
I mean, we all want to be told,you place the puppies at ten,
you know, place puppies at ten weeks.That's what you do.
And this is your list of things thatyou do each day going up to ten weeks.
And this is how you do it.
But, you know, I'mjust telling you it's it's not that easy.
I mean, you can certainly how shall I say,
(19:09):
you can put together a programand do it that way and do it the same way
every time. Right?
You can put together a program and say,I don't care, This is how you do it.
You know, if you have X breed,this is how you do it.
And you do it this wayand you do it every time.
Or you could just come up with a universalprogram and hand out sheets and say,
This is what you do on day 27.
That's what you do on day 28.
(19:30):
And you know what I mean?
You'll be right probably 80% of the time.
But you know that other 20% of the time,if you don't use your judgment
and if you're not nimble aboutswitching it up and flexible,
you know, you can wind up
doing damage to those puppies.
You know, to the pointI just had this situation recently
(19:54):
where I was placing a puppy with someonewho was going to have to fly the puppy.
And I told her
she needed to buy a flexible ticketbecause things can change.
You just don't know when that puppy
is going to go in or out of a fear periodor what's going to happen.
And it's so happenswith this particular puppy.
(20:15):
He wound up growing so fast,so early, like way bigger,
and it was a repeat breedingand these puppies in this litter were like
25% bigger than the puppies
in the first breedingfor no reason at all.
So I called her and I said,You're going to have to change your ticket
(20:36):
and come five days earlier becausethis puppy is going to outgrow his Sherpa.
He's not going to be ableto fly in the cabin.
If we wait until,
you know, when we were going to do it,which was ten and a half weeks old.
So there you go.
That's a final tip, not necessarilyabout when to place your puppies,
but if you're ever having people flyin to get puppies,
make sure they get a flexible ticket.
(21:04):
If you like this podcast,you'll love our puppy
course available at madcapuniversity.com.
Breeders, we have a course for
you too at madcapuniversity.com comand if you're interested in sending home
a copy of our puppy coursewith your puppy owners,
we offer a nice breeder discount on four
(21:27):
or more copies of the course.
Well, that's it for this time.
Thanks for listening.
Bye bye.
I'm Jane Messineo Lindquist,
and this is a Puppy Culturepotluck podcast.
You bring the topics,we bring the conversation.
This week's question is about
(00:21):
optimal age for placing puppies.
And here it goes. This is the question.
I'm not a breeder,but I have a good friend who is and uses
Puppy Culture.
And I've helped her whelpand raise a couple of litters.
So I like to learn all I can.
I have my own PuppyCulture raised pup and I love him.
(00:44):
But I have an honestly curious question.
I've known breeders who keep their puppiestill eight weeks
and some till ten weeks,some even until 12.
What are the deciding factors
for how long pups stay with the breeder?
Does it depend on breed,the specific litter,
(01:07):
or does it just come down to breederpreference?
I'm honestly just curious.
And to me, there is no wrong answer.
My dog's breeder keeps them till ten.
But my good friend that I've workedwith on her pups keeps them till eight.
Two different breeds.
So I'm just curiouswhat other breeders thoughts are on this.
(01:30):
Great question.
And it hits all the high points.
I'm going to zoom out.
Okay, and give you the big picturedirect answer, which is that
if you are a Puppy Culture breederor doing a program
similar to Puppy Culture,
where you're really workingwith the puppies as a breeder,
(01:51):
the optimal
time to place those puppies
splits the last part
of the critical socialization period
so that the breeder has
two weeksand the puppy owner has two weeks,
so the last monthof the critical socialization period
(02:12):
is splitbetween the breeder and the puppy owner.
So just taking it as the, let's
just say, very average breed.
That would probably meanthe critical socialization
period, best practice figure,it ends at 12 weeks old.
And that means that the breeder would besending the puppy home at ten weeks.
(02:35):
So that puppy owner has that lasttwo weeks in the critical socialization
periodto customize the socialization experience.
But why do we recommend this?
We recommend thisbecause in our experience,
and this is what Puppy Cultureis, advocates, I should say,
(02:57):
breeders being more experienced
are generally in a better position
to navigate the puppy
through all those firstsin the socialization period.
So first outing away from home,
first playdates with outside dogs,
(03:18):
first vet visits,first walk in an urban area,
walk in a country area,first intros to livestock, first anything.
You know, there's just a lot of waysthat you can go wrong.
Okay.
