August 27, 2024 • 69 mins
In this episode, Ryan sits down with AQHA President Jim Hunt. The discussion that follows covers issues and improvements at AQHA, Jim’s vision of the future, some bloodline and pedigree talk, and an overall fun and interesting conversation between two long time horsemen.
If you would like to hire me for an equine event, I would love to hear from you.
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Produced by Ryan Fleetwood and Starset Media
Filming, recording, and editing is by Rodrigo Henriquez, Shannon Milligan, and Jared Middlebrook at Starset Media. services@starsetmedia.ca
Special thanks to my family for supporting me and Jim Hunt for the interview, and Kildare's Ale House in Calgary for the venue.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:19):
Good day.
Folks, you are listening to the QuarterHorse Hauler with Ryan Fleetwood.
And today I have the privilege
of doing an interviewwith the current acting president, Mr.
Jim Hunt.
Mr. Jim, thank you for being with us.
Well, Ryan, it is a privilege to be here.
And, of course, we're meeting in Calgaryhere at the Stampede,
(00:40):
and that makes it extra fun to be around,you know, here in Calgary.
I haven't been back since the 1980s,when I used to rodeo a little bit.
And and so to join youand the other, horse enthusiasts
here, it's been really fun.
Yeah.
That's great.
And you've got to take in
some of the Calgary Stampede events,and we have, Yeah.
(01:01):
So it's been great.
Got my wifeJoni is with me and and of course, our
our time here is, just been,just a lot of fun last three days.
Yeah. That's great.
And we're filming here on site at,Kildare's Ale House
in South Calgary and want to thank themfor the ability to be here.
So, Jim, tell us a little bit about,
(01:21):
you and your life,what brought you to the point
of joining the SC,the executive committee at AHQA?
AJ well, thanks.
Let's start with a little bit of history.
So I am a QuarterHorse breeder, American Quarter
Horse breeder, and and my children,we have seven children.
And we continue to follow a tradition
(01:43):
of breeding the greatest equineathlete in the world as we think.
And, they're the sixth generation.
And so, my grandfather was, Spanish.
His name was Alberto Francisco Lopez.
And he came to South Dakota in the 20s
from Colorado, New Mexico area.
(02:05):
And he was employed by the diamond de
Cattle Company back in the 20s.
And, they unleashed some ground in the,in South Dakota,
part of the Indian reservation is showingIndian reservation.
And, came up thereand they brought with them
a remote of horses from the South.
(02:25):
A lot of them from Peter McHugh line.
Joe Moore line.you know, some of those old,
Foundation Quarter Horse lines and then,
he stayed there.
And when the Diamond Cattle Companyfolded in the 40s, they're removed.
And their horses,their broodmare band, stayed there
(02:47):
because they had, the
didn't feel the needto take them back to New Mexico.
So they basically became somewhat wild and
and so my grandfather knew that there wasthese good genetics that was there.
And so then in the 40s, he,
(03:09):
began to gather those wild horsesand, and comb
through and pickthe best mares out of that.
Those herds.
And then, when AQHA of course, they were.
AQHA was formed in 1940.
So in the mid 40s, then my grandfather
got some of the inspectors from AQHA
(03:30):
to come up right, and inspect those mares.
And the ones that were approved,got registration,
got registered registration certificates.
fun part of the story for thosethat are rodeo historians or enthusiasts,
the young man that he took underhis wing to be his partner was Casey Tibbs.
And Casey was just a young boyat that time.
(03:53):
And so Casey up, my grandfather
gather and brake and drainsome of those wild horses.
And then, remained
one of his partners in the horse businessfor many years to follow.
So we have a funny history.
And then, of course, I am part of Lakota,
being raised on the Cheyenne IndianReservation.
And, yeah.
(04:13):
Well, kind of a fun tidbit there.
My great great grandfather,
his name was Frederick Dupree.
He was French from Canada and great guy.
And he came down, into the Dakotas
and was a fur trader, buffalo hunter, and,
(04:34):
fell in love with a full blooded Indianwoman by the name of Mary.
Good Elks. Woman.
And, married her.
She had one child when they married.
She lost her first husband in, in a war.
And, Anyhow, Frederick Dupree marriedvery good
woman and had seven more children,and 1 in 1 of them
being FredDupré junior, my great grandfather.
(04:58):
But what's interesting about thatstory, Orion, is that
in the 1860s,
1870s, there was a big storm
called the Great White Storm.
It was a huge, massive snow stormthat went through the Montana, Wyoming,
the Dakotas, basically wiped out
(05:19):
almost to extinction, the cattle herd.
the buffalo herd,
and, horse herds and so forth.
Well,
history books showthat there was about 600 cattle left
in all those five states,and not many horses left.
(05:40):
And, after the
fur traders came inand basically hunted out the
the mature buffalo, there was fiveorphaned buffalo calves left
total.
And they were up on the NorthDakota South Dakota border.
And Frederick Dupree, my great great
(06:01):
grandfather and my and Mary, good woman,took a team and wagon
and went up and capturedthose five orphaned buffalo calves,
took them back to the Cheyenne Riverreservation,
and grew the buffaloback into existence. Her
and so with the buffalo and the livestock.
(06:23):
And then that's my Lakotaside of the heritage.
And so I just feel so blessedwith not only,
that poor part of history,but then in the horse,
the horse side of things, I've never known
not knowing anything but good Quarterhorses, the history behind them.
And so, years later,
(06:46):
when, you know, my family,my grandfather, also Lopez
also had one of the first QuarterHorse sales in South Dakota.
And Casey Tibbs was his partner.
And we still have that sale bill.
And, you know, from that,
way of life,
I didn't have much choice
(07:08):
but to remain in the Quarter Horsebusiness and breeding good quarter horses.
And as a young boy, we would go to HankWise Camps in Colorado.
We would go to Texas, to the Wagner Ranch.
We would go, you know, to the King Ranch.
We would go looking for better outcrosses,
looking for horses to make our herdsbetter, make better genetics.
(07:31):
And, and then up here,you know, about ten years ago,
I was approached by,
at that time was the,the executive vice president and the
and the president of evacuee J1, JohnnieTrotter and Don Treadway, and asked,
if they thought that I might be interested
(07:53):
in being a part of the governor's raceof the American Courthouse Association.
And because of my historyand because of my family's
involvement with the Quarter Horse,
I finally was led to,
you know, think, well,maybe I could have something to offer.
And so, Ryan Q who is theyhad gone through a trend of time
(08:16):
where memberships were on the decline,
registrations were on the decline
in terms, transfers were on the declineand so on, so forth.
And, a lot of that, you know, good horses
and breeding wasn't on the decline because
there was so many other affiliatesor other entities.
(08:39):
You know, this quarter horseindustry has become so specialized.
There's the NCAA and the NBA
and there's the reigning cow associationand there's the racehorse deal.
And you know the rodeo wore onand on and on and on.
And so they had found
themselves is frommy observation had found themselves
(09:02):
somewhat in a corner in that really the
the main ones that were interested inHHR was the show horse world.
And so but
here we had all of these ranch breeders,
Canada, United States, even Mexico
and other international countries,but especially in the United States.
(09:23):
We had all these ranch breeders of hadthese quality quarter horses,
but the AQHA had kind of lost their identity
in being involved with those breedersor the real importance.
And let us remember thatthe American Course Association, founded
(09:44):
in the pass in El Paso, Texas, in 1940,
was founded on the ranch breeders efforts.
They were founded on those goodold foundation horses, the Joe Reids.
And of course, that was waybefore three vars, the Joe Reid's,
the Joe Moores, the Peter McHugh's,you know, those horses.
(10:04):
And then later,
three bars.
A thoroughbred came inand was proved to be maybe the greatest
thing that ever happened is an out crossback on these foundation horses.
But in 1940, in El Paso.
And so then the AJSpurpose was a breed registry
to help
(10:25):
enthusiaststhat wanted to make better horses
identify by by pedigree, by genetics.
And it grew and it grew and it grew
and it into the 60s and into the 70s.
And then in the 80s,
it it didn't keep up
(10:46):
with what it neededto offer to the members.
That's, that's that's my observation.
And still had a purpose.
But it, it didn't stay current with
needs changed for breeders.
And, they weren't,
didn't keep up with recognizingthe breeders in their efforts
(11:08):
as, as as efficient as they needed to.
And so they lost a lot of momentum.
And so, of course,then we get in, you know, to the,
late 90s and into the 2000sand in the 21st century and
and so here we arein some of the, in the, the governance.
(11:31):
Found that they needed
to step up and reach out and regain
the valuethat integrity back with the breeders
and so that's, about that time is
when I was confronted and askedif I would consider
getting involved to take aand that maybe I could,
(11:51):
being a ranch breeder,being raised by a ranch breeder,
coming from a ranch breeders familyand understanding
their thoughts and their needs, thenmaybe I could have something to offer.
So I became a director of AQR
and in 2012, and then
(12:12):
served as, we developed
a ranching committee, ranching council,trying to address the needs
now, again, of our ranch breeders
and addressing those,
incentives that we needed to reach outand better recognize their efforts
and those theirtheir breeding programs of good horses
(12:34):
and, getting involvedand reaching out to the other affiliates
that so many of those samegenetics were needed
and used in the cutting horseindustry, the road horse industry, the,
you know, the barrel horsesto their great cross of not just race
and run, but they got a lot of cowhorse breeding in to a great combination.
(12:54):
Yeah. So specialized.
Anyhow,I then I after I was a director for,
about four, about five years,
I was, sought outby some of the past presidents
to considergoing on the executive committee.
And after much thought and,
(13:17):
here I am.
And so, this is my fifth year, andand the way that works
is, is, it's a five year commitmenton the executive committee.
And each year you're elevated, if you're,
voted back on each yearby the past presidents
and the general, but, the,the general membership at each convention.
(13:38):
And so, they, have thought
enough of that, that I've had enoughto offer that they've kept me on.
And so I, I have the privilegeand I say privilege
of serving as the president of this year,you know.
Yeah.
Well, I can't tell you how much that weCanadians appreciate you coming up here.
(13:58):
And I know you have a super busytravel schedule
with all the places that you're goingand all the people that you're seeing.
And in this final yearon ABC, as the president,
can you give us, some of the thingsthat you would like to see move forward
that you will seeas legacy things that you've done at AK?
(14:21):
Oh, yes.
Well, one of the thingsabout the executive committee that I,
you know, that I learned the first fouryears, you know, the executive committee,
they the
those four members can make motions and,and vote.
And the president only gets to,
(14:42):
have a voice if it's a tiebreaker, vote on issues, whatever.
And and we have nothad that issue at all this year thus far.
Very unified the executive committee.
But, you know, one of the things that,
I came in on the executive committeeand we'll go out as president
and that my objective is to solidify
(15:06):
the efforts of reengagingmany of those breeders, ranch
breeders, membersthat have become disengaged.
How do we have we done that?
We we began the ranching heritage program.
We've.
Yeah,increased the importance of the remote
(15:26):
award, the highest award and AQR j
awards at once a year.
we better improvethe recognition of horses
in high school rodeo and college rodeo.
The professional rodeo.
we're working on some thingswe hope with the Calgary Stampede
and recognizing horses,the American Quarter Horses here in Ryan.
(15:50):
You and I have talked about this before,and I.
And I again, want to make this statement
not being braggadocious or sarcastic,but just being realistic.
And that is if it was notfor the American Quarter Horse
and that horse being involvedin our Western culture
and our way of life, we wouldn'tbe wearing cowboy hats or boots.
(16:14):
We wouldn't have a rodeo.
We wouldn't have the CalgaryStampede to the level that we have it.
Because that horse that is the nucleus,that is what we focus around
in our Western way of life.
The one commonality.
The one commonality. Of us.
