Fit for TV, The Biggest Loser Exposed, Lindsay Lohan’s Freakier Friday Comeback & Australia Recognises Palestine

This week, Claire and Gab dive into three huge stories about power, perception, and the narratives we buy into:

Fit for TV: The Rise & Fall of The Biggest Loser Netflix’s new three-part documentary revisits The Biggest Loser, exposing the toxic diet culture behind the so-called “empowerment” show. We break down the scandals, the metabolic damage contestants still live with, and how the franchise shaped (and scarred) an entire generation’s relationship with food, fitness, and body image.

Lindsay Lohan’s Wholesome Hollywood Return From Freaky Friday nostalgia to her new role as a sober mother living largely out of the spotlight, Lindsay Lohan is back in a way few could have predicted. We unpack her comeback, her decision to live in Dubai for privacy, and what her story says about survival, reinvention, and second chances.

Australia Recognises Palestine: What Does It Really Mean? Australia has joined a growing number of nations formally recognising Palestine as a state. But what does “recognition” actually mean in practice? We explain the two-state solution in plain language, why public sentiment and protests shifted Albanese and Penny Wong’s stance, and how Israel has reacted.

Plus:

• Claire’s obsession with the Bruce Lehrmann defamation appeal (and the judges’ savage one-liners)

• Justice for The Parent Trap’s Meredith Blake continues

• Why eyebrow comebacks and mouth taping somehow made it into this week’s banter

If you’re here for sharp analysis, pop culture nostalgia, and a dose of side-eye at the spin behind the headlines, you’re in the right place.

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Keywords: SpinCycle, Australian podcast, The Biggest Loser Netflix documentary, diet culture, Lindsay Lohan comeback, Freaky Friday, Australia recognises Palestine, two-state solution explained, Bruce Lehrmann appeal, pop culture analysis, Claire Anglim, Gabriella Bonanno

Episode Transcript

(00:03):
.9411764706We did miss the week last week. 4 00:00:05,9.8039215686 --> 00:00:07,480.3921568627 I really missed it, but I think, you know, it's warranted. 5 00:00:07,715.6862745098 --> 00:00:08,68.6274509804 Yeah. 6 00:00:08,68.6274509804 --> 00:00:12,862.745098039 I mean, I don't know if anyone can tell that my voice is very husky indeed compared to what it normally is. 7 00:00:13,68.62745098 --> 00:00:13,303.921568627 Yeah. 8 00:00:13,333.333333333 --> 00:00:15,215.68627451 Claire was out of action last week. 9 00:00:15,264.705882353 --> 00:00:21,705.882352941 So yeah, for the sake of your ears, we thought we'd give it a week, and so Claire could recover. 10 00:00:21,911.764705882 --> 00:00:23,205.882352941 I did have a funny story though. 11 00:00:23,470.588235294 --> 00:00:27,147.058823529 I woke up on Monday with the worst. 12 00:00:27,382.352941176 --> 00:00:28,000 Sore throat. 13 00:00:28,58.823529412 --> 00:00:33,676.470588235 It was so painful and I didn't have anything. 14 00:00:33,676.470588235 --> 00:00:34,794.117647059 So I went to Chemist Warehouse. 15 00:00:34,794.117647059 --> 00:00:34,852.941176471 Yeah. 16 00:00:34,852.941176471 --> 00:00:39,705.882352941 And just went to back of the chemist and I was like, what is the strongest throat spray you've got? Yes. 17 00:00:39,882.352941176 --> 00:00:43,235.294117647 And he gave me this like strep cell forte one, and it's all over the count. 18 00:00:43,235.294117647 --> 00:00:45,000 It can't be that bad, but it's got anesthetic. 19 00:00:45,352.941176471 --> 00:00:49,274.509803922 It's got anesthetic, and it said two pumps. 20 00:00:49,656.862745098 --> 00:00:51,68.62745098 And obviously I didn't do two pumps. 21 00:00:51,68.62745098 --> 00:00:52,9.803921569 I did a lot more than that. 22 00:00:52,558.823529412 --> 00:00:55,500 Then like trying to swallow in the water's, like falling outta your mouth. 23 00:00:55,558.823529412 --> 00:00:55,764.705882353 Oh no.

(00:56):
.411764706But this is not a product recommendation. 25 00:00:58,529.411764706 --> 00:00:59,705.882352941 I mean, the product was very good. 26 00:00:59,705.882352941 --> 00:01:00,558.823529412 It did exactly. 27 00:01:01,88.235294118 --> 00:01:02,647.058823529 I couldn't feel anything but. 28 00:01:03,441.176470588 --> 00:01:06,29.411764706 I looked utterly ridiculous and I couldn't swallow. 29 00:01:06,58.823529412 --> 00:01:14,176.470588235 You are reminding me of when I got my wisdom teeth out as a 17-year-old and then trying to eat and just feeling like a cow because your mouth is just not working. 30 00:01:14,235.294117647 --> 00:01:14,529.411764706 Yeah. 31 00:01:14,529.411764706 --> 00:01:17,215.68627451 It took so long to come back as well, so I definitely had way too much. 32 00:01:17,455.882352941 --> 00:01:19,729.607843137 Oh, but you know what? So good. 33 00:01:19,759.019607843 --> 00:01:22,847.254901961 If you have a sore throat, these sprays are, I have no idea. 34 00:01:22,935.490196078 --> 00:01:24,847.254901961 iRecommend them to, neither do I. 35 00:01:24,876.666666667 --> 00:01:27,523.725490196 They that You get used to it after a while, but do you? Yeah. 36 00:01:27,582.549019608 --> 00:01:27,964.901960784 Okay. 37 00:01:27,964.901960784 --> 00:01:30,670.784313725 I haven't UI haven't been sick in so long. 38 00:01:30,670.784313725 --> 00:01:32,170.784313725 And do you know why? 'cause we both do it. 39 00:01:32,170.784313725 --> 00:01:32,847.254901961 Mouth taping. 40 00:01:33,170.784313725 --> 00:01:36,464.901960784 We do mouth taping, which we should really bring up one of these days. 41 00:01:36,464.901960784 --> 00:01:37,229.607843137 It's so good. 42 00:01:37,234.509803922 --> 00:01:37,489.411764706 It is. 43 00:01:39,168.078472698 --> 00:01:40,579.84317858 Welcome back to Spin Cycle. 44 00:01:40,815.13729623 --> 00:01:46,962.19611976 This week we're diving into Netflix, new Biggest Loser documentary and what it reveals about toxic diet culture. 45 00:01:47,182.19611976 --> 00:01:53,343.96082564 We're celebrating Lindsay Lohan's wholesome Hollywood return, and we're unpacking Australia's decision to recognize Palestine as a state. 46 00:01:53,667.4902374 --> 00:01:54,224.62745034 Let's get spinning. 47 00:02:09,837.68631584 --> 00:02:15,807.68631584 Welcome to Spin Cycle, where we dig into the stories shaping the world and take a closer look at the patterns, power plays. 48 00:02:15,807.68631584 --> 00:02:23,517.68631584 And yes, the biases hiding in plain sight where Gab and Claire, two friends with MBAs, A lot of opinions and a healthy amount of skepticism. 49 00:02:23,817.68631584 --> 00:02:26,817.68631584 We're here to help you think twice and maybe have a few laughs. 50 00:02:27,117.68631584 --> 00:02:27,892.68631584 Let's get spinning. 51 00:02:28,262.21612776 --> 00:02:37,796.52985325 Gab, what's top of mind for you this week? Firstly, do not judge, but I did wanna bring up the fact I'm, I've taken a real, brave decision. 52 00:02:38,12.21612776 --> 00:02:38,227.90240227 Mm. 53 00:02:38,286.72593168 --> 00:02:38,659.27495129 And that is. 54 00:02:39,419.07887286 --> 00:02:40,772.02004933 I'm growing my eyebrows out. 55 00:02:40,977.90240227 --> 00:02:41,477.90240227 Don't look at 'em. 56 00:02:42,7.31416698 --> 00:02:43,507.31416698 We are not, we are in the, you're all good. 57 00:02:43,507.31416698 --> 00:02:46,742.60828462 Even brow eyebrows are in, well, we are in the middle of a transition. 58 00:02:46,801.43181403 --> 00:02:48,242.60828462 And this is the hard thing, right? Mm-hmm. 59 00:02:48,477.90240227 --> 00:02:55,56.33377482 Especially when you, me, when you're like me and you've got European heritage, growing out your eyebrows longer than what you need to. 60 00:02:55,526.92201011 --> 00:02:58,438.686716 Is really daunting and you feel so vulnerable. 61 00:02:58,732.80436305 --> 00:03:06,703.39259835 But I just, it got to a point where, not that they were thin, thinner eyebrows were trending for a while and I've seen a lot in my content on TikTok. 62 00:03:06,703.39259835 --> 00:03:09,997.51024541 Oh, I've seen like the 2000 and tens thinner eyebrows were it? Yes. 63 00:03:10,56.33377482 --> 00:03:12,757.31416698 And I've been seeing more content where people. 64 00:03:13,409.27495129 --> 00:03:14,909.27495129 You know, European eyebrows. 65 00:03:15,134.76514737 --> 00:03:19,223.00044149 I just, not growing them back fully, but just a bit more so they're a bit more natural. 66 00:03:19,370.05926502 --> 00:03:20,723.00044149 And I thought, okay, let's do it. 67 00:03:20,723.00044149 --> 00:03:21,134.76514737 Now's the time. 68 00:03:21,134.76514737 --> 00:03:22,17.11808854 I don't park mine. 69 00:03:22,17.11808854 --> 00:03:23,75.94161796 I like to have at all. 70 00:03:23,80.84357874 --> 00:03:23,296.52985325 At all. 71 00:03:23,311.2357356 --> 00:03:23,987.70632384 Uh, not really. 72 00:03:23,987.70632384 --> 00:03:24,164.17691207 No. 73 00:03:24,164.17691207 --> 00:03:27,17.11808854 I like to get them, I get them like shaped twice a year and that's it. 74 00:03:27,428.88279443 --> 00:03:32,693.58867678 Uh, if I did that, Claire, I would seriously look like a gorilla, but I sort out them uni brow, but that's about it. 75 00:03:32,752.41220619 --> 00:03:33,164.17691207 Ah, okay. 76 00:03:33,693.58867678 --> 00:03:36,105.35338266 Well this is the thing I'm gonna, I'm, I'm, I'm halfway there. 77 00:03:36,370.05926502 --> 00:03:40,340.64750031 But what I've realized now that I'm growing more back, this is so sad. 78 00:03:40,487.70632384 --> 00:03:41,416.98584842 There are white hairs. 79 00:03:42,458.29455913 --> 00:03:42,899.47102972 I know. 80 00:03:42,928.88279443 --> 00:03:44,752.41220619 Oh my God. 81 00:03:44,781.8239709 --> 00:03:45,311.2357356 Okay. 82 00:03:45,311.2357356 --> 00:03:46,575.94161796 I know that is traumatizing. 