December 10, 2024 • 26 mins
This week’s question is about whether doing Puppy Culture or any other early socialization program can guarantee good outcomes for puppies.
“…I was talking to a breeder about Puppy Culture and I told her that if she would just adopt the program, she would eliminate any temperament issues with her puppies. Am I right about this? Isn’t Puppy Culture a guarantee that puppies will have good outcomes?”
In this episode I tackle:
- Re-thinking the line between nature and nurture
- The partnership between breeders and puppy owners for raising a good dog
- The evolutionary reasons why breeding “good” dogs is so difficult
Visit our website madcapradio.com for further reading.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I’m Jane Messineo Lindquist.
And this is a Puppy CulturePotluck podcast.
You bring the topics,
we bring the conversation.
(00:20):
This week's question is one that we get
often.
I'm going to paraphrase itbecause it was a long post,
but this person who wrote infound themselves in a position
of trying to persuade someone
to start doing Puppy Culturewith their litters.
(00:41):
What she was telling them was,if you'll just do this great Puppy
Culture program, it will guaranteea good outcome for your puppies.
And she was coming to me to ask meif she's right about that.
If doing PuppyCulture will in fact guarantee
a good outcome for puppies.
(01:04):
There are very few things in life
that I can state as unequivocally true,
but I can unequivocally saythat doing Puppy Culture
will not guaranteea good outcome for every puppy.
There is nothing that you can do
(01:27):
in the first 12 weeks
that is a complete panaceafor the rest of the dog's life,
that that will guarantee that everything'sgoing to turn out right for that puppy.
And there are two big reasons why.
The first reason
(01:48):
is that puppy culture, or
any good early socialization program,
should be thought more of as a ticket
to pass on to the next level.
What do I mean by that?
I mean that,
there are developmental windowsthat open and close
(02:12):
during that period, when the breederhas the puppies in their hands,
and your job as a breederis not to complete
all the socializationand training for this puppy.
Your job as a breeder
is to hand the puppy buyer
a puppy that is not a behavioral project.
(02:34):
So the first time that
that puppy ownertakes the puppy out in public,
the puppy's not going to freak out,
the first time the puppy ownerputs a leash and collar on the puppy,
the puppy somewhat familiar with itand can sort of toddle along.
The first time that the puppy ownerputs it in a pen to be alone
(02:55):
while the puppy owner goesand does something else,
the puppy's not going to freak outand have separation anxiety.
It's a, just a ticket to move onto the next level
of socialization and trainingthat the puppy owner can just move ahead
and start with their their jobbecause they do have a job.
It's not all on the breederwithout having to go
(03:19):
to some sortof behavioral modification boot camp.
So the puppy owner can
just pick up and start their work,which again,
if we ever had any doubt
that socializationand training needs to be continued,
especially for the first year of lifeand throughout
the life of the dog that you justyou have to keep it up.
(03:42):
Covid taught us that becausewe had a whole generation of puppies
that were right up until 12 weeks old,socialized
really well, Puppy Culture,we did everything.
And then for the next,
what was it, six nine months, a year?
Those puppiesreally couldn't get socialized.
(04:03):
And we saw the tragic consequences.
I mean, we we wound up
with a lot of behavioral projectsbecause that early foundation that, again,
is just like a ticket to open the gateto go ahead and do the rest of your work,
that the rest of the work was never done.
And and you have to do it.
So no, it's not all on the breeder.
(04:25):
The puppy owner has to do it .
Now, if the breeder doesn't do thatearly work,
it's a nightmare for the puppy owners.
And we see this all the timein our With Open Arms puppy owners course,
because we get a lot of puppy ownerswho are taking the course
(04:46):
whose breeders did not dothe Puppy Culture type foundation
of separation training and confinementtraining and leash walking.
And these poor people have puppies
that just cannot be put inany kind of containment or pen
that freak out, that have legitimate
(05:07):
panic at being separated.
They've never even been separatedfrom their litter mates for five minutes.
They can't have any kind of tack on them
that you put on a leash or collaror anything.