And wouldn't it look different if theAmerican Quarter Horse didn't exist?
Oh yeah.
(16:36):
Again, you know hereyour your your athletes here
are these camerapersonyou know the you know Canada Nolan.
Two for quote from Kenny McClain.
You know way back before himHerman Linder you know all of these,
iconic
Canadian cowboys again, you think werethey wouldn't
(16:56):
be part of the history booksif it wasn't for that horse.
The horse.
The Quarter Horse and and,you're here, right?
We would not have the National FinalsRodeo.
I mean, the these horses,
you know, we see interviews all the time
and very passionate that
(17:17):
if it wasn't for my horse, I would go upand down the road making a living.
If it wasn't for my hours,I wouldn't be the calf roper or the,
that team roper that I am today.
And on. And on.
And the stories that people get into,if it wasn't for my horse or
my horses, I wouldn't have met this personand this person and this person.
And and it isn't always just aboutthe horses that we see in the spotlight
(17:39):
that are the competitive horses thathave won this or won all of these titles.
It's also about the horses that each of ushold in our hearts as family members.
Yes. Who have introduced usto other people or carried our parents
or grandparents or childrenat certain times or for years and years.
(18:00):
Those horsesand those stories are so important to.
They're a part of our daily lives.
And my wife and I,that is another prime example,
of that scenario.
Right.
And that is, is thatshe was not a rodeo gal.
She was not she was a ranch girl.
And they had a set of brood maresthat they used on the ranch.
(18:21):
And every morning she wasit was out, you know,
saddleand our old saddle was going to get the,
the milk cow and or the Gaussian or,you know, just just ranch or just it
her true enjoyment is just getting out
and riding and seeing the country and and,just on the ranch, you know,
(18:42):
I looked at going through the cows
and checking themor checking the fence or whatever.
And our first common bond was the horse.
When she found out that I,
that my family raised quarter horsesand I found out that her family
raised quarter horses,that was our first common bond.
(19:03):
And so we've been married37 going on 38 years.
And and that's still our enjoymenttogether is our horses.
Yeah. It's great. Yeah.
And you have some kids who enjoy horses.
Still seven children.
And, they're all grown pretty much now,but all very involved.
Yeah.
And in our production sale that we haveevery fall and involved, they,
(19:24):
they participated in for a yearin high school rodeo
and some of them in college rodeoand so forth.
But, yeah,none of them, you know, further than that.
Now they're at home on the ranch andused to horse at the ranch in the horses.
Their best friend and. Yeah.
And, yeah, it just kind of all ensued.
(19:44):
Mom and dad. So, yeah.
I there's so many of us in the horsebusiness that,
I think if we were to take horses away,our identity would completely change.
I know mine would.
I wouldn't be anywhere near the same man
that I amif I if it wasn't for horses. Yes.
(20:04):
Absolutely true.
For myself, I wouldn't be Jim Hunt at the
in the American Quarter Horse headquartersif, if I'm knowing that.
Well he's the guythat has a really good set of quarter
horse mares and some good studsand so forth, and I take pride in that.
I mean, I, you know,you don't seek those things.
(20:26):
That's just the measuring stickthe people know you by.
Yes, sir.
Or I go back home to South Dakota,and I'm a director
at the Black HillsStock Show and and other events.
And the why?
Because of my association with the horseand the horse community.
And that those are the credentialsthat we have
because of the horse,because of our passion for the horse,
(20:50):
and because what the horse means to us,what he's done for.
Us, for each of us. Yeah, indeed.
I want to shift the focusa little bit, Jim, and talk about,
one of the questions that I have for youis that we've talked a little bit
about how the corner horses bred todayand the discipline specific breeding
(21:10):
and the disciplinespecific uses for our horses.
And there's not nearly as much focusput on the old versatility
of the Quarter Horse
inside of the association. Now,
I've thought for a long timethat there's only one commonality
that we all have underthe umbrella of the AK,
(21:33):
and that is the necessity to get
a registration paperfrom that association.
Would you say there'sany other commonalities to everyone
across the business
in in the acreage here, there.
Oh, yes.
There'sI think other commonalities and, and and
(21:56):
and that is,
the commonality whether it be.
Yeah, hanging on to the old foundation
lines or whatever the commonality is,
I want to make a better one,
whatever it takes to make a better one.
(22:17):
And, Ryan,we have seen through the history
that that, some people
have put all their efforts in going back
and trying to find isis close to the old genetics.
Is they good?
And thought, you know,
I want to go back and
(22:38):
get what they used to have becausethat was the greatest in their mind.
Yeah.
Well I've seen people that have steppedoutside of the box and they come back
and they want to, crosswith some thoroughbreds
or some other breeds and say,hey, J, would you ever consider
letting me register as an outcross some of these?
(23:00):
usually it hasn't happened.
You know,three bars, was one of the great out
crosses at acreagecourses, AKG Hall of Fame.
What he's done for the horsein that industry in the
the beginning of the Quarter Horse wasit was not its own individual breed.
It was a corporate horse.
It was, compilation of different breeds.
(23:23):
Yeah. And so but to keep it pure,
you know, they've made it
right to keep the breeding,the pedigree pure.
They have been more very strictabout what they allow to come in.
Is, is, is an out for usand what they would allow to be registered
(23:46):
in the association because they didn'twant to let it get out of control.
But the commonality is
in any of those avenuesis the desire to make a better one.
We're all competitive.
one of the we one of our neighborsgot another horse across the fence.
(24:06):
We want ourslook better. Yeah. So we're competitive.
So we're going to bring.
Or if you're barrel raceror if you're, you know, especially in that
or a grandpa of a barrel racer,you want that girl to be first
and well, you're going to, you know,you want the best one out there.
And yeah, the the make a better one,find a better one, breed a better one.
And to look good while she's doing it.
(24:28):
And and look good. Why she's doing it.
That's good.
Yeah.
So, you know,I love to talk about breeding decisions
and how they're madebecause I, I believe that that's,
a major crisis facing the industry today.
So how, Jim, when you were makingyour breeding decisions at home,
what factors come into play for youas to how you decide
(24:52):
which stallion is going with whatset of mayors?
So when when I first started,
got out on my own, I followed,
my father and grandfather,and they spent a lot of time
studying genetic back in the day,and we spent a lot of time
(25:12):
at Hank Weis Campswhen I was a little boy.
And we bought my.
My father had a son,a Leo, and a grandson, a king.
And and,you know, my observation, growing up and
and breaking a lot of those fairly soonand Colts is
two year olds and, you know,
(25:34):
I observed
that there were lions pedigrees,there were genetics.
They were more consistentin others and process that really worked.
For example,
if you go back and if you study the.
Success of performance horses.
(25:57):
And then when I say performanceI'm talking cutting horses,
rope horses, barrel racing horses.
You know, back in the day, even quarter
race horses, short track horses,
you know, Leo, son of Joeread the second by Joe, read D3
that comes out as a as a standnow in that there was a common denominator
(26:18):
that the majority of Leo's daughters,
when they were crossed on the son of three
bars, a horse by the name of sugar barsthat sugar bars
and Leo cross overall the generations of the AKG produced
(26:39):
very predictable genetics.
They were athletic.
They were trainable.
They had good minds, they had good bone.
They had, you know,they were had the quarter horse look.
And even to this day,
whether you're talking about.
So let's think of sugar bars and Leo.
(27:00):
If you look at ColonelFrankel's, you're familiar
with Colonel Franklin, sir,you have stood down as that of a daughter.
Own daughter? Yes, sir.
I had a son of Colonel Freckles.
And, you know, look at thethe track record of Colonel Freckles.
What they've done in the cow works world.
The cutting horse world.
Now, also in the calfand calf roping horses.
(27:22):
In game roping horses.
So much athletic ability and sense.
Common sense.
Cow sense.
Disposition.Colonel freckles, his daddy was
Jules Leo Bars.
Jules Leo bars was an old son.
Sugar bars out of a daughter. Leo.
So then you go to.
(27:43):
Well, you go to Franco's Playboy.
Be a three quarterbrother to Colonel Freckles.
Who was he?
He two was out of
Jules Leo barsand out of a different daughter of Leo.
Right.
Okay, let's go to the barrel racing world.
And there was a Canadian barrel racer.
Ever been named Lindsay Sears?
(28:04):
It was very successful.
And and and world champion barrel of Mars,
world champion barrel racer several times.
And she had a mare by the name of Martha.
That was her nickname.
And she was an own daughter of doctorNick bar.
And there was much successwith the doctor.
Nick bars. Well, what was doctor Nick bar?
(28:27):
He was a son of sugar barsout of the daughter of Leo
then, so that's what.
And then you go to Flint Bar andthat was the sire to doctor Nick bar and.
And Flint Bar was this idea to do,
firewater Flint and to,you know, many Flint bar.
Red arch.
Split bar was the son of sugar barsout of Flint.
(28:50):
The old daughter of Leo, outof which daughter Joanne got those horses
today are still prevailing.
as successful performers.
They them todaywe're talking 50 years later.
Now, let'sgo to some of the good cephalopod nurses.
There's, Joe Beaver or, I mean,
(29:14):
Cody of
world champion calf roper,and he wrote down a,
a mayor of Sid Millersfor a good number of years
and, a mayorthat he called by the name of Pearl
and Pearl.
What was she?
She was an auto bred mare.
She was out of a wonder auto stud.
Auto, was a son of sugar bars
(29:38):
out of a daughter,a Leo, in fact, Otto and Flint bar
were actually full brothers in bloodbecause
Julio was the the mother to old Joe,
and Flint was the mother to to, Flint Bar.
But they were full sisters,so they bred sugar bars to full sisters.
(29:59):
They got Flint Bar and they got Oto.
I share that because
being trying to be a student of genetics,what crosses worked.
Well they did.
Why did they work.
And the other thingLeo was an inbred horse.
He was one of those horsesthat they brand.
Joe Reed paid three back to his sisterand they got Leo.
(30:22):
Well Leo himself
had some severe deficiencies.
He had crooked knees.
He had there was some ham breedingcharacteristics that did come out.
But down the roadhis daughters were some of the best
crosses and brood mares back on the cross,three bars, horse sugar bars
(30:46):
and when they bred three bars to some
Leo daughters, they worked phenomenal.
There was you're out cross breeding
people are still trying now to bring in,you know, other outside genetics.
And that is the one thing, Ryan, that is.
An issuethat we're going to have to deal with.
(31:08):
We have now years later,we have our genetics.
There's such a close,closed pool of genetics
that there has become danger in that.
Well, what do I breed do next?
I don't want to get too close hereor here or here.
and there is where there's probably timeand need to allow
(31:30):
maybe some other thoroughbred linesin which you.
In recent years,
some of the racehorse lineshave been allowed in for some out crosses,
and they've been working
well here and there, and that'sall going to be trial and error.
I was a student of genetics,and so when Johnny and I got married,
we went and found and bought
(31:52):
Two Sons of Sugar bars, two of them
the last breeding sons of sugar bars and
and and built our broodmare band around
Sonny Sugar in time for sugar and
and then we had,
a couple of daughters of Leoand we tried to duplicate
(32:13):
what had already been successfulwithout making too many mistakes.
And so when you were making thosebreeding decisions for your own program,
would you say it's an entirely based
on the genetics of the horses that you'relooking at mating or primarily,
and then what other factors are you usingwhen you make your decisions?
(32:37):
And that's a very good point.
And it is.
No, not at alltotally about just the genetics.
It's about equallythe confirmation of each horse
and and the way that they moveand their athleticism
and their train ability.
Because, you know, I have seven children
(33:00):
and one of them like you're so fulland they're all full siblings.
Yeah. And guaranteed.
And anyhow that they, you know,and not one of them are alike
in statureor in mindset or in, you know, some,
learning comes easier for than others.