83 00:03:46,575.94161796 --> 00:03:49,46.52985325 So I'm, anyway, I'm just like torn. 84 00:03:49,46.52985325 --> 00:03:51,75.94161796 It's like, 'cause I've never had to tint my eyebrows. 85 00:03:51,75.94161796 --> 00:03:51,899.47102972 They're black already. 86 00:03:52,75.94161796 --> 00:03:54,223.00044149 But now I'm like, oh God, maybe that's gonna be a thing. 87 00:03:54,223.00044149 --> 00:03:56,781.8239709 So one of the best hack I learned is to tin my own eyebrows. 88 00:03:56,781.8239709 --> 00:03:58,252.41220619 It's so simple to do. 89 00:03:58,311.2357356 --> 00:04:00,723.00044149 Is it so easy? No, you guys to show me. 90 00:04:00,811.2357356 --> 00:04:01,75.94161796 Yeah. 91 00:04:01,75.94161796 --> 00:04:01,399.47102972 Yeah. 92 00:04:01,487.70632384 --> 00:04:02,223.00044149 I can do it tonight. 93 00:04:02,311.2357356 --> 00:04:03,252.41220619 Dont tin your eyebrows. 94 00:04:03,340.64750031 --> 00:04:04,311.2357356 Oh, that's so scary. 95 00:04:04,311.2357356 --> 00:04:05,311.2357356 But maybe, yeah. 96 00:04:05,454.56906894 --> 00:04:12,978.29455913 So Claire, what's top of mind for you this week? Top of mind for me, gab, is that I have been following the Bruce Luhrman Defamation Appeal. 97 00:04:13,625.35338266 --> 00:04:16,713.58867678 I love playing professional juror. 98 00:04:16,880.84357874 --> 00:04:20,998.49063756 I'm a massive nerd for this stuff, and his appeal has been so funny. 99 00:04:21,663.18006898 --> 00:04:45,944.84673564 For those that are not aware, Bruce Luhrman, who in April of last year lost his defamation case against Network 10, and Lisa Wilkinson has for some reason decided to go back and appeal the judgment, and he's being presented by for this appeal, Zali Burrows, who is a criminal lawyer and it is not. 100 00:04:46,44.84673564 --> 00:04:50,244.84673564 Admitted to the bar for defamation law and has no experience in this case. 101 00:04:50,755.53301015 --> 00:05:01,432.78791212 Watching someone who is so completely out of her depth, try to argue a case that has no merit and everyone is roasting her, like the judges are roasting her. 102 00:05:01,697.49379447 --> 00:05:09,873.9643827 The opposing counsel is roasting her, and they're still also being incredibly kind, which is just like, it's a very weird dynamic. 103 00:05:09,873.9643827 --> 00:05:11,50.43497094 It's the intern is. 104 00:05:11,418.08202976 --> 00:05:12,65.14085329 At work. 105 00:05:12,123.9643827 --> 00:05:14,947.49379447 I don't, what I don't understand is he's already a joke. 106 00:05:14,976.90555917 --> 00:05:18,329.84673564 His reputation's already gone to shreds it. 107 00:05:18,418.08202976 --> 00:05:23,741.61144153 It's a big thing as a lawyer to take up a client like that, and I just feel like her reputation. 108 00:05:23,800.43497094 --> 00:05:27,682.78791212 But gab the best thing, right? Is she's arguing a defamation case. 109 00:05:27,712.19967682 --> 00:05:28,153.37614741 Yes. 110 00:05:28,212.19967682 --> 00:05:29,300.43497094 On an appeal. 111 00:05:30,182.78791212 --> 00:05:31,682.78791212 She's a criminal lawyer. 112 00:05:32,359.25850035 --> 00:05:44,138.67026506 So how did she get to that point? If this is her, the way she's presenting herself, it is literally like, I am trying to get the analogy here, but a plumber turning up to do an electrician job, like they're just very different. 113 00:05:44,756.31732388 --> 00:05:56,197.49379447 And if you ask any, like if you've got a criminal lawyer, right, and you ask, why would you say yes to it though, wouldn't you? I mean, is she just that keen on the cash? Because I would be like, I'm not, is not my wheelhouse and this is a very public case. 114 00:05:56,668.08202976 --> 00:05:57,844.552618 I can't comment on that. 115 00:05:57,903.37614741 --> 00:06:03,256.31732388 But Bruce Luhrman has spread himself so thin, so he apparently wanted a top silk. 116 00:06:03,638.67026506 --> 00:06:05,50.43497094 Barrister but couldn't afford it. 117 00:06:05,50.43497094 --> 00:06:10,579.84673564 So he is got his lawyer to do it, but she's also representing him on all his criminal charges. 118 00:06:11,79.84673564 --> 00:06:11,285.72908859 God. 119 00:06:11,344.552618 --> 00:06:15,481.80751996 So he is being criminally charged for stealing a car in Tasmania. 120 00:06:15,511.21928466 --> 00:06:18,913.18006898 What is he, what is he doing? He's geographically spreading himself. 121 00:06:19,648.47418663 --> 00:06:25,854.35653957 He had his criminal trial for rape in the a CT and now he's got another trial for rape in Queensland. 122 00:06:26,119.06242192 --> 00:06:26,354.35653957 Oh. 123 00:06:26,913.18006898 --> 00:06:27,736.70948074 It's disgusting. 124 00:06:27,736.70948074 --> 00:06:28,60.23889251 Really. 125 00:06:28,347.6898729 --> 00:06:36,543.76830427 No, like to stand on from my perspective, like why would you go back for more the why he obviously is just obsessed with the attention, but it's not a good attention. 126 00:06:36,543.76830427 --> 00:06:38,690.8271278 Like no one, he's deluded, he's diluted. 127 00:06:38,690.8271278 --> 00:06:41,102.59183368 No one's pulling him aside going, mate, you've got no chance. 128 00:06:41,308.47418663 --> 00:06:44,382.00359839 He is living in a different sense of reality is all I can say. 129 00:06:44,609.65065721 --> 00:06:49,946.12124545 But in the initial defamation findings, justice Lee had this absolute zinger, which was. 130 00:06:50,612.78791212 --> 00:06:54,906.90555917 Having escaped a lion, then Bruce Luhrman made the mistake of coming back for his hat. 131 00:06:55,436.31732388 --> 00:07:01,230.43497094 So I'm keen to know what the next round of judges come up with, 'cause I'll need to one up that, and that is a very tough act to follow. 132 00:07:01,848.08202976 --> 00:07:24,553.9643827 The other thing is that their main argument as to why that they should reverse the findings and find for them instead was that had they known Justice Lee was going to find a soft rape had occurred Instead of the violent rape that Channel 10 had articulated, maybe their response and their case would've been different. 133 00:07:25,112.78791212 --> 00:07:26,436.31732388 Oh, that's so disgusting. 134 00:07:26,436.31732388 --> 00:07:27,965.72908859 I've got like a shiver down my spine. 135 00:07:27,995.14085329 --> 00:07:30,818.67026506 And even the judges were like, rape is rape. 136 00:07:30,818.67026506 --> 00:07:32,495.14085329 I am, I'm not following that. 137 00:07:32,495.14085329 --> 00:07:36,470.63104937 And then the opposing counsel was just like, isn't rape violent no matter what you look at it. 138 00:07:37,9.84673564 --> 00:07:37,745.14085329 Yeah, exactly. 139 00:07:38,127.49379447 --> 00:07:40,68.67026506 It is a very, very interesting concept. 140 00:07:40,147.10163761 --> 00:07:46,58.86634349 I did have coffee with a friend today and I was just ripping into the both of them and making fun of them. 141 00:07:46,441.21928466 --> 00:07:54,78.47418663 And he was like, oh, you know, there is some academic merit and trying to give me this sort of nuance perspective on it, on why it could have some substance. 142 00:07:54,343.18006898 --> 00:07:56,784.35653957 And then I was like, regardless, it's stupid. 143 00:07:56,784.35653957 --> 00:07:59,284.35653957 Like I don't want, I can't imagine a world, none of that. 144 00:07:59,313.76830427 --> 00:08:02,813.76830427 I can't imagine a world where this gets up. 145 00:08:03,343.18006898 --> 00:08:04,78.47418663 No it won't. 146 00:08:04,78.47418663 --> 00:08:04,784.35653957 And it shouldn't. 147 00:08:04,960.8271278 --> 00:08:05,107.88595133 Yeah. 148 00:08:05,107.88595133 --> 00:08:05,696.12124545 You better not. 149 00:08:05,754.94477486 --> 00:08:06,49.06242192 Yeah. 150 00:08:06,490.23889251 --> 00:08:09,990.23889251 So it is a big week for, this saga has just been going on for years. 151 00:08:10,166.70948074 --> 00:08:14,490.23889251 Next week, the Brittany Higgins and Linda Reynolds defamation hearing is supposed to get an outcome. 152 00:08:14,549.06242192 --> 00:08:15,49.06242192 Mm-hmm. 153 00:08:15,490.23889251 --> 00:08:19,490.23889251 Um, so we might do a big roundup of kind of, you know, what's happened and what defamation means. 154 00:08:19,490.23889251 --> 00:08:21,843.18006898 But I am enjoying this appeal. 155 00:08:22,431.4153631 --> 00:08:22,960.8271278 I'm glad you are. 156 00:08:24,872.8271278 --> 00:08:30,519.88595133 So Gab, this week we watch the Netflix documentary Fit for tv and you've seen the whole all three episodes. 157 00:08:30,549.29771604 --> 00:08:30,902.23889251 I have. 158 00:08:30,902.23889251 --> 00:08:31,931.65065721 I've seen all three. 159 00:08:32,284.59183368 --> 00:08:37,990.47418663 And it's about The Biggest Loser and about the show that hit us right in preteen nostalgia. 160 00:08:38,19.88595133 --> 00:08:42,19.88595133 We grew up with this show in, in, started in the US and then they had an Australian version. 161 00:08:42,578.70948074 --> 00:08:43,314.00359839 Yeah, it did. 162 00:08:43,343.4153631 --> 00:08:49,19.88595133 And it's interesting, I watched it with Corey who is from the UK and they never had anything like this. 163 00:08:49,137.53301015 --> 00:08:52,764.98399055 Did he watch it? He watched the document, truth Mean, and he was shocked. 164 00:08:53,441.45457878 --> 00:08:58,264.98399055 But at the time, it hit very different to what it does now. 165 00:08:58,264.98399055 --> 00:09:05,647.33693172 Like now it feels like an uncomfortable cautionary tale, and a lot of the things they were making the contestants do was just. 166 00:09:06,132.63104937 --> 00:09:08,456.16046114 Almost state sanctioned bullying. 