The Fundraising System with Matt Bregman | Nonprofit411

In this episode of Nonprofit411, Sarah Barton welcomes Matt Bregman, founder of The Fundraising System, to explore the essential elements of building a sustainable and effective fundraising strategy. Matt shares his journey as an "accidental fundraiser" and how his experiences shaped his approach to helping nonprofits establish clear systems for donor cultivation and engagement.

Key highlights include practical tips for small to mid-sized nonprofits, how to align fundraising efforts with organizational goals, and why generosity and relationship-building are at the heart of successful development work. Matt also introduces The Fundraising System, a resource to guide organizations in creating structured, measurable, and impactful fundraising processes.

Resources:

• The Fundraising System: www.thefundraisingsystem.com
• Connect with Matt Bregman:
  • Email: [e-mail]
  • LinkedIn: Matthew Bregman on LinkedIn
• Grant Writing Proposal Guide: Nonprofit411 Grant Guide

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hello and welcome to Nonprofit411, where we dive into resources and strategies that help nonprofits not just survive, but truly thrive.
I'm Sarah Barton, your host and fundraising advocate.
.346938776Each episode, we bring you inspiring conversations with experts in fundraising, sustainability, and best practices to equip you with the tools and confidence you need to make a real impact. 4 00:00:25,757.346938776 --> 00:00:26,467.346938776 Hi. 5 00:00:27,457.346938776 --> 00:00:30,667.346938776 Welcome to today's episode of nonprofit 411. 6 00:00:30,677.346938776 --> 00:00:33,147.346938776 I'm thrilled that you're here with us today. 7 00:00:33,177.346938776 --> 00:00:45,837.346938776 If you're new here, I'm Sarah Barton, your host and each week on nonprofit 411 we have conversations with nonprofit experts who offer practical strategies and inspiring stories to help nonprofits build sustainable funding and stronger communities. 8 00:00:46,327.346938776 --> 00:00:47,417.346938776 Whether you're here to learn. 9 00:00:47,672.346938776 --> 00:00:49,332.346938776 Be inspired or simply recharge. 10 00:00:49,352.346938776 --> 00:00:50,932.346938776 I'm so glad that you've joined us. 11 00:00:50,942.346938776 --> 00:00:53,42.346938776 So let's jump in today. 12 00:00:53,42.346938776 --> 00:00:58,272.346938776 I'm excited to welcome our guest, Matt Bregman founder of the fundraising system. 13 00:00:58,802.346938776 --> 00:01:05,502.346938776 And he's going to have a great conversation with me about his experience and some of his expertise. 14 00:01:05,512.346938776 --> 00:01:06,327.246938776 So welcome. 15 00:01:07,77.346938776 --> 00:01:07,667.346938776 Thank you. 16 00:01:07,727.346938776 --> 00:01:08,577.346938776 Glad to be here. 17 00:01:09,277.346938776 --> 00:01:09,837.346938776 Yes. 18 00:01:09,867.346938776 --> 00:01:11,187.346938776 I'm so glad you're here. 19 00:01:11,507.346938776 --> 00:01:13,407.346938776 It's, it's a beautiful day. 20 00:01:13,407.346938776 --> 00:01:14,267.346938776 I'm in West Virginia. 21 00:01:14,277.346938776 --> 00:01:15,177.346938776 I'm not sure where you're at. 22 00:01:15,187.346938776 --> 00:01:17,957.346938776 So it's actually a pretty nice day here for winter. 23 00:01:17,957.346938776 --> 00:01:22,457.347938776 So it's rainy in Montclair, New Jersey, but I'm sitting inside. 24 00:01:22,457.347938776 --> 00:01:25,947.346938776 So I don't mind makes me feel better about being inside all day. 25 00:01:27,547.346938776 --> 00:01:28,627.346938776 That is true about the rain. 26 00:01:28,687.346938776 --> 00:01:29,937.346938776 I do appreciate that too. 27 00:01:29,937.446938776 --> 00:01:45,522.34793878 So I'm going to start with my favorite question, which is what is your favorite hobby? Well, I guess if I had to say what my favorite hobby is, I would say it's watching films. 28 00:01:46,32.34793878 --> 00:02:06,532.34793878 And it's a hobby that I have not gotten to practice nearly as much as I would like in the last 22 years since my first child was born, but my son will soon be going off to college, and I think that I will have more access to the TV and more time on my calendar to go to, to art movie houses, so I'm looking forward to getting back into that. 29 00:02:07,92.34793878 --> 00:02:07,992.34793878 Oh, that's fun. 30 00:02:08,82.34793878 --> 00:02:11,692.34793878 Are you into sci fi? It looks like sci fi on your back panel. 31 00:02:11,692.34793878 --> 00:02:12,292.34793878 No, I know. 32 00:02:12,292.34793878 --> 00:02:13,392.34793878 It looks like sci fi. 33 00:02:13,412.34793878 --> 00:02:21,872.34693878 Now what's behind me is a small poster for Alphaville, which is a Jean Luc Godard film from the sixties. 34 00:02:21,892.34793878 --> 00:02:25,782.34793878 That's kind of like a make believe science fiction movie. 35 00:02:26,512.34793878 --> 00:02:32,152.34793878 And they just do closeups of neon signs in Paris and make it seem like it's the future or something. 36 00:02:32,152.34793878 --> 00:02:36,57.34793878 It's very It's a little, it's a little quirky and great. 37 00:02:36,967.34793878 --> 00:02:37,747.34793878 Oh, I love that. 38 00:02:37,837.34793878 --> 00:02:38,307.34793878 I love that. 39 00:02:38,357.34793878 --> 00:02:39,147.34793878 In college. 40 00:02:39,197.34793878 --> 00:02:42,97.34793878 I had I only had PBS. 41 00:02:42,97.34793878 --> 00:02:46,117.34793878 It was my only television station and I had a VCR. 42 00:02:46,157.34793878 --> 00:02:55,272.34793878 And so like, I don't know why, but for some reason my mom recorded all of the episode, all of the movies, the Oh, Planet of the, from Planet of the Apes. 43 00:02:55,412.34793878 --> 00:02:56,892.34793878 So the, the originals. 44 00:02:57,842.34693878 --> 00:02:57,952.34693878 Right. 45 00:02:58,852.34793878 --> 00:03:04,82.34793878 So, when I was really bored and there was nothing on PBS, I would watch Planet of the Apes. 46 00:03:04,502.34793878 --> 00:03:06,682.34793878 Simply because it's what I had access to. 47 00:03:07,642.34793878 --> 00:03:08,592.34793878 You must be an expert. 48 00:03:08,592.34793878 --> 00:03:11,232.34793878 If I ever need a Planet of the Apes expert, I know who to call. 49 00:03:12,162.34793878 --> 00:03:16,172.34793878 Yeah, it was just mindless noise in an apartment where I was by myself, really. 