Some, are more ambitious than others.
(33:20):
Some, you know, well,our horses are the same way I did. So.
But to get predictable genetics,
my first lesson was past history.
I have who I had call your past breeders.
Bud Warren and and Jerry Wells
and Hank Wise camp and,you know, on or on and on.
(33:43):
They had already been through all of these
practices and failures and successes andand my grandfather and my dad, you know,
I use, you know, a lot of, of,of, of their input as well,
because,
they knew and alreadyI mean, they spent a lifetime,
(34:03):
you know, of, of successes, failures,things work, things that didn't work.
Look, other things that we can add tothat is just
okay, confirmation is important.
And even though you got two sons of sugar,
barns are both totally differentin their conformation,
you know, there's similarities,but they're totally different
(34:24):
at the same time,the same way with their train ability.
Some horses, they come
around quicker and some more times,the horses that take the longest to train.
If they're still trained right,you end up being your better horses.
But you know, in today's world,train ability is so important.
Yeah. The mind.
(34:45):
Yeah, yeah, the mind would would.
Train ability be interchangeablewith the word disposition? Yes.
Okay. Yes. Yeah.
that's what I assumed.
I just wanted to make sure
that you were thinking the same thingas what I was assuming you meant.
And so what would you say, then,if I ask you,
what is the single most important?
(35:05):
What is your first considerationwhen making breeding decisions?
Just one. Conformation.
Conformation leaves into the way they move and they travel.
Conformation a lot of times dictates
if it's if a conformationis correct on a horse,
then the train abilityis going to come easy for them
(35:26):
because they can move, correct?
Sure, there's less frustrationand the less
frustration you have with an animal, then
the better
disposition they're going to have.
Indeed.
And when you're makingthose breeding decisions
are you putting the same type of marewith the stallion
(35:48):
or are you putting a little bitdifferent type of mare with that
stallionin order to try and come to the middle?
Sariah some of both,because for an example, if I'm trying to,
when I had Sunny Sugar,a son of sugar bars,
he was 53 anyway, 1,370 pounds
and he was bigger than whata lot of people liked.
(36:13):
in today's age to ride,
I like to 15 one, 15two and horse know high weathers and
and and a and a longer pencil neckand you know that could get out
and move with the conformation and,
now he didn't that those horses didn'tconform as well
(36:33):
to what's
needed in the cutting pin today, todayand the cutting being you need a horse
that extremely low to the groundand that can get down in order to compete.
That's just that's the way it's evolved.
Yeah.
And so but to cross any sugar back on
some freckles Playboy granddaughterswe had a son of Frank was Playboy too.
(36:56):
So we did and we get it for example.
And they were 14 to 14 three and horsesto get a balance there.
And of course, we were had an order.
So we had customers that said, boy,I would, could you raise me
some really good calf open prospects?
Well, they wanted something about 14,three, 15 hands,
(37:18):
but that could get down on the groundand park it and get back.
And so but that Sonny sugarand the sugar bars line,
they had some speedand then just natural terrain ability. So
when we were trying to raise some calf
for open horses for the kidsor for some customers,
we made the decisionto put those types of mares
(37:40):
with the bigger high weathered stud.
Yeah.
If I wanted to, I needed to replace
improved manners in my broodmare bandand I wanted good minds
and maybe a little heavier bone for,you know, to keep bone in our horses.
I like a number,a number, one size shoe on a horse,
(38:02):
you know, primarilyand in, in our ranch area.
Good foot is very important.
Sure. And so,
you know, then, I might put,
a Poco win.
A we had some poco in old bred studsat one time
and some book well-bred mares and I might,yeah, make sure that they weren't
(38:23):
brothers or sisters,but but but maybe breed them back
to keep a little more of a foundation inin some of those bred mares,
knowing thatthen I would breed those fillies
back to a 15 three and SugarBarns horse, that needed some more size.
So the different objectives marrya different breeding and the.
(38:45):
Yeah.
Where do you
standon adding thoroughbred in at this point,
whether it's in your own herdor in a Quarter Horse in general?
Well, I'm a,I'm a proponent of, of good out crosses.
And, you know, again, the simple fact is,
(39:05):
is that the American QuarterHorse was derived upon
a percentage of thoroughbred blood
in our in our, in our horses.
It goes back to conformation.
If there's an individualthoroughbred horse that came into the.
And I'm not saying that this at this pointcan be done, but down the road, I think
(39:28):
I think the American Car Associationand its directors
and breeders,the people that make it work,
they're going to be forcedto look at some possible out
crossing and allow some thoroughbredsback into the vehicle.
Now, you know,
you can breed a thoroughbred to a QuarterHorse mare and get appendix papers.
(39:48):
And that is what they're saying todaythere.
Well, thereis that the, a chance for out cross.
And then you take that appendixregistered horse and if you get so
many points on it or wins something,then it can get permanent papers.
Yeah.
So there is, a track to send outcrossing that way.
Sure.
But to answer the question,would there ever be room
(40:10):
for a full thoroughbred to come in?
I think so,I don't know when that will be or,
but I think it needs to be raised,and I sure do.
I certainly agree with you.
I know that, years ago,we were entirely focused on the old
foundation horse, and then I got him therewho helped me change my mind
(40:31):
and she was 75% thoroughbredand a daughter of Rugged Lark.
And when we bred her to our cow horsestallions, we got this
the same type of like a cow horse type,but they had a little more height
and a little more length,and they were real clean in the neck
and how they were put together anda great weather and some of those things.
And I thought, you know, maybe I'm missingsomething here.
(40:53):
And I thinkthat there are certainly things
that that thoroughbred bloodcould bring us, would offer us.
Jim, you and I could talk about thisall day long.
Yeah, I'm sure of it. Yeah. Love it.
Great conversation.Thank you for your knowledge.
But I want to turn back a little bitto your role with acreage.
Okay.
What do you see as the biggest hurdles
(41:15):
coming at acreage in the future?
The biggest hurdlesare the ones that we have in addressing.
And there's still hurdles.
And that is Ryan that,
we still have not regained the
I don't want to use
the word respect,but regain the confidence
(41:36):
back in our associationthat that from breeders,
the breedersand of course, we are a breed registry
but the breeders have notbeen, had their needs met
like they should have, you know,and and it's to nobody's fault.
Yeah. It's just the way it's.
It's just the way that it's gone.
(41:57):
Yeah, but those needs of our breedersand especially, you know, our 50 year
breeders,and there's still so many out there and,
and and even 75 yearbreeders, there's still some out there
that are actively breeding,but then you get your 30, 20
and 30 and 40 year breeders.
Many of them still feel that.
What place does AKG,how can they benefit me
(42:20):
all that you know,all I, all I, I register my my foals in
and but how you know,how can they benefit me
and is is is I can come to Calgaryand I was
I talk to the Canadian group,the Quarter Horse, group and
the same message that I
tried to reveal to themand that is, is that
(42:43):
AQ, AJ needs to continue
to do a better job of recognition.
We need to reach back out
and recognize the success of those quarterHorses from those breeders.
Wherever they may be.
Like you and I talked,maybe it's just on the ranch,
(43:03):
the enjoyment of your horse to go outand get your milk
going and or work your cattle or whateverwhatever.
To many, it's it'smaybe the success of them
raising their family,whether it's through forage or,
or youth activitiesor they just get to go to playdates
or whatever, but on a bigger scale
(43:25):
to recognize the successes of the horse.
You know, the, Calgary Stampede,help me with his name.
The pickup man.
Yeah.
Got horse of the year through AQ, AJ but
it was huge a huge honor and award
and that we finally have begun to go
(43:46):
beyond AK and go out.
And to those breedersand where their horses are at
and congratulate them them on the backor whatever
the case may be and say good job, man,that was a good horse.
Yeah.
Your breeding efforts were so worthythere.
Right?
And you know what?Most of them will go home.
(44:06):
So, you know, I think we'll make a couplemore like that, you know, great.
Some morebecause they appreciated me. Yeah.
And so your question about GM,what are your ambitions?
My ambitions are,are to continue to do a better job
of reaching out,meeting the needs of these members
that have been disengagedand new members coming in,
(44:29):
and to better
recognize the Quarter Horsewherever they're being used?
I think that's just wonderful.
And I think that that's a great priority
to set the associationback on the, the path to.
And one of the things that we talked aboutthat we can talk about again, is
(44:49):
not only just recognizing those breeders,
but asking them whythey made the decisions that they made
and what brought themto the point of creation of that horse.
Because breeding, as you well know, Jim,
is a whole lot of science
and a whole lot of art form,but can't really be explained.
(45:10):
Yes, in the way we create these horses.
And I think telling the storyof the people who create the horses
will help movethe future creation of horses
into a more proper direction.
The new that is so well put.
And one of the the other things that,
(45:31):
you know, the acreage has lost
some involvement in is just that,
you know, we used to have, trainersand breeding a buster
Welch's in and, and trainersand he was a breeder as well.
And he had so much advice
and counsel and wisdomto offer to the membership of.
(45:55):
This is why I brought this to this.
This is our should move.
This is how horse needs to move.
If you're cutting a car,this is how a horse needs to move.
If you're working cattle on a.
But there's a differenceand there's reasoning with them.
Guys lived in the saddle, lived on a horsethey know.
And just to add to that,and I hope for the comfort
(46:15):
of your viewing audience or whatever,you know, thank you.
AJ has made some really
huge effortsto reengage some of that knowledge.
For example, two years ago they allowed me
to establish the Ranching Council
and its eight members
(46:36):
that are like elders now
that give advice to give their opinion,their input.
Don't do this, do this.
Your breeders need this.They don't need this and that.
Ranching Council is comprised of removeaward winners, 50 year breeders, or both.
Most of them are both.
(46:57):
That means that they're the real deal.
They born.
Raised on a ranch, bornand raised on a horse,
born, raised is a compassionate breeders.
They know what they're doing.
And, from Terry Stewart, for us
to Martha Harmony is to Robbie Brown.
some of these families, they
(47:18):
they'rethey developed the American Association.
They were some of the first founders,their families.
And I was so blessed to be ableto get them convinced that we need you.
We need you back. So, Ryan, we've beenhere.
Has been missingsome of that wise counsel.
(47:39):
And so, two years ago,we developed the Ranching Council in.
They are from the type of school.
And if you got something that I can helpwith and be involved in and do some good.
Okay, I'll be there.
Yeah,but if you don't, I'm too busy. Yeah.
I mean, they'rethey're the real deal. Yeah.
And so the ranching, you know,segment evacuation
has evolved in the last few yearsas, positive thing.
(48:04):
And I think we have yet to see there'sso many good things that are yet to come.
I, I can't tell you how much I appreciate.
And I know that a lot of our listenerswill appreciate
your prioritizing the accuracy back,
shall I say, in the directionof being a breed organization.
(48:25):
And it's not that I personallyfind anything wrong
with the sport part of the organizationor the competitive side
of the organization,but I think that it's true
that the tail is waggingthe dog sometimes,
and that there'sa very small percentage of people who walk
into the competition arena,and I'm happy for them to do so.
(48:48):
That's great.
And it's a necessary part,but it's not the only part,
when in fact we have a larger percentageof people involved in the association,
whether they be members or enthusiastsof the breed who are just recreational.
Exactly. No, you're right on there.
And and again, I think that that directionhas been given and we are moving toward
(49:13):
recognizing the Corbett
horse in whatever fieldthey're being successful at,
not creating an event for them to gocompete at,
because we are not a show managementorganization, not supposed to be,
but as a breed registry,we can discover and research
and see where our American corporatehorses are being successful
(49:34):
and what different venuesthey're being successful in.
And then go recognize that breederand that success.
Then then you're supporting your breed,
your horse,you're the owner to the competitor.