The dogs just freak out.
This is just not
really fair to saddle the puppy ownerwith them, with this,
and 90% of our time
(05:30):
in our discussion groups is helping
peoplewhose breeders didn't do any of this work.
So yes, it makes a big difference.
You are doing the right thing by doing it,
but it doesn't guarantee a lifelong,
no problems,the is going to turn out great.
(05:50):
The puppy ownerstill has to do a lot of work.
So that's the first reason
why Puppy Cultureis not going to guarantee.
Because the ultimate outcome forthe puppies is going to depend
to a large extent
on the puppy ownerand how they take that advantage
(06:11):
that a good breeder gives them of a
of a well conditionedpuppy and runs with it.
And the second reason why
early socialization programslike Puppy Culture
can't guarantee
a perfect outcome for every puppy
(06:33):
is genetics.
Now, you've probably heard
nature and nurture,and the estimates vary.
Some say 50/50.
Some say 60/40.
They keep changing it around.
But you know,
(06:54):
there's a very strong genetic component
that's going to determine
how those puppies turn out.
And I think a lot of the reason
why science has struggled with
defining the percentage of
(07:14):
nature versus nurture,how much is genetics
and how much is the waythat you raise them
is because
they're looking at it
as one formula.
It's 100% this puppy and therefore it's
genetics has to be a portion
(07:36):
of that 100% and environment.
Meaning to say the way that you raisethem has to be a portion of that 100%.
And I propose that we rethink this
because it is 100% genetics
and also 100% environment.
(08:01):
What do I mean by that?
The possible
range
that a dog's temperament
and personality can fall within
is genetically determined.
(08:21):
There is a genetic box
that you will never breach.
You will never exceedthe limits of this genetic box.
And it is a pretty strong genetic box.
A Cavalier King Charles Spaniel
(08:43):
is never going to behave
like a border Collie, no matter what
you do to it.
A ColumbusSpaniel is never going to behave
like a cattle dog,no matter what you do to it.
This is why people choose breeds.
(09:04):
They're looking forthat concentration of genes
that narrows down the possibilitiesof the way that dog can be
based onwhatever the preference of the owner is.
Okay, so that none of these are wrongpersonalities.
They're just different personalities.
(09:24):
And they are genetically determined.
I think that is easy for people to grasp.
But what you also have to grasp
is that every single dog
born, every single human,every single living
being, has a genetic boxwhich you will not exceed.
(09:49):
There is a predetermined amount
that your behavior can be modified.
And the same is true of dogs. Okay.
They're all cattle dogs,but some are going to be better
at herding than othersor have have certain characteristics.
They're all Cavalier King Charles spaniels
on the shy bold continuum,some of them are going to be more shy.
(10:12):
Some of them are going to be more bold.
And there's a limitto how much you can change that.
So with any given animalyou're working inside of that box.
So that's 100%, 100%.
There is a box aroundwhatever you can do with that animal.
Whatever the possibilities are,they're limited.
(10:36):
That having been said,
where that animal winds up withinthat genetic box
is 100% controlled
by your environment,by what you do with that animal.
So when you're looking
as a puppy owner at a puppy.
(11:00):
You're getting the package.
It's a black box.
You don't know what it is yet,but whatever you put into that puppy,
100% is going to decide the outcomefor that puppy
within the limitsof its genetic potential.
For most dogs,
their genetic box is drawn so that on one
(11:24):
or the other end of that genetic box
is something that we as humans
would consider a poor outcome.
What we would considerunacceptable levels of fear,
shyness, aggressionat one end or the other.
There's going to be something potentiallyfor most every dog, that
(11:49):
if you really don't do the right things,you could go into bad territory.
There are
some dogs where that genetic box,no matter
where you go in that genetic box, it'sgood news.
It's going to be a great dog.
And then there are some dogswhere the genetic box truly is drawn
(12:10):
in such a way that there just reallycould be no good outcome for that puppy.
And I mean, I'm only talking now about
pathologically normal puppies.