50 00:03:16,622.34793878 --> 00:03:16,922.34793878 Right. 51 00:03:17,592.34793878 --> 00:03:25,822.34893878 So can you tell our listeners a little bit about yourself and about what got you into nonprofit work and fundraising? And where you are now. 52 00:03:26,532.34893878 --> 00:03:27,112.34893878 Sure. 53 00:03:27,152.34893878 --> 00:03:36,802.34893878 Well, you know, I always, I always really wanted to do some kind of public service work from the time I was in high school. 54 00:03:36,917.34893878 --> 00:03:44,77.34893878 I was always interested in politics and activism and as I got older, more and more in, in culture. 55 00:03:44,97.34893878 --> 00:04:00,157.34993878 And you know, I went to school and I was college and I just sort of imagined that at some point there would be some sort of divine intervention and I would find myself in a, a you know, a gainful career, but that didn't happen. 56 00:04:00,157.34993878 --> 00:04:01,897.34993878 And so when I graduated from college. 57 00:04:02,297.34993878 --> 00:04:12,667.34993878 The only thing I could really do was to go work for an organization I volunteered with in college, and I went to work there for a couple of years. 58 00:04:12,717.34993878 --> 00:04:21,777.34893878 And while I was working there, we never had any money and people would always say, Oh, well, if we had a development director, then we'd have more money. 59 00:04:21,907.34993878 --> 00:04:23,867.34993878 And I didn't know what a development director was. 60 00:04:23,867.34993878 --> 00:04:25,47.34993878 I'd never heard that term. 61 00:04:25,57.34993878 --> 00:04:28,57.34993878 This is, you know, the late 1980s. 62 00:04:28,557.34993878 --> 00:04:40,477.34993878 It was my impression and people seem to think that a development director was a rich person who had rich friends and they went to parties with their rich friends and they would ask their friends to give money to your organization. 63 00:04:41,67.34993878 --> 00:04:51,147.34993878 But the problem is that these development directors apparently wanted really outrageous 40, 000 a year, which just seemed obscene to us. 64 00:04:51,602.34993878 --> 00:04:53,402.34993878 So we couldn't afford them. 65 00:04:53,412.34993878 --> 00:04:59,992.34993878 So I volunteered to do it with the caveat that I had no idea what I was doing, but I would do it for a discounted price. 66 00:05:00,552.34993878 --> 00:05:02,112.34993878 And then I started. 67 00:05:03,362.34993878 --> 00:05:11,292.34993878 Studying it and going reading books about fundraising and going to seminars and trying my best and I'd always been a good writer. 68 00:05:11,292.34993878 --> 00:05:16,762.34993878 So writing grants was the part that came easily to me, but at the beginning, it was so hard. 69 00:05:16,762.34993878 --> 00:05:22,242.34993878 It was really, I felt like I was it was something in between trying to win the lottery and trying to become a movie star. 70 00:05:22,522.34993878 --> 00:05:25,182.34993878 It just seems so impossible that I would ever get a grant. 71 00:05:25,582.34993878 --> 00:05:27,742.34993878 Sometimes I would get a rejection. 72 00:05:28,127.34993878 --> 00:05:44,47.34993878 The day after I sent the letter, I would think, I don't think it's logistically possible to get a rejection the next day, don't they? Doesn't there have to be a day in between where they open the letter and then bring it back to the post office? But somehow it was like they were waiting at the post office with the rejection letter. 73 00:05:44,607.34993878 --> 00:05:46,967.34993878 And then one day we got, got a grant. 74 00:05:47,277.34893878 --> 00:05:54,367.34993878 And it was just the most thrilling feeling in the world to actually successfully get a grant after all those attempts. 75 00:05:54,997.34993878 --> 00:06:00,957.34993878 And I, as they say, I've been chasing that feeling ever since, you know, it was such a great feeling when it actually works. 76 00:06:00,957.34993878 --> 00:06:02,987.34893878 And I started to realize what made sense. 77 00:06:02,987.34993878 --> 00:06:06,317.34893878 And and then after a while, I realized I had a marketable skill. 78 00:06:06,947.34993878 --> 00:06:16,57.34993878 And at that time I was getting more and more interested in culture in New York city and, you know, being able to participate in the things that I was surrounded by. 79 00:06:16,57.34993878 --> 00:06:19,317.34993878 So I really wanted to work in a cultural organization. 80 00:06:19,357.34993878 --> 00:06:20,937.34993878 And I did that for a while. 81 00:06:20,987.34993878 --> 00:06:22,717.34993878 And and it's been great ever since. 82 00:06:24,322.34993878 --> 00:06:24,862.34993878 Awesome. 83 00:06:24,862.34993878 --> 00:06:25,152.34993878 Yeah. 84 00:06:25,442.34993878 --> 00:06:31,442.34993878 So I've never, I don't think I've ever interviewed anybody yet who was like, well, I knew exactly I was going to do this. 85 00:06:31,442.34993878 --> 00:06:34,212.34993878 Everyone's an accidental fundraiser, right? Yeah. 86 00:06:34,532.34993878 --> 00:06:34,802.34993878 Right. 87 00:06:35,352.34993878 --> 00:06:37,312.34993878 There may be, you know, it may happen now. 88 00:06:37,312.34993878 --> 00:06:39,212.34993878 I mean, there are people going to school and studying it. 89 00:06:39,222.34993878 --> 00:06:40,272.34993878 So it could be a different thing. 90 00:06:40,272.34993878 --> 00:06:44,282.34993878 But I think certainly for people in my generation, it was something you fell into. 91 00:06:45,102.34993878 --> 00:06:46,912.34893878 Yeah, but it's great. 92 00:06:46,942.34993878 --> 00:06:48,432.34993878 I'm glad I found it. 93 00:06:49,552.34993878 --> 00:06:53,882.34893878 My story is very similar to yours in that I came out of college, got a job. 94 00:06:54,177.34993878 --> 00:06:57,897.34993878 with a development department of a university. 95 00:06:58,367.34993878 --> 00:07:01,217.34993878 And, but I didn't have any, I didn't have any guidance. 96 00:07:01,217.34993878 --> 00:07:02,287.34893878 I think about that. 97 00:07:02,317.34993878 --> 00:07:09,27.34993878 That's, you know, my organization provides training on how to do fundraising and grant writing because I didn't have any guidance. 