But but we should notwe were not developed
to create eventsfor the horses to compete at.
(49:57):
We and at this point, there are so manyassociations, as you pointed out earlier.
I mean, you can list the big ones,the NRA, the NRA and the NCAA.
And then after thatthere are regional associations
and different groupsthat form associations
to be sport horse organizationsand to to be competitive.
(50:18):
And I just don't know thatI think that the Academy needs
to try to compete in that area,when really
our primary directiveis to be a breed organization.
Very good point.
Hey, you're right on targetand we've needed to refocus
and again become a breed organization.
And, you know, and so we are
(50:41):
presently,
content in contact with some of thesenow what we consider
to be worthy affiliates,the NCAA and the NRA
and the PRCA and all of theseand any of the
any of these other events where they'reusing the Quarter Horse, then.
Yes, let's go there.
Let's go recognize themand give them a plaque or a trophy or,
(51:05):
you know, things that and thenand then to tell the world
about the success of that horseand how they were brand and who bred them.
That's what our breed registryyou're supposed to do.
Absolutely. And that'swhat we're trying to get back to.
That's wonderful. Yeah. That's wonderful.
one of the other things I wanted
to bring up and talk to you about is,of course, something
(51:27):
that's been a pretty contentious issuein facing the action lately.
And that's digital registration.
As the acreage president, wheredo you stand on digital registration?
Well,
so and I'lljust shoot from the hip, Brian, because of
my upbringing and my historically, it'syou know, it's kind of like,
(51:49):
are you a Ford man or a Chevy man or what?
You know, or some people.
Well, as long as they run and go,I don't matter, but some are.
I'm a diehard Chevy man,or I'm a diehard Ford man or whatever.
Well, Jim Hunt, because of my grandfatherand my father and and my wife's,
father and, and,
(52:09):
I love traditionand I love the paper certificate.
However, however,
in the technology
with phased world that we live intoday, it's gone.
It's coming that the digital system
is is prevalent, moving quickly,and it's going to be here
(52:32):
and we're going to have to learn to adapt.
I don't like it personally.
I'm on my personal side,
but on the other side,I can see that it's going it's coming.
We talked earlier like online banking.
Well, you know, the old school I was on a,
you know, $100 billor turn ten of them in my pocket and well,
(52:54):
now we got plastic cardsand that's what everybody's going to.
If you're going to function,you're going to have to adapt.
However, today
still, the AQR is still trying to perfectthat technological system.
That computer system. And we're not there.
We're not ready for the full timedigital system.
(53:18):
And the measuring stick on thatis just like register racing applications.
Today, 85%
of our members, the that of new falls
still use paper for them.
So that's not readyfor the computer system.
(53:39):
Yeah.
So digital certificates
you know, I mean you were thereright at our last convention.
The message was pretty loud and clearfrom especially our foundation breeders.
And they're still the onesthat have given their lives
to breeding the American Quarter Horse.
They want that paper certificate.
(54:01):
And they're buying their memberships.
They're paying their dues.
They're paying the bills.
They deserve to have what they wantat this point.
Yeah. But when you ask where are we at.
Because it's been proposed twice now
and we mandate digital certificates.
Yeah.
The word mandate is no,no word to grassroots producers.
(54:25):
We should have a choice.
And if they can adaptto the digital certificate,
then I think you phase into it.
And if they become comfortable with it.
And again, number one, the data,the computer system and USGA is
still got some some quirks in itthat we're working on once
(54:46):
it does become totally efficient,easy to do, click of a button.
I think that
is going to be more and more acceptedall the time as time goes on.
But today we cannot mandatedigital certificates.
Yeah, they have been beneficial in
international countries overseasand on this displaying quickly.
(55:10):
So you know the mail my, my my plane or
yeah sometimesmail gets lost a lot of times.
if for example in Germany or Italy
either one.
They register their courts,they send applications overseas.
It might take them 60 daysto get their certificate in the mail
(55:34):
or digitally the click of a button,
they can have it in 60sif everything goes well.
So there is value.
Sure.
To them for the digital certificate.
Having spent three yearson the international committee
beforeI got on to stud book and registration,
I have had the benefitof having a lot of conversations
(55:57):
with those international members,and they're chomping at the bit
to get to digital registrationjust for those reasons.
They are four months
from the time they send it in
to the time they get a registration paperback can be four months or more, right?
Yeah.
So that, you know,that's that's self selling.
(56:18):
I mean, that's
that's a necessity at that point
that we have to take advantageof technology in that case
so that they can get their
certificate sooner if they sell a horseand they want to transfer that horse now
so that the new owner can gocompete on the horse or use the horse or,
or, you know,we have to try to accommodate that.
(56:39):
And yeah, it's there.
I think that, you use the termmeasuring stick earlier.
I think that a measuring stick that we canprobably use with the association
as once we have gained back thethe credibility
of the reputation of the associationand their ability to process the work
and more and more of it digitally,
(57:00):
then maybe we'll be readyto phasing somehow. Yes.
Digital registration, once people trustthat that work can get done properly,
because the old reputation of inability
persists, whether we like it or not.
But I know that it has changedand it's gotten better.
There's been efficiencies made,
(57:21):
and all sorts of things go way quickernow than they used to go.
So I think we're headed in the rightdirection.
Well, I do too.
And the other, the other areathat were headed in the right direction
is the team and the staffwithin the acreage building. And,
my first
time on the executive committee,when I walked in there not knowing,
(57:44):
you know, still a student of howit all works, I'm still learning. But,
one of my observation is the turnover
in the staff was very rapid.
And we if we had, employeethat was there for,
you know, nine months to a yearor something, and then they would get
(58:04):
we would get them trainedand they would move on to a better job.
And there was, you know,a lot of uncertainty within the building
because of the lack of technology
or the lack of just,you know, who's in charge and so on.
And so forth.
And, Ryan, that, that that atmosphere
and that attitude has changed dramaticallyand to the comfort of,
(58:26):
you know, our registration departmentthere and are such a team today.
And, our journalismdepartment is such a team today
and our finance committee,we finally, gotten
a were ahead of on ouron our accounting practices and measures.
We've got we've had less turnover in thelast two years and wages had for decades.
(58:52):
And people I'm so pleased
because I asked them personally,as I go there and as I walk the halls of
of that three story building, 220
some employees, you our how are we doing?
How are we doing? Okay.
we're we're we're having a good time.
We're enjoying this.
We're enjoying working for the members.
(59:15):
And we haven't seen that for a while.
And, and, so,you know, to your viewership,
your listeners, you know,we have got so many things yet to do,
you know, have done so many positivethings in the last number of years.
And I think we're againheaded back to the right direction.
(59:36):
And a bread organization needs to be.
And, we've got mymy fellow EAC members are just wonderful.
Yeah. We're very united. Yeah.
And, it's it's really been a privilegethis year to serve at, you.
Know, it's a strong group and it's nice,
Jim, to, bring it towards a close here.
(59:57):
Tell us what you're most looking forwardto in your last few months.
I you see.
The last few months.
So, Mike.
And, of course, it'll go till nextMarch. And,
it is again, just like what we've talked
is that I, I want to leave the EKG.
(01:00:19):
leave it better than I found it.
And that should be the objective.
A very easy member.
And we've had some incredibleas presidents.
I'm very fortunate that,
you know, we had a new hire, Carl Strauss,when he came in to the.
The building is I call our wagonboss, and Carl has just been a godsend.
Carl and his assistant Aaron Ingot and
(01:00:42):
and the camaraderiethat they've developed in that building.
And and they'd all take a bullet for oneanother.
We're very fortunate that Carl Strassmanwas willing to come out of retirement
and, be part of AK
for hopefully even now,another couple of years or more.
And, and,
(01:01:03):
as I get ready to leave HQ, AJ,
I want the members, you know,to feel confident again, to feel,
that it's a privilegeand a really an honor
to be a member of the American Associationand that they're horses.
That means so much to them
that their registration certificates,whether on paper or digital.
(01:01:26):
You know, that. They have value.
That's you know, that.
And that's my goal, as they didwhen I was a young man.
I was taught and trainedthat those certificates, those
there's a registration certificateon on Browning right there and there,
I mean, that's worthmore than what's in my bank account value.
(01:01:47):
Yeah, that's my objective too.
Yeah. Me too.
Well, Mr.
Jim, I just want to thank you so muchfor taking the time to do this with me
and for all those thattake the opportunity to learn and lesson
and for being here in Calgary and,sharing your knowledge and expertise.
Thank you so much.
And to the to the membershipand the viewers.
(01:02:09):
thanks for letting me serveas your president this year.
And I look forward and I won't go away.
I'll still be involved.
And I mean, I'll get to be on somecommittees to follow and so forth. But,
it's really been fun to share,
to bring back to this associationwhat I think my parents, they're both gone
now, but would be pleased
(01:02:30):
that I'm giving back to somethingthat's been a huge part of our lives.
We talked about a lot of great thingsin there as far as I'm concerned.
You know, wewe brought forward your message from AK
and other AK andand then of course talking about breeding.
And I could talk about thatfor three hours with you so.
I could doand I, you know, there's so much more.
(01:02:51):
I mean, I get up at night and,just preach to John.
We need to do this. We need to do this.
And this is why, you know, and andand then and then I get,
you know, you know,I better keep that's my personal opinion.
And usually though, she, she eats it upand you know, and then she just
John is an incredible studentand her folks,
(01:03:12):
her dad had a grandson, a gang,and he and a grandson of, of Poco
Grants or Poco, you know, and, you know,and they had really good
mares, palomino mares.
They were palomino.They were palomino breeders.
Okay.
And, and sobut she didn't have the exposure to the
coffee table talk or did
(01:03:34):
every morning I got up with my,you know, eyes from time as a little kid.
Pancakes.
Karo serpent coffee.
And and they drink coffee and drink milk.
But anyhow, girl, you know, my God,what about that day after yesterday?
I think we better try that cross again,you know, and her dad and grandpa and.
And my uncle. Yeah.You know, and here's why.
(01:03:54):
Or what about that I don't gray horse.
Bernie. Snuffy.
I don't think that that didn't work,you know.
Yeah. Okay.
Every morning.
Yeah.
Yeah it was we had 30 or 40 horses.
We go over, they go overnight.
You sit there and listen,you know, and. Yeah.
Yeah I mean I did that.
That was our conversation.I totally get it.
Because like you, all the oldergenerations of mine are gone, you know.
(01:04:18):
But those were the conversationswe had to.
And I find that now that the conversationsI'm having with my wife and my children
about the crosses and the fallsand what they're turning out like and how
and why and what you'd change about themif you could.
All those things.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And,you know. Very good.
Thank you sir. Thank you. You.
(01:07:25):
So in closing on this episodeof the Quarter Horse Hauler,
I just want to again thank my guest
and our, esteemed leaderand president of the AK, Mr.
Jim Hunt.
Thank you, Jim, for being here
today.
I want to thank Kildare'sAlehouse in Calgary for allowing us
(01:07:49):
the space and the abilityto record here for a day.
And, if you have any opportunityfor me in the future,
I can be an MC,announcer, auctioneer, etc.
at your event.
I also, do clinics for beginners
and intermediates, all sorts of options.
(01:08:11):
If there's something you'd liketo chat about, just drop me an email.
Ryan at Fleetwood farms.com.
That's Ryan at Fleetwood farms.com.
The filming, audiorecording and editing is done by Rodrigo
Henriques, Shannon Milligan,Jared Middlebrook from Star Set Media.
I want to thank my family for allowing methe time and the ability to do this.
And, folks, at this point, this is, costand an ambition that I've taken on myself.
(01:08:38):
If you would like to help support,you can do that at buying me
a coffee.com/ryan Fleetwood.
Also, if you can subscribe,
leave a like or a written review
or tell a friend or twoabout this podcast.