In other words,there could be puppies that are just
so far onto the shy end of the shy,
bold continuum that no matterwhat work you did with them,
(12:33):
you would never bring them upinto something that we might,
as humans, consider socially acceptable.
Same thing with aggression.
There may be dogsthat are so far toward the the
willingness to meet conflictwith aggression that
there's no way you can modify it downto an acceptable level.
(12:55):
But yet those dogs are not,
mentally defective.
They're just dogs that carry thesevery strong traits that we've bred for.
I mean, we've bred dogs to to guard us,to be guardians to to protect us.
We bred dogs to be soft and sweet.
I mean, these are all byproducts of that.
This is all normal.
(13:17):
And sometimes the box is just drawnvery far on
the ends of what we've bred for.
But in addition to that, then
you have your dogs that have psychosis.
I mean, just like with humans,there's mental illness, there's
mental illness in dogs, there are dogsthat, have personality disorders.
(13:40):
They have obsessive compulsive disorders.
Again, sometimes that's something
that can be triggered,that you can control it.
But oftentimesit's just it's a genetic sort of bomb
that's in there waiting to go offthat you just don't have control over it.
(14:01):
But you know,
those two situations eitherwhere you just can't go wrong
or you just can't go right,that that genetic box
is either all in territorythat we would find
a good outcome or territorythat we would find
unacceptable as a pet.
(14:21):
Those are more rare situations.
Usually you have a lot of powerto affect the outcome
for your puppies.
This is why when somebody asked me
if Puppy Culture is going
to guarantee a good outcome for puppies,
(14:44):
my short answer is no,
but it will guarantee the best outcomefor puppies.
And that's what we're all about.
That's all you can be aboutis the best outcome.
In the majority of cases,
if you've gone to a breederthat has selected carefully
(15:04):
for good genetic material for that breed,
and you as a puppy ownerhave done your research and are in fact
getting a breedthat you're compatible with
if you do the work, if the breeder did
the work in Puppy Cultureand you continue to do the work,
(15:24):
you're going to find yourself somewherewithin that genetic box,
that is a good outcome for youand for the puppy.
Now this is really a course in itself,
but I'm going to touch lightly on it here
and talk about
(15:46):
what this means to you
as a breeder.
Your goal should be
to stack
the deck in your favor by selectingbreeding stock that you feel is likely
to produce the outcome that you seek,based on the pedigree of the dogs
(16:09):
and the known characteristicof the ancestors in the pedigree.
But it is laughable to think
that you control
the outcome and that two good dogs equalseight good puppies.
It's just not true.
Nature does not work that way.
(16:32):
Nature is always looking
for a high assortment of genetic material,
and is going to spread the puppieson a behavioral bell curve
to maximize the potentialthat one of those puppies temperaments
is going to be optimal for the environmentthe puppies are born into.
So nature
(16:55):
is always looking for high assortmentand low predictability.
And as breeders,we are always pushing for low
assortment and high predictability.
So you are literally,as a breeder working against evolution
in trying to make all these puppiesuniform,
(17:17):
emotionally in a way that is is pleasing
and what we would call a good outcome.
Because remember, let's just take a traitlike fear,
you know, if there are eight puppies,
nature could say, listen, I'mgoing to take two of these puppies and,
and put themlike on the pathological fear end.
(17:38):
Because if they're born into a really,
like dangerous and
research resource poor environment,that really fearful puppy
actually is going to do better than thisbold, confident puppy
that gladly goes to meeteveryone that that they meet
and is happy to meet everyone,because those fearful puppies
(18:00):
will stay out of troubleand the bold puppies
could get killed in a dangerousand resource poor environment.
But you know, in a resourcerich and safe environment
like most of our puppies are born into,the bold,
gregarious puppies are going to do a lotbetter than the fearful puppies.
For the fearful puppies,
they're just going to worry themselves,almost literally to death.
(18:22):
And it's not going to be an outcomethat most puppy owners are going to want.
Same things,frankly true of aggression, that if,
a puppy is born into
a dangerous resource, poor environment,well, aggression serves them
well because they can take thingsfrom other people and dogs and survive.