98 00:07:09,27.34993878 --> 00:07:17,347.34993878 I didn't, I, in your story about like submitting the grants, like, yeah, I didn't have any idea, but I figured it was a numbers game. 99 00:07:17,367.34993878 --> 00:07:20,667.34893878 And if you submitted enough letters of of intent. 100 00:07:21,742.34993878 --> 00:07:23,332.34993878 or grant applications. 101 00:07:24,47.34993878 --> 00:07:25,107.34993878 One of them would stick. 102 00:07:27,37.34993878 --> 00:07:32,927.34893878 Yeah, no, it's funny about learning by doing because I heard so many different stories when I was starting out. 103 00:07:32,937.34993878 --> 00:07:41,957.35193878 Like, you know, people would tell me, well, it's never going to work because these foundations only give to people they know and other rich people. 104 00:07:41,957.35193878 --> 00:07:45,287.35193878 And if you don't, if you're not a rich person, they're not going to give to you if you're not. 105 00:07:45,707.35193878 --> 00:08:02,397.35093878 You didn't go to the same, you know, college as they went to or other people would say, well, you have to have lunch, you know, if you have to get a lunch meeting with all these people and, you know, it's like 25 years old and trying to get lunch meetings with foundation, but, you know, it didn't make any sense really. 106 00:08:02,397.35093878 --> 00:08:10,327.35193878 And I, I, you know, I thought, oh, am I doing this wrong? You know, you'd hear all sorts of different stories and then in time I figured it out. 107 00:08:10,327.35193878 --> 00:08:14,707.35193878 And that's one of the reasons something I really love doing is teaching about fundraising. 108 00:08:14,707.35193878 --> 00:08:27,797.35193878 And for a long time, I taught a class called a Crash course in fundraising at the support center because after I finally figured out what was going on, I would go to all sorts of, you know, conferences and. 109 00:08:28,317.35193878 --> 00:08:34,127.35193878 You know, presentations and people would always ask the same very rudimentary questions over and over again. 110 00:08:34,587.35193878 --> 00:08:49,37.35193878 And I thought I'd really like to just take to have a class where I just answer all of these very rudimentary questions for people so they can, they can jump over, you know, 2 years of trial and error and just understand some basics of how all of this works. 111 00:08:49,107.45193878 --> 00:09:01,137.45193878 So, you know, so it's great once you, once you have your sense of, of how the whole industry works and what makes sense and what doesn't, it all seems like common sense, but at the beginning it's mystifying. 112 00:09:02,7.45093878 --> 00:09:02,497.45093878 Yes. 113 00:09:02,887.45193878 --> 00:09:03,307.45193878 Yes. 114 00:09:03,547.45093878 --> 00:09:04,187.45093878 I agree. 115 00:09:04,267.45193878 --> 00:09:04,667.45143878 I agree. 116 00:09:04,667.45143878 --> 00:09:14,987.45193878 And you learned that the donors are passionate people, just like the people that you're working with within the nonprofit, right? Yeah, absolutely. 117 00:09:15,257.45193878 --> 00:09:26,337.45193878 Especially, you know, there's one story That really was a really changed my mindset, which was that there was a foundation that we were applying to. 118 00:09:26,437.45193878 --> 00:09:33,247.45143878 And I was telling the person from the foundation about how where I live. 119 00:09:33,247.45143878 --> 00:09:34,797.45143878 There was all these caps. 120 00:09:34,797.45143878 --> 00:09:38,237.45193878 If I wanted to go into the city in a cab, how I could get in the cab. 121 00:09:38,407.45193878 --> 00:09:41,237.45193878 And she said, Oh, well, I, I never take cabs. 122 00:09:41,237.45193878 --> 00:09:56,377.45193878 I only take Ever take the subway and it suddenly occurred to me, this is another person just like me who's working at a foundation whose job it is to give money away in the most you know, practical, effective way possible. 123 00:09:56,387.45093878 --> 00:09:56,897.45193878 She's not. 124 00:09:57,412.45193878 --> 00:09:58,602.45193878 She isn't the money. 125 00:09:58,612.45193878 --> 00:10:00,912.45193878 She works at the place that gives away money. 126 00:10:01,142.45193878 --> 00:10:03,732.45193878 I work at the place that gets the money to do good things. 127 00:10:03,732.45193878 --> 00:10:09,722.45193878 We're, we're sort of partners in this and it's not, you know, it's, it's, she's not the aristocrat and I'm not the peasant. 128 00:10:10,212.45193878 --> 00:10:15,322.45143878 So, that's, it was a silly little thing, but it really was one of those things that crystallized in my mind. 129 00:10:16,102.45043878 --> 00:10:16,702.45143878 I love that. 130 00:10:16,732.45043878 --> 00:10:19,452.45043878 I love that because it's advice that I give people. 131 00:10:19,452.45043878 --> 00:10:23,392.45143878 I'm always like, just call them on the phone and ask them if they're interested in what you're. 132 00:10:23,892.45143878 --> 00:10:27,122.45143878 What you're doing, because it's a great, easy place to start. 133 00:10:27,422.45143878 --> 00:10:28,542.45143878 And I'm like, they don't bite. 134 00:10:28,592.45143878 --> 00:10:32,252.45143878 I've never had any of them bite or be like, I don't want to talk to you. 135 00:10:32,262.45143878 --> 00:10:39,612.45043878 Usually they're more than happy to tell you you know, what they give towards and what they're interested in funding, because you're right. 136 00:10:39,812.45143878 --> 00:10:44,512.45143878 If they're working at an organization and they're tasked with. 137 00:10:45,82.45143878 --> 00:10:47,312.45143878 Very specific types of giving typically. 138 00:10:47,662.45143878 --> 00:10:55,42.45143878 And so it behooves them just like it behooves the nonprofit to be able to communicate what that is. 139 00:10:55,942.45043878 --> 00:10:56,552.45043878 Absolutely. 140 00:10:57,172.45143878 --> 00:11:05,92.45143878 And it really behooves the fundraiser to spend three minutes making a phone call rather than thinking by spending two weeks. 141 00:11:05,107.55143878 --> 00:11:22,114.14032766 And it's just writing the perfect letter about, you know, how your food pantry is going to help more people in the county in the coming year, only to find out that, well, this foundation only funds, you know, animal shelters in the different states. 