S1E8: The Radical Truth About Surf Wax – With Kate Richards

The Chat

The Guest: Kate Richards Founder of Radical Wax | Tennis Coach | Former Lifeguard

The Chat

Cornish Roots and a Life Outdoors Kate grew up in Cornwall, always outside, always moving. Early passions included cricket and running, spurred on by a supportive primary school and a few stand-out teachers. Later, she transitioned into tennis, drawn to its inclusivity and long-game appeal.

A Lifelong Love of the Ocean From childhood swims to teenage surfs with her friend Hannah, the sea has always been part of Kate’s rhythm. Surfing stood out for its lack of pressure and its playful, restorative nature, a contrast to competitive sport.

From Cornwall to the World and Back Again Kate travelled extensively: lifeguarding and surfing in New Zealand, coaching tennis in China and Thailand, and exploring surf spots across the globe. A decade abroad gave her fresh perspective, but Cornwall always pulled her home.

The Spark Behind Radical Wax Back in Cornwall, Kate linked up with spa product company Lemongrass House. A curiosity about what was really in surf wax led her to lab test the top-selling brands. What she found was alarming: 90% of surf waxes are made with paraffin, a petroleum by-product, even those marketed as “eco”.

Creating a Cleaner Alternative After two years of development and setbacks (especially in getting cold-water wax to work), Radical Wax was born. Made from natural ingredients and using waste resin from essential oil production, the wax performs across all conditions. Ben Skinner’s early feedback helped shape the final product, as did input from Surfing England’s junior team.

Sustainability Meets Performance Kate is clear: a product must work or it won’t get used. Her aim is to make sustainability practical and affordable, not a luxury. She also points to the deeper problem of manufacturing systems that hold back progress, rather than brands or individuals.

The Role of Community and the Next Generation Whether it’s the inquisitive groms of today or her own young son with his first surfboard, Kate finds hope in the new wave of ocean lovers. For her, sustainability isn’t just about product swaps, it’s about mindset, responsibility, and action.

Kate’s Top Achievable Tips

1. Get informed – You don’t need a lab, just a curious mind. Dig into what’s behind the brands you use.

2. Anything is better than nothing – Inspired by the 2 Minute Foundation, small steps can lead to real change.

3. Get outside – Even five minutes of fresh air helps reset your mind and body.

4. Get moving in any form – Forget the pressure, just find what you enjoy.

5. Think about your choices – Especially how they affect future generations. It all adds up.

Kate’s Evidence

1. The Cigarette Surfboard Film – A powerful surf-led campaign showing how community action can lead to real policy change.

2. The 89% Project – Most people want change but think they’re alone. This project shows we’re not.

3. BBC Short: Can Surfing Ever Be Sustainable? – Covers surf industry’s environmental impact, but tellingly omits wax.

4. Sustainable Stoke by Greg Borne – A deep dive into the challenges and ethics of surf sustainability.

5. Into the Blue Report (The Wave) – Research into blue health and how controlled surf environments can support wellbeing for all.

Contact Details Website: radicalwax.co.uk Instagram: @RadicalWax Facebook: Radical Wax LinkedIn: Kate Richards

What One Thing Can We Do Today to Make a Better Tomorrow? “Think about how your decisions today affect tomorrow.”

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
over a 100 million surf waxes are sold every year
around 90% of them are made from paraffin wax a byproduct of crude oil
that's a whole lot of petrol chemicals going straight into the ocean hi I'm
Curly Steve and I'm searching for a greener room [Music]

(00:32):
today I'm joined by Kate Richards founder of Radical Wax
she's on a mission to clean up one of surfing's dirtiest secrets the wax we
use from lab tests to launching her own blend she's proving surfers deserve
better kate welcome to the show thank you so much thanks for having me nice to

(00:55):
see you um so let's rewind tell me where did you come from and uh what um what
did you do as a youth yeah so my parents moved down to Cornwall when I was two so
I've grown up in Cornwall by the sea um as a youth I went to school as normal
love sport always been that kid that is bouncing a ball running around outside um ants in your pants and yeah always

(01:22):
been into sport and loving the outdoors excellent so you moved to Cornwall when you were two whereabouts in Cornwall did
you move to yeah I moved to Devon which is between um Truro and Falmouth and went to the school there and then we
moved to Truro when I was in secondary school and went to um went to Penn
School and then Troy College and then university from there fantastic and what

(01:45):
um so when you were you were quite sporty as a girl um what uh what sort of
sports were you into and did you get involved like with school or how did that all come together yeah I was really
lucky to be in Devon school where my head teacher was really sportsorientated and they set up a running club before
school and we'd run from Devon school to the point every Friday I think it was

(02:10):
and that got me into just the habits of going out and running and went with my
yeah all anyone from the school could come there was no it wasn't serious um parents could get involved and then we
did things like the atmouth there was um fun runs and get involved with the school there or go off and do it as well
so yeah it was brilliant having that school community encouraging it and it

(02:35):
was a fun thing to do and yeah non-competitive really excellent and so running was your major sport at that
stage or at that point yeah and also cricket actually i got into um cricket like I said I was always bouncing a ball
around um one of my uh one of the students in school his dad was a professional cricketer and he set up a
after school cricket club at our primary school amazing and um it was great he you know encouraged all the girls and

(03:02):
boys to go and um yes I got into cricket at at primary school and that taught me
loads of the skills and team and uh bowling and yeah all of that side and um
yeah it's brilliant so you so running and cricket running and cricket and how long did that go on for what sort of uh
does that still go on now do you still play cricket now unfortunately I hit I got to kind of Cormal County level of

(03:26):
cricket and tryyous um and I got to that point and I was the only girl in the
tryyouts and I was kind of unfortunately a bit kind of left out of that side of
things i felt a bit of an impostor and um the coaches at that level didn't
include me in like the warm-up so much and things so I kind of got a bit put off by cricket at that point it's