Those things help us out greatly,
so please share it with otherswho you think will enjoy it.
(01:09:00):
All the links are in the show.Description.
The Quarter HorseHauler is a production of myself,
Ryan, a Fleetwood and star set media.
Thank you for listening to the QuarterHorse Hauler.
We'll see younext time. I'm Ryan Fleetwood.
Good day.
Folks, you are listening to the QuarterHorse Hauler with Ryan Fleetwood.
And today I have the privilege
of doing an interviewwith the current acting president, Mr.
Jim Hunt.
Mr. Jim, thank you for being with us.
Well, Ryan, it is a privilege to be here.
And, of course, we're meeting in Calgaryhere at the Stampede,
(00:40):
and that makes it extra fun to be around,you know, here in Calgary.
I haven't been back since the 1980s,when I used to rodeo a little bit.
And and so to join youand the other, horse enthusiasts
here, it's been really fun.
Yeah.
That's great.
And you've got to take in
some of the Calgary Stampede events,and we have, Yeah.
(01:01):
So it's been great.
Got my wifeJoni is with me and and of course, our
our time here is, just been,just a lot of fun last three days.
Yeah. That's great.
And we're filming here on site at,Kildare's Ale House
in South Calgary and want to thank themfor the ability to be here.
So, Jim, tell us a little bit about,
(01:21):
you and your life,what brought you to the point
of joining the SC,the executive committee at AHQA?
AJ well, thanks.
Let's start with a little bit of history.
So I am a QuarterHorse breeder, American Quarter
Horse breeder, and and my children,we have seven children.
And we continue to follow a tradition
(01:43):
of breeding the greatest equineathlete in the world as we think.
And, they're the sixth generation.
And so, my grandfather was, Spanish.
His name was Alberto Francisco Lopez.
And he came to South Dakota in the 20s
from Colorado, New Mexico area.
(02:05):
And he was employed by the diamond de
Cattle Company back in the 20s.
And, they unleashed some ground in the,in South Dakota,
part of the Indian reservation is showingIndian reservation.
And, came up thereand they brought with them
a remote of horses from the South.
(02:25):
A lot of them from Peter McHugh line.
Joe Moore line.you know, some of those old,
Foundation Quarter Horse lines and then,
he stayed there.
And when the Diamond Cattle Companyfolded in the 40s, they're removed.
And their horses,their broodmare band, stayed there
(02:47):
because they had, the
didn't feel the needto take them back to New Mexico.
So they basically became somewhat wild and
and so my grandfather knew that there wasthese good genetics that was there.
And so then in the 40s, he,
(03:09):
began to gather those wild horsesand, and comb
through and pickthe best mares out of that.
Those herds.
And then, when AQHA of course, they were.
AQHA was formed in 1940.
So in the mid 40s, then my grandfather
got some of the inspectors from AQHA
(03:30):
to come up right, and inspect those mares.
And the ones that were approved,got registration,
got registered registration certificates.
fun part of the story for thosethat are rodeo historians or enthusiasts,
the young man that he took underhis wing to be his partner was Casey Tibbs.
And Casey was just a young boyat that time.
(03:53):
And so Casey up, my grandfather
gather and brake and drainsome of those wild horses.
And then, remained
one of his partners in the horse businessfor many years to follow.
So we have a funny history.
And then, of course, I am part of Lakota,
being raised on the Cheyenne IndianReservation.
And, yeah.
(04:13):
Well, kind of a fun tidbit there.
My great great grandfather,
his name was Frederick Dupree.
He was French from Canada and great guy.
And he came down, into the Dakotas
and was a fur trader, buffalo hunter, and,
(04:34):
fell in love with a full blooded Indianwoman by the name of Mary.
Good Elks. Woman.
And, married her.
She had one child when they married.
She lost her first husband in, in a war.
And, Anyhow, Frederick Dupree marriedvery good
woman and had seven more children,and 1 in 1 of them
being FredDupré junior, my great grandfather.
(04:58):
But what's interesting about thatstory, Orion, is that
in the 1860s,
1870s, there was a big storm
called the Great White Storm.
It was a huge, massive snow stormthat went through the Montana, Wyoming,
the Dakotas, basically wiped out
(05:19):
almost to extinction, the cattle herd.
the buffalo herd,
and, horse herds and so forth.
Well,
history books showthat there was about 600 cattle left
in all those five states,and not many horses left.
(05:40):
And, after the
fur traders came inand basically hunted out the
the mature buffalo, there was fiveorphaned buffalo calves left
total.
And they were up on the NorthDakota South Dakota border.
And Frederick Dupree, my great great
(06:01):
grandfather and my and Mary, good woman,took a team and wagon
and went up and capturedthose five orphaned buffalo calves,
took them back to the Cheyenne Riverreservation,
and grew the buffaloback into existence. Her
and so with the buffalo and the livestock.
(06:23):
And then that's my Lakotaside of the heritage.
And so I just feel so blessedwith not only,
that poor part of history,but then in the horse,
the horse side of things, I've never known
not knowing anything but good Quarterhorses, the history behind them.
And so, years later,
(06:46):
when, you know, my family,my grandfather, also Lopez
also had one of the first QuarterHorse sales in South Dakota.
And Casey Tibbs was his partner.
And we still have that sale bill.
And, you know, from that,
way of life,
I didn't have much choice
(07:08):
but to remain in the Quarter Horsebusiness and breeding good quarter horses.
And as a young boy, we would go to HankWise Camps in Colorado.
We would go to Texas, to the Wagner Ranch.
We would go, you know, to the King Ranch.
We would go looking for better outcrosses,
looking for horses to make our herdsbetter, make better genetics.
(07:31):
And, and then up here,you know, about ten years ago,
I was approached by,
at that time was the,the executive vice president and the
and the president of evacuee J1, JohnnieTrotter and Don Treadway, and asked,
if they thought that I might be interested
(07:53):
in being a part of the governor's raceof the American Courthouse Association.
And because of my historyand because of my family's
involvement with the Quarter Horse,
I finally was led to,
you know, think, well,maybe I could have something to offer.
And so, Ryan Q who is theyhad gone through a trend of time
(08:16):
where memberships were on the decline,
registrations were on the decline
in terms, transfers were on the declineand so on, so forth.
And, a lot of that, you know, good horses
and breeding wasn't on the decline because
there was so many other affiliatesor other entities.
(08:39):
You know, this quarter horseindustry has become so specialized.
There's the NCAA and the NBA
and there's the reigning cow associationand there's the racehorse deal.
And you know the rodeo wore onand on and on and on.
And so they had found
themselves is frommy observation had found themselves
(09:02):
somewhat in a corner in that really the
the main ones that were interested inHHR was the show horse world.
And so but
here we had all of these ranch breeders,
Canada, United States, even Mexico
and other international countries,but especially in the United States.
(09:23):
We had all these ranch breeders of hadthese quality quarter horses,
but the AQHA had kind of lost their identity
in being involved with those breedersor the real importance.
And let us remember thatthe American Course Association, founded
(09:44):
in the pass in El Paso, Texas, in 1940,
was founded on the ranch breeders efforts.
They were founded on those goodold foundation horses, the Joe Reids.
And of course, that was waybefore three vars, the Joe Reid's,
the Joe Moores, the Peter McHugh's,you know, those horses.
(10:04):
And then later,
three bars.
A thoroughbred came inand was proved to be maybe the greatest
thing that ever happened is an out crossback on these foundation horses.
But in 1940, in El Paso.
And so then the AJSpurpose was a breed registry
to help
(10:25):
enthusiaststhat wanted to make better horses
identify by by pedigree, by genetics.
And it grew and it grew and it grew
and it into the 60s and into the 70s.
And then in the 80s,
it it didn't keep up
(10:46):
with what it neededto offer to the members.
That's, that's that's my observation.
And still had a purpose.
But it, it didn't stay current with
needs changed for breeders.
And, they weren't,
didn't keep up with recognizingthe breeders in their efforts
(11:08):
as, as as efficient as they needed to.
And so they lost a lot of momentum.
And so, of course,then we get in, you know, to the,
late 90s and into the 2000sand in the 21st century and
and so here we arein some of the, in the, the governance.
(11:31):
Found that they needed
to step up and reach out and regain
the valuethat integrity back with the breeders
and so that's, about that time is
when I was confronted and askedif I would consider
getting involved to take aand that maybe I could,
(11:51):
being a ranch breeder,being raised by a ranch breeder,
coming from a ranch breeders familyand understanding
their thoughts and their needs, thenmaybe I could have something to offer.
So I became a director of AQR
and in 2012, and then
(12:12):
served as, we developed
a ranching committee, ranching council,trying to address the needs
now, again, of our ranch breeders
and addressing those,
incentives that we needed to reach outand better recognize their efforts
and those theirtheir breeding programs of good horses
(12:34):
and, getting involvedand reaching out to the other affiliates
that so many of those samegenetics were needed
and used in the cutting horseindustry, the road horse industry, the,
you know, the barrel horsesto their great cross of not just race
and run, but they got a lot of cowhorse breeding in to a great combination.
(12:54):
Yeah. So specialized.
Anyhow,I then I after I was a director for,
about four, about five years,
I was, sought outby some of the past presidents
to considergoing on the executive committee.
And after much thought and,
(13:17):
here I am.
And so, this is my fifth year, andand the way that works
is, is, it's a five year commitmenton the executive committee.
And each year you're elevated, if you're,
voted back on each yearby the past presidents
and the general, but, the,the general membership at each convention.
(13:38):
And so, they, have thought
enough of that, that I've had enoughto offer that they've kept me on.
And so I, I have the privilegeand I say privilege
of serving as the president of this year,you know.
Yeah.
Well, I can't tell you how much that weCanadians appreciate you coming up here.
(13:58):
And I know you have a super busytravel schedule
with all the places that you're goingand all the people that you're seeing.
And in this final yearon ABC, as the president,
can you give us, some of the thingsthat you would like to see move forward
that you will seeas legacy things that you've done at AK?
(14:21):
Oh, yes.
Well, one of the thingsabout the executive committee that I,
you know, that I learned the first fouryears, you know, the executive committee,
they the
those four members can make motions and,and vote.
And the president only gets to,
(14:42):
have a voice if it's a tiebreaker, vote on issues, whatever.
And and we have nothad that issue at all this year thus far.
Very unified the executive committee.
But, you know, one of the things that,
I came in on the executive committeeand we'll go out as president
and that my objective is to solidify
(15:06):
the efforts of reengagingmany of those breeders, ranch
breeders, membersthat have become disengaged.
How do we have we done that?
We we began the ranching heritage program.
We've.
Yeah,increased the importance of the remote
(15:26):
award, the highest award and AQR j
awards at once a year.
we better improvethe recognition of horses
in high school rodeo and college rodeo.
The professional rodeo.
we're working on some thingswe hope with the Calgary Stampede
and recognizing horses,the American Quarter Horses here in Ryan.
(15:50):
You and I have talked about this before,and I.
And I again, want to make this statement
not being braggadocious or sarcastic,but just being realistic.
And that is if it was notfor the American Quarter Horse
and that horse being involvedin our Western culture
and our way of life, we wouldn'tbe wearing cowboy hats or boots.
(16:14):
We wouldn't have a rodeo.
We wouldn't have the CalgaryStampede to the level that we have it.
Because that horse that is the nucleus,that is what we focus around
in our Western way of life.
The one commonality.
The one commonality. Of us.
And wouldn't it look different if theAmerican Quarter Horse didn't exist?
Oh yeah.
(16:36):
Again, you know hereyour your your athletes here
are these camerapersonyou know the you know Canada Nolan.
Two for quote from Kenny McClain.
You know way back before himHerman Linder you know all of these,
iconic
Canadian cowboys again, you think werethey wouldn't
(16:56):
be part of the history booksif it wasn't for that horse.