142 00:11:22,124.14032766 --> 00:11:23,994.14032766 So you just wait for two weeks. 143 00:11:24,4.14032766 --> 00:11:25,544.14032766 It doesn't matter how good the letter is. 144 00:11:25,544.14032766 --> 00:11:26,584.14032766 It's not what they're interested in. 145 00:11:26,584.14032766 --> 00:11:30,144.14032766 So just find out and then you know, take it from there. 146 00:11:30,744.14032766 --> 00:11:31,144.14032766 Yeah. 147 00:11:31,594.14032766 --> 00:11:33,294.13932766 So tell me about the fundraising system. 148 00:11:33,294.14032766 --> 00:11:39,334.14032766 What is it? So the fundraising system is really about the very things that we're talking about. 149 00:11:39,344.14032766 --> 00:12:04,614.14032766 What I have felt for a long time is that so many well meaning organizations Are doing good work, but they hire fundraisers who are well intentioned, but don't really have the experience to know how to organize their time, organize their processes, create a strategy that's going to be effective. 150 00:12:05,4.14032766 --> 00:12:07,994.14032766 And so they just spend a lot of time spinning their wheels. 151 00:12:08,324.14032766 --> 00:12:12,144.14032766 So, you know, you're a small to medium sized organization. 152 00:12:12,504.14032766 --> 00:12:17,204.14032766 You can't afford to hire someone who has 20 years of experience and fundraising. 153 00:12:17,544.14032766 --> 00:12:23,834.14032766 You know, it may or, you know, your setup just doesn't make sense for someone with that level of expertise. 154 00:12:23,864.14032766 --> 00:12:28,124.14032766 They may be more interested in a larger organization that can pay them a higher salary. 155 00:12:28,469.14032766 --> 00:12:59,839.14032766 So you hire some smart, young person young or not young, someone making a, a, a change in their career, it, it could be any number of things, the person maybe doesn't really exactly know what they should do when they are desperate for someone to help guide them, someone to answer those kinds of questions, you know, how do I decide what foundations to pursue, am I really supposed to have lunch with these donors, you know, do I just answer Ask them all, call people up randomly and ask them for a million dollars each and hope they'll give us, you know, 1, 000. 156 00:12:59,899.14032766 --> 00:13:12,969.14032766 Like, what am I supposed to do? And I think that by providing people with a systematic approach to fundraising and saying to people, okay, let's take a look at what are your assets. 157 00:13:13,354.14032766 --> 00:13:27,14.13932766 What do you have to offer? What are the opportunities really available to you? And how can you approach that in a strategic and systematic way that I can help those kinds of organizations to be much more effective? They don't have to hire me to be full time and pay me benefits. 158 00:13:27,14.14032766 --> 00:13:53,129.13932766 They can hire me for a few hours a week or they can hire me for You know more than that, but just for a couple of months or something whatever makes sense for them So that I can get their fundraising staff and their other staff prepared and capable of doing a good job without having to feel frustrated and at a loss and they don't have anyone to turn to. 159 00:13:53,129.14032766 --> 00:14:17,269.14032766 I think, you know, a lot of organizations, the executive director themselves doesn't really know how to supervise their Development staff and they just probably wish I would just wish I had someone who really knew what they were doing just to help supervise the staff because, you know, they're, you know, they may be really smart and, you know, Ernest and working hard, but they just don't know where to place their energy. 160 00:14:17,279.14032766 --> 00:14:18,959.14032766 So that's the role that I want to play. 161 00:14:18,959.14032766 --> 00:14:22,169.13932766 So I come come in with, you know, my background. 162 00:14:22,169.14032766 --> 00:14:23,379.14032766 I come up with my expertise. 163 00:14:23,699.14032766 --> 00:14:30,629.14132766 I have support staff that can also help to do a lot of the work if the organization doesn't have the resources to do that work. 164 00:14:31,89.14032766 --> 00:14:37,869.14032766 But more than anything I can guide that person and I can provide them actually with templates and systems. 165 00:14:37,869.14032766 --> 00:15:09,494.14032766 So, for example, a lot of organizations just don't have a systematic way of saying, okay, what, how many, how much money are we expecting to raise every year for this coming year from foundations and how much from corporations and how much from major gifts and how much from annual giving and how much from our event and how are we doing in terms of each of those things? And if it's all just sort of in your head and on note, in notebooks and on 17 different spreadsheets it feels chaotic and it makes your whole life feel anxious. 166 00:15:09,894.13932766 --> 00:15:17,54.14032766 And so there's a projection spreadsheet that's very simple that I can show people how to use and even help them to fill it in. 167 00:15:17,94.14032766 --> 00:15:27,124.14032766 And that way they can track on a week to week basis, how are we doing? It seems very simple, but A lot of people just don't have that, that very simple system in place. 168 00:15:27,534.14032766 --> 00:15:29,994.14032766 So I can help them to establish that. 169 00:15:30,864.14032766 --> 00:15:32,644.14032766 Yeah, I've learned the same thing. 170 00:15:32,654.14032766 --> 00:15:56,374.14032766 Like, you know, I think that fundraising, because many of us have been accidental fundraisers, those who do not yet fundraise don't know that there are very predictable systems that you can put in place that can help you manage your donors and move them through a process of giving, you know, try to move them from their first gift to their second gift. 171 00:15:56,374.14032766 --> 00:16:08,314.13932766 And then ultimately to ongoing giving, you know, that we can you know, farm our own data and find donors that can give more or people who are aligned in that alignment. 172 00:16:09,164.13932766 --> 00:16:11,104.13932766 It's, it's the first place I start. 