167 00:09:08,456.16046114 --> 00:09:11,691.45457878 It was very uncomfortable, it was disrespectful. 168 00:09:12,44.39575525 --> 00:09:16,142.43497094 It did not support body confidence or health and looking after yourself whatsoever. 169 00:09:16,642.43497094 --> 00:09:16,907.14085329 Yeah. 170 00:09:16,907.14085329 --> 00:09:19,995.37614741 And the documentary really does comment on that. 171 00:09:20,152.23889251 --> 00:09:26,387.53301015 We had cast members, it's weird saying cast members 'cause it was reality tv, but really the contestants were. 172 00:09:26,755.18006898 --> 00:09:33,755.18006898 The cast of a very successful TV show the producers, even Bob Harper himself. 173 00:09:33,902.23889251 --> 00:09:33,990.47418663 Mm-hmm. 174 00:09:34,225.76830427 --> 00:09:42,108.12124545 Um, the only person missing, which I was really hoping we'd see some kind of commentary from is, of course, Jillian Michaels. 175 00:09:42,137.53301015 --> 00:09:43,284.59183368 She's gone to ground. 176 00:09:43,637.53301015 --> 00:09:51,255.18006898 She has, and you totally feel that absence because she was such a prominent part of that show, not having her perspective, I think. 177 00:09:51,725.76830427 --> 00:09:57,755.18006898 Not diluting it, but I think probably her absence just shows you perhaps the shame around it. 178 00:09:57,784.59183368 --> 00:10:01,284.59183368 Yes, but Julian Michaels hasn't been a hidden figure. 179 00:10:01,284.59183368 --> 00:10:10,137.53301015 She's been doing podcasts and other bits and pieces, but with the out coming out of this documentary, she's taken herself back to ground because she does not wanna be associated. 180 00:10:10,490.47418663 --> 00:10:11,431.65065721 Yeah, exactly. 181 00:10:11,931.65065721 --> 00:10:18,755.18006898 As a bit of a reminder, the Biggest Loser, which is so long ago, this is, we're talking like 21 years ago. 182 00:10:18,931.65065721 --> 00:10:18,961.06242192 Mm. 183 00:10:19,19.88595133 --> 00:10:25,549.29771604 Which is crazy, but it debuted in 2004 as a half bootcamp, half game show. 184 00:10:25,725.76830427 --> 00:10:25,814.00359839 Mm-hmm. 185 00:10:26,49.29771604 --> 00:10:30,88.51340231 And one thing they definitely spoke about in the documentary was that. 186 00:10:30,926.74869643 --> 00:10:34,279.6898729 They was really learning as they were recording in season one. 187 00:10:34,279.6898729 --> 00:10:46,407.14085329 So season one is a bit of a shambles, but they had the weekly weigh-ins, they had the public eliminations and the people, these quite large people were just in their underwear on these giant scales. 188 00:10:47,318.90555917 --> 00:10:52,524.78791212 And one critic said that from the start, it really did belittle people with obesity. 189 00:10:52,828.70948074 --> 00:10:54,122.8271278 The tasks were humiliating. 190 00:10:54,122.8271278 --> 00:10:56,152.23889251 I remember the temptation task. 191 00:10:56,152.23889251 --> 00:11:06,152.23889251 Do you remember those? Oh, they were so bad, and they used to just make them do awful things to jeopardize all the good work that they've just done for the viewer's delight. 192 00:11:06,299.29771604 --> 00:11:13,5.18006898 But what I didn't realize is, and they talked about the send documentaries, one of it was if you eat enough weight. 193 00:11:13,476.16046114 --> 00:11:14,5.57222584 Oh, sorry. 194 00:11:14,5.57222584 --> 00:11:15,34.98399055 Enough calories. 195 00:11:15,299.6898729 --> 00:11:20,917.33693172 Then we'll let you see your family, because I didn't realize, but they were actually away from their family for six months. 196 00:11:21,417.33693172 --> 00:11:22,446.74869643 That's a long time. 197 00:11:23,5.57222584 --> 00:11:25,858.51340231 So I could understand why you'd wanna see your family. 198 00:11:25,858.51340231 --> 00:11:26,593.80751996 Yeah, yeah. 199 00:11:26,976.16046114 --> 00:11:32,358.51340231 Because you're going through one of the hardest things mentally and sometimes all you want is just, oh, that reassurance. 200 00:11:32,358.51340231 --> 00:11:37,887.92516702 Especially the reassurance when the trainers are just screaming in your face, you know their mouths practically. 201 00:11:38,284.98399055 --> 00:11:39,402.63104937 Touching their face. 202 00:11:39,981.06242192 --> 00:11:46,245.76830427 And at its peak really, the show topped the US ratings and there were local versions across countries. 203 00:11:46,245.76830427 --> 00:11:55,39.88595133 As you said, there was an Australian version, there was spinoff DVDs and then that diet, food, all the trends, frozen meals and had, and that sort of thing. 204 00:11:55,863.4153631 --> 00:11:59,726.16046114 And we had, which I can't remember the names, but the host, oh, sorry. 205 00:11:59,726.16046114 --> 00:12:01,284.98399055 The trainers for Australia. 206 00:12:02,152.63104937 --> 00:12:04,299.6898729 They were like Michelle Bridges and Shannon and Commando. 207 00:12:04,299.6898729 --> 00:12:04,358.51340231 Yeah. 208 00:12:04,696.74869643 --> 00:12:07,481.06242192 But they, they were lookalikes of the us which was really weird. 209 00:12:07,481.06242192 --> 00:12:07,520.27810819 Yeah. 210 00:12:07,520.27810819 --> 00:12:08,64.39575525 Literal really them out. 211 00:12:08,93.80751996 --> 00:12:08,329.10163761 Yeah. 212 00:12:08,329.10163761 --> 00:12:10,201.65065721 But they knew that the model would work. 213 00:12:10,378.12124545 --> 00:12:10,525.18006898 Yeah. 214 00:12:10,525.18006898 --> 00:12:16,711.45457878 People wanted two attractive young trainers that had that similar like tough love mentality. 215 00:12:16,770.27810819 --> 00:12:17,299.6898729 Yes. 216 00:12:17,299.6898729 --> 00:12:22,652.63104937 The worst thing is, is back then that was our version of empowerment and now it's just uncomfortable. 217 00:12:22,946.74869643 --> 00:12:23,182.04281408 Yeah. 218 00:12:23,946.74869643 --> 00:12:26,652.63104937 Did you, did you watch it growing up? I did. 219 00:12:26,711.45457878 --> 00:12:33,476.16046114 And I think of like, what were the other shows around that time? I think it was that, I think it was, do you remember Super Nanny? Yes. 220 00:12:33,564.39575525 --> 00:12:50,574.19967682 Um, they were all sort of like, mind you extreme maker up up, when they gave that person all the plastic surgery, everything was extreme, but with the biggest Loser it, and they touch on this in the documentary too, but they made it, if they eat less, they would obviously lose weight. 221 00:12:50,941.84673565 --> 00:12:55,647.72908859 But they did this whole thing with the exercising for a whole eight hours, you know, eight hours per day. 222 00:12:55,647.72908859 --> 00:12:55,735.9643827 Yes. 223 00:12:55,765.37614741 --> 00:12:57,471.25850035 Which is so insane. 224 00:12:57,892.8271278 --> 00:13:04,216.35653957 Just so that the, it's that dramatic theater around that, the weight loss on the scales each week. 225 00:13:04,392.8271278 --> 00:13:05,745.76830427 Not healthy, not sustainable. 226 00:13:05,750.67026506 --> 00:13:05,809.49379447 No. 227 00:13:06,241.84673565 --> 00:13:10,653.61144153 Um, and the workouts were crazy as well, like to put up contestants through five to eight hours. 228 00:13:10,653.61144153 --> 00:13:17,35.9643827 That's like exercising like a professional, but professionals are fueling their bodies with thousands of calories I think as well. 229 00:13:17,35.9643827 --> 00:13:23,271.25850035 Professionals, right? Your, your body is in and your health is at a point where it's safe to exercise like this. 230 00:13:23,800.67026506 --> 00:13:26,663.4153631 These are people who, can barely run. 231 00:13:26,898.70948074 --> 00:13:33,55.57222584 You can't run honestly, can also walking probably not so well, and they are using equipment and just. 232 00:13:33,986.94477486 --> 00:13:37,781.06242192 Really testing their body in ways that could only lead to injury. 233 00:13:38,16.35653957 --> 00:13:42,849.6898729 I mean, I exercise a lot, but if I go, too many hit workouts, I'm too sore. 234 00:13:42,849.6898729 --> 00:13:43,584.98399055 I can't do anything. 235 00:13:43,584.98399055 --> 00:13:44,143.80751996 Yeah. 236 00:13:44,820.27810819 --> 00:13:47,761.45457878 One thing also as well is it was the caffeine pill scandal. 237 00:13:47,820.27810819 --> 00:13:48,26.16046114 Yes. 238 00:13:48,26.16046114 --> 00:13:57,261.45457878 Julian Elig gave contestants caffeine pills, and one thing that I was a bit like, Hmm, Bob and the show's doctor, they disputed that they didn't approve it. 239 00:13:57,702.63104937 --> 00:14:01,854.59183368 Jillian at the time and later said that it was all sanctioned and she had permission and she has receipt. 240 00:14:02,584.98399055 --> 00:14:03,673.21928466 To prove that she did. 241 00:14:03,996.74869643 --> 00:14:08,967.33693172 And I don't know if it was Bob and the doctor kind of trying to make teaming up themselves, look, team up. 242 00:14:09,143.80751996 --> 00:14:09,467.33693172 Yeah. 243 00:14:09,879.10163761 --> 00:14:20,477.14085329 Party line, make ourselves look good, throw her under the bus or it, I wouldn't be surprised if it was as toxic as what they said, and that was just, another way they could get big numbers out of the contestants. 244 00:14:20,903.61144153 --> 00:14:26,168.31732388 The documentary certainly positioned them as trying to do the right thing. 245 00:14:26,168.31732388 --> 00:14:26,256.552618 Mm-hmm. 246 00:14:26,668.31732388 --> 00:14:33,84.98399055 Whereas, you know, and Jillian as sort of that evil one, but think back to that time, I don't know. 247 00:14:33,501.65065721 --> 00:14:35,442.8271278 I think all of them wanted to win. 248 00:14:35,733.21928467 --> 00:14:37,233.21928467 And, you know, earn more money. 