With all these first experiencesand again, the breeders being more
(03:39):
experienced are going to be quickerto read the puppies,
quicker to know,you know, when to go and when to hold,
and if the breeder can just lay in
those first impressions with the puppies.
It just paves the way for the puppy owner.
Similarly, there's a lot of things
(04:00):
like housetraining and crate and confinement
training that puppy ownersjust really struggle with.
And we breeders can do thislike breathing air.
Okay, so the difference between placing
an eight weekold completely on house trained
(04:22):
and never been introduced to a crateor confinement away from its littermates.
The difference between and placinga puppy like that and placing a puppy
at ten weeks that has had two weeksof learning to sleep in its own crate
and learning to be in a room by itselfand with its other litter mates.
It's night and day, okay, Night and day
(04:46):
and again, breeders just it's easy for usand it's hard for the puppy owners.
Things like
grooming, leash walking, you know,there are things that puppy owners
just struggle withand we find second nature.
So when you're looking at this
(05:08):
end of the critical socialization period,
you know, as a breeder, you don't wantto hold them for the whole thing
because then, you know,if the puppy owner,
let's say, has a boatand you don't have access to a boat,
that the puppy is not going to beacclimated and customized,
(05:29):
the socialization
is not going to be customizedto what the puppy owner's lifestyle is.
So I do think it's very importantthat the puppy owner has the puppy
for some of the critical socializationperiod.
So splitting those last four weeksto me is the best of both worlds.
Another reason
I like to keep my puppiesuntil ten weeks old
(05:51):
is that typically my puppies are goingto have a fear period somewhere between
eight and nine and a half weeks,sometimes as early as seven and a half.
So let's say seven and a half to nineand a half weeks.
It's you know, it's a pretty big range.
And again, as a breeder, I'm experienced.
I can see it.
I recognize the signs.
I know what to do. Okay.
(06:12):
I think it's asking the puppy ownera lot to recognize the fear period
and to recognize how to shepherd the puppythrough that.
So, again, I think that the puppyis probably going to do better
in an experienced breeders, or at least
a motivated breedershands during a fear period.
(06:33):
Now. I'm going to circle back a little bitbecause again, I touched
on, well, why not just have the breederkeep the puppies
through the entire,you know, critical socialization period?
And, you know, the answer is,
first of all, the customizationof the socialization experience, but also
(06:54):
those last four weeks, I mean,
they're really changing from
babies who are almost don'treally have an identity.
Okay?They're they're just part of this litter.
And a litter is an organismand they're really morphing from that
to individuals that really need one on one
individual attention and a lot of it.
(07:18):
And so it comes to a point,especially if you have a large litter
where you have to startmaking decisions about physically,
how many hours, you know, doyou actually have in a day
as a breederto spend individually with each puppy?
And it becomes a point of diminishingreturns as as the puppies get older.
(07:39):
And at some point, especially if you have
an experienced home or,
and also a home,I should say, with a good,
what we call a lead pony,an adult dog that can act
as sort of a role model,something for the puppy to model on.
You know, I mean, that can be a good betif you have a large litter
(08:02):
to start moving some of those puppiesmaybe a little bit earlier than others,
but in any event,
it does reach a critical pointwhere you just literally as a breeder,
don't have the hours in a day to devote to
a nine puppy litter to really do themjustice.
And again, so at that point, the puppiesreally need to go to their homes.
(08:27):
Now. That sounds great.
And you may all be thinking, “Well,there it is,
you keep the puppies until ten weeks.”But it's not that easy.
Not that easy at all,because a couple of things.
First of all, developmentally,you know, puppies are at least
two weeks different average by breed.
(08:49):
And I talk about that studyall the time where they found
a sixteen day difference in average timebetween breeds
that the puppiesshowed an initial fear response.
So that would be aroundthe five week fear response.
And at the risk of being boring,I'm also going to mention the study
(09:10):
that showed that 95% of German Shepherdpuppies had a fear
responseat five weeks and only 5% of Labradors.
So you have to take
into account breeder expertise here.
Like my my friendthat breeds Norwich Terriers
at 12 weeks old, they're still nursing,whereas my friends that breed German
(09:30):
Shepherds at nine weeks old,they are seriously taking
on their other littermatesand starting to mistrust novelty.
So those puppies are approachingthe end of their critical socialization
period, you know, at nine, ten weeks,whereas the Norwich Terriers
are still very neotenous,they're still babies at 12 weeks.
(09:51):
So youso there's just no answer to the question.