173 00:16:11,134.13932766 --> 00:16:24,234.13932766 I was actually just speaking with someone today and they said that they just did their first giving camp, their first giving Tuesday campaign, you know, which is their first fundraiser ever because they just became a 501 c three. 174 00:16:24,644.13932766 --> 00:16:31,924.14032766 And She, she, we said, I was surprised cause I told her to never say no for your donor. 175 00:16:31,924.14032766 --> 00:16:32,264.14032766 Right. 176 00:16:32,294.14032766 --> 00:16:50,424.1403277 And she said, I was surprised cause it was all members who gave, you know, and you don't, we oftentimes are hesitant maybe to ask the people that have utilized our services to give, but you know, that's such an important part of that. 177 00:16:51,59.1403277 --> 00:16:58,329.1403277 Of that system that even even if they've utilized our service, we ask them to to join us in our work. 178 00:16:59,479.1403277 --> 00:16:59,719.1403277 Yeah. 179 00:16:59,719.1403277 --> 00:17:17,189.1393277 And so much of it really is about feeling good about what you're raising money for, you know, you're not, you know, there's so many different aspects, obviously, to fundraising, but you know, part of it is, is realizing, I just want to be very honest with people about what we are trying to accomplish. 180 00:17:17,569.1393277 --> 00:17:22,89.1393277 And how much money it's going to take and how their, their support can help us get there. 181 00:17:22,89.1393277 --> 00:17:27,519.1383277 It's not about me wanting money for myself for some, you know, selfish reason. 182 00:17:28,139.1393277 --> 00:17:29,839.1393277 It's all very transparent. 183 00:17:29,849.1393277 --> 00:17:32,169.1383277 We, you know, we're trying to accomplish X. 184 00:17:32,169.1393277 --> 00:17:33,259.1383277 It's going to take this much money. 185 00:17:33,259.1393277 --> 00:17:34,879.1383277 This is how much we already have. 186 00:17:35,324.1393277 --> 00:17:39,674.1393277 If you can contribute any part of that, it will help us to accomplish our goal. 187 00:17:39,674.1393277 --> 00:17:43,164.1393277 And if people are interested and want to do that, then they will do it. 188 00:17:43,274.1393277 --> 00:17:45,44.1393277 And if they're not, then they can say no. 189 00:17:45,134.1393277 --> 00:17:46,434.1393277 And that's absolutely fine. 190 00:17:46,434.1393277 --> 00:17:51,124.1383277 It's absolutely up to them, but there's nothing wrong with asking them because what you're doing is worthwhile. 191 00:17:51,124.1383277 --> 00:17:54,354.1393277 If what you're doing is not worthwhile, you shouldn't be asking people for money. 192 00:17:54,394.1393277 --> 00:18:00,594.1393277 But, you know, assuming you're asking people for a worthwhile project, there's absolutely nothing wrong with asking people to support it. 193 00:18:00,634.1393277 --> 00:18:02,814.1393277 And the people who know you best. 194 00:18:03,294.1393277 --> 00:18:05,584.1393277 Are the people who are most likely to support you. 195 00:18:05,584.1393277 --> 00:18:07,794.1393277 I mean, that's a it's a such a simple concept. 196 00:18:08,374.1393277 --> 00:18:13,144.1393277 And yet so many new fundraisers don't really understand it. 197 00:18:13,154.1393277 --> 00:18:28,694.1393277 They sort of imagine that there's some world of rich people out there who, you know, have lots of money and could give support rather than saying, well, you know, we really need to start with those people who know us and care about us. 198 00:18:29,144.1393277 --> 00:18:31,564.1393277 Those are the people who are most likely to support us. 199 00:18:31,564.1393277 --> 00:18:37,19.1393277 And if We think there's someone who would care about us if they knew us, then we'd better get to know them. 200 00:18:37,79.1393277 --> 00:18:43,379.1393277 But going from you know, I don't know this person at all and ask them for a big gift almost never works. 201 00:18:43,379.1393277 --> 00:18:53,649.1393277 I mean, there are some exceptions, but it's rare and You know, that's the sort of thing people can waste a lot of time on just chasing after all sorts of things that don't make any sense. 202 00:18:53,709.1393277 --> 00:19:11,119.1383277 I sometimes tell people it's like, you know, if you're single and you wanted to, you know, find someone to date you know, the thing that makes most sense is to You know, think about the people, you know, who can make an introduction to someone that, you know, they think you might be interested in. 203 00:19:11,129.1383277 --> 00:19:12,639.1383277 There's, you know, online dating. 204 00:19:12,639.1383277 --> 00:19:21,199.1383277 You see where there might be a connection, you know, picking up a fashion magazine and saying, well, here's the, you know, a lot of really beautiful people. 205 00:19:21,199.1383277 --> 00:19:22,749.1383277 I'd like to date one of these people. 206 00:19:23,59.1383277 --> 00:19:25,969.1383277 You know, is not that likely to be successful because. 207 00:19:26,299.1383277 --> 00:19:31,409.1383277 Those people, you don't know those people and you have no way of knowing if you have anything in common with them. 208 00:19:31,409.1383277 --> 00:19:34,9.1383277 And it's very hard to get access to them. 209 00:19:34,19.1383277 --> 00:19:35,379.1383277 So, but that's, you know, that's. 210 00:19:35,379.1383277 --> 00:19:42,169.1383277 And so it seems ridiculous, but that's exactly the way a lot of new people in fundraising approach fundraising. 211 00:19:42,179.1383277 --> 00:19:43,839.1373277 Let's get a list of the Forbes. 212 00:19:44,309.1383277 --> 00:19:57,519.1373277 List of the richest people and let's write them each a really good letter and maybe if we write them a really compelling letter, they'll just be sitting you know, bored and wondering what they should do with their time and read the letter from beginning to end and decide to give us a million dollars. 213 00:19:57,969.1383277 --> 00:20:08,289.1393277 So, you know, just helping people to understand these very fundamental issues and then make a plan is what I'm always trying to do. 214 00:20:08,909.1393277 --> 00:20:09,259.1393277 Yeah. 215 00:20:09,399.1393277 --> 00:20:10,529.1393277 Oh, there's so much of that. 216 00:20:10,739.1393277 --> 00:20:19,629.1393277 I, I remember when I started I do not know how many board members told me board members and coworkers said, well, just write to the Gates foundation. 