249 00:14:37,233.21928467 --> 00:14:41,262.63104937 And why was the doctor returning to the show every year? Y Yeah, exactly. 250 00:14:41,644.98399055 --> 00:14:43,821.45457878 And the manipulation from the producers. 251 00:14:43,821.45457878 --> 00:14:49,262.63104937 They were encouraging contestants to gain weight before filming and to do anything they could to get that competitive advantage. 252 00:14:49,292.04281408 --> 00:14:49,556.74869643 Yeah. 253 00:14:49,586.16046114 --> 00:14:52,72.04281408 And that's not in the spirit of the show Exactly. 254 00:14:52,660.27810819 --> 00:14:54,542.63104937 But the show really wasn't about health. 255 00:14:54,871.65065721 --> 00:14:56,665.76830427 It is, it was tv. 256 00:14:56,812.8271278 --> 00:14:56,901.06242192 Mm-hmm. 257 00:14:57,136.35653957 --> 00:14:58,861.84673565 In a good, entertainment tv. 258 00:14:59,185.37614741 --> 00:15:09,665.76830427 Really just looking for those ratings and in a way, you know, treating these people in like ways of an animal or like not a human being, yeah. 259 00:15:10,283.4153631 --> 00:15:11,866.74869643 With, it feels like a zoo, honestly. 260 00:15:11,905.9643827 --> 00:15:12,258.90555918 A hundred percent. 261 00:15:12,459.88595133 --> 00:15:13,754.00359839 With the season one winner. 262 00:15:14,97.14085329 --> 00:15:20,950.08202976 Brian Benson, he gained back all the weight he lost, so he lost 239 pounds and then gained most of it back. 263 00:15:21,695.18006898 --> 00:15:28,631.45457878 And one of the really interesting things that came from the show, and it was one of the things that I think was sort of the undoing of the show or the end of it, and that was a, um. 264 00:15:29,156.74869643 --> 00:15:36,833.21928467 Investigation by the New York Time that found that the contestants, by doing what they did actually cause metabolic damage. 265 00:15:37,68.51340231 --> 00:15:44,382.23889251 And what that means is everyone has a amount of food they can eat and their body weight will rate, say roughly the same. 266 00:15:44,588.12124545 --> 00:15:44,764.59183368 Yes. 267 00:15:44,764.59183368 --> 00:15:49,323.4153631 So going into the show, the contestant might be able to eat two and a half thousand calories a day. 268 00:15:49,676.35653957 --> 00:15:51,88.12124545 Bear in mind, two and a half thousand two. 269 00:15:51,264.59183368 --> 00:15:52,617.53301016 Two to two and a thousand isn't. 270 00:15:52,970.47418663 --> 00:15:54,617.53301016 Uh, no, that's recommended. 271 00:15:54,705.76830427 --> 00:15:54,999.88595133 Oh, okay. 272 00:15:55,4.78791212 --> 00:15:58,999.88595133 So, so we we're recommended as females to eat between like 1600, 2000 calories day. 273 00:15:58,999.88595133 --> 00:15:59,465.57222584 There you go. 274 00:16:00,352.8271278 --> 00:16:02,823.4153631 And more depending on your lifestyle Yeah. 275 00:16:02,823.4153631 --> 00:16:04,323.4153631 And your height and that. 276 00:16:04,735.18006898 --> 00:16:14,926.35653957 So if your, metabolic sort of set point was 2000 calories and your maintain your weight, now it's slowed by 700 calories, that means that they can. 277 00:16:15,666.552618 --> 00:16:19,274.39575525 They need to eat 1400 calories a day to maintain the weight. 278 00:16:19,568.51340231 --> 00:16:21,215.57222584 And from that, they're not satiated. 279 00:16:21,568.51340231 --> 00:16:21,803.80751996 Hang on. 280 00:16:21,803.80751996 --> 00:16:23,127.33693172 Before they just keep gaining weight. 281 00:16:23,225.37614741 --> 00:16:23,906.74869643 So hang on. 282 00:16:23,926.35653957 --> 00:16:30,754.78791212 So if I understand before the show, there's say, say example two and a half thousand calories means you stay the same weight. 283 00:16:31,48.90555918 --> 00:16:36,88.12124545 So the show causes what your metabolism to speed up or slow. 284 00:16:36,88.12124545 --> 00:16:36,259.6898729 Slow down. 285 00:16:36,259.6898729 --> 00:16:36,455.76830427 Slow down. 286 00:16:36,455.76830427 --> 00:16:36,843.02320623 Slow down. 287 00:16:37,137.14085329 --> 00:16:37,548.90555918 Ah. 288 00:16:37,548.90555918 --> 00:16:40,19.4937945 So you could eat two and a half, but. 289 00:16:40,754.7879121 --> 00:16:45,259.6898729 You are not burning it off the same and you're actually putting on weight having a normal amount of calories. 290 00:16:45,289.1016376 --> 00:16:45,583.2192847 Yeah. 291 00:16:45,583.2192847 --> 00:16:50,818.5134023 So the example was, um, you could eat 3000 a day and not gain weight after the show. 292 00:16:51,24.3957553 --> 00:16:51,53.80752 Mm. 293 00:16:51,465.5722258 --> 00:17:00,789.1016376 You now have, you had your metabolism slow by 700 calories, which means that you can only eat 1300 calories a day and you're put in weight to prevent gaining weight. 294 00:17:00,857.7290886 --> 00:17:05,441.0624219 It's basically their bodies fighting to defend their fat stores because they were so. 295 00:17:06,534.1996768 --> 00:17:15,269.4937945 Substantially depleted in the show because they were burning 8,000 calories a day, but only incoming 800 I think as well. 296 00:17:15,445.9643827 --> 00:17:21,857.7290886 Um, which they didn't touch on so much, but these people likely before the show were secret eaters. 297 00:17:21,857.7290886 --> 00:17:24,534.1996768 You know, they had a really bad relationship with food. 298 00:17:24,857.7290886 --> 00:17:24,945.9643827 Yeah. 299 00:17:25,475.3761474 --> 00:17:29,911.6506572 And I think what they didn't the nature of the show is you are away on this camp. 300 00:17:29,911.6506572 --> 00:17:31,352.8271278 It's an isolated scenario. 301 00:17:31,382.2388925 --> 00:17:32,941.0624219 You are doing extremist things. 302 00:17:33,632.2388925 --> 00:17:36,749.8859513 You are not actually building a sustainable future for yourself. 303 00:17:36,749.8859513 --> 00:17:39,661.6506572 So when you go home, all of a sudden all those temptations are back. 304 00:17:39,896.9447749 --> 00:17:42,191.0624219 All of a sudden you've not got someone screaming in your face. 305 00:17:42,191.0624219 --> 00:17:46,191.0624219 And without that constant motivation, what are things gonna happen? There's none in the real world. 306 00:17:46,573.4153631 --> 00:17:51,838.1212454 And on the Australian one, one of the contestants spoke about that all their food would be put into coolers with their names on it. 307 00:17:52,249.8859513 --> 00:17:55,779.297716 And for six months all they did was eat food from the coolers and that was all they were allowed to eat. 308 00:17:55,779.297716 --> 00:18:03,661.6506572 Yeah, but can you ma, like anyone would lose weight if you couldn't eat anything else and you're just given what you need? Like honestly, sometimes they do think about maybe if I go to prison I'll lose weight. 309 00:18:03,720.4741866 --> 00:18:04,485.180069 You know what I mean? Exactly. 310 00:18:04,485.180069 --> 00:18:07,749.8859513 But then when they get put back in the world, all they did was go back to their old lifestyle. 311 00:18:07,779.297716 --> 00:18:11,867.5330102 They weren provide any tools, counseling, gym memberships, after the show ended. 312 00:18:12,132.2388925 --> 00:18:14,955.7683043 So these broadcasting companies made all this money. 313 00:18:15,529.297716 --> 00:18:21,882.2388925 And then just left the contestants high and dry 'cause at the end of the day, their contracts were yes, just to participate in the show. 314 00:18:22,705.7683043 --> 00:18:25,941.0624219 So the legacy of the Biggest Loser. 315 00:18:26,76.1604611 --> 00:18:32,840.8663435 By 2010, the stories leaked, cultural attitude shifted and we also had that in study come out on the damage. 316 00:18:33,282.0428141 --> 00:18:41,811.4545788 As well as that people started talking about like the steroid diet culture and really pushing and starting of the body positivity movement. 317 00:18:42,517.3369317 --> 00:18:47,693.80752 And that's when we started having, the actually bines bikini body and or about, you know, bit healthy bodies. 318 00:18:47,693.80752 --> 00:18:49,532.0428141 Yeah, it's more strange rather than skinny. 319 00:18:49,870.2781082 --> 00:18:50,164.3957553 Yeah. 320 00:18:50,164.3957553 --> 00:18:51,17.3369317 Yeah, I'd agree with that. 321 00:18:51,997.7290886 --> 00:19:02,154.5918337 And I think as well you're saying, yeah, that body positivity, we're probably in the 2010, starting to see more body shapes in advertising and a bit more diversity in that sense. 322 00:19:02,713.4153631 --> 00:19:07,948.7094807 But yeah, I think it definitely at its time, I think probably what's scary for me is. 323 00:19:08,213.4153631 --> 00:19:09,360.4741866 We didn't really question it. 324 00:19:09,365.3761474 --> 00:19:09,639.8859513 Mm-hmm. 325 00:19:09,894.7879121 --> 00:19:12,389.8859513 At the time it, like watching it felt normal. 326 00:19:12,536.9447749 --> 00:19:12,919.297716 Yeah. 327 00:19:13,419.297716 --> 00:19:22,242.8271278 So, Jillian Michaels, while she's gone to ground, she has threatened legal action and said that she only ever told the contestants to eat 1600 calories and not starve themselves. 328 00:19:22,242.8271278 --> 00:19:29,448.7094807 That does contradict a number of, didn't they, wasn't it 800 is what they were saying? They were saying 800 and that she, um, was encouraging even more. 329 00:19:29,448.7094807 --> 00:19:32,154.5918337 So there's that conflicting, different realities living there. 330 00:19:32,434.9839905 --> 00:19:36,405.5722258 It's just amazing though 'cause a show like this would not be allowed to air today. 