The horse.
The Quarter Horse and and,you're here, right?
We would not have the National FinalsRodeo.
I mean, the these horses,
you know, we see interviews all the time
and very passionate that
(17:17):
if it wasn't for my horse, I would go upand down the road making a living.
If it wasn't for my hours,I wouldn't be the calf roper or the,
that team roper that I am today.
And on. And on.
And the stories that people get into,if it wasn't for my horse or
my horses, I wouldn't have met this personand this person and this person.
And and it isn't always just aboutthe horses that we see in the spotlight
(17:39):
that are the competitive horses thathave won this or won all of these titles.
It's also about the horses that each of ushold in our hearts as family members.
Yes. Who have introduced usto other people or carried our parents
or grandparents or childrenat certain times or for years and years.
(18:00):
Those horsesand those stories are so important to.
They're a part of our daily lives.
And my wife and I,that is another prime example,
of that scenario.
Right.
And that is, is thatshe was not a rodeo gal.
She was not she was a ranch girl.
And they had a set of brood maresthat they used on the ranch.
(18:21):
And every morning she wasit was out, you know,
saddleand our old saddle was going to get the,
the milk cow and or the Gaussian or,you know, just just ranch or just it
her true enjoyment is just getting out
and riding and seeing the country and and,just on the ranch, you know,
(18:42):
I looked at going through the cows
and checking themor checking the fence or whatever.
And our first common bond was the horse.
When she found out that I,
that my family raised quarter horsesand I found out that her family
raised quarter horses,that was our first common bond.
(19:03):
And so we've been married37 going on 38 years.
And and that's still our enjoymenttogether is our horses.
Yeah. It's great. Yeah.
And you have some kids who enjoy horses.
Still seven children.
And, they're all grown pretty much now,but all very involved.
Yeah.
And in our production sale that we haveevery fall and involved, they,
(19:24):
they participated in for a yearin high school rodeo
and some of them in college rodeoand so forth.
But, yeah,none of them, you know, further than that.
Now they're at home on the ranch andused to horse at the ranch in the horses.
Their best friend and. Yeah.
And, yeah, it just kind of all ensued.
(19:44):
Mom and dad. So, yeah.
I there's so many of us in the horsebusiness that,
I think if we were to take horses away,our identity would completely change.
I know mine would.
I wouldn't be anywhere near the same man
that I amif I if it wasn't for horses. Yes.
(20:04):
Absolutely true.
For myself, I wouldn't be Jim Hunt at the
in the American Quarter Horse headquartersif, if I'm knowing that.
Well he's the guythat has a really good set of quarter
horse mares and some good studsand so forth, and I take pride in that.
I mean, I, you know,you don't seek those things.
(20:26):
That's just the measuring stickthe people know you by.
Yes, sir.
Or I go back home to South Dakota,and I'm a director
at the Black HillsStock Show and and other events.
And the why?
Because of my association with the horseand the horse community.
And that those are the credentialsthat we have
because of the horse,because of our passion for the horse,
(20:50):
and because what the horse means to us,what he's done for.
Us, for each of us. Yeah, indeed.
I want to shift the focusa little bit, Jim, and talk about,
one of the questions that I have for youis that we've talked a little bit
about how the corner horses bred todayand the discipline specific breeding
(21:10):
and the disciplinespecific uses for our horses.
And there's not nearly as much focusput on the old versatility
of the Quarter Horse
inside of the association. Now,
I've thought for a long timethat there's only one commonality
that we all have underthe umbrella of the AK,
(21:33):
and that is the necessity to get
a registration paperfrom that association.
Would you say there'sany other commonalities to everyone
across the business
in in the acreage here, there.
Oh, yes.
There'sI think other commonalities and, and and
(21:56):
and that is,
the commonality whether it be.
Yeah, hanging on to the old foundation
lines or whatever the commonality is,
I want to make a better one,
whatever it takes to make a better one.
(22:17):
And, Ryan,we have seen through the history
that that, some people
have put all their efforts in going back
and trying to find isis close to the old genetics.
Is they good?
And thought, you know,
I want to go back and
(22:38):
get what they used to have becausethat was the greatest in their mind.
Yeah.
Well I've seen people that have steppedoutside of the box and they come back
and they want to, crosswith some thoroughbreds
or some other breeds and say,hey, J, would you ever consider
letting me register as an outcross some of these?
(23:00):
usually it hasn't happened.
You know,three bars, was one of the great out
crosses at acreagecourses, AKG Hall of Fame.
What he's done for the horsein that industry in the
the beginning of the Quarter Horse wasit was not its own individual breed.
It was a corporate horse.
It was, compilation of different breeds.
(23:23):
Yeah. And so but to keep it pure,
you know, they've made it
right to keep the breeding,the pedigree pure.
They have been more very strictabout what they allow to come in.
Is, is, is an out for usand what they would allow to be registered
(23:46):
in the association because they didn'twant to let it get out of control.
But the commonality is
in any of those avenuesis the desire to make a better one.
We're all competitive.
one of the we one of our neighborsgot another horse across the fence.
(24:06):
We want ourslook better. Yeah. So we're competitive.
So we're going to bring.
Or if you're barrel raceror if you're, you know, especially in that
or a grandpa of a barrel racer,you want that girl to be first
and well, you're going to, you know,you want the best one out there.
And yeah, the the make a better one,find a better one, breed a better one.
And to look good while she's doing it.
(24:28):
And and look good. Why she's doing it.
That's good.
Yeah.
So, you know,I love to talk about breeding decisions
and how they're madebecause I, I believe that that's,
a major crisis facing the industry today.
So how, Jim, when you were makingyour breeding decisions at home,
what factors come into play for youas to how you decide
(24:52):
which stallion is going with whatset of mayors?
So when when I first started,
got out on my own, I followed,
my father and grandfather,and they spent a lot of time
studying genetic back in the day,and we spent a lot of time
(25:12):
at Hank Weis Campswhen I was a little boy.
And we bought my.
My father had a son,a Leo, and a grandson, a king.
And and,you know, my observation, growing up and
and breaking a lot of those fairly soonand Colts is
two year olds and, you know,
(25:34):
I observed
that there were lions pedigrees,there were genetics.
They were more consistentin others and process that really worked.
For example,
if you go back and if you study the.
Success of performance horses.
(25:57):
And then when I say performanceI'm talking cutting horses,
rope horses, barrel racing horses.
You know, back in the day, even quarter
race horses, short track horses,
you know, Leo, son of Joeread the second by Joe, read D3
that comes out as a as a standnow in that there was a common denominator
(26:18):
that the majority of Leo's daughters,
when they were crossed on the son of three
bars, a horse by the name of sugar barsthat sugar bars
and Leo cross overall the generations of the AKG produced
(26:39):
very predictable genetics.
They were athletic.
They were trainable.
They had good minds, they had good bone.
They had, you know,they were had the quarter horse look.
And even to this day,
whether you're talking about.
So let's think of sugar bars and Leo.
(27:00):
If you look at ColonelFrankel's, you're familiar
with Colonel Franklin, sir,you have stood down as that of a daughter.
Own daughter? Yes, sir.
I had a son of Colonel Freckles.
And, you know, look at thethe track record of Colonel Freckles.
What they've done in the cow works world.
The cutting horse world.
Now, also in the calfand calf roping horses.
(27:22):
In game roping horses.
So much athletic ability and sense.
Common sense.
Cow sense.
Disposition.Colonel freckles, his daddy was
Jules Leo Bars.
Jules Leo bars was an old son.
Sugar bars out of a daughter. Leo.
So then you go to.
(27:43):
Well, you go to Franco's Playboy.
Be a three quarterbrother to Colonel Freckles.
Who was he?
He two was out of
Jules Leo barsand out of a different daughter of Leo.
Right.
Okay, let's go to the barrel racing world.
And there was a Canadian barrel racer.
Ever been named Lindsay Sears?
(28:04):
It was very successful.
And and and world champion barrel of Mars,
world champion barrel racer several times.
And she had a mare by the name of Martha.
That was her nickname.
And she was an own daughter of doctorNick bar.
And there was much successwith the doctor.
Nick bars. Well, what was doctor Nick bar?
(28:27):
He was a son of sugar barsout of the daughter of Leo
then, so that's what.
And then you go to Flint Bar andthat was the sire to doctor Nick bar and.
And Flint Bar was this idea to do,
firewater Flint and to,you know, many Flint bar.
Red arch.
Split bar was the son of sugar barsout of Flint.
(28:50):
The old daughter of Leo, outof which daughter Joanne got those horses
today are still prevailing.
as successful performers.
They them todaywe're talking 50 years later.
Now, let'sgo to some of the good cephalopod nurses.
There's, Joe Beaver or, I mean,
(29:14):
Cody of
world champion calf roper,and he wrote down a,
a mayor of Sid Millersfor a good number of years
and, a mayorthat he called by the name of Pearl
and Pearl.
What was she?
She was an auto bred mare.
She was out of a wonder auto stud.
Auto, was a son of sugar bars
(29:38):
out of a daughter,a Leo, in fact, Otto and Flint bar
were actually full brothers in bloodbecause
Julio was the the mother to old Joe,
and Flint was the mother to to, Flint Bar.
But they were full sisters,so they bred sugar bars to full sisters.
(29:59):
They got Flint Bar and they got Oto.
I share that because
being trying to be a student of genetics,what crosses worked.
Well they did.
Why did they work.
And the other thingLeo was an inbred horse.
He was one of those horsesthat they brand.
Joe Reed paid three back to his sisterand they got Leo.
(30:22):
Well Leo himself
had some severe deficiencies.
He had crooked knees.
He had there was some ham breedingcharacteristics that did come out.
But down the roadhis daughters were some of the best
crosses and brood mares back on the cross,three bars, horse sugar bars
(30:46):
and when they bred three bars to some
Leo daughters, they worked phenomenal.
There was you're out cross breeding
people are still trying now to bring in,you know, other outside genetics.
And that is the one thing, Ryan, that is.
An issuethat we're going to have to deal with.
(31:08):
We have now years later,we have our genetics.
There's such a close,closed pool of genetics
that there has become danger in that.
Well, what do I breed do next?
I don't want to get too close hereor here or here.
and there is where there's probably timeand need to allow
(31:30):
maybe some other thoroughbred linesin which you.
In recent years,
some of the racehorse lineshave been allowed in for some out crosses,
and they've been working
well here and there, and that'sall going to be trial and error.
I was a student of genetics,and so when Johnny and I got married,
we went and found and bought
(31:52):
Two Sons of Sugar bars, two of them
the last breeding sons of sugar bars and
and and built our broodmare band around
Sonny Sugar in time for sugar and
and then we had,
a couple of daughters of Leoand we tried to duplicate
(32:13):
what had already been successfulwithout making too many mistakes.
And so when you were making thosebreeding decisions for your own program,
would you say it's an entirely based
on the genetics of the horses that you'relooking at mating or primarily,
and then what other factors are you usingwhen you make your decisions?
(32:37):
And that's a very good point.
And it is.
No, not at alltotally about just the genetics.
It's about equallythe confirmation of each horse
and and the way that they moveand their athleticism
and their train ability.
Because, you know, I have seven children
(33:00):
and one of them like you're so fulland they're all full siblings.
Yeah. And guaranteed.
And anyhow that they, you know,and not one of them are alike
in statureor in mindset or in, you know, some,
learning comes easier for than others.
Some, are more ambitious than others.
(33:20):
Some, you know, well,our horses are the same way I did. So.
But to get predictable genetics,
my first lesson was past history.
I have who I had call your past breeders.
Bud Warren and and Jerry Wells
and Hank Wise camp and,you know, on or on and on.