(18:44):
Whereas if they're born into a resourcerich environment,
aggression is a very dangerous traitto have because frankly, you know,
we just don't tolerate it as humansvery much.
Aggression and dogs.
So what I'm getting at isfrom an evolutionary point of view,
(19:04):
there are no good and badbehavioral traits,
and nature is always going to tryand spread her chips out on the board.
She she wants to maximize the potential
of just one of those puppies surviving.
Nature does not care about any individualpuppy.
Nature cares about survival of the species
(19:28):
and the best chanceof one of those puppies
surviving to reproduce is by having anassortment of temperaments.
Not what we want as breeders.
This is why we concentrategenetic material.
This is why we tryand eliminate assortment.
(19:48):
We try and eliminate the narrow downas much as we can that box,
so that box is smaller, tighter,
in a better range for us.
But again, it is laughable to think
as a breeder you control the outcomefor every single puppy.
(20:09):
You just don't.
You know, I always say.
This is probably the real reason
why most dog breeders only stay in thisfor five years, because it's a fact.
Five years is how long most people stay in
(20:30):
dog breeding and then they get out.
And I think it's because
you come into this thinking that you're
going to do all the rightthings and avoid problems.
Every one of us started out
thinking on some level,
oh, all those
other breeders, they were unethicaland they were cutting corners.
(20:54):
They weren't, you know, breedinggood temperaments together.
And, you know, they mayor may not be unethical and they may
or may not have been as selectiveas you would be about temperaments.
But I'm just telling you for surenature is going to have a turn at you
and give you a real lesson in humility
(21:14):
at some point in your breeding career.
It's a truefork in the road in the life of a breeder.
And most people,
they just they just can't take it.
And and I can't say I blame them.
There just are not a lot of people
that have the constitution
to continue and persevere with breeding.
(21:39):
Once they realize that they can dowhat's right and still be wrong,
that you can have
behavioral outliersand even whole litters, that,
despite your very best efforts and plans,
are really terrible.
And I think this real heartbreak
(22:00):
for novice breeders, when they
when they come up against this wall,
is exacerbatedby the fact that we really don't
talk about it, that
nobody wants to sort of admit
that you can do everything the right way
(22:21):
and still wind upwith a really bad outcome.
We don't really talkabout our really bad outcomes.
I mean, there's so much antibreeder sentiment.
I can't blame people,
but all I can say here is
if I can have one novice personwho's maybe going through this,
listen to my podcastand be encouraged by what I say.
(22:45):
That is a huge win for me.
If you've had a disaster,
chances are
it's not something you did wrong.
You're not alone.
We have all been through it,
whether we talk about it or not,
and you will have good outcomesin the future.
(23:07):
Don't be afraid to try again.
You will make a differencewith the good puppies
that you put out into this world.
So circling back
to the original question and summing it up
for sure,
doing Puppy Culture or another equivalent
(23:29):
early socialization program
in the first 12 weeks of life
will guarantee the best outcome
given the genetic material of the puppy.
After that,
it's the puppy owner's turn to start
(23:50):
putting input into that genetic box
to start building up
the potential for that puppy,
given again the gift that a good breederhas given them,
which is sort of a blank slatethat they can just write on.
So there are no guaranteed good outcomes.
(24:12):
There are no guaranteed good outcomesfor a living, breathing creature,
but there are best outcomes.
And as human beings that lovethese animals, that's all we can ever do.
Take whatever genetic handsthese puppies are dealt
and work toward best outcomes
(24:35):
for these animals in our care.
I mean, you know,
it's not all gloom and doom.
Chances are,
if you do all the right things,the outcome is going to be really good.
And as a breeder, you're going to makea lot of puppy owners really happy.
You're you're going to changea lot of lives for the better.
(24:57):
And puppy culture is a big part of that.
Not a guarantee, but
certainly a way tostack the deck in your favor.
If you liked this podcast,
you'll love our course for puppy owners,
available at puppyculture.com.
Breeders.