Okay.
Except for your expertiseas a breeder to clear the fear period
and then split that time between youand the puppy owner
in those last four weeksof the critical socialization period.
So the puppy owner gets a crackat customizing
(10:11):
critical social socializationand also gets the puppy
when it's in need of intense individualtraining and attention.
And you have already had a chanceto lay in all those foundations and first
experiences that can be stumbling blocks
for the average puppy owner.
(10:34):
Now, all that having been said,
I just want to pause here and saythere is no magic
in warehousing puppiesfor an extended period of time.
Okay.
So if if you're a breederthat for whatever
reason, you're either unable or unwilling
to do active socialization of the puppiesand you know, it happens.
(10:57):
We have crises in our community where,
you know, some a breeder will fall illor a breeder spouse will fall
ill or there's some other calamityand the breeder just can't do the work,
just holding on to the puppies for,you know, two more weeks
than you normally wouldis it's not doing the puppies any service.
(11:18):
Okay. So
I'm not going to lie to you,
keeping the puppies for me from, you know,
8 to 10 weeks, there are times reallywhere you just feel like,
okay, I'm broken, I can't do this anymore.
It's intense. It's a lot.
You get up every day.
I mean, keeping those puppieson a schedule, doing things,
(11:42):
enrichment, training, it'sit's like a full time job.
But it is so fantastic at the same.,
by the same token, it is suchan exhilarating, wonderful time.
But it is nerve wracking and you alwaysfeel like you're not getting enough done.
So, you know,that's a different conversation. But
(12:05):
the bigger point
is if for any reason you can't do that,okay,
or you don't want to, or you justyou just sure you can't.
Even if it's just like,I don't know, I don't have the expertise.
I can't do it.
The puppies, you know,are probably going to be better off
going to their homes a little bit earlierwhere at least they're going to get some
individual attentionand puppy class and training.
(12:30):
So looking at thisfrom a slightly different perspective,
from the puppy buyer's perspective.
So you're a puppy buyer and you're lookingat this breeder and you're wondering,
you know, what is the responsibleage to place puppies?
What's the best age to place puppies?
And is this breeder followingthat responsible ethical placement age?
(12:53):
And the operant question is not so much
specifically what agethe breeder is placing the puppies as
what is the breeder doing with the puppieswhile they have them?
Are they keeping them long enoughto complete
important protocols,or are they just warehousing them?
Are they actually doing the work
(13:14):
or are they just throwing toys in a penand leaving them to be?
Are they being carefulto keep them through their fear, period?
So these are the kinds of questionsthat as a puppy owner,
when you're looking at a breeder,you want to ask yourself basically,
what are they doing with these puppieswhile they have them?
(13:36):
Okay.
Now, there are some outsidelimits to this.
I think it's safe to say that a breeder
who's looking to place puppiesat six weeks old is not doing
what needs to be done with those puppies,at least in terms
of what we at Puppy Culturebelieve should be done with puppies.
(13:59):
And when I say
Puppy Culture,I just always hasten to add, listen,
there's lots of good breeders,great breeders who don't do Puppy Culture
or never heard of Puppy Culture,but they do essentially similar protocols.
It's not that I made up the protocolsand Puppy Culture.
I mean, there are things that breedershave been doing,
you know, forever that were taught to meby other breeders. So
(14:22):
the point is six weeks.
I'm just saying you can't be responsiblyplacing those puppies
because you could not possiblyhave been doing what you need
to do with those puppiesin that amount of time.
So all that having been said,there are occasions
where I would place a puppy
(14:45):
at a younger age than ten weeks.
For instance,
if I had a giant breed
puppy, okay, If I was breedinggiant breed puppies and I was sending
a puppy home with someonethat had to fly the puppy home
and the puppy at seven weekswas small enough to fit in to a Sherpa
(15:06):
that could fit under the seatin the airplane
so the owner could takethe puppy home in the cabin.
But if we waited till ten weeks,the puppy would be too big
and would have to go in cargo in a crate.
I mean, I'm sending the puppy homeat seven weeks.
I'm not waiting until ten weeks.
I'm not giving a puppythat experience at ten weeks old.
(15:29):
Again, you know, then it comes downto ethically placing the puppy right?
So I'm not going to send a seven weekold puppy home to a first time puppy
owner that doesn't have another puppy inthe house or a dog in the house, rather.