(33:43):
They had already been through all of these
practices and failures and successes andand my grandfather and my dad, you know,
I use, you know, a lot of, of,of, of their input as well,
because,
they knew and alreadyI mean, they spent a lifetime,
(34:03):
you know, of, of successes, failures,things work, things that didn't work.
Look, other things that we can add tothat is just
okay, confirmation is important.
And even though you got two sons of sugar,
barns are both totally differentin their conformation,
you know, there's similarities,but they're totally different
(34:24):
at the same time,the same way with their train ability.
Some horses, they come
around quicker and some more times,the horses that take the longest to train.
If they're still trained right,you end up being your better horses.
But you know, in today's world,train ability is so important.
Yeah. The mind.
(34:45):
Yeah, yeah, the mind would would.
Train ability be interchangeablewith the word disposition? Yes.
Okay. Yes. Yeah.
that's what I assumed.
I just wanted to make sure
that you were thinking the same thingas what I was assuming you meant.
And so what would you say, then,if I ask you,
what is the single most important?
(35:05):
What is your first considerationwhen making breeding decisions?
Just one. Conformation.
Conformation leaves into the way they move and they travel.
Conformation a lot of times dictates
if it's if a conformationis correct on a horse,
then the train abilityis going to come easy for them
(35:26):
because they can move, correct?
Sure, there's less frustrationand the less
frustration you have with an animal, then
the better
disposition they're going to have.
Indeed.
And when you're makingthose breeding decisions
are you putting the same type of marewith the stallion
(35:48):
or are you putting a little bitdifferent type of mare with that
stallionin order to try and come to the middle?
Sariah some of both,because for an example, if I'm trying to,
when I had Sunny Sugar,a son of sugar bars,
he was 53 anyway, 1,370 pounds
and he was bigger than whata lot of people liked.
(36:13):
in today's age to ride,
I like to 15 one, 15two and horse know high weathers and
and and a and a longer pencil neckand you know that could get out
and move with the conformation and,
now he didn't that those horses didn'tconform as well
(36:33):
to what's
needed in the cutting pin today, todayand the cutting being you need a horse
that extremely low to the groundand that can get down in order to compete.
That's just that's the way it's evolved.
Yeah.
And so but to cross any sugar back on
some freckles Playboy granddaughterswe had a son of Frank was Playboy too.
(36:56):
So we did and we get it for example.
And they were 14 to 14 three and horsesto get a balance there.
And of course, we were had an order.
So we had customers that said, boy,I would, could you raise me
some really good calf open prospects?
Well, they wanted something about 14,three, 15 hands,
(37:18):
but that could get down on the groundand park it and get back.
And so but that Sonny sugarand the sugar bars line,
they had some speedand then just natural terrain ability. So
when we were trying to raise some calf
for open horses for the kidsor for some customers,
we made the decisionto put those types of mares
(37:40):
with the bigger high weathered stud.
Yeah.
If I wanted to, I needed to replace
improved manners in my broodmare bandand I wanted good minds
and maybe a little heavier bone for,you know, to keep bone in our horses.
I like a number,a number, one size shoe on a horse,
(38:02):
you know, primarilyand in, in our ranch area.
Good foot is very important.
Sure. And so,
you know, then, I might put,
a Poco win.
A we had some poco in old bred studsat one time
and some book well-bred mares and I might,yeah, make sure that they weren't
(38:23):
brothers or sisters,but but but maybe breed them back
to keep a little more of a foundation inin some of those bred mares,
knowing thatthen I would breed those fillies
back to a 15 three and SugarBarns horse, that needed some more size.
So the different objectives marrya different breeding and the.
(38:45):
Yeah.
Where do you
standon adding thoroughbred in at this point,
whether it's in your own herdor in a Quarter Horse in general?
Well, I'm a,I'm a proponent of, of good out crosses.
And, you know, again, the simple fact is,
(39:05):
is that the American QuarterHorse was derived upon
a percentage of thoroughbred blood
in our in our, in our horses.
It goes back to conformation.
If there's an individualthoroughbred horse that came into the.
And I'm not saying that this at this pointcan be done, but down the road, I think
(39:28):
I think the American Car Associationand its directors
and breeders,the people that make it work,
they're going to be forcedto look at some possible out
crossing and allow some thoroughbredsback into the vehicle.
Now, you know,
you can breed a thoroughbred to a QuarterHorse mare and get appendix papers.
(39:48):
And that is what they're saying todaythere.
Well, thereis that the, a chance for out cross.
And then you take that appendixregistered horse and if you get so
many points on it or wins something,then it can get permanent papers.
Yeah.
So there is, a track to send outcrossing that way.
Sure.
But to answer the question,would there ever be room
(40:10):
for a full thoroughbred to come in?
I think so,I don't know when that will be or,
but I think it needs to be raised,and I sure do.
I certainly agree with you.
I know that, years ago,we were entirely focused on the old
foundation horse, and then I got him therewho helped me change my mind
(40:31):
and she was 75% thoroughbredand a daughter of Rugged Lark.
And when we bred her to our cow horsestallions, we got this
the same type of like a cow horse type,but they had a little more height
and a little more length,and they were real clean in the neck
and how they were put together anda great weather and some of those things.
And I thought, you know, maybe I'm missingsomething here.
(40:53):
And I thinkthat there are certainly things
that that thoroughbred bloodcould bring us, would offer us.
Jim, you and I could talk about thisall day long.
Yeah, I'm sure of it. Yeah. Love it.
Great conversation.Thank you for your knowledge.
But I want to turn back a little bitto your role with acreage.
Okay.
What do you see as the biggest hurdles
(41:15):
coming at acreage in the future?
The biggest hurdlesare the ones that we have in addressing.
And there's still hurdles.
And that is Ryan that,
we still have not regained the
I don't want to use
the word respect,but regain the confidence
(41:36):
back in our associationthat that from breeders,
the breedersand of course, we are a breed registry
but the breeders have notbeen, had their needs met
like they should have, you know,and and it's to nobody's fault.
Yeah. It's just the way it's.
It's just the way that it's gone.
(41:57):
Yeah, but those needs of our breedersand especially, you know, our 50 year
breeders,and there's still so many out there and,
and and even 75 yearbreeders, there's still some out there
that are actively breeding,but then you get your 30, 20
and 30 and 40 year breeders.
Many of them still feel that.
What place does AKG,how can they benefit me
(42:20):
all that you know,all I, all I, I register my my foals in
and but how you know,how can they benefit me
and is is is I can come to Calgaryand I was
I talk to the Canadian group,the Quarter Horse, group and
the same message that I
tried to reveal to themand that is, is that
(42:43):
AQ, AJ needs to continue
to do a better job of recognition.
We need to reach back out
and recognize the success of those quarterHorses from those breeders.
Wherever they may be.
Like you and I talked,maybe it's just on the ranch,
(43:03):
the enjoyment of your horse to go outand get your milk
going and or work your cattle or whateverwhatever.
To many, it's it'smaybe the success of them
raising their family,whether it's through forage or,
or youth activitiesor they just get to go to playdates
or whatever, but on a bigger scale
(43:25):
to recognize the successes of the horse.
You know, the, Calgary Stampede,help me with his name.
The pickup man.
Yeah.
Got horse of the year through AQ, AJ but
it was huge a huge honor and award
and that we finally have begun to go
(43:46):
beyond AK and go out.
And to those breedersand where their horses are at
and congratulate them them on the backor whatever
the case may be and say good job, man,that was a good horse.
Yeah.
Your breeding efforts were so worthythere.
Right?
And you know what?Most of them will go home.
(44:06):
So, you know, I think we'll make a couplemore like that, you know, great.
Some morebecause they appreciated me. Yeah.
And so your question about GM,what are your ambitions?
My ambitions are,are to continue to do a better job
of reaching out,meeting the needs of these members
that have been disengagedand new members coming in,
(44:29):
and to better
recognize the Quarter Horsewherever they're being used?
I think that's just wonderful.
And I think that that's a great priority
to set the associationback on the, the path to.
And one of the things that we talked aboutthat we can talk about again, is
(44:49):
not only just recognizing those breeders,
but asking them whythey made the decisions that they made
and what brought themto the point of creation of that horse.
Because breeding, as you well know, Jim,
is a whole lot of science
and a whole lot of art form,but can't really be explained.
(45:10):
Yes, in the way we create these horses.
And I think telling the storyof the people who create the horses
will help movethe future creation of horses
into a more proper direction.
The new that is so well put.
And one of the the other things that,
(45:31):
you know, the acreage has lost
some involvement in is just that,
you know, we used to have, trainersand breeding a buster
Welch's in and, and trainersand he was a breeder as well.
And he had so much advice
and counsel and wisdomto offer to the membership of.
(45:55):
This is why I brought this to this.
This is our should move.
This is how horse needs to move.
If you're cutting a car,this is how a horse needs to move.
If you're working cattle on a.
But there's a differenceand there's reasoning with them.
Guys lived in the saddle, lived on a horsethey know.
And just to add to that,and I hope for the comfort
(46:15):
of your viewing audience or whatever,you know, thank you.
AJ has made some really
huge effortsto reengage some of that knowledge.
For example, two years ago they allowed me
to establish the Ranching Council
and its eight members
(46:36):
that are like elders now
that give advice to give their opinion,their input.
Don't do this, do this.
Your breeders need this.They don't need this and that.
Ranching Council is comprised of removeaward winners, 50 year breeders, or both.
Most of them are both.
(46:57):
That means that they're the real deal.
They born.
Raised on a ranch, bornand raised on a horse,
born, raised is a compassionate breeders.
They know what they're doing.
And, from Terry Stewart, for us
to Martha Harmony is to Robbie Brown.
some of these families, they
(47:18):
they'rethey developed the American Association.
They were some of the first founders,their families.
And I was so blessed to be ableto get them convinced that we need you.
We need you back. So, Ryan, we've beenhere.
Has been missingsome of that wise counsel.
(47:39):
And so, two years ago,we developed the Ranching Council in.
They are from the type of school.
And if you got something that I can helpwith and be involved in and do some good.
Okay, I'll be there.
Yeah,but if you don't, I'm too busy. Yeah.
I mean, they'rethey're the real deal. Yeah.
And so the ranching, you know,segment evacuation
has evolved in the last few yearsas, positive thing.
(48:04):
And I think we have yet to see there'sso many good things that are yet to come.
I, I can't tell you how much I appreciate.
And I know that a lot of our listenerswill appreciate
your prioritizing the accuracy back,
shall I say, in the directionof being a breed organization.
(48:25):
And it's not that I personallyfind anything wrong
with the sport part of the organizationor the competitive side
of the organization,but I think that it's true
that the tail is waggingthe dog sometimes,
and that there'sa very small percentage of people who walk
into the competition arena,and I'm happy for them to do so.
(48:48):
That's great.
And it's a necessary part,but it's not the only part,
when in fact we have a larger percentageof people involved in the association,
whether they be members or enthusiastsof the breed who are just recreational.
Exactly. No, you're right on there.
And and again, I think that that directionhas been given and we are moving toward
(49:13):
recognizing the Corbett
horse in whatever fieldthey're being successful at,
not creating an event for them to gocompete at,
because we are not a show managementorganization, not supposed to be,
but as a breed registry,we can discover and research
and see where our American corporatehorses are being successful
(49:34):
and what different venuesthey're being successful in.
And then go recognize that breederand that success.
Then then you're supporting your breed,
your horse,you're the owner to the competitor.
But but we should notwe were not developed
to create eventsfor the horses to compete at.
(49:57):
We and at this point, there are so manyassociations, as you pointed out earlier.
I mean, you can list the big ones,the NRA, the NRA and the NCAA.
And then after thatthere are regional associations
and different groupsthat form associations
to be sport horse organizationsand to to be competitive.