(03:48):
completely different now which is brilliant and that's where I started going into tennis um I my mom put me in
a one of those summer camps over the summer holidays go and have a try out and um straight away loved it and got
into the tennis club from there and sort of tennis took over as my the sport that I got into and found it was much more

(04:12):
inclusive and yeah I felt much more at ease in the tennis tennis sport rather
than the cricket i kind of stopped doing cricket at that point actually so what sort of age did you transfer from Uh
about 11 about 11 and then you've played tennis for many years after that yeah so
even now I I still coach a little bit not too much but and uh I get roped in at they're really desperate for tennis

(04:36):
club um they ask me to come and play sometimes and yeah it's a sport so nice it's a sport that you can do for life
you know see go down and coach uh down there you could still see there's you know doubles getting played and these
guys are in their sort of 70s 80s and it's just such a great sport for life i've yeah really enjoyed being part of
that tennis community i love that that's amazing um I'm not going to tell you about my tennis career cuz I I hit a

(05:03):
ball over there and it it actually goes over there yeah not uh not my not my thing but um
but that's fantastic and so what about the ocean though because I know you're you're super keen on the ocean so tell
me about your ocean story yeah so I've always loved swimming or being in the water actually it doesn't matter what
kind of water i think going on holiday me and my brother we've got we had really blonde hair as kids and we'd end

(05:28):
up having green hair from being in the pool all day you know the chlorine probably was a bit toxic back then but
um yeah we'd always be underwater always trying to swim and then yeah growing up in Cornwall the beaches just becomes
part of your normal just general life um and then really my best friend Hannah
who um she was a bit older than me she got me into surfing by she was a bit

(05:53):
older so she could drive she got bored and she said hey you know do you want to
come with me and I think at that point at 16 trying you going surfing with her it was
so fun and such a different thing compared to all this sort of structured tennis that I was playing at the time i
was like "Whoa this is h you know you get hooked don't you?" Ever since then

(06:16):
that that ocean and the sea and surfing kind of was you know still is a big passion
for me it's quite a different sport isn't it i mean you've got you've got all of these sports and the you know
cricket tennis running you can do those anytime you don't really you can do them
in the rain or you can do them you know but surfing it's you got to be a bit

(06:39):
more choosy and a bit more well you can pretty much find a way then sometime anywhere can't you but uh yeah not as
like you say structured as uh as sports and I think having it as it became it's
not really a sport as well which was nice it was um very much this is active
fun you're getting better but you're not ever having to compete which was a real

(07:04):
change actually everything else that I've had ever done in sport was always training to do an tournament or getting
fitter to be able to play better whereas this was a complete break from that in
that you just go and it's only you that are putting the pressure on yourself to improve to surf maybe better waves or

(07:24):
your board gets a bit shorter maybe makes it a bit easier but it's not really the point of it is just the fun
of it and that's that's what I think was such a change and so and so great
absolutely fantastic i love that and so um so tell me about your surfing you've you've um you started surfing in
Cornwall whereabouts in Cornwall do you reckon uh we actually probably my first ever surf experience was down at Gwian

(07:50):
okay yeah i went down there with with my friend Hannah like I said and yeah we
were surfing in probably summer suits which were terrible i think I used to wear all year round yeah and wore like
five rash vests thinking that would keep me warm when it was probably keeping me colder and you come out you know
dinosaur hands can't get changed um loving it yeah loving it loving it

(08:14):
terrible suit terrible rash rest and just claw hands but yeah that was kind
of Yeah and then from there just Yeah just board got sort of like I said wet
suit got better learned a bit more about winter suits and uh yeah excellent
excellent and you've done a bit of traveling in your time as well yeah yeah tell me about that yeah so after college

(08:38):
at 18 best mate Han again uh we picked our gap year to go traveling on actually
looking back it is all the best surf spots around the world so we got one of those STA travel tickets okay we did
California uh like Fiji Tahiti wow uh Ratonga
New Zealand Australia and back and we even went out to you know Chopu at Tahiti just to see

(09:04):
it we didn't surf how long ago was this good 20 years ago now so that was that
was quite different back then there was sort of not many people surfing Chop at that time we went out and we camped
there uhhuh and there's no one there and we just got a kayak out actually to the
reef break just to see it cuz we were like we you know we come back and you see all the surfers just shredded from

(09:26):
all the reef and um we were like we cannot do that we know our limits but we loved going around and had boards at
different places and yeah so that was like the first time going out anywhere with surf or traveling um and then after
uni um lived in New Zealand for 6 months in Gisbon brilliant surf around there um

(09:49):
what made you go to uh to New Zealand yeah so I did a bit of life beach lifeguarding um and our head of our area
our district Roy he used to go and live out in New Zealand all the time and he said this is from from Cornwall from
Cornwall sorry yeah so I was beach lifeguard for a few years in my during uni in the summers and um yeah he was he

(10:13):
knew we were going wanted to go on another gap year after uni and he said "Yeah have you ever heard of Gisbon in
New Zealand?" And I was like "No." And he's like "If you want to go somewhere to surf for 6 months go there." And I
did okay what's that sort of point break setup a little bit it's more there are
beach breaks it's more boulders okay so and very much like the power in the wave says so much stronger than here so you

(10:38):
you improve so much quicker it's a bit more punch and because the tides are so
small and the ch you know it's just very easy to improve there it's very much like you know where your wave is you
know you can just paddle around it really quiet so going there was brilliant you kind This is north island
or something north Island on the east coast yeah so um around there there's loads of breaks and just at that time no

(11:04):
one there it was um So you were working as a lifeguard yep while you were traveling y and that was New Zealand and
you were there for 6 months and you surfed some awesome waves what next and then came back thought better get a job
really and I went into tennis coaching for a couple of years got all my qualifications in my tennis and was