331 00:19:36,434.9839905 --> 00:19:37,317.3369317 No, not at all. 332 00:19:37,552.6310494 --> 00:19:38,346.7486964 Not at all. 333 00:19:38,582.0428141 --> 00:19:40,287.925167 There's so much wrong with it now. 334 00:19:40,317.3369317 --> 00:19:40,405.5722258 Mm-hmm. 335 00:19:40,934.9839905 --> 00:19:41,258.5134023 Yeah. 336 00:19:42,258.5134023 --> 00:19:52,199.6898729 So, uh, one thing we haven't really touched on is what was it like in Australia? The Australian version? The Australian version, ran from 2006 to 2017, which is actually way longer than I thought. 337 00:19:52,199.6898729 --> 00:19:52,787.925167 That's 11 years. 338 00:19:52,787.925167 --> 00:19:55,817.3369317 I just assumed that it ended in like 2013. 339 00:19:55,817.3369317 --> 00:20:00,523.2192847 I didn't realize it went for, you know, you know, not far before COVID, that's not that long ago. 340 00:20:00,758.5134023 --> 00:20:09,287.925167 So trainers, Michelle Bridges and Shannon Ponton were celebrity and household names, and they went on to have very lucrative online training Yes. 341 00:20:09,317.3369317 --> 00:20:12,297.7290886 Programs providing their services. 342 00:20:12,561.8467356 --> 00:20:18,61.8467356 Michelle Bridges said she'd never met someone morbidly obese who's happy, and that was one of her key lines. 343 00:20:18,61.8467356 --> 00:20:23,473.6114415 And Chrissy Sworn and AJ Rochester and AJ was the first host to her down for fat shaming. 344 00:20:24,12.8271278 --> 00:20:26,512.8271278 Aj, you know, famously said, I've got a fat arse and I'm happy. 345 00:20:26,924.5918337 --> 00:20:27,395.180069 Yes. 346 00:20:27,865.7683043 --> 00:20:31,865.7683043 And the Aussie contestants talked a lot about the crash dieting and extreme pressure. 347 00:20:32,130.4741866 --> 00:20:38,42.2388925 And one of the contestants, she's on TikTok and she talks a lot about her experiences and Is this Fiona? Yeah. 348 00:20:38,395.180069 --> 00:20:41,71.6506572 She doesn't have nice things to say about Yeah. 349 00:20:41,71.6506572 --> 00:20:42,865.7683043 Michelle Britches at all. 350 00:20:43,208.9055592 --> 00:20:46,473.6114415 She calls her Voldemort doesn't v Yeah, I know. 351 00:20:46,919.9643821 --> 00:20:50,567.0232056 The ratings did collapse in the later year as culture shifted to body positivity. 352 00:20:51,169.9643821 --> 00:20:54,434.6702644 Uh, and so Bridges still really defends it though, right? Mm-hmm. 353 00:20:54,669.9643821 --> 00:21:01,268.0035978 Um, she was on, I'm on a celebrity get me outta here last year, and she said, I love that show. 354 00:21:01,268.0035978 --> 00:21:02,503.2977154 It was the best decade of my life. 355 00:21:02,919.1800683 --> 00:21:06,213.2977154 But the younger contestants around her clearly don't feel the same. 356 00:21:06,742.7094801 --> 00:21:07,625.0624213 No, they don't. 357 00:21:08,183.8859507 --> 00:21:13,762.3173232 So where does this leave us? The Biggest Loser feels like this strange cultural artifact. 358 00:21:14,144.6702644 --> 00:21:23,497.6114409 It was entertainment dressed up as health and it left a lot of damage in its wake because it was never really encouraging them to change their lifestyle. 359 00:21:23,497.6114409 --> 00:21:25,531.9251664 It was encouraging them to do extreme things. 360 00:21:26,424.0820291 --> 00:21:30,12.3173232 So that we would watch it and it got more extreme as the seasons went on. 361 00:21:30,188.7879115 --> 00:21:30,953.4937938 Yeah, it did. 362 00:21:31,41.729088 --> 00:21:36,541.729088 And it's one of those docs that definitely makes you go, how the hell did we watch this? We lapped it up. 363 00:21:36,541.729088 --> 00:21:37,659.3761468 Sometimes I'd, we loved it. 364 00:21:37,659.3761468 --> 00:21:41,17.219284 Sometimes I'd watch it whilst eating KFC Really? Yeah. 365 00:21:41,41.729088 --> 00:21:41,335.846735 Yeah. 366 00:21:41,335.846735 --> 00:21:44,306.4349703 We probably watched it as a family eating like Mac's or something. 367 00:21:44,335.846735 --> 00:21:44,806.4349703 Yeah., 368 00:21:44,855.4545781 --> 00:21:48,781.9251664 I remember on Friday nights, I think they had an episode and I would definitely say I watched. 369 00:21:49,620.1604605 --> 00:21:51,590.7486958 That's so funny, isn't it? I was watching it. 370 00:21:51,678.9839899 --> 00:21:51,855.4545781 Yeah. 371 00:21:51,855.4545781 --> 00:22:07,473.101637 And I think I saw a stat at the end of the doc, which said that at the time of the, when Biggest Loser started, I think obesity in America was something like 35% or 25%, and now it's 45%. 372 00:22:07,580.9447742 --> 00:22:13,257.4153625 What about with Pic though? 'cause I was gonna say a lot of the It'll shift, it'll shift does look like they've been on pic. 373 00:22:13,590.7486958 --> 00:22:15,384.8663429 Or other GLP one medications. 374 00:22:15,384.8663429 --> 00:22:34,178.9839899 Well, I do think, I mean, that's something we should certainly talk about at some point, but yeah, I think the percentage of people, I think there will start talking about other issues rather than obesity because there will be something as a almost ripple effect of the Ozempic era now. 375 00:22:34,473.101637 --> 00:22:35,85.846735 Yeah, a hundred percent. 376 00:22:35,85.846735 --> 00:22:35,242.7094801 Yeah. 377 00:22:35,247.6114409 --> 00:22:37,90.7486958 But we don't know what the Ozempic era is gonna be. 378 00:22:37,178.9839899 --> 00:22:37,502.5134017 No. 379 00:22:37,561.3369311 --> 00:22:39,678.9839899 It still hasn't hit No, it hasn't hit no. 380 00:22:41,590.9839899 --> 00:22:47,855.6898723 Have you seen the new Freaky Friday Freaky Air Friday movie? No, I know, and I know you saw it, but we haven't spoken about it. 381 00:22:47,855.6898723 --> 00:22:49,32.1604605 It was so. 382 00:22:49,899.8075193 --> 00:22:50,164.5134017 Good. 383 00:22:50,164.5134017 --> 00:22:52,429.219284 Like genuinely I loved it. 384 00:22:52,429.219284 --> 00:22:59,958.6310487 It was so nostalgic and comforting and look at the start of it, I was like, oh, this might be a little bit virtue signaling. 385 00:22:59,958.6310487 --> 00:23:04,203.729088 It might be a little bit woke like a bit like the mean girls redo. 386 00:23:04,439.0232056 --> 00:23:07,497.846735 I never that it, that was just really uncomfortable and awkward. 387 00:23:07,791.9643821 --> 00:23:09,468.4349703 This was so well done. 388 00:23:09,762.5526174 --> 00:23:13,733.1408527 It has a lot of Lindsay Lohan and Jamie Lee Curtis and it was. 389 00:23:14,262.5526174 --> 00:23:18,772.3565389 Really? Are they still the main characters? They did it in a way that they could remain. 390 00:23:19,7.6506566 --> 00:23:19,242.9447742 Okay. 391 00:23:19,242.9447742 --> 00:23:23,419.4153625 The main characters, their story, like, yes, they had the next generation in it. 392 00:23:23,772.3565389 --> 00:23:29,978.2388919 It was really well done and I just had a great night at the movies with the girls, with the chalk tops. 393 00:23:30,27.2584997 --> 00:23:38,296.8663429 There are so many movies at the moment that are having their comebacks, so I actually love, like, I haven't seen it, but it's certainly on my list. 394 00:23:38,679.219284 --> 00:23:39,238.0428134 I don't know. 395 00:23:39,267.4545781 --> 00:23:46,625.8859507 I mean, tell me what you feel like telling me, but how was Lindsay Lohan as an actress now in 2025? She's good. 396 00:23:46,625.8859507 --> 00:23:56,282.7486958 I mean, is she the same punchy teenage heartthrob that she was at our what? The movie? Because I think about it. 397 00:23:56,307.2584997 --> 00:23:58,694.5134017 What, what we were watching it as young people. 398 00:23:58,723.9251664 --> 00:23:58,988.6310487 Yeah. 399 00:23:59,194.5134017 --> 00:24:00,165.101637 As teenagers. 400 00:24:00,812.1604605 --> 00:24:07,841.5722252 It's different, but she's, so, she comes across as very sweet, authentic, that very doey like. 401 00:24:07,841.5722252 --> 00:24:15,194.5134017 I can see her and what she has been doing is a lot of those RO comms and yes, and those kind of angles, but she's had a hard life. 402 00:24:15,223.9251664 --> 00:24:21,184.7094801 She has been through the ringer, she's been through court, through drug addiction,, and she's really come out the other side. 403 00:24:21,272.9447742 --> 00:24:24,37.6506566 I'm so happy to see that she has come out the other side. 404 00:24:24,576.8663429 --> 00:24:27,929.8075193 I really hope that the next person to do that is Amanda Bees. 405 00:24:27,988.6310487 --> 00:24:33,518.0428134 I really wanted Amanda Bees come back because she's not well, but she's very well supported. 406 00:24:33,518.0428134 --> 00:24:33,606.2781076 Hope. 407 00:24:33,870.9839899 --> 00:24:39,620.9839899 One thing I'm really pleased of is her parents sort of, they really allowed her to take time off and heal and Okay. 408 00:24:39,620.9839899 --> 00:24:44,155.2977154 And that, but one thing before I jump into talking about, you know, yes. 409 00:24:44,155.2977154 --> 00:24:49,331.7683036 In the 2000 Lindsay Lohan, thank you for everyone that reached out to us who agreed with my. 410 00:24:49,758.2388919 --> 00:24:51,787.6506566 Push for justice for Meredith Blake. 411 00:24:51,964.1212448 --> 00:24:52,964.1212448 Yes. 412 00:24:53,22.9447742 --> 00:25:00,640.591833 A lot of people have said they agreed and I think we need to maintain the momentum on justice for Meredith. 413 00:25:00,787.6506566 --> 00:25:03,522.9447742 Justice For Meredith hashtag hashtag sort of thing. 414 00:25:03,907.2584997 --> 00:25:06,760.1996762 So I definitely think you should, recognize that on the Instagram page. 415 00:25:06,765.101637 --> 00:25:07,966.0820291 I'll, I'll do, okay. 416 00:25:07,966.0820291 --> 00:25:09,819.0232056 I'm not, I'm not, I'm not allowed access to the Instagram page. 417 00:25:09,819.0232056 --> 00:25:10,848.4349703 I'll sort that one out. 418 00:25:10,848.4349703 --> 00:25:11,113.1408527 Thank you. 419 00:25:11,412.1604605 --> 00:25:11,686.6702644 Absolutely. 