217 00:20:19,639.1393277 --> 00:20:23,899.1388277 Like that, the Gates foundation was their solution every single time. 218 00:20:23,899.1388277 --> 00:20:26,969.1393277 And I was like, I have written to the Gates foundation. 219 00:20:27,129.1393277 --> 00:20:30,769.1393277 However, I can tell you that this is probably not going to happen. 220 00:20:31,689.1393277 --> 00:20:32,99.1393277 Yeah. 221 00:20:32,664.1393277 --> 00:20:33,144.1393277 No, I know. 222 00:20:33,144.1393277 --> 00:20:44,494.1393277 And it's a funny thing also that, you know, we never, one of the things that's hard about being a fundraiser is you don't want to be the person who says no, just like you, you said earlier, you know, you don't want to say no for your donors. 223 00:20:44,514.1393277 --> 00:20:56,724.1393277 And so we don't want to be seeming like, well, I've given this guy 10 good ideas, right to the Gates Foundation and right to Warren Buffett and right to You know, Oprah Winfrey and, and right to Jeff Bezos. 224 00:20:56,744.1393277 --> 00:21:00,214.1393277 And, you know, I keep giving him ideas and he every time he says no, he doesn't want to do it. 225 00:21:00,724.1393277 --> 00:21:02,954.1388277 So you have to make a decision. 226 00:21:02,954.1388277 --> 00:21:03,264.1383277 Okay. 227 00:21:03,274.1393277 --> 00:21:16,134.1393277 Well, how can I do this as quickly as possible and get it out of the way and satisfy the board member? But at the same time Educate them on what is really much more likely to be effective and show them that I am doing. 228 00:21:16,144.1393277 --> 00:21:17,424.1393277 I have a plan. 229 00:21:17,954.1393277 --> 00:21:25,364.1393277 I, you know, so I think that if you don't have any plan, then you wind up just having to respond to every crazy suggestion like that. 230 00:21:25,374.1393277 --> 00:21:27,614.1383277 And it just wastes more and more of your time. 231 00:21:28,364.1393277 --> 00:21:29,34.1393277 Yes. 232 00:21:29,284.1393277 --> 00:21:29,814.1393277 Yeah. 233 00:21:29,954.1393277 --> 00:21:36,884.1393277 That's one of the frameworks that I teach is, I mean, it's the steps framework and you have to strategize. 234 00:21:36,884.1393277 --> 00:21:38,674.1393277 It's the first, the first one. 235 00:21:38,994.1383277 --> 00:21:41,554.1393277 And we're going to be really intentional about who we engage with. 236 00:21:41,944.1393277 --> 00:21:49,724.1393277 Not because other people won't be interested, but because this is like the steps, right? This is actually the steps to get to where we want to go. 237 00:21:50,124.1393277 --> 00:21:51,394.1393277 And so, yeah. 238 00:21:51,744.1393277 --> 00:21:53,224.1393277 I really appreciate what you said there. 239 00:21:53,544.1393277 --> 00:22:01,254.1393277 For me, I'll tell you something that has been ringing just as a fundraiser, a word that we don't use all the time. 240 00:22:01,304.1393277 --> 00:22:11,904.1393277 I, I think we probably use it more in our sector of the nonprofit world than others, but the word stewardship, you know, fundraising is stewardship. 241 00:22:11,934.1393277 --> 00:22:23,494.1393277 And I learned, I was listening to Chuck Bentley this weekend and he had, he said, redemptive stewardship is when God uses a faithful steward to restore what is broken. 242 00:22:23,544.1383277 --> 00:22:27,184.1393277 And I just thought, man, for her work in the nonprofit work. 243 00:22:27,524.1393277 --> 00:22:40,794.1393277 world, right? So many nonprofits, that's kind of what they do, right? They are able to restore or support something in our communities that is broken. 244 00:22:41,274.1383277 --> 00:22:49,169.1393277 And so when we think about stewardship and inviting people into that, It's so beautiful. 245 00:22:49,169.1393277 --> 00:22:50,429.1393277 Like that's a beautiful picture. 246 00:22:50,429.1393277 --> 00:22:59,9.1393277 Cause I feel like especially when you're newer in this profession, it, it feels like you're just asking for money. 247 00:22:59,474.1393277 --> 00:23:01,234.1393277 When you're new, especially. 248 00:23:01,524.1393277 --> 00:23:01,904.1393277 Right. 249 00:23:01,914.1393277 --> 00:23:12,264.1393277 But I think as you grow in the profession, this idea of stewardship in that we're inviting people in to help us with something broken is a really beautiful picture of that. 250 00:23:12,294.1393277 --> 00:23:16,524.1403277 Like, just something that's been on my mind, you know, stewardship. 251 00:23:18,94.1403277 --> 00:23:20,494.1403277 Yeah, no, I, I absolutely agree. 252 00:23:21,24.1403277 --> 00:23:32,104.1403277 And you know, it's funny also about this issue of fundraising and asking for money because So much of what we do is not asking for money. 253 00:23:32,104.1403277 --> 00:23:36,164.1403277 I mean, the vast majority of our time is not spent asking people for money. 254 00:23:36,524.1403277 --> 00:23:39,824.1393277 It's really about doing exactly what you say. 255 00:23:39,824.1403277 --> 00:23:50,914.1393277 It's about building those relationships and authentically meaningfully bringing people into the community of the organization. 256 00:23:51,404.1393277 --> 00:23:53,994.1393277 And and then when the time is right. 257 00:23:55,419.1393277 --> 00:23:59,509.1393277 To ask for a gift, then you're in a very comfortable place to ask for a gift. 258 00:23:59,529.1393277 --> 00:24:09,589.1393277 But if you're just doing nothing but going out and asking random people for gifts all the time, of course, it's a very, very uncomfortable feeling for the fundraiser. 259 00:24:09,599.1393277 --> 00:24:11,969.1393277 It's a very uncomfortable feeling for the donor. 260 00:24:12,189.1393277 --> 00:24:13,599.1383277 It's not going to be effective. 261 00:24:13,599.1393277 --> 00:24:16,279.1393277 I think that's why people are so scared of it. 262 00:24:16,289.1393277 --> 00:24:18,569.1393277 And people who don't understand fundraising. 263 00:24:18,984.1393277 --> 00:24:36,364.1393277 Unfortunately, even some of those same board members who tell you to, you know, right to the Gates Foundation think, well, you know, why are you just asking people for money all the time? What are you doing with all of your time? If you're not asking for money and who are all these other staff people in your department who aren't asking people for money? It just seems like a waste. 