(11:24):
coaching full-time um and then from there got the opportunity to take um my
tennis abroad over to China because there's international schools over there
um so Har International School wanted to set up a tennis academy at their school
and said "Would you like to come over set up the academy train to be a PE teacher and yeah that got me sort of

(11:49):
took me off again on some travels using Yeah my my coaching in in in the schools
there." That's fantastic so you were just bringing the kids along with on in were you doing anything else apart from
tennis or No at the time it was sort of full-time tennis sort of working out what what I should do you know I had
thought about did a bit of surf instructing as well should I I've always wanted to start a business so I was

(12:13):
always sort of thinking how can I do this in Cornwall i'd had a couple years working at a surf school and was it an
opportunity to set up a surf school or something and that never quite happened and then this opportunity came to go
abroad and sort of took that chance so amazing and that was China so when you
came back from China what what happened then so from China sorry I went to Thailand um so I went to Bangkok from

(12:39):
there another school same thing they wanted to grow their tennis program there and from there and then I came
back after presumably at that stage you've got a name for yourself that they know that you're good at it and they're
keen to get you across there yeah exactly so there'd been a a program in the school where they had these amazing
facilities six corpse at the school but they didn't have really that structured of bringing

(13:04):
yeah all the students through and being in a program it was very much just
having like coaches that or or teachers who tennis wasn't their specialtity so I
came in and just sort of created some structure tennis was taught in all the PE lessons and we could start bring the
kids internationally to competing as well so my role was kind of developing it to set up set up the academy there

(13:30):
and yeah get the kids playing more and these were English uh a mix of expats
and local Thai kids okay so how did you get on with the language terrible
so um yeah it's it's another international school so uh English was spoken my uh Mandarin is slightly less
terrible but my Thai is um yeah shockingly bad i'd say Mandarin is a difficult language mandarin is tricky

(13:55):
yeah but you you can't get away with any English in Beijing you need to be able
to get home basically and get you know emergency Mandarin is uh Yeah is it
literally emergency Mandarin yeah i like that so So what do you think um
you you you've got your lifeguarding your surfing your surf coaching your tennis um what do you think sort of that

(14:22):
is the thread that holds that all together yeah I think it's really getting kids or people or out and
outside and getting them to work out what they want to do with this
sport is it something they wanted to get better at is it something they want to do for fun um lifeguarding was all about
sort of preventing people getting injured surf coaching was more about giving them a taste of a different a

(14:48):
different sport that they might not have tried before and then tennis was yeah taking those players to the next level
so the theme is really just new I guess an improvement i guess
that's where who I was meeting that was what they wanted out of kind of coming to me for their whatever sport it was
excellent excellent what a beautiful gift to be able to give to to children well to anyone really i used to do some

(15:13):
self coaching as well and it was uh yeah fantastic to be able to give that sport to Yeah really to to new people who who
hadn't experienced it before and um yeah I was I was coaching maybe 15 or so
years ago and I still have people come up to me now and say you know I'm really
good you know I've been off traveling around the world surfing and things and it's it's a beautiful thing to have shared with uh with people absolutely

(15:41):
amazing excellent so um so after Thailand what what what
happened then yeah i just think the calling of every time I came back to Cornwall and visited family it kind of
every year would get harder to go back out um almost like the more I was
traveling the more I wanted to come back and have that kind of base so I was

(16:04):
always kind of in my mind thinking yeah how do I get back home um and I think just that point of kind of don't realize
where you are until you kind of are leaving it when you're going hang on a minute if I'm more sad to be going back
to my my role you know my job back there there's something not quite right here
so um the opportunity came to start a different business back here and I think

(16:29):
at that time it was like right yeah maybe it's time to go home and get
back into get back into the Cornish world so yeah Bangkok and chi and Thailand sorry Bangkok and Beijing
pretty much the antithesis of Cornwall there's no sea it's very busy it's very populated it's

(16:49):
quite a tough life in in that Yeah you are always going to be that you know the
fish out of water there a little bit so it was yeah it was just time to come back i think I'd got my traveling bug
out of me at that point and uh yeah time to come home and how much if you include
your gap years and your New Zealand how how long were you traveling for

(17:14):
yeah it must be nearly a decade actually yeah getting up to that yeah maybe nish
years yeah so yeah it was time to come back and maybe be a bit sensible i don't
know what's sensible no no I'm not quite sure what you mean
so what So you came back and what what happened then yeah so I had the opportunity to So as I say I was um out

(17:38):
in Thailand and part of my role there was taking the kids down to Phuket to
tennis tournaments we'd go and play a school down there and um came across
this amazing spa product company mhm and it was a chance to bring back presents for people back here that weren't sort
of NAF gifts and um so I got to know about this company and sort of saw how

(18:02):
they sourced their natural ingredients and loved what they were doing brought
it back and just every time I'd go back down there you know you buy a few extra bits and you start rather than giving them away you start keeping them and um
through tennis and through fan uh friends and family got to know the owner
Bobby who um is an American guy who set up the uh business out there and he sort

(18:26):
of said you know if you ever go back to the UK you know let me know might have
some opportunities for you to start this back back in the UK and tell me tell me what was the business yeah so yeah
Lemongrass House basically these natural spa products and um Yeah that what they
do is they they create these amazing natural beauty products but they also have this great they have a great

(18:51):
ability to make other products outside of their line so they're sort of showing me what they do for these other brands
and you know the creativity that they have and they said you know got a retail line but actually there's so many other
things that you could do so that's always kind of stuck in my mind of wow this is a great product i love the

(19:11):
sustainability side of it the ethics behind it and also this opportunity to do something different as well they're
very open to that so I think that was so that's what I kind of brought back here was learning right okay let's see if
what we can do with these products back in the UK and um yeah that's what I was
doing when I first came back so that was when you first came back and you bought