420 00:25:11,936.6702644 --> 00:25:12,524.9055585 Thank you. 421 00:25:12,966.0820291 --> 00:25:17,583.729088 But Lindsay Lohan in the two thousands was the poster child for the troubled starlet. 422 00:25:17,936.6702644 --> 00:25:19,83.729088 She had a lot of fights. 423 00:25:19,83.729088 --> 00:25:21,495.4937938 She had all these fights with Paris Hilton, with Hillary Duff. 424 00:25:21,495.4937938 --> 00:25:25,319.0232056 Actually, a lot of people, I don't even remember the phrase, a lot of people did not get along with Hillary Duff. 425 00:25:25,819.0232056 --> 00:25:27,642.5526174 Now I'm watching it sitting back. 426 00:25:27,701.3761468 --> 00:25:31,319.0232056 It looks like they all got along with each other, but they did not get along with Hillary Duff. 427 00:25:31,319.0232056 --> 00:25:32,877.846735 Why not Hillary Duff? I don't know. 428 00:25:32,877.846735 --> 00:25:33,966.0820291 We can unpack that another time. 429 00:25:33,995.4937938 --> 00:25:34,24.9055585 Okay. 430 00:25:34,24.9055585 --> 00:25:36,966.0820291 But Hillary Duff, I think may have been the mean girl. 431 00:25:37,348.4349703 --> 00:25:38,319.0232056 Well, yeah. 432 00:25:38,319.0232056 --> 00:25:40,142.5526174 Probably just saying it, putting it out there. 433 00:25:41,260.1996762 --> 00:25:51,436.6702644 But she went to jail a number of times for driving under the influence and then not fulfilling her obligations, not going to a court mandated rehab. 434 00:25:51,613.1408527 --> 00:25:51,848.4349703 Yeah. 435 00:25:52,24.9055585 --> 00:25:53,171.9643821 And from. 436 00:25:53,500.3957546 --> 00:25:57,333.729088 2015 until she's researched in 2021 one. 437 00:25:57,333.729088 --> 00:25:57,412.1604605 Yep. 438 00:25:57,610.7879115 --> 00:26:00,257.846735 She largely stayed out of the eye, but she was busy. 439 00:26:00,257.846735 --> 00:26:07,581.3761468 She got, you know, she met her husband, she got married, she like, so between what, when did she started getting her life back together? Between what years? Like 2015. 440 00:26:07,581.3761468 --> 00:26:08,640.1996762 2021. 441 00:26:08,640.1996762 --> 00:26:08,728.4349703 Oh, okay. 442 00:26:08,728.4349703 --> 00:26:11,375.4937938 And since then, she's been doing so well. 443 00:26:11,865.6898723 --> 00:26:15,12.7486958 She got married, she largely lives in Dubai and she lives a sober life. 444 00:26:15,42.1604605 --> 00:26:23,924.5134017 So what I realized is part of the reason why they live in Dubai is it's actually illegal to photograph people unless they have permission. 445 00:26:23,924.5134017 --> 00:26:27,895.101637 Yeah, that's amazing because she got so much trauma from the paparazzi. 446 00:26:27,895.101637 --> 00:26:28,983.3369311 Well, it cor like, correct. 447 00:26:28,983.3369311 --> 00:26:30,277.4545781 She was a child with star. 448 00:26:30,277.4545781 --> 00:26:31,983.3369311 She would've never known a private life. 449 00:26:32,12.7486958 --> 00:26:34,130.3957546 So I can see why that's so important to her. 450 00:26:34,522.5526174 --> 00:26:36,404.9055585 I always forget she's got a child as well. 451 00:26:36,404.9055585 --> 00:26:36,463.729088 Yeah. 452 00:26:36,551.9643821 --> 00:26:39,581.3761468 So I think privacy is obviously so important, really important to her. 453 00:26:39,581.3761468 --> 00:26:43,522.5526174 The other thing as well is she wanted to live a lifestyle where alcohol was not. 454 00:26:43,949.0232056 --> 00:26:44,625.4937938 A key point. 455 00:26:44,801.9643821 --> 00:26:45,96.0820291 Oh true. 456 00:26:45,713.729088 --> 00:26:51,537.2584997 And being in the Middle East where many people are Muslim, it created a really nice atmosphere for her to be able to be more supportive. 457 00:26:51,537.2584997 --> 00:26:51,596.0820291 Yeah. 458 00:26:51,596.0820291 --> 00:26:56,419.6114409 And not that, um, not that money means much to her, but it is very expensive to drink there and there. 459 00:26:56,478.4349703 --> 00:27:00,944.1212448 There's not much in terms of the variety anyway, it's not promoted in the same way. 460 00:27:00,944.1212448 --> 00:27:01,32.3565389 Right. 461 00:27:01,61.7683036 --> 00:27:01,502.9447742 Yeah. 462 00:27:01,767.6506566 --> 00:27:07,355.8859507 And even with the press junket for Freakier Friday with Jamie Lee Curtis, and they're like, it's so different. 463 00:27:07,355.8859507 --> 00:27:16,267.6506566 Like Lindsay's a mom, like Jamie's talking about, you know, helping get everything ready and there's a lot of stability and support and not the chaos that you would've expected. 464 00:27:16,679.4153625 --> 00:27:17,414.7094801 Yeah. 465 00:27:17,630.3957546 --> 00:27:19,630.3957546 I really, I'm just can't wait to see it now. 466 00:27:20,502.9447742 --> 00:27:21,738.2388919 Yeah, so highly recommend. 467 00:27:21,738.2388919 --> 00:27:28,2.9447742 The other thing I was gonna say is how good does Lindsay look? Because she went through a bit of the ringer when it comes to like plastic surgery. 468 00:27:28,2.9447742 --> 00:27:28,620.591833 Plastic surgery. 469 00:27:28,620.591833 --> 00:27:34,414.7094801 So I, when she did surg early 2021, she was doing those really cringe, horrible Netflix movies. 470 00:27:34,444.1212448 --> 00:27:34,885.2977154 Mm-hmm. 471 00:27:34,944.1212448 --> 00:27:36,502.9447742 And her fat, like, she did not look right. 472 00:27:36,502.9447742 --> 00:27:39,120.591833 She was very overfilled, totally overfilled. 473 00:27:39,150.0035978 --> 00:27:40,532.3565389 And I think particularly with. 474 00:27:41,76.474186 --> 00:27:46,311.7683036 Actresses and actors like really can't overdo their faces because you're being paid to be expressive. 475 00:27:46,341.1800683 --> 00:27:48,841.1800683 And I'm sorry if your face is flat, like you're shit. 476 00:27:49,164.7094801 --> 00:27:49,341.1800683 Yeah. 477 00:27:49,341.1800683 --> 00:27:50,900.0035978 So she's obviously had more work done. 478 00:27:50,900.0035978 --> 00:27:52,400.0035978 She looks so much more natural. 479 00:27:52,811.7683036 --> 00:27:55,439.219284 She's had whatever Demi Moores had, she had a deep plane face. 480 00:27:55,439.219284 --> 00:27:55,674.5134017 Yeah. 481 00:27:55,733.3369311 --> 00:27:55,821.5722252 Right. 482 00:27:55,821.5722252 --> 00:27:57,968.6310487 And that's when they go under the muscle and moved the nerve. 483 00:27:58,86.2781076 --> 00:28:01,498.0428134 That's she had the same surgeon as Chris Jenna who looks like, oh yeah, cool. 484 00:28:01,527.4545781 --> 00:28:03,174.5134017 Who looks like Kim's sister. 485 00:28:03,233.3369311 --> 00:28:03,527.4545781 Yeah. 486 00:28:03,850.9839899 --> 00:28:04,145.101637 Yeah. 487 00:28:04,571.5722252 --> 00:28:14,2.9447742 Basically I was speaking to someone and she said that deep plane is all the rage at the moment, but it's the hardest because if you mess it up, you can paralyze someone's face. 488 00:28:14,150.0035978 --> 00:28:17,797.0624213 But the results are amazing, the technology's getting even better and better. 489 00:28:17,826.474186 --> 00:28:25,973.5330095 So for a while it was midplane because it was less riskier, but now they're able to do the technology to be able to do that kind of more substantial movement. 490 00:28:25,973.5330095 --> 00:28:28,385.2977154 You're seeing people who just look materially different. 491 00:28:28,505.8859507 --> 00:28:30,652.9447742 Yeah, it's, the technology is so incredible. 492 00:28:30,652.9447742 --> 00:28:34,152.9447742 We'll soon be at a point where we genuinely won't know how old someone is. 493 00:28:34,447.0624213 --> 00:28:35,64.7094801 A hundred percent. 494 00:28:35,64.7094801 --> 00:28:35,182.3565389 Yeah. 495 00:28:35,182.3565389 --> 00:28:37,388.2388919 Like you're 90, but you actually look 21. 496 00:28:37,388.2388919 --> 00:28:38,858.8271272 Yeah, exactly. 497 00:28:39,270.591833 --> 00:28:39,898.0428134 It's a bit like that. 498 00:28:39,898.0428134 --> 00:28:42,349.0232056 The movie where people were like. 499 00:28:42,412.5526174 --> 00:28:43,824.3173232 Able to buy up time. 500 00:28:44,59.6114409 --> 00:28:44,147.846735 Oh. 501 00:28:44,147.846735 --> 00:28:48,30.1996762 And they're like 386, but I look like a 22-year-old. 502 00:28:48,59.6114409 --> 00:28:48,441.9643821 Yes. 503 00:28:48,441.9643821 --> 00:28:52,912.5526174 What movie was that? Did I have Justin Timberlake in it? It did In Time or something. 504 00:28:52,912.5526174 --> 00:28:53,794.9055585 In Time. 505 00:28:53,794.9055585 --> 00:28:54,236.0820291 Yeah. 506 00:28:54,236.0820291 --> 00:28:54,245.8859507 Yes. 507 00:28:54,245.8859507 --> 00:28:54,564.5134017 There you go. 508 00:28:54,819.4153625 --> 00:28:55,765.4937938 That's what it is. 509 00:28:56,412.5526174 --> 00:29:01,736.0820291 So anyway, if you are thinking about going and seeing Freaky Friday, I highly recommend it to get the most out of it. 510 00:29:01,941.9643821 --> 00:29:04,59.6114409 You need to watch Freaky Friday first. 511 00:29:04,59.6114409 --> 00:29:05,530.1996762 Oh, it is It connected. 512 00:29:05,618.4349703 --> 00:29:09,853.729088 It is super connected, and there's all these really cute, nostalgic links and nods. 513 00:29:09,941.9643821 --> 00:29:13,868.4349703 Did you do that? I re-watched Freaky Friday, the day of. 514 00:29:13,868.4349703 --> 00:29:14,427.2584997 I saw it. 515 00:29:14,515.4937938 --> 00:29:14,986.0820291 Oh, good. 516 00:29:14,986.0820291 --> 00:29:16,956.6702644 And it was so, oh, it was so good. 517 00:29:18,44.9055585 --> 00:29:18,662.5526174 Amazing. 518 00:29:20,574.5526174 --> 00:29:32,211.8075193 So Claire, for a long time now, there's been so much talk about what's happening in Palestine, in Gaza, What we've heard more about is Australia recognizing Palestine as a state. 