We have courses for you tooat puppyculture.com
(25:22):
Breeders,do you want to get your puppy owners
started on the right footwith Puppy Culture?
You can give your puppy owners the gift ofour puppy course at a nice discount
when you buy four or more copies
available at puppyculture.com.
Well, that's it for this time.
(25:44):
Thanks for listening. Bye bye.
I’m Jane Messineo Lindquist.
And this is a Puppy CulturePotluck podcast.
You bring the topics,
we bring the conversation.
(00:20):
This week's question is one that we get
often.
I'm going to paraphrase itbecause it was a long post,
but this person who wrote infound themselves in a position
of trying to persuade someone
to start doing Puppy Culturewith their litters.
(00:41):
What she was telling them was,if you'll just do this great Puppy
Culture program, it will guaranteea good outcome for your puppies.
And she was coming to me to ask meif she's right about that.
If doing PuppyCulture will in fact guarantee
a good outcome for puppies.
(01:04):
There are very few things in life
that I can state as unequivocally true,
but I can unequivocally saythat doing Puppy Culture
will not guaranteea good outcome for every puppy.
There is nothing that you can do
(01:27):
in the first 12 weeks
that is a complete panaceafor the rest of the dog's life,
that that will guarantee that everything'sgoing to turn out right for that puppy.
And there are two big reasons why.
The first reason
(01:48):
is that puppy culture, or
any good early socialization program,
should be thought more of as a ticket
to pass on to the next level.
What do I mean by that?
I mean that,
there are developmental windowsthat open and close
(02:12):
during that period, when the breederhas the puppies in their hands,
and your job as a breederis not to complete
all the socializationand training for this puppy.
Your job as a breeder
is to hand the puppy buyer
a puppy that is not a behavioral project.
(02:34):
So the first time that
that puppy ownertakes the puppy out in public,
the puppy's not going to freak out,
the first time the puppy ownerputs a leash and collar on the puppy,
the puppy somewhat familiar with itand can sort of toddle along.
The first time that the puppy ownerputs it in a pen to be alone
(02:55):
while the puppy owner goesand does something else,
the puppy's not going to freak outand have separation anxiety.
It's a, just a ticket to move onto the next level
of socialization and trainingthat the puppy owner can just move ahead
and start with their their jobbecause they do have a job.
It's not all on the breederwithout having to go
(03:19):
to some sortof behavioral modification boot camp.
So the puppy owner can
just pick up and start their work,which again,
if we ever had any doubt
that socializationand training needs to be continued,
especially for the first year of lifeand throughout
the life of the dog that you justyou have to keep it up.
(03:42):
Covid taught us that becausewe had a whole generation of puppies
that were right up until 12 weeks old,socialized
really well, Puppy Culture,we did everything.
And then for the next,
what was it, six nine months, a year?
Those puppiesreally couldn't get socialized.
(04:03):
And we saw the tragic consequences.
I mean, we we wound up
with a lot of behavioral projectsbecause that early foundation that, again,
is just like a ticket to open the gateto go ahead and do the rest of your work,
that the rest of the work was never done.
And and you have to do it.
So no, it's not all on the breeder.
(04:25):
The puppy owner has to do it .
Now, if the breeder doesn't do thatearly work,
it's a nightmare for the puppy owners.
And we see this all the timein our With Open Arms puppy owners course,
because we get a lot of puppy ownerswho are taking the course
(04:46):
whose breeders did not dothe Puppy Culture type foundation
of separation training and confinementtraining and leash walking.
And these poor people have puppies
that just cannot be put inany kind of containment or pen
that freak out, that have legitimate
(05:07):
panic at being separated.
They've never even been separatedfrom their litter mates for five minutes.
They can't have any kind of tack on them
that you put on a leash or collaror anything.
The dogs just freak out.
This is just not
really fair to saddle the puppy ownerwith them, with this,
and 90% of our time
(05:30):
in our discussion groups is helping
peoplewhose breeders didn't do any of this work.
So yes, it makes a big difference.
You are doing the right thing by doing it,
but it doesn't guarantee a lifelong,
no problems,the is going to turn out great.