(19:35):
back these uh these spa products yep and you started selling those when you got
back all online yeah we're selling them online had a little tuk tuk uh we sell some out the back of that um I was doing
a bit of tennis coaching still so kept my coaching just keeping my hand in at that so I was kind of learning had never
run a business before learning sort of that side of things also keeping up with

(20:00):
tennis loving being back and having some um doing a bit of coaching again and
yeah that's what how it all sort of came back to here and you've got a beautiful little boy tell us about that yeah so in
all of that um was lucky enough to get pregnant and yeah so he came along just
when Lemongrass House was sort of starting up so I kind of came away from

(20:23):
that side of the business um and yeah focused on on raising him um he's now
six got his first board for his sixth birthday so um yeah it's really First
surfboard first surfboard amazing so yeah looking forward to something that we can do together as he gets older
absolutely yeah and again that's another a beautiful thing for a young man to be

(20:47):
able to get on with or a young boy yeah absolutely so um when did you start when
did studying come into all of this yeah I think I've always got this I think it came about from
having having just the I the always in my mind is getting better at things so I
think I've always been like a wanting to learn or improve i'm always like thinking I

(21:12):
can be a bit faster or I can be a bit better at I can be a bit better at tennis i can be I can learn more about business so this opportunity came up to
study at Farmouth University and it just yeah really it was just the
right time right combination of what they were offering and having a a new product to to to launch it just was um

(21:36):
the perfect timing to and this was still when you just had the the spa products
at the time I just started yeah brought in a new radical wax which was part
which is the new product to launch so let's just rewind a minute
what we've gone from spa products to radical wax

(21:58):
what happened in between yeah there's a bit of a gap there this is this is exciting yeah so it's kind of radical
wax is um the culmination of everything I'd say what say what is Radical Wax so
Radical Wax is um a a collaboration with Lemongrass House so using their
expertise in natural products and we are the first surf wax company that is

(22:20):
sustainably made by a spa product company so I went back to Bobby and said
you know hey you know we have all these different ideas about products and can we really have a go at making an eco
surf wax you know I've come back from being in Asia for so long i go in the shops there's no eco surf waxes there um

(22:40):
to even buy the ones that I can buy online or difficult to find and
unfortunately just don't hold up compared to your traditional
your best sellers you know and um yeah we he came over to visit and just we
were sat in Permpor he was seeing the sea seeing how many people surf over here and it was like yeah let's let's

(23:04):
give this a go so um yeah it's um it's a combination of yeah our his expertise um
my passion for surfing and both of our passions for making good products from good ingredients and um yeah so he was
sending me samples to test out here goats no so just just before just just

(23:27):
let's again let's rewind there's a reason why
um you wanted to make an eco wax and that was something to do with a high percentage of you you've got some wax
tested yeah so in my quest for because it's really difficult to make um a good

(23:48):
eco surf wax um it's also really hard to know what's in any surf wax looking at
all the packets you go online try and find out what's in them so from a kind of a really curious standpoint I was
going "Okay there's an eco wax and then there's a not and then there's a wax what makes

(24:09):
that eco and what makes that not eco?" So I took the sort of the top
bestselling waxes to a lab and said "Look can you just help me i don't know what is in these it says attackifier
what is that?" And um attackifier attack fire something something makes it tacky
okay right yeah okay so um yeah took it to the lab asked them to break it down

(24:33):
just to help me be okay what is in these things to then can help me make a an eco
or a natural version basically and I sort of on through my research realizing that no way you know there's 100 million
bars sold every year and that's growing 100 million bars of wax sold every year

(24:54):
globally wow and 90% are prochemically based basically so they're a mix of that
lab report showed it was a mix of petrochemicals so or paraffin wax um
toxic scents so every time you know you smell your bar of wax it's actually you know I still do it and it's uh it's just

(25:14):
the scents in there are just synthetic and not good quality and then the rest
of it is just a filler so limestone so it's just a blend of these three kind of
how they're made how they're manufactured or even when you're rubbing it on your board and it's going on your skin or where it's going afterwards
they're all problematic to the to the planet to the to the to the um coral to

(25:39):
to all sorts of different things yeah and even when you dewax your board it's and you put it you know say you put it in the bin that's just going to stick in
landfill for you know wax companies say you know so good it lasts so long and
actually that's not a good thing yeah okay yeah for sure and so it's it's it
would be um good to point out there 90% of waxes are um are that there's also

(26:06):
10% that are Yeah uh and what came about as well unfortunately is that the lab
reports did show that even your ecoaxes that you think are organic natural
plant-based unfortunately are still coming out as being paraffin based because there's no
regulations there's no one testing to see what's in them and yeah so even your

(26:30):
sort of top brands that you think are eco are unfortunately yeah greenwashing what they're doing so it's uh and since
we first met um because we met a while ago um since we first met I've had a
look at some of the um brands of wax and I've tried to find online what's in them
and people are pretty quiet about about what's in them aren't they um there's no

(26:55):
glaring ingredients on the side or anything like that yeah um which is a
shame really cuz I've I've surfed for over 40 years and uh I've never even
considered what's in my wax i've used the same brand for for most of that time
um it's great wax but then it's actually not that great yeah and that's it i'm

(27:18):
exactly the same i'm I'm I've used the same wax too until kind of finding and
like you say you don't know even if you look for it you don't know what's in it so um yeah it's it's a sad state that
the the surf wax industry is in but it's only because I think it is really
difficult to make an alternative so you don't think you know I know yeah yeah

(27:42):
you made one yeah it's taken two years to get right you know to get and we might be good at this point to also say
that I've tried your wax um and I've used it for several months now so I've used it through um through the cold
water and uh and the the coming into the sort of warmer months and uh it's a
really good wax it's as good as it's as good as any other um which I'm over the