264 00:24:36,374.1393277 --> 00:24:53,224.1368277 But you know, it's like, I think if you'll forget the sports analogy, it's like saying to a quarterback, You know, why are you just throwing passes all the time? Well, you know, you have to practice, you have to work out, you have to get sleep, you have to sometimes hand the ball off, you're studying, learning plays. 265 00:24:53,224.1368277 --> 00:25:02,94.1363277 There's a million things that go into it so that when you're actually on the field and a receiver is open and you can throw them a pass, you're prepared to do that. 266 00:25:02,104.1383277 --> 00:25:09,854.1373277 But, you know, in the same way that a quarterback doesn't spend all week throwing passes, a fundraiser doesn't spend all week asking people for money. 267 00:25:10,494.1373277 --> 00:25:13,854.1373277 A lot of other things that you need to be doing as a fundraiser. 268 00:25:13,854.1373277 --> 00:25:16,854.1373277 And that's, I think that's something that people don't understand. 269 00:25:16,864.1373277 --> 00:25:22,714.1378277 And then if they're not asking for money, well, what are they doing? So, that's another thing that I try to help people with. 270 00:25:22,754.1378277 --> 00:25:24,254.1378277 Everything should be intentional. 271 00:25:24,464.1378277 --> 00:25:28,674.1368277 Everything is in the interest of as effectively as possible. 272 00:25:29,364.1378277 --> 00:25:50,674.1378277 Gathering the resources for your organization, but it's but it needs to be done thoughtfully and intentionally and and stewarding those relationships and and making sure that the organization as a whole is engaging those donors as partners and as respectful and appreciative away as possible. 273 00:25:51,99.1378277 --> 00:25:55,729.1378277 Is essential to all of this, and that really needs to be your attitude in fundraising. 274 00:25:55,729.1378277 --> 00:26:01,629.1378277 You know, I've spent a lot of time in the last few months working with the Honolulu Museum of Art. 275 00:26:02,139.1378277 --> 00:26:17,909.1368277 And when you're in Honolulu, which I'd never been to before before this consultancy you know, there's something people call the Aloha spirit, and I thought, you know, the Aloha spirit, this idea of sort of well, welcoming and being welcoming. 276 00:26:18,209.1378277 --> 00:26:28,649.1378277 Open hearted and courteous and transparent and friendly and generous is really in a way what fundraising good fundraising is. 277 00:26:28,689.1368277 --> 00:26:34,709.1378277 The Aloha spirit is really a great way of describing the way I think we all should be approaching fundraising. 278 00:26:35,949.1378277 --> 00:26:36,229.1378277 Yeah. 279 00:26:36,229.1378277 --> 00:26:37,599.1378277 And they do it in Hawaii. 280 00:26:37,709.1378277 --> 00:26:42,109.1378277 I've been to Maui and they do it so well in everything that they do. 281 00:26:42,109.1378277 --> 00:26:55,329.1378277 And I think, you know, I think actually in Japan, you know, when you give gift giving every part of the gift giving process, like, so if you're just, is really intentional and hospitable and out of grace for the other person. 282 00:26:55,329.1378277 --> 00:26:59,379.1378277 And I think the Aloha spirit is similar to that and that, you know, and I love that. 283 00:26:59,389.1378277 --> 00:27:02,599.1378277 That's, that's a great, that's a great recommendation. 284 00:27:03,299.1378277 --> 00:27:12,489.1378277 Well, so can you let our listeners know how they can learn more about you and find you on the web if they would like to? Absolutely. 285 00:27:12,499.1378277 --> 00:27:16,109.1378277 So I have a website, thefundraisingsystem. 286 00:27:16,109.1378277 --> 00:27:16,299.1378277 com. 287 00:27:17,289.1378277 --> 00:27:18,909.1378277 So www. 288 00:27:19,109.1368277 --> 00:27:20,89.1368277 thefundraisingsystem. 289 00:27:20,89.1378277 --> 00:27:20,199.1378277 com. 290 00:27:22,754.1378277 --> 00:27:26,734.1378277 And you can also find me, Matthew Bregman on LinkedIn. 291 00:27:27,234.1378277 --> 00:27:38,804.1368277 Feel free to email me at Matt at the fundraising system dot com anytime or reach out via LinkedIn or, or the form of my email on my website. 292 00:27:38,824.1378277 --> 00:27:55,474.1378277 You know, something you know, and I just always want to tell people is that If you hear this and you think, well, I'd like to reach out and just I have some questions, but I don't know if I want to engage very, very happy if you work for an organization that's doing good work. 293 00:27:56,64.1378277 --> 00:28:05,914.1378277 I'm delighted to talk to you for free and I'm not going to make a sales pitch if it seems like, you know, it would make sense for me to work for your organization. 294 00:28:06,229.1378277 --> 00:28:07,109.1378277 That would be great. 295 00:28:07,399.1378277 --> 00:28:09,529.1378277 If not, that's absolutely fine. 296 00:28:09,539.1378277 --> 00:28:10,569.1378277 Happy to talk to you. 297 00:28:10,589.1378277 --> 00:28:12,479.1378277 Give you my thoughts. 298 00:28:12,729.1378277 --> 00:28:14,769.1368277 And and I know so many other. 299 00:28:15,399.1378277 --> 00:28:20,619.1378277 Consultants have that same feeling and so don't don't be shy about reaching out. 300 00:28:20,799.1378277 --> 00:28:23,289.1378277 To me or to others who might be able to be helpful. 301 00:28:23,699.1368277 --> 00:28:26,339.1368277 If nothing else, you know, I like the sound of my own voice. 302 00:28:26,349.1368277 --> 00:28:31,189.1368277 It's fun pontificating is I always say it's easy to talk about fundraising than to do it. 303 00:28:31,189.1368277 --> 00:28:32,819.1358277 So I'm always happy to talk about it. 304 00:28:33,109.1358277 --> 00:28:35,119.1358277 So people should feel free to reach out anytime. 305 00:28:36,569.1368277 --> 00:28:36,809.1368277 I love that. 306 00:28:36,809.1368277 --> 00:28:44,229.1368277 Yeah, I think, you know, sometimes Transcribed For many, I know as a consultant, I'm coming out of the nonprofit world. 307 00:28:44,679.1368277 --> 00:28:46,319.1368277 I have a nonprofit spirit. 308 00:28:46,419.1368277 --> 00:28:48,809.1368277 It sounds like, you know, you have a nonprofit spirit. 