519 00:29:32,991.219284 --> 00:29:40,893.1800683 What we're gonna talk through now is what that actually means just to help us understand a bit more and sort of what we expect to see in the media over the next few weeks. 520 00:29:40,981.4153625 --> 00:29:41,952.0035978 Yeah, absolutely. 521 00:29:42,157.8859507 --> 00:29:44,863.7683036 We are going to talk, break it down to explain sort of. 522 00:29:45,246.1212448 --> 00:29:55,716.7094801 What is a Stu State solution? What does recognition mean in practice? Why Australians making this move? How Israel has responded? Yes, and what it means for Palestinians. 523 00:29:55,932.3957546 --> 00:30:00,520.6310487 But I think it's really important to under to explain what it actually means because it's quite complicated. 524 00:30:00,525.5330095 --> 00:30:01,491.219284 It is, it is. 525 00:30:01,491.219284 --> 00:30:04,961.8075193 And that's the thing is if you've only heard fragments, you probably have no idea. 526 00:30:05,20.6310487 --> 00:30:06,550.0428134 So that can also be helpful. 527 00:30:06,638.2781076 --> 00:30:06,844.1604605 Yeah. 528 00:30:07,11.8075193 --> 00:30:10,511.8075193 And this isn't just politics, it's about history, identity. 529 00:30:10,776.5134017 --> 00:30:15,482.3957546 Two groups who both feel that they have a valid claim to the same land. 530 00:30:15,864.7486958 --> 00:30:16,188.2781076 Yeah. 531 00:30:16,247.101637 --> 00:30:20,335.3369311 So we, what was really important now is that we break this down in plain language. 532 00:30:20,364.7486958 --> 00:30:21,776.5134017 There won't be jargon. 533 00:30:21,805.9251664 --> 00:30:22,776.5134017 There'll be no spin. 534 00:30:22,913.7683036 --> 00:30:23,737.2977154 Let's break it down. 535 00:30:23,796.1212448 --> 00:30:24,2.0035978 Yeah. 536 00:30:24,266.7094801 --> 00:30:31,604.9447742 So what is a two-state solution? It goes back to 1947, the UN plan, one state for Jews, one for Arabs. 537 00:30:31,869.6506566 --> 00:30:33,369.6506566 Israel was created. 538 00:30:33,604.9447742 --> 00:30:42,291.219284 Palestine wasn't what do you mean it wasn't, so they basically were taking a former country that wasn't recognized. 539 00:30:42,438.2781076 --> 00:30:43,879.4545781 Off the back of World War ii. 540 00:30:43,997.101637 --> 00:30:44,467.6898723 Yes. 541 00:30:44,732.3957546 --> 00:30:52,350.0428134 We need to create a place for people that have been made victims and been displaced by the Holocaust. 542 00:30:52,526.5134017 --> 00:30:52,791.219284 Yes. 543 00:30:52,791.219284 --> 00:30:54,144.1604605 And we wanna make them feel safe. 544 00:30:54,614.7486958 --> 00:30:55,55.9251664 Yes. 545 00:30:55,55.9251664 --> 00:31:02,448.0820291 They said, the Jewish people felt a connection to this land through ancient biblical references. 546 00:31:02,506.9055585 --> 00:31:02,948.0820291 Yes. 547 00:31:03,153.9643821 --> 00:31:05,271.6114409 So they created this state, but. 548 00:31:05,624.5526174 --> 00:31:11,742.1996762 At the same time, they didn't say this piece of land is gonna be Israel and this piece of land is gonna be Palestine. 549 00:31:12,36.3173232 --> 00:31:17,506.9055585 They just went Israel and the land adjacent to Israel, which we're not gonna call anything. 550 00:31:17,918.6702644 --> 00:31:18,771.6114409 Okay. 551 00:31:19,859.846735 --> 00:31:24,506.9055585 And so the modern version of that is Israel and Palestine side by side. 552 00:31:24,536.3173232 --> 00:31:29,624.5526174 We've got West Bank and Gaza as Palestine and East Jerusalem as its capital. 553 00:31:29,712.7879115 --> 00:31:30,389.2584997 Correct? Yeah. 554 00:31:30,586.3173232 --> 00:31:32,674.5526174 It never was implemented very well. 555 00:31:32,733.3761468 --> 00:31:35,321.6114409 And we can actually unfortunately pinpoint the British for this. 556 00:31:35,321.6114409 --> 00:31:38,86.3173232 'cause the British were kind of in charge of setting it up. 557 00:31:38,292.1996762 --> 00:31:38,380.4349703 Yes. 558 00:31:38,380.4349703 --> 00:31:42,203.9643821 And once they, they were kind of like the worst ever management consultants. 559 00:31:42,733.3761468 --> 00:31:47,233.3761468 Once they kind of set it up, they were like, alright, we're just gonna leave you to it. 560 00:31:47,645.1408527 --> 00:31:50,733.3761468 But in reality, that's obviously not worked from the onset. 561 00:31:50,733.3761468 --> 00:31:54,203.9643821 There was disputes over borders, refugees, settlement. 562 00:31:54,620.6310487 --> 00:31:55,674.5526174 And, and Jerusalem. 563 00:31:55,674.5526174 --> 00:31:58,409.846735 Jerusalem itself, because it's a highly religious land. 564 00:31:58,762.7879115 --> 00:32:03,615.729088 And if you think about it, you've effectively taken land where a group of people lived. 565 00:32:03,733.3761468 --> 00:32:04,56.9055585 Yes. 566 00:32:04,56.9055585 --> 00:32:10,321.6114409 And you've said, I know you live here, but we are just going to give it to this other group of people because we've gotta put them somewhere. 567 00:32:10,409.846735 --> 00:32:10,909.846735 Yes. 568 00:32:10,968.6702644 --> 00:32:16,86.3173232 And you guys are all just gonna figure it out because, we are good people. 569 00:32:16,86.3173232 --> 00:32:17,733.3761468 We will just, we'll just sort this out. 570 00:32:17,733.3761468 --> 00:32:17,743.1800683 Yeah. 571 00:32:17,885.729088 --> 00:32:21,768.0820291 It is all about relativity, right? It's two groups of people that have claims to a land. 572 00:32:21,944.5526174 --> 00:32:23,385.729088 Those claims are just different. 573 00:32:23,532.7879115 --> 00:32:24,268.0820291 They are different. 574 00:32:24,527.8859507 --> 00:32:29,910.2388919 What I was gonna say was they're both different, and unfortunately they are clashing right now. 575 00:32:30,204.3565389 --> 00:32:30,674.9447742 Exactly. 576 00:32:30,998.474186 --> 00:32:32,792.591833 So Palestinians have ancestral lamb. 577 00:32:32,792.591833 --> 00:32:35,498.474186 Like my, you know, the past few generations I've lived here. 578 00:32:35,527.8859507 --> 00:32:35,910.2388919 Yes. 579 00:32:35,910.2388919 --> 00:32:38,150.4349703 We've been here for, hun for hundreds of years. 580 00:32:38,856.3173232 --> 00:32:41,62.1996762 And the Israelis claimed ancient T um. 581 00:32:41,644.5526174 --> 00:32:43,232.7879115 And the modern state that was created. 582 00:32:43,262.1996762 --> 00:32:43,879.846735 Exactly. 583 00:32:43,938.6702644 --> 00:32:44,85.729088 Yeah. 584 00:32:44,85.729088 --> 00:32:50,350.4349703 And they are both narratives that are valid when you look at it from different perspectives. 585 00:32:50,468.0820291 --> 00:32:51,262.1996762 Yes, they are. 586 00:32:51,556.3173232 --> 00:32:55,615.1408527 And it's essentially as an analogy, we've got two siblings fighting over a family home. 587 00:32:56,423.9643821 --> 00:33:00,894.5526174 One says we've always lived here, and the other one is saying, but I legally bought it and built my life here. 588 00:33:01,159.2584997 --> 00:33:06,629.846735 So both stories are true and that's why the argument has gone on for generations. 589 00:33:06,629.846735 --> 00:33:09,894.5526174 So we're talking since what, 1947? Yeah, that's a long time. 590 00:33:10,41.6114409 --> 00:33:10,394.5526174 Yeah. 591 00:33:10,668.2781076 --> 00:33:12,697.6898723 The two state solution is the compromise. 592 00:33:12,815.3369311 --> 00:33:14,432.9839899 So you both get your own keys? Yes. 593 00:33:15,432.9839899 --> 00:33:25,285.9251664 What does recognition actually mean? And this is really confusing 'cause people say, is it symbolic or is it meaningful Recognition equals to formally acknowledge Palestine as a state. 594 00:33:25,432.9839899 --> 00:33:31,844.7486958 So you know how I said back in 1947, we recognize Israel and then there was just like adjacent land to Israel. 595 00:33:31,844.7486958 --> 00:33:39,138.8663429 Why didn't they recognize it at the time? Do we know? No, actually I think they just, it wasn't important at the time. 596 00:33:39,138.8663429 --> 00:33:40,550.6310487 It wasn't important at the time. 597 00:33:40,580.0428134 --> 00:33:40,609.4545781 Okay. 598 00:33:40,729.0624213 --> 00:33:41,523.1800683 Symbolic, yes. 599 00:33:41,651.8075193 --> 00:33:43,122.3957546 But it has practical effects. 600 00:33:43,235.1408527 --> 00:33:49,735.1408527 It means that Palestine can have embassies, it can sign agreements, and it can give aid and receive aid directly. 601 00:33:49,970.4349703 --> 00:33:57,48.8663429 Currently, aid needs to flow via Israel and be allowed via Israel because again, it's basically landlocked by Israel. 602 00:33:58,191.0232056 --> 00:34:10,161.6114409 Doesn't change checkpoints or, remove tension, but it just means that Palestine is able to have more dialogue directly with countries and those countries are allowed to have more dialogue back with Palestine. 603 00:34:10,514.5526174 --> 00:34:13,896.9055585 The analogy you can think of it, it's like you're finally being added to the group chat. 604 00:34:14,308.6702644 --> 00:34:14,838.0820291 Yes. 605 00:34:14,896.9055585 --> 00:34:16,137.101637 But it doesn't mean that you suddenly. 606 00:34:17,83.1800683 --> 00:34:17,936.1212448 Get your own apartment. 607 00:34:17,936.1212448 --> 00:34:21,965.5330095 Like we're not saying, here's the key, here's the keys to the, you know, go nuts. 608 00:34:22,142.0035978 --> 00:34:25,700.8271272 We're just saying you are, you are available to have a say as well. 609 00:34:25,818.474186 --> 00:34:27,494.9447742 Yes, recognition is currency. 610 00:34:27,936.1212448 --> 00:34:30,200.8271272 The more countries that recognize you, the more leverage you have. 611 00:34:31,200.8271272 --> 00:34:41,700.8271272 So what is happening, uh, in Australia and what is Australia doing now? So a labor policy came in since 2018 and Penny Wong pushed it into the platform. 