(28:08):
moon about um and um so you did have a
an issue with the different temperatures didn't you is obviously people like to
surf in the tropics or they like to surf in Iceland or you know they like to surf
at different temperatures and if you have a wax that um if you use a a type

(28:31):
of wax in a hot area then it just melts straight off the board and if you use a
that same if you use a wax that won't melt off your board in the summer in the winter then it's rock solid and has no
stick to it so you've got to deal with that or how how did that go yeah so that
was our biggest time um time consuming issue issue yeah basically it took a

(28:57):
year to get the cold right so like I said it's all made out in Thailand using their amazing ingredients oh it's quite
hot in Thailand it's quite hot in Thailand so um they were saying "Yeah our wax is you know the cold is actually
running absolutely melting out here." So it they couldn't test it all the or the
cool um so everything was coming back to me to test here and me testing it through the different seasons um and

(29:24):
yeah the cool was just either being too was smearing it wasn't bumping up it
would just come over and it' be didn't work um so but it was key that I you
know I said we've got to have all the different temperatures cold is what where you know where the surf community
is here like you say you travel and you take your other temperatures with you but to not have a full range I didn't

(29:48):
feel right to me it had to be we had to get everything right so they were mixing up the cool in fridges over there uh
went to refrigerated units to get it right testing it on wax um went Yeah
like these big food companies can we just bring our surfboard in your uh out back waxing up your board in your fridge
exactly and then sending it over here and you know we're back and forth going

(30:13):
yeah that was about and there's even one point where they just said look I don't think we're going to get the cold and I
said I think you can like I just believe you can cuz you just you're such an
expert in this so yeah it was lots of tweaking lots of different waxes we tried lots of different fruit waxes
different um oils different butters different resins so it's just a case of

(30:39):
yeah loads of these little pops of waxes around the place and testing and testing and testing till we yeah got that
formula right and and am I right in in um in thinking that it's a waste product
yeah so that's the difference so we use a lot of the similar like cocoa butter or the lemongrass in the spa products

(30:59):
and that's going into the wax there to make it be able to to apply but the tac
is actually one of the resins that we remove when you distill down essential
oils so an essential oil is basically the most concentrated part of a plant
that's been distilled in water and that the the water takes the essence and it

(31:23):
goes down and re reforms into and you use that scent and then the byproduct of
that is all the sticky tacky tar resin that is usually just you know it's a
natural product but it's usually just thrown away so it was a case of which one of our products that we're already
making can actually go back into the wax and create a different kind of tack and

(31:47):
yeah that was again a trial and error and yeah we found the right combination to get so we got two resins in there and
they've gone back into the wax to create the grip so what have you got now you've got a cold
which ones have you got so yep got the full set now cold cool warm tropical and a base coat as well so that can

(32:08):
effectively take you anywhere in the world yeah so I know like El Salvador where it's really really hot and maybe
even tropical wax is not tropical enough you can use a base coat there as well which is a really really hard version of
of the others and you took your um your wax to one of our fav favorite surfers
Ben Skinner didn't you and asked him his uh his opinion on it he was a huge help

(32:33):
and I've I'm really glad I got to see him about a month ago um to say "Do you realize how much you help me?" Um so I
went to him his his uh factory over in Yuki sort of just turned up hoping to
catch him because I know he's always off competing and traveling and he was very very kind and gave me half an hour of
time and said "Right come on then let's get your wax out." And this was in sort of prototype stage of still like getting

(32:58):
the versions right and he said "Look this is what I want to see from a wax."
He got one of his boards we did half of it what he uses half of it using radical
wax sort of version three or four probably by then and it just wasn't up
to what he wanted and actually all of his feedback was fantastic and at that point we didn't have a base coat and he

(33:20):
said go back actually you need to get a base coat that's really hard that then
your top coat can stick to and he really developed um yeah hearing from him what he wants
as a prourfer what he needs that half an hour really really benefited um what
what we did so um yeah thank you Ben well you don't get much better than that do you you know that's that's fantastic

(33:46):
feedback excellent um and so what what was your university journey because that
was about that time that that was starting more yeah I think I we got to
the point of very basic having a finished product like we had like a few
bars in the different temperatures and I so went to Fouth University and said "Look I'd love your help to help me

(34:13):
launch this product i've got sort of five five different waxes."
Yeah how do I take a new brand to market how do I get this known how do I get this story across because you know what
I'm what I'm facing is people not knowing what's in their wax this big
distrust of eco waxes we've all been kind of burned before you know you know can you help me do

(34:38):
this can I'd love to be part of like being with other founders and other businesses that are just on that kind of
starting of their of what could be and being in a nice community and having mentors and and learning how to do this
kind of in a bit more of a structured way rather than me potentially just taking a much longer

(35:00):
time to do it on my own so um yeah it's been great so that was with the uh what
um what part of the university was that that you were with there yeah so I'm on a master's course at Felmouth University
okay called entrepreneurship and business innovation and it's in the launchpad in the Pending campus so I'm

(35:23):
on there with other masters students and we've all got different different businesses that are ready to go
basically so you've all got a product or or a service or something that's ready to go and and that's what that course is
about is moving it forward for you so the course is designed for people with even having just an idea or me and I was

(35:45):
maybe a bit more ahead of the usual group where I actually had the finished product but I wanted to have help with
the launch um so yeah we're all we're all in different stages but actually it's really great to learn from each
other from some people being ahead some people being like still sort of getting their ideas together and seeing how Yeah

(36:05):
things changed so quickly from customers so like or from the people who you know
surface for me it's like hearing from Ben changed so much about what we did and that's what we kind of have learned
it's like we you know it's what what the people who you're making these products
for tell you is the most important thing and so so how is that going cuz um I