(05:50):
The puppy ownerstill has to do a lot of work.
So that's the first reason
why Puppy Cultureis not going to guarantee.
Because the ultimate outcome forthe puppies is going to depend
to a large extent
on the puppy ownerand how they take that advantage
(06:11):
that a good breeder gives them of a
of a well conditionedpuppy and runs with it.
And the second reason why
early socialization programslike Puppy Culture
can't guarantee
a perfect outcome for every puppy
(06:33):
is genetics.
Now, you've probably heard
nature and nurture,and the estimates vary.
Some say 50/50.
Some say 60/40.
They keep changing it around.
But you know,
(06:54):
there's a very strong genetic component
that's going to determine
how those puppies turn out.
And I think a lot of the reason
why science has struggled with
defining the percentage of
(07:14):
nature versus nurture,how much is genetics
and how much is the waythat you raise them
is because
they're looking at it
as one formula.
It's 100% this puppy and therefore it's
genetics has to be a portion
(07:36):
of that 100% and environment.
Meaning to say the way that you raisethem has to be a portion of that 100%.
And I propose that we rethink this
because it is 100% genetics
and also 100% environment.
(08:01):
What do I mean by that?
The possible
range
that a dog's temperament
and personality can fall within
is genetically determined.
(08:21):
There is a genetic box
that you will never breach.
You will never exceedthe limits of this genetic box.
And it is a pretty strong genetic box.
A Cavalier King Charles Spaniel
(08:43):
is never going to behave
like a border Collie, no matter what
you do to it.
A ColumbusSpaniel is never going to behave
like a cattle dog,no matter what you do to it.
This is why people choose breeds.
(09:04):
They're looking forthat concentration of genes
that narrows down the possibilitiesof the way that dog can be
based onwhatever the preference of the owner is.
Okay, so that none of these are wrongpersonalities.
They're just different personalities.
(09:24):
And they are genetically determined.
I think that is easy for people to grasp.
But what you also have to grasp
is that every single dog
born, every single human,every single living
being, has a genetic boxwhich you will not exceed.
(09:49):
There is a predetermined amount
that your behavior can be modified.
And the same is true of dogs. Okay.
They're all cattle dogs,but some are going to be better
at herding than othersor have have certain characteristics.
They're all Cavalier King Charles spaniels
on the shy bold continuum,some of them are going to be more shy.
(10:12):
Some of them are going to be more bold.
And there's a limitto how much you can change that.
So with any given animalyou're working inside of that box.
So that's 100%, 100%.
There is a box aroundwhatever you can do with that animal.
Whatever the possibilities are,they're limited.
(10:36):
That having been said,
where that animal winds up withinthat genetic box
is 100% controlled
by your environment,by what you do with that animal.
So when you're looking
as a puppy owner at a puppy.
(11:00):
You're getting the package.
It's a black box.
You don't know what it is yet,but whatever you put into that puppy,
100% is going to decide the outcomefor that puppy
within the limitsof its genetic potential.
For most dogs,
their genetic box is drawn so that on one
(11:24):
or the other end of that genetic box
is something that we as humans
would consider a poor outcome.
What we would considerunacceptable levels of fear,
shyness, aggressionat one end or the other.
There's going to be something potentiallyfor most every dog, that
(11:49):
if you really don't do the right things,you could go into bad territory.
There are
some dogs where that genetic box,no matter
where you go in that genetic box, it'sgood news.
It's going to be a great dog.
And then there are some dogswhere the genetic box truly is drawn
(12:10):
in such a way that there just reallycould be no good outcome for that puppy.
And I mean, I'm only talking now about
pathologically normal puppies.
In other words,there could be puppies that are just
so far onto the shy end of the shy,
bold continuum that no matterwhat work you did with them,
(12:33):
you would never bring them upinto something that we might,
as humans, consider socially acceptable.
Same thing with aggression.
There may be dogsthat are so far toward the the
willingness to meet conflictwith aggression that
there's no way you can modify it downto an acceptable level.