309 00:28:48,999.1368277 --> 00:28:54,299.1368277 Many of us in fundraising have this nonprofit spirit that we, we also just want to serve. 310 00:28:54,319.1358277 --> 00:28:56,349.1368277 And that was our goal. 311 00:28:56,359.1358277 --> 00:28:57,689.1358277 And so like, yeah. 312 00:28:57,759.1358277 --> 00:29:05,529.1368277 So I love that you invited everyone into that because I definitely invite people into and a final piece of advice that you think everyone. 313 00:29:06,64.1368277 --> 00:29:08,514.1368277 Needs to hear before we exit. 314 00:29:09,754.1368277 --> 00:29:21,929.1368277 Okay, a final piece of advice Would be always try to maintain a, a generous attitude. 315 00:29:22,489.1368277 --> 00:29:30,409.1368277 In terms of fundraising, so in the same way that I said, I'm happy to talk to people about fundraising. 316 00:29:30,479.1368277 --> 00:29:39,79.1358277 I think you should always be happy to talk to people about your organization, whether they're interested in giving you support or not. 317 00:29:39,119.1358277 --> 00:29:43,199.1368277 And, you know, it's air on the side. 318 00:29:43,719.1368277 --> 00:29:46,809.1368277 of being overly generous with people. 319 00:29:46,809.1368277 --> 00:29:53,419.1368277 If someone says, well, you know, I can't give right now, but maybe I'll give later, you know, don't treat everything. 320 00:29:53,529.1368277 --> 00:29:58,759.1368277 Don't treat it like a transaction, treat everything like a real authentic relationship. 321 00:29:58,859.1358277 --> 00:29:59,389.1358277 And. 322 00:30:00,114.1368277 --> 00:30:08,454.1368277 It's fine if you get burned sometimes and someone says, Oh, if I could, you know, come to your event for free, maybe I would give and they don't give. 323 00:30:09,204.1368277 --> 00:30:09,874.1368277 That's fine. 324 00:30:09,874.1368277 --> 00:30:11,654.1358277 That's not going to happen very often. 325 00:30:11,654.1358277 --> 00:30:22,199.1368277 Much more likely people will just to, you know, who are well meaning will appreciate the fact that you are open minded and generous and Sincere. 326 00:30:22,239.1368277 --> 00:30:30,19.1368277 So, you know, don't feel like you need to be hot throat and transactional and on your guard. 327 00:30:31,454.1368277 --> 00:30:34,794.1368277 Be trusting and open, open minded and open hearted. 328 00:30:34,794.1368277 --> 00:30:37,744.1368277 And I think good things will come from that. 329 00:30:38,614.1368277 --> 00:30:39,44.1368277 Yeah. 330 00:30:39,234.1368277 --> 00:30:43,194.1368277 Where, where the energy flows is where the money goes, actually. 331 00:30:44,284.1368277 --> 00:30:46,584.1368277 Yeah, I always say, so I have stickers. 332 00:30:46,764.1358277 --> 00:30:54,24.1368277 I don't know how many times I've mentioned them on the podcast, because we definitely all seem to have similar philosophies, but mine says not a shark tank. 333 00:30:54,34.1368277 --> 00:30:54,884.1368277 It's a coral reef. 334 00:30:55,54.1368277 --> 00:30:55,444.1368277 Right. 335 00:30:55,474.1368277 --> 00:30:57,424.1368277 And so, absolutely. 336 00:30:57,594.1368277 --> 00:30:57,924.1368277 Right. 337 00:30:58,44.1368277 --> 00:30:58,324.1368277 Yeah. 338 00:30:58,454.1368277 --> 00:30:58,724.1368277 That's great. 339 00:30:58,744.1368277 --> 00:31:02,44.1368277 So, well, thank you so much for joining us and to our listeners. 340 00:31:02,44.1368277 --> 00:31:03,544.1358277 I thank you for joining us this week. 341 00:31:03,824.1358277 --> 00:31:06,604.1358277 I look forward to having another conversation next week. 342 00:31:06,644.1368277 --> 00:31:11,724.1358277 And if you need to reach out to either myself or Matt, we're both happy to talk to you. 343 00:31:12,104.1358277 --> 00:31:12,844.1358277 Have a great week. 344 00:31:13,386.1368277 --> 00:31:16,786.1368277 Thank you so much for tuning in to this episode of Nonprofit 411. 345 00:31:17,186.1368277 --> 00:31:20,756.1368277 I hope you found today's conversation as insightful and inspiring as I did. 346 00:31:21,346.1368277 --> 00:31:24,716.1358277 Remember, building a healthy nonprofit requires a holistic approach. 347 00:31:25,26.1368277 --> 00:31:31,896.1368277 There are many resources available to support your staff, and we're dedicated to helping your organization access what it needs to thrive. 348 00:31:32,636.1358277 --> 00:31:36,203.3005062 One key to creating a thriving organization is a diverse fundraising strategy. 349 00:31:36,203.3005062 --> 00:31:41,206.0368277 While grants are an important part of that strategy, they're just one piece of the overall puzzle. 350 00:31:42,96.1368277 --> 00:31:47,516.1368277 If you're looking to strengthen your grant writing skills as part of this bigger picture, I've got a resource to help you get started. 351 00:31:48,66.1368277 --> 00:31:56,366.1368277 Download my free grant writing guide packed with practical tips and best practices to help you craft proposals that align with your overall fundraising goals. 352 00:31:56,846.1368277 --> 00:31:58,326.1368277 You'll find the link in the show notes. 353 00:31:58,616.1358277 --> 00:32:04,796.1368277 And as always, if you enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with your fellow change makers. 354 00:32:05,386.1368277 --> 00:32:07,986.1368277 Let's work together to build a vibrant nonprofit community. 355 00:32:08,306.1368277 --> 00:32:11,316.1368277 Until next time, keep pushing forward and making a difference. 356 00:32:12,515.3205011 --> 00:32:16,905.3205011 Feeling the pressure of meeting your nonprofit's fundraising goals? You're not alone. 357 00:32:17,425.3205011 --> 00:32:22,515.3195011 Many nonprofits struggle with limited resources, donor fatigue, and a lack of clear strategy. 358 00:32:23,295.3205011 --> 00:32:27,615.3205011 Nonprofit 411 offers personalized coaching to address these challenges head on. 359 00:32:28,145.3195011 --> 00:32:29,905.3205011 Together, we'll tackle your biggest obstacle. 360 00:32:31,350.3205011 --> 00:32:35,100.3205011 Boost your donor relationships and build momentum toward your mission. 361 00:32:35,650.3205011 --> 00:32:37,750.3205011 Don't let obstacles slow you down. 362 00:32:37,910.3205011 --> 00:32:41,120.3205011 Start your coaching journey today at Nonprofit411. 363 00:32:41,450.3195011 --> 00:32:41,820.3195011 org.