(36:30):
guess that your customer is first of all a surf shop secondly the actual surfer
um you know how's what's the feedback like that you're getting yeah it's been a mix actually and having this course
has been a real and having um the network that it's created and the people
who I've met has actually been really great in knowing how to how to reach surfers so is that through surf shops is

(36:54):
it best to actually not be through surf shops and they come directly to us from the website and building a community and
I think originally it was all about yeah we got to get in every surf shop and but
with that route you never get to know who they are they may buy it once and then you don't know you never see them
so I think what what I've learned is actually okay it's better to build this

(37:18):
from the surfing community up and I get to know people i get to know what they want if they come to the website we can
bring them into Radical Wax and get to know like feedback we get to see what
they want i met with you from being like "Hey have you tried the wax?" You know absolutely tell me what you think i'd
love to know you know how it's going and I would never have that if I'm trying to

(37:42):
get it in every surf shop i just I could potentially just Yeah never never meet you through that
so and you've um you've leveled it up a bit since then as well haven't you cuz you've got involved with the the the
British juniors is it so it's yeah this uh surfing England who I actually went to them originally to ask them to test
the works as well so a bit like Ben seeing how he how it was applying to his board i asked them I said could you give

(38:08):
this to your coaches give this to your juniors could you just give me some feedback on what you think is it good
enough for them my surfing is very average but these guys are doing you
know they need their feet to stick to the board don't they more than me you know it's fine for me more than me as
well whereas you know you've got these amazing genius coming up now and it's

(38:30):
critical that this wax is sticking for them in contests i mean that's the most the pinnacle of it being tested and the
credibility of it so the the feedback from them was like "Yeah we love it we've been looking for a wax for ages
and we've never found one an eco wax that kind of stands up like you said it's got to be as good as what what's

(38:51):
out there already if it's better even better but if it doesn't perform doesn't
matter how eco it is it's it's not going to be used so the feedback from those guys has been fantastic um I went and
watched the the them competing over at uh Nuki last year and just got a chance
to meet some of the juniors before we sort of formalized a sort of a bit more of a partnership with them and yeah they

(39:17):
are the ones who actually what's in your wax you know why to know they really
care and um that was really really great to hear that they're much more
inquisitive about where their products come from um and that was great to hear
that gave me like that was really positive so I was like "Oh I feel like I'm really fit with these guys and this

(39:39):
section of the of the team." So So performance is is meeting sustainability
at this stage that was the key that has always been number one is it's got to
perform otherwise it's going to become a waste it's going to become more unsustainable because we're making
product that isn't fit for purpose so and I've heard this time and time again with um with professional surfers where

(40:05):
um they want to be sustainable but the product isn't out there for them to be
sustainable for example wets suits for example surfboards uh you know the
surfing as an industry is quite a a sort of contradictory industry isn't it because you've got a lot of surfers that
go traveling so there's there's air time you've got um surfers using boards that

(40:28):
are made out of products that are you know not the best um environmentally
wise um wets suits is massive thing right now about uh wets suits um so that
performance and sustainability in the surf industry what what your thoughts on that yeah I think the innovations have
been amazing um I think it's also what's not really discussed is it's actually

(40:55):
the manufacturers that actually stop the brands potentially from being more sustainable so every brand out there
wants to be sustainable of course I mean it's what it's what we want it's what surfers want we're in the sea we're the
ones swimming in the in the sea with all these things going in into them but if

(41:15):
you're a brand that says "Yeah we of course we want to use not or the best
possible material." If the factory that makes it says we can't do it or we that
we don't have that material it's difficult for a brand to then
not do what they're doing um so a lot of brands and a lot of surfers feel like this sort of guilt is put onto them or

(41:40):
um there's a lot of backlash maybe but potentially it's just been it's just not been available the technology but now
what's so positive is that there are these innovations manufacturers are now getting on board as well and like what
we're seeing is these huge shifts in like the wets suit industry where things have just kind of like rich reached this

(42:00):
tipping point where you know there's films and docu documentaries coming out about the harmful effects of how they're
made but if the manufacturer is still making it as an alternative there is not
many options so yeah that that manufacturing side is actually where
it's key for this performance and sustainability to to move forward yeah

(42:25):
and I think um cost is a massive factor as well isn't it yes because everything
green seems to be so much more expensive and um unfortunately in today's economy
it's really difficult for people to be able to meet those extra demands so do
you not surf or do you surf with something that's slightly worse for the planet or a lot worse for the planet and

(42:48):
pay a lot cheaper for it you know yeah it's really difficult it's all these conundrums and I think yeah at the
moment it is more expensive to use sustainable products which is pricing out certain people and I think just as
we as me and as manif and as other brands grow and it becomes the norm these costs

(43:12):
will come down I think it's this starting point where yeah these materials are more expensive
and so but but the more they're used and the more they're bought that's when we and whatever i think also it's really
important to for uh people who can afford these products to step up and and
afford them because that will bring the price down yeah yeah and that's the aim

(43:35):
is like we want to make these products for everybody absolutely and that's the key so it's um
Yeah i I it's this real tricky balance between creating a product that is just
more expensive to make it there's no getting around it and being able to get it to as many people as possible so
absolutely absolutely that's my aim what about the challenges what challenges have you faced along the way yeah it's

(44:02):
um I think it's this knowledge um disconnect between people using it and
what's going on and potentially also where where it was sort of said mentioned the surf shops earlier is
maybe surf shops not realizing what surfers want so much and
so some surf shops you know open their arms up and say "Yeah we definitely want to take this." Some surf shops like we

(44:26):
said it's slightly more expensive they're very price sensitive so if they think "Nope we're not going to we don't
want to have a expensive wax," then they don't take it m so then it's a it's
kind of like it's the whole industry learning what what's going on to then