(12:55):
But yet those dogs are not,
mentally defective.
They're just dogs that carry thesevery strong traits that we've bred for.
I mean, we've bred dogs to to guard us,to be guardians to to protect us.
We bred dogs to be soft and sweet.
I mean, these are all byproducts of that.
This is all normal.
(13:17):
And sometimes the box is just drawnvery far on
the ends of what we've bred for.
But in addition to that, then
you have your dogs that have psychosis.
I mean, just like with humans,there's mental illness, there's
mental illness in dogs, there are dogsthat, have personality disorders.
(13:40):
They have obsessive compulsive disorders.
Again, sometimes that's something
that can be triggered,that you can control it.
But oftentimesit's just it's a genetic sort of bomb
that's in there waiting to go offthat you just don't have control over it.
(14:01):
But you know,
those two situations eitherwhere you just can't go wrong
or you just can't go right,that that genetic box
is either all in territorythat we would find
a good outcome or territorythat we would find
unacceptable as a pet.
(14:21):
Those are more rare situations.
Usually you have a lot of powerto affect the outcome
for your puppies.
This is why when somebody asked me
if Puppy Culture is going
to guarantee a good outcome for puppies,
(14:44):
my short answer is no,
but it will guarantee the best outcomefor puppies.
And that's what we're all about.
That's all you can be aboutis the best outcome.
In the majority of cases,
if you've gone to a breederthat has selected carefully
(15:04):
for good genetic material for that breed,
and you as a puppy ownerhave done your research and are in fact
getting a breedthat you're compatible with
if you do the work, if the breeder did
the work in Puppy Cultureand you continue to do the work,
(15:24):
you're going to find yourself somewherewithin that genetic box,
that is a good outcome for youand for the puppy.
Now this is really a course in itself,
but I'm going to touch lightly on it here
and talk about
(15:46):
what this means to you
as a breeder.
Your goal should be
to stack
the deck in your favor by selectingbreeding stock that you feel is likely
to produce the outcome that you seek,based on the pedigree of the dogs
(16:09):
and the known characteristicof the ancestors in the pedigree.
But it is laughable to think
that you control
the outcome and that two good dogs equalseight good puppies.
It's just not true.
Nature does not work that way.
(16:32):
Nature is always looking
for a high assortment of genetic material,
and is going to spread the puppieson a behavioral bell curve
to maximize the potentialthat one of those puppies temperaments
is going to be optimal for the environmentthe puppies are born into.
So nature
(16:55):
is always looking for high assortmentand low predictability.
And as breeders,we are always pushing for low
assortment and high predictability.
So you are literally,as a breeder working against evolution
in trying to make all these puppiesuniform,
(17:17):
emotionally in a way that is is pleasing
and what we would call a good outcome.
Because remember, let's just take a traitlike fear,
you know, if there are eight puppies,
nature could say, listen, I'mgoing to take two of these puppies and,
and put themlike on the pathological fear end.
(17:38):
Because if they're born into a really,
like dangerous and
research resource poor environment,that really fearful puppy
actually is going to do better than thisbold, confident puppy
that gladly goes to meeteveryone that that they meet
and is happy to meet everyone,because those fearful puppies
(18:00):
will stay out of troubleand the bold puppies
could get killed in a dangerousand resource poor environment.
But you know, in a resourcerich and safe environment
like most of our puppies are born into,the bold,
gregarious puppies are going to do a lotbetter than the fearful puppies.
For the fearful puppies,
they're just going to worry themselves,almost literally to death.
(18:22):
And it's not going to be an outcomethat most puppy owners are going to want.
Same things,frankly true of aggression, that if,
a puppy is born into
a dangerous resource, poor environment,well, aggression serves them
well because they can take thingsfrom other people and dogs and survive.
(18:44):
Whereas if they're born into a resourcerich environment,
aggression is a very dangerous traitto have because frankly, you know,
we just don't tolerate it as humansvery much.
Aggression and dogs.
So what I'm getting at isfrom an evolutionary point of view,
(19:04):
there are no good and badbehavioral traits,
and nature is always going to tryand spread her chips out on the board.