(50:18):
And I just don't know thatI think that the Academy needs
to try to compete in that area,when really
our primary directiveis to be a breed organization.
Very good point.
Hey, you're right on targetand we've needed to refocus
and again become a breed organization.
And, you know, and so we are
(50:41):
presently,
content in contact with some of thesenow what we consider
to be worthy affiliates,the NCAA and the NRA
and the PRCA and all of theseand any of the
any of these other events where they'reusing the Quarter Horse, then.
Yes, let's go there.
Let's go recognize themand give them a plaque or a trophy or,
(51:05):
you know, things that and thenand then to tell the world
about the success of that horseand how they were brand and who bred them.
That's what our breed registryyou're supposed to do.
Absolutely. And that'swhat we're trying to get back to.
That's wonderful. Yeah. That's wonderful.
one of the other things I wanted
to bring up and talk to you about is,of course, something
(51:27):
that's been a pretty contentious issuein facing the action lately.
And that's digital registration.
As the acreage president, wheredo you stand on digital registration?
Well,
so and I'lljust shoot from the hip, Brian, because of
my upbringing and my historically, it'syou know, it's kind of like,
(51:49):
are you a Ford man or a Chevy man or what?
You know, or some people.
Well, as long as they run and go,I don't matter, but some are.
I'm a diehard Chevy man,or I'm a diehard Ford man or whatever.
Well, Jim Hunt, because of my grandfatherand my father and and my wife's,
father and, and,
(52:09):
I love traditionand I love the paper certificate.
However, however,
in the technology
with phased world that we live intoday, it's gone.
It's coming that the digital system
is is prevalent, moving quickly,and it's going to be here
(52:32):
and we're going to have to learn to adapt.
I don't like it personally.
I'm on my personal side,
but on the other side,I can see that it's going it's coming.
We talked earlier like online banking.
Well, you know, the old school I was on a,
you know, $100 billor turn ten of them in my pocket and well,
(52:54):
now we got plastic cardsand that's what everybody's going to.
If you're going to function,you're going to have to adapt.
However, today
still, the AQR is still trying to perfectthat technological system.
That computer system. And we're not there.
We're not ready for the full timedigital system.
(53:18):
And the measuring stick on thatis just like register racing applications.
Today, 85%
of our members, the that of new falls
still use paper for them.
So that's not readyfor the computer system.
(53:39):
Yeah.
So digital certificates
you know, I mean you were thereright at our last convention.
The message was pretty loud and clearfrom especially our foundation breeders.
And they're still the onesthat have given their lives
to breeding the American Quarter Horse.
They want that paper certificate.
(54:01):
And they're buying their memberships.
They're paying their dues.
They're paying the bills.
They deserve to have what they wantat this point.
Yeah. But when you ask where are we at.
Because it's been proposed twice now
and we mandate digital certificates.
Yeah.
The word mandate is no,no word to grassroots producers.
(54:25):
We should have a choice.
And if they can adaptto the digital certificate,
then I think you phase into it.
And if they become comfortable with it.
And again, number one, the data,the computer system and USGA is
still got some some quirks in itthat we're working on once
(54:46):
it does become totally efficient,easy to do, click of a button.
I think that
is going to be more and more acceptedall the time as time goes on.
But today we cannot mandatedigital certificates.
Yeah, they have been beneficial in
international countries overseasand on this displaying quickly.
(55:10):
So you know the mail my, my my plane or
yeah sometimesmail gets lost a lot of times.
if for example in Germany or Italy
either one.
They register their courts,they send applications overseas.
It might take them 60 daysto get their certificate in the mail
(55:34):
or digitally the click of a button,
they can have it in 60sif everything goes well.
So there is value.
Sure.
To them for the digital certificate.
Having spent three yearson the international committee
beforeI got on to stud book and registration,
I have had the benefitof having a lot of conversations
(55:57):
with those international members,and they're chomping at the bit
to get to digital registrationjust for those reasons.
They are four months
from the time they send it in
to the time they get a registration paperback can be four months or more, right?
Yeah.
So that, you know,that's that's self selling.
(56:18):
I mean, that's
that's a necessity at that point
that we have to take advantageof technology in that case
so that they can get their
certificate sooner if they sell a horseand they want to transfer that horse now
so that the new owner can gocompete on the horse or use the horse or,
or, you know,we have to try to accommodate that.
(56:39):
And yeah, it's there.
I think that, you use the termmeasuring stick earlier.
I think that a measuring stick that we canprobably use with the association
as once we have gained back thethe credibility
of the reputation of the associationand their ability to process the work
and more and more of it digitally,
(57:00):
then maybe we'll be readyto phasing somehow. Yes.
Digital registration, once people trustthat that work can get done properly,
because the old reputation of inability
persists, whether we like it or not.
But I know that it has changedand it's gotten better.
There's been efficiencies made,
(57:21):
and all sorts of things go way quickernow than they used to go.
So I think we're headed in the rightdirection.
Well, I do too.
And the other, the other areathat were headed in the right direction
is the team and the staffwithin the acreage building. And,
my first
time on the executive committee,when I walked in there not knowing,
(57:44):
you know, still a student of howit all works, I'm still learning. But,
one of my observation is the turnover
in the staff was very rapid.
And we if we had, employeethat was there for,
you know, nine months to a yearor something, and then they would get
(58:04):
we would get them trainedand they would move on to a better job.
And there was, you know,a lot of uncertainty within the building
because of the lack of technology
or the lack of just,you know, who's in charge and so on.
And so forth.
And, Ryan, that, that that atmosphere
and that attitude has changed dramaticallyand to the comfort of,
(58:26):
you know, our registration departmentthere and are such a team today.
And, our journalismdepartment is such a team today
and our finance committee,we finally, gotten
a were ahead of on ouron our accounting practices and measures.
We've got we've had less turnover in thelast two years and wages had for decades.
(58:52):
And people I'm so pleased
because I asked them personally,as I go there and as I walk the halls of
of that three story building, 220
some employees, you our how are we doing?
How are we doing? Okay.
we're we're we're having a good time.
We're enjoying this.
We're enjoying working for the members.
(59:15):
And we haven't seen that for a while.
And, and, so,you know, to your viewership,
your listeners, you know,we have got so many things yet to do,
you know, have done so many positivethings in the last number of years.
And I think we're againheaded back to the right direction.
(59:36):
And a bread organization needs to be.
And, we've got mymy fellow EAC members are just wonderful.
Yeah. We're very united. Yeah.
And, it's it's really been a privilegethis year to serve at, you.
Know, it's a strong group and it's nice,
Jim, to, bring it towards a close here.
(59:57):
Tell us what you're most looking forwardto in your last few months.
I you see.
The last few months.
So, Mike.
And, of course, it'll go till nextMarch. And,
it is again, just like what we've talked
is that I, I want to leave the EKG.
(01:00:19):
leave it better than I found it.
And that should be the objective.
A very easy member.
And we've had some incredibleas presidents.
I'm very fortunate that,
you know, we had a new hire, Carl Strauss,when he came in to the.
The building is I call our wagonboss, and Carl has just been a godsend.
Carl and his assistant Aaron Ingot and
(01:00:42):
and the camaraderiethat they've developed in that building.
And and they'd all take a bullet for oneanother.
We're very fortunate that Carl Strassmanwas willing to come out of retirement
and, be part of AK
for hopefully even now,another couple of years or more.
And, and,
(01:01:03):
as I get ready to leave HQ, AJ,
I want the members, you know,to feel confident again, to feel,
that it's a privilegeand a really an honor
to be a member of the American Associationand that they're horses.
That means so much to them
that their registration certificates,whether on paper or digital.
(01:01:26):
You know, that. They have value.
That's you know, that.
And that's my goal, as they didwhen I was a young man.
I was taught and trainedthat those certificates, those
there's a registration certificateon on Browning right there and there,
I mean, that's worthmore than what's in my bank account value.
(01:01:47):
Yeah, that's my objective too.
Yeah. Me too.
Well, Mr.
Jim, I just want to thank you so muchfor taking the time to do this with me
and for all those thattake the opportunity to learn and lesson
and for being here in Calgary and,sharing your knowledge and expertise.
Thank you so much.
And to the to the membershipand the viewers.
(01:02:09):
thanks for letting me serveas your president this year.
And I look forward and I won't go away.
I'll still be involved.
And I mean, I'll get to be on somecommittees to follow and so forth. But,
it's really been fun to share,
to bring back to this associationwhat I think my parents, they're both gone
now, but would be pleased
(01:02:30):
that I'm giving back to somethingthat's been a huge part of our lives.
We talked about a lot of great thingsin there as far as I'm concerned.
You know, wewe brought forward your message from AK
and other AK andand then of course talking about breeding.
And I could talk about thatfor three hours with you so.
I could doand I, you know, there's so much more.
(01:02:51):
I mean, I get up at night and,just preach to John.
We need to do this. We need to do this.
And this is why, you know, and andand then and then I get,
you know, you know,I better keep that's my personal opinion.
And usually though, she, she eats it upand you know, and then she just
John is an incredible studentand her folks,
(01:03:12):
her dad had a grandson, a gang,and he and a grandson of, of Poco
Grants or Poco, you know, and, you know,and they had really good
mares, palomino mares.
They were palomino.They were palomino breeders.
Okay.
And, and sobut she didn't have the exposure to the
coffee table talk or did
(01:03:34):
every morning I got up with my,you know, eyes from time as a little kid.
Pancakes.
Karo serpent coffee.
And and they drink coffee and drink milk.
But anyhow, girl, you know, my God,what about that day after yesterday?
I think we better try that cross again,you know, and her dad and grandpa and.
And my uncle. Yeah.You know, and here's why.
(01:03:54):
Or what about that I don't gray horse.
Bernie. Snuffy.
I don't think that that didn't work,you know.
Yeah. Okay.
Every morning.
Yeah.
Yeah it was we had 30 or 40 horses.
We go over, they go overnight.
You sit there and listen,you know, and. Yeah.
Yeah I mean I did that.
That was our conversation.I totally get it.
Because like you, all the oldergenerations of mine are gone, you know.
(01:04:18):
But those were the conversationswe had to.
And I find that now that the conversationsI'm having with my wife and my children
about the crosses and the fallsand what they're turning out like and how
and why and what you'd change about themif you could.
All those things.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And,you know. Very good.
Thank you sir. Thank you. You.
(01:07:25):
So in closing on this episodeof the Quarter Horse Hauler,
I just want to again thank my guest
and our, esteemed leaderand president of the AK, Mr.
Jim Hunt.
Thank you, Jim, for being here
today.
I want to thank Kildare'sAlehouse in Calgary for allowing us
(01:07:49):
the space and the abilityto record here for a day.
And, if you have any opportunityfor me in the future,
I can be an MC,announcer, auctioneer, etc.
at your event.
I also, do clinics for beginners
and intermediates, all sorts of options.
(01:08:11):
If there's something you'd liketo chat about, just drop me an email.
Ryan at Fleetwood farms.com.
That's Ryan at Fleetwood farms.com.
The filming, audiorecording and editing is done by Rodrigo
Henriques, Shannon Milligan,Jared Middlebrook from Star Set Media.
I want to thank my family for allowing methe time and the ability to do this.
And, folks, at this point, this is, costand an ambition that I've taken on myself.
(01:08:38):
If you would like to help support,you can do that at buying me
a coffee.com/ryan Fleetwood.
Also, if you can subscribe,
leave a like or a written review
or tell a friend or twoabout this podcast.
Those things help us out greatly,
so please share it with otherswho you think will enjoy it.
(01:09:00):
All the links are in the show.Description.
The Quarter HorseHauler is a production of myself,
Ryan, a Fleetwood and star set media.
Thank you for listening to the QuarterHorse Hauler.
We'll see younext time. I'm Ryan Fleetwood.
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