612 00:34:41,847.8859507 --> 00:34:49,323.3761468 And what that was was Gaza's Ward shifted public opinion and tens of thousands march across the Sydney Harbor Bridge, which we saw recently. 613 00:34:50,323.3761468 --> 00:35:01,808.6702644 Albanese and Wong are also lining up with France and Canada in the uk and the way that the government is framing it is if we wait forever, there'll be no Palestine left to recognize exactly. 614 00:35:02,573.3761468 --> 00:35:05,985.1408527 The labor government's also responding to public sentiment. 615 00:35:06,455.729088 --> 00:35:15,573.3761468 There's been Palestine protests for years, so since, yeah, in October, 2023 was when Hamas attacked Israel and took a number of hostages. 616 00:35:15,632.1996762 --> 00:35:16,102.7879115 Yes. 617 00:35:16,279.2584997 --> 00:35:28,896.9055585 And from that Israel retaliated, and once that retaliation occurred, and I think everyone agrees now, the retaliation of Israel into Palestine has been far more significant than what Hamas did, but we're not. 618 00:35:29,161.6114409 --> 00:35:32,789.0624213 Saying, you know, it's not, absolving Hamas of responsibility. 619 00:35:33,465.5330095 --> 00:35:42,171.4153625 It's just saying that there has been a lot of people that have said the response by Israel and the way Israel is treating the people of Palestine is not acceptable. 620 00:35:42,877.2977154 --> 00:35:50,730.2388919 And with, you know, the Sydney Harbor Bridge having hundreds of thousands and the reciprocal protests across other cities. 621 00:35:51,387.101637 --> 00:35:58,563.5722252 The government can now say we need to act in terms of what the public wants, we can see that the constituents want us to do this. 622 00:35:58,710.6310487 --> 00:35:59,710.6310487 Now we're going to do it. 623 00:35:59,710.6310487 --> 00:36:07,798.8663429 So that's very important to note that it's not, you know, a small group of people pushing that you, they had data points that say, this is what the Australian people want. 624 00:36:08,4.7486958 --> 00:36:08,269.4545781 Yeah. 625 00:36:08,445.9251664 --> 00:36:09,519.4545781 I think for me it's a. 626 00:36:10,210.6310487 --> 00:36:22,289.0624213 I understand the point of the symbolic recognition, but I just worry without a framework behind it, is that, you know, is this going to seem for a general public who, taps in and taps out the news? They go, oh, it's solved Now. 627 00:36:22,465.5330095 --> 00:36:31,53.7683036 They've been symbolically recognized, but actually in reality what has changed Exactly, and that's why people are saying it's political. 628 00:36:31,53.7683036 --> 00:36:35,612.591833 It doesn't mean much the Israeli government Yes. 629 00:36:35,671.4153625 --> 00:36:36,553.7683036 Is furious. 630 00:36:36,671.4153625 --> 00:36:38,259.6506566 Netha, you called it shameful. 631 00:36:38,259.6506566 --> 00:36:43,524.3565389 He's had a lot of very visceral words for Anthony Albanese. 632 00:36:44,112.591833 --> 00:36:51,553.7683036 He's retaliated by revoking visa for Australian officials in the West Bank, and they've said that they are rewarding terrorists. 633 00:36:51,583.1800683 --> 00:36:54,847.8859507 They're rewarding Hamas, which is definitely not what Australia's saying. 634 00:36:54,852.7879115 --> 00:36:59,642.0035978 And and that's the thing is I know that's not the intention, is to recognize Hamas. 635 00:37:00,377.2977154 --> 00:37:04,901.8075193 But it's sort of, it's is that kind of elephant in the room of going, but that they're still in control right now. 636 00:37:04,906.7094801 --> 00:37:05,612.591833 They're still in control. 637 00:37:05,612.591833 --> 00:37:06,465.5330095 They're still there. 638 00:37:06,553.7683036 --> 00:37:06,759.6506566 Yeah. 639 00:37:06,759.6506566 --> 00:37:10,406.7094801 But it's about recognizing the people behind that, the people behind it. 640 00:37:10,406.7094801 --> 00:37:10,465.5330095 Yeah. 641 00:37:10,465.5330095 --> 00:37:12,789.0624213 Because Hamas is not every citizen. 642 00:37:12,789.0624213 --> 00:37:13,994.9447742 It's not in Palestine. 643 00:37:14,494.9447742 --> 00:37:21,112.591833 But then I think it's also really important that we acknowledge that the Israeli government does not equal the Israeli people. 644 00:37:21,230.2388919 --> 00:37:21,965.5330095 Exactly. 645 00:37:22,200.8271272 --> 00:37:26,965.5330095 And you need to, as consumers of this information separate. 646 00:37:27,744.9447742 --> 00:37:31,480.2388919 The government people in charge versus the population of Israel. 647 00:37:31,539.0624213 --> 00:37:31,803.7683036 Yeah. 648 00:37:32,303.7683036 --> 00:37:38,186.1212448 And you've gotta remember that they have been grieving a number of hostages that have been captured and taken from their families. 649 00:37:38,186.1212448 --> 00:37:40,744.9447742 And many of those hostages have unfortunately lost their life. 650 00:37:40,774.3565389 --> 00:37:41,333.1800683 Yes. 651 00:37:42,195.9251664 --> 00:37:48,754.7486958 And I think, you know, on this, the government's reaction, clearly the symbolic recognition does mean something. 652 00:37:48,754.7486958 --> 00:37:52,215.5330095 I mean, they wouldn't react if it didn't but. 653 00:37:53,289.0624213 --> 00:38:04,290.0428134 Yeah, it's sort of what does that mean now for Palestine? Does it change anything? For Palestines, it's, as you say, that recognition, it's just knowing that the world hasn't forgotten about them. 654 00:38:04,495.9251664 --> 00:38:04,731.219284 Yeah. 655 00:38:04,736.1212448 --> 00:38:04,922.3957546 Um. 656 00:38:05,598.8663429 --> 00:38:07,775.3369311 But this movement's only the beginning. 657 00:38:07,775.3369311 --> 00:38:07,863.5722252 Yes. 658 00:38:08,157.6898723 --> 00:38:13,951.8075193 Where a true state solution works is where there's pressure for the two to work it out. 659 00:38:14,275.3369311 --> 00:38:21,157.6898723 And the best way to think about it is Trump telling Russia, Putin and Zelensky in the Ukraine. 660 00:38:21,157.6898723 --> 00:38:26,834.1604605 So Russia, Ukraine conflict them telling, Hey, you two need to sort sit down and sort this out. 661 00:38:26,834.1604605 --> 00:38:28,451.8075193 We are not having this conflict anymore. 662 00:38:28,745.9251664 --> 00:38:33,10.6310487 So the more pressure that's put on, the more pressure that. 663 00:38:33,834.1604605 --> 00:38:36,392.9839899 They have to find a solution that they're happy to live with. 664 00:38:36,804.7486958 --> 00:38:41,951.8075193 Hardest thing is two people with different views on what they think is fair and right. 665 00:38:41,981.219284 --> 00:38:43,334.1604605 That's really difficult. 666 00:38:43,863.5722252 --> 00:38:52,187.101637 The other thing is, for Palestine to succeed and find peace with Israel, you need to allow amassed to basically be suffocated. 667 00:38:52,672.3957546 --> 00:38:53,584.1604605 Through democracy. 668 00:38:53,848.8663429 --> 00:39:02,701.8075193 So that's by advocating for the Palestinian government to have a say and be recognized and the people to support that, because that's how you get rid of the app. 669 00:39:03,113.5722252 --> 00:39:10,966.5134017 Because by oppressing the country, people feel like they've got a flock to these terrorist organizations to feel heard or to have their views had. 670 00:39:11,231.219284 --> 00:39:20,902.7879115 So you need to allow the country to rise up in a healthy way, and that has, by giving them a way to speak, and then also encouraging them to find peace with Israel. 671 00:39:21,701.8075193 --> 00:39:35,5.729088 I agree with you to some extent, but also I do worry about how dangerous it is in terms of Hamas seeing this as power to them, and so it is progressive to a certain extent it's overdue. 672 00:39:35,5.729088 --> 00:39:36,535.1408527 That's sort of Palestine. 673 00:39:37,138.0820291 --> 00:39:44,196.9055585 Hasn't been recognized until now, but it's what now goes into practice to support that actually coming to fruition. 674 00:39:44,196.9055585 --> 00:39:56,343.9643821 The other way to think about it as well is by welcoming Palestine into the fold and helping them gain economic prosperity, they are more likely to allow other countries to. 675 00:39:56,809.6506566 --> 00:39:59,662.591833 Help them to remove her mask to deconstruct it. 676 00:39:59,819.4545781 --> 00:40:02,525.3369311 'Cause at the moment, Herma is just, they just do what they want. 677 00:40:03,10.6310487 --> 00:40:03,569.4545781 No, I know. 678 00:40:03,569.4545781 --> 00:40:06,196.9055585 I think they're gonna need a lot of support to overcome that. 679 00:40:06,226.3173232 --> 00:40:09,343.9643821 It's, it's at this point the state of how the people are. 680 00:40:09,858.6702644 --> 00:40:11,35.1408527 I think they need that support. 681 00:40:11,35.1408527 --> 00:40:11,917.4937938 They can't do it on their own. 682 00:40:12,996.1604605 --> 00:40:13,260.8663429 Gab. 683 00:40:13,260.8663429 --> 00:40:15,349.101637 I think that's all we've got time for this week. 684 00:40:15,878.5134017 --> 00:40:17,407.9251664 I know it's been a big one. 685 00:40:17,407.9251664 --> 00:40:24,760.8663429 We've gone from the rise and fall of the Biggest Loser to Lindsay Lohan's, long overdue comeback and Australia's historic recognition of Palestine. 686 00:40:24,966.7486958 --> 00:40:28,290.2781076 Three stories all about power, perception and the narratives we buy into. 687 00:40:28,525.5722252 --> 00:40:33,290.2781076 Thanks all listening, and if you enjoy today's episode, don't forget to follow, rate and share us with a friend. 688 00:40:33,672.6310487 --> 00:40:38,907.9251664 We'll be met next time to unravel more of the stories shaping our culture without the spin. 689 00:40:39,202.0428134 --> 00:40:39,790.2781076 See you later.