(44:46):
make it be more available i think it's um so the barriers really are bit of a knowledge gap and
getting the word out there yeah we can do something slightly different and taking a punt yeah yeah give it a bloom
and go give it a go yeah yeah absolutely um

(45:07):
so what gives you hope ah the next generation for sure absolutely they are
the ones who are driving this you know every decision I make probably in life now actually started off thinking about
what my values for radical wax every decision I make within the business is
how does this affect the next generation so everything we do is designed to be like

(45:32):
okay whatever our next product or our next sort of thing that we're bringing in does it benefit them yes or no it's
very simple so they give me hope because you you know go and see them surfing they're so full of They're just so fun
they're just so fun so full of energy and and enthusiasm and stoke yeah

(45:53):
so these guys they're just love a knife it's brilliant yeah it's really nice seeing the Groms out there at the moment
they're sort of doing their thing and and it sort of I guess it brings you
back to when when you were a Grom and you were you had that much infused and
that much stoke well I pretty much have now but yeah exactly and it's that innocence of they're just there to have

(46:16):
fun absolutely and they all cheering each other on and it's uh Yeah it's
great so on a sort of holistic sort of starting a business um starting a
sustainable business what would your sort of takeaway be for someone who's
keen to do it and maybe they've not got themselves to the right space yet what what what would you say to them because you've gone through you've gone through

(46:39):
hell of a journey to to get to where you're at and you've you've sort of started when you weren't quite sort of
ready and and spent that time on a journey to get everything ready so what
what would your sort of takeaway be for for those that are trying to get going i
think you're never ready i think um if you wait to be ready you'll never start

(47:02):
i think you learn the most in failure so just do it i think you know everybody's
in the same boat everyone's sort of just doing what they can and so yeah my advice would just be like just start
otherwise you never know brilliant could be the best thing you ever did yeah and failure is so important failurees you

(47:23):
learn more from failure than anything else right and that's it and that's what people don't talk about is um you know
even this week we've been getting a few t-shirts made and I mean it's been a some of them have
been a total disaster but you just go "Wow." Have you been making them yourself not me but just trying to get
them designed yeah yeah no way knitting them up that's it you just learn you go "Right okay maybe we wasted a week but

(47:49):
maybe we've learned so much for forever." So yeah absolutely so that's
good so just get going just do it yeah just do it amazing so we're going to move on to your uh we've got five top
tips from you um and Alex our uh producer over there is going to he's got

(48:10):
the bell ready and he's going to give you one minute to talk about each top tip brilliant are you ready to go so
I'll read your top tip out and then uh and we'll go from there so the your first top tip is get informed knowledge
is power yes so bit like me i don't have to take it to the extreme and take stuff
to a lab but just delving in and knowing what just we've got all got the internet

(48:35):
we can all sort of search and see what's going on maybe look behind the brand or look behind just LinkedIn or you know
website whatever it is and just then you have choice i think knowledge gives you choice and you can like you said earlier
if you can choose to do something or you can choose not to and I think that's what's so nice rather than just going

(48:55):
out and being not knowing what you're buying um we all have that power now to
do that yeah absolutely oh that's good timing good timing that's that's really
important isn't it to sort of research what you're what you're buying or Yeah
there's so many good websites out there to be to to give you that information as well isn't it excellent so number two

(49:18):
tip is anything is better than nothing yeah and this idea came from um meeting
with the two-minut foundation they are very much in that there's so much and it feels so overwhelming that people just
don't start who's the two-minute foundation twoinut Foundation uh there's this great group of um ocean lovers and

(49:39):
they go and they just get they help doing beach cleans they educate in local
schools about plastic they're all about trying to remove plastic off beaches and yeah they just give simple tips of hey
this is something that you could do and what they found is that if you just start doing something for 2 minutes it
might lead to 10 minutes so just doing something if we all did something that's

(50:03):
2 minutes long it actually creates this big change and I just love that sentiment of do some Yeah do something
it doesn't have to be amazing but it's something and it's uh it can help so
thank you Alex um so so that's interesting because that sort of almost
brings us back to the beginning where you talked about running didn't you and you said that because you were doing it

(50:28):
every Friday it would just came became a habit and yeah that's that's that 2
minutes is great isn't it i think that's um the same with meditation you quite
often people say "Oh yeah I'm going to meditate for an hour." And it's like just do a minute just do a minute for a
month minute a day for a month and then the second month do two minutes and then three minutes and then four minutes and

(50:51):
um yeah that's that's awesome um we'll have to talk later about the uh twominut
foundation uh number three get outside
yeah I mean I think I always feel better or I know when I've been stuck inside
all day and I think yeah just getting outside rain wind sun whatever it is I

(51:14):
think you always feel better whatever you do even if you're just outside having a cup of tea or whatever go for a walk get out in the nature i think it
just does so much for your mind your body um especially for me
I think like I said I've got ants in my pants i'm always trying to jiggle around so like getting out there gets that kind
of um gets that movement and uh yeah always feel better for it brilliant

(51:39):
brilliant get out there and smell the roses um get moving in any form whatever
you enjoy yeah and I guess that's a bit like what I've just said but yeah I think it's people
you know finding what you love uh I've got a friend who I was chatting to today actually she's will swim happily in
freezing cold you know January but won't go swimming in a swimming pool so it's

(52:04):
um for me I think she's you know big respect that she goes out then when it's
freezing but for me that feels way harder than going for a swim in the pool
so um yeah find what you love and um do it that's the key then you will want to
do it it should never feel forced find what you love and do it yeah that's beautiful beautiful oh well done Alex

(52:30):
number five think about your choices uh think about how your choices affect
future generations you can make a difference yeah I think that's coming back to what I said earlier is just
being having a bit of perspective i think like coming a mom that's made it be much more in the forefront of my mind
maybe when you're sort of not everybody but maybe when I was younger just sort of thought about the here and now and