But, you know, an experienced dog owner,maybe even a professional dog trainer
that has, you know, two really good lead
(15:51):
pony, shaper dogs at home, heck, yeah,I'm going to send that puppy home
in seven weeks, over ten weeks to save itthat experience of going in cargo
and, you know, it comes up frequentlythat people
say, well, they shouldn't be separatedfrom their littermates so young. And
it is true that
(16:13):
I would not separate six weeks old.
I wouldn't place a six week old puppies,but just, you know,
breeders, we do split the litters upfrequently when we co-breed litters.
If we have a big litter, we frequentlywill split litters at six weeks old.
So it's not likethey have to stay with their mother.
(16:34):
I mean, normally, again, for usthe dams are done with them at five weeks.
So by six weekswe do some cut times, share
the workload just so that we can do morewith the puppies.
Because if you split thembetween two breeders, you know,
if there's just that many more handsto work with the puppies.
And the reason I mention it isbecause I want to distinguish being placed
(16:56):
as an individual puppy,like taken out of the litter
and just that one puppy taken awayand put in a home versus
splitting up litters,which we do all the time.
You know,as a closing statement on this, I'm
just going to say I getI get how frustrating this is.
Okay.
As as a puppy seeker, I understand
(17:19):
you have a specific breed in mindand you're looking for a breeder
that's doing all these best practicesas far as you know,
what they're doing with the puppies.
And when they're placing the puppies,it it's frustrating
because it's hard to find itall in one package.
You know, it's it's hard to find a breederthat has puppies available
(17:39):
that's in the breed that you want,that's doing all the right things. And
I have experienced this myself recently.
I was trying to help my sisterfind a kitten of a certain breed and,
you know, finding one
that of that breed, that
all the correct health testingwas being done,
(18:01):
that they appearedto have good temperaments
and that the breeder was doing morethan just warehousing the kittens
and then shipping them offat a certain date.
I mean, it's not easy.
So unless you're flexible about breed,in which case I recommend
you just get on the Puppy Culturediscussion group and look at what people
(18:22):
are posting and go for those breedersand or rescue foster people
that are really doing a good jobin doing the work and showing you
they're doing a good joband doing the work in the group.
You know, it's difficult.
I get it. It's difficult.
Also, as a breeder, I
understand how frustrating this answeris because,
(18:46):
you know, we all just want to be toldwhat to do, right?
I mean, we all want to be told,you place the puppies at ten,
you know, place puppies at ten weeks.That's what you do.
And this is your list of things thatyou do each day going up to ten weeks.
And this is how you do it.
But, you know, I'mjust telling you it's it's not that easy.
I mean, you can certainly how shall I say,
(19:09):
you can put together a programand do it that way and do it the same way
every time. Right?
You can put together a program and say,I don't care, This is how you do it.
You know, if you have X breed,this is how you do it.
And you do it this wayand you do it every time.
Or you could just come up with a universalprogram and hand out sheets and say,
This is what you do on day 27.
That's what you do on day 28.
(19:30):
And you know what I mean?
You'll be right probably 80% of the time.
But you know that other 20% of the time,if you don't use your judgment
and if you're not nimble aboutswitching it up and flexible,
you know, you can wind up
doing damage to those puppies.
You know, to the pointI just had this situation recently
(19:54):
where I was placing a puppy with someonewho was going to have to fly the puppy.
And I told her
she needed to buy a flexible ticketbecause things can change.
You just don't know when that puppy
is going to go in or out of a fear periodor what's going to happen.
And it's so happenswith this particular puppy.
(20:15):
He wound up growing so fast,so early, like way bigger,
and it was a repeat breedingand these puppies in this litter were like
25% bigger than the puppies
in the first breedingfor no reason at all.
So I called her and I said,You're going to have to change your ticket
(20:36):
and come five days earlier becausethis puppy is going to outgrow his Sherpa.
He's not going to be ableto fly in the cabin.
If we wait until,
you know, when we were going to do it,which was ten and a half weeks old.
So there you go.
That's a final tip, not necessarilyabout when to place your puppies,
but if you're ever having people flyin to get puppies,
make sure they get a flexible ticket.
(21:04):
If you like this podcast,you'll love our puppy
course available at madcapuniversity.com.
Breeders, we have a course for
you too at madcapuniversity.com comand if you're interested in sending home
a copy of our puppy coursewith your puppy owners,
we offer a nice breeder discount on four
(21:27):
or more copies of the course.
Well, that's it for this time.
Thanks for listening.
Bye bye.
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