She she wants to maximize the potential
of just one of those puppies surviving.
Nature does not care about any individualpuppy.
Nature cares about survival of the species
(19:28):
and the best chanceof one of those puppies
surviving to reproduce is by having anassortment of temperaments.
Not what we want as breeders.
This is why we concentrategenetic material.
This is why we tryand eliminate assortment.
(19:48):
We try and eliminate the narrow downas much as we can that box,
so that box is smaller, tighter,
in a better range for us.
But again, it is laughable to think
as a breeder you control the outcomefor every single puppy.
(20:09):
You just don't.
You know, I always say.
This is probably the real reason
why most dog breeders only stay in thisfor five years, because it's a fact.
Five years is how long most people stay in
(20:30):
dog breeding and then they get out.
And I think it's because
you come into this thinking that you're
going to do all the rightthings and avoid problems.
Every one of us started out
thinking on some level,
oh, all those
other breeders, they were unethicaland they were cutting corners.
(20:54):
They weren't, you know, breedinggood temperaments together.
And, you know, they mayor may not be unethical and they may
or may not have been as selectiveas you would be about temperaments.
But I'm just telling you for surenature is going to have a turn at you
and give you a real lesson in humility
(21:14):
at some point in your breeding career.
It's a truefork in the road in the life of a breeder.
And most people,
they just they just can't take it.
And and I can't say I blame them.
There just are not a lot of people
that have the constitution
to continue and persevere with breeding.
(21:39):
Once they realize that they can dowhat's right and still be wrong,
that you can have
behavioral outliersand even whole litters, that,
despite your very best efforts and plans,
are really terrible.
And I think this real heartbreak
(22:00):
for novice breeders, when they
when they come up against this wall,
is exacerbatedby the fact that we really don't
talk about it, that
nobody wants to sort of admit
that you can do everything the right way
(22:21):
and still wind upwith a really bad outcome.
We don't really talkabout our really bad outcomes.
I mean, there's so much antibreeder sentiment.
I can't blame people,
but all I can say here is
if I can have one novice personwho's maybe going through this,
listen to my podcastand be encouraged by what I say.
(22:45):
That is a huge win for me.
If you've had a disaster,
chances are
it's not something you did wrong.
You're not alone.
We have all been through it,
whether we talk about it or not,
and you will have good outcomesin the future.
(23:07):
Don't be afraid to try again.
You will make a differencewith the good puppies
that you put out into this world.
So circling back
to the original question and summing it up
for sure,
doing Puppy Culture or another equivalent
(23:29):
early socialization program
in the first 12 weeks of life
will guarantee the best outcome
given the genetic material of the puppy.
After that,
it's the puppy owner's turn to start
(23:50):
putting input into that genetic box
to start building up
the potential for that puppy,
given again the gift that a good breederhas given them,
which is sort of a blank slatethat they can just write on.
So there are no guaranteed good outcomes.
(24:12):
There are no guaranteed good outcomesfor a living, breathing creature,
but there are best outcomes.
And as human beings that lovethese animals, that's all we can ever do.
Take whatever genetic handsthese puppies are dealt
and work toward best outcomes
(24:35):
for these animals in our care.
I mean, you know,
it's not all gloom and doom.
Chances are,
if you do all the right things,the outcome is going to be really good.
And as a breeder, you're going to makea lot of puppy owners really happy.
You're you're going to changea lot of lives for the better.
(24:57):
And puppy culture is a big part of that.
Not a guarantee, but
certainly a way tostack the deck in your favor.
If you liked this podcast,
you'll love our course for puppy owners,
available at puppyculture.com.
Breeders.
We have courses for you tooat puppyculture.com
(25:22):
Breeders,do you want to get your puppy owners
started on the right footwith Puppy Culture?
You can give your puppy owners the gift ofour puppy course at a nice discount
when you buy four or more copies
available at puppyculture.com.
Well, that's it for this time.
(25:44):
Thanks for listening. Bye bye.
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