(52:56):
what's just tomorrow maybe but not really thinking hang on what's 30 years
look like or what's 50 years look like and yeah these choices we're making now
um yeah they do have an impact and we should be thinking about how what what
we're leaving good and bad and that's been my big drive is like if I can leave

(53:18):
something positive positive in this world through surf wax or you know whatever it is that would be a fantastic
achievement I think that's a beautiful thing a beautiful thing let's talk
evidence you've brought in uh five pieces of evidence to um about sort of
what you're speaking of and um about sustain

(53:43):
put my teeth back in and about sustainability um so once again you got one minute Alex
is on the bell and uh your first piece of evidence is the cigarette surfboard
movie yeah this was a great film that I got to watch um over in Yuki the boys
came Yeah yeah the guys who made it came over and were telling their story behind

(54:06):
um what they did and this act of people flicking a cigarette butt and finding
them at the beach and finding them everywhere and it just showed how that they a community could make a difference
right up to sort of law level and create a ban in of these products that are not
serving anybody you know not even the smokers it was saying it was damaging their health more So what was just a

(54:33):
great evidence in sort of surfing was the the vehicle that it was told through
was um yeah just showing how two guys can
create such a movement through bringing people on board creating a surfboard that's made of cigarette butts surfed in
these amazing waves and create a change amazing amazing yeah that was a superb

(54:56):
film and I uh you know recommend anyone to go and watch that it was really good
um so this your second piece of evidence is the 89%
project go for it so this is probably um well I've heard from this project from Chris
Hines he sort of pointed it out going to see him speak on how he started off at SAS and his You mean the same very same

(55:22):
Chris Hines that we had on the show before that's the guy and I'm sure he mentioned it before as well but um yeah
looking into it and sort of highlighted that we all think that it's just us thinking that we want better products
when actually it's this 89% of the population are going God we want change
and no one realizes that the person next to them is thinking exactly the same thing so it's just a piece of evidence

(55:48):
that gives me hope and this this ongoing project so if you type it in you can sort of see what what's being put out in
the media versus what people are thinking it's this sort of highlighting this disjoint between reality and what's
shown to you um amazing so we should have a look into that um so number three uh you gave me a

(56:11):
link to a YouTube um film uh it's a BBC um sort of docu short um called can
surfing ever become sustainable yeah so this sort of highlighted the different
areas of surfing which are unsustainable and the progress that is being made or not being made but what I wanted to send

(56:33):
in is just to show you that yeah the body boards are that are snapping or the resins that we're using or how shaping
boards these are all being highlighted but there was no mention at all about wax on that clip and it just was like
very evident to me that it's just a product that's just completely overlooked in our industry by surfers
and reporters as well so it's just a little clip to show you yeah it's not it's not featured yeah interesting yeah

(57:00):
so that's that's something that you're um you're shouting about now and you want us to all shout about as well so uh
use the wax and then tell your friends so So um we're bringing a book now um
called Sustainable Stoke and that's written by a chap called uh Gregory Bourne yeah so Gregory Greg Bourne he

(57:22):
was actually on this documentary and I was lucky to be taught by him as part of
my course he took my sustainability module he has a big passion for bringing sustainability into surfing or talking
to lots of different people within the industry to see change and sort of bring
theory to the to surfing and behavior in not just surfing but the community and

(57:48):
he was just yeah just a really good voice and knowledge of all the things that's going on not
only in sustainability but surfing as well and he's um he's I think he's
written three books hasn't he or is it four um and they're all available online and we'll put the uh the link to all of
your evidence and your top tips uh on our website um and then number five uh a

(58:14):
report by the wave um in Bristol that's right yeah and this is the into the blue
report yeah so the wave is this artificial wave the first one in the world in Bristol so as a surfer you kind
of think "What an artificial wave in Bristol what you know what's all that about?" and um surfed there a couple of

(58:36):
times been to some great sustainability events there and actually learning what
their why was why they built it and knowing all the evidence of this blue health and how water any water or can
just help people's minds bodies and in a controlled environment where you can set

(58:57):
the waves to be a certain height it just brings so many people there that perhaps
the sea is a barrier to for people you know so Bristol and the local area is
accessible to more people can shut things down you can create this positive
space for people to try surfing but actually their goal is mental health and

(59:21):
getting better and I was interested when I looked at a report about um the uh how
nature in itself is is uh is really good for mental health and um that's been a
massive part of my life is is I mean my mom used to find me down the beach if if ever I've uh you know wasn't quite sure

(59:42):
of what was going on in my head I'd be down the beach um looking out to see um
and it's it's so powerful isn't it well it's Do you know what it's been awesome
talking to you today we're not quite finished yet cuz I'd really like you to tell us uh how we can get in contact
with you or how we can buy the wax yeah thank you yeah thanks for having me as well loved it pleasure um so yeah we're

(01:00:06):
Radical Wax uh radicalwax.co.uk and also RadicalWax on Instagram and
Facebook excellent excellent and you're on LinkedIn linkedin so if anyone wants
to get in contact with you they can do it through that or or through the other channels whatever excellent okay so um

(01:00:26):
tell us what's the one thing we can all start doing today to create a better
tomorrow and help us find us a a greener room the most powerful thing you can do
is think about how your decisions today affect tomorrow i think if you have that
in mind with whatever you're doing you're going to have a greener room tomorrow and a greener room for years to

(01:00:51):
come excellent i love that thank you very much thank you so much for coming on the show and thank you so much for
your wax and thank you so much for what you're doing for the planet and the people thank you and uh take care thank
you that's it for this episode of Searching for a Green Room we'd love to hear your thoughts let us know what you

(01:01:12):
think who you'd like to hear from any topics you want us to cover drop us a
comment don't forget to like and subscribe so you never miss an episode see you next time